WEBVTT - U R Stardust with Bayley Van 0:00:00.480 --> 0:00:05.600 For years and years, I did not appreciate all the beautiful, 0:00:06.240 --> 0:00:11.039 magical things my body does every day. For years and years, 0:00:11.440 --> 0:00:14.440 all I could see was how my body didn't measure 0:00:14.560 --> 0:00:17.959 up to the Western ideal, with all its sexism and 0:00:18.160 --> 0:00:23.360 racism and fatphobia. I hated my body. I cursed it, 0:00:24.000 --> 0:00:27.720 I starved it. Now, when I think about my body, 0:00:28.520 --> 0:00:32.440 I think of a quote from astronomer Carl Sagan about 0:00:32.479 --> 0:00:35.640 how the elements that make up our DNA, our teeth, 0:00:36.080 --> 0:00:40.280 and our blood, those elements were made in the interiors 0:00:40.360 --> 0:00:45.879 of collapsing stars. He said, we are made of star stuff. 0:00:47.920 --> 0:00:52.000 And here's what your star dust body is doing right now. 0:00:52.720 --> 0:00:57.640 Your heart is pumping blood, Your lungs are trading oxygen 0:00:57.920 --> 0:01:02.840 for carbon dioxide. Tiny hairs in your ears are picking 0:01:02.920 --> 0:01:06.319 up the sound of my voice. Your brain is turning 0:01:06.319 --> 0:01:10.720 those sound waves into meaning. Your skin can feel the 0:01:10.800 --> 0:01:14.280 touch of a loved one. Your eyes can detect about 0:01:14.319 --> 0:01:18.640 one million colors, so many colors that there aren't even 0:01:18.720 --> 0:01:21.880 words to describe all of them in any human language. 0:01:22.920 --> 0:01:27.920 Your body can dance and laugh and dream and stretch 0:01:28.240 --> 0:01:34.479 and grow and hurt and heal itself. It's amazing. Through 0:01:34.640 --> 0:01:38.839 all of those years when I was hating my wondrous body, 0:01:39.360 --> 0:01:42.760 it was there, chugging along like a chubby little chee 0:01:42.800 --> 0:01:49.160 choo train, taking care of me. My body has been 0:01:49.440 --> 0:01:53.560 my truest friend. She's got me, has had me through 0:01:53.640 --> 0:02:01.400 all of it. She is magic. Our feelings about our 0:02:01.400 --> 0:02:05.880 bodies are almost always all tangled up with our feelings 0:02:05.920 --> 0:02:10.400 about food, and we have all sorts of feelings about food, 0:02:10.680 --> 0:02:13.799 in part because we're afraid that it will make our 0:02:13.840 --> 0:02:18.080 bodies bigger. And we've all got the message loud and 0:02:18.160 --> 0:02:22.040 clear that bigger is not okay. Ever, watch fat people 0:02:22.080 --> 0:02:25.560 get abused on The Biggest Loser, or read studies that 0:02:25.639 --> 0:02:28.360 show that fat people were twelve times more likely to 0:02:28.400 --> 0:02:32.680 face workplace discrimination. We see the way that fat people 0:02:32.680 --> 0:02:36.239 are treated, and we are afraid of being treated like that. 0:02:36.840 --> 0:02:40.880 It's normal to be afraid of being treated like poop garbage. 0:02:41.400 --> 0:02:45.200 But here at Rebel Eaters Club, we know the solution 0:02:45.320 --> 0:02:48.120 is not attempting to make your body smaller. That just 0:02:48.280 --> 0:02:52.120 keeps you in an ltr with self hatred. I used 0:02:52.120 --> 0:02:54.400 to tell myself that I was dieting because I wanted 0:02:54.440 --> 0:02:59.880 to look better and be healthier, but really I was 0:03:00.120 --> 0:03:03.000 trying to control how other people saw me and how 0:03:03.120 --> 0:03:07.239 they treated me. I couldn't change being a woman or 0:03:07.280 --> 0:03:09.840 a prist of color. I couldn't change the fact that 0:03:09.880 --> 0:03:13.120 I grew up working class. But I totally bought the 0:03:13.160 --> 0:03:16.320 idea that if I could control my body, I could 0:03:16.480 --> 0:03:22.639 maybe protect myself against at least some nasty judgments. Diet 0:03:22.680 --> 0:03:28.840 culture is about control, all kinds of control, and about 0:03:28.880 --> 0:03:33.280 twenty five percent of people who diet regularly eventually develop 0:03:33.400 --> 0:03:37.320 an eating disorder. Eds and diets are not the same, 0:03:37.600 --> 0:03:40.960 but they are both about controlling food when we feel 0:03:40.960 --> 0:03:45.520 like we cannot control other aspects of our lives. I'm 0:03:45.560 --> 0:03:50.920 Virgie Tovar. This is Rebel Eaters Club. In this episode, 0:03:51.200 --> 0:03:53.760 you're going to hear from someone who's in recovery from 0:03:53.920 --> 0:03:59.080 eating disorder. Her name is Bailey. Okay, Bailey. So I 0:03:59.240 --> 0:04:02.880 texted you and asked you if there's anything you're in 0:04:02.880 --> 0:04:05.920 the mood for. So I decided to create a little 0:04:05.960 --> 0:04:12.680 menu in this fire input. I brought bubbly water, which 0:04:13.520 --> 0:04:17.600 I have a deep passion for, and then some brie, 0:04:17.680 --> 0:04:20.800 which I have a deep passion for. We met five 0:04:20.920 --> 0:04:25.640 years ago at a reading at the San Francisco Public Library. Yes, 0:04:25.880 --> 0:04:29.440 the nerdiest meat cute ever. It happened to me she 0:04:29.560 --> 0:04:34.080 was wearing at least five necklaces, looked like an adorable 0:04:34.160 --> 0:04:38.880 goth with soft edges, and was fat like me. We 0:04:38.880 --> 0:04:42.120 were both at the library for the monthly Queer Reading series. 0:04:42.760 --> 0:04:45.560 It didn't take long before we discovered a mutual love 0:04:45.640 --> 0:04:51.920 of witchcraft, over sharing and oreos as sort of a dessert. 0:04:53.040 --> 0:04:57.159 I brought some bootleg oreos that have the mint flavor. 0:04:57.440 --> 0:05:00.599 They're kind of holiday. Yeah, they're amazing. I've eating them 0:05:00.600 --> 0:05:02.960 and they're great. You like, drop some on the floor 0:05:02.960 --> 0:05:06.119 and you're like, I'm not above eating floor oreo. Five 0:05:06.200 --> 0:05:11.960 second rule, Yes, okay, cute. I'm really stoked on this. Hummus, 0:05:12.000 --> 0:05:14.719 I'm just gonna like it. I'm going to open up 0:05:14.760 --> 0:05:19.640 the tiny baby carrots. I have always had like mixed 0:05:19.680 --> 0:05:25.200 feelings about baby carrotsky Recently, I smoked some weed with 0:05:25.279 --> 0:05:27.320 my friend to Lenny and the only food that she 0:05:27.400 --> 0:05:31.560 had was baby carrots, and it just changed. I was like, 0:05:31.680 --> 0:05:36.080 oh my god, yes, I kind of want us to 0:05:36.120 --> 0:05:40.839 do a dual carrot crunch. Hummus, moment, what do you 0:05:40.880 --> 0:05:44.840 think and just create the loudest crunch we can possibly create. 0:05:45.000 --> 0:05:48.080 Let's do it. And this is a crunch. This is 0:05:48.120 --> 0:05:51.000 the crunch that's going to ripple through history. This is 0:05:51.040 --> 0:05:54.160 the crunch that will be heard around the world. Bailey, Yes, 0:05:54.560 --> 0:05:58.000 let's do it. Are you ready? Yeah? Okay? One? Two? 0:06:04.720 --> 0:06:07.320 Like did you hear that? Okay, We're coming for you. 0:06:07.839 --> 0:06:12.039 Quick note, Bailey is twenty two. When I was twenty two, 0:06:12.360 --> 0:06:14.919 I was still busy trying to squeeze my body into 0:06:14.960 --> 0:06:19.400 tiny pants and get married narcissist to love me. But Bailey, 0:06:19.720 --> 0:06:23.840 she's way wiser than I was at her age. Diet 0:06:23.920 --> 0:06:28.600 culture is what cult leaders do to cult members, depriving 0:06:28.640 --> 0:06:32.679 them of food, depriving them of energy, depriving them of sleep. 0:06:33.279 --> 0:06:39.680 It's a method of subjugation. It's a brainwashing tool. Diet 0:06:39.760 --> 0:06:43.760 culture is like someone speaking into a microphone in your 0:06:43.760 --> 0:06:45.800 head all the time, because it's the only thing you 0:06:45.800 --> 0:06:49.200 can think about. Because when you're not eating, the only 0:06:49.240 --> 0:06:53.760 thing your body wants to do is eat. It never 0:06:53.880 --> 0:06:57.200 lets you be alone with yourself and your own thoughts 0:06:57.240 --> 0:07:01.719 to realize all of your potential. See what I mean. 0:07:03.480 --> 0:07:06.880 Bailey spent years in the throes of an eating disorder, 0:07:07.160 --> 0:07:09.680 and we're going to talk about that in detail throughout 0:07:09.720 --> 0:07:14.600 this episode. Bailey's path to recovery is unique. Everyone who 0:07:14.680 --> 0:07:18.480 struggles with eating disorder has a different path to recovery. 0:07:19.040 --> 0:07:21.880 If you have an D, your path to recovery might 0:07:21.920 --> 0:07:26.160 look entirely different. If that sounds triggering for you right now, 0:07:26.520 --> 0:07:34.200 you might want to listen to this another time. Okay, Bailey, 0:07:34.880 --> 0:07:41.600 who are you? Oh my gosh, So, I mean every 0:07:41.640 --> 0:07:45.760 person is like a lot of things. My like Instagram, 0:07:45.800 --> 0:07:52.320 bio slash Tinder bio version of myself is I'm a lesbian, 0:07:52.440 --> 0:07:56.600 I'm a woman of color, I'm an educator, I'm this 0:07:56.800 --> 0:08:00.840 is actually in my Instagram bioteam trauma definitely like working 0:08:00.840 --> 0:08:04.200 through that shit. I'm fat. These things are like very 0:08:04.200 --> 0:08:06.920 central to my identity, but also obviously don't make up 0:08:07.000 --> 0:08:10.960 all of who I am. Yeah, can you talk about 0:08:10.960 --> 0:08:15.440 the role that food played in your family? Food for 0:08:15.720 --> 0:08:21.680 my whole family is so intense, it's like rough, Like 0:08:21.800 --> 0:08:25.280 literally every woman on my mom's side of the family 0:08:25.840 --> 0:08:30.320 has actively an eating disorder, probably with the exception of me, 0:08:30.560 --> 0:08:32.720 because I like do things really hard. So I like 0:08:32.760 --> 0:08:34.640 had a release of your eating disorder to the point 0:08:34.640 --> 0:08:36.720 where someone was like, we need to intervene on this shit. 0:08:37.160 --> 0:08:39.520 So I've I've like processed a lot of that, but 0:08:39.880 --> 0:08:41.920 a lot of my family is still like really deep 0:08:42.000 --> 0:08:44.000 in it. I mean, you still live with your family. 0:08:44.280 --> 0:08:47.280 I do. I live with my mom and my little sister, right, 0:08:47.400 --> 0:08:50.800 I mean, I remember you telling me that story about 0:08:50.840 --> 0:08:54.440 the bulls the size of the bulls house. We have 0:08:54.679 --> 0:09:00.240 the smallest bulls, like almost dull sized bulls that my 0:09:00.320 --> 0:09:03.160 mother and my sister will put like servings of ice 0:09:03.200 --> 0:09:05.360 cream into, and then like I get to break those 0:09:05.400 --> 0:09:11.120 barriers by just having like four servings, just being like, yes, 0:09:11.160 --> 0:09:13.679 I will take another serving of pasta, and another and 0:09:13.840 --> 0:09:16.720 another until I get to the equivalent of a normal 0:09:16.800 --> 0:09:20.920 size bowl of pasta. Yes. Like, when you talk about 0:09:20.920 --> 0:09:24.960 being in the depths of an eating disorder, what do 0:09:25.040 --> 0:09:28.280 you consider sort of the origin story of it. Well, 0:09:28.320 --> 0:09:33.679 it started really young. I started restricting as soon as 0:09:33.679 --> 0:09:36.120 I realized that I had the ability too. That was 0:09:36.160 --> 0:09:38.880 probably around like seven. I stopped eating lunches and stuff. 0:09:39.080 --> 0:09:43.680 That is definitely eating disordered behavior, but it is also 0:09:43.760 --> 0:09:47.280 the behavior that is often expected of women, is to 0:09:47.360 --> 0:09:51.720 like skip a meal. Then, right before I started high school, 0:09:52.679 --> 0:09:58.160 I went to this sleepaway summer camp and my mom 0:09:58.240 --> 0:10:01.920 wasn't there, and I just had this moment where I 0:10:02.000 --> 0:10:05.080 was like, there's no one supervising what I eat. I 0:10:05.080 --> 0:10:09.280 could just eat nothing. And so I essentially didn't meet 0:10:09.280 --> 0:10:16.880 that whole week. And honestly, those those longer periods of 0:10:17.440 --> 0:10:21.440 like extreme restriction are kind of what kick eating disorder 0:10:21.520 --> 0:10:26.520 brain into high gear. The like long periods of like 0:10:26.640 --> 0:10:30.000 essentially starvation will start to mess up your kind of 0:10:30.040 --> 0:10:34.319 biological functions of like hunger. And I did some pretty 0:10:34.320 --> 0:10:38.240 extreme restricting and actually ended up getting hospitalized a couple 0:10:38.240 --> 0:10:44.319 of times through that. It was not fun. I don't 0:10:44.360 --> 0:10:49.880 recommend it. I'm thinking about being eight, you know, for 0:10:49.960 --> 0:10:53.120 me being eighteen years old, and I had been restricting 0:10:53.200 --> 0:10:55.520 from around the age that you were naming, like probably 0:10:55.520 --> 0:11:01.679 around seven or eight. And I remember, you know, the 0:11:01.720 --> 0:11:04.960 first time I attempted starvation or some version of it 0:11:05.000 --> 0:11:09.800 was when I was eleven. And then you know, at eighteen, 0:11:10.200 --> 0:11:13.920 I was studying abroad in college. I was living in Italy, 0:11:14.400 --> 0:11:18.360 and I had this kind of similar thought, which was, 0:11:18.640 --> 0:11:23.480 you know, I'm in another place and I can ratchet 0:11:23.559 --> 0:11:29.360 up my restriction. And for me, it was like this 0:11:29.440 --> 0:11:35.360 fantasy of returning unrecognizable. I'm thinking about Like one movie 0:11:35.400 --> 0:11:38.480 that I used to watch religiously was this movie called 0:11:38.480 --> 0:11:42.520 She's out of Control and it starred Tony Danza and 0:11:42.760 --> 0:11:47.520 also Chandler from Friends. You know, the idea is, like 0:11:47.600 --> 0:11:50.520 a lot of these movies, there's a sort of chubby 0:11:51.200 --> 0:11:55.280 girl with braces and glasses, and she's maybe a junior 0:11:55.200 --> 0:11:58.720 or a sophomore in high school. And over the summer 0:11:58.960 --> 0:12:02.160 she exercised is really hard. Every single day, She's just 0:12:02.200 --> 0:12:07.200 sweating and working out. And then that year of high 0:12:07.240 --> 0:12:10.280 school it sort of starts and she gets her braces off, 0:12:10.320 --> 0:12:13.360 and she gets her glasses off, she gets contacts, and 0:12:13.480 --> 0:12:18.160 she emerges as a babe, and she goes from you know, 0:12:18.760 --> 0:12:22.480 a zero to at ten. The reward for all of 0:12:22.520 --> 0:12:26.079 her restriction and exercising all summer and losing an entire 0:12:26.280 --> 0:12:30.320 summer of her life is that boys want to be 0:12:30.960 --> 0:12:33.680 her boyfriend anyway. So, like, you know, that kind of 0:12:33.720 --> 0:12:36.920 idea that you could you could totally change what you 0:12:37.080 --> 0:12:39.600 looked like and who you were essentially over a summer. 0:12:40.200 --> 0:12:43.000 I mean, it still is a cultural trope. Yeah, So 0:12:43.040 --> 0:12:45.440 I'm eighteen years old thinking that I'm going to radically 0:12:45.520 --> 0:12:48.720 transform be unrecognizable to my family, when I return at 0:12:48.720 --> 0:12:53.720 the international terminal, and this incentivizes me to begin eating 0:12:53.760 --> 0:13:00.000 almost nothing. And my goal is literally to eat absolute 0:13:00.040 --> 0:13:03.040 lutely as little as possible, and whenever hunger gets overwhelming, 0:13:03.040 --> 0:13:06.680 I would eat a spoonful of food. I did that 0:13:06.760 --> 0:13:08.719 for probably about a month, and then I started the 0:13:09.040 --> 0:13:11.959 signs started to happen, of like what happens when you 0:13:12.040 --> 0:13:16.359 do that for a long time. I started to lose equilibrium. 0:13:16.480 --> 0:13:18.120 That was the first thing that happened. I used to 0:13:18.120 --> 0:13:20.560 fall all the time. I would pass out. I would 0:13:20.559 --> 0:13:25.120 just like tip over, like yep, and then equilibrium leads 0:13:25.160 --> 0:13:29.240 to nausea, and then it also right like I didn't 0:13:29.240 --> 0:13:31.640 have any calories, so I was exhausted all the time. 0:13:32.160 --> 0:13:35.520 I remember at one point I was I fell asleep 0:13:35.559 --> 0:13:38.840 on a bench two blocks from my apartment because I 0:13:38.880 --> 0:13:41.439 was so exhausted. I couldn't make it from the downtown 0:13:41.720 --> 0:13:44.800 to my apartment, which was only a few blocks. And 0:13:44.960 --> 0:13:47.560 I had fallen asleep during the day, but I had 0:13:47.559 --> 0:13:50.640 slept through sunset, so I woke up. It's dark. I'm 0:13:50.640 --> 0:13:54.000 in a city I don't know that well by myself, 0:13:54.440 --> 0:13:58.400 and and yet all the while I knew all this 0:13:58.440 --> 0:14:02.120 bad stuff was happening. I do not, Bailey. I did 0:14:02.160 --> 0:14:06.120 not associate any of that negative stuff with my eating 0:14:06.120 --> 0:14:08.800 behavior because I thought that the way that I was 0:14:08.840 --> 0:14:11.960 eating was healthy and positive. I mean, do you like, 0:14:12.000 --> 0:14:15.800 do you know like eating that ordered cognitive dissonance phenomena 0:14:15.920 --> 0:14:19.120 where you're like, I'm just healthy. I don't like, I 0:14:19.120 --> 0:14:22.280 don't understand why my hair is falling out. I'm eating 0:14:22.400 --> 0:14:26.160 so well. Yeah, all I've eaten is celery, And isn't 0:14:26.200 --> 0:14:29.840 that good for you? It's just interesting how I it's 0:14:29.880 --> 0:14:35.000 such magical thinking actually, like rapid metamorphosis into an entirely 0:14:35.040 --> 0:14:39.640 different person. Oh, yes, is absurd. Yeah. Last night when 0:14:39.640 --> 0:14:42.640 we were texting, you were telling me about celery. Can 0:14:42.680 --> 0:14:47.000 you discuss the celery story? Do you feel comfort? Yes? Okay. 0:14:47.200 --> 0:14:50.960 So I had this celery oreos dichotomy. That's like literally 0:14:51.000 --> 0:14:52.560 I thought about it in my head. I was like, 0:14:52.840 --> 0:14:57.120 there's celery and there's oreos, and I never liked celery ever, 0:14:57.880 --> 0:15:01.280 but I was like eating disorder me was like two 0:15:01.360 --> 0:15:03.720 birds with one stone. You hate this food, so you're 0:15:03.760 --> 0:15:08.760 gonna eat it less. And celery is essentially hard water 0:15:09.320 --> 0:15:17.640 that taste like armpit and like allegedly you burn more 0:15:17.720 --> 0:15:21.120 calories chewing and digesting it than is in it. So 0:15:21.200 --> 0:15:23.760 I like lived on celery for about three weeks. I 0:15:23.840 --> 0:15:25.600 ended up in the hospital after that. You can't do it. 0:15:25.640 --> 0:15:31.600 You can't live on celery, you die, right, So I 0:15:31.640 --> 0:15:34.920 would just like like eat celery and then I'd like 0:15:34.960 --> 0:15:37.320 put an oreo in front of me and look and 0:15:37.400 --> 0:15:42.280 smell the oreo and eat the celery. Whoa. And then 0:15:43.560 --> 0:15:45.240 oftentimes at the end, I'd be like I need to 0:15:45.240 --> 0:15:47.000 eat this oreo, and I'd eat the oreo and I'd 0:15:47.000 --> 0:15:50.360 feel so bad and I'd cry and I'd be like, 0:15:50.480 --> 0:15:54.720 oh my god, I can't believe I ate that single oreo. Somehow, 0:15:54.800 --> 0:15:59.080 all of my feelings about food got concentrated like onto oreos, 0:15:59.280 --> 0:16:01.680 and I would think about oreos all the time. I 0:16:01.720 --> 0:16:06.120 remember doing crunches in my bedroom like one oreo, two oreos, 0:16:06.640 --> 0:16:09.920 three oreos, like I like I would just like everything 0:16:09.960 --> 0:16:12.680 I thought about was in terms of like I just 0:16:12.720 --> 0:16:16.520 want to eat a oreo so bad, but I can't. 0:16:17.520 --> 0:16:22.360 I spent so much like emotional and mental energy just 0:16:22.400 --> 0:16:26.760 like thinking about food, thinking about not eating food, thinking 0:16:26.760 --> 0:16:29.760 about what would happen if I ate food? And now 0:16:30.280 --> 0:16:33.320 I just eat, which is awesome, and then I can 0:16:33.360 --> 0:16:40.240 think about other shit. When I was in like eating 0:16:40.280 --> 0:16:44.040 disorder world was like the worst thing that could happen 0:16:44.120 --> 0:16:47.120 to me is that I would get that. And I 0:16:47.160 --> 0:16:49.080 did get that, and it was probably the best thing 0:16:49.120 --> 0:16:56.240 that ever happened to me. And honestly, like, as soon 0:16:56.240 --> 0:17:00.280 as I started eating again, that fear stopped existing. That 0:17:00.400 --> 0:17:05.480 fear is a product of like being fully enveloped in 0:17:05.680 --> 0:17:10.439 like the starving brain. And once you're out of that place, 0:17:10.560 --> 0:17:13.439 it's so much easier to find love and to like 0:17:14.000 --> 0:17:20.239 internally balance those feelings. And it's just like it's so 0:17:20.359 --> 0:17:24.760 important to eat. Please eat whoa can we can? We? 0:17:24.800 --> 0:17:26.760 Just I just I need to eat an oreo right now, 0:17:27.160 --> 0:17:54.280 let's do it. Okay, Oh my god, mmm, we're back. 0:17:55.359 --> 0:17:58.960 I'm still thinking about the teen Transformation movie and the 0:17:59.160 --> 0:18:03.040 deeply fun up idea that hidden somewhere inside of you 0:18:03.280 --> 0:18:08.480 is another version of you, the real you, that's more beautiful, 0:18:08.720 --> 0:18:12.240 more perfect, and that that person is the only one 0:18:12.320 --> 0:18:16.800 who's worthy of love. It feels deeply gendered. I mean, 0:18:16.880 --> 0:18:19.520 I don't know that dudes feel this pressure to radically 0:18:19.560 --> 0:18:25.320 transform themselves so they can just be acceptable, worthwhile, fully human, 0:18:26.400 --> 0:18:30.480 But it also feels deeply racialized. The women in these 0:18:30.520 --> 0:18:33.960 movies who could get thin and then get loved were 0:18:34.000 --> 0:18:38.880 almost always white. And years later I realized starving myself 0:18:39.080 --> 0:18:43.000 wasn't just about being as thin as possible, but being 0:18:43.000 --> 0:18:47.639 as close to whiteness as possible. To Bailey says she 0:18:47.760 --> 0:18:50.200 always knew that was part of the deal for her. 0:18:53.160 --> 0:18:58.840 I honestly, really explicitly did have that connection in my head. 0:18:59.760 --> 0:19:03.000 I'm half black, half white. My mom's side of the 0:19:03.000 --> 0:19:04.680 family is the white side of the family. My dad's 0:19:04.680 --> 0:19:06.240 side of family is the black side of the family. 0:19:06.560 --> 0:19:11.560 I'm like relatively light skinned, and honestly, as soon as 0:19:11.600 --> 0:19:15.119 I started like visibly restricting, my aunt was like, Bailey, 0:19:16.200 --> 0:19:18.000 why are you trying to look like a white girl? 0:19:18.320 --> 0:19:22.399 Like that connection was made really fast. Ultimately, I was 0:19:22.480 --> 0:19:27.919 trying to adhere to like a white, heteropatriarchal ideals of 0:19:28.000 --> 0:19:33.120 beauty and had this idea that somehow, like being more 0:19:33.160 --> 0:19:36.639 white would make me more safe and would make me 0:19:36.760 --> 0:19:42.000 more desirable. And I mean, ultimately I just lost a 0:19:42.000 --> 0:19:46.400 bunch of my hair and that didn't make me particularly 0:19:46.400 --> 0:19:50.400 desirable at all. Yeah, I mean, I think back on 0:19:51.359 --> 0:19:54.760 what happened to me in childhood, where it was primarily 0:19:54.800 --> 0:20:00.080 boys emotionally torturing me day after day after day and 0:20:00.200 --> 0:20:04.600 trying to force me through this abuse to submit to 0:20:04.640 --> 0:20:07.480 their expectation that i'd be the right size. I now 0:20:07.600 --> 0:20:11.960 realize an adulthood that I was getting two lessons at once. 0:20:12.119 --> 0:20:14.800 I was getting the lesson that I should be thin, 0:20:15.440 --> 0:20:17.679 but I was getting the lesson that if I was 0:20:17.760 --> 0:20:22.359 desirable two boys, I could be safe from abuse. Yes, 0:20:22.760 --> 0:20:26.200 they're the opposite sides of the same coin. Yes, So 0:20:27.000 --> 0:20:30.959 I feel like a lot of kind of like the 0:20:31.200 --> 0:20:35.399 everyday violence that men direct at women often has to 0:20:35.440 --> 0:20:40.760 do with deviating from like the set expectation of like 0:20:40.920 --> 0:20:47.560 what an attractive, gooid whatever malleable woman is and like 0:20:47.600 --> 0:20:52.280 a thin, quiet white woman. And I've never been any 0:20:52.359 --> 0:20:56.360 of those things. I have always been like a bit 0:20:56.400 --> 0:21:00.480 of a weirdo, loud, kind of a no at all, 0:21:01.440 --> 0:21:04.320 definitely a little eccentric, just like just like a freaking weirdo. 0:21:04.359 --> 0:21:06.240 I've been a weirdo my whole life. I'm into it, 0:21:06.359 --> 0:21:13.440 deeply charming, thank you, Like I'm into it. It's part 0:21:13.440 --> 0:21:16.680 of my identity. I've always been this way, and I've 0:21:16.720 --> 0:21:19.760 always received like a large amount of pushback from that, 0:21:20.040 --> 0:21:23.760 and so I was like, Okay, I can't. I've tried 0:21:23.800 --> 0:21:25.840 to be less weird. I can't be less weird, but 0:21:25.880 --> 0:21:29.159 I have not tried being more thin and more white. 0:21:29.680 --> 0:21:33.480 Maybe if I adhere to these expectations in other ways, 0:21:33.800 --> 0:21:37.199 I'll be safe from this abuse. That was definitely a 0:21:37.200 --> 0:21:43.960 lot of my thinking, and ultimately I was still deviant. 0:21:44.880 --> 0:21:48.479 Wasn't safe. Didn't super work out extremely well for me. 0:21:49.600 --> 0:21:53.040 One of the things that creeps me out so much 0:21:53.119 --> 0:21:57.640 now that I'm not restricting is that I of course 0:21:57.800 --> 0:22:03.399 it was unpleasant to be exhausted and irritable, all the 0:22:03.480 --> 0:22:06.399 things that hunger chronic hunger creates, right, like, you know, 0:22:06.560 --> 0:22:13.359 really physical discomfort, exhaustion, irritability, all the stuff. But I 0:22:13.400 --> 0:22:18.879 remember feeling, in the depths of my physical weakness from hunger, 0:22:19.840 --> 0:22:26.159 this sense of femininity that I never felt. Oh yes, 0:22:26.359 --> 0:22:29.920 And it was so powerful and so intoxicating to me. 0:22:30.480 --> 0:22:35.520 That weakness, that frailty was a sort of coveted and 0:22:35.640 --> 0:22:39.119 prized experience for me, and it felt very exotic and 0:22:39.160 --> 0:22:42.440 special and whatever. Do you know what I'm talking I do? 0:22:42.800 --> 0:22:44.919 I was like, oh my god, I'm fainting like a 0:22:45.000 --> 0:22:49.960 Victorian woman. Yes, but which is like, which is so 0:22:50.119 --> 0:22:53.360 tied to that white feminine yea, well, and I think 0:22:53.400 --> 0:22:55.639 like for I mean, I don't know, forgive me if 0:22:55.640 --> 0:22:58.080 I'm overstepping, but like, I think that for both of us, 0:22:58.600 --> 0:23:04.520 the white woman idea, y'all was very present in our home. Yeah, yes, 0:23:04.800 --> 0:23:09.760 very much so, me and my little sister. We didn't 0:23:09.760 --> 0:23:11.240 really grow up around my dad's side of the family. 0:23:11.240 --> 0:23:16.520 We were only around extremely thin white women. And that 0:23:16.600 --> 0:23:18.879 was just like the way I wanted to be. I 0:23:18.960 --> 0:23:21.840 just wanted to be like, like I said, a fainting 0:23:21.920 --> 0:23:28.400 Victorian woman, small enough to be easily kidnapped. Wow, like 0:23:30.680 --> 0:23:33.040 the type of person you could just throw over your 0:23:33.040 --> 0:23:38.080 shoulder and rescue or kidnapper leave with a dragon like, Yes, 0:23:38.680 --> 0:23:44.240 small enough to be easily contained. Like that's what I was. Like. Oh, 0:23:44.280 --> 0:23:48.880 I feel so like beautiful and feminine. And even though 0:23:48.920 --> 0:23:51.199 all my hair is falling out and my skin is 0:23:51.320 --> 0:23:56.440 terrible and I have constant diarrhea from chewing sugarless gum, 0:23:56.520 --> 0:24:03.680 I feel so sexy and feminine. Yeah, I'm thinking about 0:24:04.080 --> 0:24:09.919 who historically has benefited the most. It is you know, 0:24:09.960 --> 0:24:12.920 the closer you get to that white ideal, that thin ideal, 0:24:13.600 --> 0:24:17.359 the more access that you're going to get right relative 0:24:17.440 --> 0:24:21.600 to of course white dudes. But I kind of want 0:24:21.640 --> 0:24:26.359 to return to the concept of living with an eating 0:24:26.359 --> 0:24:29.720 disorder coming through it, Like for you, what was the 0:24:29.840 --> 0:24:33.119 breaking in the clouds moment for you that Did that 0:24:33.160 --> 0:24:37.119 happen internally or was it external? So it was a 0:24:37.119 --> 0:24:39.880 combination of both. So I was hospitalized a couple of times. 0:24:40.920 --> 0:24:44.399 Hospitalization is super effective because it sucks and you're like, 0:24:44.440 --> 0:24:47.800 I would do anything to not have to do that again. 0:24:48.040 --> 0:24:50.240 I also was starting to have issues with my heart, 0:24:50.880 --> 0:24:53.720 which still kind of carry through to this day. And 0:24:54.920 --> 0:24:57.480 I got to the point where I was like, I'm 0:24:57.480 --> 0:25:02.080 going to die round that time, and this is I 0:25:02.080 --> 0:25:04.520 feel like this is such like a niche Bay Area experience, 0:25:04.560 --> 0:25:07.600 but whatever. I took mushrooms for the first time, and 0:25:08.359 --> 0:25:10.240 I had this moment where I was looking at myself 0:25:10.280 --> 0:25:12.919 in the bathroom year and I was like, I have 0:25:13.080 --> 0:25:15.959 so much love for this person and I'd never had 0:25:16.000 --> 0:25:19.160 that feeling before. And as soon as I came down, 0:25:19.240 --> 0:25:22.720 that feeling went away, but I knew i'd had it. 0:25:23.840 --> 0:25:27.280 That really was like a turning point for me. And 0:25:27.800 --> 0:25:31.800 like right after that, I graduated from the various programs 0:25:31.840 --> 0:25:37.119 I was in for my eating disorder, started on an 0:25:37.160 --> 0:25:42.800 anti psychotic medication, and after I was put on medication, 0:25:42.880 --> 0:25:45.880 I gained about one hundred and thirty pounds in one year, 0:25:47.119 --> 0:25:49.800 which was like a jarring experience. I'm not gonna lie, 0:25:51.800 --> 0:25:55.399 but basically, I'm like, I'm at the point that like, 0:25:55.440 --> 0:25:57.239 even when those feelings come up, I'm like, what am 0:25:57.240 --> 0:26:02.840 I going to do? Lose one hundred and thirty pounds? No? Right, 0:26:03.160 --> 0:26:07.480 Like that's not gonna happen, So fuck it. Do you 0:26:07.480 --> 0:26:08.840 know how long it would take you to lose one 0:26:08.920 --> 0:26:11.920 hundred and thirty pounds? Bailey? Not fucking worth it. So 0:26:12.280 --> 0:26:15.200 I'm gonna love myself here, Yeah, in a way that 0:26:15.280 --> 0:26:20.280 I never have when I was thinner. And it's awesome totally. 0:26:20.680 --> 0:26:24.840 I mean, when we met, you were already aware of 0:26:25.000 --> 0:26:30.480 fad activism and fad acceptance. I'm curious about your introduction 0:26:30.560 --> 0:26:33.960 to it. Yeah, Honestly, I'm not sure. I feel like 0:26:34.000 --> 0:26:37.720 my introduction was probably through Tumbler, Like I was big 0:26:37.840 --> 0:26:41.520 into Tumbler when I was in high school. And I 0:26:41.680 --> 0:26:46.880 also because i'd like been through this whole eating disordered journey. 0:26:47.400 --> 0:26:49.600 There were like little bits like there were like a 0:26:49.640 --> 0:26:51.960 couple of people who I ran into who were like 0:26:52.080 --> 0:26:55.479 doctors or psychiatrists or psychologists who were like, hey, like 0:26:56.080 --> 0:27:03.159 there's a different way to look at this then. I like, 0:27:03.160 --> 0:27:08.359 when I was around eighteen, I want to say, kind 0:27:08.400 --> 0:27:10.439 of I had this group of friends. We were like 0:27:10.480 --> 0:27:14.600 a very alternative, very queer, even though I was still 0:27:14.680 --> 0:27:18.760 dating men and saying I was a lesbian, and we 0:27:18.840 --> 0:27:23.200 had like crazy colored hair and we're all black, and 0:27:23.680 --> 0:27:27.920 like just kind of like talked about like are very 0:27:28.240 --> 0:27:32.359 like I don't know, various intersections of oppression. And it 0:27:32.400 --> 0:27:36.520 was this moment where I was like, I'm I'm fat, 0:27:36.560 --> 0:27:40.520 I'm a freak, I'm queer, and I like I love it. 0:27:40.760 --> 0:27:43.679 Like I just got really into it. And that was 0:27:44.280 --> 0:27:46.560 I feel like when I started to kind of build 0:27:46.640 --> 0:27:49.879 this like internal self esteem where I would just like 0:27:49.960 --> 0:27:53.160 pump myself up all the time, post so many selfies 0:27:53.200 --> 0:27:55.320