WEBVTT - Marvin and Teaira 0:00:00.320 --> 0:00:03.239 The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are solely 0:00:03.279 --> 0:00:06.439 those of the authors and participants and do not necessarily 0:00:06.480 --> 0:00:10.200 represent those of iHeart Media, Tenderfoot TV, or their employees. 0:00:10.640 --> 0:00:14.800 This series contains discussions of violence and sexual violence. Listener 0:00:14.840 --> 0:00:21.600 discretion is advised. Previously an algorithm, we dug into Darren 0:00:21.640 --> 0:00:25.120 Bond's past crimes, like how he terrorized his ex girlfriend 0:00:25.160 --> 0:00:29.280 in two thousand four the Girl Fire, Beat on Fire 0:00:29.360 --> 0:00:33.800 and go to Building of All It. After serving time 0:00:33.800 --> 0:00:37.040 and Gary, Von moved back to Austin where he's sexually 0:00:37.080 --> 0:00:46.199 assaulted and almost killed a young woman Papa. But prosecutors 0:00:46.200 --> 0:00:49.200 in Austin say they were unaware of Von's violent past 0:00:49.400 --> 0:00:52.920 and labeled him as a low risk offender. Von pled 0:00:52.920 --> 0:00:55.960 guilty and served five years in prison, and after his 0:00:56.040 --> 0:01:01.040 release he went straight back to Indiana. This episode what 0:01:01.200 --> 0:01:05.240 happened when women started disappearing in Gary? But I really 0:01:05.280 --> 0:01:09.520 thought we caught longs half ago the first personal right 0:01:09.560 --> 0:01:11.840 in here. I don't want to say how I am 0:01:11.959 --> 0:01:22.600 no now states where this is everything from my Heart 0:01:22.640 --> 0:01:26.840 Media and Tenderfoot TV. This is algorithm and I'm ben 0:01:26.880 --> 0:01:31.520 Keye Brick. After Vaughan was released from prison in Austin 0:01:31.760 --> 0:01:35.080 he needed somewhere to stay. Von ended up going straight 0:01:35.080 --> 0:01:37.959 back to Gary and moving in with his brother, Reginald Beard. 0:01:38.800 --> 0:01:42.319 It's unclear exactly when Von started killing after he returned 0:01:42.319 --> 0:01:45.959 to Indiana, but Von's confirmed murders, the ones where he 0:01:45.959 --> 0:01:49.200 took police to the bodies, those appeared to have started 0:01:49.280 --> 0:01:55.000 six months after Vaughan was released from prison, when on Januen, 0:01:55.520 --> 0:02:03.560 Tierra Batty disappeared. She was kind person. Either if she 0:02:03.600 --> 0:02:05.760 can't help a person right then and this she would 0:02:05.760 --> 0:02:08.880 find a way to make something that happens for you know. 0:02:09.040 --> 0:02:11.320 She was like putting a smile on a person's face. 0:02:13.720 --> 0:02:19.400 My name is Marvin Clinton and gl was fiance. And 0:02:19.720 --> 0:02:22.679 how did you guys first meet? I'm in her on 0:02:22.840 --> 0:02:26.800 a cold winter night in the winter of two thousand 0:02:26.760 --> 0:02:30.359 and eight. I was dripping down the street and it 0:02:30.520 --> 0:02:33.040 was snow on the ground, and I just seen the 0:02:33.120 --> 0:02:36.760 person walking that the election was stressed to be outside 0:02:36.800 --> 0:02:39.680 in the wintertime instead of having on the winter coach 0:02:39.880 --> 0:02:43.359 on like a thin jacket. So I pulled up and 0:02:43.960 --> 0:02:47.120 acts she needed ris somewhere and she said yeah, but 0:02:47.160 --> 0:02:50.200 I in mind. We shaid and talked for a minute, 0:02:50.200 --> 0:02:54.000 then we exchanged from my birth and then it took 0:02:54.000 --> 0:02:58.840 off from there. Marvin liked how kind Tier was and 0:02:58.919 --> 0:03:00.720 they had more in common, and then he would have 0:03:00.760 --> 0:03:05.360 guessed her thing was football. My thing was basketball. But 0:03:05.400 --> 0:03:08.520 it was fun, you know, because she talked the way 0:03:08.520 --> 0:03:11.440 to get me interested in it and last a verse 0:03:11.639 --> 0:03:14.240 with me. Susan kind of like you could teach her 0:03:14.280 --> 0:03:18.600 about basketball, and she would teach him about football exactly. 0:03:19.800 --> 0:03:23.160 Tira and Marvin continued to date over the next four years, 0:03:23.440 --> 0:03:27.079 and in January they had a son together, tray Von. 0:03:27.960 --> 0:03:30.280 You'll actually hear him some in the background of this 0:03:30.320 --> 0:03:35.200 phone call. Tira and Marvin lived separately, and their sons 0:03:35.240 --> 0:03:38.560 stayed with Marvin, but if Tira wasn't around, she would 0:03:38.600 --> 0:03:42.840 always call. She made it a habit to talk to 0:03:42.960 --> 0:03:45.760 him three times a day. She had talked to him 0:03:45.800 --> 0:03:47.760 before he go to school, she had talked to him 0:03:47.800 --> 0:03:50.480 when he come home from school, and then she had 0:03:50.480 --> 0:03:52.080 talked to him before I put him in a bid 0:03:52.680 --> 0:03:55.920 and that was assisted with her. She never was a 0:03:56.000 --> 0:04:01.800 minute earlier. She never was a minute make On January thirteentheen, 0:04:02.320 --> 0:04:07.120 Tira disappeared. She was only twenty eight years old. We 0:04:07.240 --> 0:04:09.960 got up that morning we went around. We did a 0:04:10.040 --> 0:04:13.800 lit shopping, and I think around noon we went in 0:04:14.480 --> 0:04:19.520 Peppy Tacos's, just like a little local Mexican place. Yeahs 0:04:19.600 --> 0:04:24.080 complaining heavy tacos with Margarita's. I had a burrito squeeze 0:04:24.120 --> 0:04:29.600 and she hid full tacos two crush intoksal and then 0:04:29.720 --> 0:04:32.719 we just hung out for the rest of the day, 0:04:33.360 --> 0:04:37.839 watch TV, and I left and went to my house. 0:04:39.320 --> 0:04:42.920 She told him she's gonna call me later and wait 0:04:43.000 --> 0:04:47.800 on a call. It never happened. This wasn't normal for Tierra. 0:04:48.480 --> 0:04:51.159 She never missed her checking calls with her son, no 0:04:51.160 --> 0:04:54.480 matter what was going on. She went calls. I went 0:04:54.520 --> 0:05:00.200 on and I wait the world. Maybe she looked up out. 0:05:01.880 --> 0:05:06.360 I thought she probably fell asleep or so and round 0:05:07.200 --> 0:05:09.440 good night. The one in the morning, I tried to 0:05:09.520 --> 0:05:12.320 give him her a call, but I couldn't get an answer. 0:05:13.200 --> 0:05:15.560 And then I know, I texted her a couple of times, 0:05:15.640 --> 0:05:18.680 still no answer. I didn't think too much of it, 0:05:18.839 --> 0:05:21.760 you know, but then the next morning she didn't call. 0:05:22.640 --> 0:05:25.919 Then she didn't call that afternoon after you bout in school, 0:05:27.839 --> 0:05:31.320 and then she didn't call that night. You know, were 0:05:31.360 --> 0:05:34.440 by a house. Let myself in she want nowhere in 0:05:34.520 --> 0:05:40.719 the house. The second day not here from a contacted 0:05:40.839 --> 0:05:44.920 police and they said, well, you have to wait StEB 0:05:45.000 --> 0:05:48.599 me two hours to report the person missing to Marvin 0:05:48.680 --> 0:05:51.400 waited another day and then went back to the police, 0:05:51.800 --> 0:05:54.440 but he still couldn't convince them that something was wrong. 0:05:55.360 --> 0:05:57.599 They what they were telling enough that she probably want 0:05:57.600 --> 0:06:00.040 to be bothered with nobody. But we knew it that 0:06:00.240 --> 0:06:03.480 wasn't the case. But you n the work off with 0:06:03.680 --> 0:06:08.080 it because she called every day at the same time 0:06:08.279 --> 0:06:12.479 on the die. So a week and a half went 0:06:12.520 --> 0:06:15.640 by still having heard from him, Seeing that nobody talked 0:06:15.640 --> 0:06:19.839 to us, she had called anybody phone. We kept pounding 0:06:19.880 --> 0:06:23.159 them about the miss a person thing, and about two 0:06:23.200 --> 0:06:26.360 weeks and two that's when they finally came out and 0:06:26.360 --> 0:06:29.520 did a report. Marvin had been calling to his cell 0:06:29.560 --> 0:06:32.680 phone over and over. He says, her phone would ring 0:06:32.800 --> 0:06:35.400 and then get a voicemail, and he left her message 0:06:35.440 --> 0:06:39.159 after message until the mailbox was full, and then he 0:06:39.240 --> 0:06:46.200 started noticing something unusual. Sometimes voicemail before and then sometimes 0:06:46.440 --> 0:06:48.600 it was like somebody was going in that empty in 0:06:48.640 --> 0:06:52.159 the voicemail to the point where you can leave messages. 0:07:05.520 --> 0:07:12.320 In January, Marvin Clinton's fiancee, Tierra Batty, disappeared. Marvin called 0:07:12.360 --> 0:07:16.400 her repeatedly and never got through, but he noticed something strange. 0:07:17.160 --> 0:07:19.800 Sometimes it would tell him the voicemail was full, but 0:07:19.920 --> 0:07:22.440 other times there would be room to leave a message. 0:07:22.920 --> 0:07:25.200 What did you think was going on with the voicemails? 0:07:25.760 --> 0:07:30.760 I'm thinking somebody had not a pass code, or maybe 0:07:30.800 --> 0:07:32.840 she had gave him her pass called because she would 0:07:32.920 --> 0:07:36.920 let people use her phone, or maybe she lost the phone, 0:07:37.080 --> 0:07:41.200 or somebody just stole the phone. Whatever was going on, 0:07:41.560 --> 0:07:45.000 Marvin realized that the phone was a clue. If Tira 0:07:45.120 --> 0:07:47.280 still had it, maybe they could use the phone to 0:07:47.320 --> 0:07:50.640 locate her, and if she didn't, whoever was using it 0:07:50.680 --> 0:07:52.880 would be able to tell him something about how they'd 0:07:52.920 --> 0:07:56.720 gotten the phone. Marvin went to the police and asked 0:07:56.720 --> 0:07:59.360 them to investigate it. They were like, well, you know, 0:07:59.400 --> 0:08:02.080 we gotta get the warn we got this that it's 0:08:02.080 --> 0:08:04.960 gonna take time. So I said, okay, I'm gonna cut 0:08:05.000 --> 0:08:07.960 out the little man. So Marvin went to the Boost 0:08:08.000 --> 0:08:11.400 Mobile store, where he and Tira both had phone subscriptions. 0:08:11.840 --> 0:08:14.240 I knew the guy at the full store, he knew 0:08:14.280 --> 0:08:16.360 both of us, and he knew I would come in 0:08:16.400 --> 0:08:19.560 and pay both phone bills. So I talked to him 0:08:19.560 --> 0:08:22.040 I tone was going on. He gave me the print 0:08:22.080 --> 0:08:27.080 out of phone records. The phone records showed that Tira's 0:08:27.160 --> 0:08:30.280 phone was being used to make outgoing calls, but they 0:08:30.320 --> 0:08:33.840 weren't to any numbers that Marvin was familiar with. It 0:08:34.000 --> 0:08:40.040 was numbers with different area codes like Chicago, the suburbs 0:08:40.080 --> 0:08:43.680 of Chicago that was at least an hour hour and 0:08:43.720 --> 0:08:47.240 half away from where we were staying. So I said, 0:08:47.280 --> 0:08:51.280 well let me start. It's best gating myself. I started 0:08:51.280 --> 0:08:53.960 callings from the numbers, and a lot of numbers had 0:08:54.000 --> 0:08:59.400 became connected, but there was maybe five numbers that someone 0:08:59.480 --> 0:09:03.320 asked the phone and will always be a female that 0:09:03.360 --> 0:09:08.559 would ask them the phone. So I would say, hey, 0:09:08.800 --> 0:09:10.880 I'm calling and see if you know this person. Then 0:09:10.880 --> 0:09:12.760 they'd be like, well, how did you give my number? 0:09:13.200 --> 0:09:16.440 I said, well, this person is missing and it showed 0:09:16.480 --> 0:09:20.720 that her phone called your number, so I want to 0:09:20.720 --> 0:09:23.360 know if you know her or have you seen her? 0:09:24.080 --> 0:09:27.880 And then when I tell them it's a female, they 0:09:27.960 --> 0:09:32.199 respond to me, is that out on associate with females? 0:09:32.960 --> 0:09:35.839 M hm? So I said, well, do you remember who 0:09:35.880 --> 0:09:38.480 would call you from this number? And I would give 0:09:38.520 --> 0:09:41.400 them the number. They all would say that it will 0:09:41.440 --> 0:09:45.600 be a guy call it m hmm. It became clear 0:09:45.840 --> 0:09:49.719 that some man was using tirast phone, but Marvin had 0:09:49.760 --> 0:09:53.000 no idea who it was. One of the women Marvin 0:09:53.080 --> 0:09:56.400 spoke to seemed sympathetic to a story and offered to 0:09:56.440 --> 0:10:01.000 help man her got more into talking about what was 0:10:01.040 --> 0:10:04.920 going on, and she told me. She said, well, I 0:10:04.960 --> 0:10:08.720 don't associate with women. And I say, so, what do 0:10:08.800 --> 0:10:11.960 you mean? So she asked me, what do you need 0:10:12.000 --> 0:10:13.480 me to spell it out for you. I said, no, 0:10:13.600 --> 0:10:16.679 I understand what you're talking about. Nowt for me that 0:10:18.840 --> 0:10:23.880 she was more of a working woman to prostitute. And 0:10:23.920 --> 0:10:26.600 we talked a couple of times, and then it got 0:10:26.640 --> 0:10:28.920 to the point where she actually tried to help me 0:10:29.080 --> 0:10:31.599 find out who had the phone. She said, well, I 0:10:32.000 --> 0:10:33.960 know I talked to the guy a couple of times 0:10:34.520 --> 0:10:37.760 from that number and he was trying to pick me up, 0:10:38.360 --> 0:10:39.800 you know, he was trying to go out on a 0:10:39.880 --> 0:10:43.120 date with me. And I said, well when I called, 0:10:43.559 --> 0:10:47.920 no one answer. So she said, okay, well let me 0:10:47.960 --> 0:10:49.720 see what I could do. So she told me she 0:10:49.800 --> 0:10:52.560 was going to call it not before me, and see 0:10:52.600 --> 0:10:55.079 if she could get anybody answer, So we were the 0:10:55.120 --> 0:10:59.839 sworman since he had been calling her that if she 0:11:00.120 --> 0:11:03.880 called the number back, you know, he would ask them 0:11:03.920 --> 0:11:06.720 because she has spoke to him on that nomber before. 0:11:08.520 --> 0:11:11.120 But then she finally called me back and said, well, 0:11:11.920 --> 0:11:14.840 I'm not getting the answer. So that was the end 0:11:14.880 --> 0:11:19.080 of that. And so at that time, what were you thinking, 0:11:19.760 --> 0:11:22.920 like might have happened to her? I just knew something 0:11:22.960 --> 0:11:27.120 one right. I didn't have an idea what may have happened. 0:11:27.480 --> 0:11:31.920 I just knew something wasn't right. Marvin didn't know exactly 0:11:31.960 --> 0:11:34.080 what was going on, but he felt like he was 0:11:34.160 --> 0:11:37.000 onto something. So he went back to the police and 0:11:37.040 --> 0:11:39.559 told them that a man had been using Tira's phone 0:11:39.679 --> 0:11:46.040 to call prostitutes. I gave the detective a copy of 0:11:46.040 --> 0:11:49.280 the phone records. You seemed like he was interested in it, 0:11:49.360 --> 0:11:52.600 and he didn't tell me thanks. But from that point 0:11:52.640 --> 0:11:56.040 on what he did with the record, I have no idea. 0:11:57.240 --> 0:11:59.680 And do you remember around when that would have been. 0:12:00.440 --> 0:12:05.200 That would have been in mid February. Marvin says that 0:12:05.320 --> 0:12:08.000 after he'd given the Gary police hear his Foon records, 0:12:08.360 --> 0:12:11.520 he would regularly call to check in on their investigation. 0:12:12.200 --> 0:12:15.439 I was calling in maybe twice a week every week. 0:12:15.760 --> 0:12:18.719 If I would talk to him on Monday, I'll make 0:12:18.840 --> 0:12:22.280 my attentions to call him by Friday. Let's see what 0:12:22.480 --> 0:12:26.760 happened between Monday and Friday. Because it felt like nothing 0:12:26.880 --> 0:12:31.240 was being done. That's always we actively looking for. We're 0:12:31.240 --> 0:12:34.760 trying to gather what information we could gather, same old 0:12:35.000 --> 0:12:37.840 thing every week. And were you trying to like hold 0:12:37.920 --> 0:12:40.800 him accountable, like let him know, like, hey, I'm I'm 0:12:40.840 --> 0:12:44.760 gonna keep on you until you do something. Well he 0:12:44.920 --> 0:12:48.120 kind of figured that out. He mentioned to me, you 0:12:48.280 --> 0:12:52.080 do call a lot, and I'm like, yeah, I do. 0:12:52.440 --> 0:12:56.320 But my thing is I'm trying to get answers. Yeah, 0:12:56.559 --> 0:12:59.880 so you're going to hear from me until we do 0:13:00.120 --> 0:13:04.920 get asses. Unsatisfied with the lack of progress that police 0:13:04.920 --> 0:13:09.520 seemed to be making, Marvin continued investigating Tira's disappearance on 0:13:09.600 --> 0:13:14.080 his own. I would go to different nightclubs, different bars 0:13:14.120 --> 0:13:17.480 and stuff. Actually, hey, have you seen this person in here? 0:13:17.679 --> 0:13:20.840 I will leave a picture with information on the back 0:13:20.880 --> 0:13:24.480 of it. If you see her, here's my phone novel 0:13:24.679 --> 0:13:27.760 or calmed now one one because she's been reported missing. 0:13:28.440 --> 0:13:32.080 And then around March, somewhere between March April. I started 0:13:32.120 --> 0:13:35.480 in romas a woman who went by the name China 0:13:35.880 --> 0:13:39.720 was saying that she knew where Tira was. China was 0:13:39.800 --> 0:13:43.160 going around telling people that she's in a band of 0:13:43.240 --> 0:13:46.480 building on the west side of the town, and then 0:13:47.160 --> 0:13:51.080 she was the scene. So did you hear it straight 0:13:51.120 --> 0:13:55.120 from China or someone told you that she had been 0:13:55.120 --> 0:13:58.640 going around saying that I heard it from different people 0:13:59.080 --> 0:14:02.360 that this was China was saying. So, I mean, if 0:14:02.360 --> 0:14:04.120 it would have just been one person, I could have 0:14:04.200 --> 0:14:07.360 just kind of brushed it on. But when you're here 0:14:07.440 --> 0:14:12.439 from multiple people, different people, you know, then it starts 0:14:12.480 --> 0:14:32.200 to sink again. In the spring of Marvin Clinton went 0:14:32.240 --> 0:14:36.520 to the detective working on terrabetes missing person case. So 0:14:36.560 --> 0:14:38.360 I told him, I said, this is what I'm hearing 0:14:38.400 --> 0:14:43.360 on the streets. So he actually went and picked China up. 0:14:44.440 --> 0:14:49.280 He picked up on another charge, and he helped her 0:14:49.640 --> 0:14:54.120 in jail for three or four days. And he said 0:14:54.120 --> 0:14:56.400 he's been with a couple of times trying to get 0:14:56.720 --> 0:15:01.880 information out on for but she would used talk to him. 0:15:01.880 --> 0:15:06.600 So that made me start thinking, what she a part 0:15:06.640 --> 0:15:11.440 of this? That she helped with this, you know, because 0:15:11.640 --> 0:15:15.880 a person only knows so much unless they there, and 0:15:16.920 --> 0:15:20.280 for her to say that she's dead on the west 0:15:20.360 --> 0:15:26.560 side of town, that's knowing an awful lot. Yeah, do 0:15:26.680 --> 0:15:30.400 your China's real name? No? And have you ever ever 0:15:30.560 --> 0:15:34.160 met her? I've seen her a couple time of physically 0:15:34.240 --> 0:15:39.800 met her. See you've never like asked her for more information. 0:15:41.120 --> 0:15:44.040 Are you curious about that? Like how she found that out? 0:15:44.320 --> 0:15:47.520 I've been I've been curious about that from day one 0:15:47.560 --> 0:15:51.520 when I first started hitting it, you know. But then 0:15:52.520 --> 0:15:55.360 the detective was telling me, you know, he said, well, hey, 0:15:55.960 --> 0:15:58.400 let me do my job. This is my job. You know, 0:15:58.480 --> 0:16:01.240 you gave me the information, Now let me do my job. 0:16:02.120 --> 0:16:04.920 And I was like, okay, fine, you know, do you 0:16:04.960 --> 0:16:08.200 know did the police look into that? Did anyone search 0:16:08.280 --> 0:16:11.360 for the body? Yeah? He said they did those some 0:16:11.480 --> 0:16:15.120 active searches and some buildings on the west side and 0:16:15.240 --> 0:16:18.760 the east side of the town. But the buildings that 0:16:18.920 --> 0:16:23.400 they searched, they all came up empty. But remember Gary's 0:16:23.440 --> 0:16:26.720 population had been shrinking for decades, so the city was 0:16:26.840 --> 0:16:32.880 riddled with abandoned buildings. They're about seven thousand. Marvin knew 0:16:32.960 --> 0:16:35.360 from talking to the police that there was no way 0:16:35.400 --> 0:16:38.440 that they've done Thorist search, so he and some of 0:16:38.520 --> 0:16:42.440 Tira's friends decided to start searching through abandoned buildings themselves. 0:16:44.160 --> 0:16:47.240 The first building I went in to it was black 0:16:47.320 --> 0:16:52.920 of singing from a horror movie gang side stuff on 0:16:53.000 --> 0:16:57.400 the wall and old ragged couch that was sitting in 0:16:57.400 --> 0:17:02.160 a little wrong that had with the bottles, beer camp 0:17:02.600 --> 0:17:07.480 not cart it baggies, um use needles and stuff like that. 0:17:08.440 --> 0:17:12.920 And as I moved through the house, it was kind 0:17:12.960 --> 0:17:16.400 of scary because I didn't know what I would finding there. 0:17:17.520 --> 0:17:21.160 Were you worried about like running into someone, like someone 0:17:21.240 --> 0:17:25.720 who is like squatting or or something like that. No, 0:17:26.280 --> 0:17:31.560 not really, I was more worried about running into or 0:17:31.720 --> 0:17:36.480 being in there. That was the scariest part about it. 0:17:37.200 --> 0:17:41.200 You know. Then I stumbled in the house that I 0:17:41.520 --> 0:17:45.399 be had her in the house. Yeah, you're trying to 0:17:45.440 --> 0:17:48.200 find her, but at the same time, you almost don't 0:17:48.200 --> 0:17:54.000 want to find her exactly exactly, you know, because then 0:17:54.040 --> 0:17:59.720 you have that immature how you found her. Yeah, and 0:18:00.160 --> 0:18:04.439 and you don't know what you would look like. When's 0:18:04.480 --> 0:18:09.880 the founder if if somebody you're recognize, somebody won't recognize. 0:18:10.640 --> 0:18:13.320 So in a way, I always said to myself, Okay, 0:18:13.320 --> 0:18:16.760 I'm glad I didn't find because I want to be 0:18:16.800 --> 0:18:20.879 the one to find a person that way anyway, But 0:18:21.840 --> 0:18:25.600 I felt, you know, it was something I had to 0:18:25.680 --> 0:18:30.320 do because I felt that game police department one't doing enough. 0:18:31.680 --> 0:18:34.600 Marvin says that when he told police he was investigating 0:18:34.640 --> 0:18:38.639 abandoned buildings himself, they told him to stop. And I 0:18:38.760 --> 0:18:44.760 was like, okay, why you should want all the help 0:18:44.840 --> 0:18:49.199 you can't search you. And this explanation for me not 0:18:49.400 --> 0:18:52.320 doing it was because he said, I hate for you 0:18:52.359 --> 0:18:55.960 to be and when the houses, I know what you're 0:18:56.000 --> 0:18:58.560 not looking for. You know what you're not looking for. 0:18:59.040 --> 0:19:02.840 But just say another police drive up and see you 0:19:02.960 --> 0:19:05.919 coming out of his house, he gonna want to know 0:19:06.400 --> 0:19:10.440 what you're doing in there. So he said, I would 0:19:10.440 --> 0:19:12.199 hate to have to come and get you out of 0:19:12.280 --> 0:19:18.080 jail for being an these abandoned builders. And then he said, also, 0:19:18.240 --> 0:19:21.120 it's not really safe to do it because you don't 0:19:21.160 --> 0:19:24.280 know what the condition of the buildings before you go 0:19:24.440 --> 0:19:28.639 in now hm. So I kind of backed off of 0:19:29.040 --> 0:19:31.879 doing that, but I continue to go around with the 0:19:31.960 --> 0:19:36.200 pictures and things like that. You know, you wanted the more, 0:19:36.320 --> 0:19:39.840 but your hands really tied as far as what you 0:19:39.920 --> 0:19:44.000 can do. So the angle part come in because you 0:19:44.160 --> 0:19:48.640 felt like when none being done, you know, when none 0:19:48.680 --> 0:19:52.720 being done. And as the case went on, the more 0:19:52.840 --> 0:19:59.280 angry you got, because now it's turned from one month 0:19:59.480 --> 0:20:08.480 to months, six months and nothing that's being done. Do 0:20:08.560 --> 0:20:14.000 you remember where you were when you learned that Tira 0:20:14.240 --> 0:20:19.880 had died? Yeah? I would. Actually I was at home 0:20:20.280 --> 0:20:27.080 watching CNN and the story about Afric hardy Head came on, 0:20:28.480 --> 0:20:32.199 and they put up four of the seven names that 0:20:32.359 --> 0:20:37.960 they had identified. One person they had on there. They 0:20:38.000 --> 0:20:41.440 didn't have her name, but they heard what she was wearing, 0:20:42.560 --> 0:20:49.320 blue jeans, a blue hoodie under brownish colored coat, and 0:20:50.200 --> 0:20:55.920 right then I knew it well, because that's exactly what 0:20:56.160 --> 0:21:04.439 she had on left day. I seen her, and I 0:21:04.600 --> 0:21:08.760 picked up the phone and I called the Corners office 0:21:08.960 --> 0:21:11.879 and I said, I know who that person is. So 0:21:12.040 --> 0:21:14.439 I gave them the name of the dinners that I 0:21:14.520 --> 0:21:18.800 took it too, and they typed up a warning. They 0:21:18.840 --> 0:21:22.560 went to the dinnerst office and poor to Dentner records. 0:21:23.560 --> 0:21:26.920 The first couple of hours was really anxious because they 0:21:26.920 --> 0:21:29.800 they had called me right back. But you know, after 0:21:29.840 --> 0:21:34.000 three hours went by, I kind of relaxed because I like, well, 0:21:34.080 --> 0:21:38.600 maybe it wasn't her. Somebody just said on the same 0:21:38.640 --> 0:21:42.680 clothes she had on. And then my phone from the 0:21:42.800 --> 0:21:46.359 corner office and he told me he just wanted to 0:21:46.400 --> 0:21:51.720 confront that the dental records matched up and it was her. 0:21:54.440 --> 0:21:59.640 Now the hard part about it where her body was found. 0:22:00.359 --> 0:22:05.679 It's only like about nine blocks from where I stayed, 0:22:07.080 --> 0:22:11.119 So she was basically around the corner from where I lived. 0:22:12.359 --> 0:22:15.639 And what strikes me about it. Once everything came to 0:22:15.720 --> 0:22:20.639 a head, I got curious about the information China was 0:22:20.680 --> 0:22:25.640 putting out there, because everything she was saying was correct 0:22:26.240 --> 0:22:31.480 except for one detail. She was to see she was 0:22:31.600 --> 0:22:35.399 something in banded building, But China was saying she was 0:22:35.480 --> 0:22:37.560 in a banded building on the west side of town, 0:22:37.600 --> 0:22:40.080 But she was actually in a banded building on the 0:22:40.200 --> 0:22:43.760 east side of town. And see that brings back the 0:22:43.800 --> 0:22:47.480 point I was making earlier. You know, how would China 0:22:47.560 --> 0:22:52.119 know she did she in the band and building, But 0:22:52.200 --> 0:22:55.440 there any difference is what side of town she was 0:22:55.480 --> 0:22:58.520 found on. Yeah, see, what what do you think it's 0:22:58.520 --> 0:23:00.640 going on there? Like do you think the body got 0:23:00.720 --> 0:23:05.080 moved or do you think she was the body didn't 0:23:05.119 --> 0:23:09.320 get moved, she was killed where she was found. Mhm. 0:23:10.640 --> 0:23:14.359 You know, I had a scenario where I thought, well, 0:23:15.320 --> 0:23:20.840 maybe trying to hurt it from somebody else, and then 0:23:21.000 --> 0:23:24.879 she was just freading, you know, with with her. A 0:23:24.920 --> 0:23:28.359 lot of things came to mind that could have been this, 0:23:28.520 --> 0:23:31.640 could have been that. How you know because she's been 0:23:31.680 --> 0:23:35.399 involved or did you know who did it? We don't know, 0:23:35.680 --> 0:23:38.640 and and still today we don't know because she stopped 0:23:38.680 --> 0:23:44.600 talking to the police. Now it's possible that she could 0:23:44.600 --> 0:23:49.840 have knew Damn Van herself because as things came out, 0:23:50.640 --> 0:23:54.200 China New Tierra and they hung out in the same 0:23:54.280 --> 0:24:00.000 area together and come and find out vand head frequency 0:24:00.040 --> 0:24:05.040 at area. He was the regular around that area. Because 0:24:05.160 --> 0:24:08.280 once this picture came out, a lot of people in 0:24:08.280 --> 0:24:11.359 that area came up and say, hey, they have seen 0:24:11.480 --> 0:24:16.080 him in that area before. I think I read somewhere 0:24:16.280 --> 0:24:19.879 that um one of the other victims, maybe Tracy Martin 0:24:20.560 --> 0:24:24.960 also New Tierra. Yeah, who's that kind of like that 0:24:25.119 --> 0:24:30.600 same group or that same area where China was or yeah, 0:24:30.720 --> 0:24:35.320 let's say areas same group. It wasn't just Martin was 0:24:36.680 --> 0:24:41.200 full out of sea. Well, they knew each other. This 0:24:41.280 --> 0:24:43.960 is another place I'd like to reach out to the listeners. 0:24:44.320 --> 0:24:46.800 If you knew China or Tierra or we're part of 0:24:46.800 --> 0:24:49.320 the same group, please do you reach out. I'd love 0:24:49.359 --> 0:24:52.480 to talk to you. Contact information is in the show 0:24:52.520 --> 0:24:56.040 notes and at the end of the episode. Gary is 0:24:56.080 --> 0:24:59.239 a pretty big place, right, So so that's kind of 0:24:59.280 --> 0:25:03.680 surprising that four of them would have known each other. No, 0:25:03.800 --> 0:25:06.680 it's not that big area together, you know. I mean 0:25:08.119 --> 0:25:10.600 they all heard their own different habits that they had, 0:25:12.000 --> 0:25:17.000 so it wouldn't be strange for them to know each 0:25:17.080 --> 0:25:22.159 other because Gary is not that be What do you 0:25:22.160 --> 0:25:25.800 mean when you say they all had their habits. They 0:25:25.840 --> 0:25:28.400 all had their own problems that they was going through. 0:25:30.000 --> 0:25:33.080 They all had their different drug habits that they were 0:25:33.160 --> 0:25:36.680 trying to kick. Somen was able to kick it, song 0:25:36.960 --> 0:25:41.760 wasn't you know. So I just used the word habits, 0:25:41.800 --> 0:25:46.640 you know, because when some people get ideas of what 0:25:46.800 --> 0:25:50.640 other people do, a lot of people like the stereotypele 0:25:51.520 --> 0:25:55.560 I think they're a bad person. You know, they're not 0:25:55.680 --> 0:26:00.359 a bad person at all. You know, it's just someone 0:26:00.440 --> 0:26:03.119 was fighting their demons. Someone was able to kick us 0:26:03.160 --> 0:26:10.119 on what and van thing was because they had these habits, 0:26:11.240 --> 0:26:16.760 they wasn't worth living mm hmm. Because accring him. They 0:26:16.760 --> 0:26:19.840 didn't mean nothing to nobody becoming the things that they do, 0:26:20.640 --> 0:26:25.159 what the things that they did, you know, yeah, I 0:26:25.160 --> 0:26:27.080 mean I hear that, and I think that's probably the 0:26:27.800 --> 0:26:31.840 twisted way that he tried to justify it to himself, 0:26:31.880 --> 0:26:35.800 you know, right, So you know, it was one girl. 0:26:37.640 --> 0:26:42.800 She stayed out north in the suburbs of Chicago. She 0:26:43.040 --> 0:26:46.040 was one of the very very first person that ever 0:26:46.119 --> 0:26:50.600 weighing into him. But she happened to get away from him. 0:26:50.760 --> 0:26:54.440 She talked to the detective, but because of her line 0:26:54.520 --> 0:27:05.840 of work, they didn't have time for her. Next time 0:27:06.280 --> 0:27:09.480 on algorithm usually, you know, he brought a cheep back 0:27:09.520 --> 0:27:13.560 to the house and they got he's asking about your car, 0:27:13.920 --> 0:27:16.680 who knows you're there? And he took your cell phone. 0:27:17.400 --> 0:27:19.720 So you're saying that these are all science like you 0:27:19.800 --> 0:27:23.399 were probably wind up dead. They say what they heard 0:27:23.480 --> 0:27:27.239 was somebody in this dress and they look and they 0:27:27.400 --> 0:27:30.320 seen the woman taed up in the backroom of the car. 0:27:31.200 --> 0:27:35.000 Of sexual assaults in particular, the departments are under resource, 0:27:35.160 --> 0:27:38.400