1 00:00:11,720 --> 00:00:14,560 Speaker 1: Good morning, peeps, and welcome to woke f Daily with 2 00:00:14,680 --> 00:00:19,680 Speaker 1: Meet your Girl Danielle Moody. Pre recording from the Home Bunker, Folks, 3 00:00:19,760 --> 00:00:23,160 Speaker 1: I am taking a bit of a respite, but as always, 4 00:00:23,680 --> 00:00:27,320 Speaker 1: I leave you with some of my conversations with the 5 00:00:27,360 --> 00:00:30,600 Speaker 1: brightest Minds that we pre taped to deliver to you 6 00:00:30,800 --> 00:00:36,040 Speaker 1: this week. And coming up is my conversation with one 7 00:00:36,280 --> 00:00:40,520 Speaker 1: of my favorites and I know one of yours as well, Ellie, 8 00:00:40,560 --> 00:00:45,120 Speaker 1: Miss Stall, and Ellie and I get into a conversation 9 00:00:45,760 --> 00:00:49,360 Speaker 1: all about Trump and his legal woes. As we recorded this, 10 00:00:50,120 --> 00:00:55,120 Speaker 1: we were still on indictment watch, but breaking news had 11 00:00:55,160 --> 00:01:01,400 Speaker 1: happened that a third defendant was in fact indicted alongside 12 00:01:01,560 --> 00:01:06,840 Speaker 1: Donald Trump and will Noda. And so when I get 13 00:01:06,880 --> 00:01:11,480 Speaker 1: into this conversation with Ellie, we're talking about the mountain 14 00:01:11,520 --> 00:01:14,399 Speaker 1: of evidence in front of us. We're talking about the 15 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:21,319 Speaker 1: three cases, the Document's case, the insurrection case, and Fannie 16 00:01:21,319 --> 00:01:24,200 Speaker 1: Willis's you know, can you find me eleven hundred and 17 00:01:24,440 --> 00:01:27,560 Speaker 1: seven hundred and forty one votes case. So we are 18 00:01:27,600 --> 00:01:31,480 Speaker 1: going through all of that, and then we touch a 19 00:01:31,520 --> 00:01:35,319 Speaker 1: bit upon, you know, one of our favorite artists, at 20 00:01:35,400 --> 00:01:38,119 Speaker 1: least a favorite artist. When I was growing up and 21 00:01:38,200 --> 00:01:43,039 Speaker 1: how he has apparently just pad a lobotomy, and so 22 00:01:43,080 --> 00:01:46,800 Speaker 1: we get into some pop culture as well. I hope 23 00:01:46,840 --> 00:01:52,880 Speaker 1: that you enjoy this conversation with one of wok f's faves, 24 00:01:54,400 --> 00:02:02,240 Speaker 1: Ellie Mistell Folks, I am so excited to welcome back 25 00:02:02,360 --> 00:02:07,080 Speaker 1: to wok F after just too long of a time away, 26 00:02:08,360 --> 00:02:11,960 Speaker 1: which is our friend Ellie Missel, who is a justice 27 00:02:11,960 --> 00:02:16,200 Speaker 1: correspondent for the Nation and the author of Allow Me 28 00:02:16,280 --> 00:02:20,920 Speaker 1: to Retort, A Black Guy's Guide to the Constitution and 29 00:02:21,120 --> 00:02:22,760 Speaker 1: just all around. I don't know what the fuck we 30 00:02:22,880 --> 00:02:24,239 Speaker 1: call Twitter these days. 31 00:02:24,320 --> 00:02:24,880 Speaker 2: Is it X? 32 00:02:24,960 --> 00:02:25,920 Speaker 3: Is it? You know? 33 00:02:26,040 --> 00:02:26,440 Speaker 2: Trash? 34 00:02:26,480 --> 00:02:30,000 Speaker 1: It is trash, but you you make it a place 35 00:02:30,320 --> 00:02:31,320 Speaker 1: still worth going. 36 00:02:31,480 --> 00:02:32,840 Speaker 2: I will say that, Ellie. 37 00:02:32,880 --> 00:02:35,360 Speaker 3: Oh, don't put that. Don't you put that evil on me. 38 00:02:38,560 --> 00:02:40,320 Speaker 2: Let me not put that X on you by that. 39 00:02:41,880 --> 00:02:45,200 Speaker 1: So Ellie, you know I want to talk to you 40 00:02:45,800 --> 00:02:50,120 Speaker 1: because I just there are times when I wish that 41 00:02:50,200 --> 00:02:54,280 Speaker 1: I had not listened to the old white male professor 42 00:02:54,320 --> 00:02:55,799 Speaker 1: who told me it wasn't smart enough to go to 43 00:02:55,840 --> 00:02:58,600 Speaker 1: law school, and that I actually went. And it is 44 00:02:58,720 --> 00:03:03,240 Speaker 1: times when I'm trying to understand how much legal trouble 45 00:03:03,440 --> 00:03:06,440 Speaker 1: a normal person whose name was in Trump would be 46 00:03:06,560 --> 00:03:10,520 Speaker 1: in if they had all of these indictments that have 47 00:03:10,680 --> 00:03:14,079 Speaker 1: already come out, and one big one still that is looming, 48 00:03:14,120 --> 00:03:16,440 Speaker 1: actually two big ones that are looming if you're also 49 00:03:16,480 --> 00:03:20,280 Speaker 1: looking at the state of Georgia. But walk us through, 50 00:03:20,520 --> 00:03:25,200 Speaker 1: because it's potential, the potential of Donald Trump being indicted 51 00:03:25,240 --> 00:03:29,600 Speaker 1: for a third time while people are listening to this 52 00:03:30,160 --> 00:03:34,880 Speaker 1: is very high. So please walk us through where we 53 00:03:35,040 --> 00:03:41,360 Speaker 1: are in the insurrection case so as not to get 54 00:03:41,400 --> 00:03:45,880 Speaker 1: people confused with the other indictments that the former twice 55 00:03:45,880 --> 00:03:46,839 Speaker 1: impeach president has. 56 00:03:47,200 --> 00:03:49,200 Speaker 4: Yes, any look, a normal person would be in jail 57 00:03:49,360 --> 00:03:52,640 Speaker 4: like eight times over by this point. A normal person's 58 00:03:52,720 --> 00:03:56,080 Speaker 4: children would probably be in jail at least twice over 59 00:03:56,160 --> 00:04:00,240 Speaker 4: by this point. The normal rules simply don't apply to Trump. 60 00:04:00,480 --> 00:04:04,040 Speaker 4: The White rules does do. And that's kind of how 61 00:04:04,320 --> 00:04:09,320 Speaker 4: where we start with. Right, this indictment that's coming from 62 00:04:09,400 --> 00:04:13,280 Speaker 4: Jack Smith, potentially already out from Jack Smith, coming at 63 00:04:13,280 --> 00:04:16,560 Speaker 4: the time that we're recording. To me, this is the 64 00:04:16,600 --> 00:04:19,440 Speaker 4: big one. This is the one that we should have 65 00:04:19,640 --> 00:04:24,839 Speaker 4: been working towards. Since January seventh, twenty twenty one. Now, 66 00:04:25,160 --> 00:04:28,320 Speaker 4: there has been reporting about how Merreck Carlin has slow 67 00:04:28,360 --> 00:04:31,360 Speaker 4: walked the investigation and basically kind of did everything he 68 00:04:31,400 --> 00:04:34,200 Speaker 4: could to get Trump off the hook. But finally he 69 00:04:34,240 --> 00:04:38,000 Speaker 4: appointed Jack Smith. I've said on other shows Danielle that 70 00:04:38,080 --> 00:04:40,320 Speaker 4: I think I was wrong about Jack Smith. I thought 71 00:04:40,400 --> 00:04:44,000 Speaker 4: he would be kind of another Robert Muller type, and 72 00:04:44,240 --> 00:04:47,080 Speaker 4: he has not been. Now, No, he has not an 73 00:04:47,120 --> 00:04:50,560 Speaker 4: actual fucking prosecutor, and he has been putting the wood 74 00:04:51,320 --> 00:04:54,280 Speaker 4: to Trump, not just in the espionage case, but now 75 00:04:54,480 --> 00:04:57,760 Speaker 4: finally on the January sixth case. We already know that 76 00:04:57,800 --> 00:05:01,599 Speaker 4: he has interviewed. Basically, he is finally done the work 77 00:05:01,640 --> 00:05:05,040 Speaker 4: that Garland should have been doing and that the January 78 00:05:05,080 --> 00:05:09,520 Speaker 4: sixth Select Committee in Congress already did. Right, He's finally 79 00:05:09,920 --> 00:05:13,279 Speaker 4: done the interviews with the Cassidy Hutchinson's and the Mark 80 00:05:13,440 --> 00:05:16,800 Speaker 4: Meadows and the Steve Bannons. He's gotten all of that 81 00:05:16,920 --> 00:05:20,120 Speaker 4: information in and he's prepared to charge Trump with a 82 00:05:20,200 --> 00:05:24,160 Speaker 4: number of of crimes right the The the biggest ticket 83 00:05:24,160 --> 00:05:28,000 Speaker 4: would be kind of conspiracy to deprive rights through the 84 00:05:28,000 --> 00:05:32,200 Speaker 4: color of law. That's basically the trying to intimidate and 85 00:05:32,440 --> 00:05:36,640 Speaker 4: potentially assassinate Mike Pence charge, Like that's that's what that is. 86 00:05:38,040 --> 00:05:40,960 Speaker 3: He's going to be charged uh. We believe with. 87 00:05:42,400 --> 00:05:47,920 Speaker 4: Obstruction and and and and the fake electors scheme as well. 88 00:05:47,960 --> 00:05:49,360 Speaker 3: And the these. 89 00:05:49,160 --> 00:05:52,320 Speaker 4: Are the serious ones, not just serious in terms of 90 00:05:52,360 --> 00:05:57,680 Speaker 4: like legal uh uh jeopardy, but serious in terms of 91 00:05:58,279 --> 00:06:03,000 Speaker 4: actually holding the man countable for the coup he tried 92 00:06:03,080 --> 00:06:03,720 Speaker 4: to pull. 93 00:06:03,520 --> 00:06:05,080 Speaker 3: Off against the government. 94 00:06:05,240 --> 00:06:08,440 Speaker 4: Like that needs to happen, and it looks like that 95 00:06:08,440 --> 00:06:11,000 Speaker 4: that is finally going to happen. 96 00:06:11,400 --> 00:06:13,480 Speaker 3: The problem, Danielle, is that. 97 00:06:13,440 --> 00:06:15,960 Speaker 2: Because there always is one lle rce. 98 00:06:16,279 --> 00:06:17,599 Speaker 3: It's never just good news. 99 00:06:18,880 --> 00:06:22,599 Speaker 4: The problem is that that accountability, that trial over these 100 00:06:22,760 --> 00:06:27,000 Speaker 4: charges will most likely happen in twenty twenty five, and 101 00:06:27,440 --> 00:06:31,440 Speaker 4: will only be allowed to happen if Trump loses again 102 00:06:31,640 --> 00:06:36,360 Speaker 4: another presidential election, where he will again try to steal 103 00:06:36,360 --> 00:06:40,320 Speaker 4: it and potentially again try to do another coup. Right, 104 00:06:40,400 --> 00:06:43,760 Speaker 4: Like this is all because of the timeline, because of 105 00:06:43,839 --> 00:06:47,480 Speaker 4: Merrick Garland's slow walking to get us to this point. 106 00:06:48,240 --> 00:06:50,240 Speaker 4: We are now in a situation where it's just very 107 00:06:50,279 --> 00:06:54,200 Speaker 4: unlikely that any of these trials are going to happen 108 00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:58,159 Speaker 4: before the election. And that's not and there's almost nothing 109 00:06:58,160 --> 00:07:00,640 Speaker 4: we can do about that. Like the timeline is timeline, 110 00:07:01,600 --> 00:07:03,599 Speaker 4: and so Trump will get to run again. 111 00:07:04,120 --> 00:07:07,000 Speaker 2: But but but let me ask let me ask this. 112 00:07:07,080 --> 00:07:09,400 Speaker 3: I want to say why. 113 00:07:09,440 --> 00:07:11,440 Speaker 1: I don't even want to say I will say why. 114 00:07:12,400 --> 00:07:17,680 Speaker 1: But so you have first in the document's case, ailing 115 00:07:17,760 --> 00:07:20,440 Speaker 1: Cannon has set the date from May twenty fourth, twenty 116 00:07:20,480 --> 00:07:26,080 Speaker 1: twenty four, right, yep, And so that is several months 117 00:07:26,240 --> 00:07:31,440 Speaker 1: prior to the election. Why is it that? And then 118 00:07:31,560 --> 00:07:34,440 Speaker 1: Donald Trump prior to that? I believe that Donald Trump, 119 00:07:34,640 --> 00:07:40,600 Speaker 1: it has the another Egen Carroll case that I believe 120 00:07:40,680 --> 00:07:45,280 Speaker 1: is happening in October. Why wouldn't this case, which is 121 00:07:45,320 --> 00:07:49,000 Speaker 1: going to be heard in Washington, DC, because it has 122 00:07:49,080 --> 00:07:53,880 Speaker 1: such a long runway given Aileen Cannon's timeline, and there 123 00:07:53,920 --> 00:07:56,840 Speaker 1: is no need for security clearance in the way that 124 00:07:56,960 --> 00:08:00,600 Speaker 1: the documents case requires security clearance, why wouldn't that be 125 00:08:00,680 --> 00:08:03,640 Speaker 1: set for the end of the year or January? 126 00:08:04,200 --> 00:08:06,960 Speaker 4: Because trials take a long time. I mean, it's just 127 00:08:07,320 --> 00:08:11,400 Speaker 4: like there, it is. It is just true that trials, 128 00:08:11,520 --> 00:08:14,960 Speaker 4: especially trials of rich white people, take a long time 129 00:08:15,120 --> 00:08:18,920 Speaker 4: to process through the system, and the defense lawyers remember, 130 00:08:19,040 --> 00:08:20,720 Speaker 4: like a lot of times, here's here's the thing that 131 00:08:21,240 --> 00:08:23,200 Speaker 4: listeners have to think about a lot of times when 132 00:08:23,240 --> 00:08:27,680 Speaker 4: they hear about court cases or trials from television news 133 00:08:27,760 --> 00:08:30,440 Speaker 4: or even most print media. They're hearing about it from 134 00:08:30,440 --> 00:08:33,120 Speaker 4: the perspective of a prosecutor, right, and the prosecutors are 135 00:08:33,160 --> 00:08:35,719 Speaker 4: always like, go now, go now, we can do this now. 136 00:08:35,760 --> 00:08:39,559 Speaker 4: And when they are when the prosecutors are facing criminal 137 00:08:39,559 --> 00:08:46,080 Speaker 4: defendants who are underfunded, underprivileged, black Latino, the system is 138 00:08:46,200 --> 00:08:50,400 Speaker 4: very happy to go as quickly as humanly possible to 139 00:08:50,720 --> 00:08:54,680 Speaker 4: get a black and brown people in jail. But when 140 00:08:54,720 --> 00:08:59,160 Speaker 4: it happens to white people, the defense attorneys have usually 141 00:08:59,400 --> 00:09:04,800 Speaker 4: legitimate reasons and arguments to delay trial. 142 00:09:04,920 --> 00:09:05,120 Speaker 3: Right. 143 00:09:05,240 --> 00:09:08,280 Speaker 4: One of the biggest ones is that the defense lawyers 144 00:09:08,360 --> 00:09:11,800 Speaker 4: need time to go over all of the evidence that 145 00:09:11,840 --> 00:09:14,920 Speaker 4: the government has and prepare an adequate defense. 146 00:09:15,000 --> 00:09:15,200 Speaker 3: Right. 147 00:09:15,280 --> 00:09:20,680 Speaker 4: So in these cases I always argue kind of in 148 00:09:20,720 --> 00:09:23,400 Speaker 4: favor of the defense because I realized that more often 149 00:09:23,440 --> 00:09:25,640 Speaker 4: than not, what I'm doing is arguing on behalf of 150 00:09:25,760 --> 00:09:29,000 Speaker 4: black and Latino people who are being railroaded through the system. Right, 151 00:09:29,040 --> 00:09:34,400 Speaker 4: So I understand. I guess the need for defense attorneys 152 00:09:34,880 --> 00:09:37,920 Speaker 4: to have time to prepare their cases is Trump getting 153 00:09:37,960 --> 00:09:40,120 Speaker 4: more time than normal. It depends on what you think 154 00:09:40,160 --> 00:09:40,680 Speaker 4: normal is. 155 00:09:40,760 --> 00:09:40,960 Speaker 3: Right. 156 00:09:41,440 --> 00:09:43,760 Speaker 4: If you think normal is what we do to black people, 157 00:09:44,120 --> 00:09:47,280 Speaker 4: then hell yeah, he's getting way more time. Is he 158 00:09:47,320 --> 00:09:52,319 Speaker 4: getting more time than he should? The brass tax of 159 00:09:52,360 --> 00:09:54,040 Speaker 4: it is, if you look at the espionage case, at 160 00:09:54,120 --> 00:09:58,000 Speaker 4: least given when Smith was allowed to make these charges, 161 00:09:58,720 --> 00:10:00,559 Speaker 4: I think May twenty fourth is about the right date. 162 00:10:00,840 --> 00:10:04,600 Speaker 4: I think that's about the right time. Now the question is, 163 00:10:04,640 --> 00:10:07,200 Speaker 4: and I think that that this is the bigger problem. 164 00:10:08,000 --> 00:10:10,880 Speaker 4: It's unlike May twenty fourth is unlikely to hold up, 165 00:10:11,200 --> 00:10:14,600 Speaker 4: you know, so May twentieth, twenty twenty four is unlikely 166 00:10:14,679 --> 00:10:17,480 Speaker 4: to hold up because as we get closer to May twentieth, 167 00:10:17,679 --> 00:10:21,600 Speaker 4: twenty twenty four, Trump's lawyers will again ask for a delay. 168 00:10:21,600 --> 00:10:23,800 Speaker 4: They will say they were overwhelmed's so let's be they're 169 00:10:23,880 --> 00:10:26,400 Speaker 4: they're busy running a campaign. They'll say whatever they have 170 00:10:26,480 --> 00:10:29,640 Speaker 4: to say. And with Trump Judge Aileen Cannon having already 171 00:10:29,640 --> 00:10:33,800 Speaker 4: shown a willingness to delay this trial for six months, 172 00:10:34,440 --> 00:10:36,560 Speaker 4: it's I think, but this is. 173 00:10:36,679 --> 00:10:41,920 Speaker 1: This is why I think that the insurrection case has 174 00:10:41,960 --> 00:10:46,680 Speaker 1: the potential to go before Aileen Cannon's case. And my 175 00:10:46,840 --> 00:10:49,400 Speaker 1: ceiling is one because it's going to be held in DC. 176 00:10:49,720 --> 00:10:51,880 Speaker 1: I don't know me And this is a question for you, 177 00:10:52,000 --> 00:10:54,040 Speaker 1: who do we think that that judge is? 178 00:10:54,120 --> 00:10:54,200 Speaker 3: Like? 179 00:10:54,240 --> 00:10:56,319 Speaker 2: What circuit is this going through. 180 00:10:58,000 --> 00:11:03,400 Speaker 1: Is that this is actually at this about national security. Right, 181 00:11:03,600 --> 00:11:06,240 Speaker 1: You're talking about somebody who is going to be indicted 182 00:11:06,280 --> 00:11:09,120 Speaker 1: on charges that I am going to assume one of 183 00:11:09,160 --> 00:11:14,040 Speaker 1: them may in fact be seditious conspiracy, which we have 184 00:11:14,200 --> 00:11:18,840 Speaker 1: seen both keeper folks and others get charged with and 185 00:11:19,000 --> 00:11:23,480 Speaker 1: it stick. So I guess, like, am I being in 186 00:11:23,679 --> 00:11:28,760 Speaker 1: too naive Ellie in thinking that the fate of our 187 00:11:28,840 --> 00:11:35,960 Speaker 1: democracy and the person who instigated and incited the riot 188 00:11:36,080 --> 00:11:39,800 Speaker 1: on the Capitol and told people to overturn the government 189 00:11:39,960 --> 00:11:44,080 Speaker 1: who is running for election, that that would be caused 190 00:11:44,080 --> 00:11:45,840 Speaker 1: for a speedy trial. 191 00:11:47,000 --> 00:11:48,880 Speaker 4: I think you're right. I think it should. I think 192 00:11:48,920 --> 00:11:51,800 Speaker 4: that the differences in the January sixth case versus the 193 00:11:51,920 --> 00:11:57,600 Speaker 4: espionage case lend itself to a faster timeline than what 194 00:11:57,720 --> 00:12:01,000 Speaker 4: Eileen Cannon has set up for the espionage case. As 195 00:12:01,040 --> 00:12:03,520 Speaker 4: you point out, this is happening in DC. That means 196 00:12:03,520 --> 00:12:05,760 Speaker 4: that the judge, we don't know what judge will get on. 197 00:12:05,840 --> 00:12:09,760 Speaker 4: It will be a random choice from among the judges 198 00:12:09,840 --> 00:12:16,600 Speaker 4: that sit on in the DC circuit. Right, that circuit 199 00:12:16,760 --> 00:12:22,000 Speaker 4: is generally pretty split. Generally, it's not as conservative as 200 00:12:22,120 --> 00:12:25,640 Speaker 4: the Florida circuit where Canon was pulled from is not 201 00:12:25,720 --> 00:12:27,880 Speaker 4: as conservative as like the Fifth Circuit if it was 202 00:12:27,920 --> 00:12:31,520 Speaker 4: out in Texas or Louisiana. It's a pretty pretty evenly 203 00:12:31,679 --> 00:12:35,880 Speaker 4: split circuit, you know. But it's still gonna come down 204 00:12:35,920 --> 00:12:39,000 Speaker 4: to kind of a random dice roll in terms of 205 00:12:39,000 --> 00:12:43,040 Speaker 4: what which judge we get. Right, if you get an 206 00:12:43,080 --> 00:12:47,160 Speaker 4: aggressive judge, you will have an aggressive timeline. And yeah, 207 00:12:47,200 --> 00:12:50,360 Speaker 4: there's there's a good chance that they will set a 208 00:12:50,440 --> 00:12:55,880 Speaker 4: date before the next election. But then the defense lawyers 209 00:12:55,920 --> 00:13:00,480 Speaker 4: will appeal that date. And don't forget that these heels 210 00:13:00,520 --> 00:13:03,080 Speaker 4: about the timing of the of the of the trial 211 00:13:03,760 --> 00:13:06,520 Speaker 4: could go all the way to the Supreme Court, where 212 00:13:06,600 --> 00:13:10,120 Speaker 4: Trump has stacked the Supreme Court with his own hand 213 00:13:10,120 --> 00:13:15,320 Speaker 4: picked judges. Brett Kavanaugh in particular, is very susceptible to 214 00:13:15,520 --> 00:13:18,000 Speaker 4: arguments that this is happening too close to the election 215 00:13:18,120 --> 00:13:20,079 Speaker 4: for us to do anything about it, Like he's made 216 00:13:20,120 --> 00:13:28,120 Speaker 4: that argument before in cases involving outright racism in electoral jerrymandering. Right, 217 00:13:28,200 --> 00:13:32,600 Speaker 4: So I am not confident that an aggressive timeline will 218 00:13:33,360 --> 00:13:36,520 Speaker 4: will work in front of Brett Kavanaugh or the other conservatives. 219 00:13:36,520 --> 00:13:39,719 Speaker 4: So we'll still have to wait and see. But I 220 00:13:40,360 --> 00:13:43,880 Speaker 4: think that it is very likely that this trial will somehow, 221 00:13:43,880 --> 00:13:45,760 Speaker 4: some way get delayed until after the election. 222 00:13:46,600 --> 00:13:50,880 Speaker 1: The positive is, where are you going for the positive? 223 00:13:50,920 --> 00:13:53,840 Speaker 1: Because you have already put my feelings and my hopes 224 00:13:53,880 --> 00:13:57,240 Speaker 1: and dreams in the dumpster along with our democracy. So 225 00:13:57,360 --> 00:14:00,280 Speaker 1: where what road trip are we going? Not for the 226 00:14:00,280 --> 00:14:01,080 Speaker 1: positive side? 227 00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:04,120 Speaker 4: Posative is this the last time Trump lost an election, 228 00:14:04,200 --> 00:14:07,400 Speaker 4: he should have immediately been thrown into jail for his 229 00:14:07,480 --> 00:14:11,720 Speaker 4: efforts to overturn it. And obviously the system wasn't ready 230 00:14:11,800 --> 00:14:15,320 Speaker 4: to do that. We picked Merrick Garland instead of like 231 00:14:15,440 --> 00:14:19,080 Speaker 4: a better person. You know, lots of issues happen. We 232 00:14:19,080 --> 00:14:21,480 Speaker 4: weren't ready. The system wasn't ready to throw his ass 233 00:14:21,520 --> 00:14:24,720 Speaker 4: in jail after he lost the last election. If he 234 00:14:24,800 --> 00:14:28,480 Speaker 4: loses the next one. The positive here is that I 235 00:14:28,520 --> 00:14:30,920 Speaker 4: really do believe that if he loses the next election, 236 00:14:31,440 --> 00:14:35,160 Speaker 4: there will be you know, tiny little handcuffs waiting for 237 00:14:35,240 --> 00:14:38,160 Speaker 4: him at the end of that road. Like he needs 238 00:14:38,200 --> 00:14:40,160 Speaker 4: to win the election to stay out of jail. And 239 00:14:40,200 --> 00:14:42,840 Speaker 4: if he loses, and he should lose because he's a 240 00:14:42,880 --> 00:14:45,840 Speaker 4: terrible person and a terrible candidate and blah blah blah blah, 241 00:14:46,080 --> 00:14:48,640 Speaker 4: if he loses, there should be handcuffs. 242 00:14:48,240 --> 00:14:53,080 Speaker 1: Waiting for him if he loses, and right now we're 243 00:14:53,160 --> 00:14:56,280 Speaker 1: at a fifty to fifty fucking toss up that that 244 00:14:56,480 --> 00:15:01,440 Speaker 1: is going to be the reality, right like it's fifty 245 00:15:01,440 --> 00:15:06,480 Speaker 1: to fifty that Donald Trump doesn't have the maneuvers still 246 00:15:07,080 --> 00:15:11,400 Speaker 1: to lie, cheat and steal his way to the White House. Now, 247 00:15:12,000 --> 00:15:14,400 Speaker 1: I think that the upside, if in fact we call 248 00:15:14,480 --> 00:15:18,800 Speaker 1: it that because it's not the floor, the upside is that, 249 00:15:19,520 --> 00:15:24,400 Speaker 1: I hope, because we have tried the Jurassic Park version 250 00:15:24,440 --> 00:15:29,120 Speaker 1: where they have touched all of the fences, and folks 251 00:15:29,200 --> 00:15:33,280 Speaker 1: have been you know, are there are sixteen fake electors 252 00:15:33,360 --> 00:15:36,800 Speaker 1: that are being charged in you know, in Michigan. You 253 00:15:36,920 --> 00:15:39,920 Speaker 1: got other people that are being investigated. I think that 254 00:15:40,400 --> 00:15:42,440 Speaker 1: in my opinion, and I want to talk about this 255 00:15:42,520 --> 00:15:46,440 Speaker 1: case next the dragnet, if you will, is coming out 256 00:15:46,480 --> 00:15:49,120 Speaker 1: of Georgia, because I don't think that Trump is the 257 00:15:49,160 --> 00:15:53,040 Speaker 1: only person that Fannie Willis is looking at when she's 258 00:15:53,240 --> 00:15:57,680 Speaker 1: prepared to drop her indictments. And so again we our 259 00:15:57,760 --> 00:16:01,880 Speaker 1: democracy held on by a three read and was tested 260 00:16:02,080 --> 00:16:05,840 Speaker 1: over sixty six times in court with Rudy Giuliani, with 261 00:16:05,960 --> 00:16:08,560 Speaker 1: these fake electors, with the phone calls, and so I 262 00:16:08,640 --> 00:16:12,680 Speaker 1: think folks are prepared for what they know could be 263 00:16:12,720 --> 00:16:17,600 Speaker 1: coming their way. That's the only hope here. That and 264 00:16:18,080 --> 00:16:21,760 Speaker 1: you know, a fourth indictment, the fourth and final I 265 00:16:21,800 --> 00:16:23,400 Speaker 1: don't know, coming out of Georgia. 266 00:16:24,800 --> 00:16:26,440 Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, if we're looking for hope, that's where 267 00:16:26,480 --> 00:16:29,040 Speaker 4: we find it. Right like that, people will be more prepared, 268 00:16:29,080 --> 00:16:31,760 Speaker 4: that there are elections will be more resilient this time 269 00:16:31,800 --> 00:16:33,680 Speaker 4: than they were last time. Of course, you also have 270 00:16:33,760 --> 00:16:37,080 Speaker 4: to worry about the fact that, you know, you One 271 00:16:37,080 --> 00:16:41,480 Speaker 4: of the reasons why it's so important to prosecute people 272 00:16:41,480 --> 00:16:44,240 Speaker 4: who attempt coups is that if you don't prosecute them, 273 00:16:44,480 --> 00:16:47,520 Speaker 4: and if you don't hold them accountable, they just try 274 00:16:47,560 --> 00:16:50,680 Speaker 4: it again, and the second time they're better. So as 275 00:16:50,760 --> 00:16:53,760 Speaker 4: much as we can say that like, okay, our elections, 276 00:16:53,920 --> 00:16:58,160 Speaker 4: our election system should be better prepared to defend itself 277 00:16:58,160 --> 00:17:00,800 Speaker 4: from Trump, we also have to understand that Trump and 278 00:17:00,840 --> 00:17:05,040 Speaker 4: his forces will make a better coup attempt round two, 279 00:17:05,560 --> 00:17:10,080 Speaker 4: having potentially learned lessons from round one. We know that 280 00:17:10,119 --> 00:17:12,520 Speaker 4: they've done a lot to stack the courts, to stack 281 00:17:12,840 --> 00:17:17,240 Speaker 4: the secretaries of states in ways that are amenable to 282 00:17:17,520 --> 00:17:22,359 Speaker 4: various coup attempts, whether the legal ones, the quote unquote 283 00:17:22,440 --> 00:17:25,480 Speaker 4: legal ones of fake electors, and whatever. We all, but 284 00:17:25,520 --> 00:17:29,919 Speaker 4: we also know that his more violent forces, you know, 285 00:17:30,040 --> 00:17:33,760 Speaker 4: have also learned some lessons about how to violently overthrow 286 00:17:33,800 --> 00:17:37,240 Speaker 4: the government, and we can we have to at least 287 00:17:37,240 --> 00:17:38,800 Speaker 4: expect that they will be coming again. 288 00:17:39,960 --> 00:17:40,159 Speaker 3: You know. 289 00:17:40,200 --> 00:17:43,560 Speaker 4: We know, for instance, one of the biggest organizing things 290 00:17:43,600 --> 00:17:48,679 Speaker 4: that Trump used to put the coup out there with 291 00:17:48,720 --> 00:17:52,119 Speaker 4: social media, and after you know, being banned, we know 292 00:17:52,200 --> 00:17:55,280 Speaker 4: that he now has an ally in Elon Musk and 293 00:17:55,359 --> 00:17:58,840 Speaker 4: social media potentially to organize another coup. So like, yes, 294 00:17:58,880 --> 00:18:00,760 Speaker 4: there are more defenses, but also they're going to be 295 00:18:00,800 --> 00:18:03,080 Speaker 4: new attacks, and so we have to be you know, 296 00:18:03,160 --> 00:18:05,800 Speaker 4: I am still hopeful that he loses, and I'm still 297 00:18:05,800 --> 00:18:09,520 Speaker 4: hopeful that after he loses, he loses all of his 298 00:18:09,560 --> 00:18:12,879 Speaker 4: attempts to overthrow the election. But I'd be a fool 299 00:18:12,920 --> 00:18:14,840 Speaker 4: to think that they're not going to be It's not 300 00:18:14,880 --> 00:18:17,199 Speaker 4: going to be like, you know, we're watching TV on 301 00:18:17,480 --> 00:18:21,600 Speaker 4: November whatever, and CNN says no, the winner is declared 302 00:18:21,600 --> 00:18:24,560 Speaker 4: for and then that's it. Right, we know there's going 303 00:18:24,640 --> 00:18:27,080 Speaker 4: even after he loses. At the balance, we know there's 304 00:18:27,119 --> 00:18:30,560 Speaker 4: going to be another attempt, and hopefully we're prepared for 305 00:18:30,600 --> 00:18:30,960 Speaker 4: that too. 306 00:18:31,320 --> 00:18:33,000 Speaker 2: We shall see. 307 00:18:36,680 --> 00:18:38,840 Speaker 1: Let's switch gears a little bit just to go down 308 00:18:38,880 --> 00:18:40,440 Speaker 1: to Georgia and then I want to go to the 309 00:18:40,480 --> 00:18:44,760 Speaker 1: Supreme Court. So down in Georgia, you do have Fannie Willis. 310 00:18:44,880 --> 00:18:45,880 Speaker 2: You do have. 311 00:18:45,840 --> 00:18:49,920 Speaker 1: Another what I deem as another very serious case, right 312 00:18:50,320 --> 00:18:54,080 Speaker 1: that she's been building an unlike the slothlike pace of 313 00:18:54,160 --> 00:18:58,199 Speaker 1: Merrick Garland, she's actually been going full steam ahead for 314 00:18:58,280 --> 00:19:01,680 Speaker 1: the last two years. So give us your thoughts on 315 00:19:02,080 --> 00:19:06,520 Speaker 1: where Fannie will Willis is in terms of her You know, 316 00:19:06,600 --> 00:19:09,600 Speaker 1: she gave us an announcement several months ago that said 317 00:19:09,640 --> 00:19:13,040 Speaker 1: we were to be on the lookout between July and September. 318 00:19:13,080 --> 00:19:16,280 Speaker 1: Well we're headed into August now, So what do you 319 00:19:16,320 --> 00:19:19,520 Speaker 1: think about her case and the timing and then how 320 00:19:19,600 --> 00:19:22,760 Speaker 1: again this all measures up as we head into the 321 00:19:22,800 --> 00:19:26,480 Speaker 1: fall a year out from the presidential So I've. 322 00:19:26,320 --> 00:19:29,480 Speaker 4: Always thought Georgia had the strongest case because they have 323 00:19:29,680 --> 00:19:33,800 Speaker 4: the motherfucker on tape trying to overturn the election. Right, 324 00:19:33,840 --> 00:19:37,240 Speaker 4: They've got, like everybody's heard the tape where he tries 325 00:19:37,280 --> 00:19:40,240 Speaker 4: to find eleven thousand votes, which is just happens to 326 00:19:40,240 --> 00:19:43,520 Speaker 4: be exactly how many he needs to overturn the election. 327 00:19:43,640 --> 00:19:46,840 Speaker 4: So I've always thought that just kind of evidentiary that 328 00:19:47,040 --> 00:19:50,000 Speaker 4: is the strongest case against them. But one thing, and 329 00:19:50,080 --> 00:19:52,359 Speaker 4: I do believe that Fannie Willis has been a dedicated, 330 00:19:52,560 --> 00:19:56,639 Speaker 4: kind of hardworking public servant and is trying to do 331 00:19:56,680 --> 00:19:59,600 Speaker 4: things the right way. But we have seen that Fannie 332 00:19:59,600 --> 00:20:04,639 Speaker 4: Willis is also sensitive to political pressure. And so you know, 333 00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:09,520 Speaker 4: we saw her say before the midterms that she wouldn't 334 00:20:09,520 --> 00:20:12,639 Speaker 4: release any news within a kind of zone of secrecy 335 00:20:13,119 --> 00:20:16,760 Speaker 4: around the midterms so as to not unduly influence the 336 00:20:16,800 --> 00:20:19,960 Speaker 4: midterm elections, which is not a legal position, it's a 337 00:20:20,000 --> 00:20:23,240 Speaker 4: political position. So, you know, not something I would have done. 338 00:20:23,240 --> 00:20:26,680 Speaker 4: But okay, so now again what we what we worry 339 00:20:26,680 --> 00:20:29,280 Speaker 4: about with Willis is not whether or not she's going 340 00:20:29,320 --> 00:20:33,560 Speaker 4: to diligently charge a crime that she can prove, but 341 00:20:33,720 --> 00:20:37,080 Speaker 4: whether or not that trial comes off before the election. 342 00:20:38,119 --> 00:20:41,520 Speaker 4: And you know, if if Fannie Willis is not willing 343 00:20:41,560 --> 00:20:44,720 Speaker 4: to make any an announcement within a zone of secrecy 344 00:20:44,760 --> 00:20:46,960 Speaker 4: around the midterms, you know, is she going to be 345 00:20:46,960 --> 00:20:49,119 Speaker 4: willing to put this man to trial and let's say 346 00:20:49,640 --> 00:20:53,560 Speaker 4: July twenty twenty four, right before the Republican National Convention, 347 00:20:53,720 --> 00:20:56,000 Speaker 4: or he will be crowned the GOP. 348 00:20:55,840 --> 00:20:58,399 Speaker 3: Nominee again, I don't know that. 349 00:20:58,760 --> 00:21:02,080 Speaker 4: I don't know that she'll I don't know that I 350 00:21:02,080 --> 00:21:04,439 Speaker 4: don't know that a judge will let her do a 351 00:21:04,560 --> 00:21:06,720 Speaker 4: Georgia judge will let her do that. 352 00:21:06,880 --> 00:21:09,320 Speaker 3: So again the I. 353 00:21:09,440 --> 00:21:14,480 Speaker 4: Just am not sure despite the im men's legal jeopardy 354 00:21:14,680 --> 00:21:18,560 Speaker 4: he's under, I'm just not sure that any of these 355 00:21:18,640 --> 00:21:21,960 Speaker 4: trials the willis one either of the Jack Smith ones. 356 00:21:22,200 --> 00:21:24,360 Speaker 4: I'm not sure that any of them come off before 357 00:21:24,520 --> 00:21:26,359 Speaker 4: November twenty twenty four. 358 00:21:26,760 --> 00:21:31,040 Speaker 1: So essentially we're fucked right, And essentially we've all played 359 00:21:31,080 --> 00:21:36,600 Speaker 1: into Donald Trump and his lawyer's hands in knowing exactly 360 00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:38,359 Speaker 1: how they were going to use this, how it was 361 00:21:38,400 --> 00:21:40,600 Speaker 1: going to be spun, the timeline that was going to 362 00:21:40,640 --> 00:21:43,600 Speaker 1: be created. And the person to blame isn't just Donald 363 00:21:43,640 --> 00:21:46,040 Speaker 1: Trump and his lawyers because we always know the tactics 364 00:21:46,040 --> 00:21:49,240 Speaker 1: that we're going to be made. It is Merrick Garland 365 00:21:49,640 --> 00:21:54,640 Speaker 1: and his desire to not play politics and play the 366 00:21:54,680 --> 00:21:58,960 Speaker 1: most insane politics at the same time, which is, let 367 00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:01,800 Speaker 1: me not go after Donald Trump because I don't want 368 00:22:01,800 --> 00:22:05,040 Speaker 1: to look like this is something partisan. Let me waste 369 00:22:05,119 --> 00:22:08,440 Speaker 1: twelve months of time, and now we're here. 370 00:22:08,800 --> 00:22:12,159 Speaker 4: The analogy that Ivan mcgarland is like a basketball referee 371 00:22:12,520 --> 00:22:15,200 Speaker 4: who swallows the whistle and refuses to call a foul, 372 00:22:15,960 --> 00:22:18,000 Speaker 4: and that referee says like, Oh, I'm just trying to 373 00:22:18,000 --> 00:22:20,240 Speaker 4: be neutral and fair to both sides. I'm not gonna 374 00:22:20,280 --> 00:22:22,760 Speaker 4: call file's gonna let the games play out. That's not 375 00:22:22,880 --> 00:22:26,480 Speaker 4: being fair and neutral. That is benefiting the team that fouls. 376 00:22:28,280 --> 00:22:32,119 Speaker 4: If you don't call the rules correctly, you benefit the 377 00:22:32,200 --> 00:22:35,040 Speaker 4: team that breaks the rules. And that's Merrick Garland and 378 00:22:35,119 --> 00:22:37,280 Speaker 4: is a legend attempt to be non political. 379 00:22:37,359 --> 00:22:37,640 Speaker 3: He has. 380 00:22:37,760 --> 00:22:40,720 Speaker 4: All he's done is completely politicize the process. 381 00:22:41,960 --> 00:22:42,400 Speaker 3: And that. 382 00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:48,080 Speaker 4: The reason why I've been screaming about Merrick Garland for 383 00:22:48,080 --> 00:22:50,680 Speaker 4: two years prior to this is because at some point 384 00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:55,199 Speaker 4: his failure becomes unrecoverable, right like you can't. And this 385 00:22:55,240 --> 00:22:58,320 Speaker 4: is where I'm talking about the timeline. Because of his delays, 386 00:22:58,760 --> 00:23:01,600 Speaker 4: it's now very hard to squeeze everything in before the election. 387 00:23:01,800 --> 00:23:03,000 Speaker 3: I mean, Danielle, riddle me this. 388 00:23:03,720 --> 00:23:06,439 Speaker 4: Okay, Let's say one of these trials goes off and 389 00:23:06,480 --> 00:23:07,520 Speaker 4: he gets convicted. 390 00:23:08,359 --> 00:23:10,560 Speaker 3: Is he gonna get sentenced. 391 00:23:10,320 --> 00:23:14,200 Speaker 4: Before the election. Is he gonna be sent to jail 392 00:23:14,480 --> 00:23:17,080 Speaker 4: before the election? How does that even work? Are we 393 00:23:17,119 --> 00:23:25,040 Speaker 4: gonna actually send federal marshals to arrest the Republican nominee 394 00:23:25,560 --> 00:23:29,479 Speaker 4: for president eight weeks before the general election. Is that 395 00:23:29,520 --> 00:23:31,920 Speaker 4: really something that's gonna happen in America, because that's gonna 396 00:23:31,920 --> 00:23:36,520 Speaker 4: look like something that happens in you know, other cut 397 00:23:36,600 --> 00:23:38,280 Speaker 4: in true Banana Republic countries. 398 00:23:38,400 --> 00:23:38,600 Speaker 3: Right. 399 00:23:39,119 --> 00:23:43,600 Speaker 4: So, because the timeline has been so truncated, I just 400 00:23:43,680 --> 00:23:46,639 Speaker 4: don't know how any of this happens before he's allowed 401 00:23:46,680 --> 00:23:49,320 Speaker 4: to run again. And so even if he's tried and convicted, 402 00:23:49,720 --> 00:23:54,040 Speaker 4: if he wins the presidency, he will pardon himself from 403 00:23:54,080 --> 00:23:57,280 Speaker 4: that conviction commute, I think at that point is what 404 00:23:57,320 --> 00:23:59,680 Speaker 4: you would call what he would do. And so he 405 00:23:59,680 --> 00:24:03,680 Speaker 4: would ever face actual accountability even if he was convicted 406 00:24:03,920 --> 00:24:05,760 Speaker 4: and he was convicted on the state charges where he 407 00:24:05,800 --> 00:24:10,159 Speaker 4: can't pardon himself. I mean, again, are the Georgia State 408 00:24:10,280 --> 00:24:16,080 Speaker 4: troopers gonna go arrest the president of the United States? 409 00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:14,919 Speaker 1: Is that. 410 00:24:16,440 --> 00:24:21,280 Speaker 4: At some point the practicality kind of Trump's the theory 411 00:24:21,359 --> 00:24:25,720 Speaker 4: of the case, right, Yeah, And and so that's my problem, 412 00:24:25,880 --> 00:24:28,399 Speaker 4: that's my that's my worry. Like all of this, all 413 00:24:28,440 --> 00:24:31,119 Speaker 4: of this looks great on paper, right when you actually 414 00:24:31,119 --> 00:24:36,080 Speaker 4: when it actually comes time to try, convict and jail 415 00:24:36,240 --> 00:24:39,640 Speaker 4: this man before the election. I just think it's too late. 416 00:24:39,920 --> 00:24:41,520 Speaker 4: It wouldn't be too late if we were having this 417 00:24:41,600 --> 00:24:43,960 Speaker 4: trial right now, right. And that's again where the failure 418 00:24:43,960 --> 00:24:46,919 Speaker 4: of Garland, where the slow pace of all the investigations 419 00:24:47,320 --> 00:24:49,439 Speaker 4: really to take take a hole. If you think about 420 00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:52,399 Speaker 4: where we were at the end of the January sixth 421 00:24:52,440 --> 00:24:56,520 Speaker 4: Select Committee process, right where Trump could have been charged 422 00:24:56,720 --> 00:25:01,920 Speaker 4: that day based on that final report from the Congressional 423 00:25:01,920 --> 00:25:04,879 Speaker 4: Select Committee, right, like an aggressive prosecutor would have been 424 00:25:04,920 --> 00:25:05,840 Speaker 4: really ready. 425 00:25:05,600 --> 00:25:07,720 Speaker 3: To charge his ass that day. 426 00:25:07,760 --> 00:25:10,600 Speaker 4: At the end of twenty twenty two, then we're talking 427 00:25:10,600 --> 00:25:14,200 Speaker 4: about a trial that happens not in May twenty twenty four, 428 00:25:14,280 --> 00:25:17,320 Speaker 4: but May twenty twenty three. Yeah, we're talking about a 429 00:25:17,359 --> 00:25:21,080 Speaker 4: sentencing process that's happening over the summer. We're talking about 430 00:25:21,200 --> 00:25:25,399 Speaker 4: the legitimate ability to capture and jail this man before 431 00:25:25,600 --> 00:25:29,159 Speaker 4: Labor Day, a year and a half before the election, 432 00:25:29,720 --> 00:25:31,200 Speaker 4: and that would have been doable. 433 00:25:32,080 --> 00:25:37,320 Speaker 3: Now I don't know. I just it's very hard to 434 00:25:37,320 --> 00:25:38,120 Speaker 3: see it happening. 435 00:25:41,000 --> 00:25:43,280 Speaker 2: God, this was depressing. 436 00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:48,280 Speaker 4: Well again, if he loses straight to the pokey right, 437 00:25:50,400 --> 00:25:54,600 Speaker 4: if there's no addition, like again, the other way to 438 00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:59,600 Speaker 4: positive to spend this positively is that Trump is using 439 00:25:59,640 --> 00:26:03,720 Speaker 4: his life ast get out of jail free cards. And 440 00:26:03,800 --> 00:26:07,200 Speaker 4: as long as we don't give him four years of 441 00:26:07,280 --> 00:26:09,159 Speaker 4: another one, right, as long as we don't give him 442 00:26:09,160 --> 00:26:13,959 Speaker 4: another draw for those cards, he's gonna run out eventually 443 00:26:14,440 --> 00:26:16,240 Speaker 4: and we should be able to put his. 444 00:26:16,200 --> 00:26:16,720 Speaker 3: Ass in jail. 445 00:26:18,119 --> 00:26:22,680 Speaker 1: Okay, I mean, here's hopin, right. I have no faith, 446 00:26:22,840 --> 00:26:28,800 Speaker 1: but you know, here's hoping. Before I let you go, Ellie, 447 00:26:29,080 --> 00:26:32,480 Speaker 1: I'm gonna scrap Scotis because you know they've scrapped democracy 448 00:26:32,520 --> 00:26:36,000 Speaker 1: in the country and integrity. But I do want to 449 00:26:36,040 --> 00:26:39,440 Speaker 1: get to someone who I believe that both of us 450 00:26:39,520 --> 00:26:47,760 Speaker 1: probably grew up listening to, whose music had resonated, and 451 00:26:47,920 --> 00:26:53,360 Speaker 1: who has clearly had a fucking lobotomy. And that is 452 00:26:53,400 --> 00:26:57,879 Speaker 1: the one and only ice Cube, who was just recently 453 00:26:58,920 --> 00:27:03,080 Speaker 1: filming with none other than Tucker Carlson. 454 00:27:03,240 --> 00:27:04,560 Speaker 2: Please take the floor. 455 00:27:05,080 --> 00:27:11,640 Speaker 4: I would like our friend Torres Big, you know, feature 456 00:27:11,760 --> 00:27:17,480 Speaker 4: pieces titled from Fuck the Police to fund the Police, 457 00:27:18,040 --> 00:27:20,160 Speaker 4: the punk bitification. 458 00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:20,760 Speaker 3: Of ice Cube. 459 00:27:21,000 --> 00:27:23,280 Speaker 2: I'm texting him right now like that. 460 00:27:23,280 --> 00:27:26,240 Speaker 4: That is what I want to read, because how this 461 00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:30,159 Speaker 4: man has gone from where he was, where he was 462 00:27:31,040 --> 00:27:31,960 Speaker 4: one of the. 463 00:27:32,119 --> 00:27:34,280 Speaker 3: What what what what the what? 464 00:27:35,240 --> 00:27:37,240 Speaker 4: The over educated Black folks like me like to call 465 00:27:37,400 --> 00:27:42,480 Speaker 4: one of the urban poets, who is you know, talking 466 00:27:42,520 --> 00:27:46,720 Speaker 4: about police brutality and the devastating effects that it has 467 00:27:47,119 --> 00:27:51,639 Speaker 4: on the black community. To this point where he's kissing 468 00:27:51,680 --> 00:27:56,879 Speaker 4: their ass is just one of the biggest devolutions that 469 00:27:57,000 --> 00:27:59,320 Speaker 4: I can think of that I have seen in my lifetime. Now, 470 00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:02,760 Speaker 4: I have a theory about this, Danielle. I call it 471 00:28:02,760 --> 00:28:05,720 Speaker 4: the special black man theory, is that there are there 472 00:28:05,760 --> 00:28:08,080 Speaker 4: are you know, one of the and this kind of 473 00:28:08,760 --> 00:28:11,480 Speaker 4: they're gonna call me a critical race theorist after this, 474 00:28:11,560 --> 00:28:14,040 Speaker 4: but like you know, one of the issues that I 475 00:28:14,040 --> 00:28:16,679 Speaker 4: think a lot of black people chafe against is the 476 00:28:16,720 --> 00:28:19,359 Speaker 4: fact that we're always grouped in with everybody else, right, 477 00:28:19,400 --> 00:28:24,280 Speaker 4: We're always we're always, you know, collectively viewed as if. 478 00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:27,920 Speaker 3: We are a monolithic people, and we're not. Right. 479 00:28:28,040 --> 00:28:32,520 Speaker 4: And some, but some special black men like chase at 480 00:28:32,560 --> 00:28:36,560 Speaker 4: that more than others, right, And so then their idea 481 00:28:36,720 --> 00:28:39,480 Speaker 4: is just that whatever most black people are doing, they 482 00:28:39,520 --> 00:28:42,000 Speaker 4: gotta do something different just to prove they special, they 483 00:28:42,080 --> 00:28:45,000 Speaker 4: not like the rest of us, right, And so you 484 00:28:45,040 --> 00:28:48,160 Speaker 4: could argue, and this is why I want, again a 485 00:28:48,200 --> 00:28:50,360 Speaker 4: scholar like Terrey to kind of explain it to me, 486 00:28:50,600 --> 00:28:52,920 Speaker 4: you could argue that maybe he was never really about 487 00:28:52,960 --> 00:28:55,960 Speaker 4: fuck the police. Maybe he was always just about being special, 488 00:28:56,280 --> 00:28:59,000 Speaker 4: just just saying that special thing that makes him a 489 00:28:59,040 --> 00:29:01,040 Speaker 4: little bit different than the other lat And so now 490 00:29:01,080 --> 00:29:04,560 Speaker 4: it actually so maybe it's not incongruous. Maybe it actually 491 00:29:04,640 --> 00:29:07,320 Speaker 4: perfectly tracks. He was fucked the police when the most 492 00:29:07,320 --> 00:29:09,800 Speaker 4: black people were like, Okay, we have to have belize 493 00:29:09,800 --> 00:29:11,880 Speaker 4: what can we do? And now that most black people 494 00:29:11,880 --> 00:29:13,640 Speaker 4: were like, you know what, fuck the police, he's like, oh, 495 00:29:13,720 --> 00:29:17,160 Speaker 4: actually no, Tucker and I tan our balls together, like 496 00:29:17,160 --> 00:29:21,120 Speaker 4: because he's just like that special guy. Like that's my 497 00:29:21,480 --> 00:29:24,360 Speaker 4: that's my theory. But I have not studied, and. 498 00:29:24,280 --> 00:29:26,200 Speaker 2: So I study. 499 00:29:27,760 --> 00:29:30,440 Speaker 3: Somebody explained it to me you as. 500 00:29:30,160 --> 00:29:32,600 Speaker 1: I mean, but I think that everything that you just 501 00:29:32,680 --> 00:29:36,400 Speaker 1: laid out is right. Maybe we're the ones that got 502 00:29:36,440 --> 00:29:40,200 Speaker 1: it wrong, and he just wanted to be a standout, 503 00:29:40,800 --> 00:29:45,160 Speaker 1: and so at a time in the eighties and early 504 00:29:45,280 --> 00:29:48,560 Speaker 1: nineties he was going to be that standout with fuck 505 00:29:48,640 --> 00:29:49,200 Speaker 1: the police. 506 00:29:49,320 --> 00:29:54,120 Speaker 2: But maybe we too closely associated his. 507 00:29:54,400 --> 00:29:58,800 Speaker 1: Rapping in the way that like Chuck d of Public Enemy, 508 00:29:59,040 --> 00:30:03,320 Speaker 1: actually is that fucking guy right who believes what it 509 00:30:03,400 --> 00:30:07,080 Speaker 1: is that he is rapping about and has always right, 510 00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:10,880 Speaker 1: been that rapper of thought. And so maybe it fell 511 00:30:10,880 --> 00:30:13,120 Speaker 1: on the rest of us that this motherfucker has just 512 00:30:13,200 --> 00:30:18,080 Speaker 1: been a performer that has played the industry, played his fans, 513 00:30:18,600 --> 00:30:20,200 Speaker 1: and this is who he is. 514 00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:22,920 Speaker 4: Maybe for ice Cube that was just a song man. 515 00:30:23,760 --> 00:30:28,160 Speaker 4: It was like you you write a song for Kesha 516 00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:30,880 Speaker 4: and she's gonna sing it and it's gonna be awesome, 517 00:30:31,120 --> 00:30:32,880 Speaker 4: and maybe that's all it was. For him, it was 518 00:30:32,920 --> 00:30:36,080 Speaker 4: just a song, you know, and and and it wasn't 519 00:30:36,160 --> 00:30:37,920 Speaker 4: you know, he's not as you say, He's not Chuck Dy, 520 00:30:38,120 --> 00:30:41,240 Speaker 4: he's not KRS one. He's not one of these guys 521 00:30:41,280 --> 00:30:48,040 Speaker 4: who actually lived that life or or or live that progressiveness. 522 00:30:48,840 --> 00:30:50,280 Speaker 4: He was just a guy singing a song. 523 00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:54,640 Speaker 2: He was just a guy singing a song. How fucking sad. 524 00:30:56,760 --> 00:30:58,040 Speaker 2: I want my money back. 525 00:30:57,880 --> 00:30:58,360 Speaker 3: But I don't know. 526 00:30:58,400 --> 00:31:03,160 Speaker 4: I want a deeper dive into what's happening because the 527 00:31:03,200 --> 00:31:06,280 Speaker 4: other thing, Daniels, and you know, we're old enough and 528 00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:11,400 Speaker 4: black enough to have seen this. There is always the 529 00:31:11,600 --> 00:31:15,000 Speaker 4: like Negro gets a bit of money and loses they 530 00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:17,080 Speaker 4: damn mind right, Like they get a bit of money 531 00:31:17,520 --> 00:31:22,360 Speaker 4: and it's like, you know the black people who when 532 00:31:22,360 --> 00:31:25,080 Speaker 4: they meet the I R. S. For the first time 533 00:31:25,160 --> 00:31:29,680 Speaker 4: as an adult. It's wait a minute, what are these 534 00:31:29,720 --> 00:31:32,719 Speaker 4: tax i? Don't like these, Ronald Reagan told me. And 535 00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:37,080 Speaker 4: that's how it happens, right, Like, It's not uncommon for 536 00:31:37,360 --> 00:31:40,520 Speaker 4: people of any race, color, or creed to get a 537 00:31:40,560 --> 00:31:44,240 Speaker 4: little bit more conservative as they get older and get 538 00:31:44,280 --> 00:31:46,400 Speaker 4: more money and start to try to figure out how 539 00:31:46,480 --> 00:31:50,720 Speaker 4: to keep it. That's not uncommon. This is just the 540 00:31:50,800 --> 00:31:55,640 Speaker 4: kind of extremist, extreme extremophile version of that, you know, 541 00:31:56,120 --> 00:31:59,640 Speaker 4: normal aging process. 542 00:31:59,720 --> 00:32:03,000 Speaker 2: I don't well, I'll just tell you breaking news. Tore 543 00:32:03,240 --> 00:32:06,720 Speaker 2: just said, good idea. 544 00:32:07,360 --> 00:32:07,880 Speaker 3: I can't wait. 545 00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:14,320 Speaker 1: So, you know, folks who will have to wait and see. 546 00:32:13,320 --> 00:32:14,800 Speaker 4: Daniel, I'm like, oh my god, I'm gonna be able 547 00:32:14,800 --> 00:32:16,920 Speaker 4: to read something like I don't want to read more. 548 00:32:17,320 --> 00:32:18,880 Speaker 3: Yeah, what the hell is going on? 549 00:32:19,160 --> 00:32:19,360 Speaker 2: Yeah? 550 00:32:19,560 --> 00:32:22,880 Speaker 1: So well we'll see, we'll see you want because I 551 00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:25,240 Speaker 1: have to, I had to text them like in the moment. 552 00:32:25,400 --> 00:32:29,600 Speaker 2: So we won't see. Uh, we will see, uh where 553 00:32:29,640 --> 00:32:30,240 Speaker 2: that goes. 554 00:32:30,560 --> 00:32:33,000 Speaker 1: But you know, you could be right for a tour ray, 555 00:32:33,240 --> 00:32:35,360 Speaker 1: you know, I mean, for for for a tour ray, 556 00:32:35,440 --> 00:32:37,680 Speaker 1: this would be the interview I'd want to see. But 557 00:32:37,800 --> 00:32:40,760 Speaker 1: for ice Cube maybe that's the title of it. It 558 00:32:40,880 --> 00:32:44,800 Speaker 1: was just the song. We took it too seriously evidently, 559 00:32:46,520 --> 00:32:49,600 Speaker 1: As always my friend Ellie vis Staal, it is a 560 00:32:49,880 --> 00:32:52,400 Speaker 1: joy and a pleasure when you bring the bad news, 561 00:32:52,440 --> 00:32:54,240 Speaker 1: but you bring it with such passion and. 562 00:32:54,200 --> 00:32:57,040 Speaker 2: Flair to wok F. I always appreciate you. 563 00:32:57,360 --> 00:32:58,560 Speaker 3: Thank you so much for having me. 564 00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:05,280 Speaker 2: That is it for me today. 565 00:33:05,360 --> 00:33:09,000 Speaker 1: Dear friends on wog F. As always, power to the 566 00:33:09,040 --> 00:33:12,400 Speaker 1: people and to all the people. Power, get woke and 567 00:33:12,600 --> 00:33:13,960 Speaker 1: stay woke as fuck.