WEBVTT - Portland on my Mind 0:00:02.880 --> 0:00:06.280 You're listening and waiting on reparations production of iHeart Radio. 0:00:07.880 --> 0:00:14.400 This means a point point go support man other way 0:00:14.440 --> 0:00:18.640 from Kenosha, Wisconsin over there to Portland. It's Athens, Shorgeia. 0:00:18.800 --> 0:00:21.280 We were importing in. We got to be out here 0:00:21.280 --> 0:00:24.720 marching the importing man doing it. I'm important these ideas 0:00:24.760 --> 0:00:27.000 to all the people who have such fear from the 0:00:27.000 --> 0:00:29.960 cops when they come near with the gun. Strong. But 0:00:30.040 --> 0:00:32.200 it's okay because I'm gonna tell them, get up off 0:00:32.200 --> 0:00:34.360 of my lawn, get a buffer by law, and I'm 0:00:34.360 --> 0:00:36.599 taking your back. You don't listen to them, and they're 0:00:36.600 --> 0:00:39.040 shooting you in the back of like funk that, and 0:00:39.120 --> 0:00:41.040 you know I'm about to attack. I'm about to go 0:00:41.159 --> 0:00:43.080 and just dunk on them like our name was Shock 0:00:43.159 --> 0:00:46.000 and this is not basketball and make a fall when 0:00:46.320 --> 0:00:48.440 they got to grab the fucking phone and call them 0:00:48.479 --> 0:00:51.400 black carrot. You about to raise a red Harry. And 0:00:51.440 --> 0:00:53.199 now I'm about to go and just show you that 0:00:53.280 --> 0:00:56.040 I'm piercing because I'm the dope knife and this is 0:00:56.120 --> 0:01:00.440 Lingua rank everybody coming, thank God when I come up 0:01:00.440 --> 0:01:02.640 in the place. So yeah, I'm about to hit you 0:01:02.720 --> 0:01:05.319 in the face, make you feel like you're a lazer. 0:01:05.640 --> 0:01:09.000 I'm more lazy on the feat when I slightly haven't 0:01:09.000 --> 0:01:12.600 done it lately. It's all right because I'm skate team 0:01:12.880 --> 0:01:17.160 so smoothly. She's skate teas all these motherfucker's seat he 0:01:17.240 --> 0:01:19.400 hate team. Now I gotta show you how we're about 0:01:19.400 --> 0:01:21.680 to do the late thing. Get up on the microphone 0:01:21.680 --> 0:01:24.399 recording late at night. Everybody know we be the illest 0:01:24.480 --> 0:01:26.760 with the mic device and we hold it down. We're 0:01:26.760 --> 0:01:29.800 coming around with that bomb fast. Motherfucker's get on the mic. 0:01:29.880 --> 0:01:33.360 Listen to our podcast. You better call us god fast 0:01:33.560 --> 0:01:40.760 because I got robs in it. Out last something that salvageable, 0:01:41.000 --> 0:01:43.200 like the first part I did, hold the whole first two. 0:01:43.600 --> 0:01:50.960 Whole first two was fine. Okay, we are waiting onations. Hurry, 0:01:52.280 --> 0:01:57.200 So how's everybody doing out there? Can hear? You'll give 0:01:57.240 --> 0:02:01.240 you three seconds. It feels like the nap thing to ask, like, 0:02:01.360 --> 0:02:03.080 you know, now that we're getting the groove of it, 0:02:03.200 --> 0:02:05.440 you know, I got my sunglasses on at night, I 0:02:05.480 --> 0:02:07.760 feel like I should like break the freestyle with, Hey, 0:02:07.760 --> 0:02:11.560 how's everybody doing out there? I said, how's everybody doing 0:02:11.680 --> 0:02:15.360 out there? You know? Oh man, don't get me reminded 0:02:15.400 --> 0:02:18.840 about being on stage. I know, I know, I know, 0:02:18.919 --> 0:02:21.080 I know. So how was your week? It's good. I 0:02:21.080 --> 0:02:24.600 actually just got back from a rally in solidarity with 0:02:24.720 --> 0:02:26.560 Jacob Blake, who we're going to talk about a little 0:02:26.560 --> 0:02:29.639 bit today at City Hall. About a hundred people showed out, 0:02:29.760 --> 0:02:31.919 and we kind of put it together pretty last minute, 0:02:31.919 --> 0:02:34.320 I mean, because this is like breaking news. Um. There 0:02:34.320 --> 0:02:38.320 were like four counter protesters. There were wearing maga hats, um, 0:02:38.320 --> 0:02:40.840 no maga hats that didn't have Jesus related signs, and 0:02:40.880 --> 0:02:45.000 one of them kept yelling like y'all, Like what was 0:02:45.040 --> 0:02:48.799 he saying? It was like black babies don't matter, that's 0:02:48.840 --> 0:02:54.240 why y'all support abortion. And they called me out by 0:02:54.320 --> 0:02:56.520 name on some ship, but we were like just chanting, 0:02:56.560 --> 0:02:59.440 like chanting too loud for anyone to actually hear them. 0:02:59.600 --> 0:03:02.839 That allortion one actually might be fresh in their head 0:03:02.880 --> 0:03:08.160 because the Republican National Convention things going on right now, 0:03:08.280 --> 0:03:12.160 and they had this anti abortion lady who was talking 0:03:12.200 --> 0:03:18.080 about how plant parenthood was racist, eugenics campaign to destroy 0:03:18.200 --> 0:03:21.960 the black community and stuff. Yeah, because you know, the 0:03:22.000 --> 0:03:24.880 maggots are the most concerned with what's going on in 0:03:24.880 --> 0:03:27.800 the black community. But that's I've been, you know, doing 0:03:27.800 --> 0:03:31.560 my political junkie thing and watching the these conventions and 0:03:31.720 --> 0:03:36.640 the coverage and analysis and stuff like that. Just say, 0:03:37.360 --> 0:03:40.080 it's very difficult to do. But I've been doing it 0:03:40.120 --> 0:03:42.160 since I was like sixteen, so I might as well 0:03:42.200 --> 0:03:45.440 just keep tradition going. But it's sucking, yo. I mean 0:03:46.280 --> 0:03:50.280 we were talking about a little bit earlier. But people 0:03:50.320 --> 0:03:53.320 who were you know, I guess of the left persuasion, 0:03:54.360 --> 0:03:56.840 it would serve them well to not completely be in 0:03:56.880 --> 0:03:59.320 the dark about what's going on on the other side 0:03:59.360 --> 0:04:03.160 because they're fucking nuts. I mean, that ship is like 0:04:03.720 --> 0:04:06.480 fucking trap music for white people. Yo. They are just 0:04:07.680 --> 0:04:10.920 soaking it up and reveling in some pretty ugly stuff 0:04:10.960 --> 0:04:14.600 over there. But um, speaking of ugly stuff, the shooting 0:04:14.600 --> 0:04:16.839 at Jacob Blake. Yeah, let's go ahead and get into 0:04:16.880 --> 0:04:20.880 some of that. So on Sunday, uh, as many of 0:04:20.960 --> 0:04:24.200 us know by now, twenty nine year old father Jacob 0:04:24.200 --> 0:04:27.839 Blake's breaking up a fight in this neighborhood and Conoshal, Wisconsin. 0:04:28.000 --> 0:04:31.760 When the cops arrived on scene, and subsequently social media 0:04:31.960 --> 0:04:34.480 video circulated of Blake walking away from the cops, who 0:04:34.480 --> 0:04:37.600 had their guns drawn while attempting to get into his vehicle, 0:04:38.160 --> 0:04:40.200 and the cop pulled on the back of his shirt 0:04:40.279 --> 0:04:44.200 and fired his gun seven times, point blank into Blake's back. 0:04:44.320 --> 0:04:46.080 Three of his kids were in the car when the 0:04:46.120 --> 0:04:48.280 shooting occurred, and in fact, it was one of the 0:04:48.360 --> 0:04:53.159 children's birthday. Seeing that on your birthday, that's gonna Yeah, 0:04:53.160 --> 0:04:57.360 it's gonna change that child's life forever. I mean yeah, forever. Ever, 0:04:57.720 --> 0:05:00.040 straight up traumatized. I mean, how do you feel that 0:05:00.160 --> 0:05:03.479 the whole thing terrible? I mean, I know it's it's 0:05:03.520 --> 0:05:05.800 like another one in a long string of cases. But 0:05:06.640 --> 0:05:09.320 does this strike you in any particular way at the 0:05:09.360 --> 0:05:12.440 same time, Like, I feel like, you know what happened 0:05:12.440 --> 0:05:15.159 if Jacob is terrible, and I'm really glad that he's okay, 0:05:15.200 --> 0:05:18.480 even though he is less on the ways down from 0:05:18.480 --> 0:05:23.080 what I've heard. Um, Like, this kind of has to 0:05:23.160 --> 0:05:26.080 keep happening in order for people to continue to push. 0:05:26.240 --> 0:05:29.599 Like there was a really big explosion of energy earlier 0:05:29.640 --> 0:05:32.320 in the summer. In some places it's been sustained through 0:05:32.320 --> 0:05:36.000 the summer, and other places they've taken early losses and 0:05:36.080 --> 0:05:38.719 kind of picked up their ball and gone home. In 0:05:38.760 --> 0:05:41.560 places like Athens, for example, where people feel kind of 0:05:41.760 --> 0:05:45.359 discouraged when their initial efforts were thwarted by some of 0:05:45.400 --> 0:05:50.359 their city officials, etcetera. Um, And so I'm glad people 0:05:50.360 --> 0:05:52.680 are back in the streets. I'm glad people are margining 0:05:52.760 --> 0:05:56.440 and protesting and you know, taking up this mantle again. 0:05:57.040 --> 0:05:59.880 It's so sad it takes this to happen for us. 0:06:00.040 --> 0:06:02.320 You get back that out there and keep fighting. But 0:06:02.400 --> 0:06:05.080 maybe it has to be this way. There are martyrs 0:06:05.120 --> 0:06:08.159 for the cause of drawing people's attention to the the 0:06:08.480 --> 0:06:11.880 deeply just deep down in its core, rotten nous of 0:06:11.920 --> 0:06:18.600 our system of policing. I just don't understand if you're 0:06:18.600 --> 0:06:21.400 gonna be that scared of ship, Like why are you 0:06:21.400 --> 0:06:24.400 even a cop in the first place, Like, I mean, 0:06:24.400 --> 0:06:27.520 the police job is supposed to be. Is it a 0:06:27.600 --> 0:06:29.720 thirst for violence? I really know. I think it's like 0:06:29.760 --> 0:06:31.760 if you want to be treated as a hero, then 0:06:31.800 --> 0:06:34.800 the whole thing about it is that you're like not 0:06:34.880 --> 0:06:38.080 supposed to react like a normal motherfucker with the situation. 0:06:38.160 --> 0:06:40.480 You know, like your job is supposed to be to 0:06:40.640 --> 0:06:45.080 risk your life, to protect everybody, that risk everybody's life, 0:06:45.480 --> 0:06:49.640 protect yourself, Like like I mean, obviously we don't know 0:06:49.720 --> 0:06:51.919 why the cops had their guns drawn in the first place, 0:06:51.920 --> 0:06:56.160 but it doesn't matter. Why do you have fucking guns drawn? Like, like, 0:06:56.200 --> 0:06:59.039 I mean, there's just there's no there's no explanation that 0:06:59.080 --> 0:07:03.200 could come out of it that justifies shooting somebody seven 0:07:03.200 --> 0:07:06.320 times in the back. There's nothing. Nothing. Even if they 0:07:06.320 --> 0:07:08.599 were to say, like we were afraid that he was 0:07:08.640 --> 0:07:10.560 reaching into his car to get a gun, it's like, 0:07:11.080 --> 0:07:14.239 then fucking get shot. You signed up for this job. 0:07:14.480 --> 0:07:16.320 I mean, you signed up for this job to put 0:07:16.360 --> 0:07:19.360 your life on the line for the citizenry of Kenosha wherever. 0:07:19.560 --> 0:07:26.480 Like why, Like I don't understand. It's ill. How when 0:07:27.840 --> 0:07:30.280 when you don't want the motherfucker's to use any for us, 0:07:30.680 --> 0:07:33.680 then they're beating people's ass. Yeah, when they should just 0:07:33.760 --> 0:07:36.320 beat somebody's ass or rough them up, they're shooting them 0:07:36.360 --> 0:07:38.880 seven times, you know. I mean, it's like, what the 0:07:38.880 --> 0:07:43.840 there's never like, there's never like proportionate for It's never 0:07:43.960 --> 0:07:49.480 a proportionate I mean, like, in all honesty, if that 0:07:49.600 --> 0:07:52.200 had been hey don't go to your car, Hey, don't 0:07:52.200 --> 0:07:54.280 go to your car, and then they grab them and 0:07:55.200 --> 0:07:57.800 stopping him from getting getting his car, we're having a 0:07:57.840 --> 0:08:02.240 completely different conversation right now, completely different conversation, and somebody's 0:08:02.280 --> 0:08:05.480 not paralyzed from the waist down. And I mean, I 0:08:05.480 --> 0:08:08.200 hope he gets a grip of money from those motherfucker's, 0:08:08.240 --> 0:08:10.480 you know. But when he does get a grip of 0:08:10.520 --> 0:08:12.800 money from those motherfucker's, it's gonna come out of the 0:08:12.800 --> 0:08:16.000 city's budget that could be otherwise spent. It's not gonna 0:08:16.040 --> 0:08:17.600 come out of the police pension. It's not gonna come 0:08:17.600 --> 0:08:18.960 out of the police budget. Is going to come out 0:08:18.960 --> 0:08:22.880 of their general fund um that could otherwise have been 0:08:22.920 --> 0:08:27.960 spent on youth development programming, on cultivating community gardens. And 0:08:28.000 --> 0:08:31.640 so that's problem with I mean, like, yes, get the money, 0:08:31.680 --> 0:08:34.440 but like we gotta fix the way that city governments 0:08:34.559 --> 0:08:38.240 do that ship too, Like the Kenosho City Council. Whoever, 0:08:38.800 --> 0:08:40.920 when when they paid out that money for Jacob Blake, 0:08:41.000 --> 0:08:43.199 they need to take it out of the police budget 0:08:43.280 --> 0:08:47.920 or the police pension. Well, we talked in a earlier 0:08:47.920 --> 0:08:50.280 episode and I kind of mentioned how just personally I 0:08:50.320 --> 0:08:52.960 didn't think that defund the police was necessarily the best 0:08:52.960 --> 0:08:56.719 slogan as it were. But if you want like an 0:08:56.800 --> 0:09:00.160 idea that I think a majority of people could get, 0:09:00.440 --> 0:09:02.920 get you know easily get on board for as if 0:09:02.920 --> 0:09:06.600 you make when cops get sued for misconduct and stuff 0:09:06.600 --> 0:09:08.319 and police departments get sued if it comes out of 0:09:08.320 --> 0:09:12.400 their pension, like more like that'd be like if you'll 0:09:12.400 --> 0:09:15.840 suck around one more time, like if something like that, 0:09:15.880 --> 0:09:19.080 if something like that did pass, watch how quick stuff 0:09:19.120 --> 0:09:21.840 would be. They'd be more hesitant to pull out their 0:09:21.880 --> 0:09:36.520 gun on somebody. So in response, connotions took to the streets, 0:09:36.640 --> 0:09:39.840 knocking an officer at the scene of a shooting out 0:09:39.880 --> 0:09:42.880 with a brick to the head, arching on, breaking into 0:09:42.920 --> 0:09:45.839 the police department and ransacking it, setting fire to the 0:09:45.880 --> 0:09:49.240 county courthouse, as well as a garbage truck that have 0:09:49.360 --> 0:09:52.360 been positioned as a barricade. UM. I believe it later 0:09:52.400 --> 0:09:56.000 exploded um in addition to several dozen cars at at 0:09:56.040 --> 0:09:59.760 least one auto dealership. And that was just Sunday night, Okay, 0:09:59.760 --> 0:10:03.240 So Monday night protests continued with about a thousand, two 0:10:03.240 --> 0:10:06.079 thousand people taking to the streets, setting fire to the 0:10:06.120 --> 0:10:10.120 Department of Corrections, provoking cops to deploy tear gas second 0:10:10.280 --> 0:10:13.880 night in a row to disburse the crowd. Echoing seems familiar. 0:10:14.000 --> 0:10:16.840 As protests reached their ninetieth Day. Yeah, I saw at 0:10:16.920 --> 0:10:19.680 least one Portland based organizer tweet out for weeks people 0:10:19.679 --> 0:10:22.720 all of the world marched in solidarity with Portland. Tonight, 0:10:23.200 --> 0:10:26.080 Portland marches with Kenosha, which brings us to our topic 0:10:26.080 --> 0:10:30.440 of today, Portland, Oregon. Portland quickly blew up and somewhat 0:10:30.480 --> 0:10:33.200 faded from the national consciousness as earlier the summer they 0:10:33.240 --> 0:10:36.719 fitted off federal troops deployed there to quell the uprising. 0:10:37.000 --> 0:10:40.040 But we're left with some lingering questions, particularly what is 0:10:40.400 --> 0:10:42.960 really at the root of the Portland protests, How does 0:10:43.280 --> 0:10:46.040 Portland hip hop community feel about the Portland uprising, and 0:10:46.080 --> 0:10:48.319 how has it taken part and a little bit we're 0:10:48.320 --> 0:10:50.920 gonna be talking with Max Smith, Portland based hip hop 0:10:51.000 --> 0:10:54.400 journalists and police abolitionists. But first some background in the 0:10:54.440 --> 0:10:57.040 Portland City Council budget talks of the summer, and some 0:10:57.200 --> 0:11:00.000 lessons other municipalities can gain from the work they've done. 0:11:00.080 --> 0:11:02.600 Their work. Many would argue still have a long way 0:11:02.600 --> 0:11:05.240 to go to Portland's seventies percent white, but it's no 0:11:05.400 --> 0:11:08.760 stranger to cops gutting down black Portlanders in the last decade. 0:11:09.120 --> 0:11:11.880 Former Portland in a CP president and the first ever 0:11:11.960 --> 0:11:14.800 black women elected to the Portland City Council. Commissioners Joe 0:11:14.800 --> 0:11:17.800 and hard to See called out white Portlanders for their 0:11:17.840 --> 0:11:20.640 silence around the slayings of Kendrick James in two thousand 0:11:20.640 --> 0:11:23.360 and three, Aaron Campbell in two thousand and ten, and 0:11:23.559 --> 0:11:26.880 other black residents in recent years. Now mid that silence. 0:11:26.920 --> 0:11:29.680 The Portland Police Bureau's budget has gone from two hundred 0:11:29.760 --> 0:11:33.439 and fourteen point nine million in two thousand seventeen to 0:11:33.559 --> 0:11:36.880 two hundred and thirty one point six million twenty eighteen 0:11:37.200 --> 0:11:40.800 to two hundred and forty one point five million twenty nineteen. 0:11:41.200 --> 0:11:44.240 In May, the Portland City Council unanimously approved the city 0:11:44.240 --> 0:11:48.000 budget that included amendments allocating six hundred thirty three thousand 0:11:48.000 --> 0:11:51.360 dollars to the Portland Street Fund, a city contract police 0:11:51.360 --> 0:11:53.839 alternative that we'll talk about a little bit later, as 0:11:53.880 --> 0:11:56.480 well as five hundred and forty seven thousand dollars in 0:11:56.600 --> 0:12:00.520 local cannabis tax dollars to fund social equity grants. Together, 0:12:00.640 --> 0:12:03.880 fire and police makeup about six of the half a 0:12:03.920 --> 0:12:06.319 billion dollars city budget. But then just a couple of 0:12:06.360 --> 0:12:09.760 days later after they approved this initial budget, the uprising 0:12:09.800 --> 0:12:12.239 began costing them word to go back to the negotiating 0:12:12.280 --> 0:12:14.560 table and trying to meet public demands, which at the 0:12:14.600 --> 0:12:19.240 time community consensus was a call for a fifty million 0:12:19.320 --> 0:12:23.760 reduction in their children forty something million dollar police budget. 0:12:24.200 --> 0:12:26.559 On the second go around, the Portland City Council passed 0:12:26.559 --> 0:12:30.040 a budget that redirected more than fifty million dollars from 0:12:30.040 --> 0:12:32.840 the police bureau to other city programs and initiatives. The 0:12:32.880 --> 0:12:36.120 cuts included disbanding police units that work in schools, that 0:12:36.200 --> 0:12:40.200 investigate gun violence, and those that patrol the regional public 0:12:40.200 --> 0:12:43.280 transit system, bringing the police budget down to about two 0:12:43.480 --> 0:12:49.880 d million dollars. Now that reduction on police that investigated 0:12:49.920 --> 0:12:52.960 gun violence, is that necessarily a good thing, though, so 0:12:53.200 --> 0:12:56.040 I believe. I read that they had done an audit 0:12:56.120 --> 0:12:59.679 of the work that this task course had under undertaken 0:13:00.280 --> 0:13:02.360 in recent years and found that, you know, it was 0:13:02.440 --> 0:13:07.760 over policing black Portland, it was discriminatory. And so I mean, sure, 0:13:07.920 --> 0:13:11.240 investigate gun violence generally, but if the system you have 0:13:11.280 --> 0:13:14.760 in place isn't working and echoes calls that you know 0:13:14.840 --> 0:13:17.319 have been become common across the country at this point, 0:13:17.400 --> 0:13:21.720 that you disband the rotten system and put something new 0:13:21.760 --> 0:13:24.320 in place that actually gets the work done. So from 0:13:24.360 --> 0:13:25.800 the way that you're talking about, it sounds like it 0:13:25.880 --> 0:13:29.000 might have been one of those like rogue you know, 0:13:30.720 --> 0:13:33.560 rogue units that they create, like the crash unit in 0:13:33.679 --> 0:13:36.880 l A that went rogue, and it was pretty much 0:13:36.920 --> 0:13:39.880 being drug dealers themselves, like pretty much just abusing the 0:13:39.880 --> 0:13:42.720 part when you have these little you know, special task 0:13:42.800 --> 0:13:46.360 force within police departments and they have like special powers 0:13:46.360 --> 0:13:48.960 and special you know privileges that kind of get away 0:13:49.000 --> 0:13:50.960 with things and then start going overboard with us. So 0:13:51.000 --> 0:13:52.680 I would argue that in this case, it's not even 0:13:52.720 --> 0:13:57.520 going rogue enacting what police departments do effectively, but when 0:13:57.520 --> 0:14:00.480 you actually like get into the data of that looks 0:14:00.520 --> 0:14:04.280 like on the department department or you know, are they 0:14:04.320 --> 0:14:11.240 actually are they actually stop? Yeah, so um complicated vote. 0:14:11.400 --> 0:14:15.840 You know, some folks that research and our practitioners and 0:14:15.960 --> 0:14:20.280 alternatives to policing have found that with particularly gang violence, 0:14:20.320 --> 0:14:25.200 having um former gang members mediate gang conflicts as a 0:14:25.240 --> 0:14:27.480 way is can be a very effective way of like 0:14:27.560 --> 0:14:30.840 producing at least gang related gun violence. And so there's 0:14:30.920 --> 0:14:34.120 alternatives that exist that maybe can get funded in their 0:14:34.120 --> 0:14:38.080 next year's budget. But I think cracking down on in 0:14:38.200 --> 0:14:42.480 like you know, wiping out uh sub department that's not 0:14:42.560 --> 0:14:46.360 working like kindative is in line with this abolitionist way 0:14:46.360 --> 0:14:50.200 of that is resting all across the country anyway. So 0:14:50.520 --> 0:14:54.040 Commissioner Hardesty had harsh words for the folks who have 0:14:54.080 --> 0:14:56.720 said it isn't enough. I want you to know that 0:14:56.760 --> 0:14:58.720 it is not appropriate for you to say that I 0:14:58.720 --> 0:15:01.360 have not gone far enough. She said, you don't know 0:15:01.440 --> 0:15:03.520 the shoes that I've walked in for over the thirty 0:15:03.560 --> 0:15:06.120 years that I've lived in Portland. And I understand where 0:15:06.120 --> 0:15:08.760 she's coming from. I mean, cop between the seemingly utopian 0:15:08.800 --> 0:15:12.400 demands if a radicalized public and the dead end realities 0:15:12.440 --> 0:15:15.880 of governance, like when you like the police of the 0:15:15.880 --> 0:15:18.560 police to bureau is going to argue that every single 0:15:18.720 --> 0:15:21.040 dime they get is essential and that there can't be 0:15:21.080 --> 0:15:24.760 any budget cuts anywhere. And so that's the nature of 0:15:24.800 --> 0:15:28.760 like most government agencies. They're gonna they're going to argue 0:15:28.760 --> 0:15:32.440 for their survival by any means necessary. And so it 0:15:31.920 --> 0:15:36.320 it hinders our ability to think critically and creatively about 0:15:36.320 --> 0:15:39.400 where cuts are possible, because if someone's telling you, if 0:15:39.440 --> 0:15:42.560 you're asking supposedly the experts on how a department is run, 0:15:43.280 --> 0:15:45.760 where can we cut the fat? And they're not giving 0:15:45.760 --> 0:15:49.960 you anything, Like you're not the expert. How are you 0:15:50.000 --> 0:15:51.760 supposed to know? Like how are you supposed to call 0:15:51.760 --> 0:15:54.760 them bullshit? And so I run into issues like that 0:15:54.840 --> 0:15:57.560 all the times, where like the framing of the debate 0:15:57.640 --> 0:16:01.280 of what is possible, Like like we we turn to 0:16:01.360 --> 0:16:05.400 these experts, these engineers, these you know, traffic designers, these 0:16:06.000 --> 0:16:10.040 steward experts, and you you like want to like rely 0:16:10.120 --> 0:16:14.680 on their expertise, but you don't know, um uh, you 0:16:14.720 --> 0:16:16.360 don't have any specific what do you can talk about? 0:16:16.400 --> 0:16:21.080 Do you specific example? I mean like, um, I mean 0:16:21.120 --> 0:16:25.720 the police department here? Yeah, fucking police department here. Um. 0:16:25.840 --> 0:16:29.440 When we're designing anything from like sidewalks, you're leaning on 0:16:29.480 --> 0:16:34.760 the expertise quote unquote of like these uh design contractors, etcetera. 0:16:35.400 --> 0:16:37.120 Like I don't have a background of that. I have 0:16:37.240 --> 0:16:40.600 to most of the time trust that their calculations and 0:16:40.600 --> 0:16:43.440 their estimates and they're all that stuff is you know, 0:16:44.280 --> 0:16:48.320 informed by you know, is data driven and informed by 0:16:48.520 --> 0:16:52.320 like really robust educational background. But what if they're fucking around? 0:16:52.320 --> 0:16:53.680 What if they're fucking line to mean, what are they 0:16:53.720 --> 0:16:56.000 funk about? To me about how much sidewalk costs. How 0:16:56.080 --> 0:16:57.440 might I supposed to another line to me about how 0:16:57.520 --> 0:16:59.800 much the sidewalk costs. And so you know, that's what 0:16:59.880 --> 0:17:02.920 we run into all the time with civil servants that 0:17:03.040 --> 0:17:04.960 have to be these jack of all trades for this 0:17:05.160 --> 0:17:09.720 variety of kinds of public good the government is in 0:17:09.880 --> 0:17:13.359 charge of delivering. So let's talk a little bit about 0:17:14.160 --> 0:17:17.000 Portland Street Response. Yeah, so they up their investment in 0:17:17.040 --> 0:17:19.680 their police alternative program in the Portland Street Response to 0:17:19.800 --> 0:17:23.119 four point eight million in this revised budget. Now. PSR 0:17:23.359 --> 0:17:25.800 is modeled after a program in Eugene, Oregon known as 0:17:25.880 --> 0:17:29.360 CAHOOTS or Crisis Assistants Helping Out on Our Streets, which 0:17:29.400 --> 0:17:32.520 is run by um an organization called the White Bird Clinic. 0:17:33.280 --> 0:17:36.880 So Whitebird Clinic launched CAHOOTS as a community policing initiative 0:17:36.880 --> 0:17:40.359 in That's all right, thirty one years ago, before we 0:17:40.440 --> 0:17:42.920 were even having this conversation in the main stream, the 0:17:43.080 --> 0:17:45.680 HOOTS was operating as a police alternative that the city 0:17:45.760 --> 0:17:49.560 contracts with the handle crisis related to homelessness, intoxication, and 0:17:49.640 --> 0:17:53.560 substance abuse. The program mobilizes two person teams consisting of 0:17:53.600 --> 0:17:56.960 a medic there's a paramedic getting at something like that 0:17:57.640 --> 0:17:59.639 um as well as a crisis worker who has to 0:17:59.720 --> 0:18:02.480 stand till training and experience in the mental health field. 0:18:02.920 --> 0:18:05.320 The COHOPS teams deal with a wide range of mental 0:18:05.400 --> 0:18:10.280 health related crises, anything from conflict the resolution the substance abuse, 0:18:10.359 --> 0:18:13.920 to welfare checks, suicide threats, and more, reling on a 0:18:14.040 --> 0:18:18.920 trauma informed de escalation and harm reduction technique. Now, according 0:18:18.960 --> 0:18:22.560 to the newspaper The Oregonian, CAHOOTS, the o G version 0:18:22.640 --> 0:18:27.000 of PSR fields about of all calls to nine one 0:18:27.080 --> 0:18:30.359 one another non emergency lines to the Greater Eugene, Oregon 0:18:30.440 --> 0:18:33.879 area in two thousand eighteen. Of the twenty two thousand 0:18:34.000 --> 0:18:36.760 calls the CAHOOTS responded to, less than a hundred and 0:18:36.840 --> 0:18:40.520 fifty led to CAHOOTS requesting police for backup. Program leaders 0:18:40.640 --> 0:18:43.400 estimated that it saves the city of Eugene seven million 0:18:43.440 --> 0:18:46.920 dollars annually in medical costs and an estimated eight point 0:18:46.960 --> 0:18:50.480 five million dollars in public spending every single year because 0:18:50.560 --> 0:18:53.200 so many of the people that the non police teams 0:18:53.240 --> 0:18:56.920 help would otherwise end up in emergency rooms or you know, 0:18:57.080 --> 0:18:59.560 in jail. So how so that's been going on for 0:18:59.600 --> 0:19:01.960 a while. Thirty one years they've been doing it in 0:19:02.040 --> 0:19:05.639 Eugene and I'm not sure how recently they piloted it 0:19:06.160 --> 0:19:10.080 in UM in Portland the PSR version that's sort of 0:19:10.200 --> 0:19:15.680 modeled after cahoots. But uh, with the additional funding that 0:19:15.880 --> 0:19:18.399 was approved for it in their second round of their 0:19:18.440 --> 0:19:21.240 budget talks, they're able to to like spread it out 0:19:21.320 --> 0:19:27.240 over wider area in the city UM And uh, yeah, well, 0:19:27.280 --> 0:19:30.800 I mean that's that's interesting. I wonder if the police 0:19:30.880 --> 0:19:33.520 backup comes with them on the scene or if it's requested, 0:19:33.600 --> 0:19:36.320 like after they got check out after Okay, I was 0:19:36.680 --> 0:19:39.399 I think I was reading or watching something with someone 0:19:39.440 --> 0:19:42.399 who was a social worker who that they were talking 0:19:42.440 --> 0:19:45.040 about defunding the police, and they were making that case 0:19:45.080 --> 0:19:47.159 that they were like, well, would I be able to 0:19:47.440 --> 0:19:49.200 have back up with me just in case I needed it? 0:19:49.200 --> 0:19:51.879 Because they were talking about how domestic domestic disputes usually 0:19:52.040 --> 0:19:54.320 kind of do end with violence that they might Yeah. 0:19:54.400 --> 0:19:56.200 So the way it works here, we have mental health 0:19:56.560 --> 0:20:01.000 UM response teams that consist of a mental health professional 0:20:01.440 --> 0:20:04.920 and a police officer that are floyd when there's suicide 0:20:04.960 --> 0:20:07.320 threats or someone having some sort of mental health breakdown. 0:20:07.320 --> 0:20:11.560 Our crisis and that model is okay. But like if 0:20:12.119 --> 0:20:15.320 I am on the verge of killing myself and the 0:20:15.400 --> 0:20:17.800 cops show up, it's like, that's a perfect I'm going 0:20:17.880 --> 0:20:20.119 to provoke that motherfucker so that he'll shoot me and 0:20:20.160 --> 0:20:22.480 it's suicide by cop. We've had that. I mean, we've 0:20:22.520 --> 0:20:25.800 had people, you know, like one of the police murders 0:20:25.840 --> 0:20:28.560 that happened last year, a gentleman had a knife and 0:20:28.640 --> 0:20:30.480 he was shouting at the cops to do it, do it, 0:20:30.640 --> 0:20:32.440 do it, and they did it, and they fucking shot 0:20:32.520 --> 0:20:35.640 him dead. And so I mean the way that armed 0:20:35.680 --> 0:20:40.000 response if any kind, escalates these kinds of situations, you know, 0:20:40.160 --> 0:20:43.119 weighing that against yeah, what does what happens if it 0:20:43.160 --> 0:20:45.800 does escalate. But in the case of who it's twenty 0:20:46.320 --> 0:20:49.640 calls only a fifties, they need to call armed back 0:20:49.760 --> 0:20:52.640 up and they were able to, you know, non violently. 0:20:52.800 --> 0:20:57.960 Otherwise the escalate the situation. Um. So, I think this 0:20:58.119 --> 0:21:01.800 is a really interesting example of expanding specialized responses to crises. 0:21:02.280 --> 0:21:05.159 What police abolition could look like is piloting more and 0:21:05.200 --> 0:21:09.280 more programs like these, tailored let's say, to domestic violence 0:21:09.680 --> 0:21:13.439 or disputes, hiring former gang members, I go saying earlier 0:21:13.480 --> 0:21:17.160 to de escalate gun conflicts until you've got this really 0:21:17.200 --> 0:21:20.800 wide umbrella of crisis responses, in addition to, of course, 0:21:20.920 --> 0:21:24.400 full funding for social services that help curb crimes of survival. 0:21:25.280 --> 0:21:29.359 This month, Oregon Senator Ron Wyden has recently proposed a 0:21:29.480 --> 0:21:33.520 national alternative to using police's first responders to mental health crisis. 0:21:33.960 --> 0:21:37.480 The Cahoots Act is modeled after Eugene's eponymous program and 0:21:37.560 --> 0:21:42.720 would provide medicaid match for local municipalities across the nation 0:21:43.040 --> 0:21:47.240 that implements such program. Too bad they haven't expanded medicaid 0:21:47.359 --> 0:22:00.720 in Georgia. Fucked again. Portland has surpass us it's eightieth 0:22:00.840 --> 0:22:04.040 day of continuous protests since the George Floyd uprising began 0:22:04.119 --> 0:22:06.600 in May. And today we're joined by Max Smith, Portland 0:22:06.680 --> 0:22:09.639 hip hop journalists and promoter, an advocate for defunding and 0:22:09.680 --> 0:22:12.639 abolishing the Portland Police Bureau. You're gonna talk to us 0:22:12.640 --> 0:22:14.480 a little bit about the Portland hip hop scene and 0:22:14.520 --> 0:22:17.639 its role in the uprising. There, Mac tell us a 0:22:17.720 --> 0:22:19.959 little bit about who you are and how you got 0:22:20.000 --> 0:22:22.800 where you are today, particularly your involvement in the Pacific 0:22:22.880 --> 0:22:25.879 Northwest hip hop scene through projects like The Thesis and 0:22:25.960 --> 0:22:30.520 We out Here Magazine. Yeah, I'm Max Smith. Um, I'm 0:22:30.560 --> 0:22:33.840 a dad. I feel a concerts here called the Thesis, 0:22:33.920 --> 0:22:35.679 and I've run We out Here magazine, which is an 0:22:35.720 --> 0:22:38.960 online blog that focuses on hip hop culture for the 0:22:39.040 --> 0:22:43.360