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Speaker 1: Probably the thing that I'm most proud of reporting wise

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Speaker 1: is I was able to figure out that Nigeria's vice

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Speaker 1: president was staying at the Trump hotel based on the

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Speaker 1: pattern of the throw pillows on the couch where he

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Speaker 1: gave an interview.

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Speaker 2: I'm John Cipher and I'm Jerry o'she I served in

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Speaker 2: the CIA's Clandestine Service for twenty eight years, living undercover

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Speaker 2: all around the.

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Speaker 3: World, and in my thirty three years with the CIA,

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Speaker 3: I served in Africa, Asia, Europe, and the Middle East.

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Speaker 2: Although we don't usually look at it this way, we

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Speaker 2: created conspiracies.

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Speaker 3: In our operations. We got people to believe things that

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Speaker 3: weren't true.

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Speaker 2: Now we're investigating the conspiracy theories we see in the

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Speaker 2: news almost every day.

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Speaker 3: We'll break them down for you to determine whether they

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Speaker 3: could be real or whether we're being manipulated.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to Mission Implausible.

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Speaker 3: So, John, now that the election's up, do you think

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Speaker 3: we're finally going to hit a Trump tower Moscow?

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Speaker 2: I'm more worried about our government becoming like Russians. Right,

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Speaker 2: Like Russia has a system of oligarchs, some sort of

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Speaker 2: informal money people who are tied to the government and

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Speaker 2: pay to play and loose corruption and those type of things.

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Speaker 2: And in some ways we're becoming a little more like Russia.

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Speaker 2: You know, media gets pushed down, misinformation gets pushed into

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Speaker 2: the media by the leaders themselves for their own personal reasons,

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Speaker 2: what have you. So, I'm a little worried about that.

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Speaker 3: I don't know. I think our oligarchs will kick their

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Speaker 3: oligarch's ass. We've got Elon ew have they got, you know,

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Speaker 3: I'm not even sure is he our oligarch or is

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Speaker 3: he somebody else. Their oligarchs seem to fall out of

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Speaker 3: windows all the time, or their airplanes crash.

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Speaker 2: Elon is he's an American, but he's from South Africa.

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Speaker 2: But he's got huge stake in places like China and

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Speaker 2: Russia and other places.

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Speaker 3: I'm just worried that he's going to get deported, seeing

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Speaker 3: as how, at least according to the press, he entered

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Speaker 3: the US on a student visa and never study. Instead

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Speaker 3: he went to work, taking a job from an American.

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Speaker 3: We might have hit an American oligarch instead of Elon

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Speaker 3: if he hadn't taken that job.

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Speaker 2: What I think is, yes, Elon Musk has spent amazing

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Speaker 2: amount of money to get closer to Trump, and right

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Speaker 2: now he seems to be at mar A Lago. He's

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Speaker 2: with Trump all the time. They're making these calls to

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Speaker 2: foreign leaders. But I have to say I expect, just

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Speaker 2: like many people who sort of buy influence, when the

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Speaker 2: time comes, they get pushed away. Joseph Kennedy spent tons

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Speaker 2: of money on elections, and when push came to shove,

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Speaker 2: he got nothing. And Henry Ford in the United States,

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Speaker 2: there's a history of these guys buying their way in,

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Speaker 2: but when push comes to shove, they're not part of.

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Speaker 3: The Money can't buy you love or loyalty.

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Speaker 2: We should maybe put little bets for ourselves. A how

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Speaker 2: long before Elon is tossed from the net. But it's

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Speaker 2: disheartening to me throwing away some of the norms. They're

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Speaker 2: talking about not having people do security clearance checks. They're

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Speaker 2: talking about Trump being able to just put things in

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Speaker 2: place without Senate approval, these type of things. But I'm worried,

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Speaker 2: and I'm sure you are too. Jerry has spending time

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Speaker 2: in their security state and CIA in particular, I'm waiting

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Speaker 2: to see what they do there. I mean, are you

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Speaker 2: going to put someone in charge of CIA who can't

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Speaker 2: get a security clearance or doesn't get a security clearance.

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Speaker 3: My major concerned is for the entire US government, and

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Speaker 3: this doesn't make it a Republican or democrat. It's the

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Speaker 3: possible politicization of the women and men of the intelligence

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Speaker 3: community in the US government who served in silence following

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Speaker 3: the rules. And that's where we were in the eighteen

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Speaker 3: eighties with the spoil system.

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Speaker 2: If a republican FBI, then you have a democratic FBI.

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Speaker 2: Right now, we have a professional FBI and professional CIA,

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Speaker 2: and I worry what they're going to do is they're

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Speaker 2: going to go looking through political roles to see who

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Speaker 2: gave money to who and essentially just fire all the

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Speaker 2: senior people who gave money to other political parties or

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Speaker 2: other than Trump. You're throwing away professionalism that way, and

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Speaker 2: you're going to get answers to questions that you already

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Speaker 2: know the answer to. So Trump wants to believe I

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Speaker 2: don't know something, and that he wants the intelligence community

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Speaker 2: to tell him that he's right, rather than that role

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Speaker 2: of truth to power to try to give leaders information

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Speaker 2: they may not want, they may not like, but it

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Speaker 2: helps them in the long run, and it helps national security.

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Speaker 2: In the lawn run.

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Speaker 3: I just want people to realize that the genius I

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Speaker 3: think of American foreign policy architecture, of security architecture after

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Speaker 3: World War Two is that we created this messy group

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Speaker 3: of allies. You know, our former adversaries, the Germans, the French,

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Speaker 3: sort of our former adversaries, the Japanese South Koreans. We've

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Speaker 3: actually got this series of alliances that have stood by this.

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Speaker 3: And if we're going to be walking away from NATO

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Speaker 3: theoretically or in practice, that leaves us isolated, it alone,

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Speaker 3: it doesn't leave us stronger.

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Speaker 2: It creates other problems. So, okay, so we're going to

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Speaker 2: pull out of Europe. What happens when we're gone? Who

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Speaker 2: leads Europe? Does France lead Europe? Does Germany? It's by

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Speaker 2: far the biggest country East Europe, who's much more focused

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Speaker 2: on Russia and those type of things. Are we going

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Speaker 2: to move back to those where those kind of squabbles

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Speaker 2: start to get deeper and they instead of working together

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Speaker 2: as a European Union, it starts to split apart and

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Speaker 2: we get pulled back into different squabbles for different reasons.

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Speaker 2: There's no easy path, and unfortunately, in foreign policy and

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Speaker 2: national security.

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Speaker 3: You can never tell what conflicts we've avoided by being

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Speaker 3: in an alliance were we not in NATO, If we

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Speaker 3: didn't have NATO, would we have been dragged into wars

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Speaker 3: over and over again? And I suspect we probably might

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Speaker 3: and putin understands that divide and conquer. He is trying

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Speaker 3: to divide us from our allies because he has no allies.

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Speaker 3: No one trusts Russia, Chinese don't trust him. Even his

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Speaker 3: near abroad is surrounded by people, the Armenians who don't

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Speaker 3: trust him, or the Ukrainians who are fighting them, the Georgians,

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Speaker 3: and I really don't want to see us becoming closer

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Speaker 3: to Russia and their North Korean and Iranian allies.

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Speaker 2: We've been at that front line where we are living

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Speaker 2: with and working with allies and partners overseas, and we

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Speaker 2: see on a daily basis how much that helps us.

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Speaker 2: People give us information that they otherwise wouldn't. That helps

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Speaker 2: American interest, that helps American business, that helps save American lives.

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Speaker 2: They do it because we've developed relationships, We've developed relationships

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Speaker 2: of trust. They know that America stands for something and

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Speaker 2: it's going to be there for them when something tough

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Speaker 2: comes down the road. So they're going to help us now,

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Speaker 2: hoping that maybe we'll help them in the future.

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Speaker 3: Years ago, John, I was in the Baltics and I

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Speaker 3: bumped into a guy when he mentioned this really isolated

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Speaker 3: province up in the Hindu cushion. I said, whoa, I've

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Speaker 3: been up there too, And he mentioned this one horrific

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Speaker 3: battle that the US had been involved in, and I said, yeah,

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Speaker 3: that was really bad, and I realized we weren't talking theoretically.

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Speaker 3: He was actually there shouldered the shoulder with US forces

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Speaker 3: in northern Afghanistan after nine to eleven as Ourli, risking

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Speaker 3: his life to fight for US. And then he looked

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Speaker 3: at me afterwards and said, so, if the Russians invade

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Speaker 3: my country, you'll be here to stand with me, right.

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Speaker 3: I looked at him and I said, I hope.

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Speaker 2: So no, are we at a point where the big

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Speaker 2: powers make decisions over everybody else? Or do we work

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Speaker 2: with the people that have Western values and support us

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Speaker 2: around the world. So today's episode, I think we're going

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Speaker 2: to talk a little bit about that sort of soft corruption,

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Speaker 2: the kind of money that gets involved either in politics

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Speaker 2: or around politics. How do we deal with it with

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Speaker 2: presidents who have investments in money and connections and places.

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Speaker 2: We've had presidents before that have been quite wealthy and

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Speaker 2: it had foreign connections. Donald Trump is something different altogether.

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Speaker 2: He had this massive hotel in downtown DC that he

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Speaker 2: wanted to push people to when he was president, and

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Speaker 2: so it'll be interesting to talk to our next guest

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Speaker 2: about what he's learned as he looked into these things.

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Speaker 3: We'd like to welcome Zach Everson. He's a journalist best

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Speaker 3: known for well, for a lot of things. He writes

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Speaker 3: on the murky and mucky intersection of politics, money, conspiracies,

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Speaker 3: many reals, some imagined, and not surprisingly even on one

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Speaker 3: business in particular, a famous hotel with your infamous newsletter

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Speaker 3: eleven hundred Pennsylvania Avenue. But you always covered the tricky

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Speaker 3: and sticky topic of ethics and the galen so of

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Speaker 3: Donald Trump, for sure, but also other places along the spectrum,

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Speaker 3: so Cornell West and Alexandria Ocasio Cortes as well. Zick,

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Speaker 3: How and why you were thrown out of a hotel

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Speaker 3: and banned for life? What does this say about you

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Speaker 3: other than coming on this show?

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Speaker 1: You know, I honestly was surprise that happened. Didn't happen earlier.

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Speaker 1: So the hotel in question is, of course Trump's DC hotel.

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Speaker 1: I really, I mean, I had a newsletter dedicated to

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Speaker 1: the place. That's the eleven hundred Pensylvania, that's its address.

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Speaker 1: I had been doing this for a couple of years

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Speaker 1: at this point, and I really thought they weren't going

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Speaker 1: to throw me out because they figured it's you know,

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Speaker 1: they'd realized, oh, it's good publicity for him. You know

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Speaker 1: when I went under cover with Inside Edition there and

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Speaker 1: they caught one of the videography guys like, I'm like,

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Speaker 1: all right, I'm done. This is the trade off. If

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Speaker 1: I can get my reporting in front of the demographic

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Speaker 1: that watches Inside Edition, I'm good with this. Well, what

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Speaker 1: finally happened was the Trump was out of office and

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Speaker 1: he was selling the place. There was a spike in prices.

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Speaker 1: I was trying to figure out what it was. So

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Speaker 1: I went down to the hotel, immediately walked in and

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Speaker 1: saw signage in the lobby that they were having a

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Speaker 1: gathering of exterminators there as a conference, not to actually

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Speaker 1: do some work. By job done. I went to the bar.

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Speaker 1: I had a drink, you kind of see who comes

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Speaker 1: around see if there's anybody notable there. I get up.

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Speaker 1: I take a couple of pictures, not really of people,

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Speaker 1: but just of the building. My editor, who's the one

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Speaker 1: who does our Forbes's valuation of Donald Trump, wanted me

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Speaker 1: to just document what the retail spaces inside the hotel

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Speaker 1: were like for his valuation, So I took a couple

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Speaker 1: of pictures. I walked round the lobby, I head to

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Speaker 1: the bathroom. I'm about to make a swing by the

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Speaker 1: conference room so I can check out the exterminators. On

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Speaker 1: my way up the door, when the head of security, Ernest,

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Speaker 1: comes and says, you know, hey, write this way. So

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Speaker 1: I'm like, okay about me walking by the conference He's

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Speaker 1: leading me out this way. He's like, we're gonna have

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Speaker 1: to ask you to leave. I'm like, really, we're doing

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Speaker 1: this now, okay. And then when I get out the door,

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Speaker 1: the head of marketing was there, and I'm sure she's

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Speaker 1: not somebody who's usually involved in throwing people out, but

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Speaker 1: she was right there as it happened, and you know,

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Speaker 1: we're gonna have to ask you not to come back.

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Speaker 1: So I went home. I wrote the article and it

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Speaker 1: was most on boards to that day. It got covered

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Speaker 1: in a whole bunch of other outlets, and I'm like,

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Speaker 1: all right, we knew this was gonna happen, and here

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Speaker 1: we are to the audience.

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Speaker 3: Maybe just a quick overview of what the newsletter was

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Speaker 3: and what you were trying to do with it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. So I was a travel writer, as you mentioned

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Speaker 1: it earlier, and focused on food and dining, and I

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Speaker 1: had the assignment to cover the brand opening of Trump's

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Speaker 1: hotel here in DC in the waiting days of the

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Speaker 1: twenty sixteen election, and for all places covering it for

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Speaker 1: Fox News but for their travel section. And I was there.

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Speaker 1: It was very different. Typically when I go to a

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Speaker 1: hotel event, it would be a boozy affair. There'd be

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Speaker 1: a few writers, they'd be wining a dinasts. I mean,

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Speaker 1: this was just hordes of people. There's some hard and

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Speaker 1: whitical journalists who were just like, oh man, they're giving

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Speaker 1: us muffins. This is the greatest day ever.

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Speaker 2: There weren't for CIA guys, by the way, Yeah, not

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Speaker 2: as much as FBI guys, But yeah.

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Speaker 1: I was looking to get out of food and dining,

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Speaker 1: and nobody really takes you seriously when you want to

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Speaker 1: leave that, Like, why would you ever want to leave that?

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Speaker 1: Wasn't that a picture of you driving a Ferrari on Rome?

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Speaker 4: Like?

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Speaker 1: Why do you want this? But this seemed like an

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Speaker 1: out because it was the uh, you don't have travel

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Speaker 1: he had a travel angle. So I pitched my editor

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Speaker 1: on an article about it, not just the standard travel

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Speaker 1: stuff but all the legal issues. And as I was

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Speaker 1: reporting that, I started looking online at pictures every morning

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Speaker 1: to see who was at the Trump hotel. In part

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Speaker 1: because it took me so long to submit decent copy

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Speaker 1: for this article that the and Trump was turning through

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Speaker 1: people of his administration. The references I had would be

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Speaker 1: dated by the time it was ready for me to

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Speaker 1: file another draft. But if you had concerns about ethical

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Speaker 1: problems with the president owning a hotel a couple of

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Speaker 1: bucks in the White House, you can see him on Instagram.

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Speaker 1: I started documenting that on social media, started a thread

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Speaker 1: there that picked up some followers. The founders of substack

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Speaker 1: reached out. It was in its early days. They reached out.

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Speaker 1: So I watched the newsletter and then for a couple

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Speaker 1: of years it would go out three or four times

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Speaker 1: a week, highlighting who was at the hotel and why

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Speaker 1: it might be a conflict, and I taught myself how

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Speaker 1: to look through campaign finance filings and foyer requests and

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Speaker 1: all that other kind of stuff, and you know, built

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Speaker 1: it up from there.

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Speaker 2: For those people who haven't been there, that the Trump

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Speaker 2: Hotel was in the old post office building, which Jerry

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Speaker 2: and I are old enough to remember. It used to

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Speaker 2: be the FBI Washington Field office was there even and

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Speaker 2: it was always a little bit run down.

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Speaker 1: But what is it now, Well, now it's a Waldorf Astoria.

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Speaker 1: It's a governmental building. And Trump won the lease from

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Speaker 1: GSI General Service Administrations. He bid on the lease Hilton,

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Speaker 1: which was part of another consortium. That group said, why

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Speaker 1: are you guys awarding this to Trump? Are you not

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Speaker 1: aware that he has several bankruptcies involving hotels. If you're

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Speaker 1: not aware, here's you know, seventy five pages of print outs.

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Speaker 1: Please take a look. You accepted it just because it

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Speaker 1: was the biggest bid, and that that's wrong, and that's

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Speaker 1: what happened. The finance has never really made sense. Trump

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Speaker 1: sold it to sold the lease shortly after he left

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Speaker 1: to a group of investors who turned it into Waldorf

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Speaker 1: for Astoria, and the financial problem still existed. And they

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Speaker 1: recently defaulted on the loans, so it is now owned

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Speaker 1: by a private equity bank associated with Michael Dell and

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Speaker 1: they have kept it a Waldorf for now. But it's

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Speaker 1: going to be interesting because I don't think this is

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Speaker 1: the last step of where it is. I think they're

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Speaker 1: going to need to figure out a way to make

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Speaker 1: this financially viable.

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Speaker 3: So Zieh, we're sort of at the end of the story,

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Speaker 3: at least of the hotel, but I want to come

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Speaker 3: back to the beginning the story. And something I found

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Speaker 3: really creepy is that when you first checked into the

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Speaker 3: hotel for the newsletter, they knew who you were, right,

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Speaker 3: they were spying on you.

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Speaker 1: I wasn't totally surprised. So there's a really good book

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Speaker 1: called The gold Standard written about Ritz Carlton, and one

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Speaker 1: of the things they do is that they have a

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Speaker 1: system where they track high profile guests, journalists, other people

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Speaker 1: like that, and they have a database where they not

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Speaker 1: put in what your favorite drink is. So when I

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Speaker 1: was a travel writer and I showed up at a

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Speaker 1: Ritz Carlton, they would have an expressing they wrote that

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Speaker 1: down the first time I had It turns out that's

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Speaker 1: actually actually not my favorite drink. The fact that they

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Speaker 1: had found that on social media doesn't surprise me, and

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Speaker 1: the manager explained it. He's like, you know, we have

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Speaker 1: an act a shade apartment that just does a quick

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Speaker 1: look at our guests to see who it is, in

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Speaker 1: part for security, but in part for hospitality, Like why

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Speaker 1: are these people coming? Is it a special day? Is

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Speaker 1: there something we should know about these people? And you

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Speaker 1: type in my name and the first thing you have

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Speaker 1: this pictured me holding champagne on a cruise boat saying

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Speaker 1: travel writers. Yeah. They immediately came down, introduced themselves to

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Speaker 1: me and poured me another glass of champagne.

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Speaker 3: You checked in and they just pulled you aside. It

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Speaker 3: was like, hey, man, we know who you are.

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Speaker 1: Oh absolutely, But I wasn't doing any political reporting at

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Speaker 1: the time. It was all travel stuff, so they were

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Speaker 1: probably excited thinking, oh, here's a guy who does a

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Speaker 1: lot of writing for Conde nas Traveler and he's staying

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Speaker 1: here for a weekend. Great because a lot of concerns

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Speaker 1: about the ethics of the hotel, but in terms of

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Speaker 1: actually a luxury hotel, it's really nice. I thought they

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Speaker 1: did a pretty good job.

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Speaker 2: So was zech talking about this sort of world of money.

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Speaker 2: It's interacted with politics. I was reading about Cash Patel

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Speaker 2: and Devin Nunez who now works for Trump Media and

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Speaker 2: True Social and others. And these aren't necessarily talented people

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Speaker 2: or people who were able to make a lot of

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Speaker 2: money in their previous lives but now are making tons

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Speaker 2: of cash. Nunia's is a dairy farmer, and now he's

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Speaker 2: supposedly this big business tycoon. What have you learned about

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Speaker 2: the financial ties of Trump and those associated with him.

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Speaker 1: One thing to keep in mind with Trump, the last

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Speaker 1: time Forbes looked at it, Trump would have done better

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Speaker 1: financially if he had just taken his dad's inheritance and

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Speaker 1: stuck it in an S and P. Five hundred For

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Speaker 1: all this business acumen that he likes to put out there.

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Speaker 1: And he's very well, he's wealthy, he's worth several billion dollars,

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Speaker 1: but it would be more if you just put it

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Speaker 1: in the market and let it ride. But there's no

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Speaker 1: shortage of people who've done pretty well by themselves by Trump.

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Speaker 1: I mean, Michael Cohen did pretty well up until the

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Speaker 1: moment he did it. A lot of people go into

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Speaker 1: business with Trump and then find themselves discarded. That hasn't

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Speaker 1: happened to news. He's the CEO of Trump Median Technology Group.

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Speaker 1: But yes, he's doing pretty well for Himselfie. You see

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Speaker 1: that with other people who published books through Winning Team Publishing,

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Speaker 1: which is Don Junior's imprint. They have a book that's

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Speaker 1: been putting out some conservative publications out there. Donald Trump

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Speaker 1: has put out a couple books that way, and you

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Speaker 1: know people can do well by that.

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Speaker 3: More of this after a quick break back to our conversation.

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Speaker 1: Say you're stationed in East Berlin back in the day.

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Speaker 1: The president of East Berlin has a hotel a couple

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Speaker 1: of blocks from his residents, where all of the hangers

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Speaker 1: on are there, members of his administration, members of whatever legislature,

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Speaker 1: legislative group. They've had party operaatchicks, all scrifters, all sorts

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Speaker 1: of people. How do you handle that hotel? What do

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Speaker 1: you guys do?

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Speaker 2: Jerry's our Berlin guy, go at it, Jerff.

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Speaker 3: So that hotel sort of exists in law and legend,

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Speaker 3: but it's the Metropol in Moscow and Stalin famously used

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Speaker 3: that hotel. He took all the foreign journalists and he'd

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Speaker 3: put them in there, and he gave them all beautiful

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Speaker 3: translators who all slept with them and then spied on them.

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Speaker 3: And the Metropol was like KGB central for spying on people.

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Speaker 3: So yeah, when you control the hotel, you control hotel security.

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Speaker 3: We control who comes in and out. They may even

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Speaker 3: ban people like you from the hotel. It's a secure

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Speaker 3: space if you want to be involved in things that

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Speaker 3: you don't want law enforcement or counterintelligence to know about.

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Speaker 3: It's also a big money laundering possibility for bringing in

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Speaker 3: foreign kits. John your thoughts.

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Speaker 2: If you ever saw the book and the movie, A

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Speaker 2: book and TV show Gentlemen in Moscow, that's about the

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Speaker 2: Metropol Hotel. It's not the greatest example because both Russia

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Speaker 2: and East Germany in the time, when you're the dictator there,

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Speaker 2: like you don't actually need to steal money through a hotel.

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Speaker 2: You own the country and you can make money in

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Speaker 2: so many other ways.

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Speaker 1: I always thought, and I never saw any evidence of

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Speaker 1: foreign spies at the Trump Hotel, but I thought they

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Speaker 1: would be derelict in their duty if they weren't a

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Speaker 1: low place.

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Speaker 2: Of course, that's the point. A job as an intelligence

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Speaker 2: officer is involved what we call targeting, right trying to

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Speaker 2: find the people that have access to secrets. And in

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Speaker 2: Trump world, that was where you went to run into

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Speaker 2: Rudy Giuliani and the people who are around Trump. So

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Speaker 2: if you wanted to do that for drifting purposes, or

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Speaker 2: if you want to do that for intelligence purposes, that

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Speaker 2: was the place to go to meet somebody. Now, in

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Speaker 2: our world, you would want to meet them and then

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Speaker 2: pull them away from there because it's a place where

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Speaker 2: there was a lot of eyes, a lot of people

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Speaker 2: paying attention. What you want to do is develop a

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Speaker 2: relationship away from those prying eyes. But yeah, you're right,

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Speaker 2: there's a lot of issues and problems with that. There's

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Speaker 2: the issue of corruption, there's the issue of money lunder,

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Speaker 2: there's an issue of of spying, and all of it

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Speaker 2: is of concern. And that sounds like the Trump Hotel

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Speaker 2: was all of those things.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, marl Laga, since Trump has had classified documents there.

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Speaker 1: So during his presidency up until the date of the

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Speaker 1: FBI raid, the club sought to employ three hundred and

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Speaker 1: eighty short term temporary foreign workers. Yeah, this smirk on

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Speaker 1: your face is at all say that's a foreign leader.

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Speaker 1: How would the CIA approach that? And I've got to

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Speaker 1: imagine we're sending over twenty five different people applying to

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Speaker 1: be maids and chefs and all that other stuff.

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Speaker 3: John and I are. We've damaged our livers and put

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Speaker 3: on a lot of extra pounds going to diplomatic receptions

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Speaker 3: at hotels where being there is if the bile like you,

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Speaker 3: look around, who do I need to meet and how

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Speaker 3: do I need to meet them? And how do I

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Speaker 3: bump into them? How do I continue the relationship? And

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Speaker 3: yet those same social skills we use inside the agency,

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Speaker 3: But in the Constitution there is the Emolument's clause.

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Speaker 1: Yes, I'm familiar with it, and I hopefully I can

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Speaker 1: describe it succinctly, because I have been told by editors

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Speaker 1: from multiple outlets not to use the word emilliuments, because

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Speaker 1: that's when you lose readers. It's basically the president can

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Speaker 1: accept payments from foreigner state governments, and that was one

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Speaker 1: of the issues that was central to the hotel is

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Speaker 1: whether or not a foreign government paying Donald Trump's hotel

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Speaker 1: would count as an emiliument's a violation of that clause.

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Speaker 1: The first day, the first business day of his administration,

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Speaker 1: a group a watched our group named crew sued over

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Speaker 1: the violation of the emolument's clause. That case ended up

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Speaker 1: getting tossed by the Supreme Court is moot because Trump

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Speaker 1: was no longer office in office, and they weren't even

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Speaker 1: at a point where they were going to discuss the

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Speaker 1: case on the merits. They were still trying to figure

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Speaker 1: out who had the standing to suit Trump over that.

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Speaker 1: It's likely that even if they had resolved that it

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Speaker 1: would have been another four years. At one point, I

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Speaker 1: was recording a podcast and there were three different candidates

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Speaker 1: for president and Nigeria were there actually too, two sorry,

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00:20:29,840 --> 00:20:33,280
Speaker 1: two candidates from Nigeria Congress, people from Nigeria's legislature. Their

435
00:20:33,320 --> 00:20:36,760
Speaker 1: sitting Vice president was there. So certainly stands to reason

436
00:20:36,840 --> 00:20:41,640
Speaker 1: that the Nigerian government was paying Donald Trump via his hotel,

437
00:20:42,280 --> 00:20:44,119
Speaker 1: and that continues to go on. He doesn't have the

438
00:20:44,200 --> 00:20:47,639
Speaker 1: DC Hotel, which is not as central, but he certainly

439
00:20:47,640 --> 00:20:49,159
Speaker 1: has other properties. I think it was the government of

440
00:20:49,240 --> 00:20:52,080
Speaker 1: China rented office space in one of his New York buildings.

441
00:20:52,520 --> 00:20:54,639
Speaker 1: You know, that continues to go on and we never

442
00:20:54,800 --> 00:20:58,160
Speaker 1: got a vertical. Whether or not that's okay, And part

443
00:20:58,200 --> 00:21:00,240
Speaker 1: of it has to be blamed on the Democrats. I

444
00:21:00,320 --> 00:21:03,800
Speaker 1: really think they dragged their feet on this. They were

445
00:21:03,800 --> 00:21:05,760
Speaker 1: playing by some of the old give me some old

446
00:21:05,760 --> 00:21:08,679
Speaker 1: school courtesies, like oh you need more time to file, Okay,

447
00:21:08,680 --> 00:21:11,200
Speaker 1: that's fine. Oh they I don't even think they held

448
00:21:11,240 --> 00:21:13,639
Speaker 1: a hearing on the monuments class they scheduled when they

449
00:21:13,680 --> 00:21:15,440
Speaker 1: canceled in and I don't think they ever got around

450
00:21:15,440 --> 00:21:18,240
Speaker 1: to having it. Here we are again, and you could

451
00:21:18,240 --> 00:21:21,320
Speaker 1: certainly have government in China looking if you know mar

452
00:21:21,359 --> 00:21:22,879
Speaker 1: al Lago's banquet room, if they want to.

453
00:21:23,440 --> 00:21:25,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, I have a quick question for you. Right when

454
00:21:25,640 --> 00:21:29,399
Speaker 2: politicians often talk about the quote Biden criminal enterprise, what

455
00:21:29,480 --> 00:21:31,800
Speaker 2: have you learned about Biden's finances?

456
00:21:32,240 --> 00:21:34,919
Speaker 1: They're boring. They are what you would expect for Joe Biden.

457
00:21:35,000 --> 00:21:38,200
Speaker 1: He's a career politician. So yeah, Biden's worth about ten

458
00:21:38,240 --> 00:21:41,359
Speaker 1: million dollars largely. You know, he's had a government pension,

459
00:21:41,600 --> 00:21:43,000
Speaker 1: just the same way you guys, I'm sure are worth

460
00:21:43,000 --> 00:21:45,560
Speaker 1: that much too, from your government pensions. Yeah, yeah, I

461
00:21:45,600 --> 00:21:48,600
Speaker 1: don't know about that, but it's a solid pension. You know.

462
00:21:48,720 --> 00:21:50,720
Speaker 1: He obviously was making a lot of money when he

463
00:21:50,800 --> 00:21:53,080
Speaker 1: was doing it, now did he probably could have done

464
00:21:53,119 --> 00:21:55,160
Speaker 1: better as well if he invested a little bit differently.

465
00:21:55,520 --> 00:21:57,520
Speaker 1: Most of his money he likes to invest in real

466
00:21:57,640 --> 00:21:59,840
Speaker 1: estate is where he's put it. He said, okay, by

467
00:21:59,840 --> 00:22:02,480
Speaker 1: that he had this really huge house that's lended hisself

468
00:22:02,520 --> 00:22:05,399
Speaker 1: to some conspiracies. He had a former Jupont mansion that

469
00:22:05,440 --> 00:22:08,479
Speaker 1: he owned, and it was how can this guy afford

470
00:22:08,480 --> 00:22:10,959
Speaker 1: such a mansion? And for it because it was the

471
00:22:10,960 --> 00:22:13,719
Speaker 1: market was in a downturn, you know. Yeah, I think

472
00:22:13,720 --> 00:22:15,520
Speaker 1: it was Eric Trump saying that, and Eric should know

473
00:22:15,520 --> 00:22:18,600
Speaker 1: it well, like Donald Trump got a steal on forty

474
00:22:18,600 --> 00:22:21,160
Speaker 1: Wall Street in mar Lago because the economy wasn't doing

475
00:22:21,160 --> 00:22:23,360
Speaker 1: well and nobody really wanted those buildings. So that's exactly

476
00:22:23,400 --> 00:22:25,040
Speaker 1: how Joe Biden got his men.

477
00:22:25,200 --> 00:22:27,399
Speaker 3: I think Joe Biden also wrote a book too, didn'ty

478
00:22:27,440 --> 00:22:29,560
Speaker 3: after he was once he's out of office. He had

479
00:22:29,600 --> 00:22:32,639
Speaker 3: that four year in a readdom and yeah, speaking like

480
00:22:32,640 --> 00:22:34,680
Speaker 3: two hundred thousand dollars for a speaking gig.

481
00:22:34,800 --> 00:22:36,720
Speaker 1: Yeah, he made a few million from that. But the

482
00:22:36,760 --> 00:22:38,760
Speaker 1: book doesn't even hardly have much of a long tail.

483
00:22:38,800 --> 00:22:40,719
Speaker 1: I think on his last financial disclosure, I don't think

484
00:22:40,720 --> 00:22:42,480
Speaker 1: he disclosed making any money off of it.

485
00:22:42,640 --> 00:22:44,480
Speaker 2: And it's cheaper to buy things in Delaware too.

486
00:22:44,520 --> 00:22:46,919
Speaker 1: Frankly, maybe that's how he's doing it.

487
00:22:47,040 --> 00:22:50,720
Speaker 3: Trump famously went through a series of bankruptcies, right, he

488
00:22:50,720 --> 00:22:53,080
Speaker 3: couldn't even make a casino, it was sort of and

489
00:22:53,240 --> 00:22:58,680
Speaker 3: hotels and went bankrupt, and yet he got financed weirdly

490
00:22:58,800 --> 00:23:02,959
Speaker 3: to Deutsche right, and we're not quite sure who guaranteed

491
00:23:03,000 --> 00:23:06,000
Speaker 3: the loans even today. It could be a foreign entity.

492
00:23:06,080 --> 00:23:10,159
Speaker 3: I've read a conspiracy theory until it's proven that that

493
00:23:10,320 --> 00:23:13,639
Speaker 3: Russian oligarchs were involved and guaranteeing this. And I was

494
00:23:13,640 --> 00:23:15,360
Speaker 3: wondering if you get a sense it off. You've ever

495
00:23:15,600 --> 00:23:18,240
Speaker 3: tried to go down that rabbit hole and figure out

496
00:23:18,280 --> 00:23:22,199
Speaker 3: where before he ran in sixteen, like where did his

497
00:23:22,240 --> 00:23:25,040
Speaker 3: financing come from? After those huge failures?

498
00:23:25,400 --> 00:23:27,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, I haven't jumped down that rabbit hole that much.

499
00:23:27,800 --> 00:23:29,280
Speaker 1: You know. One of the things he's done is that

500
00:23:29,320 --> 00:23:32,680
Speaker 1: it seems like he's always able to find somebody he's

501
00:23:32,760 --> 00:23:35,360
Speaker 1: able to convince that they want to work with him,

502
00:23:35,440 --> 00:23:38,119
Speaker 1: and that that's just think he is somebody who's going

503
00:23:38,160 --> 00:23:39,520
Speaker 1: to be good for the business. And I think that's

504
00:23:39,520 --> 00:23:41,280
Speaker 1: a lot of what you had with Deutsche back, where

505
00:23:41,600 --> 00:23:43,400
Speaker 1: his personal backer went to bat for him in whay

506
00:23:43,480 --> 00:23:46,680
Speaker 1: she probably wouldn't have with other clients. I would strongly

507
00:23:46,720 --> 00:23:50,040
Speaker 1: recommend my editor's book White House, Inc. By Dan Alexander.

508
00:23:50,040 --> 00:23:52,200
Speaker 1: I would definitely take a look at that one. So

509
00:23:52,240 --> 00:23:55,640
Speaker 1: he keeps coming back and financially, he was looking at

510
00:23:55,680 --> 00:23:58,520
Speaker 1: a lot of his buildings where he had a mortgages

511
00:23:58,560 --> 00:24:01,639
Speaker 1: coming due towards the end of his administration, but he

512
00:24:01,680 --> 00:24:03,440
Speaker 1: was able to find finance and he got this bank,

513
00:24:03,520 --> 00:24:05,720
Speaker 1: Axos Bank which used to be called Bank at the Internet,

514
00:24:05,760 --> 00:24:07,879
Speaker 1: to a load of money for a Trump Tower mortgage.

515
00:24:08,000 --> 00:24:10,399
Speaker 1: And he keeps finding people who are willing to do this.

516
00:24:11,080 --> 00:24:14,400
Speaker 2: You wrote, Trump cashed in on the January sixth events.

517
00:24:14,680 --> 00:24:15,480
Speaker 2: What do you mean by that?

518
00:24:15,840 --> 00:24:18,359
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's one of the things that's really we talk about.

519
00:24:18,400 --> 00:24:20,320
Speaker 1: So much of the attention on Trump is political for

520
00:24:20,359 --> 00:24:23,600
Speaker 1: obvious reasons, but he's able to continuously like cash out

521
00:24:23,600 --> 00:24:25,880
Speaker 1: on a lot of these conspiracy theories and other events

522
00:24:26,320 --> 00:24:30,840
Speaker 1: where in January sixth, shortly after he tweeted will be wild,

523
00:24:31,160 --> 00:24:34,280
Speaker 1: the hotel Jack the hotel in DC jackas prices up,

524
00:24:34,640 --> 00:24:37,720
Speaker 1: they went ridiculously high, and I was able to go

525
00:24:37,840 --> 00:24:40,120
Speaker 1: back and look and say, oh, prices weren't that high

526
00:24:40,160 --> 00:24:43,239
Speaker 1: at all before he tweeted that, and then comparing it

527
00:24:43,320 --> 00:24:46,919
Speaker 1: to industry data from other luxury hotels in the area.

528
00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:49,399
Speaker 1: It wasn't like they all spiked, it was just the

529
00:24:49,440 --> 00:24:51,680
Speaker 1: Trump Hotel. I mean that that hit a level like

530
00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:54,560
Speaker 1: a two thousand dollars a night, which is far more

531
00:24:54,720 --> 00:24:57,800
Speaker 1: than I'd ever seen it before. And there's also the

532
00:24:57,880 --> 00:24:59,600
Speaker 1: oh they did that because they didn't want the rif

533
00:24:59,720 --> 00:25:02,920
Speaker 1: rafts at the hotel. The manager of the hotel tweeted

534
00:25:02,920 --> 00:25:05,040
Speaker 1: that room service did a record business that week.

535
00:25:05,280 --> 00:25:07,840
Speaker 3: So let's see if I can stump you on this one.

536
00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:10,640
Speaker 3: Do you know where the term lobbyist comes from.

537
00:25:11,480 --> 00:25:13,399
Speaker 1: I do. Supposedly the Willard.

538
00:25:13,760 --> 00:25:17,560
Speaker 3: It's the Willard Hotel. President Grayat used to go to

539
00:25:17,640 --> 00:25:19,840
Speaker 3: the Willard Hotel and it was just the scene is

540
00:25:19,960 --> 00:25:23,680
Speaker 3: like what you described, with everybody there. And he would

541
00:25:23,720 --> 00:25:26,320
Speaker 3: sit in the lobby and try to smoke his cigar

542
00:25:26,480 --> 00:25:28,359
Speaker 3: when you could smoke inside in those days, and have

543
00:25:28,400 --> 00:25:31,360
Speaker 3: a drink, and he would be accosted by people looking

544
00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:33,639
Speaker 3: to have him use his influence on their behalf or

545
00:25:33,680 --> 00:25:36,080
Speaker 3: to get jobs or whatever. And he called them these

546
00:25:36,160 --> 00:25:39,399
Speaker 3: damn lobbyists because they were always in the lobby.

547
00:25:39,440 --> 00:25:41,000
Speaker 1: And we got to use that word a lot at

548
00:25:41,040 --> 00:25:43,679
Speaker 1: the at Trump's Hotel, because the bar was in the lobby.

549
00:25:43,720 --> 00:25:45,880
Speaker 1: You know, it wasn't some sort of like cloistered thing away.

550
00:25:45,920 --> 00:25:47,520
Speaker 1: It was like right out there in the lobby. It

551
00:25:47,600 --> 00:25:50,080
Speaker 1: was the lobby bar. So yet I've I've probably used

552
00:25:50,080 --> 00:25:52,080
Speaker 1: the word lobbyist in more art.

553
00:25:52,080 --> 00:25:55,040
Speaker 2: I'd like to think, how do politicians make money from

554
00:25:55,080 --> 00:25:58,280
Speaker 2: conspiracy theorists and those who believe in qan on these

555
00:25:58,359 --> 00:26:01,000
Speaker 2: kind of things. I mean, it seems like people have

556
00:26:01,040 --> 00:26:03,240
Speaker 2: been able to figure out a way to make money

557
00:26:03,240 --> 00:26:05,320
Speaker 2: off these conspiracies out or do they do they put

558
00:26:05,320 --> 00:26:07,280
Speaker 2: out the conspiracies hoping to figure out a way to

559
00:26:07,440 --> 00:26:08,000
Speaker 2: make money.

560
00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:11,880
Speaker 1: One of my favorites was the hotel in Chicago had

561
00:26:11,920 --> 00:26:16,119
Speaker 1: a every year around Christmas time. It does a gingerbread

562
00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:20,240
Speaker 1: display in its elevator, and apparently the number seventeen in

563
00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:24,000
Speaker 1: the letter q were there prominently and people were going nuts.

564
00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:27,719
Speaker 1: But qwan On supporterers booked Trump's DC Hotel for an

565
00:26:27,720 --> 00:26:30,359
Speaker 1: event where the guy they all thought was JFK Junior

566
00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:32,639
Speaker 1: was there. And that's actually how it warned a lot

567
00:26:32,680 --> 00:26:35,199
Speaker 1: about QAnon was from going down that rabbit hole. I'm

568
00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:36,840
Speaker 1: looking to see who's at the Trump Hotel and then

569
00:26:36,840 --> 00:26:40,360
Speaker 1: I'm like, wait, they think this guy is JFK Junior

570
00:26:40,800 --> 00:26:43,320
Speaker 1: and then they think, oh wait, they think there's another

571
00:26:43,400 --> 00:26:46,520
Speaker 1: one of these JFK junior guys because they're different heights,

572
00:26:46,560 --> 00:26:48,959
Speaker 1: Like what the hell am I looking at? And that's

573
00:26:49,000 --> 00:26:51,280
Speaker 1: when I first was like, all right, can't ignore this

574
00:26:51,400 --> 00:26:54,119
Speaker 1: QAnon nonsense anymore. I need to get up to speed

575
00:26:54,200 --> 00:26:57,040
Speaker 1: on it. And it caught me up. But he's had

576
00:26:57,080 --> 00:26:59,399
Speaker 1: conferences at Durrell as well, where they have a lot

577
00:26:59,440 --> 00:27:02,240
Speaker 1: of people who just go there and spout off theories.

578
00:27:02,480 --> 00:27:04,680
Speaker 1: I think the way politicians benefit from it, and again

579
00:27:04,720 --> 00:27:09,000
Speaker 1: not necessarily financially directly, but is by go they were

580
00:27:09,040 --> 00:27:11,960
Speaker 1: at these conferences, they go then embrace these people. They

581
00:27:12,040 --> 00:27:14,679
Speaker 1: might not come all the way out and say, you know,

582
00:27:14,720 --> 00:27:16,720
Speaker 1: as much as like Marjorie Taylor Green does that they're

583
00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:19,760
Speaker 1: going to agree with the conspiracy theory, but they'll dog

584
00:27:19,800 --> 00:27:22,239
Speaker 1: whistle or they won't deny it, or they'll say, oh,

585
00:27:22,280 --> 00:27:24,919
Speaker 1: you know, that might that's an interesting point. And that

586
00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:26,840
Speaker 1: way they were able to pick up their following, and

587
00:27:26,840 --> 00:27:27,760
Speaker 1: I think it works.

588
00:27:27,560 --> 00:27:30,560
Speaker 3: And most people become small donors too, right, and especially

589
00:27:30,640 --> 00:27:33,560
Speaker 3: people who are passionate about their beliefs, even if those

590
00:27:33,760 --> 00:27:37,040
Speaker 3: beliefs are QAnon conspiracy theories. Once you've got the all

591
00:27:37,119 --> 00:27:41,480
Speaker 3: important list of donors right their email addresses, those are

592
00:27:41,520 --> 00:27:43,400
Speaker 3: the folks you can go out to time and time again.

593
00:27:43,520 --> 00:27:46,639
Speaker 1: I had also seen a couple reports from like legitimate

594
00:27:46,680 --> 00:27:50,400
Speaker 1: news services that in the hotel there was a room

595
00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:53,439
Speaker 1: that they called the Tinfoil Room. This is the DC Hotel,

596
00:27:53,880 --> 00:27:58,480
Speaker 1: and it was to provide secure communications for Trump in

597
00:27:58,520 --> 00:28:02,280
Speaker 1: a way that the deep state could not monitor. Now,

598
00:28:02,400 --> 00:28:05,359
Speaker 1: I filed Foyer requests, which you know, I wasn't expecting

599
00:28:05,440 --> 00:28:07,439
Speaker 1: much of response from that. I talked to people who

600
00:28:07,520 --> 00:28:10,560
Speaker 1: were intimate knowledge of the building. I couldn't get any

601
00:28:10,600 --> 00:28:13,400
Speaker 1: confirmation of it. No place sells something in these two

602
00:28:13,400 --> 00:28:15,879
Speaker 1: outlets seven or eight years ago reported it. Do you

603
00:28:15,920 --> 00:28:17,200
Speaker 1: guys even think that's plausible.

604
00:28:18,040 --> 00:28:20,320
Speaker 2: So it's in terms of grifting and things. There's a

605
00:28:20,440 --> 00:28:24,639
Speaker 2: large security industry. Back when we first started, it was

606
00:28:25,160 --> 00:28:27,280
Speaker 2: by the FBI and CI had all the fancy little

607
00:28:27,280 --> 00:28:30,360
Speaker 2: gear and listening devices and ways to block listening devices

608
00:28:30,400 --> 00:28:33,280
Speaker 2: and all that type of communications and ways to hide things.

609
00:28:33,960 --> 00:28:36,879
Speaker 2: Now there's so much of that stuff that's publicly available.

610
00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:39,280
Speaker 2: So I'm sure somebody is coming in and saying, Okay,

611
00:28:39,320 --> 00:28:42,240
Speaker 2: I'm going to sweep this room, and we're gonna put

612
00:28:42,360 --> 00:28:45,440
Speaker 2: foil behind the walls. We do this overseas like metal

613
00:28:45,760 --> 00:28:48,160
Speaker 2: caging to try in case someone's trying to send in

614
00:28:48,280 --> 00:28:51,920
Speaker 2: signals from the outside microwave signals or something, and we're

615
00:28:51,960 --> 00:28:54,880
Speaker 2: gonna have you know, full time security there. Like, there

616
00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:58,160
Speaker 2: are things you can do to create a room that

617
00:28:58,320 --> 00:29:01,400
Speaker 2: is generally secure. And the notion that the deep state

618
00:29:01,560 --> 00:29:03,680
Speaker 2: is trying to listen to the President of the United States,

619
00:29:03,680 --> 00:29:06,080
Speaker 2: who's in charge of the deep state, listening to his

620
00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:09,480
Speaker 2: stuff is crazy. If in fact that was say the Chinese,

621
00:29:09,560 --> 00:29:11,480
Speaker 2: and they thought they could create a room in a

622
00:29:11,560 --> 00:29:14,600
Speaker 2: hotel that could protect against the deep state, the FBI

623
00:29:14,680 --> 00:29:17,520
Speaker 2: to see idea to say, do have the ability probably

624
00:29:17,560 --> 00:29:19,920
Speaker 2: to make it so that as hard as you tried,

625
00:29:19,960 --> 00:29:23,320
Speaker 2: they could probably find a way around it. But for

626
00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:25,640
Speaker 2: somebody like Trump, if they actually believe this and they're

627
00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:27,320
Speaker 2: going to have these meetings of Rue Julian and this

628
00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:29,840
Speaker 2: kind of stuff, there's security places that could build it

629
00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:31,720
Speaker 2: to make it. When someone went in there, they would

630
00:29:31,720 --> 00:29:33,560
Speaker 2: feel like they are really important, and there's all these

631
00:29:33,640 --> 00:29:35,640
Speaker 2: kind of bells and whistles and stuff. So I think

632
00:29:35,640 --> 00:29:36,600
Speaker 2: that's certainly possible.

633
00:29:36,960 --> 00:29:40,360
Speaker 3: Yeah, he might actually qualify for a skiff, right for

634
00:29:40,440 --> 00:29:43,400
Speaker 3: a bubble, because he still is I think he's still

635
00:29:43,640 --> 00:29:47,760
Speaker 3: hand received briefings, classified briefings as former president at least

636
00:29:47,800 --> 00:29:50,480
Speaker 3: other former presidents get him, so he could probably make

637
00:29:50,520 --> 00:29:53,760
Speaker 3: a call for a classified space either at mar A

638
00:29:53,840 --> 00:29:56,720
Speaker 3: Lago or apps in his hotel. And I think if

639
00:29:56,760 --> 00:30:00,240
Speaker 3: the government provided that, if there was a jumble in that, yeah,

640
00:30:00,240 --> 00:30:03,000
Speaker 3: you could probably find it out through a foyer request.

641
00:30:03,000 --> 00:30:05,479
Speaker 2: But there was reporting in the paper today about this

642
00:30:05,640 --> 00:30:09,320
Speaker 2: very thing. So apparently the Biden administration went to him

643
00:30:09,360 --> 00:30:11,320
Speaker 2: and pulled him aside and gave him a classified briefing

644
00:30:11,360 --> 00:30:14,400
Speaker 2: on the fact that the Iranians are interested in potentially

645
00:30:14,440 --> 00:30:18,440
Speaker 2: assassinating him, and they gave him this briefing. And what

646
00:30:18,600 --> 00:30:20,960
Speaker 2: happened with the Mueller briefing at the beginning of his tour,

647
00:30:21,040 --> 00:30:24,479
Speaker 2: he thought that this was reported that he doesn't trust

648
00:30:24,520 --> 00:30:26,880
Speaker 2: the Biden administration. He thinks that they're trying to trick

649
00:30:26,960 --> 00:30:30,080
Speaker 2: him in some way, and so he's refused classified briefings

650
00:30:30,080 --> 00:30:33,920
Speaker 2: because he thinks it's the administration trying to put disinformation

651
00:30:33,960 --> 00:30:36,280
Speaker 2: into his head. And so, yes, he does probably have

652
00:30:36,320 --> 00:30:38,280
Speaker 2: the right to have a skiff and get regular briefings,

653
00:30:38,280 --> 00:30:41,160
Speaker 2: but apparently he's turned them down because he thinks he's

654
00:30:41,200 --> 00:30:42,640
Speaker 2: being fooled, which is silly.

655
00:30:43,040 --> 00:30:45,880
Speaker 3: That's called duty to warn. So if we know you

656
00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:49,160
Speaker 3: no seriously in the agency, if we have intelligence that

657
00:30:49,360 --> 00:30:53,880
Speaker 3: someone is faces mortal danger, to include our enemies. At

658
00:30:53,880 --> 00:30:56,320
Speaker 3: one time, there was a there's a nation state who

659
00:30:56,400 --> 00:30:59,440
Speaker 3: is really not friendly to us, and we had credible

660
00:30:59,440 --> 00:31:02,240
Speaker 3: information that someone was trying to assassinate this guy. And

661
00:31:02,320 --> 00:31:06,120
Speaker 3: I was overseas as station chief, and I arranged a

662
00:31:06,160 --> 00:31:08,120
Speaker 3: meeting and I sat down and I said, people are

663
00:31:08,120 --> 00:31:09,959
Speaker 3: trying to kill you, and I gave him some basic details.

664
00:31:10,000 --> 00:31:12,560
Speaker 3: He's what's the catch, Like, there is it one? This

665
00:31:12,720 --> 00:31:15,560
Speaker 3: is us law. I need to tell you this, and

666
00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:18,360
Speaker 3: he was certain I was up to something, but really

667
00:31:18,360 --> 00:31:19,000
Speaker 3: we work.

668
00:31:19,480 --> 00:31:21,400
Speaker 2: Hold on just a second. Well, we take a quick

669
00:31:21,440 --> 00:31:28,200
Speaker 2: break and we're back.

670
00:31:28,760 --> 00:31:31,040
Speaker 1: I like the stuff that's hiding in plain sight. Probably

671
00:31:31,040 --> 00:31:34,480
Speaker 1: the thing that I'm most proud of reporting wise is

672
00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:37,600
Speaker 1: I was able to figure out that Nigeria's vice president

673
00:31:37,680 --> 00:31:40,320
Speaker 1: was staying at the Trump hotel based on the pattern

674
00:31:40,360 --> 00:31:42,880
Speaker 1: of the throw pillows on the couch where he gave

675
00:31:42,920 --> 00:31:46,320
Speaker 1: an interview. Somebody had posted a picture with the Nigerian

676
00:31:46,360 --> 00:31:49,120
Speaker 1: Vice President, saying that they were interviewing him at Trump Hotel,

677
00:31:49,160 --> 00:31:51,280
Speaker 1: but the background was all white, so I couldn't confirm it.

678
00:31:51,320 --> 00:31:53,560
Speaker 1: That wasn't good enough, but at least it hid me

679
00:31:53,560 --> 00:31:55,600
Speaker 1: in that I should look for this guy. So I

680
00:31:55,640 --> 00:31:58,360
Speaker 1: start looking at what was he doing around the dates

681
00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:01,440
Speaker 1: that picture was taken, and I find a video interview

682
00:32:01,480 --> 00:32:04,680
Speaker 1: he did with Voice of America and it doesn't identify

683
00:32:04,720 --> 00:32:07,560
Speaker 1: where he is, but I can't. I took screenshots at

684
00:32:07,560 --> 00:32:10,080
Speaker 1: the background and you can see, you said, the design

685
00:32:10,120 --> 00:32:12,200
Speaker 1: on the throw pillows, where the lamp is, where the

686
00:32:12,240 --> 00:32:14,920
Speaker 1: pictures are, where the pictures are of the background. And

687
00:32:14,960 --> 00:32:18,240
Speaker 1: then I went to the Trump Hotels website it started

688
00:32:18,240 --> 00:32:21,120
Speaker 1: looking at pictures of their nicer sweets and was able

689
00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:23,440
Speaker 1: to find one that matched it. And then I just

690
00:32:23,440 --> 00:32:24,960
Speaker 1: lined up where the boxes are and it was like,

691
00:32:25,000 --> 00:32:28,800
Speaker 1: oh great, that was throw pillows. It's what belling Cat does,

692
00:32:28,840 --> 00:32:32,080
Speaker 1: but for you know, cushions rather than missiles.

693
00:32:32,240 --> 00:32:35,240
Speaker 2: So Zach, what are you working on now and are

694
00:32:35,320 --> 00:32:38,120
Speaker 2: you looking into anything that conspiratorial nature?

695
00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:40,600
Speaker 1: A lot of campaign finance stuff. Still looking at Trump

696
00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:44,920
Speaker 1: media through social I find very interesting what's going on there.

697
00:32:45,280 --> 00:32:48,080
Speaker 1: Just the fact that it's so overvalued and he's made

698
00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:50,479
Speaker 1: so much money. I'm fascinated to find out when he

699
00:32:50,600 --> 00:32:54,120
Speaker 1: might sell those stocks. He hasn't, he said he's keeping them.

700
00:32:54,680 --> 00:32:58,920
Speaker 1: But he is a man of many debts, both legal

701
00:32:59,040 --> 00:33:02,520
Speaker 1: and mortgage. In Particulous, forty Wall Street Building is a

702
00:33:02,520 --> 00:33:05,160
Speaker 1: bit of a money loser by our accounts, and it

703
00:33:05,360 --> 00:33:08,080
Speaker 1: has a mortgage coming due, and he might have a

704
00:33:08,080 --> 00:33:10,680
Speaker 1: hard time finding somebody who's willing to lend him money

705
00:33:10,720 --> 00:33:12,920
Speaker 1: on a business that looks to be underwater. And the

706
00:33:12,920 --> 00:33:14,479
Speaker 1: way that list is set up, it's about to get

707
00:33:14,480 --> 00:33:16,480
Speaker 1: worse for it in about ten eight years. He has

708
00:33:16,600 --> 00:33:18,800
Speaker 1: plenty of good uses for that money, and that would

709
00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:20,520
Speaker 1: be interesting to see if you sell some of it

710
00:33:20,720 --> 00:33:22,840
Speaker 1: and uses it for that. You know, right now he's

711
00:33:22,840 --> 00:33:24,520
Speaker 1: got a pretty good thing, Gallen, where he can take

712
00:33:24,600 --> 00:33:26,400
Speaker 1: his political money and use it to pay off his

713
00:33:26,480 --> 00:33:27,000
Speaker 1: legal fees.

714
00:33:27,440 --> 00:33:30,320
Speaker 2: Good luck, keep at it, very interesting. Well, get you

715
00:33:30,400 --> 00:33:33,440
Speaker 2: back as things developed. But zex, thank you so much

716
00:33:33,480 --> 00:33:35,200
Speaker 2: for your time to that really interesting stuff.

717
00:33:35,440 --> 00:33:36,719
Speaker 1: A lot to thank you guys for having me.

718
00:33:37,360 --> 00:33:42,360
Speaker 4: Mission Implausible is produced by Adam Davidson, Jerry O'sha, John Cipher,

719
00:33:42,720 --> 00:33:47,760
Speaker 4: and Jonathan Stern. The Associate producer is Rachel Harner. Mission implausible.

720
00:33:47,760 --> 00:33:51,320
Speaker 4: It's a production of honorable mention and abominable pictures for

721
00:33:51,440 --> 00:33:52,520
Speaker 4: iHeart podcasts

722
00:34:00,160 --> 00:34:14,440
Speaker 2: Oh