1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:03,760 Speaker 1: M Hey everybody, it's me Josh and for this week's 2 00:00:03,960 --> 00:00:07,600 Speaker 1: s Y s K Selects, I've chosen our classic episode 3 00:00:07,640 --> 00:00:11,120 Speaker 1: on the classic feud between the classic families, the hat 4 00:00:11,160 --> 00:00:14,120 Speaker 1: Fields and the McCoy's. It's one of the more interesting 5 00:00:14,200 --> 00:00:17,720 Speaker 1: stories of American history and it's way more nuts than 6 00:00:17,760 --> 00:00:20,319 Speaker 1: you even thought. And I don't know about you, though, 7 00:00:21,000 --> 00:00:22,599 Speaker 1: I just want to put a little bug in your ear. 8 00:00:22,840 --> 00:00:25,720 Speaker 1: Every time I hear the name Jim Vance in this episode, 9 00:00:26,000 --> 00:00:27,800 Speaker 1: I always want to follow it in my mind with 10 00:00:28,120 --> 00:00:31,240 Speaker 1: Vance refrigeration. See if that happens to you. Now that 11 00:00:31,240 --> 00:00:34,239 Speaker 1: I've said that, I hope you enjoy this one. It's 12 00:00:34,240 --> 00:00:43,320 Speaker 1: a classic, as I said, so enjoy away. Welcome to 13 00:00:43,320 --> 00:00:46,000 Speaker 1: Stuff You Should Know, a production of My Heart Radios 14 00:00:46,000 --> 00:00:54,360 Speaker 1: How Stuff Works. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm 15 00:00:54,440 --> 00:00:57,280 Speaker 1: Josh Clark. Charles W. Took. Brian is staring at me 16 00:00:57,480 --> 00:01:00,520 Speaker 1: right now. It's making me a toun uncomfortable. Jerry's over there. 17 00:01:00,680 --> 00:01:02,640 Speaker 1: I can feel her eyes burning into the side of 18 00:01:02,680 --> 00:01:05,160 Speaker 1: my head. So is the Stuff You Should Know? Where 19 00:01:05,160 --> 00:01:08,800 Speaker 1: would you like me to look? Uh uh in my ear? 20 00:01:09,120 --> 00:01:12,240 Speaker 1: Oh that's always so weird to someone's like looking, Are 21 00:01:12,280 --> 00:01:14,000 Speaker 1: you doing it right? Now like right at your hair 22 00:01:14,280 --> 00:01:20,400 Speaker 1: or really? Yeah, interesting, try my other ear. Oh yeah, 23 00:01:20,440 --> 00:01:23,360 Speaker 1: that's that's the stuff the right. Sorry, that's your left. 24 00:01:23,480 --> 00:01:25,560 Speaker 1: That's my left ear. All right, I'll remember that. Look 25 00:01:25,600 --> 00:01:29,240 Speaker 1: watch this, chuck, after seven years, can you see that 26 00:01:29,240 --> 00:01:34,720 Speaker 1: I can wiggle ears independently? Drives me crazy? So you 27 00:01:34,760 --> 00:01:37,600 Speaker 1: sit around and do it? Probably try not like a 28 00:01:37,600 --> 00:01:42,399 Speaker 1: good husband. Um, chuck. Yes, we have a bit of 29 00:01:42,440 --> 00:01:45,959 Speaker 1: an announcement here. Yeah, what we just heard? Yes, yeah, 30 00:01:46,200 --> 00:01:49,920 Speaker 1: we're in the room with either a hat Field or McCoy. 31 00:01:50,360 --> 00:01:52,680 Speaker 1: Jerry doesn't know which family she's related to. She just 32 00:01:52,720 --> 00:01:55,400 Speaker 1: knows that she's related to one of them. Yeah, like literally, 33 00:01:55,480 --> 00:01:57,320 Speaker 1: right before we press the courts, she's like, oh, by 34 00:01:57,360 --> 00:02:00,320 Speaker 1: the way, I'm related to one of these families. I'm 35 00:02:00,360 --> 00:02:03,520 Speaker 1: just not sure which. And a family member told her, 36 00:02:04,560 --> 00:02:07,960 Speaker 1: but she cousin Tyler was that? Who was? I don't know. 37 00:02:08,000 --> 00:02:10,600 Speaker 1: I think that's what she said, cousin. I get the 38 00:02:10,639 --> 00:02:12,960 Speaker 1: impression from Jerry's story though, that she's sort of like 39 00:02:13,639 --> 00:02:16,800 Speaker 1: glazed over and that's why she doesn't know. But she 40 00:02:16,840 --> 00:02:19,400 Speaker 1: does carry a six shooter on her hip, and that 41 00:02:19,520 --> 00:02:23,720 Speaker 1: explains that this is McCoy on the barrel, So maybe right, 42 00:02:23,880 --> 00:02:25,560 Speaker 1: but does that mean that it's a bullet from the 43 00:02:25,639 --> 00:02:28,760 Speaker 1: McCoys or for the McCoy's good monstry remains, you know, 44 00:02:28,919 --> 00:02:31,880 Speaker 1: good point. So we are talking about the hat Fields 45 00:02:31,919 --> 00:02:34,040 Speaker 1: in the McCoy's. For those of you who don't live 46 00:02:34,080 --> 00:02:36,480 Speaker 1: in the United States, you probably have heard of the 47 00:02:36,480 --> 00:02:40,520 Speaker 1: hat Fields in the McCoy's. It's a pretty legendary feud. Yeah, right, 48 00:02:41,000 --> 00:02:45,840 Speaker 1: we've heard of some of your history UK Australia, Matthew Flinders, 49 00:02:45,880 --> 00:02:49,480 Speaker 1: there's a name drop for you. Yeah, so hopefully you've 50 00:02:49,520 --> 00:02:51,240 Speaker 1: heard of the hat Fields in the McCoy's. Yeah, I 51 00:02:51,240 --> 00:02:53,440 Speaker 1: mean there was, if nothing else, there was a big 52 00:02:53,480 --> 00:02:56,480 Speaker 1: mini series a few years ago on television, Yeah, with 53 00:02:56,720 --> 00:03:03,880 Speaker 1: Kevin Costner and Bill Paxton, and apparently it was really dramatized. Yeah, 54 00:03:04,160 --> 00:03:09,920 Speaker 1: like asn't fictionalized. Yeah, cinematized and yeah, a little not 55 00:03:10,080 --> 00:03:14,040 Speaker 1: quite fully accurate, but at least at least they brought 56 00:03:14,040 --> 00:03:18,080 Speaker 1: attention to the feud because it needs agreed. So, the 57 00:03:18,120 --> 00:03:23,520 Speaker 1: hat Fields in McCoy's um is a family feud, so 58 00:03:23,600 --> 00:03:27,360 Speaker 1: much so that in nine the hat Fields and the 59 00:03:27,400 --> 00:03:31,200 Speaker 1: McCoy's were on the TV show Family Feud, apparently for 60 00:03:31,240 --> 00:03:34,080 Speaker 1: a full week from what I saw, and I read 61 00:03:34,160 --> 00:03:37,600 Speaker 1: that legend has it that it didn't actually inspired the 62 00:03:37,640 --> 00:03:40,400 Speaker 1: TV show, but I didn't get good verification on that. 63 00:03:40,600 --> 00:03:43,520 Speaker 1: Now and there there have been other family feuds, right, 64 00:03:44,160 --> 00:03:46,720 Speaker 1: but none are as famous as the hat Fields in 65 00:03:46,760 --> 00:03:50,080 Speaker 1: the McCoys, although at the time there were more famous 66 00:03:50,200 --> 00:03:53,400 Speaker 1: family feuds. But the hat Fields in McCoys just took 67 00:03:53,440 --> 00:03:56,960 Speaker 1: it to another level because all of the murder. Yeah, 68 00:03:57,000 --> 00:03:59,080 Speaker 1: there there was a lot of murder. It was mountain 69 00:03:59,120 --> 00:04:03,760 Speaker 1: folk versus mountain folks, families that had been intermarried and 70 00:04:04,160 --> 00:04:08,520 Speaker 1: worked for one another, and um had lived together for decades, 71 00:04:08,560 --> 00:04:13,839 Speaker 1: if not longer, alongside in this little area along the 72 00:04:13,920 --> 00:04:17,560 Speaker 1: Sandy River, I believe, the Big Sandy River, in something 73 00:04:17,640 --> 00:04:20,840 Speaker 1: that's called the Tug River Valley, and on one side 74 00:04:21,279 --> 00:04:24,200 Speaker 1: mostly the hat Fields lived on the West Virginia side 75 00:04:24,560 --> 00:04:27,920 Speaker 1: in Logan County, and right across the river on the 76 00:04:27,920 --> 00:04:31,839 Speaker 1: other side in Kentucky. The McCoy has lived in Pike County. 77 00:04:32,040 --> 00:04:36,599 Speaker 1: And that's how it was for days gone by. Yeah, 78 00:04:36,720 --> 00:04:40,440 Speaker 1: and they they were not new to the United States, 79 00:04:40,520 --> 00:04:43,760 Speaker 1: So I guess it wasn't the United States then, was it. Yeah, 80 00:04:44,600 --> 00:04:48,520 Speaker 1: we're talking about the fifties seventies. I was way off then, 81 00:04:48,920 --> 00:04:53,480 Speaker 1: but they came to America many many years before that. Um. 82 00:04:53,520 --> 00:04:55,839 Speaker 1: Apparently the hat Fields were some of the very first 83 00:04:56,440 --> 00:05:00,520 Speaker 1: to come to uh, the New World from northern Land, 84 00:05:00,800 --> 00:05:03,880 Speaker 1: and the McCoy's are obviously from Germany. Well, the hat 85 00:05:03,880 --> 00:05:06,880 Speaker 1: Fields were originally the heath Fields in England. That sounds 86 00:05:06,920 --> 00:05:09,200 Speaker 1: way more British. Yeah, but you know how you do. 87 00:05:09,880 --> 00:05:12,719 Speaker 1: You come over to America and you you dumb it 88 00:05:12,760 --> 00:05:16,000 Speaker 1: down a little. I know Heath Ledger changed his name 89 00:05:16,040 --> 00:05:20,160 Speaker 1: to hat Ledger when he got here, didn't he all right? 90 00:05:20,240 --> 00:05:23,440 Speaker 1: P uh. And the McCoy's come from Scotland, of course 91 00:05:23,440 --> 00:05:26,040 Speaker 1: you could probably figure that out, moved to Ireland before 92 00:05:26,080 --> 00:05:28,480 Speaker 1: they came to the New World. And the first known 93 00:05:28,560 --> 00:05:32,440 Speaker 1: McCoy was John McCoy in America. When was that, uh, 94 00:05:32,760 --> 00:05:36,840 Speaker 1: seventeen thirty two from Belfast, Ireland. So did they move 95 00:05:36,920 --> 00:05:39,960 Speaker 1: directly to the Tug River area? Is that where they settled? Now? 96 00:05:40,480 --> 00:05:44,080 Speaker 1: The McCoy's first settled in Maryland, where he was a 97 00:05:44,080 --> 00:05:47,080 Speaker 1: prominent landowner, and I think the Hatfield's first moved to 98 00:05:47,120 --> 00:05:52,320 Speaker 1: Tug Valley in eighteen twenty and the McCoy's uh in 99 00:05:52,480 --> 00:05:57,000 Speaker 1: eighteen o two with their twelve kids. So they've been like, really, 100 00:05:57,040 --> 00:06:00,680 Speaker 1: these families had grown up living in in working with 101 00:06:00,720 --> 00:06:04,080 Speaker 1: each other. Was not just these two families in the area, 102 00:06:04,080 --> 00:06:07,359 Speaker 1: there are plenty of other families, but like they were neighbors, 103 00:06:07,680 --> 00:06:13,120 Speaker 1: co workers, bosson employee, they were, they were husbands and wives, 104 00:06:13,400 --> 00:06:15,880 Speaker 1: they intermarried, you know, I mean like they were they 105 00:06:15,880 --> 00:06:19,880 Speaker 1: were living together for decades. Yeah. I think the two 106 00:06:20,080 --> 00:06:22,840 Speaker 1: um that originally settled at tug Fork were the actual 107 00:06:22,880 --> 00:06:28,000 Speaker 1: parents of the two main protagonists or antagonists. I guess 108 00:06:28,040 --> 00:06:31,119 Speaker 1: they were both. Yeah, they were both pro and and 109 00:06:31,120 --> 00:06:35,920 Speaker 1: and so they the the story. Our story really kind 110 00:06:35,960 --> 00:06:39,880 Speaker 1: of begins around about the Civil War. UM, this area 111 00:06:39,920 --> 00:06:44,520 Speaker 1: of the Tug River Valley was mostly Confederate, and both 112 00:06:44,520 --> 00:06:48,080 Speaker 1: the Hatfield and the McCoy's were Confederate sympathizers, if not 113 00:06:48,200 --> 00:06:53,640 Speaker 1: outright Confederate soldiers. UM. The antagonist or protagonist the patriarch 114 00:06:53,720 --> 00:06:56,760 Speaker 1: of the Hatfield family when the story begins. His name 115 00:06:56,800 --> 00:07:00,880 Speaker 1: was devil Ants Hatfield, right, Yeah, that was his nickname. 116 00:07:01,480 --> 00:07:04,560 Speaker 1: His real name was William Anderson Hatfield. Yeah, but devil 117 00:07:04,600 --> 00:07:06,640 Speaker 1: Ace what a cool name. Yeah. And I saw a 118 00:07:06,680 --> 00:07:09,240 Speaker 1: couple of different explanations for where his nickname came from. 119 00:07:09,240 --> 00:07:11,400 Speaker 1: But my favorite one was that his mother said he 120 00:07:11,480 --> 00:07:14,400 Speaker 1: was so mean, the devil himself was scared of him. Yeah. 121 00:07:14,400 --> 00:07:17,240 Speaker 1: I saw one that said he was six ft of 122 00:07:17,800 --> 00:07:21,360 Speaker 1: devil in a hundred and eighty pounds of hell. They 123 00:07:21,400 --> 00:07:23,560 Speaker 1: had stupid sayings back then. Yeah, that was It didn't 124 00:07:23,600 --> 00:07:26,080 Speaker 1: quite add up, especially in the backwoods of Kentucky and 125 00:07:26,120 --> 00:07:28,520 Speaker 1: West Virginia. You know, they just said stuff. They just 126 00:07:28,560 --> 00:07:33,120 Speaker 1: made up names as as we'll see throughout this whole episode. 127 00:07:33,440 --> 00:07:38,160 Speaker 1: But um, devil ants himself was a he was from 128 00:07:38,200 --> 00:07:40,680 Speaker 1: what I saw. He was described as somebody who took 129 00:07:40,840 --> 00:07:43,760 Speaker 1: life by the horns, right. He was very much a 130 00:07:43,800 --> 00:07:47,760 Speaker 1: self made man. Um. He got he became a pretty 131 00:07:47,760 --> 00:07:51,480 Speaker 1: wealthy timber merchant over the years. But he was, um, 132 00:07:51,600 --> 00:07:55,840 Speaker 1: he was a violent man. Uh. And he was a well, 133 00:07:55,840 --> 00:07:58,920 Speaker 1: he had some violent tendencies for sure. Yeah. And um, 134 00:07:59,440 --> 00:08:01,320 Speaker 1: you know, if you want to trace back the reason 135 00:08:01,520 --> 00:08:06,000 Speaker 1: for the Hatfield McCoy feud, there isn't I think from 136 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:08,720 Speaker 1: everything I read, there isn't like one single thing. It's 137 00:08:08,760 --> 00:08:11,400 Speaker 1: often blamed on the pig deal, which we'll hear about 138 00:08:11,440 --> 00:08:13,800 Speaker 1: coming up. That seems to be the one that historians 139 00:08:13,840 --> 00:08:16,040 Speaker 1: point to the most these days though, Yeah, but as 140 00:08:16,040 --> 00:08:18,520 Speaker 1: sort of a convenient way of telling the story, because like, 141 00:08:18,680 --> 00:08:20,760 Speaker 1: what what better way to kick off a feud than 142 00:08:20,880 --> 00:08:24,360 Speaker 1: like with the stolen pig? Right it? Definitely there were 143 00:08:24,400 --> 00:08:28,160 Speaker 1: other problems or issues between these families before then, right yeah. 144 00:08:28,200 --> 00:08:29,720 Speaker 1: But the point is there are a lot of different 145 00:08:29,720 --> 00:08:31,760 Speaker 1: things going on, and one of them was, like you said, 146 00:08:32,400 --> 00:08:36,320 Speaker 1: was Um devil Ants made a lot more money than 147 00:08:36,720 --> 00:08:40,000 Speaker 1: McCoy as as a timber guy. So on the other 148 00:08:40,080 --> 00:08:42,760 Speaker 1: side of the river, in the Kentucky side Pike County, Kentucky, 149 00:08:43,080 --> 00:08:45,640 Speaker 1: there were the McCoy's, and at the time that devil 150 00:08:45,679 --> 00:08:49,040 Speaker 1: Ants was the patriarch of the Hatfield clan, a man 151 00:08:49,160 --> 00:08:54,080 Speaker 1: named Randall McCoy Old Randal h was the head of 152 00:08:54,080 --> 00:08:57,960 Speaker 1: the McCoy clan across the river in Kentucky, Right, Yeah. 153 00:08:58,160 --> 00:09:00,560 Speaker 1: I just get the sense that he had his sort 154 00:09:00,559 --> 00:09:03,760 Speaker 1: of smaller business and was always a little bit envious 155 00:09:03,840 --> 00:09:07,400 Speaker 1: of the larger timber business across very much. So he 156 00:09:07,520 --> 00:09:11,480 Speaker 1: was um. The way that I saw him described was um. 157 00:09:11,520 --> 00:09:13,520 Speaker 1: If devil Ants as a man who took life by 158 00:09:13,559 --> 00:09:17,679 Speaker 1: the horns, Old Randal was somebody who got hooked by 159 00:09:17,760 --> 00:09:22,400 Speaker 1: life's horns and he was very bitter about his lot 160 00:09:22,520 --> 00:09:26,880 Speaker 1: in life. His father, Um I saw, was described as 161 00:09:26,960 --> 00:09:31,120 Speaker 1: didn't much care for work. Um didn't leave, didn't leave 162 00:09:31,160 --> 00:09:34,960 Speaker 1: his kids anything. So his son had to be a 163 00:09:35,000 --> 00:09:37,160 Speaker 1: self made man. But he was a self made man 164 00:09:37,240 --> 00:09:41,360 Speaker 1: who never really made himself. He married a woman named Sarah, 165 00:09:41,400 --> 00:09:44,960 Speaker 1: and Sarah's father died and left them some land and 166 00:09:45,000 --> 00:09:47,160 Speaker 1: he was able to homestead on that. So that's how 167 00:09:47,200 --> 00:09:51,079 Speaker 1: he was able to establish himself was through his wife's 168 00:09:51,120 --> 00:09:54,400 Speaker 1: inheritance of her father's land. Um, but it was enough 169 00:09:54,440 --> 00:09:57,080 Speaker 1: to set him up. They were fine. They weren't prosperous, 170 00:09:57,160 --> 00:10:01,320 Speaker 1: but they weren't like just completely poverty stricken like Randall 171 00:10:01,400 --> 00:10:04,440 Speaker 1: had grown up. But just across the river and and 172 00:10:04,760 --> 00:10:07,160 Speaker 1: this other family that he had to deal with and 173 00:10:07,200 --> 00:10:10,000 Speaker 1: work with, um and and just kind of see and 174 00:10:10,240 --> 00:10:14,360 Speaker 1: interact with, was a man who he you know, had 175 00:10:14,400 --> 00:10:17,640 Speaker 1: made himself. And and definitely Randall was bitter about that 176 00:10:17,720 --> 00:10:21,200 Speaker 1: idea and the comparison between himself and devil ance. Yeah, 177 00:10:21,200 --> 00:10:23,400 Speaker 1: and I think um, some of the McCoys even worked 178 00:10:23,400 --> 00:10:25,760 Speaker 1: for some of the hat Fields, which is always gonna 179 00:10:25,800 --> 00:10:28,400 Speaker 1: be a little tense when you feel like maybe that 180 00:10:28,600 --> 00:10:32,120 Speaker 1: feeling of superiority comes over one family because you're working 181 00:10:32,160 --> 00:10:36,240 Speaker 1: for me, you know. Yeah, So there's definitely like you're saying, tention, right, 182 00:10:36,320 --> 00:10:40,720 Speaker 1: and and you can point to maybe these guys coming 183 00:10:40,760 --> 00:10:42,800 Speaker 1: into their own as the heads of the family when 184 00:10:42,800 --> 00:10:47,480 Speaker 1: the tension really started. For many years historians pointed to 185 00:10:47,720 --> 00:10:52,720 Speaker 1: a specific incident as the source of the family feud um, 186 00:10:52,760 --> 00:10:55,480 Speaker 1: but that's since been abandoned. So, like we said, the 187 00:10:55,520 --> 00:10:58,920 Speaker 1: Civil War is about the time when this story really starts. 188 00:10:58,920 --> 00:11:02,640 Speaker 1: In earnest and most of the Tug River Valley was Confederate. 189 00:11:03,000 --> 00:11:06,559 Speaker 1: Devil Lance and possibly Randall McCoy were part of what 190 00:11:06,559 --> 00:11:10,600 Speaker 1: we're called the Logan Wildcats, which was a militia, but 191 00:11:10,760 --> 00:11:13,760 Speaker 1: during the Civil War they were an actual like army 192 00:11:13,840 --> 00:11:16,280 Speaker 1: unit of the Confederate Army. Yeah, and that's all where 193 00:11:16,280 --> 00:11:19,680 Speaker 1: Devil Lance was even the leader in one place. But 194 00:11:19,800 --> 00:11:22,719 Speaker 1: I didn't get that verified a bunch either, So so 195 00:11:23,280 --> 00:11:25,439 Speaker 1: very least was in the brigade, right, And I got 196 00:11:25,440 --> 00:11:27,400 Speaker 1: the impression that if he wasn't a leader, he was 197 00:11:27,440 --> 00:11:29,920 Speaker 1: a de facto leader, because that was just this type 198 00:11:29,920 --> 00:11:33,640 Speaker 1: of personality Devil Lance. Don't answer to nobody, right, you 199 00:11:33,720 --> 00:11:36,679 Speaker 1: answer to him, That's right. That was a great devil 200 00:11:36,720 --> 00:11:39,240 Speaker 1: Lance by the way. So I think the leader of 201 00:11:39,240 --> 00:11:42,080 Speaker 1: the Logan Wildcats is another character who will come up later. 202 00:11:42,120 --> 00:11:47,880 Speaker 1: And his name is Um Jim Vance, So Jim Vance. Um. 203 00:11:48,360 --> 00:11:50,720 Speaker 1: He was not a very great guy from what I 204 00:11:50,720 --> 00:11:54,120 Speaker 1: can understand. But I'll let him paint his own picture. Okay, Oh, 205 00:11:54,200 --> 00:11:57,079 Speaker 1: was he coming in? He will in a little bit. Instead, 206 00:11:57,080 --> 00:11:59,760 Speaker 1: we're gonna focus on a guy named Asa Harmon McCoy. 207 00:12:00,080 --> 00:12:02,480 Speaker 1: And this guy I don't have a beat on. He 208 00:12:02,920 --> 00:12:07,240 Speaker 1: decided in in just complete contrast of the place where 209 00:12:07,280 --> 00:12:11,400 Speaker 1: he grew up. Um, he was going to join the 210 00:12:11,480 --> 00:12:15,320 Speaker 1: Yankee Union Army. Yeah, and he did, Yeah, but he 211 00:12:15,360 --> 00:12:18,840 Speaker 1: broke his leg and and uh left the service after 212 00:12:18,960 --> 00:12:22,360 Speaker 1: I think a year back. While he was in service, 213 00:12:22,480 --> 00:12:26,240 Speaker 1: his um commanding officer in the Union Army ordered him 214 00:12:26,320 --> 00:12:29,800 Speaker 1: to fight devil ants because there was rumors that he 215 00:12:29,840 --> 00:12:34,000 Speaker 1: was a Confederate spy. So Harmon fights devil nts, loses 216 00:12:34,040 --> 00:12:35,839 Speaker 1: the fight. And I didn't get a sense on what 217 00:12:35,920 --> 00:12:38,280 Speaker 1: kind of fight it was, whether it was like a 218 00:12:38,320 --> 00:12:41,320 Speaker 1: gun battle or whether he literally just like spit on 219 00:12:41,360 --> 00:12:44,559 Speaker 1: his boot and like took a swing. I'm not sure. 220 00:12:44,600 --> 00:12:46,160 Speaker 1: I don't know that if the if that was even 221 00:12:46,200 --> 00:12:49,440 Speaker 1: in the mini series. Um so they getting a fight, 222 00:12:49,520 --> 00:12:53,720 Speaker 1: he loses, and then uh the can the Union troops 223 00:12:53,720 --> 00:12:56,679 Speaker 1: went after devil Ance at that point, which is really 224 00:12:56,679 --> 00:12:59,839 Speaker 1: what cost a lot of the early issues. Uh. And 225 00:13:00,000 --> 00:13:04,360 Speaker 1: then later on Harmon shot a friend of devil Ance 226 00:13:04,760 --> 00:13:08,960 Speaker 1: while stealing his horse, so in turn he killed Harmon's 227 00:13:09,000 --> 00:13:11,920 Speaker 1: commanding officer in the Union army. Okay, there's a lot 228 00:13:11,960 --> 00:13:14,800 Speaker 1: of bad blood. The guy was like literally, General Bill 229 00:13:14,840 --> 00:13:18,440 Speaker 1: France was peeing off his porch like I do, and 230 00:13:18,520 --> 00:13:21,480 Speaker 1: Devils shot him in cold blood. I hope, I hope 231 00:13:21,480 --> 00:13:24,200 Speaker 1: that does not happen to you. I really hope so too. 232 00:13:24,280 --> 00:13:25,959 Speaker 1: It would be a bad way to go. Gives you pause, 233 00:13:26,040 --> 00:13:29,920 Speaker 1: you know. Yeah. So, um the after the war, after 234 00:13:30,160 --> 00:13:35,240 Speaker 1: um Asa, Harmon McCoy uh came back home. I did 235 00:13:35,280 --> 00:13:37,400 Speaker 1: not realize the attentions were already that high. I had 236 00:13:37,400 --> 00:13:40,319 Speaker 1: the impression that was just because he fought for the Union. 237 00:13:40,559 --> 00:13:43,360 Speaker 1: I didn't know he had been made to directly target 238 00:13:43,440 --> 00:13:47,160 Speaker 1: devil Ants right well, devil Lands and the Logan Wildcats 239 00:13:47,600 --> 00:13:51,560 Speaker 1: basically sent as a message saying watch yourself, because we're 240 00:13:51,559 --> 00:13:54,520 Speaker 1: coming for you. And he very wisely went off and 241 00:13:54,520 --> 00:13:56,800 Speaker 1: lived in a cave for a while he hit out, 242 00:13:57,320 --> 00:13:58,960 Speaker 1: And so with this guy, you're like, why did he 243 00:13:58,960 --> 00:14:01,839 Speaker 1: go fire for the Union? Was abolitionists? No, he had 244 00:14:01,840 --> 00:14:04,840 Speaker 1: a slave, and the slave kept him alive by bringing 245 00:14:04,920 --> 00:14:06,520 Speaker 1: him food and stuff while he was in the cave. 246 00:14:06,600 --> 00:14:08,480 Speaker 1: So I have no idea why he went and fought 247 00:14:08,520 --> 00:14:10,840 Speaker 1: for the Union. It's weird. The fact that he did, though, 248 00:14:11,240 --> 00:14:14,680 Speaker 1: meant that his own relatives, his own McCoy is, including Randall, 249 00:14:14,800 --> 00:14:18,640 Speaker 1: his brother. Um, really, we're just kind of like, yeah, 250 00:14:18,720 --> 00:14:20,880 Speaker 1: the Logan Wildcats are out to get you, and you 251 00:14:21,000 --> 00:14:24,440 Speaker 1: brought the sign yourself, so we don't really feel for you. 252 00:14:24,720 --> 00:14:29,000 Speaker 1: And they didn't apparently make much of a problem or 253 00:14:29,480 --> 00:14:32,840 Speaker 1: much they didn't take issue with it. When the Logan 254 00:14:32,840 --> 00:14:35,400 Speaker 1: Wildcats tracked him down to the cave and killed him, well, 255 00:14:35,480 --> 00:14:38,000 Speaker 1: he was actually coming home when they killed him. I 256 00:14:38,000 --> 00:14:40,600 Speaker 1: think he finally thought like, surely, after all this time, 257 00:14:41,520 --> 00:14:47,280 Speaker 1: they've forgotten about this troglobe bite troglodyte. Yeah, so he 258 00:14:47,360 --> 00:14:49,080 Speaker 1: was walking home to see his family that he hadn't 259 00:14:49,080 --> 00:14:51,480 Speaker 1: seen in years and Jim Vance shot him. That's how 260 00:14:51,520 --> 00:14:53,880 Speaker 1: long he was in the cave. Well, that might have 261 00:14:53,920 --> 00:14:57,400 Speaker 1: been part of the war, but it said a few 262 00:14:57,480 --> 00:15:01,120 Speaker 1: years man alive so well at fulle Man Debt. Asa 263 00:15:01,200 --> 00:15:04,840 Speaker 1: Harmon Uh McCoy is killed by the Logan Wildcats, and 264 00:15:04,960 --> 00:15:07,800 Speaker 1: apparently at first everybody thought it was Devil Answer did it, 265 00:15:07,840 --> 00:15:10,120 Speaker 1: but he turned out to have been bedridden at the time, 266 00:15:10,120 --> 00:15:12,520 Speaker 1: so we had an alibi, and they think instead that 267 00:15:12,560 --> 00:15:15,000 Speaker 1: it was Jim Vance who led it and probably killed 268 00:15:15,160 --> 00:15:20,000 Speaker 1: Asa doing his Devil's uncle okay um and strong ally 269 00:15:20,440 --> 00:15:24,200 Speaker 1: Jim Vance was so uh, Asa Harmon is dead. The 270 00:15:24,280 --> 00:15:26,480 Speaker 1: first shot has been fired in the family feud, so 271 00:15:26,600 --> 00:15:29,160 Speaker 1: thought the historians for years, and then I guess after 272 00:15:29,240 --> 00:15:33,080 Speaker 1: interviewing actual hat Fields and McCoy's they realized that no, 273 00:15:33,400 --> 00:15:36,000 Speaker 1: actually the McCoy's were like, he brought it on himself. 274 00:15:37,080 --> 00:15:40,160 Speaker 1: That's that's we made peace with this, and no charges 275 00:15:40,200 --> 00:15:43,600 Speaker 1: were even brought in the murder of Asa McCoy. Yeah. 276 00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:46,960 Speaker 1: I saw one article that described it as a murder agreement, 277 00:15:47,120 --> 00:15:50,680 Speaker 1: which apparently used to have that like blood in, blood out, 278 00:15:50,760 --> 00:15:54,960 Speaker 1: and everyone's like, all right, even Stephen, okay, so done 279 00:15:55,200 --> 00:15:58,800 Speaker 1: and the first death has occurred in the Hatfield McCoy feud, 280 00:15:58,920 --> 00:16:00,440 Speaker 1: but it has nothing to do with a hat Film 281 00:16:00,480 --> 00:16:03,960 Speaker 1: McCoy feud. Technically, yes, that seems like a pretty good 282 00:16:04,000 --> 00:16:26,600 Speaker 1: time to take a break, don't you agreed, sir, So Chuck, 283 00:16:26,640 --> 00:16:32,080 Speaker 1: we're back and asa harm Instead. Things are whatever between 284 00:16:32,160 --> 00:16:34,960 Speaker 1: the hat Fields and mccois. Nothing, nothing big has gone on, 285 00:16:35,040 --> 00:16:38,440 Speaker 1: even if there were any sort of skirmishes or little 286 00:16:38,480 --> 00:16:41,280 Speaker 1: fights or run ins or that kind of thing. I 287 00:16:41,320 --> 00:16:44,920 Speaker 1: get the impression that the families when they saw each other, 288 00:16:45,320 --> 00:16:48,800 Speaker 1: there was like a a slight percentage that the sides 289 00:16:48,840 --> 00:16:50,480 Speaker 1: were going to get in at least a fist fight, 290 00:16:50,760 --> 00:16:52,680 Speaker 1: did not take like pot shots, and right now they're 291 00:16:52,720 --> 00:16:54,800 Speaker 1: with their guns. I just think they probably just didn't 292 00:16:54,800 --> 00:16:58,360 Speaker 1: like each other very much from the beginning, so there's 293 00:16:58,400 --> 00:17:02,320 Speaker 1: possible those things went on. Nothing big happened though, until 294 00:17:03,000 --> 00:17:06,080 Speaker 1: the pig the pig incident, and apparently it wasn't just 295 00:17:06,160 --> 00:17:08,040 Speaker 1: one pig, that's what it's been boiled down to, but 296 00:17:08,119 --> 00:17:10,760 Speaker 1: it was several. Yeah, and it was a big deal 297 00:17:10,800 --> 00:17:13,280 Speaker 1: if you think about a pig. Stealing a pig is 298 00:17:13,320 --> 00:17:15,800 Speaker 1: not a big deal at the time. There's a book 299 00:17:15,800 --> 00:17:20,280 Speaker 1: called The Feud by Din King. Din King Dean King 300 00:17:20,520 --> 00:17:27,959 Speaker 1: thinking said it's so weird, Dean King, And he said, uh, 301 00:17:28,040 --> 00:17:30,240 Speaker 1: where was their next meal going to come from? And 302 00:17:30,280 --> 00:17:32,199 Speaker 1: how could they feed the children in the winter. They 303 00:17:32,200 --> 00:17:35,639 Speaker 1: were lucky enough to have one pig or razorback for 304 00:17:35,720 --> 00:17:39,400 Speaker 1: cell or trade. The proceeds were used to acquire flour, sugar, coffee, 305 00:17:39,640 --> 00:17:41,960 Speaker 1: sometimes shoes or boots for their families. It was a 306 00:17:42,000 --> 00:17:45,960 Speaker 1: mainstay for the family. So these days you hear a 307 00:17:46,000 --> 00:17:47,760 Speaker 1: pig or even a couple of pigs, you think, what's 308 00:17:47,760 --> 00:17:49,879 Speaker 1: a big deal. But in the region at the time, 309 00:17:50,480 --> 00:17:53,320 Speaker 1: these these pigs were very valuable, so it was a 310 00:17:53,320 --> 00:17:56,320 Speaker 1: big deal. Right. I saw a and in the front 311 00:17:56,400 --> 00:17:58,520 Speaker 1: I saw a dude on well, yeah, and that was 312 00:17:58,520 --> 00:18:02,560 Speaker 1: another thing. Again, we're talking out backwoods Appalachian folk in 313 00:18:02,600 --> 00:18:06,600 Speaker 1: the nineteenth century. There was a lot to the idea 314 00:18:06,680 --> 00:18:09,800 Speaker 1: that you had stolen their property, which as it should be. 315 00:18:09,840 --> 00:18:13,080 Speaker 1: But even that aside. I saw this historian on Um 316 00:18:13,119 --> 00:18:16,040 Speaker 1: a CBS Sunday Morning clip from a few years ago, 317 00:18:16,520 --> 00:18:20,639 Speaker 1: and he explained, like, you can feed a sizeable family 318 00:18:21,000 --> 00:18:23,680 Speaker 1: for a month with a single pig, And this guy 319 00:18:23,760 --> 00:18:26,959 Speaker 1: stole several pigs. So the guy who was accused of 320 00:18:26,960 --> 00:18:31,560 Speaker 1: stealing the pig was um Who was it, Chuck who? 321 00:18:31,880 --> 00:18:36,439 Speaker 1: Randolph McCoy accused Floyd Hatfield. Okay, right, so um Old 322 00:18:36,520 --> 00:18:40,800 Speaker 1: Randall himself said Floyd Hatfield, cousin of devl Ance, I 323 00:18:40,920 --> 00:18:43,960 Speaker 1: know that you stole those pigs, and I'm taking you 324 00:18:44,040 --> 00:18:46,959 Speaker 1: to court. Well, they went to court. The problem is 325 00:18:47,119 --> 00:18:51,080 Speaker 1: the local magistrate was a hat Field. But in this 326 00:18:51,119 --> 00:18:53,760 Speaker 1: guy's favor, his name was a preacher. It was his 327 00:18:53,800 --> 00:18:56,199 Speaker 1: first name, I believe, and he was basically the what 328 00:18:56,280 --> 00:18:58,919 Speaker 1: amounted to the local judge in the tug River Valley. 329 00:18:59,480 --> 00:19:04,119 Speaker 1: He he tried to make it a fair trial. Is 330 00:19:04,160 --> 00:19:07,160 Speaker 1: he the one that placed it in McCoy land because 331 00:19:07,160 --> 00:19:10,000 Speaker 1: the trial took place in McCoy territory, Yes, anxided by 332 00:19:10,040 --> 00:19:12,560 Speaker 1: a Hatfield though, right, And he made sure that the 333 00:19:12,640 --> 00:19:15,080 Speaker 1: jury had six hat Fields and six McCoy's on it. 334 00:19:16,200 --> 00:19:19,439 Speaker 1: He did and nobody else, no joke. Yes, so weird, 335 00:19:19,600 --> 00:19:22,200 Speaker 1: but he was trying to make it as fair as possible, 336 00:19:22,320 --> 00:19:25,760 Speaker 1: right um. And so they had a trial where Floyd 337 00:19:25,800 --> 00:19:30,280 Speaker 1: Hatfield was tried for hog theft. Have you ever had 338 00:19:30,359 --> 00:19:35,320 Speaker 1: something stolen from you, like, you know, not hugely valuable, 339 00:19:35,320 --> 00:19:38,399 Speaker 1: but yeah, it's It's one of the things that irks 340 00:19:38,440 --> 00:19:42,520 Speaker 1: me most. It's very irritating. There's something about like just 341 00:19:42,640 --> 00:19:47,399 Speaker 1: someone taking something that you worked to buy that just 342 00:19:47,480 --> 00:19:50,960 Speaker 1: really boils my blood. Now, imagine if they took that 343 00:19:51,080 --> 00:19:54,119 Speaker 1: thing that you worked to buy, and they were directly 344 00:19:54,200 --> 00:19:56,640 Speaker 1: taking food out of your child's mouth at the same time, 345 00:19:57,640 --> 00:19:59,680 Speaker 1: it makes you mad. I'd pull a hat Field. That 346 00:19:59,760 --> 00:20:01,920 Speaker 1: we thing is is that the McCoy's and the halfl 347 00:20:02,040 --> 00:20:04,240 Speaker 1: Is at this point are saying, we will let the 348 00:20:04,400 --> 00:20:06,880 Speaker 1: we will leave it to the courts. Right. So they 349 00:20:06,920 --> 00:20:08,879 Speaker 1: did go to court. They did try to have a 350 00:20:08,920 --> 00:20:13,960 Speaker 1: fair trial. Um, or at least the preacher did. Preacher 351 00:20:14,280 --> 00:20:18,800 Speaker 1: halt Field, preacher judge right. Um. It's confusing, and the 352 00:20:18,800 --> 00:20:21,920 Speaker 1: the jury was split except for one who was a 353 00:20:22,040 --> 00:20:25,119 Speaker 1: McCoy who sided with the hat Fields. His name was 354 00:20:25,119 --> 00:20:29,840 Speaker 1: Selkirk McCoy another made up name and Selkirk Um. He 355 00:20:30,000 --> 00:20:33,720 Speaker 1: voted that because of a guy named Bill Staton, who 356 00:20:33,720 --> 00:20:37,360 Speaker 1: had testified that Floyd had not stolen the pigs. Um. 357 00:20:37,440 --> 00:20:39,360 Speaker 1: He said, you know what, I'm not going to contradict 358 00:20:39,440 --> 00:20:42,359 Speaker 1: Bill Staton. I know him to be truthful or whatever. 359 00:20:42,600 --> 00:20:46,280 Speaker 1: Plus I work for Devil Anson his logging operation. So 360 00:20:46,440 --> 00:20:50,639 Speaker 1: I'm gonna vote pro hat Field and exonerate Floyd. And 361 00:20:50,640 --> 00:20:54,359 Speaker 1: Floyd got off and Old Randall went nuts. Yes, Staton 362 00:20:54,520 --> 00:20:57,600 Speaker 1: was the main witness and he was a relative of 363 00:20:57,640 --> 00:21:00,320 Speaker 1: the McCoy's, but he was married to a hat Field right. 364 00:21:00,680 --> 00:21:04,199 Speaker 1: So um, and while they did intermarry, I saw that 365 00:21:04,240 --> 00:21:08,480 Speaker 1: there was way more marrying within the family to avoid intermarrying. 366 00:21:08,560 --> 00:21:11,679 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, there was a lot of first cousins that 367 00:21:11,760 --> 00:21:14,840 Speaker 1: were When you watch that Family Feud clip, you can 368 00:21:14,880 --> 00:21:17,679 Speaker 1: go find it on I'm sure on YouTube. But there 369 00:21:17,760 --> 00:21:19,720 Speaker 1: was a mental flass article that we found that had 370 00:21:19,720 --> 00:21:22,000 Speaker 1: it embedded at the bottom. That's where I first heard 371 00:21:22,040 --> 00:21:26,359 Speaker 1: about it. The that when they're introducing the families, they 372 00:21:26,440 --> 00:21:29,440 Speaker 1: keep introducing one another is like kissing cousins. This is 373 00:21:29,440 --> 00:21:32,880 Speaker 1: a kissing cousin, Diane, and like the families are saying 374 00:21:32,880 --> 00:21:36,719 Speaker 1: that nine. So yeah, there was a lot of like 375 00:21:37,119 --> 00:21:40,240 Speaker 1: inner marriage within the family itself. Well, they were probably 376 00:21:40,240 --> 00:21:43,800 Speaker 1: just joking, right, No, No, on Family Feud, you don't 377 00:21:43,840 --> 00:21:46,840 Speaker 1: think the guy didn't sound like he was joking. Did 378 00:21:46,880 --> 00:21:50,280 Speaker 1: he kiss his cousin on TV? No? But Richard Dawson 379 00:21:50,359 --> 00:21:53,400 Speaker 1: kissed her. He kissed everything. Guy kissed any woman who 380 00:21:53,400 --> 00:21:57,040 Speaker 1: had stand still long enough. What a flirt, Richard Dawson. 381 00:21:57,560 --> 00:22:02,399 Speaker 1: So yeah, r I P. Yeah, he didn't change his 382 00:22:02,520 --> 00:22:06,040 Speaker 1: name even though he was British. Uh, well, you don't 383 00:22:06,040 --> 00:22:11,760 Speaker 1: know that that's true. It could have been Richard Dimpsum 384 00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:18,320 Speaker 1: or Chumley Dawson. That's a great name. So so uh, 385 00:22:18,320 --> 00:22:22,520 Speaker 1: Old Randall has just lost this court case. And even worse, 386 00:22:22,720 --> 00:22:25,200 Speaker 1: he was made to pay the hat Fields court costs 387 00:22:25,560 --> 00:22:29,000 Speaker 1: for taking him to court. And remember we characterized Old 388 00:22:29,080 --> 00:22:32,160 Speaker 1: Randall as a kind of a bitter man. Anytime life 389 00:22:32,160 --> 00:22:35,280 Speaker 1: handed him lemons, he just squeezed him into his eyes, 390 00:22:35,760 --> 00:22:39,199 Speaker 1: go to anger, right um. And he went on for 391 00:22:39,200 --> 00:22:43,600 Speaker 1: this for basically years, about how this is a miscarriage 392 00:22:43,600 --> 00:22:46,560 Speaker 1: of justice, how Floyd had stolen his hogs. And so 393 00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:51,200 Speaker 1: now any time hat Fields and McCoy's um went, depending 394 00:22:51,200 --> 00:22:55,160 Speaker 1: on their allegiance to the clan or clans um, anytime 395 00:22:55,160 --> 00:22:57,600 Speaker 1: they saw each other, they were shooting at one another. 396 00:22:57,680 --> 00:23:00,320 Speaker 1: They were getting into fights, they were throwing rocks. One 397 00:23:00,359 --> 00:23:05,200 Speaker 1: of Um, one of devil Ant's sons, was standing there 398 00:23:05,240 --> 00:23:08,200 Speaker 1: when Old Randall rode up once and Old Randall started 399 00:23:08,280 --> 00:23:10,560 Speaker 1: railing on him about how Floyd had stolen a hog, 400 00:23:10,600 --> 00:23:13,840 Speaker 1: and the McCoys or the Hatfield Sun grabbed rock and 401 00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:17,280 Speaker 1: just threw it at Old Randall's mouth, just crushed his 402 00:23:17,320 --> 00:23:20,120 Speaker 1: mouth of the rock because that's what you did back then. Yeah, 403 00:23:20,119 --> 00:23:22,520 Speaker 1: that was sort of like you killed my brother Harmon, 404 00:23:23,560 --> 00:23:26,199 Speaker 1: but you stole my hog. You know, I'm cool with 405 00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:28,679 Speaker 1: the brother killing Harmon, had it coming, right, But that 406 00:23:28,760 --> 00:23:31,320 Speaker 1: hog never hurt anybody. Yeah, we were gonna eat it. 407 00:23:32,040 --> 00:23:35,320 Speaker 1: Uh So did we cover the fact that Staton two 408 00:23:35,400 --> 00:23:39,639 Speaker 1: years later was killed. This is inaccurate? Is that not true? 409 00:23:40,280 --> 00:23:44,600 Speaker 1: Bill Staton Jr. Was Kilton, Bill Sr. Was not killed 410 00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:48,320 Speaker 1: in this skirmish. This is another big retribution though, Okay 411 00:23:48,359 --> 00:23:52,199 Speaker 1: for his pause. Yeah, because after the hog incident in 412 00:23:52,280 --> 00:23:56,240 Speaker 1: the Hog Verdict, the the halt Fields and McCoy's did 413 00:23:56,280 --> 00:23:58,760 Speaker 1: not fight it out right then at the at the 414 00:23:58,880 --> 00:24:04,239 Speaker 1: um magistrate office, at Judge Preacher's place, Um. But at 415 00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:06,680 Speaker 1: any time the clan saw one another, they would shoot 416 00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:08,880 Speaker 1: at each other. They would getting fights, they would take 417 00:24:09,000 --> 00:24:13,320 Speaker 1: rocks to the faces, and then it culminated finally in 418 00:24:13,400 --> 00:24:17,480 Speaker 1: this really truly violent incident between Bill State and Jr. 419 00:24:17,720 --> 00:24:23,240 Speaker 1: And h Paris and Sam McCoy Right. Okay, so Bill 420 00:24:23,240 --> 00:24:26,400 Speaker 1: State and Junior is out hunting, sees these McCoy's sons 421 00:24:27,280 --> 00:24:30,760 Speaker 1: and says, oh, I'm in a world of trouble. I 422 00:24:30,840 --> 00:24:32,840 Speaker 1: better take a shot at one of them and shoots 423 00:24:32,880 --> 00:24:36,840 Speaker 1: Paris McCoy and the hip and Sam McCoy was like, 424 00:24:37,040 --> 00:24:40,320 Speaker 1: you shot my brother, You're going down. And he shoots 425 00:24:40,920 --> 00:24:44,640 Speaker 1: Bill and wounds him and then goes over and executes 426 00:24:44,680 --> 00:24:46,879 Speaker 1: him point blank in the head. And this is Bill Junior, 427 00:24:47,200 --> 00:24:49,800 Speaker 1: Bill Jr. See, I got another article that said it 428 00:24:49,840 --> 00:24:52,159 Speaker 1: was Bill, but it also said he's Bill Stanton. So 429 00:24:52,200 --> 00:24:55,600 Speaker 1: I'm starting to doubt all kinds of accuracy. There's a 430 00:24:55,840 --> 00:24:58,560 Speaker 1: lot of inaccurate stuff. So I got, um, I think 431 00:24:58,680 --> 00:25:00,840 Speaker 1: the description of that. And so it from a really 432 00:25:00,840 --> 00:25:03,640 Speaker 1: great book by a guy named John ed Pierce. It's 433 00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:07,439 Speaker 1: Days of Darkness Colon. So you know it's legitimate, the 434 00:25:07,480 --> 00:25:12,000 Speaker 1: feuds of Eastern Kentucky. Yeah, so there's been like serious 435 00:25:12,040 --> 00:25:15,120 Speaker 1: blood shed here. Now one of the this and this 436 00:25:15,160 --> 00:25:18,680 Speaker 1: is direct retribution for the hog stealing verdict. A man 437 00:25:18,760 --> 00:25:21,840 Speaker 1: has been executed point blank in the head, and the 438 00:25:21,880 --> 00:25:26,360 Speaker 1: two McCoy boys just tried to get away with it. Yeah, 439 00:25:26,520 --> 00:25:29,680 Speaker 1: so blood is spilling. Uh. Fast forward a bit to 440 00:25:29,880 --> 00:25:34,720 Speaker 1: eighty two and h three of Randall's sons are attacked, 441 00:25:35,600 --> 00:25:39,840 Speaker 1: stabbed twenty six times and shot Ellison Hatfield, who was 442 00:25:39,920 --> 00:25:43,480 Speaker 1: Devil's younger brother to death Right, and that was on 443 00:25:43,640 --> 00:25:46,359 Speaker 1: election day, and election days were like drunken affairs. Do 444 00:25:46,400 --> 00:25:49,399 Speaker 1: you remember when I think in the Bars episode we 445 00:25:49,440 --> 00:25:52,440 Speaker 1: talked about like, what was it, um, you get people 446 00:25:52,480 --> 00:26:00,639 Speaker 1: drunk in Yeah, bumbo planting, the applying the plants with 447 00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:05,000 Speaker 1: bumbling the voters with bumbo. Yeah. Man. But it was 448 00:26:05,040 --> 00:26:07,320 Speaker 1: election day, so everybody would get super drunk. And when 449 00:26:07,359 --> 00:26:09,400 Speaker 1: you get two clans that don't like each other super 450 00:26:09,480 --> 00:26:13,520 Speaker 1: drunk in the same place, they get in fights and 451 00:26:13,520 --> 00:26:15,640 Speaker 1: people get stay up twenty six times and then shot 452 00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:18,600 Speaker 1: in the back. Yeah. So those three sons of Randall 453 00:26:18,640 --> 00:26:22,879 Speaker 1: were actually arrested and we're presumably going to go to trial, 454 00:26:22,960 --> 00:26:27,760 Speaker 1: but vigilanteism took hold and they were kidnapped on the 455 00:26:27,800 --> 00:26:29,960 Speaker 1: way to the trial by the hat Fields and they said, 456 00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:32,679 Speaker 1: we're gonna take care of this our way. Yeah, and 457 00:26:32,720 --> 00:26:34,560 Speaker 1: they like, I don't know if they let them get 458 00:26:34,560 --> 00:26:36,520 Speaker 1: away with it, but they got away with it. No, 459 00:26:36,640 --> 00:26:38,440 Speaker 1: they did not let them get away with it. This 460 00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:42,720 Speaker 1: was a huge turning point, right um when the hat 461 00:26:42,800 --> 00:26:45,800 Speaker 1: Field or the McCoy boys were intercepted by the hat 462 00:26:45,840 --> 00:26:48,800 Speaker 1: Fields and taken across the river to West Virginia, which 463 00:26:48,840 --> 00:26:51,320 Speaker 1: is basically like taking them to Fortress hat Field. Yeah, 464 00:26:51,359 --> 00:26:55,480 Speaker 1: country justice was gonna happen. Yeah, but Devalance vowed that 465 00:26:55,520 --> 00:26:58,720 Speaker 1: if Ellison made it and didn't die, he would not 466 00:26:58,920 --> 00:27:02,760 Speaker 1: kill these hat Field are these McCoy boys. Um, But 467 00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:05,760 Speaker 1: Ellison succumbed to his wounds and did die, And so 468 00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:08,200 Speaker 1: they took these McCoy boys out and tied them to 469 00:27:08,440 --> 00:27:11,679 Speaker 1: trees and shot him I think more than fifty times 470 00:27:11,720 --> 00:27:14,760 Speaker 1: or something like that. And so you were saying, like 471 00:27:15,080 --> 00:27:18,199 Speaker 1: they got away with it not for lack of trying, right. 472 00:27:18,240 --> 00:27:22,520 Speaker 1: It basically set off this huge, huge issue like this 473 00:27:22,640 --> 00:27:26,000 Speaker 1: was even for the Tug River Valley. Chuck, this was 474 00:27:27,119 --> 00:27:31,119 Speaker 1: pretty flagrant frontier justice. You're not supposed to do this. 475 00:27:31,160 --> 00:27:34,399 Speaker 1: There's a magistrate named Preacher who's supposed to settle this 476 00:27:34,480 --> 00:27:39,520 Speaker 1: kind of stuff. Right, So a guy named Perry what 477 00:27:39,720 --> 00:27:42,159 Speaker 1: was Perry's name, Perry Klein? You know what this is? 478 00:27:42,400 --> 00:27:44,520 Speaker 1: This is too big. We need to take a break, 479 00:27:44,600 --> 00:27:55,600 Speaker 1: all right and get to the story of Perry Klein. Okay, 480 00:27:58,200 --> 00:28:00,280 Speaker 1: so we're back, chucking. We have a new guest. Name 481 00:28:00,320 --> 00:28:05,520 Speaker 1: is Perry Klein. Come on in, Perry, you're an attorney. Uh. 482 00:28:05,600 --> 00:28:08,320 Speaker 1: He was married to Martha McCoy. And here's the deal. 483 00:28:09,320 --> 00:28:13,719 Speaker 1: Years before there was a situation where Perry Klein was 484 00:28:14,960 --> 00:28:18,359 Speaker 1: cheated out of I think five thousand acres of land. 485 00:28:19,520 --> 00:28:21,680 Speaker 1: Was he cheated? I didn't know if he if it 486 00:28:21,800 --> 00:28:25,840 Speaker 1: was actual like justice, because he had supposedly been cutting 487 00:28:25,880 --> 00:28:31,640 Speaker 1: timber from uh, Devlance's timberland. Well, here's the deal. Everything 488 00:28:31,680 --> 00:28:35,040 Speaker 1: you read will say it depends on who you sympathize with, 489 00:28:35,680 --> 00:28:37,959 Speaker 1: is how you think Perry Klein and really all of 490 00:28:38,000 --> 00:28:42,040 Speaker 1: them were viewed. So I read articles that said that 491 00:28:42,080 --> 00:28:46,080 Speaker 1: he was cheated, in articles that said he wasn't cheated. Uh. 492 00:28:46,560 --> 00:28:48,480 Speaker 1: And I think the family is still today like while 493 00:28:48,520 --> 00:28:51,240 Speaker 1: there is a piece which we'll get to. Um, they 494 00:28:51,240 --> 00:28:54,840 Speaker 1: still disagree over Perry Clein's role. Okay, So, but Perry 495 00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:58,280 Speaker 1: Klein was married to a McCoy. Actually he's a Harmon 496 00:28:58,360 --> 00:29:02,640 Speaker 1: McCoy's widow, right Martha, And so, um, he had lost 497 00:29:03,040 --> 00:29:06,440 Speaker 1: five thousand acres. Really, that's how much he was forced 498 00:29:06,440 --> 00:29:09,800 Speaker 1: by the court to seed to Devilands for allegedly cutting 499 00:29:10,320 --> 00:29:12,720 Speaker 1: his timberland. Yeah, so he was. He had he had 500 00:29:13,000 --> 00:29:16,360 Speaker 1: a retribution in mind as an attorney. Right. So when 501 00:29:16,520 --> 00:29:21,400 Speaker 1: the hat Fields executed the McCoy, the three McCoy boys. 502 00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:25,960 Speaker 1: Um Perry Klein used it as a chance, depending on 503 00:29:26,000 --> 00:29:27,320 Speaker 1: how you look at it, either used it as a 504 00:29:27,400 --> 00:29:30,480 Speaker 1: chance for retribution or his family allegiance was stirred up, 505 00:29:30,800 --> 00:29:33,880 Speaker 1: and he, being an attorney, had contacts with the governor, 506 00:29:34,120 --> 00:29:38,440 Speaker 1: Governor Bunker I believe, of Kentucky and said, Governor, there's 507 00:29:38,480 --> 00:29:42,160 Speaker 1: some horrible stuff going on down here that's being perpetrated 508 00:29:42,160 --> 00:29:46,840 Speaker 1: by some West Virginians against some law abiding Kentuckians, and 509 00:29:47,160 --> 00:29:50,560 Speaker 1: you guys need to do something about it. And it worked, Actually, yeah, 510 00:29:50,560 --> 00:29:54,440 Speaker 1: they reinstated the charges and Um basically put out awards 511 00:29:54,480 --> 00:29:57,160 Speaker 1: on the head, bounties on the head, arrest bounties, that 512 00:29:57,320 --> 00:30:01,280 Speaker 1: is of the hat fields including uh six ft of 513 00:30:01,320 --> 00:30:06,120 Speaker 1: devil and pounds of hell. Yeah, himself, his sons, some 514 00:30:06,280 --> 00:30:10,360 Speaker 1: of the Um family allies like his uncle Jim Vance. 515 00:30:10,880 --> 00:30:14,440 Speaker 1: I think there were there was twenty twenty men who 516 00:30:14,600 --> 00:30:17,600 Speaker 1: had indictments against them, and since they had indictments against 517 00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:20,040 Speaker 1: them and they were hanging out in West Virginia, they 518 00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:22,959 Speaker 1: had bounties on their head. And one of the bounty hunters, 519 00:30:23,000 --> 00:30:25,280 Speaker 1: the main bounty hunter who came around it was it 520 00:30:25,360 --> 00:30:27,840 Speaker 1: was a problem that they had bounties on their head 521 00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:31,440 Speaker 1: because any crackpot who wanted to could come and take 522 00:30:31,440 --> 00:30:34,640 Speaker 1: shots at those guys. And and it was happening quite 523 00:30:34,680 --> 00:30:36,680 Speaker 1: a bit. Yeah, they wanted to collect some dough, right. 524 00:30:36,920 --> 00:30:39,000 Speaker 1: But there's one guy in particular who was a real 525 00:30:39,040 --> 00:30:41,800 Speaker 1: thorn in their side. His name was Mad Frank Phillips. 526 00:30:42,480 --> 00:30:46,680 Speaker 1: And Frank Phillips was a bounty hunter extraordinaire. He was 527 00:30:47,240 --> 00:30:51,719 Speaker 1: about as legally gray as you can get and still 528 00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:56,560 Speaker 1: not be uh, just on the darker side of the spectrum. 529 00:30:56,600 --> 00:31:00,240 Speaker 1: And he made it basically his personal war to get 530 00:31:00,240 --> 00:31:03,560 Speaker 1: as many hat Fields across the river into Kentucky as 531 00:31:03,560 --> 00:31:07,040 Speaker 1: he could. So he would carry out raids on the 532 00:31:07,080 --> 00:31:11,240 Speaker 1: hat Field stronghold in West Virginia, UM and basically just 533 00:31:11,480 --> 00:31:15,160 Speaker 1: abduct hat Fields and bring him to Kentucky so that 534 00:31:15,200 --> 00:31:17,960 Speaker 1: they could be put in the Pike County jail. And 535 00:31:17,960 --> 00:31:20,720 Speaker 1: while he did this, he was also executing people left 536 00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:23,720 Speaker 1: and right, like Jim Vance. He shot and wounded, saw 537 00:31:23,760 --> 00:31:27,520 Speaker 1: that he just wounded him, walked around from behind and um, 538 00:31:27,760 --> 00:31:30,200 Speaker 1: while Vance was begging for his life, shot him in 539 00:31:30,240 --> 00:31:32,400 Speaker 1: the head and like this is Frank Phillips. M Oh, 540 00:31:32,520 --> 00:31:34,400 Speaker 1: he would execute you just as soon as he would 541 00:31:34,440 --> 00:31:37,560 Speaker 1: capture you. Yeah, and this was this was becoming a 542 00:31:37,600 --> 00:31:40,680 Speaker 1: big deal in the press at this point, uh newspaper 543 00:31:40,720 --> 00:31:44,520 Speaker 1: started carrying the stories and became uh by all accounts 544 00:31:44,600 --> 00:31:48,720 Speaker 1: like national news, uh and legend like it was. Everyone 545 00:31:48,840 --> 00:31:51,200 Speaker 1: knew about the hat Fields and McCoys by this point, right, 546 00:31:51,280 --> 00:31:54,920 Speaker 1: and the press apparently very much sided with the McCoy's. 547 00:31:54,960 --> 00:31:59,120 Speaker 1: They painted the hat Fields to seem like Backwood's murderous 548 00:31:59,400 --> 00:32:03,360 Speaker 1: redneck who just caused trouble everywhere they went, and painted 549 00:32:03,360 --> 00:32:08,120 Speaker 1: the McCoy's is innocent, law abiding victims of of this um, 550 00:32:08,160 --> 00:32:12,080 Speaker 1: this whole feud um and the whole legend, like you're saying, 551 00:32:12,120 --> 00:32:14,440 Speaker 1: like this is all it all begins about right here, 552 00:32:14,520 --> 00:32:17,440 Speaker 1: When when there was what amounts to almost a war 553 00:32:17,560 --> 00:32:21,240 Speaker 1: between Kentucky and West Virginia because Frank Phillips kept going 554 00:32:21,280 --> 00:32:24,200 Speaker 1: and getting people and bringing them back to Pike County 555 00:32:24,320 --> 00:32:28,800 Speaker 1: and West Virginia got involved, and the two governors were 556 00:32:28,840 --> 00:32:33,960 Speaker 1: basically standing toe to toe, almost about to go invade, 557 00:32:34,080 --> 00:32:38,400 Speaker 1: sending National Guard troops in across the border. Um, but 558 00:32:38,480 --> 00:32:40,840 Speaker 1: instead they left in the courts and actually this court 559 00:32:40,880 --> 00:32:44,000 Speaker 1: case about whether it was legal or not for Frank 560 00:32:44,040 --> 00:32:47,400 Speaker 1: Phillips to have abducted the Hatfields and taken them to 561 00:32:47,440 --> 00:32:52,600 Speaker 1: the Kentucky jail. Um reached the Supreme Court actually, which 562 00:32:52,600 --> 00:32:55,120 Speaker 1: is pretty amazing. It is in the Supreme Court said, 563 00:32:55,400 --> 00:32:59,480 Speaker 1: you know what, Uh, it probably is illegal what happened, 564 00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:02,280 Speaker 1: but Kentucky's a sovereign state and there's really nothing West 565 00:33:02,320 --> 00:33:05,040 Speaker 1: Virginia can do about it, so go ahead and try him. 566 00:33:05,400 --> 00:33:08,520 Speaker 1: But before the trial, actually, and while the um these 567 00:33:08,560 --> 00:33:11,760 Speaker 1: abductions were going on, these raids carried out by Frank Phillips, 568 00:33:12,040 --> 00:33:13,760 Speaker 1: the hat Fields, like I said, like it was a 569 00:33:13,760 --> 00:33:15,840 Speaker 1: big deal in them that they were bounty hunters out 570 00:33:15,920 --> 00:33:18,600 Speaker 1: to get them, and they came up with a plan 571 00:33:19,000 --> 00:33:22,440 Speaker 1: to just end the whole thing. Yeah, in a murderous 572 00:33:22,520 --> 00:33:26,400 Speaker 1: killing spree is what they came up with. Uh. In January, 573 00:33:26,800 --> 00:33:30,000 Speaker 1: a group of hat Fields said, we're gonna attack Randolph 574 00:33:30,040 --> 00:33:33,960 Speaker 1: McCoy and his entire family, uh cap little Cappy double ants, 575 00:33:33,960 --> 00:33:36,920 Speaker 1: his son uh and an ally to Jim Vance kind 576 00:33:36,920 --> 00:33:39,640 Speaker 1: of led the way and they ambushed them at their 577 00:33:39,680 --> 00:33:44,800 Speaker 1: home on New Year's Day. Randolph actually escaped, which is uh, 578 00:33:44,840 --> 00:33:46,440 Speaker 1: they were kind of coming after him and he's the 579 00:33:46,480 --> 00:33:48,640 Speaker 1: only one who escaped. Well, they were coming after the 580 00:33:48,720 --> 00:33:52,239 Speaker 1: whole family. Yeah, like their whole intention was to just 581 00:33:52,400 --> 00:33:55,320 Speaker 1: murder this whole family of the problem. Yeah, and Randolph 582 00:33:55,480 --> 00:33:58,400 Speaker 1: was the key guy. He actually got away. His son 583 00:33:58,480 --> 00:34:01,720 Speaker 1: Calvin daughter Ala Fair were killed, uh and what they 584 00:34:01,720 --> 00:34:04,320 Speaker 1: called crossfire, but they were you know, let's get real. 585 00:34:04,880 --> 00:34:08,160 Speaker 1: And his wife, Sarah was suffered to crush skulls. She 586 00:34:08,200 --> 00:34:10,880 Speaker 1: was beaten so badly. Yeah, so Alice, they set the 587 00:34:10,920 --> 00:34:13,960 Speaker 1: house on fire. Ali Fair opened the door to put 588 00:34:14,000 --> 00:34:16,680 Speaker 1: the fire out and she was shot and killed. And 589 00:34:16,719 --> 00:34:20,560 Speaker 1: then um, her mom, Sarah wanted to come and like 590 00:34:20,840 --> 00:34:23,920 Speaker 1: comfort or dying daughter, and when she came out, they 591 00:34:24,040 --> 00:34:26,360 Speaker 1: beat her head in with the butt of a pistol 592 00:34:26,400 --> 00:34:31,759 Speaker 1: I think Cap Hatfield did. And then um, Calvin provided 593 00:34:31,840 --> 00:34:35,480 Speaker 1: cover for his dad and ran to attract their gunfire 594 00:34:35,560 --> 00:34:38,040 Speaker 1: so his dad could get away, and it worked, but 595 00:34:38,360 --> 00:34:41,880 Speaker 1: Calvin died as a result. And then two other daughters 596 00:34:41,920 --> 00:34:46,280 Speaker 1: have McCoy daughters survived, So Randall and two daughters survived 597 00:34:46,280 --> 00:34:48,719 Speaker 1: this attack on his family. And this was when it 598 00:34:48,840 --> 00:34:51,880 Speaker 1: was like if the press wasn't paying attention before and 599 00:34:51,960 --> 00:34:55,800 Speaker 1: now they really were. And um, basically everybody was outraged 600 00:34:55,840 --> 00:34:58,480 Speaker 1: at this and it's like this legend, Chuck is a 601 00:34:58,560 --> 00:35:01,399 Speaker 1: hundred something years old, right, and it's easy to kind 602 00:35:01,400 --> 00:35:05,040 Speaker 1: of see these people as caricatures or um, you know, 603 00:35:05,120 --> 00:35:09,799 Speaker 1: just historic. But when you think about what the hat 604 00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:12,239 Speaker 1: Fields planned to do and tried to do to the 605 00:35:12,360 --> 00:35:16,680 Speaker 1: McCoy's in that case on New Year's nineteen, eighteen eighty eight, Yeah, 606 00:35:16,680 --> 00:35:18,960 Speaker 1: the New Year's massacres, what was known as that's like 607 00:35:19,280 --> 00:35:23,800 Speaker 1: objectively despicable no matter when you when you when it happened, 608 00:35:24,040 --> 00:35:26,279 Speaker 1: going after an entire family to kill them, Yeah, to 609 00:35:26,360 --> 00:35:30,840 Speaker 1: wipe out a legal entailment, you know it is and 610 00:35:30,880 --> 00:35:33,440 Speaker 1: it really kind of um brings home like the actual 611 00:35:33,520 --> 00:35:36,120 Speaker 1: humanity of all of this, you know. Yeah. So it 612 00:35:36,160 --> 00:35:38,160 Speaker 1: went all the way to the Supreme Court and they decided, 613 00:35:38,239 --> 00:35:41,759 Speaker 1: you know what, these hat Fields should be tried. Uh, 614 00:35:41,800 --> 00:35:44,120 Speaker 1: And in eighteen eighty nine they were tried, and eight 615 00:35:44,160 --> 00:35:47,240 Speaker 1: of the hat Fields uh and their supporters were since 616 00:35:47,280 --> 00:35:51,800 Speaker 1: to life in prison, and one Ellison Mounts, who uh 617 00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:54,279 Speaker 1: people think is the son of Ellison Hatfield and his 618 00:35:54,360 --> 00:35:57,960 Speaker 1: first cousin, Yeah, it was actually sentenced to death. And uh. 619 00:35:58,280 --> 00:36:00,360 Speaker 1: The one issue here was a lot of people now 620 00:36:00,440 --> 00:36:02,759 Speaker 1: think he was a kind of a scapegoat because he 621 00:36:02,800 --> 00:36:07,000 Speaker 1: was mentally challenged, and uh, maybe an early false confession 622 00:36:07,080 --> 00:36:11,400 Speaker 1: happened right exactly, and he actually, um, really his was 623 00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:14,319 Speaker 1: if he didn't do it, or even if he did, 624 00:36:14,360 --> 00:36:17,959 Speaker 1: he really got screwed over by the prosecution. They said that, um, 625 00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:22,200 Speaker 1: if he confessed and and and cooperated, that he would 626 00:36:22,200 --> 00:36:24,480 Speaker 1: get a lighter sentence, when really he was the only 627 00:36:24,480 --> 00:36:26,600 Speaker 1: one who confessed and he was the only one who 628 00:36:26,680 --> 00:36:30,439 Speaker 1: was hanged. So um and his dying words, I think 629 00:36:30,480 --> 00:36:32,880 Speaker 1: we're the hat Fields made me do it and then 630 00:36:33,000 --> 00:36:36,320 Speaker 1: they hung him. Yeah, and there were no public executions 631 00:36:36,320 --> 00:36:39,120 Speaker 1: at the time, but that did not stop hundreds of people, 632 00:36:39,200 --> 00:36:42,440 Speaker 1: thousands even from coming out and watching anyway. Right, so 633 00:36:42,560 --> 00:36:45,839 Speaker 1: it was a public execution. And with the what's odd though, 634 00:36:45,920 --> 00:36:49,640 Speaker 1: is the uh so ten ten men had been captured 635 00:36:49,680 --> 00:36:52,040 Speaker 1: by Frank Phillips and had been added and tried, and 636 00:36:52,440 --> 00:36:55,240 Speaker 1: nine of them got life in prison. Ellison Mounts was 637 00:36:55,239 --> 00:37:00,920 Speaker 1: was hung and this was apparently enough to um, I guess, 638 00:37:00,960 --> 00:37:05,239 Speaker 1: mollify Randall McCoy. At first, I think he tried to 639 00:37:05,320 --> 00:37:08,919 Speaker 1: like rail against the verdict, but ultimately it was enough 640 00:37:08,960 --> 00:37:12,600 Speaker 1: to just calm him down and he went and lived 641 00:37:12,719 --> 00:37:16,560 Speaker 1: a quiet life, quiet haunted life as a ferry operator 642 00:37:16,880 --> 00:37:19,920 Speaker 1: I think, and lived to like yeah, and about a 643 00:37:20,000 --> 00:37:22,480 Speaker 1: year later. Uh, it was when the family has both 644 00:37:22,520 --> 00:37:26,560 Speaker 1: said enough is enough, let's call a truce. And uh. 645 00:37:26,719 --> 00:37:29,640 Speaker 1: From I think it was an eleven year period, almost 646 00:37:29,680 --> 00:37:34,520 Speaker 1: twenty four people were killed in both families, like close 647 00:37:34,560 --> 00:37:37,719 Speaker 1: to two dozen folks over eleven year period. That's legit. Yeah, 648 00:37:37,719 --> 00:37:39,520 Speaker 1: that's a that's a family feud right there. That's a 649 00:37:39,560 --> 00:37:42,000 Speaker 1: big feud. And devl Ance lived to a ripe old 650 00:37:42,040 --> 00:37:44,600 Speaker 1: age two. He lived to uh, I think eighty three 651 00:37:44,680 --> 00:37:47,359 Speaker 1: or something like that. That's not that old. Well, he 652 00:37:47,400 --> 00:37:49,479 Speaker 1: was born again at seventy three. I think he lived 653 00:37:49,480 --> 00:37:53,480 Speaker 1: into his eighties. And but he he was paranoid for 654 00:37:53,520 --> 00:37:55,279 Speaker 1: the rest of his life because I think there was 655 00:37:55,320 --> 00:37:57,239 Speaker 1: still bounties on his head. So he moved to an 656 00:37:57,280 --> 00:37:59,919 Speaker 1: island and carried a rifle with him at all time 657 00:38:00,480 --> 00:38:02,759 Speaker 1: for the rest of his life. Well, they if you 658 00:38:02,800 --> 00:38:06,840 Speaker 1: look at pictures of the families, they all had their guns. 659 00:38:07,080 --> 00:38:09,320 Speaker 1: I mean, that's what you did back then. But it's 660 00:38:09,320 --> 00:38:12,040 Speaker 1: it's funny to see a picture of like twenty people 661 00:38:12,280 --> 00:38:16,160 Speaker 1: in you know, twelve of them are brandishing weapons, you know, 662 00:38:16,640 --> 00:38:18,560 Speaker 1: in the in the one photo that will ever be 663 00:38:18,640 --> 00:38:21,279 Speaker 1: taken of them. They've got their gun out too. Uh 664 00:38:21,360 --> 00:38:24,279 Speaker 1: So since then they've been all over the place in 665 00:38:24,360 --> 00:38:27,600 Speaker 1: pop culture. We mentioned family Feud. There was an Abbott 666 00:38:27,600 --> 00:38:30,799 Speaker 1: and Costello movie in nifty two. Buster Keaton did a 667 00:38:30,840 --> 00:38:33,600 Speaker 1: movie too. Oh really, I feel McCoy. Uh he was 668 00:38:33,640 --> 00:38:37,680 Speaker 1: on not Looney Tunes, excuse me, Mary Melodies, big distinction, 669 00:38:38,120 --> 00:38:41,719 Speaker 1: but still bugs bunny um. Nowadays, there are even some 670 00:38:41,800 --> 00:38:45,799 Speaker 1: medical professionals who think that there was a condition that 671 00:38:45,880 --> 00:38:49,239 Speaker 1: the McCoy's had that led them to be violent. What 672 00:38:49,440 --> 00:38:55,720 Speaker 1: it's called von Hippe Lindau disease. And these geneticists study 673 00:38:55,800 --> 00:38:58,719 Speaker 1: dozens of McCoy descendants and said they have a really 674 00:38:58,800 --> 00:39:02,520 Speaker 1: high rate of this disease. It's inherited, it's rare, produces 675 00:39:02,520 --> 00:39:05,759 Speaker 1: tumors in the eyes, ears, and pancreas. Uh and a 676 00:39:05,800 --> 00:39:09,560 Speaker 1: notable side effect is high blood pressure, racing heartbeat, and 677 00:39:09,719 --> 00:39:15,360 Speaker 1: increased um aggressive behavior, increase fight or flight hormones. And 678 00:39:15,400 --> 00:39:17,400 Speaker 1: it was the McCoy's that may have had that, because 679 00:39:17,440 --> 00:39:19,640 Speaker 1: from everything I've read, it seemed like the hat Fields 680 00:39:19,640 --> 00:39:22,839 Speaker 1: would have been the one to have that. Wow, maybe 681 00:39:22,840 --> 00:39:29,480 Speaker 1: I'm a victim of contemporary press bias. Media bias. Else. 682 00:39:29,719 --> 00:39:32,360 Speaker 1: I got nothing else. Those other stuff. There's plenty of 683 00:39:32,400 --> 00:39:35,840 Speaker 1: stuff that I'm sure we didn't hit. And you should 684 00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:38,240 Speaker 1: go read some of the cool books written about this stuff. 685 00:39:38,400 --> 00:39:41,200 Speaker 1: I got one more thing, actually, here comes World War two. 686 00:39:41,600 --> 00:39:45,240 Speaker 1: Life magazine used the families as a way to unite 687 00:39:45,280 --> 00:39:48,760 Speaker 1: America's war effort by featuring them in a big photo spread. 688 00:39:48,800 --> 00:39:51,680 Speaker 1: The hat Fields of McCoy's like working together in factories 689 00:39:51,680 --> 00:39:56,279 Speaker 1: for World War two. Yeah, and they I think they 690 00:39:56,360 --> 00:39:59,680 Speaker 1: even met recently in like they're they're still out there 691 00:39:59,719 --> 00:40:02,719 Speaker 1: and there's still meeting and talking about this and uh 692 00:40:03,040 --> 00:40:08,120 Speaker 1: disagreeing friendly disagreements on people like Perry Klein and uh 693 00:40:08,320 --> 00:40:12,200 Speaker 1: he was the other guy, Mad Mad Month, Mad Frank Phillips, 694 00:40:12,200 --> 00:40:14,760 Speaker 1: Mad Frank Phillips, who remember I said he was legally gray. 695 00:40:15,320 --> 00:40:18,520 Speaker 1: He married uh a McCoy who ended up who had 696 00:40:18,560 --> 00:40:22,600 Speaker 1: had a baby with John C. Hatfield. Um, they ran 697 00:40:22,640 --> 00:40:27,080 Speaker 1: off together and got married Frank Phillips and Nancy McCoy 698 00:40:27,160 --> 00:40:30,439 Speaker 1: and ended up being prosperous bootleggers in the region. Well, 699 00:40:30,480 --> 00:40:33,240 Speaker 1: and there was also a spurned romance too that led detentions. 700 00:40:33,239 --> 00:40:38,000 Speaker 1: I forgot about that. Yeah, Roseanna Rosanna McCoy and John C. Hatfield. Yeah, 701 00:40:38,040 --> 00:40:41,400 Speaker 1: they had a little tryst and a child together, but 702 00:40:41,480 --> 00:40:45,000 Speaker 1: the child died I think aged eight months from measles. 703 00:40:45,160 --> 00:40:47,200 Speaker 1: But he kicked her to the curb before that and 704 00:40:47,239 --> 00:40:49,400 Speaker 1: then went and married her cousin Nancy, although there were 705 00:40:49,440 --> 00:40:51,520 Speaker 1: no curbs back then. He kicked her to the river bank, 706 00:40:52,239 --> 00:40:56,359 Speaker 1: to the creek side. Yeah. Again, we could probably keep 707 00:40:56,400 --> 00:40:58,440 Speaker 1: doing this for another forty five minutes, but we're not. 708 00:40:58,800 --> 00:41:00,680 Speaker 1: If you want to know more about hat fills and 709 00:41:00,760 --> 00:41:04,239 Speaker 1: McCoy's is ghost searching in your favorite search engine? And 710 00:41:04,239 --> 00:41:06,600 Speaker 1: since I said search engine, it's time for a listener mail. 711 00:41:09,760 --> 00:41:12,520 Speaker 1: I'm gonna call this just a nice little email of thanks. 712 00:41:13,320 --> 00:41:16,760 Speaker 1: I'm a nice person. Okay, Hi, Justin Chuck and Jerry. 713 00:41:16,800 --> 00:41:20,280 Speaker 1: I'm a young thirty something who lives in Berwin, Illinois. 714 00:41:20,840 --> 00:41:24,520 Speaker 1: I just recently started listening to podcasts and came across 715 00:41:24,560 --> 00:41:26,759 Speaker 1: How Stuff Works and you, guys, I'm a nerd at heart. 716 00:41:26,760 --> 00:41:29,320 Speaker 1: In your podcast feeds my inner beast. I listened to 717 00:41:29,360 --> 00:41:30,960 Speaker 1: you on my way to work on a train at 718 00:41:31,160 --> 00:41:34,720 Speaker 1: uh it sounds like Dr seuss Um at work again, 719 00:41:35,440 --> 00:41:38,400 Speaker 1: and then on my way home from work. I'm so 720 00:41:38,440 --> 00:41:40,400 Speaker 1: addicted to learning new things. Scrolling through the feed is 721 00:41:40,440 --> 00:41:44,320 Speaker 1: exhilarating because I'm dying to listen to them all. Jennifer, 722 00:41:44,360 --> 00:41:47,000 Speaker 1: there's I'm not sure if you know this. If you 723 00:41:47,040 --> 00:41:49,240 Speaker 1: follow us on iTunes, you might think they're only three hundred, 724 00:41:49,560 --> 00:41:52,600 Speaker 1: but there are more than eight hundred and fifties right, 725 00:41:54,320 --> 00:41:56,400 Speaker 1: And that's for all of you out there, and you 726 00:41:56,440 --> 00:42:00,399 Speaker 1: can find those at our website. Back to Jenner, I've 727 00:42:00,440 --> 00:42:02,960 Speaker 1: told all my friends about the podcast. I even make 728 00:42:03,000 --> 00:42:06,120 Speaker 1: my husband listen while we're cooking. I can't get enough 729 00:42:06,160 --> 00:42:08,000 Speaker 1: of all the cool topics you talk about. And since 730 00:42:08,040 --> 00:42:09,360 Speaker 1: I listen to every day, I thought, you know what, 731 00:42:09,360 --> 00:42:11,640 Speaker 1: I'm gonna send an email and hopes that it is 732 00:42:11,680 --> 00:42:13,799 Speaker 1: read on the air, and if not, at least you 733 00:42:13,840 --> 00:42:16,840 Speaker 1: know you have another dedicated listener. Thanks for spreading knowledge, 734 00:42:16,840 --> 00:42:20,239 Speaker 1: and that is Jennifer Hardy and Jennifer. Sometimes when I 735 00:42:20,239 --> 00:42:21,719 Speaker 1: get there to read things on the air, I do. 736 00:42:21,760 --> 00:42:25,000 Speaker 1: It works every time and not every time. Flattery will 737 00:42:25,000 --> 00:42:28,600 Speaker 1: get you everywhere. Uh, if you want to let us 738 00:42:28,600 --> 00:42:31,000 Speaker 1: know how great you think we are, we love hearing 739 00:42:31,040 --> 00:42:34,080 Speaker 1: that stuff. Obviously, you can tweet to us at s 740 00:42:34,200 --> 00:42:37,160 Speaker 1: Y s K podcast. You can post it on Facebook 741 00:42:37,200 --> 00:42:39,839 Speaker 1: dot com slash Stuff you Should Know. You can send 742 00:42:39,880 --> 00:42:42,160 Speaker 1: us an email to stuff podcast at how stuff Works 743 00:42:42,200 --> 00:42:44,719 Speaker 1: dot com, and as always, join us at our home 744 00:42:44,760 --> 00:42:49,920 Speaker 1: on the web. Stuff you Should Know dot Com. Stuff 745 00:42:49,960 --> 00:42:51,880 Speaker 1: you Should Know is a production of iHeart Radio's How 746 00:42:51,920 --> 00:42:54,600 Speaker 1: Stuff Works. For more podcasts for my heart Radio, because 747 00:42:54,600 --> 00:42:57,080 Speaker 1: at the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you 748 00:42:57,160 --> 00:42:58,320 Speaker 1: listen to your favorite shows.