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Speaker 1: Crime Round Up with the one and only Nancy Grace.

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Speaker 1: We are live in Athens, Georgia for the Lakeland Riley trial,

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Speaker 1: and I tell you, Nancy, it has already been gangbusters

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Speaker 1: as far as I'm concerned, right out of the gate

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Speaker 1: this morning.

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Speaker 2: Well, can we just start with the fact that the

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Speaker 2: defendant and his lawyer, which I think this is a

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Speaker 2: grave mistake, chose a bench trial over a jury trial.

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Speaker 1: What were they thinking?

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Speaker 2: And this is not a comment on the judge. I

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Speaker 2: understand this is pretty good judge. It's just that a judge,

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Speaker 2: I mean, you might be able to trick somebody on jury,

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Speaker 2: make them believe that, hey, the cops framed him or

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Speaker 2: something like that, or hey the crime why I'm framed him?

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Speaker 3: This isn't really his DNA just crazy, all right?

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Speaker 2: Sure, but Judda just gonna be going have you lost

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Speaker 2: your mind?

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Speaker 3: I do not believe the.

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Speaker 2: Entire Athen's Police department and the crime lab in Panthers

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Speaker 2: Off Panthers Doll and this one and that one all

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Speaker 2: got together to frame your client.

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Speaker 3: That did not happen. And think about it.

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Speaker 2: We know that there's a peeping time charge connected to

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Speaker 2: the murder case because this guy.

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Speaker 3: According to police, he's presumed Edison.

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Speaker 2: According to l E law enforcement, he was peeping on

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Speaker 2: women before he murdered Lake Kenriley.

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Speaker 3: Wouldn't you know?

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Speaker 2: Right when I get talking, here comes shut up David. Anyway,

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Speaker 2: all right, so we know that charge is in there,

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Speaker 2: but the defense thought, who's and nail to have the

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Speaker 2: charge removed?

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Speaker 3: Who did they argue that to the judge.

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Speaker 1: So even.

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Speaker 2: Say a motion to suppress, and what if the judge says, okay,

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Speaker 2: I'm suppressing this evidence. But then that judge is the

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Speaker 2: sole fact finder. He's acting as the jury. He knows

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Speaker 2: about all of this extrinsic evidence that otherwise the jury

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Speaker 2: would never have heard.

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Speaker 3: You see what I'm saying.

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Speaker 2: I never ever went with a bitch trial over a

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Speaker 2: jury trial. And I loved my judges, most of them anyway,

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Speaker 2: and I thought they would do the right thing. But no,

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Speaker 2: that was a bad move. Let's just kick it off

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Speaker 2: with that.

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Speaker 1: I agree with you one hundred percent. There is no

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Speaker 1: chance anybody's gonna sympathize. There's no chance you're going to

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Speaker 1: pull the wool over anybody's eyes. This is it. You've

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Speaker 1: got one sole person now determining your faith instead of twelve.

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Speaker 2: So the defense is trying to basically argue that we're

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Speaker 2: trying to that the state is trying to explain away

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Speaker 2: a tragedy.

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Speaker 3: A tragedy.

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Speaker 2: There's no question her head was bashed in with a rock.

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Speaker 2: That's not an accident. I mean, can we just get

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Speaker 2: real for a minute. Where else can defens go?

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Speaker 1: That's right, Nancy. They've got no eyewitness that can put

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Speaker 1: him in another location. They've got nobody that's going to

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Speaker 1: come up and say, hey man, you know he was

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Speaker 1: with me. They've got nothing. They got him on video

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Speaker 1: for crying out loud.

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Speaker 2: And what about the nine to one one call that

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Speaker 2: captured Lake and Riley's final moments played in court? You know,

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Speaker 2: it just her mother just burst into tears.

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Speaker 1: There's so many things that go through your mind when

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Speaker 1: you're watching the prosecution put this on and you're watching

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Speaker 1: her roommates, and you're watching that first officer and they

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Speaker 1: play that nine one one call and they confirm what

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Speaker 1: you and I said from day one, and that is

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Speaker 1: Lake Glynn fault. She fought for her life, she tried

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Speaker 1: to call for help. Nancy. It's just been an emotional,

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Speaker 1: just wildfire. This morning.

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Speaker 2: The mother had to cover her face with her hands

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Speaker 2: when that nine on one call was being played. She

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Speaker 2: couldn't not hear. She couldn't even look in the courtroom

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Speaker 2: when that was being played. I mean, and you don't

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Speaker 2: really hear Lakan herself. You hear a muffled audio, A

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Speaker 2: male voice is what you hear. But you know those

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Speaker 2: are her final moments. I mean, I can't even stand

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Speaker 2: if one of the twins gets upset.

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Speaker 3: Whenever they've gotten upset, even tho they were a little

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Speaker 3: and cried, I.

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Speaker 2: Would just it would like somebody's stabbing me in the heart.

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Speaker 2: This mother to hear that, knowing what was happening to

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Speaker 2: her daughter, and you know she was.

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Speaker 1: Going to devote her life to saving the lives of strangers.

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Speaker 1: You know, you just think of all the goodness that

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Speaker 1: is taken, and every life is precious. But I think,

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Speaker 1: especially when you're fixing the you know your entire adult

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Speaker 1: life is going to be saving people. And that's who

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Speaker 1: he chooses to kill. It just on some level, to me,

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Speaker 1: is so much worse because she wasn't just taken from

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Speaker 1: her friends and family, she was taken from all of

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Speaker 1: these people that she was gonna help Nancy.

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Speaker 2: Well, A thing that Another thing that I hate is

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Speaker 2: that this case has been turned into a political football

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Speaker 2: and it should not be because he got swept up

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Speaker 2: in the debate over immigration, illegal aliens or as they say, migrants,

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Speaker 2: after investigators said the perp came here illegally from Venezuela

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Speaker 2: and he is a member of a horrible, horrible gang

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Speaker 2: that many people are just learning about. But it's that

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Speaker 2: this particular gang gang has now infiltrated across the country

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Speaker 2: and nothing good. But that said, that's that's another thing

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Speaker 2: why you don't, if you're the defense attorney, why you

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Speaker 2: don't want a bench.

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Speaker 3: Trial, because see, the judge already knows that.

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Speaker 2: He's a member of the gang, right, but the jury

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Speaker 2: would probably not have heard that because that would have

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Speaker 2: been deemed too present prejudicial. You cannot have a bents

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Speaker 2: trial unless both sides agree to the bench trial.

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Speaker 3: Okay, So the.

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Speaker 2: Judge is going to know a lot more than a

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Speaker 2: jury would ever know. For instance, that he's an undocumented migrant,

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Speaker 2: all right. The jury may not have been able to

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Speaker 2: hear that. That may have been deemed too inflammatory for

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Speaker 2: a jury. But the judge knows all of this.

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Speaker 1: And the judge also knows that the former prosecutor that

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Speaker 1: lost the election is the one that took the death

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Speaker 1: penalty off the table. He knows all of it, the good,

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Speaker 1: the bad, and the ugly, and he cannot take that away.

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Speaker 1: Even though he's impartial, it's still knowledge that he possesses.

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Speaker 1: That He's got to factor that in. As far as

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Speaker 1: I'm concerned.

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Speaker 2: Well, of course, I'm just trying to think through what

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Speaker 2: all the judge knows that a jury would never have known.

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Speaker 3: It's extensive.

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Speaker 2: For instance, whenever a judge gets the file, the judge

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Speaker 2: has an injury would never see this, the person's wrap sheet,

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Speaker 2: all sorts of even arrests that are not convictions.

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Speaker 3: All of that is in the file.

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Speaker 2: The jury would never ever hear that, And if the

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Speaker 2: prosecutor tried to bring it up, there would be an

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Speaker 2: immediate mistrial, granted possibly with prejudice, so the state could

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Speaker 2: not re try it and not screw up the second time.

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Speaker 1: That's right, you know.

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Speaker 2: Outside outside of her being dedicating her life to helping

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Speaker 2: other people, she was an incredible scholar athlete. She inspired

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Speaker 2: other people with as they say, with her kindness. I

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Speaker 2: wonder what all that means. She was in her low sorority.

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Speaker 2: They all loved her just, I don't know, kind of

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Speaker 2: like this precious, beautiful girl that the parents thought, Wow,

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Speaker 2: how did I how did we get so lucky to

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Speaker 2: have her?

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Speaker 3: You know, that's that's.

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Speaker 1: Girl, absolutely, and you know there's proof of how just

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Speaker 1: you can count on her. She was a solid friend,

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Speaker 1: She was a solid human being. When she went missing,

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Speaker 1: it wasn't an hour after she should have been home,

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Speaker 1: and her roommates were on it. They were like, this

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Speaker 1: is not like her. She doesn't just drop off. She

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Speaker 1: is where she says she is going to be always.

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Speaker 1: And I'm going to tell you now. You know, I

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Speaker 1: got four sisters, and there's one of them. If she

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Speaker 1: was late, I would be immediately concerned. There's another one.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it might be three or four days before

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Speaker 1: we find out where where she Dan John.

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Speaker 2: Davia will be sitting outside the house in his truck.

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Speaker 2: Lucy will be no telling. There's just no telling where

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Speaker 2: Lucy will be when everybody's waiting, it doesn't matter.

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Speaker 3: At the other morning, the other morning.

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Speaker 2: They were supposed to be acolytes at the eleven o'clock service, and.

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Speaker 3: I had already gone over.

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Speaker 2: I was calling and I'm like, do I have to

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Speaker 2: march down the aisle with the candle myself?

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Speaker 3: Get in the car.

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Speaker 2: Nobody cares about your hair, Lucy, nobody.

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Speaker 3: You're the only one that cares about your hair.

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Speaker 1: Now get in the car.

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Speaker 2: Of course they made it okay, and it's so funny morning.

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Speaker 2: John David has on that robe and he's six '

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Speaker 2: six that comes just below his knees and you can

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Speaker 2: see his sweatpants and his tennis shoes coming out at

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Speaker 2: the bottom. But that said okay, and then there's perfectly

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Speaker 2: adorned okay, anyway, that said exactly here when she is not.

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Speaker 2: She is supposed to be exactly on time. Everybody says

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Speaker 2: something horrible must have happened.

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Speaker 1: They knew it, they knew it was not like her.

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Speaker 1: And that's what I'm saying. That would be true if Sheila.

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Speaker 1: It would not be true of my sister Shelley. But

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Speaker 1: that goes to prove it's not just us saying it.

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Speaker 1: Her roommates lived it. They knew something is wrong. And

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Speaker 1: of course, like we've had in other cases, this case,

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Speaker 1: she's got you know, the smart watch, and it can

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Speaker 1: tell exactly when her heart stopped beating, so that evidence

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Speaker 1: came in this morning.

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Speaker 2: Well right in the opening statements, the prosecution slammed it

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Speaker 2: and Lamb's making notes.

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Speaker 3: On Feb.

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Speaker 2: Two, the prosecutor says, is about Ibarra put on a

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Speaker 2: black hat, a hoodie style jacket, and black kitchen style

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Speaker 2: disposable gloves and went hunting for females on the UGA campus.

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Speaker 2: I mean, when Ross said that, who would put on

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Speaker 2: beside Brian Coburger, who would put on plastic gloves for

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Speaker 2: something innocent? I mean, this guy and Brian Coburger are

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Speaker 2: the only two that I know that would just walk

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Speaker 2: around wearing plastic gloves.

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Speaker 3: I mean, right there.

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Speaker 1: Right there, Sheila Ross is so solid, She's so good.

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Speaker 1: She is so just mechanical the way she will dissect

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Speaker 1: the case. She is And I'm telling you, you know,

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Speaker 1: they might have elected not to have a jury, but

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna tell you in this case, it ain't gonna matter.

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Speaker 1: She would have said it the same way showed the evident.

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Speaker 1: It's the same, you know order, And I think for

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Speaker 1: me watching her is one of those things I used

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Speaker 1: to get from you. You leave no stone unturned. And

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Speaker 1: most people will say because they said this during the

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Speaker 1: trial up in Delphi. They were like, well, the defense

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Speaker 1: had enough, so they just ended early. Let me tell

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Speaker 1: you something, you don't end early. If you have it,

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Speaker 1: you put it up. And Sheila is gonna put every

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Speaker 1: nail in that board she can find.

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Speaker 2: I had a lot of people argue, you're overdoing it.

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Speaker 2: It's overkilled. You're putting too much, you're overtrying your case.

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Speaker 2: And this is my opinion on that, and I stand

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Speaker 2: firm on it. Better to do it all and overdo

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Speaker 2: it than to not put up enough, lose your case

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Speaker 2: and then think, wow, what should have could have? Yeah,

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Speaker 2: a problem with the defense attorney. I'm not saying it's

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Speaker 2: not a great lawyer. It's and Kirby arguing an opening

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Speaker 2: statement evidence would not rude beyond a reasonable doubt that

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Speaker 2: he Barrow killed Riley, Okay, he said, and I quote

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Speaker 2: it would take gymnastics for the prosecution to argue Ibarro

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Speaker 2: killed Likan with quote circumstantial evidence. I don't know about you,

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Speaker 2: but I find the evidence to be airtight. I don't

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Speaker 2: consider DNA fingerprint to be circumstantial evidence.

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Speaker 1: No, ma'am. And let me tell you, Sheila Ross is

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Speaker 1: fixing in not it coming each this thing She's going

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Speaker 1: to have no trouble because not only do you have

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Speaker 1: DNA and the fingerprint on her phone and a video

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Speaker 1: of him discarding what he was wearing with her blood

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Speaker 1: on it. I mean, it's going to go own and

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Speaker 1: own and own in the time table. You know, you

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Speaker 1: always tell people that timeline is your money tree. It

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Speaker 1: is so tight, Nancy. They've got him going and coming,

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Speaker 1: and he's right there, not in camera shot, but he's

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Speaker 1: in the camera. He kills her, he's back in camera

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Speaker 1: discarding evidence that ain't circumstantial, baby, not at all. No.

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Speaker 2: What was very poignant to me that when the nine

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Speaker 2: one one picked up, they were saying, hey.

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Speaker 3: Can anybody hear me?

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Speaker 2: Because not on one couldn't hear any voices. The only

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Speaker 2: sound they could hear were birds chirping, you know, and

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Speaker 2: like a quiet, muffled sound.

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Speaker 3: Just the fact that as this.

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Speaker 2: Girl was dying, this beautiful young girl Liaken, you know,

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Speaker 2: everything was going on as normal, Like the birds were chirping,

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Speaker 2: people were going to classes, everything was happening normally in

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Speaker 2: the backdrop, and no one had any idea that Lacn

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Speaker 2: was fighting for her A lot. I gets the guy

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Speaker 2: who would come out hunting for a woman, like an animal,

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Speaker 2: like you know, the coyote looking for the weakest.

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Speaker 3: Animal it can find, like the hyena.

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Speaker 2: Looking for the slowest gazelle, just you know, a.

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Speaker 3: Pad of her.

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Speaker 1: He didn't care who it was.

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Speaker 2: He was just looking for a woman to attack, and

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Speaker 2: when she fought back, he wasn't having it, and he

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Speaker 2: killed her with the most convenient object he could find,

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Speaker 2: right there on the scene, and then got rid of

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Speaker 2: the evidence.

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Speaker 3: I mean, it's so.

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Speaker 1: Clear to me, you know, being here this morning. We

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Speaker 1: just broke for lunch, and the officer that testified, he's

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Speaker 1: walking down the pathway and he's got his brown file

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Speaker 1: under his arm, that accordion file that we've all had

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Speaker 1: since the eighties. And I just said to him, I said, hey,

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Speaker 1: I just want to tell you about Lakeland's case. And

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Speaker 1: he said, ma'am, I can't discuss it. I said, I

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Speaker 1: know you can't discuss it. I just want you to

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Speaker 1: know we have all been thinking of y'all. I mean,

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Speaker 1: this was a tremendous undertaking. It was horrible for all

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Speaker 1: of you. And he just said thank you and then

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Speaker 1: went on into the police department. But that's how everybody is.

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Speaker 1: The integrity of that case is being maintained just outside

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Speaker 1: that courthouse.

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Speaker 2: The defense is making it sound like this is going

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Speaker 2: to be a long shot and their circumstantial evidence, Well, no,

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Speaker 2: because investigator state that they immediately went to a dumpster

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Speaker 2: nearby and found a believe it was a sweatshirt. They

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Speaker 2: find a sweatshirt in there, and on the sweatshirt they

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Speaker 2: find blood and hair. Okay, that dumpster was near the

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Speaker 2: apartment complex where Ibora lived, hair and blood on it. It

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Speaker 2: was immediately submitted for testing and it came back with

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Speaker 2: a mixture. I don't know when all of the DNA

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Speaker 2: evidence is going to completely come in in front of

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Speaker 2: the jury, but that DNA was the combination of both

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Speaker 2: the defendant Ann Lakin's DNA.

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Speaker 3: Now not only is their video, but there.

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Speaker 2: Is a witness that positively identifies Ebarra as the one

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Speaker 2: disposing the sweatshirt. A woman living in Ebar's apartment, Ross

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Speaker 2: Belly Flores Bellow. I d's the man in the video

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Speaker 2: as Ebarra done. You know, the judge Haggard and I'm

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Speaker 2: not saying this is going to affect his opinion or

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Speaker 2: his decision at all.

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Speaker 3: You know, he's a crime victim.

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Speaker 2: His father was killed, shot and killed nearing an armed

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Speaker 2: robbery at a housing complex when he was working as

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Speaker 2: a salesman.

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Speaker 1: Well again, I know somebody else that dedicated their life

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Speaker 1: because somebody they loved was murdered, and it does affect you.

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Speaker 1: It should affect you, Nancy. I'm one of those people

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Speaker 1: when they say, don't show the jury these photographs. It

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Speaker 1: could inflame them. Dad Gummet, it ought to inflame them.

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Speaker 1: That's why they have that duty. The judge should see it,

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Speaker 1: The jury should see it. The public should see it

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Speaker 1: if they want to. You want to know what murder is.

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Speaker 1: It's ugly, it's horrific, it's horrible, but that should factor

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Speaker 1: into your decision. As far as I'm concerned, this isn't

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Speaker 1: something where people say, oh, well, I didn't realize, you know,

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Speaker 1: a fistfight looked like that. I just can't even watch boxing.

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Speaker 1: If boxing upsets you, you have no idea none. And

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Speaker 1: to me again, when you're going to take somebody's freedom,

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Speaker 1: you ought to know one hundred percent why.

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Speaker 3: I just hate it.

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Speaker 2: I hate it for her family and the people that

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Speaker 2: love her. But in years, God willing, there's a guilty

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Speaker 2: verdict in years to come, they will look back and

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Speaker 2: appreciate that this happened, that someone stood up for Lakan

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Speaker 2: and gave it two hundred percent at trial, because.

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Speaker 3: What if they didn't.

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Speaker 2: What if it was a half assed job and they

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Speaker 2: lost the case, so they made bad decisions during the case,

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Speaker 2: or they didn't really work the case. I've seen it

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Speaker 2: happen and you get a bad verdict, but not in

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Speaker 2: this case.

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Speaker 3: That is not happening.

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Speaker 1: In this case, that is not going to happen. Next

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Speaker 1: to you. Sheila Ross is the best I've ever seen.

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Speaker 2: I appreciate that because she is really good. Okay, I

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Speaker 2: wurn it upward back in the courtroom.

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Speaker 1: Thea by guys