1 00:00:01,280 --> 00:00:04,320 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class, a production 2 00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:13,600 Speaker 1: of I Heart Radio. Hello, and welcome to the podcast. 3 00:00:13,640 --> 00:00:17,320 Speaker 1: I'm Holly Fry and I'm Tracy V. Wilson. Hey, Tracy. 4 00:00:17,360 --> 00:00:21,120 Speaker 1: It's time for another eponymous foods episode, and it's so excited. 5 00:00:21,200 --> 00:00:23,919 Speaker 1: These have become a favorite of mine. I love these 6 00:00:23,960 --> 00:00:25,560 Speaker 1: because they get to talk about food, which I love. 7 00:00:25,640 --> 00:00:29,280 Speaker 1: But also they're often surprises, and this one is no different. Um, 8 00:00:29,320 --> 00:00:32,440 Speaker 1: this episode only has two foods in it. Those two 9 00:00:32,520 --> 00:00:35,120 Speaker 1: foods could not be more different. One is a flaming 10 00:00:35,159 --> 00:00:39,080 Speaker 1: dessert and one is a meat patty. Um. Also, we 11 00:00:39,120 --> 00:00:40,519 Speaker 1: want to make sure we say at the top one 12 00:00:40,520 --> 00:00:43,120 Speaker 1: of these foods was part of a fad diet. Neither 13 00:00:43,159 --> 00:00:45,000 Speaker 1: of us is really a fan of telling anybody what 14 00:00:45,080 --> 00:00:47,800 Speaker 1: to eat, but I will point out that it's a 15 00:00:47,800 --> 00:00:49,839 Speaker 1: good idea to eat a balanced diet of a lot 16 00:00:49,880 --> 00:00:52,640 Speaker 1: of different food groups unless you're instructed otherwise by your 17 00:00:52,680 --> 00:00:55,640 Speaker 1: personal physician. I don't want anyone to think we're endorsing 18 00:00:55,880 --> 00:00:57,720 Speaker 1: the strict diet that will come up in the second 19 00:00:57,760 --> 00:01:01,000 Speaker 1: story that we're telling today. UM, eat, eat which you 20 00:01:01,040 --> 00:01:02,600 Speaker 1: think is best for you. You know your body and 21 00:01:02,640 --> 00:01:08,479 Speaker 1: I don't. But this one seems very extreme to me. Yes. Uh, 22 00:01:08,560 --> 00:01:10,880 Speaker 1: folks may also be surprised to learn that it was 23 00:01:10,959 --> 00:01:15,560 Speaker 1: like a a weird diet food originally, because when I 24 00:01:15,640 --> 00:01:18,360 Speaker 1: first not something I associate with health foods at all, 25 00:01:18,360 --> 00:01:21,440 Speaker 1: and I don't think most people would. Yeah, but we're 26 00:01:21,440 --> 00:01:24,800 Speaker 1: going to start with the sweeter story. But the sweets 27 00:01:24,800 --> 00:01:27,960 Speaker 1: refer to the food. There are some slightly darker aspects 28 00:01:27,959 --> 00:01:32,000 Speaker 1: of this story. So here we go. Yea, So beyond 29 00:01:32,200 --> 00:01:35,399 Speaker 1: everything Holly just said, this first food we're talking about 30 00:01:35,560 --> 00:01:38,520 Speaker 1: is a little bit tricky because it's difficult to find 31 00:01:38,600 --> 00:01:42,920 Speaker 1: information on the person the dish is named for, even 32 00:01:42,959 --> 00:01:46,640 Speaker 1: though he's mentioned a lot. And this is relatively recent history, 33 00:01:46,680 --> 00:01:48,880 Speaker 1: so we're going to unravel as much of it as 34 00:01:48,920 --> 00:01:51,880 Speaker 1: we can. There's still a little bit of a gap, 35 00:01:52,400 --> 00:01:56,840 Speaker 1: and really the story veers off in some other directions. Anyway, 36 00:01:57,440 --> 00:02:01,360 Speaker 1: what we're talking about is Banana's Fosse stir. So if 37 00:02:01,440 --> 00:02:03,680 Speaker 1: you have been to New Orleans, you know that Brennan's 38 00:02:03,880 --> 00:02:07,160 Speaker 1: is a New Orleans dining icon at this point. Uh, 39 00:02:07,200 --> 00:02:09,840 Speaker 1: that restaurant went through some financial and legal issues in 40 00:02:09,840 --> 00:02:13,120 Speaker 1: the twenty teens. That family has kind of splintered apart 41 00:02:13,160 --> 00:02:16,000 Speaker 1: over the years, and had some disagreements. But there are 42 00:02:16,120 --> 00:02:19,240 Speaker 1: ten restaurants owned and operated by members of the Brennan 43 00:02:19,280 --> 00:02:22,760 Speaker 1: family in New Orleans today, and it all started on 44 00:02:22,840 --> 00:02:26,760 Speaker 1: Bourbon Street in nineteen six, although the main Brennan's location 45 00:02:26,840 --> 00:02:30,240 Speaker 1: relocated to Royal Street quite a while back. And while 46 00:02:30,320 --> 00:02:32,640 Speaker 1: you might think of New Orleans and associate it with 47 00:02:32,760 --> 00:02:36,240 Speaker 1: French or Cajun or Creole food traditions, all of which 48 00:02:36,280 --> 00:02:40,000 Speaker 1: you can absolutely sample at Brennan's, Owen Edward Brennan, who 49 00:02:40,000 --> 00:02:43,000 Speaker 1: first opened the restaurant, was actually an Irish American, although 50 00:02:43,000 --> 00:02:46,360 Speaker 1: he was born in New Orleans. Owen had enlisted his 51 00:02:46,520 --> 00:02:51,160 Speaker 1: younger sister Ella's help and some earlier restaurant ventures, and 52 00:02:51,240 --> 00:02:54,520 Speaker 1: when he bought out a restaurant called the Villa Kara 53 00:02:55,040 --> 00:02:58,520 Speaker 1: and turned it into Brennan's Via Kara, he had her 54 00:02:58,560 --> 00:03:01,440 Speaker 1: on staff in the French corp to restaurant as a manager, 55 00:03:01,560 --> 00:03:05,640 Speaker 1: and this was not always easy. Ella had helped her 56 00:03:05,639 --> 00:03:09,600 Speaker 1: brother out and other businesses, but management was a lot 57 00:03:09,639 --> 00:03:14,040 Speaker 1: more serious level of involvement. She really didn't have any experience. 58 00:03:14,080 --> 00:03:17,400 Speaker 1: She was only twenty one when she started there. According 59 00:03:17,440 --> 00:03:21,560 Speaker 1: to Ella Brennan's memoir quote, Owen fired me at least 60 00:03:21,639 --> 00:03:24,640 Speaker 1: three times that I recall, but Mom always made him 61 00:03:24,720 --> 00:03:27,800 Speaker 1: hire me back. It was like a bad comedy. And 62 00:03:27,960 --> 00:03:32,040 Speaker 1: in her memoir, Ella describes the moment her version of 63 00:03:32,080 --> 00:03:35,600 Speaker 1: how the bananas Foster dessert was invented. She wrote that 64 00:03:35,640 --> 00:03:39,200 Speaker 1: Owen came to her in the kitchen one morning and said, hey, kid, 65 00:03:39,280 --> 00:03:42,240 Speaker 1: we're having a dinner honoring our friend Richard. He's just 66 00:03:42,280 --> 00:03:45,080 Speaker 1: been appointed the chairman of the new Vice Commission, and 67 00:03:45,120 --> 00:03:47,440 Speaker 1: I would like to honor him with a newly created 68 00:03:47,480 --> 00:03:50,600 Speaker 1: dessert named for him, and I need it for tonight. 69 00:03:51,720 --> 00:03:53,760 Speaker 1: And though Ella told her brother that she was in 70 00:03:53,800 --> 00:03:56,560 Speaker 1: the middle of ordering liquor and revamping the breakfast menu 71 00:03:56,640 --> 00:03:59,520 Speaker 1: and she did not have time to invent a new dish, 72 00:03:59,560 --> 00:04:03,080 Speaker 1: he just up repeating the ask until she finally acquiesced 73 00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:07,160 Speaker 1: by saying, damn you, Owen. So then she recounts talking 74 00:04:07,200 --> 00:04:10,520 Speaker 1: to the major d Frank Bertucci, about this whole challenge. 75 00:04:10,800 --> 00:04:15,000 Speaker 1: She thought about how every other restaurant did cake for everything, 76 00:04:15,120 --> 00:04:17,760 Speaker 1: which she did not want to do, and then she 77 00:04:17,920 --> 00:04:21,200 Speaker 1: commented on how they had plenty of bananas. She thought 78 00:04:21,240 --> 00:04:23,720 Speaker 1: about how her mother made them for her for her 79 00:04:23,720 --> 00:04:28,480 Speaker 1: breakfast earlier on in the memoir, she recounted her favorite 80 00:04:28,560 --> 00:04:32,880 Speaker 1: childhood morning meal quote, My earliest food memory is of 81 00:04:32,920 --> 00:04:37,000 Speaker 1: her scrambled eggs and saute bananas. I just loved them. 82 00:04:37,520 --> 00:04:40,640 Speaker 1: Nellie stirred the eggs in a little bowl, poured them 83 00:04:40,640 --> 00:04:44,159 Speaker 1: into a pan sizzling with butter, stirred them again gently, 84 00:04:44,240 --> 00:04:48,320 Speaker 1: and slid them out while they were still very soft perfection. 85 00:04:48,960 --> 00:04:52,200 Speaker 1: Then she'd put a little brown sugar and cinnamon on bananas, 86 00:04:52,200 --> 00:04:56,480 Speaker 1: sliced lengthwise into quarters, turned them over in hot butter 87 00:04:56,560 --> 00:05:00,280 Speaker 1: until they were caramelized. Imagine what our kitchen smell like, 88 00:05:00,839 --> 00:05:04,679 Speaker 1: and serve them with the fluffy eggs. Nelly never could 89 00:05:04,720 --> 00:05:07,880 Speaker 1: have imagined what her handiwork and our home kitchen would 90 00:05:07,960 --> 00:05:11,440 Speaker 1: lead to. But let's just say that eggs and bananas 91 00:05:11,480 --> 00:05:15,320 Speaker 1: have been very good to our family. So Ella told 92 00:05:15,360 --> 00:05:19,359 Speaker 1: Frank Bertucci about her mom's breakfast bananas, and he also 93 00:05:19,440 --> 00:05:23,400 Speaker 1: noted that a competitor restaurant, Antoine's, had a flaming baked 94 00:05:23,400 --> 00:05:26,920 Speaker 1: Alaska that people just loved because of the flamba element 95 00:05:27,000 --> 00:05:30,120 Speaker 1: that was performed table side. And Ella thought they could 96 00:05:30,160 --> 00:05:33,000 Speaker 1: do the same with bananas, using rum and banana liqueur 97 00:05:33,120 --> 00:05:35,719 Speaker 1: for the fuel and then adding cinnamon to make it 98 00:05:35,800 --> 00:05:38,360 Speaker 1: sparkle in the flame in the dim dining room lights. 99 00:05:39,400 --> 00:05:43,680 Speaker 1: Then they thought about putting this warm banana flaming situation 100 00:05:43,800 --> 00:05:46,760 Speaker 1: over ice cream, and so by the time the dinner 101 00:05:46,800 --> 00:05:49,799 Speaker 1: that night had started, they were ready and that new dessert, 102 00:05:50,120 --> 00:05:54,560 Speaker 1: Bananas Foster, was born. So that's one version of the story. 103 00:05:55,080 --> 00:05:58,720 Speaker 1: The other is a bit simpler, and it contradicts Ella's version. 104 00:05:59,600 --> 00:06:03,799 Speaker 1: This goes that Owen, recognizing that New Orleans was basically 105 00:06:03,839 --> 00:06:07,200 Speaker 1: bursting with imported bananas, wanted to come up with a 106 00:06:07,279 --> 00:06:12,080 Speaker 1: dessert that would take advantage of all that banana availability, 107 00:06:12,120 --> 00:06:14,960 Speaker 1: so he asked his chef, Paul Blanche to come up 108 00:06:14,960 --> 00:06:18,520 Speaker 1: with something. There are some variations that suggests that Ella 109 00:06:18,640 --> 00:06:21,640 Speaker 1: and Paul worked together on it, and then, to add 110 00:06:21,680 --> 00:06:24,160 Speaker 1: a little more confusion to the mix, the name of 111 00:06:24,200 --> 00:06:28,479 Speaker 1: the restaurant shifting over time from View Kara to Brennan's 112 00:06:28,680 --> 00:06:32,960 Speaker 1: View Kara to just Brennan's, and some documentation that there 113 00:06:32,960 --> 00:06:37,240 Speaker 1: were also other name variations and a location move. That's 114 00:06:37,240 --> 00:06:40,240 Speaker 1: all led to some inconsistency in the reporting. It is 115 00:06:40,320 --> 00:06:44,520 Speaker 1: safe to say, though, that this was created at Owen 116 00:06:44,600 --> 00:06:48,920 Speaker 1: Brennan's restaurant in the early nineteen fifties. Yeah, I had 117 00:06:48,960 --> 00:06:51,240 Speaker 1: seen one account that said you'll see that it was 118 00:06:51,360 --> 00:06:55,320 Speaker 1: invented at Brennan's, but really it was invented at View 119 00:06:55,440 --> 00:06:57,880 Speaker 1: Kara when Owen Brennan owned it. It's like it's all 120 00:06:57,920 --> 00:07:01,760 Speaker 1: the same restaurant with his name shifts Um. Now, there 121 00:07:01,800 --> 00:07:04,120 Speaker 1: are two things that we have to revisit in this 122 00:07:04,160 --> 00:07:09,840 Speaker 1: story because they have some complexity. One is that availability 123 00:07:09,880 --> 00:07:14,600 Speaker 1: of bananas, and to that Vice Commission and Richard Foster's 124 00:07:14,600 --> 00:07:18,280 Speaker 1: place on it, because both of those created the scenario 125 00:07:18,440 --> 00:07:23,840 Speaker 1: that made bananas Foster happen. First, the bananas. Bananas weren't 126 00:07:23,920 --> 00:07:27,120 Speaker 1: really a common thing in the US until after the 127 00:07:27,200 --> 00:07:30,840 Speaker 1: Civil War. North America is not a place where bananas 128 00:07:30,920 --> 00:07:35,680 Speaker 1: typically grow, although today you can find banana groves in Florida. 129 00:07:36,360 --> 00:07:40,480 Speaker 1: Hawaii becoming a US state also changed the numbers quite 130 00:07:40,520 --> 00:07:44,600 Speaker 1: a bit, But even with Hawaii and Florida combined, the 131 00:07:44,720 --> 00:07:48,720 Speaker 1: US grows less than a single percent of the world's bananas. 132 00:07:49,480 --> 00:07:52,200 Speaker 1: We have them available all the time in the grocery store, though, 133 00:07:52,800 --> 00:07:57,000 Speaker 1: yep So. Starting in the eighteen seventies, bananas started arriving 134 00:07:57,080 --> 00:08:00,680 Speaker 1: in large quantities at US ports and New Orleans being 135 00:08:00,720 --> 00:08:05,360 Speaker 1: a southern port had a steady flow of bananas. Because 136 00:08:05,360 --> 00:08:08,239 Speaker 1: of New Orleans ports status, a lot of fruit companies 137 00:08:08,240 --> 00:08:11,520 Speaker 1: were headquartered in the city and the surrounding areas, and 138 00:08:11,600 --> 00:08:15,000 Speaker 1: one of those fruit companies, the Standard Fruit Company, was 139 00:08:15,080 --> 00:08:19,000 Speaker 1: loosely connected to the Brennan family through marriage. Owen and 140 00:08:19,080 --> 00:08:22,720 Speaker 1: Ella had siblings, and their brother, John, married into a 141 00:08:22,760 --> 00:08:25,680 Speaker 1: family that had a steak in Standard Fruit Company, and 142 00:08:25,720 --> 00:08:28,200 Speaker 1: for a while John started running a produce business in 143 00:08:28,240 --> 00:08:33,640 Speaker 1: the city. However, well before the now famous dessert was created, 144 00:08:33,960 --> 00:08:37,720 Speaker 1: Standard Fruit Company had a very aggressive competitor, and that 145 00:08:37,760 --> 00:08:43,080 Speaker 1: was Cuyammel Fruit Company, which became part of United Fruit Company. 146 00:08:43,320 --> 00:08:46,880 Speaker 1: Cuyammel was owned and operated by a man named Samuel 147 00:08:47,040 --> 00:08:50,560 Speaker 1: Za Murray who had immigrated first to Mobile, Alabama from 148 00:08:50,679 --> 00:08:53,840 Speaker 1: Russia and then moved to New Orleans. Sam had started 149 00:08:53,840 --> 00:08:56,280 Speaker 1: out by buying the fruit that had been on the 150 00:08:56,320 --> 00:08:59,200 Speaker 1: dock for too long as workers struggled to keep up 151 00:08:59,280 --> 00:09:02,280 Speaker 1: with this mass of influx of shipments. He would get 152 00:09:02,280 --> 00:09:05,199 Speaker 1: the fruit which was too ripe to just sit in 153 00:09:05,280 --> 00:09:08,680 Speaker 1: a restaurant pantry for long, for next to nothing, and 154 00:09:08,679 --> 00:09:10,640 Speaker 1: then would turn it around to sell it to the 155 00:09:10,640 --> 00:09:14,360 Speaker 1: public at a discount. Eventually, he had an entire network 156 00:09:14,360 --> 00:09:17,240 Speaker 1: of men selling fruit, and then as he saved up money, 157 00:09:17,280 --> 00:09:21,760 Speaker 1: he started buying land in Honduras for his own banana plantations. 158 00:09:22,520 --> 00:09:26,080 Speaker 1: And of course, most bananas hitting US ports were coming 159 00:09:26,120 --> 00:09:29,720 Speaker 1: from countries that we would call banana republic, so places 160 00:09:29,760 --> 00:09:34,080 Speaker 1: that depend economically on the export of natural resources and 161 00:09:34,080 --> 00:09:38,559 Speaker 1: are often deeply unstable from a political standpoint, largely because 162 00:09:38,679 --> 00:09:42,480 Speaker 1: US business interests were using their influence there to ensure 163 00:09:42,520 --> 00:09:45,480 Speaker 1: that their businesses thrived at the expense of the people 164 00:09:45,559 --> 00:09:49,439 Speaker 1: and workers who lived there. Honduras was the first nation 165 00:09:49,520 --> 00:09:53,040 Speaker 1: labeled a banana republic and was the primary banana exporter 166 00:09:53,120 --> 00:09:56,320 Speaker 1: in the world as of the nineteen thirties. Zu Murray, 167 00:09:56,520 --> 00:09:58,800 Speaker 1: who had ties to the CIA and the U. S 168 00:09:58,800 --> 00:10:02,120 Speaker 1: State Department, used his power and wealth to do things 169 00:10:02,160 --> 00:10:07,080 Speaker 1: like support military coups, install Manuel Banilla as president of Honduras, 170 00:10:07,200 --> 00:10:12,040 Speaker 1: and just generally to maximize exploitation of Latin American countries. 171 00:10:12,960 --> 00:10:16,839 Speaker 1: During his reign as the so called Banana King, Zamurray's 172 00:10:16,920 --> 00:10:21,040 Speaker 1: Cuiamel Fruit Company was bought out by United Fruit Company, 173 00:10:21,280 --> 00:10:26,480 Speaker 1: of which he became president. Eventually. His legacy is also 174 00:10:26,640 --> 00:10:30,000 Speaker 1: tied to the nineteen fifty for Guatemala cou that we 175 00:10:30,120 --> 00:10:34,000 Speaker 1: covered as a two parter in twenty nineteen. To be clear, 176 00:10:34,120 --> 00:10:38,040 Speaker 1: the Brennan family doesn't appear to have been directly involved 177 00:10:38,040 --> 00:10:41,120 Speaker 1: in this political maneuvering, and John didn't stay in the 178 00:10:41,160 --> 00:10:44,200 Speaker 1: produce business because he started working as a food buyer 179 00:10:44,320 --> 00:10:48,320 Speaker 1: for the restaurant. But bananas always being plentiful in the 180 00:10:48,400 --> 00:10:51,360 Speaker 1: kitchens of New Orleans restaurant during this time is something 181 00:10:51,400 --> 00:10:56,679 Speaker 1: that all ties directly back to US business interests actively 182 00:10:56,720 --> 00:10:59,760 Speaker 1: working in ways that were harmful in other countries that 183 00:10:59,800 --> 00:11:03,880 Speaker 1: they are doing business. And Standard Fruit Company eventually became 184 00:11:03,920 --> 00:11:07,000 Speaker 1: part of Dull Foods, and United Fruit Company was a 185 00:11:07,000 --> 00:11:10,200 Speaker 1: precursor to Chiquita. So coming up, we're going to talk 186 00:11:10,200 --> 00:11:12,959 Speaker 1: about the other part of New Orleans history that relates 187 00:11:13,000 --> 00:11:16,040 Speaker 1: to the Bananas Foster dish. But first we're gonna take 188 00:11:16,040 --> 00:11:28,240 Speaker 1: a quick sponsor break. So the next aspect of this 189 00:11:28,280 --> 00:11:31,079 Speaker 1: Bananas Foster story is a little bit trickier to get 190 00:11:31,120 --> 00:11:34,680 Speaker 1: details on, and that is Richard Foster, for whom the 191 00:11:34,720 --> 00:11:39,400 Speaker 1: dessert is named. New Orleans, like any big city, has crime, 192 00:11:39,600 --> 00:11:42,600 Speaker 1: and in the early nineteen fifties, a murder in the 193 00:11:42,640 --> 00:11:45,960 Speaker 1: French Quarter led to an effort to crack down on crime. 194 00:11:46,960 --> 00:11:49,760 Speaker 1: Robert Dunn, a tourist from Nashville, went out for a 195 00:11:49,880 --> 00:11:53,360 Speaker 1: day of partying on New Year's Eve leading into nineteen 196 00:11:53,440 --> 00:11:57,120 Speaker 1: fifty and after midnight he and his friends continued their 197 00:11:57,160 --> 00:12:00,319 Speaker 1: revelry and eventually they ended up at the Latin Quarter Club, 198 00:12:00,679 --> 00:12:03,560 Speaker 1: one of the many many bars on Bourbon Street, and 199 00:12:03,559 --> 00:12:07,160 Speaker 1: when a waiter was unable to resuscitate the intoxicated Done, 200 00:12:07,200 --> 00:12:10,520 Speaker 1: paramedics were called, but Done could not be revived and 201 00:12:10,559 --> 00:12:14,240 Speaker 1: he was pronounced dead at five oh five am. He 202 00:12:14,320 --> 00:12:16,640 Speaker 1: was initially believed to have had a heart attack that 203 00:12:16,720 --> 00:12:19,880 Speaker 1: was brought on from heavy drinking, but an autopsy revealed 204 00:12:20,200 --> 00:12:23,160 Speaker 1: that he had been poisoned with a sedative chloral hydrate 205 00:12:23,240 --> 00:12:27,160 Speaker 1: known as a mickey. Finn as In slipped him a mickey. 206 00:12:27,280 --> 00:12:29,240 Speaker 1: We might very well do an episode about where that 207 00:12:29,320 --> 00:12:31,559 Speaker 1: name comes from in the future, because it's a pretty 208 00:12:31,600 --> 00:12:35,280 Speaker 1: interesting story. Uh So, in this case, Done was sedated. 209 00:12:35,360 --> 00:12:37,480 Speaker 1: It was believed so that he could be mugged, but 210 00:12:37,520 --> 00:12:40,319 Speaker 1: the dose was too high and it killed him. This 211 00:12:40,520 --> 00:12:43,840 Speaker 1: death of a tourist catalyzed a whole movement to clean 212 00:12:43,920 --> 00:12:47,000 Speaker 1: up the French Quarter. This was a point where the area, 213 00:12:47,080 --> 00:12:50,560 Speaker 1: which was long considered to be unsavory, was seeing the 214 00:12:50,600 --> 00:12:55,439 Speaker 1: first pushes towards gentrification. Residents wanted city officials to make 215 00:12:55,440 --> 00:12:59,240 Speaker 1: the neighborhoods safe for them, and restaurants and clubs also 216 00:12:59,320 --> 00:13:02,000 Speaker 1: wanted to make sure that the tourism trade continued, so 217 00:13:02,120 --> 00:13:05,880 Speaker 1: they were pressuring city officials as well. Of course, this 218 00:13:06,000 --> 00:13:10,520 Speaker 1: kind of campaign usually comes with problems. Most gentrification efforts 219 00:13:10,520 --> 00:13:14,240 Speaker 1: in any city push out the very people who made 220 00:13:14,400 --> 00:13:17,800 Speaker 1: the neighborhood desirable in the first place, and there's almost 221 00:13:17,920 --> 00:13:21,560 Speaker 1: always a lot of bias and racism and classism involved. 222 00:13:22,160 --> 00:13:24,680 Speaker 1: This was definitely true for New Orleans in the early 223 00:13:24,760 --> 00:13:29,640 Speaker 1: nineteen fifties, when three committees were formed to investigate vice 224 00:13:29,840 --> 00:13:34,839 Speaker 1: and corruption. The first of these was the Mayor's Special 225 00:13:35,080 --> 00:13:38,719 Speaker 1: Citizens Committee for the View Carre the s c c 226 00:13:39,160 --> 00:13:42,800 Speaker 1: v C. In this case, View car A is another 227 00:13:42,920 --> 00:13:45,560 Speaker 1: name for the French Quarter, and it was not referencing 228 00:13:45,679 --> 00:13:50,439 Speaker 1: Owen Brennan's restaurants, although Brennan was involved in the committee 229 00:13:50,960 --> 00:13:54,800 Speaker 1: along with Richard R. Foster and several other business owners 230 00:13:55,080 --> 00:13:59,000 Speaker 1: from the quarter. Foster was a local businessman and a 231 00:13:59,080 --> 00:14:01,959 Speaker 1: civic activist who had long been troubled by the rising 232 00:14:02,000 --> 00:14:06,559 Speaker 1: crime in the French Quarter. He was unanimously elected chairman 233 00:14:06,640 --> 00:14:09,960 Speaker 1: of the sec VC because he had been advocating for 234 00:14:10,040 --> 00:14:12,920 Speaker 1: some sort of crime commission for several years at that point. 235 00:14:13,240 --> 00:14:17,400 Speaker 1: It's documented from at least so at least four to 236 00:14:17,480 --> 00:14:20,280 Speaker 1: five years. He was also a member of the Police 237 00:14:20,320 --> 00:14:24,720 Speaker 1: Advisory Board representing business owners in the French Quarter. Most 238 00:14:24,720 --> 00:14:29,800 Speaker 1: of the committee's recommendations involved removing quote shady characters from 239 00:14:29,840 --> 00:14:35,200 Speaker 1: the French Quarter. This meant investigating taxi drivers, sex workers, 240 00:14:35,280 --> 00:14:40,360 Speaker 1: anybody deemed to be deviant in their eyes, be girls, 241 00:14:40,400 --> 00:14:43,520 Speaker 1: which was short for bar girls, meaning young women who 242 00:14:43,520 --> 00:14:46,800 Speaker 1: were employed at the bars to socialize with men and 243 00:14:46,960 --> 00:14:50,479 Speaker 1: encourage them to purchase drinks. They were also under suspicion 244 00:14:51,080 --> 00:14:54,240 Speaker 1: The b girls were considered the most likely source of 245 00:14:54,280 --> 00:14:58,160 Speaker 1: the poison that had killed Robert Dunn. Homosexuals were not 246 00:14:58,320 --> 00:15:00,920 Speaker 1: called out specifically as one of the problems that the 247 00:15:00,920 --> 00:15:05,160 Speaker 1: committee sought to solve, but Foster and other committee members 248 00:15:05,520 --> 00:15:09,600 Speaker 1: very clearly held homophobic beliefs and wanted the Quarters gay 249 00:15:09,640 --> 00:15:13,480 Speaker 1: population to be pushed out as well. In the meeting 250 00:15:13,560 --> 00:15:16,360 Speaker 1: minutes for the committee from a March thirty one, nineteen 251 00:15:16,440 --> 00:15:21,000 Speaker 1: fifty discussion, Foster noted that gay men were quote congregating 252 00:15:21,000 --> 00:15:24,320 Speaker 1: in greater numbers in the quarter because New Orleans had 253 00:15:24,360 --> 00:15:28,080 Speaker 1: tolerated them while most other cities had not. There was 254 00:15:28,120 --> 00:15:30,840 Speaker 1: also a lot of targeting of women in general in 255 00:15:30,880 --> 00:15:34,640 Speaker 1: the committee's suggestions. At one point in their discussions, one 256 00:15:34,680 --> 00:15:38,360 Speaker 1: of the members pointed out that women bartenders were likely 257 00:15:38,440 --> 00:15:42,040 Speaker 1: to poison customers because they didn't make as much as men, 258 00:15:42,640 --> 00:15:46,000 Speaker 1: so they would be likely to resort to robbery of patrons. 259 00:15:46,400 --> 00:15:50,560 Speaker 1: There was a lot of bias to go around here. Yeah, 260 00:15:50,680 --> 00:15:54,360 Speaker 1: kind of anybody that wasn't a white male businessman was 261 00:15:54,400 --> 00:15:59,080 Speaker 1: like suspicious, Like they fell under that complete umbrella term 262 00:15:59,240 --> 00:16:03,240 Speaker 1: of being shady person. Two other committees were formed as 263 00:16:03,240 --> 00:16:06,600 Speaker 1: the determinations of Foster's group were reported. Those were the 264 00:16:06,600 --> 00:16:10,200 Speaker 1: Special Citizens Investigative Committee and the Committee on the Problem 265 00:16:10,240 --> 00:16:12,960 Speaker 1: of Sex Deviants, and the results of all of these 266 00:16:13,000 --> 00:16:17,000 Speaker 1: committees and their recommendations were pretty mixed. Some of the 267 00:16:17,120 --> 00:16:20,720 Speaker 1: ordinances drafted by these three committees were used by police 268 00:16:20,760 --> 00:16:23,640 Speaker 1: commissioners to advance their own careers, and they were often 269 00:16:23,760 --> 00:16:28,360 Speaker 1: used to justify raids on poor or marginalized areas. While 270 00:16:28,400 --> 00:16:32,960 Speaker 1: crimes attributed to various business owners not really pursued. If 271 00:16:32,960 --> 00:16:36,680 Speaker 1: you're wondering why these committees were drafting ordinances, because most 272 00:16:36,720 --> 00:16:38,720 Speaker 1: of the men that sat on them had businesses in 273 00:16:38,760 --> 00:16:41,480 Speaker 1: the quarter but also had law degrees, so they were 274 00:16:41,520 --> 00:16:45,160 Speaker 1: like ready to write law. Uh. We should also note 275 00:16:45,160 --> 00:16:47,000 Speaker 1: that one of the three committees formed in all of this, 276 00:16:47,160 --> 00:16:52,160 Speaker 1: the Special Citizens Investigating Committee, did uncover and expose a 277 00:16:52,280 --> 00:16:54,760 Speaker 1: lot of police corruption that ended up in a whole 278 00:16:54,760 --> 00:16:59,480 Speaker 1: other legal battle that's kind of secondary to this this story. 279 00:16:59,600 --> 00:17:05,480 Speaker 1: But even in cases where allegedly suspicious people, per their definitions, 280 00:17:05,880 --> 00:17:08,920 Speaker 1: were pushed out of the quarter, it was always temporary. 281 00:17:09,080 --> 00:17:12,760 Speaker 1: They there was always like a brief crackdown and then 282 00:17:13,000 --> 00:17:14,520 Speaker 1: things would kind of go back to the way they 283 00:17:14,560 --> 00:17:18,040 Speaker 1: were before. So all of this to say, bananas Foster 284 00:17:18,240 --> 00:17:21,720 Speaker 1: is delicious, but the atmosphere that was invented in had 285 00:17:21,760 --> 00:17:24,720 Speaker 1: plenty of problems, and some of those problems were related 286 00:17:24,760 --> 00:17:27,800 Speaker 1: to and even caused by the person the dish is 287 00:17:27,920 --> 00:17:31,240 Speaker 1: named for. It's more of a fun side note, so 288 00:17:31,400 --> 00:17:33,919 Speaker 1: we don't end on that down. Or if you're a 289 00:17:33,960 --> 00:17:37,520 Speaker 1: Disney person and you've ever eaten at Ralph Brennan's Jazz 290 00:17:37,600 --> 00:17:41,080 Speaker 1: Kitchen in Downtown Disney, Anaheim, you're eating at a restaurant 291 00:17:41,119 --> 00:17:44,320 Speaker 1: that's part of the whole Brennan legacy. Ralph Brennan is 292 00:17:44,400 --> 00:17:47,159 Speaker 1: John Brennan's son and is the current head of the 293 00:17:47,240 --> 00:17:50,200 Speaker 1: Ralph Brennan Restaurant group. Yeah, we can talk a little 294 00:17:50,200 --> 00:17:53,800 Speaker 1: bit about that and and the family uh in our 295 00:17:54,000 --> 00:17:56,640 Speaker 1: behind the scenes on Friday. But now it is time 296 00:17:56,640 --> 00:17:59,399 Speaker 1: for the next eponymous food and this one hasked to 297 00:17:59,440 --> 00:18:03,520 Speaker 1: start with a confession. I don't know, Tracy, if you 298 00:18:03,600 --> 00:18:07,919 Speaker 1: had this same issue, but I one dent thought that 299 00:18:08,040 --> 00:18:11,879 Speaker 1: Salisbury steak was named for some Duke of Salisbury. I 300 00:18:11,920 --> 00:18:14,600 Speaker 1: asked my husband. That's exactly the answer he gave as well. 301 00:18:14,880 --> 00:18:16,879 Speaker 1: And if you had asked me who was named for 302 00:18:16,880 --> 00:18:19,160 Speaker 1: in a trivia situation, that would have been the answer 303 00:18:19,240 --> 00:18:22,600 Speaker 1: you got. I don't know where, Brian, I got that notion. Well, 304 00:18:22,880 --> 00:18:24,760 Speaker 1: I think I might have thought it was named for 305 00:18:24,840 --> 00:18:28,879 Speaker 1: a place, maybe not a person, but like Salisbury Plain 306 00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:32,320 Speaker 1: where they eat kind of personal meat loaf. I was 307 00:18:32,440 --> 00:18:35,919 Speaker 1: definitely wrong. I was not correct about about the source 308 00:18:35,960 --> 00:18:37,400 Speaker 1: of the name at all. And I think a lot 309 00:18:37,440 --> 00:18:40,399 Speaker 1: of folks have some mental picture of where the name 310 00:18:40,440 --> 00:18:43,080 Speaker 1: comes from. That's like not the real one, not at all. 311 00:18:43,080 --> 00:18:46,639 Speaker 1: What it is. Uh. You probably don't think of Salisbury 312 00:18:46,680 --> 00:18:49,040 Speaker 1: steak is a health food, but that is exactly how 313 00:18:49,040 --> 00:18:53,320 Speaker 1: it was conceived. So let's talk about its namesake. Dr 314 00:18:53,480 --> 00:18:59,920 Speaker 1: James Henry Salisbury. James Salisbury was born on October twenty 315 00:19:00,080 --> 00:19:03,879 Speaker 1: three in Scott, New York. His parents were Nathan and 316 00:19:04,000 --> 00:19:08,720 Speaker 1: Lucretia Babcock Salisbury. The family was Welsh. Information about his 317 00:19:08,800 --> 00:19:11,520 Speaker 1: early life is pretty sparse, but we know he attended 318 00:19:11,640 --> 00:19:15,920 Speaker 1: the Homer Academy and then the Rensseler Polytechnic Institute. He 319 00:19:16,000 --> 00:19:20,639 Speaker 1: got his undergraduate degree in natural science in eighteen forty four. 320 00:19:21,240 --> 00:19:24,280 Speaker 1: Two years after he got his bachelor's degree, Salisbury was 321 00:19:24,359 --> 00:19:28,800 Speaker 1: hired as an assistant chemist at the New York Geological Society, 322 00:19:28,880 --> 00:19:31,280 Speaker 1: and he also, in addition to having a full time job, 323 00:19:31,359 --> 00:19:35,600 Speaker 1: pursued additional higher education degrees. He went on to Albany 324 00:19:35,600 --> 00:19:38,840 Speaker 1: Medical College for his m d. And he started studying 325 00:19:38,920 --> 00:19:41,040 Speaker 1: germs while he was in medical school, and he was 326 00:19:41,359 --> 00:19:45,040 Speaker 1: very fascinated by them. He later wrote quote, in eighteen 327 00:19:45,040 --> 00:19:48,400 Speaker 1: forty nine, I began the study of germ diseases. Those 328 00:19:48,440 --> 00:19:52,800 Speaker 1: of plants first occupied my attention, afterwards those in animals 329 00:19:52,880 --> 00:19:55,840 Speaker 1: and in man. And he also got promoted while he 330 00:19:55,880 --> 00:19:59,400 Speaker 1: was getting his medical degree to the position of principal Chemist. 331 00:20:00,160 --> 00:20:04,679 Speaker 1: We've covered germ theory on various episodes of the podcast before, 332 00:20:05,359 --> 00:20:07,880 Speaker 1: so you may have correctly thought that the late eighteen 333 00:20:07,920 --> 00:20:11,400 Speaker 1: forties was a pretty early time to be studying germs. 334 00:20:11,920 --> 00:20:14,919 Speaker 1: Salisbury was kind of a loner among his peers. His 335 00:20:15,119 --> 00:20:18,320 Speaker 1: fascination with the idea that germs were the cause of 336 00:20:18,440 --> 00:20:21,520 Speaker 1: disease is said to have gained him a fair amount 337 00:20:21,560 --> 00:20:24,320 Speaker 1: of criticism from other people. Yeah, it's kind of like, 338 00:20:24,320 --> 00:20:26,359 Speaker 1: why aren't you just treating your patients? Why do you 339 00:20:26,359 --> 00:20:30,720 Speaker 1: want to look through a microscope. In eighteen fifty two, 340 00:20:30,760 --> 00:20:33,760 Speaker 1: Salisbury left his job at the Geological Society so that 341 00:20:33,800 --> 00:20:36,240 Speaker 1: he could move to Sconnected in New York and attend 342 00:20:36,359 --> 00:20:40,359 Speaker 1: Union College for a master's degree. He supported himself during 343 00:20:40,359 --> 00:20:43,159 Speaker 1: this time by teaching chemistry at the New York Normal 344 00:20:43,200 --> 00:20:46,560 Speaker 1: School that was located about twenty miles away in Albany. 345 00:20:46,840 --> 00:20:49,399 Speaker 1: Once he had finished his master's program, he started a 346 00:20:49,440 --> 00:20:52,760 Speaker 1: private practice and he worked on his own research projects. 347 00:20:53,560 --> 00:20:56,560 Speaker 1: Dr Salisbury was ahead of his time in a number 348 00:20:56,600 --> 00:21:00,520 Speaker 1: of ways, and was studying diphtheria well before were most 349 00:21:00,560 --> 00:21:04,000 Speaker 1: others in his field. Diph THEORYA had only been named 350 00:21:04,000 --> 00:21:08,119 Speaker 1: by French physician Pierre Bret No. About twenty five years before. 351 00:21:08,880 --> 00:21:12,119 Speaker 1: It would be several more decades before the bacterium that 352 00:21:12,280 --> 00:21:16,240 Speaker 1: causes diph theoria would be identified and named, so Salisbury 353 00:21:16,359 --> 00:21:19,040 Speaker 1: was doing research with his microscope into it in the 354 00:21:19,240 --> 00:21:24,240 Speaker 1: very early stages of understanding this infection. He also studied 355 00:21:24,320 --> 00:21:28,560 Speaker 1: other medical subjects through the microscope and including measles, and 356 00:21:28,720 --> 00:21:34,560 Speaker 1: he researched alimentation, meaning how people gained nourishment, and Salisbury 357 00:21:34,600 --> 00:21:38,520 Speaker 1: started to really focus on the relation between nutrition and 358 00:21:38,680 --> 00:21:42,080 Speaker 1: disease or health. He had been from the beginning of 359 00:21:42,080 --> 00:21:45,679 Speaker 1: his private practice frustrated at the state of medicine and 360 00:21:45,720 --> 00:21:49,040 Speaker 1: its lack of understanding regarding the cause and effective disease. 361 00:21:49,560 --> 00:21:53,120 Speaker 1: He wrote quote, I was immediately and forcibly struck by 362 00:21:53,119 --> 00:21:56,600 Speaker 1: the almost entire want of medical knowledge in regard to 363 00:21:56,640 --> 00:21:59,800 Speaker 1: the true causes of disease, and by the consequent uns 364 00:22:00,000 --> 00:22:02,960 Speaker 1: certainty that must and did exist as to the means 365 00:22:02,960 --> 00:22:08,159 Speaker 1: of combating and curing pathological states. This uncertainty hampered me 366 00:22:08,200 --> 00:22:11,640 Speaker 1: at each step of my practice. The art of therapeutics 367 00:22:11,760 --> 00:22:14,760 Speaker 1: was a chaos whose sole order consisted in dealing with 368 00:22:15,160 --> 00:22:19,359 Speaker 1: established pathological conditions as though they were the disease itself 369 00:22:19,760 --> 00:22:23,320 Speaker 1: rather than what they actually were viz. Consequences based upon 370 00:22:23,400 --> 00:22:28,040 Speaker 1: antecedent and obscure states arriving from an unknown cause. The 371 00:22:28,160 --> 00:22:31,760 Speaker 1: grim list of so called incurable diseases and their steadily 372 00:22:31,840 --> 00:22:36,119 Speaker 1: increasing death rates riveted my attention and fascinated my thought. 373 00:22:36,760 --> 00:22:40,000 Speaker 1: I attained an entire conviction that they must be curable, 374 00:22:40,320 --> 00:22:45,040 Speaker 1: that since abnormal conditions could be established in previously healthy organisms, 375 00:22:45,080 --> 00:22:48,439 Speaker 1: their causation must be discoverable, and that the mind of 376 00:22:48,480 --> 00:22:51,840 Speaker 1: man must be endowed with sufficient power to trace the 377 00:22:51,880 --> 00:22:56,679 Speaker 1: interlinked sequence of diseases back to their primary source. I 378 00:22:56,800 --> 00:23:01,320 Speaker 1: determined to accomplish this discovery if possible, before my exit 379 00:23:01,440 --> 00:23:04,640 Speaker 1: from this world. We'll dive into the ways that James 380 00:23:04,720 --> 00:23:09,920 Speaker 1: Salisbury experimented with his ideas regarding food and health after 381 00:23:09,960 --> 00:23:12,000 Speaker 1: we hear from some of the sponsors that keep Stuffy 382 00:23:12,040 --> 00:23:24,600 Speaker 1: miss in history class. Going according to his own account, 383 00:23:25,040 --> 00:23:30,000 Speaker 1: starting in eighteen fifty four, Salisbury started experimenting with his diets, 384 00:23:30,119 --> 00:23:34,720 Speaker 1: starting with quote, living exclusively upon one food at a time. 385 00:23:35,520 --> 00:23:37,800 Speaker 1: I'm going to confess this brings out like my inner 386 00:23:37,880 --> 00:23:41,240 Speaker 1: seven year old of giggles because he started with baked beans, 387 00:23:41,880 --> 00:23:44,320 Speaker 1: and this one exactly as well as you might expect. 388 00:23:45,119 --> 00:23:51,360 Speaker 1: Within three days, he wrote that he experienced flatulence, constipation, dizziness, 389 00:23:51,440 --> 00:23:55,720 Speaker 1: ringing years, prickly limbs, and mental fog. He examined a 390 00:23:55,720 --> 00:23:59,040 Speaker 1: sample of his stool under the microscope and discovered that 391 00:23:59,119 --> 00:24:03,200 Speaker 1: quote the Ean food did not digest. He then noted 392 00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:07,040 Speaker 1: that the beans fermented and filled the digestive tract with yeast, 393 00:24:07,280 --> 00:24:13,000 Speaker 1: carbon dioxide, alcohol, and acetic acid. He continued these experiments 394 00:24:13,040 --> 00:24:16,760 Speaker 1: with his own diet until September eighteen fifty six. Then 395 00:24:16,840 --> 00:24:20,480 Speaker 1: he expanded his research and got six men to come 396 00:24:20,520 --> 00:24:24,800 Speaker 1: to live with him while they two eight only baked beans, 397 00:24:24,840 --> 00:24:29,359 Speaker 1: and he recorded the results. Does not sound like it 398 00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:33,040 Speaker 1: would have been a pleasant place to be during this experiment, 399 00:24:33,720 --> 00:24:39,480 Speaker 1: seven men all eating nothing but baked me. Then he 400 00:24:39,560 --> 00:24:42,960 Speaker 1: had another test group of four. After that he ate 401 00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:46,120 Speaker 1: nothing but porridge for thirty days, and then he tested 402 00:24:46,240 --> 00:24:51,560 Speaker 1: various limited diets using two thousand hogs. Unlike humans, though, 403 00:24:51,680 --> 00:24:55,760 Speaker 1: he took the hog experiments to extremes, seeing what level 404 00:24:55,880 --> 00:25:02,119 Speaker 1: of malnourishment and subsequent diseases would result in their deaths. Somehow, 405 00:25:02,160 --> 00:25:05,000 Speaker 1: even though he was eating experimental diets that often gave 406 00:25:05,080 --> 00:25:08,480 Speaker 1: him terrible gas. Salsbury managed to get married to a 407 00:25:08,520 --> 00:25:12,320 Speaker 1: woman named Clara Brazzie in eighteen sixty. She was twenty 408 00:25:12,359 --> 00:25:15,720 Speaker 1: five at the time, and the couple had three children, Alice, Mary, 409 00:25:15,760 --> 00:25:18,840 Speaker 1: and Trafford. Although Alice did not live to adulthood, she 410 00:25:18,960 --> 00:25:22,200 Speaker 1: died at the age of five. When the US Civil 411 00:25:22,200 --> 00:25:26,160 Speaker 1: War began, Salisbury cared for Union soldiers and he continued 412 00:25:26,200 --> 00:25:29,720 Speaker 1: his testing. In most cases, he was dealing with soldiers 413 00:25:29,720 --> 00:25:33,200 Speaker 1: who weren't able to fight because of chronic intestinal issues 414 00:25:33,359 --> 00:25:36,679 Speaker 1: and diarrhea, so he started to develop a program that 415 00:25:36,720 --> 00:25:39,760 Speaker 1: seemed to work fairly well for them. He was actually 416 00:25:39,800 --> 00:25:42,480 Speaker 1: feeding them a very low fiber and high protein diet, 417 00:25:42,560 --> 00:25:46,240 Speaker 1: which does help slow people's digestion. He just didn't quite 418 00:25:46,280 --> 00:25:49,359 Speaker 1: realize that was the mechanism that was at play. We 419 00:25:49,400 --> 00:25:52,560 Speaker 1: will talk about his thoughts on an ideal diet in 420 00:25:52,600 --> 00:25:56,000 Speaker 1: just a moment. So after the Civil War ended, Salisbury 421 00:25:56,040 --> 00:25:59,320 Speaker 1: moved to Cleveland, Ohio, and there he founded the Charity 422 00:25:59,359 --> 00:26:03,440 Speaker 1: Hospital Metical College and was a lecturer there on numerous topics, 423 00:26:03,920 --> 00:26:07,399 Speaker 1: and he continued his research into diet, digestion, and health, 424 00:26:08,000 --> 00:26:10,359 Speaker 1: and he was doing this work because he really felt 425 00:26:10,359 --> 00:26:13,320 Speaker 1: that if he could identify a dietary cause for the 426 00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:16,080 Speaker 1: various diseases he was studying, that he could work out 427 00:26:16,080 --> 00:26:19,480 Speaker 1: a dietary cure as well. And it took him a 428 00:26:19,520 --> 00:26:22,000 Speaker 1: long time to feel that he had enough data to 429 00:26:22,040 --> 00:26:25,960 Speaker 1: publish almost three decades and the resulting book of the 430 00:26:26,080 --> 00:26:31,320 Speaker 1: Relation of Alimentation and Disease, released in has essentially the 431 00:26:31,440 --> 00:26:35,720 Speaker 1: same diet for treating most ailments. That is, red meat, 432 00:26:36,040 --> 00:26:39,000 Speaker 1: as in, we should be eating a lot of it, 433 00:26:39,200 --> 00:26:43,600 Speaker 1: and in a specific preparation which Salisbury called muscle pulp 434 00:26:43,760 --> 00:26:47,679 Speaker 1: of beef. Salisbury had come to the conclusion that toxins 435 00:26:47,680 --> 00:26:50,560 Speaker 1: that the human body produced while trying to digest vegetables 436 00:26:51,080 --> 00:26:53,920 Speaker 1: were the cause of many many diseases, ranging from heart 437 00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:59,120 Speaker 1: disease to mental illness. His basic description of meat as 438 00:26:59,160 --> 00:27:02,720 Speaker 1: a health food is lengthy but also very detailed, So 439 00:27:02,760 --> 00:27:05,879 Speaker 1: we're going to read the whole thing. It goes like 440 00:27:05,960 --> 00:27:09,840 Speaker 1: this quote, eat the muscle pulp of lean beef made 441 00:27:09,840 --> 00:27:13,280 Speaker 1: into cakes and broiled. This pulp should be as free 442 00:27:13,280 --> 00:27:17,160 Speaker 1: as possible from connective glue or tissue fat and cartilage. 443 00:27:17,560 --> 00:27:22,040 Speaker 1: The American chopper answers very well for separating the connective tissue, 444 00:27:22,119 --> 00:27:24,919 Speaker 1: this being driven down in front of the knife to 445 00:27:24,920 --> 00:27:28,359 Speaker 1: the bottom of the board. In chopping, the beef should 446 00:27:28,400 --> 00:27:31,480 Speaker 1: not be stirred up in the chopper, but the muscle 447 00:27:31,520 --> 00:27:34,560 Speaker 1: pulp should be scraped off with a spoon at intervals 448 00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:37,960 Speaker 1: during the chopping. At the end of the chopping, the 449 00:27:38,040 --> 00:27:41,320 Speaker 1: fibrous tissue of the meat, the portion which makes up 450 00:27:41,359 --> 00:27:45,760 Speaker 1: fibrous gross all lies on the bottom board of the chopper. 451 00:27:46,240 --> 00:27:50,320 Speaker 1: This may be utilized as soup meat for well people. 452 00:27:51,280 --> 00:27:55,600 Speaker 1: Previous to chopping, the fat, bones, tendons, and fascis should 453 00:27:55,680 --> 00:27:58,600 Speaker 1: all be cut away, and the lean muscle cut up 454 00:27:58,640 --> 00:28:02,080 Speaker 1: in pieces and enter two square steaks cut through the 455 00:28:02,119 --> 00:28:04,359 Speaker 1: center of the round or the richest and best For 456 00:28:04,440 --> 00:28:08,840 Speaker 1: this purpose, beef should be procured from well fatted animals 457 00:28:08,920 --> 00:28:12,399 Speaker 1: that are from four to six years old. The pulp 458 00:28:12,480 --> 00:28:15,720 Speaker 1: should not be pressed too firmly together before broiling or 459 00:28:15,760 --> 00:28:19,840 Speaker 1: it will taste livery. Simply press it sufficiently to hold 460 00:28:19,880 --> 00:28:22,960 Speaker 1: it together. Make the cakes from half an inch two 461 00:28:22,960 --> 00:28:27,359 Speaker 1: an inch thick. Broil slowly and moderately well over a fire, 462 00:28:27,560 --> 00:28:31,199 Speaker 1: free from blaze and smoke. When cooked, put it on 463 00:28:31,240 --> 00:28:34,199 Speaker 1: a hot plate and season to taste with butter, pepper, 464 00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:39,600 Speaker 1: and salt. Use either worcestershire or halford sauce, mustard, horseradish, 465 00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:43,480 Speaker 1: or lemon juice on the meat. If desired, celery may 466 00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:47,040 Speaker 1: be moderately used as a relish. No other meat should 467 00:28:47,080 --> 00:28:51,240 Speaker 1: be allowed until the stomach becomes clean, the urine uniformly 468 00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:55,280 Speaker 1: clear and free standing at a density of from one 469 00:28:55,360 --> 00:29:00,720 Speaker 1: point zero one five to one point zero to zero. 470 00:29:01,200 --> 00:29:04,440 Speaker 1: Very detailed, so a quick note there. The American chopper 471 00:29:04,520 --> 00:29:07,200 Speaker 1: that he refers to is a device that was essentially 472 00:29:07,560 --> 00:29:10,920 Speaker 1: a hand cranked meat grinder for home use. There were 473 00:29:10,960 --> 00:29:13,200 Speaker 1: a few different versions of these, but most could be 474 00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:16,560 Speaker 1: affixed to a countertop with a clamp that was part 475 00:29:16,560 --> 00:29:17,920 Speaker 1: of it. It was kind of like a built in 476 00:29:18,000 --> 00:29:20,920 Speaker 1: sea clamp. And then you dropped meat into the cup 477 00:29:20,960 --> 00:29:23,479 Speaker 1: shaped top of the grinder and turned the crank and 478 00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:25,560 Speaker 1: the meat went through this grinder and then came out 479 00:29:25,560 --> 00:29:28,000 Speaker 1: the side where you would have a receptacle like a 480 00:29:28,040 --> 00:29:31,120 Speaker 1: bowl waiting to catch it. If you want a visual 481 00:29:31,200 --> 00:29:33,640 Speaker 1: of what this is. One of the most popular models 482 00:29:33,680 --> 00:29:36,160 Speaker 1: came out actually a few years after Salisbury's book. It 483 00:29:36,240 --> 00:29:39,920 Speaker 1: was called the Universal Food Chopper. An image search with 484 00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:42,680 Speaker 1: that phrase will pop plenty of pictures right up for you. 485 00:29:43,120 --> 00:29:45,920 Speaker 1: There were variations on the diet depending on the illness 486 00:29:46,040 --> 00:29:50,000 Speaker 1: being treated, and Salisbury didn't expect people to only live 487 00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:53,920 Speaker 1: on beef with a celery garnished forever. For a consumption, 488 00:29:54,200 --> 00:29:57,000 Speaker 1: he allowed for bread, but meals should be one part 489 00:29:57,080 --> 00:30:00,520 Speaker 1: bread to every four to six parts beef. No fruits 490 00:30:00,600 --> 00:30:05,360 Speaker 1: or vegetables, no beans, no sweets, no vinegar. For diabetes, 491 00:30:05,520 --> 00:30:08,760 Speaker 1: Salisbury recommended meat only for five to six weeks, then 492 00:30:08,760 --> 00:30:11,960 Speaker 1: the patient was allowed one mouthful of bread at each meal, 493 00:30:12,160 --> 00:30:16,600 Speaker 1: slowly increasing over time, if and only if they're urine 494 00:30:16,600 --> 00:30:20,960 Speaker 1: state out of specific density. For patients with uterine fibroids 495 00:30:21,080 --> 00:30:25,120 Speaker 1: or ovarian tumors, all meat until the tumors shrank away, 496 00:30:25,160 --> 00:30:29,280 Speaker 1: and then some bread and other meats, then slowly other foods. 497 00:30:30,160 --> 00:30:34,320 Speaker 1: He estimated the process to quote remove fibrous diseases thoroughly 498 00:30:34,560 --> 00:30:38,040 Speaker 1: would take one to three years of this diet. Treating 499 00:30:38,080 --> 00:30:41,520 Speaker 1: other ailments involved a very similar degree of limited diet, 500 00:30:42,280 --> 00:30:45,440 Speaker 1: and when Salisbury's book came out, it was very popular. 501 00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:48,480 Speaker 1: So many people started trying his meat pulp diet that 502 00:30:48,520 --> 00:30:52,000 Speaker 1: it is often called the first diet craze. So if 503 00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:54,240 Speaker 1: you think diets like ultra low carb be eating or 504 00:30:54,320 --> 00:30:58,880 Speaker 1: new not even close. Even before the Relation of Alimentation 505 00:30:58,920 --> 00:31:03,120 Speaker 1: and diseases was published, the doctor's quote meat pulp was 506 00:31:03,240 --> 00:31:06,160 Speaker 1: known among other physicians, and it was already being called 507 00:31:06,560 --> 00:31:10,960 Speaker 1: Salisbury steak. An article that was syndicated across the US 508 00:31:11,040 --> 00:31:14,200 Speaker 1: in March of eighteen eighty five. Read quote Salisbury steak 509 00:31:14,240 --> 00:31:17,440 Speaker 1: appears to be giving remarkably good results as a diet 510 00:31:17,600 --> 00:31:21,800 Speaker 1: for people troubled with weak or disordered digestion but who 511 00:31:21,840 --> 00:31:26,160 Speaker 1: require the supporting power of animal food. The write up 512 00:31:26,200 --> 00:31:29,240 Speaker 1: goes on to describe the preparation method, but it doesn't 513 00:31:29,360 --> 00:31:34,120 Speaker 1: mention James Salisbury. Instead, it references Dr Hepburn of Philadelphia, 514 00:31:34,400 --> 00:31:37,920 Speaker 1: who described to a reporter how to prepare it. An 515 00:31:38,000 --> 00:31:40,800 Speaker 1: article in the New York Medical Times the following year, 516 00:31:40,840 --> 00:31:44,440 Speaker 1: which was still two years before Salisbury's book, states quote, 517 00:31:44,880 --> 00:31:47,440 Speaker 1: A little salt and pepper and a small amount of 518 00:31:47,480 --> 00:31:52,280 Speaker 1: butter added make a knot at all unpalatable dish, and 519 00:31:52,440 --> 00:31:55,280 Speaker 1: one which contains all the strength of the beef, with 520 00:31:55,320 --> 00:32:00,280 Speaker 1: the tough indigestible portion entirely separated. This diet is used 521 00:32:00,320 --> 00:32:05,160 Speaker 1: exclusively in chronic cases by physicians professing to treat according 522 00:32:05,200 --> 00:32:08,680 Speaker 1: to the Salisbury method. They used but few drugs and 523 00:32:08,720 --> 00:32:12,520 Speaker 1: what they use are mainly tonics. So Salisbury had fans 524 00:32:12,520 --> 00:32:15,520 Speaker 1: in the medical community before the public at large had 525 00:32:15,600 --> 00:32:19,480 Speaker 1: access to this complete method that he described in the book. 526 00:32:20,160 --> 00:32:23,640 Speaker 1: The Salisbury diet gained even wider recognition when a woman 527 00:32:23,720 --> 00:32:26,840 Speaker 1: named Elma Stewart wrote of its many virtues in her 528 00:32:26,920 --> 00:32:29,720 Speaker 1: book What Must I Do to Get Well? And How 529 00:32:29,760 --> 00:32:32,800 Speaker 1: Can I Keep So? She wrote that ten years after 530 00:32:32,840 --> 00:32:36,040 Speaker 1: the relation of alimentation and disease, and she claimed that 531 00:32:36,080 --> 00:32:39,240 Speaker 1: Salisbury's diet of minced beef patties and hot water had 532 00:32:39,280 --> 00:32:42,480 Speaker 1: cured her of disease, and her endorsement had made the 533 00:32:42,520 --> 00:32:45,920 Speaker 1: diet even more popular for a while, until it kind 534 00:32:45,960 --> 00:32:48,600 Speaker 1: of fizzled out as a fad as people realize that 535 00:32:48,640 --> 00:32:51,760 Speaker 1: it was not enjoyable or often feasible to eat one 536 00:32:51,840 --> 00:32:56,960 Speaker 1: thing forever. Throughout his professional life, Salisbury was actively engaged 537 00:32:57,000 --> 00:33:00,800 Speaker 1: with his colleagues in the medical community and it into teaching. 538 00:33:00,840 --> 00:33:04,320 Speaker 1: He was president of the Institute of Microbiology and was 539 00:33:04,360 --> 00:33:08,120 Speaker 1: a member of many scientific societies. After the publication of 540 00:33:08,200 --> 00:33:11,440 Speaker 1: his book, he lived for another seventeen years and died 541 00:33:11,480 --> 00:33:14,280 Speaker 1: on September twenty three, nineteen o five, at the age 542 00:33:14,320 --> 00:33:18,480 Speaker 1: of eighty two. His wife, Clara died six weeks later 543 00:33:18,560 --> 00:33:23,320 Speaker 1: on November two. Eponymous foods Now, we know it's not 544 00:33:23,440 --> 00:33:27,920 Speaker 1: a duke of Salsburry. So UM. Sometimes we get we 545 00:33:27,960 --> 00:33:31,520 Speaker 1: get emails from folks who say, I am trying to 546 00:33:31,520 --> 00:33:34,479 Speaker 1: find your episode on X, and I cannot find it 547 00:33:34,520 --> 00:33:38,960 Speaker 1: anywhere and we have no episode on X. The person 548 00:33:39,040 --> 00:33:42,040 Speaker 1: has confused us with another podcast they also listened to. 549 00:33:43,040 --> 00:33:45,840 Speaker 1: So when I was reading this outline, I was like, 550 00:33:46,840 --> 00:33:51,200 Speaker 1: maintenance Phase just talked about this guy. In fact, the 551 00:33:51,280 --> 00:33:55,200 Speaker 1: podcast saw Bones, a totally different show with a totally 552 00:33:55,240 --> 00:33:59,520 Speaker 1: different pair of posts and approach talked about this not recently, 553 00:33:59,800 --> 00:34:07,280 Speaker 1: but in something like UM, I had no idea, yeah, 554 00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:11,279 Speaker 1: and that that was when I learned, um that there 555 00:34:11,280 --> 00:34:17,480 Speaker 1: there was not a dish unique to a place called Salisbury. Um. 556 00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:21,000 Speaker 1: Do you have some listener mail before we close out today? 557 00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:24,759 Speaker 1: I do. This is from our listener Christine, who wrote 558 00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:29,239 Speaker 1: us about Wigia boards and dowsing. Uh. Christine writes, I've 559 00:34:29,239 --> 00:34:31,160 Speaker 1: listened to y'all for years and sent you a couple 560 00:34:31,160 --> 00:34:33,840 Speaker 1: of animal photos during quarantine since I finally had some 561 00:34:33,920 --> 00:34:36,600 Speaker 1: extra time to do all the things I'd been meaning 562 00:34:36,640 --> 00:34:39,560 Speaker 1: to do. After listening to your Wigia boards episode, I 563 00:34:39,560 --> 00:34:43,640 Speaker 1: actually have some possibly intelligent related comments and questions in 564 00:34:43,760 --> 00:34:46,840 Speaker 1: your research on wigia history and dividing boards in general. 565 00:34:46,960 --> 00:34:49,799 Speaker 1: Did you happen to find many mentions or crossover with 566 00:34:49,920 --> 00:34:53,640 Speaker 1: the practice of dowsing finding underground water with sticks traditionally. 567 00:34:54,239 --> 00:34:56,680 Speaker 1: I moved from l A to rural Vermont right before 568 00:34:56,719 --> 00:34:59,319 Speaker 1: the pandemic started and somehow ended up working at the 569 00:34:59,320 --> 00:35:03,360 Speaker 1: Americans Idea of Dowser's Headquarters, which has been in Danville, 570 00:35:03,440 --> 00:35:06,600 Speaker 1: Vermont since nineteen sixty one. Although I had heard of 571 00:35:06,640 --> 00:35:10,120 Speaker 1: dowsing mentioned in historical homesteading context, I had no idea 572 00:35:10,160 --> 00:35:12,880 Speaker 1: it was something that was still practiced enough to warrant 573 00:35:12,920 --> 00:35:16,399 Speaker 1: an entire society. In the two years I've been working here, 574 00:35:16,480 --> 00:35:18,680 Speaker 1: I have learned a lot about the practice and cultural 575 00:35:18,719 --> 00:35:21,640 Speaker 1: of dowsing, although I still have a lot of skepticism. 576 00:35:21,680 --> 00:35:24,080 Speaker 1: I am a very fact based person. So how I 577 00:35:24,200 --> 00:35:26,359 Speaker 1: ended up here listening to a woman tell me about 578 00:35:26,400 --> 00:35:29,279 Speaker 1: how her ex husband is projecting his mind into the 579 00:35:29,320 --> 00:35:31,239 Speaker 1: body of a fly to spy on her at night. 580 00:35:31,280 --> 00:35:34,360 Speaker 1: I have no idea, but what I have learned about. 581 00:35:34,360 --> 00:35:36,759 Speaker 1: It seems to me to be very closely related to 582 00:35:36,760 --> 00:35:39,680 Speaker 1: the concept behind the act of using a weigia board. 583 00:35:40,440 --> 00:35:43,279 Speaker 1: In the traditional sense. Dowsing for water is based on 584 00:35:43,280 --> 00:35:46,920 Speaker 1: the concept that humans can sense water with their subconscious mind, 585 00:35:47,239 --> 00:35:49,600 Speaker 1: and micro movements in the hand caused the sticks to 586 00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:52,319 Speaker 1: move when you're over that water source. It seems an 587 00:35:52,320 --> 00:35:55,160 Speaker 1: awful lot like the unconscious micro movements that cause a 588 00:35:55,200 --> 00:35:58,880 Speaker 1: divining board plan chet to move. Yet dowser seemed to 589 00:35:58,880 --> 00:36:01,719 Speaker 1: really be disdainful to wear such a comparison. And while 590 00:36:02,120 --> 00:36:05,799 Speaker 1: tarot reraicky pendulum and board divining and even scrying are 591 00:36:05,880 --> 00:36:09,480 Speaker 1: also coming back into fashion, dowsing is almost never included 592 00:36:09,520 --> 00:36:12,560 Speaker 1: as a divining method. Maybe it's because dowsing is more 593 00:36:12,600 --> 00:36:17,719 Speaker 1: closely associated with old farmers and suspenders than sexy witches. Anyway, 594 00:36:17,719 --> 00:36:20,040 Speaker 1: all of that is to ask, have you found references 595 00:36:20,040 --> 00:36:23,040 Speaker 1: to dowsers in your research travels? While this big old 596 00:36:23,040 --> 00:36:25,799 Speaker 1: farmhouse is a treasure trove of the history of colonizer 597 00:36:25,840 --> 00:36:28,799 Speaker 1: dowsing in the region, the history beyond that seems to 598 00:36:28,800 --> 00:36:32,040 Speaker 1: be obscure. The president of the society actually asked me 599 00:36:32,080 --> 00:36:34,919 Speaker 1: the other day why it's called dowsing and the best 600 00:36:34,960 --> 00:36:37,120 Speaker 1: I can find is that it's also a nautical term 601 00:36:37,160 --> 00:36:39,640 Speaker 1: for towing something on a line, but it's more likely 602 00:36:39,680 --> 00:36:41,759 Speaker 1: to be a corruption of a foreign word. However, I 603 00:36:41,800 --> 00:36:44,440 Speaker 1: still can't find anything about it. We do have some 604 00:36:44,560 --> 00:36:48,080 Speaker 1: reprints here of translated books printed in the seventeen hundreds 605 00:36:48,120 --> 00:36:51,200 Speaker 1: in Europe about the practice, but it's not well recorded 606 00:36:51,239 --> 00:36:54,479 Speaker 1: and is mostly apocryphal. Any who just thought i'd ask, 607 00:36:54,600 --> 00:36:57,239 Speaker 1: because I'm not really finding answers, and currently I am 608 00:36:57,280 --> 00:37:00,000 Speaker 1: the only employee in this big, spooky farmhouse and all 609 00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:01,640 Speaker 1: the members of the board of trustees are out of 610 00:37:01,680 --> 00:37:04,279 Speaker 1: state for a pet tax. Here are photos of some 611 00:37:04,360 --> 00:37:06,719 Speaker 1: of my current herd of seven cats, one dog, five 612 00:37:06,760 --> 00:37:09,759 Speaker 1: guinea pigs, three tar Angela's, and one grass fighter I 613 00:37:09,800 --> 00:37:12,680 Speaker 1: brought inside, who was apparently expecting because she made an 614 00:37:12,680 --> 00:37:14,640 Speaker 1: egg sack, and now I have twenty to thirty baby 615 00:37:14,640 --> 00:37:18,480 Speaker 1: grass fighters running around. Cats are Cowboy and Little Charlie. 616 00:37:18,520 --> 00:37:21,120 Speaker 1: Onions dog is Rico, pigs are Lenny and carl and 617 00:37:21,120 --> 00:37:25,320 Speaker 1: the tarantula is Professor Puppy Breath. Thank you for taking 618 00:37:25,320 --> 00:37:27,440 Speaker 1: the time to read my dissertation, and I hope you 619 00:37:27,480 --> 00:37:30,239 Speaker 1: and yours have a wonderful holiday season. Please let me 620 00:37:30,280 --> 00:37:33,480 Speaker 1: know if you would like some dowsing round recommendations. Um, okay, 621 00:37:33,520 --> 00:37:36,560 Speaker 1: these pet pictures. The dog is amazing, the guinea pigs amazing, 622 00:37:36,920 --> 00:37:39,319 Speaker 1: the cats are adorable. And I think I might be 623 00:37:39,360 --> 00:37:41,400 Speaker 1: the only person, but I love tarantulas and I think 624 00:37:41,440 --> 00:37:44,920 Speaker 1: they're very cute. So I really appreciated that as a 625 00:37:44,920 --> 00:37:48,279 Speaker 1: pet picture because no one sends those. Um, thank you 626 00:37:48,320 --> 00:37:50,480 Speaker 1: for taking in your spider and giving a home to 627 00:37:50,640 --> 00:37:54,560 Speaker 1: her babies. UM. Here's the thing with dowsing. I didn't 628 00:37:54,640 --> 00:37:58,480 Speaker 1: run up against it a lot, in part because I 629 00:37:58,520 --> 00:38:01,120 Speaker 1: was not looking for it right. Like when we're doing 630 00:38:01,160 --> 00:38:04,680 Speaker 1: research on anything that is related to many other things, 631 00:38:05,239 --> 00:38:07,160 Speaker 1: sometimes you come up next to a thing and you 632 00:38:07,280 --> 00:38:08,600 Speaker 1: kind of have to be like, that is not my 633 00:38:08,680 --> 00:38:11,040 Speaker 1: lane and put on a blinder to it. Um. So 634 00:38:11,080 --> 00:38:16,279 Speaker 1: if dowsing came up, I probably wasn't cognizantly engaging with it. 635 00:38:16,640 --> 00:38:19,080 Speaker 1: I do think you're onto something that people it's not 636 00:38:19,120 --> 00:38:25,000 Speaker 1: even that um, people associate it with farmers instead of witches. 637 00:38:25,440 --> 00:38:28,239 Speaker 1: But I do think you're onto something that people associate 638 00:38:28,280 --> 00:38:31,759 Speaker 1: it more with, like one of those skills that like 639 00:38:31,880 --> 00:38:35,880 Speaker 1: a person who works in agriculture needs it could develop 640 00:38:36,800 --> 00:38:39,719 Speaker 1: that is less about paranormalism and more about knowing the 641 00:38:39,800 --> 00:38:42,920 Speaker 1: environment really well, that's my guess, but I don't know. 642 00:38:43,640 --> 00:38:45,520 Speaker 1: All I hear is Tom Waits in my head going, 643 00:38:47,480 --> 00:38:52,360 Speaker 1: and that's all I get. Just think about Tom Waits. Um. 644 00:38:52,400 --> 00:38:54,919 Speaker 1: I mean, who doesn't want to do that? But yeah, 645 00:38:54,920 --> 00:38:58,799 Speaker 1: it's very interesting. I haven't really researched it. I don't 646 00:38:58,800 --> 00:39:01,879 Speaker 1: know if it would ever pop up it. I think 647 00:39:02,040 --> 00:39:04,120 Speaker 1: you might be the person to do that research because 648 00:39:04,120 --> 00:39:06,359 Speaker 1: you have probably access to things we would never even 649 00:39:06,560 --> 00:39:09,359 Speaker 1: be able to find, which is pretty cool. And I 650 00:39:09,400 --> 00:39:14,399 Speaker 1: love that there is a place that is devoted to it. Still, Um, yeah, 651 00:39:14,400 --> 00:39:15,759 Speaker 1: I will say in my head, I think if it 652 00:39:15,760 --> 00:39:18,919 Speaker 1: as something it has been characterized as kind of paranormal, 653 00:39:19,120 --> 00:39:21,600 Speaker 1: but I really do think of it as like a 654 00:39:21,640 --> 00:39:25,480 Speaker 1: little more scientific, which is maybe incorrect. But you know 655 00:39:25,600 --> 00:39:28,640 Speaker 1: the way that like a farmer's almanac can predict the 656 00:39:28,640 --> 00:39:31,440 Speaker 1: weather very very well. I think of it in that 657 00:39:31,560 --> 00:39:34,120 Speaker 1: same kind of thing, right, Like it's just it's it's 658 00:39:34,160 --> 00:39:37,960 Speaker 1: experiential knowledge that gets passed down and some people naturally 659 00:39:38,360 --> 00:39:42,760 Speaker 1: into it it better than others. But again just guessing, 660 00:39:43,040 --> 00:39:46,880 Speaker 1: just guessing. Um, he would like to write to us, 661 00:39:46,920 --> 00:39:49,680 Speaker 1: you can do so We're at History podcast at iHeart 662 00:39:49,719 --> 00:39:52,200 Speaker 1: radio dot com. You can also find us on social 663 00:39:52,200 --> 00:39:55,200 Speaker 1: media at missed in History and if you would like 664 00:39:55,239 --> 00:39:57,440 Speaker 1: to subscribe to the podcast and haven't gotten around to 665 00:39:57,480 --> 00:39:59,360 Speaker 1: it yet, now is the time. You can do that 666 00:39:59,400 --> 00:40:01,440 Speaker 1: on the i heart Dio app, or anywhere you listen 667 00:40:01,480 --> 00:40:09,320 Speaker 1: to your favorite podcasts. Stuff you Missed in History Class 668 00:40:09,360 --> 00:40:12,440 Speaker 1: is a production of I heart Radio. For more podcasts 669 00:40:12,480 --> 00:40:14,839 Speaker 1: from I heart Radio, visit the i heart radio app, 670 00:40:14,960 --> 00:40:18,120 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.