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Speaker 1: Hello, Hello. This is Smart Talks with IBM, a podcast

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Speaker 1: from Pushkin Industries, I Heart Radio and IBM about what

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Speaker 1: it means to look at today's most challenging problems in

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Speaker 1: a new way. I'm Maltain Baba. In this episode, we're

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Speaker 1: going to dive into sustainability and specifically how customers and

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Speaker 1: businesses want to decrease their carbon footprint and verify that

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Speaker 1: their efforts are accurately calculated. I'll be digging into this

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Speaker 1: topic with Jason Kelly, General Manager IBM Strategic Partners. It's

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Speaker 1: the data that's in the system. It's the data that's

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Speaker 1: in our partner's capabilities such as SAP, that's from the

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Speaker 1: source all the way to consumption. And where there's more data,

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Speaker 1: which there always will be, there's more insight and there's

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Speaker 1: more progress. You may remember Jason Kelly from his conversations

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Speaker 1: with Nathan Strickland of Tech Stuff in earlier episodes of

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Speaker 1: Smart Talks. Jason is working closely with IBM partners like

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Speaker 1: SAP to think of creative solutions for businesses to measure

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Speaker 1: and offset their environmental impact. I will also be speaking

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Speaker 1: with Mark Rolfe, Senior Vice president, head of Strategic partners

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Speaker 1: partner ecosystem success at SAP people who are making progress

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Speaker 1: from a manufacturing perspective, and our applications and services from

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Speaker 1: from SAP and IBM help make that much more transparent.

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Speaker 1: Prior to his current role, Mark served as global vice

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Speaker 1: president responsible for ecosystem Innovation and once worked as the

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Speaker 1: global account director for IBM. Together, we'll discuss the ways

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Speaker 1: businesses can work together and use technology like blockchain to

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Speaker 1: create more sustainable operations with more certainty about their actual

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Speaker 1: impact and footprint. That's you mentioned your partnership. I'm an

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Speaker 1: outsider to your world. Naively, I would have thought, aren't

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Speaker 1: you guys competitors? Why? What what's going on here? That

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Speaker 1: I would have thought that you two would be at

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Speaker 1: each other's throats, and instead you're you're talking, You're like

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Speaker 1: your old friends. Can you talk a little bit about

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Speaker 1: the role of these kinds of strategic partnerships. So there's

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Speaker 1: a long heritage share of collaboration between the two companies.

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Speaker 1: But but to your question, I think, you know, I

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Speaker 1: think what the realization, at least in our industry is.

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Speaker 1: You know, there's the the the amount of collaboration that

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Speaker 1: needs to exist today. Everyone cannot do everything and you

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Speaker 1: need to focus UM and so s a P. You know,

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Speaker 1: just taking an example of IBM and s a P

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Speaker 1: the collaboration of the biggest part of the collaboration from

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Speaker 1: my perspective is having the ability to run our platform

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Speaker 1: and our application and for specific industries. Like we've been

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Speaker 1: talking about, STEP has a very good technology basis UM

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Speaker 1: for for many industries of our twenty seven industries. But

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Speaker 1: the special sauce comes in from companies like IBM that

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Speaker 1: have the expertise from their services divisions around enhancing and

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Speaker 1: invested class implementations of our technology in those industries. So

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Speaker 1: bringing that know how, bringing that subject matter of expertise

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Speaker 1: and making it very relevant from an industry perspective, and

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Speaker 1: building on top of SAP platforms with that that expertise,

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Speaker 1: it's a it's a huge piece of our business. We

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Speaker 1: will never invest in that type of expertise. We rely

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Speaker 1: on our ecosystem and in this example, IBM and and

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Speaker 1: that's been the basis of of of the success we've

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Speaker 1: had it well over fifty years now between the two organizations.

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Speaker 1: What is that that collaboration look like. I mean, is

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Speaker 1: there literally an office from both organizations where people go

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Speaker 1: together and like we were talking about utilities, are is

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Speaker 1: there a team made up of people from both organizations

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Speaker 1: that are traveling together to see the customer answers. Yes,

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Speaker 1: think of a couple of clients IBM and s a

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Speaker 1: P sitting down around the table actively seeing how do

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Speaker 1: we work with where you are to get to where

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Speaker 1: you want to be and what are the best and

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Speaker 1: best prioritized steps you can take to get there. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I think that the best way to explain at Malcolm

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Speaker 1: is that you know, we have teams that come together

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Speaker 1: and and look at what the market really needs, what

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Speaker 1: our customers really asking for, and actually working together between

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Speaker 1: IBM and s a P with customers to build solutions

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Speaker 1: number one and then take them to market and go

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Speaker 1: talk to the the larger set of customers in a

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Speaker 1: particular industry or a particular region together. So we actually

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Speaker 1: looked at the whole life cycle between how we innovate

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Speaker 1: together and build new solutions with input from actual customers

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Speaker 1: all the way through to scaling that in in in

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Speaker 1: a global fashion. So it is a very collaborative setting

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Speaker 1: that that we really have and I think that's part

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Speaker 1: of what you know from a technology perspective, Many technology

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Speaker 1: companies are really understand that the ecosystem is the real

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Speaker 1: power out there, you know, working with partners, working and

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Speaker 1: collaborating together to to really advanced goals, whether sustainability or

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Speaker 1: other initiatives. Yeah, Jason, can you talk about how many

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Speaker 1: partnerships in this in the sustainability world does IBM have.

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Speaker 1: So we look across ours, we have up to uh

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Speaker 1: twelve active partnerships across our strategic partners but that would

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Speaker 1: be limiting just to look at our largest clients because

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Speaker 1: within those there are other ecosystem players specific to where

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Speaker 1: they are in the geography and by industry, and so

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Speaker 1: we're only limited to the extent that we can be

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Speaker 1: inclusive to that that that number of players in that ecosystem.

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Speaker 1: So that's why it does demand an open type of

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Speaker 1: platform that allows these players to come together, because you

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Speaker 1: can't do it on one type of technology, you can't

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Speaker 1: do it in one cloud. And this is where you

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Speaker 1: know your your question about don't you compete, It's like, well,

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Speaker 1: of course we do in times, there's things that we

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Speaker 1: that but the opportunity for the tides to rise all

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Speaker 1: boats is bigger than us fighting in what would be

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Speaker 1: perceived as a zero sum game, because it's not. In fact,

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Speaker 1: the the the challenges now, Malcolm are so complex that

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Speaker 1: one company by itself can't solve that problem. So when

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Speaker 1: you hear say, you know, yes, sustainability as a team sport,

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Speaker 1: it's not just because it's a cool way to say it.

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Speaker 1: It's the truth. It requires all of us. We wanted

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Speaker 1: to talk to me about sustainability and I you know,

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Speaker 1: it's a word that gets banded about a lot, and

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Speaker 1: I wanted to start with the two of you telling

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Speaker 1: me what is your definition of that word. I'll jump

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Speaker 1: right in. And when I think of sustainability, I believe

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Speaker 1: that is real trust, in transparency, in making sure that

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Speaker 1: we as humans have a planet that's going to be

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Speaker 1: there now and in the future, by employing methods that

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Speaker 1: can be practiced by everyone in a way that is

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Speaker 1: self sustaining. When I think of sustainability, I think of,

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Speaker 1: you know, organizations trying to make a better place for

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Speaker 1: the for the future generations of our planet. What I

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Speaker 1: think about is how do we make it better now?

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Speaker 1: How do we start progressing towards a better planet and

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Speaker 1: making the world better. When I think of this, is

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Speaker 1: our naive question. But when I think of that word,

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Speaker 1: the first people who come to mind would be, you know, airlines, automakers,

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Speaker 1: people who have obvious large carbon footprints, who are making

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Speaker 1: things that are highly energy intensive that you know, you

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Speaker 1: could we could all give the reasons. Tell me why

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Speaker 1: tech companies such as yours also need to be as

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Speaker 1: mindful of that. Well, I'll tell you, Malcolm. Your question

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Speaker 1: started with you think of people, and then your example

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Speaker 1: went straight to airlines, and I think in there is

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Speaker 1: is part of what we see as important. Is it?

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Speaker 1: It's a B two P type of operation business to people,

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Speaker 1: where people all of us And so that's the first

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Speaker 1: thought as we were trying to make sure that we're

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Speaker 1: taking care of each other, and so if we think

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Speaker 1: of people being the center, you know, we formalized our

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Speaker 1: efforts at IBM in the seventies to say, look, we

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Speaker 1: want to be forward thinking and environmental management for decades

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Speaker 1: to come, and we have. And that's where we see

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Speaker 1: the commitment being made. Is it look if we can

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Speaker 1: do it together and not alone. And that's as I'm

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Speaker 1: here with Mark, I'm proud to say we see it

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Speaker 1: the same way with regards to an ecosystem, and it

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Speaker 1: takes all of us working together because sustainability is truly

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Speaker 1: a team sport. I think what we see from s

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Speaker 1: a p from from our side, we we we are

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Speaker 1: very focused on supporting transactions across most of you know,

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Speaker 1: the enterprise business in the world. Of the world's transactions

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Speaker 1: run through our systems. Those are transactions that support product,

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Speaker 1: the manufacturing of product, and the rollout of product. UM.

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Speaker 1: So if we think about it from that perspective, we're

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Speaker 1: we are very interested in making sure that those manufacturing practices,

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Speaker 1: the design practices around those products are efficient, are transparent,

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Speaker 1: and are ethically progressive in the way that these companies

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Speaker 1: are manufacturing or running their businesses. So so that from

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Speaker 1: our perspective, it does tie back to people. But we

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Speaker 1: take a step back and look at the products that

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Speaker 1: are being manufactured or the services being offered to people

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Speaker 1: and how we can be more transparent around that from

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Speaker 1: a sustainability perspective. Can you give you an example mark

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Speaker 1: of what you're talking about. Yeah, So, if we think

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Speaker 1: about a manufacturing floor UM and all of the data

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Speaker 1: that goes into designing a product, to actually building a

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Speaker 1: product and then actually distributing a product s AP systems

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Speaker 1: along with our partners like IBM, we put together applications

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Speaker 1: and overall systems that monitor that data that allows the

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Speaker 1: companies to build, manufacture, and distribute those systems. So we

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Speaker 1: have visibility into cow companies are actually distributing, manufacturing these products.

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Speaker 1: We can make that much more transparent. We can start

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Speaker 1: to measure the progress they're making against certain sustainability goals

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Speaker 1: and and start to to really drive a conversation around

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Speaker 1: sustainability around a product or a an area. So I

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Speaker 1: think that's key to what we see around whether it's

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Speaker 1: circular economy in terms of understanding green house effect on

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Speaker 1: manufacturing abilities of certain customers of ours, or if we

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Speaker 1: look at overall you know, carbon neutrality goals, etcetera. People

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Speaker 1: who are making progress from a manufacturing perspective, and our

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Speaker 1: applications and services from from SAP and IBM help make

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Speaker 1: that much more transparent. If I'm a a client, a

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Speaker 1: customer of yours, and I'm interested in addressing this issue,

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Speaker 1: one place I might look for guidance would be the

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Speaker 1: kind of data that would come from your software. Is

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Speaker 1: what you're saying, Yeah, if you if you think about

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Speaker 1: the overall like value chain of of what we deal

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Speaker 1: with in and from the customers. There's manufacturers, there's own consumers, etcetera.

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Speaker 1: Where along that value chain can we impact you know,

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Speaker 1: sustainable goals and drive towards more transparencies to improve upon those.

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Speaker 1: So that's really what we're we're looking at from our perspective. Jason,

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Speaker 1: can you talk a little bit about ibm S position

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Speaker 1: in all of this. When does IBM as a company's

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Speaker 1: are thinking seriously about this issue and how big of

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Speaker 1: a transition is it in the priorities of the company.

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Speaker 1: We've been doing this for decades with regards to making

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Speaker 1: sure that we're focused on the environment, the returns that

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Speaker 1: we get, our clients get, and working across that ecosystem.

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Speaker 1: As I said, we formalized in the saying, look, this

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Speaker 1: is a priority for our company, and we just announced

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Speaker 1: our latest commitment, which is that zero greenhouse gas emissions

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Speaker 1: by We did this just at the beginning of this year.

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Speaker 1: So that's the commitment that we've recently made. But you

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Speaker 1: called out something here that's key and Mark echoed it

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Speaker 1: as this thought of data. It's the data that's in

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Speaker 1: the system, It's the data that's in our partners capabilities

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Speaker 1: such as S a P that's from the source all

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Speaker 1: the way to consumption. And where there's more data, which

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Speaker 1: there always will be, there's more insight and there's more progress.

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Speaker 1: And if you think more data, more collaboration, there's even

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Speaker 1: more insight which gets faster progress. And so our position

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Speaker 1: in this is to say, look, can we create open

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Speaker 1: platforms of innovation because and I'll borrow from you, Malcolm,

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Speaker 1: that's where you know innovation comes in in desperate situations.

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Speaker 1: From the David and Goliathe example is that you're desperate,

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Speaker 1: so you reach out and you're saying, look, how can

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Speaker 1: I you know, find that that innovation? And it's through

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Speaker 1: this collaborative technology because also ultimately it is the consumer

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Speaker 1: that is asking for this. We know this because consumers

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Speaker 1: now you know other consumers were purpose driven before the

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Speaker 1: pandemic and now that's fifty and their purpose driven mean

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Speaker 1: companies with a purpose that are driving after things such

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Speaker 1: as sustainability. M HM. Can you talk a little bit

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Speaker 1: more on this in concrete terms? What does a focus

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Speaker 1: on sustainability mean for IBM. You've said it's not a

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Speaker 1: new focus, but is it fair to call it a

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Speaker 1: renewed focus. I would I would say that's fair, Malcolm,

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Speaker 1: and I would say that renewed focus in a new

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Speaker 1: era of capability. And so one place we're spending a

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Speaker 1: lot of time and effort, that's along with our partners

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Speaker 1: of the SAP and Microsoft and others, where we're saying,

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Speaker 1: let's invest in the World Business Council for Sustainable Development,

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Speaker 1: as they pulled together many of our partners, and those

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Speaker 1: are other other clients such is the Dolls, the Nestle

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Speaker 1: Shells of the of the world who are also raising

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Speaker 1: their hand in this renewed as you said, you know,

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Speaker 1: sense of sustainability. And what's really key now is, Okay,

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Speaker 1: if we're going to pay attention to carbon emissions and

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Speaker 1: carbon foot how do we document that, how do we

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Speaker 1: do that with trust and transparency in that ecosystem of

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Speaker 1: value chain? It's not just that linear supply chain, but

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Speaker 1: how do we account for all of that data in

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Speaker 1: that value chain? And so companies like the Shells and

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Speaker 1: and Exxons, the Dows, the b s S of the

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Speaker 1: world are saying, how do I account for that with

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Speaker 1: trust and transparency? And we're investing that with new technologies

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Speaker 1: that are on the edge, such as AI or even

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Speaker 1: blockchain that says, listen, how can I share data with trust?

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Speaker 1: And this is where it comes in. If you can't

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Speaker 1: trust the data, how can you make sure that we're

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Speaker 1: accounting for carbon credits? How do you know those are

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Speaker 1: real credits? How do you know those credits are accountable

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Speaker 1: for IBM or for SAP. So I'm an airline, I

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Speaker 1: want to buy carbon credits to upset my footprint UM,

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Speaker 1: and the question arises, how can I be sure that

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Speaker 1: I am accurately accounting for my own consumption? And i'm

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Speaker 1: and the marketplace is correctly measuring the UM? What the

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Speaker 1: offsite it looks like? How what, how it's priced, how

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Speaker 1: whatever it is. What you're saying is someone has to

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Speaker 1: do that kind of has to produce that data, verify

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Speaker 1: that data, um exchange that data. And that's what that's

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Speaker 1: what you guys are thinking about. Is that a fair

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Speaker 1: at summary? That's that's exactly That's exactly it. I think

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Speaker 1: that's a very important point. A lot of what what

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Speaker 1: I hear out in the marketplaces, it's about goals, right,

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Speaker 1: sustainability goals in the future. I think there's it needs

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Speaker 1: to be a kind of a shift in mentality that

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Speaker 1: we can do this now. We are doing this now,

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Speaker 1: we have applications that are you know, tracking this data.

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Speaker 1: You mentioned the airline industry. If you think about the

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Speaker 1: airline industry and the supplier side of that, or the

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Speaker 1: procurement side of that, companies need to start putting together

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Speaker 1: procurement goals related to stain sustainability and have applications and

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Speaker 1: systems that track progress against those procurement goals. They were

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Speaker 1: able to mod or measure that progress. So that's that's

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Speaker 1: happening today, and that will get much stronger, as Jason mentioned,

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Speaker 1: when when you bring in smart technologies like AI and

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Speaker 1: other technologies that will make that even more progressive. So

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Speaker 1: it's it is happening today. So I would say goals

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Speaker 1: are important, but we can actually start doing something today,

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Speaker 1: which I think is even more important. Can you give

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Speaker 1: me an example, concrete example. I'm interested instead of the

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Speaker 1: nuts and bolts, so this is actually kind of fascinating question.

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Speaker 1: Can you pick a kind of particularly either hard or

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Speaker 1: interesting case study and tell me about what are some

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Speaker 1: of the challenges from your end in providing this kind

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Speaker 1: of data, coming up with it, verifying it, providing it well,

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Speaker 1: I think from ourselves. Give one example, if you think

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Speaker 1: about a utility company and their legacy way of you know,

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Speaker 1: managing their suppliers versus where they need to be a

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Speaker 1: very very much a siloed view from from providing information

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Speaker 1: to it from suppliers, a closed system that does not

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Speaker 1: allow much transparency or even accuracy, and what they're able

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Speaker 1: to actually provide to measure a goal. There's nothing in

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Speaker 1: place that has done that before, right, so now we're

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Speaker 1: putting out applications that actually you know, take a look

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Speaker 1: at those suppliers, understand where things are coming from, have

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Speaker 1: they been ethically manufactured, you know, and be able to

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Speaker 1: again to trace that through the value chain that that

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Speaker 1: Jason and I have been talking about, and be able

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Speaker 1: to understand every step of the way and be able

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Speaker 1: to track that data and track that process throughout that

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Speaker 1: entire value chain. And I think that's something very concrete

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Speaker 1: especially and enables the purchasing teams um and the supplier

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Speaker 1: is quite honestly to improve on efficiency and visibility around

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Speaker 1: the procurement supply chain operations and serves the foundation for

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Speaker 1: those procurement goals. So kind of it's a new way

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Speaker 1: of driving transparency for these utility companies that have tons

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Speaker 1: of suppliers for their their manufacturing plans, for their their

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Speaker 1: energy plants, etcetera, and be able to report publicly that

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Speaker 1: that those are sustainable practices, that they're leveraging to improve

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Speaker 1: the overall operations, overall supply chain capabilities, etcetera. Against that,

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Speaker 1: that sounds like a really complex problem. Somebody's got a

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Speaker 1: power plant which might be fifty years old. I'm making

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Speaker 1: that up, but conceived of and built in an era

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Speaker 1: when we weren't thinking about computers on every in everyone's pocket.

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Speaker 1: You've got hundreds of thousands of customers you've got, I mean,

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Speaker 1: I don't even know what kind of on the other

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Speaker 1: end of it, the number of suppliers they're going to

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Speaker 1: have in every corner of the world. Someone who's been

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Speaker 1: an entire life trying to figure it out that problems

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Speaker 1: some have, Right, That's that's exactly it. That's the power

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Speaker 1: of what I think a technology company, application technology company,

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Speaker 1: an innovation company like SAP and IBM bring to the

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Speaker 1: table the expertise around an industry like utilities that an

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Speaker 1: IBM brings the table um. You know, it's something that

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Speaker 1: we are trying to reinvent business models based on new

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Speaker 1: technology and take those fifty year old plants, those fifty

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Speaker 1: year old systems and modernize them. And I think that

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Speaker 1: all starts with leveraging things that we didn't have and

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Speaker 1: and applying technology to that to have much more of

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Speaker 1: a transparent and and overall view of the data of

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Speaker 1: the systems, of how that thing is built of those parts.

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Speaker 1: And again that's what what companies like I V M,

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Speaker 1: S A P. And others are trying to do in

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Speaker 1: these in these very old industries that need to have

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Speaker 1: a reinvention. Yeah, and Malcolm, I was gonna hit on

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Speaker 1: your your example there, because you you ask for something concrete.

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Speaker 1: You know, there's cities upon cities. You can point at

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Speaker 1: US or international. You can look at the Chattanooga and

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Speaker 1: in the US dirtiest cities nineteen nine and then all

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Speaker 1: the way. You know, twenty years later it was a

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Speaker 1: cleanest city. Okay, so it can happen, but how does

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Speaker 1: it happen at scale? And we think concrete we give

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Speaker 1: one one one example. So we're starting to see the

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Speaker 1: other side of a pandemic. And here we had a

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Speaker 1: challenge across industries of just coming up with something we

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Speaker 1: can address it with a vaccine and trying to figure

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Speaker 1: out how could we how could we do it quicker, better,

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Speaker 1: faster in any way that we've ever done before. And

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Speaker 1: it took a lot of time and effort to sit

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Speaker 1: down and say with with the likes of fives are

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Speaker 1: along with SAP on the back end, by the way

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Speaker 1: working with IVY, and how do you how do you

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Speaker 1: change the way this is going to be developed and

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Speaker 1: pushed through the supply chain. We had the challenge of

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Speaker 1: then going through multiple levels of them. We'll stick with

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Speaker 1: the US federal, state, local governments to get dispersed, and

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Speaker 1: then we had the challenges saying who's tested and who's

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Speaker 1: received a shot? And how do you prove that you've

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Speaker 1: received a shot? In that example, I crossed industries, I've

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Speaker 1: crossed multiple lines of private public situations, and that was

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Speaker 1: to keep people alive. Now we're talking carbon credits. Does

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Speaker 1: anyone does anyone have a sense of urgency that they

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Speaker 1: would with a vaccine? Some do, some don't. But if

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Speaker 1: it's that challenging with a vaccine and a global pandemic,

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Speaker 1: how do we do it with something that's called sustainability? Well,

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Speaker 1: It starts with data. What are we seeing with the data?

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Speaker 1: Data tells us this, what do we address? We address

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Speaker 1: it with the carbon credits and carbon emissions and then

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Speaker 1: who's who's accountable for what based on trusted data. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: those two examples you're talking about one COVID vaccine, two utilities.

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Speaker 1: Utilities is harder problem from your end, Like you know,

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Speaker 1: it's not a technology forward industry. You've got state regulators

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Speaker 1: that's the dealing with. You've got fifty some different rate

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Speaker 1: depending on which state you and you have a whole

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Speaker 1: different maze you've got to work through. I mean with

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Speaker 1: the vaccine, you're talking about three multinational you know, twenty

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Speaker 1: one century companies using a brand new, the best platform

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Speaker 1: known demand versus seventy year old or whatever you know,

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Speaker 1: in fifty different states, chasing an elusive gold that they

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Speaker 1: may not even be on board on Bingo. Not only

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Speaker 1: is it behind the times in many cases and in

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Speaker 1: need of diversification as well as modernization, is it now

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Speaker 1: you have? You also have competing platforms saying how do

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Speaker 1: I leap frogs some things that are old or new?

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Speaker 1: And we're we're ready to celebrate a fifty year relationship

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Speaker 1: with SAP. Why it's because SAP continues to evolve, and

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Speaker 1: that's what in your example, Malcolm, you know, how else

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Speaker 1: to evolve and get to where you're going then with

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Speaker 1: with trusted partners, that and that this part now, I

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Speaker 1: do like it's a commercial, but I know that it

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Speaker 1: takes more than just the SAPs and ibm s. It

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Speaker 1: takes the others in the ecosystem to make that leap

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Speaker 1: frog from where they are to where they have to go.

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Speaker 1: And I think it's not just about the companies we're

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Speaker 1: talking about here, It's it's the technologies that are allowing

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Speaker 1: this and enabling this because you know, if you if

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Speaker 1: you really, I mean the pace of innovation that's happening

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Speaker 1: out of there with things like AI and machine learning

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Speaker 1: and all of that are enabling a lot of things

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Speaker 1: that that we couldn't do five years ago. So I

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Speaker 1: think I think that the technology piece of this, and

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Speaker 1: it's a much longer discussion, but you can't understate that

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Speaker 1: it's a huge enabler that wasn't there, you know, five

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Speaker 1: years ago, as I said, and just it's gonna continue

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Speaker 1: to increase the innovation pace here and unlock opportunities in

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Speaker 1: the very complex industries, like like you mentioned around utilities.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you're actually right, it's a tough one. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I wanted to talk a little bit about UM, blockchain

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Speaker 1: and AI, and it's rolled in all of this UM.

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Speaker 1: What do we what? What do those two particular technologies

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Speaker 1: bring to the table here? Blockchain the bottom line, it's

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Speaker 1: a trusted platform to share data amongst many players in

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Speaker 1: real time. That's it, share data in a trusted way.

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Speaker 1: And if you can do that in this this thought

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Speaker 1: of whose carbon credit is it and where does it

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Speaker 1: sit on the ledger of carbon credits? Now you can

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Speaker 1: do that. So that's it AI the insight. So we

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Speaker 1: started thinking about augmented intelligence or as some like to

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Speaker 1: call it, artificial intelligence. Now you can use that to

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Speaker 1: process and look at all of this data that we

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Speaker 1: couldn't before. It took a lot of time and effort,

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Speaker 1: so it was just too high or hurdle to jump over.

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Speaker 1: Not only that, but now we can sense and predict

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Speaker 1: ahead of time before something happens. So if you put

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Speaker 1: those two together, trusted data which is the fuel for

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Speaker 1: AI and doing it at scale, that's when you say, okay,

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Speaker 1: we are in a new place to play. And you

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Speaker 1: have someplace you can pull that data from. If you

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Speaker 1: could just have someone that was touching those those companies

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Speaker 1: from the source all the way to consumption. So it

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Speaker 1: sounds to be though that what you're saying is this

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Speaker 1: kind of thing you're envisioning now would have been all

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Speaker 1: but impossible, Uh five or six years ago. I mean

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Speaker 1: you're you're nodding, Mark, Yeah, No, that's what I mentioned before.

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00:26:29,520 --> 00:26:32,159
Speaker 1: I mean again, going back to the utilities industry, we

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00:26:32,359 --> 00:26:34,280
Speaker 1: couldn't do this five or six years ago. And I

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00:26:34,359 --> 00:26:37,480
Speaker 1: think that's why I think technology is enabler and things

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00:26:37,560 --> 00:26:41,160
Speaker 1: like blockchain, like AI, like machine learning, this is all

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Speaker 1: changing the landscape of they are of the possibility. If

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Speaker 1: we don't transform what we're doing by leveraging these technologies

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00:26:48,400 --> 00:26:51,680
Speaker 1: as enablers, we're not gonna make it. I mean so,

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Speaker 1: so I think that's the key thing here is that

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Speaker 1: And that's where I come from a technology background, where

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00:26:57,560 --> 00:27:00,760
Speaker 1: these things are real, they're happening now, they weren't here

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00:27:00,880 --> 00:27:03,600
Speaker 1: five years ago, and they are making a big difference.

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Speaker 1: So if we really want to accelerate this, we need

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Speaker 1: to go past the the vision of goals setting and

447
00:27:11,520 --> 00:27:13,639
Speaker 1: really start to implement and see change in some of

448
00:27:13,720 --> 00:27:16,479
Speaker 1: these things because it is possible today, and you're absolutely right,

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Speaker 1: it wasn't around five years ago. It wasn't possible five

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Speaker 1: years ago. And I just think in another five years,

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00:27:21,560 --> 00:27:23,719
Speaker 1: what is this really going to advance into? So I mean,

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Speaker 1: I think there's a huge opportunity here. Yeah, So looking

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Speaker 1: ahead five years, I give you a magic wand you

454
00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:33,560
Speaker 1: can change one thing to make your life easier. What

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Speaker 1: would it be. What's the biggest impediment that you could,

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Speaker 1: in a perfect world, would remove. I don't. I mean

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Speaker 1: I think from my respective and Jason love to hear

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Speaker 1: your side, I mean it's not the technology. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I think we know where the technology is going to

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Speaker 1: lead us. It's people. How can people open up and

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Speaker 1: be more open mind to think differently because even in

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Speaker 1: some of these industries, and again we talked a lot

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Speaker 1: about utilities, they're not thinking differently. They're just trying to

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Speaker 1: operate their busines. This isn't the way they have been

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Speaker 1: for for years. We need it's culture and it's people

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Speaker 1: to change. And I guess that brings us back to

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Speaker 1: the game of our conversation. This really is about people

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Speaker 1: and making sure that people changing the way people think

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Speaker 1: about these things and seeing the opportunity. And I would

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Speaker 1: agree it's the trust and culture change. It would be

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Speaker 1: like you trying to head out from where wherever you

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Speaker 1: are today, Malcolm and saying I'm going to get a

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Speaker 1: ride share, but you call a dispatcher. It's like, are

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00:28:30,640 --> 00:28:33,480
Speaker 1: you kidding me? You know you you don't use it,

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00:28:33,560 --> 00:28:36,600
Speaker 1: You just click on your phone. So it's changing the

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00:28:36,760 --> 00:28:41,720
Speaker 1: process and and and doing it with trust. Yeah. On

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Speaker 1: the flip side, what's been unexpectedly the easiest part of

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Speaker 1: this campaign, if you want to call it that is

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00:28:50,600 --> 00:28:56,920
Speaker 1: anything easy? Wow, that was a loaded question. The easiest.

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00:28:57,360 --> 00:29:02,080
Speaker 1: The easiest part is acknowledging that there's a challenge I think,

481
00:29:02,480 --> 00:29:06,160
Speaker 1: um in bringing together the different players that have to play.

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Speaker 1: I don't know for my and if it's if the

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00:29:09,080 --> 00:29:11,320
Speaker 1: easiest part, but the most exciting part is to see

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Speaker 1: the passion behind this. I mean, you know, at least

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Speaker 1: an organization I know and IBM because it's very very

486
00:29:16,920 --> 00:29:19,560
Speaker 1: similar in the way we think about this. There's so

487
00:29:19,680 --> 00:29:23,240
Speaker 1: much passion behind this, and people that understand what these

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00:29:23,400 --> 00:29:27,360
Speaker 1: technologies can do are are really pushing the envelope. So

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00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:30,560
Speaker 1: that I think that's you you don't have to convince

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Speaker 1: anything that anybody's the right thing to do. They see

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Speaker 1: that they are of the possibility, and I think that's

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Speaker 1: that's a very strong opportunity. Well, thank you so much.

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Speaker 1: This has been like so many of these conversations I've

494
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Speaker 1: had with IBM and IBM and friends, which is basically

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00:29:44,880 --> 00:29:48,440
Speaker 1: what this has been. This has been fascinating and um

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Speaker 1: and I really thank you for your time. All right, Well,

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00:29:51,240 --> 00:29:54,560
Speaker 1: thanks a lout Malcolm and and always Mark, thank you both.

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Speaker 1: It was a great conversation. I really appreciate it. Thank you.

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Speaker 1: Thank you again, did Auson, Kelly and Mark Rolfe for

500
00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:04,840
Speaker 1: joining me. It feels promising to hear about these efforts

501
00:30:04,920 --> 00:30:08,560
Speaker 1: from IBM and s A P and how these partnerships

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00:30:08,960 --> 00:30:15,720
Speaker 1: create a larger industry shift towards sustainability. Smart Talks with

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Speaker 1: IBM is produced by Emily ross Dak with Carly Migliore

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00:30:19,440 --> 00:30:24,280
Speaker 1: and Katherine Gurrodo, Edited by Karen Shakerge, mixed and mastered

505
00:30:24,320 --> 00:30:29,680
Speaker 1: by Jason Gambrel. Music by Granmascope. Special thanks to Molly Sosha,

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00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:33,000
Speaker 1: Andy Kelly Meal, La Belle, Jacob Weisberg, had a fane,

507
00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:36,680
Speaker 1: Eric Sandler Maggie Taylor and the teams at eight Bar

508
00:30:37,160 --> 00:30:40,560
Speaker 1: and IBM. Smart Talks with IBM is a production of

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00:30:40,640 --> 00:30:45,000
Speaker 1: Pushkin Industries and I Heart Radio. This is a paid

510
00:30:45,120 --> 00:30:51,320
Speaker 1: advertisement from IBM. You can find more episodes at IBM

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00:30:51,400 --> 00:30:57,680
Speaker 1: dot com slash smart Talks. You'll find more Pushkin podcasts

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00:30:57,920 --> 00:31:01,080
Speaker 1: on the iHeart Radio app, Apple pod guests, or wherever

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00:31:01,200 --> 00:31:05,200
Speaker 1: you like to listen. I'm Malcolm Bladwell, See you next time.

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Speaker 1: M