WEBVTT - The Gray Whale, Part 1

0:00:02.960 --> 0:00:06.040
<v Speaker 1>Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind production of iHeartRadio.

0:00:12.800 --> 0:00:15.080
<v Speaker 1>Hey you welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. My

0:00:15.160 --> 0:00:18.320
<v Speaker 1>name is Robert Lamb and Joe McCormick. This episode of

0:00:18.360 --> 0:00:20.160
<v Speaker 1>Stuff to Blow Your Mind, and I suppose the next

0:00:20.160 --> 0:00:23.080
<v Speaker 1>one as well will be dealing with gray whales. This

0:00:23.120 --> 0:00:26.040
<v Speaker 1>is a topic that I was inspired to cover because

0:00:26.079 --> 0:00:28.080
<v Speaker 1>my family was fortunate enough to get to go on

0:00:28.120 --> 0:00:32.080
<v Speaker 1>a trip to Mexico, to the Mexican state of Baja California,

0:00:32.159 --> 0:00:37.479
<v Speaker 1>sir to one of the breeding lagoons that the gray

0:00:37.520 --> 0:00:43.479
<v Speaker 1>whales migrate too every year. Specifically, we went to Ojo

0:00:43.720 --> 0:00:47.279
<v Speaker 1>Delia Bray Lagoon. That means I of the hair due

0:00:47.320 --> 0:00:50.479
<v Speaker 1>to the way it's it's shaped. And yeah, I got

0:00:50.560 --> 0:00:55.560
<v Speaker 1>to see these magnificent animals close up, got to observe

0:00:55.600 --> 0:00:57.840
<v Speaker 1>them for a couple of days. It was. It was

0:00:57.880 --> 0:01:03.520
<v Speaker 1>absolutely fantastic and certainly ignited my curiosity about these creatures.

0:01:03.960 --> 0:01:06.240
<v Speaker 1>I didn't get to see your photos because I'm not

0:01:06.280 --> 0:01:10.160
<v Speaker 1>on the gram, but Rachel was raving about them to me. Yeah,

0:01:10.200 --> 0:01:12.560
<v Speaker 1>I'll once this episode comes out off to share some

0:01:12.959 --> 0:01:16.520
<v Speaker 1>maybe in the discussion module the Facebook group or our

0:01:16.560 --> 0:01:18.399
<v Speaker 1>discord for the show, and if you don't have access

0:01:18.440 --> 0:01:21.360
<v Speaker 1>to those. Just email us and and well we'll hook

0:01:21.360 --> 0:01:24.000
<v Speaker 1>you up. But yeah, a lot. I got some great footage,

0:01:24.000 --> 0:01:26.720
<v Speaker 1>my wife got some great footage, and and more than anything,

0:01:26.760 --> 0:01:30.280
<v Speaker 1>we just got to take in this amazing location, this

0:01:30.400 --> 0:01:36.240
<v Speaker 1>amazing landscape, and these amazing animals. So this lagoon is

0:01:36.280 --> 0:01:38.560
<v Speaker 1>one of their calving grounds and you were out in

0:01:38.840 --> 0:01:43.200
<v Speaker 1>boats getting to observe them right up close right. Yeah,

0:01:43.200 --> 0:01:46.920
<v Speaker 1>this um, this is one of several different lagoons where

0:01:47.600 --> 0:01:50.520
<v Speaker 1>where where this particular population goes to. When we were

0:01:50.600 --> 0:01:54.040
<v Speaker 1>visiting there, there were hundreds of whales present in this lagoon.

0:01:54.040 --> 0:01:58.480
<v Speaker 1>It's a pretty vast lagoon. Um, it's surrounded on all

0:01:58.480 --> 0:02:01.640
<v Speaker 1>sides with this kind of desolate and haunting landscape that's

0:02:01.680 --> 0:02:05.320
<v Speaker 1>full of like salt, sand and bramble. I mean, it's there.

0:02:06.000 --> 0:02:09.560
<v Speaker 1>There are organisms they're either coyotes around and and other creatures,

0:02:09.600 --> 0:02:13.000
<v Speaker 1>but it's um, it's it's a unique landscape. Like just

0:02:13.040 --> 0:02:17.640
<v Speaker 1>flying into Guerrera Negro, the nearest town, was was really

0:02:17.720 --> 0:02:22.919
<v Speaker 1>breathtaking just because the landscape is so beautiful. But the

0:02:23.120 --> 0:02:24.960
<v Speaker 1>first morning we went out on these boats, they were

0:02:24.960 --> 0:02:28.880
<v Speaker 1>also these intense photam organa mirages on the horizon that

0:02:29.000 --> 0:02:32.320
<v Speaker 1>really added to the surreal feel of the place. What

0:02:32.360 --> 0:02:34.799
<v Speaker 1>were they like images out they look like mountains or

0:02:34.840 --> 0:02:38.359
<v Speaker 1>they were the surrounding um mountain, like some of the

0:02:38.960 --> 0:02:41.680
<v Speaker 1>peaks that were visible on the and also some of

0:02:41.720 --> 0:02:45.560
<v Speaker 1>the dunes, so like dunes and peaks. So yeah, it

0:02:45.600 --> 0:02:48.959
<v Speaker 1>was and it looked like floating islands on the horizon. Wow.

0:02:49.360 --> 0:02:51.000
<v Speaker 1>And then of course closer in you have all of

0:02:51.000 --> 0:02:56.440
<v Speaker 1>these breaching whales and spy hopping whales and it's it's amazing. Now.

0:02:56.480 --> 0:02:59.360
<v Speaker 1>I do want to stress that in this particular situation,

0:03:00.240 --> 0:03:02.240
<v Speaker 1>only a few boats were permitted on the water at

0:03:02.240 --> 0:03:04.400
<v Speaker 1>a time. There was no chasing of the whales. There

0:03:04.440 --> 0:03:07.520
<v Speaker 1>was no feeding of the whales. Um they don't eat

0:03:07.680 --> 0:03:10.600
<v Speaker 1>while they are there, and we'll get into the reasons

0:03:10.600 --> 0:03:15.000
<v Speaker 1>for this as we move through these episodes. But but

0:03:15.240 --> 0:03:16.880
<v Speaker 1>there's no need to chase, and there's no need to

0:03:16.960 --> 0:03:20.200
<v Speaker 1>it to try and bait them in, because they're very curious.

0:03:20.240 --> 0:03:22.720
<v Speaker 1>They come up to the boats, they inspect the boats,

0:03:22.720 --> 0:03:26.160
<v Speaker 1>and sometimes they're obviously scraping their skin against the holes

0:03:26.200 --> 0:03:30.320
<v Speaker 1>of the boats to perhaps to relieve themselves with some

0:03:30.400 --> 0:03:34.679
<v Speaker 1>of the parasites that they have, the exoparasites and we'll

0:03:34.680 --> 0:03:39.040
<v Speaker 1>discuss that as well in probably in well in this episode. Actually,

0:03:39.880 --> 0:03:42.280
<v Speaker 1>other times, though they're not scraping against the boats. Sometimes

0:03:42.280 --> 0:03:44.280
<v Speaker 1>they're just kind of pushing them around a little bit,

0:03:44.880 --> 0:03:48.000
<v Speaker 1>like playing with them, I guess, to try and figure

0:03:48.040 --> 0:03:50.480
<v Speaker 1>out what their mind might be. Other times they're they're

0:03:50.480 --> 0:03:55.280
<v Speaker 1>just kind of breaching a little bit. They're spy hopping. Um,

0:03:55.880 --> 0:03:58.720
<v Speaker 1>they and they seem to have some sort of interest

0:03:58.720 --> 0:04:00.600
<v Speaker 1>in what's going on in the boats or with the

0:04:00.640 --> 0:04:03.560
<v Speaker 1>boats humans will reach out and touch them, and it

0:04:03.600 --> 0:04:07.720
<v Speaker 1>seems like the whales like this on some level. Um,

0:04:07.800 --> 0:04:12.200
<v Speaker 1>it's uh, it's it's a very very very strange situation,

0:04:12.280 --> 0:04:15.200
<v Speaker 1>Like it feels kind of like certainly there's a sense

0:04:15.240 --> 0:04:18.320
<v Speaker 1>of curiosity on both sides, but there's also this, you know,

0:04:18.320 --> 0:04:20.080
<v Speaker 1>if you want to get spiritual about it, there's almost

0:04:20.120 --> 0:04:23.480
<v Speaker 1>this feeling of communion. So sometimes they'll kind of bring

0:04:23.520 --> 0:04:25.440
<v Speaker 1>part of their body out of the water or breach.

0:04:25.520 --> 0:04:27.760
<v Speaker 1>But also you said spy hopping is that when they

0:04:27.880 --> 0:04:30.200
<v Speaker 1>raise their eyes above the water level to see what's

0:04:30.240 --> 0:04:34.080
<v Speaker 1>above the surface. Well, in other species, such as the

0:04:34.200 --> 0:04:37.600
<v Speaker 1>orca um, there's there's definitely more of an eye coming

0:04:37.640 --> 0:04:41.000
<v Speaker 1>above the water. With the with the gray whales, they're

0:04:41.000 --> 0:04:45.480
<v Speaker 1>not even necessarily getting their eyes above water, so it's, uh,

0:04:45.520 --> 0:04:47.799
<v Speaker 1>you know, I think it's there. There's some differing takes

0:04:47.800 --> 0:04:50.600
<v Speaker 1>on why exactly they're doing this, but they'll, yeah, they'll

0:04:50.680 --> 0:04:52.480
<v Speaker 1>kind of spy hoop next to the boat, and they're

0:04:52.520 --> 0:04:54.960
<v Speaker 1>spy hopping out further away from the boats as well,

0:04:55.560 --> 0:04:58.680
<v Speaker 1>and um and then yea, sometimes they're rolling around in

0:04:58.720 --> 0:05:01.680
<v Speaker 1>the water and kind of and you'll even like look

0:05:01.720 --> 0:05:04.560
<v Speaker 1>into their eye that sometimes they are looking up through

0:05:04.560 --> 0:05:07.119
<v Speaker 1>the water at you, and that's one of those moments

0:05:07.120 --> 0:05:09.679
<v Speaker 1>where you're just you know, you're you're you're thinking about

0:05:09.720 --> 0:05:12.000
<v Speaker 1>like what are they seeing? What are they possibly thinking

0:05:12.040 --> 0:05:13.600
<v Speaker 1>as they look up at us? What do they think

0:05:13.640 --> 0:05:16.720
<v Speaker 1>we are? And then you also look at this whale

0:05:16.720 --> 0:05:19.760
<v Speaker 1>and you just, man, I was just thinking, like they've

0:05:20.000 --> 0:05:22.279
<v Speaker 1>they've seen things I can't even imagine, you know, And

0:05:22.400 --> 0:05:25.320
<v Speaker 1>this this particular whale is going to see things just

0:05:25.400 --> 0:05:29.640
<v Speaker 1>in the months ahead that I can scarcely imagine. So

0:05:29.680 --> 0:05:32.400
<v Speaker 1>I'm very envious of this experience. And uh, and I

0:05:32.400 --> 0:05:34.919
<v Speaker 1>would love to see gray whales up close one day too,

0:05:34.960 --> 0:05:38.520
<v Speaker 1>But I have seen plenty of video footage and at

0:05:38.560 --> 0:05:43.360
<v Speaker 1>least from what I've seen several things stand out. One

0:05:43.400 --> 0:05:46.120
<v Speaker 1>that they kind of I don't know if this makes

0:05:46.120 --> 0:05:48.960
<v Speaker 1>any sense, but they look more like rocks than any

0:05:49.000 --> 0:05:51.720
<v Speaker 1>other type of whale I can think of having seen,

0:05:52.960 --> 0:05:57.000
<v Speaker 1>and that may be aided by the many barnacles attached

0:05:57.040 --> 0:05:59.200
<v Speaker 1>to the outside of them, which, as we'll talk about

0:05:59.480 --> 0:06:03.200
<v Speaker 1>later on, very characteristic of the species of whale, having

0:06:03.240 --> 0:06:05.479
<v Speaker 1>a lot of barnacle loading on the outside. But in

0:06:05.640 --> 0:06:07.400
<v Speaker 1>looking at them, they can look very much like a

0:06:07.520 --> 0:06:12.040
<v Speaker 1>large gray boulder covered in lichen, almost where the barnacles

0:06:12.040 --> 0:06:14.080
<v Speaker 1>are kind of like the lichen patches, or at least

0:06:14.080 --> 0:06:16.880
<v Speaker 1>it seemed that way to me. M And then the

0:06:16.920 --> 0:06:22.800
<v Speaker 1>other thing being that their nostrils look very uh more

0:06:22.839 --> 0:06:25.520
<v Speaker 1>typically mammalian rather than the blow a hole that you

0:06:25.520 --> 0:06:27.240
<v Speaker 1>would see on the back of a lot of whales,

0:06:27.240 --> 0:06:30.920
<v Speaker 1>where you might perceive at least as a single blowhole. Uh.

0:06:30.960 --> 0:06:35.080
<v Speaker 1>The gray whale nostrils I recall seeing are very distinctly

0:06:35.240 --> 0:06:38.239
<v Speaker 1>separate nostrils that kind of flare more like a dog's

0:06:38.320 --> 0:06:41.400
<v Speaker 1>nostrils might. Oh yeah, yeah, this this is not your

0:06:41.480 --> 0:06:44.960
<v Speaker 1>your cartoon whale. You have those those very nostril like

0:06:45.360 --> 0:06:47.800
<v Speaker 1>blow holes on top of the head, and you if

0:06:47.800 --> 0:06:49.640
<v Speaker 1>you're if you're out on one of these lagoons, you

0:06:49.640 --> 0:06:52.040
<v Speaker 1>see see that a lot. In fact, a lot of

0:06:52.040 --> 0:06:54.800
<v Speaker 1>people end up getting spre You're constantly misted by the

0:06:54.839 --> 0:06:57.320
<v Speaker 1>spray from them, even if they're not super close to

0:06:57.400 --> 0:06:59.960
<v Speaker 1>the boats, just because you know they're they're just kind

0:07:00.040 --> 0:07:02.480
<v Speaker 1>and up they're they're blowing that blow hole. There's this

0:07:02.560 --> 0:07:05.320
<v Speaker 1>mist in the air of water and also I guess

0:07:05.400 --> 0:07:08.760
<v Speaker 1>probably some some whale snut in there as well. But

0:07:08.839 --> 0:07:10.920
<v Speaker 1>they do have to your point, they do have this

0:07:11.000 --> 0:07:13.800
<v Speaker 1>kind of rocky appearance. Part of it's the barnacle load,

0:07:14.280 --> 0:07:17.760
<v Speaker 1>but also that their their their skin is very modeled

0:07:17.800 --> 0:07:22.320
<v Speaker 1>and um and scarred, and it could look like it

0:07:22.360 --> 0:07:26.480
<v Speaker 1>is it is stone um. When if you do touch it,

0:07:26.920 --> 0:07:28.920
<v Speaker 1>I thought that it felt more or less like a

0:07:28.960 --> 0:07:31.400
<v Speaker 1>big eggplant. That's the kind of feeling I've had from it,

0:07:31.560 --> 0:07:33.560
<v Speaker 1>Like there's a little like there's a softness to it,

0:07:33.600 --> 0:07:36.640
<v Speaker 1>but it is also you know, it's like a that's

0:07:36.720 --> 0:07:39.560
<v Speaker 1>kind of wet suit feeling as well. Oh, another thing

0:07:39.560 --> 0:07:41.680
<v Speaker 1>about their skin is I and will come back to this,

0:07:41.800 --> 0:07:46.280
<v Speaker 1>but I was surprised by their whiskers. We've talked on

0:07:46.320 --> 0:07:50.000
<v Speaker 1>the show before about the evolution of whales and the

0:07:50.080 --> 0:07:52.679
<v Speaker 1>loss of body hair. So I wasn't prepared for the whiskers.

0:07:52.720 --> 0:07:56.280
<v Speaker 1>Somehow I missed this in leading up to this whale experience.

0:07:56.680 --> 0:07:59.440
<v Speaker 1>But they have quite a few whiskers. Um the other

0:07:59.480 --> 0:08:01.600
<v Speaker 1>thing that I was surprised about, because I'm some level,

0:08:01.640 --> 0:08:03.800
<v Speaker 1>I was prepared for this gentleness, So I was prepared

0:08:03.800 --> 0:08:06.000
<v Speaker 1>for this curiosity. I knew what I was getting into

0:08:06.040 --> 0:08:10.119
<v Speaker 1>with that. But but also you would you would see

0:08:10.160 --> 0:08:13.800
<v Speaker 1>them moving underneath the water. And these are big animals.

0:08:14.120 --> 0:08:17.320
<v Speaker 1>They're we're talking uh, fourteen point nine meters or forty

0:08:17.400 --> 0:08:20.360
<v Speaker 1>nine feet in length, weights of up to forty one

0:08:20.440 --> 0:08:26.680
<v Speaker 1>tons or so. So these are like school bus sized organisms,

0:08:27.040 --> 0:08:31.680
<v Speaker 1>and they're they're often very curious and gentle next to

0:08:31.720 --> 0:08:34.320
<v Speaker 1>the boat, but they can they can move with such

0:08:34.360 --> 0:08:37.560
<v Speaker 1>speed and strength, and you see that occasionally, especially when

0:08:37.559 --> 0:08:41.120
<v Speaker 1>they're engaging and mating behavior further away from the boats,

0:08:41.160 --> 0:08:44.280
<v Speaker 1>they'll they'll surge underneath the water, and you're reminded just

0:08:44.400 --> 0:08:50.440
<v Speaker 1>how how powerful and how potentially um destructive these creatures

0:08:50.440 --> 0:08:53.200
<v Speaker 1>are if they had have they had reason to be

0:08:53.240 --> 0:08:55.800
<v Speaker 1>destructive towards you. You know, it's funny. This reminds me

0:08:55.840 --> 0:09:00.120
<v Speaker 1>of all these passages in Moby Dick describing whales. We

0:09:00.200 --> 0:09:02.920
<v Speaker 1>know now from plenty of examples like this, just like

0:09:03.440 --> 0:09:06.800
<v Speaker 1>as a matter of habit do not seem to attack

0:09:06.920 --> 0:09:10.120
<v Speaker 1>humans or do anything very aggressive, at least not most

0:09:10.120 --> 0:09:13.839
<v Speaker 1>of the time. But described in these older documents with

0:09:13.960 --> 0:09:18.559
<v Speaker 1>absolute horror, just like these whales are monsters. They are killers.

0:09:18.840 --> 0:09:22.839
<v Speaker 1>They will crush you, they will swallow you whole. Yeah. Absolutely,

0:09:22.880 --> 0:09:25.400
<v Speaker 1>and in fact I ran across this wonderful description. This

0:09:25.559 --> 0:09:30.560
<v Speaker 1>is from a paper in The American Naturalist from eighteen

0:09:30.600 --> 0:09:34.920
<v Speaker 1>eighty eight by J. D. Katon, titled the California gray Whale.

0:09:36.240 --> 0:09:39.440
<v Speaker 1>The author writes, quote, of all the known species of whales,

0:09:39.800 --> 0:09:44.600
<v Speaker 1>this is the most cunning, courageous, and vicious. So terrible

0:09:44.760 --> 0:09:48.200
<v Speaker 1>is it that, with the old implements of harpoon and lance,

0:09:48.320 --> 0:09:51.600
<v Speaker 1>but few whalemen would court an encounter with it, and

0:09:51.720 --> 0:09:54.800
<v Speaker 1>it early received the name of the devil fish. I

0:09:54.920 --> 0:09:58.840
<v Speaker 1>have no account that it ever maliciously attacked an unoffending object,

0:09:59.120 --> 0:10:02.760
<v Speaker 1>Yet when it found it self pursued where escape was difficult,

0:10:03.000 --> 0:10:05.360
<v Speaker 1>even before it was struck, it has been known to

0:10:05.400 --> 0:10:08.400
<v Speaker 1>turn upon pursuers and dash a boat to fragments with

0:10:08.440 --> 0:10:11.680
<v Speaker 1>a single blow. Of its powerful flukes, and so has

0:10:11.760 --> 0:10:14.520
<v Speaker 1>many a life been lost? Okay, well, at least this

0:10:14.640 --> 0:10:18.080
<v Speaker 1>source acknowledges that this kind of behavior would be like

0:10:18.240 --> 0:10:21.760
<v Speaker 1>in response to extreme distress, like when the whale is

0:10:21.800 --> 0:10:25.280
<v Speaker 1>being attacked. Yeah. Yeah, he is acknowledging that like this,

0:10:25.280 --> 0:10:30.960
<v Speaker 1>this is aggression that's coming out of obvious whaling scenarios. Yeah.

0:10:31.800 --> 0:10:35.440
<v Speaker 1>And you know you the sad fact is, and especially

0:10:35.440 --> 0:10:38.559
<v Speaker 1>this in the show before, you can't you can't remove

0:10:38.960 --> 0:10:42.960
<v Speaker 1>whaling from our understanding of these creatures. I mean that

0:10:43.480 --> 0:10:48.400
<v Speaker 1>the history is intertwined there with our understanding of the organism,

0:10:48.400 --> 0:10:51.760
<v Speaker 1>and so we have various things where the name comes

0:10:51.800 --> 0:10:55.760
<v Speaker 1>from whaler observations, like, for instance, whale lice, which will

0:10:55.800 --> 0:10:59.199
<v Speaker 1>discuss they're not actually lice, but whalers compare them to lice,

0:10:59.280 --> 0:11:01.680
<v Speaker 1>and that's where the name comes from. I do believe

0:11:02.080 --> 0:11:05.640
<v Speaker 1>gray whales specifically are thought to have once been much

0:11:05.679 --> 0:11:09.880
<v Speaker 1>more abundant, right, but that whaling in particular reduced their

0:11:09.920 --> 0:11:14.560
<v Speaker 1>populations to present levels where there's a sustainable number of

0:11:14.600 --> 0:11:18.520
<v Speaker 1>gray whales in the population on the western coast of

0:11:18.800 --> 0:11:21.959
<v Speaker 1>the American continent, but the population that lives on the

0:11:22.280 --> 0:11:25.200
<v Speaker 1>other side of the Pacific on the eastern coast of

0:11:25.200 --> 0:11:28.320
<v Speaker 1>the Asian Mainland is much more reduced, but in both

0:11:28.320 --> 0:11:31.320
<v Speaker 1>cases reduced by whaling. Yeah, and then there was once

0:11:31.360 --> 0:11:34.720
<v Speaker 1>a North Atlantic gray whale population. These were thought to

0:11:34.800 --> 0:11:39.960
<v Speaker 1>have fed around Newfoundland, the Gulf of Saint Lawrence, Iceland,

0:11:40.080 --> 0:11:44.440
<v Speaker 1>and Europe's North North Sea and for their winter breeding

0:11:45.160 --> 0:11:48.560
<v Speaker 1>lagoons or refuges. It's thought that they might have visited

0:11:48.600 --> 0:11:52.000
<v Speaker 1>the coasts of Georgia and the Carolinas here in the States,

0:11:52.320 --> 0:11:55.840
<v Speaker 1>as well as uncertain spots along the coast of Spain, Portugal,

0:11:55.880 --> 0:11:59.240
<v Speaker 1>and Morocco. But this population was essentially extinct by the

0:11:59.280 --> 0:12:02.920
<v Speaker 1>late seventeen and early eighteenth centuries do at least in

0:12:03.040 --> 0:12:08.400
<v Speaker 1>part to whaling. Interestingly enough, there have been proposals to

0:12:08.400 --> 0:12:12.480
<v Speaker 1>try and introduce reintroduce the North Pacific gray whale into

0:12:12.520 --> 0:12:16.360
<v Speaker 1>this region to restore the population. And I've also seen

0:12:16.400 --> 0:12:19.600
<v Speaker 1>speculations about what might occur in the future due to

0:12:20.440 --> 0:12:25.000
<v Speaker 1>climate change, that as we have less sea ice, it

0:12:25.080 --> 0:12:29.720
<v Speaker 1>might enable the gray whales on their own to recolonize

0:12:29.760 --> 0:12:32.800
<v Speaker 1>this part of the ocean. I guess it would be

0:12:32.880 --> 0:12:36.559
<v Speaker 1>very difficult and expensive to try to force a recolonization

0:12:36.679 --> 0:12:40.320
<v Speaker 1>by human intervention, Yeah, because I mean nothing else. We're

0:12:40.320 --> 0:12:43.000
<v Speaker 1>talking about enormous creatures and how are you going to

0:12:43.040 --> 0:12:46.080
<v Speaker 1>get them there? I didn't, I didn't look super hard

0:12:46.120 --> 0:12:50.040
<v Speaker 1>at the proposals. They may have a very straightforward solution

0:12:50.040 --> 0:12:51.760
<v Speaker 1>to this. I'm not sure if they would be airlifting

0:12:51.800 --> 0:12:54.560
<v Speaker 1>them or shipping them across land or exactly what the

0:12:54.760 --> 0:12:58.559
<v Speaker 1>scenario is, but it has not become an actionable thing

0:12:58.679 --> 0:13:01.920
<v Speaker 1>at least yet. Well, let's talk a little bit more

0:13:01.960 --> 0:13:04.760
<v Speaker 1>about the physical characteristics of the gray whale here. Because

0:13:04.760 --> 0:13:08.439
<v Speaker 1>I guess we are um an audio program. You can

0:13:08.480 --> 0:13:12.559
<v Speaker 1>certainly look up lots of great images and footage and illustrations. Uh.

0:13:13.160 --> 0:13:15.600
<v Speaker 1>One of the books that was one of my my

0:13:15.640 --> 0:13:19.440
<v Speaker 1>prime sources here as a book by Mark Carwardine, The

0:13:19.440 --> 0:13:23.319
<v Speaker 1>Handbook of Whales, Dolphins and Porpoises of the World. Highly

0:13:23.400 --> 0:13:26.720
<v Speaker 1>recommend this book for anyone out there who's into whales,

0:13:26.720 --> 0:13:31.000
<v Speaker 1>dolphins and porpoises. Fabulous illustrations and some great photographs and

0:13:31.080 --> 0:13:34.840
<v Speaker 1>just lots of wonderful information, uh that you know, can

0:13:34.880 --> 0:13:37.720
<v Speaker 1>aid you just sort of in general general interest in

0:13:37.800 --> 0:13:40.040
<v Speaker 1>these organisms or if you're into citing them and has

0:13:40.120 --> 0:13:42.640
<v Speaker 1>like you know, how to how to pick out these

0:13:42.720 --> 0:13:47.480
<v Speaker 1>various creatures, by their markings, by their their spouts, by

0:13:47.520 --> 0:13:49.640
<v Speaker 1>their flukes, that sort of thing. So that's going to

0:13:49.679 --> 0:13:51.040
<v Speaker 1>be one of the books I'm going to keep referring

0:13:51.040 --> 0:13:52.920
<v Speaker 1>back to, for sure. But getting back to what we

0:13:52.920 --> 0:13:55.360
<v Speaker 1>were talking about earlier. Yes, these are these are whales.

0:13:55.360 --> 0:13:59.400
<v Speaker 1>These are large creatures, large whales. By some rankings, I

0:13:59.400 --> 0:14:03.119
<v Speaker 1>think they're only the eighth largest whale species. But considering

0:14:03.120 --> 0:14:05.480
<v Speaker 1>that number one, the blue whale, is the largest animal

0:14:05.559 --> 0:14:07.880
<v Speaker 1>that's ever lived, there's not really no shame in coming

0:14:07.880 --> 0:14:11.160
<v Speaker 1>at a number eight. Gray whale can reach forty nine

0:14:11.320 --> 0:14:14.040
<v Speaker 1>feet in length. That's the fourteen point nine meters way,

0:14:14.080 --> 0:14:17.400
<v Speaker 1>about forty tons. The females are larger than the males,

0:14:17.520 --> 0:14:22.240
<v Speaker 1>and even the newborns are approximately fourteen to sixteen feet long.

0:14:22.400 --> 0:14:24.880
<v Speaker 1>It's roughly four point two to four point eight meters

0:14:25.040 --> 0:14:27.720
<v Speaker 1>in wigh, around two thousand pounds or around nine hundred

0:14:27.720 --> 0:14:30.800
<v Speaker 1>and seven kilograms, So we're talking about big creatures here.

0:14:31.120 --> 0:14:34.560
<v Speaker 1>Cannot stress that enough, And I guess it's helpful that

0:14:34.600 --> 0:14:37.560
<v Speaker 1>the newborn calves are already big because it's when a

0:14:37.600 --> 0:14:41.200
<v Speaker 1>whale is young that it's most susceptible to predators like

0:14:41.280 --> 0:14:45.680
<v Speaker 1>the predation on adult gray whales, from what I understand,

0:14:45.760 --> 0:14:50.600
<v Speaker 1>is pretty rare, whereas attempts by animals such as orcas

0:14:50.640 --> 0:14:53.800
<v Speaker 1>to prey on the calves is pretty common. Yeah. Yeah,

0:14:53.800 --> 0:14:59.200
<v Speaker 1>because the healthy adult whale is a healthy adult gray

0:14:59.240 --> 0:15:03.440
<v Speaker 1>whale is a formidable opponent unless conditions are just right.

0:15:03.520 --> 0:15:06.160
<v Speaker 1>And then, of course, uh, the the young are going

0:15:06.240 --> 0:15:18.880
<v Speaker 1>to be the primary focal point of predators. Okay, so

0:15:18.880 --> 0:15:21.720
<v Speaker 1>we've established they're big, we should also come back to

0:15:21.760 --> 0:15:24.840
<v Speaker 1>the fact that, yes, they are more or less gray

0:15:24.920 --> 0:15:28.880
<v Speaker 1>in color, often look like just a big old slab

0:15:28.920 --> 0:15:34.000
<v Speaker 1>of granite, kind of like an obelisk in the water. Yes. Now,

0:15:34.720 --> 0:15:37.320
<v Speaker 1>one initial question that came up for me, of course,

0:15:37.920 --> 0:15:40.640
<v Speaker 1>especially as we were dealing in our notes here, is

0:15:40.640 --> 0:15:42.760
<v Speaker 1>it gray g R E y or is it g

0:15:43.040 --> 0:15:47.600
<v Speaker 1>r A y um. I generally assume those spellings are interchangeable.

0:15:47.680 --> 0:15:51.160
<v Speaker 1>It's like American English or British English. That's how yeah,

0:15:51.280 --> 0:15:54.160
<v Speaker 1>ye read it. Yeah, and that's one of the main distinctions.

0:15:54.760 --> 0:15:59.560
<v Speaker 1>Um Mark Carterwine in his book stresses that that either

0:15:59.680 --> 0:16:03.280
<v Speaker 1>is correct. You know, obviously gry is more common in

0:16:03.320 --> 0:16:06.640
<v Speaker 1>British English and gray is more common in American English.

0:16:06.880 --> 0:16:09.760
<v Speaker 1>And generally we're referring to what has perceived to be

0:16:09.800 --> 0:16:12.320
<v Speaker 1>the color of the creature, though much of its gray

0:16:12.360 --> 0:16:16.600
<v Speaker 1>appearance is due to those accumulated barnacles, skin lesions scarring

0:16:17.040 --> 0:16:19.720
<v Speaker 1>their actual skin, though is still often described as light

0:16:19.760 --> 0:16:23.640
<v Speaker 1>to dark gray, or maybe a gray brown. However, it's

0:16:23.680 --> 0:16:26.560
<v Speaker 1>also acceptable to consider that we dubbed them gray whales

0:16:26.600 --> 0:16:31.080
<v Speaker 1>in reference to British zoologist John Edward Gray Gray, who

0:16:31.080 --> 0:16:34.200
<v Speaker 1>lived eighteen hundred through eighteen seventy five, who placed the

0:16:34.240 --> 0:16:38.440
<v Speaker 1>whale in its own genus in eighteen sixty four. On

0:16:38.560 --> 0:16:42.640
<v Speaker 1>top of that, its scientific name is as Richtius robustus,

0:16:42.640 --> 0:16:47.640
<v Speaker 1>referring to nineteenth century Danish zoologist Frederick Estricht who lived

0:16:47.640 --> 0:16:50.360
<v Speaker 1>seventeen ninety eight through eighteen sixty three. So it could

0:16:50.360 --> 0:16:53.480
<v Speaker 1>have been the Eshricht whale. We we're glad that it's

0:16:53.480 --> 0:16:56.040
<v Speaker 1>the gray whale. Yeah, yeah, rolls off the tongue for

0:16:56.160 --> 0:16:59.000
<v Speaker 1>us at any rate, a little, a little easier. It's

0:16:59.160 --> 0:17:01.160
<v Speaker 1>been known by other names, of course, the gray back,

0:17:01.240 --> 0:17:05.520
<v Speaker 1>the muscle digger, the mud digger, the scrag whale, ripsack, hardhead,

0:17:05.800 --> 0:17:08.840
<v Speaker 1>and of course by American whalers the devil fish. That

0:17:08.960 --> 0:17:10.760
<v Speaker 1>was the one referenced in that they quote from the

0:17:10.800 --> 0:17:14.560
<v Speaker 1>article in the American Naturalists from the nineteenth century. Correct. Yes,

0:17:15.600 --> 0:17:19.920
<v Speaker 1>now there are no recognized forms or subspecies, though there

0:17:19.920 --> 0:17:23.960
<v Speaker 1>are two possible sub populations according to Carwadine, So we

0:17:24.040 --> 0:17:27.160
<v Speaker 1>have the eastern North Pacific and the western North Pacific

0:17:27.760 --> 0:17:30.840
<v Speaker 1>gray whale. But there also seems to be some cross

0:17:30.920 --> 0:17:35.120
<v Speaker 1>breeding between these two populations in the Mexican lagoons. Now

0:17:35.119 --> 0:17:36.840
<v Speaker 1>again you can put all of your sort of cartoon

0:17:36.880 --> 0:17:43.000
<v Speaker 1>whale appearances to the side, because the reality is somewhat different,

0:17:43.040 --> 0:17:46.240
<v Speaker 1>not only with the blowholes, but for starters, we should

0:17:46.240 --> 0:17:48.080
<v Speaker 1>point out that this is a baleen whale, not a

0:17:48.119 --> 0:17:52.040
<v Speaker 1>toothed whale. Baleen whales were once toothed whales earlier on

0:17:52.119 --> 0:17:54.679
<v Speaker 1>in their evolution, and we do have fossil evidence of

0:17:54.680 --> 0:17:58.080
<v Speaker 1>whales with both teeth and baleen, but they have adapted.

0:17:58.440 --> 0:18:01.560
<v Speaker 1>The gray whales have adapted to thrive as pure filter feeders.

0:18:01.880 --> 0:18:04.919
<v Speaker 1>So the baleen is a bristly material that lives inside

0:18:04.920 --> 0:18:09.400
<v Speaker 1>the whale's mouth which they use to filter feed by. Well,

0:18:09.440 --> 0:18:11.480
<v Speaker 1>there are various different ways the different species do it,

0:18:11.520 --> 0:18:15.320
<v Speaker 1>but by by forcing water through these sort of sieves.

0:18:15.440 --> 0:18:20.520
<v Speaker 1>Natural biological sieves the billing hares which capture the plankton

0:18:20.880 --> 0:18:23.600
<v Speaker 1>or the krill, or the small bits of organic matter

0:18:23.720 --> 0:18:26.119
<v Speaker 1>that the whales live on. Yeah. Yeah, and it's like

0:18:26.440 --> 0:18:31.639
<v Speaker 1>these these keratin baleen plates. And this is something I

0:18:31.680 --> 0:18:33.840
<v Speaker 1>hadn't given a lot of thought to before. But there

0:18:33.840 --> 0:18:37.159
<v Speaker 1>are different strategies to use with your baling. There are

0:18:37.160 --> 0:18:40.760
<v Speaker 1>two main strategies. Two of the main strategies anywhere, gulping

0:18:40.800 --> 0:18:43.800
<v Speaker 1>and straining, both carried out near the water surface by

0:18:44.560 --> 0:18:49.200
<v Speaker 1>different species of whales. Baleen whales, like right whales, will

0:18:49.240 --> 0:18:53.480
<v Speaker 1>slim swim through clouds of krill, open mouth, skimming them

0:18:53.480 --> 0:18:56.560
<v Speaker 1>from the water. Meanwhile, fin whales gulp up water full

0:18:56.560 --> 0:18:59.440
<v Speaker 1>of fish and or krill and then push the water

0:18:59.560 --> 0:19:03.560
<v Speaker 1>out as if through a sieve. But the gray whales

0:19:03.600 --> 0:19:07.240
<v Speaker 1>are different. They're the only modern baleen whale that dives

0:19:07.280 --> 0:19:09.960
<v Speaker 1>down deep, and I mean this is deep relative to

0:19:10.040 --> 0:19:12.280
<v Speaker 1>the waters they inhabit. These are not deep water whales.

0:19:12.320 --> 0:19:14.840
<v Speaker 1>They're not like sperm whales. They tend to stick to

0:19:15.000 --> 0:19:17.960
<v Speaker 1>coastal regions and the continental shelf, but they'll go down

0:19:18.320 --> 0:19:22.280
<v Speaker 1>deep for these regions and they'll feed as bottom feeders.

0:19:22.520 --> 0:19:25.480
<v Speaker 1>They'll turn on one side, and interestingly they are there

0:19:25.600 --> 0:19:28.880
<v Speaker 1>is like a right handedness to the gray whales. Most

0:19:28.880 --> 0:19:31.119
<v Speaker 1>whales seem to favor their right side, but some do

0:19:31.359 --> 0:19:36.560
<v Speaker 1>left instead, and they'll vacuum the water up, vacuum up water, mud, sand,

0:19:36.840 --> 0:19:40.439
<v Speaker 1>and most importantly various organisms there in the muck. And

0:19:40.480 --> 0:19:42.879
<v Speaker 1>then they'll use their tongue to push out the mud,

0:19:43.040 --> 0:19:46.240
<v Speaker 1>sand and water, but retain all these little organisms and

0:19:46.320 --> 0:19:52.439
<v Speaker 1>things they can digest in their billing. Yeah, and it's interesting,

0:19:52.440 --> 0:19:55.440
<v Speaker 1>apparently you can tell which side a particular gray whale

0:19:55.440 --> 0:19:58.440
<v Speaker 1>favors because the side it favors is generally more scraped

0:19:58.520 --> 0:20:02.000
<v Speaker 1>up and deep barnacled, because that's the side that goes

0:20:02.040 --> 0:20:06.959
<v Speaker 1>down in plows into the ocean floor. And also their

0:20:07.359 --> 0:20:11.159
<v Speaker 1>baleen plates are shorter than in other extent whales. So

0:20:11.520 --> 0:20:15.439
<v Speaker 1>these other baleen whales that use different feeding techniques, I

0:20:15.440 --> 0:20:19.200
<v Speaker 1>think they tend to have longer balin for straining out

0:20:19.200 --> 0:20:21.719
<v Speaker 1>the things that they need to eat. Now, as for

0:20:21.960 --> 0:20:25.280
<v Speaker 1>what they're eating out of the muck, Carveting points out

0:20:25.280 --> 0:20:28.720
<v Speaker 1>that a good eighty species of fish and invertebrates have

0:20:28.920 --> 0:20:32.159
<v Speaker 1>been identified as gray whale prey. However, most of the

0:20:32.240 --> 0:20:37.000
<v Speaker 1>prey that they consume consists of benthic and planktonic organisms.

0:20:37.040 --> 0:20:41.479
<v Speaker 1>Planktonic meaning, of course, plankton and benthic organisms being various

0:20:41.480 --> 0:20:46.080
<v Speaker 1>isopods that live abundantly in the sand. Apparently benthic amphipods

0:20:46.160 --> 0:20:49.040
<v Speaker 1>make up a good ninety percent of their diet. But

0:20:49.080 --> 0:20:52.920
<v Speaker 1>they're they're reasonably opportunistic and may also be shifting their

0:20:52.920 --> 0:20:57.960
<v Speaker 1>foraging habits in Arctic waters due to climate change. So basically,

0:20:58.840 --> 0:21:00.760
<v Speaker 1>my understanding based on the they're reading here, is like

0:21:00.760 --> 0:21:04.240
<v Speaker 1>they're they're going down to the mud and the muck

0:21:04.280 --> 0:21:06.320
<v Speaker 1>and the sand to get most of their food, but

0:21:06.359 --> 0:21:09.199
<v Speaker 1>if they happen to encounter some sort of plankton on

0:21:09.240 --> 0:21:11.280
<v Speaker 1>the way up, you know they're gonna breathe it in.

0:21:11.320 --> 0:21:12.879
<v Speaker 1>They're gonna they're gonna go ahead and take that in

0:21:12.960 --> 0:21:16.520
<v Speaker 1>as well. They're typically diving down thirty to sixty meters,

0:21:16.520 --> 0:21:18.080
<v Speaker 1>but they may go up to one hundred and twenty

0:21:18.119 --> 0:21:21.639
<v Speaker 1>or even one hundred and seventy, and again, opportunistic feeding

0:21:21.680 --> 0:21:24.040
<v Speaker 1>may happen at any depth, but the seabed is their

0:21:24.080 --> 0:21:27.320
<v Speaker 1>main target now. The summer is their prime feeding period,

0:21:27.840 --> 0:21:31.400
<v Speaker 1>and of course they're large whales. They're eating large meals.

0:21:31.600 --> 0:21:34.480
<v Speaker 1>They'll eat anywhere from like one to one point three

0:21:34.560 --> 0:21:38.639
<v Speaker 1>tons of the stuff per day, and the remainder of

0:21:38.680 --> 0:21:42.439
<v Speaker 1>the year entails a lot of fasting, including their migrations

0:21:42.440 --> 0:21:46.479
<v Speaker 1>to and from these calving and mating lagoons. Okay, so

0:21:46.520 --> 0:21:49.959
<v Speaker 1>they typically are going to be stocking up on food,

0:21:50.040 --> 0:21:53.480
<v Speaker 1>they're eating, they're they're banging their heads into the sediment

0:21:53.560 --> 0:21:56.679
<v Speaker 1>up in the Arctic waters, and then they migrate down

0:21:57.000 --> 0:22:02.760
<v Speaker 1>south for calving and rearing young. Yeah. Yeah, and um, yeah,

0:22:02.760 --> 0:22:04.600
<v Speaker 1>so you might think of them as just this kind

0:22:04.640 --> 0:22:09.520
<v Speaker 1>of enormous freight train of a creature that sucks up

0:22:09.800 --> 0:22:13.560
<v Speaker 1>mud and anything in the mud in the sand from

0:22:14.080 --> 0:22:16.920
<v Speaker 1>you know, from the waters that they inhabit and just

0:22:17.119 --> 0:22:19.639
<v Speaker 1>eat all summer long, Yeah, and then go go south

0:22:19.680 --> 0:22:23.119
<v Speaker 1>for the winter. Kind of the catfish of whales. Yeah,

0:22:23.160 --> 0:22:25.640
<v Speaker 1>they are. I thought about this as well. Yeah, they're

0:22:25.680 --> 0:22:27.920
<v Speaker 1>kind of because the catfish for the bottom feeders, I

0:22:28.280 --> 0:22:31.159
<v Speaker 1>grew up around and grew up here in about and

0:22:31.160 --> 0:22:33.360
<v Speaker 1>so yeah, they're they're kind of using the catfish strategy,

0:22:33.440 --> 0:22:35.639
<v Speaker 1>but on an epic scale. But don't try to go

0:22:35.720 --> 0:22:38.919
<v Speaker 1>noodling for gray whales. No, No, that doesn't sound like

0:22:38.920 --> 0:22:41.040
<v Speaker 1>a good idea now once a moll note, I think

0:22:41.040 --> 0:22:43.800
<v Speaker 1>I did read that there are some accepts. There seems

0:22:43.800 --> 0:22:45.480
<v Speaker 1>to be some evidence that there are some whales that

0:22:45.560 --> 0:22:48.320
<v Speaker 1>stay north for an extended period of time, but in

0:22:48.359 --> 0:22:52.399
<v Speaker 1>general we see this migration occurring. Other important physical notes,

0:22:52.640 --> 0:22:56.040
<v Speaker 1>just to describe them, they have slender and small heads

0:22:56.080 --> 0:22:59.040
<v Speaker 1>even in relation to their body size, certainly when you

0:22:59.080 --> 0:23:02.439
<v Speaker 1>compare them to amously big headed whales like the sperm whale,

0:23:02.440 --> 0:23:05.200
<v Speaker 1>a toothed whale. They have a stocky body with a

0:23:05.280 --> 0:23:07.359
<v Speaker 1>hump two thirds of the way down their back, along

0:23:07.359 --> 0:23:11.440
<v Speaker 1>with eight to fourteen quote unquote knuckles Further down. They

0:23:11.440 --> 0:23:13.760
<v Speaker 1>don't have a dorsal fin. They just have a small hump.

0:23:14.240 --> 0:23:18.040
<v Speaker 1>And like I mentioned earlier, they have whiskers, and apparently

0:23:18.080 --> 0:23:21.000
<v Speaker 1>they have more whiskers than any other whale. I was

0:23:21.040 --> 0:23:24.680
<v Speaker 1>not prepared for this, but the whiskers are very prominent,

0:23:24.760 --> 0:23:28.119
<v Speaker 1>and I was reading about this on the NAA website

0:23:28.480 --> 0:23:31.240
<v Speaker 1>and they point out that these are more or less

0:23:31.280 --> 0:23:34.320
<v Speaker 1>like the whiskers you'd encounter on any mammal. They are

0:23:34.359 --> 0:23:38.439
<v Speaker 1>tactile sensors. Now Carveting notes that in the older whales,

0:23:38.480 --> 0:23:42.000
<v Speaker 1>though many of these whiskers are quote unquote obliterated by

0:23:42.040 --> 0:23:45.720
<v Speaker 1>scarring and barnacles. However, wow, if the barnacles are in

0:23:45.760 --> 0:23:50.240
<v Speaker 1>some cases obliterating their sensory organs, I feel like that

0:23:50.240 --> 0:23:53.280
<v Speaker 1>that offers some input on question we're going to address

0:23:53.600 --> 0:23:56.679
<v Speaker 1>in a minute, which is about these barnacles. Now, we

0:23:56.720 --> 0:24:00.679
<v Speaker 1>mentioned them earlier, but they are a very your feature

0:24:00.720 --> 0:24:02.960
<v Speaker 1>that people notice when they look at gray whales. It

0:24:03.000 --> 0:24:05.399
<v Speaker 1>looks horrible. Some people think, you know, they look at

0:24:05.400 --> 0:24:07.320
<v Speaker 1>this and they're like, oh my god, these poor whales.

0:24:08.520 --> 0:24:12.040
<v Speaker 1>This must be a purely parasitic infestation where where the

0:24:12.040 --> 0:24:14.560
<v Speaker 1>whale is dying because of all these barnacles on it.

0:24:14.960 --> 0:24:17.320
<v Speaker 1>I think it's it's it's more of an open question

0:24:17.400 --> 0:24:22.480
<v Speaker 1>exactly what the symbiotic relationship between the whales and their

0:24:22.480 --> 0:24:27.280
<v Speaker 1>barnacles is. Is it parasitism, is it mutualism? Is it

0:24:27.400 --> 0:24:30.840
<v Speaker 1>a commensalism commensalism where the barnacle would get a benefit,

0:24:30.880 --> 0:24:32.960
<v Speaker 1>but it just doesn't really matter to the whale. We're

0:24:32.960 --> 0:24:36.399
<v Speaker 1>going to address that in a minute. Yeah, it's I

0:24:36.440 --> 0:24:37.879
<v Speaker 1>know some of you might be thinking like, I just

0:24:37.920 --> 0:24:39.280
<v Speaker 1>want to hear about the gray whales. I don't want

0:24:39.280 --> 0:24:40.679
<v Speaker 1>to hear about the barnacles. I don't want to hear

0:24:40.720 --> 0:24:43.280
<v Speaker 1>about the worka but but if there's the thing, you

0:24:43.359 --> 0:24:46.960
<v Speaker 1>can't talk about the gray whale without talking about the orca,

0:24:46.960 --> 0:24:48.840
<v Speaker 1>which will probably get into more in the second episode.

0:24:48.840 --> 0:24:50.359
<v Speaker 1>And you can't talk about them without talking about their

0:24:50.400 --> 0:24:53.320
<v Speaker 1>barnacles because they're just so so much a part of

0:24:53.840 --> 0:24:56.280
<v Speaker 1>who they are and when what they look like. Now

0:24:56.320 --> 0:24:57.879
<v Speaker 1>there again, there may be, like you said, there may

0:24:57.880 --> 0:25:01.280
<v Speaker 1>be a little more nuanced to exactly what the relationship

0:25:01.359 --> 0:25:05.639
<v Speaker 1>might be between the barnacles and the whale lice and

0:25:05.800 --> 0:25:08.720
<v Speaker 1>the whales, but for the most part, they're often referred

0:25:08.720 --> 0:25:11.200
<v Speaker 1>to as exoparasites, so we're going to probably keep using

0:25:11.240 --> 0:25:13.600
<v Speaker 1>that term, even if we're going to, you know, put

0:25:13.840 --> 0:25:17.439
<v Speaker 1>an asterisk by it and come back to it. They

0:25:17.720 --> 0:25:22.120
<v Speaker 1>do have quite an exoparasite load. Newborns are born without

0:25:22.160 --> 0:25:26.639
<v Speaker 1>any barnacles, without any lice. They're an almost uniform dark gray,

0:25:26.720 --> 0:25:29.840
<v Speaker 1>almost black color, so aside from being smaller, you can

0:25:29.840 --> 0:25:32.639
<v Speaker 1>definitely identify them in the water based on their coloration,

0:25:33.119 --> 0:25:37.320
<v Speaker 1>but they swiftly obtain these parasites as well. In addition

0:25:37.359 --> 0:25:40.240
<v Speaker 1>to of course scarring from not only the parasites but

0:25:40.280 --> 0:25:44.760
<v Speaker 1>also from threats and feeding. It gives them a very

0:25:45.240 --> 0:25:50.200
<v Speaker 1>highly variable appearance, and by feeding, I mean their own feeding,

0:25:50.240 --> 0:25:53.240
<v Speaker 1>going down and scraping themselves against the bottom of the

0:25:53.280 --> 0:26:05.560
<v Speaker 1>sea floor. Before we get into the barnacle, though, I

0:26:05.600 --> 0:26:07.119
<v Speaker 1>want to talk to just a little bit about the

0:26:07.160 --> 0:26:09.680
<v Speaker 1>whale lice, because this is all part of the exo

0:26:09.720 --> 0:26:13.680
<v Speaker 1>parasite load, which according to it to Carbondine, adult gray

0:26:13.760 --> 0:26:16.960
<v Speaker 1>whales carry more exo parasites than any other whale species

0:26:17.359 --> 0:26:20.200
<v Speaker 1>on average, more than one hundred and eighty kilograms or

0:26:20.280 --> 0:26:23.040
<v Speaker 1>three hundred and ninety six pounds of the stuff, So

0:26:23.080 --> 0:26:25.920
<v Speaker 1>they get a lot living on them. Yeah, And I

0:26:26.160 --> 0:26:29.040
<v Speaker 1>didn't do a breakdown of like how how that would

0:26:29.400 --> 0:26:31.280
<v Speaker 1>that would that sort of parasite load would be like

0:26:31.440 --> 0:26:34.119
<v Speaker 1>for the human body. But I think a lot of

0:26:34.119 --> 0:26:39.439
<v Speaker 1>our repulsion to barnacles and these these these rather large

0:26:40.160 --> 0:26:43.359
<v Speaker 1>whale lies is that. Yeah, we think about ourselves, we

0:26:43.400 --> 0:26:46.920
<v Speaker 1>think about our pets, and if those were on us,

0:26:47.040 --> 0:26:50.360
<v Speaker 1>obviously we would want them remove pronto. Hold on, rob

0:26:50.359 --> 0:26:52.520
<v Speaker 1>I just tried to do the math on the on

0:26:52.600 --> 0:26:56.480
<v Speaker 1>the loading of the barnacles and whale license stuff by weight.

0:26:57.000 --> 0:26:59.240
<v Speaker 1>So if we're saying that adult gray whales can grow

0:26:59.320 --> 0:27:02.920
<v Speaker 1>up to a out forty tons, which is eighty thousand pounds,

0:27:03.119 --> 0:27:05.720
<v Speaker 1>and then you compare that to you said they could

0:27:05.760 --> 0:27:09.080
<v Speaker 1>have up to what like almost four hundred pounds of

0:27:09.119 --> 0:27:13.320
<v Speaker 1>loading of barnicles and stuff. That is about half a

0:27:13.480 --> 0:27:16.240
<v Speaker 1>percent of the body weight. So if you translate that

0:27:16.280 --> 0:27:18.359
<v Speaker 1>to a human, I don't know, a human somebody weighs

0:27:18.359 --> 0:27:21.679
<v Speaker 1>one hundred and fifty pounds, what's half of one percent

0:27:21.720 --> 0:27:24.400
<v Speaker 1>of that body weight on the outside of them? Oh,

0:27:24.480 --> 0:27:27.280
<v Speaker 1>I don't know. Its having like, you know, three quarters

0:27:27.280 --> 0:27:29.320
<v Speaker 1>of a pound of parasites on the outside of you.

0:27:29.400 --> 0:27:32.119
<v Speaker 1>That bad. I don't know how many barnacles would that be?

0:27:32.400 --> 0:27:35.640
<v Speaker 1>I don't know. M Let's say it's one barnacle which

0:27:35.640 --> 0:27:38.240
<v Speaker 1>you put up with. That's way more than one barnicle'

0:27:38.359 --> 0:27:40.520
<v Speaker 1>that's a number of barnacles. Well, I'm being generous here.

0:27:40.920 --> 0:27:42.640
<v Speaker 1>Let's let's go ahead and pare it down to just one,

0:27:42.800 --> 0:27:45.480
<v Speaker 1>maybe two barnacles. I feel like that would still feel

0:27:45.480 --> 0:27:48.040
<v Speaker 1>like one or two barnacles too many for us. But

0:27:48.080 --> 0:27:50.040
<v Speaker 1>then again, we don't live in the ocean. We don't

0:27:50.040 --> 0:27:53.600
<v Speaker 1>have barnicles, so it's not appropriate for us to really

0:27:53.600 --> 0:27:57.000
<v Speaker 1>make judgment calls like this. Okay, Well, apologies for the

0:27:57.080 --> 0:27:59.040
<v Speaker 1>rough math. I may have screwed something up there, but

0:27:59.160 --> 0:28:01.600
<v Speaker 1>of it I tried. Now I think you captured the

0:28:01.640 --> 0:28:03.439
<v Speaker 1>general feel of it, because again we have to think

0:28:03.480 --> 0:28:07.040
<v Speaker 1>about just how big these creatures are, and as we'll

0:28:07.040 --> 0:28:10.040
<v Speaker 1>probably get into the barnacles or not covering them head

0:28:10.080 --> 0:28:13.160
<v Speaker 1>to toe. It's not like a suit of barnacles. They

0:28:13.160 --> 0:28:15.199
<v Speaker 1>tend to be clusters in certain places like top of

0:28:15.200 --> 0:28:18.280
<v Speaker 1>the head, right behind the head, and some in other places. Yeah, yeah,

0:28:18.440 --> 0:28:21.760
<v Speaker 1>they got patches, little colonies. Yeah. Yeah, they have to

0:28:21.800 --> 0:28:24.240
<v Speaker 1>keep a low profile to keep from being pulled off

0:28:24.640 --> 0:28:28.120
<v Speaker 1>by the water. Though again they'll they'll often scrape against things,

0:28:28.160 --> 0:28:30.560
<v Speaker 1>and I'm off the top of my head, I'm not

0:28:30.600 --> 0:28:34.840
<v Speaker 1>sure if they're necessarily scratching to remove themselves, remove the

0:28:34.840 --> 0:28:37.000
<v Speaker 1>barnacles from their body, or if they're dealing with like

0:28:37.080 --> 0:28:40.520
<v Speaker 1>general skin discomfort or it has to do with the lice, etc.

0:28:41.160 --> 0:28:43.360
<v Speaker 1>But they end up scraping off the barnacles. Anyway, the

0:28:43.400 --> 0:28:45.520
<v Speaker 1>one whale that we saw scraping against the bottom of

0:28:45.560 --> 0:28:48.680
<v Speaker 1>the boat, there would be this colossal scraping sound and

0:28:48.680 --> 0:28:52.520
<v Speaker 1>then like a cloud of pieces of barnacle and like

0:28:52.720 --> 0:28:55.280
<v Speaker 1>I guess, maybe some dried skin and probably some loose

0:28:55.760 --> 0:28:59.560
<v Speaker 1>whale lice would come floating up through the water. That

0:29:00.120 --> 0:29:03.160
<v Speaker 1>is gross. But to remind again you said earlier, I

0:29:03.200 --> 0:29:05.800
<v Speaker 1>think you said that the lice on these whales are

0:29:05.840 --> 0:29:09.360
<v Speaker 1>not actually lice in the sense that we usually mean

0:29:09.440 --> 0:29:14.440
<v Speaker 1>like the parasitic insects that can be found on land mammals. Right. Yeah,

0:29:14.560 --> 0:29:17.400
<v Speaker 1>we call them lies because whalers saw them on the

0:29:17.680 --> 0:29:20.680
<v Speaker 1>bodies of the whales they were slaughtering, and they were

0:29:20.800 --> 0:29:23.040
<v Speaker 1>they just made the you know, I guess a natural

0:29:23.040 --> 0:29:26.560
<v Speaker 1>comparison to be made to lyce that occur on human bodies,

0:29:26.760 --> 0:29:28.360
<v Speaker 1>and they're like, oh, well, those are whale lies. But

0:29:28.440 --> 0:29:31.600
<v Speaker 1>they're they're not lies. They're actually a type of crustacean

0:29:31.960 --> 0:29:35.800
<v Speaker 1>that's related more to the skeleton shrimp, an organism we've

0:29:35.800 --> 0:29:39.080
<v Speaker 1>talked about on the show before. So what are the

0:29:39.240 --> 0:29:43.840
<v Speaker 1>so called lice doing on these whales? Okay, So, if

0:29:43.880 --> 0:29:46.280
<v Speaker 1>you pick up Carbadine's book, and again I recommend it

0:29:46.320 --> 0:29:49.040
<v Speaker 1>for whale fans out there, he has illustrations of all

0:29:49.160 --> 0:29:53.720
<v Speaker 1>four species of whale lies that you'll find on the

0:29:53.760 --> 0:29:57.680
<v Speaker 1>gray whale. Three of them are are only found on

0:29:57.720 --> 0:30:00.560
<v Speaker 1>gray whales, and then there's another variety that is found

0:30:00.560 --> 0:30:04.320
<v Speaker 1>on gray whales and bowhead whales. But yeah, they're these

0:30:04.840 --> 0:30:06.560
<v Speaker 1>They get kind of big. They can be anywhere between

0:30:06.640 --> 0:30:10.120
<v Speaker 1>three and thirty millimeters long, so at the largest a

0:30:10.120 --> 0:30:13.320
<v Speaker 1>little over an inch. A lot of the photographs you

0:30:13.400 --> 0:30:17.960
<v Speaker 1>see of the barnacles on the bodies of gray whales,

0:30:18.240 --> 0:30:21.560
<v Speaker 1>you can also see the lice clustered around them. They

0:30:21.560 --> 0:30:23.560
<v Speaker 1>have this kind of the kind of like these kind

0:30:23.560 --> 0:30:26.360
<v Speaker 1>of ridges on their bodies, though they may not be

0:30:26.640 --> 0:30:31.320
<v Speaker 1>moving during the footage. They may live in populations of

0:30:31.440 --> 0:30:34.120
<v Speaker 1>up to seventy five hundred on a single whale, and

0:30:34.160 --> 0:30:37.000
<v Speaker 1>they generally live and die on the same whale, though

0:30:37.080 --> 0:30:39.840
<v Speaker 1>there is some degree of transference that takes place when

0:30:39.880 --> 0:30:42.840
<v Speaker 1>the whales are in close confinance with each other. But

0:30:42.920 --> 0:30:45.680
<v Speaker 1>they have no free swimming stage in their development, No,

0:30:45.920 --> 0:30:49.320
<v Speaker 1>no stage in their development in which they're swimming free

0:30:49.400 --> 0:30:52.280
<v Speaker 1>and they're running across other whales. If they're going to

0:30:52.360 --> 0:30:55.520
<v Speaker 1>jump ship, they've got to like jump ship straight to

0:30:55.600 --> 0:31:00.320
<v Speaker 1>another whale. Yeah, but all this, like the brand ending

0:31:00.360 --> 0:31:03.400
<v Speaker 1>of whale lies, it just made me sort of automatically assume, well,

0:31:03.400 --> 0:31:05.880
<v Speaker 1>they're drinking whale blood. Clearly, that's what they're doing, but

0:31:05.960 --> 0:31:09.240
<v Speaker 1>that's not what they're doing. Carboding notes that they don't

0:31:09.320 --> 0:31:13.960
<v Speaker 1>drink blood. They eat whale skin that's come off just

0:31:14.040 --> 0:31:18.160
<v Speaker 1>you know, like like old essentially like eating dry skin,

0:31:18.200 --> 0:31:21.040
<v Speaker 1>except in the water. They're possibly eating a little bit

0:31:21.080 --> 0:31:23.920
<v Speaker 1>of bacteria and algae as well, and they'll also eat

0:31:24.000 --> 0:31:28.920
<v Speaker 1>damage tissue. So carboding, writes quote. Though usually considered parasites,

0:31:28.960 --> 0:31:33.160
<v Speaker 1>they might be more accurately described as cleaning symbians awsome,

0:31:33.200 --> 0:31:37.440
<v Speaker 1>maybe providing a benefit to the whale. Yeah, yeah, now,

0:31:37.480 --> 0:31:39.680
<v Speaker 1>it's it's still worth noting that if there is an

0:31:39.680 --> 0:31:43.160
<v Speaker 1>excessively large population, that might be an indicator of poor

0:31:43.240 --> 0:31:48.040
<v Speaker 1>health for an individual whale. But you know, that's you know, obviously,

0:31:48.040 --> 0:31:49.960
<v Speaker 1>if an organism is in poor health, a lot of

0:31:49.960 --> 0:31:52.400
<v Speaker 1>things are going to be out of whack, including the

0:31:52.440 --> 0:31:54.920
<v Speaker 1>amount of creatures living on its hide. Yes, and that's

0:31:54.920 --> 0:31:57.800
<v Speaker 1>true for organisms living on and in all kinds of

0:31:57.800 --> 0:32:01.280
<v Speaker 1>other larger organisms. It's true for us, like our gut

0:32:02.560 --> 0:32:05.920
<v Speaker 1>microbiome is useful to us. All of those bacteria in

0:32:05.960 --> 0:32:09.640
<v Speaker 1>our guts are helpful, but if there something goes wrong

0:32:09.680 --> 0:32:13.760
<v Speaker 1>with our immune system, they can turn opportunistic. Absolutely. Now,

0:32:13.760 --> 0:32:17.480
<v Speaker 1>coming back to the barnacles Carveding notes that quote the

0:32:17.560 --> 0:32:20.560
<v Speaker 1>barnacles are thought to be host specific to gray whales,

0:32:20.960 --> 0:32:24.720
<v Speaker 1>though there are isolated examples on captive bottlenose dolphins and

0:32:24.760 --> 0:32:29.360
<v Speaker 1>beluga whales and one wild killer whale, and their life

0:32:29.360 --> 0:32:33.520
<v Speaker 1>cycle is synchronous with that of their hosts. And he

0:32:33.800 --> 0:32:37.040
<v Speaker 1>notes elsewhere that there are four species of whale acorn

0:32:37.080 --> 0:32:42.440
<v Speaker 1>barnacles in general, in three genera. But we're talking about

0:32:42.480 --> 0:32:48.040
<v Speaker 1>one particular species of acorn barnacle that is found on

0:32:48.080 --> 0:32:54.400
<v Speaker 1>the skin of the gray whale, and that is Cryptolepis RACHIANECTI. Sorry,

0:32:54.960 --> 0:32:58.600
<v Speaker 1>barnacles if I butchered your scientific man a little bit there, Joe,

0:32:58.640 --> 0:33:01.640
<v Speaker 1>you were kind enough to include a lot of close

0:33:01.720 --> 0:33:07.000
<v Speaker 1>up images of art of acorn barnacles in our notes here.

0:33:07.280 --> 0:33:11.800
<v Speaker 1>Would you describe these for the listeners? Well, different barnacles

0:33:11.840 --> 0:33:17.320
<v Speaker 1>have different outer appearances, and I guess this is because barnacles,

0:33:17.400 --> 0:33:22.480
<v Speaker 1>much like coral, they are small marine invertebrates, but they

0:33:22.520 --> 0:33:29.040
<v Speaker 1>are perhaps most visually notable for the external mineral structures

0:33:29.040 --> 0:33:32.560
<v Speaker 1>that they build, and those structures can sometimes be confused

0:33:32.600 --> 0:33:36.160
<v Speaker 1>with the flesh of the animals themselves. But barnacles are

0:33:36.160 --> 0:33:39.880
<v Speaker 1>actually crustaceans, so they are closely related to animals like

0:33:39.920 --> 0:33:44.280
<v Speaker 1>shrimp and crabs. And when you've seen barnacles in the past,

0:33:44.480 --> 0:33:47.360
<v Speaker 1>probably the main thing you've noticed are these external plates,

0:33:47.360 --> 0:33:50.160
<v Speaker 1>which are made of calcium carbonate. They're made of the

0:33:50.200 --> 0:33:54.600
<v Speaker 1>same material as eggshells or oyster shells or coral skeletons

0:33:54.680 --> 0:33:59.000
<v Speaker 1>and so forth, And in barnacles, these calcium carbonate plates

0:33:59.040 --> 0:34:02.120
<v Speaker 1>can have different front appearances. Some kind of like flower

0:34:02.160 --> 0:34:07.280
<v Speaker 1>buds made out of stone, or some look like cement pumpkins,

0:34:07.320 --> 0:34:11.640
<v Speaker 1>some look like tiny volcano calderas. If you zoom way out,

0:34:11.680 --> 0:34:13.879
<v Speaker 1>some of the colonies look as I mentioned earlier, kind

0:34:13.880 --> 0:34:16.880
<v Speaker 1>of like groupings of lichen on a piece of granite.

0:34:17.160 --> 0:34:19.360
<v Speaker 1>But if you zoom in and you see the shapes

0:34:19.400 --> 0:34:21.080
<v Speaker 1>and you see the kind of holes at the top

0:34:21.120 --> 0:34:25.360
<v Speaker 1>of each barnacle, they also kind of resembled the photos

0:34:25.400 --> 0:34:28.000
<v Speaker 1>that people freak out about online. And I'm never sure

0:34:28.000 --> 0:34:31.120
<v Speaker 1>how much of this freak out is kind of performative

0:34:31.120 --> 0:34:34.040
<v Speaker 1>ironic thing, but about like tryptophobia images, you know, the

0:34:34.080 --> 0:34:38.440
<v Speaker 1>lotus pod thing. I don't share this reaction, but while

0:34:38.520 --> 0:34:42.600
<v Speaker 1>reading about barnacles, I came to glean that some people

0:34:42.640 --> 0:34:47.319
<v Speaker 1>are deeply viscerally repulsed by the appearance of them. And

0:34:47.360 --> 0:34:48.960
<v Speaker 1>I didn't even know if I was going to mention this,

0:34:49.040 --> 0:34:52.160
<v Speaker 1>but I was seeing a couple of cases where there'd

0:34:52.200 --> 0:34:56.279
<v Speaker 1>be like an article on the internet about barnacles or

0:34:56.280 --> 0:34:58.600
<v Speaker 1>that featured pictures of barnacles. Then you scroll down you

0:34:58.640 --> 0:35:01.880
<v Speaker 1>look at the comments, and some people are reacting not

0:35:01.920 --> 0:35:04.200
<v Speaker 1>just with disgust, I mean there is plenty of that,

0:35:04.239 --> 0:35:07.800
<v Speaker 1>but with like moral outrage at the author for posting

0:35:07.840 --> 0:35:11.440
<v Speaker 1>these pictures, like you did something bad by showing me barnacles.

0:35:12.239 --> 0:35:15.359
<v Speaker 1>I don't quite get that, but I think it may

0:35:15.440 --> 0:35:18.719
<v Speaker 1>overlap with the trip to phobia thing, which, as I

0:35:18.719 --> 0:35:20.719
<v Speaker 1>said a minute ago, I still am not sure how

0:35:20.800 --> 0:35:23.640
<v Speaker 1>much of that is kind of like the creepy clown thing,

0:35:23.719 --> 0:35:26.120
<v Speaker 1>like like a fear that people are playing up on

0:35:26.239 --> 0:35:30.080
<v Speaker 1>purpose to be funny, or how much like their moral

0:35:30.120 --> 0:35:36.680
<v Speaker 1>outrage is just like a genuine emotional overload reaction. Yeah,

0:35:36.719 --> 0:35:40.000
<v Speaker 1>I'm not sure either, but I will say that, you know,

0:35:40.040 --> 0:35:43.799
<v Speaker 1>with the particularly with the acorn barnacles here, they look

0:35:43.840 --> 0:35:46.080
<v Speaker 1>a lot to me like the eye of sauron. They

0:35:46.080 --> 0:35:49.000
<v Speaker 1>have that kind of appearance. Yeah, so there's something a

0:35:49.000 --> 0:35:53.719
<v Speaker 1>little unnerving about them. Also, I think it's one thing

0:35:53.760 --> 0:35:55.880
<v Speaker 1>to see barnacles like this on say the whole of

0:35:55.880 --> 0:35:58.920
<v Speaker 1>the ship, or you know, barnacles of another variety, But

0:35:58.920 --> 0:36:01.719
<v Speaker 1>when they're on a living organism, um, I think maybe

0:36:01.760 --> 0:36:04.840
<v Speaker 1>there's sometimes sort of category confusion going on. Yes, and

0:36:05.239 --> 0:36:11.680
<v Speaker 1>particularly with these sort of round aperture appearing barnacles, we

0:36:11.920 --> 0:36:15.239
<v Speaker 1>I think our minds instantly go to poor an anomalies.

0:36:15.239 --> 0:36:17.520
<v Speaker 1>We think of like clogged pores, We think of pimples,

0:36:17.520 --> 0:36:21.120
<v Speaker 1>we think of various openings that may occur in um

0:36:22.000 --> 0:36:26.080
<v Speaker 1>diseased flesh. And that's maybe where our mind goes, like

0:36:26.120 --> 0:36:29.440
<v Speaker 1>that's the nearest analogy that we have as as surface

0:36:29.520 --> 0:36:32.799
<v Speaker 1>dwellers and uh, and so we think about all that

0:36:33.040 --> 0:36:35.799
<v Speaker 1>when we see barnacles on sale whale. Yeah, I can

0:36:35.920 --> 0:36:39.760
<v Speaker 1>understand that, and I certainly share that I react differently

0:36:39.760 --> 0:36:42.719
<v Speaker 1>when I see them on an animal versus on just

0:36:42.880 --> 0:36:45.320
<v Speaker 1>you know, growing on the you know, the the piling

0:36:45.360 --> 0:36:48.680
<v Speaker 1>that appear is resting on or something. Yeah, you know,

0:36:48.680 --> 0:36:51.239
<v Speaker 1>seeing the whales in the wild and seeing one close up,

0:36:51.239 --> 0:36:53.359
<v Speaker 1>like they're close enough where you could you could touch

0:36:53.400 --> 0:36:56.239
<v Speaker 1>the barnacles if you wanted to. I did not, m

0:36:56.360 --> 0:36:59.520
<v Speaker 1>and I only only touch the whale once. I'm like,

0:36:59.600 --> 0:37:02.160
<v Speaker 1>that's good. We need to make physical contact with the

0:37:02.160 --> 0:37:05.640
<v Speaker 1>great whale once and I'm good. But you know, there

0:37:05.719 --> 0:37:08.839
<v Speaker 1>is this kind of like feeling that that you end

0:37:08.880 --> 0:37:11.719
<v Speaker 1>up having her. It's like should I help? Should I scrape?

0:37:12.080 --> 0:37:13.800
<v Speaker 1>You know, not that you would, but you know you

0:37:14.680 --> 0:37:16.799
<v Speaker 1>want to sort of help the creature. Again. You think

0:37:16.800 --> 0:37:19.640
<v Speaker 1>of it almost like a dog, whereas you're if your

0:37:19.640 --> 0:37:23.319
<v Speaker 1>dog came up and your dog had some sort of orrels,

0:37:23.920 --> 0:37:25.920
<v Speaker 1>seed pods or something stuck in its fur, like you'd

0:37:25.920 --> 0:37:27.440
<v Speaker 1>want to help it out. If your cat has a

0:37:27.760 --> 0:37:29.759
<v Speaker 1>has something stuck in its fur, you're going to reach

0:37:29.760 --> 0:37:32.399
<v Speaker 1>in there and uh and pull it out and get

0:37:32.440 --> 0:37:36.240
<v Speaker 1>bitten as as a thank you. But you know, the whales,

0:37:36.239 --> 0:37:38.560
<v Speaker 1>they're not asking for this treatment. Well, And as I'll

0:37:38.600 --> 0:37:41.720
<v Speaker 1>get to in a minute, I think there's more ambiguity

0:37:41.760 --> 0:37:45.799
<v Speaker 1>than we met realizing about exactly what the pluses and

0:37:45.840 --> 0:37:49.640
<v Speaker 1>minuses of this relationship are, but a little more a

0:37:49.640 --> 0:37:52.560
<v Speaker 1>little more about barnacles themselves. So the life cycle of

0:37:52.600 --> 0:37:56.439
<v Speaker 1>a barnacle goes like this. It begins as a microscopic

0:37:56.560 --> 0:37:58.880
<v Speaker 1>larva that looks kind of like a cross between a

0:37:59.040 --> 0:38:03.520
<v Speaker 1>flea and to shrimp. And in this larval stage, after

0:38:03.640 --> 0:38:07.280
<v Speaker 1>being released by the parent, the barnacle swims around freely

0:38:07.320 --> 0:38:09.719
<v Speaker 1>in the water column, so it begins life as a

0:38:09.719 --> 0:38:12.960
<v Speaker 1>free swimming organism. It's just one of the trillions of

0:38:13.080 --> 0:38:17.200
<v Speaker 1>zooplankton bobbing around out there in the ocean. And as

0:38:17.200 --> 0:38:21.360
<v Speaker 1>a larva, the barnacle's primary mission is to find a home.

0:38:21.480 --> 0:38:24.040
<v Speaker 1>It's looking for real estate it can stake out where

0:38:24.080 --> 0:38:27.239
<v Speaker 1>it will spend the rest of its life. It does

0:38:27.320 --> 0:38:30.920
<v Speaker 1>this by exploring various surfaces and testing the properties of

0:38:30.960 --> 0:38:34.719
<v Speaker 1>these surfaces. A lot of species are attracted to chemicals

0:38:34.760 --> 0:38:37.480
<v Speaker 1>secreted by adult barnacles that let them know they have

0:38:37.600 --> 0:38:41.520
<v Speaker 1>encountered a good place to swarm and congregate. And when

0:38:41.560 --> 0:38:44.759
<v Speaker 1>the larva finds a surface it approves of, it proceeds

0:38:44.800 --> 0:38:49.680
<v Speaker 1>to glue its head down permanently. So the barnacle secretes

0:38:49.800 --> 0:38:53.600
<v Speaker 1>a form of quick drying adhesive from its antennae, and

0:38:54.040 --> 0:38:57.160
<v Speaker 1>it cements itself and this is again head down to

0:38:57.239 --> 0:38:59.440
<v Speaker 1>the place where it will spend the rest of its life.

0:39:00.239 --> 0:39:03.279
<v Speaker 1>Barnacle cement is one of the strongest, if not the

0:39:03.480 --> 0:39:07.960
<v Speaker 1>single strongest adhesive substance known in nature, so much that

0:39:08.560 --> 0:39:12.719
<v Speaker 1>scientists have studied it in hopes of developing better synthetic

0:39:12.800 --> 0:39:17.360
<v Speaker 1>glues for use in medicine and microelectronics, especially in conditions

0:39:17.360 --> 0:39:20.040
<v Speaker 1>where you need to glue things together that are already wet.

0:39:20.200 --> 0:39:22.920
<v Speaker 1>That's kind of interesting property, as like, so you're already

0:39:23.000 --> 0:39:26.800
<v Speaker 1>under the water, both surfaces are wet, so how exactly

0:39:26.800 --> 0:39:31.120
<v Speaker 1>do you glue this together effectively? Interesting. Once a barnacle

0:39:31.200 --> 0:39:35.360
<v Speaker 1>is fixed to whatever surface it has chosen, it begins

0:39:35.520 --> 0:39:40.160
<v Speaker 1>building its calcium carbonate outer plates, and it begins eating

0:39:40.160 --> 0:39:43.600
<v Speaker 1>and growing. And the barnacle's shell on the outside typically

0:39:43.640 --> 0:39:46.800
<v Speaker 1>consists of plates that surround the animal on all sides

0:39:46.840 --> 0:39:50.120
<v Speaker 1>to form a kind of cone, and then usually a

0:39:50.120 --> 0:39:52.839
<v Speaker 1>few more plates on top that form a sort of

0:39:52.960 --> 0:39:56.160
<v Speaker 1>door that the barnacle can close when it's threatened or

0:39:56.239 --> 0:40:00.360
<v Speaker 1>closed to conserve moisture, say, if it's in an intertidal area,

0:40:00.400 --> 0:40:02.719
<v Speaker 1>when the tide goes out, the barnacles exposed to the air,

0:40:02.760 --> 0:40:05.320
<v Speaker 1>it can close up its door to keep some liquid inside,

0:40:06.440 --> 0:40:09.239
<v Speaker 1>and then of course it can open them again when

0:40:09.239 --> 0:40:13.439
<v Speaker 1>it is time to feed. Barnacles are filter feeders, much

0:40:13.520 --> 0:40:18.400
<v Speaker 1>like baleen whales, but while whales feed by pushing water

0:40:18.560 --> 0:40:23.120
<v Speaker 1>through their baleen, barnacles feed by waving their feet around

0:40:23.200 --> 0:40:27.680
<v Speaker 1>in the water. Barnacles have these little legs called cerri,

0:40:28.080 --> 0:40:31.799
<v Speaker 1>which are segmented like the appendages of other crustaceans, but

0:40:32.239 --> 0:40:35.560
<v Speaker 1>covered in long little filaments, so they look like a

0:40:35.640 --> 0:40:41.160
<v Speaker 1>cross between curly shrimp legs and peacock feathers. Rob I've

0:40:41.200 --> 0:40:43.640
<v Speaker 1>attached some pictures for you to look at while I'm

0:40:43.640 --> 0:40:46.000
<v Speaker 1>describing here. So they often get the kind of like

0:40:46.120 --> 0:40:48.520
<v Speaker 1>fan these out, and they do really kind of look

0:40:48.560 --> 0:40:51.640
<v Speaker 1>like a fan a bunch of these legs arranged in

0:40:51.719 --> 0:40:55.520
<v Speaker 1>parallel with these little feathery kind of hairs coming off

0:40:55.520 --> 0:40:59.080
<v Speaker 1>of them, and they essentially function like fishing nets. The

0:40:59.120 --> 0:41:03.240
<v Speaker 1>barnacles wave of these cri through the water, collecting plankton

0:41:03.400 --> 0:41:06.840
<v Speaker 1>and organic detritus, and then drawing them into the shell

0:41:07.239 --> 0:41:11.760
<v Speaker 1>to bring the food to their mouths. Yeah, this image

0:41:11.800 --> 0:41:14.640
<v Speaker 1>is very delightful, and I guess it's it's it's harder

0:41:14.680 --> 0:41:17.520
<v Speaker 1>to hate on barnacles as much if you think of

0:41:17.520 --> 0:41:22.080
<v Speaker 1>them as like tiny old people who set down forever

0:41:22.719 --> 0:41:25.240
<v Speaker 1>on you know, say, the deck of a cruise ship,

0:41:25.560 --> 0:41:28.439
<v Speaker 1>glue their butts down, and then begin to wave their

0:41:28.680 --> 0:41:32.080
<v Speaker 1>fancily dressed legs in the air. Well. Yeah, that's right.

0:41:32.320 --> 0:41:34.760
<v Speaker 1>It wouldn't be gluing their butts, it would be gluing

0:41:34.800 --> 0:41:38.279
<v Speaker 1>their foreheads down. So you would have to imagine the

0:41:38.360 --> 0:41:41.040
<v Speaker 1>human analogy is if you lived by gluing your forehead

0:41:41.080 --> 0:41:45.320
<v Speaker 1>to a rock and then surrounding yourself with external bone

0:41:45.360 --> 0:41:48.480
<v Speaker 1>places like you grow some bones on the outside, their

0:41:48.520 --> 0:41:51.080
<v Speaker 1>bones that live outside. You surround yourself with that. Then

0:41:51.080 --> 0:41:53.480
<v Speaker 1>you wave your feet around in the air until you

0:41:53.600 --> 0:41:56.759
<v Speaker 1>catch i don't know, something dead with your toes and

0:41:56.840 --> 0:41:59.040
<v Speaker 1>your leg hairs, and then you bring that down to

0:41:59.080 --> 0:42:02.680
<v Speaker 1>your mouth. Okay, well that sounds a little more monstrous again,

0:42:02.719 --> 0:42:15.880
<v Speaker 1>we're skewing monstrous again, but it's still delightful than Another

0:42:15.920 --> 0:42:21.480
<v Speaker 1>really amazing thing about barnacles is their sexual reproduction. Barnacles,

0:42:21.600 --> 0:42:25.120
<v Speaker 1>typically in the same individual, have both male and female

0:42:25.160 --> 0:42:29.200
<v Speaker 1>sex organs, but they can't reproduce asexually. They don't bud

0:42:29.320 --> 0:42:32.680
<v Speaker 1>like some other sessile organisms. They have to find a

0:42:32.760 --> 0:42:36.480
<v Speaker 1>partner to mate with, but they're barnacles. They are stuck

0:42:36.520 --> 0:42:38.880
<v Speaker 1>to one place, remember, glued the forehead down, so they

0:42:38.920 --> 0:42:42.640
<v Speaker 1>can't go wandering around to locate a mate. Other sessile

0:42:42.760 --> 0:42:46.919
<v Speaker 1>organisms deal with the fact that they are immobile by

0:42:47.120 --> 0:42:50.040
<v Speaker 1>simply kind of spamming the water with sperm and eggs

0:42:50.080 --> 0:42:52.919
<v Speaker 1>and hoping to to you know, hoping that those sex

0:42:52.960 --> 0:42:55.640
<v Speaker 1>cells meet up with opposite sex cells somewhere out there.

0:42:55.760 --> 0:42:59.040
<v Speaker 1>This is known as broadcast spawning. I've read it alleged

0:42:59.040 --> 0:43:02.680
<v Speaker 1>in many sources. The barnacles never do this, They don't

0:43:02.680 --> 0:43:06.000
<v Speaker 1>do exactly that with both sex cells, but it does

0:43:06.000 --> 0:43:09.399
<v Speaker 1>seem some barnacles engage in sperm casting, or at least

0:43:09.400 --> 0:43:11.760
<v Speaker 1>the sperm but not the eggs, are released into open

0:43:11.800 --> 0:43:14.680
<v Speaker 1>water just in hopes that it will drift to an

0:43:14.680 --> 0:43:18.239
<v Speaker 1>individual with an egg cell. This is according to one

0:43:18.280 --> 0:43:23.080
<v Speaker 1>paper I found by Marion Barazande at All called Something

0:43:23.160 --> 0:43:27.480
<v Speaker 1>Darwin Didn't Know about Barnacles sperm cast Mating in a

0:43:27.560 --> 0:43:31.760
<v Speaker 1>common stock species, published in Proceedings of the Royal Society

0:43:31.800 --> 0:43:36.040
<v Speaker 1>b Biological Sciences in twenty thirteen. This experiment found that

0:43:36.360 --> 0:43:41.400
<v Speaker 1>Pacific intertital gooseneck barnacles do sometimes fertile fertilize eggs by

0:43:41.440 --> 0:43:45.040
<v Speaker 1>sperm casting. But this result was surprising, and the very

0:43:45.120 --> 0:43:48.080
<v Speaker 1>reason it was surprising was that for the most part,

0:43:48.200 --> 0:43:52.560
<v Speaker 1>barnacles have a different strategy. They actually physically copulate, or

0:43:52.600 --> 0:43:56.200
<v Speaker 1>as the scientists call it, pseudo copulate in order to

0:43:56.320 --> 0:43:59.240
<v Speaker 1>exchange sperm, which means they have to find a mate

0:43:59.320 --> 0:44:03.799
<v Speaker 1>by reach, which so for this reason, it has been

0:44:03.800 --> 0:44:08.400
<v Speaker 1>suggested that barnacles probably have the longest penis to body

0:44:08.480 --> 0:44:12.440
<v Speaker 1>size ratio of any animal on Earth, with penises measuring

0:44:12.760 --> 0:44:15.160
<v Speaker 1>more than the rest of the total length of the

0:44:15.200 --> 0:44:18.560
<v Speaker 1>body many times over. I've read different estimates for this.

0:44:18.800 --> 0:44:21.520
<v Speaker 1>Exactly how much longer it is seems unclear, but a

0:44:21.640 --> 0:44:25.319
<v Speaker 1>commonly cited figure is eight times body length. And these

0:44:25.320 --> 0:44:27.680
<v Speaker 1>are used kind of how you might imagine. They sense around.

0:44:27.719 --> 0:44:30.640
<v Speaker 1>They feel around at their neighbors to find a neighbor

0:44:30.719 --> 0:44:35.120
<v Speaker 1>to pseudo copulate with, and barnacles can act either as

0:44:35.239 --> 0:44:38.200
<v Speaker 1>males or females for the purposes of mating. So they

0:44:38.200 --> 0:44:43.440
<v Speaker 1>all possess these penises, and they're fascinating and remarkably adaptable organs.

0:44:43.480 --> 0:44:48.880
<v Speaker 1>Depending on environmental conditions, so like one factor is the

0:44:50.360 --> 0:44:53.279
<v Speaker 1>choppiness of the water around them, so they will grow

0:44:53.440 --> 0:44:56.960
<v Speaker 1>longer and calmer waters, but shorter and thicker and choppy

0:44:57.000 --> 0:45:00.799
<v Speaker 1>turbulent waters, because as you can imagine, long, thin appendages

0:45:00.840 --> 0:45:03.760
<v Speaker 1>are more difficult to control when the water is moving

0:45:03.800 --> 0:45:07.839
<v Speaker 1>around a lot. But the properties of this organ also

0:45:07.960 --> 0:45:11.880
<v Speaker 1>depend on the density of barnacle population. So when neighbors

0:45:11.880 --> 0:45:14.439
<v Speaker 1>are nearby, they don't need to reach as far, so

0:45:14.480 --> 0:45:16.920
<v Speaker 1>they will be shorter and less elastic. But when neighbors

0:45:16.920 --> 0:45:19.959
<v Speaker 1>are sparse, when the population is less dense, they grow

0:45:20.239 --> 0:45:23.360
<v Speaker 1>very long and elastic. Yeah. I remember a friend of

0:45:23.360 --> 0:45:25.920
<v Speaker 1>the show, Mara Hart, in her book Sex in the

0:45:25.960 --> 0:45:29.000
<v Speaker 1>Sea as the whole section talking about barnacles and their

0:45:29.000 --> 0:45:32.160
<v Speaker 1>reproductive strategies. Yeah, I remember Mara having a lot of

0:45:32.520 --> 0:45:37.840
<v Speaker 1>barnacle penis is officially amazing. But anyway, so as filter feeders,

0:45:38.680 --> 0:45:43.560
<v Speaker 1>barnacles usually attached themselves to stationary objects in places with

0:45:43.600 --> 0:45:46.040
<v Speaker 1>a lot of activity, whether that's a rock or part

0:45:46.040 --> 0:45:48.279
<v Speaker 1>of a human built structure or something else that they

0:45:48.280 --> 0:45:52.600
<v Speaker 1>will attach themselves to a place where there's a lot

0:45:52.600 --> 0:45:55.160
<v Speaker 1>of exchange of water back and forth, because again they

0:45:55.200 --> 0:45:58.160
<v Speaker 1>can't go out hunting. They need water containing their food

0:45:58.440 --> 0:46:01.080
<v Speaker 1>to wash over them. So it's no good for a

0:46:01.080 --> 0:46:04.480
<v Speaker 1>barnacle to sit around in calm, still waters. They want

0:46:04.520 --> 0:46:09.920
<v Speaker 1>flow in exchange, location, location, location exactly. Yeah, you want

0:46:09.960 --> 0:46:14.920
<v Speaker 1>foot traffic. Oftentimes this means posting up in the intertidal

0:46:15.040 --> 0:46:17.080
<v Speaker 1>zone where the tides are going to charge in and

0:46:17.120 --> 0:46:19.480
<v Speaker 1>then drain out throughout the day. But if you're a

0:46:19.520 --> 0:46:23.160
<v Speaker 1>really lucky barnacle, you could manage to attach yourself to

0:46:23.239 --> 0:46:27.120
<v Speaker 1>a rock that moves, a rock that travels along its

0:46:27.160 --> 0:46:30.480
<v Speaker 1>own course, causing water full of plankton and other goodies

0:46:30.520 --> 0:46:34.400
<v Speaker 1>to wash over you constantly. And for this reason you

0:46:34.440 --> 0:46:37.520
<v Speaker 1>will see barnacles do well by attaching themselves to the

0:46:37.600 --> 0:46:41.160
<v Speaker 1>hulls of ships. This is a common problem in shipping.

0:46:41.640 --> 0:46:45.080
<v Speaker 1>But for millions of years, before there were ships, there

0:46:45.080 --> 0:46:49.480
<v Speaker 1>were whales, giant boulders that swim, and of course before

0:46:49.600 --> 0:46:52.440
<v Speaker 1>whales there were sea turtles. And I believe I was

0:46:52.520 --> 0:46:57.680
<v Speaker 1>reading that whale barnacles derived from seaturtle barnacles. That's right.

0:46:57.719 --> 0:47:00.560
<v Speaker 1>It is thought that whale barnacles evolved from what are

0:47:00.600 --> 0:47:05.160
<v Speaker 1>called turtle barnacles, which don't just occupy turtles. They found

0:47:05.160 --> 0:47:08.040
<v Speaker 1>them the shells of sea turtles, but also other things

0:47:08.040 --> 0:47:12.200
<v Speaker 1>like the carapace of crabs, and and on some sirenians

0:47:12.200 --> 0:47:15.319
<v Speaker 1>like like manatees and so forth. But you can you

0:47:15.320 --> 0:47:19.640
<v Speaker 1>can imagine the why this diversification takes place when whales

0:47:19.719 --> 0:47:25.120
<v Speaker 1>become a possibility. Oh, these vast expanses of high to colonize,

0:47:25.440 --> 0:47:29.040
<v Speaker 1>so many whales, especially filter feeding whales, are known to

0:47:29.080 --> 0:47:34.480
<v Speaker 1>accumulate barnacles, but gray whales really excel as barnacle hosts.

0:47:34.640 --> 0:47:39.120
<v Speaker 1>In tons of pictures of these animals again, they just uh,

0:47:39.400 --> 0:47:41.600
<v Speaker 1>you know, you will see them covered in patches of

0:47:41.640 --> 0:47:45.680
<v Speaker 1>these things. There's one species of acorn barnacle you mentioned

0:47:45.680 --> 0:47:50.359
<v Speaker 1>them earlier, called Cryptolipus racy and ecti. These have been

0:47:50.560 --> 0:47:54.000
<v Speaker 1>allegedly living off of gray whales in particular for millions

0:47:54.000 --> 0:47:58.200
<v Speaker 1>of years. But looking at whale barnacles in general, I

0:47:58.280 --> 0:48:00.520
<v Speaker 1>wanted to return to this question of what is the

0:48:00.600 --> 0:48:05.640
<v Speaker 1>exact symbiotic relationship between whales and their barnacles. Are the

0:48:05.680 --> 0:48:10.600
<v Speaker 1>barnacles actual parasites causing net harm to their hosts, or

0:48:10.800 --> 0:48:13.839
<v Speaker 1>is the relationship an example of what biologists would call

0:48:13.960 --> 0:48:18.200
<v Speaker 1>commensalism where the host is not really impacted one way

0:48:18.280 --> 0:48:21.239
<v Speaker 1>or the other, but the barnacle gets a benefit. Or

0:48:21.400 --> 0:48:25.400
<v Speaker 1>is it possible there are mutualistic benefits. Do both the

0:48:25.440 --> 0:48:28.640
<v Speaker 1>whale and the barnacle get something good out of the relationship.

0:48:29.000 --> 0:48:31.759
<v Speaker 1>It seems like for a long time experts thought that

0:48:31.880 --> 0:48:35.719
<v Speaker 1>whales and their barnacles were generally an example of a

0:48:35.760 --> 0:48:39.680
<v Speaker 1>commensal relationship. So the barnacles get a benefit, get the

0:48:39.680 --> 0:48:42.240
<v Speaker 1>benefit of a moving substrate to bring them a steady

0:48:42.239 --> 0:48:46.040
<v Speaker 1>flow of plankton, as well as getting general protection from predators.

0:48:46.040 --> 0:48:49.799
<v Speaker 1>And you can see this reduced risk of predation when

0:48:49.880 --> 0:48:52.400
<v Speaker 1>attached to a whale body in the fact that whale

0:48:52.440 --> 0:48:57.000
<v Speaker 1>barnacles in particular have evolved to possess a less defensively

0:48:57.080 --> 0:49:01.560
<v Speaker 1>oriented outer plate structure they usually have rob If you

0:49:01.600 --> 0:49:04.440
<v Speaker 1>compare pictures of different kind of barnacles, it seems like

0:49:04.440 --> 0:49:07.320
<v Speaker 1>whale barnacles often just have more kind of fleshy bits

0:49:07.400 --> 0:49:09.879
<v Speaker 1>poking out of their shells at all times. They don't

0:49:09.880 --> 0:49:14.239
<v Speaker 1>close their plate doors completely or as completely, so they

0:49:14.280 --> 0:49:16.600
<v Speaker 1>just seem like they have to be less focused on

0:49:16.680 --> 0:49:19.760
<v Speaker 1>defense than some of their barnacles are. This probably also

0:49:19.880 --> 0:49:24.800
<v Speaker 1>contributes to the disturbing quality of to some to seeing

0:49:24.880 --> 0:49:28.880
<v Speaker 1>barnacles on whales, because it's more obviously some sort of

0:49:28.880 --> 0:49:31.680
<v Speaker 1>creature living on the whales hide and you can't just

0:49:32.000 --> 0:49:35.480
<v Speaker 1>dismiss it as seeing some sort of stone like de

0:49:35.520 --> 0:49:38.960
<v Speaker 1>try this that's built up there, right, So what's undeniable

0:49:39.200 --> 0:49:42.040
<v Speaker 1>is that the barnacles get a benefit from the relationship.

0:49:42.320 --> 0:49:45.520
<v Speaker 1>But is it true that the relationship is basically nothing

0:49:45.560 --> 0:49:49.280
<v Speaker 1>to the whale, neither helpful nor harmful. Well, this seems

0:49:49.400 --> 0:49:53.120
<v Speaker 1>very debatable. For one thing, having barnacles on the skin

0:49:53.320 --> 0:49:58.360
<v Speaker 1>would quite clearly reduce the hydrodynamic efficiency of the whales movement.

0:49:58.880 --> 0:50:01.200
<v Speaker 1>As a point of analogy, this is not a perfect analogy,

0:50:01.320 --> 0:50:05.400
<v Speaker 1>but I was reading from the National Marine Sanctuary Foundation

0:50:06.000 --> 0:50:09.520
<v Speaker 1>about the effect of barnacles on hips built by humans,

0:50:09.520 --> 0:50:12.160
<v Speaker 1>and they write, quote, the US Navy estimates that heavy

0:50:12.160 --> 0:50:15.560
<v Speaker 1>barnacle growth on ships can add weight and increase drag

0:50:15.680 --> 0:50:18.839
<v Speaker 1>by nearly sixty percent, which can lead to as much

0:50:18.880 --> 0:50:22.960
<v Speaker 1>as a forty percent increase in fuel consumption. Now, obviously

0:50:23.000 --> 0:50:26.280
<v Speaker 1>those figures don't map exactly onto an organism like a whale,

0:50:26.560 --> 0:50:29.279
<v Speaker 1>but the principle holds true. It seems clear that barnacles

0:50:29.320 --> 0:50:33.520
<v Speaker 1>would make a whale a less efficient swimmer, even if

0:50:33.560 --> 0:50:37.720
<v Speaker 1>only by a marginal percent. Also, the fact that whales

0:50:37.760 --> 0:50:41.799
<v Speaker 1>have been observed to engage in behavior that looks like

0:50:41.880 --> 0:50:45.640
<v Speaker 1>an attempt to remove barnacles would probably also mean that

0:50:45.719 --> 0:50:48.279
<v Speaker 1>they are at least somewhat perceived as a nuisance by

0:50:48.320 --> 0:50:51.320
<v Speaker 1>the whale, at least assuming those interpretations of that behavior

0:50:51.440 --> 0:50:53.720
<v Speaker 1>is correct. Now, Robert I. Can't remember if you mentioned

0:50:53.760 --> 0:50:55.800
<v Speaker 1>it earlier, but you had said something to me about

0:50:56.920 --> 0:51:01.160
<v Speaker 1>observations of whales appearing to one us scrape barnacles off

0:51:01.160 --> 0:51:04.879
<v Speaker 1>their body, maybe by rubbing up against things, and and

0:51:05.360 --> 0:51:08.239
<v Speaker 1>maybe we don't understand exactly what the purpose of that

0:51:08.280 --> 0:51:10.799
<v Speaker 1>behavior is, but it's been interpreted as an attempt to

0:51:10.800 --> 0:51:14.440
<v Speaker 1>remove barnacles. Yeah, yeah, that's my understanding. And they'll do

0:51:14.480 --> 0:51:16.360
<v Speaker 1>this not only on the bottoms of boats and chips,

0:51:16.360 --> 0:51:18.359
<v Speaker 1>but they'll do this on rocks and in the sand,

0:51:18.400 --> 0:51:21.359
<v Speaker 1>and also just through the act of feeding, because again,

0:51:21.360 --> 0:51:24.400
<v Speaker 1>these are bottom feeding feeders who scrape half of their

0:51:24.480 --> 0:51:29.160
<v Speaker 1>their body against the bottom of the sea. But yeah,

0:51:29.160 --> 0:51:30.680
<v Speaker 1>I guess the thing we have to keep in mind

0:51:30.800 --> 0:51:33.400
<v Speaker 1>is that it's not just the barnacles on the body,

0:51:33.520 --> 0:51:37.640
<v Speaker 1>they're also the sea lies they're scarring. There's you know,

0:51:37.760 --> 0:51:40.080
<v Speaker 1>there's reason to believe that. I guess a whale could

0:51:40.160 --> 0:51:42.239
<v Speaker 1>itch for other reasons, or have some sort of skin

0:51:42.239 --> 0:51:45.120
<v Speaker 1>irritation for other reasons, and it might be pleasurable for

0:51:45.320 --> 0:51:49.000
<v Speaker 1>other reasons for it to scrape its body against something,

0:51:49.080 --> 0:51:53.480
<v Speaker 1>even if that scraping does in effect remove barnacles from

0:51:53.480 --> 0:51:57.399
<v Speaker 1>its its skin. Yes, so there are several ways where

0:51:57.440 --> 0:52:02.279
<v Speaker 1>you might be able to interpret barnacles as parasites as

0:52:02.320 --> 0:52:05.920
<v Speaker 1>causing net harm to the whales. However, I came across

0:52:05.960 --> 0:52:08.719
<v Speaker 1>another idea that I thought was very interesting. Again, this

0:52:08.840 --> 0:52:13.040
<v Speaker 1>is not certain, it's debatable, but some researchers have speculated

0:52:13.080 --> 0:52:16.520
<v Speaker 1>there could be cases where whale barnacles are actually providing

0:52:16.520 --> 0:52:18.799
<v Speaker 1>a benefit to the whale. Now, what could that be.

0:52:18.880 --> 0:52:20.759
<v Speaker 1>It's hard to imagine by looking at it, But what

0:52:20.840 --> 0:52:24.279
<v Speaker 1>has been proposed is that barnacles may serve as a

0:52:24.400 --> 0:52:29.879
<v Speaker 1>form of armor or as a weapon in some cases. Now,

0:52:29.880 --> 0:52:32.560
<v Speaker 1>what would be the evidence for this idea? Well, I

0:52:32.600 --> 0:52:34.880
<v Speaker 1>was looking at a paper by John kb Ford and

0:52:35.040 --> 0:52:38.239
<v Speaker 1>Randall R. Reeves published in The Mammal Review in two

0:52:38.280 --> 0:52:42.040
<v Speaker 1>thousand and eight called fight or Flight Anti predator strategies

0:52:42.080 --> 0:52:46.000
<v Speaker 1>of baleen whales. Now, something we've already alluded to and

0:52:46.040 --> 0:52:47.879
<v Speaker 1>we're going to talk about more extensively in the next

0:52:47.920 --> 0:52:52.840
<v Speaker 1>episode is orca predation on gray whales in particular. But

0:52:53.200 --> 0:52:56.440
<v Speaker 1>orcas also known as killer whales, are major predators to

0:52:56.600 --> 0:53:01.360
<v Speaker 1>a number of mysticetti or baleen whale speeds, and the

0:53:01.440 --> 0:53:04.880
<v Speaker 1>authors of this paper argued that understanding the role of

0:53:05.000 --> 0:53:09.600
<v Speaker 1>orcas as predators has been hampered by poor understanding of

0:53:09.640 --> 0:53:15.240
<v Speaker 1>the different predator prey dynamics quote, including the relative vulnerability

0:53:15.280 --> 0:53:19.800
<v Speaker 1>of different misdeceit species and age classes to killer whales,

0:53:20.080 --> 0:53:24.120
<v Speaker 1>and how those prey animals avoid predation. So what are

0:53:24.200 --> 0:53:27.520
<v Speaker 1>the different patterns of behavior that different prey species of

0:53:27.520 --> 0:53:30.680
<v Speaker 1>whales resort to when an orca starts threatening them or

0:53:30.719 --> 0:53:34.279
<v Speaker 1>when a pot of orcas threatens them. The authors argue

0:53:34.320 --> 0:53:37.840
<v Speaker 1>there are two main classes of behavioral response, and those

0:53:37.880 --> 0:53:42.320
<v Speaker 1>are fight or flight. The flight strategy is fairly simple.

0:53:42.760 --> 0:53:45.239
<v Speaker 1>When you spot killer whales, you get out of there.

0:53:45.719 --> 0:53:50.560
<v Speaker 1>The authors describe the strategy as rapid monodirectional swimming away

0:53:50.560 --> 0:53:53.359
<v Speaker 1>from the orcas at a pace of between twenty and

0:53:53.440 --> 0:53:57.360
<v Speaker 1>forty kilometers an hour, a speed that the orcas cannot

0:53:57.400 --> 0:53:59.960
<v Speaker 1>generally keep up with or will not keep up with usually,

0:54:00.680 --> 0:54:04.319
<v Speaker 1>and this behavior has been observed in six species of

0:54:04.360 --> 0:54:09.000
<v Speaker 1>the genus Balinoptera, which contains animals like the mink, fin

0:54:09.160 --> 0:54:13.880
<v Speaker 1>and blue whales. On the other hand, many different species

0:54:13.920 --> 0:54:18.040
<v Speaker 1>exhibit what the authors call the fight strategy, which quote

0:54:18.080 --> 0:54:23.080
<v Speaker 1>consists of active physical defense, including self defense by single individuals,

0:54:23.560 --> 0:54:27.719
<v Speaker 1>defense of calves by their mothers, and coordinated defense by

0:54:27.760 --> 0:54:31.719
<v Speaker 1>groups of whales. It's documented for five mystic seats and

0:54:31.800 --> 0:54:35.160
<v Speaker 1>they list the Southern right whale, the North Atlantic right whale,

0:54:35.360 --> 0:54:39.080
<v Speaker 1>the bowhead whale, the humpback whale, and the gray whale.

0:54:39.480 --> 0:54:42.719
<v Speaker 1>The authors argue that these strategies are not incidental, they

0:54:42.719 --> 0:54:47.680
<v Speaker 1>are selected by evolution for each species to maximize survival odds.

0:54:47.680 --> 0:54:52.240
<v Speaker 1>Based on the whales other physical characteristics. Species that engage

0:54:52.320 --> 0:54:56.440
<v Speaker 1>in the flight strategy have streamlined bodies that are capable

0:54:56.520 --> 0:55:02.480
<v Speaker 1>of fast, sustained endurance swimming. They also quote tend to

0:55:02.560 --> 0:55:06.720
<v Speaker 1>favor pelagic habitats, which that means open sea, deep water

0:55:07.280 --> 0:55:10.960
<v Speaker 1>and calving grounds where prolonged escape sprints from killer whales

0:55:11.000 --> 0:55:15.120
<v Speaker 1>are possible. Meanwhile, they say that whales that engage in

0:55:15.760 --> 0:55:20.040
<v Speaker 1>fight strategies tend to have more robust body shapes and

0:55:20.160 --> 0:55:23.040
<v Speaker 1>they tend to be slower swimmers, but they're also usually

0:55:23.120 --> 0:55:26.920
<v Speaker 1>maneuverable swimmers, so they might not be able to do

0:55:27.120 --> 0:55:30.880
<v Speaker 1>monodirection swimming in one direction really fast for a long time,

0:55:31.160 --> 0:55:33.400
<v Speaker 1>but they can kind of move around quickly within a

0:55:33.440 --> 0:55:36.640
<v Speaker 1>small space if they need to, say, reposition their bodies

0:55:36.960 --> 0:55:41.200
<v Speaker 1>or deliver a blow. These species also quote often calve

0:55:41.400 --> 0:55:45.440
<v Speaker 1>or migrating coastal areas where proximity to shallow water provides

0:55:45.520 --> 0:55:49.759
<v Speaker 1>refuge and an advantage in defense. Most fight species have

0:55:49.840 --> 0:55:54.279
<v Speaker 1>either calocities, which are rough and hardened patches of skin,

0:55:54.719 --> 0:55:59.920
<v Speaker 1>or incrustations of barnacles on their bodies, which may serve

0:56:00.120 --> 0:56:04.880
<v Speaker 1>either primarily or secondarily as weapons or armor for defense.

0:56:05.480 --> 0:56:09.320
<v Speaker 1>So I think that's a really interesting inference here. Specifically,

0:56:09.760 --> 0:56:13.000
<v Speaker 1>whales that are more likely to fight predators rather than

0:56:13.080 --> 0:56:16.160
<v Speaker 1>run from them also happen to be the ones that

0:56:16.239 --> 0:56:20.719
<v Speaker 1>are more likely to have either calocities, these raised calloused

0:56:20.719 --> 0:56:26.000
<v Speaker 1>patches of skin, or colonies of barnacles on their skin, which,

0:56:26.040 --> 0:56:28.319
<v Speaker 1>of course, you know, a colony of barnacles you do

0:56:28.360 --> 0:56:31.239
<v Speaker 1>not want to bite into that or get slapped with it.

0:56:31.520 --> 0:56:34.880
<v Speaker 1>And the authors write that humpback whales are believed to

0:56:34.920 --> 0:56:39.000
<v Speaker 1>make use of these barnacle encrusted patches as weapons steering

0:56:39.000 --> 0:56:42.520
<v Speaker 1>fights between males at breeding grounds. They say, you know,

0:56:42.560 --> 0:56:45.240
<v Speaker 1>there are many different kind of moves that humpback whales

0:56:45.280 --> 0:56:48.759
<v Speaker 1>will do against each other. When they're displaying aggressive behaviors

0:56:49.160 --> 0:56:52.000
<v Speaker 1>to other males, they will do headbutting and ramming of

0:56:52.040 --> 0:56:56.000
<v Speaker 1>each other striking blows, and they will hit each other

0:56:56.040 --> 0:56:59.719
<v Speaker 1>with long flippers and tail flukes, and the authors point

0:56:59.719 --> 0:57:03.200
<v Speaker 1>out that these parts of the body where they will

0:57:03.360 --> 0:57:06.120
<v Speaker 1>hit each other are also parts of the body areas

0:57:06.520 --> 0:57:11.440
<v Speaker 1>where there are large incrustations of barnacles usually found. They say,

0:57:11.520 --> 0:57:14.279
<v Speaker 1>quote a blow from a barnacle encrusted surface would likely

0:57:14.320 --> 0:57:19.080
<v Speaker 1>have enhanced effectiveness in aggressive physical interactions, and from this

0:57:19.160 --> 0:57:21.520
<v Speaker 1>they go on to argue that these same types of

0:57:21.560 --> 0:57:26.280
<v Speaker 1>attacks are probably used by humpback whales against predatory orcas,

0:57:26.320 --> 0:57:30.640
<v Speaker 1>and the barnacles probably provide an advantage in the same way. Now,

0:57:30.760 --> 0:57:33.840
<v Speaker 1>the same is maybe not exactly true of gray whales,

0:57:33.880 --> 0:57:37.040
<v Speaker 1>because they say gray whales don't fight quite as much.

0:57:37.120 --> 0:57:42.440
<v Speaker 1>They don't show examples of intra specific aggression associated with

0:57:42.560 --> 0:57:47.280
<v Speaker 1>male competition like the humpback whales do, so the males

0:57:47.320 --> 0:57:51.240
<v Speaker 1>are less often fighting each other like humpback whales. But

0:57:52.200 --> 0:57:54.720
<v Speaker 1>they say that barnacles on the skin of gray whales

0:57:54.840 --> 0:57:58.560
<v Speaker 1>could still help protect the whales as basically a type

0:57:58.560 --> 0:58:02.200
<v Speaker 1>of defensive armor. If an orca tries to ram the

0:58:02.240 --> 0:58:05.040
<v Speaker 1>body of a gray whale and it's got an incrustation

0:58:05.080 --> 0:58:08.160
<v Speaker 1>of barnacles on it, or they try to bite the

0:58:08.200 --> 0:58:10.800
<v Speaker 1>gray whale, and they bite them on an incrustation of

0:58:10.840 --> 0:58:14.280
<v Speaker 1>barnacles that seems much more likely to harm the attacking animal.

0:58:14.720 --> 0:58:19.080
<v Speaker 1>This is fascinating. So on on one level, yes, than

0:58:19.120 --> 0:58:21.040
<v Speaker 1>the mating of the gray whales, well, we'll probably get

0:58:21.040 --> 0:58:24.280
<v Speaker 1>into that more in the next episode, but yeah, there's

0:58:24.320 --> 0:58:28.160
<v Speaker 1>there definitely is more of a sort of a free

0:58:28.200 --> 0:58:31.720
<v Speaker 1>love kind of vibe going on among the gray whales,

0:58:31.960 --> 0:58:35.480
<v Speaker 1>So the males are not necessarily competing with each other,

0:58:35.520 --> 0:58:40.560
<v Speaker 1>it seems and is now. But on the same level,

0:58:40.600 --> 0:58:43.640
<v Speaker 1>I mean, the whales are going to come into contact

0:58:43.640 --> 0:58:46.560
<v Speaker 1>with each other, and the barnacles do scar other whales

0:58:46.640 --> 0:58:50.160
<v Speaker 1>sort of at least incidentally. This was pointed out to

0:58:50.240 --> 0:58:52.520
<v Speaker 1>us in Mexico by one of the local guides on

0:58:52.520 --> 0:58:56.600
<v Speaker 1>the boats. Um because they're covered in scars from various things,

0:58:56.920 --> 0:59:02.200
<v Speaker 1>everything from orca attacks to barnacle scraping them via contact

0:59:02.200 --> 0:59:06.400
<v Speaker 1>with other whales. And yeah, this is an interesting idea though,

0:59:06.400 --> 0:59:11.360
<v Speaker 1>because on one level, a really good blow from a

0:59:11.400 --> 0:59:14.320
<v Speaker 1>fluke or a flipper from a gray whale I've read

0:59:14.440 --> 0:59:17.480
<v Speaker 1>it is enough to certainly to kill a man, but

0:59:17.600 --> 0:59:21.520
<v Speaker 1>also could potentially kill an orca in one blow as well.

0:59:22.080 --> 0:59:24.160
<v Speaker 1>But I guess you're not necessarily going to get that

0:59:24.320 --> 0:59:27.400
<v Speaker 1>killer blow every time. Sometimes you're just going to maybe

0:59:27.400 --> 0:59:30.920
<v Speaker 1>make a lighter contact or a near miss. And you

0:59:30.960 --> 0:59:34.280
<v Speaker 1>can imagine those scenarios would be enhanced by some sort

0:59:34.280 --> 0:59:37.840
<v Speaker 1>of barnacle encrusting. Possibly. Now, to come back on that,

0:59:37.880 --> 0:59:41.680
<v Speaker 1>you can imagine other reasonings as well that there might

0:59:41.760 --> 0:59:45.520
<v Speaker 1>be this correlation where species that are more likely to

0:59:45.560 --> 0:59:48.360
<v Speaker 1>stand and fight when attacked by orcas rather than run away,

0:59:48.360 --> 0:59:51.120
<v Speaker 1>are also the ones more likely to be encrusted with barnacles.

0:59:51.880 --> 0:59:55.680
<v Speaker 1>Maybe there is a common cause, like barnacles don't actually

0:59:55.720 --> 0:59:58.840
<v Speaker 1>make useful armor or make useful weapons, but the slow

0:59:59.120 --> 1:00:01.600
<v Speaker 1>swimming that make a gray whale have to rely on

1:00:01.720 --> 1:00:05.640
<v Speaker 1>fighting rather than rapid escape also makes it more susceptible

1:00:05.960 --> 1:00:08.840
<v Speaker 1>to barnacle infestation. That kind of thing could be possible,

1:00:09.680 --> 1:00:12.400
<v Speaker 1>But I think it's an interesting correlation, and it makes

1:00:12.400 --> 1:00:15.680
<v Speaker 1>you wonder how you would test that further, Like could

1:00:15.680 --> 1:00:19.520
<v Speaker 1>you compare different individual whales of the same species and

1:00:19.560 --> 1:00:22.480
<v Speaker 1>look at maybe how much barnacle loading they have and

1:00:22.520 --> 1:00:26.840
<v Speaker 1>then observe their relative success. It's a protecting calves from orcapods.

1:00:27.360 --> 1:00:30.600
<v Speaker 1>Do mothers with more barnacles win more fights against orcas

1:00:30.640 --> 1:00:33.120
<v Speaker 1>and so forth. I mean, it's also worth noting in

1:00:33.160 --> 1:00:36.520
<v Speaker 1>all of this that the young gray whales again have

1:00:37.080 --> 1:00:40.280
<v Speaker 1>no barnacles. They're born without barnacles. They will accumulate barnacles,

1:00:40.480 --> 1:00:43.480
<v Speaker 1>but it takes a little time for the hard barnacles

1:00:43.480 --> 1:00:49.880
<v Speaker 1>to actually build up, so especially during that period when

1:00:49.920 --> 1:00:53.960
<v Speaker 1>they're leaving those sheltered lagoons, this is when they're at

1:00:53.960 --> 1:00:57.640
<v Speaker 1>their most vulnerable for a number of reasons. However, it's

1:00:57.640 --> 1:00:59.640
<v Speaker 1>all another thing the authors point out that I think

1:00:59.640 --> 1:01:03.440
<v Speaker 1>it's where remembering is that whales, including gray whales, are

1:01:03.480 --> 1:01:08.000
<v Speaker 1>not Orca's only prey, and they are an especially dangerous

1:01:08.040 --> 1:01:11.080
<v Speaker 1>and costly type of prey for the orcas to pursue.

1:01:12.120 --> 1:01:16.080
<v Speaker 1>The author's right quote, the rarity of observed successful attacks

1:01:16.080 --> 1:01:19.720
<v Speaker 1>by killer whales on baleen whales, especially adults, maybe an

1:01:19.720 --> 1:01:24.360
<v Speaker 1>indication of the effectiveness of these anti predator strategies. Baleen

1:01:24.440 --> 1:01:28.240
<v Speaker 1>whales likely offer low profitability to killer whales relative to

1:01:28.320 --> 1:01:32.080
<v Speaker 1>some other marine mammal prey. High speed pursuit of flight

1:01:32.160 --> 1:01:35.600
<v Speaker 1>species has a high energetic cost and the low probability

1:01:35.600 --> 1:01:39.560
<v Speaker 1>of success, while attacks on fight species can involve prolonged

1:01:39.600 --> 1:01:43.400
<v Speaker 1>handling times and a risk of serious injury. So the

1:01:43.400 --> 1:01:47.000
<v Speaker 1>baleen whales here are are not helpless against these orcas, Like,

1:01:47.040 --> 1:01:49.800
<v Speaker 1>they put up a real fight. And if the orcas

1:01:49.840 --> 1:01:52.880
<v Speaker 1>are going to eat a whale calf, like they will

1:01:52.920 --> 1:01:54.760
<v Speaker 1>make them work for it. Though of course, yeah, they

1:01:55.000 --> 1:01:57.880
<v Speaker 1>will work for it. They are hard workers the orca.

1:01:58.040 --> 1:02:00.360
<v Speaker 1>But as is often the case, we've discuss this with

1:02:00.440 --> 1:02:03.880
<v Speaker 1>various predator prey relationships, like it's it's every little bit

1:02:03.920 --> 1:02:08.320
<v Speaker 1>of deterrent um that adds up to survival. Like anything

1:02:08.360 --> 1:02:12.800
<v Speaker 1>that makes you a slightly more difficult meal than you,

1:02:12.800 --> 1:02:17.320
<v Speaker 1>you increase the odds that the predators will realize that

1:02:17.360 --> 1:02:21.040
<v Speaker 1>this is not worth it. Yeah, and we'll get into

1:02:21.080 --> 1:02:22.440
<v Speaker 1>this in the next episode. I mean, that's one of

1:02:22.440 --> 1:02:26.680
<v Speaker 1>the reasons the lagoons are safe harbors is that is

1:02:26.720 --> 1:02:29.000
<v Speaker 1>that that they have found a place to go that

1:02:29.120 --> 1:02:33.760
<v Speaker 1>do not favor the orcas. And the orcas intelligent um

1:02:34.000 --> 1:02:36.960
<v Speaker 1>pack or pod hunters that they are. Uh, they will

1:02:37.000 --> 1:02:40.280
<v Speaker 1>attack their most one of their most dangerous prey when

1:02:40.520 --> 1:02:44.240
<v Speaker 1>they have the the optimal advantage, when they have everything

1:02:44.360 --> 1:02:47.280
<v Speaker 1>lining up for them. Uh, They're not gonna They're not

1:02:47.280 --> 1:02:49.120
<v Speaker 1>gonna do it. If they if they don't have a

1:02:49.240 --> 1:02:53.680
<v Speaker 1>key advantage. So I guess more on that next time. Yeah, wait,

1:02:53.720 --> 1:02:55.000
<v Speaker 1>before we close out, what do you what do you

1:02:55.000 --> 1:02:58.760
<v Speaker 1>think about the barnacle armor slash weapon hypothesis. You think

1:02:58.760 --> 1:03:01.560
<v Speaker 1>that's got anything going for it or not? I like it.

1:03:01.680 --> 1:03:07.520
<v Speaker 1>I certainly buy that at least partial encrusting with barnacles

1:03:07.640 --> 1:03:13.000
<v Speaker 1>would perhaps provide this incidental extra level of defense or offense.

1:03:13.960 --> 1:03:16.600
<v Speaker 1>I just I'm not as sure how that maybe factors

1:03:16.640 --> 1:03:21.320
<v Speaker 1>into um like the grander like evolutionary scheme of things,

1:03:21.400 --> 1:03:24.880
<v Speaker 1>you know, Yeah, and how it balances out against I guess,

1:03:24.960 --> 1:03:30.600
<v Speaker 1>uh negative impacts from say introducing dragon swimming and other things, right, yeah,

1:03:30.760 --> 1:03:34.200
<v Speaker 1>or or mating behavior and so forth. But I mean,

1:03:34.480 --> 1:03:37.440
<v Speaker 1>they've they've been scrapy with barnacles for a long time,

1:03:37.520 --> 1:03:40.120
<v Speaker 1>so they're they're accustomed to it. It is it is

1:03:40.120 --> 1:03:43.120
<v Speaker 1>a part of who they are, which I think is

1:03:43.160 --> 1:03:46.080
<v Speaker 1>one of the big take homs for again for thinking

1:03:46.080 --> 1:03:49.800
<v Speaker 1>about gray whales and their barnacles and their life and

1:03:50.240 --> 1:03:54.840
<v Speaker 1>their most notable predator like these these are are creatures

1:03:54.880 --> 1:03:56.960
<v Speaker 1>that are not only a part of their lives, but

1:03:57.000 --> 1:03:59.560
<v Speaker 1>they have shaped the life of the gray whale. They've

1:03:59.560 --> 1:04:02.240
<v Speaker 1>shaped the gray whale is and you can't remove them

1:04:02.240 --> 1:04:04.760
<v Speaker 1>from the scenario. All right, Well, on that note, we're

1:04:04.760 --> 1:04:06.080
<v Speaker 1>going to go ahead and call it for this episode.

1:04:06.080 --> 1:04:08.720
<v Speaker 1>We'll be back in the next core episode of Stuff

1:04:08.720 --> 1:04:12.160
<v Speaker 1>to Blow Your Mind to discuss gray whales in greater detail.

1:04:12.240 --> 1:04:15.160
<v Speaker 1>We'll talk about there there were more about the relationship

1:04:15.200 --> 1:04:19.120
<v Speaker 1>with the orcas. We'll talk about some of the variety

1:04:19.160 --> 1:04:20.680
<v Speaker 1>of orcas as well. We'll kind of go in an

1:04:20.760 --> 1:04:23.840
<v Speaker 1>orca's tangent, and then we'll get into more details about

1:04:23.840 --> 1:04:27.440
<v Speaker 1>their migration and their reproduction. In the meantime, we'd love

1:04:27.480 --> 1:04:30.400
<v Speaker 1>to hear from everyone out there. Do you have experiences

1:04:30.400 --> 1:04:32.120
<v Speaker 1>with gray whales that you would like to share with

1:04:32.200 --> 1:04:34.120
<v Speaker 1>us right in we'd love to hear them. Heck, if

1:04:34.200 --> 1:04:37.200
<v Speaker 1>you have any experience with whales, if you've any any

1:04:37.200 --> 1:04:38.960
<v Speaker 1>whale watchers out there and you want to tell us

1:04:38.960 --> 1:04:42.640
<v Speaker 1>about other species of whales that you're super into, let

1:04:42.720 --> 1:04:46.040
<v Speaker 1>us know. I'm I'm I'm all revved up on whales

1:04:46.080 --> 1:04:50.440
<v Speaker 1>and dolphins and porpoises right now, so I'm excited to

1:04:50.480 --> 1:04:53.440
<v Speaker 1>see your photos and hear your stories. A reminder that

1:04:53.520 --> 1:04:56.040
<v Speaker 1>Stuff to Blow Your Mind is primarily a science podcast

1:04:56.040 --> 1:04:58.840
<v Speaker 1>with core episodes on Tuesdays and Thursdays. On Mondays we

1:04:58.880 --> 1:05:01.360
<v Speaker 1>do listener mail, on Wednesday's we do a short form

1:05:01.440 --> 1:05:03.760
<v Speaker 1>artifact or monster fact, and on Friday's we do Weird

1:05:03.760 --> 1:05:05.760
<v Speaker 1>House Cinema. That's our time to set aside most serious

1:05:05.800 --> 1:05:09.360
<v Speaker 1>concerns and just talk about a weird film huch. Thanks

1:05:09.400 --> 1:05:12.479
<v Speaker 1>to our audio producer J. J. Paseway. If you would

1:05:12.560 --> 1:05:14.560
<v Speaker 1>like to get in touch with us with feedback on

1:05:14.600 --> 1:05:17.640
<v Speaker 1>this episode or any other, to suggest a topic for

1:05:17.720 --> 1:05:20.080
<v Speaker 1>the future, or just to say hello, you can email

1:05:20.160 --> 1:05:31.280
<v Speaker 1>us at contact at stuff to Blow your Mind dot com.

1:05:31.400 --> 1:05:34.280
<v Speaker 1>Stuff to Blow Your Mind is production of iHeartRadio. For

1:05:34.400 --> 1:05:37.120
<v Speaker 1>more podcasts from my Heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app,

1:05:37.320 --> 1:05:48.720
<v Speaker 1>Apple Podcasts, or wherever you're listening to your favorite shows.