Speaker 1: Hey everybody, it's Dave pass here with another edition of
Speaker 1: the Dave Pash Podcast ESPN Arizona Cardinals played by play announcer.
Speaker 1: Our guest this week is Bobby Hurley, the head coach
Speaker 1: of the Arizona Statement's basketball team and also the all
Speaker 1: time assist leader in NC double A history. Bobby, of
Speaker 1: course a great player at Duke, multiple national championships. We'll
Speaker 1: talk about his time playing from Mike Shashevski, his time
Speaker 1: in the NBA, and also his time scrimmaging the Dream
Speaker 1: Team back in ninety two. We'll also talk about a
Speaker 1: recent documentary called The Redeemed Team and some of his
Speaker 1: takeaways from that, and we'll also get into the Sun
Speaker 1: Devils and what to expect from Arizona State in twenty
Speaker 1: twenty two twenty three. We have a pretty good chip
Speaker 1: on our shoulder. A number of guys have a lot
Speaker 1: to prove. I like our team. Frankie Collins has been
Speaker 1: a really good addition. Point guard transfer from Michigan. Marcus
Speaker 1: Bagley has been healthy. We have good size on the
Speaker 1: front court, which I haven't always had here, and a
Speaker 1: lot of positives that I'm seeing. We are presented by BETMGM,
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Speaker 1: Gambling problem called one eight hundred. Next step. Okay, time
Speaker 1: for our conversation with Arizona State men's basketball head coach
Speaker 1: Bobby Hurley. So I appreciate you, Bobb becoming at studio
Speaker 1: to do this. I've had to use up like all
Speaker 1: my favors to this podcast, so thank you for coming
Speaker 1: in and doing it in person. I appreciate him. So,
Speaker 1: since this is technically a football podcast, we're not going
Speaker 1: to spend a ton of time on football, but I'm
Speaker 1: assuming growing up in Jersey. It was either Giants or Jets.
Speaker 1: But you're a Yankee fan, So does that mean Giants
Speaker 1: because Giants and Yankees are connected or no. I took
Speaker 1: a lot of heat in New Jersey because I was
Speaker 1: I was a Cowboy fan, So yeah, really good in
Speaker 1: the late seventies early eighties. My dad got me hooked
Speaker 1: and he was a big Cowboy fan as well, so
Speaker 1: it was great. The early nineties were awesome. I actually
Speaker 1: one of my great memories was prior to our NBA
Speaker 1: training camp starting, I was still in in New Jersey
Speaker 1: training working out, and it was it was Monday night
Speaker 1: football Giants Stadium to open the season, and it was
Speaker 1: Cowboys Giants and it was Dion Sanders first game. So
Speaker 1: I had my I had my Emmett Smith jersey on
Speaker 1: and you know, people yelling at me because I was still,
Speaker 1: you know, at the time, an NBA guy, so people
Speaker 1: recognize who I was, and uh so, just maneuvering around
Speaker 1: that stadium was really interesting. But I think Dion had
Speaker 1: a pick six for a touchdown and like a punt
Speaker 1: return for a touchdown, and I somehow finagled my way
Speaker 1: into a box that was right next to Jerry Jones,
Speaker 1: So it was it was like a dream come true
Speaker 1: that that night and watching the Cowboys win thirty five.
Speaker 1: You and Dion are both coaches now. He's like an
Speaker 1: ascending coach. He's going to get one of these big jobs.
Speaker 1: I mean, he's obviously knows the game and playing the
Speaker 1: cornerback position, you're out there and you're seeing the whole field,
Speaker 1: and defensively, I'm sure he's got great concepts, but he's
Speaker 1: more such a dynamic personality. You would imagine from a
Speaker 1: recruiting standpoint that it would be a home run to
Speaker 1: to have him as your coach. Do you still follow
Speaker 1: the Cowboys now? I assume you probably don't have a
Speaker 1: ton of time with recruiting and now the camp started
Speaker 1: and season starting soon to watch football, but not a
Speaker 1: whole lot. I mean, my son Bobby is now a
Speaker 1: Cowboy fan also, so he kind of fills me in
Speaker 1: on what's what's happening. And I don't. I think we
Speaker 1: lost Week one, but have played well at times. I
Speaker 1: think the records decent, the defense is pretty good apparently. Yes,
Speaker 1: Michael Parsons is a jest. Yeah, we need to get
Speaker 1: you some gear. We need to like load up the
Speaker 1: Hurley family or some Cardinals gear, so we can convert
Speaker 1: you here before before the season's over. Did you play
Speaker 1: football at all growing up? Obviously, your dad was a
Speaker 1: legendary Hall of Fame high school basketball coach, so you
Speaker 1: were playing basketball, you and your brother Danny, but football
Speaker 1: at all while you were young. My dad played football
Speaker 1: and high school and broke his leg and had a
Speaker 1: bad experience with it, so he steered us away. We
Speaker 1: would we would do some neighborhood stuff like back in
Speaker 1: the day, like in the city something. We would go
Speaker 1: play a different neighborhood. We'd have like five or six
Speaker 1: guys go play, and it was kind of for like
Speaker 1: bragging rights in the city. So I was pretty fast,
Speaker 1: so I was like I was just running fly patterns
Speaker 1: and stuff and or post like a deep post. But
Speaker 1: I didn't want to get hit. So, well, man, you
Speaker 1: were a great athlete and you've got this intensity, so
Speaker 1: I got to imagine you had the intensity to play
Speaker 1: football if you really wanted to. Yeah, I mean I
Speaker 1: just again, it was not something that you know, I mean,
Speaker 1: we would play. We'd play touch football in the street
Speaker 1: and stuff, and so we always played, but nothing ever
Speaker 1: formal for me in that way. So I got a
Speaker 1: lot of stuff I want to talk to you about,
Speaker 1: but the seasons starting soon, so let's talk a little
Speaker 1: bit about the Devils. How's camp going and your thoughts
Speaker 1: on what you've got in terms of your roster. Well,
Speaker 1: I think, uh, you know, we have a pretty good
Speaker 1: chip on our shoulder. A number of guys have a
Speaker 1: lot to prove, starting right at the top. You know,
Speaker 1: we've had two two tough years, so you know, we're
Speaker 1: very hungry, very motivated. We've been practicing extremely hard, you know.
Speaker 1: I I like our team. Frankie Collins has been a
Speaker 1: really good addition point guard transfer from Michigan. Marcus Bagley
Speaker 1: has been healthy. He had a really good practice today.
Speaker 1: So I think there are some positives. And we have
Speaker 1: good size on the front court, which I haven't always
Speaker 1: had here, and so you know, I think we could,
Speaker 1: you know, control the paint pretty well well. So I
Speaker 1: think there are a lot of positives that I'm seeing
Speaker 1: and still some things to work out. We're about a
Speaker 1: week out right now, so we're looking forward to it.
Speaker 1: I know you're a non excuse guy, and I said
Speaker 1: this many times the last couple of years on the
Speaker 1: air doing games for ESPN that you guys were impacted
Speaker 1: more by COVID I think than anybody COVID and injuries,
Speaker 1: because twenty twenty, you guys are headed for the NCAA
Speaker 1: Tournament for the third straight year. Would have been the
Speaker 1: first time in almost sixty years at Arizona State COVID
Speaker 1: hits injuries hit. Has it been hard to recover from
Speaker 1: that to a degree? And again, we have been playing
Speaker 1: so well the year they canceled the season initially, like
Speaker 1: down the stretch in the Pac twelve, within the last
Speaker 1: two weeks the regular season, we're playing for maybe a
Speaker 1: chance to win the whole conference, you know, and going
Speaker 1: on the road to UCLA and USC and then hit
Speaker 1: the Pac twelve tournament, we're the three seed, and just
Speaker 1: that tournament never happened, And so it leaves the doubt
Speaker 1: and wondering what could have been from that year because
Speaker 1: I think of all my team I've had here, that
Speaker 1: team was probably playing the best late in the season.
Speaker 1: So disappointing not to get that. And then yeah, it
Speaker 1: was a struggle with some things in COVID. Other schools
Speaker 1: were impacted by it as well, just with injuries and stoppages,
Speaker 1: and but it's been clear saleing so far, knock on wood,
Speaker 1: and we're excited that. You know, it's a little bit
Speaker 1: in the rear view mirror. Now you mentioned Bagley being back.
Speaker 1: How big is that because this kid, obviously his brother
Speaker 1: was an incredible college player, number two pick in the draft,
Speaker 1: and it seemed like he himself was heading in that
Speaker 1: direction to be a very high draft pick before the injuries. Yeah,
Speaker 1: very unfortunate timing injuries or he you know, he'd be
Speaker 1: in the NBA right now, as you touched on. But
Speaker 1: I think Marcus has been through a lot. There's been
Speaker 1: you know a lot of struggle with the injuries, and
Speaker 1: it's been frustrating for him. He's a great kid, he's
Speaker 1: a hard worker, and you know, we're just excited for
Speaker 1: him to hopefully have an opportunity to show what he
Speaker 1: could do and uh and complete a season and and
Speaker 1: help us win. I think a lot of guys that
Speaker 1: have of NBA in their future sometimes could look past
Speaker 1: the present and not be as invested. But he, you know,
Speaker 1: he loves Arizona State. You know, his grandfather was one
Speaker 1: of the legends, Joe Caldwell, and as a little kid.
Speaker 1: He would always attend a issue games, so it's in
Speaker 1: his blood and and you know he wants nothing more
Speaker 1: to have a great season. I knew that about Joe Caldwell.
Speaker 1: Doug Tamar always has it in his notes. But if
Speaker 1: you didn't know it, you would by working with Bill Walton,
Speaker 1: because that's all Bill talks about. It's five times a game.
Speaker 1: Like if you're playing Walton Bingo at home, you can
Speaker 1: cross off the Michael Crow, Bobby Hurley and Joe Caldwell
Speaker 1: squares by the ten minute mark, no doubt. It's yeah.
Speaker 1: I mean, I love Bill. It was great. I saw
Speaker 1: him at Pack Towel Media briefly, and uh, it's always
Speaker 1: fun and it's always so entertaining and unexpected you know
Speaker 1: what what might be said? And uh, you know, I
Speaker 1: think the game speaks for itself and it's entertaining. But
Speaker 1: what you guys do and the back and forth I
Speaker 1: think is it's classic might be said or what might
Speaker 1: be done. You were there witnessing. So the cupcake you
Speaker 1: guys beat. I think it was Washington there in the
Speaker 1: top ten, and you guys beat him might have even
Speaker 1: been like number one in the country. And he ate
Speaker 1: the he ate the candle, the lit candle, and then
Speaker 1: you came over, did an interview with it, and he
Speaker 1: did it again for you. I still have the picture
Speaker 1: the look on your face of you're in awe of it.
Speaker 1: But do you think because you yourself, I mean, you're
Speaker 1: still the all time assist leader in college basketball history.
Speaker 1: I mean you're one of the great players in the
Speaker 1: history of college basketball. So is Bill Do you think
Speaker 1: that you have a deeper appreciation for him because of
Speaker 1: how good you were as a player? I mean, I
Speaker 1: think because we kind of me we accomplished different things,
Speaker 1: not exactly the same, but playing in those final fours
Speaker 1: and championships, that's the like kind of a common bond,
Speaker 1: even though we didn't cross over in the same area.
Speaker 1: So I always make sure the players understand who he
Speaker 1: is when he's at our games and what he meant
Speaker 1: to the game of basketball. He's he's a legend and
Speaker 1: he loves I mean, he's I don't know if anyone
Speaker 1: prepares as hard as he does for his telecasts. And
Speaker 1: I don't think people realize that. You know, Doug Tamara
Speaker 1: knows how much time he spends talking about our players.
Speaker 1: You know, he wants to visit with them pre practice.
Speaker 1: You know, he really makes it makes us feel special.
Speaker 1: You know, when he's in the gym, he does enjoy
Speaker 1: the players. I mean, he's got sheets of paper everywhere,
Speaker 1: and it is he has notes upon notes about a player.
Speaker 1: And one of our jobs is we are supposed to
Speaker 1: humanize the student athlete. And he does a great job
Speaker 1: of that because he's asking the players about their background,
Speaker 1: about their their families, and he gets the stories on
Speaker 1: the air, and he does promote Arizona State. We know
Speaker 1: he loves Michael Crowe. We're gonna hear that. But Anderson,
Speaker 1: I mean, so he is fully invested in making it
Speaker 1: a commercial for the programs he's calling the game. And
Speaker 1: I agree, and I think there should be more humanization
Speaker 1: of it and of the players and their stories and
Speaker 1: human interests. And you know, I'm sure there are people
Speaker 1: that love the the tacticians that the xs and oh
Speaker 1: guys that do the games. But Bill, I think is
Speaker 1: a combination of both. So I mentioned that you're still
Speaker 1: the all time assist leader in the NCAA, that that
Speaker 1: record has been there for thirty years. Kareem Abdul Jabbar
Speaker 1: scoring record is going down this year. In the next month.
Speaker 1: Lebron James. I just did a game the other night
Speaker 1: and we talked about it a lot. It was one
Speaker 1: of it was the lost to Denver last week for Lebron.
Speaker 1: But that's a record that stood for thirty eight years
Speaker 1: and it's going down. Your record stood for thirty years.
Speaker 1: I don't know that it's ever going to be eclipsed
Speaker 1: because not enough guys stay what do you think? That's
Speaker 1: how I always say it. Really, I mean, I know
Speaker 1: there are guys like Chris Paul that stuck around for
Speaker 1: two years and you know, I could really pass. I
Speaker 1: took pride in passing the basketball. It was it was
Speaker 1: the one skill that I loved beyond any other to
Speaker 1: make that dynamic pass, no look and showcase you know,
Speaker 1: unselfishness and uh and the vision that I had out there.
Speaker 1: And I like to be liked by my teammates. So
Speaker 1: you know, if you make a good pass and you
Speaker 1: set them up for a shot, then you're usually you know,
Speaker 1: well liked in the locker room. So but yeah, no
Speaker 1: doubt it's it's gonna be tough to catch it. And
Speaker 1: I think it's also all the NSA tournament games that
Speaker 1: I participated in as a player. We were getting to
Speaker 1: the Final four three straight years, so it's just you're
Speaker 1: getting a lot of games compiled there. You're the second
Speaker 1: duke a lump that I've had on this podcast. I
Speaker 1: had JJ Reddick on last year. I just worked with
Speaker 1: JJ last week. Really like working him. He's great. I
Speaker 1: don't know how much you've seen him on TV, but
Speaker 1: he's really he's outstanding. He's really I mean, he could
Speaker 1: do this for a long time and be excellent for
Speaker 1: a long time. He had some great Coach K stories
Speaker 1: about Chavlick Randolph basically getting ripped by Kah. I don't
Speaker 1: is there anything, I mean, it's been thirty years, but
Speaker 1: I'm sure you have indelible moments that you can recall
Speaker 1: about Coach K. Anything that stands out to you above
Speaker 1: the others. Well, there's probably a couple. I think the
Speaker 1: one was more when we just defeated you and LV
Speaker 1: and they were They beat us the year before by
Speaker 1: thirty points my freshman year in a championship game, just
Speaker 1: humiliated in front of twenty million people, and now we're
Speaker 1: back in the same spot about to play them. They're undefeated,
Speaker 1: they're number one in the country and we're big underdogs
Speaker 1: in that game, and we go out and play the
Speaker 1: game of our lives and you know, a near perfect game.
Speaker 1: And I just remember, you know, the moments afterwards and
Speaker 1: feeling like incredible, and then going to media with coach
Speaker 1: and just he and I and saying, did we just
Speaker 1: do that? You know, because he like really motivated us
Speaker 1: that whole week. He was like, guys, I'm gonna I'm
Speaker 1: gonna be talking up UNLV, how good they are, how
Speaker 1: unbeatable they are, but we're going to kick their ass,
Speaker 1: you know, on Saturday night. And really, like I get
Speaker 1: chills thinking about like the type of motivational tactics he
Speaker 1: used that week and getting us ready to play and
Speaker 1: win that game. So that one was a special one,
Speaker 1: and I think another one would be the Dream Team
Speaker 1: week when I was selected one of eight players to
Speaker 1: go scrimmage against the original Dream Team, and it was myself,
Speaker 1: Penny Hardaway, Grant Hill, Jamal Mashburn, Alan Euston, Chris Webber.
Speaker 1: I mean, we had a squad and we were real
Speaker 1: nervous to play that game. The first scrimmage. I just
Speaker 1: remember that that bus rolling up and there was hundreds
Speaker 1: of people screaming for Jordan and Magic and all those guys,
Speaker 1: and then we pull up in like a yellow school
Speaker 1: bus and all cares where they are, and so we're
Speaker 1: the Dream Team is going through their routine, and I'm
Speaker 1: saying to myself, I'm real nervous, man. I'm like, maybe
Speaker 1: these guys, they've won so much, they're not gonna go
Speaker 1: that hard today. The first day, and they were going hard.
Speaker 1: I was like, the ball was just popping, everyone was talking.
Speaker 1: It looked like they had played together for like ten years.
Speaker 1: So now I'm even more nervous. They gave me like
Speaker 1: two minutes to warm up, and then we got to
Speaker 1: play the Dream Team, and I remember just turning it
Speaker 1: loose and I had some steals, some assists, layups. Everything
Speaker 1: was clicking, and I remember I think I drove in
Speaker 1: and lay the ball and we went up twelve, and
Speaker 1: Chuck the alley called the time out, and I just
Speaker 1: looked over at Coach k and he just he looked
Speaker 1: like he always was in control. And I gave him
Speaker 1: a look and he was like he almost looked at me,
Speaker 1: like why can't you play this good when you're with me? Um?
Speaker 1: But but that's like how I felt like, Wow, like
Speaker 1: I just impressed Coach k That's pretty cool. So and
Speaker 1: there was a story you've told before. Maybe maybe you
Speaker 1: can go a little bit deeper here on your teammate
Speaker 1: Christian Layter, who wasn't on your team, he's on the
Speaker 1: Dream Team and Magic got mad at him. Is that
Speaker 1: is that what happened? Like you beat him? Yeah, I wasn't, Dave.
Speaker 1: I wasn't going to share that. It is part of
Speaker 1: what I just talked about. It was, Um, we had
Speaker 1: went on a big run and and uh, you know,
Speaker 1: Christian and I had always you know, butted head some
Speaker 1: and he, you know, he was hard on me, and
Speaker 1: uh he could be an ass sometimes to play with,
Speaker 1: but but in a in a way that we always
Speaker 1: pushed each other like and challenged each other and stuff.
Speaker 1: So it was probably good, but you didn't always feel
Speaker 1: that way in the moment. So him being hard on me,
Speaker 1: I had a little bit of payback. I came off
Speaker 1: a high ball screen going to my left hand and
Speaker 1: Christian was guarding the screener and his job is to
Speaker 1: step out and make sure I just can't turn the
Speaker 1: corner and go to the basket. He stepped out briefly,
Speaker 1: but not long enough for Magic to get back in
Speaker 1: front of me. So as soon as he left, I
Speaker 1: just darted right down the lane and laid the ball
Speaker 1: in and Chuck Daly called that time out. I looked
Speaker 1: over a coach k and and then but the many
Speaker 1: time Magic was tearing Christian the pieces, it was like, hey,
Speaker 1: you rookie, you step out, you know, and it was
Speaker 1: just it was crazy. And I had never seen anybody
Speaker 1: like talk to Christian like that, so it was it
Speaker 1: was a little in a sick way inside it it
Speaker 1: felt good, Hey, it's the bully meeting somebody a little
Speaker 1: bit bigger, right, you know, with a bigger rep. And
Speaker 1: then he's a guy that you know, Magic is not
Speaker 1: a guy that you say anything too, so he just
Speaker 1: had to take it. Yeah, was there anybody particular that
Speaker 1: you were in awe of? Do you remember like walking
Speaker 1: and be like, oh my goodness, that's so and so.
Speaker 1: I mean you again, you were a great player, and
Speaker 1: you were top ten pick shortly after that, But was
Speaker 1: there anybody that you were like man or when you
Speaker 1: played the game or the practice and you were done, like, wow,
Speaker 1: that guy's a lot better than I thought. Good question, well,
Speaker 1: Jordan had my attention a lot like just I was
Speaker 1: always looking where he is. I had the ball out
Speaker 1: of my hands. I was always wondering what passed He's
Speaker 1: going to try and steal and go dunk it. So
Speaker 1: I was always trying to like think about where he
Speaker 1: was on the floor. I had to guard him one
Speaker 1: possession and he just he said, mouse in the house,
Speaker 1: let's go get me the ball on the block and
Speaker 1: he kind of did that that patented fadeaway jump shot
Speaker 1: over me. That was a memorable one. I mean, I
Speaker 1: don't know. The guys were really good, I mean, really
Speaker 1: down to earth, asked them questions. You know, my brother
Speaker 1: Dan had me on a mission to get some cards signed,
Speaker 1: you know which trading cards, which you know, those guys
Speaker 1: were great again about doing that, so it was pretty cool.
Speaker 1: David Robinson, man, he was a guy that was so good,
Speaker 1: a light on his feet. I don't know how he
Speaker 1: blocked the shot of mine one time. I thought I
Speaker 1: had to lay up and this guy, I don't know
Speaker 1: where he came from, and the ball was like in
Speaker 1: the third row. Scottie Pippen. It's another one. I realized
Speaker 1: I was going to be in trouble if he was
Speaker 1: guarding me in the NBA, because he laid off me
Speaker 1: about three feet and with his wingspan as Billy to jump,
Speaker 1: he just blocked my jump shot. And then he was
Speaker 1: laying far enough off me I couldn't go buy him,
Speaker 1: So I basically couldn't do anything with him. Speaking of well,
Speaker 1: first of all, before we get to the NBA, in
Speaker 1: your time in the NBA, have you watched the Redeem
Speaker 1: Team documentary on Netflix yet? Have you seen it? I have, Yes.
Speaker 1: I thought it was phenomenal. And the thing that stood
Speaker 1: out to me about well two things was Kobe and
Speaker 1: how that maybe changed players viewpoint of Kobe, because when
Speaker 1: Kobe unfortunately passed, you had a lot of players talk
Speaker 1: about how they used to pick his brain and how
Speaker 1: helpful Kobe was to them, where before that it seemed
Speaker 1: like he was kind of standoffish from those guys. That
Speaker 1: stood out to me. And then the other was the
Speaker 1: command the coach k had of that group, considering he's
Speaker 1: a college coach with the greatest players in the world
Speaker 1: and all future Hall of famers. Yeah, I just think,
Speaker 1: you know, again, that was a great documentary, well done.
Speaker 1: I think a great tribute to Kobe and and just
Speaker 1: uh you know how it was portrayed, and just seeing
Speaker 1: him jump over to scores table to save a loose
Speaker 1: ball and what he did with Pau Gasol in that
Speaker 1: first game and with something man runs him over. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he tells the guys, I'm gonna run him over. It's
Speaker 1: like one of his best friends. I mean I had
Speaker 1: chills when I saw that. I mean that was big time.
Speaker 1: You know his story when everyone went out in Vegas
Speaker 1: and he's he's going down to the workout room at
Speaker 1: five thirty when everyone's rolling in and the impact that
Speaker 1: that had. So I thought there were a lot of
Speaker 1: things that I really gravitated to that I could even
Speaker 1: use to talk to my players because all my guys
Speaker 1: like idolized Kobe and they watched it. So it was great.
Speaker 1: But but Coach k was always brilliant, you know with
Speaker 1: his messaging. You know, I think that he spends a
Speaker 1: lot of time just making sure he could find ways,
Speaker 1: you know, to motivate his guys. So have you been
Speaker 1: able to talk through that with some of your players
Speaker 1: and what's their reaction been to some of the things
Speaker 1: that they saw and now try to implement themselves. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean we just I mentioned a few of those examples.
Speaker 1: You know, talked about sacrifice a lot. You know, on
Speaker 1: a good team, you have to sacrifice. And a guy
Speaker 1: like Dwayne Wade, who's playing probably one of the best
Speaker 1: players in the NBA's coming up the bench and he
Speaker 1: handled that fine. So I think there's a lot of
Speaker 1: good lessons that you could learn. And just seeing like
Speaker 1: guys like Kobe just the willingness to do the little
Speaker 1: things and the dirty work, and talking about guarding Genobley
Speaker 1: and you know when he's maybe one of the great
Speaker 1: scores of all time, but he took it personal to
Speaker 1: try and shut him down in the game they needed
Speaker 1: him to guard Manu. So there's a lot of things
Speaker 1: that you could talk to your guys about. Coach k
Speaker 1: Retires will go down as one of the greatest coaches
Speaker 1: in the history of sports, one of the most successful
Speaker 1: coaches in the history of sports. Can you talk about
Speaker 1: the challenges that John Shire faces? Now, I mean you
Speaker 1: played there, you know what it's like. It's it's probably
Speaker 1: the toughest place to play maybe in sports for an opponent.
Speaker 1: Because of the success and because of the proximity to
Speaker 1: the fans, what do you think the challenges are for
Speaker 1: John trying to keep that thing going because a lot
Speaker 1: of times people say, you don't want to be the
Speaker 1: guy that takes the job after the guy. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: but John, obviously he's in a great spot getting that job,
Speaker 1: which is one of the best jobs in college basketball. Yeah. Well,
Speaker 1: I've been an assistant for three years before I became
Speaker 1: a head coach, and there's when you slide one seat over,
Speaker 1: it's a big difference. You know, you're you're completely in
Speaker 1: charge of many more decisions instantly throughout the course of
Speaker 1: the game. So there'll be a learning curve there. But
Speaker 1: you know, he's young, and you know he's been through
Speaker 1: the wars with Coach k he sat next to him,
Speaker 1: he's picked his brain. He's you know, he's got great energy,
Speaker 1: so you know, and the recruiting has been very stable.
Speaker 1: You know, it's not like they've dropped off in terms
Speaker 1: of getting the top talent. So that's definitely gonna help.
Speaker 1: You mentioned being an assistant. You started coaching just a
Speaker 1: little bit over a decade ago, and you know, obviously
Speaker 1: we'll get into a little bit. You know, what happened
Speaker 1: with your NBA career but there was that long period
Speaker 1: of time where you weren't coaching. I want to touch
Speaker 1: on that as well. But what finally clicked in terms of,
Speaker 1: you know, I think I want to do this because
Speaker 1: obviously you've done very well as a head coach. Well,
Speaker 1: I mean, it's something that I never knew I would
Speaker 1: take basketball as far as I took it, I always,
Speaker 1: you know, my self esteem as a basketball player wasn't great,
Speaker 1: Like I always didn't think I was good enough and
Speaker 1: continued to push myself and never thought that I would
Speaker 1: even get to the NBA. So coaching was always something
Speaker 1: that I knew that I would want to go in
Speaker 1: that direction because my dad was a long time high
Speaker 1: school coach forty five years and in the Hall of
Speaker 1: Fame as one of two high school coaches. So I
Speaker 1: was around the game and that way my whole life,
Speaker 1: and sat in those rooms with him after a bad
Speaker 1: loss when he was steaming, and you know, I just
Speaker 1: saw how much he wanted to learn the game and
Speaker 1: invested time in doing it and watching film and all
Speaker 1: the stuff he did. So I knew that it was
Speaker 1: kind of my destiny to want to do that. But
Speaker 1: with the NBA not going away, I had wanted to
Speaker 1: with my career just kind of had a bad taste
Speaker 1: in my mouth. I had the car accident that I
Speaker 1: dealt with, and I was a little burnt out from basketball,
Speaker 1: so I think I needed a little bit of a breather.
Speaker 1: But deep down, like every March madness, I like I
Speaker 1: was saying, Wow, I want to be coaching in the
Speaker 1: NSA Tournament, and or in October I'm like wow, like
Speaker 1: I should be coaching, and then I would be sidetracked
Speaker 1: with other business stuff that I was doing. And but
Speaker 1: certainly it was it was always itching at me to
Speaker 1: want to do it. You mentioned the car accident, which
Speaker 1: I know you've talked about probably more than you want
Speaker 1: to over the last thirty years, happening in your rookie season,
Speaker 1: very early on in your rookie season. Do you think
Speaker 1: if that didn't happen, your career would have been longer,
Speaker 1: or do you think because of kind of what you
Speaker 1: said earlier, you lacked some self confidence that maybe it
Speaker 1: wasn't going in the direction ultimately that you had hoped.
Speaker 1: Regardless of that, well, I mean I think I was
Speaker 1: leading all of all rookies would assist when it happened
Speaker 1: you know, I was starting, but I wasn't setting the
Speaker 1: world on fire. I was struggling from the field shooting it.
Speaker 1: I think we were still in the process of building
Speaker 1: and putting pieces together there. I don't think it was
Speaker 1: ready to be a winning situation. I was adjusting to that,
Speaker 1: which was very tough. I went from hardly ever losing
Speaker 1: any games to being, you know, one of the worst
Speaker 1: teams in the NBA. So when it did happen, knocked
Speaker 1: me back. It's hard to prepare for anything like that.
Speaker 1: It was, you know, a len the recovery. I think,
Speaker 1: you know, I had a partial term my ACL which
Speaker 1: didn't help. And I think the biggest injury though was,
Speaker 1: you know, I should have had a seat belt on.
Speaker 1: I didn't have the belt on and was ejected from
Speaker 1: the vehicle and so the impact of landing, you know,
Speaker 1: did quite a bit of damage to my left shoulder
Speaker 1: at some nerve damage in there. So just the my arm,
Speaker 1: my left arm really didn't fire the same. I became
Speaker 1: more of a right hand dominic guy. So there were
Speaker 1: some things that came out of there that I just
Speaker 1: tried to battle through. But we're not you know, ideal
Speaker 1: in terms of trying to be an elite athlete at
Speaker 1: that level. And I don't want to dismiss it all
Speaker 1: what you're saying, because obviously there was a serious situation,
Speaker 1: but you touched on something about I want to get
Speaker 1: your take on this for somebody here like Kyler Murray
Speaker 1: who won championships in high school, pretty successful, winning Heisman
Speaker 1: Trophy at Oklahoma and struggling to win the team, struggling
Speaker 1: right now, made the playoffs last year. But you know,
Speaker 1: because you've been there, somebody that won championships and then
Speaker 1: you're trying to figure out how to deal sometimes with
Speaker 1: guys that maybe aren't on your level talent wise, and
Speaker 1: trying to build a winner. How difficult. I mean, you've
Speaker 1: done it at Arizona statement, there's a great example of
Speaker 1: you doing in your coaching career, taking a program that
Speaker 1: kind of was hovering around occasionally being on the bubble
Speaker 1: too again without COVID three straight years in the NSA
Speaker 1: Tournament for first time in sixty years. I just think
Speaker 1: you've got to be stubborn, and you can never be
Speaker 1: satisfied or accept losing, and it's just got to destroy
Speaker 1: you inside. And I think the great competitors really you
Speaker 1: know if they say they hate to lose more than
Speaker 1: they love to win, and it's just it eats away
Speaker 1: at them. So you know, as long as you have
Speaker 1: that going in your belly, then then you're going to
Speaker 1: figure out a way to get the job done. So
Speaker 1: after your NBA career, before you got into coaching, you
Speaker 1: were doing horse breeding. How involved were you were you
Speaker 1: racing horses, Like, did you know everything there was to
Speaker 1: know about it or were you just kind of a
Speaker 1: casual observer. Well, it started for me back in high
Speaker 1: school occasionally. You know, my mom worked, she was a
Speaker 1: teacher assistant. My dad was a probation officer and a
Speaker 1: basketball coach. So I had babysitter, and babysitter took Bobby
Speaker 1: to the track, you know, which I don't know is
Speaker 1: the greatest place to be taken. But um so I
Speaker 1: saw the horses. I didn't understand what was going on.
Speaker 1: You know, he was you know, he was betting, uh,
Speaker 1: you know, on the races and stuff and stuff. So
Speaker 1: I had a little bit of a knowledge of it
Speaker 1: at that point. I had a lawyer friend of mine
Speaker 1: that was a thoroughbred owner and he was he sponsored
Speaker 1: my ProAm team when I played in the NBA in
Speaker 1: the in the Jersey Shore League and we were called
Speaker 1: the Alan Hurst Barber's. Um. So you play for the
Speaker 1: team and you get a haircut, you know eventually, you know,
Speaker 1: once every couple of weeks. That was my my deal
Speaker 1: with that team. It was actually the last game I
Speaker 1: ever played in my life. Was was that game? I
Speaker 1: tore my my ACL fiddle last time and had to
Speaker 1: hang it up. But that was nineteen ninety eight nine.
Speaker 1: Um So anyway, uh uh. Brian already had owned several horses.
Speaker 1: He brought me to the track. He had this new
Speaker 1: one that he loved, and and I was getting ready
Speaker 1: to play my first NBA season and he had me
Speaker 1: go to the workout. And you know, the horse looked fine.
Speaker 1: It was running fast. But they're all out there running
Speaker 1: and I don't really know the difference between which is
Speaker 1: so um he said, do you want to invest? And
Speaker 1: it was twenty thousand dollars I think, and I had
Speaker 1: the check ready, and then at the last minute, I said, look, Brian,
Speaker 1: I don't really I need to concentrate on basketball and
Speaker 1: I don't really know what's going on, so I'm going
Speaker 1: to take a pass on this and ended up that horse.
Speaker 1: He invited me to watch her run and like this
Speaker 1: huge race. It was a big purse like a year later.
Speaker 1: So kind of filed that away and um, as my
Speaker 1: basketball wind it down, I got more involved. I did
Speaker 1: more research on it, and uh, it became a way
Speaker 1: to substitute like the competitiveness that I had in basketball,
Speaker 1: and kind of dedicated towards that. And they, you know,
Speaker 1: trying to find something new to invest my time in.
Speaker 1: Doing a few more quick ones and we'll get you
Speaker 1: out of here, I know. He get filmed to watch
Speaker 1: in a season to get ready for. In nineteen ninety six,
Speaker 1: you were in a movie called Blue Chips, which I
Speaker 1: think was the first time that there were that many
Speaker 1: athletes together other than Space Jam right, which wasn't you
Speaker 1: know it was animated and they've redone it since. Well
Speaker 1: what do you remember about that? I think you were
Speaker 1: playing for Indiana for Bob Knight in the movie. Yeah,
Speaker 1: well a duke guy playing for Bob Knight. Yeah. I
Speaker 1: was nervous about that because he's you know. And again
Speaker 1: when I when I got there for the shoot, it
Speaker 1: was all live footage, so we just played Shack and
Speaker 1: Penny's team and they just they just shot raw footage.
Speaker 1: So I didn't have to act, luckily because I got
Speaker 1: no no skills there um. But he had a way.
Speaker 1: Bobby Knight just had really a way of about him,
Speaker 1: just presence about him. You just felt like a little
Speaker 1: bit of intimidation just being around him. So I really
Speaker 1: I had everything real basic and fundamental chess pass, bounce pass,
Speaker 1: none of the over the head or behind the back.
Speaker 1: I just put that all to bed. And but there
Speaker 1: was one that was one story. It was pretty funny.
Speaker 1: They take all the live footage and there's only one
Speaker 1: stage shot at the end, and everyone wants to get
Speaker 1: out of there and leave and go eat or whatever,
Speaker 1: and so the director comes over and it's the lab
Speaker 1: play there. They're getting that orchestrated and they throw it
Speaker 1: the lob to Shack and he dunks it and then
Speaker 1: they win and they go nuts and they store them
Speaker 1: the court and everything. So we're in there and it
Speaker 1: takes like fifteen twenty minutes to get the camera set
Speaker 1: up in the right position, get the fans where he
Speaker 1: wanted them, and the whole thing. So the director then
Speaker 1: comes back in the huddle and he's like, all right,
Speaker 1: we're ready for you guys now. So as we're leaving
Speaker 1: the huddle to go back out, Bobby Knight grabs a
Speaker 1: couple of guys and he says, grab Shack. Don't let
Speaker 1: him get it the lab. So they run the play
Speaker 1: and and and I forget Penny's thrown the lab to
Speaker 1: Shack and and the ball just sails out of bounds
Speaker 1: because something we just grabbed Shack and they're like cut, cut,
Speaker 1: you know, and h Then they had to reset all
Speaker 1: the cameras again and everything and get the shot figured out.
Speaker 1: So that was pretty funny, you know. I actually worked
Speaker 1: some games with Bob Knight when he worked for ESPN,
Speaker 1: and I really enjoyed working He was actually really good
Speaker 1: to me. And it's funny because he put his arm
Speaker 1: around me during an on camera and I other than
Speaker 1: the Bill games, that's the most my phone has blown
Speaker 1: up like Bob Knight, like you're you're being initiated into
Speaker 1: the club. When Bob Knight puts his arm, I thought
Speaker 1: he might hurt me first, but it was a gentle.
Speaker 1: It was a gentle uh arm. I'm guessing Blue Chips
Speaker 1: is better than Batman's versus Superman. Dawn of Justice. I
Speaker 1: was in that. I don't know if you've seen it. Oh,
Speaker 1: I haven't seen that, so it's not good. Um, the
Speaker 1: Zack Snyder cut, which is a movie that he wanted
Speaker 1: to make. Ye, it's so if you if you get
Speaker 1: the movie, there's Zack Snyder cut. We're in that football scene.
Speaker 1: It's again I didn't have to act because I'm a sportscaster,
Speaker 1: but we we introduced the Ben Affleck Batman like the
Speaker 1: It's like between Superman getting in trouble for something that
Speaker 1: maybe he did and they think maybe he's a bad
Speaker 1: guy to now introducing Ben Affleck. There's a football game
Speaker 1: that's going on and we're announcing it. But don't waste
Speaker 1: your time. I'm gonna go look for it now. Much
Speaker 1: more important things, I think to watch. Last thing, how
Speaker 1: do you think you've grown in your time at Arizona
Speaker 1: State eight years now as a as a head coach? Well,
Speaker 1: I mean I think, uh, I think the last two
Speaker 1: years have taught you a lot of lessons. They were
Speaker 1: very frustrating and hard to live through. I think being
Speaker 1: a little more tolerant, a little you know, a little
Speaker 1: bit more forgiving, you know, on myself, And I think Uh,
Speaker 1: that's been a plus. I think I'm showing a little
Speaker 1: more patients, uh, towards the guys I'm coaching, and and
Speaker 1: uh I think I've I only had one time technical
Speaker 1: last year. It was it was a big one. But
Speaker 1: uh so I'm doing better I think with the officials
Speaker 1: or trying and I don't know. I mean, I I
Speaker 1: like our team this year. I think I've delegated a
Speaker 1: little more. I think I've been too much of a
Speaker 1: control I got to control everything, and I've given more
Speaker 1: to Jermaine Kimbro for us defensively and giving him more
Speaker 1: of responsibility my associate head coach, and that's freed me
Speaker 1: up to focus in on our offense and special situations
Speaker 1: and and just the overall field of the game. With
Speaker 1: having to feel like you're in charge of everything. Well,
Speaker 1: I always enjoy covering your team. So you're a class
Speaker 1: act and I love watching you guys play. I'm hopeful
Speaker 1: that you guys get back to where you were finally
Speaker 1: through the injuries and everything and get back to where
Speaker 1: you guys were a few years ago. I know we
Speaker 1: have you guys a bunches here, so look forward to
Speaker 1: seeing you in the season. Same here, Dave, thank you,
Speaker 1: thanks man, appreciate you. A lot of subjects covered there
Speaker 1: with Bobby Hurley, along with his time as an NBA
Speaker 1: player and playing for Mike Shashevsky at Duke and going
Speaker 1: up against the Dream Team. Some interesting stuff on what
Speaker 1: he did after his playing days before he got into coaching.
Speaker 1: It's also good to catch up about the Arizona State
Speaker 1: Sun Devil basketball team. If you think about the injuries
Speaker 1: and COVID what happened to Arizona State, they would have
Speaker 1: been in the NCAA Tournament for the third straight year,
Speaker 1: which would have been historic for the Sun Devils. Hopefully
Speaker 1: they're back, and it sounds like based on what Bobby
Speaker 1: was saying about the roster and the health of Bagley,
Speaker 1: there's a chance Arizona State is among the contenders in
Speaker 1: the Pac twelve again this season. We are presented by
Speaker 1: bet MGM, the official sports betting partner of the Arizona Cardinals,
Speaker 1: and by Hila River Resorts and Casinos. You can follow
Speaker 1: us on Twitter at pashpod. You can also tell us
Speaker 1: what you think, review us, rate us by going on
Speaker 1: your podcast platform and giving us your thoughts on the
Speaker 1: Dave Pash podcast, Thank again to you for listening, and
Speaker 1: thanks to Bobby Hurley for being this week's guest on
Speaker 1: the Dave Pash Podcast m H