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Speaker 1: The shoplifters walk in and walk out like they own

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Speaker 1: the place.

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Speaker 2: They tell the security guard not to touch them, Carrying

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Speaker 2: an armful of clothing, they walk right out of the store.

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Speaker 3: I've been watching these brazen shoplifting stories on the news

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Speaker 3: every day for the past ten years.

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Speaker 4: And Atlanta woman's accused of stealing from four different stores

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Speaker 4: in a single day.

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Speaker 3: And it just keeps getting worse and worse, especially in California,

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Speaker 3: where I live. They stroll in like regular shoppers, then

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Speaker 3: scramble out lugging bags filled.

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Speaker 5: And arms full of stolen goods.

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Speaker 3: Last year, the Americana, a ritzy shopping center in Glendale,

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Speaker 3: a place I go to all the time, was hit

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Speaker 3: by an actual shoplifting mob.

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Speaker 2: And it was a brazen burglary that happened in a

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Speaker 2: broad daylight here at the Saint Laurn's store. Glendale police

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Speaker 2: is calling it a flash Moberg and says thirty to

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Speaker 2: forty people were involved. Now, the suspects escaped in about

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Speaker 2: twenty separate cars, getting away with about three hundred thousand

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Speaker 2: dollars worth of merchandise.

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Speaker 3: All these crazy instances of retail theft just seem so random, right,

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Speaker 3: But they're actually not. They're actually very very planned.

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Speaker 4: These ladies would come in, they would immediately select a

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Speaker 4: number of items, high value clothing from different retailers Lululemon, Nordstrom, Macy's,

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Speaker 4: and then they would immediately exit and leave.

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Speaker 3: It turns out all these shoplifters are really just worker

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Speaker 3: bees buzzing around all day in search of honey.

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Speaker 6: Thousands of dollars worth of cosmetics.

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Speaker 3: Lots and lots of honey, nine hundred thousand dollars worth

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Speaker 3: of jewelry, and they're bringing all that honey back to

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Speaker 3: the hive, back to the shoplifting queen Bee herself.

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Speaker 7: California Mom is the alleged ring leader behind an eight

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Speaker 7: million dollar retail theft ring. She's accused of operating a

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Speaker 7: nationwide shoplifting scheme for more than a decade, according to

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Speaker 7: the California Department of.

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Speaker 3: Justice, from her Tuscan style mansion in beautiful southern California.

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Speaker 3: Investigators say fifty three year old Michelle mack spearheaded a

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Speaker 3: team of sophisticated all female shoplifters, deploying them to bring

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Speaker 3: her millions in stolen merchandise, and according to authorities, she

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Speaker 3: hid it all in plain sight.

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Speaker 8: She's the antithesis of what you would expect to be

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Speaker 8: the head of an organized retail theft operation.

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Speaker 3: And why is that?

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Speaker 8: I mean, I'm just gonna address the elephant in the room.

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Speaker 8: It's it's her ethnicity, it's her gender.

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Speaker 3: She's a blonde, white woman.

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Speaker 8: It's it's her socioeconomic status, wealthy, nice neighborhood, big house baller.

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Speaker 8: What does your average criminal look like in a Hollywood move?

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Speaker 8: It's not Michelle Mack.

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Speaker 3: Let's just say that. I'm Jonathan Walton and this is

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Speaker 3: Queen of the con Season six, The California Girls, Episode one,

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Speaker 3: another bougie woman shopping for makeup.

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Speaker 9: Shoplifting was always kind of like a thing. That's just like,

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Speaker 9: oh God, my buddy.

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Speaker 3: Evan Goldstein is many things, a husband, a father of two,

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Speaker 3: a big time showrunner for that History Channel series The

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Speaker 3: Unexplained with Me William Shafner. But up until now, I

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Speaker 3: had no idea Evan Goldstein is also a reform shoplifter.

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Speaker 9: I remember one time in a comic book shop in Union,

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Speaker 9: New Jersey.

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Speaker 5: I'm sure they're still after me.

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Speaker 9: You know, I was big into comics and there was

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Speaker 9: a Moonnight comic. I don't know what came over me,

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Speaker 9: but I just wanted it and I didn't have enough

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Speaker 9: money for it, and I turned kind of my back

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Speaker 9: and I put it in my pants, like like kind

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Speaker 9: of where the you know, where the waste is?

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Speaker 3: Like how old are you at this point?

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Speaker 9: Eleven? So wells aren't very big, no, no, And it

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Speaker 9: wasn't premeditated. I didn't go in to steal it. I

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Speaker 9: didn't go in thinking I was just going into brows

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Speaker 9: and I just I just wanted it.

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Speaker 5: I just needed to have.

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Speaker 9: It, and I put it in my pants and I

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Speaker 9: walked out with the comic book, and I remember feeling

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Speaker 9: so bad about it afterwards. I remember feeling terrible and

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Speaker 9: it was like my dark secret. I was racked with guilt.

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Speaker 9: I'm just like, I'm a thief, I'm a criminal. What

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Speaker 9: have you done with your life? As you know, eleven

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Speaker 9: years old? And honestly, the comic book wasn't the juice

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Speaker 9: wasn't worth the squeeze. I felt a lot of guilt

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Speaker 9: about it, I really did. But I could see it

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Speaker 9: was a hit of adrenaline.

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Speaker 3: Wasn't it.

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Speaker 9: Yeah, Like there was like a certain kind of chemical

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Speaker 9: reaction in my body that was just and.

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Speaker 3: I get away with this? Are they watching me? Are

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Speaker 3: they watching me?

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Speaker 10: Run?

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Speaker 3: Am I going to the clink?

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Speaker 9: And I could see how it could become kind of

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Speaker 9: like this addictive kind of dopamine rush where it's just

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Speaker 9: like you crave that kind of sense of can I

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Speaker 9: get away with it?

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Speaker 5: That kind of Bonnie and Clyde of it?

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Speaker 6: You know?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, No, it's dude. From age I don't know ten

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Speaker 3: to age eighteen, I was a kleptomaniac. Really, I was

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Speaker 3: like a color toe. I stole everything all the time.

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Speaker 3: There it is my confession to Evan and to the world.

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Speaker 3: I myself am also a reformed shoplifter.

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Speaker 5: What were you stealing?

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Speaker 3: Nothing of value? Just a little trink I would steal

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Speaker 3: little things like keychains.

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Speaker 5: Or food, kind of like things that would fit in

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Speaker 5: your pocket.

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Speaker 3: Things that you could just grab and not pay for

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Speaker 3: a night light, like really dumb things. Nothing of value.

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Speaker 9: Re And was it that you really wanted it or

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Speaker 9: was it just the act of taking it and getting

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Speaker 9: away with it?

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Speaker 3: Was the act? I didn't know at the time, but

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Speaker 3: I was a kleptomania. Yeah, I enjoyed the rush. I'm

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Speaker 3: not gonna get caught them. They didn't get away with it.

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Speaker 3: They don't know what's happening. Yeah. And when I was

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Speaker 3: in Epcot, you know Epcot Center, you know Disney Orlando, Epcot,

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Speaker 3: we were in the Mexico pavilion and I put on

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Speaker 3: this giant, like sixty dollars sombrero. Took a picture and

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Speaker 3: I just kept walking and I went on the ride.

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Speaker 3: And my cousins, you know, they were my ages. They

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Speaker 3: were like laughing, ha ha, Jonathan stolen sombrero and I

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Speaker 3: have that picture. Maybe I'll post that picture at Queen

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Speaker 3: of the Con on Instagram. Me in a stolen sombrero. Oh,

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Speaker 3: Mexico and Epcot evidence. You're Eisner's after you. Yeah, that listen,

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Speaker 3: that's stock price. They need all the help they can get.

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Speaker 3: The day I quit shoplifting, I went cold turkey after

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Speaker 3: an ill fated trip to the supermarket. I stopped because

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Speaker 3: I was at Albertson's and there's like a salad soup bar,

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Speaker 3: and I take the potato Leaks soup and I walk

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Speaker 3: around the store pretending to be looking at other things,

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Speaker 3: and I'm pick up the milk to check the expiration date,

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Speaker 3: and I put the soup down that I'm done. With

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Speaker 3: put the milk down, and they walk out of the

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Speaker 3: store empty handed, and I get that tap on the shoulder,

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Speaker 3: excuse me, sir, are you gonna pay for that soup?

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Speaker 3: And I just like turned white. I just like freaked out.

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Speaker 3: I'm like, crap, I'm busted. And then I never stole again.

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Speaker 5: So it was okay for years and years. You get

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Speaker 5: away with it.

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Speaker 9: It's fine, you're taking these trinkets, these little bit bobbles whatever,

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Speaker 9: and then all of a sudden, the kind of reality

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Speaker 9: hits you when it's like, hey, are you gonna and

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Speaker 9: you're you're caught. I got caught, and so then it's

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Speaker 9: just like, oh my god, this is like I don't

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Speaker 9: want this.

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Speaker 5: The life of crime is not for me.

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Speaker 3: No, I don't want it.

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Speaker 5: It's like there goes you know. It's just like I

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Speaker 5: got a hundred night lights. I want it. I was

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Speaker 5: trying to trying to get to one hundred and one.

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Speaker 3: But hey, I'm in distinguished company, right, A lot of

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Speaker 3: celebrities like Wanona Rider.

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Speaker 11: Wana Rider was arragned today charging her with grand theft.

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Speaker 3: Lindsay Lohan low and pled not guilty to felony grand

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Speaker 3: theft stemming from her alleged shoplifting of a necklace from

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Speaker 3: a Venice jewelry store and James Franco, Like.

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Speaker 4: In eighth grade, we started stealing cologne. We had like

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Speaker 4: thirty bottles of Colone each.

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Speaker 9: When most people think about shoplifters, it's kind of like

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Speaker 9: this low rent kind of crime.

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Speaker 5: You know.

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Speaker 3: That's the reason celebrities can get away with it for

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Speaker 3: a while is because they're the last person you would

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Speaker 3: expect to be a shoplifter. Yeah, and that seems to

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Speaker 3: be the key to this season's Queen of the Cohn.

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Speaker 3: This woman is literally the last person on Earth you

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Speaker 3: would suspect of running a shoplifting empire. But that empire

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Speaker 3: all comes crashing down around Michelle Mack In the wee

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Speaker 3: hours of the morning on December sixth, twenty twenty three,

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Speaker 3: in the Bucolic community of Bonzol just north of San Diego.

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Speaker 3: The sun's coming up, illuminating that big California sky, casting

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Speaker 3: a morning haze on dozens of hilltop mansions framed by

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Speaker 3: rolling fields and green pastures. It's abundantly obvious that wealthy

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Speaker 3: people live here, really wealthy people, some of whom allegedly

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Speaker 3: have nefarious sources of income, because all of a sudden,

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Speaker 3: a squadron of investigators from the California Highway Patrol and

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Speaker 3: from Homeland Security pull up in a fleet of SUVs

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Speaker 3: and they start assembling outside one of these big mansions.

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Speaker 3: So you guys all we got the outplan correct, yea?

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Speaker 3: And what happens next stuns every homeowner on the block.

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Speaker 3: After the break, Welcome back to Queen of the Cohn.

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Speaker 3: Tactical teams from the California Highway Patrol and Homeland Security

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Speaker 3: are now surrounding a Tuscan style mansion just north of

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Speaker 3: San Diego, and they're ready to pounce and working diligently.

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Speaker 3: Amongst all those law enforcement agents.

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Speaker 12: We have all our entrying tools, so everybody bring them.

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Speaker 3: Is a team of investigative journalists from CNBC. How the

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Speaker 3: hell did you guys get the access like you were

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Speaker 3: embedded with the California Highway Patrol. How'd that happen?

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Speaker 13: So it was a lot of work.

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Speaker 3: Gabrielle von Rouge is CNBC's award winning retail reporter.

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Speaker 13: We had started this project and we wanted to get

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Speaker 13: an up close look at what organized retail crime actually

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Speaker 13: looked like.

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Speaker 3: And Gabrielle poured months of her blood, sweat, and tears

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Speaker 3: into this investigation because getting frontline access with law enforcement

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Speaker 3: can be impossible. A lot of these guys won't even

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Speaker 3: return my phone calls, much less allow me to embed

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Speaker 3: with them and record their early morning busts.

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Speaker 13: It's kind of hard to convince the cops to let

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Speaker 13: you in bed with them sometimes, especially when you've got

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Speaker 13: a TV crew and numerous cameras and a sound guy

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Speaker 13: and all this kind of stuff, and they are in

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Speaker 13: the midst of an actual police operation. But at the

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Speaker 13: end of the day, these are public agencies and they

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Speaker 13: are required to be transparent with the public, and in beds,

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Speaker 13: you know, police departments, all kinds of public agencies. The

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Speaker 13: military have a long history of allowing journalists to inbed

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Speaker 13: with them, to be able to see their work up

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Speaker 13: close and personal firsthand, and be able to share that

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Speaker 13: information with the public so that the public understands what

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Speaker 13: law enforcement is doing, how their tax dollars are being used.

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Speaker 13: So it does help a little bit that before I

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Speaker 13: started business, I was a crime reporter for ten years.

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Speaker 13: I have a lot of experience in betting with police

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Speaker 13: departments and with other law enforcement agencies.

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Speaker 3: Back outside in bonseil. Now, in a matter of moments,

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Speaker 3: CNBC reporter Gabrielle von Rouge steps out of the way

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Speaker 3: and a pelax of CHP and Homeland Security agents rush

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Speaker 3: in wearing bulletproof vests with guns drawn, and they storm

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Speaker 3: that three million dollar mansion, and in minutes, a blonde

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Speaker 3: woman in her early fifties, looking dazed, hair disheveled, wearing

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Speaker 3: pink pajamas and fuzzy slippers is led out in handcuffs.

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Speaker 13: There is a mother in California who is running an

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Speaker 13: online makeup store on Amazon, and police suspect that all

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Speaker 13: of the goods that are being sold are stolen, and

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Speaker 13: she is working with a network of professional thieves who

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Speaker 13: she is deploying across the country to rob makeup stores

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Speaker 13: in order to fill her online make it store.

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Speaker 3: Her name is Michelle Mack, and she and her husband,

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Speaker 3: Kenneth are charged with a bonch of felonies, including conspiracy

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Speaker 3: to commit organized retail theft and multiple counts of receipt

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Speaker 3: of stolen property. This entire bust, caught on CNBC's cameras

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Speaker 3: is just insane. I'm posting a clip of it at

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Speaker 3: Queen of the Cohn on Instagram, but I highly recommend

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Speaker 3: you watch the entire seventeen minute investigative piece on CNBC's website.

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Speaker 4: I want a map drawn of the house, separated into

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Speaker 4: two groups, and then we can start loading.

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Speaker 3: If you google how the shadowy world of organized retail

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Speaker 3: crime works, the entire video of that CNBC investigation will

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Speaker 3: pop right up. My god, the footage you guys captured

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Speaker 3: in that investigative piece stunning. You know, you see Michelle

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Speaker 3: Mack getting handcuffed, getting walked to the CHP vehicle. You

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Speaker 3: see all the crap they found, and by crap, I

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Speaker 3: mean stolen loot they found in her place, and you

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Speaker 3: got just phenomenal job. It really paints a picture of

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Speaker 3: what we are dealing with. It's eye opening.

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Speaker 13: It was an incredible story and it got a lot

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Speaker 13: of attention, and it really I think we accomplished the

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Speaker 13: job that we had set out to do, which is

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Speaker 13: what does organized retail crime actually look like? And Michelle

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Speaker 13: Mack is a perfect case for that.

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Speaker 3: According to the felony complaint filed by the California Attorney

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Speaker 3: General's Office, it's alleged that Michelle Mack hired twelve women

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Speaker 3: to steal millions of dollars worth of merchandise from hundreds

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Speaker 3: of stores. She'd then sell all that stolen merch on

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Speaker 3: Amazon to make a fortune. According to California Attorney General

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Speaker 3: Rob Bonta.

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Speaker 10: This is a multimillion dollar criminal scheme. It was complex,

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Speaker 10: it was orchestrated.

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Speaker 7: The crimes occurred from the West coast to the East

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Speaker 7: coast in this country.

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Speaker 3: During the bust, law enforcement agents are seeing removing boxes

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Speaker 3: and boxes from Michelle max ball or for car garage,

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Speaker 3: which on the inside looks more like an Amazon fulfillment center.

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Speaker 3: I mean, her neighbors had no idea. Those boxes being

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Speaker 3: carted out by law enforcement all contain cosmetics from Alta

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Speaker 3: and Sophora and merchandise from stores like Bloomingdale's, Sunglass Hut

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Speaker 3: and Lens Crafters. In all, the CHP confiscates nearly four

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Speaker 3: hundred thousand dollars worth of merchandise from Michelle Max's garage

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Speaker 3: on that one day alone.

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Speaker 13: What I am surprised at is the level of sophistication.

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Speaker 3: CNBC's Gabrielle Fonrouge again.

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Speaker 13: The extent that police alleged Michelle Mack went to to

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Speaker 13: run this retail crime organization at that point. I mean

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Speaker 13: she has like technically employees, She's sending them all across

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Speaker 13: the country. She's paying for their rental cars, for their flights,

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Speaker 13: for their hotel. She's directing them, you know what, to steal,

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Speaker 13: sending in the shopping list. She's keeping an eye on

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Speaker 13: market dynamics as well. She has to set the price appropriately,

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Speaker 13: so that's requiring a lot of research at that point,

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Speaker 13: why not just run a legitimate business, you know what

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Speaker 13: I mean? Like people get into crime the idea of

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Speaker 13: it is because it's easy money. But this doesn't feel

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Speaker 13: like easy money. The effort and time that goes into

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Speaker 13: it and the risk that's involved.

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Speaker 3: Oh, I have an answer for you. And this is

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Speaker 3: why Michelle Mack is the subject of this season of

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Speaker 3: Queen of the Con because at her heart she is

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Speaker 3: a con artist, and every con artist the money is

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Speaker 3: only secondary. And you make a great point. This is

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Speaker 3: so much work in planning and expertise and execution, and

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Speaker 3: she's hiring and firing people and setting up schedules and

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Speaker 3: you know, buying and shipping, and she could run a

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Speaker 3: real business and not run a foul of the law

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Speaker 3: and make a lot of money and do well. But

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Speaker 3: the thrill for Michelle Mack is the same threat for

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Speaker 3: every con artist. They love getting away with stuff. They

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Speaker 3: love lying and cheating, they love manipulating people. I guarantee

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Speaker 3: you she gets off on tricking her customers. They think

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Speaker 3: these are legitimate products. I'm selling them stolen stuff. They

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Speaker 3: have no idea. She gets off that her neighbors think

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Speaker 3: one thing and she's really doing another. It's just like

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Speaker 3: this hurricane of cues that thrill her that have nothing

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Speaker 3: to do with the money. I mean, the money is important,

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Speaker 3: but with Michelle Mack and a lot of con artists,

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Speaker 3: I believe the money is secondary. The thrill is the lie,

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Speaker 3: the cheat, the con, the swindle. They get a thrill

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Speaker 3: from it. And according to authorities, Michelle Mack is extremely

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Speaker 3: organized and detailed. The team of twelve women she allegedly

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Speaker 3: had working for her. Law enforcement euphemistically dubs.

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Speaker 13: The California Girls.

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Speaker 3: They call them the California Girls. Scott. That's just sexy

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Speaker 3: and exciting, and I can't believe that's the term they're

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Speaker 3: using at the CHP, like we're on the Calibirls case.

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Speaker 3: And according to investigators, Michelle Mack would furnish her team

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Speaker 3: of California Girls with detailed shopping lists, stipulating exactly what

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Speaker 3: they need to steal and from where, and she'd instruct

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Speaker 3: them to use large Louis Vauton bags to smuggle out

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Speaker 3: the stolen merchandise.

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Speaker 13: It might have helped them blending a little bit. It

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Speaker 13: could have very well been to just be like, just

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Speaker 13: look like another boogie woman shopping for makeup, and then

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Speaker 13: no one's going to pay attention to you. And then

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Speaker 13: when you clean out an entire shelf, sorry it's too late.

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Speaker 3: She directed them to do that. That's the costume you

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Speaker 3: need to wear for this con. You need to drink

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Speaker 3: a shopkeeper into thinking you're this wealthy, well healed woman,

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Speaker 3: and the Louis Vuitton goes a long way in doing that.

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Speaker 8: It's a disguise. It's all part of the disguise. That's

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Speaker 8: why they're calling them the California Girls. The Louis Vaton

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Speaker 8: bag it's designed to throw off your lost prevention officer.

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Speaker 3: Seal Beach Police Sergeant Morakian has spent more than twenty

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Speaker 3: years in law enforcement, busting shoplifters on the daily. He

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Speaker 3: even worked as a lost Prevention officer in San Diego

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Speaker 3: that stores would hire specifically to catch shoplifters, and Sergeant

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Speaker 3: Murrakian learned firsthand policing criminals that things aren't always what

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Speaker 3: they appear to be.

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Speaker 8: I mean, early on in my career, I pulled over

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Speaker 8: an elderly couple that had bricks of cocaine in the

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Speaker 8: trunk of their car, you know, and.

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Speaker 3: Then you guys partied. We look for.

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Speaker 8: Certain patterns, right, Someone wearing a mask and a hoodie

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Speaker 8: walking into a store in twenty twenty four is the

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Speaker 8: typical profile of someone who's about to steel on a

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Speaker 8: hot summer day.

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Speaker 3: You know, why are they wearing a hoodie on a

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Speaker 3: hot summer day? Right?

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Speaker 8: Yeah, So these are things that we look for. So

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Speaker 8: if you just think about the lost Prevention officer or

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Speaker 8: the employee at any of these retail stores, you know,

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Speaker 8: you see a fairly attractive girl with a Louis Vaton bag.

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Speaker 8: That's not who you're gonna follow or look at. Now

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Speaker 8: a season lost prevention officer, will you know, they'll see that.

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Speaker 3: Oh, decoy distraction, and you pay attention.

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Speaker 8: We look at it. Not we because I'm no longer

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Speaker 8: Lost Prevention, but we look at it through a different lens.

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Speaker 3: And investigators alleged that those California girls were so next

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Speaker 3: level good and they stole so much stuff from Michelle Mack.

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Speaker 3: She had nearly eight million dollars in sales on Amazon,

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Speaker 3: where she sold high end cosmetics and beauty products for

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Speaker 3: half the price they were selling for everywhere else. I mean,

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Speaker 3: who wouldn't buy from her? A bottle of Coco Chanel

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Speaker 3: perfume can cost one hundred and seventy dollars at alta,

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Speaker 3: So if you saw that same bottle selling for eighty

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Speaker 3: five dollars on Amazon, it's a no brainer. And it's

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Speaker 3: probably still land says California Highly Patrol Commissioner Sean Dori.

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Speaker 11: It's tough, and I don't know if anybody expects the

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Speaker 11: consumers to do due diligence on every product that they're

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Speaker 11: buying online. But I'll tell you, if it seems too

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Speaker 11: good to be true, it probably is, and it's probably

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Speaker 11: coming from some nefarious activity.

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Speaker 3: But perhaps the most unbelievable revelation to come to light

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Speaker 3: is that, according to the CHP investigation, this went on

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Speaker 3: for more than ten years, right under the noses of

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Speaker 3: Michelle Max's wealthy neighbors, Her customers and even Amazon itself,

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Speaker 3: much to the exasperation of California Attorney General Rob Bonta.

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Speaker 7: This Amazon marketplace site called the Online Makeup Store that

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Speaker 7: was stelling the soul and goods year after year and

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Speaker 7: it wasn't detected. You have to ask yourself, what more

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Speaker 7: can we do should we do to make sure that

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Speaker 7: incidents like this don't occur in the future.

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Speaker 10: That's the right thing to ask. I think they have

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Speaker 10: the ability to root out more sales of stolen goods

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Speaker 10: on their platform, And she'd asked themselves what work could

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Speaker 10: they have done here and what more can they do

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Speaker 10: going forward?

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Speaker 3: But like most professional con artists, Michelle Mack had a

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Speaker 3: really good cover after the break Welcome Back to Queen

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Speaker 3: of the Con. So while Michelle Mack was selling millions

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Speaker 3: in stolen beauty products out of her four car garage

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Speaker 3: in Bonzol, she had a day job. She was in

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Speaker 3: the wedding business, renting out her Tuscan style mansion that

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Speaker 3: actually had its own chapel and a vineyard, a truly

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Speaker 3: picturesque setting for any couple looking to tie the knot.

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Speaker 12: That looks like the wedding setup that me and my husband.

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Speaker 5: Had Ooh, would you guys get married San Diego?

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Speaker 3: Did you get married at Michelle Mack's house?

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Speaker 12: It looks like it that looks like the exact same setup.

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Speaker 12: Oh my gosh.

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Speaker 3: Shelleyleggett is a local TV reporter in San Diego at

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Speaker 3: the NBC station. She didn't actually have her wedding at

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Speaker 3: Michelle Max's house, just someplace that looked very similar. But

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Speaker 3: Shelley was one of the first reporters in San Diego

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Speaker 3: to cover the Michelle Max story.

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Speaker 14: The woman they've identified as the head of the operation

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Speaker 14: was recruiting young women to go into stores like Alta,

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Speaker 14: Bath and Bodyworks and Sephora to steal items and bring

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Speaker 14: them back to her so she could resell them for profit.

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Speaker 3: And how did you get involved in this case? What

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Speaker 3: happened to cause you to be at that Rob Bonta

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Speaker 3: press conference.

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Speaker 1: This was one of those stories where I felt like

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Speaker 1: I knew what I was getting into and it was

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Speaker 1: completely different. Me and my photographer that day. I guess

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Speaker 1: you can call us the breaking news crew. That means

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Speaker 1: our story was not that important. It wasn't an a

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Speaker 1: block story. It was one of those evergreen stories that

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Speaker 1: could be dropped if something bigger and better comes up.

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Speaker 3: And for listeners who don't know, when you say we

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Speaker 3: weren't an A block story, that means you weren't at

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Speaker 3: the top of the newscast. You're like one of the

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Speaker 3: big important lead stories the A block You were like BCD.

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Speaker 1: Yes, And we got the word maybe around twelve thirty

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Speaker 1: that there was a one thirty.

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Speaker 12: Press conference for We had no clue what it was.

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Speaker 1: We were just going into it thinking, Okay, he's going

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Speaker 1: to announce something.

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Speaker 12: We did not know what he was going to announce.

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Speaker 3: But your editor, your boss, your assignment DEESK managers like

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Speaker 3: you got to go to this presser.

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Speaker 1: Yes, They're like he's going to announce something and we

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Speaker 1: have to be there, and we're like okay.

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Speaker 3: And that press conference, well, good afternoon everyone.

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Speaker 7: Rob Bonte, California Attorney General, thanks for joining us.

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Speaker 3: Today is held February sixteenth, twenty twenty four, two months

438
00:24:51,240 --> 00:24:54,159
Speaker 3: after that crazy raid on Michelle Max's mansion.

439
00:24:57,160 --> 00:25:00,720
Speaker 1: It was interesting when this happened. I expected this to

440
00:25:00,760 --> 00:25:03,920
Speaker 1: be like a younger woman doing this.

441
00:25:03,840 --> 00:25:07,320
Speaker 3: Because this is like internet savvy Internet. Do you know

442
00:25:07,359 --> 00:25:09,080
Speaker 3: how to like the Amazon marketplace?

443
00:25:09,240 --> 00:25:10,520
Speaker 12: I don't even know how to do all that.

444
00:25:11,440 --> 00:25:14,399
Speaker 1: I was like, Okay, somebody that's doing this has to

445
00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:16,359
Speaker 1: be like real young in their twenties.

446
00:25:16,400 --> 00:25:19,560
Speaker 12: They're recruiting other young women to do this, and she's

447
00:25:19,640 --> 00:25:24,240
Speaker 12: like a housewife that's just hanging out at home having

448
00:25:24,280 --> 00:25:25,680
Speaker 12: everyone else do her dirty work.

449
00:25:27,080 --> 00:25:30,760
Speaker 3: And you cover these stories where twelve twenty people running

450
00:25:30,800 --> 00:25:33,560
Speaker 3: a store grab and steal like they're bringing it.

451
00:25:33,480 --> 00:25:35,760
Speaker 12: Back to her, and you never hear about them.

452
00:25:35,920 --> 00:25:39,360
Speaker 3: No, they never get caught. They disappear into the night,

453
00:25:39,440 --> 00:25:43,560
Speaker 3: into the day, into the ether, and we move on

454
00:25:43,640 --> 00:25:48,800
Speaker 3: with our lives. And according to investigators, Michelle Mack had

455
00:25:48,840 --> 00:25:52,679
Speaker 3: perfected the art of blending into her surroundings, and that

456
00:25:52,800 --> 00:25:56,560
Speaker 3: camouflage allegedly enabled her to run this multi million dollar

457
00:25:56,640 --> 00:26:00,800
Speaker 3: shoplifting ring undetected by law enforcement for more than ten

458
00:26:00,920 --> 00:26:01,600
Speaker 3: long years.

459
00:26:02,440 --> 00:26:04,800
Speaker 8: If I'm a police officer and I see Michelle Mack

460
00:26:04,880 --> 00:26:07,639
Speaker 8: driving down the street in her Land Road, I'm not

461
00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:11,680
Speaker 8: going to think she's got a crew of people out

462
00:26:11,800 --> 00:26:15,840
Speaker 8: nationwide stealing items so she can sell them in her

463
00:26:15,920 --> 00:26:16,879
Speaker 8: Amazon store.

464
00:26:18,040 --> 00:26:21,879
Speaker 3: Sergeant Jordan Morakian, who policed shoplifters in San Diego, Michelle

465
00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:25,080
Speaker 3: Mack's stomping ground for the first fourteen years of his

466
00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:29,560
Speaker 3: career freely admits that Michelle Mack is an anomaly.

467
00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:33,600
Speaker 8: You know, she has kids. I mean, there's nothing about

468
00:26:33,640 --> 00:26:38,040
Speaker 8: her that would stand out to an investigator other than

469
00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:40,560
Speaker 8: the fact that she and her husband live in a

470
00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:45,800
Speaker 8: multimillion dollar property in Bonsaw. A winery. On that property

471
00:26:45,840 --> 00:26:51,919
Speaker 8: they rented out for parties. You know, well, me being me,

472
00:26:52,119 --> 00:26:54,600
Speaker 8: and this is just how my cop brain works. The

473
00:26:54,640 --> 00:26:56,119
Speaker 8: first thing I'm going to say is, how did you

474
00:26:56,160 --> 00:26:59,240
Speaker 8: afford that. You're not going to be able to convince

475
00:26:59,240 --> 00:27:02,080
Speaker 8: me that you afford it by selling things on Amazon?

476
00:27:02,800 --> 00:27:05,040
Speaker 3: Right, So you would have suspected her if you knew

477
00:27:05,040 --> 00:27:07,119
Speaker 3: the details, if you were her neighbor, if you were

478
00:27:07,160 --> 00:27:10,320
Speaker 3: a friend and acquaintance, it would have struck you as huh.

479
00:27:10,480 --> 00:27:14,119
Speaker 8: One thousand percent Wow. I would have started me just

480
00:27:14,160 --> 00:27:16,959
Speaker 8: how I operate. I would have started asking questions like, oh,

481
00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:19,200
Speaker 8: how much do you And this is a former fraud

482
00:27:19,200 --> 00:27:21,359
Speaker 8: detective and this is what I do to people, and

483
00:27:21,400 --> 00:27:25,719
Speaker 8: it drives my friends crazy. You have this nice house,

484
00:27:25,840 --> 00:27:27,600
Speaker 8: Like what do you what do you do? Oh? I

485
00:27:27,640 --> 00:27:30,520
Speaker 8: sell things on Amazon? How much do you make annually

486
00:27:30,560 --> 00:27:32,679
Speaker 8: from that? Oh? I make this? Where do you get

487
00:27:32,720 --> 00:27:34,480
Speaker 8: your products from right.

488
00:27:34,680 --> 00:27:38,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's suspicious to you if she came across your

489
00:27:38,640 --> 00:27:41,159
Speaker 3: pat in a social situation, or you were her new neighbor,

490
00:27:41,280 --> 00:27:43,359
Speaker 3: or it would raise a red flag.

491
00:27:43,760 --> 00:27:46,680
Speaker 8: Her neighbors probably weren't questioning her because.

492
00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:48,840
Speaker 3: No, she was hiding successfully in plain sight.

493
00:27:48,840 --> 00:27:52,280
Speaker 8: In plain sight. And and me just being me. I mean,

494
00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:55,119
Speaker 8: I've gone to dinner parties before and nice homes, and

495
00:27:55,200 --> 00:27:57,399
Speaker 8: the first thing I do is I whisper to whoever

496
00:27:57,440 --> 00:28:00,200
Speaker 8: I'm there with, is what does she do for or

497
00:28:00,240 --> 00:28:01,040
Speaker 8: what does he do for me?

498
00:28:01,119 --> 00:28:05,840
Speaker 3: Because you're suspicious, you come in suspicious, right. The other

499
00:28:05,920 --> 00:28:10,120
Speaker 3: thing that strikes Sergeant Morakian is very deliberate and very planned,

500
00:28:10,480 --> 00:28:13,680
Speaker 3: is where Michelle Mack chose to live and allegedly run

501
00:28:13,760 --> 00:28:18,119
Speaker 3: her shoplifting ring out of the exclusive community of Bonzol.

502
00:28:18,520 --> 00:28:20,840
Speaker 8: Depending on who you talk to, they'll pronounce it Bonsoal

503
00:28:21,000 --> 00:28:24,320
Speaker 8: or Bonsel. It's like a piece of Italy in San

504
00:28:24,359 --> 00:28:27,719
Speaker 8: Diego County. It's like one minute you're in the city

505
00:28:28,560 --> 00:28:31,240
Speaker 8: of San Diego, you're looking at buildings, you're looking at

506
00:28:31,440 --> 00:28:34,919
Speaker 8: you know, the coastline, and the next minute you're driving

507
00:28:34,960 --> 00:28:41,640
Speaker 8: through the hills of Bonsel and you're seeing wineries and big, big,

508
00:28:41,720 --> 00:28:46,000
Speaker 8: huge mansions with Spanish tile and stamped concrete driveways.

509
00:28:48,360 --> 00:28:52,040
Speaker 1: This looks like something out of like maybe like Beverly Hills,

510
00:28:52,040 --> 00:28:55,479
Speaker 1: like a celebrities house way up on the hill, hidden

511
00:28:55,520 --> 00:28:58,680
Speaker 1: away landscaping is beautiful.

512
00:28:59,240 --> 00:29:02,400
Speaker 3: Local San dieporter Shelley like it again, if you've lived

513
00:29:02,400 --> 00:29:04,920
Speaker 3: in a lot of other states, you're a TV reporter,

514
00:29:05,160 --> 00:29:07,480
Speaker 3: you work in all these other markets. Now you're in

515
00:29:07,520 --> 00:29:10,360
Speaker 3: San Diego. What have you noticed is different in regards

516
00:29:10,400 --> 00:29:13,360
Speaker 3: to shoplifting in California versus other states.

517
00:29:13,560 --> 00:29:17,720
Speaker 1: Well, I didn't know that that weird law in California

518
00:29:17,760 --> 00:29:20,920
Speaker 1: where it's like a certain amount of money it really

519
00:29:20,960 --> 00:29:21,600
Speaker 1: doesn't matter.

520
00:29:21,960 --> 00:29:25,560
Speaker 12: I've never heard of anything like that anywhere.

521
00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:29,640
Speaker 3: Right, it's under one thousand dollars. It's a misdemeanor.

522
00:29:30,680 --> 00:29:34,400
Speaker 1: Other states it's like you steal, you get arrested, and

523
00:29:34,440 --> 00:29:37,320
Speaker 1: you go to jail and they give you papers and.

524
00:29:37,280 --> 00:29:38,000
Speaker 12: You go to court.

525
00:29:38,080 --> 00:29:42,320
Speaker 1: And it was just mind boggling when I got here

526
00:29:42,520 --> 00:29:43,840
Speaker 1: and I was like, that's a law.

527
00:29:45,080 --> 00:29:48,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, And we see it again and again on

528
00:29:48,600 --> 00:29:51,520
Speaker 3: television and TV news. They allow them to walk out

529
00:29:51,520 --> 00:29:53,960
Speaker 3: with like nine hundred dollars in merchandise because it's under

530
00:29:53,960 --> 00:29:57,360
Speaker 3: the limit and no one doesn't even But since Michelle

531
00:29:57,400 --> 00:30:00,680
Speaker 3: Mack and her team of California girls stand accused of

532
00:30:00,680 --> 00:30:04,640
Speaker 3: stealing millions of dollars in merchandise, the land of misdemeanors

533
00:30:04,920 --> 00:30:06,120
Speaker 3: is well behind them.

534
00:30:06,560 --> 00:30:09,520
Speaker 12: Gosh, why was one of those California girls? I'd be sweating.

535
00:30:10,440 --> 00:30:12,280
Speaker 3: I know, the life of crime.

536
00:30:12,480 --> 00:30:13,920
Speaker 12: I'm sweating just talking about it.

537
00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:19,440
Speaker 3: But who are these professional shoplifting women who spend all day,

538
00:30:19,760 --> 00:30:24,520
Speaker 3: every day driving from store to store stealing hundreds of

539
00:30:24,600 --> 00:30:28,719
Speaker 3: thousands of dollars worth of stuff in plain sights every

540
00:30:28,760 --> 00:30:32,320
Speaker 3: week for the Michelle Max of the world. Were you

541
00:30:32,440 --> 00:30:36,040
Speaker 3: worried at all that I might be a cop?

542
00:30:38,600 --> 00:30:41,480
Speaker 4: Not really, because I mean, like I've never heard of

543
00:30:41,520 --> 00:30:46,160
Speaker 4: like an undercover cop like doing like like a bud

544
00:30:46,440 --> 00:30:47,640
Speaker 4: for shoplifters.

545
00:30:47,880 --> 00:30:51,720
Speaker 3: They would have to catch you in the store stealing. Yeah, exactly.

546
00:30:58,320 --> 00:31:01,400
Speaker 3: Coming up this season on Queen of the Con, I'm

547
00:31:01,400 --> 00:31:05,240
Speaker 3: trying to find professional shoplifters. I don't know, man, how

548
00:31:05,280 --> 00:31:06,680
Speaker 3: did you get into shoplifting?

549
00:31:06,920 --> 00:31:08,040
Speaker 8: We were homeless for a while.

550
00:31:08,240 --> 00:31:09,920
Speaker 5: That's how we got, you know, like in the crowd.

551
00:31:10,000 --> 00:31:10,200
Speaker 8: You know.

552
00:31:10,800 --> 00:31:13,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, so you can make a thousand dollars a day

553
00:31:13,520 --> 00:31:16,200
Speaker 3: shoplifting yeah, But.

554
00:31:16,200 --> 00:31:19,960
Speaker 8: What Michelle Mack was doing was human trafficking. What Yeah,

555
00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:22,240
Speaker 8: if you really think about it, right, the definition of

556
00:31:22,320 --> 00:31:28,040
Speaker 8: human trafficking is you're basically exploiting a human being and

557
00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:33,400
Speaker 8: forcing them, coercing them, or paying them to do a

558
00:31:33,560 --> 00:31:37,760
Speaker 8: service for ill gotten games, for illegal activity.

559
00:31:37,920 --> 00:31:38,840
Speaker 3: Human trafficking.

560
00:31:39,280 --> 00:31:41,400
Speaker 6: She approached me, she was a little bit over the

561
00:31:41,440 --> 00:31:46,640
Speaker 6: top about this, this florified mansion, and I had this feeling,

562
00:31:47,840 --> 00:31:51,160
Speaker 6: and had I gone with the feeling that I normally would,

563
00:31:51,200 --> 00:31:52,720
Speaker 6: I would have politely turned her down.

564
00:31:53,000 --> 00:31:55,120
Speaker 13: She may have stolen half of my wedding cake.

565
00:31:55,840 --> 00:31:59,680
Speaker 15: What she had a huge garage, like she had so

566
00:31:59,760 --> 00:32:00,320
Speaker 15: much stuff.

567
00:32:00,320 --> 00:32:05,480
Speaker 13: She told me like she had storage units with more things.

568
00:32:05,560 --> 00:32:08,400
Speaker 8: Because she said her husband was telling her.

569
00:32:08,280 --> 00:32:10,680
Speaker 12: She was getting out of control, like getting.

570
00:32:10,400 --> 00:32:11,240
Speaker 6: So much stuff.

571
00:32:11,520 --> 00:32:13,920
Speaker 9: Who the hell was buying handpainted nail files from the

572
00:32:13,920 --> 00:32:14,680
Speaker 9: Czech Republic?

573
00:32:15,200 --> 00:32:18,440
Speaker 3: What if the Czech Republic nail files? What if those

574
00:32:18,480 --> 00:32:21,600
Speaker 3: were never meant to succeed, those were just meant to

575
00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:22,640
Speaker 3: provide her cover.

576
00:32:23,440 --> 00:32:25,960
Speaker 10: I'm not ceiling regular, I'm going to start feeling up

577
00:32:26,000 --> 00:32:26,400
Speaker 10: my bag.

578
00:32:26,520 --> 00:32:28,760
Speaker 1: Couiic so I want to know stuff that I can

579
00:32:28,800 --> 00:32:29,680
Speaker 1: grab a bulk.

580
00:32:29,920 --> 00:32:30,680
Speaker 4: That's a great text.

581
00:32:30,760 --> 00:32:31,120
Speaker 3: Message.

582
00:32:31,360 --> 00:32:34,400
Speaker 4: So these overt acts really kind of flesh out how

583
00:32:34,440 --> 00:32:35,640
Speaker 4: the conspiracy operated.

584
00:32:35,720 --> 00:32:38,720
Speaker 8: They're going to minimize what she did. She was trying

585
00:32:38,720 --> 00:32:41,960
Speaker 8: to send her kids to college, right, she was operating

586
00:32:42,000 --> 00:32:44,200
Speaker 8: a side business and it got a little out of control.

587
00:32:44,840 --> 00:32:47,000
Speaker 9: Like, why the hell would you think Michelle Mack would

588
00:32:47,000 --> 00:32:48,800
Speaker 9: talk to your.

589
00:32:48,920 --> 00:32:54,880
Speaker 3: Good I'm looking for to pey, like realistic, Oh.

590
00:32:54,720 --> 00:32:57,040
Speaker 9: My god, good morning.

591
00:32:58,440 --> 00:33:01,440
Speaker 8: When you get to a gated property, bypass that gate.

592
00:33:02,280 --> 00:33:05,520
Speaker 8: Even when you bypass that gate, you're not trespassing until

593
00:33:05,560 --> 00:33:06,520
Speaker 8: somebody says you are.

594
00:33:06,880 --> 00:33:07,800
Speaker 5: Is that her mineyard?

595
00:33:07,960 --> 00:33:11,440
Speaker 3: Look at this pouse? Jesus, What the hell do these

596
00:33:11,480 --> 00:33:14,440
Speaker 3: people do for a living? Well, we know one of

597
00:33:14,480 --> 00:33:17,360
Speaker 3: them stolen stuff on Amazon's.

598
00:33:17,520 --> 00:33:20,560
Speaker 15: Hey Michelle, my name's Jonathan. I'm with the Queen of

599
00:33:20,560 --> 00:33:23,320
Speaker 15: the Con podcast. I just wanted to see if you'd

600
00:33:23,320 --> 00:33:28,200
Speaker 15: be interested in talking to me. So I hear the

601
00:33:29,520 --> 00:33:31,360
Speaker 15: I hear the cops. Did I think we should go?

602
00:33:32,120 --> 00:33:37,640
Speaker 3: Let's roll run on the cops. If you're enjoying Queen

603
00:33:37,640 --> 00:33:40,520
Speaker 3: of the Con, tell someone click that share button and

604
00:33:40,560 --> 00:33:44,040
Speaker 3: send this podcast to anyone you think might be into it. Also,

605
00:33:44,240 --> 00:33:47,520
Speaker 3: if you can leave us a five star review, reviews

606
00:33:47,680 --> 00:33:56,680
Speaker 3: really help other listeners find us Queen of the con

607
00:33:56,800 --> 00:34:01,400
Speaker 3: The California Girls is a production of AYR Media and iHeartMedia,

608
00:34:01,440 --> 00:34:06,400
Speaker 3: Hosted by Me Jonathan Walton. Executive producers Jonathan Walton for

609
00:34:06,600 --> 00:34:11,920
Speaker 3: Jonathan Walton Productions and Elisa Rosen for AYR Media. Consulting

610
00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:17,920
Speaker 3: producer Evan Goldstein. Written by Jonathan Walton, Sound design by

611
00:34:18,040 --> 00:34:23,200
Speaker 3: Zack Hirsch, Edited and mixed by Zach Hirsch, Audio engineer

612
00:34:23,719 --> 00:34:29,640
Speaker 3: Justin Longerbean. Mastered by Justin Longerbean. Legal counsel for AYR Media,

613
00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:34,960
Speaker 3: Johnny Douglas, Executive producer for iHeartMedia, Maya Howard