WEBVTT - Affordable Home-Cooked Meals that are Good Enough with Leanne Brown #463 0:00:00.080 --> 0:00:02.920 Welcome to How the Money. I'm Joel and I am Matt, 0:00:03.000 --> 0:00:05.960 and today we're talking affordable home cooked meals that are 0:00:06.040 --> 0:00:27.840 good enough with lean Brown. So you know how your 0:00:27.880 --> 0:00:30.680 friends they have different like specialties, like you know who 0:00:30.720 --> 0:00:33.040 to call if you need a plumber recommendation, or you 0:00:33.080 --> 0:00:36.640 know which friend has the best beach recommendations in Florida. Well, 0:00:36.800 --> 0:00:38.840 Leanne Brown is who comes to mind when it comes 0:00:38.840 --> 0:00:42.120 to eating really well but for less. Leanne calls herself 0:00:42.200 --> 0:00:45.040 your friend in the kitchen and her New York Times 0:00:45.120 --> 0:00:48.599 best seller Good and Cheap is now free and has 0:00:48.640 --> 0:00:50.959 been downloaded millions of times. Will make sure to link 0:00:51.000 --> 0:00:52.919 to that in the show notes. Uh And now, her 0:00:53.080 --> 0:00:56.279 new cookbook, good Enough, was just published last week. It's 0:00:56.280 --> 0:01:00.720 a mix of essays, personal stories, and delicious recipes, as 0:01:00.720 --> 0:01:03.880 she also acknowledges the fear and anxiety that many have 0:01:04.000 --> 0:01:06.600 when it comes to cooking. We're gonna talk about all 0:01:06.680 --> 0:01:09.280 of that and more today. Leanne. Thank you for joining 0:01:09.319 --> 0:01:11.720 us today on the podcast. Thank you for having me, 0:01:11.760 --> 0:01:14.080 and we're looking forward to this chat. We're looking forward 0:01:14.080 --> 0:01:16.679 to it to lean and that's because, Yeah, as two guys, 0:01:16.760 --> 0:01:19.200 you talk about saving money a lot our go to 0:01:19.440 --> 0:01:22.280 money saving advice when it comes to paying less for 0:01:22.319 --> 0:01:26.520 food is shop at aldi like that I meant advice. 0:01:27.880 --> 0:01:29.720 We're very good starting point, but we do not have 0:01:29.760 --> 0:01:31.600 the depth of knowledge that you have. So but the 0:01:31.640 --> 0:01:33.880 first question we ask every guest who comes on the 0:01:33.920 --> 0:01:36.039 podcast is you know, Matt and I we drink a 0:01:36.040 --> 0:01:37.640 craft beer on every episode because it's something that we 0:01:37.640 --> 0:01:39.039 spend a lot of money on in the here and 0:01:39.040 --> 0:01:41.959 now while we're trying to be intentional about saving uh 0:01:42.000 --> 0:01:44.160 and investing for the future. What is that for you? 0:01:44.200 --> 0:01:47.600 What's your splurge? It's a really good question, and I 0:01:48.720 --> 0:01:50.840 have a few different directions I could go on this, 0:01:50.960 --> 0:01:53.800 but I think I want to say fundamentally, it's like 0:01:54.640 --> 0:01:58.960 splurge on something that makes your life better, that is 0:01:59.120 --> 0:02:02.320 a quality of life thing, and that's definitely where I like. 0:02:02.720 --> 0:02:05.680 I'm recording this in my bedroom and I'm thinking about 0:02:05.680 --> 0:02:09.400 how important like having a comfortable, cozy bed is for me, 0:02:09.440 --> 0:02:12.560 and so we have I have nice sheets, and truly 0:02:13.120 --> 0:02:15.200 I cannot My husband doesn't understand this. He's like the 0:02:15.200 --> 0:02:17.360 sort of person who would just leave the bed like 0:02:17.400 --> 0:02:20.320 a mess all day and just like vaguely like grab 0:02:20.480 --> 0:02:23.560 the sheets and like kind of cocoon himself and go 0:02:23.639 --> 0:02:25.440 to sleep. And I know many people who are like 0:02:25.480 --> 0:02:30.840 that it is a style thing, though I think, um, 0:02:30.919 --> 0:02:33.040 there's so many people who are just like, what's the 0:02:33.080 --> 0:02:35.679 point of making your bed because you know you're just 0:02:35.720 --> 0:02:38.160 going to mess it up again. And while I sort 0:02:38.200 --> 0:02:42.880 of intellectually understand that my body like gets such profound 0:02:42.960 --> 0:02:48.240 pleasure out of sliding into like a smooth, crisp sheet situation, 0:02:48.280 --> 0:02:50.400 it just like I feel like my whole body can 0:02:50.440 --> 0:02:54.400 just relax and it primes me to calm down and 0:02:54.440 --> 0:02:58.359 go to sleep, and sleep, like sleep for me is 0:02:58.440 --> 0:03:02.400 quality of life, like almost the number one thing. Like 0:03:02.480 --> 0:03:05.280 if there's anything that I can do, whether it's you know, 0:03:05.440 --> 0:03:08.360 yoga before bed, whether it's um, you know, trying to 0:03:08.360 --> 0:03:10.680 get enough excers of all of these things, you know, 0:03:10.800 --> 0:03:13.959 drinking less alcohol. I can think of all these sort 0:03:13.960 --> 0:03:17.080 of good habits that I have been trying to cultivate, 0:03:17.160 --> 0:03:19.880 and every time I add sort of a new good habit, 0:03:19.919 --> 0:03:22.280 almost always it comes down to, like that helps me 0:03:22.320 --> 0:03:25.840 sleep better. And so truly it's like really that simple, 0:03:26.360 --> 0:03:29.880 and um, so my bed beings of this really beautiful 0:03:29.919 --> 0:03:32.760 place is super important for my quality of life. So 0:03:32.800 --> 0:03:36.119 I think that's that's sort of where my splurge comes from. 0:03:36.120 --> 0:03:38.320 It sounds like you guys really really enjoy the pleasure 0:03:38.320 --> 0:03:40.920 and connection you get from like having a good beer together, 0:03:41.800 --> 0:03:44.160 but it's not too close to bedtime, because, like you said, 0:03:44.720 --> 0:03:47.760 that can certainly disrupolute, disruptive. We drink while we podcast 0:03:47.800 --> 0:03:49.320 in the afternoon, Lee, and I'm going to share a 0:03:49.400 --> 0:03:51.560 quick story with you. You're probably gonna cringe when I 0:03:51.600 --> 0:03:54.280 say this, but the mattress that my wife and I 0:03:54.320 --> 0:03:57.440 sleep on that we love was a free mattress that 0:03:57.480 --> 0:04:03.640 we got online through Facebook Marketplace. Hebody was giving away 0:04:03.640 --> 0:04:05.880 and we actually we were like, you know what, it's 0:04:05.920 --> 0:04:07.760 time to grow up, you know, and so we're like, okay, 0:04:07.840 --> 0:04:10.480 let's order one of these mattresses that shows up in 0:04:10.480 --> 0:04:12.960 the mail. We got it, you know, it deflated, took 0:04:12.960 --> 0:04:15.840 twenty four hours at the spring foam combo. We did 0:04:15.880 --> 0:04:17.760 not like it, and so we were actually one of 0:04:17.760 --> 0:04:19.719 the folks who took advantage of that and send it 0:04:19.760 --> 0:04:24.000 back and we pulled down that old Queen Spring mattress 0:04:24.040 --> 0:04:25.920 down from the attic. But like you said, if it 0:04:25.960 --> 0:04:27.719 works for us, I guess that's all. That's the only 0:04:27.720 --> 0:04:29.640 measure we need. Yeah, I really think that, Like, I 0:04:29.680 --> 0:04:32.240 think no judgment about how you got it, Like, if 0:04:32.279 --> 0:04:34.920 it truly feels better for you, that's the only thing 0:04:34.960 --> 0:04:37.200 that could possibly matter. Oh and real quick too. You know, 0:04:37.279 --> 0:04:39.359 so Joe and I we love to ride bikes. We 0:04:39.440 --> 0:04:41.440 read that before you moved to New York City you 0:04:41.600 --> 0:04:44.040 used to ride your bike everywhere. Do you get out 0:04:44.040 --> 0:04:46.840 in your bike much these days there in New York? Yeah. 0:04:46.880 --> 0:04:50.400 You know, it's funny because my husband, I think, frankly, 0:04:50.480 --> 0:04:53.360 as part of trying to distract himself from the state 0:04:53.400 --> 0:04:55.920 of the world these last few weeks, has been buying 0:04:56.360 --> 0:05:01.200 bike parts online obsessively, probably in you know, it's a 0:05:01.240 --> 0:05:04.440 careful way that you guys enjoyed doing too, and been 0:05:04.600 --> 0:05:06.839 just fixing up both of our bikes in small ways. 0:05:07.320 --> 0:05:10.240 And he had kind of finished up making these few 0:05:10.240 --> 0:05:14.599 small improvement you know, changing to new tires, um, fixing 0:05:14.640 --> 0:05:17.839 the hub, that kind of thing. And um, we went 0:05:17.880 --> 0:05:19.719 for a ride yesterday. It was sort of nice enough 0:05:19.720 --> 0:05:21.680 out that we went for a little family right and 0:05:21.720 --> 0:05:27.080 it felt fabulous. Um, but just family bike riding, right, 0:05:28.080 --> 0:05:30.000 so good. My daughter was like, I don't like the 0:05:30.000 --> 0:05:33.640 wind in my face, but she could deal for twenty minutes. Yes, 0:05:33.720 --> 0:05:35.480 and you know what, they're going to complain even at home. 0:05:35.560 --> 0:05:39.800 So uh, let's let's move on. Let's talk about food 0:05:39.960 --> 0:05:43.320 and eating well on a budget. And yeah, I feel 0:05:43.320 --> 0:05:46.599 like it always feels like fancy dishes that you'd get 0:05:46.839 --> 0:05:49.240 while eating out or something they're made from these expensive 0:05:49.279 --> 0:05:53.040 cuts of meat, or they've got like trouffles shredded all 0:05:53.040 --> 0:05:55.719 over the top and something like that. Um, but what 0:05:55.839 --> 0:05:58.320 you're saying is that you don't have to have a 0:05:58.360 --> 0:06:01.040 big budget. That's not important when it comes to eating 0:06:01.040 --> 0:06:04.119 great food. Like why do you say that? Because it's true, 0:06:04.360 --> 0:06:06.799 there's so many of our favorite I mean, you said 0:06:07.080 --> 0:06:09.520 what you just said is true. And at the same time, 0:06:09.520 --> 0:06:12.520 I would bring some reality to that statement that many 0:06:12.560 --> 0:06:14.400 of the things that you're going to order out are 0:06:14.440 --> 0:06:17.640 also actually going to be quite inexpensive. But in terms 0:06:17.640 --> 0:06:19.839 of the ingredients that are used, Like, for example, like 0:06:19.960 --> 0:06:23.920 let's say a fancy pasta dish that has bacon and 0:06:24.080 --> 0:06:27.320 egg as the base, you're only using like maybe one 0:06:27.400 --> 0:06:29.919 or two strips of bacon and a couple of eggs, 0:06:30.000 --> 0:06:32.440 and the pasta itself is really inexpensive, but it's sort 0:06:32.480 --> 0:06:35.120 of the technique, the way that it's being put together. 0:06:35.680 --> 0:06:38.000 That is sort of where the value comes in. And 0:06:38.000 --> 0:06:41.200 so when you can learn some of these techniques, which 0:06:41.360 --> 0:06:43.120 you know, we say the word technique, you might think, 0:06:43.120 --> 0:06:45.279 oh my gosh, that's gonna be hard. Doesn't mean it's hard, 0:06:45.279 --> 0:06:47.560 It just means it's a couple of steps that you 0:06:47.640 --> 0:06:51.039 just need to do and think through, and um, you 0:06:51.080 --> 0:06:54.760 can have these really beautiful meals that can seem really 0:06:54.800 --> 0:06:57.640 fancy just in your own kitchen really quite easily. So 0:06:57.920 --> 0:06:59.719 I guess what I always really say is learning to 0:07:00.240 --> 0:07:02.839 like getting sort of a basic idea of cooking, and 0:07:02.839 --> 0:07:05.400 I really do mean cooking sort of as opposed to baking. 0:07:06.080 --> 0:07:10.480 Cooking like learning how to you know, say, makeup pasta dish, 0:07:10.720 --> 0:07:13.520 make a grilled cheese sandwich, like literally, like these really 0:07:13.520 --> 0:07:16.320 really simple sorts of meals, make an egg dish for yourself, 0:07:16.560 --> 0:07:20.480 how to saute vegetables, um, what to do with frozen peas, 0:07:21.080 --> 0:07:23.360 you know, when to put it into the meal so 0:07:23.400 --> 0:07:25.600 that they won't still be cold. Like these sorts of 0:07:25.840 --> 0:07:30.440 simple techniques they can just lend such tremendous quality to 0:07:30.680 --> 0:07:34.320 your everyday life and not at really all that higher 0:07:34.360 --> 0:07:37.280 cost and I think and again people think like, oh gosh, yeah, 0:07:37.320 --> 0:07:39.200 we all know that learning to cook would like make 0:07:39.280 --> 0:07:41.600 my life better. But I think what most people maybe 0:07:41.600 --> 0:07:46.400 don't realize is just how quickly you can experience much 0:07:46.480 --> 0:07:49.680 much better meals. Um Like, just learn a couple of 0:07:49.720 --> 0:07:54.160 really simple things, learn one or two recipes really well, 0:07:54.240 --> 0:07:57.600 things that you really really enjoy, and you can start 0:07:57.640 --> 0:08:01.640 seeing tremendous sort of improvement in the quality of your meals. 0:08:01.680 --> 0:08:04.040 And by that I really mean the quality of the 0:08:04.600 --> 0:08:06.760 of how much you can enjoy your meals and look 0:08:06.800 --> 0:08:09.120 forward to it. Yeah, I mean, I think when you 0:08:09.160 --> 0:08:11.360 know what you're doing right, when you have some knowledge 0:08:11.400 --> 0:08:14.160 as to the strokes you're making with your knife, or 0:08:14.240 --> 0:08:16.679 like you you know, you're talking about technique here. It's 0:08:16.680 --> 0:08:18.200 sort of like when you go on like go to 0:08:18.240 --> 0:08:20.320 a museum, and if you're going through with a tour, 0:08:20.760 --> 0:08:22.480 like a guided tour or even like the audio tour, 0:08:22.720 --> 0:08:24.240 you're going to appreciate it so much more when you 0:08:24.320 --> 0:08:25.920 understand what it is that you're looking at. And I 0:08:25.920 --> 0:08:27.520 think the same can be true with your food. I 0:08:27.560 --> 0:08:30.840 love that you talked about the difference between cooking and baking, 0:08:30.840 --> 0:08:32.760 because yeah, we've talked about this on the show before, 0:08:32.840 --> 0:08:34.880 how so much of life is it's more cooking, it's 0:08:34.920 --> 0:08:38.240 not baking. It's not these precise steps that you follow. 0:08:38.640 --> 0:08:40.680 And you know, for for those of us who do 0:08:40.840 --> 0:08:42.280 feel like, you know, a duck out of water, who 0:08:42.280 --> 0:08:44.520 weren't taught kitchen skills, what are some specifics how do 0:08:44.520 --> 0:08:46.400 we get a handle on the basics in order to 0:08:46.400 --> 0:08:49.160 feel comfortable cooking well at home? What are some of 0:08:49.160 --> 0:08:52.120 those basic techniques that you think are necessary in order 0:08:52.160 --> 0:08:55.480 to feel confident? So, and I hate to do this, 0:08:55.520 --> 0:08:57.960 but it really is. It is sort of an individual thing. 0:08:58.400 --> 0:09:00.480 So it's not like okay, master, there's two and you're 0:09:00.480 --> 0:09:02.720 good to go. Um. Of course you could try something 0:09:02.760 --> 0:09:06.200 like that, but I think where when we're talking about confidence, 0:09:06.600 --> 0:09:10.240 it really is about thinking about yourself, like your personal taste, 0:09:10.760 --> 0:09:14.520 and trying to think about, like, what are five dishes 0:09:14.640 --> 0:09:18.760 that I really enjoy when I eat out, say, and 0:09:18.840 --> 0:09:22.000 maybe even thinking like what is sort of a salad 0:09:22.040 --> 0:09:25.040 that I really like? What is a pasta dish that 0:09:25.080 --> 0:09:27.840 I really like? What is a stew or a soup 0:09:27.920 --> 0:09:32.400 that I really like? And starting at that place and 0:09:32.559 --> 0:09:38.000 just learning how to make one or two of those things. Um, 0:09:38.600 --> 0:09:41.800 can be just an incredible confidence builder, and I think 0:09:41.880 --> 0:09:46.400 really putting yourself into the mix, truly thinking about your taste. 0:09:46.400 --> 0:09:48.920 I started this by saying bacon and an egg pasta. 0:09:48.960 --> 0:09:51.960 I guess what I really meant was like a carbonara. 0:09:52.080 --> 0:09:53.600 Like if you see that on your menu, I think 0:09:53.600 --> 0:09:58.000 you're like, oh carbonara, who hoo hoo, fancy fanacy. Literally 0:09:58.200 --> 0:10:02.040 bacon and egg pasta. Like it's so simple and it's 0:10:02.080 --> 0:10:04.280 just a matter of like how you put those things together. 0:10:04.320 --> 0:10:10.240 We'll often have those types of ingredients in our pantry 0:10:10.240 --> 0:10:13.280 and our fridge already. If you're a vegetarian, you know, 0:10:13.320 --> 0:10:15.720 you may want to skip the bacon. If you're wanting 0:10:15.760 --> 0:10:18.600 to add in more vegetable as you could do you know, 0:10:18.640 --> 0:10:22.240 it's still quite classic to add peas, or to add 0:10:22.280 --> 0:10:25.200 some other kind of veggies or herbs or something like that. 0:10:25.520 --> 0:10:28.640 You can add some lemon zest. These are ways to 0:10:28.720 --> 0:10:32.000 kind of bring in your own taste to it. But 0:10:32.120 --> 0:10:34.480 I think so much of it is just taking is 0:10:34.520 --> 0:10:37.240 a knowing that it is good and important. I think 0:10:37.240 --> 0:10:39.360 to take your own personal taste into account and to 0:10:39.400 --> 0:10:42.439 start where you are and then be really really patient 0:10:42.520 --> 0:10:46.560 and gentle with yourself as you get going, um, celebrate 0:10:47.000 --> 0:10:51.679 every meal you make, celebrate your effort, and appreciate yourself 0:10:51.679 --> 0:10:53.880 for the effort that you're making on your own behalf, 0:10:54.000 --> 0:10:57.640 and just like know that it's for everyone. It is 0:10:57.679 --> 0:11:01.480 hard to try something new, and so don't have that 0:11:01.559 --> 0:11:03.880 kind of self talk that I think so many of 0:11:03.960 --> 0:11:06.480 us grow up with inside our heads, which is sort 0:11:06.520 --> 0:11:08.600 of like, oh, I should be better at this already, 0:11:08.600 --> 0:11:10.360 and like that's so embarrassing that I don't know how 0:11:10.360 --> 0:11:12.240 to do that, like all of that kind of stuff. 0:11:12.320 --> 0:11:14.920 Try to like really leave that in the background and 0:11:15.040 --> 0:11:18.960 celebrate yourself that you know, no matter how small, even 0:11:19.000 --> 0:11:23.040 if it's just making toast, just appreciate the kindness of 0:11:23.080 --> 0:11:26.320 your intention as you make um these things for yourself, 0:11:26.320 --> 0:11:28.680 and that will kind of fuel you through. And it's 0:11:28.679 --> 0:11:31.440 not that it's making too big a deal out of it, 0:11:31.559 --> 0:11:33.120 or letting yourself off the hook or any of that. 0:11:33.200 --> 0:11:36.360 It's being truthful because it is a really good thing 0:11:36.679 --> 0:11:39.520 to make these things. And making any sort of habit 0:11:39.600 --> 0:11:42.920 change in our lives is hard. Like we are built 0:11:42.960 --> 0:11:45.320 as creatures of habit, we really are. And it's you know, 0:11:45.400 --> 0:11:50.280 for all kinds of important reasons that our ancestors millions 0:11:50.320 --> 0:11:55.240 of years ago, um needed. But so making changes in 0:11:55.280 --> 0:11:59.080 our lives is unsettling, and so we need to actually 0:11:59.800 --> 0:12:03.760 so poured ourselves through these experiences. And we can support 0:12:03.800 --> 0:12:07.040 ourselves not by diminishing our efforts and making fun of 0:12:07.040 --> 0:12:09.680 ourselves when we don't do well, but really celebrating ourselves. 0:12:09.720 --> 0:12:11.880 And we do make make mistakes and when it does 0:12:11.960 --> 0:12:14.600 work out not so well, to kind of roll with 0:12:14.640 --> 0:12:16.680 it and go like, yeah, that makes sense. It's part 0:12:16.679 --> 0:12:18.720 of learning, and you need to hold yourself to a 0:12:18.840 --> 0:12:22.480 realistic standard and that is what will sort of allow 0:12:22.480 --> 0:12:24.760 you to succeed in the long term totally. And I mean, 0:12:24.800 --> 0:12:26.640 and that's so much of what you focus on within 0:12:26.880 --> 0:12:29.079 you know, within your new book. I love how you're 0:12:29.080 --> 0:12:32.120 talking about gravitating towards the dishes that you enjoy. How 0:12:32.200 --> 0:12:34.080 that's a great piece of start when it comes to 0:12:34.640 --> 0:12:37.040 how you want to improve in the kitchen. You've you know, 0:12:37.040 --> 0:12:39.200 shared before as well, just some of this, you know, 0:12:39.320 --> 0:12:41.840 some of the specific tools and like you mentioned, you 0:12:41.840 --> 0:12:43.960 know a second ago, you said lemon zest and that 0:12:44.000 --> 0:12:48.000 reminded me that you talk about the microplane specifically and 0:12:48.040 --> 0:12:51.800 how this is just this really affordable tool that has 0:12:51.840 --> 0:12:54.280 so much utility, explain to folks why they need to 0:12:54.320 --> 0:12:59.160 have that. Specifically, I love a microplane because, yeah, lemon 0:12:59.240 --> 0:13:02.640 zest lines really any kind of citrus, the zest is 0:13:02.760 --> 0:13:06.840 such as I just it makes me actually so happy. 0:13:06.840 --> 0:13:09.440 I love when people have never really used zest before 0:13:10.080 --> 0:13:12.080 and I can introduce it to them for the first time, 0:13:12.080 --> 0:13:15.480 because it's so magical. If you're someone who likes cocktails 0:13:15.520 --> 0:13:17.400 as well, you might be familiar with sort of the 0:13:17.440 --> 0:13:21.920 beauty of the twist in the cocktail um and it's yeah, yeah, right, 0:13:22.200 --> 0:13:27.120 So like using the the outside of citrus. It has 0:13:27.120 --> 0:13:31.840 this incredible, incredibly strong aroma and flavor because it's basically 0:13:31.920 --> 0:13:35.040 orange oil or lemon oil or lime oil that is 0:13:35.280 --> 0:13:39.080 inside that um the zest on the outside, and so 0:13:39.120 --> 0:13:40.959 you add just a tiny bit of this and you're 0:13:41.000 --> 0:13:43.760 able to scrape it off just so easily, so quickly 0:13:44.280 --> 0:13:48.160 with the microplane, and you can add that kind of bright, 0:13:48.520 --> 0:13:52.520 acidic flavor to anything. My friends kind of make fun 0:13:52.559 --> 0:13:55.040 of me quite often when I'm cooking with them, or 0:13:55.200 --> 0:13:57.000 if I'm over at their house and they're cooking somewhere, like, 0:13:57.000 --> 0:13:58.760 should I add lemons ust to this leen? It's like, 0:13:59.679 --> 0:14:03.040 because because I always do that. And obviously we talked 0:14:03.040 --> 0:14:05.480 about money, and I mean I love the fact that 0:14:05.520 --> 0:14:07.080 you focused on that so much because I mean that's 0:14:07.120 --> 0:14:09.320 such an affordable tool, you know, Like we're not talking 0:14:09.360 --> 0:14:11.000 about you, you know, folks going out and buying like 0:14:11.720 --> 0:14:13.600 an air fire. I don't know how much an air 0:14:13.600 --> 0:14:15.480 fire cost, but I know they're hot and people love them. 0:14:15.679 --> 0:14:17.040 But I got a feeling they take up a lot 0:14:17.040 --> 0:14:19.080 of counterspace. That's true. It's true. Well, and when when 0:14:19.080 --> 0:14:21.160 it comes to money land part of the reason that 0:14:21.240 --> 0:14:23.400 you're on our radar, And like, we want to talk 0:14:23.440 --> 0:14:25.840 about your new book good Enough more as well, but 0:14:26.160 --> 0:14:28.600 like you wrote a cookbook initially, Like your claim to 0:14:28.640 --> 0:14:32.200 fame was the cookbook Good and Cheap, which was released 0:14:32.240 --> 0:14:35.160 in about eating well on just four dollars a day. 0:14:35.320 --> 0:14:37.760 Like what made you feel compelled to write that in 0:14:37.800 --> 0:14:40.600 the first place? Um? And like, yeah, can you kind 0:14:40.600 --> 0:14:42.120 of give us a little bit of an idea of 0:14:42.200 --> 0:14:44.720 what your focus was in that one? Oh well, so 0:14:44.800 --> 0:14:48.160 that came out of my master's degree and food studies 0:14:48.200 --> 0:14:50.360 at m y U, And it was just kind of 0:14:50.360 --> 0:14:55.640 looking at the state of things, Um, this awareness that 0:14:55.960 --> 0:14:58.920 you know they are huge, huge millions of people, um 0:14:58.960 --> 0:15:02.080 in the US alone who are living on a budget 0:15:02.080 --> 0:15:05.360 about four dollars a day or less. Um. That's sort 0:15:05.400 --> 0:15:10.000 of anyone who qualifies for food stamps, UH is living 0:15:10.120 --> 0:15:12.480 on our snap as it's called now, but I know 0:15:12.640 --> 0:15:14.320 most people still think of it as food stamps. The 0:15:14.320 --> 0:15:18.680 food stamps program. It's approximately four dollars per person per day, 0:15:18.720 --> 0:15:23.600 which is very little money. And I know, you know, 0:15:23.680 --> 0:15:26.160 there's a lot of issues with that, and you know, 0:15:26.200 --> 0:15:27.760 there are a lot of a lot of people who 0:15:27.760 --> 0:15:30.240 are always saying like, oh, nobody can eat healthy on that, 0:15:30.320 --> 0:15:33.320 nobody can eat enough on that. And you know, I'm 0:15:33.360 --> 0:15:36.000 not really here to say whether or not, like on 0:15:36.080 --> 0:15:39.920 a moral level, whether it's okay that there's literally millions 0:15:39.920 --> 0:15:41.680 of people living on four dollars a day and we 0:15:41.760 --> 0:15:44.520 say that that's okay. I personally don't think that that's 0:15:44.720 --> 0:15:47.840 enough and that that's okay UM. But what I wanted 0:15:47.880 --> 0:15:51.320 to do was meet this reality where it was and offer, 0:15:51.520 --> 0:15:53.360 you know, my own sort of knowledge as a home 0:15:53.400 --> 0:15:57.400 cook who knows that you know, uh, you can make 0:15:57.960 --> 0:16:01.840 really really delicious food, um for very little money if 0:16:01.920 --> 0:16:04.920 you kind of have some technique, if you have the 0:16:04.960 --> 0:16:08.240 confidence to put things together, that there's just so much 0:16:08.240 --> 0:16:11.080 more that can be done, and seeing the kinds of 0:16:11.480 --> 0:16:13.720 resources that were available to people, I just felt like 0:16:13.760 --> 0:16:17.120 they were really lacking, um in particular, they were lacking 0:16:17.400 --> 0:16:20.600 in uh, sort of the addition of fruits and vegetables 0:16:20.640 --> 0:16:23.560 and sort of anything interesting. They were often these sort 0:16:23.600 --> 0:16:26.720 of there's this attitude which you know is always there, 0:16:26.760 --> 0:16:31.080 I think in American culture around sort of poverty and 0:16:31.160 --> 0:16:33.160 not having enough. There's a sort of l well, you 0:16:33.240 --> 0:16:35.240 must have done something to deserve this, This must be 0:16:35.320 --> 0:16:38.480 kind of your fault, and and the often the resources 0:16:38.520 --> 0:16:40.600 really reflected that. It was like, you can have this 0:16:41.200 --> 0:16:47.200 three times photocopied church basement, you know, cookbook that I 0:16:47.280 --> 0:16:51.040 found at a garage sale, and you should feel really 0:16:51.120 --> 0:16:53.200 lucky that I'm letting you have this was sort of 0:16:53.200 --> 0:16:55.400 the attitude. And to me, it was like I wanted 0:16:55.440 --> 0:16:58.880 to create a resource and something that was beautiful and appealing, 0:16:58.960 --> 0:17:02.480 like any other lovely cookbook out there, but that just 0:17:02.520 --> 0:17:05.160 happened to be at a price point that could um 0:17:05.400 --> 0:17:08.560 could work for many people. And so that you know, 0:17:08.560 --> 0:17:10.960 because I also know that many people are walking into 0:17:11.800 --> 0:17:15.200 into bookstores and seeing these cookbooks and feeling left out 0:17:15.240 --> 0:17:17.359 and going like, well, I can't possibly even afford that, 0:17:17.440 --> 0:17:19.600 so why would I even try? So I wanted to 0:17:19.640 --> 0:17:25.280 be really clear that cooking absolutely is affordable, um, and 0:17:26.080 --> 0:17:28.359 sort of have that as a starting point. And and 0:17:28.480 --> 0:17:31.760 you know, there's also this like belief that you can't 0:17:31.800 --> 0:17:35.000 eat sort of healthy generally, like a healthy food, um 0:17:35.080 --> 0:17:37.720 for a little because healthy means like green juice and 0:17:38.119 --> 0:17:41.159 all these kinds of very expensive things. And you know, 0:17:41.200 --> 0:17:44.960 healthy just means like eating a variety of fruits and vegetables, 0:17:45.000 --> 0:17:47.480 and and or eating a variety of foods generally, and 0:17:47.520 --> 0:17:50.600 trying to eat more fruits and vegetables. And certainly it's 0:17:50.600 --> 0:17:53.399 true that you know, at this time of year, buying 0:17:54.080 --> 0:18:02.080 a few grams of raspberries is hideously expensive. But yes, exactly, 0:18:02.119 --> 0:18:05.199 but like, but there are ways to shop and and 0:18:05.320 --> 0:18:07.959 to cook that can sort of maximize your budget and 0:18:07.960 --> 0:18:10.760 still like to eat eat well. And something that you 0:18:10.800 --> 0:18:12.960 said at the beginning, which was sort of staying away 0:18:13.000 --> 0:18:15.600 from those like expensive cuts of meat and sort of 0:18:15.640 --> 0:18:20.000 more expensive dairy and using um, those more expensive items 0:18:20.040 --> 0:18:24.200 like um, you know, butter and cream and expensive cheeses 0:18:24.240 --> 0:18:28.440 and expensive meats, and using smaller quantities of those um 0:18:28.480 --> 0:18:32.159 alongside like the cheaper stables like rice or pasta or 0:18:32.960 --> 0:18:36.159 beans or things like that that we can, uh, you 0:18:36.200 --> 0:18:38.639 can still have just fabulous, fabulous food. So for me, 0:18:38.680 --> 0:18:42.680 it was you know, wanting to share that and um 0:18:42.760 --> 0:18:46.440 and wanting to sort of in my own small, small way, 0:18:46.520 --> 0:18:49.439 try to just like right, attempt to right this wrong 0:18:49.520 --> 0:18:52.080 that I saw out there, and and to invite just 0:18:52.240 --> 0:18:55.960 more people into the kitchen who may have felt left out. 0:18:56.000 --> 0:18:58.680 I always want to just be welcoming. I think that's 0:18:58.680 --> 0:19:01.639 like fundamentally where I always at is like welcome, welcome, 0:19:01.640 --> 0:19:04.359 welcome as many people into the process of cooking, because 0:19:04.359 --> 0:19:09.000 I think it's not just wonderful to eat well, but 0:19:09.119 --> 0:19:12.320 I think the actual process of cooking is really empowering 0:19:12.320 --> 0:19:15.119 and confidence building. Yeah, it's a good skill to have, 0:19:15.240 --> 0:19:16.640 and to know that you can feed yourself and feed 0:19:16.680 --> 0:19:20.000 yourself well feels good and it brings the light. Yes, 0:19:20.560 --> 0:19:23.040 and it also helps foster community. I mean, there's so 0:19:23.040 --> 0:19:25.320 many good things about cooking. And yeah, I love that 0:19:25.400 --> 0:19:27.840 you say you don't have to eat junk food if 0:19:27.880 --> 0:19:29.399 you don't have much money, like there's a way, And 0:19:29.440 --> 0:19:32.320 you also give people the free resource the downloadable the 0:19:32.359 --> 0:19:34.920 downloadable copy of that book. Um, Lean, we want to 0:19:34.920 --> 0:19:36.679 talk about more. We want to talk about cooking when 0:19:36.680 --> 0:19:38.240 you have kids. We want to talk about food waste, 0:19:38.280 --> 0:19:40.399 we want to talk about leftovers. We'll get to some 0:19:40.440 --> 0:19:43.040 of our questions on that front with you right after 0:19:43.080 --> 0:19:54.440 this break. Alright, we're back. We're talking about how we 0:19:54.520 --> 0:19:56.840 can cook home cooked meals that are affordable, that are 0:19:56.840 --> 0:19:59.359 good enough. We're talking with Lean Brown, and we were 0:19:59.359 --> 0:20:03.840 just talking about her previous book, Good and Cheap and 0:20:03.600 --> 0:20:04.919 Lee and one of the things actually that you do 0:20:04.960 --> 0:20:06.760 in that cookbook as well as you put the total 0:20:06.800 --> 0:20:08.600 costs for the for the dishes as well as the 0:20:08.600 --> 0:20:11.520 cost per serving, which I thought was was genius as well. 0:20:11.520 --> 0:20:13.840 But let's talk now about your new book, good Enough. 0:20:14.359 --> 0:20:16.679 I'm curious to know more about this new book, Like 0:20:16.760 --> 0:20:18.840 it does have some recipes, but it also is it's 0:20:18.960 --> 0:20:21.320 kind of part memoir, you know, with like a you 0:20:21.359 --> 0:20:23.200 know a little dash of self care advice in there. 0:20:23.760 --> 0:20:26.680 And so what made you write this book that sort 0:20:26.680 --> 0:20:32.760 of defies literary genres? Yeah, well it didn't. It actually 0:20:32.840 --> 0:20:36.399