1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:00,880 Speaker 1: What's up, everybody. 2 00:00:00,880 --> 00:00:04,440 Speaker 2: Welcome to Financial Heresy, where we talk about how money 3 00:00:04,440 --> 00:00:07,280 Speaker 2: works so that you can make more, keep more, and 4 00:00:07,360 --> 00:00:11,360 Speaker 2: give more. Today I have Bronson Hill a special guest 5 00:00:11,440 --> 00:00:11,720 Speaker 2: for you. 6 00:00:11,800 --> 00:00:12,040 Speaker 1: Here. 7 00:00:12,160 --> 00:00:19,880 Speaker 2: We're talking about real estate specifically syndications single family versus multifamily, 8 00:00:20,120 --> 00:00:25,640 Speaker 2: looking at the macro economic environment right now affecting real estate, 9 00:00:26,520 --> 00:00:30,320 Speaker 2: things like interest rates, how is that affecting different real 10 00:00:30,440 --> 00:00:34,960 Speaker 2: estate markets, and what risks that is posing to real 11 00:00:35,040 --> 00:00:40,320 Speaker 2: estate markets right now. Really fantastic conversation here that I'm 12 00:00:40,320 --> 00:00:42,600 Speaker 2: really excited for you to listen to. And if you 13 00:00:42,640 --> 00:00:46,600 Speaker 2: are interested in investing with Bronson, I'm going to have 14 00:00:46,680 --> 00:00:49,760 Speaker 2: his information linked in the show notes that you can 15 00:00:49,800 --> 00:00:53,800 Speaker 2: expand those notes there and find out more. All right, Well, 16 00:00:53,840 --> 00:00:56,360 Speaker 2: thank you so much Bronson for joining me here. Really 17 00:00:56,360 --> 00:00:57,400 Speaker 2: excited to talk to you today. 18 00:00:58,040 --> 00:00:59,400 Speaker 3: Hey, Joe, really excited to be here. 19 00:00:59,440 --> 00:01:03,440 Speaker 4: Man. I love heresy, financial love what you're doing, love macroeconomics, 20 00:01:03,440 --> 00:01:04,679 Speaker 4: so I can't wait to get into it. 21 00:01:05,200 --> 00:01:08,559 Speaker 2: Thank you, well, everything today. It's kind of crazy what's 22 00:01:08,600 --> 00:01:14,800 Speaker 2: going on. And for probably the last really since twenty twenty, 23 00:01:15,640 --> 00:01:17,640 Speaker 2: there have been a consistent group of people who have 24 00:01:17,680 --> 00:01:22,080 Speaker 2: been saying there's a real estate crash right around the corner, 25 00:01:22,800 --> 00:01:24,760 Speaker 2: and so I really want to get into that with you, 26 00:01:24,800 --> 00:01:29,319 Speaker 2: But first tell tell us, tell us how you got 27 00:01:29,319 --> 00:01:31,720 Speaker 2: into real estate and started building your business, and a 28 00:01:31,760 --> 00:01:32,840 Speaker 2: little bit about your story. 29 00:01:33,400 --> 00:01:33,680 Speaker 3: Yeah. 30 00:01:33,720 --> 00:01:36,039 Speaker 4: So, I I've always been interested in real estate. I 31 00:01:36,080 --> 00:01:38,039 Speaker 4: love the idea of making money while you sleep, or 32 00:01:38,040 --> 00:01:40,160 Speaker 4: having assets that work for you so you don't have 33 00:01:40,200 --> 00:01:43,000 Speaker 4: to work for your money. Had a single family house 34 00:01:43,040 --> 00:01:46,720 Speaker 4: for years. Had basically got into medical device sales, which 35 00:01:46,760 --> 00:01:50,080 Speaker 4: basically involves going into surgery with you know, surgeons and 36 00:01:50,120 --> 00:01:53,640 Speaker 4: cardiologists and giving them an equipment on how to you know, 37 00:01:53,720 --> 00:01:56,600 Speaker 4: do heart surgical stuff, which is very interesting. But I 38 00:01:56,600 --> 00:01:58,640 Speaker 4: saw like there were some physicians that I worked with 39 00:01:58,680 --> 00:02:00,600 Speaker 4: that you know, made great money, you know, over two 40 00:02:00,680 --> 00:02:03,200 Speaker 4: three million dollars a year each, but they were having 41 00:02:03,240 --> 00:02:05,600 Speaker 4: to work sixty eighty hours a week, and I just 42 00:02:05,880 --> 00:02:08,280 Speaker 4: thought that's really not something that was appealing to me. 43 00:02:08,320 --> 00:02:10,639 Speaker 4: So the idea of really finding a place where I 44 00:02:10,680 --> 00:02:13,120 Speaker 4: could get to financial freedom, which to me is really 45 00:02:13,160 --> 00:02:15,640 Speaker 4: freedom of time more than freedom of money, having my 46 00:02:15,680 --> 00:02:18,680 Speaker 4: investments work for me. So I had been doing single 47 00:02:18,680 --> 00:02:22,120 Speaker 4: family investing. Had cut his cousin who I got in 48 00:02:22,120 --> 00:02:23,720 Speaker 4: touch with and He's like, what are you doing this 49 00:02:23,760 --> 00:02:27,400 Speaker 4: single family thing for? Why don't you do multifamily apartment investing? 50 00:02:27,400 --> 00:02:28,840 Speaker 4: And I said, I'd love to, but I don't have 51 00:02:28,840 --> 00:02:30,679 Speaker 4: the money. He said, you can raise the money, so 52 00:02:30,720 --> 00:02:33,320 Speaker 4: I learned about syndication. Since that point, that was about 53 00:02:33,320 --> 00:02:35,800 Speaker 4: five years ago, we've raised almost thirty five million for 54 00:02:35,840 --> 00:02:38,519 Speaker 4: different assets. I quit my corporate job a couple of 55 00:02:38,560 --> 00:02:41,840 Speaker 4: years ago. We have about two hundred million in multifamily assets. 56 00:02:41,840 --> 00:02:44,959 Speaker 4: We've also done some alternative assets, such as ATM machines 57 00:02:45,000 --> 00:02:48,200 Speaker 4: and car washes, oil and gas, things like that as well. 58 00:02:48,280 --> 00:02:50,720 Speaker 4: So I'm a student of macro, love learning about all 59 00:02:50,760 --> 00:02:52,480 Speaker 4: the stuff. But I just think the idea of helping 60 00:02:52,520 --> 00:02:55,480 Speaker 4: people to get out of the time for money trade 61 00:02:55,720 --> 00:02:57,960 Speaker 4: is a passion of mine to develop streams of passive 62 00:02:57,960 --> 00:03:00,160 Speaker 4: income because, as Warren Buffet sat, unless you learn to 63 00:03:00,160 --> 00:03:02,360 Speaker 4: make money while you sleep, you'll work until you die. 64 00:03:03,600 --> 00:03:07,840 Speaker 2: Now with your with your kind of journey, there there's 65 00:03:07,880 --> 00:03:09,840 Speaker 2: always a there's always a trade off. 66 00:03:09,880 --> 00:03:13,480 Speaker 1: A lot of people will agree with Let's say. 67 00:03:13,320 --> 00:03:14,880 Speaker 2: You know ninety percent of what you just said, So 68 00:03:14,919 --> 00:03:16,600 Speaker 2: let's say I'm going to work really hard at my job, 69 00:03:16,960 --> 00:03:19,560 Speaker 2: take as much of my income as possible and buy 70 00:03:20,360 --> 00:03:23,160 Speaker 2: buy assets with that that'll produce passive income for me. 71 00:03:23,520 --> 00:03:25,079 Speaker 2: But it seems like you took a little bit of 72 00:03:25,120 --> 00:03:29,960 Speaker 2: a different route. You turned your business itself into producing 73 00:03:30,080 --> 00:03:31,320 Speaker 2: cash flowing assets. 74 00:03:32,520 --> 00:03:32,760 Speaker 3: Yeah. 75 00:03:32,840 --> 00:03:35,320 Speaker 4: Yeah, so really, I mean I didn't really come from money. 76 00:03:35,320 --> 00:03:37,280 Speaker 4: I didn't have like millions of dollars around. I had 77 00:03:37,280 --> 00:03:38,840 Speaker 4: a good job, it was making you know, a couple 78 00:03:38,880 --> 00:03:41,880 Speaker 4: hundred K a year, But it was really something that 79 00:03:42,320 --> 00:03:44,160 Speaker 4: I realized for me to grow the way I wanted 80 00:03:44,200 --> 00:03:45,280 Speaker 4: to grow, I had. 81 00:03:45,160 --> 00:03:47,280 Speaker 3: To really find a way to create value for other people. 82 00:03:47,360 --> 00:03:50,200 Speaker 4: There's a quote by Jim Rohan, who's a motivational speaker. 83 00:03:50,240 --> 00:03:52,720 Speaker 4: He said, you know, make yourself valuable to valuable people. 84 00:03:53,000 --> 00:03:54,720 Speaker 4: So if I can just create value just like you're 85 00:03:54,720 --> 00:03:57,800 Speaker 4: doing with heresy, right, you're creating value around a conversation 86 00:03:57,840 --> 00:04:01,000 Speaker 4: around macroeconomics and just you know, how can people invest 87 00:04:01,080 --> 00:04:03,280 Speaker 4: in a way where they can not only not get 88 00:04:03,360 --> 00:04:06,440 Speaker 4: hurt by a crash, they can actually grow their wealth 89 00:04:06,560 --> 00:04:08,240 Speaker 4: and they can actually grow in that way and so 90 00:04:08,760 --> 00:04:09,840 Speaker 4: a lot of you know, I think if you're into 91 00:04:09,840 --> 00:04:11,320 Speaker 4: the educational space like you and I are, we don't 92 00:04:11,360 --> 00:04:12,600 Speaker 4: necessarily do this for the money. 93 00:04:12,640 --> 00:04:14,040 Speaker 3: But in the process of doing it. 94 00:04:14,200 --> 00:04:16,159 Speaker 4: If you can help enough people, there's a way you 95 00:04:16,200 --> 00:04:18,760 Speaker 4: can basically get a piece of the upside on some 96 00:04:18,800 --> 00:04:21,320 Speaker 4: of these deals as you help people create opportunities for people. 97 00:04:21,400 --> 00:04:23,479 Speaker 4: So but yeah, I think, you know, some people would 98 00:04:23,480 --> 00:04:25,279 Speaker 4: decide a lot of people we work with are high 99 00:04:25,320 --> 00:04:28,400 Speaker 4: net worth and they choose to be fully passive. I think, 100 00:04:28,440 --> 00:04:30,200 Speaker 4: you know, we should all aspire to that full time. 101 00:04:30,240 --> 00:04:32,600 Speaker 4: But to me, I wanted to grow my wealth more quickly, and. 102 00:04:32,560 --> 00:04:34,520 Speaker 3: This allowed me at Avenue to do that. 103 00:04:35,400 --> 00:04:36,960 Speaker 1: Gotcha, Yeah, that makes sense. 104 00:04:37,160 --> 00:04:42,480 Speaker 2: So in uh, in syndications, explain for for somebody whose 105 00:04:42,640 --> 00:04:45,760 Speaker 2: only experience might be, you know, investing in a rep 106 00:04:45,880 --> 00:04:48,440 Speaker 2: like a real estate ETF or single family homes? 107 00:04:48,480 --> 00:04:50,159 Speaker 1: What is what is a syndication? 108 00:04:51,160 --> 00:04:53,040 Speaker 4: So a syndication I used to hear the first version 109 00:04:53,040 --> 00:04:54,640 Speaker 4: of the turd of the term syndication. I thought of 110 00:04:54,680 --> 00:04:57,279 Speaker 4: like a like a syndicate or like a crime boss. 111 00:04:57,080 --> 00:04:59,040 Speaker 3: Or something like that, Like a syndicate. We're part of 112 00:04:59,040 --> 00:04:59,560 Speaker 3: the syndicate. 113 00:05:00,120 --> 00:05:02,880 Speaker 4: A syndication really is just a fancy way of saying 114 00:05:03,120 --> 00:05:05,440 Speaker 4: this is a private deal, meaning it's not traded on 115 00:05:05,480 --> 00:05:09,240 Speaker 4: a public market. It's something that you'll typically have two parties. 116 00:05:09,320 --> 00:05:12,240 Speaker 4: One is a GP or a general partner. The other's LP, 117 00:05:12,520 --> 00:05:15,280 Speaker 4: a limited partner, which really is the passive investor. So 118 00:05:15,400 --> 00:05:18,000 Speaker 4: these passive investors that typically bring most of the money 119 00:05:18,160 --> 00:05:20,440 Speaker 4: and the general partners will operate the deal. Now, we 120 00:05:20,680 --> 00:05:23,239 Speaker 4: typically will put money in as well be limited partners 121 00:05:23,240 --> 00:05:25,479 Speaker 4: in the deals that we're in. But this is basically 122 00:05:25,480 --> 00:05:27,920 Speaker 4: a structure and entity that allows us to go after 123 00:05:27,960 --> 00:05:28,520 Speaker 4: a bigger deal. 124 00:05:28,600 --> 00:05:29,159 Speaker 3: So there's a lot of. 125 00:05:29,200 --> 00:05:32,560 Speaker 4: Efficiencies, and especially in multi family apartments, once we get 126 00:05:32,640 --> 00:05:35,360 Speaker 4: up of about sixty to eighty units, we can have 127 00:05:35,520 --> 00:05:38,400 Speaker 4: on site property management that actually you know, is full 128 00:05:38,400 --> 00:05:41,080 Speaker 4: time dedicated to that property. We have typically a full 129 00:05:41,120 --> 00:05:43,560 Speaker 4: time maintenance person or two, and it just makes it 130 00:05:43,600 --> 00:05:46,760 Speaker 4: much much more efficient. That's why reads and these big groups, 131 00:05:47,680 --> 00:05:49,880 Speaker 4: you know, like bigger and more expensive assets, because there's 132 00:05:49,880 --> 00:05:52,200 Speaker 4: a lot more resources you can put towards them. It's 133 00:05:52,279 --> 00:05:55,080 Speaker 4: very difficult to manage a like ten ten unit apartment 134 00:05:55,120 --> 00:05:57,560 Speaker 4: complexes because of the management. It's you know, our par 135 00:05:57,560 --> 00:06:00,840 Speaker 4: instead of managing one one hundred unit property. Somebody has 136 00:06:00,839 --> 00:06:02,800 Speaker 4: ten properties, they've got to try to go between and 137 00:06:02,839 --> 00:06:04,080 Speaker 4: provide really great. 138 00:06:04,240 --> 00:06:05,440 Speaker 3: Service and stuff like that. 139 00:06:05,480 --> 00:06:08,040 Speaker 4: So part of the benefit obviously is that we can 140 00:06:08,080 --> 00:06:11,200 Speaker 4: go after bigger, more efficient assets run them, you know, 141 00:06:11,440 --> 00:06:13,680 Speaker 4: in a very positive way. In a way, what our 142 00:06:13,920 --> 00:06:16,760 Speaker 4: strategy is is really a value add strategy where we 143 00:06:16,800 --> 00:06:19,039 Speaker 4: try to come in, we renovate, very similar to like 144 00:06:19,040 --> 00:06:21,320 Speaker 4: a house flip, where you come in you say this 145 00:06:21,360 --> 00:06:23,080 Speaker 4: house is you know, three hundred K. But if we 146 00:06:23,120 --> 00:06:25,040 Speaker 4: do you know, one hundred K and renovations, we can 147 00:06:25,080 --> 00:06:27,040 Speaker 4: sell for five hundred or six hundred. Right, So that's 148 00:06:27,080 --> 00:06:28,719 Speaker 4: kind of how it works. But we're doing it in 149 00:06:28,880 --> 00:06:31,200 Speaker 4: large apartment buildings and we're doing it for a long 150 00:06:31,240 --> 00:06:33,279 Speaker 4: period of time, maybe three to five years. So that's 151 00:06:33,560 --> 00:06:37,760 Speaker 4: typical real estate syndication. There's different there's development, there's self storage, 152 00:06:37,800 --> 00:06:40,120 Speaker 4: there's all kinds that you can syndicate a coffee farm 153 00:06:40,240 --> 00:06:43,200 Speaker 4: in South America. So syndication is just the structure or 154 00:06:43,240 --> 00:06:44,800 Speaker 4: the legal structure of how that is set up. 155 00:06:47,000 --> 00:06:50,440 Speaker 2: In terms of why somebody might be interested in this. 156 00:06:50,600 --> 00:06:53,360 Speaker 2: I'm going to use an example and you can tell 157 00:06:53,400 --> 00:06:57,640 Speaker 2: me if this is this is accurate or not. There's 158 00:06:57,680 --> 00:07:01,320 Speaker 2: a reason why war and Buffett doesn't go around looking 159 00:07:01,520 --> 00:07:04,080 Speaker 2: for things at garage sales and flipping them on eBay. 160 00:07:04,080 --> 00:07:05,880 Speaker 2: Even if you can get a three hundred, four hundred 161 00:07:05,880 --> 00:07:08,480 Speaker 2: and five hundred percent return on your money doing that. 162 00:07:09,440 --> 00:07:12,240 Speaker 2: He there, he's he couldn't do that with you know, 163 00:07:12,320 --> 00:07:15,480 Speaker 2: one hundred billion dollars. And so when you're dealing with 164 00:07:16,080 --> 00:07:19,280 Speaker 2: you know, large amounts of capital, it's more efficient to 165 00:07:19,760 --> 00:07:24,200 Speaker 2: do something like a syndication because while you know, you know, 166 00:07:24,680 --> 00:07:26,600 Speaker 2: a single fit, doing it with a bunch of single 167 00:07:26,640 --> 00:07:31,040 Speaker 2: family homes would be sometimes too cumbersome, too difficult, too 168 00:07:31,040 --> 00:07:32,320 Speaker 2: expensive to scale. 169 00:07:32,600 --> 00:07:33,680 Speaker 1: Is that is that accurate? 170 00:07:33,880 --> 00:07:34,080 Speaker 3: Yeah? 171 00:07:34,160 --> 00:07:35,840 Speaker 4: Yeah, it really comes down to you know, at some 172 00:07:35,880 --> 00:07:37,240 Speaker 4: point you're going to run out of money. You know, 173 00:07:37,280 --> 00:07:39,840 Speaker 4: if you're doing stuff in general, like as a syndicator, 174 00:07:39,840 --> 00:07:42,080 Speaker 4: as somebody who loves real estate, you only do so 175 00:07:42,080 --> 00:07:44,320 Speaker 4: many deals, then it's like, I need to start finding 176 00:07:45,000 --> 00:07:47,240 Speaker 4: other investors to be able to do it with us. 177 00:07:47,520 --> 00:07:49,960 Speaker 4: Now as a passive investor, again, that's another conversation. Why 178 00:07:49,960 --> 00:07:53,400 Speaker 4: would somebody invest in a passive investment or one of 179 00:07:53,400 --> 00:07:55,840 Speaker 4: these deals. Well, the nice thing is that, besides vetting 180 00:07:55,840 --> 00:07:59,280 Speaker 4: the deal and vetting the team, once you invest, you 181 00:07:59,320 --> 00:08:01,520 Speaker 4: are fully pass so you're not getting those calls in 182 00:08:01,560 --> 00:08:02,960 Speaker 4: the middle of the night, Hey you got a toilet 183 00:08:03,000 --> 00:08:04,960 Speaker 4: issue here, Hey we're having an issue. We got a 184 00:08:05,000 --> 00:08:07,880 Speaker 4: vict the tenant. That stuff is done by the general partners, 185 00:08:08,080 --> 00:08:10,600 Speaker 4: so it's more of a done for you approach. But 186 00:08:10,880 --> 00:08:12,800 Speaker 4: and you'd think you get paid less doing that. But 187 00:08:12,840 --> 00:08:15,240 Speaker 4: I found even from doing single family it actually the 188 00:08:15,320 --> 00:08:17,760 Speaker 4: returns are the same or even greater, especially if you 189 00:08:17,760 --> 00:08:20,800 Speaker 4: have a really good team managing things. So Robert Kiyosaki, 190 00:08:20,880 --> 00:08:23,560 Speaker 4: I heard him one time speak and he said, you know, 191 00:08:23,640 --> 00:08:26,480 Speaker 4: only you know, it's selfish to only use your own money, right, 192 00:08:26,520 --> 00:08:28,600 Speaker 4: So if I'm just doing my own deals, then that's 193 00:08:28,640 --> 00:08:30,120 Speaker 4: kind of selfish. But when you can involve more people, 194 00:08:30,160 --> 00:08:32,319 Speaker 4: it's obviously it's more fun. You can do bigger deals. 195 00:08:32,520 --> 00:08:34,880 Speaker 4: There's benefit for the limited partners, a lot of tax 196 00:08:34,880 --> 00:08:36,839 Speaker 4: benefits that come with that, as well as just a 197 00:08:36,880 --> 00:08:39,079 Speaker 4: greater upside and I think more stability. I mean, I 198 00:08:39,120 --> 00:08:41,319 Speaker 4: think another thing that people don't realize is during the 199 00:08:41,320 --> 00:08:44,880 Speaker 4: Great Recession there's a big difference between certain types of 200 00:08:45,040 --> 00:08:47,000 Speaker 4: real estate assets. Everybody asked me like, well, how is 201 00:08:47,040 --> 00:08:48,800 Speaker 4: the real estate market? And I'm like, well, well, which 202 00:08:48,840 --> 00:08:50,880 Speaker 4: one are we talking single family? You're talking multi family. 203 00:08:50,920 --> 00:08:52,680 Speaker 4: We're talking in the city out of the city, which 204 00:08:52,679 --> 00:08:55,400 Speaker 4: you know, la Chicago. What are we talking about. But 205 00:08:55,720 --> 00:08:57,800 Speaker 4: if you look at single family as a whole, which 206 00:08:57,840 --> 00:09:00,400 Speaker 4: is still a lot of submarkets there, in multi family, 207 00:09:01,080 --> 00:09:03,800 Speaker 4: there was a ten times later ten ten times less 208 00:09:04,160 --> 00:09:07,920 Speaker 4: default rate, so meaning it was ten x less in 209 00:09:08,080 --> 00:09:11,040 Speaker 4: large multifamily over sixty units than it was in single family. 210 00:09:11,120 --> 00:09:12,480 Speaker 4: So single family at the worst point in the Great 211 00:09:12,520 --> 00:09:15,360 Speaker 4: Recession of the GFC was around four percent, So I 212 00:09:15,360 --> 00:09:17,559 Speaker 4: mean about one and twenty five homes were delinquent or 213 00:09:17,559 --> 00:09:19,720 Speaker 4: in default, and it was one out of every two 214 00:09:19,760 --> 00:09:23,080 Speaker 4: hundred and fifty large multifamily. So it's really people don't 215 00:09:23,080 --> 00:09:25,760 Speaker 4: realize that people can't afford houses even now when rates 216 00:09:25,760 --> 00:09:27,280 Speaker 4: are high, Well, where do they go? They've got to 217 00:09:27,280 --> 00:09:29,160 Speaker 4: go into apartments, and so that's kind of why we 218 00:09:29,320 --> 00:09:31,439 Speaker 4: like focusing on those assets. 219 00:09:32,720 --> 00:09:32,960 Speaker 1: Now. 220 00:09:33,040 --> 00:09:36,160 Speaker 2: You bring up a really good point that is, it's 221 00:09:36,240 --> 00:09:38,880 Speaker 2: one of the common themes that you hear anytime somebody 222 00:09:38,880 --> 00:09:40,760 Speaker 2: who actually knows what they're talking about in terms of 223 00:09:40,760 --> 00:09:43,240 Speaker 2: real estate, they always say, there's no such thing as 224 00:09:43,240 --> 00:09:45,720 Speaker 2: a real estate market. Which real estate market are you 225 00:09:45,760 --> 00:09:48,360 Speaker 2: talking about? There's many of them, and i'd like to 226 00:09:48,600 --> 00:09:52,880 Speaker 2: I'd like to get into that real quick though, before 227 00:09:52,920 --> 00:09:56,320 Speaker 2: we jump into the different different markets. I'd like to 228 00:09:56,360 --> 00:09:58,720 Speaker 2: hear your outlook right now, because, like we mentioned at 229 00:09:58,760 --> 00:10:02,000 Speaker 2: the beginning of the call, there's been people since since 230 00:10:02,040 --> 00:10:05,320 Speaker 2: twenty ten, I would say, maybe twenty eleven calling for 231 00:10:05,360 --> 00:10:09,760 Speaker 2: the next real estate crash, and everybody says, oh. 232 00:10:09,679 --> 00:10:10,880 Speaker 1: You know, this time is different. 233 00:10:11,000 --> 00:10:12,920 Speaker 2: That's the you know, the thing that everybody always says 234 00:10:13,040 --> 00:10:15,120 Speaker 2: is the marker that it's definitely not going to be different. 235 00:10:15,160 --> 00:10:18,800 Speaker 2: But what is happening right now? What is your outlook? 236 00:10:18,960 --> 00:10:22,760 Speaker 2: There's lots of crazy things happening economically speaking during the 237 00:10:22,800 --> 00:10:24,040 Speaker 2: next couple of years. What are the. 238 00:10:24,000 --> 00:10:27,040 Speaker 3: Biggest risks you see with with real estate? 239 00:10:27,600 --> 00:10:29,920 Speaker 4: Yeah, so, you know, I think in general we a 240 00:10:30,000 --> 00:10:33,400 Speaker 4: lot of us are watching across all asset classes right now. 241 00:10:33,559 --> 00:10:36,000 Speaker 4: Is you know, the interest rates they've come up so 242 00:10:36,240 --> 00:10:39,640 Speaker 4: quickly and we're seeing it a lot. Actually, there's there's 243 00:10:39,720 --> 00:10:42,920 Speaker 4: rumbles of deals that are you know, there's cash calls 244 00:10:42,920 --> 00:10:44,720 Speaker 4: to investors, there's foreclosures. 245 00:10:44,760 --> 00:10:46,920 Speaker 3: I just saw that. You know, there's this big Manhattan 246 00:10:46,920 --> 00:10:47,760 Speaker 3: deal with Blackstone. 247 00:10:47,800 --> 00:10:49,840 Speaker 4: It's one of the largest private equity groups in the country, 248 00:10:50,120 --> 00:10:52,720 Speaker 4: potentially defaulting on a two hundred and seventy million dollar 249 00:10:53,000 --> 00:10:56,080 Speaker 4: eleven apartment building thing in you know, really nice part 250 00:10:56,080 --> 00:10:58,679 Speaker 4: of New York and so and you know, there's just 251 00:10:58,720 --> 00:11:01,320 Speaker 4: stories of this happening if it continue to happen. Why 252 00:11:01,360 --> 00:11:05,600 Speaker 4: it's happening is variable variable rate debt, which at leastly 253 00:11:05,640 --> 00:11:08,360 Speaker 4: for a large apartment buildings, I have heard figures it's 254 00:11:08,360 --> 00:11:11,480 Speaker 4: around eighty to ninety percent has a variable rate debt. 255 00:11:11,480 --> 00:11:13,640 Speaker 4: And you will think, well, why in the world would 256 00:11:13,679 --> 00:11:16,240 Speaker 4: somebody ever get a variable rate debt when people are 257 00:11:16,280 --> 00:11:17,880 Speaker 4: used to single family you can get a thirty year 258 00:11:18,160 --> 00:11:19,480 Speaker 4: loan on it. Right, So if I've got you know, 259 00:11:19,559 --> 00:11:21,400 Speaker 4: most people listening, if you own a home, you're at 260 00:11:21,520 --> 00:11:24,400 Speaker 4: three or four percent or less. Well, the challenge is 261 00:11:24,480 --> 00:11:26,520 Speaker 4: most of the debt is variable. The reason why is 262 00:11:26,559 --> 00:11:30,160 Speaker 4: because it's hard to get fixed rate debt on a 263 00:11:30,160 --> 00:11:31,840 Speaker 4: lot of these deals, and a lot of deals that 264 00:11:31,880 --> 00:11:33,360 Speaker 4: have been done in the last several years we've had 265 00:11:33,360 --> 00:11:35,800 Speaker 4: such a boom in real estate, the numbers really didn't 266 00:11:35,840 --> 00:11:38,679 Speaker 4: work unless people came in with this variable rate debt. 267 00:11:38,920 --> 00:11:40,520 Speaker 4: And so we're seeing, you know, as much as things 268 00:11:40,520 --> 00:11:43,160 Speaker 4: are happening in the financial sector, you know, Silicon Valley 269 00:11:43,160 --> 00:11:46,000 Speaker 4: Bank and First Republic and different things like this, in 270 00:11:46,040 --> 00:11:49,679 Speaker 4: real estate, there is a real storm brewing kind of 271 00:11:49,720 --> 00:11:53,239 Speaker 4: all over it. It's in office space, it's in apartments, 272 00:11:53,240 --> 00:11:54,000 Speaker 4: it's in different things. 273 00:11:54,000 --> 00:11:54,440 Speaker 3: In rents. 274 00:11:54,480 --> 00:11:56,480 Speaker 4: At least we're seeing in apartments. That's really what we 275 00:11:56,520 --> 00:11:59,679 Speaker 4: do among other assets. But you know, we're seeing a 276 00:11:59,720 --> 00:12:01,640 Speaker 4: lot of shake ups there. So what's going to happen 277 00:12:01,679 --> 00:12:04,520 Speaker 4: is if rates continue to rise, it creates more and 278 00:12:04,559 --> 00:12:07,199 Speaker 4: more pain. Or even if just rates stay high for longer, 279 00:12:07,600 --> 00:12:11,080 Speaker 4: even if rents are rising, they're not rising fast enough 280 00:12:11,120 --> 00:12:15,440 Speaker 4: to cover increasing interest payments. There's also issues with you know, 281 00:12:15,520 --> 00:12:16,840 Speaker 4: just cost of insurance. 282 00:12:16,920 --> 00:12:19,600 Speaker 3: In the Southeast. We do some work down there and 283 00:12:19,760 --> 00:12:20,319 Speaker 3: even labor. 284 00:12:20,360 --> 00:12:22,199 Speaker 4: A lot of these things are going up, so we're 285 00:12:22,200 --> 00:12:24,800 Speaker 4: not seeing necessarily and it comes down to if you 286 00:12:24,800 --> 00:12:27,600 Speaker 4: can operate a building well. My friend Kevin mount Ken 287 00:12:27,640 --> 00:12:30,559 Speaker 4: Maceilroy Atchi Mediamato as well. He says, really twenty twenty 288 00:12:30,600 --> 00:12:32,920 Speaker 4: three is the year of operations, And it comes down 289 00:12:32,920 --> 00:12:35,480 Speaker 4: to like this is, you know, the Warren Buffett saying, 290 00:12:35,480 --> 00:12:37,720 Speaker 4: you know, you can only tell who's been swimming naked 291 00:12:37,920 --> 00:12:39,760 Speaker 4: when the tide goes out, right, So there are people 292 00:12:39,760 --> 00:12:41,400 Speaker 4: that are swimming naked. They're just kind of hanging on. 293 00:12:41,840 --> 00:12:44,720 Speaker 4: And the longer and the more protracted this is the 294 00:12:44,720 --> 00:12:46,920 Speaker 4: more pain there's going to be. So I'm not sure 295 00:12:46,960 --> 00:12:49,920 Speaker 4: exactly how long rates will stay high. I'm seeing we're 296 00:12:49,920 --> 00:12:52,679 Speaker 4: seeing some of the cracks in the financial system. I've 297 00:12:52,720 --> 00:12:55,040 Speaker 4: really been saying, you know, over the last few months. 298 00:12:55,080 --> 00:12:57,600 Speaker 4: I think sometime this year, I'm thinking that rates will 299 00:12:57,640 --> 00:12:59,520 Speaker 4: stabilize or even start to come down a little bit. 300 00:13:00,240 --> 00:13:02,600 Speaker 4: Kind of as a counter trend to that, there is 301 00:13:03,080 --> 00:13:04,960 Speaker 4: you know, Bloomberg had an article late last year that 302 00:13:04,960 --> 00:13:08,440 Speaker 4: said there's over five trillion dollars in investor bank accounts 303 00:13:08,520 --> 00:13:11,320 Speaker 4: or in individual Americans bank accounts, which is over four 304 00:13:11,400 --> 00:13:13,520 Speaker 4: times the highest amount we've ever had, which was in 305 00:13:13,559 --> 00:13:15,320 Speaker 4: COVID and twenty twenty. So you have kind of these 306 00:13:15,320 --> 00:13:17,960 Speaker 4: different trends. You have all these people waiting to get 307 00:13:17,960 --> 00:13:20,640 Speaker 4: into stuff, inflation is high. I think what's going to 308 00:13:20,640 --> 00:13:22,000 Speaker 4: happen is rates are going to stay out. We just 309 00:13:22,000 --> 00:13:24,360 Speaker 4: don't know how bad and how long and how much 310 00:13:24,440 --> 00:13:26,360 Speaker 4: pain there's going to be. But it really is going 311 00:13:26,360 --> 00:13:28,760 Speaker 4: to be a separation between good operators that had good 312 00:13:28,840 --> 00:13:31,880 Speaker 4: foresight and those that didn't. And you know, how long 313 00:13:31,920 --> 00:13:34,040 Speaker 4: the FED holds on before if there are other cracks 314 00:13:34,080 --> 00:13:35,920 Speaker 4: in the system that show up. So I know it's 315 00:13:35,920 --> 00:13:38,120 Speaker 4: not a really great answer, but I think that there's 316 00:13:38,160 --> 00:13:40,920 Speaker 4: going to be some pretty significant pain. But I really 317 00:13:40,960 --> 00:13:43,440 Speaker 4: don't think sitting in cash is a great idea because 318 00:13:43,440 --> 00:13:46,000 Speaker 4: I think inflation is actually around fifteen percent or more. 319 00:13:46,280 --> 00:13:48,560 Speaker 3: And so I think, you know, that's the whole thing 320 00:13:48,640 --> 00:13:50,040 Speaker 3: is what do you do with this right? Where do 321 00:13:50,120 --> 00:13:50,400 Speaker 3: we go? 322 00:13:50,640 --> 00:13:52,760 Speaker 4: What does an investor do? And I think if you 323 00:13:52,840 --> 00:13:55,199 Speaker 4: can deploy in assets that are good assets, we've we've 324 00:13:55,200 --> 00:13:57,079 Speaker 4: shifted a little bit alternative to go some of these 325 00:13:57,080 --> 00:13:59,360 Speaker 4: other you know, outside of real estate type of assets 326 00:14:00,200 --> 00:14:02,120 Speaker 4: real estate, So if there's an opportunity, we'll jump back 327 00:14:02,160 --> 00:14:05,400 Speaker 4: in and get into some great deals as well. 328 00:14:05,559 --> 00:14:09,440 Speaker 2: So the interest rates thing, that's I mean, you said 329 00:14:09,440 --> 00:14:11,160 Speaker 2: a bunch of that. I'd like to go into detail 330 00:14:11,200 --> 00:14:14,040 Speaker 2: on the interest rates thing is really interesting to me 331 00:14:14,120 --> 00:14:20,000 Speaker 2: because globally speaking, the situation that single family homes have 332 00:14:20,080 --> 00:14:23,040 Speaker 2: here in the United States is an anomaly. Like nobody 333 00:14:23,040 --> 00:14:25,080 Speaker 2: in the world, for any type of real estate, has 334 00:14:25,160 --> 00:14:28,720 Speaker 2: fixed thirty year mortgages. It's like it's it's only available 335 00:14:28,760 --> 00:14:31,560 Speaker 2: to you know, single family home buyers in the States. 336 00:14:31,560 --> 00:14:35,160 Speaker 2: And so to me that that looks to me like 337 00:14:35,200 --> 00:14:36,960 Speaker 2: when you look at what's happening with you know, like 338 00:14:37,000 --> 00:14:40,240 Speaker 2: commercial real estate. It's like these deals only made sense 339 00:14:40,440 --> 00:14:43,600 Speaker 2: if you could do if you know, for the cash 340 00:14:43,600 --> 00:14:46,480 Speaker 2: flow and the numbers, if your if your payments were 341 00:14:46,520 --> 00:14:48,000 Speaker 2: low enough, and the only way to get your payments 342 00:14:48,040 --> 00:14:51,840 Speaker 2: low enough was to do these variable loans. And so 343 00:14:52,120 --> 00:14:56,600 Speaker 2: as as that kind of unravels, that would present like 344 00:14:56,680 --> 00:15:00,160 Speaker 2: an opportunity for anybody who is prepared, right, because is 345 00:15:00,160 --> 00:15:02,280 Speaker 2: going to be some distressed sellers, especially for some of 346 00:15:02,280 --> 00:15:03,760 Speaker 2: these larger properties. 347 00:15:05,040 --> 00:15:08,680 Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, so there definitely will be opportunities. I think, 348 00:15:08,760 --> 00:15:12,080 Speaker 4: you know, it's interesting in single family nationally it's around 349 00:15:12,080 --> 00:15:15,720 Speaker 4: eighteen percent, obviously more or less in different markets, but 350 00:15:15,760 --> 00:15:18,320 Speaker 4: so there has been a reduction in the price from 351 00:15:18,360 --> 00:15:20,400 Speaker 4: you know peak to where we are now. So we're 352 00:15:20,440 --> 00:15:22,480 Speaker 4: seeing that, and we have seen it in multi families, 353 00:15:22,520 --> 00:15:25,800 Speaker 4: well we've seen you know, around most areas, we're seeing 354 00:15:25,840 --> 00:15:28,640 Speaker 4: you know, prices come down a little bit. So there 355 00:15:28,680 --> 00:15:32,560 Speaker 4: is opportunity. And I've talked to really smart people that 356 00:15:32,640 --> 00:15:34,280 Speaker 4: are on both sides of this equation because you know, 357 00:15:34,280 --> 00:15:36,600 Speaker 4: the question as an investor is will do I hold 358 00:15:36,640 --> 00:15:39,080 Speaker 4: off and wait or do I actually just you know, 359 00:15:39,160 --> 00:15:41,400 Speaker 4: put it all in deals, and you know get something 360 00:15:41,440 --> 00:15:43,600 Speaker 4: that I'm cash flowing in, and I think it really 361 00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:45,320 Speaker 4: you know, the answer is depends, right, It depends on 362 00:15:45,360 --> 00:15:46,920 Speaker 4: what you want to do. Maybe hold some cash, put 363 00:15:46,960 --> 00:15:49,520 Speaker 4: some in. But I do think that there could be 364 00:15:49,560 --> 00:15:51,920 Speaker 4: some opportunities that are going to come up, and there's 365 00:15:51,920 --> 00:15:54,800 Speaker 4: there's always opportunities in every market. I think if you 366 00:15:54,880 --> 00:15:57,000 Speaker 4: can deploy, I think, you know the challenge a lot 367 00:15:57,040 --> 00:15:58,440 Speaker 4: of times if people have been holding on for the 368 00:15:58,520 --> 00:16:01,480 Speaker 4: last year or two, you know, you're losing so much 369 00:16:01,800 --> 00:16:03,880 Speaker 4: over the you know, a two year old at fifteen 370 00:16:03,880 --> 00:16:06,880 Speaker 4: percent inflation, you're losing thirty to forty percent on what 371 00:16:06,880 --> 00:16:07,680 Speaker 4: that is annuallyzed. 372 00:16:07,720 --> 00:16:11,040 Speaker 3: But it's a substantial loss. So if you do hold 373 00:16:11,080 --> 00:16:11,400 Speaker 3: for two. 374 00:16:11,360 --> 00:16:14,040 Speaker 4: Years before these deals come around, would it make sense 375 00:16:14,120 --> 00:16:15,640 Speaker 4: to put something in a more of a mid term 376 00:16:15,760 --> 00:16:18,880 Speaker 4: type of investment where or even something longer term that's 377 00:16:18,920 --> 00:16:20,600 Speaker 4: going to cash flow. So I've kind of been more 378 00:16:20,640 --> 00:16:23,120 Speaker 4: on that side personally, because I think with all this 379 00:16:23,280 --> 00:16:26,120 Speaker 4: cash on the sidelines, I don't know, I just I 380 00:16:26,160 --> 00:16:28,160 Speaker 4: like being a little more contrarian and saying, hey, you know, 381 00:16:28,480 --> 00:16:30,880 Speaker 4: when rates do come down, because I think they will 382 00:16:30,880 --> 00:16:32,320 Speaker 4: come down, and when they come down, I think there 383 00:16:32,360 --> 00:16:35,680 Speaker 4: will be a huge flood of money into these assets. 384 00:16:35,880 --> 00:16:37,720 Speaker 4: But the timing of that, that's the thing we don't know, 385 00:16:37,800 --> 00:16:39,040 Speaker 4: right Joe. We don't know if that's going to be 386 00:16:39,480 --> 00:16:41,040 Speaker 4: six months from now or three months or it's going 387 00:16:41,080 --> 00:16:42,640 Speaker 4: to be three years from now. So that's that's the 388 00:16:42,640 --> 00:16:45,119 Speaker 4: big unknown, right Yeah, Yeah. 389 00:16:44,880 --> 00:16:45,200 Speaker 1: For sure. 390 00:16:45,280 --> 00:16:48,280 Speaker 2: I mean I think I think even the biggest real 391 00:16:48,400 --> 00:16:51,400 Speaker 2: estate bears right now would all agree, Hey, if interest 392 00:16:51,480 --> 00:16:54,280 Speaker 2: rates drop, then it's go time, like we got to 393 00:16:54,280 --> 00:16:56,480 Speaker 2: get out money to play fast. And so to me, 394 00:16:57,880 --> 00:16:59,600 Speaker 2: the way that I'm looking at this, and you can 395 00:16:59,640 --> 00:17:02,840 Speaker 2: you can tell me if you disagree, is knowing that 396 00:17:03,160 --> 00:17:06,320 Speaker 2: if that catalyst is to happen, then there's a flood 397 00:17:06,359 --> 00:17:08,320 Speaker 2: of money waiting to come in and waiting to try 398 00:17:08,320 --> 00:17:10,960 Speaker 2: and snatch up any deal as possible we could get. 399 00:17:11,000 --> 00:17:12,920 Speaker 2: You know, see similar things that we saw in twenty 400 00:17:12,960 --> 00:17:15,320 Speaker 2: twenty and twenty twenty one one. Rates were low, everybody 401 00:17:15,560 --> 00:17:19,800 Speaker 2: was buying it was pushing prices higher. Right now, if 402 00:17:19,840 --> 00:17:23,160 Speaker 2: you can find a deal that makes sense, then likely 403 00:17:23,200 --> 00:17:26,399 Speaker 2: what you're doing is you're probably putting a lot more down. 404 00:17:26,480 --> 00:17:28,800 Speaker 2: You're probably not financing as much of it unless you 405 00:17:28,840 --> 00:17:33,520 Speaker 2: can find some creative financing. There are you know, subject 406 00:17:33,560 --> 00:17:35,960 Speaker 2: to deals going on right now where people assume the 407 00:17:36,000 --> 00:17:38,520 Speaker 2: older loans. So there are there are ways of ways 408 00:17:38,520 --> 00:17:40,879 Speaker 2: of doing it. But ultimately, if you can get the 409 00:17:40,960 --> 00:17:43,679 Speaker 2: numbers to make sense right now where you're still cash flowing, 410 00:17:44,160 --> 00:17:48,159 Speaker 2: then by the time that catalyst comes around, you're going 411 00:17:48,240 --> 00:17:51,399 Speaker 2: to be better off because you'll, you know, let's say 412 00:17:51,400 --> 00:17:53,680 Speaker 2: interest rates drop, you'll be able to pull equity out 413 00:17:53,920 --> 00:17:56,800 Speaker 2: and redeploy it. And so to me, it makes more 414 00:17:57,040 --> 00:17:59,439 Speaker 2: a little bit more sense to put them put your 415 00:17:59,440 --> 00:18:01,600 Speaker 2: money to work as long as the deal makes sense 416 00:18:01,680 --> 00:18:02,120 Speaker 2: right now. 417 00:18:03,040 --> 00:18:04,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, I think so. 418 00:18:04,720 --> 00:18:06,439 Speaker 4: I mean, that's that's what I've been to because you know, 419 00:18:06,440 --> 00:18:08,880 Speaker 4: the challenge is if you're waiting for certainty or everything. 420 00:18:08,880 --> 00:18:11,520 Speaker 4: I think, you know, I really think when you buy 421 00:18:11,560 --> 00:18:13,400 Speaker 4: a property, and this is really important, this is kind 422 00:18:13,400 --> 00:18:15,800 Speaker 4: of a general with real estate. When you buy a property, 423 00:18:16,000 --> 00:18:19,479 Speaker 4: your buying price is fixed, but your interest rate can 424 00:18:19,520 --> 00:18:22,520 Speaker 4: be adjusted later. So I don't know if we really, anybody, 425 00:18:22,560 --> 00:18:24,800 Speaker 4: really experts really believe that hey, rates are going to 426 00:18:24,800 --> 00:18:27,560 Speaker 4: be you know, ten percent in a year or two. 427 00:18:27,680 --> 00:18:29,480 Speaker 4: Nobody everybody kind of believes rates are going to be 428 00:18:29,480 --> 00:18:31,120 Speaker 4: back down to the fives, are going to come down. 429 00:18:31,359 --> 00:18:33,000 Speaker 4: So If that's the case, you don't want to be 430 00:18:33,080 --> 00:18:34,919 Speaker 4: last to the party. If you buy now, you can 431 00:18:34,960 --> 00:18:37,080 Speaker 4: still get a pretty good deal because rates are higher. 432 00:18:37,359 --> 00:18:40,359 Speaker 4: But I think if all this capital starts flooding in, 433 00:18:40,640 --> 00:18:42,320 Speaker 4: I think we'll look back on this time and say, man, 434 00:18:42,320 --> 00:18:43,800 Speaker 4: if we could have made that work or found a 435 00:18:43,800 --> 00:18:46,240 Speaker 4: deal that made sense, it could actually be a really 436 00:18:46,240 --> 00:18:50,040 Speaker 4: good situation for everybody. But you know, hindsight is, you know, 437 00:18:50,160 --> 00:18:51,800 Speaker 4: we don't We don't have it until we look back 438 00:18:51,840 --> 00:18:52,239 Speaker 4: and see it. 439 00:18:52,280 --> 00:18:53,840 Speaker 3: So I think it's something we can speculate on. 440 00:18:53,960 --> 00:18:55,760 Speaker 4: But I'm more of the opinion that you are where 441 00:18:55,760 --> 00:18:57,639 Speaker 4: it's like, I think a good deal can make a 442 00:18:57,640 --> 00:18:59,680 Speaker 4: lot of sense. And then, like I said, we've shifted 443 00:18:59,720 --> 00:19:02,280 Speaker 4: a little little bit from doing new real estate deals 444 00:19:02,280 --> 00:19:03,840 Speaker 4: because of the lending. It's hard to get a new 445 00:19:03,880 --> 00:19:06,919 Speaker 4: deal done just because to make the numbers work, you know, 446 00:19:06,920 --> 00:19:08,879 Speaker 4: it's it's twice as hard to raise the same amount 447 00:19:08,880 --> 00:19:10,879 Speaker 4: of capital because of investor sentiment is down and you 448 00:19:10,920 --> 00:19:11,720 Speaker 4: have to raise twice. 449 00:19:11,560 --> 00:19:12,360 Speaker 3: As much capital. 450 00:19:12,560 --> 00:19:14,600 Speaker 4: Literally, instead of twenty percent down, it's like thirty five, 451 00:19:14,720 --> 00:19:18,160 Speaker 4: forty fifty percent down. So we've shifted to do things 452 00:19:18,200 --> 00:19:20,880 Speaker 4: like that are all cash, such as our ATM. 453 00:19:20,520 --> 00:19:23,160 Speaker 3: Fund, or we have other you know, oil on gas. 454 00:19:23,040 --> 00:19:25,360 Speaker 4: Other types of deals that are just totally you know, 455 00:19:25,680 --> 00:19:28,400 Speaker 4: not correlated to real estate or interest rates. 456 00:19:29,400 --> 00:19:33,600 Speaker 2: The other thing about the about the affordability is that 457 00:19:34,359 --> 00:19:36,520 Speaker 2: a lot of people were saying, hey, like just wait 458 00:19:36,600 --> 00:19:39,040 Speaker 2: until rates go up, then prices are going to collapse, 459 00:19:39,040 --> 00:19:40,919 Speaker 2: and I'm going to buy the deal. And it's like, well, 460 00:19:41,240 --> 00:19:43,120 Speaker 2: rates went up, and they've been them for a while now, 461 00:19:43,160 --> 00:19:47,400 Speaker 2: and prices haven't collapsed. In fact, in many places, it's 462 00:19:47,440 --> 00:19:51,520 Speaker 2: still more expensive in terms of like you know, monthly 463 00:19:53,080 --> 00:19:56,320 Speaker 2: compared to compared to what it was before, because yeah, 464 00:19:56,400 --> 00:19:58,800 Speaker 2: price may have come down a little bit, but not 465 00:19:59,040 --> 00:20:03,480 Speaker 2: nearly enough to compensate for the rise in rates. 466 00:20:04,400 --> 00:20:05,200 Speaker 1: Right exactly. 467 00:20:05,320 --> 00:20:07,920 Speaker 4: Yeah, And that's you know, I think it's it's something 468 00:20:07,960 --> 00:20:10,080 Speaker 4: that's a little counterintuitive because you'd think, yeah, just rates 469 00:20:10,080 --> 00:20:11,399 Speaker 4: are rising and all of a sudden, oh, you know, 470 00:20:11,440 --> 00:20:13,760 Speaker 4: prices must be down. But you know, we're also and 471 00:20:13,800 --> 00:20:15,760 Speaker 4: you're looking at the macro here when you have such 472 00:20:15,760 --> 00:20:18,960 Speaker 4: a flood of you know, forty percent new currency over 473 00:20:19,000 --> 00:20:20,960 Speaker 4: a two year period, you know, from twenty twenty to 474 00:20:21,000 --> 00:20:23,439 Speaker 4: twenty twenty two, you got this huge flood of just 475 00:20:23,520 --> 00:20:25,640 Speaker 4: new currency and money in bank accounts. 476 00:20:26,960 --> 00:20:28,160 Speaker 3: You know, that changes everything. 477 00:20:28,200 --> 00:20:30,760 Speaker 4: And so I think even the trade, the deficit that 478 00:20:30,760 --> 00:20:33,600 Speaker 4: we're running on the budget, you know, two trillion dollars 479 00:20:33,720 --> 00:20:36,000 Speaker 4: estimated per year every year for the next ten years. 480 00:20:37,280 --> 00:20:39,199 Speaker 4: You know, everything's going to cost more. And I think that, 481 00:20:39,240 --> 00:20:40,440 Speaker 4: you know, we're seeing it. I mean, I went to 482 00:20:40,440 --> 00:20:42,240 Speaker 4: at Chipoli the other day and you know, a burrito 483 00:20:42,320 --> 00:20:44,040 Speaker 4: that year and a half ago cost me seven to 484 00:20:44,080 --> 00:20:46,520 Speaker 4: fifty is now eleven bucks. And it's the same thing. 485 00:20:46,560 --> 00:20:48,679 Speaker 4: I mean, that's a fifty percent increase in the price. 486 00:20:49,720 --> 00:20:51,159 Speaker 4: You know, that stuff is happening. So no matter what 487 00:20:51,160 --> 00:20:54,120 Speaker 4: the government says, it's like, you know, you've also it's 488 00:20:54,119 --> 00:20:56,520 Speaker 4: not like we're going to crash back to something. It 489 00:20:56,600 --> 00:20:58,719 Speaker 4: almost is kind of like the crack boom idea, right 490 00:20:58,760 --> 00:21:00,720 Speaker 4: where things kind of start to and all the sidever 491 00:21:00,720 --> 00:21:02,440 Speaker 4: you think, it's way more expensive, and we're seeing that 492 00:21:02,760 --> 00:21:04,640 Speaker 4: in all different you know, we're seeing a labor costs, 493 00:21:04,640 --> 00:21:07,400 Speaker 4: We're seeing it in construction costs and materials, We're seeing 494 00:21:07,400 --> 00:21:08,760 Speaker 4: it in insurance, We're seeing it in a lot of 495 00:21:08,800 --> 00:21:11,000 Speaker 4: different things. So I don't think it's that, you know, 496 00:21:11,080 --> 00:21:12,399 Speaker 4: we're not kind of we're like it's not going to 497 00:21:12,440 --> 00:21:14,040 Speaker 4: be this high low thing. It's going to be like 498 00:21:14,240 --> 00:21:16,560 Speaker 4: high stabilize. All of a sudden, all things are way higher. 499 00:21:16,640 --> 00:21:18,200 Speaker 4: And I just think it's going to be a protracted 500 00:21:18,240 --> 00:21:20,600 Speaker 4: period of extended inflation. And I think if you're in 501 00:21:20,640 --> 00:21:23,000 Speaker 4: assets that hedge that, such as real estate, I think 502 00:21:23,040 --> 00:21:23,880 Speaker 4: you're going to be just fine. 503 00:21:25,080 --> 00:21:27,240 Speaker 2: Now I want to talk to you about the supply 504 00:21:27,440 --> 00:21:32,480 Speaker 2: because there's two different major arguments out there about supply 505 00:21:32,840 --> 00:21:35,480 Speaker 2: and demand right now, and I don't I don't think 506 00:21:35,520 --> 00:21:38,679 Speaker 2: it's very helpful to just look at what is you know, 507 00:21:38,760 --> 00:21:41,720 Speaker 2: currently for sale. I've talked a lot about how you know, 508 00:21:42,000 --> 00:21:44,399 Speaker 2: nobody's moving because they can't afford to move, because it 509 00:21:44,440 --> 00:21:46,399 Speaker 2: can't afford to sell because if they sell and moose somewhere, 510 00:21:46,400 --> 00:21:48,720 Speaker 2: their payment's going to double. So everybody's locked and where 511 00:21:48,720 --> 00:21:51,359 Speaker 2: they're at. But a lot of people talk about overall supply, 512 00:21:51,480 --> 00:21:56,480 Speaker 2: meaning like total number of housing units versus the population, 513 00:21:57,040 --> 00:21:59,560 Speaker 2: and it is true like for the last like thirty years, 514 00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:03,760 Speaker 2: it's kind of moved sideways. We haven't really increased that ratio. 515 00:22:04,680 --> 00:22:06,520 Speaker 2: We're a little bit at a peak right now, like 516 00:22:06,520 --> 00:22:08,159 Speaker 2: we are at an all time high, but it's barely 517 00:22:08,200 --> 00:22:11,520 Speaker 2: over but we have people like we don't have like 518 00:22:11,560 --> 00:22:14,399 Speaker 2: we used to have a lot more people living in 519 00:22:14,440 --> 00:22:17,760 Speaker 2: the same household compared to now we've got we've got 520 00:22:17,760 --> 00:22:19,879 Speaker 2: a lot less people like that. That trend for like 521 00:22:19,960 --> 00:22:23,959 Speaker 2: sixty years has been moving that way. And so do 522 00:22:24,040 --> 00:22:26,240 Speaker 2: you see that as a risk? Like if things get 523 00:22:26,280 --> 00:22:30,120 Speaker 2: bad enough and you know, inflation keeps going and people 524 00:22:30,160 --> 00:22:32,959 Speaker 2: can't afford and rates keep on going up, and if 525 00:22:33,040 --> 00:22:36,600 Speaker 2: things get bad enough, do you see supply skyrocketing because 526 00:22:36,640 --> 00:22:39,480 Speaker 2: people just walk away and move in together and start 527 00:22:39,520 --> 00:22:41,280 Speaker 2: sleeping in each other's living rooms and stuff. 528 00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:44,280 Speaker 4: Yeah, So that it's a really good question the whole 529 00:22:44,280 --> 00:22:47,520 Speaker 4: subset of supply and demand. There have been several studies 530 00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:50,240 Speaker 4: that have come out in the last few years around 531 00:22:50,480 --> 00:22:53,320 Speaker 4: like how are we short of housing in the US? 532 00:22:53,359 --> 00:22:55,800 Speaker 4: Do we have more than enough housing? And every single 533 00:22:55,800 --> 00:22:59,119 Speaker 4: one that I've seen shows that we're around three to 534 00:22:59,280 --> 00:23:03,560 Speaker 4: eight million like housing units short for demand. So does 535 00:23:03,560 --> 00:23:05,200 Speaker 4: that what does that mean? I mean where are people living? 536 00:23:05,240 --> 00:23:05,760 Speaker 1: Are they? You know? 537 00:23:05,840 --> 00:23:08,720 Speaker 4: It's basically just saying that with demographics the way things 538 00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:11,159 Speaker 4: are shifting, And I think it is as much as 539 00:23:11,160 --> 00:23:13,600 Speaker 4: we're looking macro here, I think it is important to 540 00:23:13,600 --> 00:23:16,560 Speaker 4: look at trends, right, what trends are happening. I think 541 00:23:16,600 --> 00:23:20,560 Speaker 4: buying in Cleveland, Ohio, where the population is flat or declining, 542 00:23:21,720 --> 00:23:23,399 Speaker 4: you know that that's a little less releman because the 543 00:23:23,440 --> 00:23:26,399 Speaker 4: population is not growing. We bought buy a lot in Jacksonville, Florida, 544 00:23:26,440 --> 00:23:28,720 Speaker 4: where it's growing. Fifteen hundred new people are moving every 545 00:23:28,760 --> 00:23:30,919 Speaker 4: single month, and there's nowhere for them to live, right, 546 00:23:30,960 --> 00:23:33,000 Speaker 4: so that becomes a more acute issue. So I think, 547 00:23:33,080 --> 00:23:36,280 Speaker 4: you know, it kind of depends where you're at. Daniel 548 00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:39,320 Speaker 4: di Martino booth and she's pretty conservative on this. She 549 00:23:39,320 --> 00:23:41,680 Speaker 4: wrote a book called fed Up, where's a former fed advisor, 550 00:23:42,080 --> 00:23:44,959 Speaker 4: and she basically said that, you know, she doesn't believe that, 551 00:23:45,040 --> 00:23:46,560 Speaker 4: you know, three to eight million numbers. She thinks we're 552 00:23:46,560 --> 00:23:49,560 Speaker 4: about one million apartment units or housing units short. So 553 00:23:49,680 --> 00:23:52,920 Speaker 4: regardless all the experts are saying, we're actually short apartment 554 00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:55,399 Speaker 4: units or housing units. And why is this. It's because 555 00:23:55,440 --> 00:23:58,280 Speaker 4: we built a lot kind of up to you know, 556 00:23:58,359 --> 00:24:00,600 Speaker 4: right around two thousand and eight, two thousand and all 557 00:24:00,600 --> 00:24:02,280 Speaker 4: of a sudden, things just dropped off for a good 558 00:24:02,320 --> 00:24:04,920 Speaker 4: three or four years, and then we started to pick 559 00:24:04,960 --> 00:24:06,520 Speaker 4: back up, and it wasn't you know, there were several 560 00:24:06,560 --> 00:24:08,719 Speaker 4: years where no one was building. My friend Ken Macroy 561 00:24:08,720 --> 00:24:11,840 Speaker 4: said nobody was building. Between basically two thousand and nine 562 00:24:11,880 --> 00:24:14,480 Speaker 4: and twenty thirteen, nobody was building at all. So we're 563 00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:17,760 Speaker 4: basically behind. We're trying to catch up, and now it's 564 00:24:17,760 --> 00:24:19,640 Speaker 4: actually getting very difficult to build. A lot of people 565 00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:21,919 Speaker 4: that I know that have been building or having trouble 566 00:24:21,960 --> 00:24:25,960 Speaker 4: with building because of all, construction debt typically is variable debt. 567 00:24:25,960 --> 00:24:28,399 Speaker 4: There's no fixed construction debts. So if you're building, then you 568 00:24:28,440 --> 00:24:30,080 Speaker 4: have all this uncertainty. So a lot of these projects 569 00:24:30,160 --> 00:24:32,480 Speaker 4: that have started, if they haven't already started building, they'rehutting 570 00:24:32,520 --> 00:24:33,880 Speaker 4: them down and say we're just going to shut them down. 571 00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:35,800 Speaker 4: I know a friend that's a builder and they've shut 572 00:24:35,840 --> 00:24:38,280 Speaker 4: four or five projects down because they just can't do it. 573 00:24:38,280 --> 00:24:40,480 Speaker 4: So again, we have this kind of different trends. Right, 574 00:24:40,480 --> 00:24:43,000 Speaker 4: We've got a shortage of housing. We've got people migrating 575 00:24:43,040 --> 00:24:45,679 Speaker 4: to certain areas, but yet we've got we can't add 576 00:24:45,760 --> 00:24:48,680 Speaker 4: more apartments. It takes years, usually takes three years from 577 00:24:48,680 --> 00:24:51,359 Speaker 4: the time you actually locate and buy property, actually actually 578 00:24:51,359 --> 00:24:53,800 Speaker 4: get the entitlements, and you actually go out and build 579 00:24:53,800 --> 00:24:55,720 Speaker 4: and you actually open them up. So I think we're 580 00:24:55,720 --> 00:24:57,760 Speaker 4: going to be especially in particular markets, it's going to 581 00:24:57,760 --> 00:24:59,399 Speaker 4: continue to be very acute. And I think rents are going 582 00:24:59,440 --> 00:25:01,760 Speaker 4: to keep prising because no one can buy a house 583 00:25:01,840 --> 00:25:03,680 Speaker 4: right now either, right it's very difficult to go buy 584 00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:05,200 Speaker 4: a new house. So if you're you know, talking about 585 00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:08,119 Speaker 4: household deformation, somebody is young, they're getting married, they're going 586 00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:09,760 Speaker 4: and they want to go buy a house. They're professional, 587 00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:11,439 Speaker 4: it's very difficult right now. 588 00:25:11,440 --> 00:25:12,080 Speaker 3: So where do they go. 589 00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:14,239 Speaker 4: They go to apartments, they go to luxury apartments, they 590 00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:16,919 Speaker 4: go to apartments in a in a metro. That's a 591 00:25:16,960 --> 00:25:19,840 Speaker 4: place they want to be. So so so we're seeing that, 592 00:25:19,880 --> 00:25:22,159 Speaker 4: we're seeing trends like you know, two percent growth the 593 00:25:22,200 --> 00:25:25,919 Speaker 4: last year or so to Florida, certain you know states that. 594 00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:26,760 Speaker 3: We really like. 595 00:25:26,840 --> 00:25:29,000 Speaker 4: But anyway, so that I hope that answers your question, 596 00:25:29,160 --> 00:25:31,040 Speaker 4: just you know, as far as kind of where we're 597 00:25:31,080 --> 00:25:32,639 Speaker 4: headed and the shortage of housing. 598 00:25:33,280 --> 00:25:36,199 Speaker 2: Man, when you when you said that about the you know, 599 00:25:36,240 --> 00:25:40,040 Speaker 2: the construction having to stop because of because because the 600 00:25:40,080 --> 00:25:43,880 Speaker 2: debt is variable, it's like when it makes me think 601 00:25:43,920 --> 00:25:46,280 Speaker 2: of like a like a hydra or like a whack 602 00:25:46,320 --> 00:25:49,240 Speaker 2: a mole. How the Federal Reserve is like Jerome pal 603 00:25:49,320 --> 00:25:51,000 Speaker 2: he came out and he said like, hey, we need 604 00:25:51,040 --> 00:25:54,560 Speaker 2: a housing reset, and we're going to try and you know, 605 00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:56,760 Speaker 2: reading between the lines, he's saying, we need to push 606 00:25:56,840 --> 00:25:59,840 Speaker 2: price prices of housing down and so let's just jack 607 00:25:59,840 --> 00:26:01,480 Speaker 2: in test rates up and see if that works. 608 00:26:01,480 --> 00:26:03,680 Speaker 1: Well. It turns out that. 609 00:26:03,160 --> 00:26:05,800 Speaker 2: That hurts the building of new supply because the people 610 00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:08,040 Speaker 2: who are out there building new stuff need that need 611 00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:10,520 Speaker 2: the interest rates a little bit more affordable to be 612 00:26:10,560 --> 00:26:14,080 Speaker 2: able to continue their operations. And so that's you know, 613 00:26:14,440 --> 00:26:17,560 Speaker 2: you have every time they push one lever it, you know, 614 00:26:17,600 --> 00:26:20,200 Speaker 2: pops something else unexpected out the other side that they 615 00:26:20,240 --> 00:26:21,120 Speaker 2: then have to deal with. 616 00:26:21,760 --> 00:26:22,280 Speaker 3: Absolutely. 617 00:26:22,320 --> 00:26:24,360 Speaker 4: My friend Russell Grave in real estate guys, he talks 618 00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:26,040 Speaker 4: about it like almost like you have a balloon in 619 00:26:26,080 --> 00:26:28,280 Speaker 4: your hand and you're squeezing it and it just like 620 00:26:28,359 --> 00:26:30,320 Speaker 4: pops out when you push this down here, that pops 621 00:26:30,320 --> 00:26:32,800 Speaker 4: out between your fingers and everything. It's continually trying to 622 00:26:33,160 --> 00:26:35,000 Speaker 4: find a way, and I think that's what we're seeing 623 00:26:35,119 --> 00:26:37,800 Speaker 4: is that they've reached a point where, you know, Paul Vulker, 624 00:26:38,040 --> 00:26:40,199 Speaker 4: I think, you know, Powell really desires to be like 625 00:26:40,240 --> 00:26:42,240 Speaker 4: Paul Vulkar, to be able to, you know, inflict the 626 00:26:42,240 --> 00:26:45,640 Speaker 4: pain to save the economy whatever. Well Vulcar had said previously, 627 00:26:45,680 --> 00:26:47,640 Speaker 4: He's like, idn't I couldn't raised rates right now. Dead 628 00:26:47,720 --> 00:26:49,359 Speaker 4: is too high that you know, there's just there's too 629 00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:51,320 Speaker 4: many problems right now. And so I think they're going 630 00:26:51,359 --> 00:26:53,000 Speaker 4: to realize that the more they try to do this, 631 00:26:53,440 --> 00:26:54,760 Speaker 4: the more cracks are going to show up. 632 00:26:54,760 --> 00:26:55,679 Speaker 3: In the financial system. 633 00:26:56,080 --> 00:26:58,440 Speaker 4: It's in you know, real estate, it's in businesses, it's 634 00:26:58,480 --> 00:27:01,480 Speaker 4: kind of in every level that you can't and yet 635 00:27:01,640 --> 00:27:04,440 Speaker 4: what they're doing is they're kind of still like backstopping 636 00:27:04,840 --> 00:27:07,440 Speaker 4: you know, banks and saying, hey, depositors can't lose any money, 637 00:27:07,480 --> 00:27:08,880 Speaker 4: and you know, so it's like they want the pain, 638 00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:11,040 Speaker 4: but they don't want too much pain. And it's it's 639 00:27:11,080 --> 00:27:13,040 Speaker 4: just going to be really interesting where this goes, because 640 00:27:13,080 --> 00:27:15,920 Speaker 4: you cannot control everything until something just. 641 00:27:15,880 --> 00:27:19,680 Speaker 2: Explodes, yeah, or unless you have a central bank digital currency. 642 00:27:20,960 --> 00:27:22,320 Speaker 3: Yeah, and you think that's coming soon. 643 00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:25,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, we don't have to get into that. I don't 644 00:27:25,200 --> 00:27:27,600 Speaker 2: think we have time for that conversation today. But what 645 00:27:27,760 --> 00:27:30,479 Speaker 2: are your thoughts on I've seen some talk about the 646 00:27:30,520 --> 00:27:34,000 Speaker 2: forty year mortgage recently. Have you seen that and If so, 647 00:27:34,160 --> 00:27:35,080 Speaker 2: what are your thoughts on that? 648 00:27:36,520 --> 00:27:39,000 Speaker 4: I haven't I'm not familiar with that. You know, again, 649 00:27:39,040 --> 00:27:41,439 Speaker 4: most of our stuff is multi family. There is a 650 00:27:41,560 --> 00:27:44,600 Speaker 4: product that's out there that's a forty year It's like 651 00:27:44,680 --> 00:27:46,960 Speaker 4: called a hud loan. It's for apartment buildings. It's very 652 00:27:47,000 --> 00:27:49,240 Speaker 4: difficult to get, but it does exist. Is this a 653 00:27:49,280 --> 00:27:50,679 Speaker 4: residential forty year mortgage? 654 00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:53,680 Speaker 3: Is that what you're referring to? Yeah, yeah, I haven't. 655 00:27:53,680 --> 00:27:55,360 Speaker 3: I haven't heard of it. So is it actually available 656 00:27:55,400 --> 00:27:56,760 Speaker 3: to something they're just kind of talking about? 657 00:27:57,840 --> 00:27:58,679 Speaker 1: I don't know. 658 00:27:58,920 --> 00:28:00,879 Speaker 2: That's why I wanted to see I see if you 659 00:28:00,920 --> 00:28:02,520 Speaker 2: had any insight on that, because I know for a 660 00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:05,520 Speaker 2: while they were they were floating the idea, especially during 661 00:28:05,560 --> 00:28:08,560 Speaker 2: like twenty twenty and twenty twenty one, and I saw 662 00:28:08,840 --> 00:28:11,159 Speaker 2: I kept on seeing some headlines recently pop up about it. 663 00:28:11,160 --> 00:28:13,720 Speaker 2: But I didn't know if if there was anything concrete. 664 00:28:13,400 --> 00:28:14,359 Speaker 1: Yet that you knew about. 665 00:28:14,440 --> 00:28:15,320 Speaker 3: Yeah, haven't heard. 666 00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:18,600 Speaker 1: Okay, now I would. 667 00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:21,280 Speaker 2: The last question that I have for you is is 668 00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:25,560 Speaker 2: about your business? So you've been able to build this 669 00:28:26,160 --> 00:28:29,439 Speaker 2: very successful business, getting into you know, doing something that 670 00:28:29,480 --> 00:28:32,800 Speaker 2: most people would consider is very difficult to do. Finding 671 00:28:33,800 --> 00:28:36,239 Speaker 2: you know, wealthy people with money to deploy and then 672 00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:39,480 Speaker 2: being able to create something that they want to deploy 673 00:28:39,560 --> 00:28:43,520 Speaker 2: money into. And now that things are shifting, you've been 674 00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:46,880 Speaker 2: able to shift gears and now you're you're doing things 675 00:28:46,960 --> 00:28:49,520 Speaker 2: you know, completely unrelated to real estate, like you said, 676 00:28:49,520 --> 00:28:54,520 Speaker 2: with vending machines and oil. So tell me a little 677 00:28:54,520 --> 00:29:00,440 Speaker 2: bit about your your experience with building this business, what 678 00:29:00,480 --> 00:29:03,080 Speaker 2: you've done to scale, some of the big maybe some 679 00:29:03,160 --> 00:29:06,360 Speaker 2: big mistakes that you've made and had to learn from, 680 00:29:06,360 --> 00:29:07,960 Speaker 2: and how you're pivoting right now. 681 00:29:09,080 --> 00:29:12,200 Speaker 4: Yeah, so I think you know, it's really helped to 682 00:29:12,240 --> 00:29:15,760 Speaker 4: have some mentors. I mentioned my cousin, just getting around 683 00:29:15,800 --> 00:29:17,760 Speaker 4: people that are doing this. You know, if you're the 684 00:29:17,800 --> 00:29:21,840 Speaker 4: only one in the room that's entrepreneur entrepreneurial, it's weird. 685 00:29:21,880 --> 00:29:23,880 Speaker 4: I remember when I was doing this on the side 686 00:29:23,920 --> 00:29:26,040 Speaker 4: and I had my two inter k year job and 687 00:29:26,080 --> 00:29:27,880 Speaker 4: I was working twenty thirty hours a week doing that. 688 00:29:28,120 --> 00:29:29,560 Speaker 3: I don't have any entrepreneurs in. 689 00:29:29,520 --> 00:29:31,840 Speaker 4: My family, and so they were all like thinking I 690 00:29:31,920 --> 00:29:33,800 Speaker 4: was crazy that I would want to leave my job 691 00:29:33,920 --> 00:29:35,760 Speaker 4: as a golden handcuffs, like how could you leave this? 692 00:29:36,400 --> 00:29:38,640 Speaker 4: But I did get an entrepreneurs group and they were 693 00:29:38,840 --> 00:29:41,600 Speaker 4: basically there's five guys we'd meet together, you know, every 694 00:29:41,680 --> 00:29:44,160 Speaker 4: month for a couple of years, and they just kind 695 00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:46,320 Speaker 4: of I shared my situation. They're all like, yeah, prett much, 696 00:29:46,320 --> 00:29:48,000 Speaker 4: you should leave your job as soon as possible, and 697 00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:50,360 Speaker 4: you know it may not work, but you at least 698 00:29:50,360 --> 00:29:51,800 Speaker 4: you'll know and you'll try and you'll go for it. 699 00:29:51,800 --> 00:29:52,880 Speaker 3: So I'm really glad I did. 700 00:29:52,960 --> 00:29:54,960 Speaker 4: I think for anybody who's, you know, wanted to be 701 00:29:55,040 --> 00:29:57,600 Speaker 4: an entrepreneur, it is a lot of work. There's risk involved, 702 00:29:57,640 --> 00:29:59,760 Speaker 4: and I think you've got to, you know, calculate those risks. 703 00:30:00,440 --> 00:30:00,600 Speaker 1: You know. 704 00:30:00,640 --> 00:30:02,560 Speaker 4: Part of me wish is I'd done it sooner, But 705 00:30:03,240 --> 00:30:05,080 Speaker 4: also I think, you know, I've learned a lot along 706 00:30:05,120 --> 00:30:06,440 Speaker 4: the way, and it was kind of the time I 707 00:30:06,520 --> 00:30:09,800 Speaker 4: left my corporate job was a good time. But I 708 00:30:09,800 --> 00:30:12,440 Speaker 4: think in general, when it comes to creating value, I've 709 00:30:12,440 --> 00:30:14,680 Speaker 4: actually had over fifteen hundred and one on one phone 710 00:30:14,680 --> 00:30:17,600 Speaker 4: calls or zoom calls with High night Worth investors, and 711 00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:19,640 Speaker 4: so that's just been really really valuable to have that 712 00:30:19,680 --> 00:30:21,240 Speaker 4: opportunity to be able to talk and figure out what 713 00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:23,720 Speaker 4: people are interested in. And there's a huge difference from 714 00:30:23,800 --> 00:30:26,800 Speaker 4: you know, somebody who's never invested in real estate and 715 00:30:26,840 --> 00:30:31,320 Speaker 4: somebody who's done thirty syndications right, A very different conversation there. 716 00:30:31,400 --> 00:30:34,239 Speaker 4: But I think one thing I've learned is, you know, 717 00:30:34,280 --> 00:30:36,600 Speaker 4: for me, as I think, you know, is what I'm 718 00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:38,239 Speaker 4: working on now is just to try it instead of 719 00:30:38,280 --> 00:30:40,120 Speaker 4: just being a guy that does deals or we have 720 00:30:40,120 --> 00:30:41,960 Speaker 4: our business that you know, we do deals, but really 721 00:30:42,160 --> 00:30:45,200 Speaker 4: working on creating the business, hiring more people and trying 722 00:30:45,200 --> 00:30:48,240 Speaker 4: to grow that way instead of just trying to say 723 00:30:48,280 --> 00:30:49,440 Speaker 4: I'm going to try to do all that a lot 724 00:30:49,520 --> 00:30:51,680 Speaker 4: as myself. And so that's kind of where we're at, 725 00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:54,640 Speaker 4: is really trying to expand just by adding great people, 726 00:30:54,760 --> 00:30:57,120 Speaker 4: great team members, and just really you know, if we 727 00:30:57,160 --> 00:30:59,280 Speaker 4: can deliver on you know, what we want to do 728 00:30:59,280 --> 00:31:03,239 Speaker 4: for investors, It's amazing how people find more money. They oh, 729 00:31:03,240 --> 00:31:05,000 Speaker 4: I've got this, got this retirement account, or I've got 730 00:31:05,040 --> 00:31:06,760 Speaker 4: a friend, or I've got five friends, and so people 731 00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:07,560 Speaker 4: just start referring. 732 00:31:07,600 --> 00:31:09,560 Speaker 3: And so I think in any business, if you just 733 00:31:09,600 --> 00:31:10,360 Speaker 3: treat people. 734 00:31:10,160 --> 00:31:13,800 Speaker 4: Well and you just really try to serve people, I 735 00:31:13,800 --> 00:31:16,360 Speaker 4: mean that's how people do really well as they get. 736 00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:18,400 Speaker 3: You know, you help yourself solve other people's problems. 737 00:31:18,400 --> 00:31:20,120 Speaker 4: And we've done it by helping people with the money 738 00:31:20,120 --> 00:31:21,640 Speaker 4: problem now that they don't have money, but they have 739 00:31:21,720 --> 00:31:23,520 Speaker 4: money and they don't equite what to do with it. 740 00:31:23,560 --> 00:31:25,280 Speaker 4: So that's really what our focus is trying to help 741 00:31:25,320 --> 00:31:26,280 Speaker 4: develop passive wealth. 742 00:31:27,360 --> 00:31:32,320 Speaker 2: Fantastic. Well, I'm going to link your information in the 743 00:31:32,480 --> 00:31:36,080 Speaker 2: show notes, so for anybody who's not aware on the 744 00:31:36,200 --> 00:31:38,720 Speaker 2: platform that you are listening on the show notes, you 745 00:31:38,760 --> 00:31:41,960 Speaker 2: can expand that and click in to find out more 746 00:31:42,320 --> 00:31:45,840 Speaker 2: if you are interested. Thank you so much Bronson for 747 00:31:45,960 --> 00:31:51,160 Speaker 2: joining today. This was you know, lots of fantastic education 748 00:31:51,280 --> 00:31:54,600 Speaker 2: and insights right now, and I'm really excited to see 749 00:31:54,600 --> 00:31:55,360 Speaker 2: where this thing goes. 750 00:31:56,200 --> 00:31:58,040 Speaker 3: Awesome. Joe, Well, I really enjoyed being here. Thanks for 751 00:31:58,080 --> 00:31:58,360 Speaker 3: having me. 752 00:31:58,360 --> 00:31:59,720 Speaker 4: I'm excited to have you on one of our panels 753 00:31:59,720 --> 00:32:01,640 Speaker 4: coming up up to and uh talking to some smart 754 00:32:01,680 --> 00:32:04,040 Speaker 4: people about economics, so looking forward to sounds good. 755 00:32:04,040 --> 00:32:04,840 Speaker 1: Well, you have a good day.