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Speaker 1: The Book of Joe podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 1: Hey thereon, welcome back to the Book of Joe podcast.

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Speaker 1: It's me Tom Barducci and I'm with, of course, Joe

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Speaker 1: Madden and Joe. I'm not sure if you saw it,

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Speaker 1: but the other day the Nationals introduced Blake but Terra

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Speaker 1: as their new manager, and it got me thinking about

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Speaker 1: when you got the job with the Tampa Bay then

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Speaker 1: Devil Rays and you talked about, you know, you had

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Speaker 1: been an interim manager briefly with the Angels previously. But

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Speaker 1: this was holding your own baby, as you put it,

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Speaker 1: and Blake but Terra actually was holding his own baby.

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Speaker 1: The press conference had been held off while he was

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Speaker 1: opportunity to leave the birth of their first child, a daughter.

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Speaker 1: Congratulations to but Terra's But take me into that position, Joe,

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Speaker 1: when in your case, I mean, you waited a long time.

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Speaker 1: But Terra is just thirty three years old. When you

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Speaker 1: stand up there and you realize that you have a

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Speaker 1: major league team to manage.

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Speaker 2: Brother, I'm here to tell you I couldn't have done

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Speaker 2: it at thirty three. I have no idea. I'm just

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Speaker 2: being very honest with you. I was managing what I

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Speaker 2: just got done with Midland. I was about that age

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Speaker 2: maybe yeah, right around that age or so. I was

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Speaker 2: done managing in Double A. Then I became a roving instructor.

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Speaker 2: There were so many things I just didn't know. I

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Speaker 2: was just first of all, the major league vibe and

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Speaker 2: how it happens. I was not a player obviously in

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Speaker 2: the Major League, so that whole thing was it's all

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Speaker 2: the same, the distances on the fences, home plate, the

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Speaker 2: first home plate to the man, first base from the plate, etc.

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Speaker 2: But it was a completely different game, and I wow,

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Speaker 2: just a different world, brother, because I was absolutely intimidated

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Speaker 2: by it. I didn't feel confident enough in my own stuff.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I was like walking among gods and legends.

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Speaker 2: I mean the people that were involved in baseball at

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Speaker 2: that time, at least I thought that way. Now, could

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Speaker 2: I possibly think I was ready to compete against Gene

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Speaker 2: Mock or Weddy Herzog Larusse at that time, Jimmy Leland,

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Speaker 2: all these guys that were doing it. I just dude,

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Speaker 2: I couldn't do it. I wasn't ready. And I the

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Speaker 2: line I've always recognized for myself was, or it still is, is,

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Speaker 2: I don't want anything before it's my time to have

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Speaker 2: something another. I guess part of that is the earned

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Speaker 2: part of it, earning it. The other parts just intellectually emotionally,

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Speaker 2: what do I say? How do I say it? The

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Speaker 2: ability to stand up and represent your entire organization a

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Speaker 2: couple times a day through press conferences, whether it's spring training,

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Speaker 2: regular season, what's that two hundred times? And then everything

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Speaker 2: else that floats with that. Just walking into a major

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Speaker 2: league locker room and being in charge of that and

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Speaker 2: the players. There's so much going on. So I wasn't

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Speaker 2: ready for it, just being honest, I thought I was

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Speaker 2: ready when I was fifty one, and it took me

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Speaker 2: that long to really feel comfortable knowing what I know,

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Speaker 2: knowing what I knew at that time, and then they

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Speaker 2: can continue to grow. But God bless him, man, there's

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Speaker 2: no way I would have been considered anyway. But I'm

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Speaker 2: just saying there was no way I was ready to

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Speaker 2: do something like that at that point.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, let's talk about u Terra's path and whether he's

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Speaker 1: ready or not. Time will tell. He was a thirty

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Speaker 1: fifth round draft pick by the Rays at a Boston college,

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Speaker 1: just played a couple of years in the Raised system,

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Speaker 1: and I'm sure they recognized that this guy had a

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Speaker 1: future in the game, not so much as a player,

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Speaker 1: but that he could add something either as a coach,

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Speaker 1: front office, you name it. You know this, Joe. You

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Speaker 1: see some guys, right and they just have this spark

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Speaker 1: about them. For me, I'm very partial because it fits me.

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Speaker 1: He's the son of a coach, coached by his dad

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Speaker 1: growing up. I'm always leaning towards those kind of players

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Speaker 1: who grow up learning about the game from the inside

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Speaker 1: out rather than the outside in. So he was ten

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Speaker 1: years in that raise system, a little bit of did

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Speaker 1: a little bit of everything. He was a manager, starting

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Speaker 1: at the age of twenty five. How about that he

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Speaker 1: was the youngest manager and I think you were too

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Speaker 1: when you first started, Joe. He was the youngest manager

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Speaker 1: in the minor leagues. He started out in short season

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Speaker 1: Hudson Valley in a ball. He went on to manage

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Speaker 1: more than you know, four or five years. Twenty one

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Speaker 1: and twenty two. He was manager of the Year in

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Speaker 1: Single A. So he does have managing experience. But you know, Joe,

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Speaker 1: it's different being in a major league dugout. When he

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Speaker 1: manages the Nationals, it'll be his first time in a

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Speaker 1: major league dugout, and as he puts the staff together,

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Speaker 1: I would lean towards having people around me at least

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Speaker 1: a couple of guys who have been major league players

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Speaker 1: and or major league coaches. I don't know how you

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Speaker 1: feel about that, Joe, but I just think there is

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Speaker 1: I don't know, it's a different You're behind the red

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Speaker 1: ropes at that point, and I just know from talking

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Speaker 1: to players that there is a certain credibility they attached

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Speaker 1: to guys. I'm not saying that everybody your staff has

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Speaker 1: to be an all star Major leaguer, but I would

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Speaker 1: learn to having just that side representative even a little

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Speaker 1: bit of my.

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Speaker 2: No doubt, no doubt. It's almost like communication skills are

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Speaker 2: more important to an expedient rise in today's game as

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Speaker 2: opposed to just pure knowledge of the game, because part

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Speaker 2: of that is I think the necessity to be exposed

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Speaker 2: to the media as often as you are. I think

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Speaker 2: that's you said Boston College that made me think about

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Speaker 2: it immediately, and listen, I came from a good background too,

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Speaker 2: at Lafayette whatever, but I wasn't. I just didn't have

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Speaker 2: the confidence to stand up. Maybe I would have if

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Speaker 2: I was just thrust into but I did. I don't

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Speaker 2: think I had the confidence to express myself in a

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Speaker 2: way obviously that I can now, but back then, and

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Speaker 2: I see that as being very vital, and I think

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Speaker 2: maybe that's part of the game. The ascension of these

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Speaker 2: guys is that they are perceived to be able to

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Speaker 2: do those kind of things, and the absolute knowledge of

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Speaker 2: the game itself is not nearly as important. And again

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Speaker 2: that's all based on the autonomy to dugout is now

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Speaker 2: longer the autonomy to dugout. It's more you know, your

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Speaker 2: working with the front office. And again I've always been

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Speaker 2: about that. I've always advocated for that. However, when he

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Speaker 2: gets to the point where it gets too heavy handed,

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Speaker 2: I didn't like that. But I think, like I said,

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Speaker 2: the ascension of these young guys based on their communication skills.

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Speaker 2: I guess it has to be a product of the

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Speaker 2: times where even you watch like young politicals and just

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Speaker 2: other people in different businesses that are very young, how

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Speaker 2: they speak so dramatically, like in a way that they

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Speaker 2: really know what they're talking about. Now, I'm not denigrating

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Speaker 2: their intelligence level, but you just combine that with experience, intuition.

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Speaker 2: Things we always talk about it has to be lacking

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Speaker 2: because you're just too most of the time, I say

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Speaker 2: ninety percent of the time from where you're too young

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Speaker 2: to know enough to really be pushed into that position.

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Speaker 2: Social media, the way people are put out front younger,

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Speaker 2: I think also lends to their confidence in what they're

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Speaker 2: saying and how they're saying it. And then they get

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Speaker 2: supported because after all, the way this is all working

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Speaker 2: right now, it keeps getting younger younger, younger regards to

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Speaker 2: we're choosing as our leaders, and I think a lot

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Speaker 2: of that has to do with that. I mean, just

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Speaker 2: the demographically younger people social media wise, they're pushing for this,

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Speaker 2: you know, the socialist kind of method that's being incorporated

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Speaker 2: into our world right now in our country. I think

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Speaker 2: a lot of it has to do with a youth

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Speaker 2: movement as opposed to the group that has been there

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Speaker 2: for a while. So I think it's all blending together,

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Speaker 2: even into baseball, where these kind of skills are being recognized.

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Speaker 2: Communication skills are being recognized more highly as opposed to

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Speaker 2: practical ability to note the whatever you're being put in

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Speaker 2: charge of, you don't know really as much there as

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Speaker 2: you're able to talk to somebody and communicate in a

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Speaker 2: way that ameliorates the concerns of an organization. Best way

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Speaker 2: I can.

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Speaker 1: Say it, I think, no, I think you're one hundred

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Speaker 1: percent right, Joe. It's a lot going on there to unpack.

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Speaker 1: But I do think the ability not just to you know,

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Speaker 1: hold an interesting press conference twice a day, but it's

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Speaker 1: more about connecting with the players. And the players don't

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Speaker 1: get older, right, I mean, the players are going to

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Speaker 1: be in their twenties and early thirties for the most

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Speaker 1: part all the time. So the ability to connect to

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Speaker 1: the players, I think is what's important here. And it's interesting.

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Speaker 1: You know, Paul Taboni is now the president of Baseball

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Speaker 1: Operations of the Nationals. He's a younger guy. It was

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Speaker 1: actually Mike Piazza, who before but Terra was a candidate

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Speaker 1: for the job, called up to Boni and said, you

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Speaker 1: got to take a look at this guy. Piazza had

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Speaker 1: worked with him on Team Italy in the WBC. I

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Speaker 1: thought that was interesting, and listening to the press conference

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Speaker 1: for Butterra, I don't want to say it was execut

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Speaker 1: you speak, it was kind of typical of you know,

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Speaker 1: some of the platitudes that are out there that are

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Speaker 1: not necessarily about how he's going to run a game

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Speaker 1: or the nuts and bolts of being a manager and

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Speaker 1: what your style is as a manager. As much it

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Speaker 1: was about connecting with people. And in fact, the first

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Speaker 1: thing he did when he got there is he taped

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Speaker 1: a social media segment for the Nationals X channel to say, Hey,

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Speaker 1: tune into my pre conference on X and YouTube coming

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Speaker 1: up this afternoon. I mean, can you see Gene Mack

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Speaker 1: doing that. I mean that's part of the job too.

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Speaker 1: So when I say that he didn't have a you know,

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Speaker 1: it's basically boiler plate stuff. He basically said, the best

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Speaker 1: advice I've gotten is to just be yourself. At the

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Speaker 1: end of the day, when you talk with players and

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Speaker 1: you work with players, the last thing they look at

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Speaker 1: is how old or young somebody is. I think what's

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Speaker 1: most important to them is do you care about them

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Speaker 1: as a person first, and are you going to do

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Speaker 1: everything you can to help them become the best version

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Speaker 1: of themselves both on and off the field. I think

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Speaker 1: people can accomplish that in different ages and different experiences.

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Speaker 1: That's the nut of this, Joe. What I'm talking about

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Speaker 1: here is that everybody's looking for a manager who can

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Speaker 1: quote unquote connect with players, and when you do that,

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Speaker 1: you're probably going to skew younger. And I've said this before.

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Speaker 1: I think Stephen Vote became the template for managing. Now.

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Speaker 1: You know, he was one year out of the game,

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Speaker 1: he didn't coach one year with the Seattle Mariners, and

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Speaker 1: now he's been manager of the Year his first two

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Speaker 1: years with the Cleveland Guardians. But Terra is younger. But

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Speaker 1: this ability, or at least the from a front office perspective,

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Speaker 1: the looking for somebody who can quote unquote connect with

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Speaker 1: the players, I think that's driving these decisions more than anything.

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Speaker 2: No question, one hundred percent right. And I have to

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Speaker 2: understand Voter is an outlier. I mean I was, I

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Speaker 2: was around the film, and I haven't been around all

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Speaker 2: these other dudes. I get it. But I know I

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Speaker 2: know Voter. I know Voter. I knew from the from

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Speaker 2: Jump Street when I had him with the Rays, and

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Speaker 2: like I said, he used to come to big league.

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Speaker 2: We had, we had the same camp and poor Charlotte

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Speaker 2: minor leaguers and major leaguers together we'd grab anytime we

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Speaker 2: needed somebody. Let's get Voter over here. Get Voter over

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Speaker 2: here because we just loved them being there. I mean,

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Speaker 2: he could hit, you know, we had some absolute baseball skills,

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Speaker 2: but we love this personality there. That's really almost every

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Speaker 2: time we need whatever, we need a guy he doesn't play,

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Speaker 2: that's okay, just bring voter, we'll get him in that bat.

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Speaker 2: So Steven, he's he's an outlier with all this. So

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Speaker 2: when you start trying to camp everybody to this, dude,

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Speaker 2: I'm saying it's not easy to do. Now. You talked

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Speaker 2: about the talking points, the boiler plate stuff, and I

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Speaker 2: just I just read a whole bunch of that today.

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Speaker 2: I was researching, just just through my normal, normal morning stuff,

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Speaker 2: and I was reading the commentary about, you know, front

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Speaker 2: office personnel baseball being confronted or questioned about the gambling

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Speaker 2: situation and the prop bets that have become so obviously

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Speaker 2: wrong right now, and then the methods regarding how to

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Speaker 2: mitigate this, and you know, even like talking about let's

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Speaker 2: put two hundred dollars max, and even that's not enough.

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Speaker 2: I mean, they shouldn't be any app actually, So my

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Speaker 2: point overall is that there's talking points and none of

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Speaker 2: these gems that come out on a limb. I mean,

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Speaker 2: I think Jed did a little bit. Jed Hoyer are

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Speaker 2: kind of like insinuated or kind of suggested strongly that

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Speaker 2: it's they're really not good. And we talked about exactly

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Speaker 2: the same thing in regards to your phones. Right here,

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Speaker 2: I can make a bet right here. It used to

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Speaker 2: be a little bit more difficult to do the expeditious

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Speaker 2: matter whatever. But the point is the talking points. Everybody

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Speaker 2: revolves around talking points, and that's that's the part that

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Speaker 2: I think is missing. You hear Mirph talk pat with

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Speaker 2: the Brewers. I mean, he's gonna when he talks as

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Speaker 2: these conferences pre and posters, there's some genuine history involved

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Speaker 2: in these conversations. It's not just another piece of paper

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Speaker 2: memorized before we do this. Let's stay on path right here,

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Speaker 2: let's avoid this. Anytime you get a chance to incorporate

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Speaker 2: this phrase, please do listen. I was I was asked

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Speaker 2: to do those kinds of things, and I would, but

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Speaker 2: I would not. I would just like interject to get

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Speaker 2: back to whatever my stream of conscious has not wanting

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Speaker 2: me to go to. And I think that's what you're

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Speaker 2: going to be missing. You miss streams of consciousness where

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Speaker 2: people are just really relating actual experiences and camp them

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Speaker 2: to what act would occur today. And that's to me,

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Speaker 2: that's what's missing. And I think, gosh, I mean, I

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Speaker 2: know when I watch somebody or listen to somebody speak

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Speaker 2: or watch and listen, I love I love to hear

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Speaker 2: that personal related story that somehow fits into whatever we're

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Speaker 2: talking about right here, more than just hearing Ugh like

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Speaker 2: you see Ann Fox, whatever you watch, I don't care.

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Speaker 2: There's everybody He's saying the same thing all the time.

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Speaker 2: When so when you get like a even watching The Five,

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Speaker 2: you got a bunch of guys and ladies, they give

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Speaker 2: you a different commentary based on their personal experiences. That

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Speaker 2: to me is interesting. So when you're talking about same

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Speaker 2: same talking point kind of stuff, please stop that. Get

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Speaker 2: somebody out there that really has the experience and could

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Speaker 2: say tell me what you tell me what you not know,

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Speaker 2: not what you've heard. Regurgitators. This is all about regurgitation,

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Speaker 2: and I've turned off by it.

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Speaker 1: But Terra is the youngest manager by the way, Joe,

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Speaker 1: since I'm not sure if you remember this name, Frank Quillisey, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I do. Minnesota Twins a long time ago.

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Speaker 2: Man.

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Speaker 1: This is going back to nineteen seventy two. He had

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Speaker 1: an incredible career in that kind of John Schneider. He

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Speaker 1: was with one organization the whole time, you know, minor

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Speaker 1: league manager player became a coach. He was one of

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Speaker 1: Billy Martin's guys with twins. Martin Martin to take him

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Speaker 1: to the to the Tigers with him, and Calvin Griffith

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Speaker 1: wouldn't let him go, so they actually had Frank Quillisey

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Speaker 1: be He was a coach without a title. After he

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Speaker 1: was done playing. They just wanted him around and he

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Speaker 1: really didn't have job responsibilities. And halfway through that season,

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Speaker 1: Calvin Griffith made a change of managers. He fired Bill Rigney.

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Speaker 2: Good guy, great guy.

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Speaker 1: Just imagine this happening, great guy, Just imagine it's happening today. Joe.

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Speaker 1: Calvin Griffith, who was quite the character, outspoken owner. Now

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Speaker 1: there's a guy who would speak his mind. You're not

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Speaker 1: getting boiler played stuff with him. He fired Rigney. He

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Speaker 1: said because he said too many of the players were nonchalant,

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Speaker 1: they weren't trying hard enough. Can you imagine an owner

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Speaker 1: coming out and saying, I'm getting rid of the manager

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Speaker 1: because my players aren't trying hard enough. Well, Calvin Griffith

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Speaker 1: did that, and he installed a thirty three year old

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Speaker 1: to replace a veteran like Bill Radney to become the manager. Now,

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Speaker 1: the results weren't great. They were a couple of games

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Speaker 1: under five hundred the rest of the season. He lasted

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Speaker 1: another three full seasons, was right around five hundred for

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Speaker 1: his career, so I wouldn't say it was a success.

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Speaker 1: But but Terra is the youngest major league manager since

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Speaker 1: the Twins installed Frank Quillisey. By the way, back then,

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Speaker 1: Calvin Griffith was so cheap. Frank Quillisey only had three

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Speaker 1: coaches on his staff. He would have to throw batting

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Speaker 1: practice himself. The pitching coach was getting paid fifteen thousand

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Speaker 1: dollars a year, had five kids and quills. He went

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Speaker 1: to Calvin Griffith and said, you gotta pay him more.

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Speaker 1: This guy can't even support his family with what you're

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Speaker 1: paying him. And he wouldn't pay him anymore, so the

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Speaker 1: pitching coach had to leave. That was back in the day.

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Speaker 1: I know things are different here, but Frank Quillisey the

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Speaker 1: youngest until he get Blake Butterra at thirty three.

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Speaker 2: You know, That was the big thing back then, is

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Speaker 2: that they really thought coaches were totally replaceable. Nobody was irreplaceable.

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Speaker 2: For years, we worked under one year contracts. I mean,

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Speaker 2: if you don't like it, you could walk. We don't care.

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Speaker 2: You were kind of an indentured service to the organization.

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Speaker 2: And that was it. I mean, there was no other equivocating.

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Speaker 2: There was nothing to argue about here. Nothing. I remember

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Speaker 2: we win the World Series with the Angels in two

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Speaker 2: thousand and two, and I thought I was a pretty

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Speaker 2: hot shot bench coach, and I went in to talk

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Speaker 2: to Bill Stoneman about a raise and and have an agent,

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Speaker 2: and Stoney offered it five or ten thousand dollars AGI

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Speaker 2: And I was comping myself to Don Zimmer at that time,

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Speaker 2: and Stoney just, of course, I got what he gave me.

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Speaker 2: That's it. It was a two year deal, but I

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Speaker 2: got what he gave me. There was really no negotiation

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Speaker 2: going on there. But that's the way it was. Man.

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Speaker 2: You never you weren't going to get rich. You're just

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Speaker 2: trying to break even. Trust me, as a major league coach,

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Speaker 2: you broke even. You you kind of broke evnings is

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Speaker 2: if you did not live in the city that you

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Speaker 2: worked in, you got wherever you live, you got there

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Speaker 2: where you're working at. You're getting paid one thing you

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Speaker 2: got clubhouse does now you got all these other little expenditures,

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Speaker 2: You got to dress a little bit better, all the

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Speaker 2: tipping involved. It's just it became a little bit more difficult.

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Speaker 2: So this has been going on forever, and I'm here

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Speaker 2: to say, listen, I'm not complaining about it. I'm kind

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Speaker 2: of glad I did. The fact that you had to

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Speaker 2: not have it perfectly set up from the beginning, it

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Speaker 2: really causes or makes you be more creative. How do

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Speaker 2: I figure this out? You don't cry, and don't complain,

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Speaker 2: you don't go run into somebody, Just somehow figure this

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Speaker 2: thing out. And we're getting to the point now where

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Speaker 2: nobody wants to try to figure it out anymore if

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Speaker 2: they want everything done for them, and they're just watching

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Speaker 2: all this AI stuff pop up right now. It's exactly

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Speaker 2: what we thought. And they've been hiding behind. Oh, it's

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Speaker 2: just going to augment everything and those that have making

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Speaker 2: all the money off of it, whereas it's making them

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Speaker 2: a lot of money. But eventually it's going to take

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Speaker 2: over humanity. So all this stuff is in play and

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Speaker 2: I'm getting off track a little bit. But when it

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Speaker 2: came down to getting paid, man, we did not get paid.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, hasn't changed all that much, and I think coaches

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Speaker 1: are far too replaceable in the minds of the front offices.

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Speaker 1: By the way, Joe, we're gonna take a quick break

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Speaker 1: here of the Book of Joe. You're an old catcher.

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Speaker 1: I need to get your thought on how the American

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Speaker 1: League Most Valuable Player Award vote turned out. Do that.

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Speaker 1: Right after this, welcome back to the Book of Joe,

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Speaker 1: Aaron Judge won the MVP Award again. It's amazing, Joe

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Speaker 1: that Joe a Otani and Aaron Judge combined have won

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Speaker 1: seven of the last ten MVP awards in Major League Baseball.

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Speaker 1: I personally cannot remember a time where the two best

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Speaker 1: players in the game were this far in front of

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Speaker 1: the field for the past five years. It's just amazing

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Speaker 1: the way they are the biggest names, the best players

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Speaker 1: in this game and have been. But I want to

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Speaker 1: get your take on this because after watching cal Ralely

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Speaker 1: play every day in the postseason, man, I was blown

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Speaker 1: away by everything that he did. The way he runs

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Speaker 1: a game is tremendous. There's no stat to show that

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Speaker 1: the way he goes out to the mount and the

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Speaker 1: pitching coach will not go out to the mount because

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Speaker 1: he knows. And I talk to Pete Woodworth about this,

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Speaker 1: he said, Cal has never made a bad decision. Maybe

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Speaker 1: they don't work out, but I trust him implicitly. I

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Speaker 1: see that I see him taking all these foul balls.

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Speaker 1: I grew to appreciate what he did even more because

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Speaker 1: you know that dude caught more innings than anybody else

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Speaker 1: behind the plate, hit switch hitter, hitting sixty home runs,

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Speaker 1: and he still didn't win the MVP Award, which tells

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Speaker 1: you how great, and I mean great, all time great

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Speaker 1: Aaron Judge has been. But Judge got seventeen first place

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Speaker 1: votes and cal Ralely got thirteen, which is closer than

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Speaker 1: you think because when you think about it, if two

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Speaker 1: of those votes are reversed, we got ourselves a tie.

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Speaker 1: So let me get your take first, Joe on how

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Speaker 1: it turned out here? Did the writers get it right

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Speaker 1: with Aaron Judge as the al MVP.

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Speaker 2: I still believe Raley was and I mean just to really,

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Speaker 2: because I love to do simple better. Put Raleigh in

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Speaker 2: the Yankee uniform and put Judge in the saddle uniform,

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Speaker 2: and I totally believe it would have been Raley. I

398
00:20:16,638 --> 00:20:20,438
Speaker 2: swear that's just that's just the truth. Yeah, you just

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Speaker 2: described all the other things that Raley did during the

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Speaker 2: course of the season, plus epically best best offensive season

401
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Speaker 2: the catchers had. Uh, that's he's not gonna do that again.

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Speaker 2: It's way too hard to duplicate that with all you

403
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Speaker 2: just describe that the bumps to listen, every night you come,

404
00:20:37,638 --> 00:20:40,638
Speaker 2: it's like it's like playing a Friday night football game

405
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Speaker 2: and Saturday morning, how do you feel every where? Did

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Speaker 2: that come from all of a sudden? Your forearm is sore,

407
00:20:45,518 --> 00:20:47,798
Speaker 2: The back of your hand is sore, your your your

408
00:20:47,878 --> 00:20:50,798
Speaker 2: quad is sore. When you catch something's going to be

409
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Speaker 2: sore the next day. Something's just not going to be right.

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Speaker 2: And then all the responsibility, especially based on the way

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Speaker 2: games are formulated today, with the information prior to and

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Speaker 2: all the stuff that he's required to know going into

413
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Speaker 2: that game, that takes time. Now, listen, I'm not denigrating Judge.

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Speaker 2: Judge is wonderful, magnificent, I get it, but his pregame

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Speaker 2: is a lot different than the pregame of a rally

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Speaker 2: who not only has to absorb all this information but

417
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Speaker 2: also has taken care of his body. Then he's got

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Speaker 2: to get go through the process of getting ready for

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Speaker 2: the game. He does it every night. So I think

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Speaker 2: if you really sat down and broke it down, I

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Speaker 2: think I still believe Raleigh in this year, this past season,

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Speaker 2: to me, would be considered the MVP judges right there.

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Speaker 2: He's the second place, wonderful second place candidate. But again,

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Speaker 2: I just say, if you put different names on the

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Speaker 2: front of those uniforms, Rawley wins.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm going to disagree with you as much as

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Speaker 1: I agree with everything you said about what Cal brings

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Speaker 1: to a game, and I've seen it even behind the

429
00:21:53,798 --> 00:21:56,038
Speaker 1: scenes the way you know, as you said, especially in

430
00:21:56,078 --> 00:21:58,278
Speaker 1: today's game. You know, you have to have plans for

431
00:21:58,318 --> 00:22:01,438
Speaker 1: all thirteen pitchers on the staff, and it's a lot

432
00:22:01,678 --> 00:22:05,358
Speaker 1: just mentally, and each talked well about the physical grind

433
00:22:05,398 --> 00:22:09,758
Speaker 1: as well. If the numbers are even a little bit closer,

434
00:22:09,838 --> 00:22:12,278
Speaker 1: I would go Raleigh, But Joe, they're not that close.

435
00:22:12,718 --> 00:22:15,078
Speaker 1: I mean, Riley hit two forty seven. I know batting

436
00:22:15,118 --> 00:22:19,478
Speaker 1: average is not everything, but the gaps in ops ops

437
00:22:19,478 --> 00:22:23,198
Speaker 1: plus are tremendous. I mean, it's a chasm between the

438
00:22:23,238 --> 00:22:27,558
Speaker 1: two players. So to me, I think they got it right.

439
00:22:27,598 --> 00:22:30,998
Speaker 1: And I hate saying that because listen, last year, Bobby

440
00:22:30,998 --> 00:22:33,038
Speaker 1: wit Junior had one of the greatest years ever by

441
00:22:33,078 --> 00:22:36,318
Speaker 1: a shortstop and was not rewarded for it, you know,

442
00:22:36,318 --> 00:22:38,958
Speaker 1: a finished second to Judge for the MVP vote. It's

443
00:22:38,958 --> 00:22:40,958
Speaker 1: the same that this year with Cal Rawley, he probably

444
00:22:40,998 --> 00:22:43,798
Speaker 1: had and maybe take out probably the best year at

445
00:22:43,878 --> 00:22:46,118
Speaker 1: least offensively for a catcher in the history of the game,

446
00:22:46,198 --> 00:22:49,118
Speaker 1: and he's not the MVP. Again. I just think we're

447
00:22:49,118 --> 00:22:51,478
Speaker 1: getting back to what Aaron Judge is doing. The numbers

448
00:22:51,478 --> 00:22:54,038
Speaker 1: that he that he's putting up from age thirty to

449
00:22:54,078 --> 00:22:56,998
Speaker 1: thirty three. His comp is Babe Ruth. I mean, that's

450
00:22:57,038 --> 00:23:00,598
Speaker 1: what he's doing here. I mean, he's just on another planet.

451
00:23:00,638 --> 00:23:03,198
Speaker 1: This is a dude to it. He's six foot seven,

452
00:23:04,238 --> 00:23:09,198
Speaker 1: thirty one. He's twenty points past anybody else in Major

453
00:23:09,278 --> 00:23:12,198
Speaker 1: League Baseball. He won a batting title with fifty three

454
00:23:12,278 --> 00:23:15,878
Speaker 1: home runs. That's just not supposed to happen. That's how

455
00:23:15,918 --> 00:23:18,278
Speaker 1: much of a great hitter he is. And yeah he

456
00:23:18,358 --> 00:23:20,758
Speaker 1: was hurt late in the year. Probably DHD more than

457
00:23:21,278 --> 00:23:24,958
Speaker 1: certainly than he wanted, so the defensive component swings even

458
00:23:24,998 --> 00:23:28,838
Speaker 1: more to cal Raley's side. But I think the voters

459
00:23:28,918 --> 00:23:30,438
Speaker 1: kind of proved me right on this, Joe. When you

460
00:23:30,478 --> 00:23:33,078
Speaker 1: actually sit down, you start looking at the numbers, and

461
00:23:33,118 --> 00:23:37,078
Speaker 1: I know it's not a math exercise entirely, but my goodness,

462
00:23:37,158 --> 00:23:40,158
Speaker 1: the gap between what Judge did offensively and what cal

463
00:23:40,198 --> 00:23:43,238
Speaker 1: ralely did, even with sixty home runs, it's enormous, and

464
00:23:43,398 --> 00:23:44,918
Speaker 1: it's just hard to make up that gap.

465
00:23:45,438 --> 00:23:48,558
Speaker 2: How would we calculate the work that he did behind

466
00:23:48,598 --> 00:23:51,358
Speaker 2: a plate? What kind of catching ops did he have?

467
00:23:51,638 --> 00:23:54,318
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, listen, I don't think we can quantify that.

468
00:23:54,358 --> 00:23:58,518
Speaker 1: We try to with war. It's a bad approximation, it

469
00:23:58,558 --> 00:24:00,758
Speaker 1: really is, especially when it comes to the defensive side.

470
00:24:00,798 --> 00:24:04,678
Speaker 1: So you're right, I mean that is can't bring math

471
00:24:04,758 --> 00:24:06,038
Speaker 1: to that correct.

472
00:24:05,718 --> 00:24:09,598
Speaker 2: And that's where we're so at some point I would

473
00:24:09,638 --> 00:24:11,798
Speaker 2: be fine with just, you know, some people popping up

474
00:24:11,798 --> 00:24:13,758
Speaker 2: and just taking the math and putting it over here

475
00:24:13,758 --> 00:24:16,478
Speaker 2: on the side, and just taking their eyeballs and putting

476
00:24:16,518 --> 00:24:20,798
Speaker 2: them on this side and voting. My vote could be

477
00:24:20,838 --> 00:24:25,118
Speaker 2: swayed based on the complete picture of what or Rawley

478
00:24:25,118 --> 00:24:27,518
Speaker 2: did versus the complete picture of what Judge did. Because

479
00:24:27,678 --> 00:24:29,958
Speaker 2: again we talked about this. I don't even know how

480
00:24:30,038 --> 00:24:33,358
Speaker 2: much judges numbers are impacted by intentional walks. I don't know,

481
00:24:33,558 --> 00:24:35,478
Speaker 2: and I don't even know to what extent Rawleys was.

482
00:24:35,798 --> 00:24:38,838
Speaker 2: I'm sure you have that, but at some point you

483
00:24:38,878 --> 00:24:41,198
Speaker 2: have to recognize the rest of the game, and that's

484
00:24:41,518 --> 00:24:43,158
Speaker 2: when it comes to most valuable player. Of course, as

485
00:24:43,158 --> 00:24:45,638
Speaker 2: batting average was less than man, it is hard when

486
00:24:45,678 --> 00:24:47,758
Speaker 2: you do put that gear on every day, you squad

487
00:24:47,798 --> 00:24:50,278
Speaker 2: every day and actually get to go on one knee,

488
00:24:50,278 --> 00:24:53,998
Speaker 2: which is really a lifesaver for the body. But nevertheless,

489
00:24:54,878 --> 00:24:58,118
Speaker 2: he does that every day, gets in that squad, he's

490
00:24:58,118 --> 00:25:01,118
Speaker 2: looking out at the game, everybody's looking in at the game.

491
00:25:01,118 --> 00:25:04,718
Speaker 2: He's like, you suggested thirteen guys that he's in charge there,

492
00:25:04,758 --> 00:25:06,838
Speaker 2: that he has to know every nuance about this guy,

493
00:25:07,398 --> 00:25:09,438
Speaker 2: combine it with the Skyt report and then and then

494
00:25:09,598 --> 00:25:11,878
Speaker 2: match it up against the guy coming up walking to

495
00:25:11,998 --> 00:25:14,238
Speaker 2: the batter's box. And did so well with that and

496
00:25:14,278 --> 00:25:16,198
Speaker 2: how deeply they got into the season. And I know

497
00:25:16,238 --> 00:25:19,678
Speaker 2: the voting was done prior to that. However, I just

498
00:25:19,838 --> 00:25:23,758
Speaker 2: I like, if there was some formula, if that's what's necessary,

499
00:25:23,758 --> 00:25:26,478
Speaker 2: other than your eyeballs, because that's really what we've I

500
00:25:26,518 --> 00:25:28,518
Speaker 2: don't know if it's evolved or evolve to, is the

501
00:25:28,518 --> 00:25:32,118
Speaker 2: fact that we have to have a number substantiating our method,

502
00:25:32,238 --> 00:25:36,438
Speaker 2: whereas what's wrong with your good old instinct baseball eyes

503
00:25:36,878 --> 00:25:39,678
Speaker 2: and understanding what this guy went through to accomplish all this,

504
00:25:39,998 --> 00:25:42,598
Speaker 2: and how do you evaluate that in regards to giving

505
00:25:42,678 --> 00:25:46,478
Speaker 2: him more of a bump, more points elevating his stance

506
00:25:46,518 --> 00:25:48,318
Speaker 2: in this race somehow? So for me, I mean, I

507
00:25:48,318 --> 00:25:51,118
Speaker 2: guess maybe as a former catcher, I'm a little bit

508
00:25:51,118 --> 00:25:54,118
Speaker 2: more sympathetic to that because I know, brother, your body

509
00:25:54,118 --> 00:25:57,558
Speaker 2: does not feel that good every day. And to do

510
00:25:57,638 --> 00:26:00,278
Speaker 2: what he did on a daily basis, and I don't

511
00:26:00,278 --> 00:26:02,958
Speaker 2: care about his batting average everything else that he did

512
00:26:03,318 --> 00:26:06,798
Speaker 2: on a daily basis, and that bat speed was the same,

513
00:26:07,078 --> 00:26:08,558
Speaker 2: that is really impressive.

514
00:26:08,958 --> 00:26:12,398
Speaker 1: Yeah, especially working your swinging from both sides of the plate. Well,

515
00:26:12,558 --> 00:26:16,278
Speaker 1: thirteen voters at a thirty thought the same way as you, Joe.

516
00:26:16,318 --> 00:26:19,278
Speaker 1: It wasn't like this was unanimous. It was actually closer

517
00:26:19,318 --> 00:26:21,078
Speaker 1: than a lot of people thought. So it was not

518
00:26:21,118 --> 00:26:24,358
Speaker 1: a slam dunk for Aaron Judge. But yeah, sympathies go

519
00:26:24,398 --> 00:26:27,758
Speaker 1: to Cal Raley Man. He was, as you said, I'm

520
00:26:27,798 --> 00:26:29,278
Speaker 1: not sure you can have a year like that. Again,

521
00:26:29,678 --> 00:26:31,798
Speaker 1: he put up a historic all time year and it

522
00:26:31,838 --> 00:26:34,998
Speaker 1: wasn't enough to beat out Aaron Judge. We did have

523
00:26:35,078 --> 00:26:38,038
Speaker 1: a free agent signing Joe the first of the season.

524
00:26:38,278 --> 00:26:43,078
Speaker 1: Josh Naylor signs back with the Seattle Mariners five years,

525
00:26:43,438 --> 00:26:46,598
Speaker 1: ninety two point five million dollars. It's not surprising to

526
00:26:46,638 --> 00:26:48,638
Speaker 1: me that he came back to Seattle was such a

527
00:26:48,678 --> 00:26:51,798
Speaker 1: good fit. It may be surprising, though, that he signed

528
00:26:52,038 --> 00:26:56,358
Speaker 1: this quickly for this term. It's essentially it is exact

529
00:26:56,358 --> 00:27:00,438
Speaker 1: same deal that Anthony Santander has signed last year with Toronto.

530
00:27:00,838 --> 00:27:03,238
Speaker 1: Naylor had himself a really good year. I mean, you're

531
00:27:03,238 --> 00:27:05,918
Speaker 1: talking about a guy who I was really impressed watching

532
00:27:05,958 --> 00:27:08,638
Speaker 1: him in the postseason. Joe, it seemed like there were

533
00:27:08,638 --> 00:27:11,638
Speaker 1: times where he just decided, I'm not striking out. I'm

534
00:27:11,638 --> 00:27:13,358
Speaker 1: going to do whatever I can to put this ball

535
00:27:13,398 --> 00:27:15,358
Speaker 1: in play. And I think that's what helped make this

536
00:27:15,478 --> 00:27:18,358
Speaker 1: Seattle team get as far as they did, because that

537
00:27:18,398 --> 00:27:21,318
Speaker 1: team in the past offensively had way too much swing

538
00:27:21,358 --> 00:27:24,078
Speaker 1: a miss, and I think balancing out the lineup, you

539
00:27:24,078 --> 00:27:26,878
Speaker 1: don't want an entire roster of Josh Naylor's but you

540
00:27:26,878 --> 00:27:30,158
Speaker 1: need some of your lineup, as Toronto proved, I like

541
00:27:30,238 --> 00:27:32,958
Speaker 1: this signing. It was a good fit. Don't mess with it.

542
00:27:33,038 --> 00:27:36,798
Speaker 1: I give him credit. Obviously he was happy there and

543
00:27:36,838 --> 00:27:38,838
Speaker 1: he knew it was a good fit. Doesn't need to

544
00:27:38,878 --> 00:27:42,158
Speaker 1: shop it around and drag it out to January. He's

545
00:27:42,158 --> 00:27:44,118
Speaker 1: in a place I'm sure he likes with the contract

546
00:27:44,158 --> 00:27:45,958
Speaker 1: he likes. Good for them, good for the Mariners.

547
00:27:46,638 --> 00:27:49,558
Speaker 2: The latter day John Cruk, I really like him too.

548
00:27:50,678 --> 00:27:52,718
Speaker 2: The big part, I mean, look at his age, because

549
00:27:52,798 --> 00:27:55,918
Speaker 2: his the look belies his age. He's actually very young.

550
00:27:56,198 --> 00:27:57,598
Speaker 2: I mean, if you look at him, you would think

551
00:27:57,638 --> 00:27:59,678
Speaker 2: that he's a little bit older than that. So when

552
00:27:59,678 --> 00:28:01,238
Speaker 2: I saw the age, I said, damn. I mean, I

553
00:28:01,478 --> 00:28:04,358
Speaker 2: totally get it right now. But yeah, you're right, don't

554
00:28:04,398 --> 00:28:06,078
Speaker 2: You don't need a whole team of those, but you'd

555
00:28:06,078 --> 00:28:07,958
Speaker 2: definitely like to have one to maybe two of those.

556
00:28:09,158 --> 00:28:12,278
Speaker 2: He's a baseball player, the way he's able to maneuver

557
00:28:12,318 --> 00:28:15,398
Speaker 2: on the bases. Also, that see for me when I'd

558
00:28:15,398 --> 00:28:17,758
Speaker 2: go scouting, even as a young Scott, I was like,

559
00:28:17,838 --> 00:28:21,838
Speaker 2: what thirty less than thirty twenty eight, twenty seven, and

560
00:28:21,918 --> 00:28:24,438
Speaker 2: I'm going and even at that point, I would recognize

561
00:28:24,478 --> 00:28:27,038
Speaker 2: if I saw a player that I kind of liked

562
00:28:27,398 --> 00:28:30,958
Speaker 2: that really showed me good instincts on the basis, that

563
00:28:30,998 --> 00:28:34,078
Speaker 2: would really accelerate how I felt about that player, just

564
00:28:34,118 --> 00:28:37,918
Speaker 2: based on that. When you show me instincts on the basis, wow,

565
00:28:38,038 --> 00:28:41,958
Speaker 2: I am always impressed because it's when you get out there, man,

566
00:28:42,118 --> 00:28:45,518
Speaker 2: to apply yourself like that. It takes a lot of

567
00:28:45,558 --> 00:28:48,678
Speaker 2: mental focus, and sometimes you're not going so well, but

568
00:28:48,718 --> 00:28:50,398
Speaker 2: you still go out there, I mean, hitting wise, but

569
00:28:50,478 --> 00:28:51,998
Speaker 2: you go out there and you still do things on

570
00:28:52,038 --> 00:28:55,718
Speaker 2: the basis to help your team win. Carlos Payn Carlos

571
00:28:55,718 --> 00:28:58,198
Speaker 2: could not run that well. Carlos really good base runner,

572
00:28:58,438 --> 00:29:01,918
Speaker 2: great acumen out there, saw things. It's always been impressive.

573
00:29:01,998 --> 00:29:05,398
Speaker 2: So with him, I look at that, and that base

574
00:29:05,478 --> 00:29:08,718
Speaker 2: running acumen on his part tells me everything I need

575
00:29:08,758 --> 00:29:10,518
Speaker 2: to know about this guy. Because what I'm saying is

576
00:29:10,518 --> 00:29:12,638
Speaker 2: not an illusion. He is that good of a baseball player.

577
00:29:13,838 --> 00:29:15,638
Speaker 2: At bats, they're trying to put the ball in play.

578
00:29:15,678 --> 00:29:18,358
Speaker 2: All the things that he does, you know, find first pace.

579
00:29:18,438 --> 00:29:21,518
Speaker 2: Everything he does reeks of being a baseball player, and

580
00:29:21,638 --> 00:29:23,998
Speaker 2: so free Seattle's perspective, I think it's a great sign

581
00:29:24,638 --> 00:29:28,638
Speaker 2: his method of hitting. Always would always stand up there.

582
00:29:28,678 --> 00:29:30,598
Speaker 2: I mean, whether it's a line drive to left field

583
00:29:30,678 --> 00:29:33,438
Speaker 2: or a bomb over the right field wall, whichever needed

584
00:29:33,438 --> 00:29:34,918
Speaker 2: in the moment, He's going to do that, and that's

585
00:29:34,958 --> 00:29:35,638
Speaker 2: what I like about it.

586
00:29:35,918 --> 00:29:39,438
Speaker 1: Yeah, and people maybe start to wonder has affect Pete

587
00:29:39,438 --> 00:29:43,238
Speaker 1: Alonzo's market, you know, first basement, it's really not comparable.

588
00:29:43,238 --> 00:29:44,678
Speaker 1: I don't think Pete is going to be out there

589
00:29:44,718 --> 00:29:47,998
Speaker 1: for a while. You know, he's obviously more of a

590
00:29:48,038 --> 00:29:52,158
Speaker 1: slugger than Josh Naylor. But it's interesting, Joe that I

591
00:29:52,198 --> 00:29:53,798
Speaker 1: think Pete Alonso is going to wind up back with

592
00:29:53,838 --> 00:29:55,478
Speaker 1: the Mets because I don't think they have a good

593
00:29:55,478 --> 00:29:58,878
Speaker 1: fallback position. I think with Juan Soto there, you need

594
00:29:58,918 --> 00:30:02,278
Speaker 1: a right headed power back behind him. And if it's

595
00:30:02,318 --> 00:30:05,838
Speaker 1: not Pete Alonso, who is it. I mean, there's just

596
00:30:05,918 --> 00:30:09,678
Speaker 1: not another choice. So listen, it's not a done deal.

597
00:30:09,718 --> 00:30:11,718
Speaker 1: This is going to drag out. But you know, there's

598
00:30:11,758 --> 00:30:13,678
Speaker 1: talk that the Boston Red Sox are going to get

599
00:30:13,678 --> 00:30:15,398
Speaker 1: it in for Pete Alonzo, and why not. If you're

600
00:30:15,438 --> 00:30:18,278
Speaker 1: the Red Sox, you'd love to re sign Alex Bregman,

601
00:30:19,238 --> 00:30:21,518
Speaker 1: but that's gonna take a while, so you have to

602
00:30:21,598 --> 00:30:24,678
Speaker 1: maintain not just with these two Bregman and Alonso. You

603
00:30:24,718 --> 00:30:27,838
Speaker 1: have to maintain, you know, conversations and talks with with

604
00:30:27,918 --> 00:30:29,878
Speaker 1: other players. You just can't put all your eggs in

605
00:30:29,878 --> 00:30:33,678
Speaker 1: one basket. If your Boston Joe and you have some

606
00:30:33,718 --> 00:30:36,798
Speaker 1: money to spend, do you go Bregman or do you

607
00:30:36,798 --> 00:30:38,118
Speaker 1: go Alonso? I?

608
00:30:38,278 --> 00:30:41,078
Speaker 2: Well, I like Alonso with the Mets, and if I

609
00:30:41,118 --> 00:30:43,358
Speaker 2: am the Red Sox, I stay with Bregman. I think

610
00:30:43,358 --> 00:30:45,758
Speaker 2: it's I think to me, that would in my mindsight,

611
00:30:45,798 --> 00:30:49,318
Speaker 2: that's way matches up. Bregman suited to that ballpark really well.

612
00:30:49,518 --> 00:30:51,438
Speaker 2: He can't pull the ball. He's got that short, little

613
00:30:51,478 --> 00:30:54,598
Speaker 2: choppy swing. I think, you know, Alonzo, he started trying

614
00:30:54,598 --> 00:30:55,878
Speaker 2: to pull the ball too much. It wouldn't be as

615
00:30:55,878 --> 00:31:00,278
Speaker 2: good as a hitter. So I and I think Alonso's proven

616
00:31:00,278 --> 00:31:02,118
Speaker 2: that he could handle that stuff in New York. I mean,

617
00:31:02,118 --> 00:31:04,038
Speaker 2: he did a great job this year. He's in a

618
00:31:04,118 --> 00:31:06,438
Speaker 2: in another contract year and the guy goes out there

619
00:31:06,478 --> 00:31:08,678
Speaker 2: and just nails it. I think he learned a lot

620
00:31:08,718 --> 00:31:11,558
Speaker 2: about himself this year, also regarding me, whether it's approach,

621
00:31:11,638 --> 00:31:13,478
Speaker 2: how I take care of myself, what kind of training

622
00:31:13,518 --> 00:31:16,598
Speaker 2: I do, just his focus everything, you know, He's a

623
00:31:16,638 --> 00:31:20,478
Speaker 2: gregarious personality, and I think he's kind of like learned

624
00:31:20,518 --> 00:31:24,358
Speaker 2: how to channel it to the point where it now

625
00:31:24,438 --> 00:31:27,158
Speaker 2: becomes more It could blend into the leadership role a bit,

626
00:31:27,478 --> 00:31:29,118
Speaker 2: and I think if you bring him back there, he's

627
00:31:29,118 --> 00:31:30,678
Speaker 2: going to feel that he's going to feel like he,

628
00:31:31,158 --> 00:31:33,278
Speaker 2: you know, I really belong here. I want to be here.

629
00:31:33,798 --> 00:31:36,958
Speaker 2: I can now be more open in a good way

630
00:31:36,998 --> 00:31:39,638
Speaker 2: regarding how I try to influence the players around me.

631
00:31:40,198 --> 00:31:42,318
Speaker 2: I think the people of New York appreciate him and

632
00:31:42,358 --> 00:31:44,678
Speaker 2: how he plays, so that makes all the sense as well.

633
00:31:44,718 --> 00:31:47,118
Speaker 2: And I think Bregman's got that Boston attitude a little bit.

634
00:31:47,158 --> 00:31:50,118
Speaker 2: He just kind of got that Boston swagger about him.

635
00:31:50,438 --> 00:31:52,038
Speaker 2: But I think his game is more student there, so

636
00:31:52,078 --> 00:31:54,678
Speaker 2: for me, status quo on both sides, I think both

637
00:31:54,678 --> 00:31:55,798
Speaker 2: teams should sign these guys.

638
00:31:56,238 --> 00:31:58,638
Speaker 1: I'm with you, Joe, for all those reasons and for

639
00:31:58,678 --> 00:32:00,878
Speaker 1: the reasons we just talked about with Josh Naylor. You know,

640
00:32:00,918 --> 00:32:03,358
Speaker 1: when you have a good fit, you know that that

641
00:32:03,478 --> 00:32:07,438
Speaker 1: part in the as a cog and your machinery. Don't

642
00:32:07,438 --> 00:32:09,718
Speaker 1: mess around with it. Bragman is not just built for

643
00:32:09,758 --> 00:32:11,518
Speaker 1: Fenway because of that swing, and you look at his

644
00:32:11,598 --> 00:32:14,358
Speaker 1: career ops there. He just absolutely rakes in that ballpark.

645
00:32:15,038 --> 00:32:18,438
Speaker 1: He's a glue guy on that team. He is a leader.

646
00:32:18,478 --> 00:32:20,998
Speaker 1: He's a little bit like JD. Martinez with the way

647
00:32:21,038 --> 00:32:24,758
Speaker 1: he dives so deeply into hitting and preparation and figuring

648
00:32:24,758 --> 00:32:27,918
Speaker 1: out what other pitchers are doing against the lineup. He's

649
00:32:27,998 --> 00:32:30,838
Speaker 1: got tremendous value there that rubs off on, especially the

650
00:32:30,878 --> 00:32:32,998
Speaker 1: young hitters there. So I don't want to mess with

651
00:32:33,038 --> 00:32:35,358
Speaker 1: that if I'm Boston. Not to say that Pee Alonzo

652
00:32:35,478 --> 00:32:36,758
Speaker 1: is not that kind of a guy, but we know

653
00:32:36,798 --> 00:32:38,878
Speaker 1: that Peede Alonzo, and this is a good point you made, Joe,

654
00:32:38,918 --> 00:32:40,638
Speaker 1: he can get it done in New York. I mean,

655
00:32:40,638 --> 00:32:42,638
Speaker 1: that's always a box you need to check if you're

656
00:32:42,638 --> 00:32:45,438
Speaker 1: a New York general manager, president of baseball ops. Trying

657
00:32:45,438 --> 00:32:47,558
Speaker 1: to bring a player in the city doesn't bother him.

658
00:32:47,558 --> 00:32:50,598
Speaker 1: In fact, he thrives in it and he plays every day.

659
00:32:50,798 --> 00:32:53,358
Speaker 1: So I'm with you. There's no reason for either team

660
00:32:53,438 --> 00:32:57,238
Speaker 1: to go elsewhere. We'll see how those contracts work out.

661
00:32:57,518 --> 00:33:00,478
Speaker 1: Question for you on free agency, Joe, if you're the

662
00:33:00,518 --> 00:33:03,838
Speaker 1: Toronto Blue Jays, now you've really kind of redefined your friend.

663
00:33:04,798 --> 00:33:07,878
Speaker 1: I mean, it's the expectations now are and this is

664
00:33:07,918 --> 00:33:09,718
Speaker 1: what John Schneider was most proud of at the end

665
00:33:09,718 --> 00:33:11,798
Speaker 1: of the year. Of course, it hurt badly to lose

666
00:33:11,838 --> 00:33:14,838
Speaker 1: Game seven of the World Series, but they changed the

667
00:33:14,838 --> 00:33:17,438
Speaker 1: culture there. There's an expectation there that they should win,

668
00:33:17,558 --> 00:33:19,998
Speaker 1: and they're not settling for anything else, not just hey,

669
00:33:20,118 --> 00:33:23,198
Speaker 1: let's play meaningful games in September. And I hate hearing

670
00:33:23,238 --> 00:33:26,438
Speaker 1: that kind of nonsense. But if you're Toronto now, you've

671
00:33:26,438 --> 00:33:29,398
Speaker 1: got Bob Baschett, who's a free agent. You've got Kyle

672
00:33:29,478 --> 00:33:32,158
Speaker 1: Tucker who's out there as a free agent. But you

673
00:33:32,278 --> 00:33:36,798
Speaker 1: also have closers out there in Edwin Diaz, Devin Williams,

674
00:33:36,958 --> 00:33:41,118
Speaker 1: Pete Fairbanks. If you're the Blue Jays, what do you prioritize?

675
00:33:41,118 --> 00:33:43,238
Speaker 1: They do have some money to spend. They're already the

676
00:33:43,238 --> 00:33:46,318
Speaker 1: fifth highest payroll in the game. Do you go closer?

677
00:33:46,678 --> 00:33:48,958
Speaker 1: Do you go Kyle Tucker? Do you make sure you

678
00:33:48,998 --> 00:33:51,478
Speaker 1: bring back Bob Buschett, who probably is going to sign

679
00:33:51,518 --> 00:33:53,678
Speaker 1: with somebody as a second basement. I don't think he's

680
00:33:53,678 --> 00:33:54,958
Speaker 1: going to sign as a shortstop.

681
00:33:55,278 --> 00:33:57,478
Speaker 2: Yeah, I would put him back at shortstop. Second base

682
00:33:57,598 --> 00:34:00,358
Speaker 2: is interesting. I still I don't know enough because I've

683
00:34:00,398 --> 00:34:03,278
Speaker 2: not been around him. Around his daddy, but I want

684
00:34:03,318 --> 00:34:06,718
Speaker 2: his bat out there. I'm even liking left field. Quite frankly,

685
00:34:07,038 --> 00:34:09,798
Speaker 2: I don't know. I'd just not been on the field

686
00:34:09,798 --> 00:34:11,838
Speaker 2: with them enough to know how exactly I feel about

687
00:34:11,838 --> 00:34:14,278
Speaker 2: his defense. I was wrong about Mookie Betts. Mokie was

688
00:34:14,718 --> 00:34:16,958
Speaker 2: way better than I thought he could be. But having

689
00:34:16,998 --> 00:34:19,558
Speaker 2: watched Bashett, I just like to put him in a

690
00:34:19,558 --> 00:34:21,118
Speaker 2: spot where he doesn't have to worry about his defense

691
00:34:21,158 --> 00:34:22,838
Speaker 2: at all, and just Rake. That's what I'd like to

692
00:34:22,878 --> 00:34:26,918
Speaker 2: do with him. If I'm the Blue Jays. Yeah, I'm

693
00:34:26,958 --> 00:34:29,318
Speaker 2: not a Hoffman guy. I like him, but I don't

694
00:34:29,358 --> 00:34:31,158
Speaker 2: like him in that role. I think if you put

695
00:34:31,238 --> 00:34:33,118
Speaker 2: him earlier in the game, he's really going to nail

696
00:34:33,118 --> 00:34:34,598
Speaker 2: it down. He's not going to make the same kind

697
00:34:34,598 --> 00:34:37,118
Speaker 2: of mistakes. Now, how much money do they have, I

698
00:34:37,158 --> 00:34:38,958
Speaker 2: mean they've they've been trying to get guys for years.

699
00:34:38,998 --> 00:34:40,678
Speaker 2: I know they've spent on Guerrera, but if they got enough,

700
00:34:40,678 --> 00:34:42,238
Speaker 2: dough Man, I'd go after all these dudes. I don't

701
00:34:42,238 --> 00:34:45,158
Speaker 2: know if they can or cannot, but I mean, at

702
00:34:45,238 --> 00:34:48,798
Speaker 2: least like Bishett and Ikadiez or Bishett and a Tucker.

703
00:34:49,078 --> 00:34:51,158
Speaker 2: If they feel like their bullpen is good enough. But

704
00:34:51,238 --> 00:34:52,918
Speaker 2: I think they should go after two of those three.

705
00:34:53,078 --> 00:34:55,358
Speaker 2: I mean hard, because if they don't, they're not getting

706
00:34:55,398 --> 00:34:57,238
Speaker 2: back to where they were this year. They need a

707
00:34:57,278 --> 00:34:58,918
Speaker 2: real short stop like they had at the at the

708
00:34:58,958 --> 00:35:01,678
Speaker 2: end of their net. That him and Az really made

709
00:35:01,678 --> 00:35:05,278
Speaker 2: a huge difference, huge difference for them. Their defense tightened up.

710
00:35:05,278 --> 00:35:10,118
Speaker 2: I love Ernie, he's outstanding. I love a lot about them, Barger,

711
00:35:10,238 --> 00:35:13,398
Speaker 2: all these guys. They got him, But if they remain

712
00:35:14,078 --> 00:35:16,158
Speaker 2: pat hand, they ain't going back there next year. I

713
00:35:16,158 --> 00:35:19,358
Speaker 2: don't think. I really don't see it, especially with their

714
00:35:19,398 --> 00:35:21,838
Speaker 2: pitching still in the state of flux. Starting wise, some

715
00:35:21,918 --> 00:35:25,278
Speaker 2: guys you know, Bieber and Shresury just that's not going

716
00:35:25,358 --> 00:35:28,038
Speaker 2: to be what it was this year. So I think,

717
00:35:28,158 --> 00:35:30,278
Speaker 2: you know, if they get some free dump money, I

718
00:35:30,358 --> 00:35:33,118
Speaker 2: take the two out of three, two out of three

719
00:35:33,158 --> 00:35:34,638
Speaker 2: a't bat, We'll go meet Loaf on him. I want

720
00:35:34,678 --> 00:35:37,358
Speaker 2: two out of three of Baschette, Tucker and like a Diaz.

721
00:35:37,758 --> 00:35:40,718
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm with him. I would do the closer whoever

722
00:35:40,758 --> 00:35:43,998
Speaker 1: it is. I obviously Diaz is the top of the list.

723
00:35:44,878 --> 00:35:47,838
Speaker 1: That's probably one hundred and twenty million dollars, and then

724
00:35:47,878 --> 00:35:50,118
Speaker 1: Bashett which I think between the two of those you

725
00:35:50,238 --> 00:35:53,038
Speaker 1: get for less than Kyle Tucker. Kyle Tucker's probably four

726
00:35:53,118 --> 00:35:56,478
Speaker 1: hundred million plus. But yeah, if I'm Toronto, I do

727
00:35:56,558 --> 00:35:58,878
Speaker 1: want to be aggressive about one of these closers out there,

728
00:35:58,918 --> 00:36:01,478
Speaker 1: starting with Diaz. Maybe he goes back to the Mets

729
00:36:01,518 --> 00:36:02,838
Speaker 1: like a lot of people think that, but he's going

730
00:36:02,918 --> 00:36:05,318
Speaker 1: to have a great market, so it's interesting. I think

731
00:36:05,318 --> 00:36:08,038
Speaker 1: Toronto will be aggressive even though, as you mentioned, they

732
00:36:08,038 --> 00:36:10,718
Speaker 1: had the blood contract at five hundred mil. They're building

733
00:36:10,758 --> 00:36:13,198
Speaker 1: something there, There's no question about it, and now's not

734
00:36:13,318 --> 00:36:15,878
Speaker 1: the time to back off. Hey, we're gonna take a

735
00:36:15,958 --> 00:36:18,838
Speaker 1: quick break. I want to talk to Joe about we

736
00:36:18,878 --> 00:36:21,438
Speaker 1: lost in one of his former players recently. Not a

737
00:36:21,438 --> 00:36:24,398
Speaker 1: big name, but anybody who gets the Major League Baseball

738
00:36:24,438 --> 00:36:29,078
Speaker 1: and pitches seventeen years in professional baseball should be recognized.

739
00:36:29,198 --> 00:36:43,918
Speaker 1: We'll do that right after this. Welcome Back to the

740
00:36:43,958 --> 00:36:47,358
Speaker 1: Book of Joe podcast with me, Tom Berducci and Joe

741
00:36:47,398 --> 00:36:50,918
Speaker 1: Madden and Joe was in May of twenty fifteen when

742
00:36:50,958 --> 00:36:56,758
Speaker 1: the Cubs traded Wellington Castillo for your vs. Medina. I'm

743
00:36:56,798 --> 00:36:58,838
Speaker 1: not sure if you remember that because your Visa only

744
00:36:58,878 --> 00:37:02,838
Speaker 1: wind up pitching five times for you. He was a

745
00:37:02,878 --> 00:37:07,038
Speaker 1: guy traded from the Seattle Mariners. Now it turns out

746
00:37:07,118 --> 00:37:09,158
Speaker 1: that was his last year in the big leagues, but

747
00:37:09,278 --> 00:37:16,198
Speaker 1: Medina wound up pitching seventeen professional seasons, including in Venezuela, Italy,

748
00:37:16,798 --> 00:37:23,198
Speaker 1: the Czech Republic, and Nicaragua. After Major League Baseball sad story.

749
00:37:23,278 --> 00:37:25,838
Speaker 1: Just last month, just thirty seven years old, he apparently

750
00:37:26,118 --> 00:37:29,958
Speaker 1: had a heart attack while driving, collided with another car,

751
00:37:30,038 --> 00:37:32,998
Speaker 1: and was killed. I'm not sure. I know players come

752
00:37:33,038 --> 00:37:36,238
Speaker 1: and go, Joe, but someone like that comes across your radar.

753
00:37:37,198 --> 00:37:39,678
Speaker 1: I'm just impressed by someone who loves the game that much,

754
00:37:40,518 --> 00:37:44,598
Speaker 1: keeps that major league dream alive, literally pitching all over

755
00:37:44,638 --> 00:37:45,878
Speaker 1: the world, right.

756
00:37:46,278 --> 00:37:49,118
Speaker 2: Yeah, a wonderful fellow. I didn't even I swear I

757
00:37:49,118 --> 00:37:51,238
Speaker 2: didn't even see that. Man, that's horrible. I didn't know

758
00:37:51,278 --> 00:37:56,878
Speaker 2: about that. And yeah, briefly there just you know, one

759
00:37:56,878 --> 00:37:59,198
Speaker 2: of those like you're saying, a lifer do anything you

760
00:37:59,238 --> 00:38:03,318
Speaker 2: ask him to do, very eager, obviously a great team player.

761
00:38:03,398 --> 00:38:07,238
Speaker 2: But these guys, man, God, I got such a warm

762
00:38:07,278 --> 00:38:10,038
Speaker 2: place in my heart for them, as I kind of

763
00:38:10,078 --> 00:38:12,878
Speaker 2: identify with all that stuff based on you know, my

764
00:38:12,998 --> 00:38:15,478
Speaker 2: path to get to the major leagues and eventually doing

765
00:38:15,558 --> 00:38:18,798
Speaker 2: what I've been able to do. So, you know, God,

766
00:38:18,878 --> 00:38:21,198
Speaker 2: I didn't realize that, so you kind of caught me

767
00:38:21,318 --> 00:38:24,158
Speaker 2: right there. And he was he was. He was wonderful.

768
00:38:24,238 --> 00:38:29,038
Speaker 2: He's he loved lived, talk, spoke whatever, baseball and gosh,

769
00:38:29,118 --> 00:38:30,798
Speaker 2: I just the heart goes out to his family.

770
00:38:31,438 --> 00:38:34,078
Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean, as you know, Joe, there's a magical

771
00:38:34,158 --> 00:38:36,798
Speaker 1: year in twenty fifteen. I know everybody looks at twenty sixteen,

772
00:38:36,878 --> 00:38:39,318
Speaker 1: but everything started to come together for that group in

773
00:38:39,398 --> 00:38:41,958
Speaker 1: twenty fifteen and a lot of guys, you know, theo

774
00:38:41,998 --> 00:38:44,678
Speaker 1: Epstein did a great job, especially with pitching, bringing in

775
00:38:44,718 --> 00:38:48,158
Speaker 1: guys from other organizations, and I just wonder what that

776
00:38:48,358 --> 00:38:52,398
Speaker 1: was like for you to try to meld a group together.

777
00:38:52,518 --> 00:38:54,878
Speaker 1: You had the core of you know, the guys who

778
00:38:54,918 --> 00:38:57,958
Speaker 1: were drafted, you know, the Bryan's, the Rizzo's. Rizzo was

779
00:38:57,998 --> 00:39:00,718
Speaker 1: not an original Cub draft pick. But you get the point,

780
00:39:01,158 --> 00:39:04,238
Speaker 1: Kyle Schwarber, but bringing together guys from the outside and

781
00:39:04,238 --> 00:39:07,718
Speaker 1: folding them into a team concept. And you did that

782
00:39:07,758 --> 00:39:11,398
Speaker 1: in twenty fifteen. The payoff was sixteen. What's the difficulty

783
00:39:11,438 --> 00:39:11,958
Speaker 1: of doing that?

784
00:39:12,678 --> 00:39:14,878
Speaker 2: Just getting to know everybody quickly. I mean, you bring

785
00:39:14,878 --> 00:39:17,518
Speaker 2: different guys in and you know, the front officer or whoever.

786
00:39:17,598 --> 00:39:19,918
Speaker 2: They'll tell you know what they think about them. Sometimes

787
00:39:19,918 --> 00:39:24,198
Speaker 2: I had personal experience with different players where it's Khill Richards. Mean,

788
00:39:24,558 --> 00:39:26,918
Speaker 2: I had different experiences with them, But then again you

789
00:39:26,958 --> 00:39:28,878
Speaker 2: got to see them out there and you got to

790
00:39:28,918 --> 00:39:31,958
Speaker 2: decide what they're with their role is what they're capable

791
00:39:31,998 --> 00:39:34,318
Speaker 2: of doing, that level of trust you want to give

792
00:39:34,318 --> 00:39:40,038
Speaker 2: that player. There's players. Bart was a barker, and there

793
00:39:40,078 --> 00:39:42,678
Speaker 2: was a left handed got to switch hitter. God, he

794
00:39:42,718 --> 00:39:44,598
Speaker 2: had a great day in New York City. Gosh, I

795
00:39:44,638 --> 00:39:46,918
Speaker 2: can't remember his name right now. But these are role players, right,

796
00:39:47,278 --> 00:39:49,198
Speaker 2: so how do I utilize these role players? A lot

797
00:39:49,238 --> 00:39:52,518
Speaker 2: of was platoon advantage kind of stuff. Actually was kind

798
00:39:52,518 --> 00:39:55,758
Speaker 2: of fun, you know, because I wasn't really dictated how

799
00:39:55,758 --> 00:39:58,518
Speaker 2: to use these guys. Was kind of like a daily

800
00:39:58,558 --> 00:40:03,318
Speaker 2: baseball decisions creating the lineups. Like I said, giving somebody

801
00:40:03,318 --> 00:40:07,518
Speaker 2: a rest, Jonathan something like, give guys rests and then

802
00:40:07,638 --> 00:40:11,238
Speaker 2: you you just match things up, man, And it was fun.

803
00:40:11,278 --> 00:40:14,118
Speaker 2: These guys would do anything. We were good at safety squeezes,

804
00:40:14,278 --> 00:40:16,438
Speaker 2: We scored runners from third. We did all kind of

805
00:40:16,638 --> 00:40:19,718
Speaker 2: crazy things on the field, you know, you know the

806
00:40:19,758 --> 00:40:23,118
Speaker 2: five man infield that it was necessary. Picture goes in

807
00:40:23,158 --> 00:40:24,758
Speaker 2: the outfield for a bat or two, then it comes

808
00:40:24,758 --> 00:40:28,198
Speaker 2: back in. I mean, all this stuff was open because

809
00:40:28,198 --> 00:40:32,078
Speaker 2: all these guys absolutely were on board and on the

810
00:40:32,118 --> 00:40:34,798
Speaker 2: same page. It was fun. It's fun. It's fun when

811
00:40:34,798 --> 00:40:37,798
Speaker 2: you have like it was kind of like the the

812
00:40:37,918 --> 00:40:40,798
Speaker 2: very end of the fifteen sixteen seventeen, like the end

813
00:40:40,878 --> 00:40:43,718
Speaker 2: of like this moment as a manager when you could

814
00:40:43,758 --> 00:40:46,558
Speaker 2: just you know, you really did. You wrote out the plan,

815
00:40:46,678 --> 00:40:48,958
Speaker 2: talk to the coaches. You're using a lot of your

816
00:40:48,998 --> 00:40:52,198
Speaker 2: baseball experience at that point before it started leaning more

817
00:40:52,238 --> 00:40:56,078
Speaker 2: towards dictate from the front office on down. So it

818
00:40:56,278 --> 00:40:58,678
Speaker 2: was a blast. It was a great group. We had

819
00:40:58,718 --> 00:41:01,238
Speaker 2: a and then we just ran into like god, I mean,

820
00:41:01,278 --> 00:41:03,998
Speaker 2: the hottest pitching staff and Daniel Murphy, I mean, what

821
00:41:04,078 --> 00:41:07,278
Speaker 2: are you going to do? It was absolutely weird and

822
00:41:07,318 --> 00:41:10,678
Speaker 2: frustrating to watch how they dismantled this in four games.

823
00:41:10,678 --> 00:41:12,598
Speaker 2: In the players, we had no chance that pitching was

824
00:41:12,638 --> 00:41:15,398
Speaker 2: that good. Daniel was that good. So we went home.

825
00:41:15,878 --> 00:41:18,838
Speaker 2: But just think about it. The Cubs went to the

826
00:41:18,958 --> 00:41:21,518
Speaker 2: NLCS that year, eventually the World Series, the NLCS the

827
00:41:21,598 --> 00:41:24,838
Speaker 2: year after that. The three consecutive years where they had

828
00:41:24,878 --> 00:41:26,798
Speaker 2: really had not even stiffed that in a long time.

829
00:41:27,238 --> 00:41:30,958
Speaker 2: So it was the group culture that we created there.

830
00:41:31,158 --> 00:41:33,518
Speaker 2: It was very, as Brian Kenny likes to talk about,

831
00:41:33,598 --> 00:41:37,598
Speaker 2: very baseball. We just we played baseball, even including back

832
00:41:37,638 --> 00:41:40,278
Speaker 2: to back safety squeezes in a playoff game in Saint Louis.

833
00:41:40,478 --> 00:41:43,958
Speaker 2: It was fun because the guy's body in and quickly.

834
00:41:44,198 --> 00:41:47,838
Speaker 2: In that twenty fifteen season in spring training, my first

835
00:41:47,918 --> 00:41:50,758
Speaker 2: camp with them, and I'm why, you know, eyes open,

836
00:41:51,718 --> 00:41:54,398
Speaker 2: ears open, mouth shut. We're doing cutoffs and release in

837
00:41:54,438 --> 00:41:55,838
Speaker 2: one day and I'm here to tell you they're just

838
00:41:55,878 --> 00:41:59,158
Speaker 2: going through the motions. That's one time I did blow

839
00:41:59,238 --> 00:42:03,518
Speaker 2: up to think that you're going to take a fundamental

840
00:42:03,558 --> 00:42:06,078
Speaker 2: as a and run at that poorly, do not care

841
00:42:06,078 --> 00:42:08,398
Speaker 2: about it. So I think unintentionally that was a really

842
00:42:08,398 --> 00:42:10,798
Speaker 2: big moment for us and for me with that group

843
00:42:11,158 --> 00:42:13,678
Speaker 2: because I did not put up with that kind of

844
00:42:13,718 --> 00:42:16,318
Speaker 2: nonsense where you're gonna run drills poorly in spring training

845
00:42:16,718 --> 00:42:19,038
Speaker 2: and that kind of like set the tone I think

846
00:42:19,078 --> 00:42:21,718
Speaker 2: for the year. So it was a baseball league group,

847
00:42:21,798 --> 00:42:25,118
Speaker 2: was a tight group. It was really fun, great coaching staff.

848
00:42:25,678 --> 00:42:26,878
Speaker 2: I loved every second of it.

849
00:42:27,318 --> 00:42:30,718
Speaker 1: And circling back to where we began your introductory press

850
00:42:30,718 --> 00:42:35,038
Speaker 1: conference with the Cubs far from boiler plate right. In fact,

851
00:42:35,198 --> 00:42:37,638
Speaker 1: it's when you offered them by shot and beer for

852
00:42:37,678 --> 00:42:41,878
Speaker 1: the press there, right. That was awesome, by the way, Joe,

853
00:42:41,918 --> 00:42:45,318
Speaker 1: both of us have big football games coming up on Saturday.

854
00:42:45,558 --> 00:42:49,918
Speaker 1: For me, it's Nebraska at Penn State. I'm a Penn

855
00:42:49,958 --> 00:42:53,078
Speaker 1: State graduate. My brother's on the coaching staff at Nebraska.

856
00:42:53,398 --> 00:42:55,678
Speaker 1: I will be out there in Happy Valley for that game.

857
00:42:56,198 --> 00:43:00,758
Speaker 1: And you, of course, of Lafayette and Lehigh, the one

858
00:43:00,838 --> 00:43:05,478
Speaker 1: hundred and sixty first meeting in rivalry, both come in

859
00:43:05,798 --> 00:43:10,358
Speaker 1: undefeated in the Patriot League winner take all. Wow.

860
00:43:10,758 --> 00:43:13,078
Speaker 2: I'll be on the fifty yard line and I'm debating

861
00:43:13,078 --> 00:43:14,958
Speaker 2: whether to wear my raccoon code or not. I got

862
00:43:14,958 --> 00:43:19,398
Speaker 2: this really heavy, furry Canadian made raccoon coat that really

863
00:43:19,398 --> 00:43:22,838
Speaker 2: could withstand I think minus fifty. So I'm and although

864
00:43:22,838 --> 00:43:25,038
Speaker 2: I think the weather is going to be good, to

865
00:43:25,158 --> 00:43:27,518
Speaker 2: have both teams being undefeated, it's gonna be really fun.

866
00:43:27,518 --> 00:43:31,478
Speaker 2: And plus we're on or what two hundred year anniversary

867
00:43:31,478 --> 00:43:34,838
Speaker 2: of being a college Lafayette is so this year and

868
00:43:34,918 --> 00:43:37,998
Speaker 2: next year both games are going to be at Lafayette,

869
00:43:38,038 --> 00:43:40,518
Speaker 2: I guess. So next year is probably the celebration because

870
00:43:40,518 --> 00:43:43,078
Speaker 2: this was our term, but we permitted Lee haid a

871
00:43:43,078 --> 00:43:45,638
Speaker 2: half two consecutive years, and now we have two consecutive years.

872
00:43:46,678 --> 00:43:48,518
Speaker 2: I don't have that completely right. I'll look it up

873
00:43:48,558 --> 00:43:51,198
Speaker 2: so I could speak more intelligently about it. But I'm Jack,

874
00:43:51,718 --> 00:43:54,558
Speaker 2: Wendy and I are going to go on Saturday. I'm

875
00:43:54,598 --> 00:43:57,718
Speaker 2: flying up there on Thursday and then we'll head on

876
00:43:57,758 --> 00:44:00,598
Speaker 2: down there on Saturday and have a pretty complete day. Listen.

877
00:44:00,958 --> 00:44:04,878
Speaker 2: I know, Penn stay beautiful, wonderful, but I I Fisher

878
00:44:04,958 --> 00:44:08,158
Speaker 2: Field at Oafayette College. It's this little bowl kind of

879
00:44:08,158 --> 00:44:12,598
Speaker 2: a thing. It's the essence of pure college football. I'm

880
00:44:13,118 --> 00:44:15,358
Speaker 2: I get. I know, I actually played on that field

881
00:44:15,918 --> 00:44:18,278
Speaker 2: back in seventy three whatever it was, and so it's

882
00:44:18,358 --> 00:44:22,278
Speaker 2: kind of cool for me personally. But to have a

883
00:44:22,398 --> 00:44:24,838
Speaker 2: chance to win the Patriot League, Lehi's undefeated. I think

884
00:44:24,878 --> 00:44:27,878
Speaker 2: all the way through we lost at Oregon State, we lost,

885
00:44:27,958 --> 00:44:30,238
Speaker 2: I saw Princeton, we lost, Princeton, came up, your team

886
00:44:30,278 --> 00:44:32,558
Speaker 2: came up and beat us. But it's We've played a

887
00:44:32,558 --> 00:44:35,358
Speaker 2: lot better since that Princeton game. So I'm really curious.

888
00:44:35,438 --> 00:44:37,478
Speaker 2: It's a lot of fun and I'm looking forward to it.

889
00:44:37,998 --> 00:44:40,998
Speaker 1: That is awesome both us looking forward to a great

890
00:44:41,038 --> 00:44:44,438
Speaker 1: day of football on Saturday. In the meantime, Joe, you

891
00:44:44,518 --> 00:44:47,118
Speaker 1: always bring us home with words of wisdom. What do

892
00:44:47,158 --> 00:44:49,398
Speaker 1: you have for this edition of the Book of Joe

893
00:44:49,438 --> 00:44:50,158
Speaker 1: to bring us home?

894
00:44:50,478 --> 00:44:51,998
Speaker 2: You know? And I think it was rooted and when

895
00:44:51,998 --> 00:44:54,918
Speaker 2: I was talking about when front office personnel were asked

896
00:44:54,958 --> 00:44:59,678
Speaker 2: about gambling in baseball and the problems that they're confronted

897
00:44:59,718 --> 00:45:03,158
Speaker 2: with now and possible solutions, and everybody's like punting on

898
00:45:03,198 --> 00:45:05,918
Speaker 2: this one, and or they would just give like we

899
00:45:06,038 --> 00:45:08,038
Speaker 2: talked about the boiler plate answer, and that's what I was,

900
00:45:08,398 --> 00:45:11,358
Speaker 2: That's where I was this morning. Absolutely, I was kind

901
00:45:11,358 --> 00:45:17,478
Speaker 2: of disappointed that there wasn't any more demonstrative answers. And

902
00:45:17,558 --> 00:45:19,678
Speaker 2: I think that's where we, you know, we always wanted

903
00:45:19,678 --> 00:45:21,598
Speaker 2: to be so politically correct that we fail to say

904
00:45:21,638 --> 00:45:26,358
Speaker 2: what we think sometimes, and that's that's antithetical to what

905
00:45:26,438 --> 00:45:30,718
Speaker 2: I believe in. I love when somebody has a different

906
00:45:31,318 --> 00:45:33,198
Speaker 2: like you just disagree with me a couple of minutes ago,

907
00:45:33,198 --> 00:45:36,038
Speaker 2: and I love that stuff. God, that's the That's the

908
00:45:36,078 --> 00:45:39,038
Speaker 2: best part of an organizational meeting or even a meeting

909
00:45:39,038 --> 00:45:40,998
Speaker 2: before a series with your coaching staff when they say

910
00:45:41,278 --> 00:45:43,118
Speaker 2: I don't, I don't agree with you. God do I

911
00:45:43,158 --> 00:45:46,638
Speaker 2: love that anyhow, disappoint it and some of the answers

912
00:45:46,638 --> 00:45:48,358
Speaker 2: that are at really punt it, like going for the

913
00:45:48,478 --> 00:45:51,918
Speaker 2: coffin corner, staying away from it, and so Jeorge Benard

914
00:45:51,958 --> 00:45:55,598
Speaker 2: Shaw the single biggest problem in communication is the illusion

915
00:45:55,878 --> 00:45:59,398
Speaker 2: that it has taken place to communicate. Sometimes they just

916
00:45:59,518 --> 00:46:03,198
Speaker 2: add lip service to something and then you walk away

917
00:46:03,198 --> 00:46:05,398
Speaker 2: from it as though the other side really understands where

918
00:46:05,398 --> 00:46:08,918
Speaker 2: you're coming from. And it's so important to slow that

919
00:46:08,958 --> 00:46:12,998
Speaker 2: communication process down and understand that it's hit home, like

920
00:46:13,078 --> 00:46:16,078
Speaker 2: even in baseball when you're communicating with kids that speak

921
00:46:16,078 --> 00:46:19,038
Speaker 2: a different language, to really make sure that whatever you

922
00:46:19,118 --> 00:46:21,758
Speaker 2: had to say, which may have probably was important, that

923
00:46:21,918 --> 00:46:26,038
Speaker 2: it as it has been communicated, that both sides understand

924
00:46:26,038 --> 00:46:28,398
Speaker 2: what's going on right here. I only think you get

925
00:46:28,398 --> 00:46:33,438
Speaker 2: to that point with questioning, with disagreement, with healthy arguments.

926
00:46:33,678 --> 00:46:36,478
Speaker 2: You know, you have this constructive criticism flowing back and forth.

927
00:46:36,718 --> 00:46:41,638
Speaker 2: That's when communication really takes place. So anyway, that was

928
00:46:41,678 --> 00:46:44,118
Speaker 2: what motivated my thought for the day, and we kind

929
00:46:44,118 --> 00:46:46,758
Speaker 2: of covered it during the course of the conversation. But

930
00:46:46,958 --> 00:46:49,238
Speaker 2: I love truth tellers. You love truth tellers. I love

931
00:46:49,278 --> 00:46:51,798
Speaker 2: truth tellers, and again, at the end of the day,

932
00:46:51,998 --> 00:46:55,478
Speaker 2: please disagree with me and set me straight and tell

933
00:46:55,478 --> 00:46:57,998
Speaker 2: me where I'm wrong. I do enjoy that, and that's

934
00:46:58,358 --> 00:47:00,878
Speaker 2: the best way to run a major league coaching staff

935
00:47:01,118 --> 00:47:03,518
Speaker 2: and a major league organization. Yeah.

936
00:47:03,598 --> 00:47:07,278
Speaker 1: Great, great observation, Joe. And especially as it relates to

937
00:47:07,358 --> 00:47:10,198
Speaker 1: these prop bets or micro bets and baseball. I don't

938
00:47:10,198 --> 00:47:12,438
Speaker 1: know why it's so controversial for someone to come out

939
00:47:12,438 --> 00:47:17,198
Speaker 1: and say, listen, I understand legal gambling. It's it's this

940
00:47:17,318 --> 00:47:19,718
Speaker 1: is what we have now, but we need guardrails, right,

941
00:47:19,838 --> 00:47:22,478
Speaker 1: Why do we have these prop bets because of their

942
00:47:22,478 --> 00:47:25,598
Speaker 1: invitations to trouble. Just get rid of them, don't cap

943
00:47:25,678 --> 00:47:28,318
Speaker 1: them as they're doing. Now, that's a nice step forward,

944
00:47:28,318 --> 00:47:31,318
Speaker 1: two hundred dollars max on a prop bet, But why

945
00:47:31,358 --> 00:47:34,718
Speaker 1: even have it? Is it really worth it? I don't

946
00:47:34,758 --> 00:47:37,918
Speaker 1: think so, for the risk it puts the players and

947
00:47:37,958 --> 00:47:39,718
Speaker 1: the game itself in only the.

948
00:47:39,798 --> 00:47:42,118
Speaker 2: You know, the gambling community knows that how much money

949
00:47:42,158 --> 00:47:45,678
Speaker 2: they make on those particular bets. And again, it's just

950
00:47:45,958 --> 00:47:48,118
Speaker 2: I'm just you know, I'm adverse to all of this stuff.

951
00:47:48,158 --> 00:47:50,838
Speaker 2: You know that, I know it's part of the landscape.

952
00:47:50,838 --> 00:47:52,438
Speaker 2: But just because it's part of the landscape, it doesn't

953
00:47:52,438 --> 00:47:53,718
Speaker 2: mean it looks really pretty in the garden.

954
00:47:53,758 --> 00:47:57,438
Speaker 1: Brother Well said, great job, Joe. We'll see you next

955
00:47:57,438 --> 00:47:59,118
Speaker 1: time on the Book of Joe you.

956
00:47:59,118 --> 00:48:02,278
Speaker 2: Tube brother, Go Nitney Lyons, baby, and go go Leopards.

957
00:48:10,878 --> 00:48:14,118
Speaker 1: The Book of Joe podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.

958
00:48:14,318 --> 00:48:19,318
Speaker 1: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

959
00:48:19,438 --> 00:48:21,198
Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts.