Speaker 1: We were watching Survivor last night, and like, you know,
Speaker 1: somebody just was just tanking their own tribe's challenge because she,
Speaker 1: you know, wanted to prove herself being right now.
Speaker 2: I was like, cee, Indie, really, so wait, she was
Speaker 2: doing like the definition of biting her nose to spite
Speaker 2: her face? Yes, and how tell us explain the situation?
Speaker 1: Okay, so it's it's Game Changers. This is our second
Speaker 1: time watching this season from thirty four. I think it's
Speaker 1: Debbie rewatching the season third time.
Speaker 3: Oh my god, that must be a really good one.
Speaker 1: It's a great season. Ozzie's there, Malcolm just got kicked out.
Speaker 1: It's amazing. Anyway, Debbie is just tanking her own team
Speaker 1: because they they didn't let her pick, you know, the
Speaker 1: last challenge which position she had, and but you you
Speaker 1: watch the playback and she clearly asked to be on
Speaker 1: the balance beam and they let her on the balance beam.
Speaker 1: But she made it all about Culpepper anyway, so out
Speaker 1: of spite, she's like sitting there and I just turned
Speaker 1: to India and I'm like, you know, sometimes it's it
Speaker 1: feels so good to be right, but wouldn't you rather
Speaker 1: just be happy? Like, you know, it's like it's either
Speaker 1: happy or right. Sometimes it really does come down to that.
Speaker 1: And I was like, and we all do it, We
Speaker 1: all so badly want to be right. And it's like
Speaker 1: that is way actually almost more of a drive than
Speaker 1: being happy, like you feel it in the moment.
Speaker 4: More.
Speaker 1: It's more like you're adrenaline pushes you to win or
Speaker 1: to be right, and it's like it's you need it
Speaker 1: and you want it and you're so willing to get
Speaker 1: it that you'll completely tank your own interests and your
Speaker 1: own happiness. It's awful, But it's like one of those
Speaker 1: things like, oh my god, I wish I'd known this
Speaker 1: when I was younger. You know, it's like you just
Speaker 1: don't like you just it's so it's such a it's
Speaker 1: like a drug, you know, righteousness.
Speaker 2: I've never had to deal with that because I'm just
Speaker 2: always right and naturally I don't know how it happens.
Speaker 3: So I've really never experienced that because I've.
Speaker 4: I was right.
Speaker 1: I was wrong once nineteen ninety four. It was it
Speaker 1: was not great.
Speaker 3: Yeah, oh you remember exactly the time.
Speaker 4: Well what about you?
Speaker 3: When were you wrong?
Speaker 5: I've never been right. I've come to that realization. There's
Speaker 5: a there's a great Falstaffian kind of joy in knowing
Speaker 5: you are never ever right, no matter what you do.
Speaker 2: It's so great to just walk through life knowing that,
Speaker 2: and then you are really always happy because you won.
Speaker 2: You know you're not going to be right, but then
Speaker 2: if you are, what a pleasant surprise it is.
Speaker 5: But it's also this this there's this this string that
Speaker 5: fate has or happiness has, or whatever it is, that
Speaker 5: has wrapped tightly and yet suppily around my chest to
Speaker 5: where every time I get to the point where I'm like, wow,
Speaker 5: actually starting to be happy, something for my past rips
Speaker 5: me the back and goes, No, you are an anxiety ridden,
Speaker 5: sometimes fat human being who got lucky with your wife.
Speaker 5: That's your lot, bro, you don't get anything more than that.
Speaker 1: Man this morning Falstaffian and supply has already come out
Speaker 1: of Will's mouth.
Speaker 5: I am pro stoked.
Speaker 2: I am here for he's been reading the thesaurus.
Speaker 1: Oh no, he's just it's just on fire.
Speaker 5: I love it. Let's go, let's go, let's bring it, Jackie.
Speaker 3: Welcome to Pon Meets World. I'm Danielle Fischle.
Speaker 2: I'm right strong, and I'm Wilfride When we recently recapped
Speaker 2: Shallow Boy and declared it one of our absolute favorite
Speaker 2: episodes of Boy Meets World so far. A lot of
Speaker 2: things stood out on our first watch in at least
Speaker 2: twenty five years. The pure dynamo that was Lesha Haley's
Speaker 2: first acting gig, the songwriting of Jeff Sherman, Will's impeccable
Speaker 2: comedic timing, even a possible autographed O J Simpson Jersey
Speaker 2: on the Wall. But the one thing that had us
Speaker 2: scrubbing back on Disney Plus to watch it again and
Speaker 2: again for laughs, the hilarious reaction of a Chubby's waitress
Speaker 2: trying her hardest to serve tables but also immediately get
Speaker 2: Eric that check he needs, and we all knew jack Oh,
Speaker 2: so that's so good, and we all knew, Hey, that's Jackie.
Speaker 2: She was one of our stand ins and the occasional
Speaker 2: background actor who had some lines here and there, but
Speaker 2: more importantly than that, we loved her. Luckily, I had
Speaker 2: kept in touch with Jackie over the years through social
Speaker 2: media and followed her career as she now, like director
Speaker 2: Jeff McCracken, has shifted her talents to art as well
Speaker 2: as some side work in voiceover and considering we had
Speaker 2: dozens of emails praising her reaction acting, which I think
Speaker 2: is fair to abbreviate as a reacting. We wanted to
Speaker 2: bring her on the podcast and dig deeper into her small,
Speaker 2: yet critical role and everything about this lovely person. So
Speaker 2: welcome to pod meets World, Jackie Fell.
Speaker 6: Oh my god, Hi, that's usually my job. I always
Speaker 6: start crying.
Speaker 4: Look amazing, So did you? God? Exactly the same.
Speaker 5: So great to.
Speaker 1: See you exactly how I imagined you too, looking cool
Speaker 1: in a gallery. I love it. Amazing. Are you in
Speaker 1: North Carolina? Still?
Speaker 4: I am. I'm in Asheville.
Speaker 1: Yes, I love Ashville.
Speaker 4: You've been here?
Speaker 5: Oh yeah?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Yeah, but I actually almost went to grad school
Speaker 1: there because there's a great writing program that.
Speaker 5: What is this?
Speaker 4: Is it?
Speaker 1: What is the name? Wilson? Wilson wis? Yeah? Anyway?
Speaker 5: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Amazing, that's so fun.
Speaker 2: So, Jackie, I think we have mentioned the job of
Speaker 2: stand in a couple of times on this podcast, but
Speaker 2: I I think maybe we've just assumed that people understand
Speaker 2: really what that means. So will you start by telling
Speaker 2: us exactly what this important job is on a TV show?
Speaker 5: Yes?
Speaker 4: Okay, So there's kind of two different things. So a
Speaker 4: stand in on a sitcom is different than a stand
Speaker 4: in on a film show or a movie. So I've
Speaker 4: done both. And on a film or a film show,
Speaker 4: you don't necessarily know, you don't get a script, you
Speaker 4: don't know even if you're coming back. You're just told
Speaker 4: show up at this time, report to this person, and
Speaker 4: maybe you get the title, and you you don't really know.
Speaker 4: And so that is where pretty much you're you're there
Speaker 4: for lighting purposes. So the actors will come in rehearse
Speaker 4: a scene, and basically as a stand in you work
Speaker 4: with the director of photography mostly, so what they do
Speaker 4: is they were and then maybe the third camera assistant
Speaker 4: will walk around and put little tape marks on all
Speaker 4: the key spots that the actors are standing in, so
Speaker 4: each like piece of tape would be a different setup,
Speaker 4: a different lighting setup. So then once they rehearsed, and
Speaker 4: if you're very lucky, they write it down the number
Speaker 4: order of those tape because sometimes you look around it's
Speaker 4: just like a pile of tape spots all over the floor.
Speaker 4: And then when the actors are released, they will say
Speaker 4: second team. That's what stand ins are called. Hit mark
Speaker 4: number one. You just stand there and they work around
Speaker 4: you and you can sometimes talk with the other stand ins.
Speaker 4: You're very quiet, you don't, you know, you just are
Speaker 4: there for like you move to you know, spot number two,
Speaker 4: just number two. So on a multi camera show, it's
Speaker 4: completely different. So there you get a script. You pretty
Speaker 4: much know what's going on all the time, and so
Speaker 4: came on for you guys, or because you guys were minors,
Speaker 4: so in that sense, when you guys were at school,
Speaker 4: that's when they would maybe use us the stand ins. However,
Speaker 4: they organized it so well that you guys really did
Speaker 4: all your rehearsals. They hardly ever used us for miners
Speaker 4: at all. It was usually for guest stars that they
Speaker 4: didn't hire for five days. Sometimes it would just be
Speaker 4: three days. So we would fill in for the various
Speaker 4: guest stars. Uh maybe you weren't even cast yet, and so.
Speaker 1: That was basically acting with us. Yeah, like you in
Speaker 1: the scenes all week. So for rehearsals and run through,
Speaker 1: you guys would be the guest cast, like our our
Speaker 1: troop of stand ins were our sort of like recurring
Speaker 1: like our cast. Yeah, our coasts for the whole week.
Speaker 4: Yeah, but with zero pressure on us, which was amazing, Like,
Speaker 4: you know, it's the easiest job in the world, like
Speaker 4: if we have no pressure whatsoever. And what was really
Speaker 4: cool is when we were shooting at CBS Radford, I
Speaker 4: lived right across the street. I literally walked to work.
Speaker 4: And because I was so broke at the time, I
Speaker 4: was newly married. My husband was a substitute teacher during
Speaker 4: the day and went to school at night to get
Speaker 4: his full teaching credential. I would go and show up early,
Speaker 4: eat breakfast at Craft Service for free, then at lunch
Speaker 4: I'd make another sandwich at Craft Service. I had two
Speaker 4: meals that I got no pressure hang around most of
Speaker 4: the day. And also your show and the other multi
Speaker 4: camera show that I worked on, which was thunder Alley. Yeah, Andrew, Keegan,
Speaker 4: Danielle and you guys were so both sets were so
Speaker 4: nice that I always felt welcomed, respected, part of a team.
Speaker 4: It was really the best experience.
Speaker 5: Well that's the thing. I mean, at the end of
Speaker 5: the day, we acted with y'all more than we acted
Speaker 5: with anybody else. Because you're right, the guest stars would
Speaker 5: come in every once in a while, but the team
Speaker 5: of stand ins, we were an ensemble for I mean again,
Speaker 5: we acted with you all more than we acted with
Speaker 5: anybody else. Yeah, never really thought about that before.
Speaker 4: It was the best training, honestly. I mean I always
Speaker 4: wanted to be an actor, but I knew waiting tables.
Speaker 4: What am I going to learn? Nothing where you gonna
Speaker 4: like really learn, not just the business, but just how
Speaker 4: to be professional, how to be really good. And that's
Speaker 4: why I loved working behind the scenes because of the
Speaker 4: best education ever. I learned what to do and what
Speaker 4: not to do.
Speaker 3: Yeah. So what season did you start on boy Meet's
Speaker 3: World with us?
Speaker 5: So?
Speaker 4: I started season three, episode nine, and again I didn't
Speaker 4: know that I had the job. It was so I
Speaker 4: think it was Michael Shay that called me in because
Speaker 4: I worked with his brother Bill Shay on thunder Ally Okay,
Speaker 4: So I think that's how Michael Shea knew who I was.
Speaker 4: So it was just, hey, we've got a job for
Speaker 4: you this week. That's all you're told. You're gonna be
Speaker 4: standing in for a guest star who was Brittany Murphy
Speaker 4: who was not famous.
Speaker 3: Right, she was playing Triny.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yes, Trieny. And so that was my first and
Speaker 4: I remember going on and saying, you know, I'm coming back.
Speaker 4: I don't know who was here before me, because then
Speaker 4: it was just like, you're free next week, Yes, yes, okay,
Speaker 4: you'll be the kids standing. I never knew how long,
Speaker 4: and it just was you. Maybe they just will just
Speaker 4: keep calling me back. I'll just keep showing up.
Speaker 3: So do you remember Brittany at all?
Speaker 4: I do? I do. I remember. I pretty much came
Speaker 4: home that first week to my husband and I said,
Speaker 4: I don't know who this girl is, but she's really funny.
Speaker 4: She's got some like she doesn't just play the obvious joke,
Speaker 4: she nicles under it. She just was so nuanced and
Speaker 4: sophisticated and just so goofy. I was like, I think
Speaker 4: she's going to be a star.
Speaker 3: You were right, You were absolutely right.
Speaker 2: Did you know anything about Boy Meets World before you started?
Speaker 3: Had you ever heard of the show? Nothing?
Speaker 4: I had no idea. I thought it was such a
Speaker 4: weird title. I had no idea who anybody was. No,
Speaker 4: it was just a job. And I don't even remember
Speaker 4: if we were shooting at kt LA Disney. I know
Speaker 4: it wasn't Radford at that time. Season three was kat
Speaker 4: A was kat A?
Speaker 5: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Were stoked because you were like, oh, yeah, I know,
Speaker 1: I want to work.
Speaker 5: It was so great.
Speaker 1: And then how long did you stay? You were all
Speaker 1: the way through season six? Right or seven?
Speaker 4: Don't know, I don't remember. I don't remember. I remember
Speaker 4: it was you know, Jack was there, the red Hair
Speaker 4: Maitln was there.
Speaker 1: Was well into season six, if not seven, because I
Speaker 1: remember you leaving and it was like early and it
Speaker 1: was like halfway through the season. I remember being like,
Speaker 1: oh my god, Jack, we.
Speaker 5: Were seriously bummed. I remember that when you told us
Speaker 5: that you were leaving, was like, I know.
Speaker 4: I just had to We needed to make the move.
Speaker 4: We wanted to start a family. You know, we couldn't
Speaker 4: afford to live there. All of our family was on
Speaker 4: the East Coast, So yeah, we made a big move.
Speaker 2: So as a stand in, do you also work very
Speaker 2: closely with the directors?
Speaker 4: Well, yeah, not as much on our show because it
Speaker 4: was such a well oiled machine. Plus you guys were
Speaker 4: older and you didn't So when I worked on thunder Alley,
Speaker 4: I stood in or Haley Joel Osmond, who was five
Speaker 4: at the time, and I was also his dialogue coach,
Speaker 4: and the director was Robbie Benson and he so because
Speaker 4: Haley was five there was a lot. He was in
Speaker 4: school a lot more so I really did a lot
Speaker 4: of his rehearsals for him, and Robbie would give me,
Speaker 4: not just like acting notes, he would give me blocking notes,
Speaker 4: you know, all kinds of acting notes. Plus Haley was
Speaker 4: so young. I would go through the script with him
Speaker 4: and he would have his arm around me. And then
Speaker 4: I remember one day I show up and he's at
Speaker 4: the table and he's got the script and I'm like, Haley,
Speaker 4: what are you doing. He's like, oh, I'm reading the
Speaker 4: script like you can read. This was like months later.
Speaker 7: He never told me he could read.
Speaker 4: He's like, yeah, just like when you do it better.
Speaker 4: Oh my god.
Speaker 2: So other thing I don't think we've talked about enough.
Speaker 2: Will you talk about the role of a dialogue coach?
Speaker 4: Yes, So I was not a dialogue coach on your show.
Speaker 4: I was a dialogue coach on thunder Alley. For it
Speaker 4: was basically to run lines to help people memorize their lines.
Speaker 4: It wasn't giving them acting notes, and it wasn't dialect coach.
Speaker 4: So I wasn't teaching any accents or anything. And with
Speaker 4: Haley's case, he just wasn't on set that much because
Speaker 4: he was so young, So Robbie I worked very close
Speaker 4: with him, and he would and especially on rehearsals when
Speaker 4: the cameras would be there, I'd be way in the
Speaker 4: back because I'm a stand in, you know, I'm like
Speaker 4: bottom of the barrel. And he would be like, oh,
Speaker 4: we need and he would look around Jackie and I yes, yes, Robbie,
Speaker 4: and he was like, okay, you know, make sure he
Speaker 4: did this and this and this. And I would write
Speaker 4: it all down. And it got to the point where
Speaker 4: I would be standing next to the director at the
Speaker 4: monitors and he would see something. He'd look at me
Speaker 4: and I'd be like, yep, I got it. We wouldn't
Speaker 4: even talk. It was so rewarding and so wonderful, and
Speaker 4: I loved, loved that part of the job. I was
Speaker 4: so close with Haley. I ended up my daughter's name
Speaker 4: is Haley. Haley was the first maternal stirrings I ever had.
Speaker 4: That's so cool. He was at my wedding.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, And how old is your Haley? Now?
Speaker 4: My Haley is in her first year of medical school.
Speaker 8: Oh my god, I was so old.
Speaker 1: That's so awesome. Oh my god.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I did. I loved doing all that and on
Speaker 4: Boy Meets World. What was really cool is uh McCracken
Speaker 4: and David Traynor. They were so nice and so treated
Speaker 4: us so well that they would throw us voiceover off
Speaker 4: camera lines all the time, which was I don't even
Speaker 4: know if Michael Jacobs knew that we were just do
Speaker 4: it in the run through and then be like, just
Speaker 4: do it.
Speaker 1: Pay pump, right, I mean that would.
Speaker 4: Yes, and a residual. It was a huge deal.
Speaker 1: Thousands of dollars. Yeah.
Speaker 5: I remember how excited we would be when one of
Speaker 5: the stand ins would get a job on camera too,
Speaker 5: because I remember the first time it happened was Model
Speaker 5: Family with Matt Kirkwood still in touch with him the greatest.
Speaker 5: So he played the photographer and we were all super excited.
Speaker 5: We told that story about how you know, Michael was like.
Speaker 1: What's going on?
Speaker 5: I see him his hairs now his hair's up, and
Speaker 5: we saw that get all scared because it's like, oh no,
Speaker 5: what's going on. They had him put his hair down.
Speaker 5: But the same thing happened to you during Shallow Boy,
Speaker 5: No Legend, No.
Speaker 4: No, no. So I was technically an extra. I never
Speaker 4: had an on camera roll on Boy Meet Swirld I
Speaker 4: had many voiceover jobs, so I am so grateful, but
Speaker 4: I never got to sit in the makeup share, which wow,
Speaker 4: is a dream. Oh No, Basically.
Speaker 1: You stole that scene in Shallow as an extra. It's
Speaker 1: like Haley and then you the guest stars and that
Speaker 1: that's so good. It makes the whole joke. It's so funny.
Speaker 5: It does.
Speaker 1: And I never just been throughout the week like do
Speaker 1: you remember how that happened? Like was that?
Speaker 4: Yes? So as a stand in you get a day rate,
Speaker 4: and at the time it was like one hundred bucks
Speaker 4: a day, and technically you can be used as an extra.
Speaker 4: They could force you to be an extra. I didn't
Speaker 4: want to be an extra because I wanted to be
Speaker 4: an actor and that kind of looked bad. So of
Speaker 4: course Steve Hayfer, who I loved and was so kind
Speaker 4: and I'm still in contact with him, it was like, Jackie,
Speaker 4: we really need you to be a waitress at Chubby's.
Speaker 4: And I was like, all right, nothing was written in
Speaker 4: the script. It was just to give you somebody to
Speaker 4: go check. So I don't think Sherman wrote anything in there.
Speaker 4: It was it was Sherman, right, they wrote that. I think, yeah,
Speaker 4: there was no direct action. So I thought, well, good god,
Speaker 4: if I've got to do this, I might as well
Speaker 4: have fun with it. And so I just came up
Speaker 4: with that bit, oh just because I was bored, Like
Speaker 4: what am I going to do?
Speaker 1: Do it during the Did we do it during the
Speaker 1: run through? We must have done it during the run
Speaker 1: You must have done it during the run through, because yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: because we wouldn't have put you in through wardrobe and
Speaker 1: put you in the scene unless they were like, you
Speaker 1: didn't have to have this beat.
Speaker 4: I had no wardrobe, no makeup, no, because I was
Speaker 4: an extra.
Speaker 1: But didn't you but that You're wearing a waitress outfit, right,
Speaker 1: so you had to have.
Speaker 3: Like they give me an they gave her an apron.
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, I know. It was so funny, But I
Speaker 4: was just technically, uh, I guess it's background actor.
Speaker 3: When I started, it was features background actor.
Speaker 1: But if you were being paid as a stand and
Speaker 1: then you wouldn't have even been paid as a background
Speaker 1: extra for.
Speaker 2: That, not at all, right, you were I was just
Speaker 2: counted as part of your job.
Speaker 1: The voiceovers that you would get, like what were the
Speaker 1: voiceover the off camera stuff?
Speaker 4: All of your family at the trailer Park. It was
Speaker 4: kind of lot. Can't you down? There was a you know,
Speaker 4: neighbor or something screaming that was me. Then I was
Speaker 4: all the TV show commercials like, uh, you're singled out?
Speaker 4: I think I singled out, singled out? There was I
Speaker 4: was on the Witches of Pembrook. I was enraging Corey
Speaker 4: Flamingo kid. I don't know, it's like six Maybe that's
Speaker 4: so fun.
Speaker 5: Voiceovers The best job in the world, isn't it. It
Speaker 5: is the best job in the world.
Speaker 2: And Jackie, that's what you've been doing a lot now, right,
Speaker 2: So talk to us about your voiceover work.
Speaker 4: Yes, so I I am A was a full time
Speaker 4: voiceover talent for twenty five years.
Speaker 5: Isn't that the best? It's the bad?
Speaker 4: Leave LA to make it as.
Speaker 1: So where it goes.
Speaker 4: But I will share a little story with you about
Speaker 4: pretty much a life changing moment that I had of
Speaker 4: it changed my life and how I was going to
Speaker 4: show up. Is that okay for me to tell me
Speaker 4: this story? Okay? So, I don't know if this was
Speaker 4: in our one of the hiatuses or whatnot. Maybe it
Speaker 4: was before I start on Boy Meets World. But I
Speaker 4: get a call when you do as a stand in
Speaker 4: on this you know movie. Okay, here's who you report to.
Speaker 4: I had no idea anything, so I report and it
Speaker 4: turns out that the show had been it was a movie,
Speaker 4: and I was replacing somebody that got fired, so already
Speaker 4: I'm terrified. Oh my god. I was tending an actress
Speaker 4: who was a child actress who was now an adult transitioned.
Speaker 4: She was stunningly beautiful. I was so excited to be there,
Speaker 4: and she just would not look at me, would not
Speaker 4: say hello, we would you know pass I would you know,
Speaker 4: leave the mark and she would take over. She just
Speaker 4: looked beyond me, and I thought, okay, I have no
Speaker 4: idea what happened to the other person. I just played
Speaker 4: it really cool, just minded my own business, so stayed
Speaker 4: out of her way. And there was one scene where
Speaker 4: it was kind of a stunt where she was on
Speaker 4: this swing and she had a fall down, like flying
Speaker 4: off the swing and landed in this dirt and leaves,
Speaker 4: and the DP said to me, the director of photography,
Speaker 4: I really need to set up this shot. It's going
Speaker 4: to be an extreme close up of her face on
Speaker 4: the ground. Can you help me do this? So for
Speaker 4: I for like hours, I was flying off the swing
Speaker 4: into the dirt. I was bruised, I had twigs in
Speaker 4: my hair. I'm a prap bloodied. It was a night shoot.
Speaker 4: I was freezing. So they bring her out. We'll just
Speaker 4: call her Jane Jane. So she comes out and the
Speaker 4: DP says, Jackie's going to show you where your mark is,
Speaker 4: how we rehearsed it. It's really important that you land
Speaker 4: on this mark. So she's standing there and I do
Speaker 4: the whole thing for her, and I'm covered in mud.
Speaker 4: I'm on the ground and I look up and she's
Speaker 4: literally really standing over me, and she goes, that's the
Speaker 4: worst job in the world. I was like, are you
Speaker 4: freaking kidding me?
Speaker 5: Oh my god.
Speaker 4: She was in her twenties, making thousands and thousands of dollars.
Speaker 4: I was making maybe one hundred bucks a day, much
Speaker 4: older than her. That night, we were walking to our
Speaker 4: cars at the same time, and I hung way back
Speaker 4: so she wouldn't see me. We're walking up and she,
Speaker 4: you know, turns into this like gorgeous sports car and
Speaker 4: I turned into my beat up Hyundai that was dented,
Speaker 4: no air conditioning, no radio. First car I ever had,
Speaker 4: the car I had the entire time for ten years
Speaker 4: that I was in LA. That's how broke I was.
Speaker 4: And she got in her car and I literally got
Speaker 4: down on my knees in the middle of the street
Speaker 4: and I said, God, Universe, please let me be an actor.
Speaker 4: I will be on time, I will be professional, I
Speaker 4: will be respectful, I will be grateful. I may not
Speaker 4: be the best actor I may, but I will be
Speaker 4: kind to everyone. Never forgot that, and to this day,
Speaker 4: I've never been late for a job ever. I've never complained.
Speaker 4: I have been kind to whoever was on the totem pole,
Speaker 4: and I have been so professional so that well, and
Speaker 4: you know, I never said her name. I never told
Speaker 4: anybody who it was, because honestly, I don't know if
Speaker 4: she was going through she had a long career after it.
Speaker 4: I don't know if she was you know, I didn't
Speaker 4: want to do the movie. It was awful. I know
Speaker 4: if she was contractually buying, you know, buying to that,
Speaker 4: or if she broke up with her boyfriend, or if
Speaker 4: she lost her reund like, I don't know what her
Speaker 4: story was. So I'm going to give her the benefit
Speaker 4: of the doubt that it wasn't me. It was just
Speaker 4: a time in her life. So I took it as like,
Speaker 4: what a great teaching moment that I you know, you
Speaker 4: guys modeled really how to be awesome and respectful and
Speaker 4: professional and kind. And she showed me the other side
Speaker 4: of it, and I was like, Okay, I've seen this,
Speaker 4: I know what to do. And so that was a
Speaker 4: big turning point for me.
Speaker 1: That's amazing. I know you said that we modeled kind of,
Speaker 1: but we we must have been clueless to such a
Speaker 1: degree just as kids, I mean as teenagers. I mean
Speaker 1: like there was no you know, we're sitting there and
Speaker 1: we've talked about like our amazing parking spots with ours,
Speaker 1: and we drive up. Meanwhile you're like taking extra meals
Speaker 1: that you can from craft Service. You're like basically, you know,
Speaker 1: hoarding sandwiches from Craig Right, that like disconnect must have
Speaker 1: been palpable for you in a way that we had
Speaker 1: no idea because we in our naivete we like we're
Speaker 1: all equals and we're all having fun, but we're clue.
Speaker 1: That must have been Was that hard for you or
Speaker 1: weird for you or did you ever feel like you
Speaker 1: wanted to just smack us?
Speaker 4: Not you guys? Uh, personally, I had a lot of
Speaker 4: shame around it because you know, I wanted to be
Speaker 4: something I couldn't I didn't have the opportunity to be.
Speaker 4: But so, like I said, there were some people that
Speaker 4: I don't want to say they were clueless, but they
Speaker 4: were just so self absorbed. You guys just were kind.
Speaker 4: You didn't it never occurred to you because that wasn't
Speaker 4: your reality. But you didn't make me feel bad or
Speaker 4: less or I just kept that to myself. Nobody knew.
Speaker 4: That was just you know, where I was in my life.
Speaker 4: But you guys were awesome, always kind and professional and
Speaker 4: God made me laugh all the time.
Speaker 5: I was just I remember that quite a bit. I
Speaker 5: remember that quite a bit. You and I hung out
Speaker 5: a lot because aside, yeah, because it was it was
Speaker 5: the again they were sometimes they were in school still
Speaker 5: or especially by third season. So I just remember you
Speaker 5: and I having some great conversations and stuff about your art,
Speaker 5: and I mean we, yeah, we talked a lot, you
Speaker 5: and I. It was it was a ton of fun.
Speaker 5: I just remember it fully enjoying that. And so I
Speaker 5: know we're going to get into your art, but I
Speaker 5: have a story that I doubt you'll remember but it
Speaker 5: was very important in my life. So you were you
Speaker 5: would come in at the time you were doing beaded pouches.
Speaker 5: You were selling. You were selling these really cool handmade
Speaker 5: so you had one that was really really cool. And
Speaker 5: I had this idea that I wanted to do. So
Speaker 5: the day that there was a movie that we all
Speaker 5: auditioned for called Trojan War. And making the transition at
Speaker 5: the time from being a television actor to a film
Speaker 5: actor was a very big deal. And I booked Trojan
Speaker 5: War and I signed a three picture deal with Warner Brothers.
Speaker 5: Oh my god. So I yeah, no. If you're like, wow,
Speaker 5: Trojan War, I've never seen it, No one has, but
Speaker 5: I went to you. This was so the when I
Speaker 5: found out I was going to be doing the movie,
Speaker 5: I bought one of your beaded pouches and I took
Speaker 5: I took the date that I got the job from
Speaker 5: a calendar, and I folded it up and I put
Speaker 5: it in your beaded pouch and I gave it to
Speaker 5: my mom as a gift. So she opened the pouch
Speaker 5: and she took off the first She's like, God, this
Speaker 5: is beautiful. And I was like, well, there's something inside
Speaker 5: for you, and she opened it up and there was
Speaker 5: the date, and I said, that's the date I booked
Speaker 5: the thing. But and she still has it. I saw
Speaker 5: it was and she still has the date is still
Speaker 5: in your perfect It's a black and white little beaded
Speaker 5: pouch that is just still perfectly handmade, and it's in
Speaker 5: my mom's jewelry box and she still has it there
Speaker 5: to this day. So I literally just saw it.
Speaker 1: Oh you yeah.
Speaker 4: Now you know I needed the money, but it was so.
Speaker 5: Special to me that I remember being like, I need
Speaker 5: to take this and I need to put this special
Speaker 5: date inside. And that was the gift from my mom
Speaker 5: was your beating.
Speaker 4: Oh thank you so much. That's so sweet.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 4: I also worked as a cigarette girl. Uh yeah during
Speaker 4: Boy Meets World.
Speaker 3: I remember that you had the tray.
Speaker 5: Oh okay, the life I was like a cigarette.
Speaker 1: They haven't like I don't remember anybody had my cigarettes what.
Speaker 4: Like the fifties costume. I would work like Monday nights
Speaker 4: from ten to three in the morning. Uh, just for
Speaker 4: that extra money. And it was so funny because I,
Speaker 4: you know, I had the whole tray, all these cigarettes
Speaker 4: and candy, and I wasn't interested in like meeting, you know,
Speaker 4: going to raves. I was there like I'm gonna make money,
Speaker 4: Like I wanted to go to the best club. So
Speaker 4: I would stand literally in front of and next to
Speaker 4: the cigarette machine with my whole tray of cigarettes. So
Speaker 4: my cigarettes were like two seventy five, no, three twenty five,
Speaker 4: and the cigarette machine was two twenty five. So I
Speaker 4: would stand there and people would come up to the
Speaker 4: cigarette machine. I'd be like really, and I'd be like,
Speaker 4: all right, yeah, I'll take what you So I would
Speaker 4: like pack it, open it, light it for them. They
Speaker 4: would give me like a five dollars and I would
Speaker 4: just go thank you, and they would be like uh,
Speaker 4: And I'm like, oh you want to change.
Speaker 3: They're like that's.
Speaker 5: Likely people into tips.
Speaker 1: I love it. I love it.
Speaker 5: Where was this in La? Where was this?
Speaker 4: Yeah? Well it was I think it was called the
Speaker 4: China Club. It was something in Beverly Hills. I didn't
Speaker 4: want to work any of the other hip, you know,
Speaker 4: young people clubs. I wanted where the most money was.
Speaker 3: So I was a club.
Speaker 1: Yeah wait, how did you get a job like that?
Speaker 1: Was there like a cigarette girl agency? That was like
Speaker 1: sending people?
Speaker 4: Yes, Miss Kidney's concessions, you guys. I had so many
Speaker 4: weird jobs. I also worked the William Morris Agency, do
Speaker 4: you know what? So I totally like faked my way
Speaker 4: into that job too, Like this has been my mo
Speaker 4: my whole life. It's like, Okay, how can I like
Speaker 4: get in through the back door and like figure out
Speaker 4: a creative way because I'm never going to be an
Speaker 4: actor waiting tables or doing it the traditional way. I'm
Speaker 4: just going to learn from the inside out. So sorry,
Speaker 4: I got so many stories, you guys. It just cut
Speaker 4: me off and we're like going to the boy.
Speaker 1: That's what we're here for.
Speaker 4: So basically, right out of college, I moved to LA.
Speaker 4: I had no family support. I was completely broke. I
Speaker 4: crashed with like a friend, you know, like sleeping on
Speaker 4: her couch. I eventually got an apartment and I had
Speaker 4: no car in La. So I went to a temp agency,
Speaker 4: had no idea what was going on. They're like, okay,
Speaker 4: we have an opening at the William Morris Agency. You're
Speaker 4: going to be subbing at a new agent's desk for
Speaker 4: a few days. I'm like, no, kad, no idea what
Speaker 4: it was. So I show up and I'm like, ooh,
Speaker 4: I took a bus. So that was like an hour
Speaker 4: early ahead of me. So I took a bus. I'm
Speaker 4: in Beverly Hills. I'm like, oh, this is a big deal.
Speaker 4: So I sit on the desk and looking around and
Speaker 4: they're like, all you have to do is just answer phones. He's,
Speaker 4: you know, gonna be interview. He was a new agent.
Speaker 4: His name was Rick. He was kind of like Matthew Perry.
Speaker 4: He looked like a blonde Matthew Perry and he had
Speaker 4: the same irreverent sense of humor. And so he was
Speaker 4: brand new. So he got like a ton of jobs that,
Speaker 4: like the other agents didn't want, so he was really
Speaker 4: like trying to juggle everything. He'd be like, okay, here's
Speaker 4: a list of actors. There's the headshot room. It was
Speaker 4: in the commercial and voiceover department. He's like, just go
Speaker 4: pull the headshots, put them in an envelope, and then
Speaker 4: send them to dispatch. You know, I'm like okay. So
Speaker 4: as I was doing all that stuff and just answer
Speaker 4: the phones, he was interviewing for a full time assistant.
Speaker 4: So he was so funny. I had such a great
Speaker 4: time with him. So I kept calling up that temp
Speaker 4: agency and I said hey, make sure you put me
Speaker 4: on this guy's desk tomorrow. They're like, okay, So Rick's office,
Speaker 4: So he would be facing the door and whoever was
Speaker 4: interviewing would have their back to the door. So I
Speaker 4: had one of those like rolling chairs, so as he
Speaker 4: was interviewing, I would literally roll past the doorway and
Speaker 4: I'd be like and I was just making him laugh
Speaker 4: the whole time. Oh, and I was like, So finally,
Speaker 4: after three days he comes out and he goes, do
Speaker 4: you just want this job? I'm like, oh, yeah, fu,
Speaker 4: you never ask. So I got the job and like
Speaker 4: a week later, you know, we didn't even have computers.
Speaker 4: This is like eighty nine or something. So I'm at
Speaker 4: the typewriter typing up a contract he gave me, and
Speaker 4: he's standing over me. He's like, you have no idea
Speaker 4: how to type? Do you?
Speaker 5: Like?
Speaker 4: No, He's like, you've never been an administrative assistant, have you?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 4: Okay? Great? And I was there for We had the
Speaker 4: best time. He gave me so much responsibility because he
Speaker 4: was so busy. And then about a year later I
Speaker 4: got pulled in you know, you know, the whole famous
Speaker 4: like male you know that William Morris back in the day.
Speaker 4: You would do mailroom dispatch junior agent. Then you would
Speaker 4: become an agent. So in the voiceover department, people would
Speaker 4: come in an audition so I could listen to them.
Speaker 4: I would call up there, you know, I would get
Speaker 4: them into their auditions a voicecaster and he laying Craig.
Speaker 4: I don't even know if these places are around anymore.
Speaker 4: And sometimes I would if like somebody canceled and say, oh,
Speaker 4: I can't make it this audition. I would sometimes call
Speaker 4: up as that actor and imitate them. So I would
Speaker 4: like to do a voice and be like, hey, I'm
Speaker 4: really sorry, I can't make it today, and they'd be like,
Speaker 4: oh no, no worries, and I'm like, okay, I can do this.
Speaker 4: So I was like learning behind the scenes. And after
Speaker 4: a year the head of the department came up to
Speaker 4: me and he said, listen, we love you. We would
Speaker 4: like to offer you skipping the entire process. You will
Speaker 4: be driving a Mercedes in a year. Would you like
Speaker 4: to be an agent here? And that was my crossroads
Speaker 4: where I was like like nope, because I don't want
Speaker 4: to throw away my dream of being an actor. So
Speaker 4: I left and became a waitress and hated that. Yeah,
Speaker 4: so that was my kids. Yeah, and he helped me
Speaker 4: a lot.
Speaker 3: How did you then get into voiceover?
Speaker 4: Well, so Rick the agent, he was like, well, because
Speaker 4: I could imitate everybody, everybody on the roster, I could
Speaker 4: do it. And I was watching them audition yea, and
Speaker 4: he was like, I want you to study with At
Speaker 4: the time, Sue Blue, I don't know if you know yeap.
Speaker 4: She did my demo. She hired me for a job
Speaker 4: because I had no no representation, and they were like, oh,
Speaker 4: we'll represent you. I'm like, okay, I'm at William Morris
Speaker 4: with zero, zero experience. So that's kind of how I
Speaker 4: got into it was just taking some classes. Sue produced
Speaker 4: my animation demo. She hired me for a job. I
Speaker 4: did voiceovers on on y'all show. But when I moved
Speaker 4: to North Carolina Ashville, there were two do you know
Speaker 4: ISDN technology? Okay, so that was the technology when I,
Speaker 4: you know, started, So I moved here. There were two
Speaker 4: ISDN studios here in town that were competitors. But all
Speaker 4: the actors can work for any however many you want.
Speaker 4: So we didn't have home studios at the time, so
Speaker 4: I would literally drive and then there was another studio
Speaker 4: forty five minutes away and another one two and a
Speaker 4: half hours away, so it was the same few people
Speaker 4: doing all the jobs. So I would just drive from
Speaker 4: once through the day. I would have like four or
Speaker 4: five sessions a day, and they were but they were
Speaker 4: low paying because it was it was we were right
Speaker 4: to work state and I was a financial core member
Speaker 4: of the union. So I did quantity, not quality, and
Speaker 4: then eventually built a home studio because they were needing that.
Speaker 4: So I had a whisper room and iced DAN Technology
Speaker 4: and all the other voice actors who maybe weren't quite
Speaker 4: that serious, they were like, oh I don't I'm not
Speaker 4: investing in that, you know. So that kind of that
Speaker 4: even narrowed it further and it was just the same
Speaker 4: bunch of us doing all the jobs. And it was great.
Speaker 4: It was the heyday. And then of course, like everything changes,
Speaker 4: and then iced DN went away. It was sources connect
Speaker 4: and then everything opened up and anybody with an iPhone
Speaker 4: can say, oh, I'm a voice talent now. Yeah, everything changed.
Speaker 4: But my daughter when she was born, when I had
Speaker 4: the home studio, they didn't have like kids on the roster,
Speaker 4: and they were like, hey, can you throw your kid
Speaker 4: in the booth. She was two and a half and
Speaker 4: she would do line. I would just feed her a
Speaker 4: line and she was fearless. She would just do it.
Speaker 4: So she was a voice actor from two years old
Speaker 4: all the way through high school. Never cared about it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, cool, I remember, gave it up to be a doctor.
Speaker 1: Come on, come on, Jackie. Do you remember the week
Speaker 1: when the Simpsons actors were renegotiating and you went in
Speaker 1: for was it least Simpson? Yes?
Speaker 4: Remember, yes?
Speaker 1: And I never sitting around talking with you and you
Speaker 1: were like, I want this job obviously, but we were
Speaker 1: having the whole thing like but we also know that
Speaker 1: these actors are great and they kind of deserve more money.
Speaker 1: And it was like this whole discussion, but you were like, yeah,
Speaker 1: but this is a game change if I and we
Speaker 1: were like, yeah, you gotta you got a audition for that.
Speaker 1: But I remember like that was the first time hearing
Speaker 1: about like for me, like because I hadn't done any
Speaker 1: voiceover yet, and like you were, you were like, I'm
Speaker 1: up for Lisa Simpson. I'm going in. I remember hearing
Speaker 1: you do it. I was like, oh my god, I
Speaker 1: want you to.
Speaker 4: Get in the job. They never had any intention of
Speaker 4: replacing it.
Speaker 1: They brought you to just scare the crap out of them.
Speaker 4: But it was still fun to go in and be like,
Speaker 4: I can I can do this. I mean I knew
Speaker 4: always I could do this, just I didn't have the face.
Speaker 4: I didn't have the I was never going to be
Speaker 4: plucked or discovered or I knew I couldn't go the
Speaker 4: traditional way. I was going to have to go figure
Speaker 4: out how to be an actor a different way. And
Speaker 4: I just took me a long time. But it, like
Speaker 4: you know, I eventually did it. But I do have
Speaker 4: another story this. This was another turning point where I
Speaker 4: realized I'm just not I don't look like on camera.
Speaker 4: It's just not going to happen for me. So it
Speaker 4: was a boy Meets World episode.
Speaker 1: And.
Speaker 4: So they it was an episode where Turner's old girlfriend
Speaker 4: shows up Anthony Tyler Quinn's old girlfriend.
Speaker 5: I remember the New Year's episode was that it No
Speaker 5: New Year's.
Speaker 1: Episode was three old girlfriends. This is the one where
Speaker 1: he went to dinner with the girl Connecticut jacket girl
Speaker 1: from Connecticut.
Speaker 5: That I never saw the episode Westport Girl. That's it.
Speaker 4: Yeah, they didn't hire any actress. They couldn't cast her.
Speaker 4: So for like three days I was playing the girlfriend,
Speaker 4: and I remember I knew all lines and for run through,
Speaker 4: and you know, I wasn't overacting or anything. I was
Speaker 4: just doing the lines. But for run through, I knew,
Speaker 4: like the producers, they need to see if things are working.
Speaker 4: You can't just like read it flat. I mean, they
Speaker 4: needed to know our joke's landing, you know. So I
Speaker 4: took it seriously. I'm gonna give him something to see.
Speaker 4: And so there was this one moment where they turner
Speaker 4: and this girl have some kind of awkward goodbye, you know,
Speaker 4: at the door and they're like, oh, Gordon, and he
Speaker 4: shuts the door and she turns away and she's kind
Speaker 4: of thinking, just thinking, and he's on the other side
Speaker 4: of the door and they're both like thinking. She turned,
Speaker 4: you know, kind of takes this moment of like and
Speaker 4: she turns, she goes up to the door ready to knock,
Speaker 4: and he opens it. It was like a timing thing.
Speaker 4: So at the run through, I didn't know how long
Speaker 4: he was going to be and just was this moment
Speaker 4: that I turned to the door, I put my arm up,
Speaker 4: he opened the door, and we kissed, real kissed. Like,
Speaker 4: we kissed, and I know, so I've been married to
Speaker 4: my husband since nineteen ninety five. Anthony Tyler Quinn is
Speaker 4: the only man I ever kissed besides my husband. We don't.
Speaker 4: And then afterwards he was married too, you know, we
Speaker 4: were like. He was like, oh my god, I'm sorry.
Speaker 4: Is that okay? I was like, no, no, I'm sorry.
Speaker 4: I mean we just did it. And so like after that,
Speaker 4: a bunch of people came up to me and said, wow,
Speaker 4: you're really that was great. Why don't they just give
Speaker 4: you the part? And I remember thinking, because I'm not
Speaker 4: pretty enough, and so I remember knowing that. I was like,
Speaker 4: I am not a leading lady. I never will be it.
Speaker 4: I can't have this part. So they bring in the
Speaker 4: actress and she was fine.
Speaker 3: She was nice.
Speaker 4: I still have no problem with her. She did fine.
Speaker 4: So you know how we tape the show before the
Speaker 4: audience came in. We'd get everything in the can and
Speaker 4: then you know, the audience would come in. You guys
Speaker 4: would do it live. So during the day when they
Speaker 4: were filming, you know, she was filming that one scene
Speaker 4: and Dedie goes, Jackie kim here. I said what And
Speaker 4: I thought, oh ohm, I in trouble. She had her
Speaker 4: head set on. She goes, I think you need to
Speaker 4: hear this. She takes her head set off, she puts
Speaker 4: it on me. All the camera guys and all the
Speaker 4: people in the room upstairs going jacky, jacky jackey on
Speaker 4: her scene, and I just wanted to cry.
Speaker 3: I was like, oh, oh my god, Like I.
Speaker 4: Just it was so meaningful to me, Like it's not
Speaker 4: that I suck, It's just that I won't be able
Speaker 4: to go this route. I'm just gonna have to figure
Speaker 4: out another way.
Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, ya.
Speaker 1: I don't you know, it's funny. I'm I'm interested that
Speaker 1: you, you know, you sort of say like I'm not pretty enough.
Speaker 1: First of all, that's just ridiculous in my opinion, but
Speaker 1: I also think that that's not I think, you know,
Speaker 1: I think there's something. Unfortunately, especially for the producers and
Speaker 1: writers of our show, there was all the if you
Speaker 1: were a stand in you were there were so many
Speaker 1: strikes against you, like you they like they.
Speaker 3: Were familiar with you, but yeah, and.
Speaker 1: So they never took you seriously as an actor. And
Speaker 1: it was like, you know, you would have been better
Speaker 1: in another situation. You know, if you could have like
Speaker 1: been auditioning or acting in a but within the context
Speaker 1: of our show. Like I think the strikes were against
Speaker 1: you just contextually, you know, like and it had nothing
Speaker 1: to do with your looks or your acting or any
Speaker 1: of that. It's just literally like they're obsessed with like
Speaker 1: who the casting director gets or like there's just there
Speaker 1: was like this ceiling too to the to being a Sunday.
Speaker 1: You're a placeholder.
Speaker 5: Yeah, if you come in and you are doing better
Speaker 5: than the actor that they cast, they.
Speaker 1: Will never see it.
Speaker 5: You will never see it because I don't see that.
Speaker 5: They're just standing in until we get the real actor.
Speaker 5: And it was exactly they could give.
Speaker 1: You an extra job, right, they give you a background job,
Speaker 1: They could give you a one line maybe, but something
Speaker 1: like that, like a real like a guest star role.
Speaker 1: There was no way that was ever going to happen,
Speaker 1: no matter how good you were, you know. And but
Speaker 1: I just want to say, it's not about your your
Speaker 1: talent obviously, which I think you know, but also wasn't
Speaker 1: about your looks. It was it was about the context
Speaker 1: of that whole situation.
Speaker 5: Like it depends on the producers, it depends on the
Speaker 5: writers because again you guys know I bring this up
Speaker 5: every single time, and you'd make fun of me for it.
Speaker 5: But MASH, there was a an actress on MASH who
Speaker 5: started as as a background actor, who was there for
Speaker 5: years as a background actor. Then she started to have
Speaker 5: a few lines. Then she started have a few lines,
Speaker 5: and then season eight or nine there was an episode
Speaker 5: all about her. She starred in the episode, right, And
Speaker 5: so you will occasionally get shows where you you know,
Speaker 5: they will see you for for who you are and
Speaker 5: then use that talent. But unfortunately, I don't think our
Speaker 5: just want to know.
Speaker 4: I don't know Rare Right, Yeah, I don't think you did.
Speaker 4: Some of the some of the writers were like we
Speaker 4: would hang out sometimes after taping. We would go to
Speaker 4: a bar and I would sit with Howard and Matt
Speaker 4: Nelson and what was.
Speaker 1: The bar in the valley? Like the Mexican to this
Speaker 1: Mexican restaurant?
Speaker 5: What was that the cantina orsa vega.
Speaker 4: No idea. I don't know.
Speaker 1: I just remember There's like one time near the end
Speaker 1: of the show where I finally got to see like
Speaker 1: where the writers went. I was like, Oh, it's like
Speaker 1: this dark, cool Mexican restaurant in the Valley.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I would go and I'd be an equal like
Speaker 4: it's weird, Like I'd be like, we be friends and
Speaker 4: hang out, and then I'd come to this set and
Speaker 4: it's like, Okay, yeah, I know my place.
Speaker 2: I would like to say one other thing now, as
Speaker 2: a as a director who's been on the other side
Speaker 2: of those conversations, I've been in the rooms with the
Speaker 2: EPs when they're talking about whether or not to give
Speaker 2: a role to a stand in. Really a lot a
Speaker 2: lot of time, what comes up is they don't want
Speaker 2: there to be animosity and competition between the with the
Speaker 2: other stand ins, and if we give this role to
Speaker 2: Jackie this week, we are then going to feel like
Speaker 2: we have to make it equal for the other stand ins,
Speaker 2: and we don't want to be beholden to that. We
Speaker 2: don't want to have to in our minds be thinking about, well,
Speaker 2: we gave a role to Jackie. And so sometimes you
Speaker 2: lose out on the role simply because they don't want
Speaker 2: to set a precedent, I guess. So there's a lot
Speaker 2: of things.
Speaker 1: That its awful Catch twenty two of, Like, the only
Speaker 1: reason you take a stand in job is because you
Speaker 1: want to be an actor, right for the most part.
Speaker 1: I mean maybe there's exceptions, but it seems to me
Speaker 1: like your only interest in it is to be within
Speaker 1: the industry to get the experience. But then because you're
Speaker 1: categorized as a stand in the same like you said
Speaker 1: Jackie about being an extra, it's like you're a second
Speaker 1: class actor and so within that context, they might never
Speaker 1: be able to see you in this other light. So
Speaker 1: in a weird way, it's like, while you're getting this experience,
Speaker 1: while you're making connections, you're making connections sort of classified
Speaker 1: as this other thing, you know, and that's like it's
Speaker 1: a really tough you know. So yeah, I mean it
Speaker 1: makes perfect sense that you were able to achieve voiceover
Speaker 1: success because within that context, you know, you're just just
Speaker 1: your pure talent, it's just your voice.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 4: But I had to leave LA to become become an actor, yeah, actor.
Speaker 1: You know, I think that's always the case, right, It's
Speaker 1: like you just have to you have to be super
Speaker 1: confident and like comfortable with your own life and your
Speaker 1: own self and that and that shines through in everything
Speaker 1: that you do. And I think like for you, clearly
Speaker 1: you you when you when the second you made that
Speaker 1: move of like well this is what I care about.
Speaker 1: This is then I think that that plays out in
Speaker 1: every other aspect of your life where that confidence probably
Speaker 1: you know, helped you all around.
Speaker 4: Just had to get creative. I had to do everything
Speaker 4: just a little bit differently than the standard way.
Speaker 7: But that's okay.
Speaker 5: You you said that you don't think Michael even knew
Speaker 5: your name, which brings me to something that for Unfortunately
Speaker 5: for writer Danielle and I, we saw an episode not
Speaker 5: too long ago that took place in part of it
Speaker 5: took place in the Wilderness Store, and one of the
Speaker 5: actors in the Wilderness Store was one of our stand ins.
Speaker 5: Featured background was one of our stand ins, and we
Speaker 5: couldn't remember his name.
Speaker 4: Wait a minute. It was a guy named Mark Mark Mark,
Speaker 4: and Mark had like some kind of strange to pay
Speaker 4: Maybe Mark.
Speaker 5: I remember he had glasses. It was exactly yes, okay,
Speaker 5: so it was Mark Mark.
Speaker 1: So he was there for a very short time.
Speaker 4: I think, yeah, And I don't know who I mean,
Speaker 4: I didn't come in at the beginning. Who was there
Speaker 4: before me? Who was the female.
Speaker 5: People?
Speaker 1: We had little people for the first season because because
Speaker 1: we were we were smaller, we were all kids. So
Speaker 1: the first season. It was it was three. It was
Speaker 1: Kevin and Tracy, Tracy and and uh.
Speaker 5: Oh my god, Kevin, Tracy and John. No, I can
Speaker 5: picture them all. Two of them were married. Tracy was
Speaker 5: married right.
Speaker 1: To the guy who we can't remember. Yeah, oh my god,
Speaker 1: what was his name?
Speaker 5: N I thought it was John, but I could be wrong. Yeah,
Speaker 5: So it was we had little people the first was it.
Speaker 1: Only the first season that we had little people, and
Speaker 1: maybe a little bit of the second, but you know,
Speaker 1: then Ben and I got tall, and so it was
Speaker 1: really only Morgan was the only.
Speaker 3: Let's explain that a little bit too.
Speaker 2: So when you have a kid's show, at least back
Speaker 2: in the nineties, it was very common practice that your
Speaker 2: stand ins would they would try to find stand ins
Speaker 2: that were as close to your height as possible. Because
Speaker 2: although lighting on a multi camera set is not quite
Speaker 2: as important as Jackie mentioned, on a film set where
Speaker 2: they're really lightingt framing is important. The cameras need to
Speaker 2: know if someone is if a child is sitting, and
Speaker 2: then they stand up. Camera needs to know what the
Speaker 2: focus needs to be when they stand up. Lighting needs
Speaker 2: to know where do I need to light Where's And
Speaker 2: so our first season the majority of our stand ins
Speaker 2: were little people, and because.
Speaker 1: Then adults, because then they can work longer hours because
Speaker 1: of kids. Then you have to provide school, you have to,
Speaker 1: you know, so you need grown ups who are under
Speaker 1: you know, the five foot or whatever. We were four
Speaker 1: and a half feet. So yeah, so you end up
Speaker 1: with like a little people, which we had.
Speaker 9: Yeah, and now I have to pang a hair almost,
Speaker 9: I know exactly did you ever think when you were
Speaker 9: working on Boy Meets World that we would still be
Speaker 9: talking about it thirty years later?
Speaker 4: No, first of all thirty years that just was I know, incomprehensible.
Speaker 5: Yep.
Speaker 4: No, I mean I followed it when I left, and
Speaker 4: I followed Girl Meets World, and I you know, knew
Speaker 4: loosely what you guys were doing, but I know, I
Speaker 4: knew it was a major, major show. I had a
Speaker 4: major impact on a lot. You guys have super fans.
Speaker 4: It was a big deal for a lot of people.
Speaker 4: So am I surprised? No? Not really. I mean it
Speaker 4: warms my heart to see you guys together, still friends,
Speaker 4: still like not poopooing this experience, but like really looking
Speaker 4: at it from a different perspective, more mature, you know.
Speaker 4: But being super honest and transparent, but also really treating
Speaker 4: it with respect and like being so good to your fans.
Speaker 4: I mean, gosh, I love that. I love that, Jackie.
Speaker 1: I have this memory that it's kind of weird, and
Speaker 1: you probably don't remember it, but I wanted to bring
Speaker 1: it up because I think it shows like my mindset
Speaker 1: at the time, which is like just doesn't make sense
Speaker 1: to me now. But when you were leaving, like I remember,
Speaker 1: we were all very sad, and it was like in
Speaker 1: the middle of the season, and it was like, oh
Speaker 1: my gosh, well that's good for you that you're, you know,
Speaker 1: making this move, and you seemed really happy. And then
Speaker 1: I remember you asked me to sign like a script
Speaker 1: or a photograph or whatever, and I got really upset
Speaker 1: and like yeah, and I was like I'm not And
Speaker 1: I remember being like it was like a big deal
Speaker 1: of saying but Jackie's my friend, Like I'm not going
Speaker 1: to sign. And I did eventually do it, but it
Speaker 1: just goes to show that, like, you know, and of
Speaker 1: course now I'm like, I'm glad I signed it, and
Speaker 1: I'm glad because we haven't stayed in touch. But when
Speaker 1: you were nineteen eighteen years old and you're on a
Speaker 1: TV show and we work together. I was like, well,
Speaker 1: Jackie's always going to be in my life, We're always
Speaker 1: going to be friends. Why should I have to sign
Speaker 1: something for her? And like what a jackass? Like what
Speaker 1: a like classic? You know, like why you know it's
Speaker 1: like or on the flip side, like why didn't we
Speaker 1: keep in touch? Like you know, shut up?
Speaker 4: Writer, like but it was so social media though at
Speaker 4: the time totally it was just like that.
Speaker 1: It just show's the bubble that we were in, do
Speaker 1: you know what I mean? Like the bubble that I
Speaker 1: was in, certainly like where I was and I had
Speaker 1: this real like moments.
Speaker 5: Got the original mug too. Look at that, oh.
Speaker 4: Truly, and you know it's weird. Writer. I have pictures
Speaker 4: because we didn't have cell phone you know, camera phones
Speaker 4: at the time. I'm so sad. I have a picture
Speaker 4: of me and Danielle hugging me, and Will hugging me
Speaker 4: and Ben hugging and I don't have a picture with you,
Speaker 4: and I'm so sad of me and Bill.
Speaker 2: I have like the next time writers in Ashville, you
Speaker 2: should stop by. And I also want to talk to
Speaker 2: you before we say goodbye to you. I want to
Speaker 2: talk to you about your other art. You were such
Speaker 2: an artist, a voiceover artist, and actor, all these things,
Speaker 2: but I want to talk to you about your your
Speaker 2: physical media art.
Speaker 3: Tell me about the well.
Speaker 4: I was always creative, but I just wanted to be
Speaker 4: an actor, so that was all the focus. But when
Speaker 4: I had a home studio and I didn't drive to
Speaker 4: all the studios all the time, I would have all
Speaker 4: this downtime at home. So in my basement where my
Speaker 4: booth was, I had another room that I kind of
Speaker 4: turned into a craft room an art studio, and I
Speaker 4: just loved making things where I didn't have to wait
Speaker 4: for permission to practice my craft. You know, as a
Speaker 4: voiceover actor, you gotta wait. I mean, you can walk
Speaker 4: around doing voices all day, but you have to be cast.
Speaker 4: You have to you know, you gotta wait to practice
Speaker 4: your craft. And I was like, oh, I can paint,
Speaker 4: you know, whatever I want, anytime I want, and I
Speaker 4: can be the total boss of this. So I started
Speaker 4: doing that, and then I got into my first gallery
Speaker 4: the same way I did everything else. Totally my way
Speaker 4: through that, and I had no experience. I basically went
Speaker 4: to a really prestigious gallery here in the River Arts District.
Speaker 4: This is my gallery, by the way, And I went
Speaker 4: up to the gallery owner and I said, I would
Speaker 4: love for you to carry my work. And I can't
Speaker 4: afford rent to pay rent to have a working studio
Speaker 4: in the district, So if you would give me a
Speaker 4: corner of your gallery that I could paint in, and
Speaker 4: if you will represent me, I will work for free
Speaker 4: three days a week volunteer at your gallery so you
Speaker 4: can take off and I will help your customers, and
Speaker 4: again so I can learn everything about the gallery and
Speaker 4: being a good artist. And he was like done. So
Speaker 4: I did that. I got my first representation. And this
Speaker 4: gallery is right upstairs from that gallery, and I would
Speaker 4: come visit here, and this had many artists in it,
Speaker 4: and I remember thinking, if I ever had my own gallery,
Speaker 4: I really like that. And then an opening came up
Speaker 4: and the girl that had this space, there's like a leaseholder,
Speaker 4: and then there were sub letters. She invited me to
Speaker 4: be a part of this gallery, which I did, and
Speaker 4: I still said one day. She was here for ten years,
Speaker 4: and the days she decided to do something else, she said,
Speaker 4: would you like to over the gallery?
Speaker 5: I'm like, oh yeah.
Speaker 4: I eventually always got what I wanted, always through a
Speaker 4: creative way. That's been pretty much my life. So now
Speaker 4: I do this more full time and I still do voiceovers,
Speaker 4: but not as much. I have a few regular clients.
Speaker 4: I still have my home studio. I still do it,
Speaker 4: but I just don't the mark is just different. It's
Speaker 4: just a different situation now.
Speaker 2: So well, finely, when we asked you to check out
Speaker 2: the Shallow Boy episode where you totally steal the scene
Speaker 2: with the greatest disease, what are your feelings when you
Speaker 2: see yourself twenty five years ago or so on screen,
Speaker 2: and what would you tell that version of Jackie.
Speaker 4: Oh, that's very emotional, to be honest, of course, the
Speaker 4: first thing I did when I saw myself was ooh,
Speaker 4: I was not not pretty. I just looked at myself
Speaker 4: and just said, oh. But I thought it was funny.
Speaker 4: I thought it was a funny moment. I loved the scene.
Speaker 4: I loved watching the episode. It was a little hard
Speaker 4: to watch myself, and I think maybe that's maybe that
Speaker 4: is where things just kind of worked out for the best.
Speaker 4: Where I just never did on camera. I did voiceover
Speaker 4: work where that was not a factor. I can be
Speaker 4: a grandmother, I can be a little kid. I can
Speaker 4: do you know, I wouldn't have that, But it was
Speaker 4: that was hard to watch myself, to be honest, it
Speaker 4: was it was difficult and I never yeah yeah, But
Speaker 4: then I watched it again and I kind of got
Speaker 4: over it and got it.
Speaker 7: Got it, Get over yourself.
Speaker 2: Jack What would you like to tell that version of Jackie?
Speaker 2: What would you like to tell your young self?
Speaker 4: I would just say, keep going, girl. You will get
Speaker 4: every single thing you want. It's just going to take
Speaker 4: a while. And just take notes. Be nice, be kind,
Speaker 4: be respectful, just don't don't get discouraged. You'll get there.
Speaker 4: It'll just be a little different. It'll just look a
Speaker 4: little different, but you'll get there.
Speaker 3: Well.
Speaker 2: I am perfectly comfortable speaking for all of us on
Speaker 2: this zoom when I say to you, without trying to
Speaker 2: be creepy, we have never once thought of you as
Speaker 2: anything other than extremely talented and absolutely beautiful.
Speaker 3: Yes, you have never. It is never.
Speaker 2: None of the thoughts that you have had about yourself
Speaker 2: in that way have ever ever crossed our minds.
Speaker 4: Nope, thank you.
Speaker 2: You You are special and you are unique, and you
Speaker 2: are funny, and all of our memories with you are
Speaker 2: positive and in all of our memories you are beautiful
Speaker 2: the same way you are now.
Speaker 4: Thank you so much, you guys. I'm just so happy
Speaker 4: all of you. Just your lives have turned out so well.
Speaker 4: Your parents, you're married, you're successful, you're behind the scenes,
Speaker 4: you haven't You've all flourished. You know, as we know
Speaker 4: child actors, there's many ways that can turn out. And you, guys,
Speaker 4: I always was hoping for the best for you, and
Speaker 4: you guys did it. I'm just so happy.
Speaker 2: Well, thank you happy, and thank you for all that
Speaker 2: you contributed to our ears on Boy Meets World. Please
Speaker 2: let people know where they can find you, where they
Speaker 2: can find your art, give us all your where where
Speaker 2: can we find you?
Speaker 5: So?
Speaker 4: I am on Instagram at Jackie fell f e h L.
Speaker 4: I am in Asheville and the River Arts District. I
Speaker 4: have this gallery. I also have a home studio, not
Speaker 4: on Facebook much but kind of there. And yeah, I
Speaker 4: think I think that's it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And so for for Instagram, it is also j
Speaker 2: A c q u I and then as she spelled
Speaker 2: fell f e h L. You can find her there
Speaker 2: and see all of her incredible art.
Speaker 3: And Jackie voiceover chick.
Speaker 4: Is you can hear my weird little demos on voiceover
Speaker 4: chick dot com. It hasn't been updated. It still says
Speaker 4: I s dan technology. But if you want to hear
Speaker 4: my demos, that's where they are.
Speaker 3: So incredible.
Speaker 2: Jackie, thank you so much for spending your time with
Speaker 2: us this morning. It's been such a pleasure to see
Speaker 2: you again and reconnect with you.
Speaker 1: You too, You guys, let's hang out.
Speaker 8: Are we doing?
Speaker 1: And we're doing. We're in North Carolina, but we're where
Speaker 1: are we going? We're going to Durham, Durham. That's pretty
Speaker 1: far right.
Speaker 4: My daughter's in like an hour from Chapel Hill, not
Speaker 4: far from you guys. She's at school at Campbell University.
Speaker 4: But I know I was thinking should I drive out
Speaker 4: there and crash?
Speaker 2: But yes, think if you're able to, please do.
Speaker 3: We would love to see you.
Speaker 4: Thanks you guys, So proud of you all and appreciate
Speaker 4: you so much.
Speaker 2: Thank you by Jackie. Yeah, that's actually a great idea.
Speaker 2: Jensen just said she can come up. She can be
Speaker 2: a part of our live show and docre.
Speaker 5: Where she comes throws everything in the back of the
Speaker 5: be amazing. Yeah, love it be fun.
Speaker 1: God is so good to see her.
Speaker 3: I know, I know, she looks exactly the same.
Speaker 2: Her hair color has changed, she wasn't gray back then,
Speaker 2: but that's it.
Speaker 1: And I'm so glad you said somedingy, Danielle, because once
Speaker 1: again it would be creepy for me to talk about
Speaker 1: how beautiful she was. Always so gorgeous. Gorgeous, that's like
Speaker 1: one of the defining things about Jacket. So the fact
Speaker 1: that she brought it up multiple times, like I wasn't
Speaker 1: pretty enough, is like, wow, that's just you know, we
Speaker 1: all have these things about ourselves, you know, and especially
Speaker 1: I think for actors it's always you know, how you
Speaker 1: look is just the thing that you're concerned about because
Speaker 1: so much of the industry, especially back then. I'm hoping
Speaker 1: it's less so, but you know, it is superficial. It's
Speaker 1: part of the job is to be and so you
Speaker 1: have to be concerned with presentation, and unfortunately that becomes
Speaker 1: so much self judgment and self doubt and man, it's
Speaker 1: such a bumber to hear at somebody so beautiful.
Speaker 5: Ever ever, she looks like like in my casting head,
Speaker 5: she looks like a superhero. Yeah, hold on, looks like
Speaker 5: a superhero to me, Like I'd love to cast her
Speaker 5: in something where she plays a badass because she looks
Speaker 5: like a superhero. Yes, she's such a cool.
Speaker 3: So awesome.
Speaker 2: Well, thank you all for joining us for this episode
Speaker 2: of Pod Meets World. As always, you can follow us
Speaker 2: on Instagram pod meets World Show. You can send us
Speaker 2: your emails podmeets Worldshow at gmail dot com.
Speaker 3: And we have merch merch.
Speaker 5: For the love of God, somebody bring me the merch.
Speaker 3: Oh will send us out.
Speaker 5: We love you all, pod dismissed.
Speaker 1: Podmeets World is nheart podcast producer and hosted by Danielle Fischel,
Speaker 1: Wilfredell and Ryder Strong executive producers Jensen Karp and Amy Sugarman,
Speaker 1: Executive in charge of production, Danielle Romo, producer and editor,
Speaker 1: Tara Sudbaksh producer, Maddy Moore, engineer and Boy Meets World
Speaker 1: super fan Easton Allen.
Speaker 5: Our theme song is by Kyle Morton of Typhoon and
Speaker 5: you can follow us on Instagram at podmeets World Show
Speaker 5: or email us at Podmeets Worldshow at gmail dot com.