WEBVTT - Manner of Life 0:00:00.400 --> 0:00:03.920 The cheerleaders at a gym in Buffalo have been recording 0:00:03.960 --> 0:00:09.240 themselves to make a new documentary where the news reporters 0:00:09.240 --> 0:00:13.160 because one year ago a mass shooting changed their lives. 0:00:13.200 --> 0:00:15.400 He just walked around shot all the black people. The 0:00:15.480 --> 0:00:18.440 cheer squad, most of whom are black, had to figure 0:00:18.480 --> 0:00:21.160 out how to go on and how to compete. I 0:00:21.280 --> 0:00:23.840 wanted to win for them more than anything this season. 0:00:24.000 --> 0:00:28.640 Listen to the embedded podcast from NPR within the iHeartRadio app, 0:00:28.800 --> 0:00:32.720 or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Carol Fisher and 0:00:32.760 --> 0:00:36.800 I'm hosting a podcast called The Girlfriends. It's Las Vegas, 0:00:36.960 --> 0:00:40.200 it's the nineteen nineties, and it is time to find 0:00:40.240 --> 0:00:44.560 a husband. There were four Jewish doctors who were felt 0:00:44.600 --> 0:00:48.040 to be eligible bachelors. One of them was of the 0:00:48.640 --> 0:00:53.239 Baron bat On paper he was perfect, but in reality, 0:00:53.440 --> 0:00:58.080 this guy's a wacko. He shouted to the point went unconscious. 0:00:58.280 --> 0:01:00.560 I would call him and I would say, I know 0:01:00.600 --> 0:01:03.520 you killed my sister. You can listen to The Girlfriends 0:01:03.600 --> 0:01:07.680 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get 0:01:07.680 --> 0:01:11.840 your podcasts. Hi, I'm free and I'm rthy. We have 0:01:11.920 --> 0:01:14.760 spent the last twenty years building and working at some 0:01:14.800 --> 0:01:17.319 of the largest companies in the world. We worked with 0:01:17.440 --> 0:01:20.640 some remarkable people Rob mcalinney. When I see the people 0:01:20.680 --> 0:01:23.200 of Wrexham, I grew up exactly like them. Check Out 0:01:23.240 --> 0:01:26.480 the Arth and Tree Arm show. That is a R 0:01:26.760 --> 0:01:31.240 D HI and s R I R A M show. 0:01:31.760 --> 0:01:34.400 Listen to the Art Instrie Arm Show on the iHeart 0:01:34.480 --> 0:01:38.119 Radio app, Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. 0:01:39.240 --> 0:01:42.040 This is the story of a man who's fascinated me. 0:01:42.680 --> 0:01:45.759 His name was Sweet Daddy Grace, and that's a name 0:01:46.040 --> 0:01:49.200 you don't forget. He was a visionary who built a 0:01:49.240 --> 0:01:53.480 fortune as a black man during Jim Crow during the Depression, 0:01:53.840 --> 0:01:57.400 but today not many people know about him. The race 0:01:57.760 --> 0:02:00.280 sort of wiped out, and I wonder if this was 0:02:00.360 --> 0:02:04.880 done intentionally. Listen to Sweet Daddy Grace on the iHeartRadio app, 0:02:04.960 --> 0:02:12.079 Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. You live 0:02:12.160 --> 0:02:14.960 to try to defend your family, or you'd live to 0:02:15.000 --> 0:02:18.919 try to defend people if you can. It's not something 0:02:18.960 --> 0:02:21.440 I could put my finger on, but it's just inside 0:02:21.440 --> 0:02:24.640 of us. I would wait until hill of bullets for 0:02:24.680 --> 0:02:26.920 somebody in my family to this day, and I don't 0:02:26.919 --> 0:02:29.200 know why but it would, and everybody in my family 0:02:29.200 --> 0:02:37.880 would did the same. We just would. This is the 0:02:37.919 --> 0:02:44.080 Piked and Massacre returned to Pike County season three, Episode eight, 0:02:44.960 --> 0:02:51.120 Manner of Life. I'm Courtney Armstrong, a television producer at 0:02:51.200 --> 0:02:55.639 Katie's Studios with Stephanie Ledecker and Jeff Shane. So far 0:02:55.720 --> 0:02:58.280 the season, we've heard a lot about recent core proceedings 0:02:58.320 --> 0:03:01.000 between the Wagoners and the prosecute fusion that will shape 0:03:01.080 --> 0:03:05.919 upcoming trials. They've covered everything from where the trials will 0:03:05.919 --> 0:03:09.040 be held, what evidence will be allowed into testimony, and 0:03:09.160 --> 0:03:13.120 who might be charged with what. All of this leads 0:03:13.120 --> 0:03:15.040 to what we hope will be some small form of 0:03:15.080 --> 0:03:18.520 justice for the Roden, Gillie, and Manly families who lost 0:03:18.520 --> 0:03:22.480 the unthinkable. When the Masaker initially happens six years ago, 0:03:22.680 --> 0:03:26.720 a lot of the remaining family members spoke publicly. Not 0:03:26.880 --> 0:03:31.320 so in recent years, however, we've made contact with some 0:03:31.360 --> 0:03:33.920 people who want to share their memories of their family. 0:03:35.480 --> 0:03:38.280 Here's Jeff speaking with a Roden family member who reached 0:03:38.280 --> 0:03:41.280 out to us. They've asked us not to use their name. 0:03:43.000 --> 0:03:45.440 I'm curious how you found us and what made you 0:03:45.600 --> 0:03:48.680 contact us. Now I drive a lot on the road, 0:03:48.800 --> 0:03:52.840 and I listened to podcasts everywhere. I happened upon the 0:03:52.880 --> 0:03:56.480 Pike and Masker, which is part of my extended family. 0:03:56.480 --> 0:03:58.960 So I wanted to listen to it, and I was 0:03:59.120 --> 0:04:02.000 really impressed with the respect that was given to the family, 0:04:02.360 --> 0:04:05.880 and so a friend of mine and myself we eagerly 0:04:06.000 --> 0:04:08.080 wait every week to hear it, and so I just 0:04:08.160 --> 0:04:10.920 commented on it, you know, thanking you all for being 0:04:10.920 --> 0:04:15.480 respectful to the family. What is that experience like losing 0:04:15.640 --> 0:04:17.440 loved ones but then losing it in a way where 0:04:17.480 --> 0:04:19.960 other people are kind of a part of your experience. 0:04:20.480 --> 0:04:22.920 It'd be a strange thing to divine for you because 0:04:23.320 --> 0:04:25.240 we would see each other a few times a year 0:04:25.520 --> 0:04:28.800 at family unions and what have you. So it was 0:04:28.839 --> 0:04:31.120 a giant shop man. I hate to say this, but 0:04:31.200 --> 0:04:34.360 it wasn't as hurting to me as I know it 0:04:34.480 --> 0:04:37.080 was to a lot of the very close family members. 0:04:38.440 --> 0:04:42.000 And it's hard to describe a law such a loss 0:04:42.000 --> 0:04:45.960 of a large chunk of a family. When you first 0:04:46.000 --> 0:04:48.560 heard the podcast, what was your thought? I kind of 0:04:48.600 --> 0:04:51.039 got interested in yours because you all would give the 0:04:51.080 --> 0:04:53.479 facts as they were, and then you would talk about 0:04:53.520 --> 0:04:56.279 the possibilities of how that would make people feel. So 0:04:56.360 --> 0:04:59.560 that was very interesting to me. These are not just 0:04:59.640 --> 0:05:02.240 people who were removed from this earth. They were people. 0:05:02.279 --> 0:05:06.920 They were real people. You actually going after trying to 0:05:06.920 --> 0:05:10.279 bring real life people to this is pretty exciting to me. 0:05:10.640 --> 0:05:13.880 I mean, not making them as victims alone. You're making 0:05:13.920 --> 0:05:17.840 them as people, and that's appreciated. Jeff asked what growing 0:05:17.920 --> 0:05:19.720 up as a member of the Roden family was like 0:05:20.720 --> 0:05:24.839 he first spoke about Geneva Roden as a reminder, Geneva 0:05:24.960 --> 0:05:29.120 is Chris Roden seniors and Kenneth's mother, Frankie Hannah and 0:05:29.200 --> 0:05:33.919 little Chris's grandmother. Growing up, especially in my younger years, 0:05:34.160 --> 0:05:37.440 we would go visit Geneva and her family, and the 0:05:37.440 --> 0:05:41.080 things I remember the most. When you met Geneva, you 0:05:41.120 --> 0:05:45.240 were guaranteed a smile and always a hug, and whatever 0:05:45.279 --> 0:05:48.000 they had, whether it be a watermelon or a piece 0:05:48.040 --> 0:05:51.200 of cake or whatever it was, was shared with you. 0:05:51.240 --> 0:05:53.839 When you got there, you just became one of the kids. 0:05:54.360 --> 0:05:57.320 Geneva just was always the sweetest thing ever was and 0:05:57.440 --> 0:06:01.240 would just hug you to death. About three times a 0:06:01.360 --> 0:06:04.000 year our family would get together and we would just 0:06:04.080 --> 0:06:06.800 pile in a car and we would ride and see relatives, 0:06:07.279 --> 0:06:11.400 and Geneva lived close to other relatives, so we would 0:06:11.400 --> 0:06:14.200 just kind of make a big round trip into Ohio 0:06:14.240 --> 0:06:16.360 and then back into Kentucky. We would spend two or 0:06:16.360 --> 0:06:19.799 three days up there, just filing up wherever we could. 0:06:20.160 --> 0:06:22.680 And our family was that way. If you went to 0:06:22.720 --> 0:06:25.279 their house, they just made room for you. It didn't matter. 0:06:25.760 --> 0:06:27.919 You just had a great time, and you go swimming, 0:06:27.960 --> 0:06:30.640 and you do this and that. We didn't have Facebook 0:06:30.680 --> 0:06:32.680 or things like that in those days. It sounds like 0:06:32.720 --> 0:06:34.880 you like a nice way to grow up. It was, 0:06:35.200 --> 0:06:40.000 it really was. Immediately after the murders, Geneva spoke publicly 0:06:40.040 --> 0:06:44.520 about the unimatchinable loss she was facing. On April twenty second, 0:06:44.680 --> 0:06:48.640 twenty sixteen, in one single night, she lost her sons, 0:06:48.839 --> 0:06:54.280 Chris Roden Senior and Kenneth Roden, her grandchildren Frankie, Hannah 0:06:54.279 --> 0:06:59.920 May and Little Chris Roden, and her nephew Gary. Her word, 0:07:00.000 --> 0:07:02.800 it's where a stark juxtaposition to the idyllic glafe her 0:07:02.839 --> 0:07:09.280 family once lived. I'd like to say that I'm the 0:07:09.520 --> 0:07:21.520 mother Christopher Senior and the mother of Kenneth, and from 0:07:21.600 --> 0:07:30.600 my mother's heart that I hurt so bad inside from 0:07:30.680 --> 0:07:34.680 the day. That night I helmed out it's there's someone 0:07:34.840 --> 0:07:45.160 out there that knows anything about what happened with the 0:07:45.480 --> 0:07:55.240 please please come forward. There has to be so it 0:07:55.360 --> 0:08:00.520 was all both like the world had ended when I 0:08:00.640 --> 0:08:07.680 found out about the family that they took out, my grandchildren, 0:08:08.720 --> 0:08:20.000 Mike's daughters, all my nephew, and my grandson, my girlfriend. 0:08:20.520 --> 0:08:27.760 There was eight members that they took that day and 0:08:26.520 --> 0:08:34.240 they hurt them, blew away from a mother. I think 0:08:34.280 --> 0:08:37.800 about a day night, I lose a lot of sleep 0:08:37.880 --> 0:08:45.440 board and still what trying to go on the rest 0:08:45.520 --> 0:08:50.920 of my children is going to so much listen to 0:08:51.280 --> 0:08:59.160 brothers the same day. I would have never dreamed that's 0:08:59.240 --> 0:09:05.000 something my guess what had happened here Stephanie and Jeff 0:09:05.280 --> 0:09:09.720 speaking about Geneva Rodin. Geneva Roden is nearly eighty years old, 0:09:10.000 --> 0:09:13.480 and it's impossible to imagine what she deals with every day, 0:09:13.480 --> 0:09:16.719 not only the court proceedings, but also being there for 0:09:16.760 --> 0:09:19.920 her family because there's still many other family members who 0:09:19.920 --> 0:09:22.600 rely on her and lean on her as the Rodan matriarch. 0:09:23.080 --> 0:09:26.880 Several years ago, when we were first making the documentary 0:09:26.920 --> 0:09:29.800 for Oxygen about the Roden murders. Jeff and I actually 0:09:29.840 --> 0:09:33.280 went to the nursing home that Geneva resided at. At 0:09:33.280 --> 0:09:36.319 the time, we actually thought she was a distant cousin 0:09:36.400 --> 0:09:39.079 to the Rodens, and we didn't realize until we got 0:09:39.120 --> 0:09:42.680 there that she was actually Chris Senior's mother and that 0:09:42.960 --> 0:09:48.600 she had lost her children and her grandchildren, And ultimately 0:09:48.600 --> 0:09:51.240 she was uncomfortable speaking on camera, which we of course 0:09:51.520 --> 0:09:55.640 completely understood. It was all just way too raw for her, 0:09:55.960 --> 0:10:00.920 and her level of grief was frankly unimaginable. Geneva is 0:10:00.920 --> 0:10:05.000 really an example of a person who's frankly inspiring. You know, 0:10:05.040 --> 0:10:08.040 We've said this many times since then. When you meet 0:10:08.040 --> 0:10:13.040 another human being who has experienced such deep pain and 0:10:13.400 --> 0:10:17.320 she can continue to push on and continue to be 0:10:17.440 --> 0:10:19.959 there for her loved ones and show up to court 0:10:20.200 --> 0:10:23.920 relentlessly and push through, then surely the rest of us 0:10:24.000 --> 0:10:26.240 can push through whatever is stressing us in our lives. 0:10:26.840 --> 0:10:31.600 And she's really offered us a lot of perspective. I 0:10:31.720 --> 0:10:34.360 share this really simply to say, the level of grief 0:10:34.400 --> 0:10:39.640 that this family has experienced is incredibly far reaching. Geneva 0:10:39.920 --> 0:10:42.480 Wrotan and other members for her family, I would imagine 0:10:42.640 --> 0:10:44.679 the catalysts for them wanting to speak out is to 0:10:44.720 --> 0:10:48.480 bring attention to their family's case and not just have 0:10:48.640 --> 0:10:51.760 to be about the accused Wagner family and really remind 0:10:51.800 --> 0:10:54.760 everyone that the victims, the Rodents in this case, were 0:10:54.800 --> 0:10:58.480 real human beings who were not just what happened to 0:10:58.480 --> 0:11:02.120 them in twenty sixteen. It's so true. And also, you know, 0:11:02.240 --> 0:11:06.800 oftentimes when we talk about crime, the victims just become 0:11:06.800 --> 0:11:09.640 a footnote. It's always about the manner of death and 0:11:09.760 --> 0:11:14.280 less about the manner of life. And this is another 0:11:14.320 --> 0:11:18.120 example that you know, Geneva is a living and breathing 0:11:18.559 --> 0:11:22.679 woman who has had her entire family wiped out, and 0:11:22.760 --> 0:11:28.840 whoever is responsible for that should pay. Jeff continued his 0:11:28.920 --> 0:11:33.720 conversation with the Rodent family member. Where Chris Senior and 0:11:33.880 --> 0:11:36.040 Garry and Kenneth were they around? Did you see them? 0:11:36.600 --> 0:11:41.240 They were about probably eight or nine, maybe teen years younger. Man. 0:11:41.520 --> 0:11:45.040 I remember Chris Junior and Kenneth and them. They were 0:11:45.240 --> 0:11:48.240 wandering around just doing what kids do. They played with us, 0:11:48.360 --> 0:11:52.360 kids have always played together. We really didn't keep in 0:11:52.440 --> 0:11:55.920 contact after you know, outside of family unions, life kept 0:11:55.960 --> 0:11:58.840 getting in a way for everyone, and that's just the 0:11:58.920 --> 0:12:02.679 sad fact of the way was they were just beating 0:12:02.720 --> 0:12:05.680 their way through this world, just like everyone else. To believe. 0:12:05.720 --> 0:12:08.680 That's why this thing was more shocking than one would think. 0:12:12.480 --> 0:12:15.400 It became clear that there were obvious parallels between Chris 0:12:15.480 --> 0:12:19.480 Roden Senior's upbringing and how he, alongside his wife Dana, 0:12:19.679 --> 0:12:22.559 raised his own family. They were just people, They were 0:12:22.640 --> 0:12:26.320 just good old Americans. She was the daughter of a 0:12:26.720 --> 0:12:29.600 man named Tipp who lost his life in a little 0:12:29.600 --> 0:12:34.080 place called Jonesborough, Ohio. He was logging. An attractor come 0:12:34.080 --> 0:12:36.480 back on him and killed him. And then not too 0:12:36.480 --> 0:12:41.040 long after that, she lost her mother. That left Geneva 0:12:41.160 --> 0:12:45.360 with raising her own siblings. After losing her mother and father, 0:12:45.800 --> 0:12:49.400 she got married and they had children, and this happened 0:12:49.559 --> 0:12:52.560 at the same time, and that she had this entire 0:12:52.880 --> 0:12:56.360 group of people, her siblings and her own children that 0:12:56.480 --> 0:12:59.560 she was raising. So that takes an immense amount of 0:12:59.600 --> 0:13:02.640 strength to do. Giving the way the world is in. 0:13:02.800 --> 0:13:05.360 Geneva didn't have a whole lot to get through this world, 0:13:05.400 --> 0:13:09.520 but she made it. She was a finer hen and 0:13:09.600 --> 0:13:13.880 she raised them, and she raised fine people. Geneva's father 0:13:14.160 --> 0:13:17.640 was one of eight or ten brothers who grew up 0:13:17.720 --> 0:13:22.040 down in Kentucky. They lived in poverty, but it's not 0:13:22.120 --> 0:13:25.920 a poverty that most people would understand. During the wintertime, 0:13:25.960 --> 0:13:28.560 they didn't have shoes. They didn't even have leather to 0:13:28.720 --> 0:13:32.120 put on their feet. They would wrap rags or whatever 0:13:32.160 --> 0:13:34.840 they could find around their feet just to get to school. 0:13:36.280 --> 0:13:40.080 They went to school in a one room schoolhouse on 0:13:40.120 --> 0:13:42.760 a little place called Grassy Creek. There was no way 0:13:42.800 --> 0:13:46.559 to make a living for their father, James. That survival 0:13:46.600 --> 0:13:51.080 instinct was passed down through through Geneva in most of 0:13:51.120 --> 0:13:54.319 the family, and her dad was an amazing man, even 0:13:54.480 --> 0:13:58.680 long before there were mechanics. He would find old cars 0:13:58.760 --> 0:14:01.880 or tractors and make a run, and then he would 0:14:01.920 --> 0:14:04.920 trade him for stuff that didn't run. Now, in that 0:14:05.080 --> 0:14:07.880 trade he would get a little extra money which would 0:14:07.920 --> 0:14:10.440 go to his family and they might be able to 0:14:10.480 --> 0:14:16.040 buy a little something, a little bit of food. I've 0:14:16.120 --> 0:14:19.400 heard the Rodens being super resourceful with cars and good 0:14:19.400 --> 0:14:22.840 with your hands. I've heard that about Chris Junior being 0:14:22.880 --> 0:14:25.080 fiercely protective of one another and going to bath for 0:14:25.160 --> 0:14:28.120 each other. It's the same stuff, and it's a little 0:14:28.120 --> 0:14:30.120 easier for me than it then it would be for you. 0:14:30.160 --> 0:14:32.280 Of course, because I know the family. But that is 0:14:32.360 --> 0:14:35.240 very interesting that you can draw a line from the 0:14:35.440 --> 0:14:40.120 early nineteen hundreds to her children and see similarities, like 0:14:40.360 --> 0:14:42.480 Chris Junior would just jump under the hood of a 0:14:42.560 --> 0:14:45.240 car and be able to fix it. I can see 0:14:45.240 --> 0:14:47.640 those similarities and being able to defend each other. I 0:14:47.640 --> 0:14:49.680 could see that going all the way back to that 0:14:49.720 --> 0:14:51.960 side of the family. I just want to clarify by 0:14:52.040 --> 0:14:56.280 Chris Junior, you mean Chris Roden sor yes, he's Chris 0:14:56.360 --> 0:15:01.560 Junior to you, because there's another Chris. Yes. Jeff also 0:15:01.640 --> 0:15:05.480 recently had a phone conversation with Talicia, Dana and Chris 0:15:05.480 --> 0:15:10.800 Senior's niece and Hannah, Frankie and little Chris's cousin Will 0:15:10.840 --> 0:15:13.360 gone more than six years now, the Rodents are present 0:15:13.400 --> 0:15:17.360 with Talicia and live on with her young daughters. As 0:15:17.480 --> 0:15:20.480 someone who has been working on this story for many years, 0:15:20.560 --> 0:15:23.120 I feel very touched by it. And I'm sure you 0:15:23.160 --> 0:15:26.240 know obviously I've been related to everyone. It means a 0:15:26.240 --> 0:15:28.880 lot to share her about and talk about it. Can 0:15:28.920 --> 0:15:30.960 you hear me? Okay, yeah, I can hear you. I 0:15:31.160 --> 0:15:34.000 was checking to see where the kiddos work. How many 0:15:34.080 --> 0:15:36.640 kids do you have? I have fu, you have your 0:15:36.640 --> 0:15:39.760 hands fall. Yes, they're all girls. I actually have one 0:15:39.840 --> 0:15:43.400 named after Aunt Dana, and her name is Hannah Lynn. 0:15:43.640 --> 0:15:46.120 We gave her Hannah after the two Hannah's and Lynn 0:15:46.160 --> 0:15:51.120 after Dana. That's beautiful. So Dana was your great aunt 0:15:51.600 --> 0:15:54.160 and she was able to meet your eldest daughter, Cherokee 0:15:54.440 --> 0:15:58.640 before everything happened. Dana was my aunt. She was Cherokee's 0:15:58.920 --> 0:16:03.960 great aunt. Are your parents? My mother was Dana's sister, Kathy. 0:16:04.240 --> 0:16:06.920 She has two sisters and a brother. Her brother's name 0:16:06.960 --> 0:16:10.920 is James Manley. And then my other aunt, Bobby Joe. 0:16:11.760 --> 0:16:14.720 As a reminder, Talicia's aunt, Bobby Joe Manley is the 0:16:14.760 --> 0:16:17.760 one who discovered the horrific crime scene and called nine 0:16:17.840 --> 0:16:33.360 one one one yes, I y yes, forty um. We 0:16:33.520 --> 0:16:38.320 walked to the no ball. Okay. Her brother Hall said, okay, 0:16:37.720 --> 0:16:45.880 what's your girl? Danny has sir forty seventy seventy forty 0:16:46.040 --> 0:16:52.880 seventy seven, forty seventy seven, okay, forty seventh seventh correct, yes, 0:16:55.640 --> 0:17:02.600 man going on, I fling all over the house. Okay. 0:17:02.720 --> 0:17:05.680 My brother haws and stays room and looks like I've 0:17:05.800 --> 0:17:10.840 beat the hell. I love them Okay, we're gonna blood 0:17:10.880 --> 0:17:14.560 all hearts. Man, can you counting with county? That's then, 0:17:14.680 --> 0:17:21.000 is said town, It's my county. H Okay, okay, I 0:17:21.119 --> 0:17:25.200 need to get out of the house. Thank you driving 0:17:25.200 --> 0:17:30.520 over there. And that's like him running Christ luring Harry 0:17:30.640 --> 0:17:34.520 Rod and sanking Hairy Roman sings in him. Looks like 0:17:34.560 --> 0:17:38.440 the dad think, I think the great sad. Look, I 0:17:38.480 --> 0:17:41.159 don't beat the pop out on them. Okay, if there 0:17:41.240 --> 0:17:46.639 anybody else from the house, can I say? I know? Okay, 0:17:46.800 --> 0:17:48.760 so doors was lost with the god here but on 0:17:48.880 --> 0:17:51.560 her friends teams, and I went in and hit her, 0:17:51.680 --> 0:17:53.800 landing on the floor and went on the house and 0:17:54.119 --> 0:17:56.680 I'm starting right now. Okay, stay out of the house 0:17:56.720 --> 0:17:59.800 the way anybody do her there? Play? Yeah, all right 0:18:00.000 --> 0:18:14.520 about the trauma of that discovery is long lasting. I 0:18:14.680 --> 0:18:17.119 used to hang out a lot with Bobby Joe that 0:18:17.320 --> 0:18:23.480 like after everything happened, she just like completely changed. Here 0:18:23.520 --> 0:18:27.840 again is Jeff As a reminder, Bobby Joe Manly is 0:18:28.000 --> 0:18:31.359 Dana Roden's sister, and she discovered the horrific crime scene 0:18:31.440 --> 0:18:35.280 at Chris Senior Roden and Frankie Roden's house. And to 0:18:35.400 --> 0:18:37.520 just kind of put yourself in her shoes. She found 0:18:37.800 --> 0:18:41.879 out that her loved ones were heinously murdered, not by 0:18:41.960 --> 0:18:44.840 word of mouth, but actually by discovering their bloody bodies. 0:18:45.480 --> 0:18:48.040 And an experience like that it changes you forever, How 0:18:48.080 --> 0:18:50.600 could it not. And we did a little research into 0:18:50.960 --> 0:18:54.600 severe trauma like the kind Bobby Joe experienced, and only 0:18:54.640 --> 0:18:58.399 around seven percent of Americans report experiencing an event like this. 0:18:58.560 --> 0:19:01.080 And obviously, even I would say what Bobby Joe went 0:19:01.119 --> 0:19:03.480 through was probably worse than what a lot of those 0:19:03.520 --> 0:19:07.000 seven percent report. It's just unimaginable, and I don't think 0:19:07.000 --> 0:19:15.160 anyone could ever understand what she's dealt with. Here's Jeff 0:19:15.520 --> 0:19:19.360 again speaking with Telicia. To me and Hannah were only 0:19:19.480 --> 0:19:22.840 like six months and fourteen days apart. Oh wow, I 0:19:23.040 --> 0:19:25.600 just turned twenty four. I actually have a picture of 0:19:25.720 --> 0:19:27.520 us on our baby and my baby book in the 0:19:27.640 --> 0:19:29.760 Very Bad She was a year and a half in 0:19:29.840 --> 0:19:32.360 this picture and I was five months. So you guys 0:19:32.400 --> 0:19:35.440 grew up together. They gare rope took. Everybody was pretty 0:19:35.440 --> 0:19:39.280 close her, and my little brother was close to him, 0:19:39.320 --> 0:19:43.040 and Christopher wasn't very far apart either. Everybody used to 0:19:43.040 --> 0:19:44.920 ask me what I thought of Frank Gillis like, listen, 0:19:45.320 --> 0:19:50.439 me and Frankie and Hannah and Christopher and Henry Junior, 0:19:50.480 --> 0:19:53.200 which is my brother, and Heath, which is my other brother. 0:19:53.280 --> 0:19:55.720 I said we was something else, especially around Fourth of July, 0:19:55.920 --> 0:19:58.639 because when Fourth of July came, we wanted to try 0:19:58.680 --> 0:20:03.359 and have Roman candle fights, anything else, so there'd be 0:20:03.440 --> 0:20:07.000 like big family celebrations on these kind of days. Yeah, 0:20:08.440 --> 0:20:10.520 we're going to take a break. We'll be back in 0:20:10.560 --> 0:20:18.159 a moment. Oh. I'm Carol Fisher and I'm hosting a 0:20:18.240 --> 0:20:21.760 podcast called The girl Friends. Back in the nineteen nineties 0:20:21.840 --> 0:20:24.400 in Las Vegas, a few of us dated the most 0:20:24.520 --> 0:20:30.399 eligible bachelor in town, Bob. He spoke several languages, he 0:20:30.840 --> 0:20:35.600 did medical missionary work, and he was Jewish. He was 0:20:35.760 --> 0:20:40.320 perfect on paper, but he wasn't. He really wasn't. He 0:20:40.600 --> 0:20:44.920 shouted into the point she went unconscious. Bob could lie 0:20:45.280 --> 0:20:49.119 about anything, but only takes the one time when somebody 0:20:49.240 --> 0:20:53.080 ends up dead. Unfortunately for Bob, us girlfriends know how 0:20:53.119 --> 0:20:56.080 to fight back. I wanted him to pay for his crime. 0:20:56.320 --> 0:20:59.080 He needed to be put to justice. I'll be honest 0:20:59.119 --> 0:21:00.879 with your five song right now. I'd spit on him. 0:21:01.080 --> 0:21:03.600 I would call him and I would say, I know 0:21:03.680 --> 0:21:06.639 you killed my sister. I will always hound you and 0:21:06.800 --> 0:21:09.440 haunt you. You can listen to the Girlfriends on the 0:21:09.560 --> 0:21:14.240 iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. 0:21:14.960 --> 0:21:19.000 My name's Laverne Cox. I'm an actress, producer, fashionista, and 0:21:19.160 --> 0:21:22.000 host of The Laverne Cox Show. You may remember my 0:21:22.040 --> 0:21:26.639 award winning first season. I've been pretty busy. There's always 0:21:26.680 --> 0:21:29.879 time to touch incredible guests about important things. People like 0:21:30.040 --> 0:21:32.320 me have been screaming for years. We've got to watch 0:21:32.400 --> 0:21:34.880 the Supreme Court. What they're doing is wrong, what they're 0:21:34.920 --> 0:21:37.440 doing is evil. They will take things away, and I 0:21:37.600 --> 0:21:41.240 can only hope that Dobbs is that like Pearl Harbor moment, girl, 0:21:41.320 --> 0:21:43.520 you and I both know what it took to just 0:21:43.680 --> 0:21:45.840 get through the day in New York City and get 0:21:45.880 --> 0:21:48.840 home in one piece. And so the fact that we're 0:21:48.920 --> 0:21:51.879 here and what you've achieved and what I've achieved, you know, 0:21:52.320 --> 0:21:56.400 that's momentous. It's not just sitting around complaining about some bills. 0:21:56.520 --> 0:21:59.000 The only reason that you might think, as Chase said, 0:21:59.040 --> 0:22:02.440 that we're always measurable is because people are constantly attacking 0:22:02.520 --> 0:22:05.120 us and we're constantly noticing it. Listen to the Laverne 0:22:05.160 --> 0:22:09.119 Cox Show on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast or wherever 0:22:09.240 --> 0:22:13.320 you get your podcast. Be sure to subscribe and share 0:22:15.359 --> 0:22:17.560 in our twenty two years of friendship. Andy. This has 0:22:17.600 --> 0:22:20.359 to be the most bizarre thing we've ever done. I know, 0:22:20.760 --> 0:22:24.399 I love it. Our podcast My Vagina said what is 0:22:24.440 --> 0:22:27.240 a podcast where we ask our everyday Vagina listeners to 0:22:27.320 --> 0:22:29.439 pull up a seat at the best Friend's table as 0:22:29.480 --> 0:22:32.920 we share our most personal and humiliating stories and ask 0:22:33.040 --> 0:22:36.199 questions about women's bodies. We are going to discuss all 0:22:36.280 --> 0:22:38.920 body things like what exactly are we supposed to do 0:22:39.000 --> 0:22:42.520 with our pubs? Oh my gosh, if you could have 0:22:42.880 --> 0:22:49.520 a heart shaped pube that were bedazzled in pink rubies. Perrymenopause. 0:22:49.840 --> 0:22:52.520 I feel right now justified. I'm going to start my 0:22:52.640 --> 0:22:56.399 own personal movement. I'm going to start blaming anything that 0:22:56.520 --> 0:23:00.560 goes wrong in my life on perrymenopause, leg here too long, 0:23:00.680 --> 0:23:06.880 Perry don't have the will to clean? Perrymnopad exactly? Are 0:23:06.960 --> 0:23:10.520 whack periods? Boob issues? And so much more. Listen to 0:23:10.600 --> 0:23:13.919 My Vagina Said What Podcasts on the iHeartRadio app, Apple 0:23:14.000 --> 0:23:18.080 Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts what they're more 0:23:18.160 --> 0:23:21.600 identity threats than you realize. Even if you monitor your credit, 0:23:21.760 --> 0:23:24.480 only a little personal info needs to leak out, like 0:23:24.640 --> 0:23:28.399 your social Security number or password, or you did any 0:23:28.440 --> 0:23:32.400 coming a victimist. LifeLock alerts you to threats you can miss. 0:23:32.600 --> 0:23:36.000 If your identity is stolen, a dedicated US based restoration 0:23:36.119 --> 0:23:38.760 specialist will work to fix it. No one can prevent 0:23:38.880 --> 0:23:42.199 all identity theft or monitor all transactions, but everyone can 0:23:42.200 --> 0:23:44.320 save up to twenty five percent off their first year. 0:23:44.720 --> 0:23:56.080 Go to LifeLock dot com slash aware as the grown 0:23:56.119 --> 0:23:59.560 to teenagers. Like many girls, Talicia and Hannah May would 0:23:59.600 --> 0:24:01.560 do it to this hair and makeup and have fun 0:24:01.640 --> 0:24:05.360 just driving around. Me and Hannah May like the long 0:24:05.440 --> 0:24:07.840 destination drives with no idea where it was going. I'm 0:24:07.840 --> 0:24:10.560 just listening to music. What kind of music did she like? 0:24:10.960 --> 0:24:13.240 She was mainly a country girl. Other than that she 0:24:13.400 --> 0:24:16.600 liked Brian Church. I think is his name? She did, 0:24:16.720 --> 0:24:19.400 ay said, a country girl when she was in a jeep. 0:24:19.440 --> 0:24:20.760 She liked to go out, and she liked to go 0:24:20.920 --> 0:24:23.600 money and tell me about Dana. What kind of aunt 0:24:23.760 --> 0:24:26.440 was she? She would take us all clothes shopping for 0:24:26.560 --> 0:24:30.080 school and stuff. When school time came around. Your kids 0:24:30.080 --> 0:24:34.440 are young, do they know about your great aunt and 0:24:34.680 --> 0:24:37.920 what happened. I actually have a book I made in 0:24:38.040 --> 0:24:41.159 memory of them. It's like a photo album book. I 0:24:41.320 --> 0:24:44.119 figured why not keep their memory alive with the children. 0:24:46.400 --> 0:24:49.920 When I was pregnant with Cherokee, Hannah had actually done 0:24:49.960 --> 0:24:52.960 a like a gender reveal with me. She'd done my pictures, 0:24:53.200 --> 0:24:55.399 and then right before I gave birth to Cherokee, she 0:24:55.480 --> 0:24:59.879 had also done my maternity picture. Dana was one of 0:25:00.080 --> 0:25:02.600 the first ones I told that I was pregnant with Cherokee. 0:25:03.000 --> 0:25:05.480 She was so excited and she kept Tommy, Oh, you're 0:25:05.480 --> 0:25:06.800 having a girl. I was like, hey day, and I 0:25:06.840 --> 0:25:10.080 don't know yet. I had went into labor with Cherokee 0:25:10.200 --> 0:25:13.320 on the eighth of March and then I didn't have 0:25:13.400 --> 0:25:17.560 her until the nights, and Dana was there the whole time. 0:25:17.680 --> 0:25:20.760 She pasted the floors and she was like, is she 0:25:21.080 --> 0:25:25.439 ready to get hurt? And Hanname was there when an 0:25:25.560 --> 0:25:28.359 Dana first saw Cherokee. She started crying at first, and 0:25:28.520 --> 0:25:30.960 she looked at me and she was like, she's so beautiful. 0:25:31.560 --> 0:25:34.359 After we brought her home from the hospital, she would 0:25:34.359 --> 0:25:36.280 always want Cherokee to come out and take naps with 0:25:36.359 --> 0:25:38.720