WEBVTT - How Police Body Cameras Work 0:00:01.120 --> 0:00:04.600 Welcome to Stuff you Should Know from how Stuff Works 0:00:04.600 --> 0:00:13.480 dot com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark. 0:00:14.040 --> 0:00:17.000 There's Charles w Chuck Bryant, there's Jerry over there. So 0:00:17.040 --> 0:00:20.759 this is stuff you should know, like ever expanding law 0:00:20.840 --> 0:00:27.120 Enforcement edition yet another Yeah we just did when didn't we? 0:00:27.760 --> 0:00:32.000 Yeah we uh yeah, I can't remember which one it was. 0:00:33.320 --> 0:00:36.080 They'll run together now. Yeah, Well we've done a lot yep. 0:00:36.240 --> 0:00:39.199 Body cameras. Uh, and I kind of want to pick 0:00:39.240 --> 0:00:41.120 this one out. Thought, well, I don't know if there's 0:00:41.120 --> 0:00:42.400 a whole lot there, but it ended up being a 0:00:42.440 --> 0:00:44.240 little more interesting than I thought to be. Yeah, there's 0:00:44.280 --> 0:00:49.160 a lot there, at least culturally too. Totally. So, um, 0:00:49.240 --> 0:00:55.800 we're talking body cameras, and they're pretty straightforward at their base. Um, 0:00:55.840 --> 0:00:58.760 but once you kind of start looking at like the 0:00:58.800 --> 0:01:02.760 cultural baggage associated with them, why they're being used, it 0:01:03.200 --> 0:01:08.360 is a pretty mushrooming topic for sure. And apparently back 0:01:08.360 --> 0:01:11.960 in two thou five the Brits started using them and 0:01:12.680 --> 0:01:14.839 they ran some Yeah, because I mean, like the city 0:01:14.840 --> 0:01:16.800 of London, I don't think there's a square inch that 0:01:16.880 --> 0:01:21.360 isn't under surveillance, you know. Yeah, they're just pretty uh technologically, 0:01:22.319 --> 0:01:25.319 um forward, I think sure, Like the first cell phone 0:01:25.319 --> 0:01:28.679 I ever saw was in London. Really yeah, obviously of 0:01:29.080 --> 0:01:31.520 like Japan and Korea for that kind of stuff. Well 0:01:31.640 --> 0:01:33.280 maybe there too, but I didn't go to either one 0:01:33.280 --> 0:01:35.840 of those places in the early nineties, I got you, 0:01:35.959 --> 0:01:39.960 So you're like, London's in your head for that. So 0:01:40.240 --> 0:01:45.839 um with with I guess the UK in particular, once 0:01:45.880 --> 0:01:48.760 they started using body cameras, they started using them more 0:01:48.760 --> 0:01:51.520 and more and more. And that's definitely the case with 0:01:51.560 --> 0:01:55.880 the United States more recently. Um And apparently there's a 0:01:56.600 --> 0:02:00.320 there's a pilot program that really started the whole thing 0:02:00.400 --> 0:02:03.800 off back in two thousand and twelve in a little 0:02:03.840 --> 0:02:07.440 town called Rialto, California, which is about fifty miles east 0:02:07.560 --> 0:02:11.079 of Los Angeles. Yeah, and in Rialto, I'm not sure 0:02:11.080 --> 0:02:13.560 what the impetus was, but the police chief and a 0:02:13.600 --> 0:02:17.720 criminologist got together and said, let's let's try this. They 0:02:17.760 --> 0:02:20.480 gave half of the police force body cameras to wear, 0:02:20.840 --> 0:02:23.560 and then switched and gave the other half I guess 0:02:23.560 --> 0:02:25.760 the second half of the year, throughout all of two 0:02:25.760 --> 0:02:28.840 thousand twelve, Yeah, and what they were mainly tracking were 0:02:28.880 --> 0:02:34.000 two different things. Uh, incidences police force and then civilian 0:02:34.000 --> 0:02:38.960 complaints against officers. UM, generally after use the police force, 0:02:39.160 --> 0:02:43.120 but just complaints period. Yeah, basically, and the results are 0:02:43.120 --> 0:02:48.960 pretty surprising. I think. Yeah, they the officers who wore 0:02:49.000 --> 0:02:54.400 the cameras used force half as often just generally would 0:02:54.520 --> 0:02:59.200 use I get well, not less force. That's a little misleading. 0:03:00.080 --> 0:03:04.640 They would use force less of the of the time. Um. 0:03:04.760 --> 0:03:08.080 And then the complaints filed, they said they couldn't really Um, 0:03:08.120 --> 0:03:10.240 there were so few complaints that couldn't really draw a 0:03:10.240 --> 0:03:16.840 good statistical conclusion. But there was a nine reduction compared 0:03:16.880 --> 0:03:20.440 with two thousand eleven of complaints. And they found out 0:03:20.440 --> 0:03:24.400 other stuff too. I looked into the study. UM, and 0:03:24.440 --> 0:03:27.280 this is just the commentary from the research team. These 0:03:27.280 --> 0:03:29.440 aren't like facts and figures. But you know, you do 0:03:29.480 --> 0:03:31.360 a study like this and then they analyze it, then 0:03:31.360 --> 0:03:33.959 they say, well, this is what I think. Um. They 0:03:33.960 --> 0:03:37.200 say that their research shows that people tend to adhere 0:03:37.240 --> 0:03:40.040 to social norms and change your conduct once they're aware 0:03:40.080 --> 0:03:43.880 that their behavior is being observed. Um. And the body 0:03:43.880 --> 0:03:47.000 worn cameras can bey a straightforward, pragmatic message. You were 0:03:47.000 --> 0:03:49.640 being watched a videotape and expected to follow the rules. 0:03:50.160 --> 0:03:52.720 And apparently this uh, what they call a self awareness 0:03:52.720 --> 0:03:57.520 effect is a neutral third eye that works on both sides. 0:03:57.640 --> 0:04:01.680 They said it suspect tend to cool down their aggressive 0:04:01.680 --> 0:04:06.840 actions more and it deters officers from reacting excessively or 0:04:06.920 --> 0:04:10.320 unnecessarily with force. So it kind of works both ways. 0:04:11.120 --> 0:04:13.440 And uh, the final thing I thought was really interesting 0:04:13.520 --> 0:04:16.640 was had what they called a spillover effect, which was 0:04:17.520 --> 0:04:21.120 even officers that weren't using the cameras because they did, 0:04:21.279 --> 0:04:23.559 like you said, with half the force at a time, 0:04:24.360 --> 0:04:30.200 they had fewer incidences of force used. And they speculate 0:04:30.440 --> 0:04:33.799 that they just think there's a conscious effort than going 0:04:33.839 --> 0:04:38.720 on to make uh, to improve their behavior, so that 0:04:38.760 --> 0:04:42.080 the the officers that had the cameras being watched didn't 0:04:42.120 --> 0:04:46.400 like have an advantage or a disadvantage, Like they sort 0:04:46.400 --> 0:04:48.760 of normalize the whole thing, even if they weren't wearing 0:04:48.760 --> 0:04:53.240 a camera at all. Yeah, I mean it's a speculation, 0:04:53.279 --> 0:04:55.960 but it sort of makes sense. Well, so this the 0:04:56.040 --> 0:05:00.960 rialto study is really um often I died because it 0:05:01.080 --> 0:05:03.200 was the first of its kind in the United States 0:05:03.560 --> 0:05:08.760 and because the results were so surprising, and then so 0:05:08.839 --> 0:05:12.279 we also the city immediately was like, Okay, all officers 0:05:12.320 --> 0:05:16.359 now have body cameras. After the results came in, and 0:05:16.400 --> 0:05:19.599 it just so happened that this took place. The study 0:05:19.640 --> 0:05:24.000 took place um right before a couple of very high 0:05:24.000 --> 0:05:29.920 profile police involved deaths, Eric Garner UM and then Michael Brown. 0:05:30.640 --> 0:05:34.080 And Michael Brown's death in particular raised the issue of 0:05:34.200 --> 0:05:37.880 body warren cameras, which is in the general term for 0:05:38.040 --> 0:05:43.479 the cameras police are wearing UM. Because Darren Wilson, who 0:05:43.480 --> 0:05:45.920 shot Michael Brown, the police officer who shot him six 0:05:46.040 --> 0:05:50.920 times UM what gave one account of the story and 0:05:50.920 --> 0:05:54.480 witnesses gave another account of the story. And so when 0:05:54.600 --> 0:05:58.080 Michael Brown's death kind of became part of a national conversation, 0:05:58.320 --> 0:06:01.800 and especially with Eric Garner's death to which immediately proceeded 0:06:01.880 --> 0:06:06.240 I think like a month before, back in two thousand fourteen, UM. 0:06:06.400 --> 0:06:10.359 Eric Garner's death was full on video taped by a 0:06:10.440 --> 0:06:13.240 guy who was standing there recording it on a cell phone, 0:06:13.760 --> 0:06:16.719 and it got out and it was released to the public, 0:06:17.160 --> 0:06:22.320 and it started this national conversation about police brutality UM 0:06:22.680 --> 0:06:26.960 and but it also had this other real aspect to 0:06:27.040 --> 0:06:30.800 it that this conversation might not be happening were it 0:06:30.920 --> 0:06:36.159 not for video documentation of these of Eric Garner's death. 0:06:36.920 --> 0:06:38.960 So the fact that this is happening at a time 0:06:39.240 --> 0:06:42.400 right after rialto has had this study, people are looking 0:06:42.440 --> 0:06:47.039 around saying this. There's entire swaths these communities, UM have 0:06:47.160 --> 0:06:51.400 had this what was called a simmering distrust of the police, 0:06:51.680 --> 0:06:53.679 and they've had it forever. But now all of a sudden, 0:06:53.760 --> 0:06:56.760 the rest of the nation's paying attention to this very 0:06:56.800 --> 0:07:02.320 important issue. UM and this, these body cameras work so 0:07:02.360 --> 0:07:05.040 well for this little town in east of Los Angeles, 0:07:05.120 --> 0:07:07.560 maybe we should start to institute those. And all of 0:07:07.600 --> 0:07:10.920 a sudden, the Department of Justice starts showing out forty 0:07:10.960 --> 0:07:13.600 three million dollars in grants for local law enforcement to 0:07:13.680 --> 0:07:17.640 buy body cameras. And there was this this idea that good, 0:07:17.680 --> 0:07:20.920 the problem solved. But to a lot of people, and 0:07:21.120 --> 0:07:24.880 at least impart myself included, it kind of seems like 0:07:25.720 --> 0:07:28.040 this could just be a bandied Does it actually solve 0:07:28.080 --> 0:07:31.920 anything or does it actually just underscore the distrust on 0:07:32.040 --> 0:07:34.840 both sides, Like I don't trust that you're not gonna 0:07:34.960 --> 0:07:37.680 file a false report about me being brutal on you, 0:07:37.920 --> 0:07:41.560 so I'm recording you and I have to wear this 0:07:41.880 --> 0:07:45.320 because the federal government knows that you don't trust me, 0:07:45.480 --> 0:07:51.160 and I might beat you up extra judiciously. So if 0:07:51.680 --> 0:07:54.080 if neither side trusts one another and you just have 0:07:54.720 --> 0:07:57.920 a video camera observing the whole thing, does that actually 0:07:57.920 --> 0:08:01.200 solve anything or does it just underscore the trust. That's 0:08:01.240 --> 0:08:03.760 that's probably the biggest question to me that came out 0:08:03.760 --> 0:08:07.000 of researching this episode. Yeah, I think for me, it's 0:08:07.080 --> 0:08:09.720 it's not a magic pill by any means, but it's 0:08:09.880 --> 0:08:12.840 another tool that can help. But but what I think 0:08:13.120 --> 0:08:16.360 that then the issue to me then is you can't 0:08:16.440 --> 0:08:18.920 just overly rely on that one tool. I think it 0:08:19.040 --> 0:08:22.840 kind of has a tendency to lull people into complacency, like, Okay, 0:08:23.040 --> 0:08:24.640 we've got this tool out there now, we don't have 0:08:24.680 --> 0:08:28.640 to worry about the actual underlying issues. Yeah, and we'll 0:08:28.640 --> 0:08:30.400 get into I mean, there's a bunch of reasons why 0:08:30.400 --> 0:08:33.280 it's not a magic pill. We'll get into all those later. 0:08:33.400 --> 0:08:36.800 But um, as of right now, it was hard to 0:08:36.840 --> 0:08:40.720 get statistics, but I got one from about a year 0:08:40.760 --> 0:08:44.679 ago that said forty three of the sixty eight major 0:08:44.760 --> 0:08:48.080 cities now, have you know that what they call the 0:08:48.120 --> 0:08:52.600 major police forces in the US now use body cameras. However, 0:08:53.600 --> 0:08:58.120 U say that they will begin to use them, and 0:08:58.160 --> 0:09:01.760 are you know, taking steps to do so. Um. But 0:09:01.880 --> 0:09:04.880 however they here and this is one of the issues 0:09:05.240 --> 0:09:09.080 of why it's not a magic pill. Um. Only three 0:09:09.120 --> 0:09:13.480 percent of these and this is a survey, only three 0:09:13.480 --> 0:09:17.520 percent of the officers reported recording seven plus hours per day. 0:09:18.040 --> 0:09:20.440 And that's in a in a typical I think, what 0:09:20.480 --> 0:09:22.800 do they work generally twelve hours at a time? Yeah, 0:09:22.920 --> 0:09:25.920 I might, I understand. So only three percent recording seven 0:09:26.000 --> 0:09:31.719 of those hours recorded? Uh, less than recorded three or 0:09:31.800 --> 0:09:36.400 fewer hours per day. UM. So that's one of the 0:09:36.400 --> 0:09:40.200 big issues is some departments, well, I mean, and it 0:09:40.280 --> 0:09:43.800 varies from department in locality to locality on what the 0:09:43.880 --> 0:09:47.240 rules are. Some of them say, all right, well, here's 0:09:47.240 --> 0:09:50.120 your body camera, but you don't have to use it. Um. 0:09:50.200 --> 0:09:55.480 Some of them say use it during any um, confrontation 0:09:55.520 --> 0:09:59.200 with a citizen, any call you have to make. Some say, well, 0:09:59.240 --> 0:10:00.559 you gotta turn them off when you go into a 0:10:00.559 --> 0:10:03.480 private residence because, as we'll talk about a little later, 0:10:03.520 --> 0:10:05.720 the a c l U. You know, it's a privacy 0:10:05.720 --> 0:10:08.560 issue when you're filming people without their consent. That could 0:10:08.640 --> 0:10:12.079 potentially be released, but surprisingly a little bit the a 0:10:12.200 --> 0:10:15.720 c l U eventually kind of said, no, we will. 0:10:15.920 --> 0:10:19.560 We would rather have the officers where these even though 0:10:19.600 --> 0:10:23.360 it's a privacy issue for citizens. It's a tricky, tricky thing. 0:10:23.520 --> 0:10:27.520 Oh man, it is a can of worms like no other. Um. 0:10:27.600 --> 0:10:30.760 But we I mean, I think everyone knows what these are. 0:10:30.800 --> 0:10:33.120 We haven't even said yet. These are cameras that police 0:10:33.120 --> 0:10:37.400 officers wear on their body. Um. The ones I've mostly seen, 0:10:37.400 --> 0:10:40.160 they were sort of on their chest, yeah, like where 0:10:40.200 --> 0:10:43.880 there CB used to be. Yeah. Some of them though, 0:10:43.880 --> 0:10:47.080 are on the shoulder, on the helmet, um or on 0:10:47.120 --> 0:10:50.560 the collar. But mostly I've seen the one that it 0:10:50.800 --> 0:10:52.880 kind of actually looks like a little C, B H 0:10:54.040 --> 0:10:56.080 whatever you call it. Not a CB handle because that's 0:10:57.000 --> 0:11:01.480 rubber Ducky in the in the truck. What you know, 0:11:01.559 --> 0:11:04.559 the CB handle is what your name is. And rubber 0:11:04.640 --> 0:11:07.080 Ducky was from Convoy. I think when was it? I 0:11:07.120 --> 0:11:10.200 think so the movie or the song the movie, well 0:11:10.320 --> 0:11:14.760 the songs from them, Oh man, those guys are great. 0:11:15.160 --> 0:11:20.319 So what the receiver? But you're talking to it the mouthpiece? Okay, 0:11:20.559 --> 0:11:23.040 I just call it the walkie talkie part. The walkie 0:11:23.080 --> 0:11:27.240 talkie part anyway, it's generally mounted on the chest and uh, 0:11:27.320 --> 0:11:30.480 there are many manufacturers that make these now, um, some 0:11:30.600 --> 0:11:33.840 of them or wire wireless. Some of them have high death, 0:11:34.360 --> 0:11:38.480 some of them have one touch activation and ultra wide angle. 0:11:39.080 --> 0:11:41.320 Because that's one of the issues why it's not a 0:11:41.320 --> 0:11:44.800 magic pill. Like the view that they get if it's 0:11:44.840 --> 0:11:48.400 not a wide angle, is a chest high view of 0:11:48.960 --> 0:11:52.520 whatever the officer's body is pointed at, not necessarily what 0:11:52.520 --> 0:11:56.920 their faces looking at, where their eyes are looking. Um, 0:11:57.000 --> 0:12:01.040 it's it's okay, but you know it's not. It's not 0:12:02.040 --> 0:12:05.600 solve for everything in all issues. No, it's not, because 0:12:05.720 --> 0:12:08.800 we'll get into later. You know, if if something happens 0:12:08.800 --> 0:12:12.160 off camera that hasn't captured, like a suspect reaching for 0:12:12.200 --> 0:12:14.680 a gun and but on camera, all of a sudden, 0:12:14.720 --> 0:12:16.800 the cops just standing there and then the next thing 0:12:16.840 --> 0:12:18.480 you know, he pulls his gun out and shoots the guy, 0:12:19.080 --> 0:12:22.040 it's like, well that that cop just went berserk because 0:12:22.040 --> 0:12:24.480 the camera didn't capture that thing. Most of them have 0:12:24.520 --> 0:12:26.160 a time and date stamp. Some of them have the 0:12:26.160 --> 0:12:29.160 badge number of the cop. Some of them have GPS coordinates. 0:12:29.880 --> 0:12:33.880 Some of them take still photos some stream to remote devices. 0:12:35.160 --> 0:12:37.160 Very few of them can you actually is it like 0:12:37.200 --> 0:12:39.320 a iPhone where you can as a screen that you 0:12:39.320 --> 0:12:42.280 can watch it, But some of them can hook up 0:12:42.280 --> 0:12:46.120 to an app to your phone where you can watch it. Yeah, advanced. 0:12:46.160 --> 0:12:49.040 I read this article about the one that Taser's putting out. 0:12:49.120 --> 0:12:51.240 It was largely about that was by It was a 0:12:51.280 --> 0:12:56.920 Motherboard article by Alex Pasternak, and he um talks about 0:12:56.960 --> 0:13:00.679 how one of the big concerns is in the addition 0:13:00.720 --> 0:13:06.240 of facial recognition, like computer facial recognition, because supposedly, I 0:13:06.240 --> 0:13:11.560 didn't know this, half of Americans have their face in 0:13:11.600 --> 0:13:16.440 a facial recognition database already. So if you're just somebody 0:13:16.480 --> 0:13:19.360 walking past one of these cameras and it has facial 0:13:19.360 --> 0:13:22.480 recognition attached to it, it will say, oh, well there 0:13:22.559 --> 0:13:25.080 when Josh Clark, he was here on this date at 0:13:25.120 --> 0:13:28.040 this time and he's wanted for murder, right, Well, that 0:13:28.120 --> 0:13:30.000 was part of the point. It's like, well, you know, 0:13:30.160 --> 0:13:33.760 the camera can pick it up and then the database can, 0:13:33.840 --> 0:13:37.439 let you know, go get that guy he's wanted for murder. Um. 0:13:37.480 --> 0:13:40.000 But also, if you're as a private citizen, as you're 0:13:41.400 --> 0:13:46.000 the you're right against unlawful search and seizure being UM 0:13:46.200 --> 0:13:49.040 violated by that kind of thing, and apparently that is 0:13:49.160 --> 0:13:53.160 definitely a direction that that UM these cameras are starting 0:13:53.200 --> 0:13:56.480 to go now, like facial recognition will soon be the 0:13:56.559 --> 0:13:59.560 next step as they're deployed further and further, it's going 0:13:59.600 --> 0:14:03.520 to be like a common UM feature on them. Yeah. 0:14:04.600 --> 0:14:08.559 Another feature that uh, most of these cameras have now, 0:14:08.559 --> 0:14:10.440 and this is a very interesting one because it's kind 0:14:10.440 --> 0:14:13.560 of played out recently to be significant, is a buffering 0:14:13.679 --> 0:14:18.400 pre record. So if this cameras on, it's recording, but 0:14:18.440 --> 0:14:22.160 it records in thirty second or sixty second intervals with 0:14:22.200 --> 0:14:25.440 no audio most of the time. So what's happening is 0:14:25.520 --> 0:14:29.040 even if the cop has not pressed record, it's recording 0:14:29.040 --> 0:14:33.840 and a racing over itself constantly, um if it's turned on. 0:14:34.400 --> 0:14:39.280 So what happens when the cop hits record is it's 0:14:39.280 --> 0:14:42.280 gonna have that thirty or sixty seconds tagged onto it 0:14:42.880 --> 0:14:46.480 and that gets saved, which can be a big asset 0:14:46.680 --> 0:14:50.040 if the cop. Uh you know a lot of times 0:14:50.040 --> 0:14:51.840 a cop will see something and turn it on, but 0:14:51.960 --> 0:14:54.680 they have just missed what's happened, but it'll grab that 0:14:54.720 --> 0:14:57.480 thirty seconds, which can be a big help, or in 0:14:57.520 --> 0:15:02.200 the case of Baltimore, it can bust a cop planning evidence. Yeah, 0:15:02.240 --> 0:15:05.160 I saw that too, So that to me was more 0:15:05.240 --> 0:15:08.480 like interpretation of video. What is your what was your 0:15:08.520 --> 0:15:10.280 take on it? Well, no, there were two of them. 0:15:10.320 --> 0:15:13.240 The most recent one was interpretation of video. I think 0:15:13.240 --> 0:15:16.440 there was one previous to that where it actually caught 0:15:16.480 --> 0:15:18.960 the cop planning evidence because he didn't know that the 0:15:18.960 --> 0:15:22.120 thirty second buffer was happening. Oh really, I didn't see 0:15:22.120 --> 0:15:24.600 that one. Uh. And then that may have been I'm 0:15:24.600 --> 0:15:26.680 not sure in this case, but sometimes it's uploaded to 0:15:26.680 --> 0:15:31.360 a cloud and it's there right. The second one I 0:15:31.400 --> 0:15:35.600 think was what it looks like is that the cops 0:15:35.840 --> 0:15:40.360 took a made a concerted effort to organize and deploy 0:15:40.480 --> 0:15:46.640 their cameras at specific times to get away with planning evidence. 0:15:48.080 --> 0:15:50.640 So that's the speculation. This is all very brand new 0:15:50.680 --> 0:15:53.720 in the news. But you know, their cops saying like, 0:15:53.720 --> 0:15:55.160 do you have yours on? You're not supposed to have 0:15:55.240 --> 0:15:58.520 yours on yet, saying things like that, and of course 0:15:58.600 --> 0:16:01.000 the a c, L, EU and and the prosecutors are 0:16:01.040 --> 0:16:04.400 saying this is clearly the cops trying to coordinate this 0:16:04.440 --> 0:16:09.600 thing with their cameras staging with reality. Yeah, and that's 0:16:10.160 --> 0:16:12.480 something that is going to start happening more and more. 0:16:12.560 --> 0:16:16.960 I mean, ideally all all cops are doing really good work, uh, 0:16:17.000 --> 0:16:19.200 and you don't have to worry about that. But you know, 0:16:19.280 --> 0:16:21.360 there's been plenty of cases over the years of bad 0:16:21.400 --> 0:16:24.280 cops doing bad things, and now these body cameras, they're 0:16:24.280 --> 0:16:26.000 gonna have to find a way to get around it. Yeah, 0:16:26.040 --> 0:16:28.520 and I want to can I just say something real quick? So, 0:16:28.520 --> 0:16:31.680 so the the whole issue to me is this, right, Like, um, 0:16:31.720 --> 0:16:34.840 I think I've probably come off as distrustful of cops 0:16:34.880 --> 0:16:40.920 sometimes and to me, um, so, as society, we give 0:16:41.000 --> 0:16:44.400 cops like a tremendous amount of power over us, right, 0:16:44.840 --> 0:16:47.920 and we give it to them in exchange for them up, 0:16:48.200 --> 0:16:53.040 you know, upholding the law and protecting us right. Right. 0:16:53.440 --> 0:16:57.600 But the problem is is if that trust is broken, 0:16:58.280 --> 0:17:01.000 then that's a huge issue because as you go suddenly 0:17:01.160 --> 0:17:05.040 from because you can't do anything about it, and you 0:17:05.119 --> 0:17:09.240 go from being a protected citizen to being a hostage 0:17:09.240 --> 0:17:12.919 of the state. Right. So that means to me that 0:17:13.000 --> 0:17:17.680 police have to be like above reproach, that they they 0:17:17.800 --> 0:17:22.639 have to be as angelic as possible right, and that 0:17:22.840 --> 0:17:27.960 if they're there, um, if they're that, if they're called 0:17:28.000 --> 0:17:32.200 into question for something, there shouldn't even be the slightest 0:17:32.280 --> 0:17:35.320 hint that they're being protected or it's being covered up 0:17:35.720 --> 0:17:38.320 or anything like that, and government needs to step in 0:17:38.359 --> 0:17:40.640 and do something about it. And that has not been 0:17:40.680 --> 0:17:44.800 the case. Government has broken down in its role of 0:17:45.080 --> 0:17:49.200 overseeing police when the question of trust is brought up, 0:17:49.680 --> 0:17:53.680 and what you're left with then is a citizenry that 0:17:54.080 --> 0:17:56.040 it says I don't trust the cops any longer, and 0:17:56.400 --> 0:17:58.520 just as bad as that, I don't trust the governments 0:17:58.560 --> 0:18:02.840 to root out back cops. Um when the trust is broken, 0:18:03.200 --> 0:18:06.919 but the power structure is still there. That doesn't exactly exactly, 0:18:06.960 --> 0:18:09.880 So we're all hostages now to the cops. That's it's 0:18:09.920 --> 0:18:12.919 clearer than ever. Now. That's that's my problem. I'm not 0:18:12.960 --> 0:18:15.960 saying that that is necessarily the case, or that even 0:18:16.000 --> 0:18:17.920 if it is the case, it's the case across the board. 0:18:18.040 --> 0:18:19.960 I think there are plenty of plenty and plenty of 0:18:20.000 --> 0:18:22.560 good cops out there who really do hold themselves to 0:18:22.640 --> 0:18:25.080 a very high stenator. But the fact is there are 0:18:25.160 --> 0:18:27.679 bad cops out there too, And I don't believe that 0:18:27.720 --> 0:18:33.680 bad cops are rooted out and prosecuted like they should be, 0:18:34.560 --> 0:18:38.000 and that the trust between the citizens and the police 0:18:38.240 --> 0:18:41.400 has eroded as a result, and the government has totally 0:18:41.480 --> 0:18:45.800 dropped the ball in in repairing that. Yeah, and especially 0:18:45.800 --> 0:18:50.320 tough too when like every uh, every bad cop documentary 0:18:50.359 --> 0:18:53.919 you've ever seen of them, the first thing you hear 0:18:54.000 --> 0:18:55.960 cops saying as well, the first rule is you gotta 0:18:56.000 --> 0:18:58.360 cover for your buddy cops. Like, even if you don't 0:18:58.359 --> 0:19:00.560 agree with them, you don't ride out a cop. And 0:19:00.640 --> 0:19:05.280 so then you're like, I think cops also subscribe almost 0:19:05.320 --> 0:19:08.000 across the board to what's right is right though, you 0:19:08.040 --> 0:19:10.960 know what I mean, and that they do kind of 0:19:10.960 --> 0:19:14.080 tend to to to go toward that. I like to 0:19:14.160 --> 0:19:17.000 think that I want to think that. Um, and I 0:19:17.040 --> 0:19:19.960 hope I'm not being naive and thinking that you wanna 0:19:19.960 --> 0:19:21.960 take a break. Yeah, all right, let's do it. We'll 0:19:21.960 --> 0:19:43.280 talk a little more about body cameras. All right, we're 0:19:43.320 --> 0:19:46.480 back with a little more of the mundane, which is 0:19:46.720 --> 0:19:49.399 the cost of these things. Uh. They can go up 0:19:49.440 --> 0:19:54.720 to about nine bucks or as low as the low hundreds. UM, 0:19:54.800 --> 0:19:57.159 let's such just say an average of four bucks for 0:19:57.200 --> 0:20:00.679 a system. UM, and if you have a large police 0:20:00.720 --> 0:20:05.200 force of six cops, that's a lot of dough, Um 0:20:05.240 --> 0:20:08.440 it is. But Uncle Sam is offsetting a lot of that. Yeah. Sure, 0:20:08.920 --> 0:20:11.959 And and I think everyone is in favor of these 0:20:13.359 --> 0:20:16.720 And I think our article points out in a very 0:20:16.760 --> 0:20:21.520 astute way, like ideally these things can provide clarity, but 0:20:21.600 --> 0:20:25.159 at the very least it's just another measure in place 0:20:25.440 --> 0:20:28.760 to help protect citizens and police. Yes, but there's a 0:20:28.800 --> 0:20:32.600 group who say, no, these are kind of a bad idea. 0:20:32.720 --> 0:20:36.560 And I find it's suspicious that the government is um 0:20:36.560 --> 0:20:42.280 supporting this so so wholeheartedly, that it's just um advancing 0:20:42.320 --> 0:20:45.760 the surveillance state that much more normalizing the idea of 0:20:45.800 --> 0:20:49.320 people being recorded everywhere they go all the time, even 0:20:49.320 --> 0:20:52.719 in interacting with other people. Yeah, so I think there 0:20:52.760 --> 0:20:54.760 are some people who just don't even like the idea 0:20:54.760 --> 0:20:57.960 of of body war and cameras at all. Well, citizens 0:20:57.960 --> 0:21:03.720 and cops probably, right, Um, So another big problem or not, Well, 0:21:03.760 --> 0:21:05.919 I guess it is sort of a problem or challenge 0:21:05.920 --> 0:21:09.480 at least, is is how to store this information, um, 0:21:09.520 --> 0:21:12.440 depending on where you are, Like they use Oakland as 0:21:12.480 --> 0:21:15.800 a as an example in this article. Six hundred cops, 0:21:15.800 --> 0:21:19.679 six hundred body cameras generates about seven terabytes of video 0:21:20.200 --> 0:21:24.240 every month and UM Storing the stuff is a big 0:21:24.680 --> 0:21:27.560 challenge because depending on where you are, you have a 0:21:27.640 --> 0:21:31.800 lot of rules in place because this is evidence potentially 0:21:32.520 --> 0:21:34.679 and it's you know, you can't just store it anyway 0:21:34.720 --> 0:21:36.399 you like in Oakland they have to keep it for 0:21:36.480 --> 0:21:41.320 two years of anything that's involved in an investigation. It's 0:21:41.359 --> 0:21:46.760 longer than that. Uh. Duluth Minnesota they point out thirty days. Laurel, 0:21:46.800 --> 0:21:50.800 Maryland has six six months. Like that's a lot of data. 0:21:51.040 --> 0:21:56.240 And the security standards are really uh strict, and they 0:21:56.320 --> 0:21:58.439 gotta figure out how to store this stuff, how to 0:21:58.480 --> 0:22:02.520 do it safely. And because people that know how to 0:22:02.560 --> 0:22:06.200 make money are are behind this. There are companies that's 0:22:06.400 --> 0:22:10.600 very smartly are coming up with complete systems that will 0:22:10.600 --> 0:22:13.400 offer a police department and say hey, we got you covered. 0:22:13.720 --> 0:22:15.879 We will take care of your storage, we will comply 0:22:16.000 --> 0:22:19.280 with all your rules and regulations, will train your people 0:22:19.280 --> 0:22:21.760 because you gotta hire in house people just to keep 0:22:21.800 --> 0:22:24.280 track of the data. Uh, and we'll do it all 0:22:24.320 --> 0:22:28.399 for you, exactly like Taser apparently has one heck of 0:22:28.440 --> 0:22:32.800 a system where when the when the UM officer puts 0:22:32.840 --> 0:22:36.440 there embody warrn camera on the dock to charge it 0:22:36.600 --> 0:22:40.760 simultaneously starts uploading um all of the all of the 0:22:40.840 --> 0:22:44.199 day's recording, right, So yeah, and it goes to the 0:22:44.200 --> 0:22:48.800 cloud um and multiple people have access to it. But 0:22:48.920 --> 0:22:54.000 it's any interaction with the video is logged automatically by 0:22:54.040 --> 0:22:57.680 the system. If somebody goes to delete it, like only 0:22:57.720 --> 0:23:01.359 certain people have access to delete file aisles, but again 0:23:01.440 --> 0:23:04.639 multiple people do, and so if somebody goes to delete it, 0:23:05.040 --> 0:23:09.800 they they're the other people who have the ability ability 0:23:09.880 --> 0:23:13.440 to delete it are notified. So it's spreads Yeah, it 0:23:13.520 --> 0:23:16.640 spreads out accountability. So it's like, well, wait a minute, 0:23:16.680 --> 0:23:19.320 I'm going down to for letting you delete it. If so, 0:23:19.400 --> 0:23:22.520 what are you deleting this for kind of thing? Um, 0:23:22.520 --> 0:23:25.200 it's a pretty smart system. Like from what I read 0:23:25.280 --> 0:23:28.840 from Pastor Neck in particular his article, it was like 0:23:28.920 --> 0:23:32.119 Taser's got it going on. But if you if you 0:23:32.240 --> 0:23:35.959 take the software away from it and the you know, 0:23:36.040 --> 0:23:38.880 the LED light attached to it and all that stuff, 0:23:39.320 --> 0:23:41.919 it's really what you have is basically a GoPro camera. 0:23:42.760 --> 0:23:49.919 It's the it's the highly encrypted and protected software that 0:23:50.040 --> 0:23:52.160 goes along with it that really makes it like law 0:23:52.240 --> 0:23:54.600 enforcement specific. Yeah. I think in a lot of these 0:23:54.600 --> 0:23:58.080 places the d A even has access remotely to this footage, 0:23:58.520 --> 0:24:02.000 which is pretty interesting. The thing that that worries me 0:24:02.040 --> 0:24:05.919 a little bit is the the situations where the local 0:24:06.000 --> 0:24:11.359 police department has their own employees who are responsible for 0:24:11.920 --> 0:24:18.440 keeping and maintaining and storing the video. It should be 0:24:19.200 --> 0:24:23.600 it should be larger than that. You know, that's too localized. Yeah, 0:24:23.680 --> 0:24:25.960 I mean this, it's sort of like it makes me 0:24:26.000 --> 0:24:28.399 think of all the movies I've seen where the the 0:24:28.440 --> 0:24:32.639 evidence locker is guarded by like a dude, and someone 0:24:32.680 --> 0:24:35.560