Speaker 1: Hi, Get Everybody on Dan Horde and this is the
Speaker 1: Bengals Booth podcast, The Getting beats all the time, better, better,
Speaker 1: better audition as the Bengals look for their second win
Speaker 1: in a row this week, as they faced the five
Speaker 1: and seven Browns in Cleveland. Coming up, I'll be joined
Speaker 1: by my broadcast partner Dave Lapham as we discussed the
Speaker 1: latest Bengals news, including the return of John Ross, a
Speaker 1: fair assessment of offensive lineman Bobby Hart, and what seems
Speaker 1: like an absurd question, do the Bengals have to worry
Speaker 1: about one win going to their heads? My locker room
Speaker 1: conversation this week is with safety Jesse Bates, who describes
Speaker 1: just how good it felt to no longer have to
Speaker 1: worry about possibly joining the two thousand and eight Lions
Speaker 1: and the two thousand and seventeen Browns and the Owen
Speaker 1: sixteen Club. And in this week's No the Fox segment,
Speaker 1: we'll get the lowdown on the Cleveland Browns from one
Speaker 1: of my favorite radio play by play guys in the NFL,
Speaker 1: Cleveland's Jim Donovan. All of that is straight ahead, but first,
Speaker 1: here's a quick reminder that you can have the latest
Speaker 1: edition of this podcast delivered right to your phone, tablet,
Speaker 1: or computer by subscribing on iTunes, Stitcher, Google Play, Spotify,
Speaker 1: or pod Bean. It's the greatest thing since the movie
Speaker 1: die Hard. The Christmas season is upon us, and that
Speaker 1: means there should be plenty of opportunities while scanning around
Speaker 1: the dial to find the perfect Christmas movie. Die Hard.
Speaker 1: It's one of my all time favorite movies period. Bruce
Speaker 1: Willis has never been better. Alan Rickman is the perfect
Speaker 1: villain as Hans Gruba, and it's one of the most
Speaker 1: quotable movies ever, from Shoot the Glass to Hans Bubby,
Speaker 1: I'm Your White Knight, to Yippie Kaye mother, Well, you
Speaker 1: know the rest. So tis the season to be jolly
Speaker 1: and to spend a couple of hours at the Nakatomi
Speaker 1: plazat Christmas Party. Now, let's get to the latest Bengals
Speaker 1: news with my broadcast partner Dave Lapham, and we start
Speaker 1: with a Bengals defense that held the New York Jets
Speaker 1: to two hundred and seventy one yards and two field
Speaker 1: goals last week and did not give up a twenty
Speaker 1: yard play for the first time in twenty seven games.
Speaker 1: Lap the Bengals defense has held three straight opponents to
Speaker 1: seventeen or fewer points. Is that mostly due to mediocre
Speaker 1: opponents or do you see signs that the defense might
Speaker 1: actually be decent. I think it's a combination of both,
Speaker 1: you know. I do think that anytime you hold any offense,
Speaker 1: I don't care if it's peewee football out of the
Speaker 1: end zone and limit them to field goals, you've done
Speaker 1: a hell of a job. And I thought that defensive
Speaker 1: performance they had last week was masterful. Really. I mean,
Speaker 1: they didn't even let him in the red zone. They
Speaker 1: didn't even let him inside the twenty yard line one snap,
Speaker 1: just a yeoman's effort right there. But I do think
Speaker 1: that it's a combination of the level of the opponent
Speaker 1: and the people up front, coupled with the Bengals getting
Speaker 1: healthy on their side of it defensively, so instead of
Speaker 1: six man rotation, they've had a full eight man rotation
Speaker 1: against lesser groups, And that combination, that synergy of not
Speaker 1: as good an opponent up front and having all of
Speaker 1: your guys and keeping your stars fresh, fresher in the
Speaker 1: fourth quarter and all throughout the football game has been
Speaker 1: a big, big deal. Because in the opener against Seattle
Speaker 1: when all hands were on deck. Defensive line kicked some tail,
Speaker 1: I mean, just dominated up front. And then the injuries
Speaker 1: start happening and they're playing good quality opponents and Lamar
Speaker 1: Jackson's of the world and you're down a few guys
Speaker 1: in your front seven. You know, those things kind of
Speaker 1: snowball the wrong way. Now maybe you're playing you know,
Speaker 1: you're done with Jackson and the Baltimore Ravens. You don't
Speaker 1: have to worry about that that craziness anymore. You don't
Speaker 1: have the forty nine ers with what they were doing,
Speaker 1: a lot of those offenses and those offensive lines are gone,
Speaker 1: and you're playing, you know, offenses that aren't quite as
Speaker 1: explosive with less talent in their offensive line, and you've
Speaker 1: got your troops back. I think I think it's that
Speaker 1: that entire storyline right there. John Ross, his eligibolter, returned
Speaker 1: from the injured list this week. It sounds like he's
Speaker 1: going too. How does that impact the playbook? Well, I mean,
Speaker 1: I keep going back to Deshaun Watson, you know, talking
Speaker 1: about um he had he had a subpart performance and
Speaker 1: then the following week came back and played very well,
Speaker 1: you know, and then Thursday Night football. He had another
Speaker 1: great game. But when he went from the poor performance
Speaker 1: to coming back and playing well, he was asked after
Speaker 1: the game, you know, what's the difference in how you performed?
Speaker 1: You said, got Fuller back. Fuller of Notre Dame stretched
Speaker 1: the field man. Bengals almost drafted him, they wanted him,
Speaker 1: and the Texans got them right. The Bengals did, and
Speaker 1: then later on they draft John Ross to that same role.
Speaker 1: So Fuller and Ross provide the same thing. What's Fuller
Speaker 1: provided to Deshaun Watson, Ross is going to provide to
Speaker 1: Andy Dalton, and what Fuller provided to his cohorts the
Speaker 1: receiver position, John Ross is going to provide to Tyler
Speaker 1: Boyd and his cohorts at the receiver position as well.
Speaker 1: So I think that it's just having speed, somebody that
Speaker 1: you know, takes the top off the defense. The box
Speaker 1: that the Bengals will have been playing and will finally
Speaker 1: be open and they'll be able to walk outside the
Speaker 1: box and get some fresh air and say, wow, it's
Speaker 1: nice out here, you know. And I think there's going
Speaker 1: to be an impact. And like we've talked about a
Speaker 1: few times, it not only impacts the passing attack where
Speaker 1: guys like Tyler Boyd and Tyler Eiffert, can you know,
Speaker 1: abuse the middle of the football field. When John Ross
Speaker 1: is stretching one side of it, he is going to
Speaker 1: tilt coverage. You know. It opens up some running lanes
Speaker 1: for Joe Mixon, makes it easier for the offensive line
Speaker 1: to create some cavities for Joe Misson to take advantage
Speaker 1: of and man up in Cleveland, it's grass in Miami's grass.
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, of AJ Green would come back as well,
Speaker 1: And obviously that's a hope in her prayers. There's no
Speaker 1: indication that that would be the case at this point
Speaker 1: in time. But if he were to come back, have
Speaker 1: John Ross on one side, AJ Green and the other
Speaker 1: taking the top off the defense on both sides of
Speaker 1: the football field, I mean, the offense would look so different.
Speaker 1: People would be like, where's this been. It's been on
Speaker 1: the sideline with injury. I mean, the Bengals have been playing.
Speaker 1: They've been hamstrung all season long in terms of what
Speaker 1: they really are offensively. Let's talk about a wide receiver
Speaker 1: who does not have great speed, Audent Tate. He never
Speaker 1: really seems to be open, but he's become a key weapon.
Speaker 1: He had four catches for sixty six yards last week.
Speaker 1: He's on a pace for seven hundred forty five receiving
Speaker 1: yards this year. Have you ever seen anybody quite like
Speaker 1: Auden Tate? You know, he's I've seen a lot of
Speaker 1: receivers that you know, don't didn't have great speed, but
Speaker 1: could find a way to get open, you know, Danny
Speaker 1: Abramowitz and Fred Bolitnikoff, and I mean, but that's that's
Speaker 1: back a lot of years ago. Chip Myers was a
Speaker 1: big receiver, tall, not super speed, but kind of deceptive speed.
Speaker 1: Pat mcinally same type of guy, big, tall receiver, deceptive speed.
Speaker 1: This guy, though, is six to five almost two hundred
Speaker 1: and thirty pounds, like two hundred and twenty eight pounds,
Speaker 1: So you know, I'm sure a lot of teams in
Speaker 1: the league there was a temptation to say, hey, let's
Speaker 1: get him up to like two thirty eight, two forties
Speaker 1: and see if he can play tight end. But he's
Speaker 1: he is a gifted wide receiver. I mean that's due
Speaker 1: to the injuries. He's had a legitimate chance, and he's
Speaker 1: proven that he belongs in the National Football League's He's
Speaker 1: a guy that he's not going to run by you.
Speaker 1: But when he's covered, he's open because he'll box you out.
Speaker 1: I mean, he uses his body position to his advantage.
Speaker 1: He's got extremely long arms, so you know, he's got
Speaker 1: these big candle levers that he's got a huge catching radius.
Speaker 1: And when he gets his hands on the football, they're
Speaker 1: extremely strong. They're like suction cups, and he wins contested catches.
Speaker 1: And the one thing that he does is when he's
Speaker 1: right at the end of his route, at the top
Speaker 1: of his route, he does have the step to short
Speaker 1: space quickness for his size, and he can get you know,
Speaker 1: a little bit of separation just enough where he'll be
Speaker 1: able to use his body and do the things that
Speaker 1: that he can do. But man, I mean we've seen
Speaker 1: him contorting his body and you know, diving and making
Speaker 1: these circus catches. I mean, it's it's incredible to watch
Speaker 1: this kid and quarterbacks feel totally confident going back shoulder
Speaker 1: if he's covered, just going back shoulder to take get
Speaker 1: it anywhere in that vicinity. He'll make a play on it.
Speaker 1: It's it's been impressive to watch. He's been you know,
Speaker 1: he's been a nice storyline to follow this year. Offensive
Speaker 1: coordinator Brian Callahan had praised for right tackle Bobby Hart
Speaker 1: this week. It wasn't effusive, but he said he's had
Speaker 1: a solid season overall. Do you agree. I think people are.
Speaker 1: I mean, they'd love to pile on on Bobby Hart,
Speaker 1: there's no question. I mean it started with the contract.
Speaker 1: You know, he gets more money than people felt like
Speaker 1: he should get, so he becomes an easy target, you know,
Speaker 1: in their mind. And he'll have his you know, a
Speaker 1: moment where he jumps off sides or whatever. But his
Speaker 1: whole thing is he wants to be on the cutting
Speaker 1: edge of I have to get off these defensive linemen.
Speaker 1: I don't want to let them have a good get
Speaker 1: off on me. I'm quick, My strength was my feet.
Speaker 1: I'm an He's an athletic guy, he really is. He's
Speaker 1: not a big, group overpower you type guy, but he's
Speaker 1: got really good feet, he's got long arms, he uses
Speaker 1: his hands well, and yeah, honestly, he's he's played pretty solidly.
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, where would they be without Bobby
Speaker 1: Hart and Trey Hopkins. I mean those guys have been
Speaker 1: the staples, you know, in terms of and Bobby Honestly,
Speaker 1: since the Baltimore game, the second Baltimore game. Has been
Speaker 1: playing with a bum shoulder and it's he said, it's
Speaker 1: not getting worse, but he's had a harness on it
Speaker 1: from time to time and you can't really get it
Speaker 1: up above his head. But you don't need to to
Speaker 1: be able to block. So he has enough of his
Speaker 1: power and his strength where he can keep his hands
Speaker 1: and arms below his shoulders and be able to block people.
Speaker 1: So the fact that he's out there sucking it up,
Speaker 1: you know, playing hurt and the shoulder injury is not fun.
Speaker 1: Believe me, when you have shoulder problems, it's not fun
Speaker 1: when you're alignment because you know you're dealing with you're
Speaker 1: dealing with that pain every snap. So you know, I
Speaker 1: think that saying that he's had a solid season would
Speaker 1: I wouldn't dispute that. I wouldn't disagree with that whatsoever.
Speaker 1: Speaking of the old line, rookie Michael Jordan was back
Speaker 1: in this dining lineup last week. How did he do
Speaker 1: a lot better? You know, I thought, you know, lesson
Speaker 1: learned and was learned against a great player, I mean,
Speaker 1: Cameron Heyward is He's a man. There's no doubt about that.
Speaker 1: Fellow Buckeye. He's having a Pro Bowl season. I don't
Speaker 1: think he gets enough credit, even though it's a Pro
Speaker 1: Bowl player. It's like nobody talks about him enough in
Speaker 1: my opinion. But you know, Michael learned a lot that
Speaker 1: football game in Pittsburgh. As a line they gave up
Speaker 1: eight sacks and Cameron Hayward had two and a half
Speaker 1: of them. So he's worked his way back. He was
Speaker 1: nicked up a little bit injury wise, worked his way back.
Speaker 1: They started using him as the extra tight end and
Speaker 1: formations and there he is out there again. Another guy
Speaker 1: with huge radius, I mean, long athletic, can move his feet,
Speaker 1: He's got power. The biggest thing about Michael Jordana that
Speaker 1: has impressed me extremely mature. I mean he's only twenty
Speaker 1: two years old. I think he just recently turned it
Speaker 1: and his parents raised him right. I mean, that kid
Speaker 1: is mature and a lot of guys might have crumbled
Speaker 1: and assumed the fetal position to never recover after what
Speaker 1: happened with Cameron Hayward. But he uses as a learning
Speaker 1: tool and I think he's gonna have a hell of
Speaker 1: a career. I think he's gonna play a long time.
Speaker 1: I think he's gonna play at a very high level
Speaker 1: for a long time. I think they feel like traded
Speaker 1: up to get him for a reason, and I think
Speaker 1: they feel comfortable with it. Bengals in Cleveland to take
Speaker 1: on the Browns this Sunday, Lap the Browns. Around the
Speaker 1: cover of Sports Illustrated's NFL Preview edition, SI predicted that
Speaker 1: the Browns would win the AFC North. Well, they're five
Speaker 1: and seven. They lost to the Steelers last week with
Speaker 1: Devlin Duck Hodges at quarterback. Are you surprised that the
Speaker 1: Browns aren't that good? You know, I think that sometimes
Speaker 1: expectations are set so high it's almost impossible to achieve them.
Speaker 1: And honestly, a first time head coach takes time. I mean,
Speaker 1: he was assistant running back coach. I think at the
Speaker 1: beginning of the year a year ago, it was crazy.
Speaker 1: I mean, the Mete York rise has been just, you know,
Speaker 1: a site to behold. Freddy Kitchens came out of nowhere,
Speaker 1: and you know, I really thought that the way they
Speaker 1: the way they responded, you know, last year to Greg Williams,
Speaker 1: I really thought that that might be a direction that
Speaker 1: they go and maybe make Freddy Kitchens offensive coordinator because
Speaker 1: there's a relationship with Baker Mayfield. Because of his relationship
Speaker 1: with Baker Mayfield, they named him the head coach and
Speaker 1: let Greg Williams walk so and I think the defense
Speaker 1: was playing so well into Greg Williams. I would have
Speaker 1: just kept him around and kept that kind of style
Speaker 1: of play that they were responding to. So I you know,
Speaker 1: I think I think part of it is decisions that
Speaker 1: were made in the coaching aspect of it, and then
Speaker 1: a lot of times you accumulate star players like they did,
Speaker 1: doesn't mean it's going to work in terms of chemistry,
Speaker 1: in terms of you know, defining roles on a football team,
Speaker 1: checking egos and all the things that have to go
Speaker 1: with that. So I thought they would be better. I
Speaker 1: did not see them, you know, being a super Bowl winner,
Speaker 1: of being a Super Bowl participant, winning the AFC Championship.
Speaker 1: I didn't see that. But I saw them being a
Speaker 1: potential playoff team. You know what, the talent they have,
Speaker 1: and they haven't performed up to that level. There's there's
Speaker 1: no doubt about that, and there's there's a myriad of
Speaker 1: reasons why, and it just goes to show you that
Speaker 1: the intangibles are at least as maybe more important than
Speaker 1: intangibles when you're putting the thing together. And I think
Speaker 1: I think this football team is probably a pretty good
Speaker 1: example of that lap. After setting a rookie record with
Speaker 1: twenty seven touchdown passes and becoming a pitch man for
Speaker 1: every other advertiser on TV, Baker Mayfield has had a
Speaker 1: lousy year. He has last among qualifying quarterbacks and passer rating.
Speaker 1: He's got fourteen interceptions. That's the third most in the NFL.
Speaker 1: Are we talking second year growing pains or something more?
Speaker 1: That's that's a great question. I mean, I think that
Speaker 1: a lot of times defensive coordinators have a full offseason
Speaker 1: to take a look at Baker Mayfield, what he does best,
Speaker 1: to take away from him, Like Bill Belichick always says,
Speaker 1: take a player's strength, the way, make him play left
Speaker 1: handed if he's a right handed player, or vice versa,
Speaker 1: you know, And I think people are doing that with
Speaker 1: Baker Mayfield somewhat. Maybe he's not handling the looks and
Speaker 1: the pressures as much or as well as he did.
Speaker 1: That's a good question. I mean, it would have to be.
Speaker 1: You don't have to be tracking him almost on a
Speaker 1: week to week basis. Up there to see and to
Speaker 1: see what they're doing against him. And part of it
Speaker 1: too is you know, bringing in a guy like Beckham
Speaker 1: and you know you've got Landry who you had established
Speaker 1: a relationship. Now Beckham wants the ball. I mean, it's
Speaker 1: just it's kind of a tug of war. Even if
Speaker 1: it's not something that is verbalized, you know that everybody
Speaker 1: wants to football. It's to me, it's almost like when
Speaker 1: you have too many superstars at one position group, it
Speaker 1: can be an issue. You know there you're always better
Speaker 1: off having a clear cut number one and then you know,
Speaker 1: and then everybody else has roles. Sometimes when you have
Speaker 1: one and one a or two ones or whatever it is,
Speaker 1: that can kind of play with a quarterback a little
Speaker 1: bit too. I think losing his tight end to injury,
Speaker 1: who's a big time playmaker, was a factor in it
Speaker 1: as well. He does like to utilize the tight end.
Speaker 1: He had a great one when he was at Oklahoma
Speaker 1: Andrews was playing well, you know, for the Baltimore Ravens.
Speaker 1: So he's very mindful of involving tight ends in the
Speaker 1: passing game. So it's a bunch of things. Offensive line
Speaker 1: I don't think is his playing as well, maybe as
Speaker 1: they did last year. So it's probably not just a thing.
Speaker 1: It's like it always is. It's an accumulation of a
Speaker 1: lot of things, and sometimes those little things start accumulating,
Speaker 1: they become big issues. Lap As crazy as this might sound,
Speaker 1: after No. And eleven start, did the Bengals have to
Speaker 1: worry about one win going to their heads? You know,
Speaker 1: handling success, that that old story is a factor, and
Speaker 1: you know, one win, he can't hardly term it success,
Speaker 1: but it is such a relief. It's like that nasty
Speaker 1: pimple that filled and all that pressure and finally that
Speaker 1: sucker pops, you know. I mean, that's what you're hoping
Speaker 1: might happen, and the Bengals get that victory and it
Speaker 1: alleviates and leaves all that pressure. But Dan, it wasn't
Speaker 1: a masterpiece. I mean, they averaged one point eight yards
Speaker 1: a carry. They had no players of twenty yards or more.
Speaker 1: Their longest run was nine yards, their longest pass I
Speaker 1: think was seventeen. It was a touchdown. I mean, it
Speaker 1: wasn't like they ripped it up offensively. Defensively, you know,
Speaker 1: they were unbelievable defensively. They've only given up one touchdown
Speaker 1: the last ten quarters of play. I mean, that's that's
Speaker 1: pretty phenomenal and thirty nine points in the last three games.
Speaker 1: They've been building and getting better on the defensive side
Speaker 1: of things. But there were a lot of corrections to
Speaker 1: be made looking at that tape. And I bet if
Speaker 1: guys looked at that tape against the New York Jets,
Speaker 1: particularly offensively, they can point to other games as an
Speaker 1: offensive line where we blocked guys better than that and
Speaker 1: lost the football game by two scores. We didn't block
Speaker 1: these guys as well in the running and we by
Speaker 1: two scores. So it's a crazy game, and you just
Speaker 1: always have to try to improve on your techniques and
Speaker 1: fundamentals and and try to make plays. I mean, it's
Speaker 1: all about making plays and limiting the plays that the
Speaker 1: other team makes. It's that simple. Best analogy ever, getting
Speaker 1: a win after an on eleven start is like popping
Speaker 1: a nasty pimple. I wouldn't want to see that line
Speaker 1: on a T shirt, although someday I hope to see
Speaker 1: a Dave Lapham T shirt with the words A loose
Speaker 1: groin is a happy groin. Now, time for this week's
Speaker 1: locker Room Conversation. As I visit with a second year
Speaker 1: Bengal who will be looking for his first win in
Speaker 1: three tries against Baker Mayfield and the Cleveland Browns. We're
Speaker 1: in the locker room with second year safety Jesse Bates.
Speaker 1: Give me a few words to describe how good it
Speaker 1: felt on Sunday night. Yeah, it's a lot of worries
Speaker 1: I can say about getting the first win. Obviously, it's
Speaker 1: something that we've won it all year. Um, it sucks
Speaker 1: that we had to wait until week twelve or whatever
Speaker 1: it was, but we finally got the monkey off our
Speaker 1: back and hopefully we can continue to build some minimum
Speaker 1: for next year, just knowing that we're that we can't
Speaker 1: play for any championships this year. So we're talking to
Speaker 1: Jesse Bates. When you guys came back to work on Monday,
Speaker 1: did everybody have a little pep in their step? Yeah?
Speaker 1: It was a little different, um watching the film compared
Speaker 1: to you know, losing. Um, I think we played a
Speaker 1: complete game as a whole football team, not just defensively
Speaker 1: or offensively. I think we played well consistently throughout the game.
Speaker 1: So that was good to see. I hate to even
Speaker 1: ask the question, but there've only been two oh and
Speaker 1: sixteen teams in history. As the losses were mounting, were
Speaker 1: you getting worried about that potential scarlet letter? UM? It's
Speaker 1: funny there was no conversation throughout the players thinking about
Speaker 1: going on sixteen. I think we're we did a really
Speaker 1: good job of just going in to every week, just
Speaker 1: going one to know UM. And unfortunately, like I said,
Speaker 1: we had to wait until week thirteen or whatever it
Speaker 1: was to get the first win. UM. We amongst you know,
Speaker 1: family and friends, you never want to be that team UM.
Speaker 1: For example, like the Cleveland Grounds. I mean they're they're
Speaker 1: all sixteen UM, and we don't want to be that.
Speaker 1: So hopefully we can stack some wins and you know,
Speaker 1: makes the season feel a little better on the back end.
Speaker 1: We're talking to Jesse Bates. Over the last three weeks,
Speaker 1: the defense is given up seventeen, sixteen and six points.
Speaker 1: That's going to get you a win almost any time.
Speaker 1: What's been the difference? UM, I just think that we
Speaker 1: executed UM the game plan very well. UH. The biggest
Speaker 1: thing that a lot of people have noticed is that
Speaker 1: we haven't given up a lot of explosive players. UM.
Speaker 1: And that's been the key part that hurt us um
Speaker 1: in the first part of the season. Um. And also
Speaker 1: we've we've been able to generate some turnovers as well
Speaker 1: and stop the run. So those three things. I mean
Speaker 1: that that has been the huge key for us defensively
Speaker 1: to give up. I mean I think that we're giving
Speaker 1: up to touchdown or a touchdown and up past ten
Speaker 1: quarters or something like that. Um, it's just good that
Speaker 1: we're playing well. It just needs to continue to snowball effect,
Speaker 1: like I said, and build the momentum to weeks on.
Speaker 1: Go ahead, Jesse, your thirteenth in the NFL and solo tackles.
Speaker 1: Switch is necessarily ideal when you're playing safety. But how
Speaker 1: much pride do you take and getting guys to the ground.
Speaker 1: Um yeah, it's something that Um, that's that's my job.
Speaker 1: That's my job description. Um, I'm a safety. I'm the
Speaker 1: last line of defense. And UM, if you can't get
Speaker 1: people on the ground, you're not doing your job, your
Speaker 1: job very well. So UM, me and me and Sean
Speaker 1: we take pride and you know, getting guys on the ground,
Speaker 1: making sure that there's no um, you know, explosive touchdowns
Speaker 1: that are happening. So UM yeah, I mean I take
Speaker 1: pride in that, and that's good to hear. So Sean,
Speaker 1: of course, is Sean Williams your fellows safety. He has
Speaker 1: played with a wide variety of injuries this year. I mean,
Speaker 1: everybody's bagged up this time of year, but in his case,
Speaker 1: it's been some pretty serious stuff. I might respect you
Speaker 1: have for him. Yeah, you know this isn't just the
Speaker 1: only example of having respect for him. You know, coming
Speaker 1: in as a rookie last year and hanging on to
Speaker 1: him and him taking me under his wing was a
Speaker 1: huge respect thing for me. And it's built not just
Speaker 1: on the field, it's built off the field as well. Um,
Speaker 1: Sean is pretty much like a big brother to me.
Speaker 1: So I got a lot of respect for him. You
Speaker 1: face the Browns this week. I heard you say earlier
Speaker 1: in the week that everybody knows about Odell Beckham Junior
Speaker 1: and Jarvis Landry and they're great players, but the real
Speaker 1: key is the running backs. Yeah, and I think the
Speaker 1: two hour receivers they let everyone know when they catch
Speaker 1: the ball. I think that's what everybody, all the fans
Speaker 1: and stuff, wants to see because, like like you're saying, Um,
Speaker 1: before the season, they were the Super Bowl team that
Speaker 1: everybody thought that I was gonna make it to the
Speaker 1: Super Bowl. Um, and it's not such like that anymore. U.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I just think you know, Nick Chubb and
Speaker 1: Cream Hunt, those are the guys that gets that team going. Um.
Speaker 1: It's not the receivers, obviously, they're very dynamic. Um. But
Speaker 1: the thing that gets that that team going is those
Speaker 1: two running backs. So that's something that we've keyed in
Speaker 1: on this week. So last thing, Baker Mayfield has four
Speaker 1: teen picks this year. Is he a guy that has
Speaker 1: so much faith in his arm and his ability to
Speaker 1: stick it in a tight window that you think there
Speaker 1: will be opportunities to pick one off? Yeah? Absolutely. Um,
Speaker 1: I think last year he got away with a lot
Speaker 1: of stuff didn't and now it's kind of hurting him.
Speaker 1: He's thrown a lot of interceptions. Um. You know, hopefully
Speaker 1: you can throw us some. I mean, we haven't got
Speaker 1: as many as we wanted to as a secondary, as
Speaker 1: a whole defense. Um, but yeah, hopefully we can get
Speaker 1: him ratled and give him to talk a little stuff
Speaker 1: and those some interceptions. I hope this Monday is as
Speaker 1: enjoyable as last Monday. Wise, best of thanks for the time. Yes, Sir,
Speaker 1: that's Jesse Bates Baker. Mayfield has not had a good
Speaker 1: year other than cashing the checks for being on every
Speaker 1: other commercial on TV. But the Bengals only have to
Speaker 1: pop on the tape from last season to see Mayfield
Speaker 1: at is absolute best. In two wins against Cincinnati, the
Speaker 1: former Heisman Trophy winner through seven touchdown passes with no
Speaker 1: interceptions and a passer rating of one thirty five point eight.
Speaker 1: This year, it's been a different story. The number one
Speaker 1: pick in last year's draft ranks last among qualifying quarterbacks
Speaker 1: in completion percentage, touchdown to interception ratio and passer rating,
Speaker 1: and this week he's dealing with a bruised hand suffered
Speaker 1: late in the second quarter in last week's loss in Pittsburgh.
Speaker 1: Dave lappom and I discussed that and much more in
Speaker 1: this week's No The Faux segment with the radio voice
Speaker 1: of the Browns, Jim Donovan. My first question is how
Speaker 1: are those Pittsburghs started a T shirt selling? Are you
Speaker 1: wearing one as we speak? Right? If I did not
Speaker 1: wear mine outside to a movie? Yeah, I just got
Speaker 1: to go to the mister Rogers round. It's a great
Speaker 1: day in the papers of the movie and I did
Speaker 1: not have my uh fo it started his T shirt on.
Speaker 1: I have to tell you that's uh that whole thing.
Speaker 1: I mean not only that, I mean the T shirt,
Speaker 1: but what triggered it all That Thursday night game. Um,
Speaker 1: you know that that that was a great, great night
Speaker 1: in Cleveland. That turned into a real bad night in Cleveland.
Speaker 1: I mean it really did. When you beat the Steelers especially,
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, we it spent so long since
Speaker 1: the Browns had beaten the Steelers, but when you beat
Speaker 1: them it should be a holiday. The that statement. I
Speaker 1: have to tell you guys, because of the last eight
Speaker 1: seconds of that game and how it all you know,
Speaker 1: went down in that ugly melee when you watched out
Speaker 1: the first Entergy Stadium that night. It really how what
Speaker 1: they lost that night, and then all the other stuff
Speaker 1: that's gone down the road with it has been unbelievable.
Speaker 1: Freddy Kitchen seems like a likable guy, but that was
Speaker 1: just kind of such a silly thing to do, to
Speaker 1: be photographed with a fan. I would think you would
Speaker 1: have to know how that would come off. Is he
Speaker 1: just naive? Yeah? I think so, Dan, I really do.
Speaker 1: I think all of this notoriety. That really started last
Speaker 1: year when he became the offensive coordinator and the offense
Speaker 1: really started to Cleitch as you guys saw when he
Speaker 1: took over the play calling, and you know, he was
Speaker 1: just I think Clevelander said, Hey, this guy's like one
Speaker 1: of us. I mean, he wore the orange sweatshirt at
Speaker 1: that time that said dog Pound on it, and people
Speaker 1: really related to that. And so he became kind of
Speaker 1: a real favorite and the team finished well, and and
Speaker 1: he bought into that too. I mean, you know, he's
Speaker 1: out there. He's like a greeter when you meet him
Speaker 1: out in the streets. I mean he stops and talks
Speaker 1: to everybody. So I think all of this that came
Speaker 1: along with being the head coach of the Browns really
Speaker 1: was overwhelming to him. And there are a lot of
Speaker 1: areas whereas he has had a tough time handle, like
Speaker 1: what happened with the T shirt, but also what's happened
Speaker 1: with the you know, the multitude of responsibilities that go
Speaker 1: with becoming a head coach because he has never been
Speaker 1: a head coach before. Is the situation here in Cincinnati
Speaker 1: is Zach Taylor head coach and play caller is Freddie
Speaker 1: Kitchen's head coach. Is Monkin play caller? Is Freddie play caller?
Speaker 1: How much influence does Todd Monkin have on the offense. Well,
Speaker 1: that equation has been hard to decipher, but at least
Speaker 1: on game day, Freddie is the head coach and he
Speaker 1: is calling the play right Todd Monkin sits upstairs. They
Speaker 1: have never really come out and said here's how it happens,
Speaker 1: you know, to radio's down to play and then Freddie says, yeah,
Speaker 1: you're nay, And they've never really gone over that. You know.
Speaker 1: David was like it was a funny situation anyway, because
Speaker 1: Monkin is a you know, he's a pretty well established
Speaker 1: guy who was a head coach in college and of
Speaker 1: course a play caller before in and when he came
Speaker 1: here and Freddie had been come the head coach and
Speaker 1: was and openly said I'm gonna I'll call the place,
Speaker 1: he wondered why Monkin came here in the first place
Speaker 1: to do that. You know, it was kind of a
Speaker 1: strange set up for a guy that was so h
Speaker 1: you know, he has such good experience, but they've never
Speaker 1: really come out and said this is how we do it.
Speaker 1: They don't even describe what the format they go through
Speaker 1: during the week. Other than I know Todd, you know
Speaker 1: as a was a bit fan. I mean when he
Speaker 1: came here, he talked a great deal about getting the
Speaker 1: opportunity to be around a young quarterback like Baker Mayfield
Speaker 1: and watching him grow. And I know he was in
Speaker 1: love with, you know, the air raid offense coming into
Speaker 1: the NFL, and he up with what Kansas City was
Speaker 1: doing and he wanted to see that he put into
Speaker 1: the to the Cleveland offense. So I'm sure there's monk
Speaker 1: in influence. But as far as strategically on game day,
Speaker 1: as far as I know and what we've seen through
Speaker 1: the throe of these games, these twelve games, I would
Speaker 1: have to say that Freddie is he's calling the place
Speaker 1: too right. We are talking to the voice of the Browns,
Speaker 1: Jim Donovan. Jim. A lot of us expected to be
Speaker 1: the brown expected the Browns to be good this year.
Speaker 1: I'll put myself in that category. I'm not necessarily talking
Speaker 1: Super Bowl good, but certainly playoff good in my case
Speaker 1: at least, what did so many of us get wrong
Speaker 1: about the Cleveland Browns? Yeah, I think, Um, I think
Speaker 1: there's a lot to be said for chemistry. And I
Speaker 1: think at the end of the year last year when
Speaker 1: they get on that nice little run, they had a
Speaker 1: nice little chemistry going. They really did, and whether it
Speaker 1: was pretty you know, turning the offense around and and
Speaker 1: and Greg Williams really kind of making them to the
Speaker 1: long they were a very disciplined team at the end
Speaker 1: of the year. Um, but that was last year. But
Speaker 1: then coming into this year, you know, they added the
Speaker 1: big name parts. I mean they've been obviously OBJ and
Speaker 1: coming here that was the biggest of them all. And
Speaker 1: with the you know, Kareem Hunt joining the team and
Speaker 1: then sitting out the eight weeks because of suspension, and
Speaker 1: then adding him into the offense, It's been kind of
Speaker 1: like when you go into a buffet line and you
Speaker 1: just take everything, and they went and they took everything
Speaker 1: and they added that, and then when you sit down
Speaker 1: at potendy, you go on, this is just too much
Speaker 1: for me to eat. And really, when they're out on
Speaker 1: the field, you look at it and you just say,
Speaker 1: I don't think they really know what they want to
Speaker 1: do with all of this. I don't think they know
Speaker 1: how they can function. It's great to say we have
Speaker 1: Nick Chubb and Kareem Hunt, but I don't think they
Speaker 1: have a downpack yet. Of Okay, it's great to have them,
Speaker 1: but how are we going to use each one of
Speaker 1: their skills? How are we going to have them on
Speaker 1: the field together. What are we going to do? And
Speaker 1: the bier stopsacle has been Beckham. How it get him involved?
Speaker 1: And there has just been no chemistry. But I have
Speaker 1: to say this, in the off season, you know, Odell
Speaker 1: Beckham Junior really didn't do anything in the off season.
Speaker 1: He attended one OTA session, he came to the Mints,
Speaker 1: but he really didn't do anything. He came to training camp,
Speaker 1: he never played in the preseason game. So when they
Speaker 1: went out on the field and the opening game of
Speaker 1: the season against Tennessee, they can't expected, I think, to
Speaker 1: just snap their fingers and it's gonna work. And it
Speaker 1: has not worked. You mentioned discipline. You look at penalty yards.
Speaker 1: The Bengals of one and eleven football team have the
Speaker 1: fewest penalty yards of any team in the NFL. Number one,
Speaker 1: only five hundred and forty penalty yards. The team that
Speaker 1: has the most of the Cleveland Browns, you know, they've
Speaker 1: got nine hundred and twenty six penalty yards. The Bengals case,
Speaker 1: just have not made enough plays. Penalties have not betrayed
Speaker 1: the big plays. Have penalties betrayed and offset a lot
Speaker 1: of big plays by the Browns. Had they been not
Speaker 1: only numerous, but very untimely. Yeah, they have, and there's
Speaker 1: been and there's a lot of after the whistle stuff, Gabe.
Speaker 1: It really is, especially early in the year. The opening
Speaker 1: game of the year against Tennessee, they had eighteen eighteen
Speaker 1: accept eighteen accepted penalties. I mean they are over twenty.
Speaker 1: You know, if they had taken them all. Um, you know,
Speaker 1: they've had thirteen penaltyue games eleven. Only in the last
Speaker 1: couple of weeks has that come. I'm down a little bit.
Speaker 1: But yeah, there was a lot of there's a lot
Speaker 1: of unsports fell conduct, rough in the passer, that kind
Speaker 1: of stuff. I mean, they've had ejections. I mean not
Speaker 1: just the Miles Garrett one. I mean they've had to
Speaker 1: you know, there's there's left tackle Greg Robinson got kicked
Speaker 1: out of the opening game for kicking a guy in
Speaker 1: the head. I mean really, I mean really undisciplined stuff.
Speaker 1: Now during during the summer, you know, Hardy was saying
Speaker 1: they we're going to be a very tough football team,
Speaker 1: and I want them to be tough, and you know
Speaker 1: we're going to come back people. But there's a real line.
Speaker 1: I think that you have to you have to watch
Speaker 1: that you go over on the wrong side of that line.
Speaker 1: And I think too many times, uh that's happened. I mean,
Speaker 1: they the penalties have been absolutely just absurd. And then
Speaker 1: you go at the tikie tack ones where they can't
Speaker 1: get lined up, you know, a lot of false starts
Speaker 1: things like that. So, um, you know that that that's
Speaker 1: been something that really, you know a lot of people
Speaker 1: have said, hey, listen, there's a there's a discipline problem,
Speaker 1: you know, bordering on totally doing discipline. And I think
Speaker 1: that that falls on the post, on the head coach
Speaker 1: and definitely his staff. Sure. A couple more questions for
Speaker 1: the Voice of the Browns. Jim Donovan described Baker Mayfield's
Speaker 1: play this year. He's had a tough year, he really has.
Speaker 1: I mean, he had a sophomore I don't think it's
Speaker 1: I don't know if it's a sophomore slump. I think
Speaker 1: it definitely probably. Yeah, I think you could probably characterize
Speaker 1: it that way. Now. To hear myself saying it because
Speaker 1: I've watched it go. He has not. I don't think
Speaker 1: he's been comfortable guys with that offensive line in front
Speaker 1: of him, and I think he's taken a lot of hits.
Speaker 1: And he had a rough day in Pittsburgh last Sunday.
Speaker 1: He got sacked five times, he had an injured hand,
Speaker 1: he fumbled, he got intercepted. The interceptions were really high,
Speaker 1: especially early in the season. Got a little bit better
Speaker 1: before the Pittsburgh game when they won the three games
Speaker 1: in a row. He's been very frustrating at times. He's
Speaker 1: battled with the media a couple of times. You know,
Speaker 1: he looks as though he just doesn't know what he
Speaker 1: wants to do at times. And he was so decisive
Speaker 1: and so affluent last year, and I think that's why
Speaker 1: everybody was so excited about him coming into his second season.
Speaker 1: But whether it's just the odd of having a guy
Speaker 1: like Odell Beckham Junior out there and saying to yourself,
Speaker 1: I gotta get him the ball. I gotta get him
Speaker 1: the ball. It was a little bit like that when
Speaker 1: they had Josh Gordon here and he would return after
Speaker 1: a suspension and they would say, okay, listen, he's back
Speaker 1: in the lineup, we've got to push the ball to him,
Speaker 1: and everybody else fell out of the offense. And it's
Speaker 1: been like that. He's had a very, very tough year.
Speaker 1: I think that this will be a year. I think
Speaker 1: when he goes into year three next year, he'll look
Speaker 1: back and say, Wow, it's this position is really a
Speaker 1: lot tougher than I thought it was going to be
Speaker 1: after my rookie year. Two players, one offense, one defense,
Speaker 1: I think are a little uncelebrated in terms of what
Speaker 1: they do in my mind. Like you say, quarterback, star receivers,
Speaker 1: Nick Chubb, dude, I mean he's leading the NFL and
Speaker 1: rushing he runs as hard as anybody's ever seen. Eleven
Speaker 1: hundred and seventy five rushing yards, averaging almost five yards
Speaker 1: to carry, seven rushing touchdown. This dude is the real deal.
Speaker 1: And then defensively, Joe Schobert. Nobody talks it. He's a
Speaker 1: tackling machine. He's got fifty more tackles than the next guy.
Speaker 1: Basically Mack Wilson two sacks, four interceptions, all you know,
Speaker 1: all in the last in the last four games. Nine
Speaker 1: pass defense, two forced fumbles, fumble, recovery. He's a stat
Speaker 1: line stuff for those two guys, one on offense, one
Speaker 1: on defense. I'm like, man, they just jump out on
Speaker 1: tape now. Yeah. Nick Chubb is just the ultimate professional
Speaker 1: who doesn't look for any of the spotlight. He shuns it.
Speaker 1: He really does. He just does. He just does his
Speaker 1: work out in the field. There are no wild celebrations
Speaker 1: after touchdowns. He does it the old fashioned way, Dade.
Speaker 1: He kind of hands the ball to the official breed.
Speaker 1: He really is a rare breed. The other thing is
Speaker 1: he can run with power and then he's had an
Speaker 1: extra gear. He can run away from you. I mean
Speaker 1: he's had some classic long runs. He had a ninety
Speaker 1: two yard or in the big win that they had
Speaker 1: in Baltimore earlier season. It really kind of broke the
Speaker 1: game open. He can get you a yard, he can
Speaker 1: get you fifty yards. He's worked awfully hard, and especially
Speaker 1: when you know they had traded Duke Johnson and they
Speaker 1: didn't have Kareem Hunt for the first eight weeks, Chuck
Speaker 1: really worked hard him being a good receiver out of
Speaker 1: the background, and he's become more than adequate at doing that.
Speaker 1: But he is the ultimate throwback professional guy just a
Speaker 1: tremendous Kip doesn't say boo, and I mean he does
Speaker 1: it in a skyway, not in a way that you know,
Speaker 1: he shuns you. The other guy is he's a great story.
Speaker 1: Joe Shoulberg was a guy that when they joke to him,
Speaker 1: they thought, this guy's gonna be a core special teams player. Baby,
Speaker 1: he might get on the field. But I gotta give
Speaker 1: Gleg Williams a lot of credit. He's the guy that
Speaker 1: changed him into a mere linebacker. And he's really like
Speaker 1: a coordinator out on the field for them and they
Speaker 1: need that, believe me. You know, he gets the line
Speaker 1: up and then he makes play and he's all over
Speaker 1: the field. He can go sideline to sideline. His death
Speaker 1: on being able to drop in the passing in is
Speaker 1: tremendous and he's really a he's a terrific player. Keith
Speaker 1: thing Now, I mean, this is a contract year for
Speaker 1: him and it will be interesting to see what they
Speaker 1: do as far as they able to give him back
Speaker 1: next year. Our thanks to Jim Donovan. And that's going
Speaker 1: to do it for this episode of the podcast. If
Speaker 1: you haven't done so already, don't forget to subscribe. And
Speaker 1: if you have a minute, please give it a rating
Speaker 1: or share a comment. Five star ratings help more Bengals
Speaker 1: fans find this podcast. I'm Dan Horde and thank you
Speaker 1: for listening to the Bengals Booth podcast