1 00:00:01,720 --> 00:00:05,560 Speaker 1: All media. Hi everyone, It's me James, and I'm coming 2 00:00:05,600 --> 00:00:07,560 Speaker 1: at you today with one of these little requests that 3 00:00:07,760 --> 00:00:10,360 Speaker 1: I make sometimes when there's something that we would like 4 00:00:10,440 --> 00:00:13,000 Speaker 1: you to do, when it's very important to do. So 5 00:00:13,640 --> 00:00:16,239 Speaker 1: today I want to talk to you about Syria, and 6 00:00:16,280 --> 00:00:19,920 Speaker 1: specifically Northeast Syria. So with the world's eyes fixed on Syria, 7 00:00:19,960 --> 00:00:22,720 Speaker 1: many are rightly celebrating as a brutal dictatorship of Basha 8 00:00:22,800 --> 00:00:25,480 Speaker 1: a Lasad comes to an end. But for Kurdish and 9 00:00:25,480 --> 00:00:29,320 Speaker 1: other minority communities, recent days have bought violent attacks, ethnic 10 00:00:29,360 --> 00:00:33,120 Speaker 1: cleansing and occupation by Turkis back to Jahadis groups in 11 00:00:33,159 --> 00:00:35,479 Speaker 1: an attempt to take advantage of the chaos by crushing 12 00:00:35,520 --> 00:00:39,000 Speaker 1: the Rajava Revolution. Turkey and its mercenaries are openly committing 13 00:00:39,000 --> 00:00:42,960 Speaker 1: war crimes against the region's autonomous communities. Many thousands have 14 00:00:43,040 --> 00:00:45,519 Speaker 1: already been forced to be displaced and thousands more are 15 00:00:45,560 --> 00:00:49,839 Speaker 1: in danger. To make matters worth this remains largely absent 16 00:00:49,920 --> 00:00:53,080 Speaker 1: from the mainstream media reporting on Syria. If you'd like 17 00:00:53,120 --> 00:00:55,160 Speaker 1: to share your solidarity with the people of northern and 18 00:00:55,200 --> 00:00:57,840 Speaker 1: Eastern Syria, please call on Congress to take urgent action 19 00:00:58,000 --> 00:01:00,920 Speaker 1: by passing the Emergency legislation to stop the fight, hold 20 00:01:00,960 --> 00:01:04,640 Speaker 1: Turkey accountable, and commit US support to the Syrian democratic 21 00:01:04,720 --> 00:01:07,800 Speaker 1: forces and the diverse communities under their protection. If you 22 00:01:08,160 --> 00:01:10,640 Speaker 1: want to take action today, you can go to Defendrojaba 23 00:01:10,680 --> 00:01:13,600 Speaker 1: dot org. That's d E F E N d R 24 00:01:13,680 --> 00:01:17,520 Speaker 1: o ja va dot org. If you are able to 25 00:01:18,120 --> 00:01:20,720 Speaker 1: the most effective action we can take right now is 26 00:01:20,760 --> 00:01:24,160 Speaker 1: to call a couple of representatives, one representative and one Senator. 27 00:01:24,400 --> 00:01:27,280 Speaker 1: A representative would be Gregory Meeks. He's from New York. 28 00:01:27,319 --> 00:01:29,320 Speaker 1: He's a Democrat. He is a ranking member of the 29 00:01:29,360 --> 00:01:32,480 Speaker 1: House Foreign Affairs Committee. His phone number is two zero 30 00:01:32,560 --> 00:01:36,120 Speaker 1: two two two five three four six one. The other 31 00:01:36,160 --> 00:01:39,320 Speaker 1: one will be Senator James rish He's an Idaho Republican. 32 00:01:39,800 --> 00:01:42,440 Speaker 1: He is a ranking member's Senate Foreign Relations Committee. His 33 00:01:42,560 --> 00:01:45,559 Speaker 1: phone number would be two zero two two two four 34 00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:49,920 Speaker 1: two seven five two. If you'd like to have some 35 00:01:49,960 --> 00:01:52,800 Speaker 1: talking points, you can find those on Defendrojaba dot org. 36 00:01:53,680 --> 00:01:56,880 Speaker 1: If you'd like to donate financially instead, especially to this 37 00:01:57,000 --> 00:01:59,800 Speaker 1: humanitarian aid effort for the tens of thousands of people 38 00:01:59,800 --> 00:02:03,720 Speaker 1: who who have been displaced by the SNA's advances, you 39 00:02:03,760 --> 00:02:06,440 Speaker 1: can donate to two organizations that I would suggest to 40 00:02:06,480 --> 00:02:09,960 Speaker 1: first we be Heavier store the Curtis Red Crescent. That's 41 00:02:10,360 --> 00:02:14,960 Speaker 1: h E Yva s O R dot com and you 42 00:02:15,080 --> 00:02:16,560 Speaker 1: want to go slash e n If you want to 43 00:02:16,560 --> 00:02:18,960 Speaker 1: see their website in English, you can donate there. The 44 00:02:19,000 --> 00:02:21,320 Speaker 1: other one will be the Free Burmer Rangers who are 45 00:02:21,360 --> 00:02:24,400 Speaker 1: currently working in Raka. I was talking to my friend 46 00:02:24,400 --> 00:02:27,120 Speaker 1: Abat who works with them. You can donate to them 47 00:02:27,240 --> 00:02:32,120 Speaker 1: at www dot free fr e E Burma b U 48 00:02:32,280 --> 00:02:35,919 Speaker 1: r m A rangers dot com. We will put all 49 00:02:35,960 --> 00:02:38,320 Speaker 1: of this in the show notes or the URL, so 50 00:02:38,320 --> 00:02:40,000 Speaker 1: if you're driving you don't have to write them down. 51 00:02:40,280 --> 00:02:42,360 Speaker 1: Those are the concrete ways that we can help right 52 00:02:42,400 --> 00:02:44,919 Speaker 1: now and what is unfolding as a very terrible situation 53 00:02:45,240 --> 00:02:46,240 Speaker 1: in Assyria. Thanks. 54 00:02:46,280 --> 00:02:50,399 Speaker 2: I hope you do an episode Welcome to It could 55 00:02:50,400 --> 00:02:53,200 Speaker 2: happen here a podcast where I your host Miya One, 56 00:02:53,680 --> 00:02:58,200 Speaker 2: talks about inflation. We have covered inflation on this show extensively, 57 00:02:58,639 --> 00:03:01,520 Speaker 2: and now it is once again time to return to 58 00:03:01,560 --> 00:03:04,240 Speaker 2: it as we head into a world where concerns about 59 00:03:04,240 --> 00:03:08,360 Speaker 2: inflation and the economy are the most cited justifications for 60 00:03:08,400 --> 00:03:12,280 Speaker 2: people voting for one Donald Trump. But unlike our other 61 00:03:12,560 --> 00:03:16,000 Speaker 2: Oh God had so many episodes about inflation. This one 62 00:03:16,200 --> 00:03:18,720 Speaker 2: is going to be a bit different. Is going to 63 00:03:18,720 --> 00:03:20,920 Speaker 2: start out somewhat similar in that I am going to 64 00:03:20,960 --> 00:03:24,720 Speaker 2: lay out a brief explanation of the sort of material 65 00:03:24,800 --> 00:03:27,080 Speaker 2: causes of the inflation cycle, and talk a bit about 66 00:03:27,120 --> 00:03:30,240 Speaker 2: inflation theories, which is what we've been largely doing on 67 00:03:30,280 --> 00:03:33,119 Speaker 2: this show for a while. And then I am going 68 00:03:33,120 --> 00:03:35,920 Speaker 2: to explain why none of that shit mattered, why none 69 00:03:35,960 --> 00:03:38,440 Speaker 2: of what was actually causing inflation mattered a single bit, 70 00:03:38,480 --> 00:03:42,000 Speaker 2: because ultimately, our experience of inflation, and more importantly, of 71 00:03:42,120 --> 00:03:45,040 Speaker 2: price in general, is based on a sense of justice 72 00:03:45,760 --> 00:03:49,080 Speaker 2: or as the academics call it, a moral economy, and 73 00:03:49,120 --> 00:03:54,440 Speaker 2: not on anything that's sort of going on. So let's 74 00:03:54,480 --> 00:04:00,600 Speaker 2: begin with what is going on with inflation now. As 75 00:04:00,600 --> 00:04:03,880 Speaker 2: we've discussed before on this show, most economists do not 76 00:04:04,160 --> 00:04:07,840 Speaker 2: understand why inflation happens. People will take theories. Those theories 77 00:04:07,880 --> 00:04:11,080 Speaker 2: are usually quite bad. There is no mainstream consensus on 78 00:04:11,120 --> 00:04:13,920 Speaker 2: what is going on. As both me and my friends 79 00:04:13,920 --> 00:04:17,400 Speaker 2: at the magazine Strange Matters have pointed out, former Federal 80 00:04:17,440 --> 00:04:21,960 Speaker 2: Reserve Governor Daniel Tarulo said, quote, the substantive point is 81 00:04:22,000 --> 00:04:25,000 Speaker 2: that we do not at present have a theory of 82 00:04:25,000 --> 00:04:29,360 Speaker 2: inflation dynamics that work sufficiently well to be of use 83 00:04:29,400 --> 00:04:33,640 Speaker 2: for the business of real time monetary policy making. So again, 84 00:04:34,000 --> 00:04:35,800 Speaker 2: this is a guy who used to be a Federal 85 00:04:35,839 --> 00:04:39,080 Speaker 2: Reserve governor who has admitted that they have no idea 86 00:04:39,080 --> 00:04:41,520 Speaker 2: what the fuck is going on with inflation. Looking at 87 00:04:41,560 --> 00:04:43,240 Speaker 2: the extent to which people don't know what's going on 88 00:04:43,279 --> 00:04:46,120 Speaker 2: to inflation and how the various theories simply don't work 89 00:04:46,279 --> 00:04:49,920 Speaker 2: is a large part of Steve Mann's Notes towards the 90 00:04:49,920 --> 00:04:52,120 Speaker 2: Theory of Inflation, which is a Strange Matter's article that 91 00:04:52,160 --> 00:04:54,159 Speaker 2: a lot of this will be pulled from. And we've 92 00:04:54,160 --> 00:04:57,640 Speaker 2: had Ze on the talk about this before. So there 93 00:04:57,640 --> 00:05:00,880 Speaker 2: are a lot of theories about inflation and none of 94 00:05:00,920 --> 00:05:05,000 Speaker 2: them work very well. Inflation on a fundamental level is 95 00:05:05,160 --> 00:05:07,800 Speaker 2: just prices going up. People have this tendency to think 96 00:05:07,839 --> 00:05:11,479 Speaker 2: about inflation in terms of the value of money going down, 97 00:05:12,640 --> 00:05:16,040 Speaker 2: but on a pure level, all inflation says is that 98 00:05:16,200 --> 00:05:20,120 Speaker 2: prices go up. Now, the most common theory of inflation 99 00:05:20,360 --> 00:05:23,160 Speaker 2: is inflation is based on there being too much money 100 00:05:23,200 --> 00:05:26,800 Speaker 2: in the economy, And the thing about those theories is 101 00:05:26,839 --> 00:05:29,240 Speaker 2: that they don't work outside of like a very few 102 00:05:29,240 --> 00:05:33,200 Speaker 2: specific examples of hyperinflation that loom large over our understanding 103 00:05:33,200 --> 00:05:37,279 Speaker 2: of what inflation is, even though they have absolutely quantitatively 104 00:05:37,320 --> 00:05:39,599 Speaker 2: and theoretically, they have absolutely nothing to do with the 105 00:05:39,600 --> 00:05:43,000 Speaker 2: inflation that we've seen over the past four years. So 106 00:05:43,200 --> 00:05:46,599 Speaker 2: instead of talking about that shit anymore, Man and the 107 00:05:46,640 --> 00:05:49,240 Speaker 2: Strange Matter's crew developed what they call the supply chain 108 00:05:49,320 --> 00:05:51,840 Speaker 2: theory of inflation. So I'm going to read the quote 109 00:05:51,880 --> 00:05:55,479 Speaker 2: from Notes Towards the Theory of Inflation. As economist JW. 110 00:05:55,560 --> 00:05:58,640 Speaker 2: And Mason recently remarked on his website, inflation is just 111 00:05:58,680 --> 00:06:02,000 Speaker 2: an increase in prices. So for every theory of price setting, 112 00:06:02,120 --> 00:06:06,280 Speaker 2: there's a corresponding theory of inflation. If inflation theory is 113 00:06:06,360 --> 00:06:09,400 Speaker 2: downstream of price setting, this is still a quote from 114 00:06:09,440 --> 00:06:13,359 Speaker 2: that article, but not the Jovansing quote. If inflation is 115 00:06:13,400 --> 00:06:16,480 Speaker 2: downstream of price theory, then no account of inflation can 116 00:06:16,520 --> 00:06:19,640 Speaker 2: begin with the macro economy at all, since prices are 117 00:06:19,680 --> 00:06:22,559 Speaker 2: set at the micro level. Rather, you need to look 118 00:06:22,880 --> 00:06:26,839 Speaker 2: at particular industrial sectors, their supply chains, and ultimately the 119 00:06:26,880 --> 00:06:30,279 Speaker 2: pricing decisions of their firms. Only then are the true 120 00:06:30,279 --> 00:06:33,799 Speaker 2: causes of inflation, both the internal failures of the industrial 121 00:06:33,839 --> 00:06:37,920 Speaker 2: system and external shocks to it, which can cause price rises. Revealed. 122 00:06:38,880 --> 00:06:42,240 Speaker 2: Man's price theory is fairly simple, right. It flows from 123 00:06:42,279 --> 00:06:45,320 Speaker 2: the basic observation that prices are set by guys in offices, 124 00:06:45,480 --> 00:06:49,120 Speaker 2: not by something abstract as like market forces and supply 125 00:06:49,240 --> 00:06:53,040 Speaker 2: and demand in economic terms. What this argument amounts to 126 00:06:53,240 --> 00:06:56,000 Speaker 2: is the argument that corporations are price makers and not 127 00:06:56,120 --> 00:06:59,400 Speaker 2: price takers. Right, there's a bunch of guys they sit 128 00:06:59,440 --> 00:07:01,880 Speaker 2: in offices and develop a strategy of but what prices 129 00:07:01,880 --> 00:07:04,760 Speaker 2: are going to be? And that's you know, how they're set, 130 00:07:05,440 --> 00:07:07,680 Speaker 2: And what matters to the people who develop prices are 131 00:07:07,680 --> 00:07:10,600 Speaker 2: things like goodwill, which is to say, not pissing off 132 00:07:10,640 --> 00:07:14,080 Speaker 2: their customers by raising prices, and things like their balance 133 00:07:14,080 --> 00:07:17,680 Speaker 2: sheets which reflect you know, their incomes and costs. Price 134 00:07:17,720 --> 00:07:21,040 Speaker 2: in this model is just cost plus markup. And we 135 00:07:21,160 --> 00:07:24,000 Speaker 2: know this is how prices are actually set because, as 136 00:07:24,040 --> 00:07:27,120 Speaker 2: Man points out, people have gone through and done surveys 137 00:07:27,120 --> 00:07:29,800 Speaker 2: of pricing managers and ask them how they set prices 138 00:07:29,880 --> 00:07:34,360 Speaker 2: and the answer is costless workup. So what would cause 139 00:07:34,400 --> 00:07:38,800 Speaker 2: these guys in offices to increase their prices? Well, these 140 00:07:38,800 --> 00:07:43,240 Speaker 2: are companies that are all part of a global supply chain, 141 00:07:43,400 --> 00:07:45,840 Speaker 2: a very very broad global supply chain, and a very 142 00:07:45,880 --> 00:07:49,600 Speaker 2: complicated global supply chain. This means that if the cost 143 00:07:49,680 --> 00:07:52,320 Speaker 2: of the stuff they buy from other suppliers on the 144 00:07:52,400 --> 00:07:55,320 Speaker 2: chain in order to produce what they're selling, if those 145 00:07:55,360 --> 00:07:58,040 Speaker 2: prices go up, because there is, to use a purely 146 00:07:58,080 --> 00:08:04,120 Speaker 2: hypothetical example, a giant pandemic, those costs increases eventually had 147 00:08:04,160 --> 00:08:06,400 Speaker 2: to be passed down to the people paying the products 148 00:08:06,520 --> 00:08:09,040 Speaker 2: so that the corporation can maintain its balance sheets and 149 00:08:09,080 --> 00:08:11,840 Speaker 2: maintain it sort of price plus markup as something that 150 00:08:12,120 --> 00:08:16,280 Speaker 2: you know, covers their costs. Right, This is what set 151 00:08:16,320 --> 00:08:18,240 Speaker 2: off the giant inflation spike in the US and the 152 00:08:18,280 --> 00:08:21,360 Speaker 2: Biden administration. You know, the cost side of cost plus 153 00:08:21,400 --> 00:08:24,760 Speaker 2: markup exploded. But it doesn't really matter why the prices 154 00:08:24,800 --> 00:08:27,920 Speaker 2: increased for our purposes, and our purposes are looking at 155 00:08:27,920 --> 00:08:31,120 Speaker 2: sort of why Trump won the election. What was important, 156 00:08:31,200 --> 00:08:34,679 Speaker 2: you know, about inflation wasn't even the price increases. It 157 00:08:34,760 --> 00:08:37,560 Speaker 2: was the narratives around inflation and how we understand the 158 00:08:37,600 --> 00:08:41,040 Speaker 2: economy at a moral level. And for that we're going 159 00:08:41,040 --> 00:08:43,480 Speaker 2: to turn to one of the most popular accounts of inflation, 160 00:08:44,120 --> 00:08:49,440 Speaker 2: so called greedflation. Now, as we've said, price is cost 161 00:08:49,520 --> 00:08:53,080 Speaker 2: plus markup, and you can raise prices because of cost, 162 00:08:53,640 --> 00:08:55,439 Speaker 2: but you can also do this because you want to 163 00:08:55,520 --> 00:08:59,400 Speaker 2: increase your markup. And this is something that happened during 164 00:08:59,440 --> 00:09:03,320 Speaker 2: the inflation search. Companies realized that consumers were willing to 165 00:09:03,400 --> 00:09:06,520 Speaker 2: accept higher prices without the usual good will hit because 166 00:09:06,520 --> 00:09:09,559 Speaker 2: they thought the prices were going up because inflation was happening, 167 00:09:09,920 --> 00:09:12,320 Speaker 2: and because they were willing to accept the higher prices 168 00:09:12,360 --> 00:09:15,440 Speaker 2: and not you know, try to shop somewhere else, corporations went, 169 00:09:15,480 --> 00:09:17,719 Speaker 2: fuck it, let's just keep jacking the prices up. And 170 00:09:18,040 --> 00:09:21,760 Speaker 2: this really really pissed people off. It still does, and 171 00:09:21,800 --> 00:09:24,480 Speaker 2: this is something that was true across the entire political spectrum. 172 00:09:24,520 --> 00:09:24,640 Speaker 1: Right. 173 00:09:24,679 --> 00:09:27,760 Speaker 2: People were very, very angry about this sort of reflation thing, 174 00:09:28,640 --> 00:09:32,120 Speaker 2: and that rage is more important than the technical details 175 00:09:32,200 --> 00:09:36,240 Speaker 2: of why inflation happened, because the way we understand inflation 176 00:09:36,600 --> 00:09:40,360 Speaker 2: is not through conventional economics. We understand it through the 177 00:09:40,400 --> 00:09:44,280 Speaker 2: moral economy. And when we come back from a different 178 00:09:44,360 --> 00:09:47,040 Speaker 2: kind of economy, which is to say, this ad break, 179 00:09:47,320 --> 00:09:49,960 Speaker 2: we are going to examine what the moral economy is, 180 00:09:50,120 --> 00:09:52,600 Speaker 2: how it differs from our sort of regular economy, where 181 00:09:52,600 --> 00:09:56,520 Speaker 2: it came from, and why it's relevant to our situation now. 182 00:10:07,000 --> 00:10:11,280 Speaker 2: And we are so back, all right, let's talk about 183 00:10:11,320 --> 00:10:15,680 Speaker 2: the moral economy. The moral economy is a concept developed 184 00:10:15,679 --> 00:10:18,600 Speaker 2: by the British historian E. P. Thompson in the early 185 00:10:18,679 --> 00:10:22,920 Speaker 2: nineteen seventies. Thompson was attempting to explain the previous century 186 00:10:22,920 --> 00:10:25,040 Speaker 2: and a half of bread riots by what he termed 187 00:10:25,160 --> 00:10:30,000 Speaker 2: the English crowd by applying anthropological principles to their actions. 188 00:10:30,440 --> 00:10:32,720 Speaker 2: I'm just going to read from Thompson's The Moral Economy 189 00:10:32,720 --> 00:10:35,800 Speaker 2: of the English Crowd here. It is, of course true 190 00:10:35,840 --> 00:10:39,239 Speaker 2: that riots were triggered off by soaring prices, by malpractice 191 00:10:39,240 --> 00:10:43,560 Speaker 2: among dealers, or by hunger. But these grievances operated within 192 00:10:43,600 --> 00:10:47,080 Speaker 2: a popular consensus as to what we're legitimate and what 193 00:10:47,120 --> 00:10:52,280 Speaker 2: we're illegitimate practices in marketing, milling, baking, etc. This, in 194 00:10:52,320 --> 00:10:55,840 Speaker 2: its turn, was grounded upon a consistent traditional view of 195 00:10:55,920 --> 00:10:59,800 Speaker 2: social norms and obligations of the proper economic function of 196 00:11:00,040 --> 00:11:04,760 Speaker 2: le parties within the community, which, when taken together, can 197 00:11:04,800 --> 00:11:07,400 Speaker 2: be said to constitute the moral economy of the poor. 198 00:11:08,000 --> 00:11:11,000 Speaker 2: In outrage to these moral assumptions, quite as much as 199 00:11:11,080 --> 00:11:15,640 Speaker 2: actual deprivation was the usual occasion for direct action. Now, 200 00:11:15,840 --> 00:11:18,160 Speaker 2: the moral economy of the English Crowd in the eighteenth 201 00:11:18,200 --> 00:11:20,880 Speaker 2: century is about a very specific period in British history, 202 00:11:20,880 --> 00:11:23,960 Speaker 2: which is to say, the seventeen hundreds, and about how 203 00:11:24,000 --> 00:11:27,440 Speaker 2: people thought bread should be sold. Peasants and the new 204 00:11:27,559 --> 00:11:32,240 Speaker 2: urban workers had very specific ideas about, you know, bread, 205 00:11:32,559 --> 00:11:34,880 Speaker 2: about how bread should be produced, about who should be 206 00:11:34,880 --> 00:11:36,960 Speaker 2: allowed to sell it, about where and when they should 207 00:11:36,960 --> 00:11:38,920 Speaker 2: be allowed to sell it, about how it should be sold, 208 00:11:38,960 --> 00:11:41,760 Speaker 2: how it should not be sold. And because of this, 209 00:11:41,960 --> 00:11:44,400 Speaker 2: you know, because of their experience in sort of previous 210 00:11:44,440 --> 00:11:47,160 Speaker 2: systems that before the sort of imposition of the free 211 00:11:47,240 --> 00:11:51,160 Speaker 2: market system or quote unquote free market system, they have 212 00:11:51,520 --> 00:11:55,280 Speaker 2: a very specific series of hatreds. They hate middlemen, they 213 00:11:55,280 --> 00:11:58,200 Speaker 2: hate grainhoarders, they hate all of the aspects of the 214 00:11:58,240 --> 00:12:01,840 Speaker 2: new quote unquote free market impose additional costs and burdens 215 00:12:01,920 --> 00:12:07,040 Speaker 2: on them. And they also believed that elites have a 216 00:12:07,160 --> 00:12:09,600 Speaker 2: kind of moral duty to the masses based on the 217 00:12:09,640 --> 00:12:12,600 Speaker 2: norms and traditions of their society. And when they welch 218 00:12:12,640 --> 00:12:14,920 Speaker 2: on that deal in a way that makes people's lives worse, 219 00:12:15,320 --> 00:12:20,679 Speaker 2: people get extremely pissed off. These peasants and urban workers 220 00:12:20,720 --> 00:12:24,760 Speaker 2: particularly hated price increases, and they hated price increases so 221 00:12:24,840 --> 00:12:29,120 Speaker 2: much that this frequently turned into riots. But the actual 222 00:12:29,360 --> 00:12:33,560 Speaker 2: contents of these riots are very interesting. Instead of simply 223 00:12:33,640 --> 00:12:36,880 Speaker 2: seizing all of the grain, they do something else entirely. 224 00:12:37,400 --> 00:12:40,920 Speaker 2: Here's Thompson again. Quote. The central action in this pattern 225 00:12:41,080 --> 00:12:43,679 Speaker 2: is not the sack of grainaries and grain or flour, 226 00:12:44,080 --> 00:12:47,240 Speaker 2: but the action of quote setting the price. From a 227 00:12:47,240 --> 00:12:50,280 Speaker 2: few lines later, they might then order the farmer to 228 00:12:50,320 --> 00:12:53,800 Speaker 2: send quote convenient quantities to market to be sold, quote 229 00:12:54,080 --> 00:12:58,200 Speaker 2: and at a quote reasonable price. The justices were further 230 00:12:58,240 --> 00:13:00,960 Speaker 2: empowered to quote set down a certain price upon a 231 00:13:00,960 --> 00:13:04,080 Speaker 2: bushel of every kind of grain. So, if you follow 232 00:13:04,120 --> 00:13:07,000 Speaker 2: this here, right, what's happening in these British bread riots 233 00:13:07,120 --> 00:13:10,720 Speaker 2: is that the revolt isn't just about their you know, 234 00:13:10,800 --> 00:13:13,760 Speaker 2: being a price to grain. It's that people have a 235 00:13:13,880 --> 00:13:17,200 Speaker 2: very very specific moral understanding of what the price of 236 00:13:17,240 --> 00:13:21,120 Speaker 2: grain should be, and they take direct actions that are 237 00:13:21,160 --> 00:13:23,600 Speaker 2: designed to set the price of grain to the level 238 00:13:23,640 --> 00:13:26,720 Speaker 2: they thought it should rest at. And this kind of 239 00:13:26,760 --> 00:13:30,400 Speaker 2: action is extremely common sort of across Europe in this 240 00:13:30,600 --> 00:13:31,600 Speaker 2: entire time period. 241 00:13:31,720 --> 00:13:31,880 Speaker 1: Right. 242 00:13:32,320 --> 00:13:35,480 Speaker 2: It's also a hallmark of the French Revolution. You can 243 00:13:35,559 --> 00:13:38,120 Speaker 2: see in this right, in this sort of rage over 244 00:13:38,200 --> 00:13:41,280 Speaker 2: price in the sense of justice. The outlines of our 245 00:13:41,320 --> 00:13:45,480 Speaker 2: current moral economy you have, you know, staggering outrage's price 246 00:13:45,559 --> 00:13:47,960 Speaker 2: in clarice is seen as on jests, which is reflation 247 00:13:48,520 --> 00:13:51,320 Speaker 2: or just inflation in general, because people are just mad 248 00:13:51,360 --> 00:13:54,200 Speaker 2: about the concept of the price going up, paired with 249 00:13:54,360 --> 00:13:56,640 Speaker 2: rage at the elites, which manifests the sort of hatred 250 00:13:56,640 --> 00:13:58,720 Speaker 2: of Joe Biden the Democrats for being the people who 251 00:13:58,720 --> 00:14:02,800 Speaker 2: presided over the price increases. We also have our own 252 00:14:02,880 --> 00:14:06,439 Speaker 2: rage about price gouging in immediate market terms, and this 253 00:14:06,480 --> 00:14:09,680 Speaker 2: is something that the most annoying libertarians and the defenders 254 00:14:09,720 --> 00:14:12,280 Speaker 2: of the market love to point out. There's nothing actually 255 00:14:12,520 --> 00:14:16,640 Speaker 2: wrong by market economics about say Martin Skrelly jacking the 256 00:14:16,679 --> 00:14:19,080 Speaker 2: price of medicine up until you can't afford it anymore, 257 00:14:19,800 --> 00:14:23,240 Speaker 2: or you know, other things that we find extremely terrible, 258 00:14:23,360 --> 00:14:26,720 Speaker 2: like people jacking the price of water when people need water, 259 00:14:26,760 --> 00:14:30,720 Speaker 2: like bottled water dreat hurricanes. We are all outraged, So 260 00:14:31,040 --> 00:14:34,000 Speaker 2: why do we feel morally strong about it? And that 261 00:14:34,200 --> 00:14:37,120 Speaker 2: is the moral economy, babe. This is something that you know, 262 00:14:37,320 --> 00:14:39,880 Speaker 2: These these reactions, right, the emotional reactions we have to this, 263 00:14:39,960 --> 00:14:43,520 Speaker 2: the sense of injustice that we feel, are almost entirely 264 00:14:43,640 --> 00:14:46,280 Speaker 2: outside of the realm of what you would call traditional 265 00:14:46,280 --> 00:14:49,840 Speaker 2: economics right, And that's because we're functioning on something that 266 00:14:49,960 --> 00:14:52,520 Speaker 2: is in some senses older than that kind of economics. 267 00:14:53,200 --> 00:14:57,400 Speaker 2: But there's something else going on here at a fundamental level. 268 00:14:58,240 --> 00:15:01,880 Speaker 2: And what's important about you know, price and the reaction 269 00:15:01,960 --> 00:15:04,960 Speaker 2: to inflation is that it's an outrage based on a 270 00:15:05,000 --> 00:15:08,280 Speaker 2: sense of justice. Right. This rage is not a measure 271 00:15:08,480 --> 00:15:11,880 Speaker 2: of direct exploitation necessarily. I think it was the political 272 00:15:11,920 --> 00:15:14,800 Speaker 2: scientist James C. Scott who wrote his own book called 273 00:15:14,800 --> 00:15:18,440 Speaker 2: The Moral Economy of the Peasant, and Scott argues that, 274 00:15:18,520 --> 00:15:21,800 Speaker 2: you know, and ib Thompson also argues this that it's 275 00:15:21,840 --> 00:15:24,400 Speaker 2: the moral angle that causes people to revolt, not the 276 00:15:24,520 --> 00:15:27,960 Speaker 2: direct level of exploitation. You can, in fact, you know, 277 00:15:28,040 --> 00:15:32,080 Speaker 2: inflict hideous exploitation on people as long as they think 278 00:15:32,120 --> 00:15:34,880 Speaker 2: that it's just. But when you violate these moral principles, 279 00:15:35,640 --> 00:15:39,200 Speaker 2: that's when people really lose it. But it also means, right, 280 00:15:39,280 --> 00:15:41,600 Speaker 2: the fact that the sort of sense of outrage is 281 00:15:41,640 --> 00:15:46,840 Speaker 2: not necessarily directly tied to the exploitation level. It means 282 00:15:46,840 --> 00:15:49,120 Speaker 2: that rich people can be bad about inflation even though 283 00:15:49,120 --> 00:15:52,560 Speaker 2: they're completely fine, because these people also still have this 284 00:15:52,600 --> 00:15:56,000 Speaker 2: sort of sense of justice about what prices should be. Now. 285 00:15:56,520 --> 00:15:58,920 Speaker 2: It's also worth noting here that it is possible to 286 00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:02,480 Speaker 2: have high inflation rates and have everyone be fine. In fact, 287 00:16:02,600 --> 00:16:06,320 Speaker 2: we have discussed scenarios like that on this show. In 288 00:16:06,360 --> 00:16:08,800 Speaker 2: my episodes about the rise of Lulah, the current president 289 00:16:08,840 --> 00:16:13,040 Speaker 2: of Brazil, we discussed how military dictatorship in Brazil produced 290 00:16:13,040 --> 00:16:16,080 Speaker 2: an economy that was, you know, you had twenty percent 291 00:16:16,320 --> 00:16:18,880 Speaker 2: year on year inflation, right, but also you had forty 292 00:16:18,920 --> 00:16:21,880 Speaker 2: percent yearly wage increases, and so everyone was like kind 293 00:16:21,880 --> 00:16:23,600 Speaker 2: of fine with it because the amount of money you 294 00:16:23,600 --> 00:16:25,560 Speaker 2: were making was going up every year. So nobody really 295 00:16:25,560 --> 00:16:28,640 Speaker 2: cared about even things like the military dictatorship itself. There 296 00:16:28,640 --> 00:16:30,840 Speaker 2: was not an enormous amount of opposition to it. But 297 00:16:30,920 --> 00:16:33,760 Speaker 2: then Brazil's trade unions figured out the government had been 298 00:16:33,880 --> 00:16:37,280 Speaker 2: lying about inflation numbers, and this started off a series 299 00:16:37,280 --> 00:16:39,840 Speaker 2: of protests that you know, would send Lula like into 300 00:16:39,880 --> 00:16:41,840 Speaker 2: his big name of his political career, and eventually this 301 00:16:41,920 --> 00:16:44,560 Speaker 2: is one of the sort of dominoes that leads to 302 00:16:45,400 --> 00:16:48,680 Speaker 2: knocking down the military dictatorship. And that's because you know, 303 00:16:48,760 --> 00:16:51,440 Speaker 2: the level of exploitations people were living under hadn't changed, 304 00:16:52,080 --> 00:16:54,920 Speaker 2: but the deal that they had made right the sort 305 00:16:54,920 --> 00:16:56,960 Speaker 2: of deal with with the military government of like, we 306 00:16:57,000 --> 00:16:59,160 Speaker 2: won't do anything, our wages will continue to go up, 307 00:16:59,160 --> 00:17:00,800 Speaker 2: and inflation will get need to be work at a 308 00:17:00,880 --> 00:17:05,120 Speaker 2: certain level such that we're still getting paid. That deal 309 00:17:05,320 --> 00:17:08,480 Speaker 2: was violated, and that sense of injustice was powerful enough 310 00:17:08,520 --> 00:17:13,679 Speaker 2: to really kickstart in extremely powerful brasilient labor movements and 311 00:17:13,800 --> 00:17:18,120 Speaker 2: kickstart the fall of a dictatorship. Now, one of Thompson's 312 00:17:18,200 --> 00:17:20,359 Speaker 2: arguments was that the success of Adam Smith and his 313 00:17:20,440 --> 00:17:23,320 Speaker 2: cohort and Smith is moving around and making his arguments 314 00:17:23,320 --> 00:17:25,480 Speaker 2: about what the free market is in the period where 315 00:17:25,480 --> 00:17:27,639 Speaker 2: we're dealing with all of these sort of grand crises. 316 00:17:28,600 --> 00:17:31,919 Speaker 2: His argument is that the success of Smith was moving 317 00:17:31,960 --> 00:17:34,600 Speaker 2: economics out of the domain of morality where it was born. 318 00:17:34,640 --> 00:17:38,240 Speaker 2: Economics was originally an aspect of moral philosophy, right, it 319 00:17:38,280 --> 00:17:41,240 Speaker 2: was part of that discipline. But you know, Smith and 320 00:17:41,240 --> 00:17:43,200 Speaker 2: as people move it out, And this is why liberal 321 00:17:43,200 --> 00:17:47,400 Speaker 2: economists find the anger about inflation so uncomprehensible. They see 322 00:17:47,440 --> 00:17:49,560 Speaker 2: it in purely statistical terms and go like, look, the 323 00:17:49,600 --> 00:17:53,080 Speaker 2: economy is great. Why is everyone mad? And you know, 324 00:17:53,200 --> 00:17:55,800 Speaker 2: I could get into hear a bunch of arguments about 325 00:17:55,800 --> 00:17:57,920 Speaker 2: whether or not this is actually true. I mean, I'm 326 00:17:57,920 --> 00:18:02,040 Speaker 2: going to return to my sort of argument about like, well, yeah, okay, 327 00:18:02,320 --> 00:18:04,480 Speaker 2: even if you believe all of the economic indicators are 328 00:18:04,520 --> 00:18:07,199 Speaker 2: great for says people like I'm trans for me, the 329 00:18:07,240 --> 00:18:11,040 Speaker 2: economy is it has an unemployment rate of like nineteen 330 00:18:11,119 --> 00:18:14,399 Speaker 2: thirty six US great depression. So you know, there are 331 00:18:14,400 --> 00:18:16,280 Speaker 2: a lot of people for whom the economic outlook is 332 00:18:16,280 --> 00:18:18,440 Speaker 2: not good. People for whom, you know, even the wage 333 00:18:18,480 --> 00:18:20,840 Speaker 2: increases that they got in this period still leave them 334 00:18:20,920 --> 00:18:24,000 Speaker 2: in sort of hideous and crippling poverty. And none of 335 00:18:24,040 --> 00:18:27,159 Speaker 2: that shit matters because the statistics that these people are 336 00:18:27,160 --> 00:18:29,000 Speaker 2: trying to use to try to get everyone to calm 337 00:18:29,040 --> 00:18:32,280 Speaker 2: down are not operating in the inside of the moral economy. 338 00:18:32,320 --> 00:18:34,560 Speaker 2: They're operating outside of it because they're from a tradition 339 00:18:34,600 --> 00:18:37,840 Speaker 2: that is specifically about not working inside the moral economy. 340 00:18:38,320 --> 00:18:40,080 Speaker 2: And the people that are interacting with are in the 341 00:18:40,119 --> 00:18:44,720 Speaker 2: moral economy. But why is it like this, right? Why 342 00:18:44,880 --> 00:18:47,359 Speaker 2: why do we have a moral economy that functions this 343 00:18:47,440 --> 00:18:50,199 Speaker 2: way in the case of the peasants and you know, 344 00:18:50,240 --> 00:18:52,600 Speaker 2: the working people of the seventeen hundreds across Europe, and 345 00:18:52,640 --> 00:18:54,240 Speaker 2: you know, this just goes on through the eighteen hundreds 346 00:18:54,280 --> 00:18:56,960 Speaker 2: too right. We can trace the moral economy to a 347 00:18:57,080 --> 00:19:00,600 Speaker 2: very very specific set of conditions and traditions and expectations 348 00:19:00,680 --> 00:19:04,720 Speaker 2: rooted in how people traditionally bop bread. But what are 349 00:19:04,720 --> 00:19:09,920 Speaker 2: the conditions of the modern American moral economy? To understand that, 350 00:19:10,000 --> 00:19:12,520 Speaker 2: we need to turn to the concept of price itself. 351 00:19:13,240 --> 00:19:16,480 Speaker 2: But first, do you know what guarantees low price? Actually, 352 00:19:16,480 --> 00:19:18,199 Speaker 2: I probably should all say the word guarantee. That is 353 00:19:18,240 --> 00:19:22,200 Speaker 2: probably staggeringly illegible. You know what probably has low prices? 354 00:19:22,440 --> 00:19:36,119 Speaker 2: It's the products and services that support this podcast. We 355 00:19:36,400 --> 00:19:43,840 Speaker 2: are back, So let us now turn to price. The 356 00:19:43,840 --> 00:19:48,639 Speaker 2: political economist Shimsheng Bickler and Jonathan Needson argue that price 357 00:19:48,800 --> 00:19:51,879 Speaker 2: is the unit of what orders capitalist society. You know, 358 00:19:51,920 --> 00:19:54,879 Speaker 2: price is like the fundamental units of political economy. It's 359 00:19:54,960 --> 00:19:57,280 Speaker 2: it's the thing that orders and structures the entire society. 360 00:19:57,680 --> 00:20:00,479 Speaker 2: If you want to know more about this, read their 361 00:20:00,480 --> 00:20:04,560 Speaker 2: book Capital as Power. It's quite good. I am mentioning 362 00:20:04,600 --> 00:20:07,960 Speaker 2: them because I'm about to misuse their argument completely in 363 00:20:08,000 --> 00:20:10,040 Speaker 2: tandem with a quote from Marx that I am also 364 00:20:10,080 --> 00:20:11,719 Speaker 2: about to misuse. And I am going to do this 365 00:20:11,760 --> 00:20:16,320 Speaker 2: to make a different point. So I agree with Bickler 366 00:20:16,359 --> 00:20:19,160 Speaker 2: and needs in that price is the unit that orders 367 00:20:19,160 --> 00:20:23,600 Speaker 2: capitalist society. But what I'm interested in is price is 368 00:20:23,640 --> 00:20:27,720 Speaker 2: what's called a social hieroglyphic. Now, social hieroglyphic is a 369 00:20:27,840 --> 00:20:31,320 Speaker 2: term that's a one off term that Marx used wants 370 00:20:31,359 --> 00:20:34,479 Speaker 2: to talk about how price like mystifies at ature value whatever. 371 00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:37,600 Speaker 2: I don't care about that. I care about it because 372 00:20:38,480 --> 00:20:41,240 Speaker 2: there's something very interesting about price itself, and there's something 373 00:20:41,240 --> 00:20:45,000 Speaker 2: interesting about the notion of a hieroglyph. Now Marx is 374 00:20:45,040 --> 00:20:46,959 Speaker 2: using hieroglyph in the term of like it's something you 375 00:20:46,960 --> 00:20:48,600 Speaker 2: have to be decoded, right, because he's writing in the 376 00:20:48,600 --> 00:20:50,960 Speaker 2: eighteen hundreds. This is you know, everyone's obsessed with hieroglyphs. 377 00:20:51,680 --> 00:20:54,800 Speaker 2: I am using hieroglyphs because hieroglyphs are also a method 378 00:20:54,800 --> 00:20:59,600 Speaker 2: of encoding complex information into a single character. Right, Price 379 00:20:59,720 --> 00:21:03,520 Speaker 2: as a social hieroglyph is important because price is the 380 00:21:03,560 --> 00:21:06,439 Speaker 2: mechanism through which we understand and often through which we 381 00:21:06,480 --> 00:21:10,919 Speaker 2: fail to understand the world. Our entire lives in the 382 00:21:10,960 --> 00:21:13,359 Speaker 2: eyes of the people who rule this world, our entire 383 00:21:13,440 --> 00:21:16,679 Speaker 2: lives are captured in a single number. Everything you do 384 00:21:16,760 --> 00:21:20,080 Speaker 2: at work is ultimately just a price on a corporate spreadsheet. 385 00:21:20,720 --> 00:21:23,720 Speaker 2: The entirety of the labor process of producing a good, 386 00:21:24,080 --> 00:21:27,560 Speaker 2: every hour worked, every drop of sweat, every tier, every 387 00:21:27,600 --> 00:21:30,160 Speaker 2: broken body, and shattered city and trade union is lined 388 00:21:30,200 --> 00:21:32,680 Speaker 2: up in front of a firing squad, appears in the 389 00:21:32,800 --> 00:21:37,720 Speaker 2: end as a simple number. Price. To express it another way, 390 00:21:37,920 --> 00:21:40,360 Speaker 2: heals Daniel conn and the painted Bird from their song 391 00:21:40,440 --> 00:21:44,240 Speaker 2: the Butcher's share. Let's take a walk around the old bazaar, 392 00:21:44,520 --> 00:21:47,919 Speaker 2: where every little thing has treffled far, every pair of 393 00:21:47,960 --> 00:21:51,040 Speaker 2: pants and grain of rice contains this poorer story in 394 00:21:51,080 --> 00:21:54,960 Speaker 2: its price. A story of the power people wield, a 395 00:21:55,040 --> 00:21:58,960 Speaker 2: story about factories and fields, a story of which you'll 396 00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:01,760 Speaker 2: never have to be aware, just as long as the 397 00:22:01,800 --> 00:22:07,560 Speaker 2: butcher gets his share. Price, this single number is how 398 00:22:07,600 --> 00:22:12,119 Speaker 2: we understand the world, and it causes us to treat 399 00:22:12,200 --> 00:22:16,200 Speaker 2: price and thus inflation, as a matter of morality and 400 00:22:16,240 --> 00:22:20,520 Speaker 2: not economic rationality. Because price is the way that our 401 00:22:20,560 --> 00:22:23,480 Speaker 2: society causes us to interact with people. It's the way 402 00:22:23,480 --> 00:22:26,359 Speaker 2: we interact with objects. It is the thing that structures 403 00:22:26,359 --> 00:22:30,879 Speaker 2: the way we all behave and understand the world. But 404 00:22:31,000 --> 00:22:37,760 Speaker 2: price has another function. It is the gatekeeper of capitalist society. 405 00:22:38,760 --> 00:22:42,040 Speaker 2: Because price and a man with a gun is what's 406 00:22:42,040 --> 00:22:45,960 Speaker 2: standing between you and the ability to live your life 407 00:22:46,119 --> 00:22:49,520 Speaker 2: outrage of the moral economics of price increases are similar, 408 00:22:49,720 --> 00:22:54,199 Speaker 2: but not identical, to the impulses behind looting. Everything that 409 00:22:54,240 --> 00:22:57,760 Speaker 2: you ever need and have been unable to get is 410 00:22:58,440 --> 00:23:01,119 Speaker 2: when you walk into a grocery store, just sitting there 411 00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:04,240 Speaker 2: right in front of you, but between you and it 412 00:23:04,760 --> 00:23:07,520 Speaker 2: is a number and a man with a gun, and 413 00:23:07,600 --> 00:23:10,560 Speaker 2: the man with a gun fucking hates you. So the 414 00:23:10,560 --> 00:23:14,359 Speaker 2: moment you're free, you just take it. Price in the 415 00:23:14,520 --> 00:23:18,320 Speaker 2: entire economic system behind it is organized very specifically, so 416 00:23:18,440 --> 00:23:22,240 Speaker 2: you don't do this. E. P. Thompson argued that the 417 00:23:22,280 --> 00:23:25,960 Speaker 2: moral economy was pre political. The movements that it produced 418 00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:29,399 Speaker 2: could be extremely well organized, but they fundamentally were not 419 00:23:29,560 --> 00:23:32,159 Speaker 2: the real movement which abolishes the present state of things. 420 00:23:33,320 --> 00:23:37,119 Speaker 2: In twenty twenty, we for a brief moment saw the 421 00:23:37,119 --> 00:23:41,320 Speaker 2: outlines of that movement. The uprising was brutally crushed in 422 00:23:41,359 --> 00:23:44,719 Speaker 2: its place. We saw the emersions of pre political concerns 423 00:23:44,800 --> 00:23:48,359 Speaker 2: about price right. We saw once again a massive panic 424 00:23:48,400 --> 00:23:51,000 Speaker 2: about inflation. And this is not to say that you know, 425 00:23:51,040 --> 00:23:53,800 Speaker 2: inflation didn't hurt people. It did. It was in large 426 00:23:53,840 --> 00:23:57,520 Speaker 2: extent of fiasco. But look at the politics for a 427 00:23:57,560 --> 00:24:01,000 Speaker 2: moment that this has produced. Right, what the media understands 428 00:24:01,000 --> 00:24:03,160 Speaker 2: is economic anxiety, and what I think we can now 429 00:24:03,200 --> 00:24:06,520 Speaker 2: better understand as the moral economy that is a result 430 00:24:06,640 --> 00:24:09,080 Speaker 2: of the fact that our entire economic system is structured 431 00:24:09,119 --> 00:24:11,600 Speaker 2: by price, and that we encode all of the information 432 00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:15,400 Speaker 2: in our life into prices that we sell ourselves for, 433 00:24:15,480 --> 00:24:19,080 Speaker 2: and that we in turn are sold things for those 434 00:24:19,119 --> 00:24:23,400 Speaker 2: prices going up. The product of it was Trump, right, 435 00:24:24,440 --> 00:24:27,080 Speaker 2: and there's I think a reason why these sort of 436 00:24:27,119 --> 00:24:30,800 Speaker 2: pre economic explanations are preferred to the answers and you know, 437 00:24:30,880 --> 00:24:34,120 Speaker 2: to the actions that people saw in twenty twenty four 438 00:24:34,200 --> 00:24:37,040 Speaker 2: years later. Portland, one of the centers of the uprising, 439 00:24:37,720 --> 00:24:40,879 Speaker 2: now has almost every grocery store at the exit of 440 00:24:40,920 --> 00:24:44,760 Speaker 2: it is armed guards with guns. And these guards are 441 00:24:44,760 --> 00:24:47,919 Speaker 2: there to maintain the price system. They're there because, for 442 00:24:47,920 --> 00:24:51,959 Speaker 2: a very brief moment, people started thinking something dangerous. They 443 00:24:51,960 --> 00:24:59,480 Speaker 2: started thinking, what if this didn't have a price, it 444 00:24:59,520 --> 00:24:59,920 Speaker 2: could happen. 445 00:25:00,119 --> 00:25:02,480 Speaker 3: Here is a production of cool Zone Media. For more 446 00:25:02,480 --> 00:25:06,800 Speaker 3: podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website coolzonmedia dot com, 447 00:25:06,920 --> 00:25:10,000 Speaker 3: or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 448 00:25:10,080 --> 00:25:12,920 Speaker 3: or wherever you listen to podcasts you can now find 449 00:25:12,960 --> 00:25:16,000 Speaker 3: sources for It could happen here, listed directly in episode descriptions. 450 00:25:16,320 --> 00:25:17,160 Speaker 3: Thanks for listening.