Speaker 1: Guess what, mango, what's that? Well, so I've probably spent
Speaker 1: a little more time than I should today just sitting
Speaker 1: here trying to calculate America's gross national happiness gross wife
Speaker 1: our gross national happiness. So it's this index created in
Speaker 1: the nineteen seventies by the King of Bhutan, and he
Speaker 1: decided that instead of focusing on his country's gross domestic
Speaker 1: product or GDP, that they should be focused on their
Speaker 1: g n H And and so the government began working
Speaker 1: on policies to increase gross national happiness. So this is
Speaker 1: a real thing. I'm not kidding. And as part of
Speaker 1: the focus, the Boutanese government came up with an education
Speaker 1: reform plan called Educating for Gross National Happiness. They were
Speaker 1: trying to provide a more holistic schooling for the country's children,
Speaker 1: you know, better in a great schools into their communities
Speaker 1: and promote ecological health. I mean it's all good stuff, right, yeah,
Speaker 1: And at the very least, it's a very sweet idea,
Speaker 1: I agree, but you know, it's fast. They need to
Speaker 1: look at how different countries around the world approach education
Speaker 1: and and what they decided to focus on, and how
Speaker 1: even some of the operank systems in the world can
Speaker 1: approach things so differently, so we'll talk about some of
Speaker 1: those today. But don't worry, We're not done talking about
Speaker 1: gross national happiness. So let's get started, right Hey, their
Speaker 1: podcast listeners, welcome to Part Time Genius. I'm Will Pearson
Speaker 1: and as always I'm joined by my good friend man
Speaker 1: guest Ticketer and on the other side of that soundproof
Speaker 1: glass doing his best Billy Idle impression as our friend
Speaker 1: and producer Tristan McNeil. It's not a bad one. Actually
Speaker 1: looks kind of looks like him. Are you ready to
Speaker 1: talk education? Mango? Am I? So? I'm super excited for
Speaker 1: our guests and and we're definitely gonna put one of
Speaker 1: our listeners to the test with a ridiculous quiz and
Speaker 1: I'm ready to get started, all right. Well, before we
Speaker 1: dive in, we should say that they are obviously challenges
Speaker 1: involved when you try to compare educational systems around the world.
Speaker 1: Every country has its own values and its own challenges
Speaker 1: and of course its own strengths. But we did decide
Speaker 1: to look at data gathered by the o e c D,
Speaker 1: which is the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development and
Speaker 1: and specifically their Program for International Student Assessment, and the
Speaker 1: o e c D is this inner governmental organization. It's
Speaker 1: made up of thirty five countries, the US being one
Speaker 1: of those, and other places are included like Australia and Mexico,
Speaker 1: the United Kingdom, Finland, Japan, Chile, and and several others.
Speaker 1: And the organization was founded in the sixties with this
Speaker 1: goal of trying to help economic development around the world.
Speaker 1: They also work to think through common problems, but one
Speaker 1: of the areas that they look at is the quality
Speaker 1: of education around the world. So this Program for International
Speaker 1: Student Assessment is is just one way that they evaluate
Speaker 1: things like the level of education and science and math
Speaker 1: and reading. But you know also what percentage of children
Speaker 1: have access to education. Yeah, and we should also say
Speaker 1: that in looking at an assessment like this, we know
Speaker 1: it's not a perfect science and it doesn't really give
Speaker 1: us a look at every country in the world. I mean,
Speaker 1: this has been criticized for like only in valuating the
Speaker 1: wealthier nations, and that's a valid criticism, but it's one
Speaker 1: of the better collections of data available and it is
Speaker 1: fascinating to look through. Yeah. So all that to say,
Speaker 1: you'll hear us referring to the O e c D
Speaker 1: as we compare countries that are members. And our goal
Speaker 1: here is not to say that one country is better
Speaker 1: than others. But it really is fascinating how you could
Speaker 1: pick two countries that are near the top of the
Speaker 1: student assessment in terms of math and science and reading
Speaker 1: scores and realize that they have incredibly different approaches to education.
Speaker 1: And that's exactly what we want to do. I mean,
Speaker 1: these are these are two countries that you will always
Speaker 1: show up on these lists of the best school systems
Speaker 1: around the world. But again, these two countries are so
Speaker 1: very different in how they approach education. Yeah, and not
Speaker 1: from one another, but also from us. Right, And of
Speaker 1: course we're talking about Finland and Japan here, and we'll
Speaker 1: be looking at a few other countries too, but let's
Speaker 1: start with Ease. So Will's assignment was to look into Finland,
Speaker 1: and I took Japan. And we should know that we
Speaker 1: couldn't have done this episode without the incredible research assistance
Speaker 1: from Jocelyn Sears. So well, why don't you talk to
Speaker 1: me about Finland? All right? So it was super interesting
Speaker 1: reading about the investment and focus that Finland put into
Speaker 1: their educational system really beginning in the early nineteen sixties,
Speaker 1: and this was when parliament there decided that the best
Speaker 1: way to really build long term economic success was to
Speaker 1: invest in education and specifically in their teachers. So they
Speaker 1: made the decision that all teachers needed to be highly trained,
Speaker 1: and by the late nineteen seventies, all teachers were required
Speaker 1: to have a master's degree. And get this, fewer than
Speaker 1: fifteen percent of applicants are even accepted into these master's programs.
Speaker 1: It's that competitive. And according to a fascinating Smithsonian article
Speaker 1: I was looking at the focus on investing in teachers,
Speaker 1: it really led to this elevated status for teachers. It
Speaker 1: kind of put them on par with doctors and lawyers,
Speaker 1: and not in terms of salary, but because of the
Speaker 1: amount of autonomy and respect that they're given. Yeah. And
Speaker 1: and so you were telling me that even after they
Speaker 1: get into the master's programs, it's still really competitive to
Speaker 1: get those teaching jobs. Yeah. So one statistic I saw
Speaker 1: from a few years ago is that there are nearly
Speaker 1: seven thousand applicants competing for fewer than seven hundred openings
Speaker 1: at the primary school level. And you know, most teachers
Speaker 1: now have master's degrees not only in education, but also
Speaker 1: in a specific content area, and there's additional focus on
Speaker 1: being prepared to teach their special needs students, which is wild.
Speaker 1: But talk to me about autonomy. Well, the government decided
Speaker 1: that once they'd really invested in teacher training after about
Speaker 1: a decade or so, it was it was time to
Speaker 1: put decision making in the hands of these teachers. So
Speaker 1: prior to the nineties, the curriculum guides in Finland were
Speaker 1: something like seven hundred pages long, which I mean, I
Speaker 1: guess isn't that surprising since there's obviously a ton involved
Speaker 1: in teaching. But what's more crazy than that is that
Speaker 1: if you want to read the core curriculum guidelines for
Speaker 1: teaching math today, you can do that in fewer than
Speaker 1: ten pages. Yeah, it's because these are really just guiding principles,
Speaker 1: and the teachers and local schools they're able to tailor
Speaker 1: those guiding principles to meet the needs of their local population.
Speaker 1: So this whole structure is pretty decentralized. Then, oh, definite.
Speaker 1: So that's definitely all fascinating. But here's what I might
Speaker 1: find even more interesting, and it's that when we were
Speaker 1: looking at the stats on school hours and time spent
Speaker 1: with the teachers. It seems like kids in Finland are
Speaker 1: spending far less time with their teachers than kids in
Speaker 1: most other countries. Well that's right, but but let's back
Speaker 1: up a little bit and start from the beginning. So,
Speaker 1: so kids actually don't start school there until they're seven
Speaker 1: years old, and before that, Finland does provide this heavily
Speaker 1: subsidized daycare, you know, opportunity for all of its children.
Speaker 1: But in these preschools, they aren't really focused on teaching
Speaker 1: things like math and reading. The focus is much more
Speaker 1: on play, I mean lots and lots of creative play
Speaker 1: and outdoor play. And then the parental leaf policy and
Speaker 1: Inland is so generous, allowing parents to stay home until
Speaker 1: their kids reach three, and so their rates of enrollment
Speaker 1: in early childhood education are are actually pretty low. And
Speaker 1: even after three, there are fewer kids in preschool at
Speaker 1: ages three and four than any other country in the
Speaker 1: O e c D. That's really interesting. But what about
Speaker 1: once they get to primary school. Well, here's where our
Speaker 1: kids are going to be incredibly jealous. So for the
Speaker 1: first few years of school, the school day is only
Speaker 1: four hours long and seventy five minutes of that is recess,
Speaker 1: seventy five minutes of recess, so I'm certain my son
Speaker 1: doesn't see anywhere near that much. No, I was looking.
Speaker 1: I think the average time allocated the recess in the
Speaker 1: US is is less than half an hour. I think
Speaker 1: it's like twenty seven minutes. But you know, in Finland
Speaker 1: it's mandated that they have fifteen minutes of recess for
Speaker 1: every hour of instruction, and even beyond that, the schools
Speaker 1: also incorporates so much more time for arts and crafts
Speaker 1: and just very active hands on learning. So forget about
Speaker 1: my kids being jealous, like I'm jealous. I get it,
Speaker 1: I get but I'm guessing the days get longer as
Speaker 1: the kids get a little older. Yeah, but you know,
Speaker 1: even by ninth grade, school days are just six hours long.
Speaker 1: So if you total the amount of time finished kids
Speaker 1: spend at school over their nine years of basic education,
Speaker 1: it's about sis which I know that sounds like a lot,
Speaker 1: but that's more than a thousand hours less than the
Speaker 1: O E C D average. So one of the things
Speaker 1: I read about Finland and that I'll talk about a
Speaker 1: little when we look at Japan is the psychology of
Speaker 1: removing shoes when coming into the classroom. Well, I thought
Speaker 1: this was interesting too, And and of course in a
Speaker 1: place like Finland where it's very cold in the winter,
Speaker 1: there's a practical purpose for taking your shoes off, you know,
Speaker 1: to prevent bringing in snow and mud. But like you said,
Speaker 1: there's also a psychological impact that's been seen in multiple studies.
Speaker 1: So the thinking is that students feel more relaxed than
Speaker 1: at home, that it helps them focus and even improves
Speaker 1: their behavior. And it was interesting to read about studies
Speaker 1: in other countries where it's more common to wear shoes
Speaker 1: indoors and to see the impact of testing on shoe removal.
Speaker 1: And so one experiment in Spain, where it's the norm
Speaker 1: to wear shoes indoors, found that behavior and performance improved
Speaker 1: with the shoe removal test. That's pretty neat. So back
Speaker 1: to the time spent on school and studying, we haven't
Speaker 1: talked about homework. Are the kids in Finland making up
Speaker 1: for less time in school spent by doing more homework?
Speaker 1: Not even close, to be honest with I mean, in fact,
Speaker 1: kids in Finland spend less time doing homework than any
Speaker 1: other kids in the O E. C. D SO study
Speaker 1: from two thousand and twelve found that the average fifteen
Speaker 1: year old spent about two hundred minutes per week on
Speaker 1: after school study. That's almost a hundred minutes lower than
Speaker 1: the next lowest, which was the Czech Republic. My son
Speaker 1: hits homework so much, I'm sure he's gonna be packing
Speaker 1: his bag exactly. So what else do we want to
Speaker 1: know about the education in Finland? All? Right? Well, a
Speaker 1: few things, a few other notes I had here, but
Speaker 1: but one big one I actually should have noted this
Speaker 1: earlier is that a big part of the reformed education
Speaker 1: policy in Finland is focused on equality and education or
Speaker 1: equal access I guess. And so there's a strong belief
Speaker 1: that every child, regardless of their family's income, or their background,
Speaker 1: or their status or location, should have the same educational opportunity.
Speaker 1: They really see, education is this way to combat social inequality,
Speaker 1: and as a result of this, the gap between the
Speaker 1: weakest and the strongest students is the smallest in the world.
Speaker 1: And there are a couple other things I wanted to mention.
Speaker 1: What else here? Um? Oh yeah, Actually, there aren't any
Speaker 1: standardized test in Finland, which is like school paradise, I know.
Speaker 1: So instead teachers work to assess the students independently as
Speaker 1: they progress, so this gets back to the highly trained
Speaker 1: teacher thing, and every student receives free school lunches as
Speaker 1: well as access to medical and dental care. Uh University
Speaker 1: tuition is free now. As for the future, their latest
Speaker 1: curriculum updates focus on something called phenomenon based teaching, which
Speaker 1: is this effort to focus less on individual subjects and
Speaker 1: more on this interdisciplinary approach. So the teachers collaborate more,
Speaker 1: you know, to make this work, and it'll be interesting
Speaker 1: to see what this means for Finland in the future.
Speaker 1: And all of this is completely fascinating to me. One
Speaker 1: other note, though, I do think we should keep in
Speaker 1: mind that there are only about five million people in Finland,
Speaker 1: so it's a very small country compared to some of
Speaker 1: the other massive countries around the world, and even compared
Speaker 1: to Japan, which I know we'll talk about next. So
Speaker 1: this is not to say that everything that works in
Speaker 1: Finland will work everywhere else, but it's still really interesting
Speaker 1: to see what they've accomplished. Definitely, Well, I'm ready to
Speaker 1: talk about your fan but first, why don't we take
Speaker 1: a quick break. So Mango, a couple of weeks ago,
Speaker 1: you may Remember, we responded to several listener requests, and
Speaker 1: we we told our listeners that we were going to
Speaker 1: give some of them a chance to be on the
Speaker 1: show and play some of our ridiculous quizzes. All they
Speaker 1: had to do was either send us an email or
Speaker 1: call into our Fact hotline four pt Genius to tell
Speaker 1: us why they should be on the show. And that's
Speaker 1: seven Fact hot Line. It is still right, Manga. I
Speaker 1: was just gonna say that's good. I just wanted to
Speaker 1: check because I've heard of a lot of fact hot
Speaker 1: lines or other hotlines not going so I'm glad we're
Speaker 1: maintaining that. So so anyway, our guest today responded and
Speaker 1: and was the only person who wrote in or who
Speaker 1: called in, and who was both a zombie on the
Speaker 1: Las Vegas Strip and a production of Evil Dead the
Speaker 1: Musical and a mechanical bull operator. I think was the
Speaker 1: only person that called it. We've got so many great
Speaker 1: calls and so many great emails, but Sam Murphy was
Speaker 1: the only person that called in with both of those qualifications,
Speaker 1: as well as being a science teacher at the elementary level,
Speaker 1: which is why we decided to have Sam on the
Speaker 1: show today. So Sam Murphy. Welcome to part time genius. Hi. So,
Speaker 1: I'm assuming growing up you you always knew that you
Speaker 1: wanted to be both a zombie on the Las Vegas
Speaker 1: trip and a mechanical bull operators. That is that accurate? No, absolutely,
Speaker 1: you know. And like when I was looking for college programs,
Speaker 1: I looked for something I could double major in both
Speaker 1: of those things. It was very important to me. That's terrific. Well,
Speaker 1: I had a question specifically about the bull operating side
Speaker 1: of it. I actually two questions. What one, what's a
Speaker 1: respectable time to stay on a bull for? And too?
Speaker 1: Have you have you ever seen anyone right a sober? Okay? Um?
Speaker 1: So the official time in rodeo is eight seconds and
Speaker 1: then you're officially being scored from that point on. So
Speaker 1: if you can stay on mechanical bowl for eight seconds,
Speaker 1: having never rode before, you're doing great. That's fantastic. Um.
Speaker 1: And I'm sure. Yeah, during the day there are a
Speaker 1: couple of times where people were mostly sober. It's people
Speaker 1: on the laws biggest trip. Yeah, imagine that's true. Just
Speaker 1: to clarify, if you have not made it eight seconds,
Speaker 1: you're not even to the point of being judged yet.
Speaker 1: Is that what you're saying in rodeo. Yeah, you have
Speaker 1: to go eight seconds and then they'll start scoring you.
Speaker 1: So I mean, like when I was a bull operator,
Speaker 1: I'd go pretty easy for the first like four so
Speaker 1: people could feel good about themselves. Got it, and you
Speaker 1: crank it up? I understand. Okay, Now that's pretty awesome.
Speaker 1: And you're also a comedian and an actor in Las
Speaker 1: Vegas as well as a science teacher. I mean, I
Speaker 1: don't know how you find the time to do all
Speaker 1: of this, but but tell us what you teach at
Speaker 1: the elementary level. UM. Yeah, so it's a really really
Speaker 1: great third party company. UM. And we teach science, and
Speaker 1: we sort of teach like the highlight reels of science.
Speaker 1: So we dropped dry ice into things and see what happens,
Speaker 1: and we make them slime and we send that home
Speaker 1: with them. UM. So it's really really cool to be
Speaker 1: this fun, bright part of kids days when they're really
Speaker 1: bogged down with tests and making sure that they hit
Speaker 1: certain requirements in certain marks, and we say, go play.
Speaker 1: Oh that's awesome, that's awesome. Well, well we have a
Speaker 1: quiz ready for you today, Mango. What quiz are we
Speaker 1: putting Sam up to? Uh, well, it was going to
Speaker 1: be called the Great School Quiz, but I've upgraded it
Speaker 1: to the pretty Great School Quiz. Al Right, Well, it's
Speaker 1: five questions and they're pretty straightforward questions, but they're fun.
Speaker 1: One Sammy ready to play? I'm so ready? All right,
Speaker 1: here we go. Question number one. What band wrote confusing
Speaker 1: lyrics to the song I Am the Walrus when they
Speaker 1: heard that high school students were being forced to study
Speaker 1: and analyze their songs in class. That's right, one for one, alright.
Speaker 1: Question number two, what popular condiment was banned in French
Speaker 1: school cafeterias in two thousand eleven on the grounds that
Speaker 1: it posed a threat to the national cuisine. Yeah, that's right,
Speaker 1: well done too for two. That sounded like a little
Speaker 1: bit of a guest, But I'm glad you trusted your
Speaker 1: got on that one. Okay. I just feel like French
Speaker 1: people would be like ruining alright. Question number three. What
Speaker 1: nineteen seventies and eighties animated music series got its start
Speaker 1: when an ad executive realized that his kid couldn't remember
Speaker 1: the multiplication tables but had no problem recalling rock lyrics.
Speaker 1: M Holograss not a bad guest of the answer, to
Speaker 1: this one, Mango. Yeah, what am I talking? Yeah that's right,
Speaker 1: Schoolhouse Rock. But we'll give that to you. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: think we're giving Sam credit for that one. Alright. Question
Speaker 1: number four. What Cuban dictator declared nineteen sixty one the
Speaker 1: Year of Education and sent literacy brigades to the countryside
Speaker 1: to build schools and teach people to read. Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 1: And and by the end of that year, literacy had
Speaker 1: jumped from sixty to nine. Alright, so you're four for four.
Speaker 1: Let's see how Sam can do on the last one
Speaker 1: and two thousand, fifteen students in Chicago launched a unique fundraiser.
Speaker 1: They got the school to play the song Baby by
Speaker 1: this Canadian artist between classes, and students could pay money
Speaker 1: to get it to stop. What artists are we talking about?
Speaker 1: Justin Bieber. The campaign was so effective that it raised
Speaker 1: over a thousand dollars in less than three days. Wow.
Speaker 1: So I think Sam has gone an astonishing five for five.
Speaker 1: So what is Sam je today? Mango? Yes, I'm when
Speaker 1: amazing five for five? And not only is Sam one
Speaker 1: a handwred note to their mom or boss, but also
Speaker 1: a copy of Stray shopping Carts of North America, which
Speaker 1: is a field guide to abandon shopping carts. Thank you,
Speaker 1: I'm so excited. Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 1: You guys, welcome back to Part time Genius. Now, before
Speaker 1: the break, we talked about Finland, and I wish all
Speaker 1: our kids the best as they relocate it to take
Speaker 1: advantage of their shorter school days and lack of standardized testing.
Speaker 1: But now it's time to talk about another country that
Speaker 1: also appears near the top of these O e c
Speaker 1: D rankings. And again this is based on scores in
Speaker 1: math and science and reading, but it's a country with
Speaker 1: a very very different approach, and that's Japan. So Mango,
Speaker 1: the mic is yours. Thanks for warming up for me.
Speaker 1: So I want to go back to a point you
Speaker 1: made earlier about the fact that every country is different
Speaker 1: and that each culture has its own priorities and their
Speaker 1: own interests. So even though Finland and Fancy very high
Speaker 1: scores on the assessment, they really do have different approaches.
Speaker 1: And I actually wanted to start by talking about values first.
Speaker 1: So so things beyond I guess the learning of the
Speaker 1: core subjects m definitely and and we'll get to that
Speaker 1: stuff too, But first I want to emphasize how much
Speaker 1: focused Japanese culture puts on developing independence and the sense
Speaker 1: of social responsibility, all at a very young age. So
Speaker 1: one way to illustrate the importance of independence before we
Speaker 1: talk about what happens at school is how kids get
Speaker 1: to school. I've I've read about this a little bit before,
Speaker 1: and and and that's the fact. I guess that most
Speaker 1: kids in Japan walk to school, Right, that's true, but
Speaker 1: that's not all. So most of them, as as young
Speaker 1: as like six years old, will walk to school alone
Speaker 1: or at least not with their parents. Like many of
Speaker 1: them walk as a group. But usually this big ends
Speaker 1: around first grade. And for most schools, if kids are
Speaker 1: within walking distance, they're required to walk. The walking distance
Speaker 1: can be considered more than four to five kilometers, so
Speaker 1: the average walk for an elementary school kid can be
Speaker 1: up to thirty to sixty minutes. Yeah. There's a sociologist
Speaker 1: in Tokyo whose name Terru Clavell, and she put it
Speaker 1: this way quote, it's a culturally indoctrinated understanding that children
Speaker 1: are supposed to be independent by the time they start
Speaker 1: grade school. Really, so that's age six. And she goes
Speaker 1: on to refer to a statement in Japanese that translates
Speaker 1: quote to the adored child send him on journeys. Alright, So,
Speaker 1: so you've got six year olds walking up to an
Speaker 1: hour with no adults supervision. Well, in most areas, the
Speaker 1: PTA finds these retirees in the area and asked them
Speaker 1: to come outside and you know, supervise the walkers, and
Speaker 1: they have designated safe zone houses if any kids need
Speaker 1: any sort of help. Well, if anything, I would have
Speaker 1: to imagine this emphasis on walking would play at least
Speaker 1: a little bit of a role in Japan having lower
Speaker 1: rates of childhood obesity. Oh, it definitely does, all right.
Speaker 1: So so you were saying that there's also this focus
Speaker 1: on social responsibility, and this is something I feel like
Speaker 1: I have seen a little bit about. Does this have
Speaker 1: something to do with the fact that I've heard a
Speaker 1: few times that they're no no janitors in Japanese schools? Yeah,
Speaker 1: so you know, I'd heard that a lot too, And
Speaker 1: that's not exactly true about the no janitors things. So
Speaker 1: most schools do have them, but they focus on the
Speaker 1: more complicated repairs and in most cases also cleaned the bathrooms.
Speaker 1: But yeah, that's the basic idea. So there's something called tokatsu,
Speaker 1: and it's these are non cognitive activities that are used
Speaker 1: to develop the sense of social responsibility. And these include
Speaker 1: the daily chores. The children are responsible for cleaning the classroom,
Speaker 1: cleaning common areas, stuff like that, and this starts at
Speaker 1: first grade, and students are required to bring their own
Speaker 1: washcloths to help out with the cleaning. They'll clean for
Speaker 1: about twenty minutes a day, and in one report I
Speaker 1: saw during this time the school might play cheerful, marching
Speaker 1: music and it's all over the sound system. But it's
Speaker 1: to keep everyone energized at home. Yeah, And and to
Speaker 1: be clear, this is not seen as any sort of punishment.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's it's much more about this moral education
Speaker 1: and learning to be responsible in a group. And as
Speaker 1: you might guess, much of the stems from the Buddhist
Speaker 1: idea of purification and and the sense that cleaning is
Speaker 1: not far off from a form of meditations. Interesting and
Speaker 1: in addition to this, most schools don't have cafeterias, so
Speaker 1: students in their teachers have lunch together in their classrooms
Speaker 1: and in places where the schools are providing the food.
Speaker 1: Students actually rotate through the responsibilities of serving others in
Speaker 1: the class. I mean, I think that's great, But what
Speaker 1: about the core classes themselves? I mean, I'm guessing this
Speaker 1: is where we're going to see the biggest differences from Finland.
Speaker 1: This is where Japan and Finland definitely take different approaches.
Speaker 1: And this is the case whether we're talking about a
Speaker 1: number of hours in school, the focus of the classes
Speaker 1: in school, homework, even standardized testing. So let's talk about
Speaker 1: the school hours first. For much of the twentieth century,
Speaker 1: Japan followed a six day school week, and they've always
Speaker 1: had a reputation for this very strict teaching methods with
Speaker 1: like lots of rote memorization, and this six day school
Speaker 1: week is something that's been fiercely debated over the past
Speaker 1: few decades. In what way, Well, in the seventies and eighties,
Speaker 1: people became more vocal about the amount of pressure being
Speaker 1: placed on students in Japan, and in response, there was
Speaker 1: this new educational system developed called you tori kyoku. I
Speaker 1: know I'm pronouncing that wrong, exactly right, So this translates
Speaker 1: roughly as quote pressure free education. You did say that, right,
Speaker 1: which is kind of funny when you think of it
Speaker 1: being applied in Japan. But there was this attempt to
Speaker 1: replace some of that wrote learning with this move towards
Speaker 1: more creative thinking and problem solving skills. And and on
Speaker 1: top of all of that, the school week went from
Speaker 1: six to five days in the nineties and did that
Speaker 1: help some Well, it's tough to say what it did
Speaker 1: for students stress levels. But it hasn't all gone smoothly.
Speaker 1: And in fact, after the shift, Japan saw its scores
Speaker 1: go down a bit on the International Achievement tests. So
Speaker 1: many people want them to return to the six day weeks,
Speaker 1: and in fact, in a survey a few weeks ago,
Speaker 1: eighty six percent of parents in Tokyo were in favor
Speaker 1: of returning to Saturday classes and only seven percent we're
Speaker 1: actually opposed. That is incredible and I cannot see that
Speaker 1: being the case here. Oh no, it wouldn't be. And
Speaker 1: and there's definitely a moved to push back towards the
Speaker 1: sixth day weeks. So in fact, there's a bit of
Speaker 1: a loophole in the legislation which gives schools the opportunity
Speaker 1: to teach classes on Saturdays if there's a special need.
Speaker 1: So in two thousand and twelve, nearly half of elementary
Speaker 1: schools and junior high schools were holding at least some
Speaker 1: amount of Saturday classes, so they definitely spend far more
Speaker 1: time in the classroom than the students in Finland. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and that's not the only additional time they're spending there.
Speaker 1: Because they have these highly competitive entrance exams and other
Speaker 1: standardized tests. There's something called juku or or cram schools,
Speaker 1: and they help students prepare for years for these exams.
Speaker 1: Like these cram schools meet after school and on weekends
Speaker 1: to help students prepare for future exams in math, science, English,
Speaker 1: and we're talking kids as young as six or seven,
Speaker 1: Like one report showed nearly twenty of elementary students and
Speaker 1: almost half of junior high students attended some amount of
Speaker 1: cram school. And these schools weren't cheap, like they cost
Speaker 1: more than three thousand dollars per year in some cases.
Speaker 1: And it isn't just juku like like one study showed
Speaker 1: nearly seventy of students attending after school math lessons as well.
Speaker 1: So so unlike in Finland where from a very young
Speaker 1: age there's this huge focus on preparing for entrance exams
Speaker 1: and standardized tests. I mean, it sounds so stressful. Yeah,
Speaker 1: despite some of the efforts to address the intense pressure, like,
Speaker 1: it's definitely still a very real thing. I look at
Speaker 1: these numbers here and it's like eight two percent of
Speaker 1: Japanese students report being very worried about their grades in school.
Speaker 1: And there's some other issues that they should be addressing
Speaker 1: as well, like bullying is actually an issue in Japan,
Speaker 1: but it's a little different than in the US. It's
Speaker 1: very much a group phenomena there where the entire class
Speaker 1: will gang up on one classmate and it's really sad.
Speaker 1: It's it's like between the stress and the bullying. It's
Speaker 1: thought to be the primary reason that teen suicide rates
Speaker 1: spike on September one, which is the first day of school.
Speaker 1: That's horrible. Yeah, And and for all the impressive test
Speaker 1: scores and achievements, that's definitely a problem that needs to
Speaker 1: be addressed. But I do want to finish the discussion
Speaker 1: to Japan on a positive note. What you got unicycleicycle
Speaker 1: that smile on everybody's face. So the majority of elementary
Speaker 1: schools in Japan have unicycles on hand for kids to
Speaker 1: ride during recess time. And it's because the Ministry of
Speaker 1: Education shouldn't recommends that schools have these along with bamboo
Speaker 1: stilt to help build core strength, right of course. I
Speaker 1: mean they even have an all Japan elementary school competition
Speaker 1: or a championship of unicycling. That's pretty awesome and definitely
Speaker 1: a better way to end the discussion of Japan, you know.
Speaker 1: But but hopefully they can successfully address some of the
Speaker 1: issues you mentioned, because it does seem like there's certain
Speaker 1: things about you know, their focus on independence and a
Speaker 1: desire to serve others that seem very good. But all right,
Speaker 1: let's take a quick break before we talk about a
Speaker 1: few other places. Our guest today is an education reporter
Speaker 1: at u S News and World Report, and she's been
Speaker 1: covering education policy and politics for nearly a decade now,
Speaker 1: Lauren Camera, Welcome to Part Time Genius than so So, Lauren,
Speaker 1: we're spending most of this episode talking about education systems
Speaker 1: around the world. So far in this episode, we've talked
Speaker 1: about Finland and Mango just finished schooling us on Japan.
Speaker 1: So now we want to talk a little bit about
Speaker 1: the US. But it seems like that can be a
Speaker 1: little bit challenging because, you know, rather than pointing to
Speaker 1: a big national trend. It feels like you kind of
Speaker 1: have to look at what all the states are doing
Speaker 1: individually or independently. Would you say this is true? Yeah, absolutely,
Speaker 1: I'd say that that's definitely true. Um. I often say that,
Speaker 1: you know, there's not really one overarching trend, but rather
Speaker 1: lots of states trying to do lots of different things
Speaker 1: all the time. UM. Sometimes I like to joke that
Speaker 1: in the USC education system loves its shiny new objects.
Speaker 1: It upsets it a lot over you know, one thing,
Speaker 1: and then it's quickly onto the next. Would you mind
Speaker 1: telling us about a few of those shiniest ones. Well,
Speaker 1: right now you might be seeing some of your kids
Speaker 1: have later school start times for examples, uh schools, and
Speaker 1: at least nineteen states that um I know of our
Speaker 1: planning to start the school day later this year. This
Speaker 1: is sort of a trend that's been happening the last
Speaker 1: year or two, after the CDC released a report a
Speaker 1: couple of years ago just blatantly saying that kids are
Speaker 1: not getting enough sleep and um that they're just starting
Speaker 1: the school day to early. So you'll probably see that continue.
Speaker 1: You also might see less homework. UM. There was a
Speaker 1: recent survey in June by Morning consoled that pretty much
Speaker 1: found that of American adults feel that, um, you know,
Speaker 1: less than one hour of homework per day is pretty
Speaker 1: much appropriate for elementary school students. So we've seen, for example,
Speaker 1: there is a school district in Florida, I believe it's
Speaker 1: Marion County. The school superintendent recently issued a ban on
Speaker 1: homework in thirty one of its elementary school. So you
Speaker 1: might not see a hard line drawn like that everywhere,
Speaker 1: but we might start to see a dip in homework assignments. Um. Also,
Speaker 1: I would say, you know, the increased use of technology.
Speaker 1: This has been a trend for the last couple of years,
Speaker 1: but um it's actually a really interesting one. If you
Speaker 1: look at the data. In twenties or team, only four
Speaker 1: million students had access to broadband that was fast enough
Speaker 1: that allowed them to use digital tablets in the classroom.
Speaker 1: But now, just like four years later, that number has
Speaker 1: pretty much catapulted to thirty nine point two million students
Speaker 1: have that ability. Now, just to ask you about that,
Speaker 1: your are you saying, just to clarify, is that access
Speaker 1: in the classroom or access at home. That's access in
Speaker 1: the classroom and at libraries okay, okay, So the ability
Speaker 1: to do their work on those Yeah, yeah, that's largely
Speaker 1: thanks to actually, believe it or not, a federal program
Speaker 1: called e rate. It's probably one of the only federal
Speaker 1: programs I can think of off the top of my
Speaker 1: head that was conceived and is doing exactly what it's
Speaker 1: supposed to do. So in the four short years you have,
Speaker 1: you know, thirty five million more students having that ability.
Speaker 1: So it's pretty remarkable. Actually. You know, one other thing
Speaker 1: that I could think of is that the probably be
Speaker 1: an increased interest in making popular again vote tech programs, apprenticeships,
Speaker 1: things like that, other technical skill courses as ways to
Speaker 1: help build the so called skills gap that's getting a
Speaker 1: lot of attention these days as well. Yeah. Now on
Speaker 1: the homework front, is are these decisions based on studies
Speaker 1: around the um effectiveness or lack of effectiveness of homework
Speaker 1: or is it based on just kind of family needs
Speaker 1: of it? Do do you know why the trend does
Speaker 1: seem to be moving in the direction of less homework
Speaker 1: for students. I mean, I'm fully in favor of it,
Speaker 1: I'm just curious why. Yeah, well, I've in the eleventh
Speaker 1: month old sun. He's not really bringing home a lot
Speaker 1: of homework yet, but he's falling behind already. Yeah, right, UM,
Speaker 1: I think it's it's both based on you know, public polling, opinions, UM,
Speaker 1: and also research that suggests, you know, a lot of
Speaker 1: the learning is the most effective learning at least is
Speaker 1: done in the classroom. Well, and is there anything else
Speaker 1: that do you feel like we should know about right
Speaker 1: now regarding education policy or or any other trends. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's probably um, you know, it's probably worth noting that
Speaker 1: as a backdrop to the story. All states right now
Speaker 1: are in the process of devising new education plans. This
Speaker 1: is something that's required under the new federal Education Law,
Speaker 1: the Every Students Sees Act, and those plans are in
Speaker 1: the process of being okayed by the um Department of Education.
Speaker 1: And that's really going to change how students in schools
Speaker 1: are assessed and held accountable and will therefore have a
Speaker 1: big impact on the classroom. Uh. You might, as a
Speaker 1: parent start to see some of these changes this year,
Speaker 1: perhaps things like greater access to art classes or a
Speaker 1: p in IB classes, potentially STEM programs, and some states
Speaker 1: are proposing to even pay more attention to socio emotional
Speaker 1: health of students. That's very interesting. Well, I'm glad you're
Speaker 1: here to read through all fifty of those plans so
Speaker 1: that you cannot make sense of those for us. But
Speaker 1: thanks so much for your terrific reporting and for joining
Speaker 1: us today on part Time Genius. Yeah, thanks so much
Speaker 1: for having me. Welcome back to part Time Genius. We
Speaker 1: were just wrapping up our discussion of Japan, but I
Speaker 1: realized I had one more question, and that's because we've
Speaker 1: been looking at two pretty different ends of the spectrum
Speaker 1: in terms of time spent at school and after school
Speaker 1: work and standardized testing, and we're talking about these are
Speaker 1: kind of two ends of the spectrum. It's so, do
Speaker 1: Japanese students spend more time on homework than all other countries?
Speaker 1: Actually no, so that honor belongs to China. And it's
Speaker 1: not even a close competition like the O E c
Speaker 1: D looked at sixty five countries in a study a
Speaker 1: few years ago, and Chinese students spend eight hundred thirty
Speaker 1: one minutes per week on homework. My gosh, and that's
Speaker 1: almost two minutes more than the next closest, which was
Speaker 1: the Russian Federation. They spend five five minutes and only
Speaker 1: a few other countries spent more than five minutes per
Speaker 1: week on homework. And of course all of this is
Speaker 1: more than four times what the kids in Finland are spending. Gosh.
Speaker 1: In fact, almost high school students in China say they
Speaker 1: typically finished their homework after eleven pm. Yeah, and it
Speaker 1: sounds like this is another place where, you know, the
Speaker 1: level of competition and stress must be so high. Definitely. So.
Speaker 1: Just like Japan, China has some very high stakes tests
Speaker 1: for their students. Like there's a huge nine hour college
Speaker 1: entrance exam called the High Test. And unlike the s
Speaker 1: A T where several students hit perfect scores every year,
Speaker 1: no one has ever achieved a seven fifty, which is
Speaker 1: the perfect score on this exam. And I guess this
Speaker 1: exam is is really important for college entrance. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: mean it's not just important, it's actually the only criteria
Speaker 1: for getting into Chinese university. Yeah. It's so competitive there
Speaker 1: that the top universities may only select one out of
Speaker 1: fifty students. Oh my god, that's crazy. And you know
Speaker 1: we sit here thinking that the U S schools are
Speaker 1: a competitive Yeah, no kidding. And and this exam is
Speaker 1: so important that can have this major impact on students
Speaker 1: future career and even their marital status. But I think
Speaker 1: the craziest part about the exam maybe the prompts used
Speaker 1: in the writing section. So according to an article in
Speaker 1: The Guardian, two of the prompts from the two thousand
Speaker 1: and fifteen exam included quote do butterfly wings have colors?
Speaker 1: And quote who do you admire most? A biotechnology researcher,
Speaker 1: a welding engineer, technician or a photographer. I'd like to
Speaker 1: turn in my essay on that first one. The answer
Speaker 1: would just be yes. But it seems like there would
Speaker 1: have to be a breaking point for all of this
Speaker 1: one day. Well that's already kind of starting to happen,
Speaker 1: though not really in this seismic way, but you definitely
Speaker 1: see fewer students taking the exam and just opting to
Speaker 1: go to school abroad, and and then others are starting
Speaker 1: to go to vocational schools, which tend to be less competitive.
Speaker 1: I mean, I doubt the entrance exam is contributing much
Speaker 1: to gross national happiness. I mean, if they're measuring that there,
Speaker 1: I kind of doubt that they are. I told you
Speaker 1: I was going to bring this one back up, but
Speaker 1: but let's go back to Bhutan's It was really fun
Speaker 1: reading about the implementation of this program. And so it's
Speaker 1: focused on four primary pillars. So there's sustainable development, preservation
Speaker 1: and promotion of culture, conservation of the environment, and good governance.
Speaker 1: And then to measure their progress, Bhutan developed an index
Speaker 1: in two thousand and eight that would quote reflect g
Speaker 1: n H values, set benchmarks, and track policies and performance
Speaker 1: of the country. So the way they set these benchmarks
Speaker 1: and track all of this is through this index that
Speaker 1: includes nine domains their psychological well being, time use, community, vitality, culture, health, education,
Speaker 1: environmental diversity, living standard, and governance. You got all those
Speaker 1: I got, But you know, I mean, like the whole
Speaker 1: four pillars and nine domains thing. It sounds so Buddhist,
Speaker 1: like it reminds me of the Four Noble Truths and
Speaker 1: the eight Full path. I love the way you say
Speaker 1: Buddhis But that's because it really is rooted in Buddhist
Speaker 1: philosophy and and and that's no big surprise because Bhutan
Speaker 1: is majority Buddhist. And in fact, in two thousand ten
Speaker 1: they began requiring schools to make time for daily meditation.
Speaker 1: But even back on the education side of me, there's
Speaker 1: there's another interesting piece of this. So with their focus
Speaker 1: on education and all their efforts to provide primary schooling
Speaker 1: for everyone and increase the literacy rate, Bhutan is seeing
Speaker 1: some pretty significant results. I mean, they're not going to
Speaker 1: be on the same top list that Finland and Japan
Speaker 1: are in terms of all of their scores, but what
Speaker 1: they've accomplished is still really impressive. So just just looking
Speaker 1: at some of the numbers for literacy, actually, let me
Speaker 1: pull these back up. It says in two thousand five,
Speaker 1: the literacy rate for those sixty five and older was
Speaker 1: about for men and only five percent for women. But
Speaker 1: if you look at the fifteen to twenty four age
Speaker 1: range at that point, it was eight percent for men
Speaker 1: and sixty eight percent for women. But then fast forward
Speaker 1: seven years to two thousand and twelve, looking at that
Speaker 1: fifteen to twenty four year old age group, again, it
Speaker 1: jumped to for men and almost for women. I mean,
Speaker 1: these are some huge games. Yeah, it's incredible, So maybe
Speaker 1: focusing on gross national happiness isn't such a silly idea.
Speaker 1: But you know what else is incredible? The part time
Speaker 1: genius backed off. All right, I'll kick us off here.
Speaker 1: So earlier when we were talking about all students receiving
Speaker 1: free school lunches in Finland, I'm not sure if you
Speaker 1: saw the story, but this will now be happening in
Speaker 1: New York City. Earlier this year in New York announced
Speaker 1: the program to provide free lunches to all public school kids,
Speaker 1: which is great. So looking at a country we didn't
Speaker 1: really talk about today, do you know that in France
Speaker 1: schools are working to teach children not to be picky
Speaker 1: eaters through this thing called taste training lester So in
Speaker 1: two thousand eleven this became part of their national curriculum,
Speaker 1: and Karenlebillion, author of French Kids Eat Everything, told warts
Speaker 1: quote the French take a different approach to food from
Speaker 1: a very young age. They believe and have done scientific
Speaker 1: research to prove that you can teach your kids to
Speaker 1: eat just like you teach them to read. And according
Speaker 1: to the report, young kids are expected to learn how
Speaker 1: to enjoy such delicacies as pickled pig snouts. So I'd
Speaker 1: like to see them trying to get my kids the
Speaker 1: eat the host gross. Actually, I had a fact here
Speaker 1: about education in France as well, and I didn't know
Speaker 1: that Traditionally, French children have only gone to school four
Speaker 1: days a week, and it's Wednesday that's kind of their
Speaker 1: special day with no school. And this dates back to
Speaker 1: the late eighteen hundreds when this day was reserved for
Speaker 1: religious education, and in the seventies it became a mandatory
Speaker 1: day off. But in the past decade or so it's
Speaker 1: turned into this heated debate. To go back to two
Speaker 1: thousand eight, Nicholas Sarkozy mandated the elimination of classes held
Speaker 1: on Saturday, which some schools were kind of using to
Speaker 1: make up for that day off, and mandated they returned
Speaker 1: to this four day week. So then a few years
Speaker 1: later Francois Holland instituted a half day on Wednesday, so
Speaker 1: became four and a half day school week. And then
Speaker 1: early in his term, Emmanuel Macron informed schools that they
Speaker 1: would have the option of going back to the four
Speaker 1: day week if they so desired. That's amazing. So, speaking
Speaker 1: of recent announcements, something I forgot to mention, we were
Speaker 1: talking about Japan. According to the Japan Times quote this year,
Speaker 1: the Ministry of Education announced they would be adding the
Speaker 1: teaching of a second language at all elementary schools and
Speaker 1: so while he might be thinking English, it's actually computer
Speaker 1: programming languages. So as part of the language curriculum update
Speaker 1: to be completed by all students will be taught coding
Speaker 1: in schools. Wow, okay, alright, Well, in Russia, September one
Speaker 1: is known as Knowledge Day and it's the celebration of
Speaker 1: the beginning of school and it's accompanied by lots and
Speaker 1: lots of ceremony. So at the end of the ceremony,
Speaker 1: a first grade girl sits on the shoulders of a
Speaker 1: senior boy and then she rings a bell to signify
Speaker 1: the start of the year. I had no idea what
Speaker 1: that means, but it sounds very like, of course, she
Speaker 1: sits on the shoulders and rings a and it's time
Speaker 1: to start school. So I have to admit I saved
Speaker 1: this one for last. In two thousand to nonprofits started
Speaker 1: by Hilula Swan of our I'm sure I'm getting that
Speaker 1: good job created the first boat based school in Bangladesh.
Speaker 1: And so you might be wondering why. It's because so
Speaker 1: much of the country is often flooded during the monsoon season.
Speaker 1: It makes it very difficult for many kids to get
Speaker 1: to school. And with a boat based school, the school
Speaker 1: comes to them. So by there were twenty two of
Speaker 1: these floating schools. And it's amazing because the school really
Speaker 1: also serves as a school bus by traveling around and
Speaker 1: picking up the students. And after all the students are collected,
Speaker 1: the boat docks and and the school they begins, I know,
Speaker 1: and the boats have internet access and they've got solar
Speaker 1: panels to make it all possible. And the Bill and
Speaker 1: Melinda Gates Foundation have given it a million dollars to
Speaker 1: build more boats and improve the technology. It's really phenomenal.
Speaker 1: And uh, it isn't just there so inspired by this,
Speaker 1: you can actually find schools in other countries prone to flooding.
Speaker 1: So these occur in Cambodia and Nigeria, the Philippines, Vietnam
Speaker 1: and Zambia as well. Now I see why you say that,
Speaker 1: one mango, I have to admit that that is an
Speaker 1: incredible fact and and be honest, worthy of this week's trophy.
Speaker 1: So congratulations, that's it for today's show. Thanks so much
Speaker 1: for listening. Thanks again for listening. Part Time Genius is
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Speaker 1: Do we do? We forget Jason? Jason who