WEBVTT - S04 Episode 20 Extra: Outside the Darkroom

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome to Unexplained Extra with me Richard McClain Smith, where

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<v Speaker 1>for the weeks in between episodes, we look at stories

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<v Speaker 1>and ideas that, for one reason or other, didn't make

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<v Speaker 1>it into the previous show. In the last episode, the Homecoming,

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<v Speaker 1>we relived the extraordinary story of Travis Walton, who, after

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<v Speaker 1>going missing for five days in nineteen seventy five, reappeared

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<v Speaker 1>with the incredible claim that he'd been abducted by what

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<v Speaker 1>he believed were beings from another planet. Regardless of what

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<v Speaker 1>we choose to believe about the story, it remains one

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<v Speaker 1>of the more well known and to many plausible accounts

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<v Speaker 1>of a supposed encounter with the UFO. This is perhaps

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<v Speaker 1>surprising considering how Travis's story relies purely on anecdotal evidence.

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<v Speaker 1>In comparison, most other well known and similarly highly regarded

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<v Speaker 1>stories of alleged UFO encounters, such as the supposed Roswell crash,

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<v Speaker 1>the Rendelsham Forest incident, and more recently, the US Navy

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<v Speaker 1>flight footage, has either pictorial or video evidence to accompany it.

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<v Speaker 1>Many say that if a genuine alien spacecraft really had

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<v Speaker 1>appeared on Earth, who would be incontrovertible photographic or video

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<v Speaker 1>evidence to prove it, and yet there are countless videos

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<v Speaker 1>and photos purporting to reveal exactly that. More often than not, however,

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<v Speaker 1>they are dismissed as cases of mistaken identity or simply fakes.

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<v Speaker 1>In reality, unless a craft were to land on a

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<v Speaker 1>busy high street in full view of a live news

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<v Speaker 1>broadcast and collectively witnessed by everyone you knew, any photo

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<v Speaker 1>or video evidence could easily be dismissed. Perhaps that is,

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<v Speaker 1>with the exception of one photo. For many years, the

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<v Speaker 1>British government, when pushed to answer questions about the UFO phenomenon,

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<v Speaker 1>would routinely respond that there was no intelligence interest in

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<v Speaker 1>such things, and by extension, the government had no interest

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<v Speaker 1>in them at all. Eyebrows were raised, however, when in

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<v Speaker 1>May two thousand and eight, the British Ministry of Defense

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<v Speaker 1>released a series of top secret files to the National Archive,

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<v Speaker 1>which included a host of reports of UFO sightings stretching

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<v Speaker 1>back to nineteen seventy eight. Over the next few years,

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<v Speaker 1>as more files were released, it would become apparent that

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<v Speaker 1>not only had the British government been keeping a keen

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<v Speaker 1>interest in the phenomena, but that they had been since

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<v Speaker 1>the nineteen forties. In order to do this, a team

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<v Speaker 1>of civil service staff were tasked with collating and in

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<v Speaker 1>some cases, following up on alleged sightings of UFO. In

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<v Speaker 1>nineteen ninety one, a new member joined the team. Nick Pope,

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<v Speaker 1>had previously worked in the Royal Air Force Operations Room

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<v Speaker 1>during the nineteen ninety Gulf War as a member of

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<v Speaker 1>the Defense Intelligence Staff for the British Ministry of Defense. There,

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<v Speaker 1>his job was to read through drafts of books that

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<v Speaker 1>were being written about the conflict to make sure there

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<v Speaker 1>wasn't any top secret information that could be detrimental for

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<v Speaker 1>British intelligence. With British operations in the Gulf winding down

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<v Speaker 1>in nineteen ninety one, Pope was moved to another department

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<v Speaker 1>in which his main responsibilities involved executing various tasks relating

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<v Speaker 1>to the non operational activities of the Royal Air Force.

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<v Speaker 1>A key element of this role, as stipulated on Pope's website,

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<v Speaker 1>nick pope dot Net, was keeping tabs on any unidentified

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<v Speaker 1>aerial phenomena reported to the department and to analyze if

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<v Speaker 1>such phenomena posed a threat to national security. On Pope's

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<v Speaker 1>first day in his new office, having been shown to

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<v Speaker 1>his desk, He looked up to see an unusual poster

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<v Speaker 1>stuck to the wall. The image appeared to be an

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<v Speaker 1>enlarged photograph of the British countryside, with a large, dark colored,

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<v Speaker 1>diamond shaped object appearing to hover in the sky, while

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<v Speaker 1>to the right of it, Pope could make out what

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<v Speaker 1>appeared to be a fighter jet traveling at speed. Asking

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<v Speaker 1>his colleague opposite about it, the colleague replied that it

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<v Speaker 1>was indeed a photograph taken in August nineteen ninety by

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<v Speaker 1>two members of the public walking in an area in

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<v Speaker 1>the middle of Scotland known as Calvin. The pair claimed

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<v Speaker 1>they came across it suddenly and watched it hover silently

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<v Speaker 1>for a few minutes until a Harrier fighter plane arrived

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<v Speaker 1>and flew past it a few times, after which the

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<v Speaker 1>object shot straight up into the air and accelerated away

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<v Speaker 1>at a colossal rate. The photo had been sent to

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<v Speaker 1>the national newspaper, the Scottish Daily Record, before being passed

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<v Speaker 1>on to the Ministry of Defense. Having been analyzed by

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<v Speaker 1>the RFS Joint Air Reconnaissance Intelligence Center, it was deemed

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<v Speaker 1>that whatever the object was in the picture was there

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<v Speaker 1>when the photograph was taken and was estimated to be

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<v Speaker 1>about twenty five meters in diameter. It was, as Nick

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<v Speaker 1>Pope claims his colleagues stated, quite simply, the best photographed

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<v Speaker 1>their department had ever received of a UFO. Ordinarily, the

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<v Speaker 1>instinct of Pope and his colleagues when presented with such

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<v Speaker 1>a photograph was to get to the bottom of which

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<v Speaker 1>earthly nation the UFO had been developed, by what they

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<v Speaker 1>were doing flying it in British airspace, and how could

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<v Speaker 1>the British get their hands on the technology? On this occasion, however,

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<v Speaker 1>the intelligent staff were stumped. Pope claimed that during one

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<v Speaker 1>briefing on the UFO phenomena in general, his colleague at

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<v Speaker 1>one point drew attention to the diamond shaped object in

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<v Speaker 1>the photo, and, pointing to the right, said it's not

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<v Speaker 1>the Americans, then, pointing to the left, it's not the Russians, then,

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<v Speaker 1>moving his finger above the object, said and that only leaves.

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<v Speaker 1>The photograph remained on the wall until nineteen ninety four,

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<v Speaker 1>when it was unceremoniously removed by Pope's head of division.

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<v Speaker 1>After a series of similar UFO sightings in the early nineties,

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<v Speaker 1>suspicions were raised that the US Air Force was secretly

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<v Speaker 1>testing prototype aircraft in British airspace. However, after being confronted

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<v Speaker 1>with this accusation in Parliament, British Defense ministers were forced

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<v Speaker 1>to reveal that the US government had assured them that

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<v Speaker 1>neither the Airforce or any other US body we're conducting

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<v Speaker 1>such tests over Britain. Are you always taking care of

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<v Speaker 1>your family? Do you often take care of others and

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<v Speaker 1>not yourself? Now it's time to take care of yourself,

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<v Speaker 1>back to feeling your best, to feeling like yourself again.

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<v Speaker 1>With teledoc, you can speak to a licensed therapist by

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<v Speaker 1>available through most insurance employers. Download the app or visitteldoc

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<v Speaker 1>dot com forward slash Unexplained podcast today to get started.

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<v Speaker 1>That's teladoc dot com slash Unexplained podcast. Pope has suggested

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<v Speaker 1>that his head of division confiscated the photo not because

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<v Speaker 1>it was a craft from outer space, but because he

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<v Speaker 1>didn't believe the assurances from the US and as such

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<v Speaker 1>thought it might be of use to the Ministry of Defense.

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<v Speaker 1>Either way, according to Pope, neither the photograph or the negatives,

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<v Speaker 1>which were also handed over to the Ministry of Defense

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<v Speaker 1>by the Scottish Daily Record newspaper, have ever been seen since.

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<v Speaker 1>In two thousand and eleven, the mod files relating to

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<v Speaker 1>this incident were declassified. The following has taken verbatim from

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<v Speaker 1>National Archives file d e FE twenty four forward Slash

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<v Speaker 1>one nine four zero UFO Reports with redactions. UFO Incident, Saturday,

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<v Speaker 1>fourth August nineteen ninety Location, Calvin, Scotland, twenty miles north

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<v Speaker 1>of pit Lockery, off the A nine time nine p

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<v Speaker 1>m approximately. Description large diamond shape UFO hovering for about

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<v Speaker 1>ten minutes before ascending vertically upwards at high speed during sighting.

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<v Speaker 1>Ri F aircraft believed to be a harrier made a

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<v Speaker 1>number of low level passes for five to six minutes

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<v Speaker 1>before disappearing. Off witnesses one name redacted, the other unidentified.

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<v Speaker 1>Additional information. A number of color photographs taken by eye

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<v Speaker 1>witness were passed to ri F Petrevi and Scottish Daily Record.

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<v Speaker 1>Original Nega Tis also passed a Daily Record weather main

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<v Speaker 1>cloud base ninety five thousand feet dropping down to fifteen

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<v Speaker 1>thousand feet during showers. Wind was west to southwest ten

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<v Speaker 1>to fifteen kilometers, temperature of fourteen celsius occasional showers minutes

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<v Speaker 1>taken from fourteenth September nineteen ninety. Under Secretary of State

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<v Speaker 1>for the Air Force may wish to be aware that

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<v Speaker 1>the Scottish Daily Record may run a story regarding an

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<v Speaker 1>alleged sighting of a UFO near pit Lockery in early August.

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<v Speaker 1>Such stories are not normally drawn to the attention of

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<v Speaker 1>ministers and the Ministry of Defense and the Press Office

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<v Speaker 1>invariably responds to questions along well established lines, emphasizing our

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<v Speaker 1>limited interest in the UFO phenomenon and explaining that we

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<v Speaker 1>therefore do not have the resources to undertake any in

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<v Speaker 1>depth investigation into particular sightings. On this occasion, however, the

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<v Speaker 1>Mood has been provided with six photographic negatives of an

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<v Speaker 1>alleged UFO by the Scottish Daily Record and has been

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<v Speaker 1>asked for comments, almost certainly for inclusion in the forthcoming story.

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<v Speaker 1>For this reason, it is felt that the Undersecretary of

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<v Speaker 1>State be made aware of the background and the line

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<v Speaker 1>adopted by the Deputy Director of Public Relations in responding

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<v Speaker 1>to the newspaper. The photographs, which were received on the

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<v Speaker 1>tenth of September, are alleged to have been taken near

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<v Speaker 1>the A nine road at Calvin, north of Pitlochry, on

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<v Speaker 1>the evening of August fourth. They show a large stationary

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<v Speaker 1>diamond shaped object, past which it appears a small jet

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<v Speaker 1>aircraft is flying. The negatives have been considered by the

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<v Speaker 1>relevant staffs, who've established the jet aircraft is a Harrier

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<v Speaker 1>and also identified a barely visible second aircraft, again probably

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<v Speaker 1>a Harrier, but have reached no definite conclusion regarding the

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<v Speaker 1>large object. It has also been confirmed that there is

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<v Speaker 1>no record of harriers operating in the area at the

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<v Speaker 1>time at which the photographs are alleged to have been taken.

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<v Speaker 1>The negatives have now been returned to the Scottish Daily

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<v Speaker 1>Record in consultation with the RF's Deputy Director of Public Relations,

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<v Speaker 1>it has been agreed that the attached line to take

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<v Speaker 1>should be used in responding to the Scottish Daily Record.

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<v Speaker 1>These are consistent with the position adopted in the replies

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<v Speaker 1>to the many public and occasional parliamentary enquiries on the

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<v Speaker 1>subject of UFOs. The defense lines to take are as follows.

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<v Speaker 1>Have looked at photographs, no definite conclusions regarding the large

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<v Speaker 1>diamond shaped object, confident that jet aircraft is a harrier

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<v Speaker 1>jump jet, have no record of harriers operating in location

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<v Speaker 1>at stated time or date. And finally that there have

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<v Speaker 1>been no other reports received by MOD of unusual activity

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<v Speaker 1>or sightings at location, date or time. If pressed on

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<v Speaker 1>who in the MD studied the pictures, reply all citing reports,

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<v Speaker 1>including on occasion, photographs and drawings received by MOD, are

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<v Speaker 1>referred to the staff and the Department which are responsible

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<v Speaker 1>for Air Defense of UK, who examine them as part

0:13:20.840 --> 0:13:27.320
<v Speaker 1>of their normal duties. Thank you to Mark town End

0:13:27.480 --> 0:13:31.640
<v Speaker 1>for suggesting this story. If you enjoy Unexplained and would

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<v Speaker 1>Forward Slash Unexplained Podcast. Now it's time to take care

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