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Speaker 1: Welcome to Unexplained Extra with me Richard McClain Smith, where

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Speaker 1: for the weeks in between episodes, we look at stories

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Speaker 1: and ideas that, for one reason or other, didn't make

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Speaker 1: it into the previous show. In the last episode, the Homecoming,

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Speaker 1: we relived the extraordinary story of Travis Walton, who, after

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Speaker 1: going missing for five days in nineteen seventy five, reappeared

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Speaker 1: with the incredible claim that he'd been abducted by what

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Speaker 1: he believed were beings from another planet. Regardless of what

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Speaker 1: we choose to believe about the story, it remains one

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Speaker 1: of the more well known and to many plausible accounts

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Speaker 1: of a supposed encounter with the UFO. This is perhaps

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Speaker 1: surprising considering how Travis's story relies purely on anecdotal evidence.

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Speaker 1: In comparison, most other well known and similarly highly regarded

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Speaker 1: stories of alleged UFO encounters, such as the supposed Roswell crash,

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Speaker 1: the Rendelsham Forest incident, and more recently, the US Navy

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Speaker 1: flight footage, has either pictorial or video evidence to accompany it.

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Speaker 1: Many say that if a genuine alien spacecraft really had

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Speaker 1: appeared on Earth, who would be incontrovertible photographic or video

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Speaker 1: evidence to prove it, and yet there are countless videos

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Speaker 1: and photos purporting to reveal exactly that. More often than not, however,

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Speaker 1: they are dismissed as cases of mistaken identity or simply fakes.

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Speaker 1: In reality, unless a craft were to land on a

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Speaker 1: busy high street in full view of a live news

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Speaker 1: broadcast and collectively witnessed by everyone you knew, any photo

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Speaker 1: or video evidence could easily be dismissed. Perhaps that is,

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Speaker 1: with the exception of one photo. For many years, the

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Speaker 1: British government, when pushed to answer questions about the UFO phenomenon,

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Speaker 1: would routinely respond that there was no intelligence interest in

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Speaker 1: such things, and by extension, the government had no interest

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Speaker 1: in them at all. Eyebrows were raised, however, when in

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Speaker 1: May two thousand and eight, the British Ministry of Defense

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Speaker 1: released a series of top secret files to the National Archive,

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Speaker 1: which included a host of reports of UFO sightings stretching

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Speaker 1: back to nineteen seventy eight. Over the next few years,

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Speaker 1: as more files were released, it would become apparent that

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Speaker 1: not only had the British government been keeping a keen

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Speaker 1: interest in the phenomena, but that they had been since

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Speaker 1: the nineteen forties. In order to do this, a team

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Speaker 1: of civil service staff were tasked with collating and in

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Speaker 1: some cases, following up on alleged sightings of UFO. In

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Speaker 1: nineteen ninety one, a new member joined the team. Nick Pope,

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Speaker 1: had previously worked in the Royal Air Force Operations Room

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Speaker 1: during the nineteen ninety Gulf War as a member of

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Speaker 1: the Defense Intelligence Staff for the British Ministry of Defense. There,

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Speaker 1: his job was to read through drafts of books that

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Speaker 1: were being written about the conflict to make sure there

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Speaker 1: wasn't any top secret information that could be detrimental for

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Speaker 1: British intelligence. With British operations in the Gulf winding down

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Speaker 1: in nineteen ninety one, Pope was moved to another department

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Speaker 1: in which his main responsibilities involved executing various tasks relating

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Speaker 1: to the non operational activities of the Royal Air Force.

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Speaker 1: A key element of this role, as stipulated on Pope's website,

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Speaker 1: nick pope dot Net, was keeping tabs on any unidentified

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Speaker 1: aerial phenomena reported to the department and to analyze if

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Speaker 1: such phenomena posed a threat to national security. On Pope's

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Speaker 1: first day in his new office, having been shown to

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Speaker 1: his desk, He looked up to see an unusual poster

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Speaker 1: stuck to the wall. The image appeared to be an

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Speaker 1: enlarged photograph of the British countryside, with a large, dark colored,

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Speaker 1: diamond shaped object appearing to hover in the sky, while

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Speaker 1: to the right of it, Pope could make out what

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Speaker 1: appeared to be a fighter jet traveling at speed. Asking

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Speaker 1: his colleague opposite about it, the colleague replied that it

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Speaker 1: was indeed a photograph taken in August nineteen ninety by

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Speaker 1: two members of the public walking in an area in

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Speaker 1: the middle of Scotland known as Calvin. The pair claimed

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Speaker 1: they came across it suddenly and watched it hover silently

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Speaker 1: for a few minutes until a Harrier fighter plane arrived

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Speaker 1: and flew past it a few times, after which the

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Speaker 1: object shot straight up into the air and accelerated away

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Speaker 1: at a colossal rate. The photo had been sent to

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Speaker 1: the national newspaper, the Scottish Daily Record, before being passed

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Speaker 1: on to the Ministry of Defense. Having been analyzed by

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Speaker 1: the RFS Joint Air Reconnaissance Intelligence Center, it was deemed

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Speaker 1: that whatever the object was in the picture was there

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Speaker 1: when the photograph was taken and was estimated to be

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Speaker 1: about twenty five meters in diameter. It was, as Nick

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Speaker 1: Pope claims his colleagues stated, quite simply, the best photographed

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Speaker 1: their department had ever received of a UFO. Ordinarily, the

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Speaker 1: instinct of Pope and his colleagues when presented with such

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Speaker 1: a photograph was to get to the bottom of which

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Speaker 1: earthly nation the UFO had been developed, by what they

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Speaker 1: were doing flying it in British airspace, and how could

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Speaker 1: the British get their hands on the technology? On this occasion, however,

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Speaker 1: the intelligent staff were stumped. Pope claimed that during one

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Speaker 1: briefing on the UFO phenomena in general, his colleague at

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Speaker 1: one point drew attention to the diamond shaped object in

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Speaker 1: the photo, and, pointing to the right, said it's not

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Speaker 1: the Americans, then, pointing to the left, it's not the Russians, then,

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Speaker 1: moving his finger above the object, said and that only leaves.

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Speaker 1: The photograph remained on the wall until nineteen ninety four,

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Speaker 1: when it was unceremoniously removed by Pope's head of division.

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Speaker 1: After a series of similar UFO sightings in the early nineties,

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Speaker 1: suspicions were raised that the US Air Force was secretly

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Speaker 1: testing prototype aircraft in British airspace. However, after being confronted

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Speaker 1: with this accusation in Parliament, British Defense ministers were forced

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Speaker 1: to reveal that the US government had assured them that

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Speaker 1: neither the Airforce or any other US body we're conducting

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Speaker 1: such tests over Britain. Are you always taking care of

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Speaker 1: your family? Do you often take care of others and

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Speaker 1: not yourself? Now it's time to take care of yourself,

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Speaker 1: to make time for you. You deserve it. Teledoc gives

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Speaker 1: you access to a licensed therapist to help you get

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Speaker 1: With teledoc, you can speak to a licensed therapist by

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Speaker 1: phone or video. Therapy appointments are available seven days a

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Speaker 1: week from seven am to nine pm local time. If

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Speaker 1: you feel overwhelmed sometimes maybe you feel stressed or anxious,

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Speaker 1: depressed or lonely, or you might be struggling with a

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Speaker 1: personal or family issue, teledoc can help. Teledoc is committed

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Speaker 1: to facilitating great therapeutic matches, so they make it easy

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Speaker 1: available through most insurance employers. Download the app or visitteldoc

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Speaker 1: dot com forward slash Unexplained podcast today to get started.

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Speaker 1: That's teladoc dot com slash Unexplained podcast. Pope has suggested

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Speaker 1: that his head of division confiscated the photo not because

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Speaker 1: it was a craft from outer space, but because he

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Speaker 1: didn't believe the assurances from the US and as such

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Speaker 1: thought it might be of use to the Ministry of Defense.

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Speaker 1: Either way, according to Pope, neither the photograph or the negatives,

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Speaker 1: which were also handed over to the Ministry of Defense

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Speaker 1: by the Scottish Daily Record newspaper, have ever been seen since.

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Speaker 1: In two thousand and eleven, the mod files relating to

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Speaker 1: this incident were declassified. The following has taken verbatim from

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Speaker 1: National Archives file d e FE twenty four forward Slash

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Speaker 1: one nine four zero UFO Reports with redactions. UFO Incident, Saturday,

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Speaker 1: fourth August nineteen ninety Location, Calvin, Scotland, twenty miles north

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Speaker 1: of pit Lockery, off the A nine time nine p

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Speaker 1: m approximately. Description large diamond shape UFO hovering for about

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Speaker 1: ten minutes before ascending vertically upwards at high speed during sighting.

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Speaker 1: Ri F aircraft believed to be a harrier made a

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Speaker 1: number of low level passes for five to six minutes

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Speaker 1: before disappearing. Off witnesses one name redacted, the other unidentified.

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Speaker 1: Additional information. A number of color photographs taken by eye

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Speaker 1: witness were passed to ri F Petrevi and Scottish Daily Record.

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Speaker 1: Original Nega Tis also passed a Daily Record weather main

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Speaker 1: cloud base ninety five thousand feet dropping down to fifteen

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Speaker 1: thousand feet during showers. Wind was west to southwest ten

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Speaker 1: to fifteen kilometers, temperature of fourteen celsius occasional showers minutes

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Speaker 1: taken from fourteenth September nineteen ninety. Under Secretary of State

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Speaker 1: for the Air Force may wish to be aware that

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Speaker 1: the Scottish Daily Record may run a story regarding an

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Speaker 1: alleged sighting of a UFO near pit Lockery in early August.

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Speaker 1: Such stories are not normally drawn to the attention of

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Speaker 1: ministers and the Ministry of Defense and the Press Office

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Speaker 1: invariably responds to questions along well established lines, emphasizing our

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Speaker 1: limited interest in the UFO phenomenon and explaining that we

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Speaker 1: therefore do not have the resources to undertake any in

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Speaker 1: depth investigation into particular sightings. On this occasion, however, the

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Speaker 1: Mood has been provided with six photographic negatives of an

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Speaker 1: alleged UFO by the Scottish Daily Record and has been

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Speaker 1: asked for comments, almost certainly for inclusion in the forthcoming story.

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Speaker 1: For this reason, it is felt that the Undersecretary of

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Speaker 1: State be made aware of the background and the line

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Speaker 1: adopted by the Deputy Director of Public Relations in responding

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Speaker 1: to the newspaper. The photographs, which were received on the

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Speaker 1: tenth of September, are alleged to have been taken near

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Speaker 1: the A nine road at Calvin, north of Pitlochry, on

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Speaker 1: the evening of August fourth. They show a large stationary

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Speaker 1: diamond shaped object, past which it appears a small jet

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Speaker 1: aircraft is flying. The negatives have been considered by the

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Speaker 1: relevant staffs, who've established the jet aircraft is a Harrier

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Speaker 1: and also identified a barely visible second aircraft, again probably

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Speaker 1: a Harrier, but have reached no definite conclusion regarding the

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Speaker 1: large object. It has also been confirmed that there is

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Speaker 1: no record of harriers operating in the area at the

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Speaker 1: time at which the photographs are alleged to have been taken.

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Speaker 1: The negatives have now been returned to the Scottish Daily

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Speaker 1: Record in consultation with the RF's Deputy Director of Public Relations,

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Speaker 1: it has been agreed that the attached line to take

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Speaker 1: should be used in responding to the Scottish Daily Record.

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Speaker 1: These are consistent with the position adopted in the replies

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Speaker 1: to the many public and occasional parliamentary enquiries on the

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Speaker 1: subject of UFOs. The defense lines to take are as follows.

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Speaker 1: Have looked at photographs, no definite conclusions regarding the large

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Speaker 1: diamond shaped object, confident that jet aircraft is a harrier

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Speaker 1: jump jet, have no record of harriers operating in location

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Speaker 1: at stated time or date. And finally that there have

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Speaker 1: been no other reports received by MOD of unusual activity

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Speaker 1: or sightings at location, date or time. If pressed on

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Speaker 1: who in the MD studied the pictures, reply all citing reports,

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Speaker 1: including on occasion, photographs and drawings received by MOD, are

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Speaker 1: referred to the staff and the Department which are responsible

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Speaker 1: for Air Defense of UK, who examine them as part

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Speaker 1: of their normal duties. Thank you to Mark town End

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Speaker 1: for suggesting this story. If you enjoy Unexplained and would

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