Speaker 1: Quest Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2: All Right, ladies and.
Speaker 1: Gentlemen, welcome to another episode of Quest Love Supreme. Young
Speaker 1: addition is Quest Love and we are Team Supreme here?
Speaker 1: Why yeah, what's going on? You had another room?
Speaker 3: How about right? More talk show?
Speaker 1: We now you're the queen of the castle because your
Speaker 1: room choices. You literally know how to make new environments
Speaker 1: in every episode.
Speaker 3: We've worked on it every day. Yes, but look, seriously,
Speaker 3: I mean you see the difference though, right.
Speaker 1: I'm impressed. There's funktually going on. Y'all can see. I'm
Speaker 1: clearly cluttered.
Speaker 2: Take it from mister himself.
Speaker 1: Well, also, freaking star wars beams on me. What's good, Steve?
Speaker 1: How's it going good?
Speaker 4: How's everybody doing today?
Speaker 5: Hi?
Speaker 6: Bony than good to see us, Steve.
Speaker 1: Steve are our resident instrumental music collegist and on paid bill.
Speaker 2: Yes, sir, how's life man? As a former tenor sax player?
Speaker 2: I could be more excited to this is the day? Man,
Speaker 2: I'm into it.
Speaker 1: Wait. I learned more and more about you each episode.
Speaker 2: You know this? So I I was a saxophone player
Speaker 2: all my life, and then I like.
Speaker 1: Then, how come you never came to a jam session
Speaker 1: on paid.
Speaker 2: Bill because I was never invited to a jam session.
Speaker 1: To invite you on paid bill unless you've made it
Speaker 1: known that you're more than a producer songwriting.
Speaker 2: Well, okay, sorry, no, not at all. In fact, those
Speaker 2: are Ludwig Quest Love drums behind me, just so we're
Speaker 2: all on the same page.
Speaker 1: Wow.
Speaker 2: The tom is the Tom's from the Breakbeats thing. This one.
Speaker 1: I was impressed. I was a little jealous. I was like,
Speaker 1: how come you were rocking Quest Loves.
Speaker 2: I like to pretend that this side of the room
Speaker 2: that I pretend to play all of these things. I
Speaker 2: also pretend to play all of these things. You'll know
Speaker 2: it that none of them are on. But it's okay,
Speaker 2: it's cool. They look awesome. I guess that body James
Speaker 2: only plays the saxophone to his left. All that other
Speaker 2: shit is all fake too. I feel like that's the
Speaker 2: vibe for sure. I'm kidding all right.
Speaker 1: Anyway. Anyway, you know, we've had many musicians on the show,
Speaker 1: Ladies and Gentlemen in the past couple of episodes of
Speaker 1: Quest of Supreme. Today's no exception. Our guest today is
Speaker 1: a multi Grammy nominated chart topping arrangers, songwriter, musician, saxophone
Speaker 1: player who's built an incredible career for the last forty
Speaker 1: plus years with Luminaries, starting off with Barns Day. Okay,
Speaker 1: I'll get to the Marris date part because I'm very
Speaker 1: familiar with the color of Success era of Mars, which
Speaker 1: I definitely want to ask you questions about the Isley's
Speaker 1: collaborations with al Ji Rod, George Duke, so many others.
Speaker 1: Right now, he is just released his new LP called
Speaker 1: slow Burn with Corey Henry, dubbed Corey Henry mister Egyptian Musk.
Speaker 1: I think he bathes in about four gallons of Egyptian
Speaker 1: musk a day.
Speaker 6: I didn't we spent together, Dude, If you shake Corey.
Speaker 1: I shook Corey's hand once and had to like shower
Speaker 1: four times when I got home.
Speaker 2: And that was like you and the good old days
Speaker 2: with Shade Butter. You used to smell like a bakery
Speaker 2: all the time. That was the joke that went around.
Speaker 2: Now you don't as much, but you used to smell
Speaker 2: like that too.
Speaker 1: Right, But I think Corey puts it on his hands,
Speaker 1: which I'm like, wait a minute, I'm like, why do
Speaker 1: I smell like Egyptian musk. Like literally, I'm like being
Speaker 1: Corey's oils on like other people us.
Speaker 3: He's going through that stage, you know, I see.
Speaker 1: Well, not to mention Marcus Miller. October, London's on slow
Speaker 1: Burn just got released, and uh, you know it's rather
Speaker 1: fitting that, uh, we have a conversation with one and
Speaker 1: only Bonie James on Quest Love Supreme. Welcome to be here.
Speaker 1: So this is the first time we're seeing you without
Speaker 1: your signature? Is we say a ballero?
Speaker 6: No, it's a fedora?
Speaker 1: Really okay, I thought it was balleerro. This means that
Speaker 1: you allowed joing your life if you're still this young environment.
Speaker 6: So I feel younger every day. I'm noticing more since
Speaker 6: I turned sixty a few years ago, that I'm getting
Speaker 6: younger every day. That's my feeling.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think as these generation passes, like you remember
Speaker 1: what sixty looked like when we were kids, I think
Speaker 1: it's the amount of stress that you allowed it in
Speaker 1: your life that determines like how you're going to look.
Speaker 6: So, but my career path is very very helpful to
Speaker 6: my general demeanor and sense of well being, very fortunate.
Speaker 1: So I take it you're in an environment that is
Speaker 1: your home studio.
Speaker 6: This is my home studio, the backyard.
Speaker 1: Where do you reside in the world.
Speaker 6: I live in West Hollywood in Los Angeles, okay, and
Speaker 6: this is when I'm not on the road. This is
Speaker 6: where I spend most of my time here in the
Speaker 6: backyard studio.
Speaker 1: Nice. Okay, that's what's up. How long have you had
Speaker 1: this setup?
Speaker 6: I've been living here for like twenty seven years, okay.
Speaker 6: The previous owner had been a stockbroker and had an
Speaker 6: office out here, and then when I moved in, I
Speaker 6: turned it into my studio. So this is where I've
Speaker 6: been working ever since. Then.
Speaker 1: I see, I got it, I got it. Where are
Speaker 1: you originally from?
Speaker 6: I well, I was born in Lowell, Massachusetts, which is
Speaker 6: a little town outside of Boston. And I grew up
Speaker 6: mostly in New Rochelle, New York, which is a little
Speaker 6: town outside of Manhattan.
Speaker 1: New Rochelle. Okay, yeah, and I know that from brand
Speaker 1: Nubian rhymes.
Speaker 6: Halfway through high school, my whole family moved to Los
Speaker 6: Angeles to my dad's job, moved us and I've been
Speaker 6: here ever since.
Speaker 1: Oh okay, So I always start with this question. Could
Speaker 1: you tell me what your first musical memory.
Speaker 6: Was my first musical memory. You know, there was a
Speaker 6: lot of music in my house. My father was an
Speaker 6: attorney that when I was young five sixty seven worked
Speaker 6: for Columbia Records, so there were a lot of records around,
Speaker 6: and I loved music right away, and I love to dance.
Speaker 6: I remember he had a lot of film soundtracks and
Speaker 6: I remember what is popping into my head is the
Speaker 6: soundtrack for Zorba of the Greek. Really yeah, that music
Speaker 6: just really excited me and I used to dance around
Speaker 6: the living room to disorber the Greek. And I think
Speaker 6: that's one of my very first musical memories.
Speaker 1: Strangely enough, what era did your dad work at Columbia?
Speaker 6: Well, this has got to be, you know, mid late sixties.
Speaker 6: You know there was also Dave Brubak Records were there,
Speaker 6: and golly, you know Bill Evans Records. And I mean
Speaker 6: the very first record I remember buying with my own
Speaker 6: money was Chick Courrey is No Mystery. So this is
Speaker 6: what early mid seventies, yeah somewhere yeah, well, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 6: it was. It was early Return to Forever.
Speaker 1: Okay. So that's a curious thing for me because normally,
Speaker 1: if something outside of the pop frame speaks to someone
Speaker 1: under the age of fifteen, then they kind of think
Speaker 1: different to me, like, what was it about that period,
Speaker 1: because I know that, you know, you were like ten
Speaker 1: years old when when jazz was changing, like with Bitches
Speaker 1: Brew and the Headhunters and kind of jazz was figuring out,
Speaker 1: like what it's new metamorphosis was. How many siblings do
Speaker 1: you have?
Speaker 6: I had, Well, I I only have one brother left.
Speaker 6: I had two brothers when I was growing up. My
Speaker 6: older brother passed away about twenty some odd years ago.
Speaker 1: Are you the youngest.
Speaker 6: I was the middle child. Yeah, my younger brother is
Speaker 6: five years younger. My older brother was like eleven months older.
Speaker 6: You know, I mean to go back to your question.
Speaker 6: I mean I also loved pop music and R and
Speaker 6: B music too. I love to listen to the radio,
Speaker 6: and I remember being really excited by you know, Stevie
Speaker 6: Wonder and things like that, and Bitches Brew was not
Speaker 6: my thing, even when everyone was digging it. You know.
Speaker 6: I liked a little bit more accessible music. And I
Speaker 6: think I still that's kind of you know, the tradition
Speaker 6: that I'm in, and I think that that was probably
Speaker 6: a seed that was planted when I was young. The
Speaker 6: fusion thing, you know. I don't know. I think I
Speaker 6: was just I loved instrumental music quite a bit. I
Speaker 6: remember Barry White and Love Unlimited Orchestra. I was so
Speaker 6: excited when there was a pop hit of instrumental music
Speaker 6: on the radio, and that was always my thing.
Speaker 1: It's weird, assuming, Matt, you played stacks all your life,
Speaker 1: do you play any other instruments as well?
Speaker 6: I started on clarinet. You know, back in the days
Speaker 6: when I was a kid in New Rochelle, everybody basically
Speaker 6: in third grade would sign up to play an instrument.
Speaker 6: There was a band class and I wanted to get
Speaker 6: a trumpet. We went to the music store. All they
Speaker 6: had were clarinet, so I took a clarinet home. We
Speaker 6: rented one, and then two years later there were so
Speaker 6: many clarinets in this band. The teacher had gotten a
Speaker 6: saxophone and he leaned on me to switch to the saxophone.
Speaker 6: And I really resisted it because it was so much
Speaker 6: heavier case I was going to have to carry too
Speaker 6: and from the school. But he said, if you play
Speaker 6: the saxophone, you can be in the stage band when
Speaker 6: you get to junior high and the stage band had
Speaker 6: just come to visit and they had very snazzy satin
Speaker 6: jackets and ascot ties and a drummer and a bass player.
Speaker 6: And so that was really what convinced me was the
Speaker 6: chance to get stage when I got to junior high
Speaker 6: school and that's when I picked up the saxophone at ten.
Speaker 1: I fig you're the perfect age for me to ask
Speaker 1: this question because you can answer it sort of in
Speaker 1: retrospect because oftentimes, especially with a lot of my hip
Speaker 1: hop constituents and my first generation hip hop constituents, you know,
Speaker 1: like grand Master Flash or Graham Wizard Theatore. Now, those
Speaker 1: particular guys would tell me that, you know, there was
Speaker 1: a period when they were in elementary school or middle
Speaker 1: school in which some sort of art class was required
Speaker 1: and sometimes you had to do multiple things. You had
Speaker 1: to take arts and crafts, but you also had to
Speaker 1: take music. You had to like the word had is
Speaker 1: key here. It wasn't like an elective or an option.
Speaker 1: And then they said that there was a shift or
Speaker 1: a tied kind of at the end of the pre
Speaker 1: Watergate Nixon administration in which a lot of these programs
Speaker 1: got cut. They were all telling me, like, you know,
Speaker 1: I really wanted to play bass, but we didn't have
Speaker 1: any bass classes. So I became a DJ. And that's
Speaker 1: kind of how a lot of the first generation hip
Speaker 1: hop class was. But a lot of the generation of
Speaker 1: musicians now, is that how they came to music?
Speaker 6: Well, by now, I mean from Michael Hort, I think
Speaker 6: a lot of them did.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean specifically, you're like, you know, the sixties
Speaker 1: seventies generation.
Speaker 6: Yeah, it was a trip. And it seems like such
Speaker 6: an ancient history, doesn't it, that that was the deal,
Speaker 6: you know, And this was a public school, middle class,
Speaker 6: lower middle class, mixed.
Speaker 1: I'm only asking simply because I think kind of in
Speaker 1: my rose colored bubble view of it, I thought like,
Speaker 1: if you come out the womb with some sort of
Speaker 1: musical talent and your parents are like, oh, this is
Speaker 1: what you want to do, and then you pursue it.
Speaker 1: But a lot of my idols of the kind of
Speaker 1: Midwest migration, you know, families who moved from down south
Speaker 1: to Detroit or Ohio, Indiana, whatever, you know, they were like, no,
Speaker 1: like I did have natural talent. I just saw bass
Speaker 1: one day. I mean, even Christian McBride told me like,
Speaker 1: even though his dad was a bass player like he
Speaker 1: came to risk, came to base late, like when he
Speaker 1: was twelve or thirteen. I thought he came out the
Speaker 1: womb like with a bass in hand. So not knowing
Speaker 1: how to play a clarinet, How did it take you
Speaker 1: to literally figure out the fingering and all those things?
Speaker 6: Boy, that's you know. I don't remember exactly, but my
Speaker 6: recollection is says that I was pretty good at it
Speaker 6: compared to the other kids in the class, pretty quick,
Speaker 6: and that was one of the reasons that he thought
Speaker 6: it would be easier for me to switch to the
Speaker 6: saxophone two years later. I mean, clarinet never really warmed
Speaker 6: up too, but as soon as I picked up the saxophone,
Speaker 6: it really did become my favorite thing to do, and
Speaker 6: all my hobbies fell away. But prior to that, I
Speaker 6: did not come up. I mean, my my family has
Speaker 6: no musical talent whatsoever other than me. My parents can't
Speaker 6: even carry a tune. You know, if they sing Happy Birthday,
Speaker 6: you can't even tell what song it is.
Speaker 2: James and I are very similar. I just want to say,
Speaker 2: the clarinet to the saxophone. The parents, my parents are doctors.
Speaker 2: I'm loving all this. I feel like I'm watching a show.
Speaker 1: Yes, no, no, you're not the same. Because Bonie James
Speaker 1: let me know that he played the saxophone on Paatee Bill.
Speaker 2: Oh, here you go, here you go. Here's that moment.
Speaker 2: It's happening. It just happened.
Speaker 6: When So last time you picked up the saxophone, do
Speaker 6: you do you still play it?
Speaker 2: It's right over there the case. No, I don't, as
Speaker 2: much as I like to.
Speaker 1: Walk over there, let me challenge.
Speaker 2: Challenge, no way, but I appreciate it. But no, not
Speaker 2: in front of body James. That feels like sacrilegious and weird.
Speaker 2: Let's move on.
Speaker 1: You co created Hamilton. You can do anything.
Speaker 2: I did not. We produced the album together. I did
Speaker 2: not make Hamilton. We made an album together a long
Speaker 2: time ago.
Speaker 1: So was switching to saxophone? Is that transferable? In other words, like,
Speaker 1: if given a clarinet or saxophone, is it the same fingering?
Speaker 1: Is it the same? Similar?
Speaker 2: Similar point?
Speaker 6: Yeah, it's similar to a point. Part of the clarinet
Speaker 6: is the same. And then when you switch to you
Speaker 6: go over the octave and it changes. It's a little
Speaker 6: bit more confusing. The clarinet. Plus the clarinet is an
Speaker 6: open holding strut in the saxophone is a close holding
Speaker 6: string with keys. The ambisher completely different. To get a
Speaker 6: good sound out of the saxophone, you have to hold
Speaker 6: your your interior mouth and you know, teeth and lips
Speaker 6: and everything is different. But many sax players also play
Speaker 6: the clarinet and flute because they're all similar fingerings.
Speaker 1: Have you ever challenged yourself for other brass instruments like trumpet, trombone. No.
Speaker 6: And I a clarinet for many, many years, and I
Speaker 6: have a flute in the closet that every now and
Speaker 6: then if I need a flute on one of my records,
Speaker 6: I will shed for a day or two enough to
Speaker 6: get a wispy sound. But yeah, I mainly have been
Speaker 6: concentrating on the saxophone. And I did play keyboards for
Speaker 6: a long time too. That was, you know, my entree
Speaker 6: into professional show business was playing keyboards.
Speaker 3: But just to be clear, you never played the recorder.
Speaker 6: I did play the recorder as well. Really, quarter is
Speaker 6: a very challenging, It's true, really hard is.
Speaker 3: When they give all the kids first.
Speaker 6: So yeah, but if you've ever heard someone really play
Speaker 6: the recorder, it's quite impressive because it's who.
Speaker 2: Are your early influences in the early days, like clarinet
Speaker 2: transitioning to saxophone, like clearly you picked it up, and
Speaker 2: then with somebody like you should listen to this was
Speaker 2: there like a touchstone artist.
Speaker 6: I left on when you're a kid and you're picking
Speaker 6: up the saxophone. And I took, you know, private lessons
Speaker 6: in addition to the school into Rochelle. The private teacher
Speaker 6: that taught me, he was a guy named Stanley Hammer,
Speaker 6: and I came to find out that Bob Mintzer, famous
Speaker 6: sax player from the Yellow Jackets, also studied with him,
Speaker 6: although he was a few years older. And what I
Speaker 6: remember about him was he had a couple of dogs
Speaker 6: that were yapping incessantly during the lessons. You know, when
Speaker 6: you first start on the saxophone, people will push you.
Speaker 6: I started on alto, and people will push you to
Speaker 6: listen to Charlie Parker and you know that kind of
Speaker 6: beatbop music. He was not really didn't warm me up
Speaker 6: because I was, like I said, I loved radio. I
Speaker 6: loved the R and B. The fusion thing came a
Speaker 6: little later, but when I heard Grover Washington Junior in
Speaker 6: seventy five, you know, it's the first cat I heard
Speaker 6: that was mixing up sort of a go go beat
Speaker 6: with a lovely saxophone tone and improvisational spirit, but with
Speaker 6: a song that you could hear. And that was what really,
Speaker 6: you know, was like wow, man, this is dope. And
Speaker 6: that was kind of the path that it started. That's
Speaker 6: what started me down this path. And that's a tradition
Speaker 6: I think I'm sort of carrying on today.
Speaker 1: So with the saxophone, how hard is it to find
Speaker 1: your Like? I know Coltrane when I first hear it.
Speaker 1: I know Herb Albert when I first hear him. I
Speaker 1: always wondered how a brass player finds a tone Like.
Speaker 6: I think that's kind of harder for me to be
Speaker 6: objective about, but I mean I when I think about
Speaker 6: it on my own term. So I think it was
Speaker 6: when I really started to write songs for me as
Speaker 6: an artist, you know, when I really started to think when,
Speaker 6: you know, because so much of my life prior to
Speaker 6: when I started making records was working as a sideman,
Speaker 6: and you have to be a chameleon, and and you
Speaker 6: would often you know, I played keyboards a lot, but
Speaker 6: when I got to play the saxophone, I have to
Speaker 6: learn someone else's solo. So I would, you know, pretend
Speaker 6: to be Ernie Watts, or pretend to be David Sandborn
Speaker 6: or you know, an imitative kind.
Speaker 1: Of thing Ernie what Wow. Okay, But when I.
Speaker 6: Really got frustrated with that lifestyle and I thought, man,
Speaker 6: I really should just try and do my own thing.
Speaker 6: I wasn't liking any of the songs I was writing
Speaker 6: for other people. I was trying to, you know, get
Speaker 6: a publishing deal, all the things young musicians do, and
Speaker 6: I thought, let me just try and make records, make
Speaker 6: music for me. That was when I think I started
Speaker 6: to feel what I was playing more and to really
Speaker 6: just become more immeshed in the music. And that was
Speaker 6: when the horn became more my voice and distinguishable. And
Speaker 6: people tell me now that they can always tell it's
Speaker 6: me and I'm.
Speaker 3: Very slow Burn.
Speaker 5: You can tell from some of the other records, like
Speaker 5: the actual slow Burn record Thank You.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 6: And I think hopefully my sound has continued to evolve.
Speaker 6: I mean, I'm always working on trying to become more
Speaker 6: and more the essence of whatever it is that I'm doing,
Speaker 6: and so much of that is the more adept you
Speaker 6: get at the horn, the fewer barriers that are for
Speaker 6: expressing yourself. And if you're really playing from the heart,
Speaker 6: I think you're going to have an identific thought and
Speaker 6: identifiable voice, whether you're singing were playing an instrument. So
Speaker 6: that's my theory.
Speaker 1: Wow, okay, So what was your first creative project before
Speaker 1: you're taking this seriously or like once once you get
Speaker 1: your chops in order as a kid into your teens
Speaker 1: was what was the first creative project that you put together?
Speaker 6: I was in a band called Line One. This was
Speaker 6: probably late high school through most of college. Another member
Speaker 6: that band is a guitar player producer named John Shanks
Speaker 6: you might be familiar with.
Speaker 1: I heard the name.
Speaker 6: Yes, he does a lot of rock and roll records.
Speaker 6: He won Producer of the Year a few years back.
Speaker 6: He was the guitar player in that band. We're not
Speaker 6: really in touch now, but you know. And that was
Speaker 6: like it was started out as a sort of a
Speaker 6: fusion R and B instrumental band, and then we tried
Speaker 6: to sort of turn into Level forty two or something
Speaker 6: like that, and we werehearseding Kenny Gradney's garage. Kenny Gradney,
Speaker 6: the bass player from Little Feet, was like our mentor
Speaker 6: and that was like my life for the whole main
Speaker 6: part of my late teens, early twenties, and until I
Speaker 6: actually got my gig with Morris Day, and that was
Speaker 6: you know, we were going to try and be stars,
Speaker 6: but it never happened for us.
Speaker 1: What was your first professional gig?
Speaker 6: Well, you know, I had decided when I graduated from
Speaker 6: high school that I was not going to pursue a
Speaker 6: career music. I thought it was not possible.
Speaker 3: Yeah, here's another job. Okay, another job.
Speaker 1: Okay, watch it ass. What did you want to be
Speaker 1: when you were a kid.
Speaker 6: I was not sure, but I mean, my father was
Speaker 6: an attorney, so I thought, well, maybe I'll eventually go
Speaker 6: to law school. I studied history in college. I went
Speaker 6: away to UC Berkeley. I didn't practice my horn at
Speaker 6: all for almost an entire year, and I was miserable
Speaker 6: and came back to LA for summer vacation and hooked
Speaker 6: back up with this band. And they were playing some
Speaker 6: real gigs as opposed to dances or parties and things
Speaker 6: that we had done before. And they had a gig
Speaker 6: at the Improv which used to have music on Melrose
Speaker 6: used to have muscasionally, and I got up on stage
Speaker 6: with them and I had this epiphan This was like
Speaker 6: the summer between my freshman and sophomore year at college
Speaker 6: where I thought, you know what, this is what I
Speaker 6: really love to do, and I'm going to move back
Speaker 6: to LA and stick with this band. And I mean
Speaker 6: I transferred to UCLA and I did graduate from college
Speaker 6: with a degree in history, but from on I was
Speaker 6: very much a half assed student and dedicated to music.
Speaker 6: So it was about nineteen that I kind of made
Speaker 6: that decision. You know. Also my wife, who I'm still
Speaker 6: married to now, you know, when we she was very
Speaker 6: helpful in helping me decide, you know, I should I
Speaker 6: try and do this, Should I go to college? Should
Speaker 6: I be a lawyer? And she's like, you should really
Speaker 6: try and do this.
Speaker 5: So while y'all met that that far back when she
Speaker 5: was just a struggling actress in your.
Speaker 6: Yeah, forty four years now married for thirty nine.
Speaker 2: Wow, it might be your greatest success. Sever that's amazing.
Speaker 6: It's one of the great blessings of my life.
Speaker 5: Got to ask a question, what were the other job?
Speaker 5: Did you ever work any other jobs besides music?
Speaker 6: I was a a you know, culinary transportation engineer for.
Speaker 3: Me way way Way, Wait, a culinary transportation.
Speaker 6: Pizza delivered.
Speaker 1: I was like wait in my head, I was like, okay,
Speaker 1: I know it.
Speaker 3: Was something closed Bill.
Speaker 6: I worked probably for four or five years delivering pizzas
Speaker 6: to pay the bills while I was playing in these
Speaker 6: various bands and trying to figure out how you make
Speaker 6: a living as a musician. And it was right from
Speaker 6: that pizza gig that I got into Morris's band in
Speaker 6: nineteen eighty five, and.
Speaker 3: The pizza gig.
Speaker 6: I had to postpone my wedding because I got the
Speaker 6: gig with Morris and the schedule for that first tour
Speaker 6: interrupted our wedding plan.
Speaker 1: So she's a patient woman. I take it.
Speaker 6: She's a lovely woman.
Speaker 1: Was your family encouraging of this decision? And this is
Speaker 1: coming from a person who, at least my dad was
Speaker 1: not too thrilled at once. He eventually found out about
Speaker 1: the roots. But for you, was your family encouraging of
Speaker 1: you pursuing this passion or was it like safety first
Speaker 1: and get the money become a lawyer?
Speaker 6: They were from that, You know, we want you to
Speaker 6: be happy school of parenting, which I'm very great.
Speaker 7: That's rare, very so I don't even get casual about
Speaker 7: that hippie. I'm sure that they were worried. But you know,
Speaker 7: after I'm Lily and I moved in together soon after,
Speaker 7: and I was living independently and was not you know,
Speaker 7: on their dole, and and I think that they were supportive,
Speaker 7: is my recollection.
Speaker 6: And of course once I started making a living as
Speaker 6: a sidemen and you know, some of those early gigs
Speaker 6: they paid pretty well for back in the day, and
Speaker 6: and I think that they were relieved. But you know, now,
Speaker 6: my father passed away a few years ago, but my mom,
Speaker 6: you know, is still very proud of everything, you know,
Speaker 6: and it's kind of kind of weird for them that
Speaker 6: this has turned out for me, because, as I said,
Speaker 6: there's no music in our family at all, and yet
Speaker 6: here I'm still doing this all these years later.
Speaker 3: One of the rare people. You actually buy a CD
Speaker 3: in Starbucks.
Speaker 2: CDs?
Speaker 1: What are those?
Speaker 6: Right?
Speaker 1: So did you play Keyboards and Saxon Morris's band?
Speaker 6: Yeah, well I got the gig on Keyboards.
Speaker 1: Knows you with the okay? Because I was watching the
Speaker 1: Soul Train episode of the character in Oak Tree, and
Speaker 1: I was.
Speaker 6: Keyboards is me.
Speaker 1: No?
Speaker 6: No? No, I have a trench coat on. Yes, I know, well,
Speaker 6: like I had a key I think I was just
Speaker 6: playing on a stand. But yeah, no, I've done. I
Speaker 6: did a lot of those TV shows with Morris back
Speaker 6: from that that era.
Speaker 1: That's your first gig.
Speaker 6: That was my first real professional touring gig.
Speaker 1: Lead up to the story of how you got that gig?
Speaker 6: Okay, So I was as I was playing in that
Speaker 6: band line one and we weren't really getting anywhere, and
Speaker 6: I was the litting pizzas and I was like, man,
Speaker 6: this is getting kind of old, you know. And then
Speaker 6: right around that same time, Morris was post Purple Rain.
Speaker 6: Morris was on the cover of Newsweek magazine. You know,
Speaker 6: he's a star. He broke up with Prince and moved
Speaker 6: to La to put a solo band together, and they
Speaker 6: had a cattle Call audition, and somehow I caught wind
Speaker 6: of it that they were looking for a keyboard player.
Speaker 6: And I had a little Juno sixty keyboard that I
Speaker 6: was trying to write songs on, and I taught myself
Speaker 6: how to play Jungle Love and the Bird to the
Speaker 6: best of my ability, because I'm not a great keyboard
Speaker 6: player even to this day. I mean, I can, you know,
Speaker 6: make things happen.
Speaker 1: The song you know what to do.
Speaker 6: I learned the song I can do it, you know,
Speaker 6: and I had a groove, you know, I had I
Speaker 6: think I had the groove, and I had a look
Speaker 6: and I was happy when I was playing music. I
Speaker 6: was bopping around. They hired me that same day.
Speaker 1: Really okay, so that started that starting.
Speaker 6: Kurt Biscarra was the drummer Kirkie Bee and Roman Johnson
Speaker 6: was keyboard player. Gail Johnson was keyboard player. Ricky free
Speaker 6: Smith who's still doing it now, is still in the
Speaker 6: time now was there?
Speaker 1: Then he's the Asian guy playing drums.
Speaker 6: Filipino guy, Yeah, Filipino.
Speaker 1: Who is he? Because next to Zorro I would always
Speaker 1: see yeah, you know you.
Speaker 6: Were all those butt fests with zoro a right right right?
Speaker 6: That was who he was playing with.
Speaker 1: Yeah, New Dish Bobby Brown. So next to Zorrow, I
Speaker 1: would see Kirkby everywhere.
Speaker 6: Kirky be his first gig too. We met that day
Speaker 6: and and our lives were transformed, honestly, you know, because wow,
Speaker 6: we're like, anyway.
Speaker 1: Who is crazy?
Speaker 6: Kurt Scare is his name. He's still a very popular
Speaker 6: successful session drummer. You know, he's played with I see it.
Speaker 1: I still see him working.
Speaker 6: Pip Jagger and but he did Tom Petty for a while.
Speaker 6: You know a lot of big gigs, great rum, this
Speaker 6: is you.
Speaker 3: With the mustache. I'm looking at the video Resultia.
Speaker 6: That wasn't me with a key tart. I think there's
Speaker 6: there's there's like an American bandstand you can see me
Speaker 6: on with Morris. But uh, I don't think that's me
Speaker 6: that you're seeing it.
Speaker 3: Stash required right, Bonie, Oh no.
Speaker 6: I no, hat it was just a younger version of me.
Speaker 1: So okay, explain to me during that period, how do
Speaker 1: you even get in the loop now? It's hella different,
Speaker 1: Like it.
Speaker 6: Was a constant struggle, you know. I mean it was
Speaker 6: how you know, tried to figure it out, you know
Speaker 6: networking man, I mean, yeah, it was different.
Speaker 1: I remember like when I was a teenager. It's like
Speaker 1: the end. So I came up right when the Internet
Speaker 1: was was getting established. But you know, oftentimes people will
Speaker 1: read like backstage like or or one of those trade
Speaker 1: local papers that would have listings of like audition for
Speaker 1: da da DA, audition for data DA, I'll say today,
Speaker 1: And musicians come to me all the time, like yo,
Speaker 1: I played Dada da da da da da da da.
Speaker 1: And if they're serious about it, I will tell them
Speaker 1: that you probably want to figure out a way to
Speaker 1: get within at least three degrees of Adam Blackstone. Yes,
Speaker 1: Adam Blackstone basically he runs the mafia like he's the mafia.
Speaker 3: Like he's him and his wife.
Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, if you can figure out And sometimes, and
Speaker 1: I tell them all the time, like you might not
Speaker 1: have access to Adam, but you might have access to
Speaker 1: a cat that plays with a cat that knows Adams.
Speaker 1: So it's almost like you almost got an audition for
Speaker 1: like three cats before you even get to kiss the ring.
Speaker 1: What was the system in eighty five in terms of
Speaker 1: like I hear a gig coming up, and who did
Speaker 1: you have to know that's the ring the kiss to
Speaker 1: get inside the game?
Speaker 5: You know.
Speaker 6: Look, I don't really remember too specifically how I heard
Speaker 6: about the Morris thing, but I do remember that after
Speaker 6: I was doing Morris for a few years, and that
Speaker 6: was like my gig, you know, he was busy and
Speaker 6: and I convinced them I could play saxophone too, so
Speaker 6: he gave me a spot in the show. He would
Speaker 6: run off and do a costume change during Jiggilow's Get
Speaker 6: Lonely two, and I would lead the band for a
Speaker 6: good five sometimes ten minutes in arenas okay, with saxophone solo.
Speaker 6: So I got sort of somehow known as a cat
Speaker 6: that could play keyboards and saxophone, and that was a
Speaker 6: valuable thing in the eighties, you know. So yeah, yeah,
Speaker 6: word of mouth. And then I think I caught the
Speaker 6: attention of Tony Maiden from Rufus. From Rufus, I was
Speaker 6: not an Adam Blackstone, but putting some bands together for people.
Speaker 6: So I went and did Randy Crawford with him, and
Speaker 6: then he got me the Isisley Brothers. A couple of
Speaker 6: years after that, I got in with a guy named
Speaker 6: Cornelius Mims, who's a bass player. He put me in
Speaker 6: with Ray Parker Junior and Cherrelle and you know, and
Speaker 6: I just was doing enough gigs that somehow people knew
Speaker 6: who I was and my phone would ring.
Speaker 3: Randy Crawford is not a name that said a lot.
Speaker 5: Can you just tell us something, a story or what
Speaker 5: was it like to work with her in that way?
Speaker 6: Well, I mean she has some wonderful music, you know. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 6: everytime she opened her mouth, she sounds just like she
Speaker 6: sounds on the record, and it's a very unique voice.
Speaker 6: It was an interesting gig, you know. She would sing
Speaker 6: very very softly, and we all had to play very
Speaker 6: very softly. And it was an incredible band. The bass
Speaker 6: player named Sake Coup Bunch. It was Oh my gosh,
Speaker 6: Thundercat's father, Ron Brunner's senior, his father Prubber, Randy Crawford's band,
Speaker 6: Tony Maiden playing guitar, Wayne Ziggy Lindsay playing keyboards, who
Speaker 6: is now actually quite in there with another one of
Speaker 6: those Adam Black Stunt type guys, Ricky Minor, but he's
Speaker 6: all in all of his bands. He's actually gave me
Speaker 6: the Buddy James name in Randy Crawford's band. That's I
Speaker 6: guess to say.
Speaker 1: How did you get that name?
Speaker 6: It was Wayne Lindsay Randy Crawford's band. She was very
Speaker 6: popular in Scandinavia at the time, not a big name
Speaker 6: in the States, but a star in like Norway and
Speaker 6: Denmark and Sweden. So we go over there for months
Speaker 6: at a time. It's like eighty six, I'm gonna say,
Speaker 6: and everything costs a fortune. And I said to Wayne
Speaker 6: Lindsay Mann, I just won't eat for the next couple
Speaker 6: of days. Walking down the street one day, he said, shit,
Speaker 6: you'll get all skinny. I probably weighed fifty pounds less
Speaker 6: than I do now anyway, and he said, you'll get
Speaker 6: all skinny. Off to start calling you Bony James or something,
Speaker 6: and I said, please don't call me Boni James.
Speaker 1: Mess with me.
Speaker 6: He kept calling me that and introducing me to people
Speaker 6: that way, and you know, this network of people all
Speaker 6: started to think that this guy was Bonie James, and
Speaker 6: it just caught on.
Speaker 1: That is great.
Speaker 5: Before that, you were just going by your government Jim Oppenheim.
Speaker 1: Well, Bonie James got a better ring to it.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 6: Well he after making records, he did, in fact call
Speaker 6: me and say you owe me because I do.
Speaker 1: Yeah, maybe now is the time to go on record
Speaker 1: to how we first connected. Did I tell you the story?
Speaker 4: I knew this story was coming. I've been waiting all
Speaker 4: all day forward.
Speaker 2: Shut up, let's let's go.
Speaker 1: Let's go. Do you know the story, Bony, of how
Speaker 1: we truly hooked up?
Speaker 6: I thought we called you to come and play on
Speaker 6: the ride CD.
Speaker 1: Yeah you did. So. If there's one thing you know
Speaker 1: about me is the who's doing first bit is kind
Speaker 1: of the ever repetitive cycled bit that happens in my life.
Speaker 1: I'll say a good once a month, right, so check it.
Speaker 1: We're at the tail end of Voodoo, right, d'angelo's voodoo
Speaker 1: four year process start it. Yeah, well there's a god
Speaker 1: empty Angelo right right right, And so you know, we're
Speaker 1: the tail end of the record. And now we're rehearsing
Speaker 1: the band that's going to tour this album for an
Speaker 1: entire year, and we're also kind of messing around at
Speaker 1: Electric Lady Studios, you know, because I'll say that the
Speaker 1: album came out January two thousand. We went close to
Speaker 1: the edge. I'll say, like it got mastered in sequenced
Speaker 1: maybe the first week of December. So Russ is like,
Speaker 1: still around and whatnot, and we're getting ready for these
Speaker 1: first hits small clubs to test out the show and whatnot.
Speaker 1: And it just so happens that we're going to do
Speaker 1: a good week in Los Angeles and Russ says, oh dog,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna be out there with Bonie. He said, by
Speaker 1: the way, they want to get you on the album. Now.
Speaker 1: Instantly I was like, yo, dog, you serious? Such a man,
Speaker 1: been a fan of theirs for exactly exactly. So I
Speaker 1: was like, man, been been a fan of theirs forever,
Speaker 1: d D. So I put my assistant with him. They
Speaker 1: you know, work it out. Okay, we'll see you in
Speaker 1: La Da Da Da da da. So I believe the
Speaker 1: studio that we recorded it was Westlake Audio, was it not?
Speaker 6: I can't remember it was it was Westlake.
Speaker 1: Audio only because I know that this was the spot
Speaker 1: that Michael Jackson's Off the Wall the rhythm tracks were recorded.
Speaker 6: I did work a lot at Westlake back in those days.
Speaker 1: Right, And so I'm instantly like mind blown, like, yo,
Speaker 1: I cannot believe I'm here at the same spot that
Speaker 1: Off the Wall was created. Now. The thing is because
Speaker 1: it's so far up in the mountains cell phones back then,
Speaker 1: pre pre pre iPhone folks like, it's hard to get
Speaker 1: a signal. And I drove there and didn't know where
Speaker 1: to go. Like so I was like, well, I'll just
Speaker 1: sit in the lounge and maybe someone will come out
Speaker 1: and get me, because I didn't want to just cold walk.
Speaker 1: I mean, now I have the confidence of like, not,
Speaker 1: oh hey, course, love, how you doing. No, no, no,
Speaker 1: they're in studio a like back then, I just you know,
Speaker 1: I didn't want to just step into anyone's room. And
Speaker 1: so about fifteen minutes, twenty minutes goes by, and I
Speaker 1: don't want you guys to think I'm late, but I
Speaker 1: don't know what to do. And so suddenly I look
Speaker 1: over across and I was like, wow, that guy looks
Speaker 1: like Marcus Miller. Now you know, this is two thousand.
Speaker 1: I haven't fully immersed myself into the music community, so
Speaker 1: I'm still like playing in the back and not say anything.
Speaker 1: But I was like, oh my god, I think that's
Speaker 1: Marcus Miller. Should I go and talk to him? And
Speaker 1: then the next thing I know, three other guys walk
Speaker 1: in and he's saying their names, and I instantly know
Speaker 1: the names of the guys from Sea Wind, and I
Speaker 1: don't know it's Jerry hay Or or whatever. So I
Speaker 1: was like, yo, it's like the off the Walk cats
Speaker 1: are here in the flesh. So I'm like, it's just
Speaker 1: sitting there like mind blowing that these session musicians are here.
Speaker 1: And then Marcus comes up to me, like what's up, Cat,
Speaker 1: And this is the first time I meet Marcus, and
Speaker 1: we're hey, man, how you doing Big Fanny work? And
Speaker 1: da Da Da Da, and we're talking about Luther for
Speaker 1: like ten minutes whatever, and so he's like, you ready
Speaker 1: to come along? And I was like, oh, you're on
Speaker 1: the session too, session dude. Wait. So I walk in,
Speaker 1: so literally, I walk in the session and I'm still like, okay,
Speaker 1: it's not disco music. And I pulled Russ to the side.
Speaker 1: I was like, wait, this is the bony m session,
Speaker 1: right ah, And Russ is like, who I said? And
Speaker 1: here's here comes the whole who's on first thing?
Speaker 6: Oh my gosh.
Speaker 1: He's like, who I said? You said Boney Boney am
Speaker 1: right the rasputin and you know he said boot no,
Speaker 1: Boney James. And then but again my entire life. Wow.
Speaker 1: Even how I got on Hamilton is almost the same
Speaker 1: way I accidentally got on Hamilton and only found out
Speaker 1: later how me being late to a meeting, me not
Speaker 1: knowing the context of when Lynn Manwell was asking me,
Speaker 1: so you'll do it with us? I thought I was
Speaker 1: agreeing to a whole nother project. And then my manager's like, yo,
Speaker 1: did you just tell Lin Manuel Miranda you work on
Speaker 1: a project called Hamilton. I'm like, yeah, the me and
Speaker 1: yesterday for Da Da Da Da They're like, no, you idiot,
Speaker 1: that was for it. I'm the mister magoo looking up
Speaker 1: kids of accidental projects.
Speaker 6: But you had no idea who I was.
Speaker 1: No, I knew who you were. But when he said Boneye,
Speaker 1: I just instantly thought, Bonie m.
Speaker 6: You didn't necessarily you walked into the session, that it
Speaker 6: was me and not I.
Speaker 1: Walked in the session and I pulled Rust to the side.
Speaker 1: It was like they're taking a jazz route, like what
Speaker 1: happened at the disco.
Speaker 6: Because I recall you seemed really quiet that day.
Speaker 1: Well, I'm I'm you know, I'm You're can't ask them,
Speaker 1: I'm aloof Some people say I'm stand office or loof whatever.
Speaker 1: But it took me ten minutes. Nevertheless, I was excited
Speaker 1: because dude, you bringing in Marcus Miller and see when
Speaker 1: and all these cats. But yeah, there's about nine stories
Speaker 1: like that. But yeah, Hamiltown.
Speaker 6: Absolutely fabus on that track that we cut that day.
Speaker 6: That was a song called Brandon Central, which actually is
Speaker 6: a dope. You should go back and listen to it
Speaker 6: and you will feel good about what you did.
Speaker 1: I'm very much familiar with my like I mean, I
Speaker 1: committed to it. I committed to it. But at the time,
Speaker 1: I was excited about the fact that doing Bonie m
Speaker 1: simply because I've been playing for four years straight with
Speaker 1: di'angelo rim Shot Funk, and I thought, oh, man doing
Speaker 1: like a German disco thing, like, I'll do the opposite
Speaker 1: of me. I'll play with a low snare. Yeah. I
Speaker 1: was like, oh, I'm gonna undo me. And then I
Speaker 1: was like, oh, okay, Well, I guess he wants me
Speaker 1: because he heard some of the voodoo stuff or whatever,
Speaker 1: and I'll play like questlove. But I thought I was
Speaker 1: going there to try my dip my toe in like
Speaker 1: proto German disco.
Speaker 5: So but you mentioned something a mirror that I want
Speaker 5: to I want to ask Bonnie about. But to the
Speaker 5: both of you guys, the person you both have in
Speaker 5: common in that way is Mark macus Miller, And I'm
Speaker 5: curious how this relationship started and how you guys continue
Speaker 5: to know to it, because y'all have been together ever since.
Speaker 6: Marcus had played on another song on a previous album
Speaker 6: that was through Paul Brown, who was my co producer
Speaker 6: at the time, and Paul had a connection to Luther
Speaker 6: because he had been the engineer that recorded Luther's vocals
Speaker 6: for many many years, and that was how he hooked
Speaker 6: up with Marcus, and I kept what record of it
Speaker 6: he played on. It might have been my second record, Backbone,
Speaker 6: or maybe it was the same record, but we got
Speaker 6: Marcus to play on a track and that was how
Speaker 6: we met, and then we called him again to do
Speaker 6: the thing with You, which we didn't actually end up
Speaker 6: using the bass on the track that he played on
Speaker 6: with You. I ended up replacing it. Oh, it was
Speaker 6: something else. But then Marcus and I fell out of
Speaker 6: touch for many many years, but we'd see each other
Speaker 6: maybe at festivals. And then we started co hosting these cruises,
Speaker 6: these these jazz cruises about fifteen twenty years ago, and
Speaker 6: so now we take these music themes Crusis twice a
Speaker 6: year where we're the host and there's twenty artists and
Speaker 6: like twenty five hundred fans, and so we've been doing
Speaker 6: that and that's why, you know, I was really excited
Speaker 6: to get Marcus on the new record. And he's playing
Speaker 6: on two tracks, acoustic based solo on one track on
Speaker 6: the new album because we were in the dress room
Speaker 6: on the ship he was messing around with acoustic bassa
Speaker 6: I didn't even know you played acoustic bass. He said, Man,
Speaker 6: that's all I play at home. And I'm like, huh,
Speaker 6: So he's playing acoustic bass solo on my new record,
Speaker 6: which I don't think a lot of people have heard
Speaker 6: him do, but.
Speaker 1: That I've never heard him do that.
Speaker 6: That the market thing. First song on the new record,
Speaker 6: there's a Marcus Miller acoustic bass solo.
Speaker 5: Is that you said you talked about the cruises. I
Speaker 5: recently went to the Monterey Jazz Festival, and I'm curious,
Speaker 5: you know, I didn't realize how much of a nice
Speaker 5: mix it is of legendary musicians a lot of times
Speaker 5: with these jazz festivals, and also the newer ones that
Speaker 5: are popping. Is that sometimes for you how you find
Speaker 5: some of these folks that you want to put on
Speaker 5: your projects.
Speaker 6: In a way, not so much. You know, most of
Speaker 6: the people that are on these cruises are people I know.
Speaker 6: You know, it's more established artists that they book on
Speaker 6: the cruise. But I just try and keep my ear
Speaker 6: out for collaborations quite often, you know.
Speaker 5: You have a good ear for new talent, and I
Speaker 5: always wonder, like even with October London, I was like,
Speaker 5: why am out of even though he's perfect for that record.
Speaker 6: But you know, I just try and keep a list going,
Speaker 6: honestly for collaborations. This is a whole other topic, but
Speaker 6: I kind of have a list in my phone ideas,
Speaker 6: you know, of various kinds of things, and if I
Speaker 6: hear somebody, I'll think maybe someday, you know. And then
Speaker 6: if I'm working on a track, and whenever I start
Speaker 6: writing a track, I'm always trying to write it for
Speaker 6: me as the artist. But every now and then I'll
Speaker 6: come up with something I think, you know that that's
Speaker 6: got a vibe. It could be a vocal, you know,
Speaker 6: maybe this could be a collab with someone who who
Speaker 6: who should be the person that I reach out to to,
Speaker 6: you know, co write or sing or whatever. And then
Speaker 6: you just kind of use your intuition. And I've had some.
Speaker 2: Luck doing Who's at the top of the list now.
Speaker 6: Oh my gosh, you know, I don't know, you know,
Speaker 6: it's all songs specific in your thone Bony Bony.
Speaker 1: Wait wait, we kind of skipped though, because I do
Speaker 1: want to know what is the journey that led to
Speaker 1: the Trust album? Like, what was the journey of you
Speaker 1: not being a sideman anymore and you being your own
Speaker 1: man and starting this project because you also have like
Speaker 1: your knack for playing with like air quote the Cats.
Speaker 1: You know, you have Freddie Washington on this record in
Speaker 1: Paul Jackson Jr. So the first question is tell me
Speaker 1: about the steps that led to the Trust album.
Speaker 6: All right, Well, so, you know, I was frustrated in
Speaker 6: my I've been doing the sideman thing for like seven years,
Speaker 6: and I was really frustrated with it. It's just not
Speaker 6: artistically satisfying it anyway, I felt like I might as
Speaker 6: well be better delivering pizzas you know quite often. I mean,
Speaker 6: my one of my very last gigs that was really
Speaker 6: a catalyst for me to work harder at trying to
Speaker 6: become a solo artist was.
Speaker 1: Martika Toy Soldiers Martica what.
Speaker 6: Is Solter's Martika?
Speaker 1: Ah Nice.
Speaker 6: So I was playing second keyboards and had one sax
Speaker 6: solo and I was triggering vocals on an EMU, I think,
Speaker 6: and it was just so boring, and I thought, you know,
Speaker 6: I just was not happy, and I thought I should.
Speaker 6: I should. And right around the same time, you know,
Speaker 6: because this contemporary jazz had had a foulo period for
Speaker 6: a while and it was starting to research and nobody
Speaker 6: was really doing and then all of a sudden I
Speaker 6: heard people doing it. I was in a record store.
Speaker 6: I heard a Kirk Whalem record called The Part and
Speaker 6: I thought, oh, but people are doing this again, you know.
Speaker 6: And it was a pretty dope record, and I thought, well,
Speaker 6: maybe I should really try and start to write songs
Speaker 6: for me again. And that's when I did that. And
Speaker 6: then I got into Bobby Caldwell's band soon after, and
Speaker 6: that was a great gig, a lot of saxophone, great songs.
Speaker 6: The mixer front of house mixer for this Japan tour
Speaker 6: we did was this cat Paul Brown Okay, a small
Speaker 6: production deal with a label called Spindletop Records. They were
Speaker 6: making a Sam Ryini record. He was about to make
Speaker 6: his third sam Ryinniy record. That's another sax player from
Speaker 6: that early nineties. And Sam said, I can't can't deal
Speaker 6: with working with these cats at Spindletop anymore. It's a
Speaker 6: little bit of jivy, so he backed out. Paul had
Speaker 6: the budget. So we had been on the road and
Speaker 6: he said, hey, out of the blue one day he
Speaker 6: called me up and said, have you ever wanted to
Speaker 6: make a record? And I'm like, man, I've been trying
Speaker 6: to make my record for years. So we got together.
Speaker 6: I played in my songs, and like two weeks later
Speaker 6: we were in the studio making trust. That's how that happened.
Speaker 6: And he had from working Spindletop and Sam Ryiney was
Speaker 6: in with Freddie Jet.
Speaker 1: All the contexts okay, Paul Japson Junior, and uh.
Speaker 6: You know who was playing drums on that record. Carlos
Speaker 6: Vega played drums on that first record.
Speaker 1: Carlos Vegas, Yeah, and Lenny Castro did percussion any pastro.
Speaker 6: And that was my first record, and then you know,
Speaker 6: like a few months later I was on the radio.
Speaker 6: It was a trip, okay.
Speaker 1: So I always wanted to ask this your second album
Speaker 1: once you get established, and I think the first time
Speaker 1: I've heard your name, you were nominated for I believe,
Speaker 1: like a Soul Train Award.
Speaker 6: Probably Sweet Thing. That was like my fourth record. I
Speaker 6: think that I got the Soul Trainward.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, Sweet Thing.
Speaker 1: It wasn't Backbone nominated, or.
Speaker 6: Maybe I don't remember. It could be. That's a long
Speaker 6: time ago.
Speaker 1: So in that environment, especially when you're in the heavy
Speaker 1: traffic of smooth jazz.
Speaker 3: Is that okay to say I wait.
Speaker 6: To call it that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and then I thought, oh, well, sook, that was
Speaker 3: one of my questions.
Speaker 6: So we weren't calling it that back then either. That
Speaker 6: was all pre smooth jazz radio.
Speaker 1: Kind of kind of that was having my question. Have
Speaker 1: My question is those that are involved in a genre
Speaker 1: never own that, like I've never owned soul doctor Dres,
Speaker 1: never own like gangster rap. And I'm certain you don't
Speaker 1: own smooth jazz. But once you once you start to stick,
Speaker 1: once you're just not the guy that's like, hey I
Speaker 1: got my CD, Oh yeah, I'll take it. I'll listen
Speaker 1: to your little CD like you're you're actually putting numbers
Speaker 1: on the board first of all? Are you? Because I
Speaker 1: know that there's no type of snobbery like jazz music snobbery.
Speaker 1: I mean, there's so many New York musicians looking down
Speaker 1: on you know these Joe Sample told me a gazillion
Speaker 1: stories of how like New York cats used to look
Speaker 1: down on them and whatever. Marcus had stories. M two
Speaker 1: made stories about leaving Miles and hey, we're gonna write
Speaker 1: some poppets and them catching fleck and all those things.
Speaker 1: But you know, is the jazz world like high school
Speaker 1: or is different clicks and whatnot. Like when you first
Speaker 1: entered the game, how did you find your click?
Speaker 2: Like the warriors, who are the bullies?
Speaker 1: Well, you know, I don't want to you give me names,
Speaker 1: but like there has to be bullies, there has to
Speaker 1: be the cool kids. There have to be the hey,
Speaker 1: let me, let me lead. You know, the person that
Speaker 1: you meet on your first day kindergarten shows you I
Speaker 1: might be.
Speaker 6: Unique in this respect a little bit because I'm kind
Speaker 6: of a loner. And I tried very hard not to
Speaker 6: get caught up in that. I mean, definitely there were
Speaker 6: frustrations at times when I was making what I thought
Speaker 6: were really great records, right and I'm getting, you know,
Speaker 6: the attention or or you know, the kind of attention
Speaker 6: I thought I deserved, and and you know, honestly, that
Speaker 6: always just made me try harder. And I'm still just honestly,
Speaker 6: my main focus is to try make better records and
Speaker 6: be a better sax player. I'm still a student. I
Speaker 6: don't think I'm one hundred percent formed, and you know,
Speaker 6: I'm just going to keep doing this till I croak
Speaker 6: and just try and get better and ignore people that
Speaker 6: don't love it, and know that there's some people that
Speaker 6: love it. I mean, I truly feel that music is
Speaker 6: so subjective, and I try not to be judgmental about
Speaker 6: people that are judging other musicians.
Speaker 5: To Mears point, has there been someone who said to
Speaker 5: you that you were unexpected, that walked up to you
Speaker 5: and really was like, yo, do I respect what you're doing?
Speaker 3: I love your work?
Speaker 5: And it was somebody who we would be surprised because
Speaker 5: they might have been considered one of those kind of
Speaker 5: SnO people.
Speaker 6: Yes, I don't have too much contact with a lot
Speaker 6: of jests, so I mean, many people have told me
Speaker 6: they love my music, and I'm always really grateful, you know.
Speaker 6: I mean, I remember Nate China wrote an article in
Speaker 6: the New York Times had come to see us play
Speaker 6: and said, you know, it's not my cup of tea,
Speaker 6: but they're doing it really well. And I thought, oh,
Speaker 6: that's a nice thing. Who said Nate Chinnin Yeah, So
Speaker 6: I thought that was nice. But generally, I try as
Speaker 6: hard as I can to ignore it for all of boys,
Speaker 6: because I'm just trying to make music. And I don't
Speaker 6: know that jazz argument thing. I mean, I know it's
Speaker 6: out there, but.
Speaker 1: Is it hard for jazz radio, Like, as a guy
Speaker 1: that's constantly traveling city to city, I'm pretty much familiar
Speaker 1: with like every I don't like, I'm not a you know,
Speaker 1: I'm kind of out of my zone when it comes
Speaker 1: to contemporary radio, like what I would listen to when
Speaker 1: I was twenty, you know, the hot ninety sevens of
Speaker 1: the world and whatnot. Like I'm kind of out of
Speaker 1: that range. So nine times out of ten, I meani
Speaker 1: to listen to like NPR or the local jazz station,
Speaker 1: and oftentimes I wonder, Okay, For instance, I live in
Speaker 1: the New York area right now, so I think, like
Speaker 1: our main station here is a WBGO in New York.
Speaker 1: They were kind of locked into an extremely traditional, you know,
Speaker 1: one era only borderline almost like went and approved left
Speaker 1: level and I say that with air quotes and sarcasm
Speaker 1: kind of both format. And then I think around they
Speaker 1: got new management in twenty eighteen, and not only did
Speaker 1: they let the air quote sj end quote format on,
Speaker 1: but then also like I'm starting to hear my music,
Speaker 1: like they're playing neo soul and they're playing breakbeats, and
Speaker 1: they're they're like really opening up.
Speaker 3: More urban ac kind of stuff. Huh.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so it didn't feel like it was a curse
Speaker 1: word or like, all right, let's let our step cousins in.
Speaker 1: It felt like a really all inclusive, almost close to
Speaker 1: what radio was like when I was a kid, where
Speaker 1: you're hearing a bunch of stuff too, but you know,
Speaker 1: because you started professionally in ninety one, Like, I know,
Speaker 1: it's one thing to just make a mark in the
Speaker 1: world in general, but it's like you kind of also
Speaker 1: have to make a mark withinside the bubble of your
Speaker 1: world of jazz. Also, like, how hard was it, at
Speaker 1: least with radio to embrace you in the first part
Speaker 1: of your career.
Speaker 6: Back in the day. Well, I recall that I made
Speaker 6: kind of a splash when I got on the ship.
Speaker 6: That's my recollection. I think that what I was doing
Speaker 6: and hopefully what I'm still doing has a distinct sound
Speaker 6: I'm as compared to say, like the Ripping Tins or
Speaker 6: some of the other guys that were really big back
Speaker 6: then and had a little bit more of a you know,
Speaker 6: an umph behind it, a much more of an R
Speaker 6: and B influence than some of the cats that were
Speaker 6: big at that time, and they dug it at and
Speaker 6: I remember that first record there was no distribution at all.
Speaker 6: I mean, you know, but I was like, I played
Speaker 6: you and people come up to me with like an
Speaker 6: angry attitude, like, man, I can't find your record. And
Speaker 6: I was then very fortunate to as that company was
Speaker 6: going under and trying to sell their catalog to another
Speaker 6: bad label, Warner Brothers was come in and buying just
Speaker 6: my contract off of the label. And this was a
Speaker 6: very tense period as Spintletop was going under and I
Speaker 6: had already made the Backbone CD and had it in
Speaker 6: the can, and Warner Brothers was able to sort of
Speaker 6: rescue it from what had been probably obscurity. And then
Speaker 6: the second record came out on Warner Brothers, and after
Speaker 6: that things kind of really opened up. I was still
Speaker 6: working as a sideband though until like ninety four to
Speaker 6: pay my bills.
Speaker 5: I was going to ask you, it seems like there's
Speaker 5: always been a relationship with urban ac radio that a
Speaker 5: lot of jazz musicians don't have the honor of having.
Speaker 3: Like Bony was never just jazz radio.
Speaker 5: You have great You have real like urban ac singles
Speaker 5: that I've always heard on the w h u R S,
Speaker 5: the Dass.
Speaker 1: Thels, Urban State.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Yeah, you're.
Speaker 6: Very grateful, unfortunate that that those stations play on music.
Speaker 6: In fact, on the new CD this October London, it's
Speaker 6: my second highest charting urban AC hit in my career,
Speaker 6: the biggest. It's like two thousand and one, which is
Speaker 6: a beautiful thing. It's top ten single. So you know
Speaker 6: for a guy playing saxophone and ah, it's it's an accomplish.
Speaker 3: It's amusing. I was like, he got it. He's in
Speaker 3: a music video like, this is.
Speaker 1: Right my song.
Speaker 6: I think it's a really good track. So I'm really
Speaker 6: proud of you m. The fact that people are playing
Speaker 6: it on the radio and streaming it, it's it's all good.
Speaker 6: You know.
Speaker 1: Well, I was going to ask what made you want
Speaker 1: to because for me that was unprecedented, especially my first
Speaker 1: three four years in the business, where you know, it
Speaker 1: took us like four albums to catch on. So thus
Speaker 1: the roots would often be on these shows, a lot
Speaker 1: of jazz related shows and whatnot, and again it was
Speaker 1: it was kind of the ru were off the red
Speaker 1: nose reindeer thing, like they're letting rappers in here, and
Speaker 1: you know, they don't know we're serious musicians. And so
Speaker 1: even the fact that you know when you started working
Speaker 1: with like Pino and Blao and myself and like their quote,
Speaker 1: the cats.
Speaker 6: Yeah, you were the cats. You're still the cats.
Speaker 1: You were early off the gate in that kind of
Speaker 1: co sign that that would take you know, other people
Speaker 1: around like two thousand and six, two thousand and seven
Speaker 1: to catch up on. But what is it about you?
Speaker 1: Are you always looking towards tomorrow? Are you always looking
Speaker 1: towards like who the new cat is now? Because you
Speaker 1: you are early in terms of the.
Speaker 6: Co sign of me hearing what you guys were doing
Speaker 6: and digging it and wondering, in my love for music
Speaker 6: and creating things, what would it sound like if I
Speaker 6: hooked up with these cats?
Speaker 1: Got it?
Speaker 6: That was really what it was. You know, It's like, damn,
Speaker 6: I love what they're doing. And you know my music
Speaker 6: has an R and B tinge to it, but these
Speaker 6: guys are playing like cutting edge, I thought at the time.
Speaker 6: And still you know, it's just really dope, interesting creative
Speaker 6: R and B music with its modern and retro at
Speaker 6: the same time. And what would it sound like if
Speaker 6: I put my sound on top of that? And just
Speaker 6: in the sense of having fun making shit, you know.
Speaker 1: Of of your many collaborations with singers give me and
Speaker 1: I know it's like, you know, who's your favorite child
Speaker 1: or what, what's your favorite breath took? What would you say,
Speaker 1: is singer wise a moment that pleases you in terms
Speaker 1: of who you collaborated with?
Speaker 6: Oh man, I mean that's a you know, like you
Speaker 6: said that they're all like children. No, I've got like
Speaker 6: thirty some odd collaborations now that I know.
Speaker 1: So is it algebraic question?
Speaker 3: Delila? Is it? Trina Broussard? Is it? I don't know,
Speaker 3: it's somewhere.
Speaker 6: I think every single one of those tracks has something
Speaker 6: cool about it, and maybe some succeeded more than others.
Speaker 3: Okay, yeah, man, that's totally honest.
Speaker 6: I mean, can you look back at your catalog and say,
Speaker 6: this is my favorite song or something?
Speaker 3: The question?
Speaker 1: The question, dude, I will say this to the grave,
Speaker 1: that ninety six to two thousand period of making Voodoo
Speaker 1: was such an eye opening moment for me in terms
Speaker 1: of like realizing my power and you know, all these
Speaker 1: mistakes I've made are now this is what you want
Speaker 1: me to do? You want me to play fucked up
Speaker 1: like my fond memories? Is that period? So I would
Speaker 1: say like collabing outside of my own group, collabing with D'Angelo,
Speaker 1: there's always a mind blowing two kids in the candy
Speaker 1: store thing that excites me. So, you know, but you're
Speaker 1: also allowed to not have favorites, you know what I mean.
Speaker 6: The experience of recording the Coasting Track with Layla was
Speaker 6: a great thing, I mean, because I didn't really know
Speaker 6: her that well prior to that, and then that was
Speaker 6: one of the very few times in recent history where
Speaker 6: she's actually came over here and we cut it together,
Speaker 6: just the two of us in this room over the
Speaker 6: course of you know, five or six hours of layering
Speaker 6: all the vocals, and I had never even heard what
Speaker 6: she had come up with until she came over that
Speaker 6: day and sang along with my demo on her phone,
Speaker 6: like I'm thinking that something like this, And that was
Speaker 6: just a really joyous experience getting to know her and
Speaker 6: collaborate with her, and the song turned out great, and
Speaker 6: then we did some touring together and so like, you know,
Speaker 6: we're friends, which is a nice thing. Such respect for her, that's.
Speaker 3: Why you did good? But said was so hard easy?
Speaker 3: I mean, it was easy, wasn't her?
Speaker 6: But this October song Honestly, when I hear it back,
Speaker 6: I think this might be the most integrated saxophone vocal
Speaker 6: collaboration in terms of it doesn't sound like it's two
Speaker 6: separate songs, or maybe you know, it's not easy to
Speaker 6: work the horn into an R and B contemporary R
Speaker 6: and B hit and have it sound like it belongs there.
Speaker 5: And to gain October his second single that doesn't still
Speaker 5: you hear the Marvin but you not doesn't mean Bilber
Speaker 5: talking about but it's not the karaoke it's still.
Speaker 6: I didn't produce his vocal though, you know, I sent
Speaker 6: him this track and they sent me this thing back,
Speaker 6: and you know we didn't even meet till well after
Speaker 6: the record was done.
Speaker 1: So that's all right. So who is it that like,
Speaker 1: is there's still anyone on your bucket list or that
Speaker 1: you who to collaborate with?
Speaker 6: Or I mean, look, you know, Stevie Wonder is still
Speaker 6: my favorite artist. I would say I'd love to work
Speaker 6: with Stevie someday. You know, even just a harmonica would
Speaker 6: be nice.
Speaker 1: Okay, Stevie's success, He's accessible. You gotta know the cats
Speaker 1: that knows the cats that know the cats.
Speaker 6: You know, I did a bunch of benefits for him
Speaker 6: with him. You know, he's got this the Toys for
Speaker 6: Tots things that he.
Speaker 1: Does for Christmas.
Speaker 6: I done it a few times, and so he gave
Speaker 6: me his number ones and said, you know, if you
Speaker 6: have a good luck. I called him and and left
Speaker 6: messages over the years, but I've I've never been able.
Speaker 1: To look the He's world famous. Jimmy Jay and Terry
Speaker 1: Lewis have a kind of a hilarious system when they
Speaker 1: desperately need Stevie Wonder. It's like they tag team, like, Okay,
Speaker 1: are you going to go straight to his house and
Speaker 1: just knock on his door or is it us like
Speaker 1: you might have to literally.
Speaker 8: He don't even know you called, right, Yeah, nou He's
Speaker 8: good with his phone, but he also just you know,
Speaker 8: sometimes doesn't do that jazz being the ever morphing art
Speaker 8: form that it is.
Speaker 1: You know, is there things that you have yet to
Speaker 1: do musically that you would like to try? That's sort
Speaker 1: of different.
Speaker 6: I think, you know, what I've been asked that question before,
Speaker 6: and what I normally say, and I think this is true,
Speaker 6: is that I'm really just trying to do me and
Speaker 6: in each moment, I never know ahead of time, what's
Speaker 6: going to come out? You know, I'm just really trying
Speaker 6: to connect with whatever music is in me. You know,
Speaker 6: I get ideas still, luckily, and then it's my job
Speaker 6: to try and get the ideas that float into my
Speaker 6: head out so that people can hear them and to
Speaker 6: realize them so fully that I feel like, Okay, that's done,
Speaker 6: and that's just an ongoing process. I don't have any
Speaker 6: sort of extraneous goals of things like I'm going to
Speaker 6: do this or that or the other thing. I don't
Speaker 6: think of it that way. I'm just always trying to
Speaker 6: respond to the music that is in front of me.
Speaker 6: And where those ideas come from. It's mysterious, but luckily
Speaker 6: I'm still getting them. So that's the best I can
Speaker 6: answer that. But I have no plans to do like
Speaker 6: a straight ahead record or a polka record or something
Speaker 6: like that.
Speaker 1: All right, well let's do a poka record again.
Speaker 2: People pay money for that shit.
Speaker 6: Protection that we should maybe do something together now, that
Speaker 6: would be a nice goal.
Speaker 1: I mean, I've never met a challenge I couldn't handle.
Speaker 3: So this time you walk in knowing that it's Bony Jay,
Speaker 3: and this.
Speaker 1: Time I would know unlike you, babe, Bill not tell
Speaker 1: me you play saxophone.
Speaker 2: Well, you only could get back to the clarinet if
Speaker 2: we're doing polka. I mean that'd be some.
Speaker 1: Shit our triple and it'll be on Jami record.
Speaker 6: So I still do go and study things, you know,
Speaker 6: like if I hear something that I couldn't play when
Speaker 6: I was younger, now I'll sit down and like learn it.
Speaker 6: And that's good for me just as a sax player,
Speaker 6: because I'm always still trying to improve my connection to
Speaker 6: the instrument. But in terms of making a record, I
Speaker 6: think that the thing the thing I like about my
Speaker 6: music is that it's it's honest to to just me.
Speaker 3: So do you have Do people ever suggest to you
Speaker 3: folks that they would.
Speaker 6: Love to hear you with sure? Oh yeah all the time,
Speaker 6: as I have one Yeah, whut on list?
Speaker 5: Yes, And I don't know if you've already done it before,
Speaker 5: So excuse me if you have a bony.
Speaker 3: Your catalog is you know not?
Speaker 5: Then Michael Franks, Oh yeah, nobody, like.
Speaker 6: They're playing shows every now and then. He's got to
Speaker 6: be in his late seventies, I'm assuming.
Speaker 5: But he still sounds amazing. I've been hearing about his
Speaker 5: shows that he still does.
Speaker 9: I'm just saying, desert players, just asking like, like, because
Speaker 9: you've run in so many different avenues and things like
Speaker 9: who are you like top three favorite like guys who
Speaker 9: I really have the sound.
Speaker 2: I'm sure you get asked that a lot.
Speaker 6: But I don't listen to much music anymore except when
Speaker 6: I'm I'm making my own music. But I still love Grover.
Speaker 6: You know, Wilton Felder was a big influence on me.
Speaker 6: Sean Coltrane. You know, he's got a thing. You don't say, yeah,
Speaker 6: but but more of the lyrical ballad type Coltrane rather
Speaker 6: than the more experiment uh, screaming kind of stuff. I mean,
Speaker 6: I I I love stan Getz. I mean I love
Speaker 6: Paul Desmond. I love guys that were lyrical, and you
Speaker 6: know that's kind of more my thing.
Speaker 3: You didn't like to be punched in a face like
Speaker 3: I like to be.
Speaker 6: I just like a sound. I like when I listened
Speaker 6: to the saxophone. I like a saxophone that that envelops you.
Speaker 6: And that's what I'm sort of trying to do.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 6: It's like a warm hug. I mean, it can still
Speaker 6: dig in and make you feel something, but it's coming
Speaker 6: from a from a kind place.
Speaker 1: Well, brother again, I'm so glad we finally got the
Speaker 1: tell that story, Steve, are you satisfied I finally said
Speaker 1: it and Bony.
Speaker 4: Yeah, that was that was cathartic.
Speaker 1: I think for ever.
Speaker 2: The record, we wanted g Love and we got Quest Love.
Speaker 2: So it was a bit of a you know, so
Speaker 2: there you go.
Speaker 6: Up getting together and working at Electric Lady on a
Speaker 6: on a later couple of tracks as well. I don't
Speaker 6: know if you remember.
Speaker 1: That, of course I told you I remember my work absolutely.
Speaker 1: I mean once I did that, of course I remember.
Speaker 3: No.
Speaker 1: But thank you man, uh, you know you've been a
Speaker 1: stand up cat, really good to us over the years,
Speaker 1: supporting the community and and you know, we thank you
Speaker 1: for doing the show with us, and you know, much
Speaker 1: success to you, and thank you. Thank you for for
Speaker 1: joining us on behalf of Layah and Unpaid Bill and
Speaker 1: shook A Steve quest Love and our guests today Tony
Speaker 1: James not Bony In, thank you for doing this with
Speaker 1: us and we'll see you on the next go around here. Peace,
Speaker 1: This is Sugar Steve.
Speaker 4: Thank you for listening to Questlove Supreme. This podcast is
Speaker 4: hosted by a Mere Quest Love, Thompson, Liah Saint Clair, Sugar,
Speaker 4: Steve Mandel, and unpaid Bill Sherman. The executive producers are
Speaker 4: a mere quest of Thompson, Sean g and Brian Calhoun,
Speaker 4: produced by Britney Benjamin, Jake Payne and Liah Saint Clair
Speaker 4: edited by Alex Conroy. Produced for iHeart by Noel Brown
Speaker 4: Westlove Supreme is.
Speaker 1: A production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit
Speaker 1: the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to
Speaker 1: your favorite shows.