Speaker 1: There's nothing like this in sports. You don't there is
Speaker 1: no free throw contest to join the Lakers, and it's
Speaker 1: not joined the Lakers and sit on the end of
Speaker 1: the bench. It's joined the Lakers, and you have the
Speaker 1: same exact chance as everybody else does. Like obviously talent aside.
Speaker 1: When you tee it up, you're equal to Rory McIlroy
Speaker 1: on Monday, and there's nothing like it in sports. I
Speaker 1: got dots my head, can't get John nothing. What I'm
Speaker 1: thinking about, can't get him now nothing, think well I'm
Speaker 1: thinking about. Hello. This is Alan shipping Nuck back to
Speaker 1: the Fire Drill Podcast, as always, joined by Ryan French
Speaker 1: and Michael Bamberger. It's such a big moment of golf,
Speaker 1: we thought we'd bring in a couple of extra voices
Speaker 1: for this very special pod. We have Mattchenella and super
Speaker 1: agent Mac Barnhardt coming in from Idaho where he's been
Speaker 1: snowboarding with the likes of Davis Love. Will get to
Speaker 1: all that soon, but we thought we would start with
Speaker 1: Ryan and the Mega Monday Qualifier here in Scottsdale. Ryan's
Speaker 1: coming straight from the golf course. He's all he's all
Speaker 1: jacked up because he lives with this stuff. Ryan. I
Speaker 1: know we lost a few a few players because the
Speaker 1: Monday finishing pebble beats and that slightly damp in your spirits.
Speaker 1: But how was this Monday? What are the storylines and
Speaker 1: just bring it to life for our listeners please. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I actually think guys, uh, is that it got better
Speaker 1: because the tour players didn't make it. Um. You know
Speaker 1: all of those guys are doing okay, and the three
Speaker 1: stories that got through our unreal Um. I put out
Speaker 1: a tweet, uh, thirty five combined seasons as pros from
Speaker 1: the three guys that have got through, uh, that got
Speaker 1: through today and this is their combined fourth PGA Tour event.
Speaker 1: They have four PGA Tour events prior to this, thirty
Speaker 1: five years, thirty five seasons. Andre Metzger has been a
Speaker 1: pro since two thousand and seven and this is his
Speaker 1: second PGA Tour event ever. Uh And it's for a
Speaker 1: twenty million dollar person. I heard today and I don't
Speaker 1: know if it's acurate, but last place is forty three dollars,
Speaker 1: So making the cut is a game changer for these guys. Um.
Speaker 1: I mean it just perfectly sums up uh why I
Speaker 1: love Mondays Brett White five years ago had a brain
Speaker 1: infection and couldn't walk or talk, and Monday qualified for
Speaker 1: one of the most important that one of the biggest
Speaker 1: tour events, the biggest purse ever. UH. Dalton Ward went
Speaker 1: to a junior college and average seventy nine and then
Speaker 1: quit and is now playing in at an elevated event.
Speaker 1: And Andre Metsicer, although a many tour legend, literally said
Speaker 1: to me today, I said, ah that you know he
Speaker 1: lives in Scottsdale, has an apartment at Scosta with his
Speaker 1: wife and kids. And said, I said, well, at least
Speaker 1: you saved some money on UH on lodging. And he said,
Speaker 1: what money. I don't have any money. And so if
Speaker 1: those three stories don't make what I cover worthwhile, I
Speaker 1: can't help you. It doesn't get it. It It doesn't get
Speaker 1: any better than that. I don't know what to say.
Speaker 1: And I watched all three of the guys, UH sit
Speaker 1: there and wait for scores to come in. Look at
Speaker 1: every group, hold their breath. Read how the people are
Speaker 1: walking towards scoring because the chance of a lifetime uh,
Speaker 1: it's coming their way now. And I've said it a
Speaker 1: million times. If the PGA Tour doesn't lean into this part.
Speaker 1: This is the advantage they have. This is what they have,
Speaker 1: not only storytelling on the Monday Que level, but all levels.
Speaker 1: So I know how we said we're going around the horn.
Speaker 1: I just dominated the first three minutes. I apologize and
Speaker 1: that's it, right, Ryan, No no playoff today, that's unusual. Yeah,
Speaker 1: no playoff today. It was great because it was gonna
Speaker 1: get dark and would had to had to uh, I
Speaker 1: had to go into tomorrow. And these guys that haven't
Speaker 1: had the opportunity, as Mac knows, as hard to sleep
Speaker 1: on a on on that when it's staring in in
Speaker 1: the face from not from now until the morning is
Speaker 1: a lot of time to think about how much money
Speaker 1: twenty million dollars is And so I think it's just
Speaker 1: better that it went off like this. Great stories, tons
Speaker 1: of tour guys. I give a lot of respect to
Speaker 1: guys like Martin trainer. Uh finished took a flight this
Speaker 1: morning and then rushed over Harrison. Andyicott played with Will Bateman,
Speaker 1: the actor in the in UH as his pro am partner.
Speaker 1: Will Bateman flew him in his private jet to l
Speaker 1: A so he could catch a flight to Phoenix. I mean,
Speaker 1: this is Monday que too. This was I couldn't even
Speaker 1: I couldn't keep all the stories away. It's too much
Speaker 1: to cover. You mean Jason Bateman or Will our Net which, yeah, whatever,
Speaker 1: both of those guys, they were both on the plane.
Speaker 1: That's how I screwed it up. Jason Bateman and Will
Speaker 1: Arnette were on the plane. SmartLess. This has become an
Speaker 1: episode of smartst Um. I mean, it's true that this
Speaker 1: is the number one advantage of the PGA tour has
Speaker 1: over Say Live is that it's not a closed shop,
Speaker 1: and you can't have these exceptionally charming stories. And there's
Speaker 1: still elements of a meritocracy where guys can can barge
Speaker 1: their way into the field and and change your life
Speaker 1: in one great week. And Andre Metzker, You've told me
Speaker 1: many stories about him. He's a Dakotas toward legend. And
Speaker 1: there's one particularly colorful tale. It's time that you you've
Speaker 1: put it out into the wild. Ryan, even sitting on
Speaker 1: this for too many years, what is the most famous story? No,
Speaker 1: I refuse, I refused to write tell this story because
Speaker 1: I'm going to write it. It's eight better in the
Speaker 1: written word. He's a legend. He likes to party, and uh,
Speaker 1: I love him, and I refuse to tell this story
Speaker 1: without a full understanding of everything that went into it.
Speaker 1: And uh, it needs contacts. I don't know why. I
Speaker 1: don't know what context I would learn, but uh, that's
Speaker 1: the that's the tease for my next story. Andre Messer
Speaker 1: and the Dakota Steward. Michael, this is the guy you
Speaker 1: should catting for, by the way, Okay, thank you Ryan, Ryan.
Speaker 1: What can a guy make if anything on a Monday night?
Speaker 1: These three guys in particular, can they sign up for
Speaker 1: anything Taylor made or anything else so they'll get him
Speaker 1: quick cash come Thursday morning? Uh no, uh no, some
Speaker 1: of these guys have like a little bonus. Uh. Brett
Speaker 1: is a titlist guy, so I would assume he'll he
Speaker 1: gets like three thousand dollars for getting into the event. Um,
Speaker 1: Matt could speak better to you. Know, Brett's story is
Speaker 1: really great. His agent has already sent me a message
Speaker 1: in thanking me. I assume it will resonate with a
Speaker 1: lot of people, and so I assume he can find
Speaker 1: little deals like Mark did, uh to kind of help
Speaker 1: them through the week. Yeah, they get paid now, right,
Speaker 1: don't don't don't they get a stipend for playing now
Speaker 1: if you if you're not a member. I mean, I
Speaker 1: know the regular guys get five thousand against and I
Speaker 1: think the other guys they don't get that. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: don't know. I confirmed today that Monday qualifiers do not
Speaker 1: get the five thousand dollars. PGA Tour can't afford the
Speaker 1: extra fifteen thousand dollars. It's gonna break it. Sorry. Yeah,
Speaker 1: the guys that needed the most, Yeah, the guys that
Speaker 1: needed the most, Yeah, they don't get it. Ryan, do
Speaker 1: you think this guy would have rather Monday qualified for
Speaker 1: uh John Deere with less purse with fifty fifty best
Speaker 1: players in the world not playing. Um, I mean it's
Speaker 1: quite a jump from Monday qualifying to go on a
Speaker 1: play and against the filled that stacked. I mean it's
Speaker 1: a stacked you know, it's like it's like a player's right, um,
Speaker 1: and not not just you know, I'm not saying these
Speaker 1: guys shouldn't be there, but Mac, I think, I mean,
Speaker 1: it's a great question, Mac, uh, I as you know
Speaker 1: better than I you do you talk to these players
Speaker 1: every day because I've always loved the mental aspect of
Speaker 1: these players. I asked Andre tonight I was like, do
Speaker 1: you believe that you can be on the PGA Tour.
Speaker 1: This is the guy who's forty one years old and
Speaker 1: has played two PGA Tour events, And I said, do
Speaker 1: you belong on the PGA Tour? And he said, And
Speaker 1: whether that's true or not, it doesn't matter. He believes it.
Speaker 1: And so I don't know if he thinks that far
Speaker 1: ahead mac like or thinks about options like that, would
Speaker 1: he rather play in the John Dear I think he
Speaker 1: believes that he can he can win the way management
Speaker 1: despite the odds that it probably it's going to be
Speaker 1: a lottery ticket basically probably not that good odds well,
Speaker 1: and even more on that, it gets even harder because
Speaker 1: these are guys who used to playing with nobody watching,
Speaker 1: and now you come to the crucible of TPC Scottsdale
Speaker 1: with you know, a hundred thousand plus people, a lot
Speaker 1: of big Yahoo factor, the noise, the energy, the distractions.
Speaker 1: I mean to think that you could go from the
Speaker 1: Dakoda's Tour and then navigate that's completely different competitive environment.
Speaker 1: Just it just adds to the romance if one of
Speaker 1: these guys don't even make the cut, because it would
Speaker 1: be a phenomenal accomplishment. I think it becomes a two
Speaker 1: day story now to see if they can make a
Speaker 1: cut instead of having to follow a four day story.
Speaker 1: In what you're seeing who wins the tournament. Like the
Speaker 1: idea that you're now just following guys just to see
Speaker 1: if they could, like like Baldwin and A T and
Speaker 1: T last year, which was can you make the cut?
Speaker 1: And then it becomes a turner. It's a one day
Speaker 1: tournament FTMA cut to see how much he can impact
Speaker 1: his life. It's just so much more interesting to me
Speaker 1: than one of these top players in the world just
Speaker 1: getting another one point eight million dollar check or whatever
Speaker 1: they're gonna be. It just um, it's no contest for me,
Speaker 1: you know. The tour kind of like Augusta has gone
Speaker 1: away from printing money, right it'll tell you how much
Speaker 1: money to tall me FedEx cup points. Now money is
Speaker 1: back into the conversation. It's all everybody talks about. And
Speaker 1: it's kind of funny. And Scott's tale is gonna be
Speaker 1: talking about the money and there's a football studium around
Speaker 1: the part three. You can't make it more non traditional
Speaker 1: than that, and so it's it's kind of comical. That
Speaker 1: now money is the only It's like the lottery's gotten
Speaker 1: big enough for people to play by tickets now or something. Uh,
Speaker 1: this is gonna be fun to watch Ryan. If these
Speaker 1: get Ryan, if these guys top ten this week, do
Speaker 1: they get into Honda? Yes? Uh, he had what's next
Speaker 1: week Genesis, so they would not get into Genesis and
Speaker 1: then uh, and they would get into Honda, and they
Speaker 1: would So I mean that gets to Matt's point. In
Speaker 1: other words, you've got competitions within competitions. They just wanted
Speaker 1: a tremendous competition. Get into the field. Now they can
Speaker 1: make a cut. Can they play you're good enough golf
Speaker 1: and Saturday and send you to top ten and get
Speaker 1: another started, another start at Honda. You know, careers have
Speaker 1: started on less likely things than that. Yeah, I mean
Speaker 1: I think for especially like Andre, I mean and and
Speaker 1: Brett too. I mean, Brett was talking today about how
Speaker 1: he's saving money here and saving money there as all
Speaker 1: these guys do and girls that are charging it. And
Speaker 1: I think a little pressure off guys like Andre if
Speaker 1: he makes the cut because you finished his dead last
Speaker 1: forty three thousand might as well be a million. And so,
Speaker 1: you know, a little pressure off and you can just
Speaker 1: kind of free wheel. It's but yeah, I mean, I
Speaker 1: said to Jake, our producer, and you know we've agreed,
Speaker 1: there's nothing like this in sports. You don't there is
Speaker 1: no free throw contest to join the Lakers, and it's
Speaker 1: not joined the Lakers and sit on the end of
Speaker 1: the bench. It's joined the Lakers, and you have the
Speaker 1: same exact chance as everybody else does. Like obviously talent aside.
Speaker 1: When you tee it up, you're equal to Rory McElroy
Speaker 1: on Monday. And there's nothing like it in sports. I
Speaker 1: obviously love it, but I love it. That's great stuff.
Speaker 1: So to max point, you know, money makes the world
Speaker 1: go around, and especially the golf world right now, and uh,
Speaker 1: it'll be a big part of of the Phoenix Open backstory.
Speaker 1: But it's certainly had an effect on the term that
Speaker 1: just ended in Pebble Beach because you know Pebble used
Speaker 1: to get a pretty good field. Tiger played its a
Speaker 1: good amountain in the early years. You know, Phil was
Speaker 1: a staple. Uh, you had to you had a guys,
Speaker 1: you know, some of the Florida guys never played it whatever,
Speaker 1: but it was a respectable field and there were always
Speaker 1: some stars at the top, where there was Dustin Johnson,
Speaker 1: whom I of her. But with the advent of Middle
Speaker 1: Eastern money and now especially live golf and and the
Speaker 1: saut inter National, you know, pell Beach has has been
Speaker 1: decimated from the standpoint of attracting players, and um, you know,
Speaker 1: we saw a lot of guys withdraw on before the
Speaker 1: tournament even ended. And it's a shame because those of
Speaker 1: us who were on the ground, like Matt and myself,
Speaker 1: there's no term, there's more fun to be at. The
Speaker 1: pros are relaxed, the amateurs are good fun. There's there's
Speaker 1: parties and dinners and and music every night. And when
Speaker 1: you're on the grounds, it's it's an incredible experience. But
Speaker 1: if you're watching at home, um, you know, there's not
Speaker 1: enough cameras at Spyglass or Monterey Peninsula, and there's not
Speaker 1: enough no stars on the leaderboard. So Mac, I'm curious
Speaker 1: for your overview about you know that they we're starting
Speaker 1: to really see it now that this chasm between the big,
Speaker 1: big events like Phoenix and the non elevated events like Pebble,
Speaker 1: And are you hearing from players like they are now
Speaker 1: building their whole schedule around the elevated events, and what
Speaker 1: is your take on on sort of the house versus
Speaker 1: the have mores on the PG tour right now. Well,
Speaker 1: it's the first time that I in my career thirty years,
Speaker 1: that I've ever heard of players schedule based on purse.
Speaker 1: The usually based on their playing, you know, the courses
Speaker 1: they like, the rest schedule, three on one off, that
Speaker 1: kind of thing. That's the first time I've ever heard
Speaker 1: them talking about money, and not that winning three million
Speaker 1: and wonderful, but winning a million and a half is
Speaker 1: I mean astonishing, and why they even cared And I
Speaker 1: think that one of the problems. And you see this,
Speaker 1: and I won't go to the player, but there have
Speaker 1: been players that have played the week schedule on tour.
Speaker 1: There's always been elevated that's an unelevated events. They just
Speaker 1: never said it. There were always events that but there
Speaker 1: were players that would be able to finish in the
Speaker 1: top thirty and fed X points playing all the small events,
Speaker 1: playing against the least competition that you can play in,
Speaker 1: and they get top thirty. In the next year, they
Speaker 1: lose their card because now they start and the memorials
Speaker 1: and the colonials and the Bay Hills, they play the
Speaker 1: elevated events, and again I'm using elevated just because the
Speaker 1: fields are stronger, and they lose their card playing against
Speaker 1: that competition. And it's happened quite a few times. And
Speaker 1: now you've got guys that haven't won on tour, that
Speaker 1: have no security other than keeping their card this year,
Speaker 1: that are scheduling, skipping the Honda, skipping the San Diego,
Speaker 1: skipping the ones that are quote non elevated for the purse.
Speaker 1: And if I'm those guys, I'm thinking, let me go
Speaker 1: get a win, let me go prove I can beat
Speaker 1: these people before I gotta go play where the tour
Speaker 1: makes the top fifty players come and beat them. So
Speaker 1: it's changed the whole dynamic and I've never seen anything
Speaker 1: like it. I mean, they really should just be honing
Speaker 1: their skills and getting good at golf. Looking at how
Speaker 1: much they make it should be relevant. It really shouldn't be.
Speaker 1: It's a great insight Mac, you know, and Tiger used
Speaker 1: to always say that, and Jordan's Speed said the exact
Speaker 1: same thing. When it's come win at every level of
Speaker 1: which you're planning, and don't play at a level which
Speaker 1: you're not ready to play. Uh so like if you
Speaker 1: can top ten at John Deere, that doesn't mean can
Speaker 1: top ten at the Genesis. It's a big difference in
Speaker 1: golf course in field. So I think it's a it's
Speaker 1: a great insight, and I think it would be a
Speaker 1: very shrewd manager would say why don't you play this
Speaker 1: tournament because this win will get you in the Masters
Speaker 1: and you're not in the Masters Max two polite, but
Speaker 1: I know he was thinking of probably Fred funk right,
Speaker 1: who made a career out of winning opposite events and
Speaker 1: and secondary events. But Ryan Gay and Wayne Levy, a
Speaker 1: lot of guys Fred did when the players are so
Speaker 1: when But you're right, there's a lot of guys that
Speaker 1: created quite nice career. If you can look at the
Speaker 1: tournaments they won, and they were they would have been
Speaker 1: considered unelevated events based on the strength of field, not
Speaker 1: the money necessarily. But it's okay, I mean, I mean
Speaker 1: that's you know, we go back to Triple A baseball.
Speaker 1: There's it's okay to go play the weaker fields. But
Speaker 1: and then, if you have to know thyself, you know
Speaker 1: some of these guys, even though they may have a
Speaker 1: really incredible year and win, they still shouldn't just step
Speaker 1: themselves up and go on, I'm gonna play Memorial, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna play golf course that don't fit their game. Um.
Speaker 1: I mean, but you see it. And again I guess
Speaker 1: they want to test themselves against the best. But I
Speaker 1: think once you're settled and you've got your tour wins
Speaker 1: and you can you know you've got some time, then
Speaker 1: go test. But if I, if I haven't won, I'm
Speaker 1: going nowhere near these strong fields and if I can
Speaker 1: help it. Matt, you know you you were on the
Speaker 1: grounds of Pebble last week. We got to hang out
Speaker 1: a little bit. Can you speak to that that um
Speaker 1: sort of break between anyone who's on the grounds of
Speaker 1: that tournament and and those watching at home. And I
Speaker 1: know you had a really fun week popping around and
Speaker 1: talking to people, and uh, if you're at Pebble Beach
Speaker 1: and you're in the Gulf world, how how great and
Speaker 1: how valuable the week is that? Yeah? Before I get
Speaker 1: to that. By the way, just and Rose winds today
Speaker 1: hasn't one in four years gets into the Masters. Like
Speaker 1: Justin Rose is a guy who just who just cleaned up.
Speaker 1: I mean, what what an opportunity he just had had
Speaker 1: one of these events to turn the back end of
Speaker 1: his career around. I mean, good for him, by the way,
Speaker 1: all of him. I mean he's now he's not relevant again,
Speaker 1: and that you know from what I was told from
Speaker 1: good sources. He was. He was a live guy, like
Speaker 1: forty two years old. He you know, done high burn
Speaker 1: rate back home and he needed he needed something and
Speaker 1: he just got. He just got what he needed. And
Speaker 1: good for him at at a venue that obviously mattered
Speaker 1: to him. But I was just going to talk about
Speaker 1: how you know, Steve John is a friend of ours,
Speaker 1: the tournament director three courses, rain Wind. They had a
Speaker 1: heart attack one of the caddies you know bow Hostler's group,
Speaker 1: you know the guy he put put his head and
Speaker 1: you know Lucas Nelson's lap. They brought him back to life.
Speaker 1: He's still be intended to at at the local hospital.
Speaker 1: All that, you know, Extra Day TV Tale, all this,
Speaker 1: the egos and the logistics and all that goes into
Speaker 1: Pebble Beach. But when you, like you say, and when
Speaker 1: you're there, it is so much fun. The venues they're playing,
Speaker 1: the people who are there. You know, they've done a
Speaker 1: great job of getting relevant celebrities to be a part
Speaker 1: of athletes Josh Alan and Aaron Rodgers one that they
Speaker 1: I mean, music every night no matter where you turn,
Speaker 1: there's multiple multiple The volunteers party was insane, you know
Speaker 1: Eric Church and and uh Toby who is the Who's
Speaker 1: the Lucas Nelson's actually blistered the blister the show, I
Speaker 1: mean everyone went crazy. I mean it was Ray Romano,
Speaker 1: you know, Darius Rucker one after the next getting up
Speaker 1: and performing one trying to do out do the other.
Speaker 1: Clint Eastwood their backstage, you know, Bill Murray coming up
Speaker 1: and kissing the ring and giving respects to Clean Eastwood.
Speaker 1: It was It's an incredible event. And part of me
Speaker 1: feels bad for them because they don't get the field.
Speaker 1: Part of me respects the fact that they're like, you
Speaker 1: know what, whoever is here wants to be here, and
Speaker 1: whoever is gonna be here is gonna have a great time,
Speaker 1: regardless of the elements of what's happening. They put on
Speaker 1: a great event at a great venue and they got
Speaker 1: it done, and they deserve credit. All the maintenance crew
Speaker 1: that had to deal with the the weather and the elements,
Speaker 1: and the squeegee and the greens I mean it was exhaustive.
Speaker 1: I'm sure everybody be a part of that, but they
Speaker 1: got it done and they deserve credit. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: I know some of the board members of the help
Speaker 1: run the tournament, and their attitude is really interesting. They
Speaker 1: don't worry about the pros who don't show up, Like
Speaker 1: that tournament has donated mortgage hearity than any other on
Speaker 1: the PGA Tour, and they feel like their mandate is
Speaker 1: ray as much money as possible for the community. And
Speaker 1: so that you know, the amateurs not only did they
Speaker 1: pay thirty thou dollars, but some some kick in extra
Speaker 1: just because they love the event. Some guys say, well,
Speaker 1: if you give me a spot, I'll I'll round up
Speaker 1: two hundred thousand, whatever it may be. And it is
Speaker 1: an incredible, uh community resource to have that tournament and
Speaker 1: that that's that's the people who run it. That's what
Speaker 1: they focus on. And I think it's admirable. We we get,
Speaker 1: we get so wrapped up in and who's not there
Speaker 1: but the pros that come, you know, they play hard.
Speaker 1: They still give out ten million dollars or playing through
Speaker 1: the best course golf courses on the planet, and so, uh,
Speaker 1: it's you know, it's obviously my hometown event, and next
Speaker 1: year it's it hasn't officially been named an elevated event,
Speaker 1: but it's going to be. And of course it will
Speaker 1: be a delight to see all the best players on
Speaker 1: those golf courses. And there's probably be some tweaks to
Speaker 1: the format. You know, they may just go thirty six
Speaker 1: holes with the the amateurs and may only go two courses.
Speaker 1: Like a lot of things are on the table to
Speaker 1: make that whole, that whole event go. But um, in
Speaker 1: the end, it was a pretty great show. And um,
Speaker 1: you know, Justin Rose is funny because I talked about
Speaker 1: Tory Pines about his decision not to go live and
Speaker 1: he said he got a very good offer and he
Speaker 1: really thought about it, and um, you know he was
Speaker 1: it was it was a real thing. It's really it
Speaker 1: was tangible. But he said, I just felt like to
Speaker 1: achieve my goals in golf, I was better serving the
Speaker 1: PGA Tour. And so it's cool he was rewarded with
Speaker 1: the w and you know, clearly he's got one US Open,
Speaker 1: but he thinks he can pick off another major before
Speaker 1: all said and done, and he the the weekly grind
Speaker 1: of the tours where he knows he's gonna be sharpest,
Speaker 1: and so I kind of have a new newfound respect
Speaker 1: for Rose. And I know, Michael you've you've covered him
Speaker 1: a bit here and there through the years. What are
Speaker 1: your impressions of of Justin and you have any stories? Uh,
Speaker 1: the last time I was with him for any length
Speaker 1: of time at all was when he one in San Diego.
Speaker 1: As Matt was saying, already three years ago, it seems
Speaker 1: like it seems like yesterday, and uh uh it's he
Speaker 1: would have seen like the protetypocal guy to go live. Uh,
Speaker 1: except for one very significant effect, I think, And Alan,
Speaker 1: you probably can speak to this far better than I. Uh,
Speaker 1: he's represented by Mark Steinberg and none of mark Steinberg's
Speaker 1: is that still correct? On none of mark steinberg disguise
Speaker 1: have gone gone live? Okay, Uh so can you imagine, Well,
Speaker 1: Alan Phillison, maybe you can finish that sentence for me.
Speaker 1: Uh yeah, Well we'll throw this to Mac in a second.
Speaker 1: But that is definitely and this is all gonna be
Speaker 1: in my book because it's a fascinating part of this
Speaker 1: whole piece is you have this GSC agency. Almost all
Speaker 1: of their guys went live Excel, which is Mark Steinberg's
Speaker 1: None of them have gone and that there's there's and
Speaker 1: I've talked to players in both stables and they admit,
Speaker 1: you know, there's a there's a momentum and there's almost
Speaker 1: a pure pressure and you're not immune to that. But
Speaker 1: that's what I asked really specifically. I said, you know,
Speaker 1: do you feel like Steinberg kind of because he's he's
Speaker 1: all onto the PGA tour. It's was Tiger like, did
Speaker 1: you feel like he steered you away from Live? And
Speaker 1: he said no, I mean, they brought me the offer
Speaker 1: and it was up to me to decide, and I
Speaker 1: made the decision. And if I had decided to go live,
Speaker 1: they would have supported it. And so uh, he debunked
Speaker 1: that theory a little bit, but um, not really. I mean,
Speaker 1: but you know, in his mind, he was given he
Speaker 1: was They fought hard for him to get the best offer.
Speaker 1: And I talked to another person who works for X
Speaker 1: XL and they said, you know, a lot of our
Speaker 1: guys got offers and we brought to them and we
Speaker 1: we talked it out and um, and ultimately they made
Speaker 1: their own choice to to go one direction or the other.
Speaker 1: But um, I'm curious your take mac on um how
Speaker 1: the landscape has sort of changed in the agency business
Speaker 1: because it's the first time you have a real competitor
Speaker 1: you can play off against, um, you know, one tour
Speaker 1: against the other and UM. Because it's it's so sensitive,
Speaker 1: you know, the agents have to have a lot of
Speaker 1: these conversations in the shadows because the players have to
Speaker 1: be careful and how is how is your life and
Speaker 1: your colleagues life change in this era of live golf amazing? UM.
Speaker 1: The going back to you know, clients do make their
Speaker 1: own decisions, guys. I don't know anybody it's got the
Speaker 1: power to move a guy if he's going somewhere, if
Speaker 1: he's going to change clubs or whatever. Maybe there's a
Speaker 1: little softer, maybe there's a little selling on each side
Speaker 1: of it. But now, if the players made their decisions,
Speaker 1: I don't think that's got anything to do with it.
Speaker 1: But yeah, but this is where the fund begins now.
Speaker 1: So in our business signing, the top players that come
Speaker 1: out of that are gonna come out now with an
Speaker 1: opportunity to have a tour card right out of college,
Speaker 1: which you know, before I've got to get a guy
Speaker 1: to get on the corn ferry and then I've got
Speaker 1: So it's two years to really elevate to get where
Speaker 1: you can get PGA Tour contracts. So now getting the
Speaker 1: kids that can get on tour that will earn cars
Speaker 1: out of college is a huge deal, right, And a
Speaker 1: lot of that comes from starts and events. So in
Speaker 1: other words, they get exemptions into PGA Tour events and
Speaker 1: make cuts. It helps their college plan to get on tour.
Speaker 1: So obviously, if you're well liked and your player can
Speaker 1: get more starts, and this is what we'll be watching,
Speaker 1: or there's certain agencies that their their recruits seem to
Speaker 1: get more starts, the kids in college that they're recruiting
Speaker 1: or they're playing more um. And then the most fascinating thing,
Speaker 1: let's just go and say, and I don't I don't
Speaker 1: use this likely, but let's say the next Tiger Woods
Speaker 1: shows up and he's a junior in college and he
Speaker 1: gets the points to become a tour player, and you
Speaker 1: sign him. And it used to be your first call
Speaker 1: would be to you know, the club manufacturer or clothing manufacturer. Well,
Speaker 1: now your first call would a guest be to Jay
Speaker 1: Monahan to say, Jay, you know I've got this kid,
Speaker 1: and I'm sure he's going to get an offer from Live.
Speaker 1: What can we do? And that's a very strange call.
Speaker 1: And it's not leveraging, it's just what you have to do,
Speaker 1: because do they want that call? Does the tour wants
Speaker 1: you to call and say, listen, I've got a young
Speaker 1: kid and lives gonna go after him. That's going to
Speaker 1: be the biggest change and how the business is approached
Speaker 1: and getting the kids that are going to get on tour.
Speaker 1: This you know, this Gordon Sergeant kid, who's just phenomenal,
Speaker 1: great kid. You know, you know if he's if he
Speaker 1: earns enough points to get his tour card comes right out.
Speaker 1: The value of that kid versus a kid that's got
Speaker 1: to go through corn Ferry is remarkable. It's remarkable the difference,
Speaker 1: right and and seriously, the will the tour get in
Speaker 1: a position to where it starts offering stuff to these
Speaker 1: players not to go Live? I mean it's kind of
Speaker 1: what P I P is, right, I mean, it's kind
Speaker 1: of what it is. So yeah, it's changed the whole
Speaker 1: dynamic in that sense, Mac Mac, How would that work?
Speaker 1: How can Jay Monahan just offer up money to some
Speaker 1: kids out of college on what basis. I didn't say
Speaker 1: he could, but I'm saying I've never had the question
Speaker 1: and I probably won't get one of these guys that
Speaker 1: you know, I'm you know, but but what us? But
Speaker 1: right now, what they've done, they've given where a college
Speaker 1: player can earn points and become straight to the tour,
Speaker 1: not go to Q School, Corn Ferry, nothing right, But
Speaker 1: that's just an exemption. That's not I mean, that's they
Speaker 1: get the five thousand, I guess guaranteed, but they don't.
Speaker 1: That's it. And if you've got Live offering twenty five million,
Speaker 1: does the tour want to know about that? Do they
Speaker 1: want to say that? And I'll use Gordon Sergeant just
Speaker 1: because he's the kid right now that I mean, if
Speaker 1: Live makes a run at him, but fifty million or
Speaker 1: whatever some I'm silly number, does the tour want you
Speaker 1: to call them before? Or is it just no? This
Speaker 1: is we're gonna give him one year on the tour.
Speaker 1: So I don't know. I don't know how Jay Monahan does.
Speaker 1: I don't know where the p ip money came from.
Speaker 1: I don't know where any of it came from. But
Speaker 1: I just know that this is what in my business
Speaker 1: people are talking about, is how do we handle that. Well, now,
Speaker 1: now there's the t G l Um, that's become just
Speaker 1: another way to reward players who are loyalty. That's not
Speaker 1: necessarily gonna go to a kid out of college, but
Speaker 1: that's become a thank you for for your service to
Speaker 1: a lot of these goals. When you take you take
Speaker 1: the pit money, you take the TGL money, that's that
Speaker 1: that's that's going to be real money. Um, that hasn't
Speaker 1: that has nothing to do with what your score is
Speaker 1: at the end of the day. I don't I'm not
Speaker 1: saying any of this is going to happen, but if
Speaker 1: you see the trend of where it's going, you see
Speaker 1: you see guys getting repaid for their loyalty. But let's
Speaker 1: say that next Tiger Woods comes out and they know
Speaker 1: it's this got this kind of impact on the game,
Speaker 1: would the tour negotiate against Live to keep him? Well,
Speaker 1: I mean it's it's like the PGA Tour. You they're
Speaker 1: now giving away cards to college kids. I mean, they
Speaker 1: never would have done that in the past, But that's
Speaker 1: to try and thwart Live Golf from from poaching all
Speaker 1: the young players. I mean, there's no doubt they're they're
Speaker 1: fighting back and that's what these elevated events are. And um,
Speaker 1: so yeah, I mean the tour has reshaped its business
Speaker 1: model because of lives. So to think that they're not
Speaker 1: gonna pull every lever that they have to to try
Speaker 1: and keep players, I mean they clearly are. And you know,
Speaker 1: we all know about the Bubba Watson kind of threw
Speaker 1: the lid off of it, and you know about this.
Speaker 1: To Mac, it's like the tour cannot pay appearance fees,
Speaker 1: but the tournament sponsor can can pay a guy to
Speaker 1: show up at a cocktail party. You know, it's here's
Speaker 1: your three thousand dollars for having a drink and telling
Speaker 1: a couple of jokes. And that's been going on for
Speaker 1: a long time, and that that may or may not accelerate.
Speaker 1: I mean, there's there's a there's a lot of ways
Speaker 1: to get money into the pockets of the players that
Speaker 1: are not you know, visible to the to the public.
Speaker 1: Hey Mack, as we've discussed many times, you're more of
Speaker 1: a life coach, really an adviser than you know, quote
Speaker 1: just just an agent. Um when someone says something like
Speaker 1: Max Hooma, you know you can't buy my dreams. But
Speaker 1: you've got another kid who you know, the families hundreds
Speaker 1: of thousand dollars in debt because of you know, all
Speaker 1: the money they've spent playing amateur golf, and like, now
Speaker 1: there's a live offers say you can take, you can
Speaker 1: actually make money. Now, how do you How do you
Speaker 1: as an advisor play those things out when you're talking
Speaker 1: talking to golfers or or or how you know in
Speaker 1: the future might be talking to golfers about that sort
Speaker 1: of decision I think, I mean, I think it's gonna change,
Speaker 1: but no, I do it just like I would do
Speaker 1: with any offer, whether it's an appearance fee or a
Speaker 1: contract to represent a certain brand. You lay it all
Speaker 1: out in the facts, and the facts are, what are
Speaker 1: your obligations, what do you get paid for it? And
Speaker 1: and then once you do those two things, then you
Speaker 1: go into the pros and cons. You know, if you
Speaker 1: do this, this is kind of what you're looking at.
Speaker 1: And if you do that, if you if you sign
Speaker 1: with this company, you must play the driver. And if
Speaker 1: that driver at some point doesn't fit you, you can't
Speaker 1: get out. You'll lose your whole contracts a lot, you know,
Speaker 1: so you would do it. No differently, it's just lay
Speaker 1: the pros and cons. I mean, that's your job. It's
Speaker 1: just to give them the opportunities. Um, and they're gonna come.
Speaker 1: You know, you said one of the things that change,
Speaker 1: and um, you know, they just come out and said
Speaker 1: if a kid comes out of college and plays a
Speaker 1: live event or an unauthorized event, he's banned for a
Speaker 1: year from the tour. And so there's a lot of
Speaker 1: us in this business are thinking, Wow, I wonder if
Speaker 1: they could take and if you're a manager and you
Speaker 1: take a player to live, could they suspend your credentials
Speaker 1: for a year? Could they you know, what can they do?
Speaker 1: I don't know, but we've laughed about it in a
Speaker 1: sense that you know, they could say we took a
Speaker 1: player to live, you're out, and then you didn't take
Speaker 1: a player to live, you're in. I mean, I don't know. Again,
Speaker 1: it's these are just things that we've never had these
Speaker 1: conversations about. And most of the time when I taught
Speaker 1: the parents, they're wanting just enough money for their kids
Speaker 1: to pursue their dream. That's what they want. If they
Speaker 1: can get enough contract money to where they can play
Speaker 1: three or four years. Just what it really takes to
Speaker 1: get on tour. I mean, it's a rule. Um, that's
Speaker 1: all I ever wanted. Now parents are like how much
Speaker 1: money is out there, like like big money? And does
Speaker 1: it compete with the club companies, does it complete with
Speaker 1: the clothing companies. I mean, one of the things you
Speaker 1: got understand is if if the Live goes to this
Speaker 1: team model, the managers are not going to be able
Speaker 1: to sell the club contracts, the clothing contracts, the logos.
Speaker 1: They're all gonna be team driven. So you could sell
Speaker 1: a player to Live, but that's the end of your
Speaker 1: revenue stream with that kid, because now it's all based
Speaker 1: on the team. Right. Um, So there's I mean, there's
Speaker 1: all kinds of reasons to go and not go, but
Speaker 1: these are all possible scenarios that would happen that you know,
Speaker 1: g S I think is the company you said is
Speaker 1: send a bunch of guys there. Well, if all their
Speaker 1: guys lose all their corporate deals because they're on Live
Speaker 1: and that agent is not, they're not going to do
Speaker 1: as well the next year after those signing bonuses are gone. Right.
Speaker 1: So I mean it's just like I said, it's a
Speaker 1: different conversation. But I'll tell you this, every kid that
Speaker 1: I've talked to has asked about live. Everyone it's fair.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's another opportunity. Well they they and and
Speaker 1: with elevated events being even more elevated and less opportunities
Speaker 1: coming down the line as more sponsors get piste and
Speaker 1: leave the PGA Tour or can't afford the PGA Tour,
Speaker 1: Live is actually going to only be become more relevant
Speaker 1: if time goes by correct or not. What totally could
Speaker 1: I mean, let's face it, what Alan just said about
Speaker 1: a t n T. The amount of money that that
Speaker 1: they give the local charities, That's what the PGA Tour
Speaker 1: has always been to me. The the g g O
Speaker 1: in Greensboro and the rs M and St. Simon's and
Speaker 1: the those things were community driven projects to raise money
Speaker 1: for local I mean, if you go to Sanderson Farms,
Speaker 1: they never had the strongest field, but go look at
Speaker 1: the people that show up to cheer and and go
Speaker 1: to the chalais and and it's a community deal. That's
Speaker 1: what I've always thought the tour was. Um, I didn't
Speaker 1: they weren't. You had some big events, you know, you
Speaker 1: had the memorials, and you had you know, the players,
Speaker 1: But in reality, each PGA Tour event was just a
Speaker 1: community driven event. And and now do you go away
Speaker 1: from that kind of like NASCAR? Did you know they
Speaker 1: got away from their communities where they had racing fans
Speaker 1: and they went to places didn't have racing fans. And
Speaker 1: I think there's a little bit of burnout and people
Speaker 1: thinking that these golfers are getting greedy about money. They
Speaker 1: just you know, it's just never talked about. It was
Speaker 1: one thing that golf was different. So it's it's crazy
Speaker 1: out there. Ryan. You had, Um, you had to tweet
Speaker 1: about the Asian Tour event because counsual fans may be confused.
Speaker 1: But the Saudi event that was just played this last week,
Speaker 1: that's not live. Um, that's just part of the Asian
Speaker 1: Tour schedule. But you had to tweet, you know, showing
Speaker 1: a lot of big time pleasure there and something of
Speaker 1: the fact like if you thought the many guys are
Speaker 1: gonna show up for an Asian Tour event, you know,
Speaker 1: a year or two ago, Um, you had been crazy.
Speaker 1: I'm sure if I'm stating that exactly right. But in
Speaker 1: your world, are you hearing more talk about Asia as
Speaker 1: a landing place? Um? And as as the second tier
Speaker 1: tour events if they start to wither away and there's
Speaker 1: fear of playing opportunities. Um, I mean, did you do
Speaker 1: you think that that that's really accelerating now as AS
Speaker 1: Live has become more real thing and um, the Asian
Speaker 1: Tour investments kicking in. Yeah. Yeah. But also it's brought
Speaker 1: up the Asian Tour has kind of always been kind
Speaker 1: of a third tier and now they're prominent in the
Speaker 1: golf world and they have to clean up a lot
Speaker 1: of their stuff. Uh. They give out tons of exemptions.
Speaker 1: Each event has twenty seven invites. They've kind of done
Speaker 1: things where you could you could pay your way into
Speaker 1: final stage. Ah. It happened here uh this year that
Speaker 1: a guy that missed at first stage in Arizona for
Speaker 1: Asian t Q School has a relationship with Phil Mickelson.
Speaker 1: All of a sudden, this guy appeared in final stage
Speaker 1: even though we missed at first stage, got his card. Uh.
Speaker 1: You know, those are little things that need to be
Speaker 1: cleaned up as they uh, you know, start to to
Speaker 1: move up this thing because it is a very real
Speaker 1: option for players right now. A lot of grinders want
Speaker 1: to play on the Asian Tour because it's a viable
Speaker 1: option to make a living. But I've already heard from
Speaker 1: multiple guys that have gotten their Asian Tour card how
Speaker 1: frustrated they are about not being able to get in
Speaker 1: a few of these events to start. So it's like,
Speaker 1: you know, this is this is becoming a prominent golf
Speaker 1: tour is to learn how to manage all of these things. Uh,
Speaker 1: they've kind of operated in the shadows for so long
Speaker 1: that they have to clean it up. But it's a
Speaker 1: viable option. They're q school was huge. It will be
Speaker 1: even bigger every year as long as these guys start
Speaker 1: to get some opportunities. So, um, the Gulf world is dividing.
Speaker 1: That just dis all there is to it. There's more
Speaker 1: options for people to do it. And uh as mcnos
Speaker 1: and all of you guys know that you start to
Speaker 1: lose some of these top players or they get spread out,
Speaker 1: then I'm not sure anybody wins, but I know the
Speaker 1: tour loses. Hey Man, to to follow up on something,
Speaker 1: uh Max said, Uh, you talked to a lot of
Speaker 1: people who are you know, at the highest levels of
Speaker 1: the game. There are forty four PGA Tour events are
Speaker 1: gonna be played this year At some point I mentioned
Speaker 1: Jay Monahan trying to match live tournament for tournament is
Speaker 1: gonna say, you guys got a cough up more. How
Speaker 1: many events do you think from what you're here and
Speaker 1: how many events do you think we could we could
Speaker 1: lose The Tour could lose between I think you could
Speaker 1: lose fourteen to fifteen Wow, if you're going up to
Speaker 1: only five million to play in an elevate to be
Speaker 1: an elevated event, and the Tour isn't subsidizing any of that,
Speaker 1: and other events are obviously gonna have to you know,
Speaker 1: pony up some or you're just going to be left
Speaker 1: to a depleted field. How many can justify any kind
Speaker 1: of expense when you're down to a field of you know,
Speaker 1: non marquee players, A T and T might be able
Speaker 1: to do it, you know that, you know, without being
Speaker 1: an elevated event because of the celebrities, You're gonna have
Speaker 1: to see some changes in models. I mean, I just
Speaker 1: think the schedule is going to get shorter anyway, where
Speaker 1: what happens to World Golf Championships. I mean these next
Speaker 1: you know, six to eighteen months. I just think it's
Speaker 1: going to be one of the most tumultuous times in
Speaker 1: professional golf history, it would be why out matter what
Speaker 1: you're saying, pans out, because then the Live Tour and
Speaker 1: the PGA Tour would essentially have very similar schedules. You know,
Speaker 1: twenty years so events, so a few more than that
Speaker 1: on the PGA Tour, everyone with big names and and
Speaker 1: and really big pay days, and then a few Sanderson
Speaker 1: farms that are hanging on for the sake of the community.
Speaker 1: And then do you have room then do you have
Speaker 1: room for live to actually coexist? Is there an opportunity
Speaker 1: to have like a split schedule, so you have a
Speaker 1: PGA Tour time of the year and you have a
Speaker 1: Live Tour time of the year. You have the majors
Speaker 1: in which you know, then then where does the world
Speaker 1: Golf ranket? What happens there? I mean, all of this
Speaker 1: has got this is going to be this is gonna
Speaker 1: be wild. From a corporate standpoint, sponsorship standpoint, media standpoint,
Speaker 1: players standpoint, agent standpoint, it's everything. You know, how many
Speaker 1: books are you gonna write? Alan see if I survived
Speaker 1: this one? But yeah, I'm not sure if the casual fans,
Speaker 1: what's that? In what way? Physically physically like like, who's
Speaker 1: after all all the Yeah, a number of ways I
Speaker 1: could perish, but the I'm not sure the casual I understands,
Speaker 1: like the center is barely holding this year for the
Speaker 1: PGA Tour. Like they were able to cop it all together.
Speaker 1: They threw a bunch of money at the problem, they
Speaker 1: kept the players they could keep, and they just bought
Speaker 1: themselves a year. But the ship is really gonna hit
Speaker 1: the fan in two thousand four when all they have
Speaker 1: to go to all these sponsors and they have to
Speaker 1: tell them what they want and need from them, and
Speaker 1: companies that may have already been rethinking the cost of
Speaker 1: hosting when that cost doubles or triples. Um, they're gonna
Speaker 1: start hemorrhaging sponsors. And then it's gonna get really interesting
Speaker 1: because you know, I been talking to a lot of
Speaker 1: players about this. Um. You know, like Peter mal Naughty.
Speaker 1: He's one of the four now now five player directors
Speaker 1: for the PGA Tour, and he's the only one who's
Speaker 1: not a very you know, accomplished golfer. He's won a
Speaker 1: bunch of tournaments and and this and that, And I said,
Speaker 1: I mean, is it your role to represent you know,
Speaker 1: the middle class on Tori said, that's why I did this,
Speaker 1: Like we have to have a voice. He's like, I'm
Speaker 1: not comfortable with the way things got shoved through at
Speaker 1: that Delaware meeting. We went outside of our normal governance
Speaker 1: and someone's got to stand up for the little guy.
Speaker 1: And he's like, I'm not sure I wanted to be
Speaker 1: that person, but someone had to do it. And I
Speaker 1: talked to Kevin Streelman at Pebble Beach. Um, you know,
Speaker 1: he's had a very nice career, but he's never been
Speaker 1: one of the top top guys. And he's he's up
Speaker 1: to possibly be on the board next year, and um,
Speaker 1: I said, can we talk? He said, I'm dying to talk,
Speaker 1: but I can't do it right now. There's just too
Speaker 1: much going on. You know, There's there's gonna be a
Speaker 1: big player meeting at bay Hill, and that's when a
Speaker 1: lot of stuff is gonna have to get hashed out
Speaker 1: and it's gonna be fraught. I mean, to be in
Speaker 1: that room would be spectacular, because, um, the players on
Speaker 1: the PG Tour still don't know what the fields are
Speaker 1: going to be for these elevated events next year. What
Speaker 1: do you have to do to be one of the guys,
Speaker 1: is it top fifty, top seventy, top one dred Like
Speaker 1: kekn Bradley told me, He's like, I don't even know
Speaker 1: what the target is, Like, I don't know what my
Speaker 1: goal is for this year. So I'm just saying I
Speaker 1: got to get in the top fifty because they're gonna
Speaker 1: have to at least have fifty guys in those fields.
Speaker 1: But um, it's it's a very unusual moment in the
Speaker 1: game where the players are starting to there's this this
Speaker 1: discontent is fermenting and you know, I've asked some of them,
Speaker 1: why not have why not have a union? You only
Speaker 1: support doesn't have a union. You got the top twenty
Speaker 1: guys in the secret meeting setting policy for two other
Speaker 1: dudes who are in very different places in their career, Like,
Speaker 1: how is that even possible? And a lot of the
Speaker 1: players are like it's it sucks. You know, I'm not
Speaker 1: happy about it. Um. I understand the stars are important
Speaker 1: and we got to take care of them, but what
Speaker 1: about the rest of us? And so this is all
Speaker 1: bubbling under the surface, and um, depending on on how
Speaker 1: some of these decisions go and what happens with the sponsors,
Speaker 1: what happens with the schedule. It could it could get
Speaker 1: really messy, and of course that's what I'm rooting for,
Speaker 1: because I always root for anarchy. But um, the Tours
Speaker 1: managed to have this season come off somewhat smoothly and
Speaker 1: and have this appearance of a reshape PG tour. But
Speaker 1: everything is up for grabs right now. Michael, what we're
Speaker 1: gonna say, Yeah, that's all very well said Alan Jay
Speaker 1: Monna Han has done actually a masterful job getting this
Speaker 1: year off the ground, and Greg Norman and his people
Speaker 1: have actually a masterful job getting Live up and running
Speaker 1: as fast as they did. But this is a very big,
Speaker 1: very big. But golf is leaderless right now. And all
Speaker 1: the traditional models that we four and Mac who who
Speaker 1: had to click off and and all of our listeners
Speaker 1: basically grew up on the models are gone. Like the
Speaker 1: great model of baseball pre Bud Sealing, of a commissioner
Speaker 1: who looks out for the fans, the owners and the players,
Speaker 1: that's gone. I mean that used to existing golf. It's gone.
Speaker 1: There's nobody in this whole discussion. All we're talking about is,
Speaker 1: you know, to use the phrase we've used, you know,
Speaker 1: the rich, the rich and the richer. Yet Basically, no
Speaker 1: one's talking about the ordinary fan and going to Sanderson
Speaker 1: Farms and going to Colonial or you know, trying to
Speaker 1: snag a ticket for for more if you're lucky enough.
Speaker 1: The fan is being completely ignored here. There's been never
Speaker 1: any discussion of what can we do to make this
Speaker 1: PG two are more lively, more interesting, more team events,
Speaker 1: more mixed events, whatever it might be. It's just business
Speaker 1: as usual and cater to the super rich and the
Speaker 1: super talented, and it's got people very frustrated and is
Speaker 1: really turning people off. And they're all forgetting about who
Speaker 1: pays the bills around here, and of course it is
Speaker 1: the fan. So I feel like when when you get
Speaker 1: into a conversation linguist and you really think about where
Speaker 1: the PUGA Tour is going, it's lost. I I would
Speaker 1: I would say all of that is totally true, because
Speaker 1: I've talked to enough tournament sponsors to tell you that
Speaker 1: j Monhan and the PGA Tour and whatever you quote
Speaker 1: as leadership is not doing anything to talk with the
Speaker 1: sponsors are with these other players outside the top twenty.
Speaker 1: They're talking at them, They're telling him exactly what the
Speaker 1: planet there is no actual let's sit down, Let's hear
Speaker 1: some thoughts. Let's make sure they're focused on those those
Speaker 1: marquee players, and let the chips fall where they may.
Speaker 1: Where these are the top players, these are where they're
Speaker 1: gonna play. This is the amount amount you're gonna and Alan,
Speaker 1: you said they kind of secured this year. I'm not
Speaker 1: sure they have. I'm not so sure that there's not
Speaker 1: gonna be there's not gonna be sponsors who are gonna
Speaker 1: walk in the middle of this year and say, you
Speaker 1: know what, based on what you're telling us about what
Speaker 1: the future is. I'm out now. I'm out because I'm
Speaker 1: not I'm not like the way we're being treated or
Speaker 1: or how we're being dealt with, or how we're not
Speaker 1: a part of the process. I mean, have they secured here?
Speaker 1: I just don't think that's it, that's a done deal yet.
Speaker 1: That would be epic. I mean, Ryan, what does this
Speaker 1: mean to to your constituency? Like if the PG Tour
Speaker 1: becomes even more of a closed shop, it's fewer tournaments
Speaker 1: and it's smaller fields, Like do we do we assume
Speaker 1: they'll pump more money into the KFT and and you
Speaker 1: can at least make a decent living there or is
Speaker 1: it just an absolute free for all. You gotta go
Speaker 1: to Asia, you gotta go to Japan, you gotta go Australasia,
Speaker 1: you gotta go to Europe. Like what does this mean
Speaker 1: for your guys? Yeah, I mean I've always been scared
Speaker 1: that once lived became a viable option, and now we're
Speaker 1: at these elevated events that were headed for to live tours. Right,
Speaker 1: It's like, I don't understand how the corn ferry and
Speaker 1: this tour under a tour can survive. Um, you know,
Speaker 1: everyone was like it creates more playing opportunities. You us
Speaker 1: it has in the short term, but I'm just not
Speaker 1: sure if that's a viable option, uh in the long term.
Speaker 1: And so you know that the it's pretty well understood
Speaker 1: that Monday Qualifiers aren't going to be a part of
Speaker 1: the elevated events going forward. It's going to be some
Speaker 1: sort of reduced field and uh it's it's unfortunate. Um,
Speaker 1: you know, I I tweeted it out tonight, is is
Speaker 1: I really think? And it's just not about Monday Qualifiers.
Speaker 1: It's about the competitions. Michael said it a billion times,
Speaker 1: is who makes the cut and who doesn't and all
Speaker 1: those kinds of things are what the tour has overlived.
Speaker 1: And I just don't understand leading the other way. I
Speaker 1: will never understand it. Obviously I'm biased, I get that,
Speaker 1: but I just don't understand why you're trying to Jay
Speaker 1: Monahan has said that they can't compete dollar for dollar,
Speaker 1: so why try to uh lean into something else and whatever?
Speaker 1: Since he said that, by the all he's done is
Speaker 1: tried to compete dollar for dollar every from the day
Speaker 1: that he said that I can't compete dollar for dollar,
Speaker 1: every move has been to compete dollar for dollar. Every move. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's what all said. And it's sad because you know,
Speaker 1: Abraham Answer won the tournament in Saudi Arabia, and he's
Speaker 1: such an appealing player, I mean, devastatingly handsome, has a
Speaker 1: great backstory. I love how tidy his game is, and
Speaker 1: it seems like he could he could be a guy
Speaker 1: who played really well on big stages. And it's only
Speaker 1: his third win and he's like, Okay, he's built towards
Speaker 1: something really cool. But now the live season is gonna
Speaker 1: start and he's just gonna recede from view. And you know,
Speaker 1: he earned some world ranking points in this Asian Tour
Speaker 1: event that might help get him into the majors, but
Speaker 1: it's not a sure thing based on how We'll see
Speaker 1: how the numbers go. And it's like, you know, I
Speaker 1: was really really excited about Abraham answer a couple of
Speaker 1: years ago, as as this up and coming international superstar
Speaker 1: who was carrying the flag for you know, the great
Speaker 1: country met Go and all this stuff, and and um,
Speaker 1: it was a nice win, but how do you build
Speaker 1: on it when you when you go, you go back
Speaker 1: to live where no one's really watching the competition that closely.
Speaker 1: So even that was kind of a bummer. Like all
Speaker 1: those players jilted Pebble Beach, they went to Saudi Arabia
Speaker 1: to take the money, but um, the result in my
Speaker 1: mind is devalued. So it's just ties up what you're saying, Michael,
Speaker 1: do you what you want to say? Our colleague Jeff
Speaker 1: Ogilvy has made this point repeatedly to us. We all
Speaker 1: to different degrees, have a very American centric view. We
Speaker 1: grew up on the PG Tour, We love golf, we
Speaker 1: wish we could play at that level. Um, but I
Speaker 1: have not Abraham answers name. First off, I didn't know
Speaker 1: who won in Saudi Arabe until you just said it.
Speaker 1: That's so much I care and I love golf to
Speaker 1: Abraham answer his name, Abe answer, and I've enjoyed interviewing
Speaker 1: him a lot. His name is not come into my
Speaker 1: mind once since he went to live. And so to
Speaker 1: those who say us let him go, there's a lot
Speaker 1: to be said for just let him go, because Colin
Speaker 1: Marikawa is a great young talent, and I'm glad he's
Speaker 1: stating for now if you care about the pH A Tour,
Speaker 1: which I do. But if he left, there's there be,
Speaker 1: there'll be and there'll be a new one. So they're
Speaker 1: really I'm really as Matt said, you know all he's
Speaker 1: done his match dollar for dollar. I'm really not sure
Speaker 1: this strategy plays out in the long term. And I
Speaker 1: wish I could say the name. But someone who's really
Speaker 1: smart in golf that we all know said to me,
Speaker 1: I'd said, what just what would you say to j
Speaker 1: He'd say, I'd say let him go. And once you
Speaker 1: take that mindset and you realize that we the fans
Speaker 1: are in control, it's the game where the great the
Speaker 1: greatness of the game is the game, and the greatness
Speaker 1: of professional golf is that we care about what happens. Uh,
Speaker 1: so we're going to care about what happens. And you know, no,
Speaker 1: but that you know, Mac as you said, had to
Speaker 1: had to jump off and got to love his his
Speaker 1: insight and perspective because I love hearing from the business
Speaker 1: side of of the players. But Max said it all
Speaker 1: along from day one. If you're the tour let him go,
Speaker 1: let him go, and stay true to who you are
Speaker 1: and what you are and the model you have. And
Speaker 1: then I mean, and and that just didn't happen. But
Speaker 1: that's exactly what Max said from day one. I mean,
Speaker 1: I go back to Ryan's monologue at the start of
Speaker 1: this podcast, was so beautiful and eloquent about this is
Speaker 1: what it's all about. I mean, it's the competition, it's
Speaker 1: the human element. And you know, we're lucky if we
Speaker 1: still have Monday cues and and we still have tournaments
Speaker 1: like Pebble Beach where we had a bunch of guys
Speaker 1: fighting for their livelihoods and there was there was a
Speaker 1: palpable hunger among you know. I mean, speaking of Pumil Naughty,
Speaker 1: he had a chance to change his whole career. He
Speaker 1: didn't get it done, but he played really well, and
Speaker 1: he can build on that. There was a bunch of
Speaker 1: guys that leaderboard that I found intriguing. They weren't big stars,
Speaker 1: but it doesn't mean they can't be in a year
Speaker 1: or two. And so um it is. It's a very interesting,
Speaker 1: interesting moment in all of this, um Alan, you can
Speaker 1: absolutely write a book for the ages here because what
Speaker 1: we are really seeing here, we we have this intense
Speaker 1: interest in this narrow thing. But this narrow thing is
Speaker 1: revealing our culture where it is right now, more than
Speaker 1: almost anything you could imagine. I mean, it dovetails right
Speaker 1: off of the Trump election and the fascination with celebrity
Speaker 1: that got Trump elected in the first place. Uh, we
Speaker 1: don't know what MBSs motives are here. If he's just
Speaker 1: trying to be if he's just trying to disrupt corporate America.
Speaker 1: He's shown that he didn't, you know, with the snap
Speaker 1: of the finger and a few billion dollars in years
Speaker 1: a hundred billion dollars more where that came from. So uh,
Speaker 1: these are scarily interesting. He's trying to court corporate America.
Speaker 1: I've been reading a lot of MBS. I'm like on
Speaker 1: my third book now, and I mean he's obsessed with
Speaker 1: turning Saudi Arabia into a modern commercial center for banking
Speaker 1: and for tourism and for all of these things. And
Speaker 1: that's why they're willing to lose money on this little
Speaker 1: golf league, is because it gets them into the room
Speaker 1: with all the power brokers and and all the big
Speaker 1: banks and all the big sponsors and all the guys
Speaker 1: in the pro ams and so um. It's you know,
Speaker 1: it's just a trojan horse to try and to try
Speaker 1: and get into these these other industries and these other
Speaker 1: conversations and so um. He I mean, he is a
Speaker 1: disruptive force. I mean his vision for Saudi Arabia was
Speaker 1: to completely modernize it in every possible way. Um. And
Speaker 1: except for how he treat his own citizens, you know,
Speaker 1: has always been this what they do publicly and what
Speaker 1: they do privately. In in the international community they want
Speaker 1: to see being seen as progressive, and at home they
Speaker 1: crack down on descent and and you know there's brutal oppression.
Speaker 1: But it's this dichotomy there and so um, that's where
Speaker 1: the golf comes in. I mean, it's not a it's
Speaker 1: not a secret. He's trying to court the decision makers
Speaker 1: and he's trying to he's trying to buy a seat
Speaker 1: the table at all these powerful institutions, and golf is
Speaker 1: a great way to do it. But Alan, I don't Alan,
Speaker 1: I don't like his chances of getting into Augusta National.
Speaker 1: He's building his own evidently. Yeah, that was another well
Speaker 1: said Brian. That was another news break. Some piece of
Speaker 1: land cells in Augusta, Georgia, and all of a sudden
Speaker 1: Live Golf is going to build their own Augusta National
Speaker 1: and then they're gonna host something the week of the Masters,
Speaker 1: and it all went the whole rumor's mill went kind
Speaker 1: of crazy. And Matt, you were helpful in debunking that.
Speaker 1: But just I mean, parcels of lands all the time
Speaker 1: to golf developers, and but in this overheated era, like
Speaker 1: all of a sudden has this jeo political importance and
Speaker 1: it's just kind of wild. What can you give us
Speaker 1: the TikTok on that story? Well, only just that I
Speaker 1: was debunking Core and Crenshaw being a part of of
Speaker 1: a piece of property near Augustic National in which it
Speaker 1: would be built for the South East and you know,
Speaker 1: compete for you know, some sort of attention around the
Speaker 1: time of the Masters, to which you know Core and Crenshaw.
Speaker 1: That's an absolute no, in no way, shape or form.
Speaker 1: Ben Crunshall hosts the Champions dinner to two time Masters winner.
Speaker 1: He's like Mr Bobby Jones, historian, you know, Augusta enthusiast,
Speaker 1: and it would be there would be not a chance
Speaker 1: in hell, not only for the fact that they're busy
Speaker 1: and they're booked for the next three or four years.
Speaker 1: But it's just not Scott says, who manages, you know,
Speaker 1: helps with the business of corn Crunch, has said absolutely not.
Speaker 1: This is a definitive no. So that's the only thing
Speaker 1: I was debunking. Then Scotty called me back and said,
Speaker 1: actually the land that they were shown and that uh
Speaker 1: they were you know, the plans that they sort of
Speaker 1: you know, observed, actually wasn't the land that was talked
Speaker 1: about by one of the one of the social handles.
Speaker 1: And so there there's you know, now now there is
Speaker 1: there could be two pieces of land that are being purchasing.
Speaker 1: I'd say, what's happening with the land around Augusta is
Speaker 1: still a mystery, but I can definitely tell you that
Speaker 1: corn Crunch are not going to be involved that's funny.
Speaker 1: I mean, just the juiciness never ends. Um I will
Speaker 1: say a much needed tonic for these troubling times is
Speaker 1: the new episode of The Grind that drops on February seven.
Speaker 1: This episode three, and it follows this young woman named
Speaker 1: Page Crawford on the road to the LPGA. She's living
Speaker 1: in her van and she traveling with her girlfriend and
Speaker 1: it's just the sweetest, most intimate story. And um I
Speaker 1: have rarely consumed a piece of content that left me
Speaker 1: wanting to root for an athlete more than this this story.
Speaker 1: And um I hope all you all you folks out
Speaker 1: there have seen episodes one and two, which which were
Speaker 1: obviously really cool, and Ryan French played a big part
Speaker 1: in them. And it's clear see your pebble Beach and
Speaker 1: you're on the PGA tour and and you know, Ryan
Speaker 1: and Mark Baldwin are hopping from tournament to tournament and
Speaker 1: airport to airport, and there was like an incredible energy
Speaker 1: and sort of propulsion to those two episodes. And this
Speaker 1: one has a different feeling. It's it's the sort of
Speaker 1: meditative and it's beautiful, and um I really hope everyone
Speaker 1: checks out this episode. We're super proud of it, and
Speaker 1: I think it elevates this whole series to a different
Speaker 1: place because it just shows all these all these players
Speaker 1: are doing it their own way and it's unique. So
Speaker 1: before we go, I just I just wanted to give
Speaker 1: a shout out to episode three of The Grind, which
Speaker 1: is probably my favorite one, and um, I implore all
Speaker 1: of you to carve out twenty minutes to enjoy it. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I had a really good conversation with Page and making
Speaker 1: Uh it's a great addition. We'll have that out later
Speaker 1: in the week. And uh, yeah, it's it's very good.
Speaker 1: When you live in a van and cook every meal
Speaker 1: in that van, that is truly the Grind. How about
Speaker 1: the pullout toilet? I mean at that point when they
Speaker 1: when they reveal their their porta potty, which is something
Speaker 1: that looks like a box. It looks like the box
Speaker 1: the size of something you get shoes in, and that's
Speaker 1: where they use as a restaurant. I'm like, what that
Speaker 1: if that's not the ground? I mean Page Crawford, Mark
Speaker 1: Baldwin and then Andre Metzger Dalton Ward Brett White, like
Speaker 1: three guys that just got in Today's Monday Cue. That
Speaker 1: to me is just so much more interesting and compelling
Speaker 1: and worth time and energy and interest. It's just so
Speaker 1: much better. Uh So that's where I'm going to continue
Speaker 1: to focus my energy and attention. It's just thank you
Speaker 1: Ryan for bringing all these to life, bring him to life.
Speaker 1: Thank you guys for giving me the opportunity it's been today.
Speaker 1: Like h uh, I mean I think I hope that
Speaker 1: that's what comes through, but like, I truly love that stuff.
Speaker 1: It was so cool to see. Uh you know, there
Speaker 1: was probably fifty or a hundred fans out there total today,
Speaker 1: and like, I love that we have all had some
Speaker 1: sort of small effect. I'm telling you that's four that's
Speaker 1: forty seven to ninety seven more fans than are normal
Speaker 1: at a normal Monday. Que. Okay, so like ninety seven
Speaker 1: more than any other Monday que. So uh, I mean,
Speaker 1: it's just it was just uh it was great. It's
Speaker 1: it's just awesome. I uh, super super fired up about
Speaker 1: what happened today. It's a ideal and I hope that
Speaker 1: all three make the cut. Were you fired up with
Speaker 1: that last Versias was riding shotgun for you today? That
Speaker 1: son of a bitch I just steal my gig. Well, people,
Speaker 1: believing he had people believing he was trying to steal
Speaker 1: just I'm reading comments right now that are still met
Speaker 1: at last, like hey you why don't you know went
Speaker 1: out to the one day qualifier with Ryan and he
Speaker 1: had this running bit or he's like, Wow, these Monday
Speaker 1: qualifiers are great. Someone should really write about these, And
Speaker 1: to his everlasting credit, he just kept a bit going
Speaker 1: the whole day, like and like he was breaking all
Speaker 1: these stories and all this news and Allen. The best
Speaker 1: part of it is in the first one that he
Speaker 1: says he's doing this, I'm sitting right behind him, like
Speaker 1: it's not like he just did this on his own.
Speaker 1: I'm sitting in the car with him in the first
Speaker 1: couple of them, like, this is not It's just not.
Speaker 1: It was. It was great Twitter content. It really made
Speaker 1: the day fun. And U Ryan's stories, which we're gonna
Speaker 1: get off this podcast. We can start typing it. That'll
Speaker 1: be up tomorrow. Um well, I should say on February seven,
Speaker 1: depending on when you listen to this. His whole dispatch
Speaker 1: from from the Mega a Monday Qualify here in Phoenix. So, uh,
Speaker 1: you know, it's just another intriguing and and fascinating and
Speaker 1: maddening wee can golf. But as as Michael said eloquently,
Speaker 1: the game is the game. The game never changes, and
Speaker 1: if you can filter out some of these other things
Speaker 1: that the beauty of golf and a tournament golf, it
Speaker 1: still remains. So um, look forward to you not what
Speaker 1: Ryan's been up to. I'll have an ask Allen up
Speaker 1: on on the on the website. We'll have the Grind episode. Uh,
Speaker 1: there's all kinds of good stuff. We have the accompanying
Speaker 1: podcast that's called the Grind Podcast that that Ryan mentioned
Speaker 1: where he goes sort of the story behind the story
Speaker 1: with Paige Crawford, and who knows what other surprises are coming.
Speaker 1: We know Michael's working on a couple of cool stories. So,
Speaker 1: as always, thank you for listening to these fire drills.
Speaker 1: Thanks for checking out our stuff on on fire Pit
Speaker 1: Collective dot com. Any any partying words before we go, Fellas,
Speaker 1: these are interesting times. He doesn't look like Michael's in
Speaker 1: one of those movies. Doesn't look like when Michael's in
Speaker 1: one of those movies. He's headed to heaven, like up
Speaker 1: in the top corners. It's like light at the corner, yes,
Speaker 1: very much. Yeah, it's like, oh, no, Michael's passing away.
Speaker 1: That's alright, Michael, stay here with us. We're gonna We're
Speaker 1: gonna let Michael move on to the hereafter. So um,
Speaker 1: this is Alan Schipnuk for Ryan French Matchinella, Michael Bamberger
Speaker 1: and Mac Barnhart sign off from this fire. Drill thinks
Speaker 1: as always for listening, and we'll do it again soon.
Speaker 1: That's the end, then big play to win. Made a
Speaker 1: fortune with my ship game. I ran the table and
Speaker 1: thought I could fall. Then the winter hit me like
Speaker 1: a cannon ball, and now I can't shake is losing
Speaker 1: the street. Every road I take isn't head in the street.
Speaker 1: I got thoughts in my head, can't get aloud, trying
Speaker 1: not to think what I'm thinking about. I got thoughts
Speaker 1: in my head. I can't get them out, trying not
Speaker 1: to think what I'm thinking about.