WEBVTT - Fresh (2022)

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<v Speaker 1>On the Bechdel Cast.

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<v Speaker 2>The questions asked if movies.

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<v Speaker 1>Have women in them, are all their discussions just boyfriends

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<v Speaker 1>and husbands, or do they have individualism? It's the patriarchy,

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<v Speaker 1>zeph and bast start changing it with the Bechdel Cast.

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<v Speaker 3>Nonmnam, Jamie, I'm hungry for.

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<v Speaker 2>What for you?

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<v Speaker 3>For me?

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<v Speaker 2>For my ass?

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, for your ass and your titties.

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<v Speaker 2>Egg on my ass. I thought he took her whole ass,

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<v Speaker 2>but it turns out just a portion.

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<v Speaker 3>Questions I'm not sure, wait, because she seems like she

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<v Speaker 3>has her ass pretty much intact afterwards.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but I don't know. But I guess I forgot again.

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<v Speaker 2>My male gaze radar is all off, and I forgot

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<v Speaker 2>to check the size of her ass at the beginning

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<v Speaker 2>of the movie. Well, I was looking okay, good, good, disrespectfully.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm sure.

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<v Speaker 3>Yes, I was gazing in a very objectifying way and

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<v Speaker 3>I didn't notice that much of a difference.

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<v Speaker 2>Wow, get her ass? Okay, Welcome to Wow. What a really,

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<v Speaker 2>really feminist introduction to the episode. Welcome to the Bechdel Cast.

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<v Speaker 2>My name's Jamie Loftus.

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<v Speaker 3>My name is Caitlin Durante, and this is our show

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<v Speaker 3>where we examine movies through an intersectional feminist lens, using

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<v Speaker 3>the Bechdel Test as a jumping off point, as frelutely

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<v Speaker 3>and what's that, Jamie Well.

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<v Speaker 2>The Bechdel Test is a media metric created by Alison

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<v Speaker 2>Bechdel and her friend Liz Wallace, which is why it's

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<v Speaker 2>often called the Bechdel Wallace Test. It was originally created

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<v Speaker 2>as a bit for Alison Bechdel's iconic I host was

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<v Speaker 2>an iconic comic collection Nice to Watch out for, but

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<v Speaker 2>eventually it became used as a sort of metric to

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<v Speaker 2>see if people care about characters of marginalized genders, and

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<v Speaker 2>the answer is often know. Today, I think we have

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<v Speaker 2>a great discussion ahead. Yes, So the version of the

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<v Speaker 2>test that we use a little bit of a modified version,

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<v Speaker 2>requires that two characters of a marginalized gender with names

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<v Speaker 2>speak to each other about something other than a man

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<v Speaker 2>for two lines of dialogue or more. Yeah, that's sort

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<v Speaker 2>of what we're up to. I appreciate if nothing else,

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<v Speaker 2>the movie we're talking about today really warns you about

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<v Speaker 2>men from Oregon, And I think that's a really important

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<v Speaker 2>psa that I rarely see reflected in film. To all

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<v Speaker 2>of our listeners in organ can't wait to see you

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<v Speaker 2>at the next live show. But like men from Oregon

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<v Speaker 2>scary scary to me personally in my lived experience, I'm

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<v Speaker 2>afraid of them in my lived experience. They want to

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<v Speaker 2>steal my ass and eat it. That's just my lived experience.

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<v Speaker 3>Sure to sure that hasn't happened to me yet. Time

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<v Speaker 3>will tell.

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<v Speaker 2>I was about to say, well, it's just a matter

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<v Speaker 2>of time. It's just a matter of time. You meet

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<v Speaker 2>them in a different city and then you find out

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<v Speaker 2>month's sin they're from Oregon, and then you're like, oh,

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<v Speaker 2>this man's trying to kill me.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah. Anyways, we're covering Fresh twenty twenty two, originally released

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<v Speaker 3>on Hulu. Was it, I believe Jamie? What's your relationship

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<v Speaker 3>slash history with the movie?

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<v Speaker 2>Well, first, I just realized that the character played by

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<v Speaker 2>Sebastian stand is in fact from Texas. So I would

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<v Speaker 2>like to modify as he tells us. And so actually

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<v Speaker 2>I would just like to say, Men who Live Live,

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<v Speaker 2>I'd like to totally backtrack everything I said. I was

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<v Speaker 2>just trying to be rude to an ex boyfriend. There's

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<v Speaker 2>plenty of time left in the episode to do that.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>In any case, my history with this movie is that

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<v Speaker 2>I had not seen it. I meant to and then didn't,

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<v Speaker 2>as so very often happens to me with movies on streamers.

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<v Speaker 2>It's weird. I feel like I used to be sort

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<v Speaker 2>of the reverse of this, but now it's like I

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<v Speaker 2>am much less likely to watch a movie if I

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<v Speaker 2>if I don't get a chance to watch it in theaters.

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<v Speaker 3>You're a theater girly.

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<v Speaker 2>Now I'm a theater girl. I'm an AFC Stubbs passholder.

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<v Speaker 2>So yeah, I would have loved to see this in theaters.

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<v Speaker 2>It's a bummer that that didn't happen. I don't know

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<v Speaker 2>if there was like a limited release or something, but

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<v Speaker 2>but yeah, I really like the stars of this movie,

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<v Speaker 2>Daisy Egga Jones and of course Itanio's own Sebastian Stan.

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<v Speaker 3>Yes.

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<v Speaker 2>So I was excited to see it and i'd never

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<v Speaker 2>seen I know that this was the director Mimi Cave's

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<v Speaker 2>feature length debut, which is wild. I feel like it's

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<v Speaker 2>such a fully realized thing. Yeah, I enjoyed it. It's

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<v Speaker 2>a brief and uncomplicated history with this movie.

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<v Speaker 3>What about you, Caitlin, I did see it about a

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<v Speaker 3>year ago. Maybe not right when it came out, but

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<v Speaker 3>within not too long of it being released. Our mutual

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<v Speaker 3>friend Bryant and I watched it together and I thought

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<v Speaker 3>it was interesting.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I think.

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<v Speaker 3>I already knew what it was about. It's about cannibalism,

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<v Speaker 3>and I knew that going in, so I wasn't like

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<v Speaker 3>surprised at the twist or anything.

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<v Speaker 2>I kind of was surprised at well, if we can

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<v Speaker 2>talk about like pacing good stuff. Yeah, because I also

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<v Speaker 2>felt I hadn't even seen the trailer for it. I

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<v Speaker 2>don't think, but I knew what this movie was about,

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<v Speaker 2>like maybe just through like hearsay or whatever it was.

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<v Speaker 2>But yeah, but yeah, it takes a long time for

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<v Speaker 2>it to reveal that it's a cannibal movie for a

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<v Speaker 2>movie that it seems like everyone knows is a cannibal movie, right,

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<v Speaker 2>What are you gonna do?

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<v Speaker 3>What are you gonna do? I did earlier today write

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<v Speaker 3>a letter boxed.

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<v Speaker 2>Review bra I've never done before.

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<v Speaker 3>Yes, simply states this movie gives new meaning to the

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<v Speaker 3>term meet cute.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I gotta hand it to you. I gotta hand

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<v Speaker 2>it to you.

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<v Speaker 3>Thank you so much. But anyway, Yeah, I saw the movie.

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<v Speaker 3>I was like, oh, that was pretty cool, and now

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<v Speaker 3>we're talking about it, so let's proceed, shall we.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm very excited. Yeah, there is a certain amount of

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<v Speaker 2>like Catharsis, to watch a good movie like this, for sure,

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<v Speaker 2>I quite enjoy So if nothing else, I feel like,

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<v Speaker 2>there it's a good opportunity for us to publicly air

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<v Speaker 2>out some personal dating horrors. And isn't that beautiful?

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<v Speaker 3>That's honestly a lot of what my discussion will be

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<v Speaker 3>about here today.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, great, then welcome to a gossip with us, because yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>I feel like I really enjoyed this movie, and part

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<v Speaker 2>of it was because they were just like you could

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<v Speaker 2>just tell that it was written by a woman who

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<v Speaker 2>has to date men. Just there were like these little

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<v Speaker 2>details that you're like ooh oof, no eh hah, yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>that including like there's nothing more bone chilling than being

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<v Speaker 2>in a man's home and there's no signal and you're

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<v Speaker 2>like scary. I hate to ruin the mood, but I

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<v Speaker 2>remember having to do that once, being like I hate

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<v Speaker 2>to like wreck the mood, but like I need you

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<v Speaker 2>to give me the Wi Fi just in case you

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<v Speaker 2>want to kill me, and like, but you just have

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<v Speaker 2>to be direct about it because honestly, at that point,

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<v Speaker 2>if he's gonna kill you, he would just start at

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<v Speaker 2>the request.

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<v Speaker 3>This is true.

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<v Speaker 2>It's not like I can change my fate at this point.

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<v Speaker 2>But yeah, I like that reminded me of a couple

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<v Speaker 2>of years ago we were just like, oh my god, Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>you have to be like, hey, I'm awkward, but I

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<v Speaker 2>need to be able to call nine one one in

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<v Speaker 2>case you're horrible.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah. Also, so we just covered get Out and I

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<v Speaker 3>watched this movie on the same day that we covered,

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<v Speaker 3>So I like watched it out in the morning we

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<v Speaker 3>recorded that episode, and then like later that night I

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<v Speaker 3>watched Fresh so Wild. What a day?

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<v Speaker 2>What a day for you?

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<v Speaker 3>But the movie follows similar beats in the sense that

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<v Speaker 3>it's like someone who goes to this unfamiliar place with

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<v Speaker 3>a romantic partner. They have alterior motives. Yeah, the protagonist

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<v Speaker 3>gets abducted, they have to try to escape, death is

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<v Speaker 3>or you know, loss of autonomy is imminent. You know,

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<v Speaker 3>lots of stuff like that, and then a victorious, triumphant

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<v Speaker 3>escape from the protagonist at the end. So like, you know,

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<v Speaker 3>obviously very different stories, but like following similar beats.

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<v Speaker 2>Similar beats. I didn't think about that. Yeah, that's very

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<v Speaker 2>very true. Similar friend to the rescue thing. Yes, indeed,

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<v Speaker 2>although I did love that they had oh my gosh,

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<v Speaker 2>what is this character's name bartender?

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<v Speaker 3>Oh, Paul Paul.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah. I love that they did have Paul be like no.

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<v Speaker 3>No, he shows up to help and then he's like

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<v Speaker 3>never mind.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and you're just like, well, I you know, I

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<v Speaker 2>wish he had called someone else, but I don't not

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<v Speaker 2>get it.

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<v Speaker 3>Right because he's well, we'll talk about him. But yeah,

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<v Speaker 3>I found that interesting.

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<v Speaker 2>I thought that was an interesting fake out because you

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<v Speaker 2>I think maybe it is because we just watched to

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<v Speaker 2>get Out. I kept waiting for like the TSA moments

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<v Speaker 2>at the end of get Out, you're like, oh, no,

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<v Speaker 2>he's gonna leave. I guess that that is like pretty realistic.

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<v Speaker 3>Anyways, I'll do the recap and then we'll go from there.

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<v Speaker 2>Let's do it.

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<v Speaker 3>Actually, let's take a quick break first and then we'll

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<v Speaker 3>come back.

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<v Speaker 4>Oh all right, welcome back.

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<v Speaker 3>Will you're back?

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<v Speaker 2>Sharpen your freaking blades.

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<v Speaker 3>Baby, oh or your teeth, because I just stand i'snna

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<v Speaker 3>eat your s sebashians Stan, Like, what is going on there?

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<v Speaker 2>I've been trying to figure out what is going on there?

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<v Speaker 2>For years? What's going on there?

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<v Speaker 3>Because I remember you saying you could not register who

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<v Speaker 3>that person was until Titania came out, and then you're like, oh,

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<v Speaker 3>now I know who he is because he plays is

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<v Speaker 3>it Jeff Galuley, Yes, thank you.

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<v Speaker 2>We're a great recall.

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<v Speaker 3>Wow.

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<v Speaker 2>Uh yes, I think that maybe you know, in retrospect,

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<v Speaker 2>my issue with registering Sebashians Stan's face had more to

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<v Speaker 2>do with like Marvel glaze sure, where he was in

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<v Speaker 2>a lot of Marvel movies. And I feel like, this

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<v Speaker 2>is my theory, if you are in like enough Marvel movies,

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<v Speaker 2>your face just becomes naturally blurry to the human eye

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<v Speaker 2>for like five years, but then it wears off and

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<v Speaker 2>you're like, and he's and he's doing I haven't I

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<v Speaker 2>don't know. I saw the Donald Trump movie and I

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<v Speaker 2>was like.

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<v Speaker 3>Oh, okay.

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<v Speaker 2>But in any case, like he's he's a good actor,

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<v Speaker 2>and I feel like he tries a lot of interesting stuff.

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<v Speaker 2>But this was around the time where he was starting

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<v Speaker 2>to try more interesting stuff instead of just playing like

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<v Speaker 2>the Ppee Warrior or like whoever he is in Marvel?

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<v Speaker 2>Is he the Pepee Warrior? Uh?

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, no, that's correct. Is he the Winter Soldier or

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<v Speaker 3>is someone else the Winter Soldier? Don't answer my question, listeners,

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<v Speaker 3>I don't want to know, actually don't know.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm just like, congratulations to Sebashianstan for the blur finally

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<v Speaker 2>wearing off of his face. I do register him now

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<v Speaker 2>as an autonomous human man. And I think he's quite talented.

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<v Speaker 3>H yeah, no, but I agree it. Tanya really did

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<v Speaker 3>it for me. And while he plays a despicable character

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<v Speaker 3>in that movie, he is unfortunately so hot.

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<v Speaker 2>He's really hot in that movie, specifically the little mustache.

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<v Speaker 2>You're like, I know, what is it? And You're like

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<v Speaker 2>it's my dad. Like You're like, what the fun? Anyways, anyways,

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<v Speaker 2>let's keep moving. I do appreciate, like I feel like,

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<v Speaker 2>and this will change the next time we talk about

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<v Speaker 2>Sebastian Stan. None of this passes the Bechdel test. But

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<v Speaker 2>he has, like I appreciate when an actor recognizes they

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<v Speaker 2>have like a somewhat punishable kind of handsome face, because

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<v Speaker 2>Sebastia stand like he's like villainous handsome.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, yeah, I think so.

0:12:16.000 --> 0:12:20.600
<v Speaker 2>Anyways, Daisy Egar Jones was great in Twisters. Yeah, and

0:12:20.960 --> 0:12:23.360
<v Speaker 2>under the banner of Heaven, did you watch that.

0:12:23.679 --> 0:12:24.160
<v Speaker 3>I did not.

0:12:25.240 --> 0:12:29.040
<v Speaker 2>Well, it's really depressing. Don't watch it unless you want

0:12:29.040 --> 0:12:30.080
<v Speaker 2>to get really upset.

0:12:30.640 --> 0:12:32.960
<v Speaker 3>I feel like I know of it because you made

0:12:32.960 --> 0:12:35.640
<v Speaker 3>a joke to the effect of under the banner of

0:12:35.720 --> 0:12:37.680
<v Speaker 3>Kevin le mignonk you.

0:12:37.920 --> 0:12:40.520
<v Speaker 2>Thank you for bringing that up. I didn't know if

0:12:40.520 --> 0:12:43.520
<v Speaker 2>there's gonna be a way to bring that up organically. Yes,

0:12:43.920 --> 0:12:49.240
<v Speaker 2>I would absolutely watch under the banner of Kevin, under

0:12:49.280 --> 0:12:54.040
<v Speaker 2>the banner of Heaven, it's you know, it's an Andrew

0:12:54.040 --> 0:12:56.960
<v Speaker 2>Garfield Police detective show. I would say, maybe too sad,

0:12:57.160 --> 0:12:58.040
<v Speaker 2>maybe don't watch.

0:12:58.880 --> 0:13:01.360
<v Speaker 3>But under the banner of Kevin. Yes, anyway, Yes, let's

0:13:01.400 --> 0:13:04.200
<v Speaker 3>get it. Yeah, let's keep moving a lot.

0:13:04.320 --> 0:13:08.400
<v Speaker 2>I like Chaos episode, Chaos episode.

0:13:08.880 --> 0:13:09.080
<v Speaker 1>Ah.

0:13:09.320 --> 0:13:12.520
<v Speaker 3>Right. So this is a horror movie, so you know

0:13:12.679 --> 0:13:18.840
<v Speaker 3>content warnings. There's violence against women, there's abduction, there's human trafficking,

0:13:18.960 --> 0:13:25.080
<v Speaker 3>there's cannibalism. The movie takes place in the Pacific Northwest,

0:13:25.240 --> 0:13:27.040
<v Speaker 3>in Portland, specifically, I believe.

0:13:27.480 --> 0:13:28.839
<v Speaker 2>Yes we meet.

0:13:28.920 --> 0:13:34.800
<v Speaker 3>Noah played by Daisy Edgar Jones. She's a single lady

0:13:35.240 --> 0:13:40.959
<v Speaker 3>looking for, if not love, she's just dating. She's out

0:13:40.960 --> 0:13:43.960
<v Speaker 3>there dating, going on dates. She goes on a first

0:13:44.040 --> 0:13:46.880
<v Speaker 3>date with a guy who ends up being a total asshole.

0:13:47.640 --> 0:13:50.679
<v Speaker 3>She's not having luck on the dating apps. Men are

0:13:50.720 --> 0:13:55.760
<v Speaker 3>being gross and sending her dick pics unsolicited things like

0:13:55.800 --> 0:13:59.960
<v Speaker 3>that her best friend Molly played by Jojo t. Gibb

0:14:00.440 --> 0:14:04.040
<v Speaker 3>reassures Noah that she doesn't need a man, and they've

0:14:04.120 --> 0:14:08.199
<v Speaker 3>just been conditioned by Disney Princess movies to have unrealistic

0:14:08.280 --> 0:14:11.400
<v Speaker 3>expectations about love and romance.

0:14:11.160 --> 0:14:15.560
<v Speaker 2>And you're like, okay, twenty twelve, let's freaking go buzzby

0:14:15.640 --> 0:14:16.319
<v Speaker 2>twenty twelve.

0:14:18.000 --> 0:14:21.200
<v Speaker 3>So one night, Noah heads to the grocery store to

0:14:21.400 --> 0:14:26.360
<v Speaker 3>grab some treats. A guy there strikes up a conversation

0:14:26.480 --> 0:14:30.800
<v Speaker 3>with her about cotton candy grapes. This is Steve played

0:14:30.840 --> 0:14:32.000
<v Speaker 3>by Sebastian Stan.

0:14:32.440 --> 0:14:36.040
<v Speaker 2>Okay, Mistake number one, don't go on a date with

0:14:36.080 --> 0:14:38.200
<v Speaker 2>someone you meet in the vegetable aisle.

0:14:38.720 --> 0:14:41.320
<v Speaker 3>Proceed with caution. I would say, well.

0:14:41.120 --> 0:14:43.760
<v Speaker 2>I just the vegetables. Like if I met a guy,

0:14:44.000 --> 0:14:47.520
<v Speaker 2>you know, near the macaroni, I would be like sure,

0:14:47.680 --> 0:14:52.600
<v Speaker 2>you'd be like, ooh, yeah.

0:14:51.320 --> 0:14:53.640
<v Speaker 3>I did have a guy approach me in the grocery

0:14:53.640 --> 0:14:56.840
<v Speaker 3>store one time. This was back when I lived in Boston,

0:14:57.000 --> 0:15:02.080
<v Speaker 3>so probably like twelve years ago. Okay, and he was

0:15:02.160 --> 0:15:05.320
<v Speaker 3>just like, hi, You're so beautiful, and.

0:15:05.240 --> 0:15:06.000
<v Speaker 2>I said, who me?

0:15:09.120 --> 0:15:12.240
<v Speaker 3>And then we did go on a like coffee date.

0:15:12.320 --> 0:15:14.640
<v Speaker 3>I want to say, like later that day. It was

0:15:14.680 --> 0:15:17.120
<v Speaker 3>like a Saturday or Sunday, when I was just like, fu,

0:15:17.160 --> 0:15:18.320
<v Speaker 3>I'm not doing anything.

0:15:18.760 --> 0:15:20.000
<v Speaker 2>You almost got freshed.

0:15:20.440 --> 0:15:23.560
<v Speaker 3>I almost got freshed. But I quickly realized that I

0:15:23.600 --> 0:15:27.920
<v Speaker 3>was not romantically interested in him, and I said, I'm

0:15:27.960 --> 0:15:29.560
<v Speaker 3>going to leave forever now bye.

0:15:29.800 --> 0:15:30.040
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

0:15:30.400 --> 0:15:33.160
<v Speaker 3>So I saved myself from being freshed. Good for you,

0:15:33.400 --> 0:15:34.520
<v Speaker 3>Good for you, Thank you.

0:15:34.600 --> 0:15:38.000
<v Speaker 2>I feel like I'm constantly putting myself in situations where

0:15:38.000 --> 0:15:41.760
<v Speaker 2>I could possibly get freshed. It's a common criticism of me.

0:15:43.560 --> 0:15:45.480
<v Speaker 2>I mean, but so far, so good.

0:15:45.600 --> 0:15:48.800
<v Speaker 3>So far so good, and it's not your fault if

0:15:48.800 --> 0:15:49.440
<v Speaker 3>it happens.

0:15:49.960 --> 0:15:53.200
<v Speaker 2>I mean, let's be honest when.

0:15:55.440 --> 0:15:57.720
<v Speaker 3>Well, let's try not to put that out into the universe.

0:15:57.760 --> 0:16:02.120
<v Speaker 3>But anyway, she's approached by this, you know, charming guy

0:16:02.160 --> 0:16:05.240
<v Speaker 3>who's trying to flirt and he asks for her number,

0:16:05.480 --> 0:16:09.280
<v Speaker 3>and he's Sebastian Stan So she says yes, and she

0:16:09.320 --> 0:16:10.440
<v Speaker 3>gives him her number.

0:16:10.600 --> 0:16:13.600
<v Speaker 2>Who could blame her? She's but human, all right.

0:16:14.560 --> 0:16:18.160
<v Speaker 3>A few days later he texts her and they meet

0:16:18.240 --> 0:16:20.840
<v Speaker 3>up for a date and they hit it off. It

0:16:20.920 --> 0:16:25.080
<v Speaker 3>seems like they have a lot in common. They smooch,

0:16:25.800 --> 0:16:30.040
<v Speaker 3>they go back to her place, and Jamie they have sex.

0:16:32.640 --> 0:16:38.040
<v Speaker 2>Don't tell me that you should have done a content

0:16:38.080 --> 0:16:38.640
<v Speaker 2>warning for that.

0:16:39.000 --> 0:16:43.720
<v Speaker 3>Yeah sorry at the X Yeah stop. This episode is

0:16:43.800 --> 0:16:48.320
<v Speaker 3>rated R okay. So some time passes and they keep

0:16:48.360 --> 0:16:52.640
<v Speaker 3>seeing each other. It's going well, it's cute. He even

0:16:52.680 --> 0:16:57.880
<v Speaker 3>suggests they go away together on a weekend trip, but Mollie,

0:16:57.920 --> 0:17:00.720
<v Speaker 3>her best friend, is a bit wary of this because

0:17:00.720 --> 0:17:03.800
<v Speaker 3>he doesn't have social media, she's never met him, she

0:17:03.840 --> 0:17:06.639
<v Speaker 3>doesn't nobody looks like. She doesn't like that this trip

0:17:06.720 --> 0:17:09.960
<v Speaker 3>is this like surprise that he's kind of springing on Noah,

0:17:10.200 --> 0:17:13.800
<v Speaker 3>especially because like she doesn't know where they're going. But

0:17:13.840 --> 0:17:16.679
<v Speaker 3>they're like whatever, it will be fine. And so Steve

0:17:16.960 --> 0:17:20.760
<v Speaker 3>picks up Noah and they head to his place before

0:17:20.800 --> 0:17:23.639
<v Speaker 3>going to whatever this destination is, which turns out to

0:17:23.640 --> 0:17:27.520
<v Speaker 3>be Cottage Grove, Oregon, and also where he lives seems

0:17:27.520 --> 0:17:30.080
<v Speaker 3>to be a several hour drive away from the city

0:17:30.200 --> 0:17:32.000
<v Speaker 3>because by the time they get there it's dark.

0:17:32.520 --> 0:17:35.440
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it was a little confused about that, but also,

0:17:35.600 --> 0:17:38.760
<v Speaker 2>I mean I can definitely relate with, even though this

0:17:38.880 --> 0:17:42.679
<v Speaker 2>kind of stretches credulity a little bit, the feeling of like,

0:17:43.359 --> 0:17:47.159
<v Speaker 2>I don't know, like someone that you like being like

0:17:47.240 --> 0:17:51.119
<v Speaker 2>this is normal, And then I've definitely been a person

0:17:51.160 --> 0:17:54.520
<v Speaker 2>that's like, ah, yeah, totally and this is regular for me,

0:17:55.000 --> 0:17:58.160
<v Speaker 2>Like it's unfortunately definitely a thing.

0:17:58.240 --> 0:18:01.359
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, because you like want to put your trust into

0:18:01.400 --> 0:18:04.760
<v Speaker 3>someone that you like, and so you're just like, sure,

0:18:04.800 --> 0:18:08.040
<v Speaker 3>everything's fine, although we do see Noah seeming a bit

0:18:08.359 --> 0:18:11.760
<v Speaker 3>uneasy about this because she gets to the house, she

0:18:11.840 --> 0:18:14.720
<v Speaker 3>wants to connect to the Wi fi there's no cell service,

0:18:15.640 --> 0:18:18.800
<v Speaker 3>and you know, he ignores that. He makes her a

0:18:18.880 --> 0:18:25.200
<v Speaker 3>drink which he has drugged, and Noah loses consciousness. And

0:18:25.240 --> 0:18:27.520
<v Speaker 3>then we get the title card and the opening credits,

0:18:27.520 --> 0:18:31.600
<v Speaker 3>which is like thirty minutes into the movie. So surprise,

0:18:31.880 --> 0:18:35.800
<v Speaker 3>the movie's called Fresh. So it turns out Steve is

0:18:36.400 --> 0:18:40.200
<v Speaker 3>the bad guy. Yeah, Noah wakes up in a windowless room,

0:18:40.560 --> 0:18:43.560
<v Speaker 3>her arm is chained to the floor, and we're like, okay,

0:18:43.800 --> 0:18:45.600
<v Speaker 3>saw vibes Savva.

0:18:45.720 --> 0:18:48.960
<v Speaker 2>I was also thinking of ten Cloverfield Lane, a movie

0:18:49.000 --> 0:18:49.760
<v Speaker 2>I really.

0:18:49.560 --> 0:18:51.320
<v Speaker 3>Like, Oh, I need to rewatch that.

0:18:52.480 --> 0:18:55.400
<v Speaker 2>I remember really liking it.

0:18:55.720 --> 0:18:58.840
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I know, so did I except for I remember

0:18:58.880 --> 0:19:01.960
<v Speaker 3>thinking the end and I'll try not to say any

0:19:02.000 --> 0:19:04.600
<v Speaker 3>spoilers here, but the end felt tacked on and that

0:19:04.720 --> 0:19:06.800
<v Speaker 3>it belonged in a different movie.

0:19:07.080 --> 0:19:09.560
<v Speaker 2>The end was really weird. Yeah.

0:19:09.600 --> 0:19:12.000
<v Speaker 3>Well, also because you find out that that was a

0:19:12.040 --> 0:19:15.199
<v Speaker 3>script written on spec I think that had nothing to

0:19:15.240 --> 0:19:18.920
<v Speaker 3>do with the Cloverfield franchise, right, And then they bought

0:19:19.000 --> 0:19:21.240
<v Speaker 3>the script and then like co opted it into a

0:19:21.280 --> 0:19:25.080
<v Speaker 3>Cloverfield movie, and so you're just like, what, it doesn't

0:19:25.119 --> 0:19:27.840
<v Speaker 3>make any sense anyway. Okay, So she wakes up in

0:19:27.880 --> 0:19:31.879
<v Speaker 3>this room chained to the wall, but instead of Jigsaw

0:19:31.960 --> 0:19:36.439
<v Speaker 3>on a tape recorder saying let's play a game, Steve

0:19:36.520 --> 0:19:39.680
<v Speaker 3>is in the room and he explains that he drugged

0:19:39.720 --> 0:19:42.720
<v Speaker 3>Noah and that he intends to keep her trapped there,

0:19:43.480 --> 0:19:48.199
<v Speaker 3>chop off pieces of her and sell her meat because

0:19:48.240 --> 0:19:52.560
<v Speaker 3>people pay him a lot of money for human meat.

0:19:53.080 --> 0:19:55.600
<v Speaker 3>And he says he's going to keep her alive as

0:19:55.640 --> 0:19:59.880
<v Speaker 3>long as possible because the fresher the meat the bat

0:20:00.280 --> 0:20:02.200
<v Speaker 3>and the more valuable it is. And we're like, hey,

0:20:02.240 --> 0:20:04.920
<v Speaker 3>the name of the movie is Fresh.

0:20:05.080 --> 0:20:07.399
<v Speaker 2>And they meet in the Fresh produce isle.

0:20:07.920 --> 0:20:11.000
<v Speaker 3>Uh huh, and she's standing under a sign that says

0:20:11.359 --> 0:20:12.960
<v Speaker 3>fresh meets.

0:20:12.920 --> 0:20:17.240
<v Speaker 2>Wow, and that's just a little joke he's doing. Yeah,

0:20:17.359 --> 0:20:19.560
<v Speaker 2>the movie is called Fresh. The movie's called Fresh, and

0:20:19.720 --> 0:20:22.720
<v Speaker 2>you won't forget it as you're watching the movie Fresh.

0:20:23.119 --> 0:20:26.400
<v Speaker 3>Yeah. So he's like, I won't kill you right away

0:20:26.800 --> 0:20:30.840
<v Speaker 3>unless you act up, in which case he'll kill her sooner.

0:20:31.800 --> 0:20:35.679
<v Speaker 3>So Noah is obviously terrified because, believe it or not,

0:20:35.760 --> 0:20:40.639
<v Speaker 3>she wants to keep her meat on her body. Molly, meanwhile,

0:20:41.200 --> 0:20:44.679
<v Speaker 3>is trying to call and text Noah because Molly hasn't

0:20:44.680 --> 0:20:48.159
<v Speaker 3>heard from her, and she gets a text response and

0:20:48.240 --> 0:20:51.480
<v Speaker 3>it's clear to us the audience that it's Steve pretending

0:20:51.520 --> 0:20:57.040
<v Speaker 3>to be Noah. So back in Noah's dungeon room, she's screaming,

0:20:57.119 --> 0:20:59.600
<v Speaker 3>she's crying. She hears a voice coming from the room

0:20:59.640 --> 0:21:03.480
<v Speaker 3>next time her. This is Penny played by Andrea Bang,

0:21:04.119 --> 0:21:07.000
<v Speaker 3>saying that Steve isn't there right now and that she's

0:21:07.040 --> 0:21:10.880
<v Speaker 3>in the same situation as Noah, although Steve has already

0:21:10.880 --> 0:21:14.400
<v Speaker 3>started cutting off parts of her to sell her meat.

0:21:15.359 --> 0:21:18.960
<v Speaker 3>And there's a third woman, Melissa, although she has been

0:21:19.040 --> 0:21:21.360
<v Speaker 3>there for a while and it seems that she has

0:21:21.440 --> 0:21:27.280
<v Speaker 3>like lost her mind. Steve comes back and we see

0:21:27.359 --> 0:21:32.960
<v Speaker 3>him cut up Melissa's amputated leg. He's tenderizing the meat,

0:21:33.080 --> 0:21:36.800
<v Speaker 3>he seals it, he packages it into a few different boxes.

0:21:36.640 --> 0:21:39.000
<v Speaker 2>And he's like basically doing I mean, there is a

0:21:39.040 --> 0:21:43.000
<v Speaker 2>portion of this movie where Sebastian Stan is like, remember

0:21:43.080 --> 0:21:46.200
<v Speaker 2>Christian Bale in American Psycho, I'm kind of doing that.

0:21:46.240 --> 0:21:48.840
<v Speaker 2>Like the you know, the needle drops and stuff felt

0:21:48.880 --> 0:21:50.560
<v Speaker 2>very reminiscent of American Psycho.

0:21:50.880 --> 0:21:54.960
<v Speaker 3>Sure, yeah, yeah, you half expect Sebastian Stan to start

0:21:55.000 --> 0:21:59.199
<v Speaker 3>monologuing about Huey Lewis in the news or Whitney Houston

0:21:59.280 --> 0:21:59.919
<v Speaker 3>or something.

0:21:59.800 --> 0:22:02.720
<v Speaker 2>Right right, Like he's not as far, god, but I mean,

0:22:02.760 --> 0:22:04.000
<v Speaker 2>what kind of yardstick is that?

0:22:04.119 --> 0:22:04.960
<v Speaker 4>But yeah, like.

0:22:05.320 --> 0:22:09.720
<v Speaker 2>Grooving around with his victims to like eighties music, You're like,

0:22:09.800 --> 0:22:11.800
<v Speaker 2>I know this, I know for some reason this is

0:22:11.800 --> 0:22:14.000
<v Speaker 2>a trope, right, yes.

0:22:14.359 --> 0:22:16.359
<v Speaker 3>And he's like putting the meat in these like little

0:22:16.359 --> 0:22:19.240
<v Speaker 3>care packages along with like the photos of the women

0:22:19.359 --> 0:22:22.240
<v Speaker 3>and like articles of their clothing and stuff like that.

0:22:22.359 --> 0:22:24.560
<v Speaker 3>It seems like he always like says to these women,

0:22:24.640 --> 0:22:26.840
<v Speaker 3>let's go on a trip, and then that way they

0:22:26.880 --> 0:22:29.960
<v Speaker 3>pack a bag full of stuff and then he steals

0:22:30.000 --> 0:22:31.480
<v Speaker 3>it and anyway, so.

0:22:31.600 --> 0:22:36.760
<v Speaker 2>He's objectifying women. Would we agree that he views women

0:22:36.800 --> 0:22:40.919
<v Speaker 2>as proud objects? What do you mean? That was the

0:22:40.960 --> 0:22:43.720
<v Speaker 2>thought I had? It wasn't the very end of the movie.

0:22:43.800 --> 0:22:48.760
<v Speaker 2>But well, let's just go on a second. Wait, wait

0:22:48.800 --> 0:22:51.280
<v Speaker 2>a minute, A looks like this guy respects ladies at all.

0:22:53.160 --> 0:22:57.280
<v Speaker 3>Right, all right, So Noah is determined to get out

0:22:57.280 --> 0:23:01.679
<v Speaker 3>of this situation. She tells Steve that she needs to

0:23:01.720 --> 0:23:05.359
<v Speaker 3>take a shower, which he is about to let her do,

0:23:05.680 --> 0:23:09.680
<v Speaker 3>so he leads her upstairs. She takes note of her surroundings,

0:23:10.280 --> 0:23:12.760
<v Speaker 3>but then she tries to break free and escape, and

0:23:12.880 --> 0:23:16.639
<v Speaker 3>Steve stops her. When she wakes up again, she's on

0:23:16.720 --> 0:23:22.960
<v Speaker 3>a surgical bed and he is surgically removing her buttocks.

0:23:23.760 --> 0:23:24.440
<v Speaker 2>Wilds.

0:23:24.720 --> 0:23:29.800
<v Speaker 3>Yeah. Mollie, meanwhile, is still concerned, and she starts digging

0:23:29.920 --> 0:23:35.040
<v Speaker 3>and realizes that the picture that Noah quote unquote texted

0:23:35.240 --> 0:23:39.359
<v Speaker 3>of her trip is actually a stock photo from a website.

0:23:39.440 --> 0:23:40.840
<v Speaker 3>So Molly knows something's up.

0:23:41.040 --> 0:23:44.520
<v Speaker 2>Also, like the second your good friend starts texting you

0:23:44.640 --> 0:23:50.399
<v Speaker 2>fully punctuated sentences, You're like, they've been kidnapped, They've been taken. Yeah,

0:23:50.480 --> 0:23:53.400
<v Speaker 2>your close friend would never send you a full sentence

0:23:53.440 --> 0:23:55.280
<v Speaker 2>in a text that's absurd.

0:23:55.480 --> 0:24:00.399
<v Speaker 3>Also, you see Molly's face have this like book of

0:24:00.600 --> 0:24:05.280
<v Speaker 3>incredulity when she sends a heart emoji, and it almost

0:24:05.320 --> 0:24:09.159
<v Speaker 3>seems like, oh, she never uses emojis. That wasn't established,

0:24:09.119 --> 0:24:10.840
<v Speaker 3>And I feel like that maybe would have been helpful

0:24:10.880 --> 0:24:14.720
<v Speaker 3>to establish that, like Noah never uses emojis. But you

0:24:14.760 --> 0:24:18.440
<v Speaker 3>see her be suspicious Molly. That is when she gets

0:24:18.520 --> 0:24:21.879
<v Speaker 3>the heart emoji, and that's when she starts kind of investigating.

0:24:22.040 --> 0:24:25.439
<v Speaker 3>She sees the stock photo, and so she goes to

0:24:25.520 --> 0:24:28.520
<v Speaker 3>the bar where Noah went on her first date with Steve,

0:24:29.240 --> 0:24:34.600
<v Speaker 3>and she asks the bartender, Paul played by theo Okinewe,

0:24:35.119 --> 0:24:39.080
<v Speaker 3>who is a former lover of Molly's. They used to

0:24:39.200 --> 0:24:42.760
<v Speaker 3>like have a casual hookup situation, it seemed, and she

0:24:42.920 --> 0:24:46.520
<v Speaker 3>asks Paul to give her any info on Steve, like

0:24:46.600 --> 0:24:49.240
<v Speaker 3>his last name from the credit card that he paid with,

0:24:50.040 --> 0:24:53.600
<v Speaker 3>and Paul eventually gives Molly Steve's full name. So she

0:24:54.080 --> 0:24:58.480
<v Speaker 3>gets to googling, and it seems like Steve has a

0:24:58.560 --> 0:25:01.400
<v Speaker 3>wife and two young k kids, and she finds out

0:25:01.400 --> 0:25:06.280
<v Speaker 3>where he lives. Back in the Dungeon, Noah confides in

0:25:06.359 --> 0:25:11.280
<v Speaker 3>Penny that she slept with Steve and Penny is like, oh, whoa,

0:25:11.320 --> 0:25:13.280
<v Speaker 3>Like none of the rest of us did, but I'm

0:25:13.280 --> 0:25:17.440
<v Speaker 3>not shaming you. It's probably a compliment. Actually, yeah.

0:25:17.520 --> 0:25:20.639
<v Speaker 2>Penny is like through the wall comments are very very funny,

0:25:20.640 --> 0:25:24.000
<v Speaker 2>where she's like no shame, no shame, but like wow.

0:25:24.320 --> 0:25:29.080
<v Speaker 3>Whoa right? And then when Noah asks Steve why he

0:25:29.160 --> 0:25:32.560
<v Speaker 3>slept with her, he's like, yeah, I told you, I

0:25:32.720 --> 0:25:37.119
<v Speaker 3>like you. Then in a magazine that Steve gave Noah

0:25:37.119 --> 0:25:41.480
<v Speaker 3>to like help her pass the time, Noah notices writing

0:25:41.520 --> 0:25:44.840
<v Speaker 3>from another woman and it says like, if you're reading this,

0:25:45.000 --> 0:25:48.920
<v Speaker 3>it means he likes you. Use it keep fucking fighting.

0:25:49.720 --> 0:25:55.880
<v Speaker 3>And then it's signed Sammy Akbari. So Noah, taking this advice,

0:25:56.160 --> 0:26:00.399
<v Speaker 3>tries a new tactic where she asks Steve what the

0:26:00.520 --> 0:26:05.360
<v Speaker 3>human meat tastes like and he's like, oh, it's exquisite.

0:26:06.160 --> 0:26:08.159
<v Speaker 3>Why do you ask, though, And she's like ha ha,

0:26:08.280 --> 0:26:10.920
<v Speaker 3>I don't know, just curious, and he's like.

0:26:10.960 --> 0:26:13.520
<v Speaker 2>Hmm, I still haven't seen Silence of the Lambs? Is

0:26:13.560 --> 0:26:17.280
<v Speaker 2>he Hannibal Electering now? Is he like oscillating between.

0:26:18.440 --> 0:26:23.560
<v Speaker 3>No, I wasn't getting Hannibal Lecter vibes from Steve, but

0:26:23.720 --> 0:26:26.520
<v Speaker 3>isn't Hannibal elector a cannibal. I mean, he says like,

0:26:26.600 --> 0:26:29.360
<v Speaker 3>I ate her liver with fava beans in a nice kianti.

0:26:30.000 --> 0:26:32.840
<v Speaker 2>But he's just a killer. He's not like a down

0:26:32.880 --> 0:26:33.960
<v Speaker 2>home cannibal.

0:26:34.880 --> 0:26:37.920
<v Speaker 3>Well like Hannibal Lecter. I don't think we at least

0:26:37.920 --> 0:26:40.600
<v Speaker 3>in Silence of the Lambs. I haven't seen the other

0:26:41.000 --> 0:26:43.840
<v Speaker 3>Like there's Hannibal and then there's Red Dragon, and then

0:26:43.840 --> 0:26:46.200
<v Speaker 3>there's a show and you know, the sequels and the

0:26:46.240 --> 0:26:49.119
<v Speaker 3>spinoffs and stuff like that, I haven't seen. But in

0:26:49.760 --> 0:26:53.000
<v Speaker 3>Silence of the Lambs, you never see Hannibal. He's not

0:26:53.080 --> 0:26:56.480
<v Speaker 3>like a flirty, charming, handsome young guy who's.

0:26:56.240 --> 0:27:05.960
<v Speaker 2>Like, wow, just drag him. She's kill Sorry, sorry, you're

0:27:06.000 --> 0:27:08.960
<v Speaker 2>like geez, he's just scary.

0:27:09.080 --> 0:27:12.040
<v Speaker 3>So he he has a different approach than Steve.

0:27:12.600 --> 0:27:15.560
<v Speaker 2>Okay, okay, thank you, I need it. I wanted to know.

0:27:17.000 --> 0:27:21.320
<v Speaker 3>Meanwhile, Mollie goes to Steve's house where he lives with

0:27:21.440 --> 0:27:24.240
<v Speaker 3>his family, so like his other home, not the one

0:27:24.240 --> 0:27:29.720
<v Speaker 3>that he has a whole like cannibalism laboratory at and

0:27:29.840 --> 0:27:35.240
<v Speaker 3>Mollie tells his wife Anne played by Charlotte Lebon, that

0:27:35.320 --> 0:27:39.600
<v Speaker 3>her friend Noah has been seeing Steve, and Anne is

0:27:39.680 --> 0:27:42.800
<v Speaker 3>like I are you sure that that doesn't sound right?

0:27:43.840 --> 0:27:47.320
<v Speaker 3>And then Steve comes home, so Mollie sees him and

0:27:47.359 --> 0:27:52.119
<v Speaker 3>he denies that he knows Noah. So Molly calls Noah's phone,

0:27:52.280 --> 0:27:55.560
<v Speaker 3>which Steve has on him, and it starts ringing, so

0:27:55.640 --> 0:28:02.119
<v Speaker 3>he's busted. But twist, his wife is in on the

0:28:02.160 --> 0:28:04.800
<v Speaker 3>whole operation, and she knocks Molly out.

0:28:05.240 --> 0:28:07.800
<v Speaker 2>The thing that is interesting about this movie is I

0:28:07.880 --> 0:28:11.959
<v Speaker 2>really enjoyed it, and none of the twists surprised me. Like,

0:28:12.040 --> 0:28:14.679
<v Speaker 2>I feel like the second you see her haircut, you're like,

0:28:14.800 --> 0:28:15.640
<v Speaker 2>she's in on it.

0:28:15.920 --> 0:28:18.800
<v Speaker 3>You know, she does give off vibes that are a

0:28:18.920 --> 0:28:23.240
<v Speaker 3>little too sinister for me to be super surprised by

0:28:23.240 --> 0:28:28.520
<v Speaker 3>that twist. Yeah, so Ann the wife is in on

0:28:28.640 --> 0:28:31.840
<v Speaker 3>this whole cannibalism operation thing. And then we get another

0:28:31.920 --> 0:28:38.479
<v Speaker 3>reveal that she Anne has a prosthetic leg. Presumably she

0:28:38.680 --> 0:28:42.600
<v Speaker 3>was one of Steve's former victims. She's a survivor of

0:28:42.640 --> 0:28:48.000
<v Speaker 3>this situation. And then he spared Anne and married her.

0:28:48.560 --> 0:28:53.640
<v Speaker 3>Is what you can like gather. Then Steve basically invites

0:28:53.720 --> 0:28:58.200
<v Speaker 3>Noah on a little date upstairs where he prepares a

0:28:58.360 --> 0:29:02.280
<v Speaker 3>dinner of human meat her and the whole time she

0:29:02.440 --> 0:29:05.240
<v Speaker 3>is like, you know, calculating away out of there.

0:29:05.280 --> 0:29:08.520
<v Speaker 2>Freaks a whole new you need to girl dinner, am I? Right?

0:29:08.800 --> 0:29:09.040
<v Speaker 1>WHOA?

0:29:14.280 --> 0:29:17.640
<v Speaker 3>So anyway, she's like feigning interest in the line of

0:29:17.640 --> 0:29:22.360
<v Speaker 3>work he's in, you know, the cannibalism industry, and he's

0:29:22.400 --> 0:29:25.080
<v Speaker 3>telling her about it, and she's like, uh huh, and

0:29:25.120 --> 0:29:30.160
<v Speaker 3>she asks if he only eats women, and he's like, yeah,

0:29:30.200 --> 0:29:34.160
<v Speaker 3>that's where the market is, plus they taste better. And

0:29:34.200 --> 0:29:39.440
<v Speaker 3>then she eats some human meat from a woman named Hope,

0:29:40.520 --> 0:29:43.920
<v Speaker 3>and then he brings her back to her room after

0:29:43.960 --> 0:29:47.440
<v Speaker 3>the date. She makes herself throw up this meal because

0:29:47.480 --> 0:29:50.080
<v Speaker 3>you know, she obviously only ate it to manipulate him,

0:29:50.680 --> 0:29:53.360
<v Speaker 3>but it's working and he wants to have dinner with

0:29:53.400 --> 0:29:58.880
<v Speaker 3>her again the following night. Then we see Steve take

0:29:59.280 --> 0:30:03.200
<v Speaker 3>Mollie out of of her like dungeon enclosure. Noah doesn't

0:30:03.200 --> 0:30:05.680
<v Speaker 3>know that Mollie is there, although she does realize that

0:30:05.880 --> 0:30:11.080
<v Speaker 3>some new woman is present, and then Steve cuts part

0:30:11.240 --> 0:30:16.400
<v Speaker 3>of Molly off. Also, Mollie had shared her location with Paul,

0:30:17.120 --> 0:30:20.960
<v Speaker 3>and he sees that she's somewhere far away, and then

0:30:21.000 --> 0:30:24.880
<v Speaker 3>her location becomes unavailable entirely, and so he's like, hmm,

0:30:25.000 --> 0:30:28.560
<v Speaker 3>that's weird, and then he'll eventually set off to go

0:30:28.600 --> 0:30:31.600
<v Speaker 3>find her. Then it's time for the next little date

0:30:31.680 --> 0:30:35.840
<v Speaker 3>between Noah and Steve, and she's being very flirty and familiar,

0:30:36.440 --> 0:30:39.920
<v Speaker 3>and she's like clearly trying to put Steve at ease

0:30:41.000 --> 0:30:43.800
<v Speaker 3>and get him very comfortable to like let his guard

0:30:43.840 --> 0:30:47.680
<v Speaker 3>down and all that stuff. They eat Melissa liver pete.

0:30:48.560 --> 0:30:52.000
<v Speaker 3>They also eat breast meat, which I think might belong

0:30:52.080 --> 0:30:54.560
<v Speaker 3>to Molly, because I feel like it's implied what's being

0:30:54.600 --> 0:30:56.600
<v Speaker 3>removed from her is Molly's breasts.

0:30:57.000 --> 0:30:59.840
<v Speaker 2>Oh okay, because I also was just like very un

0:31:00.120 --> 0:31:03.640
<v Speaker 2>clear on I mean not that I'm like be more specific,

0:31:03.800 --> 0:31:07.080
<v Speaker 2>but like I was kind of unclear on just the

0:31:07.080 --> 0:31:08.960
<v Speaker 2>there's a little bit of YadA YadA when it comes

0:31:09.000 --> 0:31:13.000
<v Speaker 2>to the healing process, for sure, because I just feel

0:31:13.000 --> 0:31:16.520
<v Speaker 2>like if someone took even half of my ass, I

0:31:16.520 --> 0:31:19.440
<v Speaker 2>wouldn't be like I can sit down for a date

0:31:20.000 --> 0:31:20.600
<v Speaker 2>next week.

0:31:21.080 --> 0:31:23.960
<v Speaker 3>You would think it would take a lot longer to heal.

0:31:24.400 --> 0:31:26.160
<v Speaker 2>As a horror fan, I feel like it's almost a

0:31:26.200 --> 0:31:30.040
<v Speaker 2>missed opportunity to like do some like And he has

0:31:30.120 --> 0:31:34.280
<v Speaker 2>this freaky chair he designed for women without asses, Like

0:31:34.520 --> 0:31:34.920
<v Speaker 2>you know.

0:31:35.040 --> 0:31:37.360
<v Speaker 3>I feel like she does sit on one of those

0:31:37.440 --> 0:31:39.120
<v Speaker 3>like little cushioned donuts.

0:31:39.960 --> 0:31:42.720
<v Speaker 2>That's true, that's true. But wow, he does care.

0:31:42.960 --> 0:31:49.040
<v Speaker 3>He thinks of everything. This Steve also another reason I

0:31:49.040 --> 0:31:51.880
<v Speaker 3>think it's Molly's because he doesn't specify whose breasts they're eating.

0:31:52.280 --> 0:31:56.120
<v Speaker 3>He says the other names of the other uh oh,

0:31:56.640 --> 0:31:57.040
<v Speaker 3>but he does.

0:31:57.720 --> 0:31:58.720
<v Speaker 2>He doesn't want her to know.

0:31:58.960 --> 0:32:04.280
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, he shows her this stash of all the belongings

0:32:04.320 --> 0:32:07.600
<v Speaker 3>from like the women he has abducted, as well as

0:32:07.600 --> 0:32:11.560
<v Speaker 3>photos of them. So Noah sees Melissa and Penny and

0:32:11.840 --> 0:32:14.560
<v Speaker 3>Sammy who had left the note in the magazine, as

0:32:14.560 --> 0:32:16.680
<v Speaker 3>well as all their phones. So now she like knows

0:32:16.720 --> 0:32:21.080
<v Speaker 3>where the phones are. And then she really turns up

0:32:21.240 --> 0:32:24.480
<v Speaker 3>the charm, except well, she's like, she gets very vulnerable

0:32:24.840 --> 0:32:28.280
<v Speaker 3>and she's crying and he's like, come your babe, it's okay.

0:32:28.640 --> 0:32:31.760
<v Speaker 3>And then they start kissing, and then they dance and

0:32:31.760 --> 0:32:35.000
<v Speaker 3>they start fooling around and she's about to go down

0:32:35.040 --> 0:32:40.680
<v Speaker 3>on him, but then she bites his dick off. Question mark,

0:32:41.760 --> 0:32:43.800
<v Speaker 3>I hope, So I hope.

0:32:43.840 --> 0:32:47.080
<v Speaker 2>So again a little unclear. I kind of wonder if

0:32:47.080 --> 0:32:50.120
<v Speaker 2>this wasn't like available on Disney Plus, like if you

0:32:50.160 --> 0:32:54.160
<v Speaker 2>would really get to see it. It is so weird.

0:32:54.400 --> 0:32:58.360
<v Speaker 2>I added Hulu to my Disney Plus and now it's like, oh,

0:32:58.360 --> 0:33:01.920
<v Speaker 2>it's cheaper, it really is, like, but no, it's funny.

0:33:01.960 --> 0:33:04.640
<v Speaker 2>Like when you add Hulu to Disney Plus, it just

0:33:04.680 --> 0:33:08.760
<v Speaker 2>defeats the purpose of Disney Plus entirely because you're like, oh,

0:33:09.280 --> 0:33:11.160
<v Speaker 2>I feel like Disney Plus used to be really discerning

0:33:11.240 --> 0:33:13.400
<v Speaker 2>about like it has to be family friendly. And you're like,

0:33:13.400 --> 0:33:16.560
<v Speaker 2>now I can watch Daisy Egar Jones like bite someone's

0:33:16.640 --> 0:33:20.920
<v Speaker 2>dick off right after Nightmare before Christmas or whatever.

0:33:22.040 --> 0:33:26.680
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, yeah, I mean funny juxtaposition. Yeah, but anyway, she

0:33:26.680 --> 0:33:29.520
<v Speaker 3>bites his dick off, or at least bites it enough

0:33:29.560 --> 0:33:32.920
<v Speaker 3>that it draws a lot of blood, and she smears

0:33:32.960 --> 0:33:36.640
<v Speaker 3>toothpaste in his eyes. And then she grabs a phone,

0:33:36.680 --> 0:33:40.640
<v Speaker 3>grabs some keys, starts to escape, but first she saves

0:33:40.680 --> 0:33:43.360
<v Speaker 3>Molly and Penny and the three of them.

0:33:43.440 --> 0:33:44.760
<v Speaker 2>You're like, what about Melissa.

0:33:45.480 --> 0:33:48.640
<v Speaker 3>Melissa's presumed dead because she no longer has a liver.

0:33:49.680 --> 0:33:52.880
<v Speaker 3>They ate her liver, So I think that implies I.

0:33:52.800 --> 0:33:56.440
<v Speaker 2>Guess I don't know how bodies work. I'm like, don't you.

0:33:56.560 --> 0:33:59.160
<v Speaker 2>I'm thinking of kidneys, and I'm thinking of kidneys because

0:33:59.160 --> 0:34:02.040
<v Speaker 2>you well you need you don't have two livers, well,

0:34:02.200 --> 0:34:05.000
<v Speaker 2>I know, but you can live without one kidney. I

0:34:05.120 --> 0:34:09.800
<v Speaker 2>just was like, livers, you have two, okay.

0:34:09.920 --> 0:34:12.160
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, just the one liver and they ate it. So

0:34:12.360 --> 0:34:17.239
<v Speaker 3>Melissa is probably dead, so she can't save her, but

0:34:17.280 --> 0:34:22.080
<v Speaker 3>she does save Penny and Mollie, and the three of

0:34:22.120 --> 0:34:26.560
<v Speaker 3>them fight off Steve with knives and meat tender risers,

0:34:26.719 --> 0:34:29.600
<v Speaker 3>and they managed to get outside into the woods, but

0:34:29.640 --> 0:34:32.799
<v Speaker 3>Steve comes after them with a gun. He's shooting at them.

0:34:32.920 --> 0:34:37.560
<v Speaker 3>He is absolutely furious that Noah tricked him. Meanwhile, Paul

0:34:37.600 --> 0:34:40.840
<v Speaker 3>has driven to Steve's house to try to find Molly,

0:34:40.880 --> 0:34:43.800
<v Speaker 3>but he's like, this is creepy, and then he hears

0:34:43.840 --> 0:34:47.799
<v Speaker 3>the gunshots, and so he leaves, being like I've seen

0:34:47.800 --> 0:34:50.000
<v Speaker 3>this movie and I don't make it out alive, you know,

0:34:50.080 --> 0:34:54.320
<v Speaker 3>commenting on how black people often do not survive horror movies. Yeah,

0:34:54.360 --> 0:34:55.520
<v Speaker 3>so he leaves.

0:34:55.680 --> 0:34:58.960
<v Speaker 2>I did keep expecting him to come back. Same, but

0:34:59.239 --> 0:35:01.440
<v Speaker 2>I kind of like that he doesn't, like, I mean,

0:35:01.440 --> 0:35:03.160
<v Speaker 2>because they liberate themselves.

0:35:04.000 --> 0:35:07.120
<v Speaker 3>True. I was like, I hope he's at least nearby

0:35:07.280 --> 0:35:09.520
<v Speaker 3>so that they can get a ride home from him.

0:35:09.960 --> 0:35:13.520
<v Speaker 2>They are very far away, very and I mean as

0:35:13.520 --> 0:35:15.680
<v Speaker 2>we're about to talk about, like the ending of this

0:35:15.760 --> 0:35:17.120
<v Speaker 2>movie is very abrupt.

0:35:17.400 --> 0:35:21.399
<v Speaker 3>It is, yeah, although maybe you know, everyone ends up dead,

0:35:21.480 --> 0:35:23.680
<v Speaker 3>so maybe they just like take the keys to one

0:35:23.680 --> 0:35:25.799
<v Speaker 3>of Sebastian Stan's cars and drive.

0:35:26.239 --> 0:35:28.040
<v Speaker 2>I mean, I don't even mean that as a criticism.

0:35:28.080 --> 0:35:31.520
<v Speaker 2>I was just like, oh, yeah, I guess it's yeah.

0:35:31.560 --> 0:35:37.879
<v Speaker 3>Anyway. So Paul leaves, but Steve's wife Anne shows up

0:35:37.920 --> 0:35:41.200
<v Speaker 3>at the house. She sees that Steve is in danger,

0:35:41.880 --> 0:35:46.480
<v Speaker 3>but Noah, Molly, and Penny get to him first. Noah

0:35:46.520 --> 0:35:49.560
<v Speaker 3>grabs his gun and shoots him in the head, killing him.

0:35:50.239 --> 0:35:52.800
<v Speaker 3>Then Noah goes back into the woods to get her phone,

0:35:53.000 --> 0:35:56.719
<v Speaker 3>which she dropped, and Anne approaches her, pretending to be

0:35:56.800 --> 0:36:02.120
<v Speaker 3>one of Steve's victims. Then she attacks Noah, but Molly

0:36:02.480 --> 0:36:05.520
<v Speaker 3>saves her and bashes in Anne's head with a shovel,

0:36:06.239 --> 0:36:09.239
<v Speaker 3>and then the movie ends with Noah and Molly embracing

0:36:09.920 --> 0:36:13.120
<v Speaker 3>plus a little button where Noah gets a text from

0:36:13.239 --> 0:36:14.960
<v Speaker 3>I think, the guy she went on a date with

0:36:15.000 --> 0:36:18.040
<v Speaker 3>at the beginning of the movie saying like you up

0:36:18.719 --> 0:36:23.319
<v Speaker 3>the end. So that's the movie. Let's take another quick

0:36:23.320 --> 0:36:36.600
<v Speaker 3>break and we'll come back to discuss. And we're back

0:36:36.719 --> 0:36:37.320
<v Speaker 3>we're back.

0:36:37.960 --> 0:36:41.840
<v Speaker 2>So, okay, here's my big I'm just gonna come in

0:36:41.880 --> 0:36:46.400
<v Speaker 2>with my big question. I say it, Okay. I feel

0:36:46.480 --> 0:36:50.840
<v Speaker 2>like the characters are generally underdeveloped, but in particular, I

0:36:50.840 --> 0:36:55.200
<v Speaker 2>feel like it really stands out with Molly's character. I

0:36:55.239 --> 0:36:59.680
<v Speaker 2>feel like the black best friend trope is being sort

0:36:59.719 --> 0:37:04.080
<v Speaker 2>of ployed pretty heavily here. Yeah, I guess what I

0:37:04.200 --> 0:37:07.759
<v Speaker 2>will say is that, like I wouldn't say that, you know,

0:37:07.880 --> 0:37:11.880
<v Speaker 2>we know Noah so well and we don't know anything

0:37:11.920 --> 0:37:13.880
<v Speaker 2>about Molly, like I would say, we don't really know

0:37:14.000 --> 0:37:17.760
<v Speaker 2>either of these characters very well. But it's just the

0:37:17.760 --> 0:37:21.800
<v Speaker 2>the trope of like, while Mollie is a very active character,

0:37:22.000 --> 0:37:25.040
<v Speaker 2>and I like that their friendship is at the core

0:37:25.120 --> 0:37:27.160
<v Speaker 2>of the movie, and you can read in this message

0:37:27.160 --> 0:37:30.800
<v Speaker 2>of like, you know, Steve's maybe biggest mistake with Noah

0:37:30.960 --> 0:37:33.719
<v Speaker 2>is to assume that a lack of biological family in

0:37:33.760 --> 0:37:36.799
<v Speaker 2>her life means that no one cares about her, and

0:37:36.880 --> 0:37:40.000
<v Speaker 2>that she has found family with Molly and all this

0:37:40.000 --> 0:37:42.919
<v Speaker 2>stuff like that is great. I like friendship between women

0:37:42.960 --> 0:37:45.200
<v Speaker 2>at the core of a story. But you know, while

0:37:45.200 --> 0:37:48.160
<v Speaker 2>Molly is a very active character, she's in the story

0:37:48.280 --> 0:37:51.839
<v Speaker 2>to service no you know what I mean, I don't

0:37:51.840 --> 0:37:52.799
<v Speaker 2>know for sure, did that come.

0:37:52.760 --> 0:37:55.279
<v Speaker 3>Up for you? Definitely, especially because in the first like

0:37:56.239 --> 0:37:59.520
<v Speaker 3>several scenes we either see Molly in or like hear

0:37:59.600 --> 0:38:04.280
<v Speaker 3>her in a phone conversation. She is just like giving

0:38:04.320 --> 0:38:08.520
<v Speaker 3>advice to her straight white friend because we learned the

0:38:08.840 --> 0:38:11.400
<v Speaker 3>Molly is queer, she dates men and women.

0:38:11.880 --> 0:38:13.520
<v Speaker 2>It was to the point where I was like, I

0:38:13.600 --> 0:38:16.480
<v Speaker 2>wonder if this is gonna be a trope that's like

0:38:16.600 --> 0:38:19.360
<v Speaker 2>commented on within the movie, because it felt pretty like

0:38:19.920 --> 0:38:23.839
<v Speaker 2>obvious what trope is happening there, but it's not really

0:38:23.880 --> 0:38:28.160
<v Speaker 2>commented on where yeah, she's just weirdly fixated on the

0:38:28.239 --> 0:38:33.120
<v Speaker 2>relationship of her straight white friend and you're just like, God,

0:38:33.239 --> 0:38:34.040
<v Speaker 2>what year is it?

0:38:34.239 --> 0:38:34.560
<v Speaker 4>Come on?

0:38:35.160 --> 0:38:39.600
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, you do see Mollie talking about like what it's

0:38:39.680 --> 0:38:42.360
<v Speaker 3>like to date women and how there are fewer games

0:38:42.440 --> 0:38:47.160
<v Speaker 3>and there's more emotional dependence, which she's saying it seems

0:38:47.239 --> 0:38:50.280
<v Speaker 3>like ingest you know, she's kind of joking around, because

0:38:50.280 --> 0:38:53.360
<v Speaker 3>that's otherwise a pretty like reductive thing to say, but

0:38:53.440 --> 0:38:55.960
<v Speaker 3>it seems like she's joking. But I was like, well,

0:38:56.000 --> 0:38:58.640
<v Speaker 3>can't we see that then to give like Molly more

0:38:58.800 --> 0:39:02.080
<v Speaker 3>interior life, like see her dating women and what that

0:39:02.120 --> 0:39:06.520
<v Speaker 3>does look like in contrast to Noah dating men, that

0:39:06.640 --> 0:39:10.640
<v Speaker 3>would develop Molly's character a bit more and make it

0:39:10.680 --> 0:39:13.919
<v Speaker 3>so that she has more interiority versus everything she does

0:39:14.040 --> 0:39:18.279
<v Speaker 3>is in service of her straight white best friend. I

0:39:18.320 --> 0:39:21.719
<v Speaker 3>do feel like she is that Mollie is integrated into

0:39:21.800 --> 0:39:25.279
<v Speaker 3>the story more meaningfully than I was expecting, because she does,

0:39:25.320 --> 0:39:30.440
<v Speaker 3>like go to investigate and then she helps to defeat

0:39:30.600 --> 0:39:33.920
<v Speaker 3>Steve and she kills Anne. But it still means that

0:39:33.960 --> 0:39:39.720
<v Speaker 3>everything she does is to like help her white best friend.

0:39:40.160 --> 0:39:44.000
<v Speaker 2>Right. It's tricky because I do yeah, Mollie does become

0:39:44.560 --> 0:39:47.880
<v Speaker 2>a very I mean, the movie can't happen without Molly.

0:39:48.000 --> 0:39:50.560
<v Speaker 2>It's not like she's strictly there and in the way

0:39:50.560 --> 0:39:53.239
<v Speaker 2>that I feel like we see this trope in other

0:39:53.440 --> 0:39:57.759
<v Speaker 2>movies where it's like a very expendable character who's just

0:39:57.880 --> 0:40:01.040
<v Speaker 2>there to basically be like, so, how are you feeling

0:40:01.200 --> 0:40:04.960
<v Speaker 2>about the relationship? So, like I will give the writer

0:40:05.200 --> 0:40:08.080
<v Speaker 2>Lauren Kahn like credit for you know, this movie is

0:40:08.080 --> 0:40:10.960
<v Speaker 2>not possible without Molly. She's integral to the plot. For

0:40:11.160 --> 0:40:15.120
<v Speaker 2>she's extremely active, like she's smart, like my favorite scenes

0:40:15.160 --> 0:40:18.960
<v Speaker 2>with Mollie. And also Jojo T. Gibs is really funny,

0:40:19.040 --> 0:40:24.560
<v Speaker 2>she's great, but she thinks like a girl, like you know,

0:40:24.640 --> 0:40:27.360
<v Speaker 2>like you when something is like a little bit off

0:40:27.440 --> 0:40:30.680
<v Speaker 2>with her friend, or like the way that she views

0:40:30.760 --> 0:40:33.000
<v Speaker 2>texting and the way that she approaches things like it

0:40:33.320 --> 0:40:37.080
<v Speaker 2>all felt very like authentic and you know, relatable, and

0:40:37.160 --> 0:40:39.239
<v Speaker 2>like even the fact that, just like the touches of

0:40:39.280 --> 0:40:42.560
<v Speaker 2>like she makes sure to share her location with somebody

0:40:42.600 --> 0:40:45.360
<v Speaker 2>when she's going into a situation that feels unsafe and

0:40:45.480 --> 0:40:49.400
<v Speaker 2>just like, yeah, I liked her character when the like

0:40:49.480 --> 0:40:52.920
<v Speaker 2>internal logic that she has and she's funny and she's cool,

0:40:53.000 --> 0:40:57.680
<v Speaker 2>but it's like there's nothing else really there for her.

0:40:58.080 --> 0:41:00.319
<v Speaker 2>Like I feel like this movie would have been more

0:41:00.320 --> 0:41:04.160
<v Speaker 2>interesting to me as like a two hander where Molly

0:41:04.239 --> 0:41:08.360
<v Speaker 2>and Noah are like characters of equal importance as opposed

0:41:08.400 --> 0:41:12.760
<v Speaker 2>to Mollie is Noah's friend, which is how this movie

0:41:12.960 --> 0:41:14.520
<v Speaker 2>you know rolls out for sure.

0:41:15.640 --> 0:41:17.319
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, And I don't think it would have been that

0:41:17.400 --> 0:41:20.799
<v Speaker 3>big of an adjustment, like writing wise or structurally or

0:41:20.800 --> 0:41:21.520
<v Speaker 3>anything like that.

0:41:21.680 --> 0:41:24.480
<v Speaker 2>So and I think it just like from a writing

0:41:24.560 --> 0:41:29.520
<v Speaker 2>perspective too, like Mollie is unbelievably loyal to Noah, like

0:41:29.840 --> 0:41:32.799
<v Speaker 2>which is great friend love that. Yeah, but I would

0:41:32.800 --> 0:41:35.640
<v Speaker 2>have liked to know a little bit more about their friendship.

0:41:35.680 --> 0:41:38.439
<v Speaker 2>We don't really learn very much about it a bit,

0:41:38.480 --> 0:41:41.240
<v Speaker 2>Like I think the most we get is her telling

0:41:41.440 --> 0:41:42.680
<v Speaker 2>Steve they used.

0:41:42.520 --> 0:41:45.960
<v Speaker 3>To work together. Yeah, okay, like you know.

0:41:46.000 --> 0:41:48.279
<v Speaker 2>You work with a lot of people, like and there,

0:41:48.480 --> 0:41:50.840
<v Speaker 2>I don't know, Like I feel like there is something

0:41:50.880 --> 0:41:52.880
<v Speaker 2>a little bit missing for me there where I know

0:41:52.920 --> 0:41:55.319
<v Speaker 2>in horror, very often you don't get a ton of

0:41:55.320 --> 0:42:00.680
<v Speaker 2>information about characters. That's fine as long as it's equally distributed, right, Yeah,

0:42:00.719 --> 0:42:02.759
<v Speaker 2>But like it would have made more sense to me

0:42:02.840 --> 0:42:05.320
<v Speaker 2>if Molly was like, Noah, you know, got me through

0:42:06.200 --> 0:42:09.440
<v Speaker 2>this really difficult period in my life, or like something

0:42:09.480 --> 0:42:13.000
<v Speaker 2>to really explain why she will go balls to the

0:42:13.040 --> 0:42:15.720
<v Speaker 2>wall for this character that I feel like gets away

0:42:15.760 --> 0:42:19.680
<v Speaker 2>from the best friend trope a little bit because not

0:42:19.840 --> 0:42:23.400
<v Speaker 2>that like Noah, you know that your friend should not actively,

0:42:23.440 --> 0:42:26.400
<v Speaker 2>of course, try to rescue you if you've been kidnapped

0:42:26.440 --> 0:42:30.160
<v Speaker 2>by a cannibal. But but I do feel like I

0:42:30.160 --> 0:42:34.000
<v Speaker 2>would have liked to understand their connection a little more,

0:42:34.000 --> 0:42:36.680
<v Speaker 2>And I feel like it would have made the movie stronger.

0:42:37.040 --> 0:42:40.520
<v Speaker 3>Right, especially because we open on a conversation with them,

0:42:40.800 --> 0:42:43.480
<v Speaker 3>you know where Noah is getting advice from Mollie. We

0:42:43.640 --> 0:42:46.600
<v Speaker 3>close on a beat of them like embracing saying I

0:42:46.640 --> 0:42:49.719
<v Speaker 3>love you, I love you more, and it's like, well,

0:42:49.840 --> 0:42:53.080
<v Speaker 3>then contextualize that a bit more please.

0:42:53.440 --> 0:42:56.160
<v Speaker 2>And I feel the same way with Penny and Noah,

0:42:56.200 --> 0:43:00.640
<v Speaker 2>where again you get like the suggestion of a like

0:43:00.960 --> 0:43:04.360
<v Speaker 2>cool character dynamic between the two of them. I feel like,

0:43:04.480 --> 0:43:08.239
<v Speaker 2>you know, in a lesser movie, you'd have victims sort

0:43:08.239 --> 0:43:11.319
<v Speaker 2>of turn against each other or whatever it is, right,

0:43:12.000 --> 0:43:15.359
<v Speaker 2>but they are very much on each other's side. But again,

0:43:15.400 --> 0:43:17.560
<v Speaker 2>you're like there's an opportunity for them to get to

0:43:17.640 --> 0:43:20.839
<v Speaker 2>know each other, and like they kind of don't. It's

0:43:20.880 --> 0:43:24.640
<v Speaker 2>these like little jokes instead, and we don't learn very

0:43:24.719 --> 0:43:26.840
<v Speaker 2>much about Penny, And again, I think it makes the

0:43:26.880 --> 0:43:32.160
<v Speaker 2>movie stronger if we know more about her, like you know,

0:43:32.440 --> 0:43:35.680
<v Speaker 2>and finding something she and Noah have in common, like

0:43:35.760 --> 0:43:38.319
<v Speaker 2>I don't know, I just the relationships between women in

0:43:38.360 --> 0:43:40.959
<v Speaker 2>general in this movie. I feel like, you know, there's

0:43:41.080 --> 0:43:44.520
<v Speaker 2>interesting stuff there, but it kind of like there just

0:43:44.680 --> 0:43:50.160
<v Speaker 2>wasn't enough for there to be a really impactful relationship

0:43:50.239 --> 0:43:52.759
<v Speaker 2>between women. Molly and Noah are great, but it's just

0:43:53.239 --> 0:43:56.040
<v Speaker 2>for me. It was like, what have you guys done? Together,

0:43:56.160 --> 0:43:59.160
<v Speaker 2>Like okay, like what is the friendship?

0:43:59.280 --> 0:43:59.520
<v Speaker 4>Yeah?

0:44:00.239 --> 0:44:06.719
<v Speaker 3>More for sure. Yeah, I want to talk about Anne

0:44:06.800 --> 0:44:11.640
<v Speaker 3>her Wow, good arrested development reference.

0:44:11.960 --> 0:44:15.600
<v Speaker 2>Thank you. Yeah, let's talk about and Charlotte Lebon.

0:44:16.480 --> 0:44:21.319
<v Speaker 3>Yes, so you know, you can read her character as

0:44:21.600 --> 0:44:23.799
<v Speaker 3>someone who did what she had to do in order

0:44:23.840 --> 0:44:29.640
<v Speaker 3>to survive. It seems like she seduced Steve into sparing

0:44:29.760 --> 0:44:34.600
<v Speaker 3>her and that was her method of escape from almost

0:44:34.880 --> 0:44:39.759
<v Speaker 3>certain death. So I chose to read her character and

0:44:39.840 --> 0:44:45.400
<v Speaker 3>her behavior as commentary on people who are like the

0:44:45.480 --> 0:44:51.200
<v Speaker 3>victims or recipients or survivors of some form of oppression,

0:44:52.200 --> 0:44:56.799
<v Speaker 3>and then rather than siding with other oppressed people like

0:44:56.960 --> 0:45:00.160
<v Speaker 3>you think they would, because you think they'd have empathy

0:45:00.200 --> 0:45:05.640
<v Speaker 3>because they experienced the same oppression themselves, but instead they

0:45:05.800 --> 0:45:11.239
<v Speaker 3>align themselves with the oppressor and become complicit in, if

0:45:11.280 --> 0:45:15.680
<v Speaker 3>not active, participants, in the oppression of others, which is

0:45:15.680 --> 0:45:19.200
<v Speaker 3>something I think about a lot. I am conly thinking

0:45:19.200 --> 0:45:22.080
<v Speaker 3>about this. It happens a lot in society. Ever heard

0:45:22.120 --> 0:45:25.239
<v Speaker 3>of it? And I find it to be such a

0:45:25.520 --> 0:45:28.839
<v Speaker 3>troubling yet fascinating phenomenon.

0:45:29.200 --> 0:45:31.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean it's like all the fucking time, Like

0:45:32.040 --> 0:45:34.479
<v Speaker 2>how many this is unfortunate? But yeah, Like, I feel

0:45:34.480 --> 0:45:36.840
<v Speaker 2>like a lot of people have the experience of, especially

0:45:37.160 --> 0:45:40.240
<v Speaker 2>people of marginalized genders, of like my first boss who's

0:45:40.239 --> 0:45:43.960
<v Speaker 2>not a man, and then they are also upholding the

0:45:44.040 --> 0:45:49.680
<v Speaker 2>same shit, and you're like, well, what the fuck the point? Right,

0:45:49.760 --> 0:45:50.840
<v Speaker 2>what is the point?

0:45:51.200 --> 0:45:56.040
<v Speaker 3>You know, it's the trad wife phenomenon. It's like when

0:45:56.160 --> 0:45:59.120
<v Speaker 3>black people become cops. You know, there's like a bunch

0:45:59.120 --> 0:46:00.799
<v Speaker 3>of different exams, and.

0:46:00.760 --> 0:46:03.480
<v Speaker 2>There's all of these societal reasons, Like you're saying, like,

0:46:03.480 --> 0:46:06.839
<v Speaker 2>there's societal reasons as to why this happens, but it is.

0:46:07.600 --> 0:46:11.680
<v Speaker 2>It's like sad. It's sad to see in characters like Anne,

0:46:11.680 --> 0:46:14.640
<v Speaker 2>and I appreciated that. I thought that, Yeah, that was

0:46:14.640 --> 0:46:17.759
<v Speaker 2>like one of the more effective things in the movie.

0:46:18.040 --> 0:46:20.799
<v Speaker 2>I guess I am fine with the way that that

0:46:21.440 --> 0:46:24.680
<v Speaker 2>character went. But the thing I liked the most is

0:46:24.719 --> 0:46:28.000
<v Speaker 2>that I feel like the movie it does not have

0:46:28.120 --> 0:46:31.880
<v Speaker 2>a ton of empathy for Anne, but I think it

0:46:31.960 --> 0:46:33.759
<v Speaker 2>had a little bit in a way that I think

0:46:33.880 --> 0:46:37.480
<v Speaker 2>was interesting. Where Noah, it seems like, is being presented

0:46:37.560 --> 0:46:41.319
<v Speaker 2>with the beginnings of the same kind of dynamic, right,

0:46:41.360 --> 0:46:45.120
<v Speaker 2>where like Noah, in order to escape the immediate circumstances

0:46:45.760 --> 0:46:50.040
<v Speaker 2>is having to play meat ball with this guy, right,

0:46:50.160 --> 0:46:55.360
<v Speaker 2>like he's thank you, thank you, no, but like she

0:46:55.360 --> 0:46:57.279
<v Speaker 2>she is sort of having to play ball with him

0:46:57.320 --> 0:47:01.080
<v Speaker 2>in order to liberate herself, and she is different. She

0:47:01.680 --> 0:47:06.040
<v Speaker 2>liberates the other women who are trapped there. But I

0:47:06.239 --> 0:47:08.799
<v Speaker 2>did think it was interesting that it was like, oh,

0:47:08.840 --> 0:47:12.680
<v Speaker 2>this is almost certainly what happened with Anne, but she

0:47:12.800 --> 0:47:16.200
<v Speaker 2>did not liberate the other people. And you know I

0:47:16.239 --> 0:47:19.520
<v Speaker 2>would hazard I guess out of fear and like out

0:47:19.560 --> 0:47:23.240
<v Speaker 2>of selfishness and fear, right, which is why a lot

0:47:23.360 --> 0:47:26.560
<v Speaker 2>of people of marginalized genders uphold the patriarchy because it's

0:47:26.600 --> 0:47:33.839
<v Speaker 2>personally advantageous and because they're afraid of not aligning. And

0:47:34.080 --> 0:47:36.600
<v Speaker 2>you see it everywhere. You see it in fucking politics

0:47:36.680 --> 0:47:39.520
<v Speaker 2>all the fucking time. Yes, we could keep going, right.

0:47:39.680 --> 0:47:41.760
<v Speaker 3>I think it has a lot to do with power

0:47:41.840 --> 0:47:44.640
<v Speaker 3>dynamics as well, where people will choose the side of

0:47:44.680 --> 0:47:47.640
<v Speaker 3>the oppressor because the oppressor has more power and they

0:47:47.640 --> 0:47:50.560
<v Speaker 3>think that if they align with the oppressor, they will

0:47:50.600 --> 0:47:53.759
<v Speaker 3>inherit some of that power. And that is true, and

0:47:53.800 --> 0:47:55.839
<v Speaker 3>that does happen sometimes, but it doesn't mean that they

0:47:55.880 --> 0:48:01.000
<v Speaker 3>will be immune to oppression and marginalization because cause this

0:48:01.080 --> 0:48:04.880
<v Speaker 3>oppression is very large scale in it's systemic, and it

0:48:04.920 --> 0:48:07.319
<v Speaker 3>needs to be fought against, which is what Noah does,

0:48:08.040 --> 0:48:11.279
<v Speaker 3>rather than what Anne does, which is like, you know,

0:48:11.520 --> 0:48:16.320
<v Speaker 3>uphold it after she escapes quote unquote from the oppression.

0:48:16.719 --> 0:48:19.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. I thought that was really effective. Yeah. And then

0:48:20.280 --> 0:48:23.919
<v Speaker 2>I mean we are quite literally bashed over the head

0:48:23.920 --> 0:48:27.920
<v Speaker 2>with that message as well when Molly kills Anne, and

0:48:27.960 --> 0:48:29.960
<v Speaker 2>I think she says like, bitches like you are.

0:48:29.840 --> 0:48:32.360
<v Speaker 3>The problem, Like, yeah, I came to you for help.

0:48:32.680 --> 0:48:34.719
<v Speaker 2>I almost like again, I feel like I'm coming dead

0:48:34.760 --> 0:48:36.480
<v Speaker 2>too hard to that. I almost like didn't need that.

0:48:36.560 --> 0:48:39.160
<v Speaker 2>I'm like, yeah, no, we get I got it, Like

0:48:39.640 --> 0:48:41.760
<v Speaker 2>I got it. Yes, and is a part of the problem.

0:48:42.520 --> 0:48:44.759
<v Speaker 2>But you know, it's a horror movie. It can't be.

0:48:44.920 --> 0:48:45.360
<v Speaker 1>It's weird.

0:48:45.600 --> 0:48:48.520
<v Speaker 2>Sure, sure, but yeah, I thought that that was pretty effective.

0:48:48.719 --> 0:48:51.279
<v Speaker 2>I did have just like a story logic question where

0:48:51.920 --> 0:48:55.120
<v Speaker 2>so like they have two kids and Sebastian stans just

0:48:55.239 --> 0:48:58.120
<v Speaker 2>bonking women over the head and meanwhile, my sons are asleep,

0:48:58.680 --> 0:49:01.640
<v Speaker 2>My two gorgeous sons are like upstairs.

0:49:01.280 --> 0:49:04.640
<v Speaker 3>And his murder cannibal house is so far away, like

0:49:04.719 --> 0:49:07.399
<v Speaker 3>how does he have the time to drive the air

0:49:07.480 --> 0:49:10.280
<v Speaker 3>and back to his other house where his family lives.

0:49:10.760 --> 0:49:15.600
<v Speaker 2>You know, yeah, you know. I yeah, cheating men, you

0:49:15.640 --> 0:49:18.040
<v Speaker 2>know men, men with the secret life. They make it work,

0:49:18.120 --> 0:49:23.880
<v Speaker 2>they make it work. Yeah, yeah, there are our strongest soldiers.

0:49:24.600 --> 0:49:24.880
<v Speaker 4>Yeah.

0:49:24.960 --> 0:49:27.759
<v Speaker 2>I thought the an stuff was effective, and I feel

0:49:27.760 --> 0:49:31.719
<v Speaker 2>like that character's like presence was pretty well balanced. What

0:49:31.840 --> 0:49:33.719
<v Speaker 2>I was interested in? What did you think of like

0:49:33.760 --> 0:49:36.640
<v Speaker 2>when she saw I don't know, I guess okay, I

0:49:36.680 --> 0:49:41.160
<v Speaker 2>do have questions about her ending right, because for a second,

0:49:41.239 --> 0:49:43.640
<v Speaker 2>I was like, are we supposed to believe that this

0:49:43.840 --> 0:49:47.120
<v Speaker 2>is like Anne's idea. No, it's Steve's idea, which makes

0:49:47.160 --> 0:49:51.640
<v Speaker 2>more sense. Great, but you know, she sees his body

0:49:52.120 --> 0:49:53.640
<v Speaker 2>and I feel like you sort of get a sense

0:49:53.640 --> 0:49:56.759
<v Speaker 2>of like a little bit of relief from her. She's like,

0:49:56.800 --> 0:49:58.439
<v Speaker 2>all right, put it on ice. We're going to sell

0:49:58.480 --> 0:50:02.080
<v Speaker 2>his meat. Yes, like is the suggestion there, But then

0:50:02.120 --> 0:50:07.200
<v Speaker 2>she like pretends to be grateful for Noah but then

0:50:07.320 --> 0:50:09.120
<v Speaker 2>tries to kill her. I guess I was just like

0:50:09.200 --> 0:50:12.280
<v Speaker 2>a little bit coulde. I guess that's just the power

0:50:12.360 --> 0:50:15.960
<v Speaker 2>dynamic right where she's like, now I'm going to have.

0:50:15.920 --> 0:50:18.680
<v Speaker 3>The meat business business.

0:50:18.719 --> 0:50:20.759
<v Speaker 2>Like I guess I was a little confused about what

0:50:20.880 --> 0:50:24.120
<v Speaker 2>her end game was because theoretically, like she is now

0:50:24.200 --> 0:50:26.880
<v Speaker 2>liberated too, Yes, but I don't know.

0:50:27.320 --> 0:50:29.960
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I guess that she's just like so deep in the.

0:50:30.800 --> 0:50:34.520
<v Speaker 2>Meat, so deep in the meat. Of course, it's like

0:50:34.600 --> 0:50:36.719
<v Speaker 2>she I don't know, I guess I don't know how

0:50:36.719 --> 0:50:38.720
<v Speaker 2>that would play out for her in the courts.

0:50:39.080 --> 0:50:39.840
<v Speaker 3>Uh huh.

0:50:39.880 --> 0:50:42.680
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, I'm like, and you really want to keep

0:50:42.760 --> 0:50:45.080
<v Speaker 2>running this business? Like it seems like it's kind of

0:50:45.120 --> 0:50:49.680
<v Speaker 2>on thin nice as it is. Yeah, In any case,

0:50:49.719 --> 0:50:51.799
<v Speaker 2>I just wanted to mention that because I wasn't totally

0:50:52.920 --> 0:50:55.360
<v Speaker 2>because the movie does just end very quickly for me,

0:50:55.480 --> 0:50:58.640
<v Speaker 2>where I would have been interested in maybe one more

0:50:58.680 --> 0:51:02.360
<v Speaker 2>beat with Anne to understand where she's coming from a

0:51:02.360 --> 0:51:05.600
<v Speaker 2>little better. Like obviously her character is indefensible, but like

0:51:06.000 --> 0:51:09.080
<v Speaker 2>in order to just like explore the idea that we

0:51:09.080 --> 0:51:11.759
<v Speaker 2>were just talking about a little more and siding with

0:51:11.840 --> 0:51:14.040
<v Speaker 2>the oppressor and what leads to there, I feel like

0:51:14.520 --> 0:51:18.799
<v Speaker 2>it maybe would have benefited from a little more investigation

0:51:18.840 --> 0:51:21.760
<v Speaker 2>of that, especially because like Noah and Anne, it seems

0:51:21.800 --> 0:51:27.000
<v Speaker 2>like we're treated pretty similarly towards the beginning by Steve,

0:51:27.840 --> 0:51:30.520
<v Speaker 2>and I almost feel like, well, then don't you want

0:51:30.560 --> 0:51:33.160
<v Speaker 2>to see those characters like interact a little bit. I

0:51:33.160 --> 0:51:34.720
<v Speaker 2>don't know, I think it could have been interesting.

0:51:35.160 --> 0:51:41.600
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, And what about Anne made her gravitate toward being

0:51:41.719 --> 0:51:45.440
<v Speaker 3>complicit and being part of the problem exactly, Like what

0:51:45.480 --> 0:51:49.000
<v Speaker 3>were her circumstances that led her to that versus like

0:51:49.040 --> 0:51:51.120
<v Speaker 3>how did she differ from Noah?

0:51:51.440 --> 0:51:54.440
<v Speaker 2>Right? I mean, because she is obviously she is a villain,

0:51:54.480 --> 0:51:57.239
<v Speaker 2>but she is a more complicated villain than Steve. And

0:51:57.280 --> 0:52:01.319
<v Speaker 2>I feel like it would have been interesting and just

0:52:01.480 --> 0:52:06.080
<v Speaker 2>again like another chance to like have more character moments

0:52:06.120 --> 0:52:08.120
<v Speaker 2>between the women in this movie that just kind of

0:52:08.200 --> 0:52:10.120
<v Speaker 2>like doesn't happen.

0:52:10.680 --> 0:52:14.440
<v Speaker 3>Yeah. Also worth noting that Anne is a character with

0:52:14.560 --> 0:52:17.040
<v Speaker 3>a prosthetic limb, which is not the case for the

0:52:17.080 --> 0:52:20.720
<v Speaker 3>actor Charlotte Lebon, so it's another example of an able

0:52:20.719 --> 0:52:25.839
<v Speaker 3>bodied actor playing a disabled character. I want to also

0:52:25.880 --> 0:52:29.680
<v Speaker 3>briefly touch on the man who is with Anne at

0:52:29.680 --> 0:52:32.840
<v Speaker 3>the end, who she tells like put his body on ice.

0:52:33.400 --> 0:52:36.319
<v Speaker 3>This is someone who we've seen briefly before. Seems to

0:52:36.360 --> 0:52:41.160
<v Speaker 3>be like an assistant who like helps deliver the packaged meat.

0:52:42.239 --> 0:52:46.640
<v Speaker 3>He appears to be like a First Nation's indigenous person,

0:52:47.160 --> 0:52:49.719
<v Speaker 3>but we don't know anything about this person. He has,

0:52:49.800 --> 0:52:54.360
<v Speaker 3>Like I think no dialogue. We don't know why he

0:52:54.480 --> 0:52:58.760
<v Speaker 3>would be working for this white couple doing their evil bidding.

0:53:00.000 --> 0:53:02.680
<v Speaker 3>He clearly knows what they're doing. He's standing right there

0:53:02.840 --> 0:53:06.480
<v Speaker 3>when like the dead body of Steve is there, like

0:53:06.560 --> 0:53:09.120
<v Speaker 3>he's packaging the you know, he's he knows what the

0:53:09.120 --> 0:53:09.960
<v Speaker 3>operation is.

0:53:10.360 --> 0:53:10.760
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

0:53:10.800 --> 0:53:13.799
<v Speaker 3>So it's just like why this care? Like this is

0:53:13.840 --> 0:53:19.400
<v Speaker 3>not the inclusion or representation we need of indigenous characters.

0:53:20.360 --> 0:53:21.880
<v Speaker 3>Why was this choice made?

0:53:22.520 --> 0:53:26.520
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, a character that could be so easily removed again, Yeah,

0:53:26.640 --> 0:53:29.640
<v Speaker 2>just another like it just feels a little bit like

0:53:29.680 --> 0:53:30.759
<v Speaker 2>what are we trying to do here?

0:53:31.080 --> 0:53:36.080
<v Speaker 3>Right, Because like a lot of casting in contemporary movies

0:53:36.120 --> 0:53:41.440
<v Speaker 3>within the past few years, it is more inclusive, but

0:53:41.520 --> 0:53:43.680
<v Speaker 3>a lot of these movies are still made by white people,

0:53:43.920 --> 0:53:46.640
<v Speaker 3>and they're just like, oh, I have to fill a quota, right,

0:53:46.680 --> 0:53:48.400
<v Speaker 3>you know, I want to be inclusive in my casting,

0:53:48.719 --> 0:53:50.680
<v Speaker 3>But they're not giving a lot of thought about like

0:53:51.040 --> 0:53:54.680
<v Speaker 3>who is in what role, who is occupying what he

0:53:54.840 --> 0:53:59.239
<v Speaker 3>has the narrative power like yeah, and what implications a

0:53:59.280 --> 0:54:02.520
<v Speaker 3>certain person and cast in a certain role has and

0:54:02.560 --> 0:54:07.000
<v Speaker 3>whether that tracks logically at all. So that felt to

0:54:07.040 --> 0:54:10.480
<v Speaker 3>me like an example of like, oh, let's see an

0:54:10.560 --> 0:54:12.359
<v Speaker 3>indigenous person on screen.

0:54:12.400 --> 0:54:14.680
<v Speaker 2>But in a role that could be taken out of

0:54:14.719 --> 0:54:18.160
<v Speaker 2>the movie without any issue. Like, yeah, I agree with

0:54:18.200 --> 0:54:22.080
<v Speaker 2>you there, And yeah, it's frustrating because I don't know

0:54:22.120 --> 0:54:25.760
<v Speaker 2>who casts this movie. It is a fairly diverse cast,

0:54:25.840 --> 0:54:31.359
<v Speaker 2>but it cuts along very, very trophy lines. And this

0:54:31.400 --> 0:54:33.400
<v Speaker 2>movie came out two years ago, Like there's really no

0:54:33.520 --> 0:54:38.319
<v Speaker 2>reason for that to have happened, and it ultimately kind

0:54:38.320 --> 0:54:42.080
<v Speaker 2>of undercuts what this movie is trying to do by like,

0:54:42.280 --> 0:54:45.160
<v Speaker 2>you know, subverting the gaze of a cannibal movie, which

0:54:45.200 --> 0:54:48.239
<v Speaker 2>is a cool idea and like it works for me

0:54:48.360 --> 0:54:50.960
<v Speaker 2>for the most part, but it's like that level of

0:54:51.120 --> 0:54:54.160
<v Speaker 2>care again, it's just kind of I mean, like a

0:54:54.200 --> 0:54:58.920
<v Speaker 2>white feminis the thing to do is for one message

0:54:58.920 --> 0:55:01.439
<v Speaker 2>to come through really clearly. But the you know, intersectional

0:55:01.480 --> 0:55:04.640
<v Speaker 2>thinking I don't think was there at least in the casting.

0:55:04.800 --> 0:55:08.360
<v Speaker 2>I mean, and yeah, in the casting, it definitely wasn't

0:55:08.760 --> 0:55:10.880
<v Speaker 2>for sure. Yeah, should we talk about Steve.

0:55:11.400 --> 0:55:12.800
<v Speaker 3>Let's talk about Steve.

0:55:13.400 --> 0:55:17.120
<v Speaker 2>I have to say I thought the like rom com

0:55:17.239 --> 0:55:21.239
<v Speaker 2>portion of this movie was very effective for me in

0:55:21.320 --> 0:55:24.239
<v Speaker 2>terms of just like, I mean, rom COM's the wrong

0:55:24.360 --> 0:55:27.400
<v Speaker 2>thing to call it, but just I think my favorite

0:55:27.400 --> 0:55:31.000
<v Speaker 2>parts of the movie The Cannibal stuff great, sure, and

0:55:31.040 --> 0:55:34.040
<v Speaker 2>I like it, but there was this like weird satisfaction

0:55:34.120 --> 0:55:40.319
<v Speaker 2>of watching someone who is smart blow past all of

0:55:40.360 --> 0:55:45.520
<v Speaker 2>these red flags. It just made me feel better about myself.

0:55:45.719 --> 0:55:48.239
<v Speaker 2>You know, were so many times. You know, it's like,

0:55:48.239 --> 0:55:50.319
<v Speaker 2>if you end up in a bad situation, you end

0:55:50.400 --> 0:55:53.520
<v Speaker 2>up in a bad relationship, you're made out to be

0:55:53.719 --> 0:55:55.920
<v Speaker 2>like God, I'm I mean and she says that to herself,

0:55:55.920 --> 0:55:59.000
<v Speaker 2>like I'm so stupid, Like how could I have let

0:55:59.120 --> 0:56:02.080
<v Speaker 2>this happen? And I feel like the movie does do

0:56:02.160 --> 0:56:04.279
<v Speaker 2>a really good job of illustrating the fact. I mean

0:56:04.360 --> 0:56:07.920
<v Speaker 2>sometimes it's just Penny saying that through the wall, but

0:56:08.200 --> 0:56:12.799
<v Speaker 2>like that, no, like there was not some crucial thing

0:56:12.880 --> 0:56:17.360
<v Speaker 2>that you did wrong that means that you're now getting cannibaled.

0:56:17.680 --> 0:56:19.880
<v Speaker 2>But I thought that the writing with like the subtle

0:56:19.960 --> 0:56:24.680
<v Speaker 2>red flags, that whole section, that whole beginning section, really

0:56:24.880 --> 0:56:25.600
<v Speaker 2>worked for.

0:56:25.480 --> 0:56:30.920
<v Speaker 3>Me, especially because the red flags are subtle enough that

0:56:31.040 --> 0:56:35.400
<v Speaker 3>even if you are smart and intuitive and perceptive, you

0:56:35.640 --> 0:56:41.239
<v Speaker 3>might not recognize them, especially because in just like the

0:56:41.360 --> 0:56:45.839
<v Speaker 3>landscape of modern dating and so many men and I'm

0:56:45.880 --> 0:56:50.400
<v Speaker 3>now speaking from personal experience here, but like cis men

0:56:50.480 --> 0:56:57.040
<v Speaker 3>tend to not consider the fact that people of marginalized

0:56:57.080 --> 0:57:02.200
<v Speaker 3>genders move through the world very differently, and that there's

0:57:02.200 --> 0:57:05.279
<v Speaker 3>a level of like caution and self preservation that we

0:57:05.360 --> 0:57:07.920
<v Speaker 3>have to be far more concerned about than sis men.

0:57:08.160 --> 0:57:11.520
<v Speaker 3>And I try to communicate that a lot with like

0:57:11.600 --> 0:57:15.200
<v Speaker 3>people I've matched with on a dating app and we're

0:57:15.920 --> 0:57:18.960
<v Speaker 3>scheduling a first date, and I am and not that

0:57:19.000 --> 0:57:22.480
<v Speaker 3>I've always done this, but boy have I learned my lessons.

0:57:22.520 --> 0:57:26.280
<v Speaker 3>But like, generally speaking, I will insist that we meet

0:57:26.280 --> 0:57:29.040
<v Speaker 3>in a public space and in a neighborhood that is

0:57:29.080 --> 0:57:32.240
<v Speaker 3>familiar to me, because I need an exit strategy if

0:57:32.240 --> 0:57:34.480
<v Speaker 3>I need to get away, I want to be able

0:57:34.520 --> 0:57:36.640
<v Speaker 3>to do it safely, and I want to like have

0:57:36.720 --> 0:57:40.120
<v Speaker 3>it be in a place where I can navigate easily.

0:57:40.880 --> 0:57:43.880
<v Speaker 3>But a lot of people who I'm like organizing a

0:57:43.960 --> 0:57:48.120
<v Speaker 3>date with, and unfortunately I'm tragically heterosexual, so it's men

0:57:48.920 --> 0:57:52.919
<v Speaker 3>who I'm dating, They'll be like, oh, well, just come over,

0:57:53.160 --> 0:57:56.400
<v Speaker 3>you know, and I'm like, no, I haven't met you.

0:57:56.480 --> 0:57:58.520
<v Speaker 3>I don't know you. I don't know if I can

0:57:58.560 --> 0:58:00.640
<v Speaker 3>trust you, and they're like, oh, of course you can,

0:58:00.800 --> 0:58:03.720
<v Speaker 3>blah blah blah, and I'm like, do you not understand

0:58:03.760 --> 0:58:07.160
<v Speaker 3>that trust is something that people earn. You can't just

0:58:07.800 --> 0:58:11.840
<v Speaker 3>declare that you're trustworthy and have me automatically trust you.

0:58:12.080 --> 0:58:14.680
<v Speaker 3>But so many CIS men don't seem to understand that.

0:58:15.200 --> 0:58:18.120
<v Speaker 3>And again I'll tell them, we have to meet in public.

0:58:18.200 --> 0:58:21.200
<v Speaker 3>I want to hang out in public for a long

0:58:21.280 --> 0:58:24.800
<v Speaker 3>time before I would ever consider like going to your

0:58:24.840 --> 0:58:27.000
<v Speaker 3>place or bringing you back to my place, like, I

0:58:27.120 --> 0:58:31.640
<v Speaker 3>have to know that I can feel safe, and like

0:58:32.160 --> 0:58:34.160
<v Speaker 3>the number of men who just like do not even

0:58:34.240 --> 0:58:37.480
<v Speaker 3>consider that or care about that is astonishing.

0:58:37.960 --> 0:58:39.840
<v Speaker 2>It's interesting because I know that you and I approach

0:58:39.920 --> 0:58:42.760
<v Speaker 2>like I think you approach dating much smarter than I

0:58:42.800 --> 0:58:46.960
<v Speaker 2>have historically. But I mean, even who knows I really,

0:58:47.040 --> 0:58:50.080
<v Speaker 2>I mean, you know, check the logs. But I do

0:58:50.360 --> 0:58:54.400
<v Speaker 2>like I agree with you, and especially any time I

0:58:54.400 --> 0:58:57.280
<v Speaker 2>feel like when I've done that dating, I've never even

0:58:57.320 --> 0:59:00.560
<v Speaker 2>really said that that's what I'm doing because I am

0:59:00.640 --> 0:59:05.200
<v Speaker 2>afraid it will be interpreted as you know, I'm afraid

0:59:05.240 --> 0:59:09.360
<v Speaker 2>of the dynamic that introduces, even though it's like, of course,

0:59:09.600 --> 0:59:12.360
<v Speaker 2>of course you're thinking that. And I feel like a

0:59:12.440 --> 0:59:16.520
<v Speaker 2>lot of men cannot handle the idea that they are

0:59:16.560 --> 0:59:19.840
<v Speaker 2>not inherently trusted and that like the world doesn't fucking

0:59:19.880 --> 0:59:22.200
<v Speaker 2>revolve around them for sure. And I mean, I think

0:59:22.240 --> 0:59:24.480
<v Speaker 2>that what you're doing makes so much sense because it's

0:59:24.560 --> 0:59:28.040
<v Speaker 2>like you're just normalizing, Like there's no reason for me

0:59:28.120 --> 0:59:29.960
<v Speaker 2>to trust you. You are a stranger.

0:59:30.360 --> 0:59:31.919
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, and like I.

0:59:31.840 --> 0:59:35.200
<v Speaker 2>Have to move through the world differently, and I wish

0:59:35.280 --> 0:59:39.080
<v Speaker 2>that there was a more like a clearer understanding to that.

0:59:40.080 --> 0:59:43.080
<v Speaker 2>But I've definitely been I won't even say guilty of,

0:59:43.160 --> 0:59:45.680
<v Speaker 2>but my instinct in the past has been too planned

0:59:45.680 --> 0:59:48.480
<v Speaker 2>for that. But never say that that's what I'm doing,

0:59:49.160 --> 0:59:52.120
<v Speaker 2>because I'm afraid of how men react when their pride

0:59:52.200 --> 0:59:55.440
<v Speaker 2>is injured, which should be scary yet and my experience

0:59:55.520 --> 0:59:58.800
<v Speaker 2>is often violent, Yeah, yeah, or cruel or whatever. I mean,

0:59:58.840 --> 1:00:01.360
<v Speaker 2>I think you get that quick with the guy from

1:00:01.440 --> 1:00:02.640
<v Speaker 2>Jane the Virgin at.

1:00:02.480 --> 1:00:06.120
<v Speaker 3>The beginning of the movie, Oh is that who that is? Yeah,

1:00:06.200 --> 1:00:07.600
<v Speaker 3>I didn't watch much of that show.

1:00:07.880 --> 1:00:11.680
<v Speaker 2>I've for some reason was so into it then, but yeah,

1:00:11.720 --> 1:00:14.880
<v Speaker 2>that like he is the sort of you know, archetypical

1:00:14.960 --> 1:00:19.400
<v Speaker 2>bad date and that this is like what Noah is

1:00:20.040 --> 1:00:22.520
<v Speaker 2>used to. And I think that that ends up being

1:00:22.720 --> 1:00:25.640
<v Speaker 2>very effective because as I was like watching the movie,

1:00:25.640 --> 1:00:29.400
<v Speaker 2>I'm like, I would have fallen for this, I would have.

1:00:29.760 --> 1:00:32.280
<v Speaker 2>And I think that it's very like you're saying that

1:00:32.320 --> 1:00:35.680
<v Speaker 2>the red flags are very present and noted by her friend,

1:00:36.080 --> 1:00:38.640
<v Speaker 2>but is subtle enough that she's like, it's probably not

1:00:38.680 --> 1:00:42.000
<v Speaker 2>a big deal. Let's see what happened, right, and like

1:00:42.200 --> 1:00:47.040
<v Speaker 2>that sort of looped thinking of like, well, if I

1:00:47.080 --> 1:00:49.040
<v Speaker 2>am worried about this, then how am I ever going

1:00:49.080 --> 1:00:51.040
<v Speaker 2>to have a relationship blah blah blah blah blah blah,

1:00:51.080 --> 1:00:54.080
<v Speaker 2>and like feeling that sort of loop. I don't know.

1:00:54.320 --> 1:00:57.440
<v Speaker 2>And then when she gets to the house, I've just

1:00:57.560 --> 1:01:01.680
<v Speaker 2>like soft triggered by yeah, just going into someone's house

1:01:01.680 --> 1:01:04.040
<v Speaker 2>and realizing you're like, oh, I don't know where I am,

1:01:04.680 --> 1:01:06.320
<v Speaker 2>or like if I do know where I am, I'm

1:01:06.360 --> 1:01:09.880
<v Speaker 2>not able to communicate easily enough. And now the power

1:01:10.000 --> 1:01:13.320
<v Speaker 2>dynamic is such that I have to basically admit I

1:01:13.320 --> 1:01:15.960
<v Speaker 2>don't feel totally safe right now. Could you give me

1:01:16.000 --> 1:01:18.880
<v Speaker 2>the tools to feel safer and sort of being at

1:01:18.920 --> 1:01:24.000
<v Speaker 2>someone else's mercy but having to maintain a like sexy

1:01:24.880 --> 1:01:28.800
<v Speaker 2>like vibe while being like okay, like it's Jay.

1:01:28.640 --> 1:01:32.240
<v Speaker 3>What's your Wi Fi best word? Yeah?

1:01:32.280 --> 1:01:34.760
<v Speaker 2>I mean, but like I went on a weekend trip

1:01:34.840 --> 1:01:38.080
<v Speaker 2>with someone who I had just recently started dating, you know,

1:01:38.080 --> 1:01:40.440
<v Speaker 2>a couple of years ago, and there is like that

1:01:40.520 --> 1:01:43.320
<v Speaker 2>moment where you're like, well, we don't know each other

1:01:43.400 --> 1:01:45.680
<v Speaker 2>that well, and you know, and then the more time

1:01:45.680 --> 1:01:47.800
<v Speaker 2>we're spending together, I'm like, and I don't know if

1:01:47.920 --> 1:01:50.440
<v Speaker 2>I like you very much, and You're like, well, how

1:01:50.480 --> 1:01:52.160
<v Speaker 2>the fuck would I get out of here? I mean,

1:01:52.400 --> 1:01:54.919
<v Speaker 2>it is just, yeah, I don't know dating men. It

1:01:55.000 --> 1:01:58.280
<v Speaker 2>is just like means that you frequently find yourself in

1:01:58.320 --> 1:02:02.800
<v Speaker 2>what feels like hostage situation, and that is a lot

1:02:02.840 --> 1:02:05.240
<v Speaker 2>of why this movie works works.

1:02:05.520 --> 1:02:07.960
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, oh okay, wait, I have so many thoughts. One

1:02:08.200 --> 1:02:13.240
<v Speaker 3>is that I think the fact that they meet under

1:02:13.280 --> 1:02:17.920
<v Speaker 3>the circumstances of meeting in real life quote unquote versus

1:02:17.920 --> 1:02:21.400
<v Speaker 3>meeting over a dating app might inform some of her

1:02:22.120 --> 1:02:25.760
<v Speaker 3>feeling more at ease, even though they are perfect strangers

1:02:25.760 --> 1:02:28.280
<v Speaker 3>and they don't know each other. But because I mean

1:02:28.320 --> 1:02:31.240
<v Speaker 3>to bring them back to our personal lives, you and

1:02:31.320 --> 1:02:33.320
<v Speaker 3>I approach dating differently in the sense that I feel

1:02:33.320 --> 1:02:35.400
<v Speaker 3>like you tend to date people who you have met

1:02:35.680 --> 1:02:38.840
<v Speaker 3>in real life, either you know, in some kind of

1:02:38.840 --> 1:02:43.120
<v Speaker 3>comedy circumstances or you know, different settings where I've never

1:02:43.200 --> 1:02:46.440
<v Speaker 3>done apps yet, and I've pretty much only done dating

1:02:46.480 --> 1:02:48.960
<v Speaker 3>apps and that's how I've met like ninety five percent

1:02:48.960 --> 1:02:52.320
<v Speaker 3>of the people I've like briefly dated. So there is

1:02:52.400 --> 1:02:55.240
<v Speaker 3>this level of like, oh my god, I'm meeting up

1:02:55.240 --> 1:02:58.320
<v Speaker 3>with a stranger who I've only corresponded with over text

1:02:58.480 --> 1:03:02.160
<v Speaker 3>or maybe FaceTime, but like they're so straight. So that

1:03:02.440 --> 1:03:03.840
<v Speaker 3>does mean that I feel like I have to be

1:03:03.960 --> 1:03:08.200
<v Speaker 3>extra cautious and extra clear about my intentions because I

1:03:08.280 --> 1:03:13.600
<v Speaker 3>totally get like being wary of setting boundaries because of

1:03:13.640 --> 1:03:18.080
<v Speaker 3>how so many men respond to setting boundaries and feeling

1:03:18.600 --> 1:03:22.800
<v Speaker 3>like their ego is bruised because they're not automatically trustworthy.

1:03:22.920 --> 1:03:26.000
<v Speaker 3>But like you said, I am trying to like normalize

1:03:26.000 --> 1:03:32.200
<v Speaker 3>the idea of like men understanding that they are just

1:03:32.320 --> 1:03:37.240
<v Speaker 3>inherently safer moving through the world than people of marginalized genders.

1:03:36.920 --> 1:03:39.200
<v Speaker 2>Which is like it feels so weird at this late

1:03:39.320 --> 1:03:42.880
<v Speaker 2>stage that like you have to be like, have you

1:03:42.920 --> 1:03:43.800
<v Speaker 2>ever thought about this?

1:03:43.960 --> 1:03:46.560
<v Speaker 3>You're like, and so okay, there's a spectrum of what

1:03:46.600 --> 1:03:49.800
<v Speaker 3>will happen if, first of all, a man just like

1:03:49.840 --> 1:03:53.360
<v Speaker 3>ass this man saying come over. We've never met in

1:03:53.400 --> 1:03:56.480
<v Speaker 3>real life before, but let's have our first date on

1:03:56.520 --> 1:03:59.400
<v Speaker 3>my couch. That is a red flag just in and

1:03:59.440 --> 1:04:02.720
<v Speaker 3>of itself, and I usually will just not talk to

1:04:02.720 --> 1:04:04.800
<v Speaker 3>the people after that. But if we've already had some

1:04:04.920 --> 1:04:08.280
<v Speaker 3>kind of like rapport that feels fun and we were

1:04:08.360 --> 1:04:10.760
<v Speaker 3>flirting and we like it seemed like a good conversation

1:04:10.840 --> 1:04:14.600
<v Speaker 3>stuff like that, I will be like, no, actually, I

1:04:14.680 --> 1:04:17.960
<v Speaker 3>need to meet you in public, and then I'll explain why.

1:04:18.000 --> 1:04:20.200
<v Speaker 3>I'll be like, I need to make sure we vibe

1:04:20.440 --> 1:04:23.080
<v Speaker 3>number one, because like, if we're just sitting on your

1:04:23.120 --> 1:04:26.000
<v Speaker 3>couch and I don't feel any romantic feelings.

1:04:25.840 --> 1:04:27.680
<v Speaker 2>At best, that's awkward.

1:04:27.680 --> 1:04:29.640
<v Speaker 3>And it's like, don't you want to know if you

1:04:29.840 --> 1:04:32.080
<v Speaker 3>vibe with me? Like what if you're not into me?

1:04:32.280 --> 1:04:34.480
<v Speaker 3>Like this is a two way street first of all.

1:04:35.160 --> 1:04:37.000
<v Speaker 3>And I was like, and that's just not safe for me,

1:04:37.280 --> 1:04:39.800
<v Speaker 3>Like I don't feel safe or comfortable doing that. We

1:04:39.880 --> 1:04:42.280
<v Speaker 3>have to meet in a neutral public place that is

1:04:42.320 --> 1:04:45.120
<v Speaker 3>familiar to me. If they say, Okay, totally get it,

1:04:45.200 --> 1:04:47.400
<v Speaker 3>no worries, We'll go out for a drink or whatever,

1:04:47.440 --> 1:04:51.240
<v Speaker 3>blah blah blah, fine, I'll proceed. Anyone who pushes back,

1:04:51.280 --> 1:04:53.240
<v Speaker 3>and I have had men push back on that to

1:04:53.320 --> 1:04:56.760
<v Speaker 3>be like, oh, then they act like I'm being difficult, like.

1:04:56.720 --> 1:04:57.920
<v Speaker 2>You've saved yourself.

1:04:58.040 --> 1:05:00.760
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, yeah, like you know everything need to know, which

1:05:00.760 --> 1:05:05.440
<v Speaker 3>is that that person is scary and doesn't understand boundaries

1:05:05.560 --> 1:05:09.520
<v Speaker 3>and just like doesn't care about people being concerned for

1:05:09.560 --> 1:05:13.200
<v Speaker 3>their own safety and all those things. So right, there's that,

1:05:13.440 --> 1:05:17.360
<v Speaker 3>But I'm wondering, like back to her meeting him in

1:05:17.480 --> 1:05:20.520
<v Speaker 3>this public place and she's.

1:05:20.320 --> 1:05:23.400
<v Speaker 2>Done quote unquote everything right, and I feel like this

1:05:23.440 --> 1:05:27.320
<v Speaker 2>movie makes it clear that even if you do everything right,

1:05:28.520 --> 1:05:31.520
<v Speaker 2>that doesn't mean you're safe, which is a skin which

1:05:31.560 --> 1:05:35.080
<v Speaker 2>is a very you know, negative message it is, but

1:05:35.160 --> 1:05:37.280
<v Speaker 2>it's true. I mean, I guess, like coming from the

1:05:37.280 --> 1:05:41.360
<v Speaker 2>opposite place, and I mean I'm just like absolutely petrified

1:05:41.560 --> 1:05:45.760
<v Speaker 2>of apps and and just strangers in general. I think

1:05:45.760 --> 1:05:48.960
<v Speaker 2>that's just like, hmm, my social anxiety is such that

1:05:49.080 --> 1:05:50.800
<v Speaker 2>it's always been a non starter for me as I've

1:05:50.840 --> 1:05:53.520
<v Speaker 2>dated people that I met meet in person, and you know,

1:05:53.720 --> 1:05:58.560
<v Speaker 2>as this movie demonstrates, not better, not better, true different

1:05:58.680 --> 1:06:01.880
<v Speaker 2>kind of bad. But I I'm glad that there is

1:06:02.040 --> 1:06:05.480
<v Speaker 2>And I guess I wonder because I haven't really experienced it,

1:06:05.520 --> 1:06:08.400
<v Speaker 2>but that like when it's someone you haven't met in

1:06:08.440 --> 1:06:10.800
<v Speaker 2>person before, it almost feels like maybe a little bit

1:06:10.840 --> 1:06:13.120
<v Speaker 2>easier to set that boundary because you're like it just

1:06:13.200 --> 1:06:18.200
<v Speaker 2>makes sense, whereas like if it's someone i've met before again,

1:06:18.320 --> 1:06:21.000
<v Speaker 2>I mean it's like I have a secret plan where

1:06:21.040 --> 1:06:24.640
<v Speaker 2>it's like my my boyfriend right now, who you know,

1:06:24.920 --> 1:06:27.200
<v Speaker 2>so far, so good. I don't think he's gonna steal

1:06:27.280 --> 1:06:32.120
<v Speaker 2>my ass. No, I love the guy. Uh, but but

1:06:32.320 --> 1:06:34.720
<v Speaker 2>like for our first date, I was like, let's go

1:06:34.840 --> 1:06:38.080
<v Speaker 2>on a walk while it's light out.

1:06:38.240 --> 1:06:41.040
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, even though I knew that we got along and

1:06:41.080 --> 1:06:43.160
<v Speaker 3>that we vibed, and because you already knew him a

1:06:43.160 --> 1:06:45.080
<v Speaker 3>little bit too, right, right, I.

1:06:45.000 --> 1:06:47.080
<v Speaker 2>Mean that's I think that that's like my level of

1:06:47.160 --> 1:06:49.880
<v Speaker 2>paranoia with men that I was like, I will only

1:06:50.000 --> 1:06:52.640
<v Speaker 2>really hang out with men that I am already pretty

1:06:52.640 --> 1:06:55.880
<v Speaker 2>sure I'm not actively afraid of. Yeah, Like I just

1:06:55.960 --> 1:06:59.040
<v Speaker 2>don't trust other people's vouching. I just like I just

1:06:59.080 --> 1:07:02.560
<v Speaker 2>can't do it. And and that's probably just like PTSD

1:07:02.680 --> 1:07:06.120
<v Speaker 2>stuff from the past, but like, but yeah, so I

1:07:06.200 --> 1:07:08.240
<v Speaker 2>just was like, even with a man that I have

1:07:08.880 --> 1:07:12.600
<v Speaker 2>known in passing for like a year, still, it's like

1:07:12.760 --> 1:07:14.600
<v Speaker 2>we have to meet up when it's light I need

1:07:14.600 --> 1:07:18.840
<v Speaker 2>to like understand what your general vibe is right so

1:07:18.920 --> 1:07:22.600
<v Speaker 2>that I can get out yeah, because it's like, but

1:07:22.680 --> 1:07:25.440
<v Speaker 2>like even then, you're it's just so fucked up. I

1:07:25.440 --> 1:07:27.600
<v Speaker 2>don't know. That's why I and I like that there's

1:07:27.640 --> 1:07:31.680
<v Speaker 2>like almost this expanded metaphor of of course he's done

1:07:31.680 --> 1:07:36.120
<v Speaker 2>this before. Of course I'm not special, and that I

1:07:36.160 --> 1:07:39.600
<v Speaker 2>feel like was very resonant for me too. Is like

1:07:39.960 --> 1:07:43.000
<v Speaker 2>it is very tempting to be like, there's something different

1:07:43.080 --> 1:07:46.920
<v Speaker 2>about me, and it's like you know, occasionally, but it

1:07:46.960 --> 1:07:49.280
<v Speaker 2>doesn't matter, because the way a lot of CIS men

1:07:49.320 --> 1:07:54.240
<v Speaker 2>will treat you is the exact same way they've loved,

1:07:54.240 --> 1:07:56.600
<v Speaker 2>bombed and taken in a lot of other people who

1:07:56.720 --> 1:08:01.640
<v Speaker 2>sometimes look strikingly similar to you. It's very spooky, it's scary.

1:08:01.960 --> 1:08:04.440
<v Speaker 2>I was thinking about this experience I had that you

1:08:04.560 --> 1:08:08.040
<v Speaker 2>know about, but like I knew the guy who was

1:08:08.120 --> 1:08:11.280
<v Speaker 2>dating had dated another woman who I had met before,

1:08:12.120 --> 1:08:18.000
<v Speaker 2>and we look not dissimilar, and when things ended in

1:08:18.000 --> 1:08:20.639
<v Speaker 2>this very like horrible way, I reached out to her

1:08:20.680 --> 1:08:23.320
<v Speaker 2>and we had a sort of like moment of like

1:08:23.720 --> 1:08:28.320
<v Speaker 2>the play by play was exactly the fucking same. But

1:08:28.479 --> 1:08:31.320
<v Speaker 2>it's just it is so many like little echoes of

1:08:31.360 --> 1:08:35.400
<v Speaker 2>this movie just felt so familiar, and I like that,

1:08:35.600 --> 1:08:39.679
<v Speaker 2>even though intersectionally I don't think this movie does well

1:08:39.720 --> 1:08:46.080
<v Speaker 2>at all, there is this like understood solidarity between most women,

1:08:46.560 --> 1:08:49.720
<v Speaker 2>and I think that's also authentic too, as like there

1:08:49.760 --> 1:08:53.280
<v Speaker 2>are ants in the world who are treated just as

1:08:53.280 --> 1:08:57.240
<v Speaker 2>horribly as you are, but do not have solidarity with

1:08:57.280 --> 1:08:59.720
<v Speaker 2>you at all for sure, And I feel like, you know,

1:08:59.760 --> 1:09:03.280
<v Speaker 2>see that gradient, even though I would have liked more

1:09:03.320 --> 1:09:07.519
<v Speaker 2>depth than the characters, like, I appreciate that well.

1:09:07.560 --> 1:09:11.439
<v Speaker 3>Going back to the like blame and shame component of

1:09:11.560 --> 1:09:15.040
<v Speaker 3>the movie that Noah feels like we said, the red

1:09:15.080 --> 1:09:20.280
<v Speaker 3>flags are so subtle that they are missible at least

1:09:20.360 --> 1:09:23.280
<v Speaker 3>until she gets to his house. He won't give her

1:09:23.320 --> 1:09:26.760
<v Speaker 3>the Wi Fi password and then she's drugged. Obviously from

1:09:26.760 --> 1:09:30.960
<v Speaker 3>that point on, like the red flags are glaring, but

1:09:31.080 --> 1:09:36.600
<v Speaker 3>prior to that, they are arguably not even red flags.

1:09:36.640 --> 1:09:39.240
<v Speaker 3>Like a lot of what he does wouldn't ping for

1:09:39.320 --> 1:09:41.400
<v Speaker 3>someone as being like, you know, him not being on

1:09:41.439 --> 1:09:45.760
<v Speaker 3>social media. That's something that some people just choose not

1:09:45.960 --> 1:09:48.320
<v Speaker 3>to do, and it's not necessarily a red flag.

1:09:48.400 --> 1:09:48.599
<v Speaker 4>You know.

1:09:48.640 --> 1:09:51.840
<v Speaker 3>There's different things that yeah, maybe could be interpreted as

1:09:51.840 --> 1:09:54.120
<v Speaker 3>a red flag, but like they're not.

1:09:54.160 --> 1:09:58.080
<v Speaker 2>I'm like unless you're old, you should at least have Controversially,

1:09:58.080 --> 1:10:00.040
<v Speaker 2>you should have an Instagram account. If you don't, I

1:10:00.479 --> 1:10:02.160
<v Speaker 2>think you're kind of fucking scary.

1:10:02.560 --> 1:10:04.120
<v Speaker 3>I mean, even if you don't post it.

1:10:04.120 --> 1:10:08.800
<v Speaker 2>But again, just have it. Have like have. I do

1:10:08.840 --> 1:10:11.800
<v Speaker 2>feel like there is a necessity to have someone be

1:10:11.880 --> 1:10:15.000
<v Speaker 2>able to vouch for your existence. Otherwise you're like, what

1:10:15.080 --> 1:10:17.480
<v Speaker 2>do you have to hide? And the answer is often.

1:10:17.439 --> 1:10:21.599
<v Speaker 3>Something something right. But there are things that could be

1:10:21.920 --> 1:10:25.479
<v Speaker 3>not even interpreted as a red flag. But she still

1:10:26.400 --> 1:10:30.479
<v Speaker 3>blames herself and she thinks, you know, she says like, oh,

1:10:30.560 --> 1:10:32.679
<v Speaker 3>I'm the only one who's slept with him. Oh my god,

1:10:33.439 --> 1:10:38.160
<v Speaker 3>And she's disgusted with herself and humiliated. And Penny, although

1:10:38.200 --> 1:10:40.639
<v Speaker 3>she does sort of like pass judgment to be like, wait,

1:10:40.720 --> 1:10:43.559
<v Speaker 3>you slept with him. I don't think anyone others of

1:10:43.680 --> 1:10:47.120
<v Speaker 3>us did. But I'm not slept shaming you, you know,

1:10:47.240 --> 1:10:51.320
<v Speaker 3>so there's something to that. But she then follows up

1:10:51.400 --> 1:10:54.519
<v Speaker 3>Penny does by saying like, it's not our fault, it's

1:10:54.560 --> 1:10:59.599
<v Speaker 3>always their fault. And the idea of like you said,

1:10:59.840 --> 1:11:02.799
<v Speaker 3>you can do everything right, or you can proceed with caution,

1:11:02.920 --> 1:11:06.799
<v Speaker 3>and you can just go about dating the way modern

1:11:06.880 --> 1:11:12.080
<v Speaker 3>dating generally goes and it can still end horribly and

1:11:12.160 --> 1:11:16.080
<v Speaker 3>it's because it's the fault of the perpetrators.

1:11:16.360 --> 1:11:18.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I like again it's like it's all a little

1:11:18.960 --> 1:11:22.559
<v Speaker 2>bit undercooked, but the core message of it and the

1:11:22.600 --> 1:11:25.280
<v Speaker 2>fact that the empathy of the movie is clearly with

1:11:25.439 --> 1:11:27.760
<v Speaker 2>Noah and that it's done I think just in a

1:11:27.800 --> 1:11:30.439
<v Speaker 2>way we don't see in horror very often, where it's like,

1:11:31.160 --> 1:11:33.960
<v Speaker 2>I don't think a cis man could have written this movie,

1:11:34.000 --> 1:11:36.040
<v Speaker 2>because you do have to have sort of the lived

1:11:36.080 --> 1:11:39.800
<v Speaker 2>experience of I have to protect myself and thinking on

1:11:39.840 --> 1:11:42.679
<v Speaker 2>the other end of that, how would I think if

1:11:42.760 --> 1:11:46.280
<v Speaker 2>my friend told me this about this guy? Like, I

1:11:46.280 --> 1:11:50.120
<v Speaker 2>feel like that was all very like well thought out

1:11:50.160 --> 1:11:53.639
<v Speaker 2>and considered and didn't feel like ten y. I feel

1:11:53.640 --> 1:11:57.320
<v Speaker 2>like sometimes especially with it's like talking about like modern dating,

1:11:57.560 --> 1:12:01.840
<v Speaker 2>the technology's weirdly outdated, which wasn't true here either, which

1:12:01.880 --> 1:12:03.479
<v Speaker 2>I feel like is kind of hard to do. So

1:12:04.400 --> 1:12:08.000
<v Speaker 2>kudos kudos too, Yes, Because this movie is written and

1:12:08.080 --> 1:12:13.639
<v Speaker 2>directed by women, white women, Mimi Cave and Lauren Con

1:12:14.360 --> 1:12:18.280
<v Speaker 2>and it's also produced by Adam McKay, which I love

1:12:18.320 --> 1:12:20.360
<v Speaker 2>to hear it. I guess Lauren Conn began as Adam

1:12:20.400 --> 1:12:21.280
<v Speaker 2>McKay's assistant.

1:12:21.360 --> 1:12:22.000
<v Speaker 3>Oh, not kidding.

1:12:22.479 --> 1:12:25.320
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean I feel like we are saying more

1:12:25.840 --> 1:12:29.719
<v Speaker 2>horror movies from a more diverse array of directors and

1:12:30.320 --> 1:12:33.000
<v Speaker 2>genre movies in general. But like, you know, keep it coming,

1:12:33.240 --> 1:12:34.880
<v Speaker 2>keep it coming common And.

1:12:34.760 --> 1:12:37.320
<v Speaker 3>That was my point. You reminded me of what my

1:12:37.400 --> 1:12:42.360
<v Speaker 3>point was, which is that so many horror movies from

1:12:42.479 --> 1:12:47.639
<v Speaker 3>years past did so much to blame the women for

1:12:47.720 --> 1:12:51.360
<v Speaker 3>getting killed. You know, the whole trope of like, if

1:12:51.400 --> 1:12:54.960
<v Speaker 3>you're a woman and you have sex with someone, then

1:12:55.080 --> 1:12:59.360
<v Speaker 3>you got it right. There's that, you know, there's the

1:12:59.360 --> 1:13:02.960
<v Speaker 3>final girl trope, which this movie avoids because there are

1:13:04.040 --> 1:13:06.639
<v Speaker 3>three final girls.

1:13:06.800 --> 1:13:10.280
<v Speaker 2>And I think this movie is again trying to avoid

1:13:10.840 --> 1:13:14.000
<v Speaker 2>racialized tropes in horror, but I would say it is

1:13:14.200 --> 1:13:16.280
<v Speaker 2>less successful at doing that.

1:13:16.600 --> 1:13:21.479
<v Speaker 3>I agree, Yeah, Paul, just real quickly. Yes, On one hand,

1:13:21.479 --> 1:13:24.960
<v Speaker 3>you have him recognized of the danger he's potentially in.

1:13:25.280 --> 1:13:27.759
<v Speaker 3>He hears gunshots, he's in the middle of the woods,

1:13:28.400 --> 1:13:32.640
<v Speaker 3>and he acknowledges like, I've seen this horror movie and

1:13:32.720 --> 1:13:34.720
<v Speaker 3>I know that I don't make it out alive, so

1:13:34.840 --> 1:13:38.960
<v Speaker 3>I'm going to bounce. But also, is that kind of

1:13:39.000 --> 1:13:42.960
<v Speaker 3>commentary on how like men tend not to be helpful

1:13:43.320 --> 1:13:45.840
<v Speaker 3>in these situations when it comes to like women's liberation.

1:13:46.600 --> 1:13:49.800
<v Speaker 2>It felt unclear to me, Like, yeah, I thought the

1:13:49.920 --> 1:13:52.120
<v Speaker 2>idea of it was interesting, but it kind of just

1:13:52.200 --> 1:13:54.160
<v Speaker 2>felt like a weird joke.

1:13:55.040 --> 1:13:57.080
<v Speaker 3>Well, why make him even drive the whole way up

1:13:57.080 --> 1:14:00.240
<v Speaker 3>there if narratively he's not going to do anything, He's

1:14:00.280 --> 1:14:01.959
<v Speaker 3>just gonna turn right back around.

1:14:02.439 --> 1:14:03.960
<v Speaker 2>That was the thing I was curious about to Yeah,

1:14:04.040 --> 1:14:07.040
<v Speaker 2>especially because like I would be curious what got cut

1:14:07.080 --> 1:14:09.640
<v Speaker 2>from this movie, because it did feel like there are

1:14:09.640 --> 1:14:12.320
<v Speaker 2>certain little plot holes that probably could have been fixed

1:14:12.320 --> 1:14:16.040
<v Speaker 2>by another scene that might have existed at some point. Yeah,

1:14:16.080 --> 1:14:19.479
<v Speaker 2>because Paul like has not that he's like a prominent character,

1:14:19.600 --> 1:14:22.920
<v Speaker 2>but he does have more screen time than a character

1:14:22.960 --> 1:14:27.080
<v Speaker 2>who randomly bails right would have. Like you're just like, well,

1:14:27.120 --> 1:14:29.160
<v Speaker 2>then what was the point? I mean, I guess you know.

1:14:29.240 --> 1:14:32.800
<v Speaker 2>His function is to connect Molly back to Noah again,

1:14:33.240 --> 1:14:36.479
<v Speaker 2>a black character servicing ultimately servicing the white characters. Yeah,

1:14:36.479 --> 1:14:38.360
<v Speaker 2>but then at the end, it's sort of like his

1:14:38.400 --> 1:14:43.120
<v Speaker 2>whole character ends in this kind of confusing joke.

1:14:44.000 --> 1:14:48.600
<v Speaker 3>It's also implied that he's only helping Molly because he

1:14:48.720 --> 1:14:52.000
<v Speaker 3>thinks he has an opportunity to have sex with her

1:14:52.160 --> 1:14:54.240
<v Speaker 3>again or to like reignite there.

1:14:54.520 --> 1:14:58.280
<v Speaker 2>Which is like a man to do. And I appreciated that,

1:14:58.400 --> 1:15:04.479
<v Speaker 2>like Noah and Molly different points use their whiles to

1:15:04.560 --> 1:15:07.000
<v Speaker 2>get what they need from who they need it from where.

1:15:07.080 --> 1:15:10.120
<v Speaker 2>It's like pretty clear from just how Noah and Molly

1:15:10.200 --> 1:15:15.120
<v Speaker 2>talk about Paul that Mollie's like not interested and I

1:15:15.160 --> 1:15:17.439
<v Speaker 2>think kind of ghosted him when they dated.

1:15:17.479 --> 1:15:18.120
<v Speaker 3>It seems like it.

1:15:18.200 --> 1:15:20.320
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so it's not like she's all of a sudden

1:15:20.360 --> 1:15:23.479
<v Speaker 2>interested in him again. I think she possibly knows that

1:15:23.520 --> 1:15:27.160
<v Speaker 2>this is his personality and wants to, you know, keep

1:15:27.240 --> 1:15:29.960
<v Speaker 2>him involved and entice. But again, you would think with

1:15:30.240 --> 1:15:33.720
<v Speaker 2>Mollie and with all of these characters, does Mollie not

1:15:33.800 --> 1:15:37.759
<v Speaker 2>have a second friend to tell Hey, I'm like someone

1:15:37.800 --> 1:15:41.639
<v Speaker 2>that you would trust more than someone you ghosted last year?

1:15:41.880 --> 1:15:44.559
<v Speaker 2>Like it just I get it. It's like a small

1:15:44.680 --> 1:15:48.320
<v Speaker 2>cast and it's movie logic, but I just felt like

1:15:48.360 --> 1:15:52.519
<v Speaker 2>another it just the smallness of these women's world. It's

1:15:52.720 --> 1:15:54.160
<v Speaker 2>just kind of bizarre.

1:15:54.439 --> 1:15:56.200
<v Speaker 3>That's why I think it would have been interesting if

1:15:56.560 --> 1:16:00.439
<v Speaker 3>like Mollie is dating a woman, right, and she's person

1:16:00.479 --> 1:16:07.240
<v Speaker 3>who helps Molly on this quest and we see what

1:16:07.280 --> 1:16:09.719
<v Speaker 3>that dynamic looks like. Not to say that like women

1:16:09.840 --> 1:16:13.759
<v Speaker 3>dating women is perfect in sunshine and butterflies and amazing

1:16:14.040 --> 1:16:17.640
<v Speaker 3>and like that contrasted with women dating men, but like

1:16:18.280 --> 1:16:21.439
<v Speaker 3>that would have been an interesting dynamic to explore to

1:16:21.479 --> 1:16:24.160
<v Speaker 3>see how those interactions are different, or just just see

1:16:24.600 --> 1:16:26.120
<v Speaker 3>what that looks like and also.

1:16:25.920 --> 1:16:28.160
<v Speaker 2>Feels like, I mean on Noah's part, Like if Noah's

1:16:28.160 --> 1:16:30.680
<v Speaker 2>always hanging out with a couple, that would sort of

1:16:30.720 --> 1:16:34.320
<v Speaker 2>explain why she might be dating more. Yeah, which because

1:16:34.360 --> 1:16:37.519
<v Speaker 2>I mean, I've been the friend of a couple and

1:16:37.560 --> 1:16:40.439
<v Speaker 2>it's like, if the couple is awesome, it's awesome. But

1:16:40.600 --> 1:16:42.120
<v Speaker 2>sometimes some days you're like.

1:16:42.680 --> 1:16:46.160
<v Speaker 3>Wow, I am really the third wheel, ARENENTI.

1:16:46.240 --> 1:16:50.520
<v Speaker 2>No one's kissing me. This stinks.

1:16:51.880 --> 1:16:55.120
<v Speaker 3>And that's why I need to find myself a throuble

1:16:55.360 --> 1:16:57.400
<v Speaker 3>to be exactly.

1:16:58.040 --> 1:16:59.920
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Yeah, I think that that's all I really have

1:17:00.400 --> 1:17:03.439
<v Speaker 2>for this movie. I think it's good. I like it.

1:17:03.439 --> 1:17:06.080
<v Speaker 2>It passes the Bechdel test for sure.

1:17:06.280 --> 1:17:09.280
<v Speaker 3>It does. Noah and Molly they do talk a lot

1:17:09.320 --> 1:17:13.320
<v Speaker 3>about Steve, and they talk about dating men in general.

1:17:14.000 --> 1:17:16.880
<v Speaker 3>But I think that if you're going to not pass

1:17:17.000 --> 1:17:20.160
<v Speaker 3>the Bechdel test, a great way to do it is

1:17:20.320 --> 1:17:26.040
<v Speaker 3>to comment on how dating men is difficult and awful.

1:17:25.800 --> 1:17:28.880
<v Speaker 2>And that they are protecting each other.

1:17:29.920 --> 1:17:30.160
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

1:17:30.240 --> 1:17:33.280
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, like they're talking about protecting each other from men,

1:17:34.080 --> 1:17:38.360
<v Speaker 2>which I feel like spiritually passes or mistrusting men fundamentally.

1:17:38.800 --> 1:17:43.760
<v Speaker 3>Yeah. Right, And then Noah and Penny talk about their situation,

1:17:45.000 --> 1:17:48.200
<v Speaker 3>which is they're only in this situation because of a man.

1:17:48.479 --> 1:17:51.920
<v Speaker 2>But if you know, I mean, I feel comfortable saying

1:17:51.920 --> 1:17:57.000
<v Speaker 2>this movie pretty handily passes technically and on vibes. But

1:17:57.080 --> 1:18:00.240
<v Speaker 2>what about the most important metric of all time? Can

1:18:00.280 --> 1:18:02.120
<v Speaker 2>you tell that I have to pee really bad because

1:18:02.120 --> 1:18:05.519
<v Speaker 2>I started talking so fast? So what do you think

1:18:05.880 --> 1:18:08.240
<v Speaker 2>in regards to the nipples scale?

1:18:08.240 --> 1:18:10.599
<v Speaker 3>Will we rate the nipples zero to five nipples? Examining

1:18:10.600 --> 1:18:12.559
<v Speaker 3>it through an intersectional feminist lens, I'm going to give

1:18:12.600 --> 1:18:16.880
<v Speaker 3>them movie yes, three nipples. Yeah, I mean, you could

1:18:16.920 --> 1:18:20.080
<v Speaker 3>look at this whole movie is like the meat eating

1:18:20.240 --> 1:18:24.519
<v Speaker 3>of women as a kind of allegory or metaphor for

1:18:24.640 --> 1:18:30.760
<v Speaker 3>just like the objectification and exploitation of women's bodies in society,

1:18:31.600 --> 1:18:35.600
<v Speaker 3>And that's an interesting metaphor. And the fact that the

1:18:35.640 --> 1:18:39.960
<v Speaker 3>women triumph at the end and they stand in solidarity

1:18:40.000 --> 1:18:42.439
<v Speaker 3>with each other and do the opposite of what Anne does,

1:18:42.520 --> 1:18:45.400
<v Speaker 3>which you know her thing is she becomes part of

1:18:45.439 --> 1:18:46.120
<v Speaker 3>the problem.

1:18:46.479 --> 1:18:49.800
<v Speaker 2>So and it doesn't save her because it never does.

1:18:49.840 --> 1:18:52.479
<v Speaker 3>Right, and she gets brutally bashed over the head with

1:18:52.520 --> 1:18:56.439
<v Speaker 3>a shovel yike, and so right. So there's these cool

1:18:56.479 --> 1:18:58.920
<v Speaker 3>things happening. The fact that the movie, even though the

1:18:59.000 --> 1:19:03.720
<v Speaker 3>character blames herself, the movie is not blaming her for

1:19:03.840 --> 1:19:07.719
<v Speaker 3>not seeing that she was being seduced by a cannibal

1:19:08.160 --> 1:19:11.360
<v Speaker 3>who was planning to sell her meat. So I think

1:19:11.400 --> 1:19:14.000
<v Speaker 3>there's a lot of cool stuff going on. There are

1:19:14.040 --> 1:19:17.280
<v Speaker 3>some things that I feel like we're mishandled, especially in

1:19:17.320 --> 1:19:22.240
<v Speaker 3>regards to casting choices and the characters who are people

1:19:22.280 --> 1:19:27.839
<v Speaker 3>of color servicing the white characters and all that stuff.

1:19:27.920 --> 1:19:34.719
<v Speaker 3>So three nipples. I will give one to Jojo T. Gibbs,

1:19:34.720 --> 1:19:39.800
<v Speaker 3>who plays Molly, I will give one to Andrea Bang

1:19:39.840 --> 1:19:45.800
<v Speaker 3>who plays Penny. And I'll give my final nipple to

1:19:47.560 --> 1:19:50.120
<v Speaker 3>semiak Bari, who we don't see on screen, but she's

1:19:50.160 --> 1:19:53.320
<v Speaker 3>the character who leaves the note in the magazine.

1:19:53.120 --> 1:19:56.080
<v Speaker 2>Amazing, Yes, I am going to meet you at three.

1:19:56.240 --> 1:19:59.439
<v Speaker 2>I think that this movie has leaves something to be

1:19:59.479 --> 1:20:02.120
<v Speaker 2>desired in terms of intersectionality, I feel like there's a

1:20:02.160 --> 1:20:05.120
<v Speaker 2>lot of surface y stuff where there is a diverse

1:20:05.160 --> 1:20:08.320
<v Speaker 2>cast and there is queer characters, but it still is

1:20:08.439 --> 1:20:12.240
<v Speaker 2>ultimately a white, hetero story, and these are the characters

1:20:12.280 --> 1:20:15.880
<v Speaker 2>that are ultimately being serviced by the plot. However, when

1:20:15.880 --> 1:20:21.320
<v Speaker 2>it comes to contemporary dating commentary, it's awesome and like

1:20:21.760 --> 1:20:24.679
<v Speaker 2>I think it works super well. The performances are really good,

1:20:25.160 --> 1:20:28.599
<v Speaker 2>the writing is really specific and a way that I'm

1:20:28.840 --> 1:20:31.160
<v Speaker 2>not used to seeing in horror because there's not enough

1:20:31.200 --> 1:20:34.360
<v Speaker 2>women that get to take big swings in horror. So

1:20:35.160 --> 1:20:37.680
<v Speaker 2>the highs are high, the lows are frustrating, but I

1:20:37.720 --> 1:20:41.960
<v Speaker 2>am excited to see more, particularly from Mimi Cave. So

1:20:42.000 --> 1:20:44.800
<v Speaker 2>I'll go three nipples. I will give one to Mimi Cave,

1:20:45.120 --> 1:20:48.080
<v Speaker 2>I will give one to Jojo Gibbs, and I will

1:20:48.080 --> 1:20:51.080
<v Speaker 2>give the final one to Oh my goodness who played Penny.

1:20:51.160 --> 1:20:55.320
<v Speaker 2>I shut my tab fuck, oh Andrea bang, Andrea bang,

1:20:56.000 --> 1:21:01.160
<v Speaker 2>and yeah, congratulations to Sebastian Stan for me recognize him now?

1:21:01.520 --> 1:21:03.720
<v Speaker 3>Yes, yes, yes, yes, also quick shout out sorry. I

1:21:03.760 --> 1:21:05.840
<v Speaker 3>know he have to pee, but I just want to

1:21:05.880 --> 1:21:09.920
<v Speaker 3>say the moment of foreshadowing when Noah and Steve go

1:21:10.000 --> 1:21:13.639
<v Speaker 3>back to her place for the first time, and she's like, Ooh,

1:21:13.640 --> 1:21:15.680
<v Speaker 3>can I get you anything to drink or eat? And

1:21:15.720 --> 1:21:20.600
<v Speaker 3>he says no, just you because he's gonna eat her.

1:21:21.520 --> 1:21:27.280
<v Speaker 2>Also just a classic cringe man thing to say.

1:21:27.160 --> 1:21:29.160
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, no, I just went you babe.

1:21:29.520 --> 1:21:31.639
<v Speaker 2>I just want you just feel good. I'm like, no,

1:21:31.840 --> 1:21:38.800
<v Speaker 2>you don't anyways, fucking liar. And with that, uh, and

1:21:38.880 --> 1:21:44.519
<v Speaker 2>that's a fresher movie. You can follow us everywhere. You

1:21:44.560 --> 1:21:47.080
<v Speaker 2>can follow us on Instagram at bachdol guys, you can

1:21:47.080 --> 1:21:49.960
<v Speaker 2>follow us on Twitter, backl the cast, and you can

1:21:50.320 --> 1:21:53.559
<v Speaker 2>subscribe to and in fact, you should subscribe to our

1:21:53.600 --> 1:21:58.080
<v Speaker 2>Patreon aka Matreon Patreon dot com slash Bechdel Cast. Five

1:21:58.120 --> 1:22:01.840
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1:22:01.880 --> 1:22:02.960
<v Speaker 2>How nice is that?

1:22:02.960 --> 1:22:05.560
<v Speaker 3>That's so nice? You know what else is nice is

1:22:05.600 --> 1:22:09.040
<v Speaker 3>the fact that I'm headlining two shows in Boston on

1:22:09.520 --> 1:22:12.800
<v Speaker 3>November oh gosh is it sixteenth. So if you live

1:22:12.840 --> 1:22:15.320
<v Speaker 3>in Boston and you want to see me do stand up,

1:22:15.800 --> 1:22:19.080
<v Speaker 3>go to my website Kaitlindononte dot com and the links

1:22:19.280 --> 1:22:21.679
<v Speaker 3>will be there for that. I just wanted to plug

1:22:21.760 --> 1:22:23.680
<v Speaker 3>that real quick. Now.

1:22:23.680 --> 1:22:25.439
<v Speaker 2>That's what I call nice. And if you want to

1:22:25.439 --> 1:22:30.840
<v Speaker 2>see me live in person in Los Angeles. I'm workshopping

1:22:30.880 --> 1:22:32.720
<v Speaker 2>my new show at the Lyric and you can check

1:22:32.760 --> 1:22:38.439
<v Speaker 2>it out on November twentieth and December fourth, and the

1:22:38.479 --> 1:22:42.120
<v Speaker 2>other one's sold out sorry, And you can also get

1:22:42.160 --> 1:22:44.880
<v Speaker 2>our merch at teapopulic dot com. Slash The Bechdel Cast.

1:22:45.000 --> 1:22:49.600
<v Speaker 2>Holidays coming up, babe, could be fun, could be. And

1:22:49.720 --> 1:22:51.720
<v Speaker 2>with that I have to go chop off my own

1:22:51.760 --> 1:22:53.040
<v Speaker 2>ass and eat it for lunch.

1:22:53.360 --> 1:23:00.040
<v Speaker 3>Me too, Okay, Bye bye. The Bechdel Cast is a

1:23:00.120 --> 1:23:04.200
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