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Speaker 1: On the Bechdel Cast.

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Speaker 2: The questions asked if movies.

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Speaker 1: Have women in them, are all their discussions just boyfriends

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Speaker 1: and husbands, or do they have individualism? It's the patriarchy,

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Speaker 1: zeph and bast start changing it with the Bechdel Cast.

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Speaker 3: Nonmnam, Jamie, I'm hungry for.

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Speaker 2: What for you?

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Speaker 3: For me?

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Speaker 2: For my ass?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, for your ass and your titties.

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Speaker 2: Egg on my ass. I thought he took her whole ass,

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Speaker 2: but it turns out just a portion.

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Speaker 3: Questions I'm not sure, wait, because she seems like she

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Speaker 3: has her ass pretty much intact afterwards.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but I don't know. But I guess I forgot again.

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Speaker 2: My male gaze radar is all off, and I forgot

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Speaker 2: to check the size of her ass at the beginning

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Speaker 2: of the movie. Well, I was looking okay, good, good, disrespectfully.

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Speaker 2: I'm sure.

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Speaker 3: Yes, I was gazing in a very objectifying way and

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Speaker 3: I didn't notice that much of a difference.

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Speaker 2: Wow, get her ass? Okay, Welcome to Wow. What a really,

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Speaker 2: really feminist introduction to the episode. Welcome to the Bechdel Cast.

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Speaker 2: My name's Jamie Loftus.

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Speaker 3: My name is Caitlin Durante, and this is our show

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Speaker 3: where we examine movies through an intersectional feminist lens, using

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Speaker 3: the Bechdel Test as a jumping off point, as frelutely

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Speaker 3: and what's that, Jamie Well.

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Speaker 2: The Bechdel Test is a media metric created by Alison

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Speaker 2: Bechdel and her friend Liz Wallace, which is why it's

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Speaker 2: often called the Bechdel Wallace Test. It was originally created

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Speaker 2: as a bit for Alison Bechdel's iconic I host was

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Speaker 2: an iconic comic collection Nice to Watch out for, but

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Speaker 2: eventually it became used as a sort of metric to

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Speaker 2: see if people care about characters of marginalized genders, and

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Speaker 2: the answer is often know. Today, I think we have

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Speaker 2: a great discussion ahead. Yes, So the version of the

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Speaker 2: test that we use a little bit of a modified version,

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Speaker 2: requires that two characters of a marginalized gender with names

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Speaker 2: speak to each other about something other than a man

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Speaker 2: for two lines of dialogue or more. Yeah, that's sort

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Speaker 2: of what we're up to. I appreciate if nothing else,

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Speaker 2: the movie we're talking about today really warns you about

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Speaker 2: men from Oregon, And I think that's a really important

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Speaker 2: psa that I rarely see reflected in film. To all

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Speaker 2: of our listeners in organ can't wait to see you

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Speaker 2: at the next live show. But like men from Oregon

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Speaker 2: scary scary to me personally in my lived experience, I'm

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Speaker 2: afraid of them in my lived experience. They want to

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Speaker 2: steal my ass and eat it. That's just my lived experience.

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Speaker 3: Sure to sure that hasn't happened to me yet. Time

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Speaker 3: will tell.

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Speaker 2: I was about to say, well, it's just a matter

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Speaker 2: of time. It's just a matter of time. You meet

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Speaker 2: them in a different city and then you find out

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Speaker 2: month's sin they're from Oregon, and then you're like, oh,

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Speaker 2: this man's trying to kill me.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Anyways, we're covering Fresh twenty twenty two, originally released

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Speaker 3: on Hulu. Was it, I believe Jamie? What's your relationship

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Speaker 3: slash history with the movie?

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Speaker 2: Well, first, I just realized that the character played by

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Speaker 2: Sebastian stand is in fact from Texas. So I would

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Speaker 2: like to modify as he tells us. And so actually

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Speaker 2: I would just like to say, Men who Live Live,

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Speaker 2: I'd like to totally backtrack everything I said. I was

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Speaker 2: just trying to be rude to an ex boyfriend. There's

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Speaker 2: plenty of time left in the episode to do that.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 2: In any case, my history with this movie is that

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Speaker 2: I had not seen it. I meant to and then didn't,

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Speaker 2: as so very often happens to me with movies on streamers.

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Speaker 2: It's weird. I feel like I used to be sort

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Speaker 2: of the reverse of this, but now it's like I

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Speaker 2: am much less likely to watch a movie if I

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Speaker 2: if I don't get a chance to watch it in theaters.

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Speaker 3: You're a theater girly.

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Speaker 2: Now I'm a theater girl. I'm an AFC Stubbs passholder.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, I would have loved to see this in theaters.

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Speaker 2: It's a bummer that that didn't happen. I don't know

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Speaker 2: if there was like a limited release or something, but

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Speaker 2: but yeah, I really like the stars of this movie,

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Speaker 2: Daisy Egga Jones and of course Itanio's own Sebastian Stan.

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Speaker 3: Yes.

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Speaker 2: So I was excited to see it and i'd never

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Speaker 2: seen I know that this was the director Mimi Cave's

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Speaker 2: feature length debut, which is wild. I feel like it's

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Speaker 2: such a fully realized thing. Yeah, I enjoyed it. It's

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Speaker 2: a brief and uncomplicated history with this movie.

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Speaker 3: What about you, Caitlin, I did see it about a

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Speaker 3: year ago. Maybe not right when it came out, but

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Speaker 3: within not too long of it being released. Our mutual

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Speaker 3: friend Bryant and I watched it together and I thought

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Speaker 3: it was interesting.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think.

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Speaker 3: I already knew what it was about. It's about cannibalism,

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Speaker 3: and I knew that going in, so I wasn't like

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Speaker 3: surprised at the twist or anything.

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Speaker 2: I kind of was surprised at well, if we can

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Speaker 2: talk about like pacing good stuff. Yeah, because I also

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Speaker 2: felt I hadn't even seen the trailer for it. I

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Speaker 2: don't think, but I knew what this movie was about,

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Speaker 2: like maybe just through like hearsay or whatever it was.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, but yeah, it takes a long time for

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Speaker 2: it to reveal that it's a cannibal movie for a

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Speaker 2: movie that it seems like everyone knows is a cannibal movie, right,

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Speaker 2: What are you gonna do?

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Speaker 3: What are you gonna do? I did earlier today write

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Speaker 3: a letter boxed.

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Speaker 2: Review bra I've never done before.

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Speaker 3: Yes, simply states this movie gives new meaning to the

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Speaker 3: term meet cute.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I gotta hand it to you. I gotta hand

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Speaker 2: it to you.

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Speaker 3: Thank you so much. But anyway, Yeah, I saw the movie.

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Speaker 3: I was like, oh, that was pretty cool, and now

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Speaker 3: we're talking about it, so let's proceed, shall we.

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Speaker 2: I'm very excited. Yeah, there is a certain amount of

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Speaker 2: like Catharsis, to watch a good movie like this, for sure,

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Speaker 2: I quite enjoy So if nothing else, I feel like,

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Speaker 2: there it's a good opportunity for us to publicly air

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Speaker 2: out some personal dating horrors. And isn't that beautiful?

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Speaker 3: That's honestly a lot of what my discussion will be

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Speaker 3: about here today.

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Speaker 2: Okay, great, then welcome to a gossip with us, because yeah,

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Speaker 2: I feel like I really enjoyed this movie, and part

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Speaker 2: of it was because they were just like you could

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Speaker 2: just tell that it was written by a woman who

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Speaker 2: has to date men. Just there were like these little

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Speaker 2: details that you're like ooh oof, no eh hah, yeah,

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Speaker 2: that including like there's nothing more bone chilling than being

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Speaker 2: in a man's home and there's no signal and you're

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Speaker 2: like scary. I hate to ruin the mood, but I

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Speaker 2: remember having to do that once, being like I hate

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Speaker 2: to like wreck the mood, but like I need you

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Speaker 2: to give me the Wi Fi just in case you

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Speaker 2: want to kill me, and like, but you just have

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Speaker 2: to be direct about it because honestly, at that point,

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Speaker 2: if he's gonna kill you, he would just start at

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Speaker 2: the request.

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Speaker 3: This is true.

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Speaker 2: It's not like I can change my fate at this point.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, I like that reminded me of a couple

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Speaker 2: of years ago we were just like, oh my god, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: you have to be like, hey, I'm awkward, but I

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Speaker 2: need to be able to call nine one one in

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Speaker 2: case you're horrible.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Also, so we just covered get Out and I

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Speaker 3: watched this movie on the same day that we covered,

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Speaker 3: So I like watched it out in the morning we

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Speaker 3: recorded that episode, and then like later that night I

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Speaker 3: watched Fresh so Wild. What a day?

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Speaker 2: What a day for you?

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Speaker 3: But the movie follows similar beats in the sense that

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Speaker 3: it's like someone who goes to this unfamiliar place with

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Speaker 3: a romantic partner. They have alterior motives. Yeah, the protagonist

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Speaker 3: gets abducted, they have to try to escape, death is

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Speaker 3: or you know, loss of autonomy is imminent. You know,

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Speaker 3: lots of stuff like that, and then a victorious, triumphant

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Speaker 3: escape from the protagonist at the end. So like, you know,

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Speaker 3: obviously very different stories, but like following similar beats.

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Speaker 2: Similar beats. I didn't think about that. Yeah, that's very

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Speaker 2: very true. Similar friend to the rescue thing. Yes, indeed,

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Speaker 2: although I did love that they had oh my gosh,

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Speaker 2: what is this character's name bartender?

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Speaker 3: Oh, Paul Paul.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. I love that they did have Paul be like no.

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Speaker 3: No, he shows up to help and then he's like

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Speaker 3: never mind.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and you're just like, well, I you know, I

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Speaker 2: wish he had called someone else, but I don't not

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Speaker 2: get it.

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Speaker 3: Right because he's well, we'll talk about him. But yeah,

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Speaker 3: I found that interesting.

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Speaker 2: I thought that was an interesting fake out because you

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Speaker 2: I think maybe it is because we just watched to

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Speaker 2: get Out. I kept waiting for like the TSA moments

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Speaker 2: at the end of get Out, you're like, oh, no,

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Speaker 2: he's gonna leave. I guess that that is like pretty realistic.

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Speaker 3: Anyways, I'll do the recap and then we'll go from there.

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Speaker 2: Let's do it.

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Speaker 3: Actually, let's take a quick break first and then we'll

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Speaker 3: come back.

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Speaker 4: Oh all right, welcome back.

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Speaker 3: Will you're back?

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Speaker 2: Sharpen your freaking blades.

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Speaker 3: Baby, oh or your teeth, because I just stand i'snna

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Speaker 3: eat your s sebashians Stan, Like, what is going on there?

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Speaker 2: I've been trying to figure out what is going on there?

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Speaker 2: For years? What's going on there?

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Speaker 3: Because I remember you saying you could not register who

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Speaker 3: that person was until Titania came out, and then you're like, oh,

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Speaker 3: now I know who he is because he plays is

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Speaker 3: it Jeff Galuley, Yes, thank you.

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Speaker 2: We're a great recall.

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Speaker 3: Wow.

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Speaker 2: Uh yes, I think that maybe you know, in retrospect,

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Speaker 2: my issue with registering Sebashians Stan's face had more to

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Speaker 2: do with like Marvel glaze sure, where he was in

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Speaker 2: a lot of Marvel movies. And I feel like, this

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Speaker 2: is my theory, if you are in like enough Marvel movies,

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Speaker 2: your face just becomes naturally blurry to the human eye

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Speaker 2: for like five years, but then it wears off and

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Speaker 2: you're like, and he's and he's doing I haven't I

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Speaker 2: don't know. I saw the Donald Trump movie and I

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Speaker 2: was like.

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Speaker 3: Oh, okay.

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Speaker 2: But in any case, like he's he's a good actor,

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Speaker 2: and I feel like he tries a lot of interesting stuff.

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Speaker 2: But this was around the time where he was starting

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Speaker 2: to try more interesting stuff instead of just playing like

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Speaker 2: the Ppee Warrior or like whoever he is in Marvel?

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Speaker 2: Is he the Pepee Warrior? Uh?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, no, that's correct. Is he the Winter Soldier or

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Speaker 3: is someone else the Winter Soldier? Don't answer my question, listeners,

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Speaker 3: I don't want to know, actually don't know.

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Speaker 2: I'm just like, congratulations to Sebashianstan for the blur finally

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Speaker 2: wearing off of his face. I do register him now

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Speaker 2: as an autonomous human man. And I think he's quite talented.

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Speaker 3: H yeah, no, but I agree it. Tanya really did

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Speaker 3: it for me. And while he plays a despicable character

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Speaker 3: in that movie, he is unfortunately so hot.

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Speaker 2: He's really hot in that movie, specifically the little mustache.

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Speaker 2: You're like, I know, what is it? And You're like

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Speaker 2: it's my dad. Like You're like, what the fun? Anyways, anyways,

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Speaker 2: let's keep moving. I do appreciate, like I feel like,

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Speaker 2: and this will change the next time we talk about

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Speaker 2: Sebastian Stan. None of this passes the Bechdel test. But

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Speaker 2: he has, like I appreciate when an actor recognizes they

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Speaker 2: have like a somewhat punishable kind of handsome face, because

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Speaker 2: Sebastia stand like he's like villainous handsome.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I think so.

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Speaker 2: Anyways, Daisy Egar Jones was great in Twisters. Yeah, and

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Speaker 2: under the banner of Heaven, did you watch that.

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Speaker 3: I did not.

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Speaker 2: Well, it's really depressing. Don't watch it unless you want

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Speaker 2: to get really upset.

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Speaker 3: I feel like I know of it because you made

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Speaker 3: a joke to the effect of under the banner of

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Speaker 3: Kevin le mignonk you.

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Speaker 2: Thank you for bringing that up. I didn't know if

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Speaker 2: there's gonna be a way to bring that up organically. Yes,

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Speaker 2: I would absolutely watch under the banner of Kevin, under

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Speaker 2: the banner of Heaven, it's you know, it's an Andrew

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Speaker 2: Garfield Police detective show. I would say, maybe too sad,

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Speaker 2: maybe don't watch.

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Speaker 3: But under the banner of Kevin. Yes, anyway, Yes, let's

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Speaker 3: get it. Yeah, let's keep moving a lot.

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Speaker 2: I like Chaos episode, Chaos episode.

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Speaker 1: Ah.

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Speaker 3: Right. So this is a horror movie, so you know

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Speaker 3: content warnings. There's violence against women, there's abduction, there's human trafficking,

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Speaker 3: there's cannibalism. The movie takes place in the Pacific Northwest,

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Speaker 3: in Portland, specifically, I believe.

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Speaker 2: Yes we meet.

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Speaker 3: Noah played by Daisy Edgar Jones. She's a single lady

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Speaker 3: looking for, if not love, she's just dating. She's out

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Speaker 3: there dating, going on dates. She goes on a first

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Speaker 3: date with a guy who ends up being a total asshole.

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Speaker 3: She's not having luck on the dating apps. Men are

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Speaker 3: being gross and sending her dick pics unsolicited things like

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Speaker 3: that her best friend Molly played by Jojo t. Gibb

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Speaker 3: reassures Noah that she doesn't need a man, and they've

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Speaker 3: just been conditioned by Disney Princess movies to have unrealistic

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Speaker 3: expectations about love and romance.

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Speaker 2: And you're like, okay, twenty twelve, let's freaking go buzzby

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Speaker 2: twenty twelve.

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Speaker 3: So one night, Noah heads to the grocery store to

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Speaker 3: grab some treats. A guy there strikes up a conversation

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Speaker 3: with her about cotton candy grapes. This is Steve played

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Speaker 3: by Sebastian Stan.

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Speaker 2: Okay, Mistake number one, don't go on a date with

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Speaker 2: someone you meet in the vegetable aisle.

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Speaker 3: Proceed with caution. I would say, well.

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Speaker 2: I just the vegetables. Like if I met a guy,

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Speaker 2: you know, near the macaroni, I would be like sure,

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Speaker 2: you'd be like, ooh, yeah.

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Speaker 3: I did have a guy approach me in the grocery

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Speaker 3: store one time. This was back when I lived in Boston,

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Speaker 3: so probably like twelve years ago. Okay, and he was

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Speaker 3: just like, hi, You're so beautiful, and.

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Speaker 2: I said, who me?

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Speaker 3: And then we did go on a like coffee date.

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Speaker 3: I want to say, like later that day. It was

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Speaker 3: like a Saturday or Sunday, when I was just like, fu,

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Speaker 3: I'm not doing anything.

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Speaker 2: You almost got freshed.

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Speaker 3: I almost got freshed. But I quickly realized that I

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Speaker 3: was not romantically interested in him, and I said, I'm

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Speaker 3: going to leave forever now bye.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: So I saved myself from being freshed. Good for you,

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Speaker 3: Good for you, Thank you.

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Speaker 2: I feel like I'm constantly putting myself in situations where

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Speaker 2: I could possibly get freshed. It's a common criticism of me.

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Speaker 2: I mean, but so far, so good.

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Speaker 3: So far so good, and it's not your fault if

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Speaker 3: it happens.

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Speaker 2: I mean, let's be honest when.

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Speaker 3: Well, let's try not to put that out into the universe.

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Speaker 3: But anyway, she's approached by this, you know, charming guy

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Speaker 3: who's trying to flirt and he asks for her number,

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Speaker 3: and he's Sebastian Stan So she says yes, and she

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Speaker 3: gives him her number.

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Speaker 2: Who could blame her? She's but human, all right.

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Speaker 3: A few days later he texts her and they meet

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Speaker 3: up for a date and they hit it off. It

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Speaker 3: seems like they have a lot in common. They smooch,

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Speaker 3: they go back to her place, and Jamie they have sex.

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Speaker 2: Don't tell me that you should have done a content

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Speaker 2: warning for that.

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Speaker 3: Yeah sorry at the X Yeah stop. This episode is

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Speaker 3: rated R okay. So some time passes and they keep

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Speaker 3: seeing each other. It's going well, it's cute. He even

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Speaker 3: suggests they go away together on a weekend trip, but Mollie,

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Speaker 3: her best friend, is a bit wary of this because

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Speaker 3: he doesn't have social media, she's never met him, she

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Speaker 3: doesn't nobody looks like. She doesn't like that this trip

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Speaker 3: is this like surprise that he's kind of springing on Noah,

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Speaker 3: especially because like she doesn't know where they're going. But

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Speaker 3: they're like whatever, it will be fine. And so Steve

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Speaker 3: picks up Noah and they head to his place before

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Speaker 3: going to whatever this destination is, which turns out to

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Speaker 3: be Cottage Grove, Oregon, and also where he lives seems

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Speaker 3: to be a several hour drive away from the city

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Speaker 3: because by the time they get there it's dark.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it was a little confused about that, but also,

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Speaker 2: I mean I can definitely relate with, even though this

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Speaker 2: kind of stretches credulity a little bit, the feeling of like,

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Speaker 2: I don't know, like someone that you like being like

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Speaker 2: this is normal, And then I've definitely been a person

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Speaker 2: that's like, ah, yeah, totally and this is regular for me,

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Speaker 2: Like it's unfortunately definitely a thing.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, because you like want to put your trust into

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Speaker 3: someone that you like, and so you're just like, sure,

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Speaker 3: everything's fine, although we do see Noah seeming a bit

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Speaker 3: uneasy about this because she gets to the house, she

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Speaker 3: wants to connect to the Wi fi there's no cell service,

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Speaker 3: and you know, he ignores that. He makes her a

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Speaker 3: drink which he has drugged, and Noah loses consciousness. And

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Speaker 3: then we get the title card and the opening credits,

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Speaker 3: which is like thirty minutes into the movie. So surprise,

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Speaker 3: the movie's called Fresh. So it turns out Steve is

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Speaker 3: the bad guy. Yeah, Noah wakes up in a windowless room,

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Speaker 3: her arm is chained to the floor, and we're like, okay,

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Speaker 3: saw vibes Savva.

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Speaker 2: I was also thinking of ten Cloverfield Lane, a movie

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Speaker 2: I really.

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Speaker 3: Like, Oh, I need to rewatch that.

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Speaker 2: I remember really liking it.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I know, so did I except for I remember

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Speaker 3: thinking the end and I'll try not to say any

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Speaker 3: spoilers here, but the end felt tacked on and that

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Speaker 3: it belonged in a different movie.

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Speaker 2: The end was really weird. Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Well, also because you find out that that was a

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00:19:12,040 --> 00:19:15,199
Speaker 3: script written on spec I think that had nothing to

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Speaker 3: do with the Cloverfield franchise, right, And then they bought

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Speaker 3: the script and then like co opted it into a

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00:19:21,280 --> 00:19:25,080
Speaker 3: Cloverfield movie, and so you're just like, what, it doesn't

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Speaker 3: make any sense anyway. Okay, So she wakes up in

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Speaker 3: this room chained to the wall, but instead of Jigsaw

362
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Speaker 3: on a tape recorder saying let's play a game, Steve

363
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Speaker 3: is in the room and he explains that he drugged

364
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Speaker 3: Noah and that he intends to keep her trapped there,

365
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Speaker 3: chop off pieces of her and sell her meat because

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Speaker 3: people pay him a lot of money for human meat.

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Speaker 3: And he says he's going to keep her alive as

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Speaker 3: long as possible because the fresher the meat the bat

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Speaker 3: and the more valuable it is. And we're like, hey,

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Speaker 3: the name of the movie is Fresh.

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Speaker 2: And they meet in the Fresh produce isle.

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Speaker 3: Uh huh, and she's standing under a sign that says

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Speaker 3: fresh meets.

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Speaker 2: Wow, and that's just a little joke he's doing. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: the movie is called Fresh. The movie's called Fresh, and

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Speaker 2: you won't forget it as you're watching the movie Fresh.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. So he's like, I won't kill you right away

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Speaker 3: unless you act up, in which case he'll kill her sooner.

379
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Speaker 3: So Noah is obviously terrified because, believe it or not,

380
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Speaker 3: she wants to keep her meat on her body. Molly, meanwhile,

381
00:20:41,200 --> 00:20:44,679
Speaker 3: is trying to call and text Noah because Molly hasn't

382
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Speaker 3: heard from her, and she gets a text response and

383
00:20:48,240 --> 00:20:51,480
Speaker 3: it's clear to us the audience that it's Steve pretending

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Speaker 3: to be Noah. So back in Noah's dungeon room, she's screaming,

385
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Speaker 3: she's crying. She hears a voice coming from the room

386
00:20:59,640 --> 00:21:03,480
Speaker 3: next time her. This is Penny played by Andrea Bang,

387
00:21:04,119 --> 00:21:07,000
Speaker 3: saying that Steve isn't there right now and that she's

388
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Speaker 3: in the same situation as Noah, although Steve has already

389
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Speaker 3: started cutting off parts of her to sell her meat.

390
00:21:15,359 --> 00:21:18,960
Speaker 3: And there's a third woman, Melissa, although she has been

391
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Speaker 3: there for a while and it seems that she has

392
00:21:21,440 --> 00:21:27,280
Speaker 3: like lost her mind. Steve comes back and we see

393
00:21:27,359 --> 00:21:32,960
Speaker 3: him cut up Melissa's amputated leg. He's tenderizing the meat,

394
00:21:33,080 --> 00:21:36,800
Speaker 3: he seals it, he packages it into a few different boxes.

395
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Speaker 2: And he's like basically doing I mean, there is a

396
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Speaker 2: portion of this movie where Sebastian Stan is like, remember

397
00:21:43,080 --> 00:21:46,200
Speaker 2: Christian Bale in American Psycho, I'm kind of doing that.

398
00:21:46,240 --> 00:21:48,840
Speaker 2: Like the you know, the needle drops and stuff felt

399
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Speaker 2: very reminiscent of American Psycho.

400
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Speaker 3: Sure, yeah, yeah, you half expect Sebastian Stan to start

401
00:21:55,000 --> 00:21:59,199
Speaker 3: monologuing about Huey Lewis in the news or Whitney Houston

402
00:21:59,280 --> 00:21:59,919
Speaker 3: or something.

403
00:21:59,800 --> 00:22:02,720
Speaker 2: Right right, Like he's not as far, god, but I mean,

404
00:22:02,760 --> 00:22:04,000
Speaker 2: what kind of yardstick is that?

405
00:22:04,119 --> 00:22:04,960
Speaker 4: But yeah, like.

406
00:22:05,320 --> 00:22:09,720
Speaker 2: Grooving around with his victims to like eighties music, You're like,

407
00:22:09,800 --> 00:22:11,800
Speaker 2: I know this, I know for some reason this is

408
00:22:11,800 --> 00:22:14,000
Speaker 2: a trope, right, yes.

409
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Speaker 3: And he's like putting the meat in these like little

410
00:22:16,359 --> 00:22:19,240
Speaker 3: care packages along with like the photos of the women

411
00:22:19,359 --> 00:22:22,240
Speaker 3: and like articles of their clothing and stuff like that.

412
00:22:22,359 --> 00:22:24,560
Speaker 3: It seems like he always like says to these women,

413
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Speaker 3: let's go on a trip, and then that way they

414
00:22:26,880 --> 00:22:29,960
Speaker 3: pack a bag full of stuff and then he steals

415
00:22:30,000 --> 00:22:31,480
Speaker 3: it and anyway, so.

416
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Speaker 2: He's objectifying women. Would we agree that he views women

417
00:22:36,800 --> 00:22:40,919
Speaker 2: as proud objects? What do you mean? That was the

418
00:22:40,960 --> 00:22:43,720
Speaker 2: thought I had? It wasn't the very end of the movie.

419
00:22:43,800 --> 00:22:48,760
Speaker 2: But well, let's just go on a second. Wait, wait

420
00:22:48,800 --> 00:22:51,280
Speaker 2: a minute, A looks like this guy respects ladies at all.

421
00:22:53,160 --> 00:22:57,280
Speaker 3: Right, all right, So Noah is determined to get out

422
00:22:57,280 --> 00:23:01,679
Speaker 3: of this situation. She tells Steve that she needs to

423
00:23:01,720 --> 00:23:05,359
Speaker 3: take a shower, which he is about to let her do,

424
00:23:05,680 --> 00:23:09,680
Speaker 3: so he leads her upstairs. She takes note of her surroundings,

425
00:23:10,280 --> 00:23:12,760
Speaker 3: but then she tries to break free and escape, and

426
00:23:12,880 --> 00:23:16,639
Speaker 3: Steve stops her. When she wakes up again, she's on

427
00:23:16,720 --> 00:23:22,960
Speaker 3: a surgical bed and he is surgically removing her buttocks.

428
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Speaker 2: Wilds.

429
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Speaker 3: Yeah. Mollie, meanwhile, is still concerned, and she starts digging

430
00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:35,040
Speaker 3: and realizes that the picture that Noah quote unquote texted

431
00:23:35,240 --> 00:23:39,359
Speaker 3: of her trip is actually a stock photo from a website.

432
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Speaker 3: So Molly knows something's up.

433
00:23:41,040 --> 00:23:44,520
Speaker 2: Also, like the second your good friend starts texting you

434
00:23:44,640 --> 00:23:50,399
Speaker 2: fully punctuated sentences, You're like, they've been kidnapped, They've been taken. Yeah,

435
00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:53,400
Speaker 2: your close friend would never send you a full sentence

436
00:23:53,440 --> 00:23:55,280
Speaker 2: in a text that's absurd.

437
00:23:55,480 --> 00:24:00,399
Speaker 3: Also, you see Molly's face have this like book of

438
00:24:00,600 --> 00:24:05,280
Speaker 3: incredulity when she sends a heart emoji, and it almost

439
00:24:05,320 --> 00:24:09,159
Speaker 3: seems like, oh, she never uses emojis. That wasn't established,

440
00:24:09,119 --> 00:24:10,840
Speaker 3: And I feel like that maybe would have been helpful

441
00:24:10,880 --> 00:24:14,720
Speaker 3: to establish that, like Noah never uses emojis. But you

442
00:24:14,760 --> 00:24:18,440
Speaker 3: see her be suspicious Molly. That is when she gets

443
00:24:18,520 --> 00:24:21,879
Speaker 3: the heart emoji, and that's when she starts kind of investigating.

444
00:24:22,040 --> 00:24:25,439
Speaker 3: She sees the stock photo, and so she goes to

445
00:24:25,520 --> 00:24:28,520
Speaker 3: the bar where Noah went on her first date with Steve,

446
00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:34,600
Speaker 3: and she asks the bartender, Paul played by theo Okinewe,

447
00:24:35,119 --> 00:24:39,080
Speaker 3: who is a former lover of Molly's. They used to

448
00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:42,760
Speaker 3: like have a casual hookup situation, it seemed, and she

449
00:24:42,920 --> 00:24:46,520
Speaker 3: asks Paul to give her any info on Steve, like

450
00:24:46,600 --> 00:24:49,240
Speaker 3: his last name from the credit card that he paid with,

451
00:24:50,040 --> 00:24:53,600
Speaker 3: and Paul eventually gives Molly Steve's full name. So she

452
00:24:54,080 --> 00:24:58,480
Speaker 3: gets to googling, and it seems like Steve has a

453
00:24:58,560 --> 00:25:01,400
Speaker 3: wife and two young k kids, and she finds out

454
00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:06,280
Speaker 3: where he lives. Back in the Dungeon, Noah confides in

455
00:25:06,359 --> 00:25:11,280
Speaker 3: Penny that she slept with Steve and Penny is like, oh, whoa,

456
00:25:11,320 --> 00:25:13,280
Speaker 3: Like none of the rest of us did, but I'm

457
00:25:13,280 --> 00:25:17,440
Speaker 3: not shaming you. It's probably a compliment. Actually, yeah.

458
00:25:17,520 --> 00:25:20,639
Speaker 2: Penny is like through the wall comments are very very funny,

459
00:25:20,640 --> 00:25:24,000
Speaker 2: where she's like no shame, no shame, but like wow.

460
00:25:24,320 --> 00:25:29,080
Speaker 3: Whoa right? And then when Noah asks Steve why he

461
00:25:29,160 --> 00:25:32,560
Speaker 3: slept with her, he's like, yeah, I told you, I

462
00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:37,119
Speaker 3: like you. Then in a magazine that Steve gave Noah

463
00:25:37,119 --> 00:25:41,480
Speaker 3: to like help her pass the time, Noah notices writing

464
00:25:41,520 --> 00:25:44,840
Speaker 3: from another woman and it says like, if you're reading this,

465
00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:48,920
Speaker 3: it means he likes you. Use it keep fucking fighting.

466
00:25:49,720 --> 00:25:55,880
Speaker 3: And then it's signed Sammy Akbari. So Noah, taking this advice,

467
00:25:56,160 --> 00:26:00,399
Speaker 3: tries a new tactic where she asks Steve what the

468
00:26:00,520 --> 00:26:05,360
Speaker 3: human meat tastes like and he's like, oh, it's exquisite.

469
00:26:06,160 --> 00:26:08,159
Speaker 3: Why do you ask, though, And she's like ha ha,

470
00:26:08,280 --> 00:26:10,920
Speaker 3: I don't know, just curious, and he's like.

471
00:26:10,960 --> 00:26:13,520
Speaker 2: Hmm, I still haven't seen Silence of the Lambs? Is

472
00:26:13,560 --> 00:26:17,280
Speaker 2: he Hannibal Electering now? Is he like oscillating between.

473
00:26:18,440 --> 00:26:23,560
Speaker 3: No, I wasn't getting Hannibal Lecter vibes from Steve, but

474
00:26:23,720 --> 00:26:26,520
Speaker 3: isn't Hannibal elector a cannibal. I mean, he says like,

475
00:26:26,600 --> 00:26:29,360
Speaker 3: I ate her liver with fava beans in a nice kianti.

476
00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:32,840
Speaker 2: But he's just a killer. He's not like a down

477
00:26:32,880 --> 00:26:33,960
Speaker 2: home cannibal.

478
00:26:34,880 --> 00:26:37,920
Speaker 3: Well like Hannibal Lecter. I don't think we at least

479
00:26:37,920 --> 00:26:40,600
Speaker 3: in Silence of the Lambs. I haven't seen the other

480
00:26:41,000 --> 00:26:43,840
Speaker 3: Like there's Hannibal and then there's Red Dragon, and then

481
00:26:43,840 --> 00:26:46,200
Speaker 3: there's a show and you know, the sequels and the

482
00:26:46,240 --> 00:26:49,119
Speaker 3: spinoffs and stuff like that, I haven't seen. But in

483
00:26:49,760 --> 00:26:53,000
Speaker 3: Silence of the Lambs, you never see Hannibal. He's not

484
00:26:53,080 --> 00:26:56,480
Speaker 3: like a flirty, charming, handsome young guy who's.

485
00:26:56,240 --> 00:27:05,960
Speaker 2: Like, wow, just drag him. She's kill Sorry, sorry, you're

486
00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:08,960
Speaker 2: like geez, he's just scary.

487
00:27:09,080 --> 00:27:12,040
Speaker 3: So he he has a different approach than Steve.

488
00:27:12,600 --> 00:27:15,560
Speaker 2: Okay, okay, thank you, I need it. I wanted to know.

489
00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:21,320
Speaker 3: Meanwhile, Mollie goes to Steve's house where he lives with

490
00:27:21,440 --> 00:27:24,240
Speaker 3: his family, so like his other home, not the one

491
00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:29,720
Speaker 3: that he has a whole like cannibalism laboratory at and

492
00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:35,240
Speaker 3: Mollie tells his wife Anne played by Charlotte Lebon, that

493
00:27:35,320 --> 00:27:39,600
Speaker 3: her friend Noah has been seeing Steve, and Anne is

494
00:27:39,680 --> 00:27:42,800
Speaker 3: like I are you sure that that doesn't sound right?

495
00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:47,320
Speaker 3: And then Steve comes home, so Mollie sees him and

496
00:27:47,359 --> 00:27:52,119
Speaker 3: he denies that he knows Noah. So Molly calls Noah's phone,

497
00:27:52,280 --> 00:27:55,560
Speaker 3: which Steve has on him, and it starts ringing, so

498
00:27:55,640 --> 00:28:02,119
Speaker 3: he's busted. But twist, his wife is in on the

499
00:28:02,160 --> 00:28:04,800
Speaker 3: whole operation, and she knocks Molly out.

500
00:28:05,240 --> 00:28:07,800
Speaker 2: The thing that is interesting about this movie is I

501
00:28:07,880 --> 00:28:11,959
Speaker 2: really enjoyed it, and none of the twists surprised me. Like,

502
00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:14,679
Speaker 2: I feel like the second you see her haircut, you're like,

503
00:28:14,800 --> 00:28:15,640
Speaker 2: she's in on it.

504
00:28:15,920 --> 00:28:18,800
Speaker 3: You know, she does give off vibes that are a

505
00:28:18,920 --> 00:28:23,240
Speaker 3: little too sinister for me to be super surprised by

506
00:28:23,240 --> 00:28:28,520
Speaker 3: that twist. Yeah, so Ann the wife is in on

507
00:28:28,640 --> 00:28:31,840
Speaker 3: this whole cannibalism operation thing. And then we get another

508
00:28:31,920 --> 00:28:38,479
Speaker 3: reveal that she Anne has a prosthetic leg. Presumably she

509
00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:42,600
Speaker 3: was one of Steve's former victims. She's a survivor of

510
00:28:42,640 --> 00:28:48,000
Speaker 3: this situation. And then he spared Anne and married her.

511
00:28:48,560 --> 00:28:53,640
Speaker 3: Is what you can like gather. Then Steve basically invites

512
00:28:53,720 --> 00:28:58,200
Speaker 3: Noah on a little date upstairs where he prepares a

513
00:28:58,360 --> 00:29:02,280
Speaker 3: dinner of human meat her and the whole time she

514
00:29:02,440 --> 00:29:05,240
Speaker 3: is like, you know, calculating away out of there.

515
00:29:05,280 --> 00:29:08,520
Speaker 2: Freaks a whole new you need to girl dinner, am I? Right?

516
00:29:08,800 --> 00:29:09,040
Speaker 1: WHOA?

517
00:29:14,280 --> 00:29:17,640
Speaker 3: So anyway, she's like feigning interest in the line of

518
00:29:17,640 --> 00:29:22,360
Speaker 3: work he's in, you know, the cannibalism industry, and he's

519
00:29:22,400 --> 00:29:25,080
Speaker 3: telling her about it, and she's like, uh huh, and

520
00:29:25,120 --> 00:29:30,160
Speaker 3: she asks if he only eats women, and he's like, yeah,

521
00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:34,160
Speaker 3: that's where the market is, plus they taste better. And

522
00:29:34,200 --> 00:29:39,440
Speaker 3: then she eats some human meat from a woman named Hope,

523
00:29:40,520 --> 00:29:43,920
Speaker 3: and then he brings her back to her room after

524
00:29:43,960 --> 00:29:47,440
Speaker 3: the date. She makes herself throw up this meal because

525
00:29:47,480 --> 00:29:50,080
Speaker 3: you know, she obviously only ate it to manipulate him,

526
00:29:50,680 --> 00:29:53,360
Speaker 3: but it's working and he wants to have dinner with

527
00:29:53,400 --> 00:29:58,880
Speaker 3: her again the following night. Then we see Steve take

528
00:29:59,280 --> 00:30:03,200
Speaker 3: Mollie out of of her like dungeon enclosure. Noah doesn't

529
00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:05,680
Speaker 3: know that Mollie is there, although she does realize that

530
00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:11,080
Speaker 3: some new woman is present, and then Steve cuts part

531
00:30:11,240 --> 00:30:16,400
Speaker 3: of Molly off. Also, Mollie had shared her location with Paul,

532
00:30:17,120 --> 00:30:20,960
Speaker 3: and he sees that she's somewhere far away, and then

533
00:30:21,000 --> 00:30:24,880
Speaker 3: her location becomes unavailable entirely, and so he's like, hmm,

534
00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:28,560
Speaker 3: that's weird, and then he'll eventually set off to go

535
00:30:28,600 --> 00:30:31,600
Speaker 3: find her. Then it's time for the next little date

536
00:30:31,680 --> 00:30:35,840
Speaker 3: between Noah and Steve, and she's being very flirty and familiar,

537
00:30:36,440 --> 00:30:39,920
Speaker 3: and she's like clearly trying to put Steve at ease

538
00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:43,800
Speaker 3: and get him very comfortable to like let his guard

539
00:30:43,840 --> 00:30:47,680
Speaker 3: down and all that stuff. They eat Melissa liver pete.

540
00:30:48,560 --> 00:30:52,000
Speaker 3: They also eat breast meat, which I think might belong

541
00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:54,560
Speaker 3: to Molly, because I feel like it's implied what's being

542
00:30:54,600 --> 00:30:56,600
Speaker 3: removed from her is Molly's breasts.

543
00:30:57,000 --> 00:30:59,840
Speaker 2: Oh okay, because I also was just like very un

544
00:31:00,120 --> 00:31:03,640
Speaker 2: clear on I mean not that I'm like be more specific,

545
00:31:03,800 --> 00:31:07,080
Speaker 2: but like I was kind of unclear on just the

546
00:31:07,080 --> 00:31:08,960
Speaker 2: there's a little bit of YadA YadA when it comes

547
00:31:09,000 --> 00:31:13,000
Speaker 2: to the healing process, for sure, because I just feel

548
00:31:13,000 --> 00:31:16,520
Speaker 2: like if someone took even half of my ass, I

549
00:31:16,520 --> 00:31:19,440
Speaker 2: wouldn't be like I can sit down for a date

550
00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:20,600
Speaker 2: next week.

551
00:31:21,080 --> 00:31:23,960
Speaker 3: You would think it would take a lot longer to heal.

552
00:31:24,400 --> 00:31:26,160
Speaker 2: As a horror fan, I feel like it's almost a

553
00:31:26,200 --> 00:31:30,040
Speaker 2: missed opportunity to like do some like And he has

554
00:31:30,120 --> 00:31:34,280
Speaker 2: this freaky chair he designed for women without asses, Like

555
00:31:34,520 --> 00:31:34,920
Speaker 2: you know.

556
00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:37,360
Speaker 3: I feel like she does sit on one of those

557
00:31:37,440 --> 00:31:39,120
Speaker 3: like little cushioned donuts.

558
00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:42,720
Speaker 2: That's true, that's true. But wow, he does care.

559
00:31:42,960 --> 00:31:49,040
Speaker 3: He thinks of everything. This Steve also another reason I

560
00:31:49,040 --> 00:31:51,880
Speaker 3: think it's Molly's because he doesn't specify whose breasts they're eating.

561
00:31:52,280 --> 00:31:56,120
Speaker 3: He says the other names of the other uh oh,

562
00:31:56,640 --> 00:31:57,040
Speaker 3: but he does.

563
00:31:57,720 --> 00:31:58,720
Speaker 2: He doesn't want her to know.

564
00:31:58,960 --> 00:32:04,280
Speaker 3: Yeah, he shows her this stash of all the belongings

565
00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:07,600
Speaker 3: from like the women he has abducted, as well as

566
00:32:07,600 --> 00:32:11,560
Speaker 3: photos of them. So Noah sees Melissa and Penny and

567
00:32:11,840 --> 00:32:14,560
Speaker 3: Sammy who had left the note in the magazine, as

568
00:32:14,560 --> 00:32:16,680
Speaker 3: well as all their phones. So now she like knows

569
00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:21,080
Speaker 3: where the phones are. And then she really turns up

570
00:32:21,240 --> 00:32:24,480
Speaker 3: the charm, except well, she's like, she gets very vulnerable

571
00:32:24,840 --> 00:32:28,280
Speaker 3: and she's crying and he's like, come your babe, it's okay.

572
00:32:28,640 --> 00:32:31,760
Speaker 3: And then they start kissing, and then they dance and

573
00:32:31,760 --> 00:32:35,000
Speaker 3: they start fooling around and she's about to go down

574
00:32:35,040 --> 00:32:40,680
Speaker 3: on him, but then she bites his dick off. Question mark,

575
00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:43,800
Speaker 3: I hope, So I hope.

576
00:32:43,840 --> 00:32:47,080
Speaker 2: So again a little unclear. I kind of wonder if

577
00:32:47,080 --> 00:32:50,120
Speaker 2: this wasn't like available on Disney Plus, like if you

578
00:32:50,160 --> 00:32:54,160
Speaker 2: would really get to see it. It is so weird.

579
00:32:54,400 --> 00:32:58,360
Speaker 2: I added Hulu to my Disney Plus and now it's like, oh,

580
00:32:58,360 --> 00:33:01,920
Speaker 2: it's cheaper, it really is, like, but no, it's funny.

581
00:33:01,960 --> 00:33:04,640
Speaker 2: Like when you add Hulu to Disney Plus, it just

582
00:33:04,680 --> 00:33:08,760
Speaker 2: defeats the purpose of Disney Plus entirely because you're like, oh,

583
00:33:09,280 --> 00:33:11,160
Speaker 2: I feel like Disney Plus used to be really discerning

584
00:33:11,240 --> 00:33:13,400
Speaker 2: about like it has to be family friendly. And you're like,

585
00:33:13,400 --> 00:33:16,560
Speaker 2: now I can watch Daisy Egar Jones like bite someone's

586
00:33:16,640 --> 00:33:20,920
Speaker 2: dick off right after Nightmare before Christmas or whatever.

587
00:33:22,040 --> 00:33:26,680
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I mean funny juxtaposition. Yeah, but anyway, she

588
00:33:26,680 --> 00:33:29,520
Speaker 3: bites his dick off, or at least bites it enough

589
00:33:29,560 --> 00:33:32,920
Speaker 3: that it draws a lot of blood, and she smears

590
00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:36,640
Speaker 3: toothpaste in his eyes. And then she grabs a phone,

591
00:33:36,680 --> 00:33:40,640
Speaker 3: grabs some keys, starts to escape, but first she saves

592
00:33:40,680 --> 00:33:43,360
Speaker 3: Molly and Penny and the three of them.

593
00:33:43,440 --> 00:33:44,760
Speaker 2: You're like, what about Melissa.

594
00:33:45,480 --> 00:33:48,640
Speaker 3: Melissa's presumed dead because she no longer has a liver.

595
00:33:49,680 --> 00:33:52,880
Speaker 3: They ate her liver, So I think that implies I.

596
00:33:52,800 --> 00:33:56,440
Speaker 2: Guess I don't know how bodies work. I'm like, don't you.

597
00:33:56,560 --> 00:33:59,160
Speaker 2: I'm thinking of kidneys, and I'm thinking of kidneys because

598
00:33:59,160 --> 00:34:02,040
Speaker 2: you well you need you don't have two livers, well,

599
00:34:02,200 --> 00:34:05,000
Speaker 2: I know, but you can live without one kidney. I

600
00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:09,800
Speaker 2: just was like, livers, you have two, okay.

601
00:34:09,920 --> 00:34:12,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, just the one liver and they ate it. So

602
00:34:12,360 --> 00:34:17,239
Speaker 3: Melissa is probably dead, so she can't save her, but

603
00:34:17,280 --> 00:34:22,080
Speaker 3: she does save Penny and Mollie, and the three of

604
00:34:22,120 --> 00:34:26,560
Speaker 3: them fight off Steve with knives and meat tender risers,

605
00:34:26,719 --> 00:34:29,600
Speaker 3: and they managed to get outside into the woods, but

606
00:34:29,640 --> 00:34:32,799
Speaker 3: Steve comes after them with a gun. He's shooting at them.

607
00:34:32,920 --> 00:34:37,560
Speaker 3: He is absolutely furious that Noah tricked him. Meanwhile, Paul

608
00:34:37,600 --> 00:34:40,840
Speaker 3: has driven to Steve's house to try to find Molly,

609
00:34:40,880 --> 00:34:43,800
Speaker 3: but he's like, this is creepy, and then he hears

610
00:34:43,840 --> 00:34:47,799
Speaker 3: the gunshots, and so he leaves, being like I've seen

611
00:34:47,800 --> 00:34:50,000
Speaker 3: this movie and I don't make it out alive, you know,

612
00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:54,320
Speaker 3: commenting on how black people often do not survive horror movies. Yeah,

613
00:34:54,360 --> 00:34:55,520
Speaker 3: so he leaves.

614
00:34:55,680 --> 00:34:58,960
Speaker 2: I did keep expecting him to come back. Same, but

615
00:34:59,239 --> 00:35:01,440
Speaker 2: I kind of like that he doesn't, like, I mean,

616
00:35:01,440 --> 00:35:03,160
Speaker 2: because they liberate themselves.

617
00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:07,120
Speaker 3: True. I was like, I hope he's at least nearby

618
00:35:07,280 --> 00:35:09,520
Speaker 3: so that they can get a ride home from him.

619
00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:13,520
Speaker 2: They are very far away, very and I mean as

620
00:35:13,520 --> 00:35:15,680
Speaker 2: we're about to talk about, like the ending of this

621
00:35:15,760 --> 00:35:17,120
Speaker 2: movie is very abrupt.

622
00:35:17,400 --> 00:35:21,399
Speaker 3: It is, yeah, although maybe you know, everyone ends up dead,

623
00:35:21,480 --> 00:35:23,680
Speaker 3: so maybe they just like take the keys to one

624
00:35:23,680 --> 00:35:25,799
Speaker 3: of Sebastian Stan's cars and drive.

625
00:35:26,239 --> 00:35:28,040
Speaker 2: I mean, I don't even mean that as a criticism.

626
00:35:28,080 --> 00:35:31,520
Speaker 2: I was just like, oh, yeah, I guess it's yeah.

627
00:35:31,560 --> 00:35:37,879
Speaker 3: Anyway. So Paul leaves, but Steve's wife Anne shows up

628
00:35:37,920 --> 00:35:41,200
Speaker 3: at the house. She sees that Steve is in danger,

629
00:35:41,880 --> 00:35:46,480
Speaker 3: but Noah, Molly, and Penny get to him first. Noah

630
00:35:46,520 --> 00:35:49,560
Speaker 3: grabs his gun and shoots him in the head, killing him.

631
00:35:50,239 --> 00:35:52,800
Speaker 3: Then Noah goes back into the woods to get her phone,

632
00:35:53,000 --> 00:35:56,719
Speaker 3: which she dropped, and Anne approaches her, pretending to be

633
00:35:56,800 --> 00:36:02,120
Speaker 3: one of Steve's victims. Then she attacks Noah, but Molly

634
00:36:02,480 --> 00:36:05,520
Speaker 3: saves her and bashes in Anne's head with a shovel,

635
00:36:06,239 --> 00:36:09,239
Speaker 3: and then the movie ends with Noah and Molly embracing

636
00:36:09,920 --> 00:36:13,120
Speaker 3: plus a little button where Noah gets a text from

637
00:36:13,239 --> 00:36:14,960
Speaker 3: I think, the guy she went on a date with

638
00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:18,040
Speaker 3: at the beginning of the movie saying like you up

639
00:36:18,719 --> 00:36:23,319
Speaker 3: the end. So that's the movie. Let's take another quick

640
00:36:23,320 --> 00:36:36,600
Speaker 3: break and we'll come back to discuss. And we're back

641
00:36:36,719 --> 00:36:37,320
Speaker 3: we're back.

642
00:36:37,960 --> 00:36:41,840
Speaker 2: So, okay, here's my big I'm just gonna come in

643
00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:46,400
Speaker 2: with my big question. I say it, Okay. I feel

644
00:36:46,480 --> 00:36:50,840
Speaker 2: like the characters are generally underdeveloped, but in particular, I

645
00:36:50,840 --> 00:36:55,200
Speaker 2: feel like it really stands out with Molly's character. I

646
00:36:55,239 --> 00:36:59,680
Speaker 2: feel like the black best friend trope is being sort

647
00:36:59,719 --> 00:37:04,080
Speaker 2: of ployed pretty heavily here. Yeah, I guess what I

648
00:37:04,200 --> 00:37:07,759
Speaker 2: will say is that, like I wouldn't say that, you know,

649
00:37:07,880 --> 00:37:11,880
Speaker 2: we know Noah so well and we don't know anything

650
00:37:11,920 --> 00:37:13,880
Speaker 2: about Molly, like I would say, we don't really know

651
00:37:14,000 --> 00:37:17,760
Speaker 2: either of these characters very well. But it's just the

652
00:37:17,760 --> 00:37:21,800
Speaker 2: the trope of like, while Mollie is a very active character,

653
00:37:22,000 --> 00:37:25,040
Speaker 2: and I like that their friendship is at the core

654
00:37:25,120 --> 00:37:27,160
Speaker 2: of the movie, and you can read in this message

655
00:37:27,160 --> 00:37:30,800
Speaker 2: of like, you know, Steve's maybe biggest mistake with Noah

656
00:37:30,960 --> 00:37:33,719
Speaker 2: is to assume that a lack of biological family in

657
00:37:33,760 --> 00:37:36,799
Speaker 2: her life means that no one cares about her, and

658
00:37:36,880 --> 00:37:40,000
Speaker 2: that she has found family with Molly and all this

659
00:37:40,000 --> 00:37:42,919
Speaker 2: stuff like that is great. I like friendship between women

660
00:37:42,960 --> 00:37:45,200
Speaker 2: at the core of a story. But you know, while

661
00:37:45,200 --> 00:37:48,160
Speaker 2: Molly is a very active character, she's in the story

662
00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:51,839
Speaker 2: to service no you know what I mean, I don't

663
00:37:51,840 --> 00:37:52,799
Speaker 2: know for sure, did that come.

664
00:37:52,760 --> 00:37:55,279
Speaker 3: Up for you? Definitely, especially because in the first like

665
00:37:56,239 --> 00:37:59,520
Speaker 3: several scenes we either see Molly in or like hear

666
00:37:59,600 --> 00:38:04,280
Speaker 3: her in a phone conversation. She is just like giving

667
00:38:04,320 --> 00:38:08,520
Speaker 3: advice to her straight white friend because we learned the

668
00:38:08,840 --> 00:38:11,400
Speaker 3: Molly is queer, she dates men and women.

669
00:38:11,880 --> 00:38:13,520
Speaker 2: It was to the point where I was like, I

670
00:38:13,600 --> 00:38:16,480
Speaker 2: wonder if this is gonna be a trope that's like

671
00:38:16,600 --> 00:38:19,360
Speaker 2: commented on within the movie, because it felt pretty like

672
00:38:19,920 --> 00:38:23,839
Speaker 2: obvious what trope is happening there, but it's not really

673
00:38:23,880 --> 00:38:28,160
Speaker 2: commented on where yeah, she's just weirdly fixated on the

674
00:38:28,239 --> 00:38:33,120
Speaker 2: relationship of her straight white friend and you're just like, God,

675
00:38:33,239 --> 00:38:34,040
Speaker 2: what year is it?

676
00:38:34,239 --> 00:38:34,560
Speaker 4: Come on?

677
00:38:35,160 --> 00:38:39,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, you do see Mollie talking about like what it's

678
00:38:39,680 --> 00:38:42,360
Speaker 3: like to date women and how there are fewer games

679
00:38:42,440 --> 00:38:47,160
Speaker 3: and there's more emotional dependence, which she's saying it seems

680
00:38:47,239 --> 00:38:50,280
Speaker 3: like ingest you know, she's kind of joking around, because

681
00:38:50,280 --> 00:38:53,360
Speaker 3: that's otherwise a pretty like reductive thing to say, but

682
00:38:53,440 --> 00:38:55,960
Speaker 3: it seems like she's joking. But I was like, well,

683
00:38:56,000 --> 00:38:58,640
Speaker 3: can't we see that then to give like Molly more

684
00:38:58,800 --> 00:39:02,080
Speaker 3: interior life, like see her dating women and what that

685
00:39:02,120 --> 00:39:06,520
Speaker 3: does look like in contrast to Noah dating men, that

686
00:39:06,640 --> 00:39:10,640
Speaker 3: would develop Molly's character a bit more and make it

687
00:39:10,680 --> 00:39:13,919
Speaker 3: so that she has more interiority versus everything she does

688
00:39:14,040 --> 00:39:18,279
Speaker 3: is in service of her straight white best friend. I

689
00:39:18,320 --> 00:39:21,719
Speaker 3: do feel like she is that Mollie is integrated into

690
00:39:21,800 --> 00:39:25,279
Speaker 3: the story more meaningfully than I was expecting, because she does,

691
00:39:25,320 --> 00:39:30,440
Speaker 3: like go to investigate and then she helps to defeat

692
00:39:30,600 --> 00:39:33,920
Speaker 3: Steve and she kills Anne. But it still means that

693
00:39:33,960 --> 00:39:39,720
Speaker 3: everything she does is to like help her white best friend.

694
00:39:40,160 --> 00:39:44,000
Speaker 2: Right. It's tricky because I do yeah, Mollie does become

695
00:39:44,560 --> 00:39:47,880
Speaker 2: a very I mean, the movie can't happen without Molly.

696
00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:50,560
Speaker 2: It's not like she's strictly there and in the way

697
00:39:50,560 --> 00:39:53,239
Speaker 2: that I feel like we see this trope in other

698
00:39:53,440 --> 00:39:57,759
Speaker 2: movies where it's like a very expendable character who's just

699
00:39:57,880 --> 00:40:01,040
Speaker 2: there to basically be like, so, how are you feeling

700
00:40:01,200 --> 00:40:04,960
Speaker 2: about the relationship? So, like I will give the writer

701
00:40:05,200 --> 00:40:08,080
Speaker 2: Lauren Kahn like credit for you know, this movie is

702
00:40:08,080 --> 00:40:10,960
Speaker 2: not possible without Molly. She's integral to the plot. For

703
00:40:11,160 --> 00:40:15,120
Speaker 2: she's extremely active, like she's smart, like my favorite scenes

704
00:40:15,160 --> 00:40:18,960
Speaker 2: with Mollie. And also Jojo T. Gibs is really funny,

705
00:40:19,040 --> 00:40:24,560
Speaker 2: she's great, but she thinks like a girl, like you know,

706
00:40:24,640 --> 00:40:27,360
Speaker 2: like you when something is like a little bit off

707
00:40:27,440 --> 00:40:30,680
Speaker 2: with her friend, or like the way that she views

708
00:40:30,760 --> 00:40:33,000
Speaker 2: texting and the way that she approaches things like it

709
00:40:33,320 --> 00:40:37,080
Speaker 2: all felt very like authentic and you know, relatable, and

710
00:40:37,160 --> 00:40:39,239
Speaker 2: like even the fact that, just like the touches of

711
00:40:39,280 --> 00:40:42,560
Speaker 2: like she makes sure to share her location with somebody

712
00:40:42,600 --> 00:40:45,360
Speaker 2: when she's going into a situation that feels unsafe and

713
00:40:45,480 --> 00:40:49,400
Speaker 2: just like, yeah, I liked her character when the like

714
00:40:49,480 --> 00:40:52,920
Speaker 2: internal logic that she has and she's funny and she's cool,

715
00:40:53,000 --> 00:40:57,680
Speaker 2: but it's like there's nothing else really there for her.

716
00:40:58,080 --> 00:41:00,319
Speaker 2: Like I feel like this movie would have been more

717
00:41:00,320 --> 00:41:04,160
Speaker 2: interesting to me as like a two hander where Molly

718
00:41:04,239 --> 00:41:08,360
Speaker 2: and Noah are like characters of equal importance as opposed

719
00:41:08,400 --> 00:41:12,760
Speaker 2: to Mollie is Noah's friend, which is how this movie

720
00:41:12,960 --> 00:41:14,520
Speaker 2: you know rolls out for sure.

721
00:41:15,640 --> 00:41:17,319
Speaker 3: Yeah, And I don't think it would have been that

722
00:41:17,400 --> 00:41:20,799
Speaker 3: big of an adjustment, like writing wise or structurally or

723
00:41:20,800 --> 00:41:21,520
Speaker 3: anything like that.

724
00:41:21,680 --> 00:41:24,480
Speaker 2: So and I think it just like from a writing

725
00:41:24,560 --> 00:41:29,520
Speaker 2: perspective too, like Mollie is unbelievably loyal to Noah, like

726
00:41:29,840 --> 00:41:32,799
Speaker 2: which is great friend love that. Yeah, but I would

727
00:41:32,800 --> 00:41:35,640
Speaker 2: have liked to know a little bit more about their friendship.

728
00:41:35,680 --> 00:41:38,439
Speaker 2: We don't really learn very much about it a bit,

729
00:41:38,480 --> 00:41:41,240
Speaker 2: Like I think the most we get is her telling

730
00:41:41,440 --> 00:41:42,680
Speaker 2: Steve they used.

731
00:41:42,520 --> 00:41:45,960
Speaker 3: To work together. Yeah, okay, like you know.

732
00:41:46,000 --> 00:41:48,279
Speaker 2: You work with a lot of people, like and there,

733
00:41:48,480 --> 00:41:50,840
Speaker 2: I don't know, Like I feel like there is something

734
00:41:50,880 --> 00:41:52,880
Speaker 2: a little bit missing for me there where I know

735
00:41:52,920 --> 00:41:55,319
Speaker 2: in horror, very often you don't get a ton of

736
00:41:55,320 --> 00:42:00,680
Speaker 2: information about characters. That's fine as long as it's equally distributed, right, Yeah,

737
00:42:00,719 --> 00:42:02,759
Speaker 2: But like it would have made more sense to me

738
00:42:02,840 --> 00:42:05,320
Speaker 2: if Molly was like, Noah, you know, got me through

739
00:42:06,200 --> 00:42:09,440
Speaker 2: this really difficult period in my life, or like something

740
00:42:09,480 --> 00:42:13,000
Speaker 2: to really explain why she will go balls to the

741
00:42:13,040 --> 00:42:15,720
Speaker 2: wall for this character that I feel like gets away

742
00:42:15,760 --> 00:42:19,680
Speaker 2: from the best friend trope a little bit because not

743
00:42:19,840 --> 00:42:23,400
Speaker 2: that like Noah, you know that your friend should not actively,

744
00:42:23,440 --> 00:42:26,400
Speaker 2: of course, try to rescue you if you've been kidnapped

745
00:42:26,440 --> 00:42:30,160
Speaker 2: by a cannibal. But but I do feel like I

746
00:42:30,160 --> 00:42:34,000
Speaker 2: would have liked to understand their connection a little more,

747
00:42:34,000 --> 00:42:36,680
Speaker 2: And I feel like it would have made the movie stronger.

748
00:42:37,040 --> 00:42:40,520
Speaker 3: Right, especially because we open on a conversation with them,

749
00:42:40,800 --> 00:42:43,480
Speaker 3: you know where Noah is getting advice from Mollie. We

750
00:42:43,640 --> 00:42:46,600
Speaker 3: close on a beat of them like embracing saying I

751
00:42:46,640 --> 00:42:49,719
Speaker 3: love you, I love you more, and it's like, well,

752
00:42:49,840 --> 00:42:53,080
Speaker 3: then contextualize that a bit more please.

753
00:42:53,440 --> 00:42:56,160
Speaker 2: And I feel the same way with Penny and Noah,

754
00:42:56,200 --> 00:43:00,640
Speaker 2: where again you get like the suggestion of a like

755
00:43:00,960 --> 00:43:04,360
Speaker 2: cool character dynamic between the two of them. I feel like,

756
00:43:04,480 --> 00:43:08,239
Speaker 2: you know, in a lesser movie, you'd have victims sort

757
00:43:08,239 --> 00:43:11,319
Speaker 2: of turn against each other or whatever it is, right,

758
00:43:12,000 --> 00:43:15,359
Speaker 2: but they are very much on each other's side. But again,

759
00:43:15,400 --> 00:43:17,560
Speaker 2: you're like there's an opportunity for them to get to

760
00:43:17,640 --> 00:43:20,839
Speaker 2: know each other, and like they kind of don't. It's

761
00:43:20,880 --> 00:43:24,640
Speaker 2: these like little jokes instead, and we don't learn very

762
00:43:24,719 --> 00:43:26,840
Speaker 2: much about Penny, And again, I think it makes the

763
00:43:26,880 --> 00:43:32,160
Speaker 2: movie stronger if we know more about her, like you know,

764
00:43:32,440 --> 00:43:35,680
Speaker 2: and finding something she and Noah have in common, like

765
00:43:35,760 --> 00:43:38,319
Speaker 2: I don't know, I just the relationships between women in

766
00:43:38,360 --> 00:43:40,959
Speaker 2: general in this movie. I feel like, you know, there's

767
00:43:41,080 --> 00:43:44,520
Speaker 2: interesting stuff there, but it kind of like there just

768
00:43:44,680 --> 00:43:50,160
Speaker 2: wasn't enough for there to be a really impactful relationship

769
00:43:50,239 --> 00:43:52,759
Speaker 2: between women. Molly and Noah are great, but it's just

770
00:43:53,239 --> 00:43:56,040
Speaker 2: for me. It was like, what have you guys done? Together,

771
00:43:56,160 --> 00:43:59,160
Speaker 2: Like okay, like what is the friendship?

772
00:43:59,280 --> 00:43:59,520
Speaker 4: Yeah?

773
00:44:00,239 --> 00:44:06,719
Speaker 3: More for sure. Yeah, I want to talk about Anne

774
00:44:06,800 --> 00:44:11,640
Speaker 3: her Wow, good arrested development reference.

775
00:44:11,960 --> 00:44:15,600
Speaker 2: Thank you. Yeah, let's talk about and Charlotte Lebon.

776
00:44:16,480 --> 00:44:21,319
Speaker 3: Yes, so you know, you can read her character as

777
00:44:21,600 --> 00:44:23,799
Speaker 3: someone who did what she had to do in order

778
00:44:23,840 --> 00:44:29,640
Speaker 3: to survive. It seems like she seduced Steve into sparing

779
00:44:29,760 --> 00:44:34,600
Speaker 3: her and that was her method of escape from almost

780
00:44:34,880 --> 00:44:39,759
Speaker 3: certain death. So I chose to read her character and

781
00:44:39,840 --> 00:44:45,400
Speaker 3: her behavior as commentary on people who are like the

782
00:44:45,480 --> 00:44:51,200
Speaker 3: victims or recipients or survivors of some form of oppression,

783
00:44:52,200 --> 00:44:56,799
Speaker 3: and then rather than siding with other oppressed people like

784
00:44:56,960 --> 00:45:00,160
Speaker 3: you think they would, because you think they'd have empathy

785
00:45:00,200 --> 00:45:05,640
Speaker 3: because they experienced the same oppression themselves, but instead they

786
00:45:05,800 --> 00:45:11,239
Speaker 3: align themselves with the oppressor and become complicit in, if

787
00:45:11,280 --> 00:45:15,680
Speaker 3: not active, participants, in the oppression of others, which is

788
00:45:15,680 --> 00:45:19,200
Speaker 3: something I think about a lot. I am conly thinking

789
00:45:19,200 --> 00:45:22,080
Speaker 3: about this. It happens a lot in society. Ever heard

790
00:45:22,120 --> 00:45:25,239
Speaker 3: of it? And I find it to be such a

791
00:45:25,520 --> 00:45:28,839
Speaker 3: troubling yet fascinating phenomenon.

792
00:45:29,200 --> 00:45:31,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it's like all the fucking time, Like

793
00:45:32,040 --> 00:45:34,479
Speaker 2: how many this is unfortunate? But yeah, Like, I feel

794
00:45:34,480 --> 00:45:36,840
Speaker 2: like a lot of people have the experience of, especially

795
00:45:37,160 --> 00:45:40,240
Speaker 2: people of marginalized genders, of like my first boss who's

796
00:45:40,239 --> 00:45:43,960
Speaker 2: not a man, and then they are also upholding the

797
00:45:44,040 --> 00:45:49,680
Speaker 2: same shit, and you're like, well, what the fuck the point? Right,

798
00:45:49,760 --> 00:45:50,840
Speaker 2: what is the point?

799
00:45:51,200 --> 00:45:56,040
Speaker 3: You know, it's the trad wife phenomenon. It's like when

800
00:45:56,160 --> 00:45:59,120
Speaker 3: black people become cops. You know, there's like a bunch

801
00:45:59,120 --> 00:46:00,799
Speaker 3: of different exams, and.

802
00:46:00,760 --> 00:46:03,480
Speaker 2: There's all of these societal reasons, Like you're saying, like,

803
00:46:03,480 --> 00:46:06,839
Speaker 2: there's societal reasons as to why this happens, but it is.

804
00:46:07,600 --> 00:46:11,680
Speaker 2: It's like sad. It's sad to see in characters like Anne,

805
00:46:11,680 --> 00:46:14,640
Speaker 2: and I appreciated that. I thought that, Yeah, that was

806
00:46:14,640 --> 00:46:17,759
Speaker 2: like one of the more effective things in the movie.

807
00:46:18,040 --> 00:46:20,799
Speaker 2: I guess I am fine with the way that that

808
00:46:21,440 --> 00:46:24,680
Speaker 2: character went. But the thing I liked the most is

809
00:46:24,719 --> 00:46:28,000
Speaker 2: that I feel like the movie it does not have

810
00:46:28,120 --> 00:46:31,880
Speaker 2: a ton of empathy for Anne, but I think it

811
00:46:31,960 --> 00:46:33,759
Speaker 2: had a little bit in a way that I think

812
00:46:33,880 --> 00:46:37,480
Speaker 2: was interesting. Where Noah, it seems like, is being presented

813
00:46:37,560 --> 00:46:41,319
Speaker 2: with the beginnings of the same kind of dynamic, right,

814
00:46:41,360 --> 00:46:45,120
Speaker 2: where like Noah, in order to escape the immediate circumstances

815
00:46:45,760 --> 00:46:50,040
Speaker 2: is having to play meat ball with this guy, right,

816
00:46:50,160 --> 00:46:55,360
Speaker 2: like he's thank you, thank you, no, but like she

817
00:46:55,360 --> 00:46:57,279
Speaker 2: she is sort of having to play ball with him

818
00:46:57,320 --> 00:47:01,080
Speaker 2: in order to liberate herself, and she is different. She

819
00:47:01,680 --> 00:47:06,040
Speaker 2: liberates the other women who are trapped there. But I

820
00:47:06,239 --> 00:47:08,799
Speaker 2: did think it was interesting that it was like, oh,

821
00:47:08,840 --> 00:47:12,680
Speaker 2: this is almost certainly what happened with Anne, but she

822
00:47:12,800 --> 00:47:16,200
Speaker 2: did not liberate the other people. And you know I

823
00:47:16,239 --> 00:47:19,520
Speaker 2: would hazard I guess out of fear and like out

824
00:47:19,560 --> 00:47:23,240
Speaker 2: of selfishness and fear, right, which is why a lot

825
00:47:23,360 --> 00:47:26,560
Speaker 2: of people of marginalized genders uphold the patriarchy because it's

826
00:47:26,600 --> 00:47:33,839
Speaker 2: personally advantageous and because they're afraid of not aligning. And

827
00:47:34,080 --> 00:47:36,600
Speaker 2: you see it everywhere. You see it in fucking politics

828
00:47:36,680 --> 00:47:39,520
Speaker 2: all the fucking time. Yes, we could keep going, right.

829
00:47:39,680 --> 00:47:41,760
Speaker 3: I think it has a lot to do with power

830
00:47:41,840 --> 00:47:44,640
Speaker 3: dynamics as well, where people will choose the side of

831
00:47:44,680 --> 00:47:47,640
Speaker 3: the oppressor because the oppressor has more power and they

832
00:47:47,640 --> 00:47:50,560
Speaker 3: think that if they align with the oppressor, they will

833
00:47:50,600 --> 00:47:53,759
Speaker 3: inherit some of that power. And that is true, and

834
00:47:53,800 --> 00:47:55,839
Speaker 3: that does happen sometimes, but it doesn't mean that they

835
00:47:55,880 --> 00:48:01,000
Speaker 3: will be immune to oppression and marginalization because cause this

836
00:48:01,080 --> 00:48:04,880
Speaker 3: oppression is very large scale in it's systemic, and it

837
00:48:04,920 --> 00:48:07,319
Speaker 3: needs to be fought against, which is what Noah does,

838
00:48:08,040 --> 00:48:11,279
Speaker 3: rather than what Anne does, which is like, you know,

839
00:48:11,520 --> 00:48:16,320
Speaker 3: uphold it after she escapes quote unquote from the oppression.

840
00:48:16,719 --> 00:48:19,960
Speaker 2: Yeah. I thought that was really effective. Yeah. And then

841
00:48:20,280 --> 00:48:23,919
Speaker 2: I mean we are quite literally bashed over the head

842
00:48:23,920 --> 00:48:27,920
Speaker 2: with that message as well when Molly kills Anne, and

843
00:48:27,960 --> 00:48:29,960
Speaker 2: I think she says like, bitches like you are.

844
00:48:29,840 --> 00:48:32,360
Speaker 3: The problem, Like, yeah, I came to you for help.

845
00:48:32,680 --> 00:48:34,719
Speaker 2: I almost like again, I feel like I'm coming dead

846
00:48:34,760 --> 00:48:36,480
Speaker 2: too hard to that. I almost like didn't need that.

847
00:48:36,560 --> 00:48:39,160
Speaker 2: I'm like, yeah, no, we get I got it, Like

848
00:48:39,640 --> 00:48:41,760
Speaker 2: I got it. Yes, and is a part of the problem.

849
00:48:42,520 --> 00:48:44,759
Speaker 2: But you know, it's a horror movie. It can't be.

850
00:48:44,920 --> 00:48:45,360
Speaker 1: It's weird.

851
00:48:45,600 --> 00:48:48,520
Speaker 2: Sure, sure, but yeah, I thought that that was pretty effective.

852
00:48:48,719 --> 00:48:51,279
Speaker 2: I did have just like a story logic question where

853
00:48:51,920 --> 00:48:55,120
Speaker 2: so like they have two kids and Sebastian stans just

854
00:48:55,239 --> 00:48:58,120
Speaker 2: bonking women over the head and meanwhile, my sons are asleep,

855
00:48:58,680 --> 00:49:01,640
Speaker 2: My two gorgeous sons are like upstairs.

856
00:49:01,280 --> 00:49:04,640
Speaker 3: And his murder cannibal house is so far away, like

857
00:49:04,719 --> 00:49:07,399
Speaker 3: how does he have the time to drive the air

858
00:49:07,480 --> 00:49:10,280
Speaker 3: and back to his other house where his family lives.

859
00:49:10,760 --> 00:49:15,600
Speaker 2: You know, yeah, you know. I yeah, cheating men, you

860
00:49:15,640 --> 00:49:18,040
Speaker 2: know men, men with the secret life. They make it work,

861
00:49:18,120 --> 00:49:23,880
Speaker 2: they make it work. Yeah, yeah, there are our strongest soldiers.

862
00:49:24,600 --> 00:49:24,880
Speaker 4: Yeah.

863
00:49:24,960 --> 00:49:27,759
Speaker 2: I thought the an stuff was effective, and I feel

864
00:49:27,760 --> 00:49:31,719
Speaker 2: like that character's like presence was pretty well balanced. What

865
00:49:31,840 --> 00:49:33,719
Speaker 2: I was interested in? What did you think of like

866
00:49:33,760 --> 00:49:36,640
Speaker 2: when she saw I don't know, I guess okay, I

867
00:49:36,680 --> 00:49:41,160
Speaker 2: do have questions about her ending right, because for a second,

868
00:49:41,239 --> 00:49:43,640
Speaker 2: I was like, are we supposed to believe that this

869
00:49:43,840 --> 00:49:47,120
Speaker 2: is like Anne's idea. No, it's Steve's idea, which makes

870
00:49:47,160 --> 00:49:51,640
Speaker 2: more sense. Great, but you know, she sees his body

871
00:49:52,120 --> 00:49:53,640
Speaker 2: and I feel like you sort of get a sense

872
00:49:53,640 --> 00:49:56,759
Speaker 2: of like a little bit of relief from her. She's like,

873
00:49:56,800 --> 00:49:58,439
Speaker 2: all right, put it on ice. We're going to sell

874
00:49:58,480 --> 00:50:02,080
Speaker 2: his meat. Yes, like is the suggestion there, But then

875
00:50:02,120 --> 00:50:07,200
Speaker 2: she like pretends to be grateful for Noah but then

876
00:50:07,320 --> 00:50:09,120
Speaker 2: tries to kill her. I guess I was just like

877
00:50:09,200 --> 00:50:12,280
Speaker 2: a little bit coulde. I guess that's just the power

878
00:50:12,360 --> 00:50:15,960
Speaker 2: dynamic right where she's like, now I'm going to have.

879
00:50:15,920 --> 00:50:18,680
Speaker 3: The meat business business.

880
00:50:18,719 --> 00:50:20,759
Speaker 2: Like I guess I was a little confused about what

881
00:50:20,880 --> 00:50:24,120
Speaker 2: her end game was because theoretically, like she is now

882
00:50:24,200 --> 00:50:26,880
Speaker 2: liberated too, Yes, but I don't know.

883
00:50:27,320 --> 00:50:29,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, I guess that she's just like so deep in the.

884
00:50:30,800 --> 00:50:34,520
Speaker 2: Meat, so deep in the meat. Of course, it's like

885
00:50:34,600 --> 00:50:36,719
Speaker 2: she I don't know, I guess I don't know how

886
00:50:36,719 --> 00:50:38,720
Speaker 2: that would play out for her in the courts.

887
00:50:39,080 --> 00:50:39,840
Speaker 3: Uh huh.

888
00:50:39,880 --> 00:50:42,680
Speaker 2: But yeah, I'm like, and you really want to keep

889
00:50:42,760 --> 00:50:45,080
Speaker 2: running this business? Like it seems like it's kind of

890
00:50:45,120 --> 00:50:49,680
Speaker 2: on thin nice as it is. Yeah, In any case,

891
00:50:49,719 --> 00:50:51,799
Speaker 2: I just wanted to mention that because I wasn't totally

892
00:50:52,920 --> 00:50:55,360
Speaker 2: because the movie does just end very quickly for me,

893
00:50:55,480 --> 00:50:58,640
Speaker 2: where I would have been interested in maybe one more

894
00:50:58,680 --> 00:51:02,360
Speaker 2: beat with Anne to understand where she's coming from a

895
00:51:02,360 --> 00:51:05,600
Speaker 2: little better. Like obviously her character is indefensible, but like

896
00:51:06,000 --> 00:51:09,080
Speaker 2: in order to just like explore the idea that we

897
00:51:09,080 --> 00:51:11,759
Speaker 2: were just talking about a little more and siding with

898
00:51:11,840 --> 00:51:14,040
Speaker 2: the oppressor and what leads to there, I feel like

899
00:51:14,520 --> 00:51:18,799
Speaker 2: it maybe would have benefited from a little more investigation

900
00:51:18,840 --> 00:51:21,760
Speaker 2: of that, especially because like Noah and Anne, it seems

901
00:51:21,800 --> 00:51:27,000
Speaker 2: like we're treated pretty similarly towards the beginning by Steve,

902
00:51:27,840 --> 00:51:30,520
Speaker 2: and I almost feel like, well, then don't you want

903
00:51:30,560 --> 00:51:33,160
Speaker 2: to see those characters like interact a little bit. I

904
00:51:33,160 --> 00:51:34,720
Speaker 2: don't know, I think it could have been interesting.

905
00:51:35,160 --> 00:51:41,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, And what about Anne made her gravitate toward being

906
00:51:41,719 --> 00:51:45,440
Speaker 3: complicit and being part of the problem exactly, Like what

907
00:51:45,480 --> 00:51:49,000
Speaker 3: were her circumstances that led her to that versus like

908
00:51:49,040 --> 00:51:51,120
Speaker 3: how did she differ from Noah?

909
00:51:51,440 --> 00:51:54,440
Speaker 2: Right? I mean, because she is obviously she is a villain,

910
00:51:54,480 --> 00:51:57,239
Speaker 2: but she is a more complicated villain than Steve. And

911
00:51:57,280 --> 00:52:01,319
Speaker 2: I feel like it would have been interesting and just

912
00:52:01,480 --> 00:52:06,080
Speaker 2: again like another chance to like have more character moments

913
00:52:06,120 --> 00:52:08,120
Speaker 2: between the women in this movie that just kind of

914
00:52:08,200 --> 00:52:10,120
Speaker 2: like doesn't happen.

915
00:52:10,680 --> 00:52:14,440
Speaker 3: Yeah. Also worth noting that Anne is a character with

916
00:52:14,560 --> 00:52:17,040
Speaker 3: a prosthetic limb, which is not the case for the

917
00:52:17,080 --> 00:52:20,720
Speaker 3: actor Charlotte Lebon, so it's another example of an able

918
00:52:20,719 --> 00:52:25,839
Speaker 3: bodied actor playing a disabled character. I want to also

919
00:52:25,880 --> 00:52:29,680
Speaker 3: briefly touch on the man who is with Anne at

920
00:52:29,680 --> 00:52:32,840
Speaker 3: the end, who she tells like put his body on ice.

921
00:52:33,400 --> 00:52:36,319
Speaker 3: This is someone who we've seen briefly before. Seems to

922
00:52:36,360 --> 00:52:41,160
Speaker 3: be like an assistant who like helps deliver the packaged meat.

923
00:52:42,239 --> 00:52:46,640
Speaker 3: He appears to be like a First Nation's indigenous person,

924
00:52:47,160 --> 00:52:49,719
Speaker 3: but we don't know anything about this person. He has,

925
00:52:49,800 --> 00:52:54,360
Speaker 3: Like I think no dialogue. We don't know why he

926
00:52:54,480 --> 00:52:58,760
Speaker 3: would be working for this white couple doing their evil bidding.

927
00:53:00,000 --> 00:53:02,680
Speaker 3: He clearly knows what they're doing. He's standing right there

928
00:53:02,840 --> 00:53:06,480
Speaker 3: when like the dead body of Steve is there, like

929
00:53:06,560 --> 00:53:09,120
Speaker 3: he's packaging the you know, he's he knows what the

930
00:53:09,120 --> 00:53:09,960
Speaker 3: operation is.

931
00:53:10,360 --> 00:53:10,760
Speaker 2: Yeah.

932
00:53:10,800 --> 00:53:13,799
Speaker 3: So it's just like why this care? Like this is

933
00:53:13,840 --> 00:53:19,400
Speaker 3: not the inclusion or representation we need of indigenous characters.

934
00:53:20,360 --> 00:53:21,880
Speaker 3: Why was this choice made?

935
00:53:22,520 --> 00:53:26,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, a character that could be so easily removed again, Yeah,

936
00:53:26,640 --> 00:53:29,640
Speaker 2: just another like it just feels a little bit like

937
00:53:29,680 --> 00:53:30,759
Speaker 2: what are we trying to do here?

938
00:53:31,080 --> 00:53:36,080
Speaker 3: Right, Because like a lot of casting in contemporary movies

939
00:53:36,120 --> 00:53:41,440
Speaker 3: within the past few years, it is more inclusive, but

940
00:53:41,520 --> 00:53:43,680
Speaker 3: a lot of these movies are still made by white people,

941
00:53:43,920 --> 00:53:46,640
Speaker 3: and they're just like, oh, I have to fill a quota, right,

942
00:53:46,680 --> 00:53:48,400
Speaker 3: you know, I want to be inclusive in my casting,

943
00:53:48,719 --> 00:53:50,680
Speaker 3: But they're not giving a lot of thought about like

944
00:53:51,040 --> 00:53:54,680
Speaker 3: who is in what role, who is occupying what he

945
00:53:54,840 --> 00:53:59,239
Speaker 3: has the narrative power like yeah, and what implications a

946
00:53:59,280 --> 00:54:02,520
Speaker 3: certain person and cast in a certain role has and

947
00:54:02,560 --> 00:54:07,000
Speaker 3: whether that tracks logically at all. So that felt to

948
00:54:07,040 --> 00:54:10,480
Speaker 3: me like an example of like, oh, let's see an

949
00:54:10,560 --> 00:54:12,359
Speaker 3: indigenous person on screen.

950
00:54:12,400 --> 00:54:14,680
Speaker 2: But in a role that could be taken out of

951
00:54:14,719 --> 00:54:18,160
Speaker 2: the movie without any issue. Like, yeah, I agree with

952
00:54:18,200 --> 00:54:22,080
Speaker 2: you there, And yeah, it's frustrating because I don't know

953
00:54:22,120 --> 00:54:25,760
Speaker 2: who casts this movie. It is a fairly diverse cast,

954
00:54:25,840 --> 00:54:31,359
Speaker 2: but it cuts along very, very trophy lines. And this

955
00:54:31,400 --> 00:54:33,400
Speaker 2: movie came out two years ago, Like there's really no

956
00:54:33,520 --> 00:54:38,319
Speaker 2: reason for that to have happened, and it ultimately kind

957
00:54:38,320 --> 00:54:42,080
Speaker 2: of undercuts what this movie is trying to do by like,

958
00:54:42,280 --> 00:54:45,160
Speaker 2: you know, subverting the gaze of a cannibal movie, which

959
00:54:45,200 --> 00:54:48,239
Speaker 2: is a cool idea and like it works for me

960
00:54:48,360 --> 00:54:50,960
Speaker 2: for the most part, but it's like that level of

961
00:54:51,120 --> 00:54:54,160
Speaker 2: care again, it's just kind of I mean, like a

962
00:54:54,200 --> 00:54:58,920
Speaker 2: white feminis the thing to do is for one message

963
00:54:58,920 --> 00:55:01,439
Speaker 2: to come through really clearly. But the you know, intersectional

964
00:55:01,480 --> 00:55:04,640
Speaker 2: thinking I don't think was there at least in the casting.

965
00:55:04,800 --> 00:55:08,360
Speaker 2: I mean, and yeah, in the casting, it definitely wasn't

966
00:55:08,760 --> 00:55:10,880
Speaker 2: for sure. Yeah, should we talk about Steve.

967
00:55:11,400 --> 00:55:12,800
Speaker 3: Let's talk about Steve.

968
00:55:13,400 --> 00:55:17,120
Speaker 2: I have to say I thought the like rom com

969
00:55:17,239 --> 00:55:21,239
Speaker 2: portion of this movie was very effective for me in

970
00:55:21,320 --> 00:55:24,239
Speaker 2: terms of just like, I mean, rom COM's the wrong

971
00:55:24,360 --> 00:55:27,400
Speaker 2: thing to call it, but just I think my favorite

972
00:55:27,400 --> 00:55:31,000
Speaker 2: parts of the movie The Cannibal stuff great, sure, and

973
00:55:31,040 --> 00:55:34,040
Speaker 2: I like it, but there was this like weird satisfaction

974
00:55:34,120 --> 00:55:40,319
Speaker 2: of watching someone who is smart blow past all of

975
00:55:40,360 --> 00:55:45,520
Speaker 2: these red flags. It just made me feel better about myself.

976
00:55:45,719 --> 00:55:48,239
Speaker 2: You know, were so many times. You know, it's like,

977
00:55:48,239 --> 00:55:50,319
Speaker 2: if you end up in a bad situation, you end

978
00:55:50,400 --> 00:55:53,520
Speaker 2: up in a bad relationship, you're made out to be

979
00:55:53,719 --> 00:55:55,920
Speaker 2: like God, I'm I mean and she says that to herself,

980
00:55:55,920 --> 00:55:59,000
Speaker 2: like I'm so stupid, Like how could I have let

981
00:55:59,120 --> 00:56:02,080
Speaker 2: this happen? And I feel like the movie does do

982
00:56:02,160 --> 00:56:04,279
Speaker 2: a really good job of illustrating the fact. I mean

983
00:56:04,360 --> 00:56:07,920
Speaker 2: sometimes it's just Penny saying that through the wall, but

984
00:56:08,200 --> 00:56:12,799
Speaker 2: like that, no, like there was not some crucial thing

985
00:56:12,880 --> 00:56:17,360
Speaker 2: that you did wrong that means that you're now getting cannibaled.

986
00:56:17,680 --> 00:56:19,880
Speaker 2: But I thought that the writing with like the subtle

987
00:56:19,960 --> 00:56:24,680
Speaker 2: red flags, that whole section, that whole beginning section, really

988
00:56:24,880 --> 00:56:25,600
Speaker 2: worked for.

989
00:56:25,480 --> 00:56:30,920
Speaker 3: Me, especially because the red flags are subtle enough that

990
00:56:31,040 --> 00:56:35,400
Speaker 3: even if you are smart and intuitive and perceptive, you

991
00:56:35,640 --> 00:56:41,239
Speaker 3: might not recognize them, especially because in just like the

992
00:56:41,360 --> 00:56:45,839
Speaker 3: landscape of modern dating and so many men and I'm

993
00:56:45,880 --> 00:56:50,400
Speaker 3: now speaking from personal experience here, but like cis men

994
00:56:50,480 --> 00:56:57,040
Speaker 3: tend to not consider the fact that people of marginalized

995
00:56:57,080 --> 00:57:02,200
Speaker 3: genders move through the world very differently, and that there's

996
00:57:02,200 --> 00:57:05,279
Speaker 3: a level of like caution and self preservation that we

997
00:57:05,360 --> 00:57:07,920
Speaker 3: have to be far more concerned about than sis men.

998
00:57:08,160 --> 00:57:11,520
Speaker 3: And I try to communicate that a lot with like

999
00:57:11,600 --> 00:57:15,200
Speaker 3: people I've matched with on a dating app and we're

1000
00:57:15,920 --> 00:57:18,960
Speaker 3: scheduling a first date, and I am and not that

1001
00:57:19,000 --> 00:57:22,480
Speaker 3: I've always done this, but boy have I learned my lessons.

1002
00:57:22,520 --> 00:57:26,280
Speaker 3: But like, generally speaking, I will insist that we meet

1003
00:57:26,280 --> 00:57:29,040
Speaker 3: in a public space and in a neighborhood that is

1004
00:57:29,080 --> 00:57:32,240
Speaker 3: familiar to me, because I need an exit strategy if

1005
00:57:32,240 --> 00:57:34,480
Speaker 3: I need to get away, I want to be able

1006
00:57:34,520 --> 00:57:36,640
Speaker 3: to do it safely, and I want to like have

1007
00:57:36,720 --> 00:57:40,120
Speaker 3: it be in a place where I can navigate easily.

1008
00:57:40,880 --> 00:57:43,880
Speaker 3: But a lot of people who I'm like organizing a

1009
00:57:43,960 --> 00:57:48,120
Speaker 3: date with, and unfortunately I'm tragically heterosexual, so it's men

1010
00:57:48,920 --> 00:57:52,919
Speaker 3: who I'm dating, They'll be like, oh, well, just come over,

1011
00:57:53,160 --> 00:57:56,400
Speaker 3: you know, and I'm like, no, I haven't met you.

1012
00:57:56,480 --> 00:57:58,520
Speaker 3: I don't know you. I don't know if I can

1013
00:57:58,560 --> 00:58:00,640
Speaker 3: trust you, and they're like, oh, of course you can,

1014
00:58:00,800 --> 00:58:03,720
Speaker 3: blah blah blah, and I'm like, do you not understand

1015
00:58:03,760 --> 00:58:07,160
Speaker 3: that trust is something that people earn. You can't just

1016
00:58:07,800 --> 00:58:11,840
Speaker 3: declare that you're trustworthy and have me automatically trust you.

1017
00:58:12,080 --> 00:58:14,680
Speaker 3: But so many CIS men don't seem to understand that.

1018
00:58:15,200 --> 00:58:18,120
Speaker 3: And again I'll tell them, we have to meet in public.

1019
00:58:18,200 --> 00:58:21,200
Speaker 3: I want to hang out in public for a long

1020
00:58:21,280 --> 00:58:24,800
Speaker 3: time before I would ever consider like going to your

1021
00:58:24,840 --> 00:58:27,000
Speaker 3: place or bringing you back to my place, like, I

1022
00:58:27,120 --> 00:58:31,640
Speaker 3: have to know that I can feel safe, and like

1023
00:58:32,160 --> 00:58:34,160
Speaker 3: the number of men who just like do not even

1024
00:58:34,240 --> 00:58:37,480
Speaker 3: consider that or care about that is astonishing.

1025
00:58:37,960 --> 00:58:39,840
Speaker 2: It's interesting because I know that you and I approach

1026
00:58:39,920 --> 00:58:42,760
Speaker 2: like I think you approach dating much smarter than I

1027
00:58:42,800 --> 00:58:46,960
Speaker 2: have historically. But I mean, even who knows I really,

1028
00:58:47,040 --> 00:58:50,080
Speaker 2: I mean, you know, check the logs. But I do

1029
00:58:50,360 --> 00:58:54,400
Speaker 2: like I agree with you, and especially any time I

1030
00:58:54,400 --> 00:58:57,280
Speaker 2: feel like when I've done that dating, I've never even

1031
00:58:57,320 --> 00:59:00,560
Speaker 2: really said that that's what I'm doing because I am

1032
00:59:00,640 --> 00:59:05,200
Speaker 2: afraid it will be interpreted as you know, I'm afraid

1033
00:59:05,240 --> 00:59:09,360
Speaker 2: of the dynamic that introduces, even though it's like, of course,

1034
00:59:09,600 --> 00:59:12,360
Speaker 2: of course you're thinking that. And I feel like a

1035
00:59:12,440 --> 00:59:16,520
Speaker 2: lot of men cannot handle the idea that they are

1036
00:59:16,560 --> 00:59:19,840
Speaker 2: not inherently trusted and that like the world doesn't fucking

1037
00:59:19,880 --> 00:59:22,200
Speaker 2: revolve around them for sure. And I mean, I think

1038
00:59:22,240 --> 00:59:24,480
Speaker 2: that what you're doing makes so much sense because it's

1039
00:59:24,560 --> 00:59:28,040
Speaker 2: like you're just normalizing, Like there's no reason for me

1040
00:59:28,120 --> 00:59:29,960
Speaker 2: to trust you. You are a stranger.

1041
00:59:30,360 --> 00:59:31,919
Speaker 3: Yeah, and like I.

1042
00:59:31,840 --> 00:59:35,200
Speaker 2: Have to move through the world differently, and I wish

1043
00:59:35,280 --> 00:59:39,080
Speaker 2: that there was a more like a clearer understanding to that.

1044
00:59:40,080 --> 00:59:43,080
Speaker 2: But I've definitely been I won't even say guilty of,

1045
00:59:43,160 --> 00:59:45,680
Speaker 2: but my instinct in the past has been too planned

1046
00:59:45,680 --> 00:59:48,480
Speaker 2: for that. But never say that that's what I'm doing,

1047
00:59:49,160 --> 00:59:52,120
Speaker 2: because I'm afraid of how men react when their pride

1048
00:59:52,200 --> 00:59:55,440
Speaker 2: is injured, which should be scary yet and my experience

1049
00:59:55,520 --> 00:59:58,800
Speaker 2: is often violent, Yeah, yeah, or cruel or whatever. I mean,

1050
00:59:58,840 --> 01:00:01,360
Speaker 2: I think you get that quick with the guy from

1051
01:00:01,440 --> 01:00:02,640
Speaker 2: Jane the Virgin at.

1052
01:00:02,480 --> 01:00:06,120
Speaker 3: The beginning of the movie, Oh is that who that is? Yeah,

1053
01:00:06,200 --> 01:00:07,600
Speaker 3: I didn't watch much of that show.

1054
01:00:07,880 --> 01:00:11,680
Speaker 2: I've for some reason was so into it then, but yeah,

1055
01:00:11,720 --> 01:00:14,880
Speaker 2: that like he is the sort of you know, archetypical

1056
01:00:14,960 --> 01:00:19,400
Speaker 2: bad date and that this is like what Noah is

1057
01:00:20,040 --> 01:00:22,520
Speaker 2: used to. And I think that that ends up being

1058
01:00:22,720 --> 01:00:25,640
Speaker 2: very effective because as I was like watching the movie,

1059
01:00:25,640 --> 01:00:29,400
Speaker 2: I'm like, I would have fallen for this, I would have.

1060
01:00:29,760 --> 01:00:32,280
Speaker 2: And I think that it's very like you're saying that

1061
01:00:32,320 --> 01:00:35,680
Speaker 2: the red flags are very present and noted by her friend,

1062
01:00:36,080 --> 01:00:38,640
Speaker 2: but is subtle enough that she's like, it's probably not

1063
01:00:38,680 --> 01:00:42,000
Speaker 2: a big deal. Let's see what happened, right, and like

1064
01:00:42,200 --> 01:00:47,040
Speaker 2: that sort of looped thinking of like, well, if I

1065
01:00:47,080 --> 01:00:49,040
Speaker 2: am worried about this, then how am I ever going

1066
01:00:49,080 --> 01:00:51,040
Speaker 2: to have a relationship blah blah blah blah blah blah,

1067
01:00:51,080 --> 01:00:54,080
Speaker 2: and like feeling that sort of loop. I don't know.

1068
01:00:54,320 --> 01:00:57,440
Speaker 2: And then when she gets to the house, I've just

1069
01:00:57,560 --> 01:01:01,680
Speaker 2: like soft triggered by yeah, just going into someone's house

1070
01:01:01,680 --> 01:01:04,040
Speaker 2: and realizing you're like, oh, I don't know where I am,

1071
01:01:04,680 --> 01:01:06,320
Speaker 2: or like if I do know where I am, I'm

1072
01:01:06,360 --> 01:01:09,880
Speaker 2: not able to communicate easily enough. And now the power

1073
01:01:10,000 --> 01:01:13,320
Speaker 2: dynamic is such that I have to basically admit I

1074
01:01:13,320 --> 01:01:15,960
Speaker 2: don't feel totally safe right now. Could you give me

1075
01:01:16,000 --> 01:01:18,880
Speaker 2: the tools to feel safer and sort of being at

1076
01:01:18,920 --> 01:01:24,000
Speaker 2: someone else's mercy but having to maintain a like sexy

1077
01:01:24,880 --> 01:01:28,800
Speaker 2: like vibe while being like okay, like it's Jay.

1078
01:01:28,640 --> 01:01:32,240
Speaker 3: What's your Wi Fi best word? Yeah?

1079
01:01:32,280 --> 01:01:34,760
Speaker 2: I mean, but like I went on a weekend trip

1080
01:01:34,840 --> 01:01:38,080
Speaker 2: with someone who I had just recently started dating, you know,

1081
01:01:38,080 --> 01:01:40,440
Speaker 2: a couple of years ago, and there is like that

1082
01:01:40,520 --> 01:01:43,320
Speaker 2: moment where you're like, well, we don't know each other

1083
01:01:43,400 --> 01:01:45,680
Speaker 2: that well, and you know, and then the more time

1084
01:01:45,680 --> 01:01:47,800
Speaker 2: we're spending together, I'm like, and I don't know if

1085
01:01:47,920 --> 01:01:50,440
Speaker 2: I like you very much, and You're like, well, how

1086
01:01:50,480 --> 01:01:52,160
Speaker 2: the fuck would I get out of here? I mean,

1087
01:01:52,400 --> 01:01:54,919
Speaker 2: it is just, yeah, I don't know dating men. It

1088
01:01:55,000 --> 01:01:58,280
Speaker 2: is just like means that you frequently find yourself in

1089
01:01:58,320 --> 01:02:02,800
Speaker 2: what feels like hostage situation, and that is a lot

1090
01:02:02,840 --> 01:02:05,240
Speaker 2: of why this movie works works.

1091
01:02:05,520 --> 01:02:07,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, oh okay, wait, I have so many thoughts. One

1092
01:02:08,200 --> 01:02:13,240
Speaker 3: is that I think the fact that they meet under

1093
01:02:13,280 --> 01:02:17,920
Speaker 3: the circumstances of meeting in real life quote unquote versus

1094
01:02:17,920 --> 01:02:21,400
Speaker 3: meeting over a dating app might inform some of her

1095
01:02:22,120 --> 01:02:25,760
Speaker 3: feeling more at ease, even though they are perfect strangers

1096
01:02:25,760 --> 01:02:28,280
Speaker 3: and they don't know each other. But because I mean

1097
01:02:28,320 --> 01:02:31,240
Speaker 3: to bring them back to our personal lives, you and

1098
01:02:31,320 --> 01:02:33,320
Speaker 3: I approach dating differently in the sense that I feel

1099
01:02:33,320 --> 01:02:35,400
Speaker 3: like you tend to date people who you have met

1100
01:02:35,680 --> 01:02:38,840
Speaker 3: in real life, either you know, in some kind of

1101
01:02:38,840 --> 01:02:43,120
Speaker 3: comedy circumstances or you know, different settings where I've never

1102
01:02:43,200 --> 01:02:46,440
Speaker 3: done apps yet, and I've pretty much only done dating

1103
01:02:46,480 --> 01:02:48,960
Speaker 3: apps and that's how I've met like ninety five percent

1104
01:02:48,960 --> 01:02:52,320
Speaker 3: of the people I've like briefly dated. So there is

1105
01:02:52,400 --> 01:02:55,240
Speaker 3: this level of like, oh my god, I'm meeting up

1106
01:02:55,240 --> 01:02:58,320
Speaker 3: with a stranger who I've only corresponded with over text

1107
01:02:58,480 --> 01:03:02,160
Speaker 3: or maybe FaceTime, but like they're so straight. So that

1108
01:03:02,440 --> 01:03:03,840
Speaker 3: does mean that I feel like I have to be

1109
01:03:03,960 --> 01:03:08,200
Speaker 3: extra cautious and extra clear about my intentions because I

1110
01:03:08,280 --> 01:03:13,600
Speaker 3: totally get like being wary of setting boundaries because of

1111
01:03:13,640 --> 01:03:18,080
Speaker 3: how so many men respond to setting boundaries and feeling

1112
01:03:18,600 --> 01:03:22,800
Speaker 3: like their ego is bruised because they're not automatically trustworthy.

1113
01:03:22,920 --> 01:03:26,000
Speaker 3: But like you said, I am trying to like normalize

1114
01:03:26,000 --> 01:03:32,200
Speaker 3: the idea of like men understanding that they are just

1115
01:03:32,320 --> 01:03:37,240
Speaker 3: inherently safer moving through the world than people of marginalized genders.

1116
01:03:36,920 --> 01:03:39,200
Speaker 2: Which is like it feels so weird at this late

1117
01:03:39,320 --> 01:03:42,880
Speaker 2: stage that like you have to be like, have you

1118
01:03:42,920 --> 01:03:43,800
Speaker 2: ever thought about this?

1119
01:03:43,960 --> 01:03:46,560
Speaker 3: You're like, and so okay, there's a spectrum of what

1120
01:03:46,600 --> 01:03:49,800
Speaker 3: will happen if, first of all, a man just like

1121
01:03:49,840 --> 01:03:53,360
Speaker 3: ass this man saying come over. We've never met in

1122
01:03:53,400 --> 01:03:56,480
Speaker 3: real life before, but let's have our first date on

1123
01:03:56,520 --> 01:03:59,400
Speaker 3: my couch. That is a red flag just in and

1124
01:03:59,440 --> 01:04:02,720
Speaker 3: of itself, and I usually will just not talk to

1125
01:04:02,720 --> 01:04:04,800
Speaker 3: the people after that. But if we've already had some

1126
01:04:04,920 --> 01:04:08,280
Speaker 3: kind of like rapport that feels fun and we were

1127
01:04:08,360 --> 01:04:10,760
Speaker 3: flirting and we like it seemed like a good conversation

1128
01:04:10,840 --> 01:04:14,600
Speaker 3: stuff like that, I will be like, no, actually, I

1129
01:04:14,680 --> 01:04:17,960
Speaker 3: need to meet you in public, and then I'll explain why.

1130
01:04:18,000 --> 01:04:20,200
Speaker 3: I'll be like, I need to make sure we vibe

1131
01:04:20,440 --> 01:04:23,080
Speaker 3: number one, because like, if we're just sitting on your

1132
01:04:23,120 --> 01:04:26,000
Speaker 3: couch and I don't feel any romantic feelings.

1133
01:04:25,840 --> 01:04:27,680
Speaker 2: At best, that's awkward.

1134
01:04:27,680 --> 01:04:29,640
Speaker 3: And it's like, don't you want to know if you

1135
01:04:29,840 --> 01:04:32,080
Speaker 3: vibe with me? Like what if you're not into me?

1136
01:04:32,280 --> 01:04:34,480
Speaker 3: Like this is a two way street first of all.

1137
01:04:35,160 --> 01:04:37,000
Speaker 3: And I was like, and that's just not safe for me,

1138
01:04:37,280 --> 01:04:39,800
Speaker 3: Like I don't feel safe or comfortable doing that. We

1139
01:04:39,880 --> 01:04:42,280
Speaker 3: have to meet in a neutral public place that is

1140
01:04:42,320 --> 01:04:45,120
Speaker 3: familiar to me. If they say, Okay, totally get it,

1141
01:04:45,200 --> 01:04:47,400
Speaker 3: no worries, We'll go out for a drink or whatever,

1142
01:04:47,440 --> 01:04:51,240
Speaker 3: blah blah blah, fine, I'll proceed. Anyone who pushes back,

1143
01:04:51,280 --> 01:04:53,240
Speaker 3: and I have had men push back on that to

1144
01:04:53,320 --> 01:04:56,760
Speaker 3: be like, oh, then they act like I'm being difficult, like.

1145
01:04:56,720 --> 01:04:57,920
Speaker 2: You've saved yourself.

1146
01:04:58,040 --> 01:05:00,760
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, like you know everything need to know, which

1147
01:05:00,760 --> 01:05:05,440
Speaker 3: is that that person is scary and doesn't understand boundaries

1148
01:05:05,560 --> 01:05:09,520
Speaker 3: and just like doesn't care about people being concerned for

1149
01:05:09,560 --> 01:05:13,200
Speaker 3: their own safety and all those things. So right, there's that,

1150
01:05:13,440 --> 01:05:17,360
Speaker 3: But I'm wondering, like back to her meeting him in

1151
01:05:17,480 --> 01:05:20,520
Speaker 3: this public place and she's.

1152
01:05:20,320 --> 01:05:23,400
Speaker 2: Done quote unquote everything right, and I feel like this

1153
01:05:23,440 --> 01:05:27,320
Speaker 2: movie makes it clear that even if you do everything right,

1154
01:05:28,520 --> 01:05:31,520
Speaker 2: that doesn't mean you're safe, which is a skin which

1155
01:05:31,560 --> 01:05:35,080
Speaker 2: is a very you know, negative message it is, but

1156
01:05:35,160 --> 01:05:37,280
Speaker 2: it's true. I mean, I guess, like coming from the

1157
01:05:37,280 --> 01:05:41,360
Speaker 2: opposite place, and I mean I'm just like absolutely petrified

1158
01:05:41,560 --> 01:05:45,760
Speaker 2: of apps and and just strangers in general. I think

1159
01:05:45,760 --> 01:05:48,960
Speaker 2: that's just like, hmm, my social anxiety is such that

1160
01:05:49,080 --> 01:05:50,800
Speaker 2: it's always been a non starter for me as I've

1161
01:05:50,840 --> 01:05:53,520
Speaker 2: dated people that I met meet in person, and you know,

1162
01:05:53,720 --> 01:05:58,560
Speaker 2: as this movie demonstrates, not better, not better, true different

1163
01:05:58,680 --> 01:06:01,880
Speaker 2: kind of bad. But I I'm glad that there is

1164
01:06:02,040 --> 01:06:05,480
Speaker 2: And I guess I wonder because I haven't really experienced it,

1165
01:06:05,520 --> 01:06:08,400
Speaker 2: but that like when it's someone you haven't met in

1166
01:06:08,440 --> 01:06:10,800
Speaker 2: person before, it almost feels like maybe a little bit

1167
01:06:10,840 --> 01:06:13,120
Speaker 2: easier to set that boundary because you're like it just

1168
01:06:13,200 --> 01:06:18,200
Speaker 2: makes sense, whereas like if it's someone i've met before again,

1169
01:06:18,320 --> 01:06:21,000
Speaker 2: I mean it's like I have a secret plan where

1170
01:06:21,040 --> 01:06:24,640
Speaker 2: it's like my my boyfriend right now, who you know,

1171
01:06:24,920 --> 01:06:27,200
Speaker 2: so far, so good. I don't think he's gonna steal

1172
01:06:27,280 --> 01:06:32,120
Speaker 2: my ass. No, I love the guy. Uh, but but

1173
01:06:32,320 --> 01:06:34,720
Speaker 2: like for our first date, I was like, let's go

1174
01:06:34,840 --> 01:06:38,080
Speaker 2: on a walk while it's light out.

1175
01:06:38,240 --> 01:06:41,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, even though I knew that we got along and

1176
01:06:41,080 --> 01:06:43,160
Speaker 3: that we vibed, and because you already knew him a

1177
01:06:43,160 --> 01:06:45,080
Speaker 3: little bit too, right, right, I.

1178
01:06:45,000 --> 01:06:47,080
Speaker 2: Mean that's I think that that's like my level of

1179
01:06:47,160 --> 01:06:49,880
Speaker 2: paranoia with men that I was like, I will only

1180
01:06:50,000 --> 01:06:52,640
Speaker 2: really hang out with men that I am already pretty

1181
01:06:52,640 --> 01:06:55,880
Speaker 2: sure I'm not actively afraid of. Yeah, Like I just

1182
01:06:55,960 --> 01:06:59,040
Speaker 2: don't trust other people's vouching. I just like I just

1183
01:06:59,080 --> 01:07:02,560
Speaker 2: can't do it. And and that's probably just like PTSD

1184
01:07:02,680 --> 01:07:06,120
Speaker 2: stuff from the past, but like, but yeah, so I

1185
01:07:06,200 --> 01:07:08,240
Speaker 2: just was like, even with a man that I have

1186
01:07:08,880 --> 01:07:12,600
Speaker 2: known in passing for like a year, still, it's like

1187
01:07:12,760 --> 01:07:14,600
Speaker 2: we have to meet up when it's light I need

1188
01:07:14,600 --> 01:07:18,840
Speaker 2: to like understand what your general vibe is right so

1189
01:07:18,920 --> 01:07:22,600
Speaker 2: that I can get out yeah, because it's like, but

1190
01:07:22,680 --> 01:07:25,440
Speaker 2: like even then, you're it's just so fucked up. I

1191
01:07:25,440 --> 01:07:27,600
Speaker 2: don't know. That's why I and I like that there's

1192
01:07:27,640 --> 01:07:31,680
Speaker 2: like almost this expanded metaphor of of course he's done

1193
01:07:31,680 --> 01:07:36,120
Speaker 2: this before. Of course I'm not special, and that I

1194
01:07:36,160 --> 01:07:39,600
Speaker 2: feel like was very resonant for me too. Is like

1195
01:07:39,960 --> 01:07:43,000
Speaker 2: it is very tempting to be like, there's something different

1196
01:07:43,080 --> 01:07:46,920
Speaker 2: about me, and it's like you know, occasionally, but it

1197
01:07:46,960 --> 01:07:49,280
Speaker 2: doesn't matter, because the way a lot of CIS men

1198
01:07:49,320 --> 01:07:54,240
Speaker 2: will treat you is the exact same way they've loved,

1199
01:07:54,240 --> 01:07:56,600
Speaker 2: bombed and taken in a lot of other people who

1200
01:07:56,720 --> 01:08:01,640
Speaker 2: sometimes look strikingly similar to you. It's very spooky, it's scary.

1201
01:08:01,960 --> 01:08:04,440
Speaker 2: I was thinking about this experience I had that you

1202
01:08:04,560 --> 01:08:08,040
Speaker 2: know about, but like I knew the guy who was

1203
01:08:08,120 --> 01:08:11,280
Speaker 2: dating had dated another woman who I had met before,

1204
01:08:12,120 --> 01:08:18,000
Speaker 2: and we look not dissimilar, and when things ended in

1205
01:08:18,000 --> 01:08:20,639
Speaker 2: this very like horrible way, I reached out to her

1206
01:08:20,680 --> 01:08:23,320
Speaker 2: and we had a sort of like moment of like

1207
01:08:23,720 --> 01:08:28,320
Speaker 2: the play by play was exactly the fucking same. But

1208
01:08:28,479 --> 01:08:31,320
Speaker 2: it's just it is so many like little echoes of

1209
01:08:31,360 --> 01:08:35,400
Speaker 2: this movie just felt so familiar, and I like that,

1210
01:08:35,600 --> 01:08:39,679
Speaker 2: even though intersectionally I don't think this movie does well

1211
01:08:39,720 --> 01:08:46,080
Speaker 2: at all, there is this like understood solidarity between most women,

1212
01:08:46,560 --> 01:08:49,720
Speaker 2: and I think that's also authentic too, as like there

1213
01:08:49,760 --> 01:08:53,280
Speaker 2: are ants in the world who are treated just as

1214
01:08:53,280 --> 01:08:57,240
Speaker 2: horribly as you are, but do not have solidarity with

1215
01:08:57,280 --> 01:08:59,720
Speaker 2: you at all for sure, And I feel like, you know,

1216
01:08:59,760 --> 01:09:03,280
Speaker 2: see that gradient, even though I would have liked more

1217
01:09:03,320 --> 01:09:07,519
Speaker 2: depth than the characters, like, I appreciate that well.

1218
01:09:07,560 --> 01:09:11,439
Speaker 3: Going back to the like blame and shame component of

1219
01:09:11,560 --> 01:09:15,040
Speaker 3: the movie that Noah feels like we said, the red

1220
01:09:15,080 --> 01:09:20,280
Speaker 3: flags are so subtle that they are missible at least

1221
01:09:20,360 --> 01:09:23,280
Speaker 3: until she gets to his house. He won't give her

1222
01:09:23,320 --> 01:09:26,760
Speaker 3: the Wi Fi password and then she's drugged. Obviously from

1223
01:09:26,760 --> 01:09:30,960
Speaker 3: that point on, like the red flags are glaring, but

1224
01:09:31,080 --> 01:09:36,600
Speaker 3: prior to that, they are arguably not even red flags.

1225
01:09:36,640 --> 01:09:39,240
Speaker 3: Like a lot of what he does wouldn't ping for

1226
01:09:39,320 --> 01:09:41,400
Speaker 3: someone as being like, you know, him not being on

1227
01:09:41,439 --> 01:09:45,760
Speaker 3: social media. That's something that some people just choose not

1228
01:09:45,960 --> 01:09:48,320
Speaker 3: to do, and it's not necessarily a red flag.

1229
01:09:48,400 --> 01:09:48,599
Speaker 4: You know.

1230
01:09:48,640 --> 01:09:51,840
Speaker 3: There's different things that yeah, maybe could be interpreted as

1231
01:09:51,840 --> 01:09:54,120
Speaker 3: a red flag, but like they're not.

1232
01:09:54,160 --> 01:09:58,080
Speaker 2: I'm like unless you're old, you should at least have Controversially,

1233
01:09:58,080 --> 01:10:00,040
Speaker 2: you should have an Instagram account. If you don't, I

1234
01:10:00,479 --> 01:10:02,160
Speaker 2: think you're kind of fucking scary.

1235
01:10:02,560 --> 01:10:04,120
Speaker 3: I mean, even if you don't post it.

1236
01:10:04,120 --> 01:10:08,800
Speaker 2: But again, just have it. Have like have. I do

1237
01:10:08,840 --> 01:10:11,800
Speaker 2: feel like there is a necessity to have someone be

1238
01:10:11,880 --> 01:10:15,000
Speaker 2: able to vouch for your existence. Otherwise you're like, what

1239
01:10:15,080 --> 01:10:17,480
Speaker 2: do you have to hide? And the answer is often.

1240
01:10:17,439 --> 01:10:21,599
Speaker 3: Something something right. But there are things that could be

1241
01:10:21,920 --> 01:10:25,479
Speaker 3: not even interpreted as a red flag. But she still

1242
01:10:26,400 --> 01:10:30,479
Speaker 3: blames herself and she thinks, you know, she says like, oh,

1243
01:10:30,560 --> 01:10:32,679
Speaker 3: I'm the only one who's slept with him. Oh my god,

1244
01:10:33,439 --> 01:10:38,160
Speaker 3: And she's disgusted with herself and humiliated. And Penny, although

1245
01:10:38,200 --> 01:10:40,639
Speaker 3: she does sort of like pass judgment to be like, wait,

1246
01:10:40,720 --> 01:10:43,559
Speaker 3: you slept with him. I don't think anyone others of

1247
01:10:43,680 --> 01:10:47,120
Speaker 3: us did. But I'm not slept shaming you, you know,

1248
01:10:47,240 --> 01:10:51,320
Speaker 3: so there's something to that. But she then follows up

1249
01:10:51,400 --> 01:10:54,519
Speaker 3: Penny does by saying like, it's not our fault, it's

1250
01:10:54,560 --> 01:10:59,599
Speaker 3: always their fault. And the idea of like you said,

1251
01:10:59,840 --> 01:11:02,799
Speaker 3: you can do everything right, or you can proceed with caution,

1252
01:11:02,920 --> 01:11:06,799
Speaker 3: and you can just go about dating the way modern

1253
01:11:06,880 --> 01:11:12,080
Speaker 3: dating generally goes and it can still end horribly and

1254
01:11:12,160 --> 01:11:16,080
Speaker 3: it's because it's the fault of the perpetrators.

1255
01:11:16,360 --> 01:11:18,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, I like again it's like it's all a little

1256
01:11:18,960 --> 01:11:22,559
Speaker 2: bit undercooked, but the core message of it and the

1257
01:11:22,600 --> 01:11:25,280
Speaker 2: fact that the empathy of the movie is clearly with

1258
01:11:25,439 --> 01:11:27,760
Speaker 2: Noah and that it's done I think just in a

1259
01:11:27,800 --> 01:11:30,439
Speaker 2: way we don't see in horror very often, where it's like,

1260
01:11:31,160 --> 01:11:33,960
Speaker 2: I don't think a cis man could have written this movie,

1261
01:11:34,000 --> 01:11:36,040
Speaker 2: because you do have to have sort of the lived

1262
01:11:36,080 --> 01:11:39,800
Speaker 2: experience of I have to protect myself and thinking on

1263
01:11:39,840 --> 01:11:42,679
Speaker 2: the other end of that, how would I think if

1264
01:11:42,760 --> 01:11:46,280
Speaker 2: my friend told me this about this guy? Like, I

1265
01:11:46,280 --> 01:11:50,120
Speaker 2: feel like that was all very like well thought out

1266
01:11:50,160 --> 01:11:53,639
Speaker 2: and considered and didn't feel like ten y. I feel

1267
01:11:53,640 --> 01:11:57,320
Speaker 2: like sometimes especially with it's like talking about like modern dating,

1268
01:11:57,560 --> 01:12:01,840
Speaker 2: the technology's weirdly outdated, which wasn't true here either, which

1269
01:12:01,880 --> 01:12:03,479
Speaker 2: I feel like is kind of hard to do. So

1270
01:12:04,400 --> 01:12:08,000
Speaker 2: kudos kudos too, Yes, Because this movie is written and

1271
01:12:08,080 --> 01:12:13,639
Speaker 2: directed by women, white women, Mimi Cave and Lauren Con

1272
01:12:14,360 --> 01:12:18,280
Speaker 2: and it's also produced by Adam McKay, which I love

1273
01:12:18,320 --> 01:12:20,360
Speaker 2: to hear it. I guess Lauren Conn began as Adam

1274
01:12:20,400 --> 01:12:21,280
Speaker 2: McKay's assistant.

1275
01:12:21,360 --> 01:12:22,000
Speaker 3: Oh, not kidding.

1276
01:12:22,479 --> 01:12:25,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I feel like we are saying more

1277
01:12:25,840 --> 01:12:29,719
Speaker 2: horror movies from a more diverse array of directors and

1278
01:12:30,320 --> 01:12:33,000
Speaker 2: genre movies in general. But like, you know, keep it coming,

1279
01:12:33,240 --> 01:12:34,880
Speaker 2: keep it coming common And.

1280
01:12:34,760 --> 01:12:37,320
Speaker 3: That was my point. You reminded me of what my

1281
01:12:37,400 --> 01:12:42,360
Speaker 3: point was, which is that so many horror movies from

1282
01:12:42,479 --> 01:12:47,639
Speaker 3: years past did so much to blame the women for

1283
01:12:47,720 --> 01:12:51,360
Speaker 3: getting killed. You know, the whole trope of like, if

1284
01:12:51,400 --> 01:12:54,960
Speaker 3: you're a woman and you have sex with someone, then

1285
01:12:55,080 --> 01:12:59,360
Speaker 3: you got it right. There's that, you know, there's the

1286
01:12:59,360 --> 01:13:02,960
Speaker 3: final girl trope, which this movie avoids because there are

1287
01:13:04,040 --> 01:13:06,639
Speaker 3: three final girls.

1288
01:13:06,800 --> 01:13:10,280
Speaker 2: And I think this movie is again trying to avoid

1289
01:13:10,840 --> 01:13:14,000
Speaker 2: racialized tropes in horror, but I would say it is

1290
01:13:14,200 --> 01:13:16,280
Speaker 2: less successful at doing that.

1291
01:13:16,600 --> 01:13:21,479
Speaker 3: I agree, Yeah, Paul, just real quickly. Yes, On one hand,

1292
01:13:21,479 --> 01:13:24,960
Speaker 3: you have him recognized of the danger he's potentially in.

1293
01:13:25,280 --> 01:13:27,759
Speaker 3: He hears gunshots, he's in the middle of the woods,

1294
01:13:28,400 --> 01:13:32,640
Speaker 3: and he acknowledges like, I've seen this horror movie and

1295
01:13:32,720 --> 01:13:34,720
Speaker 3: I know that I don't make it out alive, so

1296
01:13:34,840 --> 01:13:38,960
Speaker 3: I'm going to bounce. But also, is that kind of

1297
01:13:39,000 --> 01:13:42,960
Speaker 3: commentary on how like men tend not to be helpful

1298
01:13:43,320 --> 01:13:45,840
Speaker 3: in these situations when it comes to like women's liberation.

1299
01:13:46,600 --> 01:13:49,800
Speaker 2: It felt unclear to me, Like, yeah, I thought the

1300
01:13:49,920 --> 01:13:52,120
Speaker 2: idea of it was interesting, but it kind of just

1301
01:13:52,200 --> 01:13:54,160
Speaker 2: felt like a weird joke.

1302
01:13:55,040 --> 01:13:57,080
Speaker 3: Well, why make him even drive the whole way up

1303
01:13:57,080 --> 01:14:00,240
Speaker 3: there if narratively he's not going to do anything, He's

1304
01:14:00,280 --> 01:14:01,959
Speaker 3: just gonna turn right back around.

1305
01:14:02,439 --> 01:14:03,960
Speaker 2: That was the thing I was curious about to Yeah,

1306
01:14:04,040 --> 01:14:07,040
Speaker 2: especially because like I would be curious what got cut

1307
01:14:07,080 --> 01:14:09,640
Speaker 2: from this movie, because it did feel like there are

1308
01:14:09,640 --> 01:14:12,320
Speaker 2: certain little plot holes that probably could have been fixed

1309
01:14:12,320 --> 01:14:16,040
Speaker 2: by another scene that might have existed at some point. Yeah,

1310
01:14:16,080 --> 01:14:19,479
Speaker 2: because Paul like has not that he's like a prominent character,

1311
01:14:19,600 --> 01:14:22,920
Speaker 2: but he does have more screen time than a character

1312
01:14:22,960 --> 01:14:27,080
Speaker 2: who randomly bails right would have. Like you're just like, well,

1313
01:14:27,120 --> 01:14:29,160
Speaker 2: then what was the point? I mean, I guess you know.

1314
01:14:29,240 --> 01:14:32,800
Speaker 2: His function is to connect Molly back to Noah again,

1315
01:14:33,240 --> 01:14:36,479
Speaker 2: a black character servicing ultimately servicing the white characters. Yeah,

1316
01:14:36,479 --> 01:14:38,360
Speaker 2: but then at the end, it's sort of like his

1317
01:14:38,400 --> 01:14:43,120
Speaker 2: whole character ends in this kind of confusing joke.

1318
01:14:44,000 --> 01:14:48,600
Speaker 3: It's also implied that he's only helping Molly because he

1319
01:14:48,720 --> 01:14:52,000
Speaker 3: thinks he has an opportunity to have sex with her

1320
01:14:52,160 --> 01:14:54,240
Speaker 3: again or to like reignite there.

1321
01:14:54,520 --> 01:14:58,280
Speaker 2: Which is like a man to do. And I appreciated that,

1322
01:14:58,400 --> 01:15:04,479
Speaker 2: like Noah and Molly different points use their whiles to

1323
01:15:04,560 --> 01:15:07,000
Speaker 2: get what they need from who they need it from where.

1324
01:15:07,080 --> 01:15:10,120
Speaker 2: It's like pretty clear from just how Noah and Molly

1325
01:15:10,200 --> 01:15:15,120
Speaker 2: talk about Paul that Mollie's like not interested and I

1326
01:15:15,160 --> 01:15:17,439
Speaker 2: think kind of ghosted him when they dated.

1327
01:15:17,479 --> 01:15:18,120
Speaker 3: It seems like it.

1328
01:15:18,200 --> 01:15:20,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, so it's not like she's all of a sudden

1329
01:15:20,360 --> 01:15:23,479
Speaker 2: interested in him again. I think she possibly knows that

1330
01:15:23,520 --> 01:15:27,160
Speaker 2: this is his personality and wants to, you know, keep

1331
01:15:27,240 --> 01:15:29,960
Speaker 2: him involved and entice. But again, you would think with

1332
01:15:30,240 --> 01:15:33,720
Speaker 2: Mollie and with all of these characters, does Mollie not

1333
01:15:33,800 --> 01:15:37,759
Speaker 2: have a second friend to tell Hey, I'm like someone

1334
01:15:37,800 --> 01:15:41,639
Speaker 2: that you would trust more than someone you ghosted last year?

1335
01:15:41,880 --> 01:15:44,559
Speaker 2: Like it just I get it. It's like a small

1336
01:15:44,680 --> 01:15:48,320
Speaker 2: cast and it's movie logic, but I just felt like

1337
01:15:48,360 --> 01:15:52,519
Speaker 2: another it just the smallness of these women's world. It's

1338
01:15:52,720 --> 01:15:54,160
Speaker 2: just kind of bizarre.

1339
01:15:54,439 --> 01:15:56,200
Speaker 3: That's why I think it would have been interesting if

1340
01:15:56,560 --> 01:16:00,439
Speaker 3: like Mollie is dating a woman, right, and she's person

1341
01:16:00,479 --> 01:16:07,240
Speaker 3: who helps Molly on this quest and we see what

1342
01:16:07,280 --> 01:16:09,719
Speaker 3: that dynamic looks like. Not to say that like women

1343
01:16:09,840 --> 01:16:13,759
Speaker 3: dating women is perfect in sunshine and butterflies and amazing

1344
01:16:14,040 --> 01:16:17,640
Speaker 3: and like that contrasted with women dating men, but like

1345
01:16:18,280 --> 01:16:21,439
Speaker 3: that would have been an interesting dynamic to explore to

1346
01:16:21,479 --> 01:16:24,160
Speaker 3: see how those interactions are different, or just just see

1347
01:16:24,600 --> 01:16:26,120
Speaker 3: what that looks like and also.

1348
01:16:25,920 --> 01:16:28,160
Speaker 2: Feels like, I mean on Noah's part, Like if Noah's

1349
01:16:28,160 --> 01:16:30,680
Speaker 2: always hanging out with a couple, that would sort of

1350
01:16:30,720 --> 01:16:34,320
Speaker 2: explain why she might be dating more. Yeah, which because

1351
01:16:34,360 --> 01:16:37,519
Speaker 2: I mean, I've been the friend of a couple and

1352
01:16:37,560 --> 01:16:40,439
Speaker 2: it's like, if the couple is awesome, it's awesome. But

1353
01:16:40,600 --> 01:16:42,120
Speaker 2: sometimes some days you're like.

1354
01:16:42,680 --> 01:16:46,160
Speaker 3: Wow, I am really the third wheel, ARENENTI.

1355
01:16:46,240 --> 01:16:50,520
Speaker 2: No one's kissing me. This stinks.

1356
01:16:51,880 --> 01:16:55,120
Speaker 3: And that's why I need to find myself a throuble

1357
01:16:55,360 --> 01:16:57,400
Speaker 3: to be exactly.

1358
01:16:58,040 --> 01:16:59,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, I think that that's all I really have

1359
01:17:00,400 --> 01:17:03,439
Speaker 2: for this movie. I think it's good. I like it.

1360
01:17:03,439 --> 01:17:06,080
Speaker 2: It passes the Bechdel test for sure.

1361
01:17:06,280 --> 01:17:09,280
Speaker 3: It does. Noah and Molly they do talk a lot

1362
01:17:09,320 --> 01:17:13,320
Speaker 3: about Steve, and they talk about dating men in general.

1363
01:17:14,000 --> 01:17:16,880
Speaker 3: But I think that if you're going to not pass

1364
01:17:17,000 --> 01:17:20,160
Speaker 3: the Bechdel test, a great way to do it is

1365
01:17:20,320 --> 01:17:26,040
Speaker 3: to comment on how dating men is difficult and awful.

1366
01:17:25,800 --> 01:17:28,880
Speaker 2: And that they are protecting each other.

1367
01:17:29,920 --> 01:17:30,160
Speaker 3: Yeah.

1368
01:17:30,240 --> 01:17:33,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, like they're talking about protecting each other from men,

1369
01:17:34,080 --> 01:17:38,360
Speaker 2: which I feel like spiritually passes or mistrusting men fundamentally.

1370
01:17:38,800 --> 01:17:43,760
Speaker 3: Yeah. Right, And then Noah and Penny talk about their situation,

1371
01:17:45,000 --> 01:17:48,200
Speaker 3: which is they're only in this situation because of a man.

1372
01:17:48,479 --> 01:17:51,920
Speaker 2: But if you know, I mean, I feel comfortable saying

1373
01:17:51,920 --> 01:17:57,000
Speaker 2: this movie pretty handily passes technically and on vibes. But

1374
01:17:57,080 --> 01:18:00,240
Speaker 2: what about the most important metric of all time? Can

1375
01:18:00,280 --> 01:18:02,120
Speaker 2: you tell that I have to pee really bad because

1376
01:18:02,120 --> 01:18:05,519
Speaker 2: I started talking so fast? So what do you think

1377
01:18:05,880 --> 01:18:08,240
Speaker 2: in regards to the nipples scale?

1378
01:18:08,240 --> 01:18:10,599
Speaker 3: Will we rate the nipples zero to five nipples? Examining

1379
01:18:10,600 --> 01:18:12,559
Speaker 3: it through an intersectional feminist lens, I'm going to give

1380
01:18:12,600 --> 01:18:16,880
Speaker 3: them movie yes, three nipples. Yeah, I mean, you could

1381
01:18:16,920 --> 01:18:20,080
Speaker 3: look at this whole movie is like the meat eating

1382
01:18:20,240 --> 01:18:24,519
Speaker 3: of women as a kind of allegory or metaphor for

1383
01:18:24,640 --> 01:18:30,760
Speaker 3: just like the objectification and exploitation of women's bodies in society,

1384
01:18:31,600 --> 01:18:35,600
Speaker 3: And that's an interesting metaphor. And the fact that the

1385
01:18:35,640 --> 01:18:39,960
Speaker 3: women triumph at the end and they stand in solidarity

1386
01:18:40,000 --> 01:18:42,439
Speaker 3: with each other and do the opposite of what Anne does,

1387
01:18:42,520 --> 01:18:45,400
Speaker 3: which you know her thing is she becomes part of

1388
01:18:45,439 --> 01:18:46,120
Speaker 3: the problem.

1389
01:18:46,479 --> 01:18:49,800
Speaker 2: So and it doesn't save her because it never does.

1390
01:18:49,840 --> 01:18:52,479
Speaker 3: Right, and she gets brutally bashed over the head with

1391
01:18:52,520 --> 01:18:56,439
Speaker 3: a shovel yike, and so right. So there's these cool

1392
01:18:56,479 --> 01:18:58,920
Speaker 3: things happening. The fact that the movie, even though the

1393
01:18:59,000 --> 01:19:03,720
Speaker 3: character blames herself, the movie is not blaming her for

1394
01:19:03,840 --> 01:19:07,719
Speaker 3: not seeing that she was being seduced by a cannibal

1395
01:19:08,160 --> 01:19:11,360
Speaker 3: who was planning to sell her meat. So I think

1396
01:19:11,400 --> 01:19:14,000
Speaker 3: there's a lot of cool stuff going on. There are

1397
01:19:14,040 --> 01:19:17,280
Speaker 3: some things that I feel like we're mishandled, especially in

1398
01:19:17,320 --> 01:19:22,240
Speaker 3: regards to casting choices and the characters who are people

1399
01:19:22,280 --> 01:19:27,839
Speaker 3: of color servicing the white characters and all that stuff.

1400
01:19:27,920 --> 01:19:34,719
Speaker 3: So three nipples. I will give one to Jojo T. Gibbs,

1401
01:19:34,720 --> 01:19:39,800
Speaker 3: who plays Molly, I will give one to Andrea Bang

1402
01:19:39,840 --> 01:19:45,800
Speaker 3: who plays Penny. And I'll give my final nipple to

1403
01:19:47,560 --> 01:19:50,120
Speaker 3: semiak Bari, who we don't see on screen, but she's

1404
01:19:50,160 --> 01:19:53,320
Speaker 3: the character who leaves the note in the magazine.

1405
01:19:53,120 --> 01:19:56,080
Speaker 2: Amazing, Yes, I am going to meet you at three.

1406
01:19:56,240 --> 01:19:59,439
Speaker 2: I think that this movie has leaves something to be

1407
01:19:59,479 --> 01:20:02,120
Speaker 2: desired in terms of intersectionality, I feel like there's a

1408
01:20:02,160 --> 01:20:05,120
Speaker 2: lot of surface y stuff where there is a diverse

1409
01:20:05,160 --> 01:20:08,320
Speaker 2: cast and there is queer characters, but it still is

1410
01:20:08,439 --> 01:20:12,240
Speaker 2: ultimately a white, hetero story, and these are the characters

1411
01:20:12,280 --> 01:20:15,880
Speaker 2: that are ultimately being serviced by the plot. However, when

1412
01:20:15,880 --> 01:20:21,320
Speaker 2: it comes to contemporary dating commentary, it's awesome and like

1413
01:20:21,760 --> 01:20:24,679
Speaker 2: I think it works super well. The performances are really good,

1414
01:20:25,160 --> 01:20:28,599
Speaker 2: the writing is really specific and a way that I'm

1415
01:20:28,840 --> 01:20:31,160
Speaker 2: not used to seeing in horror because there's not enough

1416
01:20:31,200 --> 01:20:34,360
Speaker 2: women that get to take big swings in horror. So

1417
01:20:35,160 --> 01:20:37,680
Speaker 2: the highs are high, the lows are frustrating, but I

1418
01:20:37,720 --> 01:20:41,960
Speaker 2: am excited to see more, particularly from Mimi Cave. So

1419
01:20:42,000 --> 01:20:44,800
Speaker 2: I'll go three nipples. I will give one to Mimi Cave,

1420
01:20:45,120 --> 01:20:48,080
Speaker 2: I will give one to Jojo Gibbs, and I will

1421
01:20:48,080 --> 01:20:51,080
Speaker 2: give the final one to Oh my goodness who played Penny.

1422
01:20:51,160 --> 01:20:55,320
Speaker 2: I shut my tab fuck, oh Andrea bang, Andrea bang,

1423
01:20:56,000 --> 01:21:01,160
Speaker 2: and yeah, congratulations to Sebastian Stan for me recognize him now?

1424
01:21:01,520 --> 01:21:03,720
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, yes, yes, also quick shout out sorry. I

1425
01:21:03,760 --> 01:21:05,840
Speaker 3: know he have to pee, but I just want to

1426
01:21:05,880 --> 01:21:09,920
Speaker 3: say the moment of foreshadowing when Noah and Steve go

1427
01:21:10,000 --> 01:21:13,639
Speaker 3: back to her place for the first time, and she's like, Ooh,

1428
01:21:13,640 --> 01:21:15,680
Speaker 3: can I get you anything to drink or eat? And

1429
01:21:15,720 --> 01:21:20,600
Speaker 3: he says no, just you because he's gonna eat her.

1430
01:21:21,520 --> 01:21:27,280
Speaker 2: Also just a classic cringe man thing to say.

1431
01:21:27,160 --> 01:21:29,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, I just went you babe.

1432
01:21:29,520 --> 01:21:31,639
Speaker 2: I just want you just feel good. I'm like, no,

1433
01:21:31,840 --> 01:21:38,800
Speaker 2: you don't anyways, fucking liar. And with that, uh, and

1434
01:21:38,880 --> 01:21:44,519
Speaker 2: that's a fresher movie. You can follow us everywhere. You

1435
01:21:44,560 --> 01:21:47,080
Speaker 2: can follow us on Instagram at bachdol guys, you can

1436
01:21:47,080 --> 01:21:49,960
Speaker 2: follow us on Twitter, backl the cast, and you can

1437
01:21:50,320 --> 01:21:53,559
Speaker 2: subscribe to and in fact, you should subscribe to our

1438
01:21:53,600 --> 01:21:58,080
Speaker 2: Patreon aka Matreon Patreon dot com slash Bechdel Cast. Five

1439
01:21:58,120 --> 01:22:01,840
Speaker 2: dollars a month gets you two bonus episodes every damn month.

1440
01:22:01,880 --> 01:22:02,960
Speaker 2: How nice is that?

1441
01:22:02,960 --> 01:22:05,560
Speaker 3: That's so nice? You know what else is nice is

1442
01:22:05,600 --> 01:22:09,040
Speaker 3: the fact that I'm headlining two shows in Boston on

1443
01:22:09,520 --> 01:22:12,800
Speaker 3: November oh gosh is it sixteenth. So if you live

1444
01:22:12,840 --> 01:22:15,320
Speaker 3: in Boston and you want to see me do stand up,

1445
01:22:15,800 --> 01:22:19,080
Speaker 3: go to my website Kaitlindononte dot com and the links

1446
01:22:19,280 --> 01:22:21,679
Speaker 3: will be there for that. I just wanted to plug

1447
01:22:21,760 --> 01:22:23,680
Speaker 3: that real quick. Now.

1448
01:22:23,680 --> 01:22:25,439
Speaker 2: That's what I call nice. And if you want to

1449
01:22:25,439 --> 01:22:30,840
Speaker 2: see me live in person in Los Angeles. I'm workshopping

1450
01:22:30,880 --> 01:22:32,720
Speaker 2: my new show at the Lyric and you can check

1451
01:22:32,760 --> 01:22:38,439
Speaker 2: it out on November twentieth and December fourth, and the

1452
01:22:38,479 --> 01:22:42,120
Speaker 2: other one's sold out sorry, And you can also get

1453
01:22:42,160 --> 01:22:44,880
Speaker 2: our merch at teapopulic dot com. Slash The Bechdel Cast.

1454
01:22:45,000 --> 01:22:49,600
Speaker 2: Holidays coming up, babe, could be fun, could be. And

1455
01:22:49,720 --> 01:22:51,720
Speaker 2: with that I have to go chop off my own

1456
01:22:51,760 --> 01:22:53,040
Speaker 2: ass and eat it for lunch.

1457
01:22:53,360 --> 01:23:00,040
Speaker 3: Me too, Okay, Bye bye. The Bechdel Cast is a

1458
01:23:00,120 --> 01:23:04,200
Speaker 3: production of iHeartMedia, hosted by Caitlin Derante and Jamie Loftis,

1459
01:23:04,320 --> 01:23:08,160
Speaker 3: produced by Sophie Lichterman, edited by Mo laboord Our theme

1460
01:23:08,240 --> 01:23:12,400
Speaker 3: song was composed by Mike Kaplan with vocals by Katherine Voskresensky.

1461
01:23:12,920 --> 01:23:16,240
Speaker 3: Our logo in merch is designed by Jamie Loftis and

1462
01:23:16,320 --> 01:23:20,200
Speaker 3: a special thanks to Aristotle Acevedo. For more information about

1463
01:23:20,200 --> 01:23:23,200
Speaker 3: the podcast, please visit linktree slash Bechdelcast