WEBVTT - Episode 98: Dwayne McDuffie 0:00:08.960 --> 0:00:13.600 Oh all right, after BONTI, welcome to Nerdificent. How you doing, 0:00:13.640 --> 0:00:16.800 I'm your host if you wadway, And sitting across from 0:00:16.800 --> 0:00:19.800 me in the place of miss Danny fer Nandez, who 0:00:19.840 --> 0:00:25.520 has important things to handle, is Joel Monique, producer at 0:00:25.520 --> 0:00:28.159 I Heart and writer whose work has been featured in 0:00:28.520 --> 0:00:36.160 The Hollywood Reporter, The A V Club, and Vulture. Yes, 0:00:36.760 --> 0:00:40.640 Dan on the booth, appreciate you. Uh yeah, nobody can 0:00:40.680 --> 0:00:43.159 replace Danny, but I'm here to fill the space that 0:00:43.159 --> 0:00:47.080 she sometimes occupies. And uh yeah, I'm excited because it's 0:00:47.080 --> 0:00:50.760 a really good topic. I might cry today. Warnings Okay. 0:00:51.880 --> 0:00:54.880 I also like that you gave us the step mom speech, like, 0:00:54.920 --> 0:00:59.520 I'm not here to replace your mom. Just you know, 0:01:00.280 --> 0:01:02.760 think of me as an extra mom, you know when 0:01:02.800 --> 0:01:08.640 you get two moms. No, I'm not good, but you 0:01:08.680 --> 0:01:11.240 know I'll tell you what. But like, like, no actual guy, 0:01:11.360 --> 0:01:13.640 just breaking, I'll pick you up in your drunk I'll 0:01:13.680 --> 0:01:16.000 tell your father. It'll be okay. I'm I'm the cool one. 0:01:16.080 --> 0:01:23.600 I'm only five years anyway. Oh, that other voice you 0:01:23.680 --> 0:01:27.280 here is Johnny Parker, writer of The black Man's Guy 0:01:27.560 --> 0:01:30.520 to get him pulled over, die cute and e Walks 0:01:30.520 --> 0:01:33.000 are better than Hobbits. How you doing? I am good? 0:01:33.040 --> 0:01:34.600 I would get at what up to everybody? Good to 0:01:34.640 --> 0:01:36.319 be here, Thanks for having me on. Yeah, I know 0:01:36.480 --> 0:01:38.600 that it almost took a dark turn, but I pulled 0:01:38.600 --> 0:01:45.000 this back. Yeah, you know, it's just we're gathered here 0:01:45.040 --> 0:01:48.840 today to talk about I would argue one of the 0:01:48.920 --> 0:01:55.200 most influential, UH black creators in the comic industry. You know, 0:01:55.560 --> 0:01:59.680 he's definitely I think it's like one of those things 0:01:59.720 --> 0:02:01.760 that where I think if he was alive today, he'd 0:02:01.760 --> 0:02:06.160 be like getting them McFarlane maybe even those Jeff John 0:02:06.400 --> 0:02:08.760 checks right now. If he were alive today, I would 0:02:09.160 --> 0:02:12.040 bet money that despite many of the issues he had 0:02:12.040 --> 0:02:16.239 with DC, given his track record of improving elevating a 0:02:16.280 --> 0:02:17.920 lot of their work, DC would have called him in 0:02:17.919 --> 0:02:20.280 like around Justice League to be like, yo, bro, bro, bro, 0:02:20.639 --> 0:02:22.440 We're sorry about the past, but like he would have 0:02:22.639 --> 0:02:26.799 passed on this script because even if they didn't call 0:02:26.880 --> 0:02:29.120 him then, they definitely would have called him. After the 0:02:29.200 --> 0:02:32.440 Black Panther weekend, They're like, we need you, it's time 0:02:34.639 --> 0:02:37.280 come out. We could be ready for you know, they 0:02:37.360 --> 0:02:39.680 like that moles Morale's kid. Maybe it's time for Static 0:02:39.720 --> 0:02:42.399 to get his shot. I don't know, we just need 0:02:42.440 --> 0:02:45.160 you here in an alternate university somewhere, still kicking at 0:02:46.280 --> 0:02:48.919 Oh yeah, Well before we jump into it, the way 0:02:48.960 --> 0:02:52.119 we like to start our episodes here, uh, is by 0:02:52.240 --> 0:02:54.480 talking about what we're geeking out about this week. So 0:02:54.960 --> 0:02:56.880 I'll let you start off, Johnny, what are you geeking 0:02:56.880 --> 0:03:00.360 out about? Okay, first time here? Yeah, of course there's 0:03:00.440 --> 0:03:04.080 no limit out alright, Michelle, So our first thing is 0:03:04.120 --> 0:03:07.520 the world my my Heroes Academia Heroes Rising premiere, like 0:03:07.639 --> 0:03:09.639 so yeah, planning, so I got to go check that out. 0:03:09.639 --> 0:03:11.880 That was like really doping everything like that. And honestly 0:03:11.919 --> 0:03:13.320 the party when I was just geeking out about us 0:03:13.320 --> 0:03:15.280 because we like talk abou Daye McDuffie talk about like 0:03:15.520 --> 0:03:18.040 representation with the culture, it was just so proud to 0:03:18.080 --> 0:03:20.080 see like so many people of color there who are 0:03:20.080 --> 0:03:21.720 into like anime and what not, who have like push 0:03:21.720 --> 0:03:23.600 the grown on Ford and whatnot. Like it was dope 0:03:23.600 --> 0:03:24.840 by like I was like standing in line. It's to 0:03:24.919 --> 0:03:27.080 King Vader, so I'm marking the whole crew from RDC 0:03:27.200 --> 0:03:31.119 one World and everything like that. Hosted the event, well yeah, 0:03:31.120 --> 0:03:32.560 there you go, and then also saw your co host 0:03:32.639 --> 0:03:34.280 there as well. Yeah, so it was just really dope 0:03:34.280 --> 0:03:36.200 to see, like, you know, like this little genre that 0:03:36.280 --> 0:03:38.720 was like we trade VHS tapes back in the day, 0:03:38.720 --> 0:03:40.280 and the night is everything to catch up. Now I's 0:03:40.280 --> 0:03:41.840 blew up to this level and like all these people 0:03:41.880 --> 0:03:43.720 of color that are pushing the genre four too. It's 0:03:43.720 --> 0:03:46.120 so dope to see. And then, um, second thing I'm 0:03:46.120 --> 0:03:47.720 getting out about hard right now is I'm not sure 0:03:47.760 --> 0:03:50.560 wrestling fans here. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm going 0:03:50.560 --> 0:03:54.960 crazy for Bianca Bella right now. Oh my god, yesterday, 0:03:55.000 --> 0:03:57.000 I don't know jack about wrestling, but she comes up 0:03:57.000 --> 0:03:59.120 in my timeline enough that I'm like, look at this 0:03:59.240 --> 0:04:03.360 bitch work. Oh no, she's so hot right out. She's 0:04:03.400 --> 0:04:05.000 given the business to like all the level of female 0:04:05.040 --> 0:04:07.040 wrestle right now, go up to Charlotte, like you don't 0:04:07.120 --> 0:04:10.000 even go here. And then the last paper of view, 0:04:10.000 --> 0:04:12.240 she literally came out a robe. They said, I'm Black 0:04:12.280 --> 0:04:14.960 history in the making. Yeah, and she's just amazing somebody level. 0:04:14.960 --> 0:04:16.280 So I just want to say, like props to her. 0:04:16.520 --> 0:04:18.480 She's giving me like more about female wrestling and what 0:04:18.480 --> 0:04:20.720 they're doing it just herself. So I'm excited where she's 0:04:20.880 --> 0:04:23.080 going yeah, yeah, Now that's that's the one thing I 0:04:23.120 --> 0:04:25.039 was talking about where it's like she is killing in 0:04:25.040 --> 0:04:27.839 then next T she's holding it down. And the biggest 0:04:27.880 --> 0:04:31.040 problem is that all the women wrestlers that get bumped 0:04:31.120 --> 0:04:34.840 up to w w uh E the main roster, it 0:04:35.000 --> 0:04:38.200 just they it always fizzles out because they only play. 0:04:38.360 --> 0:04:41.400 They only get one match of night, so you have 0:04:41.560 --> 0:04:44.840 one match of night and and so there's only so 0:04:44.880 --> 0:04:47.240 many stories you can tell someone. Just let her thrive 0:04:47.400 --> 0:04:51.400 in then x T, because y'all did Oscar dirty Oscar? 0:04:51.880 --> 0:04:54.280 She she was so great and y'all just let that 0:04:54.320 --> 0:04:56.560 heat fizzle. So I don't want to see any more 0:04:56.600 --> 0:04:59.120 of my faiths have their heat fizzle. So let I'll 0:04:59.160 --> 0:05:00.760 let her thrive. I'm only with you because like with 0:05:00.880 --> 0:05:03.279 cars ain't one up. I was like, cars ain't she's 0:05:03.279 --> 0:05:06.240 a party, She's gonna find one piece, let's go. And 0:05:06.279 --> 0:05:07.640 then all of a a sudden was like, y'all are you 0:05:07.680 --> 0:05:09.840 doing nothing with her? It's kind of like you say, 0:05:09.880 --> 0:05:11.480 because like sadly enoughhen they go to me Rosh, they 0:05:11.520 --> 0:05:13.840 get one match and every single match is about Becky 0:05:13.960 --> 0:05:16.360 or Charlotte and Sasha or Bailey. So I give a 0:05:16.400 --> 0:05:17.640 lot of the other women get plushed back, which is 0:05:17.640 --> 0:05:19.480 disappointed to see. So I agree with you, Like n 0:05:19.600 --> 0:05:21.800 XT is definitely like place where to thrive right now. Yeah, 0:05:21.839 --> 0:05:25.080 I'm living it. Uh what about you, Joe? What are 0:05:25.080 --> 0:05:28.360 you geeking out about this week? Um? Every year that 0:05:28.880 --> 0:05:31.640 HBO releases West World, I'm like, I'm not gonna watch 0:05:31.720 --> 0:05:34.360 because it's not gonna hold it to the original, or 0:05:34.400 --> 0:05:37.159 it's not gonna be that's good, or or the ending 0:05:37.200 --> 0:05:39.400 was kind of dumb and I hated it, but the 0:05:39.440 --> 0:05:44.520 new trailers look so good. It's just can't get over it. 0:05:45.520 --> 0:05:48.560 I am a sucker and I'm gonna watch this season. Uh. 0:05:49.360 --> 0:05:53.719 Also getting out over the Batman, which is threatening to 0:05:53.720 --> 0:05:56.120 tell the Batman story I've always wanted to watch in theaters, 0:05:56.240 --> 0:05:59.480 which is an actual detective story, and the costume is 0:06:00.000 --> 0:06:01.960 so awesome and he uses parts of the gun that 0:06:02.040 --> 0:06:04.920 killed his parents as a bad symbol. Listen, it's gonna 0:06:04.960 --> 0:06:06.880 be so dark and metal, but in a way that 0:06:07.040 --> 0:06:12.240 isn't um purposely dark And wait, how do you so? 0:06:12.320 --> 0:06:15.640 Sometimes I think try hard? Yeah, sometimes dark is like 0:06:15.800 --> 0:06:19.000 it's murder and we're just sad and angry. Uh, this 0:06:19.080 --> 0:06:20.960 is darker than like there's some dark things happening in 0:06:20.960 --> 0:06:23.400 the world. We're gonna dress it starting with gun violence, 0:06:23.440 --> 0:06:26.600 which is exactly where you should start with Batman. Oh god, 0:06:26.640 --> 0:06:29.240 I'm so excited. It looks really good. I hope it's 0:06:29.240 --> 0:06:34.040 as good as it looks. Oh man, that's dis ope. 0:06:35.040 --> 0:06:37.400 What I'm seeking out about this week is, you know, 0:06:37.960 --> 0:06:41.800 it's it's hard to pinpoint one. I will, but I 0:06:41.920 --> 0:06:45.080 will say before I pinpoint one, i'd say anime in general. 0:06:45.640 --> 0:06:48.839 My friend Lisa just got me real deep back into 0:06:48.880 --> 0:06:50.760 anime because it was that thing where I think I 0:06:50.800 --> 0:06:52.480 talked about it on the pod where I just felt 0:06:52.520 --> 0:06:57.040 like I was so behind, and she posted, uh, just 0:06:57.080 --> 0:06:59.960 like one of the like scene screens where you show 0:07:00.000 --> 0:07:03.640 like multiple pictures of a scene um in Banana Fish, 0:07:03.720 --> 0:07:05.719 and it was so interesting. I was like, what is 0:07:05.760 --> 0:07:07.680 this anime I need to see? When I like just 0:07:07.800 --> 0:07:11.360 binge through And then next thing, you know, I was like, Okay, 0:07:11.400 --> 0:07:13.680 what's the new hotness boom? And then I caught up 0:07:13.720 --> 0:07:17.840 on my hero I'm still like, I'm still on the 0:07:17.960 --> 0:07:20.040 season four. I'm not full all the way caught up, 0:07:20.160 --> 0:07:22.520 but I'm in the current season with the with the 0:07:22.560 --> 0:07:27.280 girls as they say, um but uh, also like I 0:07:27.600 --> 0:07:31.040 finished Mob Psycho and then I went back. Yeah, I 0:07:31.680 --> 0:07:35.040 went back and rewatch Android Kei Kaier the animation, which 0:07:35.160 --> 0:07:38.680 is just a depressing slow anime, but it's done in 0:07:38.720 --> 0:07:42.360 that like Astro Boy Cyborgs zero zero nine style, which 0:07:42.400 --> 0:07:45.080 is very interesting to look the transformation scenes hold up. 0:07:45.240 --> 0:07:49.120 So anyway, uh, I definitely wanna shout out her for 0:07:49.280 --> 0:07:53.320 getting me back into darkness, like I welcome back. Yeah, 0:07:53.360 --> 0:07:56.320 I went, I went back. I went to lunch all 0:07:56.360 --> 0:07:58.280 my last job and on launch, I picked up a 0:07:58.320 --> 0:08:01.960 Gundam and like cow pico and Japanese snacks, and I 0:08:02.000 --> 0:08:04.080 was like, oh here we oh so we're back to 0:08:04.360 --> 0:08:09.840 dirty wee biffy. This is fully back in my roots. 0:08:10.000 --> 0:08:12.800 But yeah, she has a podcast It's called Kawaii five. 0:08:12.840 --> 0:08:14.680 Oh if you don't hear her talk, but yeah, the 0:08:14.720 --> 0:08:17.239 current one I'm watching and the one geeking out about 0:08:17.240 --> 0:08:20.760 his Black Lagoon, which going back and watching it, it's 0:08:20.800 --> 0:08:25.520 been fun to see like good representation of black people 0:08:25.760 --> 0:08:29.360 and like, like I pointed, I'd said it on Twitter, 0:08:29.400 --> 0:08:32.760 Cyborg zero O nine the like newer run looks good, 0:08:32.840 --> 0:08:38.000 the older run is tragic, is very tragic. I'd say 0:08:38.080 --> 0:08:39.800 I was like if I didn't, if I saw that, 0:08:40.600 --> 0:08:43.760 I probably would have skipped the whole joint. But the 0:08:43.880 --> 0:08:45.920 new one that got this brother. Because I was I 0:08:46.000 --> 0:08:48.120 was already like, oh, they over here breaking stereotypes. This 0:08:48.160 --> 0:08:51.480 is the brother that his power is swimming. And then 0:08:51.640 --> 0:08:53.679 and then I went back and saw the old joint, 0:08:53.679 --> 0:08:56.080 I was like, oh, no, why do that, So just 0:08:56.120 --> 0:08:59.800 stick to the newer animated Loki. When I saw you 0:08:59.840 --> 0:09:01.800 both that picture, I was like, Oh they had Drew Hill. 0:09:01.880 --> 0:09:07.640 Good job. It was like, oh, my gosh, all right, 0:09:08.360 --> 0:09:11.400 that Cisco seems like the perfect segue to talk about 0:09:11.480 --> 0:09:20.760 Dwayne to leaders in our community down uh. Dwayne McDuffie 0:09:20.840 --> 0:09:23.600 was born in nineteen sixty two and who we unfortunately 0:09:23.640 --> 0:09:26.800 lost in two thousand eleven, was keenly aware at a 0:09:26.880 --> 0:09:29.880 very young age that heroic protagonist who looked even remotely 0:09:29.920 --> 0:09:32.040 like him were nowhere to be found in comic books 0:09:32.080 --> 0:09:35.440 that he loved to read. Ethnically diverse characters were not 0:09:35.559 --> 0:09:41.040 only woefully underrepresented, but grossly inauthentic uh And profoundly inspired 0:09:41.080 --> 0:09:43.600 by seeing himself reflected in media as a hero for 0:09:43.640 --> 0:09:46.440 the first time via the Black Panther, young Dwayne grew 0:09:46.559 --> 0:09:49.600 up to become the pioneer of diversity in both mainstream 0:09:49.600 --> 0:09:54.520 comic book and animation industries UH and animation industries encouraging 0:09:54.920 --> 0:09:59.160 UH and creating widely inclusive cultural variety with contemporary, non 0:09:59.160 --> 0:10:02.600 stereotypical care to represent the hero and all of us, 0:10:02.800 --> 0:10:05.880 which is that I wanted to read that verbatim because 0:10:06.480 --> 0:10:08.439 I think that's gonna be like the theme of the 0:10:08.520 --> 0:10:11.520 whole episode. But before we even jump into it, I'm 0:10:11.520 --> 0:10:16.559 curious about what everyone's first experience with Duffy was did do? 0:10:16.760 --> 0:10:19.760 It was Static Shock, which was the first animated cartoon 0:10:19.840 --> 0:10:23.000 he did. UH. And of course, as a young kid 0:10:23.040 --> 0:10:25.440 who was like really into Batman, the animated series, I 0:10:25.520 --> 0:10:27.560 was like, Oh, they're making a black one, Like, let's 0:10:27.600 --> 0:10:30.840 check it out. UH. If you follow me on anything, 0:10:30.880 --> 0:10:32.880 you know that. I didn't discover comic books were still 0:10:32.880 --> 0:10:34.880 a real thing until I got to college, because the 0:10:34.960 --> 0:10:36.840 lesbians of the bookstore where I shopped as a kid 0:10:36.880 --> 0:10:40.160 were like, come read the classics, don't bother with any 0:10:40.200 --> 0:10:42.800 of those old comic book things. So my comic book 0:10:42.800 --> 0:10:47.640 experience was very strictly limited to television animated series specifically UM, 0:10:47.679 --> 0:10:49.320 and I was just bowled over by the fact that 0:10:49.360 --> 0:10:51.520 they're here. Was like a kid who kind of looked 0:10:51.520 --> 0:10:54.240 like me, who had superpowers, who got to like fight 0:10:54.240 --> 0:10:59.400 alongside Batman like whoa, and but also like avoided almost 0:10:59.400 --> 0:11:02.040 any story type, like he skateboarded, which people were like, 0:11:02.080 --> 0:11:04.000 that's not a black thing. It's totally a black thing. 0:11:04.160 --> 0:11:08.280 Green Campbell put some respect on his name. Uh like 0:11:08.440 --> 0:11:10.320 the fact that he you know, had parents that were 0:11:10.320 --> 0:11:12.160 both there and both loved him, and he didn't have 0:11:12.240 --> 0:11:15.200 like a lot of tragedy going around. Uh, there's everything 0:11:15.240 --> 0:11:18.920 to love about Static, but most specifically the hair. Oh yeah, 0:11:19.240 --> 0:11:21.920 I do I want to rewind and do a quick 0:11:22.240 --> 0:11:26.400 Black History Month moment about Kareem Campbell because I think, 0:11:26.559 --> 0:11:28.800 uh yeah, I can't just mention his name for those 0:11:29.120 --> 0:11:32.240 Green Campbell was one of the first black skaters I saw, 0:11:32.480 --> 0:11:34.920 and he was kind of generally one of the first 0:11:35.000 --> 0:11:38.880 black mainstream skaters. And the story behind him, uh that 0:11:38.960 --> 0:11:41.680 you know, I was I heard and I was like, oh, 0:11:41.720 --> 0:11:45.120 this is an interesting and important story and it actually 0:11:45.240 --> 0:11:48.320 we'ves right in to what we're going to talk about today. 0:11:48.520 --> 0:11:50.520 Is the fact that like when he was first making 0:11:50.559 --> 0:11:53.560 skate videos and all that he was doing this, you know, 0:11:53.840 --> 0:11:56.480 using the same rock songs that everyone was using, using 0:11:56.480 --> 0:11:58.720 the same you know this and what he was just 0:11:58.800 --> 0:12:00.680 kind of like trying to a similar late and get 0:12:00.679 --> 0:12:02.600 in that way. And then it wasn' until one day 0:12:02.679 --> 0:12:05.319 his own was like that's not you though, like you 0:12:05.320 --> 0:12:07.840 you know you you you like hip hop, you like this, 0:12:08.040 --> 0:12:11.600 you know. And then the moment he just started dressing 0:12:11.640 --> 0:12:14.920 like he dressed big baggy clothes using hip hop in 0:12:14.960 --> 0:12:17.680 his videos, that's when he stood out. And that's when 0:12:18.000 --> 0:12:20.200 like he just kind of blew up from there because 0:12:20.200 --> 0:12:22.360 no one was doing that, you know. Skateboard was still 0:12:22.400 --> 0:12:26.200 kind of on that punk rock, surf rock kind of wave. 0:12:26.600 --> 0:12:28.600 So now when you add this like hip hop, which 0:12:28.920 --> 0:12:31.040 you know, I'm gonna it's Black History Month, so I'll 0:12:31.080 --> 0:12:35.079 say this and not care. Much cooler than those of 0:12:35.240 --> 0:12:39.679 those music genres, the much cool the style, the subculture, 0:12:39.760 --> 0:12:43.000 everything about it. It's much cooler. So it was It's 0:12:43.000 --> 0:12:45.280 so funny because we're so afraid to just be ourselves 0:12:45.400 --> 0:12:48.600 because when you're in like white dominated spaces, you're like, well, 0:12:48.640 --> 0:12:50.240 I just got to do the thing, y'all do it, 0:12:50.440 --> 0:12:52.439 and then you bring like your flavor to and they're like, no, 0:12:52.600 --> 0:12:55.760 that I like the season and that you put on this. 0:12:55.760 --> 0:12:58.520 This is nice said that, because it also kind of 0:12:58.520 --> 0:13:00.280 shows like how like because we're both in the kers 0:13:00.280 --> 0:13:02.600 off the street culture go because he really gets sneakers 0:13:02.640 --> 0:13:04.839 and skate instrey. Now like Supreme and all these things, 0:13:05.080 --> 0:13:07.400 it's totally still that hip hop influence. Like all that 0:13:07.400 --> 0:13:10.200 stuff that he probably brought into it, he's still existing today. 0:13:10.520 --> 0:13:12.200 So in a way, by him being himself, he helped 0:13:12.240 --> 0:13:14.280 change the general change of culture, which is a lot 0:13:14.280 --> 0:13:16.560 of time what like African Americans do. It's that when 0:13:16.559 --> 0:13:18.040 we put our stamp on it, we put our stamp 0:13:18.040 --> 0:13:19.760 on it, and it usually stays yeah, well that And 0:13:19.800 --> 0:13:22.360 that's what's so interesting because being of that skate culture 0:13:22.360 --> 0:13:24.320 and coming in with Kareem, you know you have like 0:13:24.440 --> 0:13:27.240 Chocolate Girl, but then you had d g K dirty 0:13:27.240 --> 0:13:30.000 ghetto kids coming in and like all those like brands 0:13:30.000 --> 0:13:33.000 that are truly like nah, we were gonna be the 0:13:33.040 --> 0:13:35.920 black band. You had Zoo York, you know like that, 0:13:36.280 --> 0:13:39.319 and it just really like it really is h It 0:13:39.480 --> 0:13:41.840 made it better because like you still have like those 0:13:41.880 --> 0:13:44.400 brands that still do the punk rock type stuff, but 0:13:44.440 --> 0:13:47.480 it's just there's more diversity within it. For just the 0:13:47.559 --> 0:13:51.280 average consumer. Yeah, so it just helps to put your 0:13:51.320 --> 0:13:53.200 voice that's dope and thinking about it, like if he 0:13:53.240 --> 0:13:56.000 doesn't do that, do we get tired of the creator? Yeah, 0:13:56.000 --> 0:13:57.960 because if he by him seeing like the hip hop 0:13:57.960 --> 0:14:00.280 and his own president there him reflected in that, he's like, oh, 0:14:00.320 --> 0:14:01.840 I want to skate. I want to do these things too, 0:14:02.000 --> 0:14:04.040 which least again the whole crew and odd future and 0:14:04.080 --> 0:14:05.960 everything like that. So it's like if that doesn't happen, 0:14:05.960 --> 0:14:07.280 then maybe we don't get these things later wrong. So 0:14:07.400 --> 0:14:09.880 that's super dough. Yeah, there's there's a whole lot of 0:14:10.240 --> 0:14:12.480 what ifs I have with Tyler, Like what if Tyler's 0:14:12.520 --> 0:14:14.680 Nigerian dad was around, maybe he would have gone to 0:14:14.720 --> 0:14:16.960 the meetings that my dad is not. Me and Tyler 0:14:17.200 --> 0:14:20.240 would become homies and I would have been in our future. 0:14:20.320 --> 0:14:22.800 Like that's what I think about. I think about that 0:14:24.960 --> 0:14:26.960 right now. Yeah, I would have been the Frank Ocean 0:14:27.000 --> 0:14:31.000 and then the old dude just like yeah, yeah, Nigerian brother, 0:14:31.160 --> 0:14:37.360 let's go. Oh, So I guess for me, Um, how 0:14:37.400 --> 0:14:39.600 are you guys supposed to? Dayne was very so much 0:14:39.600 --> 0:14:41.840 of yours, but it's actually the comics. So I remember 0:14:41.880 --> 0:14:43.720 my best friend back when I was like high school whatever. 0:14:43.760 --> 0:14:45.720 He was in Falster care and sadly enough he had 0:14:45.760 --> 0:14:47.640 to it. It's like Falster parents whatever. And they were like, 0:14:47.640 --> 0:14:49.240 we're gonna throw out our comic books and he's like, 0:14:49.400 --> 0:14:51.960 the damn you will. He called me really quickly. It 0:14:52.080 --> 0:14:53.320 was like the trying to throw in my comics. I 0:14:53.320 --> 0:14:54.680 was like, got you dad, to try to do those 0:14:54.720 --> 0:14:57.360 comics we wanted. We like drove to us house picked 0:14:57.400 --> 0:15:00.560 up his comics like when everything cool, come to your books. 0:15:00.800 --> 0:15:02.280 So we drive out to my crib. He's like, yo, 0:15:02.320 --> 0:15:04.360 read them, exploring whatever. And he had been in the 0:15:04.400 --> 0:15:06.000 comics like way longer than me. So when I get 0:15:06.040 --> 0:15:07.920 back whatever and flipped, it was like, oh you got this, 0:15:07.960 --> 0:15:11.720 you got this, got static, he guess this. And I 0:15:11.760 --> 0:15:14.200 just started reading and I'm like, oh snap. They starts 0:15:14.200 --> 0:15:15.640 blowing me away and I read like through the whole 0:15:15.720 --> 0:15:18.000 run and then I'm reading Bloods and Naked and Hardware 0:15:18.040 --> 0:15:20.440 an Icon. It's like all blows me away, and it 0:15:20.520 --> 0:15:22.560 was crazy. It's like I've always been a fan of comics, 0:15:22.600 --> 0:15:24.840 like I've always levet comics and animation or whatnot. But 0:15:24.880 --> 0:15:26.440 when I used to create, like you know, my own characters. 0:15:26.440 --> 0:15:28.960 As a kid growing up, it was also always so 0:15:29.000 --> 0:15:30.960 hard to create cares of color. Everybody can I'm out white. 0:15:31.240 --> 0:15:33.200 But the moment I read Static, I was like, oh snap, 0:15:33.240 --> 0:15:35.360 I see myself. I can do this. And that's when 0:15:35.360 --> 0:15:38.000 I start coming my boom, my black characters, my Latino characters, 0:15:38.120 --> 0:15:40.160 and started like creating this like diverse array things. So 0:15:40.800 --> 0:15:42.840 thank you Dwayne because he inspired that in me, because 0:15:42.840 --> 0:15:44.120 if they didn't do that, then I would have the 0:15:44.120 --> 0:15:47.200 books i'm making now. Yes, of all, you're an amazing friend. 0:15:47.480 --> 0:15:50.120 So that is amazing that your dad was like, yes, 0:15:50.600 --> 0:15:55.080 and go right now, preserve these comic books. Stunning. Yeah, 0:15:55.160 --> 0:15:57.720 I mean that. That's kind of like it's funny that 0:15:57.800 --> 0:16:00.400 you said, like seeing that change how you view it, 0:16:00.640 --> 0:16:03.600 because it is funny how your art starts with what 0:16:03.720 --> 0:16:06.200 you liked. When I was really in a drawing, all 0:16:06.240 --> 0:16:10.840 my guys had spiky hair, buff body, spiky hair, buff bodies, 0:16:10.920 --> 0:16:13.440 and then Static came around and then they had the 0:16:13.480 --> 0:16:17.640 trunk style hair but with dreads, and I was like, 0:16:17.760 --> 0:16:20.280 that was the shift when I was like, oh, yeah, no, 0:16:20.280 --> 0:16:23.200 now I'm still gonna do the DVZ thing, but they're 0:16:23.240 --> 0:16:26.400 gonna have dreads now I remember I was watching teenage 0:16:26.480 --> 0:16:28.520 music Turtles of course, and then I was also watching 0:16:28.560 --> 0:16:30.880 Bionic six. So who was my first year character, the 0:16:30.920 --> 0:16:35.280 Bionic Ninja. I'm so original. Everyone's gonna want to buy this. 0:16:36.200 --> 0:16:37.600 And it's like, but yeah, that's what happens. Though. You 0:16:37.600 --> 0:16:39.560 get influenced by what you see and like kind of say, 0:16:39.560 --> 0:16:41.720 that's why representation is so important, because when you see 0:16:41.720 --> 0:16:43.520 it in front of you, that's what allows you to 0:16:43.560 --> 0:16:45.680 see yourself in it and take it to the next level. Yeah, 0:16:45.840 --> 0:16:47.840 And it's so funny because like you do get the 0:16:47.840 --> 0:16:49.920 pushback on like it should matter and this that and whatever. 0:16:50.040 --> 0:16:51.640 It was like, yeah, yeah, you say that, But I 0:16:51.680 --> 0:16:55.520 just can't wait for years down when diversity is normalized 0:16:55.520 --> 0:16:58.160 in the heads of everyone because they see it like 0:16:58.240 --> 0:17:01.280 you're bucking against it because you're so used to these 0:17:01.360 --> 0:17:03.680 like all white things and you've never had a problem 0:17:03.720 --> 0:17:05.879 with it because you've seen yourself within it, you know, 0:17:06.359 --> 0:17:10.640 versus like and and that's the thing is like, honestly, like, 0:17:11.480 --> 0:17:16.919 no one will have a problem with an all white cast. 0:17:17.240 --> 0:17:20.000 It's just let's mix it up. If if you had, 0:17:20.080 --> 0:17:23.440 if you had, like if we if we went through 0:17:23.440 --> 0:17:26.399 the year and all and every month you had a 0:17:26.480 --> 0:17:32.199 black panther you had, Uh what was that? Like, I'm 0:17:32.240 --> 0:17:34.680 trying to think of like a good like Latin X 0:17:34.800 --> 0:17:41.360 representation of crazy rich Asians, um spider Man, Miles Morales, 0:17:41.359 --> 0:17:44.440 Spider Man, just like representation across the board and your 0:17:44.480 --> 0:17:48.320 little women's and you're whatever. I love them, They're my 0:17:48.359 --> 0:17:50.520 favorite directors, but I'm definitely going to say they've been 0:17:50.520 --> 0:17:53.160 scared of black people since Lady Killers, the Coen Brothers, 0:17:53.920 --> 0:17:57.840 you know, like like like we we love those directors. 0:17:57.920 --> 0:18:01.200 It's just like we just want something different every now 0:18:01.200 --> 0:18:03.119 and then. Just give us alue Wing every once in a 0:18:03.080 --> 0:18:06.479 a home exactly make my movies. Give her some cash. 0:18:07.000 --> 0:18:08.439 Like I always kind of thought about that because like, well, 0:18:08.440 --> 0:18:10.320 Scorsesey got nobody for The Irishman, and I was like, 0:18:10.320 --> 0:18:12.800 oh that's cool. I was like, bro, you always making 0:18:12.800 --> 0:18:15.240 these gangster films, but like would it, why don't you 0:18:15.280 --> 0:18:17.400 just do like Scorsesey, I'm gonna a remakeup New Jack 0:18:17.440 --> 0:18:19.680 City and it is like just kind of run with however, 0:18:19.840 --> 0:18:21.080 like I want to tell the story of like Frank 0:18:21.119 --> 0:18:23.120 White in My Way and everything like that. Such mixed 0:18:23.119 --> 0:18:27.160 feelings about that because scorsese is an old white man, 0:18:28.040 --> 0:18:31.119 like he real old, and I just worry if you 0:18:31.119 --> 0:18:32.960 can handle the material. And so my my thing is 0:18:33.000 --> 0:18:34.240 if you want to stay in your lane and you 0:18:34.280 --> 0:18:36.040 don't want to venture out, I'm totally fine with that. 0:18:36.080 --> 0:18:39.680 To me. It's not the attacking the individual creator isn't 0:18:39.680 --> 0:18:42.119 necessarily going to bring about good representations. I want to 0:18:42.160 --> 0:18:43.240 hit up the studio and be like, so, I know 0:18:43.320 --> 0:18:46.000 y'all are getting pitches from a lot of people who 0:18:46.119 --> 0:18:48.199 are quality and who could make good stuff that make 0:18:48.280 --> 0:18:50.000 you money, and the fact that you guys just keep 0:18:50.000 --> 0:18:53.280 turning them down so fresh or ruining their picking them 0:18:53.320 --> 0:18:55.639 up and then subsequently ruining the project with your like 0:18:55.960 --> 0:18:58.280 incredibly white notes. But I don't understand this. We have 0:18:58.320 --> 0:19:01.920 to explain it to you. Our audience will get Jesus. So, yeah, 0:19:01.960 --> 0:19:04.040 I feel like there's there's a lot of space for 0:19:04.240 --> 0:19:07.479 you know, major corporations to maybe do their Yeah, And 0:19:07.520 --> 0:19:09.680 I think that's what it is. And I think that's 0:19:09.760 --> 0:19:12.160 that's what it really is, is that no one's trying 0:19:12.200 --> 0:19:15.080 to take your thing away to make room. Like there's 0:19:15.119 --> 0:19:18.360 this idea, this weird idea that in order to diversify 0:19:18.440 --> 0:19:23.680 things will be taking money like I think normal consumers 0:19:23.720 --> 0:19:27.040 don't realize how much money just like I I don't 0:19:27.080 --> 0:19:29.879 think consumers realize how many movies are just made that 0:19:29.960 --> 0:19:32.840 you never see, Like like there are movies that are made, 0:19:33.000 --> 0:19:36.359 they're in festivals, millions of dollars went into it, and 0:19:36.400 --> 0:19:38.880 you just never see it because it just didn't pop 0:19:38.880 --> 0:19:41.879 the way they liked. Shout out for creating array and 0:19:41.920 --> 0:19:44.879 being like I'll just release them myself exactly because like it, 0:19:45.200 --> 0:19:48.359 that's just how stuff. So it's in like every year 0:19:48.760 --> 0:19:52.600 we add thousands more things to see, so there's not 0:19:52.760 --> 0:19:56.760 a there isn't this struggle for space in the medium 0:19:56.840 --> 0:19:59.840 for people to see things. So I think there's no 0:20:00.000 --> 0:20:04.720 one should genuinely have a problem with diversity because it 0:20:04.760 --> 0:20:08.280 doesn't affect your thing if you choose not to watch it. 0:20:08.480 --> 0:20:10.720 Not only but not only that though, but it's like people, 0:20:10.800 --> 0:20:13.480 it's weird. Just in today's world, diversity is like so 0:20:13.560 --> 0:20:15.800 profitable as well. You think about like the number one 0:20:15.800 --> 0:20:18.040 franchise right now, that's damn they're on nine movies. Is 0:20:18.040 --> 0:20:21.600 fast and furious and it has an amazing diverse cast. 0:20:21.880 --> 0:20:24.760 Will play in every single country exactly. Everybody will go 0:20:24.800 --> 0:20:27.000 and see it, and like it was crazy as he 0:20:27.040 --> 0:20:29.000 will kind of realized that because when he did um 0:20:29.160 --> 0:20:32.119 Beven Diesel Triple X, Return of Xandraw Cage, which is like, 0:20:32.440 --> 0:20:34.440 that's a movie. The other thing about this though, that 0:20:34.520 --> 0:20:36.040 he would he do. He did the exact same for me. 0:20:36.119 --> 0:20:38.160 He doing Fast Furious. He brought in all these international 0:20:38.200 --> 0:20:40.200 stars and so here in America, I think it made 0:20:40.200 --> 0:20:42.639 like a hundred and fifty million whatever, but worldwide like 0:20:42.680 --> 0:20:44.919 over three or something million, So he made his budget 0:20:44.960 --> 0:20:46.640 back and then something. And so it just shows that 0:20:46.760 --> 0:20:48.760 the power of diversity, because like when people see themselves, 0:20:48.880 --> 0:20:51.800 they will go spend those dollars on that people. People 0:20:51.920 --> 0:20:54.440 sleep on my man Ven, but then be making moves. 0:20:55.200 --> 0:20:58.560 My man, Mr Diesel, watch out for him. He's such 0:20:59.040 --> 0:21:01.320 in real life. I know. That's why I loved everything 0:21:01.359 --> 0:21:06.920 about so. Uh, you know, we're gonna take a quick 0:21:07.000 --> 0:21:10.040 break while y'all still on that info we just dropped 0:21:10.080 --> 0:21:12.440 for y'all, But when we get back, we'll be talking 0:21:12.440 --> 0:21:16.200 about Dwayne's younger years, the Marvel years, all the way 0:21:16.240 --> 0:21:20.680 to d C and Milestone and all that good stuff. 0:21:21.240 --> 0:21:34.159 After these messages and we're back here, yeah, yeah, so 0:21:34.520 --> 0:21:37.920 you know, I'm I'm here with Johnny Parker, Joel Monique 0:21:38.119 --> 0:21:42.399 and where she talking about Dwayne McDuffie, his legacy and 0:21:42.480 --> 0:21:44.800 just everything around it. I think that's one thing just 0:21:44.840 --> 0:21:46.800 in case, because I noticed we did that with the 0:21:46.840 --> 0:21:49.400 static thing, and that's something I didn't like. I saw 0:21:49.400 --> 0:21:51.639 it happening, and I didn't want to stop because I 0:21:51.640 --> 0:21:54.520 think that was the spirit of these episodes, is, uh, 0:21:54.600 --> 0:21:57.719 you know, these episodes are you know, about black history 0:21:57.720 --> 0:22:00.679 Black History Month? So I'm not you know, if we 0:22:00.760 --> 0:22:05.280 bounce off of the subject and start talking about black history, 0:22:05.280 --> 0:22:07.639 black culture in general, that's kind of the spirit of 0:22:07.680 --> 0:22:10.840 the episode. So and if you're if you're paying attention, 0:22:10.840 --> 0:22:13.760 we're still dropping some some knowledge. And I mean, I 0:22:13.760 --> 0:22:16.280 think if you think about doing McDuffie specifically, in his 0:22:16.480 --> 0:22:18.920 entire goal in comics was for us to be able 0:22:18.960 --> 0:22:22.679 to have these conversations, but even further than that, Like gosh, 0:22:22.960 --> 0:22:25.120 there's so many times I wish like McDuffie were here 0:22:25.160 --> 0:22:27.600 because the circles that we run in, we would have 0:22:27.640 --> 0:22:30.159 met him so many times over already, Like I'm for 0:22:30.280 --> 0:22:33.639 sure positive I would have some kind of connected relationship 0:22:33.640 --> 0:22:36.560 with McDuffie, and like we didn't get a chance to 0:22:36.600 --> 0:22:39.160 tell to you, like, yo, you put me onto comics 0:22:39.160 --> 0:22:42.919 in a way that was like it wasn't available to me. 0:22:42.960 --> 0:22:45.640 And then here's like him tell stories of his childhood 0:22:45.640 --> 0:22:48.159 and things that really drove him to like, you know, 0:22:48.160 --> 0:22:50.399 you guys are anime fans. We've seen some very racist 0:22:50.440 --> 0:22:56.760 representations of black people. Oh gosh, we name dropping. Uh, 0:22:58.040 --> 0:23:00.639 it's it was. It was a challenge previous lead to 0:23:00.640 --> 0:23:05.560 to see representations of yourself that weren't gangsters and comics 0:23:05.600 --> 0:23:08.920 that weren't um dumb and uneducated, but they were beefy 0:23:09.000 --> 0:23:11.600 so they could fight, so totally worth it that weren't 0:23:11.800 --> 0:23:15.720 strictly just sex objects. A lot of time for women. Um, 0:23:15.840 --> 0:23:17.880 and we definitely really changed the game. And he did 0:23:17.920 --> 0:23:21.000 it like from the inside, which I think is like 0:23:21.119 --> 0:23:23.679 crazy impressive, Like the guy had no fear of just 0:23:23.760 --> 0:23:25.680 being like laying it all out there and being like, no, 0:23:25.800 --> 0:23:27.680 y'all are part of the problem, and I'm not gonna 0:23:27.680 --> 0:23:32.480 stand here and just let that continue. Yellow to see 0:23:32.520 --> 0:23:38.560 it right up. Actually they get the meat. Oh my god, Okay, 0:23:38.760 --> 0:23:42.600 please tell us all about it. So I moved out 0:23:42.640 --> 0:23:44.159 to l A back in two thousand and six to 0:23:44.560 --> 0:23:46.920 teach and write comics and everything like that. And so 0:23:47.160 --> 0:23:49.520 back when you was the world l a um, they 0:23:49.600 --> 0:23:51.080 still had a round. I remember looking at the guesses, 0:23:51.080 --> 0:23:53.920 Who's going there that year? I was like anyway, wait 0:23:54.520 --> 0:23:55.840 and I was like, Okay, I gotta go. I gotta 0:23:55.880 --> 0:23:57.480 go meet this man or whatever. So it was so dope, 0:23:57.520 --> 0:23:59.320 I gotta go here, umuce, we get a panels, we 0:23:59.359 --> 0:24:00.480 got some of the things he was doing. I think 0:24:00.480 --> 0:24:02.879 at that time he was just finishing a firestorm in tradition, 0:24:03.160 --> 0:24:05.120 going to his next project. And then he goes after 0:24:05.160 --> 0:24:06.359 the panel and I get a chance to go up 0:24:06.400 --> 0:24:07.520 to him. I was like, yeah, I just wanna say 0:24:07.560 --> 0:24:09.600 thank you for all you've done, Like I'm from Detroit, 0:24:09.640 --> 0:24:11.760 You're from Detroit, You with you mind, with you of him, 0:24:11.760 --> 0:24:13.200 and like I didn't know I was follow your foots 0:24:13.200 --> 0:24:14.480 sets for so long. Thank you first pad to make 0:24:14.560 --> 0:24:17.520 my comics everything I do. He's like, thank you, appreciate it, um, 0:24:17.680 --> 0:24:19.280 and he gave me like a cut, precise copy like 0:24:19.280 --> 0:24:22.840 static shock, and he just always carries this back. Are 0:24:22.840 --> 0:24:28.360 you seriously? Boom boom cool? Thank you Dwayne. And then 0:24:28.440 --> 0:24:29.960 it was just so dumb because after that we gotta 0:24:30.000 --> 0:24:31.119 chop it up a little bit like that. Like what 0:24:31.240 --> 0:24:33.320 was really dope is, um, if anybody's just proves from Detroit, 0:24:33.640 --> 0:24:35.359 you know, and um, the center of the city, we 0:24:35.400 --> 0:24:37.520 have a Joe Louis fist. It's like this like giant 0:24:37.520 --> 0:24:39.760 thing or whatever. Right, So the current Firestorm was based 0:24:39.760 --> 0:24:41.760 in Detroit, so he wanted to do this like final 0:24:41.800 --> 0:24:43.960 storyline where it's like fire Storms gonna face up against 0:24:44.040 --> 0:24:45.760 dark Side. He was gonna charge up the fist and 0:24:45.800 --> 0:24:47.840 they hit dark Side with it, and he was like 0:24:47.840 --> 0:24:49.600 it was gonna be dope. But he was like the 0:24:49.680 --> 0:24:52.960 anturtles told me no, and we don't do those things. 0:24:53.040 --> 0:24:55.520 I was like, okay, fine, but um but no. He 0:24:55.600 --> 0:24:57.880 was super cool, super personal, like one of the nicest people. 0:24:58.280 --> 0:25:00.440 Conversated with me for like almost like twenty thirty minutes, 0:25:00.480 --> 0:25:01.560 and I was like it was awesome. It was cool. 0:25:01.560 --> 0:25:05.480 Then oh my god, he loved her hero was actually 0:25:05.520 --> 0:25:08.639 like good, yeah in real life, you know that that 0:25:08.720 --> 0:25:14.640 warms my heart. Thank you so much. Oh man. Oh well, 0:25:15.040 --> 0:25:18.000 So for his younger years, he said that he read 0:25:18.000 --> 0:25:20.680 comic books casually like most kids did in the seventies, 0:25:20.720 --> 0:25:23.800 was a big fan of Spider Man, Fantastic four. Uh, 0:25:23.960 --> 0:25:26.520 he just never met anyone who was anything like like 0:25:26.600 --> 0:25:30.160 the black characters that existed in comics. Blacks and comics 0:25:30.240 --> 0:25:33.159 and many, many years were drawn as subhuman. The Spirit, 0:25:33.480 --> 0:25:37.440 which is a relatively realistically drawn comic Ebony White, could 0:25:37.440 --> 0:25:40.159 have been a Grimlin. I'm not sure amount of reader 0:25:40.160 --> 0:25:43.679 would understand that he was human. Uh, if you've ever 0:25:43.680 --> 0:25:46.680 seen the Spirit, he's like a great kind of like 0:25:46.960 --> 0:25:50.119 Goblin esque sidekick. He's just meant to be like a 0:25:50.160 --> 0:25:53.239 black man. Yeah. And it's you're looking at you're like, 0:25:53.280 --> 0:25:56.879 what the hell? Yeah, I'm gonna take it a second. 0:25:56.880 --> 0:26:02.480 I gotta look at this. Oh yeah, oh no, oh no, 0:26:03.040 --> 0:26:07.920 it's very any style with the pink like overly round lips. Yeah. 0:26:07.960 --> 0:26:10.520 And this cover that we're looking at, he has uh 0:26:10.520 --> 0:26:14.959 two fives and he's licking his lips. He got some 0:26:15.040 --> 0:26:18.560 cash now watch out. Oh my gosh. Yeah this is yeah, 0:26:18.840 --> 0:26:20.520 this is that was what you had. That was what 0:26:20.600 --> 0:26:24.040 you could look forward to if you were reading comics. Yeah, 0:26:24.119 --> 0:26:26.600 this was yeah. Yeah. If you look side by side, 0:26:26.640 --> 0:26:30.760 it looks like two different art styles. Yeah. That's and 0:26:30.800 --> 0:26:35.000 it's funny because like that they the energy of that, uh, 0:26:35.200 --> 0:26:38.760 the energy of of that just shows how kind of 0:26:38.800 --> 0:26:41.879 flippant racism was at the time where it's like like 0:26:41.960 --> 0:26:45.840 because too. To them, it was like, oh, this is funny, 0:26:45.920 --> 0:26:48.879 this is funny heat to have this character and and 0:26:48.920 --> 0:26:52.520 to put you know, this person in here and have 0:26:52.640 --> 0:26:58.000 him next to this like attractive tall white man's you know, 0:26:58.160 --> 0:27:01.800 you got your white voice if he so that's so 0:27:01.880 --> 0:27:08.399 it's very um, it's very like it is like if 0:27:08.400 --> 0:27:11.840 you're growing up with that, you definitely want to fight that. Yeah. Well, 0:27:11.880 --> 0:27:15.440 and I think it's disheartening to constantly be seeing yourself 0:27:15.480 --> 0:27:19.000 as that. Like I mean, listen on the playground when 0:27:19.000 --> 0:27:20.520 you were trying to figure out like who you were 0:27:20.520 --> 0:27:22.480 going to be in a group, Like listen, the girls 0:27:22.520 --> 0:27:24.879 were doing Spice Girls and they're like, you are scary 0:27:24.880 --> 0:27:27.840 Spice And I was like, I'm not participating now because 0:27:27.840 --> 0:27:30.200 I don't look scary spicies a national treasure, but because 0:27:30.200 --> 0:27:32.040 I understood what was happening at that moment, which is 0:27:32.119 --> 0:27:34.040 you're black and we don't really care about your personality 0:27:34.040 --> 0:27:35.840 outside of that, and we're going to show you in 0:27:35.920 --> 0:27:37.960 this character. And so if you're a comic book fan 0:27:38.400 --> 0:27:40.800 and you're gonna be the black character, like if you're 0:27:40.840 --> 0:27:42.520 gonna be whitey, like in the hell out of here. 0:27:42.520 --> 0:27:46.240 I don't understand. Uh, I don't understand how it happened. 0:27:46.240 --> 0:27:49.120 There was nobody there to check them on it. Uh, 0:27:49.200 --> 0:27:52.640 this is what constituted is humor and is uh they 0:27:52.640 --> 0:27:55.320 were like, no, it's inclusive. There's a black person in there. Look. 0:27:55.359 --> 0:28:00.760 And it's funny because it's like it really is like vy. 0:28:02.320 --> 0:28:04.920 It's just how it kind of carries over is like 0:28:05.240 --> 0:28:08.080 that that is the same design that we got of 0:28:08.200 --> 0:28:11.840 the sixties version of uh cyborgs zeros or eight, which 0:28:11.880 --> 0:28:14.440 was the black Cyborg. And it really is crazy how 0:28:14.560 --> 0:28:18.560 like the power of like just this racist connotation being 0:28:18.600 --> 0:28:22.920 carried over and uh and and used. And it's interesting 0:28:22.960 --> 0:28:27.280 because you know, it's often often tried to uh used 0:28:27.320 --> 0:28:29.200 to defend it where it's like, oh, they didn't know 0:28:29.280 --> 0:28:33.880 in all this, but it's like you knew. And the 0:28:33.920 --> 0:28:35.800 main problem too, is that like it goes back to 0:28:35.800 --> 0:28:37.520 like who were in those offices there, because again that's 0:28:37.520 --> 0:28:39.720 where like the racism not employing people of coloring those 0:28:39.760 --> 0:28:42.320 offices really comes to the play. Because even the nineties, 0:28:42.320 --> 0:28:44.680 when you look at Marvel, every black man that they 0:28:44.720 --> 0:28:46.560 drew had exact same look. It was like a brother 0:28:46.800 --> 0:28:49.280 like Brave with the high top every single time, like 0:28:49.280 --> 0:28:51.600 if Luke Cage and Blaze stood side by side black 0:28:51.600 --> 0:28:53.400 wait which is which? And so the thing about it 0:28:53.400 --> 0:28:55.080 is those that like But when you start hiding people 0:28:55.080 --> 0:28:56.880 of color the work in these officers, that's when you 0:28:56.880 --> 0:28:59.000 start getting interesting character designs. You start seeing like different 0:28:59.000 --> 0:29:03.440 hairstyles and those lives actually representing those books. Now seventies 0:29:03.560 --> 0:29:06.320 get up to like the early to mid nineties, he 0:29:06.440 --> 0:29:09.080 was still rock and disco like way past when it 0:29:09.120 --> 0:29:13.520 was popular or like stylish. It makes no sense, Well 0:29:13.560 --> 0:29:16.600 you only have one black acquaintance, what other what other 0:29:16.960 --> 0:29:19.240 you know samples because they ain't they ain't going down 0:29:19.280 --> 0:29:21.760 to the hood. They ain't going down to black neighborhood. 0:29:21.840 --> 0:29:24.160 So you have to think about It's funny because, like 0:29:24.640 --> 0:29:28.760 I think, the wildest thing about racism and why, like 0:29:29.120 --> 0:29:33.280 you know, the word systematic gets thrown around, is there's 0:29:33.320 --> 0:29:38.200 so many little things that can happen that makes it 0:29:38.400 --> 0:29:43.520 happened that you unintentionally, like I could like we like 0:29:43.840 --> 0:29:46.680 if someone came and was like if he I worked 0:29:46.680 --> 0:29:50.360 in Marvel and nineties and no one there, I promise 0:29:50.440 --> 0:29:52.480 you I spoke to him on no one there was racist. 0:29:53.000 --> 0:29:55.600 I could I'd still like I could believe that and 0:29:55.640 --> 0:30:00.960 still believe that this this happened. Why Because simply just 0:30:01.160 --> 0:30:06.000 not being racist doesn't like protect you from not being racist. 0:30:06.080 --> 0:30:08.120 Like you could go your whole life being like I 0:30:08.120 --> 0:30:10.760 I respect black people. I will never say the in word. 0:30:10.960 --> 0:30:14.920 But if you're not aware of the microaggressions and things 0:30:14.920 --> 0:30:19.520 that affect them, then you are walking through life with 0:30:19.560 --> 0:30:21.760 a blind side. You don't you don't know things you 0:30:21.800 --> 0:30:25.600 can accidentally do. I mean, it's the same thing of like, 0:30:25.920 --> 0:30:28.000 because people always try and like make it seem like 0:30:28.160 --> 0:30:30.520 such a complex race thing, where I was like, why 0:30:30.560 --> 0:30:32.120 does it matter if you touch your head or why 0:30:32.160 --> 0:30:34.400 does like micro aggressions don't matter. But it's the same 0:30:34.400 --> 0:30:37.520 thing of if your mom has died, If your mom 0:30:37.520 --> 0:30:39.840 has died, I don't know your mom died. We out 0:30:39.920 --> 0:30:42.240 joking and I say your mama. That's gonna hit you 0:30:42.520 --> 0:30:45.640 way differently than if I say someone that started so 0:30:45.680 --> 0:30:48.560 many fights back when I was growing up, all because 0:30:48.560 --> 0:30:52.440 it's like an unseen fact about this person that they've 0:30:52.480 --> 0:30:56.320 lost their parents, so anything said about said parents hurts more. 0:30:56.720 --> 0:30:59.640 That's the exact same thing when it comes to race 0:30:59.840 --> 0:31:02.360 is there. There are things that have affected people of 0:31:02.360 --> 0:31:05.440 color in different ways. That's the you know, that's why 0:31:05.520 --> 0:31:09.760 you can't have a black person with monkey on the 0:31:09.840 --> 0:31:12.520 t for your h and image. Like we get, we 0:31:12.600 --> 0:31:15.080 know that that's not what you mean. But if you 0:31:15.160 --> 0:31:19.080 are refusing to look at the history, the widely sold 0:31:19.120 --> 0:31:21.760 comic book that were that, where you can google and 0:31:21.840 --> 0:31:25.160 see the animals that too, that portray us, the look 0:31:25.240 --> 0:31:27.680 that they're going for is a monkey like like it 0:31:27.720 --> 0:31:30.040 looks weird. We're saying gremlin, we're saying pick in any 0:31:30.200 --> 0:31:33.840 but they're making they they try because it's historically a 0:31:33.960 --> 0:31:38.480 thing that has happened. So you're not you're not a racist. 0:31:38.800 --> 0:31:43.360 But if you accidentally label someone you did a racist thing, 0:31:43.400 --> 0:31:46.720 and that's fine. Everyone will make mistakes. Instead of trying 0:31:46.720 --> 0:31:50.000 to fight for over a label that isn't being labeled 0:31:50.000 --> 0:31:53.400 on you, we're labeling the action. Fix the action. Stop 0:31:53.480 --> 0:31:56.960 defending yourself, because we never defense is what starts making 0:31:57.000 --> 0:32:00.840 you a racist. Just I mean, no, it's fine, Well 0:32:00.880 --> 0:32:05.600 it's not fine. It's it's the simple thing of like 0:32:05.680 --> 0:32:08.800 I think, I think, if we're being honest, we've all 0:32:08.840 --> 0:32:17.480 been black a while, we've all been to my life. Well, 0:32:17.520 --> 0:32:21.280 and we've all been online a while and now, you know, 0:32:21.880 --> 0:32:26.120 conversations online are getting more progressive, like are like, it's funny, 0:32:26.160 --> 0:32:29.600 you know, we got lines of people wearing their woecats. 0:32:29.640 --> 0:32:32.000 But I remember when tray Von happened and I had 0:32:32.040 --> 0:32:36.120 to convince people that it wasn't an isolated incident. You know, yeah, 0:32:36.280 --> 0:32:38.480 like we so so we've come a long way in 0:32:38.560 --> 0:32:43.120 conversations about race, but there is this genuine fear everyone. 0:32:43.640 --> 0:32:46.240 It's so funny because like there I think we're at 0:32:46.240 --> 0:32:48.800 a point where people are more afraid of being called 0:32:48.880 --> 0:32:53.440 racist than being racist, because you're afraid of like your 0:32:53.520 --> 0:32:56.400 image and it's like, it's not about that. But then 0:32:56.640 --> 0:32:59.560 you know, this would be a longer conversation because we 0:32:59.640 --> 0:33:02.240 do there are we you have technology the other side 0:33:02.280 --> 0:33:04.880 that is for some reason about that where they want 0:33:04.920 --> 0:33:08.840 to take a small piece of information run with it, 0:33:08.960 --> 0:33:11.479 and you know, there's all different But I think at 0:33:11.520 --> 0:33:15.440 the end of the day, everyone should just listen more. 0:33:17.360 --> 0:33:21.320 It absolutely be more helpful. I think I feel like 0:33:21.360 --> 0:33:24.480 that's McDuffie tried to do that a lot throughout his career. 0:33:25.400 --> 0:33:29.960 A skip forward to the teenage Negro Ninja thrashers. Uh. 0:33:30.360 --> 0:33:32.680 Portion of our segment today, which is sort of one 0:33:32.680 --> 0:33:35.120 of the most iconic things that McDuffie has done in 0:33:35.200 --> 0:33:37.600 his career, which is he's worked at both of the 0:33:37.640 --> 0:33:40.680 Big two. He started off at Marvel. He was an 0:33:40.720 --> 0:33:46.080 assistant to the editor Bob who dance key but Dansky. Um. 0:33:46.400 --> 0:33:48.760 They like worked on these super epic cards as real 0:33:48.800 --> 0:33:50.880 circle back to in a minute. Um, that sort of 0:33:50.880 --> 0:33:54.160 started the Marvel card catalog. Um. He worked on a 0:33:54.200 --> 0:33:57.160 lot of things like the Damage Control comic books, which 0:33:57.160 --> 0:34:00.640 again we'll circle back to because they're incredible. But he 0:34:00.680 --> 0:34:04.280 was also not a silent black man. He wasn't there 0:34:04.320 --> 0:34:05.760 to get along. He was there to make the kind 0:34:05.800 --> 0:34:07.960 of comics he wanted to see as a kid. So 0:34:08.239 --> 0:34:12.000 on December thirteenth, nineteen eighty nine, when Joel was two 0:34:12.000 --> 0:34:16.799 months old, Uh, crazy, guys, time is weird. Um, he 0:34:16.840 --> 0:34:19.440 wrote this letter. I'm gonna do a dramatic interpretation of it. 0:34:19.960 --> 0:34:24.520 In the past year of all African American superheroes appearing 0:34:24.520 --> 0:34:29.960 in the Marvel universe possessed skateboard based superpowers and attempt 0:34:30.080 --> 0:34:32.400 to remain on the cutting edge of comics, I hereby 0:34:32.480 --> 0:34:35.680 propose a new series that will fully exploit this existing 0:34:35.760 --> 0:34:40.120 new trend. Teenage Negro Ninja Thrashers. When a group of 0:34:40.160 --> 0:34:45.800 teenage negroes fine comic powers skateboards, their lives are forever changed. 0:34:46.200 --> 0:34:50.279 A team of distinct characters joined together, swerving, swearing an 0:34:50.280 --> 0:34:54.239 oath to use their powers for good. The characters are 0:34:54.480 --> 0:34:58.560 Rocket Racer, a black guy on a skateboard, Nightmare Thrasher, 0:34:58.719 --> 0:35:03.760 a black guy on a skateboard, and dark really black 0:35:03.800 --> 0:35:07.919 guy on a skateboard, and their leader, the mysterious black 0:35:07.920 --> 0:35:11.120 guy on a skateboard. Not only as that mysterious black 0:35:11.120 --> 0:35:14.120 guy on a skateboard, this is a surefire hit as 0:35:14.160 --> 0:35:18.560 it contains all of these popular elements CIRCA nine clothing 0:35:18.560 --> 0:35:22.960 and hairstyle, bizarre speech patterns unrecognizable by any member of 0:35:23.040 --> 0:35:26.160 any culture on this planet. A smart white friend to 0:35:26.200 --> 0:35:29.839 help them out of trouble. Their heroes, their heroes who 0:35:29.880 --> 0:35:31.799 could be you if you were a black I mean, 0:35:32.120 --> 0:35:35.839 they're on skateboards. They have an attractive white female friend 0:35:35.840 --> 0:35:39.279 to calm them down when they get too excited. Face it, Pilgrim, 0:35:39.320 --> 0:35:41.880 that one's got it all? Have I made my point? 0:35:44.520 --> 0:35:48.399 Can you imagine sending this to your boss? I mean 0:35:49.040 --> 0:35:51.600 We were talking about this a bit with the Milestone 0:35:51.640 --> 0:35:55.800 eraw and it's the one of that the beautiful comfortable 0:35:55.800 --> 0:35:58.719 place that you could be in as a black creative 0:35:58.800 --> 0:36:03.520 when you realize you have marked your place in your 0:36:04.200 --> 0:36:09.600 in your like undeniability and you know, like like these 0:36:09.600 --> 0:36:11.719 are all power moves. Like he knows he's at the 0:36:11.760 --> 0:36:15.400 top of his game at the time. He he like 0:36:16.000 --> 0:36:19.799 he probably still was like I'm I'm walking the line here, 0:36:19.960 --> 0:36:24.400 but he also knew they have a big, gigantic, uh 0:36:24.600 --> 0:36:27.000 you know, competition that he can just go over that 0:36:27.000 --> 0:36:28.960 will scoop him up for a second because you know, 0:36:29.400 --> 0:36:32.319 so like it is interesting because they're the power of 0:36:32.920 --> 0:36:37.080 a person of color. With power, U allows you to 0:36:37.120 --> 0:36:39.279 make change and it's and it's and he gets to 0:36:39.920 --> 0:36:44.960 it's funny because in a way this is the nicer 0:36:45.080 --> 0:36:47.440 version because he could have just straight and be like, look, 0:36:47.480 --> 0:36:49.560 this is a problem. This is why it's a problem. 0:36:50.239 --> 0:36:52.200 But he was like, oh, I will make them laugh 0:36:52.719 --> 0:36:55.880 with this, like funny you know, pitch but kind of 0:36:55.960 --> 0:36:59.239 like make a point about it. It was interating as 0:36:59.280 --> 0:37:01.360 well as you say that about how he's like standing 0:37:01.400 --> 0:37:02.880 up and everything and like he has an opportunity to 0:37:02.960 --> 0:37:05.719 other swater. So he's like confident himself. But it's also 0:37:05.760 --> 0:37:07.560 crazy because he has this like as he does this, 0:37:08.000 --> 0:37:09.480 he's doing it because it's the right thing to do. 0:37:09.960 --> 0:37:12.000 Like he's taking a stand because sometimes you have to 0:37:12.000 --> 0:37:13.880 take a stand. You have to take risks because if 0:37:13.920 --> 0:37:16.320 you don't do it, we don't get changed, and it 0:37:16.440 --> 0:37:18.080 might become because I'm not sure you guys know this, 0:37:18.120 --> 0:37:20.640 but like after he finished as an English major, he 0:37:20.680 --> 0:37:22.640 actually became a physicist and went there for grad school. 0:37:22.880 --> 0:37:24.040 But one of the things that happened when he was 0:37:24.040 --> 0:37:26.000 in grad school he discovered that some of the technology 0:37:26.040 --> 0:37:28.080 had to research and developed was being used in patriot 0:37:28.120 --> 0:37:31.280 messals against without his permission, and so he had no idea. 0:37:31.320 --> 0:37:33.200 But when he found this out, he became dishired, and 0:37:33.239 --> 0:37:34.640 that's what made him go to New York and start 0:37:34.640 --> 0:37:36.480 studying film and everything like that. But it just kind 0:37:36.480 --> 0:37:37.840 of goes to that point he's just like like no, 0:37:37.960 --> 0:37:40.080 like we can't just allow ourselves to be by standards 0:37:40.400 --> 0:37:42.320 in this process. Is we have to take a stand. 0:37:42.640 --> 0:37:44.239 And that's something he's always like stood behind, which just 0:37:44.280 --> 0:37:46.279 makes him so admirable. I mean, this also sounds like 0:37:46.600 --> 0:37:48.520 a black person who's been were here around white people 0:37:48.520 --> 0:37:52.480 for a long time and it's tired, um, because it's 0:37:52.600 --> 0:37:56.560 as gentle as it is. Imagine you've been writing one 0:37:56.600 --> 0:38:01.160 of the black superheroes on skateboard comic books. Like that 0:38:01.600 --> 0:38:04.640 is a slap in the face. Like it's very like 0:38:04.920 --> 0:38:08.239 up front and also sort of almost reads like like 0:38:08.320 --> 0:38:11.400 either change it or I'm leaving sort of vibe to 0:38:11.560 --> 0:38:14.520 it because like and also the vibe of like, I've 0:38:14.520 --> 0:38:17.520 said this before many times in many separate ways, and 0:38:17.560 --> 0:38:20.000 I cannot make it any more clear than the statement 0:38:20.080 --> 0:38:22.200 right here. It's such a ballsy move. And I wish 0:38:22.239 --> 0:38:25.279 we had more of his own direct quote on like 0:38:25.320 --> 0:38:28.840 that experience and what it was like, um, because I 0:38:28.880 --> 0:38:31.120 think it must have been. I imagine it to be 0:38:31.200 --> 0:38:34.040 somewhat frightening and also liberating at the same time. Definitely 0:38:34.080 --> 0:38:36.560 just do it and doing it. And it's it's interesting 0:38:36.600 --> 0:38:40.799 too because I do wonder about like the culture at 0:38:40.840 --> 0:38:44.120 Marvel around this time, because after a video that I 0:38:44.160 --> 0:38:49.280 think you shared of Stanley with Todd McFarlane and Rob 0:38:49.320 --> 0:38:54.480 Life felt drawing and Stanley hated guys. It's the most 0:38:54.560 --> 0:38:56.759 epic video, Like if you ever see an old person 0:38:56.840 --> 0:38:59.520 take down a young person, just verbally, and it's it's 0:38:59.560 --> 0:39:01.640 so eat in the Stanley way. I've been meaning to 0:39:01.680 --> 0:39:04.760 talk to you guys about these feet. What are you drawing? 0:39:04.840 --> 0:39:07.640 These weird little feet on these giant bodies. I think 0:39:07.640 --> 0:39:09.360 it takes you longer to write your signature than it 0:39:09.400 --> 0:39:13.800 takes you to draw this comic book page. Stanley is vicious, 0:39:13.840 --> 0:39:16.400 so good, But yeah, it was. It does not seem 0:39:16.440 --> 0:39:22.319 like a great uh cozy comforting like they were. They 0:39:22.360 --> 0:39:25.520 were they were their box and every every day. Stanley 0:39:25.560 --> 0:39:29.120 had left in the seventies to start the Hollywood portion 0:39:29.200 --> 0:39:32.279 of Marvel out of New York. And then if we 0:39:32.480 --> 0:39:36.960 consider the comic Boom fail in the nineties, man, yeah, 0:39:37.280 --> 0:39:38.840 it's it's got to be a lot because it's a 0:39:38.880 --> 0:39:42.200 lot of changeover in who's running the company, in the 0:39:42.200 --> 0:39:44.040 direction of the company, and the fact that okay, so 0:39:44.080 --> 0:39:47.640 now we're allocating resources to TV. Comics have always had 0:39:47.680 --> 0:39:52.839 sort of a competitive nature with moving pictures, as it were. 0:39:53.680 --> 0:39:55.759 It's an art formals and we gotta respect just the 0:39:55.800 --> 0:39:59.839 comic book aspect of it. Yeah, yeah, this is right 0:40:00.120 --> 0:40:03.680 for that said boom. But yeah, before we go forward, 0:40:04.000 --> 0:40:07.960 I think, yeah, we should um talk about damage control 0:40:08.080 --> 0:40:12.239 and the cards that he was working on. Yes, I 0:40:12.320 --> 0:40:15.160 really liked the cards. I pulled a couple of samples 0:40:15.200 --> 0:40:17.520 to look at. They have this one where it's a 0:40:17.600 --> 0:40:20.200 nine card, Like if you collect these nine cards, they 0:40:20.239 --> 0:40:25.560 form a bunch of different villains surrounding Galactus. And it 0:40:25.640 --> 0:40:29.240 is so they're like very nineties and like the black 0:40:29.840 --> 0:40:32.360 Star kind of background within like a ton of like 0:40:32.480 --> 0:40:36.160 Neon colors up front, all the muscles on all of 0:40:36.160 --> 0:40:39.080 the Euros, even the ladies are kind of bulked up 0:40:39.080 --> 0:40:43.080 a little bit. Uh. It is like they're really beautiful cards. 0:40:43.080 --> 0:40:45.640 And at this point McDuffie started this project, I want 0:40:45.640 --> 0:40:48.920 to say, in eighty nine, he's working as an assistant. Um, 0:40:49.000 --> 0:40:52.719 so they're not his designs, but he's helping curate, coordinate. 0:40:52.800 --> 0:40:55.200 And it's these sort of put a huge landmark out 0:40:55.239 --> 0:40:58.239 there for kids who maybe hadn't gotten into comics or 0:40:58.239 --> 0:40:59.919 didn't know all the characters yet. It was a great 0:41:00.040 --> 0:41:02.800 sort of launch platform for people to get into comics. 0:41:02.800 --> 0:41:04.719 And I think that sort of speaks to McDuffie's entire 0:41:04.760 --> 0:41:07.880 career has been sort of like opening a gate to 0:41:07.880 --> 0:41:12.359 allow new people into comic books. Yeah, um yeah. And 0:41:12.400 --> 0:41:15.560 then uh. Then after his kind of first major work 0:41:15.719 --> 0:41:18.120 was the Damage Control comic you were talking about. What 0:41:18.400 --> 0:41:21.120 was that about? Okay, So Damage Control is maybe one 0:41:21.120 --> 0:41:23.319 of the most unique cool ideas to come out of 0:41:23.320 --> 0:41:25.840 Marvel in this era, and it's the idea like, what 0:41:26.000 --> 0:41:29.960 happens after a giant superhero battle. There's this huge mess 0:41:30.000 --> 0:41:32.399 some it's gonna be someone's job to come and clean 0:41:32.440 --> 0:41:35.880 this up. So Tony Stark and Wilson Fisk become partners 0:41:36.400 --> 0:41:40.279 to create a new thing called Damage Control um the 0:41:40.360 --> 0:41:43.000 US Department of Damage called the d d c UH. 0:41:43.040 --> 0:41:45.560 And by partnering, if it's the villain's fault, were the 0:41:45.560 --> 0:41:47.920 hero's fault, we can kind of bowl clean it up together, 0:41:48.280 --> 0:41:51.440 which sort of makes a statement about comics, which is 0:41:51.480 --> 0:41:53.880 this idea of like, oh, we don't need try to 0:41:53.920 --> 0:41:56.799 stop fighting or it's gonna be forever, so we need 0:41:56.840 --> 0:41:58.640 to figure out a way to work together to make 0:41:58.640 --> 0:42:00.680 sure we don't have people to man at us about 0:42:00.680 --> 0:42:02.880 the fact that we're fighting and destroying half of this intera. 0:42:03.200 --> 0:42:05.319 So you get a ton of like man on the 0:42:05.320 --> 0:42:08.680 ground quips, and it's I think this very much highlights 0:42:08.719 --> 0:42:11.040 what McDuffie's gonna do later when he goes to d C. 0:42:11.600 --> 0:42:14.960 And it's the idea of like not just superheroes, but 0:42:15.360 --> 0:42:17.960 how are people impacted by superheroes and how does that 0:42:18.040 --> 0:42:20.160 make this world different from the world we live in. 0:42:20.840 --> 0:42:23.440 And it's so much more interesting, I think than just 0:42:23.560 --> 0:42:26.960 like end of the World stuff. I've read maybe like 0:42:27.080 --> 0:42:30.040 several hundred End of the World comic books. Almost every 0:42:30.080 --> 0:42:32.239 movie is about like the heroes, don't do this, it's 0:42:32.280 --> 0:42:35.120 the end of the world. It's too much, it's too dramatic. 0:42:35.200 --> 0:42:36.719 We can't always be like that's life and death, and 0:42:36.760 --> 0:42:38.680 that's a whole lot. And in between there there's a 0:42:38.680 --> 0:42:41.640 ton of emotional beats that we're missing that are intriguing, 0:42:42.160 --> 0:42:45.600 um that talk about like the real life things that 0:42:45.680 --> 0:42:48.000 we as the reader the viewer are going through. And 0:42:48.080 --> 0:42:49.640 you get all of that in Damage Control. And on 0:42:49.680 --> 0:42:54.439 top of that, it's hilarious. It's amazing, Like the first 0:42:54.600 --> 0:42:57.040 pay the first five issues when I firstart getting collecting comics, 0:42:57.040 --> 0:42:59.080 and it's so good. Like one of the beats in it, 0:42:59.080 --> 0:43:01.560 it's like the like you know, they're cleanup of supervillain 0:43:01.560 --> 0:43:04.160 accent or whatever. It's a constructure on site. One of 0:43:04.160 --> 0:43:06.520 the construction guys like finding a purple or but whatever 0:43:06.760 --> 0:43:09.080 it picks up, he changes it like huge galactic being 0:43:09.160 --> 0:43:11.880 or whatever. He's like, I must need leave now I 0:43:11.920 --> 0:43:14.399 have a higher purpose. And the crew form is like, man, 0:43:14.440 --> 0:43:18.320 that's the third guy this week. It's just what, Yeah, 0:43:18.400 --> 0:43:19.880 that's just the beast of they all go through, and 0:43:19.880 --> 0:43:21.960 like the second issue is like so dope because it's 0:43:22.000 --> 0:43:23.640 either second or third or four this issue where it's 0:43:23.680 --> 0:43:25.840 like the covers like Dr Doom and they counter it, 0:43:25.840 --> 0:43:27.560 which is a black guy for him because includes a 0:43:27.560 --> 0:43:30.160 diversity there. It's like, you're gonna pay off Doom. And 0:43:30.200 --> 0:43:31.960 the whole thing is like the whole issues about him 0:43:31.960 --> 0:43:34.040 going trying to get doomed to pay on a check 0:43:34.080 --> 0:43:37.560 the heels damage control and it's just hilarious. It's like seriously, 0:43:37.760 --> 0:43:39.160 but he don't care. He's like, doesn't care, he's a 0:43:39.160 --> 0:43:40.920 digcare the case from like very he's like that man 0:43:41.040 --> 0:43:45.239 gonna pay what he out. He goes out and you 0:43:45.280 --> 0:43:48.840 know I'm gonna jump. So he does walle at d C. 0:43:49.080 --> 0:43:52.719 But I think the biggest point of d C is Milestone. 0:43:53.239 --> 0:43:55.040 And the reason I want to jump in Milestone is 0:43:55.280 --> 0:43:58.240 I didn't know that bit about McDuffie and the Patriot 0:43:58.280 --> 0:44:02.440 missile because that is so similar to the story of hardware. 0:44:03.000 --> 0:44:05.879 So it's so it's so cool to know that that 0:44:06.000 --> 0:44:09.560 was actually inspired by you know, because you know, it's 0:44:09.680 --> 0:44:11.480 it's always don't win. Like you hear a track and 0:44:11.520 --> 0:44:13.719 they're like, well, this is the events that inspired He's like, 0:44:13.760 --> 0:44:16.680 I hear that. I hear that now, So can you 0:44:16.680 --> 0:44:20.279 guys break down Hardware for fans that don't haven't read him. Yeah, 0:44:20.360 --> 0:44:22.240 if you haven't read him, first, go to the Milestone 0:44:22.239 --> 0:44:25.399 media episode. We break him down. But to say it again, uh, 0:44:25.440 --> 0:44:30.200 so Hardware is essentially Milestone's Iron Man. He was he was, 0:44:30.320 --> 0:44:32.799 you know, taken in by this white man who like 0:44:32.920 --> 0:44:37.160 funded his schooling. Uh and and and he funded his schooling. 0:44:37.280 --> 0:44:39.840 He was like this top engineer and now he's working 0:44:39.840 --> 0:44:43.399 for this like huge like um tech company. But he 0:44:43.440 --> 0:44:47.080 finds out that they're like making black market weapons. And 0:44:47.560 --> 0:44:49.719 actually before he finds out out, he asked for a 0:44:49.719 --> 0:44:51.399 piece of steak in the company. He's like, hey, I've 0:44:51.400 --> 0:44:54.600 been working, I've been inventing all these things for you. Yeah, 0:44:54.760 --> 0:44:56.239 maybe I get a piece of the pie. And he 0:44:56.320 --> 0:44:58.560 was like, you were just a tool. I took you. 0:44:58.640 --> 0:45:00.520 I I built you a sharp you. You You were just 0:45:00.560 --> 0:45:03.720 a tool for me. You get nothing. You should be happy, 0:45:03.760 --> 0:45:07.440 you should be thanking me. So then he angry, you know, 0:45:07.480 --> 0:45:10.200 he starts getting resentful. He does them digging, finds out 0:45:10.239 --> 0:45:12.880 they're making black market weapons, tries to go through the 0:45:12.880 --> 0:45:15.320 proper means FBI and all this. They do nothing because 0:45:15.360 --> 0:45:18.200 their hands are and everything. Then he becomes Hardware to 0:45:18.280 --> 0:45:22.000 come stop them from using those uh inventions that he 0:45:22.080 --> 0:45:26.160 made for weapons. That is incredible and I like the 0:45:26.200 --> 0:45:29.239 idea that likely couldn't possibly have gone up against the 0:45:29.320 --> 0:45:31.400 United States government to be like, take my technology at 0:45:31.440 --> 0:45:33.360 your missiles. And so for him to be able to 0:45:33.360 --> 0:45:34.719 put it in a comic book and share it with 0:45:34.760 --> 0:45:39.320 the world and be like, the power of art is 0:45:39.360 --> 0:45:42.600 like when you feel like weak and helpless, you create 0:45:42.640 --> 0:45:45.400 this world in which you can handle that problem. You 0:45:45.440 --> 0:45:48.000 know for sure it's crazy too those because well they 0:45:48.120 --> 0:45:50.080 groups of the filers talk about it, but when Big 0:45:50.120 --> 0:45:53.160 Deffite doeskin. They mentioned that Hardware also represents their struggle 0:45:53.200 --> 0:45:55.319 with in the comedy Stree itself because its creators they 0:45:55.320 --> 0:45:57.799 are creating these awesome like heroes or whatnot, but they 0:45:57.840 --> 0:45:59.719 don't actually own a stake within the company, and so 0:45:59.800 --> 0:46:01.919 when asked for it, they're told, no, you're getting paid 0:46:01.920 --> 0:46:04.200 a salary, you getting paid a wage. This is UM. 0:46:04.640 --> 0:46:06.239 You can't own any of this. So that kind of 0:46:06.239 --> 0:46:08.680 sparks most people do Milestone Comics itself. So it's so 0:46:08.800 --> 0:46:11.200 dope because within like hardware, there's this duality of like 0:46:11.280 --> 0:46:14.560 both those allegories going on. Yeah, to do a multiple 0:46:14.960 --> 0:46:18.080 episode pool for you, uh, if you're just tuning into 0:46:18.160 --> 0:46:20.440 this for the first time. Yeah, we talked about that 0:46:20.560 --> 0:46:23.320 in UM in the Milestone episodes. But also what we 0:46:23.400 --> 0:46:25.719 talked about in the Milestone episodes is something we talked 0:46:25.719 --> 0:46:29.439 about in our Image episode is Milestone was created after 0:46:29.640 --> 0:46:32.200 Image Comics left, and if you don't know what happened, 0:46:32.239 --> 0:46:34.680 Image Comics basically wanted that. They're like, Yo, we're making 0:46:34.719 --> 0:46:37.400 these characters, y'all starting to do movies. We need a 0:46:37.440 --> 0:46:39.800 piece of this company. They said no, They're like I 0:46:40.640 --> 0:46:44.520 and yeah, this is what was. It was like Todd McFarlane, Uh, 0:46:45.760 --> 0:46:50.719 Jim Um and one more who I always forget who 0:46:50.760 --> 0:46:54.680 created savastrat Night. Yeah, and he that was like the 0:46:54.840 --> 0:46:57.520 mount Rushmore of comics at the time. So that was 0:46:57.600 --> 0:47:00.160 a huge hit. So then to have their other are 0:47:00.239 --> 0:47:03.080 like stars come up and like, look, we're about to 0:47:03.120 --> 0:47:05.880 do what they did because when they pitched, they brought 0:47:06.040 --> 0:47:08.640 like all these stories they had, Like they didn't just 0:47:08.800 --> 0:47:11.880 pitch like with thoughts and ideas, they had bibles. So 0:47:12.560 --> 0:47:15.840 DC was like, well, we don't want another Image comics 0:47:15.920 --> 0:47:18.640 because Image at this point probably was tearing them up 0:47:19.040 --> 0:47:24.600 because Image was spot alone. Was Yeah, it was interesting. 0:47:24.680 --> 0:47:27.200 DC made the right move. Because Greg Pulo talks about this. 0:47:27.440 --> 0:47:29.200 He's artists on Court of Owls. He also do small 0:47:29.200 --> 0:47:31.239 for a long time. Greg says he started at Marvel 0:47:31.280 --> 0:47:33.600 during that time period, but Marvel wasn't happened none of that. 0:47:33.760 --> 0:47:36.000 So they didn't want another situation where like all star 0:47:36.080 --> 0:47:37.920 artists relieved whatever, So they did the opposite of DC. 0:47:38.280 --> 0:47:40.680 They put people down, so they were promoting you. They 0:47:40.760 --> 0:47:42.719 were putting you out there as much or whatever. So Greg, 0:47:42.760 --> 0:47:45.520 you just just killed the artists as the hero or 0:47:45.560 --> 0:47:48.360 the inspired exact nuts. So he felt that tension the air, 0:47:48.440 --> 0:47:50.239 which he called shimile later on or whatever. Yeah, it 0:47:50.320 --> 0:47:52.000 was like during that time period after that left, it 0:47:52.120 --> 0:47:53.680 was like DC made the right play instead of was 0:47:53.680 --> 0:47:57.000 trying to fight against it. Let's promoted from with them. Yeah, man, 0:47:57.360 --> 0:48:01.279 that's that's it's so wild to just the politics that 0:48:01.400 --> 0:48:03.160 go in because you know, when you think about it, 0:48:03.200 --> 0:48:05.239 we just go in and buy the comics that are available. 0:48:05.320 --> 0:48:07.759 We often forget that, like, you know, these are people 0:48:07.800 --> 0:48:09.640 trying to make a living and all this, and it's 0:48:09.680 --> 0:48:13.960 even harder now because buying as much comics. I think 0:48:14.000 --> 0:48:15.680 it's also a great What worked out of the deal 0:48:15.760 --> 0:48:18.360 is the fact that Like Milestone was then able to 0:48:18.440 --> 0:48:21.240 integrate a lot of their characters into the d C. Cannon, 0:48:21.719 --> 0:48:23.920 which for me as a kid was vital because I 0:48:24.160 --> 0:48:27.560 definitely wouldn't have found Milestone on my own, and without that, 0:48:27.680 --> 0:48:30.200 then I don't have Rocket, Who's instantly became a favorite 0:48:30.200 --> 0:48:32.160 of the second I saw her, like oh is this love? 0:48:32.320 --> 0:48:36.160 Like she got the shortcut, like wow, and it jumpsuit 0:48:36.239 --> 0:48:40.080 ready to go, like Icon is amazing, like the Alien 0:48:40.120 --> 0:48:43.479 who've been here forever and chooses to be presented as black, 0:48:43.600 --> 0:48:45.719 like that will always be a writer tie for me. 0:48:46.280 --> 0:48:48.080 Um And now when you know, of course the Wich 0:48:48.080 --> 0:48:50.120 shows like Young Justice and Justice League and all of that, 0:48:50.200 --> 0:48:52.640 we've been able to see some of our favorite characters 0:48:52.760 --> 0:48:56.120 like Satic appear alongside like our favorite team heroes and 0:48:56.160 --> 0:48:59.239 now they're just a part of that universe. Yeah, and 0:48:59.320 --> 0:49:02.640 then really I'm excited to jump into DC animation, but 0:49:02.719 --> 0:49:13.680 we're gonna do that right after these messages and we're back. 0:49:14.239 --> 0:49:17.480 Are you're doing. We're talking Dwayne McDuffie, I have Johnny 0:49:17.560 --> 0:49:22.560 Parker and Joel Monique. So before we get into DC animation, Uh, 0:49:22.760 --> 0:49:25.360 you know, let's let's talk about some DC drama. You 0:49:25.480 --> 0:49:27.520 had some DC drama. You you had the tea, You 0:49:27.600 --> 0:49:31.000 had the tea, Let me pull out the cups. It 0:49:31.080 --> 0:49:33.680 got so juicy, got so juicy. So pretty much as 0:49:33.719 --> 0:49:36.080 Milestone is going along whatever, they making progress, having these 0:49:36.080 --> 0:49:38.000 great sales, static Shock is embraced when he go awards 0:49:38.040 --> 0:49:40.000 or whatever. So Dwayne and company are trying to like 0:49:40.040 --> 0:49:42.600 push the envelope as far as doing authentic storytelling. So 0:49:42.680 --> 0:49:45.120 for one issue, a static Shock is around the teams 0:49:45.160 --> 0:49:47.719 like sixteen or somewhere around there. There's a cover which 0:49:47.760 --> 0:49:50.160 has Static on the couch making out with his girlfriend. 0:49:50.239 --> 0:49:52.960 Oh yeah, so pretty much it's like it's like it's 0:49:53.000 --> 0:49:54.520 nothing like to or scared whatever. They both have their 0:49:54.520 --> 0:49:56.719 clothes on, but they're like making out. And then there's 0:49:56.719 --> 0:50:00.080 also some condoms nearby whatever, because they're gonna be intimate whatever. Oh. 0:50:00.239 --> 0:50:02.759 The head of DC at this time shuts it down. 0:50:02.840 --> 0:50:04.440 He's like, look, no, you can't do this. And then 0:50:04.560 --> 0:50:06.600 Dwayne is like, no, we can't do this. We're our 0:50:06.640 --> 0:50:08.759 own company. I'm that or in chieved. We need to 0:50:08.800 --> 0:50:10.520 go and do this. He's like, not only that, yo, 0:50:10.600 --> 0:50:12.480 but if we look in the history of comics, you've 0:50:12.520 --> 0:50:15.120 had way more risque covers. Like there's a cover She's like, 0:50:15.239 --> 0:50:16.960 I got all that stuff trolled off or whatever. It's 0:50:16.960 --> 0:50:19.160 like it looks almost like a Playboy cover. So Dwayne's like, 0:50:19.360 --> 0:50:22.440 we're doing something lay more tamed. That you're intimidated by this, 0:50:22.520 --> 0:50:23.920 and he writes a letter to him is pretty much 0:50:23.960 --> 0:50:27.120 saying like, um, because it's African American characters or whatnot, 0:50:27.160 --> 0:50:29.800 and there's some racist behind this choice and whatnot. So 0:50:30.160 --> 0:50:33.080 DC says, no, you're not doing it, um and give 0:50:33.080 --> 0:50:35.880 the whole reason because news stands have quotes of Etiqueta 0:50:35.880 --> 0:50:37.759 blah blah blah. So instead they do a close up 0:50:37.800 --> 0:50:39.239 with them just kissing and put like a little heart 0:50:39.280 --> 0:50:42.320 around it. But in the back Dwayne puts that editorial 0:50:42.560 --> 0:50:44.000 where he could cause it all the reason why we 0:50:44.040 --> 0:50:47.000 couldn't do this, And he doesn't quote for radim call 0:50:47.120 --> 0:50:49.279 the head of DC at that time racist. He says 0:50:49.400 --> 0:50:51.560 this was a racist act. And after that the head 0:50:51.600 --> 0:50:53.640 of d C is like, oh no no. And then 0:50:53.719 --> 0:50:55.880 ever since then they just had the solid relationship. So 0:50:56.000 --> 0:50:58.200 they ended up having against Duyne steps down as editor 0:50:58.239 --> 0:51:00.560 in chief. Then it's Talent takes over editor in chief. 0:51:00.760 --> 0:51:02.600 But then then his coln's like, look, I'm done with this. 0:51:03.000 --> 0:51:05.279 He leaves, go start like Bowtown comments or something like 0:51:05.280 --> 0:51:07.840 that the other creator, and then Dwayne comes back in. 0:51:08.080 --> 0:51:10.279 But at that point Dennis has left and it's never 0:51:10.320 --> 0:51:12.680 been the same. Oh so that kind of was the 0:51:12.800 --> 0:51:17.560 main kind of shaking things up in a possible do 0:51:17.600 --> 0:51:19.640 you think about the times like this is what nine 0:51:19.800 --> 0:51:24.239 four ninety five? Uh, the idea that like safe sex 0:51:24.400 --> 0:51:30.839 was pretty aid society at this PLC because they had 0:51:30.880 --> 0:51:37.520 the big condom Yeah when that album came out. Um, 0:51:38.480 --> 0:51:41.359 so yeah, it's just over a box of condoms, bro. 0:51:44.000 --> 0:51:46.000 Especially like you mentioned at the time, like people learning 0:51:46.000 --> 0:51:48.520 about AIDS is actually practicing stef sex. Like if anything, 0:51:48.640 --> 0:51:50.560 that's a really dope ad right there. Yeah, it's just 0:51:50.600 --> 0:51:52.480 saying like okay, be intimate because you're going to do it, 0:51:52.520 --> 0:51:54.360 but it's like be safe as you do it, and 0:51:54.440 --> 0:51:56.400 it's like really smart, being authentic and again like the 0:51:56.440 --> 0:51:58.200 only point out back. Then you compare it to like 0:51:58.239 --> 0:51:59.919 any of those other characters they were putting on covers, 0:51:59.960 --> 0:52:03.120 like half naked are usually caucages, which blade there you go, 0:52:03.320 --> 0:52:04.959 like no one had a problem with. But like, because 0:52:05.000 --> 0:52:07.200 we do with a couple of characters of color, everyone 0:52:07.239 --> 0:52:08.960 gets up on arms. I mean you can. I mean 0:52:09.040 --> 0:52:12.279 that's kind of been a weird uh thing that's even 0:52:12.360 --> 0:52:15.719 been in media is how you know black love is 0:52:15.840 --> 0:52:19.839 displayed like you never get to see it really kind 0:52:19.880 --> 0:52:23.120 of shown, you know, until like shows like Insecure, show 0:52:23.239 --> 0:52:31.480 My Man Lawrence getting in that day. We were a 0:52:32.080 --> 0:52:36.440 mess after that, like what the hell? But I think 0:52:36.520 --> 0:52:38.520 about that too, because I just finished season two of 0:52:38.560 --> 0:52:42.759 Altered Carbon, which I hardly recommend um. But I don't 0:52:42.880 --> 0:52:45.320 think I had ever seen Anthony Mackie as love interest 0:52:45.920 --> 0:52:48.919 is always a very kind of de sexualized military hero, 0:52:49.680 --> 0:52:52.480 specifically in his larger preexterus, specifically stuff he's done with Marvel, 0:52:52.520 --> 0:52:54.480 which you know, maybe we'll see a change on Disney Plus, 0:52:54.560 --> 0:52:59.440 but maybe not. He is great rings all the chemistry, um, 0:52:59.760 --> 0:53:01.400 and the thing we see with a lot of characters 0:53:01.440 --> 0:53:03.600 like if you're not like a Michael B. Jordan type 0:53:03.600 --> 0:53:06.280 where you're pretty much specifically sold on your sex appeal. 0:53:06.800 --> 0:53:08.440 Until he started producing his own work and out he's 0:53:08.480 --> 0:53:10.719 kind of getting into these more serious projects a lot 0:53:10.760 --> 0:53:14.640 of times. Yeah, we're not allowed to be uh sexual 0:53:14.840 --> 0:53:17.480 or even I would say like romantic, and it's again 0:53:17.520 --> 0:53:19.800 a little bit frustrating, and why I always encourage you 0:53:19.840 --> 0:53:22.759 to just find more color creators of color so we 0:53:22.800 --> 0:53:25.200 can avoid these kind of traps. It also speaks to 0:53:25.280 --> 0:53:27.200 like watch some of the properties that come on the past, 0:53:27.280 --> 0:53:29.480 like Last for so Long, like Living Single at Martin, 0:53:29.520 --> 0:53:32.120 which represent positive like ways of like black love. And 0:53:32.200 --> 0:53:34.239 the reason why like even today, like I teach high 0:53:34.280 --> 0:53:36.440 school English and my kids still talk about Martin to 0:53:36.480 --> 0:53:39.160 Living Singles, like why are you watching this? That's the 0:53:39.160 --> 0:53:41.160 reason why is because this is their representation happening on 0:53:41.200 --> 0:53:43.799 screen for them, and it's not being done in enough places. Yeah, 0:53:43.960 --> 0:53:48.320 absolutely definitely. Um, but yeah, well, well we'll start. So 0:53:48.520 --> 0:53:51.360 he does kind of get good with DC because he 0:53:51.440 --> 0:53:55.239 starts doing their animation, right. Yeah, this is early two thousands, 0:53:55.360 --> 0:53:59.000 so it's been about four or five years post the 0:53:59.080 --> 0:54:01.880 comic breakup to you, when he starts entering DC Animation 0:54:01.920 --> 0:54:04.600 to work on first Static Shock, then Justice League and 0:54:04.640 --> 0:54:08.040 then Justice League Unlimited. What what was interesting is like 0:54:08.080 --> 0:54:11.160 I always felt his you know, Static was definitely the 0:54:11.239 --> 0:54:15.320 first for me of that duffy energy. But like, I 0:54:15.440 --> 0:54:18.240 have one thing I didn't really notice that that definitely 0:54:18.360 --> 0:54:21.680 is his probably huge handprint was the fact that with 0:54:21.920 --> 0:54:27.320 Justice League, we got um, John Um Stewart, John Stewart 0:54:27.480 --> 0:54:32.000 instead of Hal Jordan's. How Jordan's is DC can't get 0:54:32.160 --> 0:54:34.680 enough of Hal Jordan's And he was like, no, We're 0:54:34.680 --> 0:54:38.480 doing Jon Stewart. What a choice? Like, what a decision 0:54:38.560 --> 0:54:40.560 to give us John Stewart, Because John Stewart had a 0:54:40.800 --> 0:54:44.040 very fundamental impact on me as a child, Like this 0:54:44.200 --> 0:54:46.759 idea of getting to see how do you how do 0:54:46.800 --> 0:54:49.080 you even like describe like John Stewarts a soldier who 0:54:49.239 --> 0:54:51.840 isn't necessarily interested in following orders, like he's he's a 0:54:51.960 --> 0:54:55.160 thinking soldier, which I think is again often rare for 0:54:55.280 --> 0:54:58.279 black characters, specifically if we're looking in that time period. Um. 0:54:58.480 --> 0:55:00.359 But then also on top of that, like he has 0:55:00.600 --> 0:55:05.000 one of the great romances I stay like, oh my gosh, 0:55:05.400 --> 0:55:08.439 Green Lantern and Hawk Girl are like my favorite DC 0:55:08.600 --> 0:55:12.400 couple period, hands down, Like I stand them so hard 0:55:12.840 --> 0:55:15.320 even though, And what's really crazy is we may definitely 0:55:15.320 --> 0:55:18.440 made me be like I know that your cheated girlfriend 0:55:18.520 --> 0:55:21.880 is right there and she looks amazing, but can you 0:55:21.920 --> 0:55:24.600 please go back with Hawk Girl? Like that is nuts. 0:55:24.640 --> 0:55:26.319 Who would ever thought like a white lady over black? 0:55:26.400 --> 0:55:29.759 Not me? But really, I said that relationship so hard 0:55:29.800 --> 0:55:32.759 because because we may definitely wrote it real well, um, 0:55:33.080 --> 0:55:35.440 because all of these characters got to be fully fleshed 0:55:35.440 --> 0:55:37.640 out human beings because despite the fact that they were 0:55:37.719 --> 0:55:40.160 writing a children's show, they wanted to make a show 0:55:40.239 --> 0:55:42.759 that spoke to legitimately all ages. And I think it's 0:55:42.760 --> 0:55:45.840 something that comic books does better than probably any other medium, 0:55:46.360 --> 0:55:49.600 is the examine, like we don't need to dissect our 0:55:49.840 --> 0:55:52.880 material for different age groups, like this is literally for 0:55:53.120 --> 0:55:55.279 all ages can come and enjoy something in this story. 0:55:55.600 --> 0:55:57.480 You cannot be left out. It's not too mature and 0:55:57.560 --> 0:56:00.160 beyond your years. And they do it beautifully and and 0:56:00.480 --> 0:56:02.920 support it really well. And John Stewart is a huge part. 0:56:03.000 --> 0:56:05.359 On top of that, he gives the Martian man Hunter, 0:56:05.719 --> 0:56:09.400 who also like Icon is an alien came to planet 0:56:09.440 --> 0:56:11.839 Earth and chose to live his life as a black man. 0:56:12.239 --> 0:56:14.880 Shoot his day floor is me because he was doing it, 0:56:15.040 --> 0:56:18.399 like you know, pre two thousand's choosing to live walk 0:56:18.480 --> 0:56:21.560 down the street as a black Eye felt uncomfortable. A 0:56:21.640 --> 0:56:26.919 nice little icon nod that's really like Icon and Rocket 0:56:27.000 --> 0:56:29.800 come in Justice League Unlimited. That's where I first see Rocket, 0:56:29.880 --> 0:56:32.760 and I just there's he's able to imbue these characters 0:56:33.239 --> 0:56:36.640 so well and make they felt like DC originals, you 0:56:36.719 --> 0:56:38.399 know what I mean. And I think that's also again 0:56:38.440 --> 0:56:41.160 speaks to his knowledge of just comic book and comic 0:56:41.239 --> 0:56:44.000 book characters that it doesn't feel like a lot of 0:56:44.040 --> 0:56:46.680 times I think when people create characters, you're like, I 0:56:46.800 --> 0:56:49.239 see a lot of you in this, and there's not 0:56:49.640 --> 0:56:51.840 necessarily something wrong with that, but it does take away 0:56:51.920 --> 0:56:54.800 from your suspension of disbelief. So for these characters to 0:56:54.880 --> 0:56:58.000 come into the DC world and outside of the dakodea 0:56:58.120 --> 0:57:02.360 Verse and male Old and become fully functioning members of 0:57:02.480 --> 0:57:06.160 Team Justice League, like, I needed it, and I couldn't 0:57:06.200 --> 0:57:07.839 have been aware that I needed it at the time, 0:57:07.920 --> 0:57:10.440 but I'm so glad that I had it. Yeah, you know, 0:57:10.520 --> 0:57:12.120 he's so smart with doing it and it was cool. 0:57:12.160 --> 0:57:14.400 Is he always does like undercover, like you said, been 0:57:14.440 --> 0:57:17.080 that bit of icon and everything. Um, but I'm sorry, 0:57:17.080 --> 0:57:19.440 go ahead, no, no, no, I'm listening. I was gonna say, 0:57:19.440 --> 0:57:20.720 because like one of the cool things that he did 0:57:20.880 --> 0:57:23.320 was on because the icon the book. People don't know 0:57:23.360 --> 0:57:25.320 this all the time, but like, like so he's doing 0:57:25.360 --> 0:57:27.040 that first like twelve is you run right and you 0:57:27.160 --> 0:57:29.120 meet Rocket. It was like Rockets like break into his house. 0:57:29.160 --> 0:57:30.640 She does all the stuff. She's like, you need to 0:57:30.640 --> 0:57:32.000 be a hero, you need to do this, this and this, 0:57:32.240 --> 0:57:34.040 and that's when you actually get some starts getting involved 0:57:34.120 --> 0:57:35.560 or not. And then he gives her the bell. She 0:57:35.600 --> 0:57:36.880 becomes a hero or not. But then she gets the 0:57:36.920 --> 0:57:38.720 whole story and she gets pregnant and like does all 0:57:38.760 --> 0:57:41.000 these things. But what people don't realize is that Loki, 0:57:41.080 --> 0:57:42.960 if you look back at that book, Rocket is the 0:57:43.080 --> 0:57:45.960 actual progressive force of that book. And so Dennis Colwin 0:57:46.000 --> 0:57:47.440 gave it um this like talk one time in my 0:57:47.440 --> 0:57:49.280 comic shop. He explained to was like, like, no, the 0:57:49.320 --> 0:57:51.919 main character icon was Rocket because like people just didn't 0:57:51.920 --> 0:57:54.240 realize it. But we couldn't put Rocket on the cover 0:57:54.360 --> 0:57:56.200 and to sell this black woman lead book. So we 0:57:56.280 --> 0:57:59.000 tricked everybody and by having to be Icon, everyone's reading 0:57:59.040 --> 0:58:01.120 this Superman as book, but actually make characters Rocket this 0:58:01.160 --> 0:58:04.120 all time the covers of that comic book, it's very 0:58:04.160 --> 0:58:10.360 frequently Icon standing behind Rocket. Oh my god, don't think 0:58:10.360 --> 0:58:11.920 about Dyne and all those guys. When they were doing this, 0:58:11.960 --> 0:58:14.000 they just realized that, like, if you put diversity in 0:58:14.000 --> 0:58:16.160 people's faces, they'll go against it, but if you do 0:58:16.240 --> 0:58:18.520 a subvertly, people go along with it. Because the way 0:58:18.560 --> 0:58:19.840 you talk about that later on when he wrote on 0:58:19.960 --> 0:58:23.240 Justice League, um bocking around with two thousand nine ten 0:58:23.600 --> 0:58:25.640 and so he so pretty much when he got on 0:58:25.680 --> 0:58:27.200 the book, he doesn't get choice of choose was on 0:58:27.240 --> 0:58:29.440 the team. They give him the established team, and so 0:58:29.560 --> 0:58:31.160 one of the three characters they end up giving him 0:58:31.160 --> 0:58:36.360 more Vixing Firestorm and it's a third black hairt I 0:58:36.400 --> 0:58:38.200 can't think I think he did this. John Stewart, who's 0:58:38.240 --> 0:58:39.680 on that team. He doesn't get a choice in this. 0:58:40.040 --> 0:58:41.640 But when they do it, though, all of a sudden, 0:58:41.840 --> 0:58:44.480 the fan base ghost nuts. They're like mcdufy's making the 0:58:44.560 --> 0:58:47.520 Justice League and all this kind of stuff. And he 0:58:47.600 --> 0:58:52.280 was like, I didn't even choose the Dame and it's 0:58:52.320 --> 0:58:54.920 like and even talks about it, and like he even explains, 0:58:54.960 --> 0:58:56.320 like I had my choice, like I would have put 0:58:56.360 --> 0:58:58.080 other people on the team. It's like, I'm right, listen, 0:58:58.080 --> 0:59:00.400 they won't even let me write Superman, Batman, One Woman. 0:59:00.520 --> 0:59:01.960 They're not even the team that they're giving me, so 0:59:02.080 --> 0:59:04.480 like come on, and so yeah, it's kind of shows 0:59:04.480 --> 0:59:06.400 that again, like we subvert with it. You can actually 0:59:06.440 --> 0:59:07.960 tell a lot of great storylines, but if you travel 0:59:07.960 --> 0:59:10.320 with things and people's faces, they'll be very resistant. Lot, 0:59:10.880 --> 0:59:12.960 it's a wild We pulled a couple of clips to 0:59:13.120 --> 0:59:16.640 kind of showcase the writing style of Dwayne McDuffie. The 0:59:16.720 --> 0:59:21.600 first one is from Justice League Flashpoint. It's from season one. 0:59:21.640 --> 0:59:24.400 If you guys haven't checked out, uh Justice League, or 0:59:24.400 --> 0:59:26.200 if that's new to you or it's been a minute, 0:59:26.480 --> 0:59:29.520 I cannot like encourage you enough to go back and look, 0:59:29.640 --> 0:59:32.640 he did the Brave of the Bold episode Star Crossed 0:59:33.080 --> 0:59:35.520 and Destroyer, And I think what Dwayne does better than 0:59:35.560 --> 0:59:37.760 most is he found a way to invigorate a lot 0:59:37.840 --> 0:59:41.760 of the old popular storylines and make them fresh and news. 0:59:41.800 --> 0:59:44.560 So let's here. This is a political debate that the 0:59:44.640 --> 0:59:46.800 team is having deciding on how they're going to stop 0:59:46.880 --> 0:59:49.960 lex Luther from flash point. I don't remember asking you 0:59:50.080 --> 0:59:53.320 for your opinion. No, how about when you guys hijacked 0:59:53.360 --> 0:59:55.600 me up here against my will and maybe join this team? 0:59:56.200 --> 0:59:58.640 Batman said, I was supposed to keep you guys honest. 0:59:59.040 --> 1:00:01.800 Do I look like a man to you? Actually a 1:00:01.960 --> 1:00:04.560 kind of do, especially when you're all scaly like that. 1:00:06.600 --> 1:00:09.000 We can't let Cadmus get away with it. No one's 1:00:09.040 --> 1:00:11.800 saying we should, but we have to keep a cool head. 1:00:12.360 --> 1:00:16.200 Do you know what they did to me? Kid Hambleton's 1:00:16.200 --> 1:00:19.400 a piece of garbage and Luthor's worse. But this isn't 1:00:19.440 --> 1:00:21.960 the way to stop them. We must also consider the 1:00:22.000 --> 1:00:24.360 possibility that Cadmus is right to be afraid of us, 1:00:25.480 --> 1:00:28.920 and there is strong evidence of Cadmus having legitimate connections 1:00:29.000 --> 1:00:31.959 to the government, maybe to some rogue black ops group. 1:00:32.080 --> 1:00:35.120 The real government wouldn't get involved in anything like this. Hey, 1:00:35.600 --> 1:00:37.840 I'm the only guy in the room who doesn't have superpowers. 1:00:38.040 --> 1:00:40.640 And let me tell you, you guys scare me. What 1:00:40.760 --> 1:00:42.960 if you do decide to go marching down there taking 1:00:43.000 --> 1:00:45.280 care of whoever you think is guilty, who could stop 1:00:45.360 --> 1:00:48.040 you me? So you want the government to have a 1:00:48.120 --> 1:00:51.280 bunch of superhuman weapons just to keep us in check. No, 1:00:52.440 --> 1:00:55.800 I don't know. Yeah, the guys are hearing in that 1:00:55.880 --> 1:01:00.560 cliff that's Green Lantern, Superman, Martian, Man, Hunters, Supergirl, and 1:01:00.640 --> 1:01:03.480 the Flash, thank you. Uh, And they're basically trying to decide, like, 1:01:03.680 --> 1:01:06.360 are we going to just go down to Earth and 1:01:06.440 --> 1:01:08.280 take care of business as we do with superheroes. They 1:01:08.280 --> 1:01:10.920 don't have a directive, there's nobody deciding who can and 1:01:11.000 --> 1:01:13.840 cannot go on certain missions. They just sort of decide 1:01:13.880 --> 1:01:15.640 in the moment, and they're like, listen, we know Lex 1:01:15.720 --> 1:01:18.080 Luther's doing some shadow stuff. We know Cadmus is out 1:01:18.120 --> 1:01:22.320 here testing Superman's DNA, creating people that can go out 1:01:22.360 --> 1:01:25.160 there and cause additional harm with our faces. With our DNA, 1:01:25.800 --> 1:01:28.440 we can go down and stop them. And basically the 1:01:28.560 --> 1:01:32.240 Flash and Green Arrow are basically like, yo, y'all got 1:01:32.360 --> 1:01:35.760 a chill. We can't just be out here causing a 1:01:35.880 --> 1:01:37.720 fight or we could be seen as the bad guys. 1:01:37.760 --> 1:01:40.200 People have a right to be terrified of you guys. Specifically, 1:01:40.480 --> 1:01:44.040 you have superhuman powers. A missile could maybe stop you, 1:01:44.200 --> 1:01:46.000 not Superman. There's nothing we can do to stop you. 1:01:46.080 --> 1:01:48.720 If you decided to go rogue. And it's those kinds 1:01:48.720 --> 1:01:52.080 of conversations which will occasionally happen in comic books here there, 1:01:52.160 --> 1:01:55.400 that are the fundamental forefront of how Dwayne McDuffie approached 1:01:55.520 --> 1:01:58.800 comic book storytelling, because he really took the idea of 1:01:58.880 --> 1:02:01.080 like with great power, where it comes great responsibility to 1:02:01.240 --> 1:02:04.200 its degree, and applied it very frequently to all of 1:02:04.320 --> 1:02:06.760 his characters and made him ask what are you doing 1:02:06.840 --> 1:02:09.120 with your time, with your life here? How are you 1:02:09.200 --> 1:02:12.840 impacting others? That was at the forefront of his writing style, 1:02:12.880 --> 1:02:15.439 and I really appreciate the way that he often gave 1:02:15.520 --> 1:02:18.640 that to black folks. There's a um if we had 1:02:18.680 --> 1:02:21.040 time to pull infinite clips, I would have. There's an 1:02:21.080 --> 1:02:26.920 episode of um uh Justice League where John Stewart is 1:02:27.000 --> 1:02:30.600 on Earth walking around in like his old neighborhood, and 1:02:30.640 --> 1:02:33.840 this old black guy basically calls him out and he's like, listen, 1:02:33.880 --> 1:02:35.520 I know you out there with all the little superheroes 1:02:35.760 --> 1:02:37.320 find off aliens and stuff. He's like, but you ain't 1:02:37.400 --> 1:02:39.200 been around this block in a long time, and you 1:02:39.280 --> 1:02:41.600 ain't been helping your people in this space in a 1:02:41.680 --> 1:02:44.120 long time. So you go out and go, you know, 1:02:44.240 --> 1:02:46.520 save the whole world or whatever. But we're still here, 1:02:46.560 --> 1:02:49.120 we're still hurting, we're still suffering, and you've forgotten about us. 1:02:49.160 --> 1:02:52.080 And to do a check on a black guy like 1:02:52.320 --> 1:02:56.240 that again in a children's cartoon impacted me. It's like 1:02:56.360 --> 1:02:58.480 I was like ten or eleven watching this and being 1:02:58.560 --> 1:03:00.880 like man growing up it a very like an all 1:03:00.960 --> 1:03:04.040 white school district essentially, you know, wonder thing like how 1:03:04.120 --> 1:03:07.440 am I not connecting to my community at this time? 1:03:07.480 --> 1:03:08.640 And how do I get back? And how do I 1:03:08.720 --> 1:03:11.200 do that in a way that is you know, impactful, 1:03:11.240 --> 1:03:13.560 and it is important. And I think by posing those 1:03:13.640 --> 1:03:16.800 questions to children that oftentimes as we grow up, those 1:03:16.840 --> 1:03:18.720 are the things that we reflect back on and then 1:03:18.800 --> 1:03:20.720 and and and carry us and may help us make 1:03:20.760 --> 1:03:23.360 our decisions and how we want to react in the world. Gosh, 1:03:23.480 --> 1:03:27.160 Doamy Duffie seriously, he's just is that just a shame 1:03:27.200 --> 1:03:28.480 that we lost him. It's a shame we don't have 1:03:28.560 --> 1:03:31.040 more of him, versions of him out there making comic 1:03:31.040 --> 1:03:34.280 books right now. I'm trying. I'm trying. We are all 1:03:34.320 --> 1:03:37.520 out here. It's not for a lack of black creators. 1:03:37.640 --> 1:03:41.120 It's not a lack of black creators. It's financially, So 1:03:41.320 --> 1:03:43.840 it's a it's a huge struggle to make good art 1:03:44.560 --> 1:03:47.439 when you don't have the cash flow and when people 1:03:47.480 --> 1:03:49.680 want to constantly question and second guess what it is 1:03:49.800 --> 1:03:52.080 you're creating in the first place. Yeah, and like you said, 1:03:52.080 --> 1:03:54.160 it's like this opportunity because there's a lot of like 1:03:54.320 --> 1:03:56.280 dope creators out there who are creating these books. And 1:03:56.280 --> 1:03:57.840 when I were telling you this a mazing stories. You 1:03:57.880 --> 1:03:59.720 can go to any artist Sally at comic con and 1:03:59.760 --> 1:04:02.120 real like wherever you're gonna see our faces. But the problem, 1:04:02.160 --> 1:04:04.720 lizzos that we're publishers backing us, so we don't get 1:04:04.760 --> 1:04:07.400 that natural distribution or whatnot. Like without a publisher, I'm 1:04:07.400 --> 1:04:08.760 not sure how far can get The black Man's got 1:04:08.840 --> 1:04:10.520 to getting pulled over. But if I had that with me, 1:04:10.600 --> 1:04:12.360 then I can put that in every comic shop across 1:04:12.360 --> 1:04:14.480 the country. So you're exactly right, we have that funding, 1:04:14.520 --> 1:04:16.960 we have the opportunity at least like these amazing things 1:04:17.280 --> 1:04:19.120 and was dope. It is like that storyline low key 1:04:19.200 --> 1:04:20.800 influence comics. I want to say what fro almost like 1:04:20.800 --> 1:04:23.000 the next ten years because in that like one clip 1:04:23.120 --> 1:04:24.800 right there is a kid I remember watching They're like 1:04:25.120 --> 1:04:27.080 what no, the hero should do with the heroes want 1:04:27.120 --> 1:04:28.800 to do? And then I saw a man of steel. 1:04:28.800 --> 1:04:32.040 I was like, no, they need accountability, they need accountability. No, no, 1:04:32.200 --> 1:04:36.200 no no. But what's crazy is that drops around like 1:04:36.200 --> 1:04:38.040 two thousands. But then what happens around two thousand five 1:04:38.320 --> 1:04:40.400 six step seven? We get the Civil War star line 1:04:40.400 --> 1:04:43.200 and Marvel Comics, which is just emulating that, and it's 1:04:43.240 --> 1:04:45.560 that whole thing about like super responsibility. And then we 1:04:45.600 --> 1:04:47.120 see that in other like books of what was going 1:04:47.160 --> 1:04:49.040 for like next in the year. So like, you're exactly 1:04:49.120 --> 1:04:50.640 right that one little bit of writing he did on 1:04:50.680 --> 1:04:53.000 this animation that's so a dope, that's so conting said 1:04:53.040 --> 1:04:54.360 of like the Patriot Act and all the things that 1:04:54.360 --> 1:04:56.200 are actually happening in the government. He was able to 1:04:56.240 --> 1:04:58.040 stretch that and people were in the room with that 1:04:58.080 --> 1:05:00.360 and like helping influence comics for the next decade. Yeah, 1:05:01.400 --> 1:05:05.280 do you want to play this last clip? Ye? John 1:05:05.360 --> 1:05:09.000 picked this? What you want to cue it up? Okay? 1:05:09.040 --> 1:05:12.040 So um, going back Batman Beyond Batman be honest an 1:05:12.040 --> 1:05:13.920 amazing series. But the problem it is so sadly enough, 1:05:14.080 --> 1:05:16.280 it never got a season finale, never got that sind off, 1:05:16.480 --> 1:05:18.720 so Dwayne's like, oh no, I got this because I 1:05:18.760 --> 1:05:20.840 think when he worked on Just League, he did sixty 1:05:20.920 --> 1:05:22.560 of the ninety episodes, he's one every single one of 1:05:22.560 --> 1:05:24.600 the most. So he's like, we're gonna do for Batman. 1:05:24.720 --> 1:05:27.760 In this epilogue, here Amanda waller um is explained how 1:05:27.800 --> 1:05:31.200 she's actually created Terry McGinnis the Batman, beyond about how 1:05:31.320 --> 1:05:33.640 he's actually like a clone of Batman, and she begins 1:05:33.680 --> 1:05:36.280 explaining why we need a Batman in today's world. Stop 1:05:36.400 --> 1:05:39.160 me if you've heard it before. You're eight years old. 1:05:39.600 --> 1:05:42.959 Your parents have just taken you to a rousing adventure film. 1:05:44.560 --> 1:05:49.560 A grand time is had by all, but unknown to you, 1:05:51.040 --> 1:05:55.520 a mysterious figure heights in the shadows. My plan was simple. 1:05:56.160 --> 1:05:58.640 The killer would leap out at you, would kill your family. 1:06:00.240 --> 1:06:03.040 The trauma would put you on the path to becoming Batman. 1:06:05.400 --> 1:06:11.320 One problem, my assassin wouldn't pull the trigger. I argued 1:06:11.360 --> 1:06:14.120 with her, but deep down I knew she was right. 1:06:14.760 --> 1:06:18.440 People say Batman is obsessive, that he'd do anything to 1:06:18.520 --> 1:06:25.040 achieve his goals, but he'd never resort to murder. So 1:06:25.240 --> 1:06:29.880 if I was to honor all he stood for, neither 1:06:30.000 --> 1:06:34.560 could I. And yet my dad wound up murdered anyway. 1:06:35.200 --> 1:06:37.760 Don't you get it? No matter what you did or 1:06:37.840 --> 1:06:39.600 didn't do, I was going to end up being Bruce's 1:06:39.680 --> 1:06:43.920 carbon copy. Was fate. You know. The Lord has been 1:06:43.960 --> 1:06:46.960 a great comfort to me all these years. Try not 1:06:47.080 --> 1:06:50.560 to look so surprised. Yeah, I've got a lot to 1:06:50.600 --> 1:06:52.920 answer for when I meet him, But I'd like to 1:06:53.000 --> 1:06:56.200 believe that for all the harm I've caused, I've also 1:06:56.320 --> 1:06:59.760 done some good. Maybe the angels need a sharp sword 1:06:59.800 --> 1:07:03.480 to like A good book says, He moves in mysterious ways. 1:07:04.160 --> 1:07:08.400 His plan is a mystery. But here's what Isn't he 1:07:08.600 --> 1:07:13.800 gave us free Will we choose our own fate for 1:07:14.080 --> 1:07:19.320 good or ill. I've known Bruce Wayne for over fifty years, 1:07:19.600 --> 1:07:22.320 and I've been keeping an eye on you your whole life. 1:07:23.040 --> 1:07:28.120 You're not Bruce's clone, you're his son. There are similarities, 1:07:28.200 --> 1:07:32.200 mind you, but more than a few differences too. You 1:07:32.320 --> 1:07:36.360 don't quite have his magnificent brain, for instance. You do 1:07:36.520 --> 1:07:40.040 have his heart, though, and for all that fierce exterior, 1:07:40.120 --> 1:07:42.560 I've never met anyone who cared as deeply about his 1:07:42.680 --> 1:07:49.439 fellow man as Bruce Wayne, except maybe you. You want 1:07:49.480 --> 1:07:51.840 to have a little better life than the old man's. 1:07:53.000 --> 1:07:56.760 Take care of the people who love you or don't, 1:07:57.880 --> 1:08:02.720 it's your choice. I've had my whole life, and having 1:08:02.760 --> 1:08:05.480 a fat Amanda Waller walking around putting fingers in Batman's 1:08:05.480 --> 1:08:07.080 face telling him this is how the game plan is 1:08:07.080 --> 1:08:10.280 gonna work was inspirational. And I think a huge part 1:08:10.520 --> 1:08:12.560 of what made her awesome was that that Dwayne mcduvie, 1:08:12.720 --> 1:08:14.680 and I'll give props the Gail Simone too, we're back 1:08:14.720 --> 1:08:17.240 there writing her, structuring her in such a way that 1:08:17.360 --> 1:08:19.840 made her uh an epic forced to be reckoned with. 1:08:20.000 --> 1:08:22.920 She knew Bruce Wayne's identity and she was not afraid 1:08:22.960 --> 1:08:25.200 to use it against him. But I think what we 1:08:25.320 --> 1:08:29.240 just heard, like this whole breakdown first of psychological analysis 1:08:29.280 --> 1:08:31.879 of Batman, which is maybe one of the most fascinating 1:08:31.960 --> 1:08:37.040 characters in the American canon, to um pivoting to how 1:08:37.120 --> 1:08:41.800 that's going to continue beyond him, and viewing morality uh 1:08:41.960 --> 1:08:47.400 and uh mortality smoothly in a way again accessible to 1:08:47.520 --> 1:08:51.719 all ages, to all people across demographics, like the power 1:08:51.800 --> 1:08:55.080 of McDuffie. It's just and if you watch that episode. 1:08:55.240 --> 1:08:58.599 In the end, uh, Terry goes back to Bruce's mansion 1:08:59.120 --> 1:09:01.599 and Bruce is struggling to open a bottle of pills 1:09:01.680 --> 1:09:03.400 as he's like lecturing him about like can you tell 1:09:03.439 --> 1:09:05.559 me where you go? And like I'm worried about Gotham. 1:09:05.600 --> 1:09:07.519 I'm trying to coordinate. He's like, listen, old man, I'm 1:09:07.520 --> 1:09:09.200 gonna open your pills and let me go see Superman 1:09:09.200 --> 1:09:12.200 about whatever this business is. I got you, like take 1:09:12.240 --> 1:09:15.160 a nap. You're my dad. And it's just, oh my gosh, 1:09:15.560 --> 1:09:18.720 it's so beautiful. I really I'm glad you picked this 1:09:18.800 --> 1:09:21.679 one job. No problem because like no problem that you're playing, 1:09:21.680 --> 1:09:24.120 because honestly, for me, it's like it kind of shows 1:09:24.160 --> 1:09:26.200 how dope Batman is, and it shows how well do 1:09:26.280 --> 1:09:29.320 I understood the characters, because for Batman, it's not the money, 1:09:29.400 --> 1:09:31.479 it's not the guy. That's not the ninja training that 1:09:31.560 --> 1:09:34.599 does help, But it's just empathy his Emyothy, the way 1:09:34.640 --> 1:09:36.519 he cares about his fellow man. That says some power 1:09:36.520 --> 1:09:38.920 from like from everyone and um. And again it shows 1:09:38.960 --> 1:09:41.040 what Terry is Terris everything is so strong, dislike him. 1:09:41.240 --> 1:09:42.320 And what I like it as well is that it 1:09:42.360 --> 1:09:44.120 shows that Terry goes on a different path because it 1:09:44.200 --> 1:09:45.880 writes that he goes and he's trying to go meet 1:09:45.880 --> 1:09:48.559 with a superman and everything. He's also got a wedding ring. 1:09:49.040 --> 1:09:50.680 He's like, I want to do what Bruce didn't do. 1:09:50.840 --> 1:09:52.840 I'm gonna value my family, want to keep his acutally going. 1:09:52.880 --> 1:09:54.519 I'm gonna like value the people that I have, and 1:09:54.560 --> 1:09:56.559 I push everyone away. And it just kind of shows 1:09:56.640 --> 1:10:02.000 how like McDuffie understood character growth and how characters need evolved. Yeah, 1:10:02.400 --> 1:10:04.840 McDuffie said the part of his goal was to make 1:10:05.320 --> 1:10:09.679 black characters applicable to young white kids, not the idea 1:10:09.800 --> 1:10:12.360 that like you necessarily connect with him, but just that 1:10:12.680 --> 1:10:15.960 that a black man could be your superman as well. Um. 1:10:16.400 --> 1:10:18.479 And so while scrolling through Twitter after I had doing 1:10:18.479 --> 1:10:21.320 a lot of research on this, I found this adorable tweet. Um, 1:10:21.520 --> 1:10:24.599 I'm gonna give proper credit. It's from rand bat at 1:10:24.760 --> 1:10:27.880 rand bot Um and the tweet says, fourth grade at 1:10:27.960 --> 1:10:31.559 Dexter's School does a living wax museum for Black History Month. 1:10:31.920 --> 1:10:34.600 This guy was between McDuffie. It's a white kid with 1:10:34.760 --> 1:10:37.920 Dwayne's um, what you call us a goatee like drawn 1:10:38.000 --> 1:10:40.880 on and the thick glasses and like a static shock 1:10:41.000 --> 1:10:44.080 t shirt on. There's no black face here. This is 1:10:44.120 --> 1:10:47.200 just a kid who wants to like give props to 1:10:47.240 --> 1:10:50.840 Dweyne McDuffie, whose favorite superhero is Static Shock. And I 1:10:50.920 --> 1:10:53.360 think if you go to Hans and Things, you constantly 1:10:53.400 --> 1:10:56.880 see the static jacket because it's sick um and I 1:10:57.200 --> 1:10:59.840 it's if we had to lose him, if he's not 1:11:00.040 --> 1:11:04.240 here anymore, it's awesome that his legacy endures to this 1:11:04.439 --> 1:11:08.960 next generation and beyond um perhaps to McDuffie for giving 1:11:09.040 --> 1:11:12.040 us so much. Well, yeah, that that's kind of what 1:11:12.120 --> 1:11:16.240 I wanted to use, uh for you know, there for 1:11:16.520 --> 1:11:18.720 the you know, usually at this point we're discussed like 1:11:18.760 --> 1:11:20.720 the future and the future and all this, but I 1:11:20.800 --> 1:11:22.920 think the future is and something we're going to talk about. 1:11:23.280 --> 1:11:25.960 It's a future that you, the listener, are going to 1:11:26.040 --> 1:11:28.640 show us to all the people of color, to all 1:11:28.760 --> 1:11:31.519 even white people. I don't not even exclude y'all, but 1:11:31.600 --> 1:11:34.560 to all the writers and creators who are listening to 1:11:34.720 --> 1:11:37.920 this episode right now. The future of Dwayne McDuffie lives 1:11:37.960 --> 1:11:40.280 inside you. Or what are you doing to push the 1:11:40.400 --> 1:11:45.040 envelope to be more accessible, to shine light on people 1:11:45.080 --> 1:11:47.400 who might be sitting in the shade. What are you 1:11:47.560 --> 1:11:51.840 creating to uh introduce to the world people who might 1:11:51.920 --> 1:11:53.920 not be seen as much. And I do think that 1:11:54.160 --> 1:11:57.320 can live within anyone listening, no matter the color of 1:11:57.400 --> 1:12:00.960 your skin, whether it be through LGBT you a plus, 1:12:01.800 --> 1:12:05.160 whether it be through disabled, whether it be through any 1:12:05.400 --> 1:12:09.559 type of afflictions that might uh you know be around 1:12:09.640 --> 1:12:13.080 you or you know you yourself might be dealing with. 1:12:13.600 --> 1:12:17.479 You have the power to shine light and to raise 1:12:17.479 --> 1:12:20.439 awareness of it. Uh. It's just at the end of 1:12:20.600 --> 1:12:24.559 your pen. And with that, you know, uh, where can 1:12:24.600 --> 1:12:27.679 people find you? Johnny? What what? What is there you'd 1:12:27.720 --> 1:12:29.920 like to plug? You can find me at Johnny P 1:12:30.080 --> 1:12:32.840 three on three on my Patreon and Instagram and Twitter. Um, 1:12:33.040 --> 1:12:34.799 I'll be doing a kickstarter for one of my series 1:12:34.920 --> 1:12:37.320 and may called Broken. It's a video game animey adventure. 1:12:37.720 --> 1:12:40.800 It's like Smash Brothers Melee meets Pokemon. It's super double 1:12:40.880 --> 1:12:44.519 super Thank you um and then you can form a Patreon. 1:12:44.560 --> 1:12:45.760 You can find me a Johny p thro one through 1:12:45.760 --> 1:12:48.400 Instagram and Twitter. And I also on a wrestling podcast 1:12:48.720 --> 1:12:51.760 for that that hashtag show called t HS Wrestling. We 1:12:51.880 --> 1:12:53.960 do a show every Sunday night, so come watch me. 1:12:54.360 --> 1:12:56.920 My co host Nisa and John Um and we gotta 1:12:57.000 --> 1:13:01.439 go through and talk about all good things wrestling every week. Yeah, 1:13:01.600 --> 1:13:05.360 I'm all over the internet at Joel Monique and for 1:13:05.479 --> 1:13:07.960 the next three four weeks over at who shot you 1:13:08.120 --> 1:13:10.800 taking over? If he's positioned there filming for everybody. It's 1:13:10.800 --> 1:13:17.360 a good time, appreciated, a lot of knowledge. Yeah, and 1:13:17.479 --> 1:13:19.679 you know me. If you wide away on Twitter and Instagram. 1:13:19.800 --> 1:13:22.679 If d's on Twitch, watch super Punch every night Monday 1:13:22.720 --> 1:13:26.080 through third Monday through Thursday, where I host at eleven 1:13:26.120 --> 1:13:31.880 pm Eastern eight pm Pacific time. The discord is Discord 1:13:32.200 --> 1:13:36.519 dot che Che Forward slash, uh Salt Squad. We have 1:13:36.560 --> 1:13:39.800 an anime club. Now we're watching Black Lagoon, uh so 1:13:40.240 --> 1:13:43.720 tune in for that and uh last but certainly not 1:13:44.000 --> 1:13:47.040 leaks t public dot com, Forward slash and are difficent 1:13:47.120 --> 1:13:50.400 for all your mercy goodness, pull up and let us 1:13:50.920 --> 1:13:54.040 make you look good and like we always end every episode, 1:13:54.640 --> 1:13:55.160 Stay Nerd,