WEBVTT - The CTO and CIO of the United States

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<v Speaker 1>Get in touch with technology with tech Stuff from how

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<v Speaker 1>stuff works dot com. Join Josh and Chuck, the guys

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<v Speaker 1>who bring you stuff you should know, as they take

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<v Speaker 1>a trip around the world to help you get smarter

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<v Speaker 1>in a topsy chrv economy. Check out the all new

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<v Speaker 1>super Stuff Guide to the Economy from how stuff Works

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<v Speaker 1>dot com, available now exclusively on iTunes. Hi there, everybody,

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome to tech Stuff. My name is Chris Poulette. I'm

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<v Speaker 1>an editor here at how stuff works dot com, and

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<v Speaker 1>sitting next to me, as usual, is senior writer Jonathan Strickland.

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<v Speaker 1>Hey there, and uh, I think we have some official

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<v Speaker 1>business to get to. We do very official, yes, well

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<v Speaker 1>at least not quite official at the moment, but it's

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<v Speaker 1>going to be official very soon. And this is uh

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<v Speaker 1>for our for our listeners in other countries, UM, please

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<v Speaker 1>humor us. We're going to talk about the United States

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<v Speaker 1>specifically in this podcast because our President Barack Obama has

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<v Speaker 1>decide to to um to to create a couple of

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<v Speaker 1>new positions in his cabinet that are going to undoubtedly

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<v Speaker 1>have an effect on the way we access the internet. Uh.

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<v Speaker 1>The way internet um is uh well, kind of oversight

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<v Speaker 1>of the Internet from a government level, lots of different

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<v Speaker 1>things that are gonna really have an impact on us

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<v Speaker 1>as consumers. That's right. Um. And this is uh complete

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<v Speaker 1>departure from the past. I mean, Um, among the things

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<v Speaker 1>that the former president, George W. Bush was criticized for

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<v Speaker 1>was not being very technical. Um. And uh, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>it's it's sort of well known now that Barack Obama's

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<v Speaker 1>presidential campaign was extremely technical. He was everywhere on Facebook

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<v Speaker 1>and on Twitter and all sorts of other social media

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<v Speaker 1>to recruiting volunteers, trying to get votes. Um. And uh,

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<v Speaker 1>you know it was a bit of a culture shock

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<v Speaker 1>for some of the staffers when they entered the White House. Um,

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<v Speaker 1>because you know, by nature, the federal government has to be,

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<v Speaker 1>especially in the White House, he has to be somewhat

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<v Speaker 1>restrictive as far as technological policies because you know, some

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<v Speaker 1>of the stuff were to leak, you know, state secrets.

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<v Speaker 1>That's some pretty serious stuff you don't want just bouncing

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<v Speaker 1>around on the internet. Yeah. I've seen the documentary twenty

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<v Speaker 1>four and according to that, it's really dangerous to let

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<v Speaker 1>that information get out. Also, there's always a mole. There's

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<v Speaker 1>always a mole. Really, Yeah, that's a completely different. Oh well,

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<v Speaker 1>that's true. But anyway, what we're getting at here is

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<v Speaker 1>way back in November two thousand seven, then Senator Baraque

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<v Speaker 1>Obama announced that he intended that if he were elected,

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<v Speaker 1>to appoint a Chief Technology Officer or c t O.

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<v Speaker 1>And um, that was that was all a big deal.

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<v Speaker 1>And of course, now he has been elected, he has

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<v Speaker 1>not yet as of the recording of this podcast, appointed

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<v Speaker 1>a c t O, but he has a pointed a

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<v Speaker 1>Chief Information Officer or c i O. And um. Actually, uh,

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<v Speaker 1>that kind of relieves me in a way. UM. And

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<v Speaker 1>I'll tell you why. It's because the parameters for the

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<v Speaker 1>job of c t O we're so wide that I

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<v Speaker 1>was convinced no single person could accomplish all of those tasks.

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<v Speaker 1>But if he has a c I O and a

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<v Speaker 1>c t O, then some of those duties can be

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<v Speaker 1>split across two different people, and suddenly it becomes much

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<v Speaker 1>more manageable. Um and uh. And some of those duties

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<v Speaker 1>included here. I've got a list actually from this is

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<v Speaker 1>from Congress. Okay, it's a Congressional reports. So the first

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<v Speaker 1>role would exploits explicitly articulated on President Obama's earlier campaign

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<v Speaker 1>and transition websites might be described as a supra Chief

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<v Speaker 1>Information Officer with the mission of using information technology to

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<v Speaker 1>improve the delivery of government services, increasing trans cureency of

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<v Speaker 1>government policy making, and opening channels for increased citizen participation

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<v Speaker 1>in government, as well as ensuring that the nation's information

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<v Speaker 1>and communications infrastructure is robust and secure. In this capacity,

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<v Speaker 1>a c t O would also ensure that best practices

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<v Speaker 1>are identified, shared and implemented across agencies. That's one role.

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<v Speaker 1>Role number two it might be described as an advocate

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<v Speaker 1>for technological innovation in support of national interests such as

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<v Speaker 1>economic growth, job creation, improvements to quality of life, national defense,

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<v Speaker 1>and homeland security. Some have speculated that President Obama might

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<v Speaker 1>charge a CTO with a wider scope of responsibilities, including

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<v Speaker 1>development and advocacy of national I c T policies like

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<v Speaker 1>net neutrality and broadband access technology policies intended to spur

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<v Speaker 1>innovation and economic growth, intellectual property enforcement, and oversight of

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<v Speaker 1>a federally backed venture capital fund to support deployment of

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<v Speaker 1>clean technologies. So that's a tall order, yep yep um.

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<v Speaker 1>And another one of the reasons that I read about

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<v Speaker 1>was basically to promote the use of broadband in underserved

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<v Speaker 1>areas the United States is and broadband penetration. About twenty

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<v Speaker 1>three out of every hundred people are served with some

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<v Speaker 1>sort of broadband, at least according to the Organization for

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<v Speaker 1>Economic Cooperation and Development. So, I mean, there's a lot

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<v Speaker 1>to do as far as getting technology, especially internet technology,

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<v Speaker 1>more widespread use in the United States. So let's start.

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<v Speaker 1>Let's break this down and talk about both of these

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<v Speaker 1>in turn. We'll start with the Chief Information Officer. I

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<v Speaker 1>blogged about this guy earlier, so I should be able

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<v Speaker 1>to talk about him a little bit. So you've got

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<v Speaker 1>the information on the Chief Information Officers. Yes, I even

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<v Speaker 1>have his correct title. He'd he'd be proud of you, Yes,

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<v Speaker 1>I would hope. So his name is Vivic Gundra. And uh, okay,

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<v Speaker 1>here's where I get a little ill because Vivic is

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<v Speaker 1>the same age as yours. Truly, really, I'm the same

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<v Speaker 1>age as the United States Chief Information Officer. No, no, no,

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<v Speaker 1>I'm older than you. I know you're older than I am.

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<v Speaker 1>So you're older than the United States Chief Information Officer.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm going to retire after this podcast, I know. Isn't

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<v Speaker 1>that incredible? Okay, So granted, now when you're talking about

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<v Speaker 1>things like the Internet, I T infrastructure, that kind of stuff. Uh,

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<v Speaker 1>you really are looking for people who have their their

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<v Speaker 1>finger on the pulse of what's going on right now.

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<v Speaker 1>So I guess it kind of makes sense that he's

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<v Speaker 1>going young with this. It's just kind of sobering when

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<v Speaker 1>you start seeing people who are in charge of a

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<v Speaker 1>very important positions who are the same age or younger

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<v Speaker 1>than you are, and then you start questioning what you've

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<v Speaker 1>done with your life. Anyway, So he's a thirty four

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<v Speaker 1>years old. Um. He was born in New Delhi. Then

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<v Speaker 1>as his family migrated to Tanzania, and then at the

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<v Speaker 1>age eleven he moved to the United States. And before

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<v Speaker 1>he was appointed the Chief Information Officer of the United States,

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<v Speaker 1>he was the uh ct OH, the Chief Technology Officer

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<v Speaker 1>for the District of Columbia, and so that's he was

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<v Speaker 1>actually in charge of eighty six different agencies there. Um

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<v Speaker 1>he was they all reported to him essentially in his

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<v Speaker 1>role as CTO. And before that, he was the Assistant

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<v Speaker 1>Secretary of Commerce and Technology for the Commonwealth of Virginia.

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<v Speaker 1>So he's held some pretty serious high end tech positions.

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<v Speaker 1>And this is a man who knows his stuff, And

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<v Speaker 1>he's already come out and talked about the sort of

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<v Speaker 1>things that he wants to do as the c i

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<v Speaker 1>O of the United States, and it's a big list. Um.

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<v Speaker 1>Part of that is, like we we talked about transparency earlier.

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<v Speaker 1>That was one of the things that Congress said Barack

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<v Speaker 1>Obama wanted in his c t O. What looks like

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<v Speaker 1>the c i O is gonna handle that part of

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<v Speaker 1>the equation. Uh, And when we're talking about transparency, we're

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<v Speaker 1>saying that it will be his responsibility to make sure

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<v Speaker 1>that public information is easily available to the citizens of

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<v Speaker 1>the United States, that you don't have to jump through

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<v Speaker 1>hoops in order to find information that should be publicly available.

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<v Speaker 1>To that end, he's trying to establish a website called

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<v Speaker 1>data dot gov, which will kind of be a clearing

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<v Speaker 1>house of all this information, hopefully organized in such a

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<v Speaker 1>way that it's easy to navigate and find exactly what

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<v Speaker 1>you're looking for. So this is a big deal. I mean,

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<v Speaker 1>it's going to theoretically give the average citizen a chance

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<v Speaker 1>to see the decision making process that goes that's involved

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<v Speaker 1>in creating policies. And uh, you know that this really

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<v Speaker 1>does fall in line with what Barack Obama had done previously,

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<v Speaker 1>his idea of communicating to the people and making things

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<v Speaker 1>as clear as possible so that the people know what

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<v Speaker 1>what they're elected officials are doing and why they're doing it,

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<v Speaker 1>because a lot of times, you know, well, people will

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<v Speaker 1>elect an official based upon apology, a party affiliation, and

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<v Speaker 1>and maybe a few policies. Like you, you happen to

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<v Speaker 1>know that person's stance on a particular issue, but beyond that,

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<v Speaker 1>we kind of let them do their thing, and then

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<v Speaker 1>we get upset when tax time comes around. And then

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<v Speaker 1>you know that, we get more upset when elections come

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<v Speaker 1>around and we decided to throw one group out and

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<v Speaker 1>bring another group in, but we don't tend to build

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<v Speaker 1>build a lot of understanding of what's going on throughout

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<v Speaker 1>that time. This is an attempt to change that, which

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<v Speaker 1>I mean now, granted, a huge responsibility is going to

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<v Speaker 1>fall upon the American citizens to make sure that they

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<v Speaker 1>actually take advantage of these opportunities. But it's a huge step.

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<v Speaker 1>I think that's true. And um, it's been notoriously difficult

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<v Speaker 1>over the past few years to get it a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of this information, Um, you know, things that should be

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<v Speaker 1>available via the freedom of Information Act um, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>simply because it's it's you know, not ready for h

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<v Speaker 1>for public consumption, right, you know, in the public area.

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<v Speaker 1>So this is this is a serious, um, serious step. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>And and now granted, there's no guarantee that we're going

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<v Speaker 1>to see a decrease in things like citing executive privilege

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<v Speaker 1>anything like that. I mean, they're still going to be

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<v Speaker 1>opportunities for politicians to keep information held back based on

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<v Speaker 1>numerous kinds of criteria, but state secrets and all kinds

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<v Speaker 1>of other things that are gonna you know, prevent it

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<v Speaker 1>from being published at least immediately. Being sometime will tell

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<v Speaker 1>whether or not this this data dot gov site will

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<v Speaker 1>really be a great tool. But it's it's I'm being

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<v Speaker 1>I'm trying to be optimistic about it because it sounds

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<v Speaker 1>to me like it could really be an incredible development. Well,

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<v Speaker 1>I'm I'm interested to know who the CTO is going

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<v Speaker 1>to be, boy, you and everybody else, you know, looking

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<v Speaker 1>at a at the Business Week website, Um, I saw

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<v Speaker 1>an article last fall and they had some pretty you know,

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<v Speaker 1>because Senator Obama at that time had made public that

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<v Speaker 1>he wanted a ct O if he were elected. Presidents

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<v Speaker 1>and so they started floating some names around. I mean

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<v Speaker 1>people like Google CEO Eric Schmidt, who actually pulled his

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<v Speaker 1>name out of the running last fall the surf also

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<v Speaker 1>another Google guy, Yes, the chief Internet Evangelists, one of

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<v Speaker 1>the fathers of the Internet. Oh yeah, and that too, yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>Uh Steve Balmer, Microsoft CEO and a fan of all

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<v Speaker 1>the developers. Developers, Um, Jeff Bezos. That's Amazon dot Com right,

0:11:20.080 --> 0:11:22.480
<v Speaker 1>yes it is. And look at that. And uh, you

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<v Speaker 1>know Ed Felton from Princeton University and Lawrence Lessig from

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<v Speaker 1>the Stanford University Center for the Internet and Society, also

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<v Speaker 1>of Creative Commons fame. Uh you know, all those people's

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<v Speaker 1>names have been mentioned. And uh, just in January they

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<v Speaker 1>were mentioning two names that were very probable. Um. One

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<v Speaker 1>of them was Vivek Kundra, who is now the c

0:11:47.960 --> 0:11:51.040
<v Speaker 1>i Oh wait a minute, that leaves one name. Who

0:11:51.040 --> 0:11:58.600
<v Speaker 1>would be ah put Mastere Warrior w No, no, I'm sorry. No,

0:11:58.800 --> 0:12:04.480
<v Speaker 1>she's the CTO of Cisco formally yeah. Yeah, with with

0:12:04.600 --> 0:12:09.680
<v Speaker 1>some seriously uh impressive credentials of her own. Now, so

0:12:10.440 --> 0:12:12.360
<v Speaker 1>if the c i O is really in charge of

0:12:12.800 --> 0:12:17.839
<v Speaker 1>information infrastructure and transparency and making sure to promote these

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<v Speaker 1>sort of things. The ct O. What is the CTO

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<v Speaker 1>gonna do? This is a good question. There's not not

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<v Speaker 1>been a lot of discussion, official discussion from Obama's administration

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<v Speaker 1>to really lay out all the different, um, the different

0:12:33.920 --> 0:12:37.280
<v Speaker 1>job duties that the CTO would have. We can we

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<v Speaker 1>can make some assumptions, I mean it, UH, perhaps forming

0:12:40.880 --> 0:12:45.960
<v Speaker 1>policies on things like UH like technology innovation and UM,

0:12:46.000 --> 0:12:48.120
<v Speaker 1>even things like net neutrality, that sort of thing that

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<v Speaker 1>may be able to shape national policy on those matters.

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<v Speaker 1>But also other things like kind of investigating sort of

0:12:56.280 --> 0:13:01.920
<v Speaker 1>the the what kind of technology the government can use, UM,

0:13:01.960 --> 0:13:05.679
<v Speaker 1>pushing that boundary a little further. And also another important

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<v Speaker 1>role will be trying to help create more jobs in

0:13:09.440 --> 0:13:13.120
<v Speaker 1>the technology field within the United States and UM. Just

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<v Speaker 1>today when we're recording this podcast, I saw a report

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<v Speaker 1>from c NET. This was very depressing actually, especially if

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<v Speaker 1>you're in the tech sector and you're looking for a job,

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<v Speaker 1>because according to c NET, tech job postings fell forty

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<v Speaker 1>point four percent in March over a year ago figures

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<v Speaker 1>and UH. And also most of those cuts came from

0:13:36.080 --> 0:13:38.760
<v Speaker 1>full time positions. So if you're out of a job

0:13:38.800 --> 0:13:41.880
<v Speaker 1>and you're looking for something in the tech industry. Um,

0:13:41.920 --> 0:13:44.479
<v Speaker 1>there are a lot fewer jobs out there being posted

0:13:44.600 --> 0:13:47.760
<v Speaker 1>than there were a year ago. This is a huge problem,

0:13:47.800 --> 0:13:50.920
<v Speaker 1>and I mean it's it's not surprising because the economy

0:13:50.960 --> 0:13:54.200
<v Speaker 1>has been so in so much trouble recently, but it's

0:13:54.559 --> 0:13:56.880
<v Speaker 1>And also you've heard, of course about all the thousands

0:13:56.880 --> 0:13:59.959
<v Speaker 1>and thousands of of layoffs that various companies have had

0:14:00.080 --> 0:14:03.880
<v Speaker 1>to do, including companies that had never laid off employees before,

0:14:04.880 --> 0:14:09.120
<v Speaker 1>like Microsoft and Google both historically had never really done

0:14:09.120 --> 0:14:12.920
<v Speaker 1>any of these mass employee layoffs until late two thousand eight,

0:14:12.960 --> 0:14:16.560
<v Speaker 1>early two thousand nine. So that's a tall order for

0:14:16.640 --> 0:14:19.480
<v Speaker 1>the c t O. UM. I wish whomever holds that

0:14:19.520 --> 0:14:23.560
<v Speaker 1>position the best of luck. Well, one thing about these

0:14:23.560 --> 0:14:26.840
<v Speaker 1>positions is, um they're going to have an opportunity to

0:14:27.000 --> 0:14:29.160
<v Speaker 1>shape what the next c I O and c t

0:14:29.360 --> 0:14:33.240
<v Speaker 1>O do because, um, you know, as the originators in

0:14:33.280 --> 0:14:36.600
<v Speaker 1>these positions, they're going to have you know, people are

0:14:36.640 --> 0:14:39.240
<v Speaker 1>going to look to what they do, you know, in

0:14:39.280 --> 0:14:43.080
<v Speaker 1>successive administrations. You know, assuming that the next president keeps

0:14:43.360 --> 0:14:47.160
<v Speaker 1>those two cabinet level positions in place, UM, you know,

0:14:47.200 --> 0:14:49.440
<v Speaker 1>they're going to have a lot of influence on the

0:14:49.480 --> 0:14:52.840
<v Speaker 1>technological future of the country and the way the government

0:14:52.960 --> 0:14:57.280
<v Speaker 1>and technology industries interact with one another. So you know

0:14:57.400 --> 0:15:00.880
<v Speaker 1>that this is not something to be taken light. I

0:15:00.960 --> 0:15:03.160
<v Speaker 1>also kind of hope that the CTO and the c

0:15:03.400 --> 0:15:08.160
<v Speaker 1>IO can work together too to kind of really take

0:15:08.200 --> 0:15:12.480
<v Speaker 1>a real close look at the way certain mega corporations

0:15:12.520 --> 0:15:15.880
<v Speaker 1>are kind of throwing their weight around and essentially dictating

0:15:15.920 --> 0:15:19.160
<v Speaker 1>what political policy is in the in the realms of

0:15:19.200 --> 0:15:22.040
<v Speaker 1>the Internet. I'm talking here about I S P S.

0:15:22.080 --> 0:15:25.680
<v Speaker 1>I'm talking about like the net neutrality that would be it,

0:15:25.920 --> 0:15:27.960
<v Speaker 1>or maybe the r I double A or the MP

0:15:28.080 --> 0:15:32.920
<v Speaker 1>double A. I mean, we're talking about gigantic organizations that

0:15:33.440 --> 0:15:36.680
<v Speaker 1>have been able to pretty much shape the way the

0:15:36.800 --> 0:15:41.760
<v Speaker 1>u S. Law handles handles situations over the Internet. Are

0:15:43.280 --> 0:15:46.920
<v Speaker 1>defining what is a crime versus what is not a crime. UH,

0:15:47.000 --> 0:15:50.680
<v Speaker 1>And you know it's almost like the uh like they're there,

0:15:51.240 --> 0:15:53.760
<v Speaker 1>they're making up the rules. It would be nice to

0:15:53.800 --> 0:15:59.240
<v Speaker 1>have some people who really know the whole background and

0:15:59.280 --> 0:16:02.000
<v Speaker 1>can really look at the big picture and define what

0:16:02.080 --> 0:16:05.200
<v Speaker 1>the rules are. Now, maybe those rules won't be the

0:16:05.240 --> 0:16:08.360
<v Speaker 1>same ones that I would like to see, but at

0:16:08.400 --> 0:16:10.080
<v Speaker 1>least I know that it would be coming from a

0:16:10.120 --> 0:16:14.120
<v Speaker 1>more impartial party. Well, and it's uh, it's true too

0:16:14.120 --> 0:16:16.000
<v Speaker 1>that the FCC has had a hand in a lot

0:16:16.040 --> 0:16:18.000
<v Speaker 1>of this in the past, but it's really sort of

0:16:18.080 --> 0:16:21.280
<v Speaker 1>been a different role than what the c I O

0:16:21.400 --> 0:16:25.560
<v Speaker 1>and CTO would do, uh, it would take in this case,

0:16:25.640 --> 0:16:27.520
<v Speaker 1>because they're gonna be a lot more hands on. The

0:16:27.520 --> 0:16:31.400
<v Speaker 1>FCC has um their fingers and a lot more different

0:16:31.480 --> 0:16:36.600
<v Speaker 1>kinds of communication. Um. And it's sort of a I

0:16:36.600 --> 0:16:38.840
<v Speaker 1>don't know, a peripheral rule in some In some ways

0:16:38.920 --> 0:16:41.600
<v Speaker 1>it's you know, it's not the same as it would

0:16:41.600 --> 0:16:43.520
<v Speaker 1>be for for these guys who are going to be

0:16:43.560 --> 0:16:48.200
<v Speaker 1>completely focused on you know, tech and the Internet. And

0:16:48.240 --> 0:16:51.760
<v Speaker 1>I do have one more hope for for them. Hopefully

0:16:51.760 --> 0:16:53.840
<v Speaker 1>they can get this straighten out. I really hope that

0:16:53.920 --> 0:16:58.640
<v Speaker 1>somebody can identify who took that poor Walrus's bucket. Yeah,

0:16:58.720 --> 0:17:01.920
<v Speaker 1>I do too. I mean that that bucket has been

0:17:01.920 --> 0:17:05.720
<v Speaker 1>missing for quite some time and is in a lot

0:17:05.760 --> 0:17:10.359
<v Speaker 1>of distress. I've seen pictures, many of them. I can't

0:17:10.359 --> 0:17:14.520
<v Speaker 1>believe you brought that up. I'm really surprised that you

0:17:14.520 --> 0:17:16.080
<v Speaker 1>can't believe I brought that up. Well, I was also

0:17:16.119 --> 0:17:19.520
<v Speaker 1>going to say, on a more serious note that they

0:17:19.560 --> 0:17:21.240
<v Speaker 1>do have a big job ahead of them, and of

0:17:21.280 --> 0:17:23.959
<v Speaker 1>course not all of these questions will be answered very

0:17:24.040 --> 0:17:26.639
<v Speaker 1>quickly because when you think about Internet, of course is

0:17:26.640 --> 0:17:29.760
<v Speaker 1>a global entity. It does not belong to the United States.

0:17:30.480 --> 0:17:32.920
<v Speaker 1>There's a lot of lawlessness on there. It just comes

0:17:32.960 --> 0:17:36.439
<v Speaker 1>from being a multinational entity made up of basically a

0:17:36.440 --> 0:17:40.600
<v Speaker 1>whole bunch of individual people. Right, So, so they're going

0:17:40.640 --> 0:17:43.040
<v Speaker 1>to be some limitations they'll be working with just based

0:17:43.080 --> 0:17:46.320
<v Speaker 1>upon what the Internet is. So not to mention just

0:17:46.400 --> 0:17:50.120
<v Speaker 1>getting started. Yeah, it's The're not building on anybody else's work, right,

0:17:50.160 --> 0:17:53.879
<v Speaker 1>This is you know, it's so much of Obama's administration

0:17:54.000 --> 0:17:57.920
<v Speaker 1>is really all about building from the ground up that

0:17:58.080 --> 0:18:02.680
<v Speaker 1>it's sometimes really overwhelming. Um, I can't I'll be a maze.

0:18:02.880 --> 0:18:04.639
<v Speaker 1>I'm really looking forward to seeing where we are in

0:18:04.680 --> 0:18:07.560
<v Speaker 1>four years, just to see how much of that is successful,

0:18:07.600 --> 0:18:09.600
<v Speaker 1>because to me, when I look at it just looks

0:18:09.600 --> 0:18:12.520
<v Speaker 1>so monumental that I can't even imagine it. Lest we

0:18:12.680 --> 0:18:16.719
<v Speaker 1>sound partial. Um, you know, honestly, I think these positions

0:18:16.800 --> 0:18:20.760
<v Speaker 1>are would be useful to anybody, you know, Democrat, Republican, Tory,

0:18:20.800 --> 0:18:28.960
<v Speaker 1>wig federalist, federalists, you know, anarchists, maybe maybe even like libertarian. Yeah,

0:18:29.000 --> 0:18:31.520
<v Speaker 1>but I mean, you know these are you know, so

0:18:31.600 --> 0:18:33.679
<v Speaker 1>many of us depend on technology. I think this is

0:18:33.960 --> 0:18:36.760
<v Speaker 1>a good step for anybody to to put into practice.

0:18:36.800 --> 0:18:40.320
<v Speaker 1>It's much better than ignoring it. Yeah, definitely, Sea So

0:18:40.480 --> 0:18:42.199
<v Speaker 1>well that was that was a good discussion on the

0:18:42.240 --> 0:18:44.800
<v Speaker 1>old ct O and c i O. So that brings

0:18:44.880 --> 0:18:54.240
<v Speaker 1>us to listener mail. So listener mail. This one comes

0:18:54.280 --> 0:18:58.720
<v Speaker 1>from Matt, and Matt says, hey there, it's my line, Matt.

0:18:59.840 --> 0:19:02.840
<v Speaker 1>So I listen to your episode on niche social networks

0:19:02.840 --> 0:19:05.639
<v Speaker 1>and I have one that is growing very fast, my

0:19:05.800 --> 0:19:09.840
<v Speaker 1>leaky dot com. It springs off of the Harry Potter

0:19:09.880 --> 0:19:12.720
<v Speaker 1>news site, the Leaky Cauldron dot org, and it has

0:19:12.760 --> 0:19:15.960
<v Speaker 1>been growing steadily since January. Well, we have a few

0:19:15.960 --> 0:19:19.000
<v Speaker 1>Harry Potter fans in the office, so I'm going to

0:19:19.040 --> 0:19:21.360
<v Speaker 1>spread this information around so that we can see how

0:19:21.400 --> 0:19:24.560
<v Speaker 1>many of them, uh you know, brandished their wands online,

0:19:25.040 --> 0:19:29.919
<v Speaker 1>so to speak. Maybe I should have a warded that differently. Well,

0:19:29.960 --> 0:19:32.720
<v Speaker 1>too late. Now, if any of you would like to

0:19:32.760 --> 0:19:36.280
<v Speaker 1>send any comments or suggestions or corrections or anything of

0:19:36.320 --> 0:19:38.480
<v Speaker 1>that nature to us, you can do that at tech

0:19:38.560 --> 0:19:42.200
<v Speaker 1>stuff at how stuff works dot com. Remember we also

0:19:42.240 --> 0:19:45.360
<v Speaker 1>have blogs at blogs dot how stuff Works dot com,

0:19:45.400 --> 0:19:48.359
<v Speaker 1>slash category slash tech stuff, and you can find a

0:19:48.440 --> 0:19:51.399
<v Speaker 1>lot of this information on our website, how stuff works

0:19:51.440 --> 0:19:54.520
<v Speaker 1>dot com. We will talk to you again really soon

0:19:56.119 --> 0:19:58.520
<v Speaker 1>for more on this and thousands of other topics. Is

0:19:58.560 --> 0:20:00.040
<v Speaker 1>it how staff works dot com s