1 00:00:00,880 --> 00:00:04,360 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound On podcast. Catch us 2 00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:06,479 Speaker 1: live weekdays at one Eastern. 3 00:00:06,160 --> 00:00:09,360 Speaker 2: On Bloomberg dot Com, the iHeartRadio app, and the Bloomberg 4 00:00:09,400 --> 00:00:10,200 Speaker 2: Business app. 5 00:00:10,240 --> 00:00:12,800 Speaker 1: Or listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts. 6 00:00:15,600 --> 00:00:19,320 Speaker 3: What happens when there's a debate and no one wins. 7 00:00:20,280 --> 00:00:23,160 Speaker 3: Welcome to hour two of Sound on this day. After 8 00:00:23,200 --> 00:00:26,520 Speaker 3: the big debate and Donald Trump's counter programming last night, 9 00:00:26,880 --> 00:00:29,639 Speaker 3: prompting a lot of sound bites but no apparent shakeup 10 00:00:29,960 --> 00:00:31,280 Speaker 3: in the landscape here. 11 00:00:31,680 --> 00:00:33,000 Speaker 4: The Republican race for president. 12 00:00:33,040 --> 00:00:34,760 Speaker 3: We're going to be joined this hour by Lonnie Chen, 13 00:00:34,840 --> 00:00:37,879 Speaker 3: longtime Republican strategist now with the Hoover Institution, about what 14 00:00:37,920 --> 00:00:40,720 Speaker 3: we heard last night, whether he sees a potential for 15 00:00:40,800 --> 00:00:43,200 Speaker 3: anyone to break out in this race, and how Donald 16 00:00:43,240 --> 00:00:46,600 Speaker 3: Trump did with the other show. Later, breaking news on 17 00:00:46,640 --> 00:00:48,760 Speaker 3: the downing of a jet in Russia. We've told you 18 00:00:48,760 --> 00:00:52,600 Speaker 3: about apparently carrying Yevgeny pregosion. We have news from the 19 00:00:52,680 --> 00:00:55,440 Speaker 3: United States on how that plane may have gone down. 20 00:00:55,880 --> 00:00:57,960 Speaker 3: With a lot to cover this hour, let's start on 21 00:00:57,960 --> 00:01:00,800 Speaker 3: Wall Street. Charlie Pellett has our update on rating for us. 22 00:01:00,840 --> 00:01:04,039 Speaker 3: As always, Hey try, Thank you very much. Joe Matthew, Hi, Charlie, 23 00:01:04,080 --> 00:01:06,440 Speaker 3: thank you. Welcome to our two of Sound On. I'm 24 00:01:06,520 --> 00:01:09,319 Speaker 3: Joe Matthew in Washington, joined at the table now by 25 00:01:09,360 --> 00:01:12,440 Speaker 3: our friend Kaylee Lines, who's still resting up after a 26 00:01:12,560 --> 00:01:15,320 Speaker 3: night of three hours of programming essentially between the debate 27 00:01:15,319 --> 00:01:17,480 Speaker 3: and the interview. And boy, we've got a lot to 28 00:01:18,640 --> 00:01:21,960 Speaker 3: come yet today with our eyes on Fulton County and Georgia. 29 00:01:22,000 --> 00:01:24,600 Speaker 4: This just it's August, but it never stops. 30 00:01:24,840 --> 00:01:27,960 Speaker 5: No multiple things to pay attention to at once, last 31 00:01:28,040 --> 00:01:31,240 Speaker 5: night being the X interview between Trump and Tucker as 32 00:01:31,280 --> 00:01:33,800 Speaker 5: well as the first primary debate, and then today the 33 00:01:33,840 --> 00:01:36,600 Speaker 5: aftermath of the debate. We're all trying to assess whether 34 00:01:36,640 --> 00:01:40,119 Speaker 5: any needles actually were moved by the conversation that happened 35 00:01:40,120 --> 00:01:42,520 Speaker 5: on stage in Milwaukee. At the same time, we also 36 00:01:42,600 --> 00:01:44,800 Speaker 5: have our eyes on Trump's airplane to see when it's 37 00:01:44,800 --> 00:01:48,400 Speaker 5: going to travel from New Jersey down to Georgia so 38 00:01:48,440 --> 00:01:49,320 Speaker 5: that he could show up at the. 39 00:01:49,320 --> 00:01:50,200 Speaker 6: Jail in Fulton County. 40 00:01:50,240 --> 00:01:51,560 Speaker 4: So it was really good with the X. You just 41 00:01:51,640 --> 00:01:53,520 Speaker 4: went right to X. There's no more Twitter for you. 42 00:01:54,560 --> 00:01:55,200 Speaker 4: I don't know, I. 43 00:01:55,200 --> 00:01:59,520 Speaker 5: Feel like I fluctuate. Yeah, but it said Tucker on X. 44 00:01:59,520 --> 00:02:01,800 Speaker 4: I think that he had a whole logo last night. 45 00:02:02,000 --> 00:02:05,840 Speaker 3: Now X Elon Musk was clearly embracing this whole thing. 46 00:02:06,720 --> 00:02:09,440 Speaker 3: We're going to talk to Lonnie Chen, who's with us 47 00:02:09,440 --> 00:02:12,519 Speaker 3: here at the table as well today, a longtime Republican 48 00:02:12,560 --> 00:02:15,880 Speaker 3: strategist helped to run, helped to advise the Rodney campaign, 49 00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:18,160 Speaker 3: the market Rubio campaign in sixteen. We're just talking to 50 00:02:18,200 --> 00:02:20,360 Speaker 3: Nicky Haley about that. Remember that big endorsement. 51 00:02:20,360 --> 00:02:22,640 Speaker 4: I bet you do. Welcome back, It's wonderful to see you. 52 00:02:23,400 --> 00:02:25,320 Speaker 3: I want to bring it back to a moment last 53 00:02:25,360 --> 00:02:27,360 Speaker 3: night that you may have had a hard time finding 54 00:02:27,360 --> 00:02:30,480 Speaker 3: to begin with or remembering, because the governor of Florida 55 00:02:30,480 --> 00:02:30,880 Speaker 3: did speak. 56 00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:33,600 Speaker 7: We want to start on this with a show of hands. 57 00:02:34,080 --> 00:02:39,600 Speaker 7: Do you believe in human behavior is causing climate change? 58 00:02:39,639 --> 00:02:42,000 Speaker 4: Raise your hand if you do. Look, we're not school children. 59 00:02:42,080 --> 00:02:44,079 Speaker 4: Let's have the debate. I mean, I'm happy to take 60 00:02:44,080 --> 00:02:44,760 Speaker 4: it to start up. 61 00:02:48,000 --> 00:02:50,640 Speaker 3: That was actually one of probably his better moments last night, 62 00:02:50,680 --> 00:02:54,200 Speaker 3: where he tried to seize the debate, try to get 63 00:02:54,240 --> 00:02:57,400 Speaker 3: the microphone. The Trump team, Lonnie said that he had 64 00:02:57,440 --> 00:02:59,639 Speaker 3: a cameo and they thought they'd hear a little more 65 00:02:59,639 --> 00:03:01,600 Speaker 3: from him last night. The whole idea was this was 66 00:03:01,600 --> 00:03:04,000 Speaker 3: going to be a pileon run. But some folks who 67 00:03:04,320 --> 00:03:06,240 Speaker 3: might maybe watch a ten or twenty minute chunk didn't 68 00:03:06,240 --> 00:03:07,040 Speaker 3: even hear from him. 69 00:03:07,880 --> 00:03:09,760 Speaker 4: Did he let you down? What was the strategy? 70 00:03:10,000 --> 00:03:14,440 Speaker 8: I mean, look, the strategy probably for him was to survive, honestly, 71 00:03:14,520 --> 00:03:16,600 Speaker 8: because I also thought I also thought it was going 72 00:03:16,680 --> 00:03:18,440 Speaker 8: to be a pile on the fact that it wasn't 73 00:03:18,639 --> 00:03:20,560 Speaker 8: makes it a win for him because he doesn't come 74 00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:23,000 Speaker 8: out of the debate any worse. In my view, there 75 00:03:23,000 --> 00:03:25,480 Speaker 8: are a lot of people who are in the donor community, 76 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:28,800 Speaker 8: who were in the establishment sort of thought leader, whatever 77 00:03:28,800 --> 00:03:31,120 Speaker 8: you want to call it, the establishment community, who had 78 00:03:31,120 --> 00:03:33,280 Speaker 8: their doubts about Rond DeSantis going in a last night, 79 00:03:33,440 --> 00:03:37,240 Speaker 8: and I don't think that he did anything to make 80 00:03:37,280 --> 00:03:39,440 Speaker 8: those doubts worse, Let's put it that way. So in 81 00:03:39,440 --> 00:03:41,760 Speaker 8: that sense, I think you have to view that as 82 00:03:41,880 --> 00:03:44,119 Speaker 8: a win. Now, could he have been more forceful, could 83 00:03:44,120 --> 00:03:47,360 Speaker 8: he have been involved in more conversations, perhaps, but I 84 00:03:47,400 --> 00:03:50,240 Speaker 8: think if you look at the overall trajectory of that campaign, 85 00:03:51,440 --> 00:03:53,640 Speaker 8: it could have been a lot worse, right, And if 86 00:03:53,680 --> 00:03:55,920 Speaker 8: everybody had come after him and he was sort of 87 00:03:55,960 --> 00:03:58,320 Speaker 8: parrying things, it could have been worse. 88 00:03:58,480 --> 00:04:01,080 Speaker 5: I think, well, who they decided to go laughter ultimately, 89 00:04:01,080 --> 00:04:03,280 Speaker 5: and who commanded a lot of the oxygen and attention 90 00:04:04,080 --> 00:04:07,040 Speaker 5: was the vake Romsque who has been pulling in third. 91 00:04:07,440 --> 00:04:10,080 Speaker 5: Even if DeSantis didn't do anything to make it materially 92 00:04:10,160 --> 00:04:13,800 Speaker 5: worse an absence of making it material materially better, did 93 00:04:13,800 --> 00:04:16,400 Speaker 5: he just perhaps sacrifice the number two position? Do you 94 00:04:16,400 --> 00:04:19,200 Speaker 5: think we could see someone like Levig overtaking him in 95 00:04:19,240 --> 00:04:20,400 Speaker 5: the Nozo distant future. 96 00:04:20,520 --> 00:04:23,880 Speaker 8: I think what Viveke did was to reinforce the concept 97 00:04:23,880 --> 00:04:26,880 Speaker 8: that he's very good communicator. He's very good in those situations, 98 00:04:27,360 --> 00:04:29,400 Speaker 8: but I think he's got a ceiling. And I think 99 00:04:29,440 --> 00:04:32,520 Speaker 8: if you look at the you know, a couple of 100 00:04:32,560 --> 00:04:34,920 Speaker 8: focus groups were done right after the debate by various 101 00:04:34,960 --> 00:04:36,960 Speaker 8: media networks, and I think what was conveyed in those 102 00:04:36,960 --> 00:04:38,960 Speaker 8: focus groups is what all the people are thinking, which 103 00:04:39,000 --> 00:04:42,240 Speaker 8: is he seems like a nice communicator, he seems you know, slick, 104 00:04:42,640 --> 00:04:45,840 Speaker 8: but he's too young, he's not experienced enough. I do 105 00:04:45,880 --> 00:04:48,080 Speaker 8: think that those attacks, while they seemed a little bit 106 00:04:48,080 --> 00:04:51,440 Speaker 8: hackneyed at the time, do speak to his principal problem, 107 00:04:51,480 --> 00:04:53,960 Speaker 8: which is that there's only so much of the electorate 108 00:04:54,000 --> 00:04:57,000 Speaker 8: that's available to him in a Republican primary, and he's 109 00:04:57,000 --> 00:04:59,280 Speaker 8: going to hit that ceiling and that's pretty much going 110 00:04:59,320 --> 00:05:00,640 Speaker 8: to be it in my view. So you're right, he 111 00:05:00,680 --> 00:05:02,400 Speaker 8: drove a lot of attention. He may even be at 112 00:05:02,400 --> 00:05:03,880 Speaker 8: the center of the stage for the next debate at 113 00:05:03,880 --> 00:05:06,240 Speaker 8: the Reagan Library in California, but I don't think it 114 00:05:06,279 --> 00:05:08,000 Speaker 8: makes him any more likely to be the nominee. 115 00:05:08,000 --> 00:05:12,520 Speaker 3: So this is a stock that popped after hours already 116 00:05:12,640 --> 00:05:15,719 Speaker 3: use a yeah, but I mean, look, we could listen. 117 00:05:15,760 --> 00:05:16,840 Speaker 4: That's the way these things work. 118 00:05:16,880 --> 00:05:17,040 Speaker 8: Though. 119 00:05:17,040 --> 00:05:19,680 Speaker 3: When you look back at the sixteen campaign, everybody got 120 00:05:19,720 --> 00:05:21,719 Speaker 3: a night or a month, yeah, and then there was 121 00:05:21,760 --> 00:05:24,039 Speaker 3: no follow on, asked Chris Christie. That actually could have 122 00:05:24,080 --> 00:05:26,240 Speaker 3: been the high water mark for mister Ramaswami. 123 00:05:26,320 --> 00:05:27,760 Speaker 6: No, yeah, very well could have been. 124 00:05:27,960 --> 00:05:31,400 Speaker 8: And what you see, what I saw last night was 125 00:05:31,400 --> 00:05:34,440 Speaker 8: how much disdain, just raw disdain. 126 00:05:34,040 --> 00:05:35,640 Speaker 6: There was for him from the other candidates. 127 00:05:35,680 --> 00:05:38,400 Speaker 8: I'm about to look at the way that Nikki Haley 128 00:05:38,440 --> 00:05:40,840 Speaker 8: engaged him, the way that Mike Pence engaged him. Chris Christie, 129 00:05:41,279 --> 00:05:45,520 Speaker 8: everybody took their shots at vague because I think the 130 00:05:45,680 --> 00:05:48,200 Speaker 8: idea that he's up there with them, they find to 131 00:05:48,240 --> 00:05:51,560 Speaker 8: be kind of fundamentally offensive in some ways, right, and 132 00:05:52,120 --> 00:05:54,440 Speaker 8: they were not afraid to let that emotion show when 133 00:05:54,440 --> 00:05:54,880 Speaker 8: they went aft. 134 00:05:54,960 --> 00:05:58,240 Speaker 3: When you remember the moment Kayley, when he said Donald Trump, 135 00:05:59,160 --> 00:06:02,240 Speaker 3: I believe was the president of the twenty first century, 136 00:06:02,279 --> 00:06:03,800 Speaker 3: then why would you run against him? 137 00:06:04,160 --> 00:06:05,800 Speaker 4: I can't answer that in my head. 138 00:06:05,880 --> 00:06:07,560 Speaker 5: Well, I think this is the question we have frankly 139 00:06:07,600 --> 00:06:11,760 Speaker 5: been continually asking, is that Trump is the opponent of 140 00:06:11,839 --> 00:06:14,880 Speaker 5: all of these individuals, and yet most of them, in 141 00:06:14,920 --> 00:06:18,160 Speaker 5: the absence of Asa Hutchinson and Chris Christy for example, 142 00:06:18,640 --> 00:06:21,640 Speaker 5: have been very reluctant to speak out against him, and 143 00:06:21,680 --> 00:06:25,479 Speaker 5: in some cases have actually outright defended him. How long 144 00:06:25,520 --> 00:06:28,200 Speaker 5: can they keep that up if realistically they need to 145 00:06:28,200 --> 00:06:29,360 Speaker 5: get through him to. 146 00:06:29,320 --> 00:06:31,400 Speaker 8: Get to phenomenal Well, I mean, that's exactly the right question, 147 00:06:31,520 --> 00:06:34,680 Speaker 8: because the way this primary has set up. I have 148 00:06:34,800 --> 00:06:37,279 Speaker 8: always felt, if you want to take out the king, 149 00:06:37,360 --> 00:06:39,960 Speaker 8: you need to take out the king. You cannot use proxies, 150 00:06:40,000 --> 00:06:43,839 Speaker 8: you cannot go sideways, you have to come directly at him, 151 00:06:44,040 --> 00:06:46,480 Speaker 8: and no one really has been willing to do that 152 00:06:46,520 --> 00:06:48,440 Speaker 8: in a sustained way, or certainly in a way that 153 00:06:48,440 --> 00:06:51,440 Speaker 8: would impact the likelihood that he's the nominee. And so 154 00:06:52,040 --> 00:06:55,520 Speaker 8: what you're left with is this inalterable conclusion that last night, 155 00:06:55,960 --> 00:06:59,240 Speaker 8: while entertaining for some, did not move the needle for 156 00:06:59,320 --> 00:07:02,320 Speaker 8: anybody else. So this is still Donald Trump's nominating contests. 157 00:07:02,640 --> 00:07:05,359 Speaker 8: I think the poll numbers will reflect, broadly speaking, a 158 00:07:05,400 --> 00:07:07,560 Speaker 8: bump for NICKI Haley, so she's going to go from 159 00:07:07,600 --> 00:07:10,000 Speaker 8: maybe two percent to four percent or five percent. But 160 00:07:10,080 --> 00:07:12,480 Speaker 8: at the end of the day, this is still Donald 161 00:07:12,480 --> 00:07:13,480 Speaker 8: Trump's race to lose. 162 00:07:13,560 --> 00:07:15,160 Speaker 6: It has been that way. 163 00:07:15,200 --> 00:07:18,400 Speaker 8: And I say that with some sadness, because you know, 164 00:07:18,480 --> 00:07:21,600 Speaker 8: I think that it's it's harmful for the Republican Party 165 00:07:21,640 --> 00:07:23,240 Speaker 8: in the long run to have Donald Trump as the 166 00:07:23,280 --> 00:07:26,240 Speaker 8: nominee the party again. But as I look at it, 167 00:07:26,320 --> 00:07:30,320 Speaker 8: I don't see any other conclusion being logically and empirically verifiable. 168 00:07:30,680 --> 00:07:33,160 Speaker 4: So smart move to sit down with Tucker and not again. 169 00:07:33,280 --> 00:07:35,880 Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean, I listen, why why should he have 170 00:07:35,880 --> 00:07:36,240 Speaker 6: gone to that? 171 00:07:36,440 --> 00:07:39,320 Speaker 8: He would have gotten beat up on probably or in 172 00:07:39,400 --> 00:07:42,240 Speaker 8: the alternative, he does well, and he's not a whole 173 00:07:42,280 --> 00:07:45,040 Speaker 8: lot better off. Right, his numbers are what his numbers are, Tucker, 174 00:07:45,080 --> 00:07:49,200 Speaker 8: He's speaking to his audience, and it's just a much 175 00:07:49,400 --> 00:07:53,400 Speaker 8: lower sort of likelihood that something goes wrong in that 176 00:07:53,520 --> 00:07:55,200 Speaker 8: environment versus in the debate environment. 177 00:07:55,280 --> 00:07:57,560 Speaker 6: So I think his team made the right call. 178 00:07:57,600 --> 00:07:59,840 Speaker 8: It's not the right call for democracy, but it's the 179 00:07:59,880 --> 00:08:01,560 Speaker 8: right call for the Trump team absolutely. 180 00:08:02,040 --> 00:08:04,960 Speaker 5: So as you're talking about the idea that this is 181 00:08:05,160 --> 00:08:07,160 Speaker 5: still Trump's race to lose, that no one is really 182 00:08:07,200 --> 00:08:09,200 Speaker 5: moving the needle here. Could the needle be moved if 183 00:08:09,240 --> 00:08:11,440 Speaker 5: it were four candidates on that stage instead of eight, 184 00:08:11,680 --> 00:08:14,360 Speaker 5: If we start to see a winnowing down of the 185 00:08:14,400 --> 00:08:16,600 Speaker 5: field from here, as we get closer to the second debate, 186 00:08:16,640 --> 00:08:18,800 Speaker 5: we see whether or not anyone who didn't make the 187 00:08:18,800 --> 00:08:21,040 Speaker 5: criteria this time around, whether or not they can pull 188 00:08:21,080 --> 00:08:24,920 Speaker 5: it off in round two. Is that when we actually 189 00:08:24,960 --> 00:08:27,160 Speaker 5: start to see it make a difference, And until then 190 00:08:27,240 --> 00:08:28,960 Speaker 5: is his lead just going to continue to widen. 191 00:08:29,280 --> 00:08:32,360 Speaker 8: If you look at primary campaigns past, it has been 192 00:08:32,400 --> 00:08:34,320 Speaker 8: when that field winnows and you're down to three or 193 00:08:34,320 --> 00:08:37,560 Speaker 8: four candidates around that debate stage or table, when you 194 00:08:37,679 --> 00:08:41,240 Speaker 8: begin to see harder contrasts. Right, it's when you had 195 00:08:41,280 --> 00:08:44,200 Speaker 8: Chris Christy going after Marco Rubio and that takedown. You know, 196 00:08:44,240 --> 00:08:45,960 Speaker 8: I think there were fewer candidates by the time we 197 00:08:46,000 --> 00:08:47,840 Speaker 8: got to that, not a lot fewer but a few fewer. 198 00:08:48,360 --> 00:08:50,720 Speaker 8: And so I do think what this rate, this race 199 00:08:50,800 --> 00:08:52,800 Speaker 8: is going to have to crystallize to a point where 200 00:08:52,840 --> 00:08:56,040 Speaker 8: it's one on one, and you've got a lot of 201 00:08:56,040 --> 00:08:57,920 Speaker 8: things standing in the way of one on one right now. 202 00:08:58,000 --> 00:09:01,160 Speaker 8: You've got personal ambition, you've got a lot of financial 203 00:09:01,200 --> 00:09:04,760 Speaker 8: resources behind some of these candidates, and you've got the 204 00:09:04,840 --> 00:09:08,200 Speaker 8: fact that their personal incentive is probably to stay in 205 00:09:08,240 --> 00:09:10,120 Speaker 8: as long as they can because they can participate in 206 00:09:10,160 --> 00:09:12,800 Speaker 8: these debates, people will learn more about them. There are 207 00:09:13,120 --> 00:09:16,400 Speaker 8: advantages to being in this race. So I just think 208 00:09:16,480 --> 00:09:21,199 Speaker 8: that Donald Trump having the lead also has several intrinsic advantages, 209 00:09:21,240 --> 00:09:23,640 Speaker 8: such as the fact that the inertia is going to 210 00:09:23,679 --> 00:09:26,640 Speaker 8: run toward a more people in the race for longer 211 00:09:27,120 --> 00:09:27,400 Speaker 8: than not. 212 00:09:29,080 --> 00:09:32,640 Speaker 3: Is part of the Donald Trump strategy to show up 213 00:09:32,640 --> 00:09:37,320 Speaker 3: at court today effective in keeping him in front of 214 00:09:37,320 --> 00:09:40,520 Speaker 3: the news, blunting what apparently was really not a balance 215 00:09:40,600 --> 00:09:43,400 Speaker 3: for anyone last night. The choreography we're going to see 216 00:09:43,400 --> 00:09:44,520 Speaker 3: over the next twelve hours is going to. 217 00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:46,079 Speaker 4: Be important for him, it is. 218 00:09:46,240 --> 00:09:48,200 Speaker 8: I mean, you know, he's always of the belief that 219 00:09:48,240 --> 00:09:50,880 Speaker 8: there's no such thing as bad coverage, as bad media, 220 00:09:50,960 --> 00:09:52,480 Speaker 8: and you know, he may be right about that. 221 00:09:52,520 --> 00:09:53,800 Speaker 4: I don't know the risks today then. 222 00:09:55,320 --> 00:09:56,160 Speaker 6: The same risks. 223 00:09:56,160 --> 00:09:58,440 Speaker 8: I mean, the risks right now are all general election risks. 224 00:09:58,440 --> 00:10:01,760 Speaker 8: In my view, they're not primary risks. One thing that 225 00:10:01,880 --> 00:10:04,000 Speaker 8: Nicki ham to go to this general primary issue. One 226 00:10:04,000 --> 00:10:06,599 Speaker 8: thing that Nicki Haley did very well last night was 227 00:10:06,679 --> 00:10:10,280 Speaker 8: present herself as a credible general election candidate. Her answers 228 00:10:10,320 --> 00:10:13,440 Speaker 8: on abortion on a whole other series, especially abortion, I 229 00:10:13,440 --> 00:10:17,960 Speaker 8: thought were really tuned toward that audience of independent voters, 230 00:10:18,280 --> 00:10:20,880 Speaker 8: whether they're pro life or pro choice. They hear what 231 00:10:20,920 --> 00:10:23,000 Speaker 8: she says and they think that's a very reasonable position 232 00:10:23,040 --> 00:10:26,360 Speaker 8: to take. So she was able to distinguish herself as 233 00:10:26,360 --> 00:10:28,960 Speaker 8: an effective general election candidate. She may have been the 234 00:10:28,960 --> 00:10:32,320 Speaker 8: only one, perhaps aside from Christy or Hutchinson or Bergham 235 00:10:32,360 --> 00:10:34,720 Speaker 8: to a certain degree, who were able to do that. 236 00:10:34,960 --> 00:10:40,000 Speaker 8: So I think Trump's challenge tonight is he's just getting 237 00:10:40,040 --> 00:10:41,600 Speaker 8: more fodder in my view to Joe Biden. 238 00:10:41,640 --> 00:10:43,480 Speaker 6: I mean the Biden team. 239 00:10:43,520 --> 00:10:46,280 Speaker 8: They're talking about Bidenomics now, They're not going to be 240 00:10:46,280 --> 00:10:49,320 Speaker 8: talking about Bidenomics when we get to next summer. About 241 00:10:49,360 --> 00:10:51,520 Speaker 8: Donald Trump and about his legal troubles and do you 242 00:10:51,559 --> 00:10:53,839 Speaker 8: really want this person in the White House again, that's 243 00:10:53,880 --> 00:10:57,000 Speaker 8: what it'll be. It's a really interesting election because it's 244 00:10:57,040 --> 00:10:59,000 Speaker 8: a referendum on both Biden and Trump. 245 00:11:00,160 --> 00:11:02,000 Speaker 5: Had that in a while, and to your point, Nikki 246 00:11:02,000 --> 00:11:04,160 Speaker 5: Haley was talking about that last night. She said most 247 00:11:04,240 --> 00:11:06,880 Speaker 5: voters do not want to see a rematch. Also said 248 00:11:06,920 --> 00:11:09,280 Speaker 5: that Donald Trump is either the least liked or the 249 00:11:09,320 --> 00:11:12,440 Speaker 5: most hated. I forget the exact language, so roughly phrasing 250 00:11:12,520 --> 00:11:15,240 Speaker 5: politician in America, and they can't win a general election 251 00:11:15,760 --> 00:11:18,600 Speaker 5: that way. But you say that the Biden administration eventually 252 00:11:18,640 --> 00:11:20,200 Speaker 5: is going to have to talk about Trump and his 253 00:11:20,280 --> 00:11:23,760 Speaker 5: legal problems. They have specifically avoided doing that to this point. 254 00:11:24,120 --> 00:11:26,480 Speaker 5: Because we also heard on stage last night a lot 255 00:11:26,520 --> 00:11:29,520 Speaker 5: about the weaponization of the Justice Department and going after 256 00:11:29,640 --> 00:11:32,480 Speaker 5: political opponents. How do they get around that narrative? 257 00:11:33,400 --> 00:11:37,360 Speaker 8: Yeah, I mean, I think that some of it is 258 00:11:37,360 --> 00:11:39,040 Speaker 8: They're just going to have to take their lumps on it, 259 00:11:39,120 --> 00:11:42,600 Speaker 8: because at the end of the day, the attack on 260 00:11:42,720 --> 00:11:48,080 Speaker 8: Trump is probably more effective than the notion that and 261 00:11:48,240 --> 00:11:50,080 Speaker 8: we'd have to see numbers to really support this. But 262 00:11:50,120 --> 00:11:53,280 Speaker 8: my instinct just says, if you've got this whole range 263 00:11:53,320 --> 00:11:55,120 Speaker 8: of stuff on Trump, and so much of it Hinges 264 00:11:55,120 --> 00:11:56,319 Speaker 8: on his legal difficulties. 265 00:11:57,080 --> 00:11:58,920 Speaker 6: Separate and apart from the federal. 266 00:11:58,559 --> 00:12:00,920 Speaker 8: Case, you've got all these state cases as well. There's 267 00:12:01,040 --> 00:12:04,000 Speaker 8: enough material there to use that they probably ought to 268 00:12:04,080 --> 00:12:06,240 Speaker 8: use it, and I think they will use it. And again, 269 00:12:06,360 --> 00:12:09,320 Speaker 8: I just I think the challenge with making the economic argument, 270 00:12:09,320 --> 00:12:12,000 Speaker 8: which I know they want to make, is it does 271 00:12:12,040 --> 00:12:13,920 Speaker 8: fly in the face a little bit of where people 272 00:12:13,960 --> 00:12:16,040 Speaker 8: are in terms of how they feel about the economy. 273 00:12:16,080 --> 00:12:17,640 Speaker 8: And if you look at all the survey of research, 274 00:12:17,679 --> 00:12:20,360 Speaker 8: there was a poll done by Quinnipiac University, there's another 275 00:12:20,400 --> 00:12:23,640 Speaker 8: poll done recently that just shows, particularly Amongst African Americans 276 00:12:23,679 --> 00:12:26,360 Speaker 8: and Hispanics, a deep disaffection with economics right now, with 277 00:12:26,600 --> 00:12:29,880 Speaker 8: the condition of the economy, and you're making an argument 278 00:12:29,920 --> 00:12:31,839 Speaker 8: about Bidenomics is working, and people are like, well, it 279 00:12:31,840 --> 00:12:34,959 Speaker 8: doesn't work it for me, right, So that mismatch really 280 00:12:35,080 --> 00:12:37,720 Speaker 8: leaves them with very few available arguments. And that's why 281 00:12:37,760 --> 00:12:39,839 Speaker 8: I think the Trump argument will be irresistible for I. 282 00:12:39,920 --> 00:12:42,400 Speaker 3: Nicky Haley went to the economy last night and a 283 00:12:42,440 --> 00:12:44,839 Speaker 3: pretty interesting moment. We asked her about this earlier today, 284 00:12:44,920 --> 00:12:47,760 Speaker 3: calling out not only Democrats but also Republicans for adding 285 00:12:48,120 --> 00:12:49,240 Speaker 3: to the nation's debt. 286 00:12:49,440 --> 00:12:51,600 Speaker 7: They need to stop the spending, they need to stop 287 00:12:51,640 --> 00:12:54,280 Speaker 7: the borrowing. They need to eliminate the earmarks that the 288 00:12:54,320 --> 00:12:57,079 Speaker 7: Republicans brought back in, and they need to make sure 289 00:12:57,120 --> 00:13:00,679 Speaker 7: they understand these are taxpayer dollars, it's not theirs. And 290 00:13:00,720 --> 00:13:03,520 Speaker 7: while they're all saying this, you have Ron de Santas, 291 00:13:03,600 --> 00:13:06,280 Speaker 7: You've got Tim Scott, you've got Mike Pence. They all 292 00:13:06,360 --> 00:13:09,720 Speaker 7: voted to raise the debt and Donald Trump added eight 293 00:13:09,960 --> 00:13:13,120 Speaker 7: trillion to our debt. And our kids are never going 294 00:13:13,200 --> 00:13:14,000 Speaker 7: to forgive us for. 295 00:13:14,000 --> 00:13:18,480 Speaker 3: This, naming names, including Donald Trump. In that case, eight 296 00:13:18,520 --> 00:13:22,280 Speaker 3: trillion dollars is a big number that Joe Biden, i'm sure, 297 00:13:22,360 --> 00:13:24,360 Speaker 3: is looking forward to reminding people about. 298 00:13:24,760 --> 00:13:26,520 Speaker 4: I just wonder your thoughts on Nikki Haley. 299 00:13:26,600 --> 00:13:28,400 Speaker 3: Last night, she had a good night, She get a 300 00:13:28,440 --> 00:13:31,160 Speaker 3: lot of buzz this morning, she had some powerful exchanges, 301 00:13:31,600 --> 00:13:34,040 Speaker 3: and I think to your I think you were at 302 00:13:34,120 --> 00:13:36,120 Speaker 3: least going there a little bit earlier. She sounded a 303 00:13:36,160 --> 00:13:39,120 Speaker 3: lot more like a Mitt Romney last night than a 304 00:13:39,240 --> 00:13:39,760 Speaker 3: Donald Trump. 305 00:13:39,800 --> 00:13:40,920 Speaker 4: But is there a party for that? 306 00:13:41,280 --> 00:13:44,119 Speaker 8: Well, first of all, I think the argument on deficits 307 00:13:44,160 --> 00:13:46,800 Speaker 8: and debt is a good argument for her to carry. 308 00:13:46,920 --> 00:13:49,160 Speaker 8: And I appreciate that she carried that because it doesn't 309 00:13:49,200 --> 00:13:51,120 Speaker 8: feel like a lot of Republicans are willing to Is 310 00:13:51,120 --> 00:13:52,920 Speaker 8: there an audience for it that I'm not sure about. 311 00:13:54,360 --> 00:13:56,760 Speaker 8: I think within the Republican Party there is certainly an 312 00:13:56,800 --> 00:13:59,319 Speaker 8: audience for it. It is a smaller audience today than 313 00:13:59,360 --> 00:14:02,800 Speaker 8: ten years ago. Ten years ago, deficits and debt. You know, 314 00:14:02,800 --> 00:14:05,760 Speaker 8: when I worked on Mitt Romney's twenty twelve effort, I 315 00:14:05,800 --> 00:14:07,560 Speaker 8: will tell you that was always one of our top 316 00:14:07,600 --> 00:14:11,960 Speaker 8: polling issues that people were deeply concerned. This was coming 317 00:14:12,000 --> 00:14:15,920 Speaker 8: out of the Tea Party movement of twenty ten, twenty eleven, Obamacare, 318 00:14:15,960 --> 00:14:18,000 Speaker 8: all that other stuff. There was a lot of interest 319 00:14:18,080 --> 00:14:20,600 Speaker 8: in deficit and debt. Now I'm not so sure, but 320 00:14:21,120 --> 00:14:23,880 Speaker 8: what she is showing is that she's trying, in some 321 00:14:23,920 --> 00:14:25,560 Speaker 8: ways to unite the tribes here. 322 00:14:26,040 --> 00:14:28,200 Speaker 6: She's trying to say, listen, if you like the America 323 00:14:28,280 --> 00:14:31,080 Speaker 6: First stuff, I was part of that administration. I did that. 324 00:14:31,520 --> 00:14:34,480 Speaker 8: If you like the fiscal conservative, that's me. I'm telling 325 00:14:34,480 --> 00:14:37,200 Speaker 8: you about deficit and debt. If you like the social conservative, 326 00:14:37,520 --> 00:14:40,680 Speaker 8: I'm just socially conservative enough. I'm pro life, but I 327 00:14:40,680 --> 00:14:43,440 Speaker 8: do believe in states having some measure of control over things. 328 00:14:44,080 --> 00:14:46,200 Speaker 8: I think she was trying to be the unite the 329 00:14:46,240 --> 00:14:48,720 Speaker 8: tribe's candidate. And if you think about the numbers in 330 00:14:48,760 --> 00:14:52,240 Speaker 8: this primary, they're probably sixty five percent of people out 331 00:14:52,240 --> 00:14:54,720 Speaker 8: there in the Republican primary who don't want Donald Trump 332 00:14:54,720 --> 00:14:55,560 Speaker 8: to be the nominatee. 333 00:14:55,760 --> 00:14:58,880 Speaker 6: So you can unite those tribes exactly. How about it? 334 00:14:58,920 --> 00:15:00,480 Speaker 3: Lone, great to have you, Thanks, thanks for having me 335 00:15:00,560 --> 00:15:03,440 Speaker 3: talk to us A light chat with us on sound On. 336 00:15:06,400 --> 00:15:09,800 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg sound On podcast. Catch the 337 00:15:09,840 --> 00:15:13,720 Speaker 1: program live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, the 338 00:15:13,760 --> 00:15:17,120 Speaker 1: tune in app, Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg Business App. 339 00:15:17,240 --> 00:15:20,080 Speaker 1: You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our 340 00:15:20,120 --> 00:15:24,600 Speaker 1: flagship New York station, Just say Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty. 341 00:15:25,800 --> 00:15:29,040 Speaker 3: The former Republican governor of South Carolina, of course, our 342 00:15:29,120 --> 00:15:32,320 Speaker 3: former ambassador to the UN who had a big night 343 00:15:32,440 --> 00:15:35,440 Speaker 3: on the debate stage, getting a lot more attention this 344 00:15:35,520 --> 00:15:37,360 Speaker 3: day than she was even yesterday. 345 00:15:38,040 --> 00:15:39,760 Speaker 4: But can she keep the momentum going. 346 00:15:39,920 --> 00:15:42,960 Speaker 3: Let's assemble our panel, our signature panel is here with 347 00:15:43,040 --> 00:15:45,200 Speaker 3: more after the big night. That would of course be 348 00:15:45,240 --> 00:15:49,200 Speaker 3: Bloomberg Politics contributors Jeanie Schanzeno and Rick Davis. 349 00:15:49,280 --> 00:15:50,440 Speaker 4: Great to have both of you here. 350 00:15:50,480 --> 00:15:53,680 Speaker 3: Guys, Rick, I'll start with you, after this big conversation 351 00:15:54,600 --> 00:15:58,920 Speaker 3: for the Republican Party last night, your initial reaction to 352 00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:01,920 Speaker 3: Nicki Haley a big night here sparring with the vig 353 00:16:02,040 --> 00:16:05,560 Speaker 3: Ramaswami any number of others and even called out Donald 354 00:16:05,600 --> 00:16:07,200 Speaker 3: Trump and members of her own party. 355 00:16:07,280 --> 00:16:09,040 Speaker 4: Was this a good performance? Did she win the night? 356 00:16:10,520 --> 00:16:13,120 Speaker 9: Well, she certainly executed on her plan, and I think 357 00:16:13,120 --> 00:16:15,360 Speaker 9: we were all surprised by that plan. And by the way, 358 00:16:15,440 --> 00:16:18,720 Speaker 9: kudos for getting her on an interview today. I think 359 00:16:18,800 --> 00:16:20,720 Speaker 9: you know, we learned a little bit about her views 360 00:16:20,720 --> 00:16:23,640 Speaker 9: on social security, which actually seemed to track more the 361 00:16:23,720 --> 00:16:26,840 Speaker 9: Mike Pence view than most of the people that were 362 00:16:27,280 --> 00:16:29,760 Speaker 9: on the stage last night. But look, I mean she 363 00:16:29,960 --> 00:16:33,360 Speaker 9: turned out to be the anti Trump elixir for the state. 364 00:16:33,560 --> 00:16:36,920 Speaker 9: I mean, she did more along the lines that we 365 00:16:37,040 --> 00:16:39,800 Speaker 9: thought Chris Christy would do, which is really take it 366 00:16:39,800 --> 00:16:43,680 Speaker 9: to Trump the administration, contrasts her views on everything from 367 00:16:43,720 --> 00:16:49,920 Speaker 9: economic issues to trade to national security and and and 368 00:16:50,120 --> 00:16:55,000 Speaker 9: really got into it, uh with vic Ramaswami in a 369 00:16:55,040 --> 00:16:57,840 Speaker 9: way that you know, kudos to her for standing up 370 00:16:58,200 --> 00:17:01,520 Speaker 9: for her principles. So I think she was a standout 371 00:17:01,640 --> 00:17:05,800 Speaker 9: last night. I'm not sure how much demand there is 372 00:17:06,160 --> 00:17:10,560 Speaker 9: for that kind of point of view within the Republican Party. 373 00:17:10,680 --> 00:17:14,439 Speaker 9: I mean, if she is the last person standing against 374 00:17:14,440 --> 00:17:17,720 Speaker 9: Donald Trump, I think it might be an interesting race. 375 00:17:19,600 --> 00:17:22,200 Speaker 3: Would love your take on this as well, Jeanie Shanzano. 376 00:17:22,240 --> 00:17:24,879 Speaker 3: Here's the moments that Nikki Haley jumped out of the 377 00:17:24,880 --> 00:17:27,520 Speaker 3: box to go at it with the vig Ramaswami on 378 00:17:27,720 --> 00:17:28,600 Speaker 3: foreign affairs. 379 00:17:28,920 --> 00:17:32,119 Speaker 6: Why always to go and defund Israel? You want to 380 00:17:32,119 --> 00:17:34,040 Speaker 6: get let me address that. I'm glad you brought that up. 381 00:17:34,080 --> 00:17:36,120 Speaker 6: Go and give you to address each of those. 382 00:17:36,160 --> 00:17:40,800 Speaker 10: Right now us the false is of a professional politician. 383 00:17:41,040 --> 00:17:41,600 Speaker 11: There you have it. 384 00:17:42,280 --> 00:17:43,680 Speaker 12: So the reality is less. 385 00:17:43,880 --> 00:17:46,680 Speaker 7: You have no foreign policy experience, and you. 386 00:17:46,640 --> 00:17:51,840 Speaker 13: Know what, the policy experience that you chosen, the less WARLD. 387 00:17:51,680 --> 00:17:53,280 Speaker 6: Has gotten into act to address that. 388 00:17:54,040 --> 00:17:58,600 Speaker 10: So our relationship with Israel will it never be stronger 389 00:17:58,640 --> 00:18:01,159 Speaker 10: than by the end of my first But it's not 390 00:18:01,359 --> 00:18:04,320 Speaker 10: quiet relationship, it is a friendship. 391 00:18:05,320 --> 00:18:08,879 Speaker 3: You have no foreign policy experience and it shows, she said, Genie, 392 00:18:08,880 --> 00:18:10,280 Speaker 3: how did Nicki Haley do last night? 393 00:18:12,200 --> 00:18:14,600 Speaker 14: She performed very well. And I think if you're a 394 00:18:14,640 --> 00:18:18,919 Speaker 14: Democrat watching this, you're hoping that she is not the nominee, 395 00:18:19,240 --> 00:18:22,919 Speaker 14: And lucky for Democrats, it's unlikely she will be because 396 00:18:23,200 --> 00:18:26,439 Speaker 14: Nicki Haley is running and she is probably the winner 397 00:18:26,440 --> 00:18:30,360 Speaker 14: of any sort of quote unquote establishment Republicans. She's probably 398 00:18:30,400 --> 00:18:33,000 Speaker 14: the winner of the donor class. But as you hear 399 00:18:33,119 --> 00:18:37,520 Speaker 14: that audience from the second they began introducing the candidates 400 00:18:37,560 --> 00:18:39,920 Speaker 14: on stage and we heard the booze for Chris Christie, 401 00:18:39,960 --> 00:18:44,040 Speaker 14: it sounded even like for Asa Hutchinson. You knew that 402 00:18:44,160 --> 00:18:46,760 Speaker 14: this was Donald Trump's crowd all the way. And Vivek 403 00:18:46,840 --> 00:18:50,520 Speaker 14: Ramaswami every time he spoke, and to me, he was 404 00:18:50,560 --> 00:18:53,439 Speaker 14: auditioning to be VP. He was the stand in for 405 00:18:53,520 --> 00:18:56,560 Speaker 14: Donald Trump. He was met with cheers for the most part. 406 00:18:56,880 --> 00:18:59,879 Speaker 14: So she had a very strong night. I'm just not 407 00:19:00,160 --> 00:19:03,280 Speaker 14: sure there's an audience for it in the Republican Party. 408 00:19:03,560 --> 00:19:05,679 Speaker 14: That was sitting in that audience and that is going 409 00:19:05,720 --> 00:19:08,440 Speaker 14: to be voting in these primaries, and that's the problem 410 00:19:08,480 --> 00:19:11,440 Speaker 14: for the Republican Party. And so you know, it is 411 00:19:11,480 --> 00:19:14,400 Speaker 14: a real challenge for somebody like her, but she did. 412 00:19:14,480 --> 00:19:18,120 Speaker 14: For Democrats. She's you know, looming as a big, pragmatic 413 00:19:18,440 --> 00:19:20,240 Speaker 14: old style Republican concern. 414 00:19:21,840 --> 00:19:24,199 Speaker 3: So you both seem to agree here she's from a 415 00:19:24,240 --> 00:19:28,200 Speaker 3: Republican party of the past. Maybe let's talk about the 416 00:19:28,920 --> 00:19:31,320 Speaker 3: Ramaswami a little bit more, because she wasn't the only 417 00:19:31,359 --> 00:19:33,520 Speaker 3: one to call him out for a lack of experience. 418 00:19:33,560 --> 00:19:34,160 Speaker 4: How about Mike. 419 00:19:34,280 --> 00:19:37,680 Speaker 1: Joe Biden has weakened this country at home and abroad. 420 00:19:38,320 --> 00:19:40,800 Speaker 6: Now is not the time for on the job training. 421 00:19:41,200 --> 00:19:42,959 Speaker 4: We don't need to bring in a rookie. 422 00:19:43,200 --> 00:19:45,439 Speaker 6: We don't need to bring in people without experience. 423 00:19:46,640 --> 00:19:49,560 Speaker 3: You know, there was that memo, remember from the Ron 424 00:19:49,600 --> 00:19:51,760 Speaker 3: DeSantis pac that said he was going to go after 425 00:19:51,800 --> 00:19:53,280 Speaker 3: of Avague that would be the target. 426 00:19:53,280 --> 00:19:55,480 Speaker 4: Apparently it was. He was not the only one to 427 00:19:55,480 --> 00:19:57,400 Speaker 4: get that memo. Here's Chris Christy. 428 00:19:57,280 --> 00:20:00,880 Speaker 11: Already tonight of a guy who sounds it's like chatchi 429 00:20:01,080 --> 00:20:07,879 Speaker 11: BT standing up here. And the last person in one 430 00:20:07,920 --> 00:20:09,920 Speaker 11: of these debates, Bret who stood in the middle of 431 00:20:09,960 --> 00:20:12,959 Speaker 11: the stage and said, what's a skinny guy with an 432 00:20:12,960 --> 00:20:16,280 Speaker 11: odd last name doing up here? Was Barack Obama. And 433 00:20:16,320 --> 00:20:18,680 Speaker 11: I'm afraid we're dealing with the same type of amateur 434 00:20:18,760 --> 00:20:20,440 Speaker 11: who sand In saves tonight. 435 00:20:20,560 --> 00:20:24,280 Speaker 4: Gi Amish, give me a hug just like you did at. 436 00:20:24,200 --> 00:20:26,680 Speaker 6: The same time, and you help let me. 437 00:20:26,720 --> 00:20:30,080 Speaker 4: Just like Obama too, he never did get the hug. 438 00:20:30,440 --> 00:20:34,440 Speaker 3: I will give the Vake Ramaswami credit for smiling through 439 00:20:34,480 --> 00:20:36,679 Speaker 3: the entire debate. I feel like there might be something, 440 00:20:37,280 --> 00:20:40,560 Speaker 3: uh somewhat contagious there. But Rick, are we going to 441 00:20:40,640 --> 00:20:42,800 Speaker 3: look back at last night as the peak of the 442 00:20:42,880 --> 00:20:43,959 Speaker 3: Ramaswami campaign. 443 00:20:45,560 --> 00:20:46,240 Speaker 12: Oh, I don't know. 444 00:20:46,320 --> 00:20:48,119 Speaker 9: I think he's going to be around for a little while. 445 00:20:48,160 --> 00:20:51,399 Speaker 9: He's he's he's pretty good on the stump and people 446 00:20:51,400 --> 00:20:54,040 Speaker 9: are entertained, and maybe he is, like. 447 00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:55,880 Speaker 12: What Genie says, auditioning for VP. 448 00:20:56,320 --> 00:20:59,840 Speaker 9: What's interesting is every vote he's got that's sitting on 449 00:21:00,080 --> 00:21:02,480 Speaker 9: his ballot is a Donald Trump boat, right. I mean, 450 00:21:02,520 --> 00:21:05,399 Speaker 9: like what we learned last night is he's willing to 451 00:21:05,400 --> 00:21:09,960 Speaker 9: go way further out, like what Ambassador Nicky Haley pointed 452 00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:12,679 Speaker 9: out than anybody else on that stage, for things like 453 00:21:13,040 --> 00:21:17,280 Speaker 9: supporting Putin, you know, giving a break to China, you know, 454 00:21:17,680 --> 00:21:20,680 Speaker 9: abandoning our friends in the Middle East like Israel. I mean, 455 00:21:20,960 --> 00:21:24,360 Speaker 9: you know, these are such outrageous positions that no one 456 00:21:24,359 --> 00:21:26,720 Speaker 9: else is going to touch that rail, you know, on 457 00:21:26,760 --> 00:21:30,800 Speaker 9: that stage, except Donald Trump, who actually got ahead by 458 00:21:30,960 --> 00:21:34,520 Speaker 9: saying outrageous things just like vec has done. So, uh, 459 00:21:34,760 --> 00:21:36,600 Speaker 9: if you got to worry if Veck ever got out 460 00:21:36,600 --> 00:21:38,680 Speaker 9: of the race, I think all that support just goes 461 00:21:38,720 --> 00:21:42,359 Speaker 9: to pad the comfort of the Donald Trump margin. So 462 00:21:43,480 --> 00:21:48,240 Speaker 9: you know, Govivac Trade the beast, you know, keep going 463 00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:52,200 Speaker 9: up in the polls because nobody else outside of a 464 00:21:52,240 --> 00:21:54,920 Speaker 9: hard Trump supporter is going to be for that guy. 465 00:21:56,080 --> 00:21:59,760 Speaker 3: Well, it's confusing to me, Genie, because Ramaswami said last 466 00:21:59,800 --> 00:22:03,360 Speaker 3: night that he believes Donald Trump was the greatest president 467 00:22:03,400 --> 00:22:04,560 Speaker 3: of the twenty first century. 468 00:22:05,400 --> 00:22:07,000 Speaker 4: If you believe that, why would you run? 469 00:22:09,119 --> 00:22:11,879 Speaker 14: That's absolutely right. And of course you know of a 470 00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:16,040 Speaker 14: man who's facing what ninety one criminal chargees and is 471 00:22:16,200 --> 00:22:20,880 Speaker 14: you know, in four jurisdictions, facing trials that may put 472 00:22:20,920 --> 00:22:23,640 Speaker 14: him in jail for his life and turning himself in today. 473 00:22:24,040 --> 00:22:27,720 Speaker 14: You know, for the Democrats, the vek Ramaswami is something 474 00:22:27,800 --> 00:22:31,000 Speaker 14: of a dream. Nothing could be better for them than 475 00:22:31,040 --> 00:22:33,679 Speaker 14: if it's not Donald Trump it's the vek Ramaswami. But 476 00:22:33,720 --> 00:22:36,960 Speaker 14: of course, to Rick's point, where's the pathway for somebody 477 00:22:37,000 --> 00:22:40,640 Speaker 14: like the vek Ramaswami because he's sort of Trump junior. 478 00:22:41,520 --> 00:22:44,880 Speaker 14: And you know I heard somebody today describe him as 479 00:22:44,920 --> 00:22:47,560 Speaker 14: the Tracy Flick of the election, which, as you mentioned, 480 00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:51,080 Speaker 14: all the smiling, the best political campaign movie ever election 481 00:22:51,200 --> 00:22:53,879 Speaker 14: with Reese Witherspoon, and that's really what he seemed like. 482 00:22:53,960 --> 00:22:58,760 Speaker 14: But you've got to wonder, you know, what is he doing? 483 00:22:58,840 --> 00:23:00,600 Speaker 14: And that's why I come back. Do I think he 484 00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:04,200 Speaker 14: is auditioning to be VP or a cabinet member? That said, 485 00:23:04,880 --> 00:23:08,000 Speaker 14: you know, he came out of nowhere, and for him 486 00:23:08,040 --> 00:23:10,679 Speaker 14: to be the center of this debate and to be 487 00:23:10,720 --> 00:23:13,760 Speaker 14: the person that a former vice president all these governors 488 00:23:13,800 --> 00:23:17,119 Speaker 14: and former governors are attacking, and to have this standout 489 00:23:17,160 --> 00:23:20,639 Speaker 14: performance for what it is, I think really speaks to 490 00:23:20,720 --> 00:23:24,840 Speaker 14: the really, really dismal path that the Republican Party is 491 00:23:24,880 --> 00:23:27,120 Speaker 14: going down now and the fact that Trump was right 492 00:23:27,200 --> 00:23:30,160 Speaker 14: to skip this. This is his party and his election 493 00:23:30,359 --> 00:23:33,520 Speaker 14: in his campaign right now to lose, and it was 494 00:23:33,600 --> 00:23:34,840 Speaker 14: showcased last night. 495 00:23:36,200 --> 00:23:38,919 Speaker 3: Extra points for the Tracy Flick reference, Scott. I can 496 00:23:39,000 --> 00:23:42,199 Speaker 3: always count on Eugenie Schanzeno. How did Mike Keen's do 497 00:23:42,280 --> 00:23:44,360 Speaker 3: we heard his voice a minute ago. Rick, he had 498 00:23:44,359 --> 00:23:46,720 Speaker 3: more experience than anyone else. He really took the moment 499 00:23:47,680 --> 00:23:50,280 Speaker 3: when he could to try to stand out from the pack. 500 00:23:50,359 --> 00:23:52,760 Speaker 3: He leaned into the January sixth story. Did he do 501 00:23:52,920 --> 00:23:54,200 Speaker 3: enough to stay viable? 502 00:23:55,760 --> 00:23:58,680 Speaker 9: You know, look his pathway is Iowa, and so look 503 00:23:58,720 --> 00:24:00,919 Speaker 9: at what he did. He was more combative than I 504 00:24:00,920 --> 00:24:03,560 Speaker 9: think anybody thought he was going to be. He took 505 00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:06,760 Speaker 9: his normal shot at Donald Trump on the Constitution, and 506 00:24:06,800 --> 00:24:09,800 Speaker 9: he talked a lot about scripture and his faith, which 507 00:24:09,880 --> 00:24:12,280 Speaker 9: is a good road to hoe if you're trying to 508 00:24:12,320 --> 00:24:15,240 Speaker 9: win a caucus in Iowa. So I'm not sure how 509 00:24:15,320 --> 00:24:17,879 Speaker 9: much of that's going to sell in New Hampshire. But 510 00:24:18,760 --> 00:24:21,200 Speaker 9: he's a one state candidate and he worked at hard 511 00:24:21,280 --> 00:24:23,800 Speaker 9: last night. I'd say he did pretty well, much better 512 00:24:24,080 --> 00:24:27,200 Speaker 9: than I thought he could. He has very high negatives 513 00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:30,480 Speaker 9: within Republican caucus goers in Iowa, So the question is 514 00:24:30,880 --> 00:24:33,800 Speaker 9: did he overcome some of that negativity. It's not a 515 00:24:33,840 --> 00:24:37,560 Speaker 9: neutral position on him. Republicans in Iowa don't like him, 516 00:24:37,560 --> 00:24:38,800 Speaker 9: and so he's going to have to do what he 517 00:24:38,840 --> 00:24:40,800 Speaker 9: can to overcome that. But I think he made some 518 00:24:40,880 --> 00:24:41,840 Speaker 9: progress last night. 519 00:24:42,840 --> 00:24:44,679 Speaker 3: We'll see how he does, I guess in the second debate. 520 00:24:44,680 --> 00:24:46,680 Speaker 3: But you know whose name I have not mentioned yet, 521 00:24:47,440 --> 00:24:49,439 Speaker 3: he was supposed to be the star last night. He 522 00:24:49,480 --> 00:24:51,480 Speaker 3: came in with a very different strategy than I think 523 00:24:51,520 --> 00:24:55,840 Speaker 3: some expected. The governor of Florida, who did the Trump 524 00:24:55,880 --> 00:25:00,520 Speaker 3: team suggests, played a cameo at best in the debate 525 00:25:00,600 --> 00:25:04,359 Speaker 3: last night. But when he spoke, he didn't seem like 526 00:25:04,480 --> 00:25:07,920 Speaker 3: he was terribly involved in the rest of the debate, 527 00:25:08,560 --> 00:25:11,640 Speaker 3: almost as if there was media training. Maybe you guys 528 00:25:11,640 --> 00:25:13,320 Speaker 3: can weigh in on this to say, hey, no one 529 00:25:13,359 --> 00:25:18,320 Speaker 3: watches these things. We need capturable content for social media. 530 00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:22,080 Speaker 3: Don't worry about what comes before or after your opportunity. 531 00:25:22,240 --> 00:25:25,720 Speaker 4: This economy it was a mistake. It should have never happened. 532 00:25:25,920 --> 00:25:29,080 Speaker 15: And in Florida, we led the country out of lockdown. 533 00:25:29,160 --> 00:25:32,160 Speaker 15: We kept our state free and open. And I can 534 00:25:32,240 --> 00:25:35,480 Speaker 15: tell you this, as your president, I will never let 535 00:25:35,760 --> 00:25:39,360 Speaker 15: the deep state bureaucrats lock you down. You don't take 536 00:25:39,440 --> 00:25:43,320 Speaker 15: somebody like Fauci and coddle him. You bring Fauci in, 537 00:25:43,440 --> 00:25:47,040 Speaker 15: you sit him down, and you say, Anthony, you are fired. 538 00:25:49,240 --> 00:25:51,879 Speaker 3: Interesting because I thought that was Donald Trump's line, you're fired. 539 00:25:51,880 --> 00:25:55,240 Speaker 3: But he went there a lot of uncomfortable smiles last night. 540 00:25:55,280 --> 00:25:59,040 Speaker 3: He was frozen at one point in the camera. Rick Davis, 541 00:25:59,359 --> 00:26:01,000 Speaker 3: how did Ron DeSantis do. 542 00:26:02,760 --> 00:26:03,080 Speaker 12: Well? 543 00:26:03,760 --> 00:26:07,439 Speaker 9: I'm afraid my old friend Brett O'Donnell, who gave the 544 00:26:07,520 --> 00:26:12,040 Speaker 9: maid advice to John McCain and virtually every presidential campaign 545 00:26:12,119 --> 00:26:14,960 Speaker 9: since then, had his work cut out for him because 546 00:26:15,320 --> 00:26:19,359 Speaker 9: who looked more uncomfortable on that stage than what was 547 00:26:19,400 --> 00:26:23,240 Speaker 9: supposed to be the guy everybody wanted. So look, I mean, 548 00:26:23,320 --> 00:26:25,880 Speaker 9: maybe he just doesn't have it an him, But as 549 00:26:25,880 --> 00:26:27,840 Speaker 9: you pointed out, he just kind of ignored what was 550 00:26:27,840 --> 00:26:30,640 Speaker 9: going on, didn't care what question was asked of him, 551 00:26:30,760 --> 00:26:34,280 Speaker 9: didn't interact with anybody else, didn't create a moment where 552 00:26:34,280 --> 00:26:37,399 Speaker 9: he did anything other than his normal talking points. So 553 00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:41,320 Speaker 9: if he thinks he's on the comeback trail with that performance, 554 00:26:41,640 --> 00:26:42,840 Speaker 9: he's on the wrong path. 555 00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:45,679 Speaker 4: Well that's not good, Genie. 556 00:26:45,680 --> 00:26:47,800 Speaker 3: This was supposed to be the night that he reversed 557 00:26:47,840 --> 00:26:50,920 Speaker 3: the slide. You know, he's doing the big campaign reset 558 00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:55,160 Speaker 3: or something like that. Is there something to his approach? 559 00:26:55,680 --> 00:26:59,320 Speaker 3: It was certainly clippable for Instagram and Twitter or did 560 00:26:59,320 --> 00:27:00,480 Speaker 3: he lose groundlin Last Life? 561 00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:04,960 Speaker 14: Yeah, it was clippable for Trump's campaign, certainly. I don't 562 00:27:04,960 --> 00:27:08,000 Speaker 14: know about the Santisis campaign, you know. Quite Frankly, Joe, 563 00:27:08,080 --> 00:27:10,000 Speaker 14: you're like a half hour into this show and you're 564 00:27:10,119 --> 00:27:13,200 Speaker 14: just messaging, you know, mentioning him now, and that's pretty 565 00:27:13,280 --> 00:27:16,840 Speaker 14: much the reality of Dysantis. Was he even on that stage? 566 00:27:16,880 --> 00:27:19,840 Speaker 14: I kept wondering, did he think he was like Donald Trump? 567 00:27:19,920 --> 00:27:22,199 Speaker 14: Up fifty points, forty points and he could just not 568 00:27:22,280 --> 00:27:25,400 Speaker 14: show up because quite frankly, it was like he wasn't 569 00:27:25,440 --> 00:27:29,080 Speaker 14: even there and he was center stage, he was upstaged. 570 00:27:29,440 --> 00:27:33,360 Speaker 14: He did not take many opportunities, if any. He looked uncomfortable. 571 00:27:33,800 --> 00:27:37,680 Speaker 14: He said things about Fauci. And you know, let's remember 572 00:27:37,880 --> 00:27:41,200 Speaker 14: the pandemic for Republican voters in the primary right at 573 00:27:41,200 --> 00:27:45,440 Speaker 14: this point doesn't matter, and Fauci already retired, So why 574 00:27:45,480 --> 00:27:46,560 Speaker 14: is he talking about him? 575 00:27:46,840 --> 00:27:47,080 Speaker 12: You know? 576 00:27:47,160 --> 00:27:50,399 Speaker 14: It just it was a mind boggling sort of strategy, 577 00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:53,119 Speaker 14: if there was one, he didn't execute. But this is 578 00:27:53,160 --> 00:27:55,879 Speaker 14: how he was in the gubernatorial debates as well. He 579 00:27:56,080 --> 00:27:59,520 Speaker 14: is not a good debater. He's not a good retail politician. 580 00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:01,919 Speaker 14: I don't know what his path is forward. But I 581 00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:04,439 Speaker 14: can't imagine you're a big money donor and you're thinking 582 00:28:04,840 --> 00:28:07,159 Speaker 14: that's the guy for me, I can't imagine it. I 583 00:28:07,200 --> 00:28:09,000 Speaker 14: think it was a really poor performance. 584 00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:12,320 Speaker 3: So what happens after a night like that? Rick GENI 585 00:28:12,480 --> 00:28:15,720 Speaker 3: just mentioned the donors, what's this campaign doing now? They 586 00:28:15,720 --> 00:28:18,240 Speaker 3: can't think that went well? Well, I'll ask you the 587 00:28:18,280 --> 00:28:20,639 Speaker 3: same thing I guess I did about Ramas Swami. Do 588 00:28:20,720 --> 00:28:22,800 Speaker 3: we look back at last night as you know, kind 589 00:28:22,800 --> 00:28:24,639 Speaker 3: of the beginning of the end or has that already happened? 590 00:28:26,080 --> 00:28:26,280 Speaker 12: You know? 591 00:28:26,359 --> 00:28:29,120 Speaker 9: Look, I think that he's already slid thirty points from 592 00:28:29,119 --> 00:28:32,760 Speaker 9: his ballot in February, right, So, like what more is left? 593 00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:36,879 Speaker 9: And the reality is too if people are looking for 594 00:28:36,920 --> 00:28:39,720 Speaker 9: an option for Donald Trump and they're in that cohort 595 00:28:39,760 --> 00:28:41,920 Speaker 9: where they may be sitting on Trump's ballot, right, how 596 00:28:41,920 --> 00:28:45,160 Speaker 9: do we get people off of Trump and onto another candidate. 597 00:28:45,320 --> 00:28:48,240 Speaker 9: I'd say Ramaswami kind of made his case last night. 598 00:28:48,560 --> 00:28:50,600 Speaker 9: You think Donald Trump's crazy and I'm going to do 599 00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:52,440 Speaker 9: these insane things around the world. 600 00:28:52,640 --> 00:28:53,080 Speaker 8: Pick me. 601 00:28:53,320 --> 00:28:56,360 Speaker 12: I'll even be more crazy and do more insane things 602 00:28:56,400 --> 00:28:56,960 Speaker 12: around the world. 603 00:28:57,040 --> 00:29:01,080 Speaker 9: I mean, like, he actually played a completely different deck 604 00:29:01,080 --> 00:29:03,040 Speaker 9: of cards and I think got away with it. So 605 00:29:03,840 --> 00:29:05,560 Speaker 9: I doubt if there's going to be very many Trump 606 00:29:05,640 --> 00:29:08,760 Speaker 9: voters shopping for the DeSantis, Oh you know, you're a 607 00:29:08,760 --> 00:29:11,440 Speaker 9: better option for me. I think they're going full crazy 608 00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:14,320 Speaker 9: and may start, you know, moving over to Ramaswami and 609 00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:18,800 Speaker 9: seeing whether or not he's the real deal. It doesn't 610 00:29:18,840 --> 00:29:20,640 Speaker 9: really make a bit of difference to the rest of 611 00:29:20,680 --> 00:29:22,480 Speaker 9: the field because they're not competing with. 612 00:29:22,400 --> 00:29:23,240 Speaker 12: The same voters. 613 00:29:23,440 --> 00:29:26,680 Speaker 9: Ramaswamy's not going to take a single ballot away from 614 00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:31,360 Speaker 9: Tim Scott or you know, Nicky Hayley or any of 615 00:29:31,400 --> 00:29:32,720 Speaker 9: the other candidates. 616 00:29:33,600 --> 00:29:36,840 Speaker 3: Well, we've got a lot more to talk about, including 617 00:29:36,880 --> 00:29:40,080 Speaker 3: the man who was not in the room last night, 618 00:29:40,360 --> 00:29:43,480 Speaker 3: Donald Trump sat down with Tucker Carlson, did a polished 619 00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:48,120 Speaker 3: edited interview that covered a lot of ground from Jeffrey 620 00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:49,720 Speaker 3: Epstein to Civil War. 621 00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:51,560 Speaker 4: And this is the. 622 00:29:51,600 --> 00:29:54,280 Speaker 3: Day he's expected to show up in Fulton County to surrender. 623 00:29:54,680 --> 00:29:56,680 Speaker 3: So we're about to shift our attention back to Donald 624 00:29:56,720 --> 00:29:59,440 Speaker 3: Trump's legal issues. We'll talk about it next with Rick 625 00:29:59,520 --> 00:30:01,360 Speaker 3: and Jeanie. Only here on sound On. 626 00:30:02,280 --> 00:30:05,800 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound On podcast. Catch us 627 00:30:05,840 --> 00:30:07,840 Speaker 1: live weekdays at one Eastern. 628 00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:10,760 Speaker 2: On Bloomberg dot com, the iHeartRadio app, and the Bloomberg 629 00:30:10,800 --> 00:30:14,240 Speaker 2: Business App, or listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts. 630 00:30:17,200 --> 00:30:19,520 Speaker 3: Of course, it wasn't just the debate last night. We 631 00:30:19,560 --> 00:30:23,320 Speaker 3: also had the split screen with Donald Trump, the fore 632 00:30:23,440 --> 00:30:26,680 Speaker 3: and beyond front runner in this contest, sitting for an 633 00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:31,800 Speaker 3: interview with Tucker Carlson because you know, he figured with 634 00:30:31,840 --> 00:30:36,160 Speaker 3: his polling numbers, he had no interests in going to 635 00:30:36,240 --> 00:30:36,720 Speaker 3: that debate. 636 00:30:36,760 --> 00:30:37,640 Speaker 4: He was bigger than it. 637 00:30:37,840 --> 00:30:40,400 Speaker 13: Rules have come out, and I'm leading by fifty and 638 00:30:40,480 --> 00:30:43,640 Speaker 13: sixty points, and you know some of them are at 639 00:30:43,640 --> 00:30:47,240 Speaker 13: one and zero and the two. And I'm saying, do 640 00:30:47,280 --> 00:30:49,240 Speaker 13: I sit there for an hour or two hours, whatever 641 00:30:49,280 --> 00:30:52,960 Speaker 13: it's going to be and get harassed by people that 642 00:30:53,760 --> 00:30:55,280 Speaker 13: should need me running for president? 643 00:30:55,320 --> 00:30:56,280 Speaker 12: Should I be doing that? 644 00:30:56,440 --> 00:30:56,520 Speaker 16: So? 645 00:30:56,680 --> 00:30:59,560 Speaker 4: If so, no show. 646 00:30:59,680 --> 00:31:01,680 Speaker 3: And they talked about a lot of stuff beyond the 647 00:31:01,680 --> 00:31:05,080 Speaker 3: debate with Tucker Carlson. It's about forty five minutes long. 648 00:31:05,080 --> 00:31:08,040 Speaker 3: I guess they got into whether Jeffrey Epstein was murdered. 649 00:31:08,120 --> 00:31:10,160 Speaker 3: They got into whether we're heading for a civil war. 650 00:31:11,640 --> 00:31:15,240 Speaker 3: Sort of a bizarre conversation as the President did his 651 00:31:15,320 --> 00:31:19,400 Speaker 3: best to appear bigger than the debate last night, which 652 00:31:19,480 --> 00:31:22,920 Speaker 3: members of the Trump team called the undercar Let's reassembled 653 00:31:22,920 --> 00:31:26,720 Speaker 3: our Panel, Rick Davis and Jeanie Shanzano Bloomberg Politics contributors. 654 00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:29,120 Speaker 3: I don't know if you watched it, Genie, maybe you 655 00:31:29,200 --> 00:31:31,800 Speaker 3: have to get back there and add to the views 656 00:31:31,880 --> 00:31:34,000 Speaker 3: on Twitter or x or whatever we call it. But 657 00:31:34,120 --> 00:31:39,600 Speaker 3: in retrospect, having seen the debate, was that actually the 658 00:31:39,680 --> 00:31:40,920 Speaker 3: smart move from Donald Trump? 659 00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:44,200 Speaker 4: Or did he missed an opportunity. 660 00:31:44,240 --> 00:31:47,080 Speaker 14: He didn't miss an opportunity by skipping the debate. There 661 00:31:47,160 --> 00:31:49,640 Speaker 14: was really no reason for him to appear there, and 662 00:31:49,680 --> 00:31:54,320 Speaker 14: he was right about that. But this interview, I, in 663 00:31:54,400 --> 00:31:59,240 Speaker 14: my mind, the words come chilling weird. They talked about 664 00:31:59,320 --> 00:32:03,800 Speaker 14: civil war, they talked about potential violence. Carlson asked him 665 00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:06,760 Speaker 14: if he thought he was going to be assassinated. So 666 00:32:07,240 --> 00:32:10,680 Speaker 14: if anybody thinks that if Donald Trump is the nominee 667 00:32:10,680 --> 00:32:14,440 Speaker 14: and that seems increasingly likely that things are going to 668 00:32:14,680 --> 00:32:17,800 Speaker 14: calm down, that is absolutely not the case. I mean, 669 00:32:17,840 --> 00:32:22,120 Speaker 14: they are talking about political and social violence in the 670 00:32:22,160 --> 00:32:25,960 Speaker 14: Civil War, and Donald Trump came off as sort of 671 00:32:26,840 --> 00:32:30,400 Speaker 14: less unhinged than Chuck Tucker Carlson, if it's possible. But 672 00:32:30,600 --> 00:32:34,280 Speaker 14: it was a very very bizarre conversation, and as you mentioned, 673 00:32:34,320 --> 00:32:37,440 Speaker 14: even got into things like Jeffrey Epstein and whether he 674 00:32:37,520 --> 00:32:40,320 Speaker 14: killed himself or not. So you know, he was right 675 00:32:40,360 --> 00:32:42,400 Speaker 14: to skip the debate. Doesn't make that much sense if 676 00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:45,479 Speaker 14: you're forty points up. But this interview is a chilling 677 00:32:45,560 --> 00:32:48,880 Speaker 14: reminder as to what's ahead if he's the nominee, and indeed, 678 00:32:48,920 --> 00:32:49,840 Speaker 14: if he's reelected. 679 00:32:51,000 --> 00:32:53,280 Speaker 3: Good Weighana, I guess on the Civil War if you 680 00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:57,400 Speaker 3: want to hear Rick. But I just wonder strategically, the 681 00:32:57,440 --> 00:33:00,080 Speaker 3: conventional wisdom was, hey, why would Trump ever go? And 682 00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:01,880 Speaker 3: it looks like he may not attend any of these 683 00:33:02,760 --> 00:33:05,320 Speaker 3: primary debates based on what he's posted on social media. 684 00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:07,280 Speaker 3: He's not going to be able to resist this for 685 00:33:07,360 --> 00:33:09,080 Speaker 3: a lot longer though, Right, is he really going to 686 00:33:09,120 --> 00:33:09,800 Speaker 3: sit all these out? 687 00:33:11,240 --> 00:33:11,480 Speaker 1: Well? 688 00:33:11,520 --> 00:33:14,400 Speaker 12: He might, I mean unless there's a serious challenge. 689 00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:18,320 Speaker 9: That confronts him that he would need to try to vanquish. 690 00:33:18,440 --> 00:33:21,200 Speaker 9: I can't imagine what's in it for him to stand 691 00:33:21,240 --> 00:33:25,040 Speaker 9: around a bunch of the replacements and give them sort 692 00:33:25,080 --> 00:33:29,560 Speaker 9: of a free shot at him. They seem encouraging to 693 00:33:29,600 --> 00:33:32,440 Speaker 9: want to do it. So I think he did the 694 00:33:32,560 --> 00:33:35,920 Speaker 9: right thing. He had to do something, And I agree 695 00:33:35,960 --> 00:33:38,240 Speaker 9: with Genie. I mean, the most bizarre thing wasn't Donald 696 00:33:38,240 --> 00:33:40,880 Speaker 9: Trump last night. It was Stucker Carlson. I mean, the 697 00:33:41,000 --> 00:33:45,480 Speaker 9: strangest bunch of questions you know about conspiracy theories and 698 00:33:45,560 --> 00:33:48,920 Speaker 9: oddball you know, questions that I've ever seen in an interview, 699 00:33:49,680 --> 00:33:52,600 Speaker 9: and the most low energy between the two of them. 700 00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:56,080 Speaker 9: I mean, like, who's going to name them low energy? 701 00:33:56,120 --> 00:33:59,840 Speaker 9: I mean, it's it was boring, and I'll be honest. 702 00:34:00,080 --> 00:34:03,600 Speaker 9: You know, when I was on the Ronald Reagan campaign. 703 00:34:03,160 --> 00:34:05,560 Speaker 12: We talked a lot about the Panama Canal. Didn't think 704 00:34:05,600 --> 00:34:07,480 Speaker 12: we were going to hear about that again last night, 705 00:34:07,560 --> 00:34:08,399 Speaker 12: but sure enough. 706 00:34:08,960 --> 00:34:12,720 Speaker 9: You know those nasty Chinese infiltrated the Panama Canal. 707 00:34:12,760 --> 00:34:14,640 Speaker 12: Well, he was president for four years. 708 00:34:14,680 --> 00:34:18,520 Speaker 9: Did he do anything about China infiltration of the Panama Canal? 709 00:34:18,680 --> 00:34:19,920 Speaker 12: I don't remember, but. 710 00:34:20,800 --> 00:34:23,680 Speaker 9: I must say, remember, I think this is the first 711 00:34:23,680 --> 00:34:26,520 Speaker 9: time I hear whatever say. I think the undercard was 712 00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:27,680 Speaker 9: better than the top fight. 713 00:34:29,200 --> 00:34:31,799 Speaker 3: I can't disagree with that. I feel like Jeanie would 714 00:34:31,840 --> 00:34:34,759 Speaker 3: agree as well. And his hope here is to just 715 00:34:34,760 --> 00:34:38,319 Speaker 3: debate Joe Biden right bypass the primaries. Act like you're 716 00:34:38,400 --> 00:34:41,680 Speaker 3: the incumbent, get on stage with President Biden. 717 00:34:42,680 --> 00:34:45,080 Speaker 4: He did get into the age issue. 718 00:34:44,840 --> 00:34:47,160 Speaker 3: Last night, despite the fact that he's only four years 719 00:34:47,200 --> 00:34:48,640 Speaker 3: younger than the city president. 720 00:34:48,719 --> 00:34:52,040 Speaker 13: Can't walk to the helicop, he walks, he can't lift 721 00:34:52,040 --> 00:34:53,640 Speaker 13: his feet out of the grass. You know, it's only 722 00:34:53,640 --> 00:34:55,720 Speaker 13: two inches at the White House. I have said a lot, 723 00:34:56,360 --> 00:34:58,399 Speaker 13: but you watch him and it looks like he's walking on. 724 00:34:58,360 --> 00:35:03,000 Speaker 3: Toothpicks, walking on toothpicks across the south lawn. 725 00:35:03,080 --> 00:35:03,919 Speaker 4: Never mind the beach. 726 00:35:03,960 --> 00:35:06,360 Speaker 3: We've seen a lot of beach photos lately. I guess 727 00:35:06,600 --> 00:35:07,680 Speaker 3: Donald Trump's been paying. 728 00:35:07,719 --> 00:35:09,759 Speaker 13: You see in the beach where he can't lift the chair. 729 00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:11,680 Speaker 13: You know this years are meant to be light, right, 730 00:35:11,840 --> 00:35:13,560 Speaker 13: They're like two ounces. 731 00:35:13,680 --> 00:35:14,520 Speaker 4: He lift them up. 732 00:35:15,080 --> 00:35:18,080 Speaker 13: He can't lift the chair. He can't walk to the chair. 733 00:35:18,440 --> 00:35:20,279 Speaker 13: And I don't know what they're doing with the beach. 734 00:35:20,360 --> 00:35:22,439 Speaker 13: You know, this beach is seeming to play a big role. 735 00:35:22,480 --> 00:35:25,040 Speaker 13: But they love pictures of him on the beach. I 736 00:35:25,040 --> 00:35:26,360 Speaker 13: think it looks terrible on the beach. 737 00:35:27,560 --> 00:35:29,360 Speaker 3: Maybe he should be on the golf course, Genie. I 738 00:35:29,400 --> 00:35:31,480 Speaker 3: don't know, but it didn't seem like he had too 739 00:35:31,600 --> 00:35:32,919 Speaker 3: much trouble lifting the chair. 740 00:35:33,920 --> 00:35:34,960 Speaker 4: Is he onto something? 741 00:35:35,000 --> 00:35:35,280 Speaker 1: Though? 742 00:35:35,400 --> 00:35:38,880 Speaker 3: Since this Hawaii trip, there's been a much more concerted 743 00:35:39,719 --> 00:35:44,040 Speaker 3: effort to paint Joe Biden as being too old and unfit. 744 00:35:44,320 --> 00:35:46,000 Speaker 4: Mentally and physically for this job. 745 00:35:47,600 --> 00:35:49,560 Speaker 14: Yeah, it's the same thing that they tried to do 746 00:35:49,640 --> 00:35:53,280 Speaker 14: to Hillary Clinton and in the unsuccessfully in twenty sixteen. 747 00:35:53,840 --> 00:35:57,200 Speaker 14: To try to say that she didn't have her faculties together, 748 00:35:57,800 --> 00:36:00,359 Speaker 14: and they're trying to do it with Joe Biden. As 749 00:36:00,400 --> 00:36:04,200 Speaker 14: you looked at the conservative media post that Hawaii trip, 750 00:36:04,440 --> 00:36:06,719 Speaker 14: there was a lot of those memes and videos about 751 00:36:06,760 --> 00:36:07,400 Speaker 14: him sleeping. 752 00:36:07,440 --> 00:36:08,560 Speaker 12: Well, he wasn't sleeping. 753 00:36:08,920 --> 00:36:12,319 Speaker 14: He was swallowing. He was putting his head down during 754 00:36:12,360 --> 00:36:15,680 Speaker 14: a very tough discussion about all the people who had 755 00:36:15,760 --> 00:36:19,239 Speaker 14: you know, suffered during the fires and the victims. So 756 00:36:19,480 --> 00:36:21,399 Speaker 14: you know, there is an awful lot of that going down. 757 00:36:21,440 --> 00:36:24,440 Speaker 14: But I have to say I was surprised even for 758 00:36:24,600 --> 00:36:27,520 Speaker 14: Donald Trump to go there because of course today when 759 00:36:27,520 --> 00:36:31,520 Speaker 14: he turns himself in, they may release his weight, and 760 00:36:31,840 --> 00:36:33,960 Speaker 14: not just the mug shot, but his weight, which is 761 00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:36,719 Speaker 14: something he may want to avoid. We know he's very 762 00:36:36,760 --> 00:36:39,520 Speaker 14: concerned about that. So for him to be talking about 763 00:36:39,520 --> 00:36:42,600 Speaker 14: somebody else's physical condition, I think it's going to be 764 00:36:42,600 --> 00:36:45,000 Speaker 14: interesting to see what comes out about his weight when 765 00:36:45,000 --> 00:36:49,120 Speaker 14: they book him today in that horrific jail down in Atlanta, 766 00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:53,200 Speaker 14: and he's gonna you know, and know Ronnie Jackson there 767 00:36:53,239 --> 00:36:55,160 Speaker 14: to say what excellent condition he's in. 768 00:36:56,280 --> 00:36:57,000 Speaker 4: Well, that's true. 769 00:36:57,200 --> 00:36:59,439 Speaker 3: You know they did the fake mug shot, right, didn't 770 00:36:59,440 --> 00:37:03,360 Speaker 3: they put a a false weight on the T shirts 771 00:37:03,360 --> 00:37:06,040 Speaker 3: that they I look, we're gonna see a mugshot apparently 772 00:37:06,080 --> 00:37:08,720 Speaker 3: at some point later on today. We don't know exactly 773 00:37:08,719 --> 00:37:10,120 Speaker 3: when he's going to get to the courthouse, but of 774 00:37:10,160 --> 00:37:13,080 Speaker 3: course we'll keep you posted on all of this here 775 00:37:13,120 --> 00:37:16,759 Speaker 3: on Bloomberg. Genie Shanzano and Rick Davis reminding us that 776 00:37:16,840 --> 00:37:18,600 Speaker 3: we have a whole other leg in this story later 777 00:37:18,640 --> 00:37:20,440 Speaker 3: on today as we go back to Fulton County. 778 00:37:20,440 --> 00:37:22,680 Speaker 4: But we're not done with the debate, not quite yet. 779 00:37:23,200 --> 00:37:25,640 Speaker 3: Some final thoughts from our panel straight ahead on who 780 00:37:25,760 --> 00:37:29,080 Speaker 3: was locked out of the spin room last night and 781 00:37:29,120 --> 00:37:31,000 Speaker 3: they're still complaining about it. 782 00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:32,239 Speaker 4: It's the fastest show in. 783 00:37:32,239 --> 00:37:36,440 Speaker 3: Politics the day after the debate, the day of the surrender. 784 00:37:36,480 --> 00:37:40,480 Speaker 3: I'm Joe Matthew in Washington. Glad you're with us. It's Bloomberg. 785 00:37:42,440 --> 00:37:45,799 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch the 786 00:37:45,840 --> 00:37:49,719 Speaker 1: program live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, the 787 00:37:49,800 --> 00:37:53,120 Speaker 1: tune in alf, Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg Business app. 788 00:37:53,239 --> 00:37:56,120 Speaker 1: You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our 789 00:37:56,120 --> 00:37:59,800 Speaker 1: flagship New York station, Just say Alexa play Bloomberg. 790 00:38:02,000 --> 00:38:04,440 Speaker 3: Of course, the part of the show at the debate, 791 00:38:04,520 --> 00:38:07,680 Speaker 3: like last night in Milwaukee, is what's happening outside of 792 00:38:07,680 --> 00:38:09,399 Speaker 3: the hall and in the spin room is what. 793 00:38:09,360 --> 00:38:09,799 Speaker 4: They call it. 794 00:38:09,800 --> 00:38:12,880 Speaker 3: That's where all the surrogates go after the big debate, 795 00:38:12,920 --> 00:38:16,160 Speaker 3: try to get on cable news and literally spin what 796 00:38:16,239 --> 00:38:19,920 Speaker 3: their preferred candidate said, try to set things straight. But 797 00:38:19,920 --> 00:38:22,400 Speaker 3: of course Donald Trump skipped the debate and the RNC 798 00:38:22,520 --> 00:38:26,240 Speaker 3: made a decision last evening to not allow Trump surrogates. 799 00:38:26,239 --> 00:38:27,920 Speaker 3: We're gonna have Rick and Jennie weigh in on this 800 00:38:28,000 --> 00:38:30,920 Speaker 3: because it turned into a pile up at the door 801 00:38:31,640 --> 00:38:34,520 Speaker 3: of the spin room. Just ask Marjorie Taylor Green, who 802 00:38:34,520 --> 00:38:37,200 Speaker 3: went on a rival conservative network to complain about it. 803 00:38:37,200 --> 00:38:41,560 Speaker 16: Blocked us out. They would not allow myself, Matt Gates, 804 00:38:41,640 --> 00:38:44,640 Speaker 16: any other Trump surrogates to go into the spin room. 805 00:38:45,320 --> 00:38:48,080 Speaker 16: We argued with them, talk to them. We showed the 806 00:38:48,080 --> 00:38:52,240 Speaker 16: correct credentials, We had spin room credentials, and they would 807 00:38:52,239 --> 00:38:56,520 Speaker 16: not let us in. So this is censorship from Fox News. 808 00:38:57,880 --> 00:39:01,920 Speaker 3: Actually the RNC, I believe, if not Fox Alls, they 809 00:39:01,960 --> 00:39:03,959 Speaker 3: both said that this would be the case. They warned 810 00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:06,040 Speaker 3: them that they would not be welcome. But I'll tell 811 00:39:06,080 --> 00:39:07,880 Speaker 3: you what Donald Trump Junior showed up to and. 812 00:39:08,719 --> 00:39:09,520 Speaker 1: Because any of us. 813 00:39:10,239 --> 00:39:11,600 Speaker 4: But that's what it is. I'd been told by all 814 00:39:11,640 --> 00:39:12,680 Speaker 4: this and I would be able to go in. 815 00:39:12,800 --> 00:39:14,719 Speaker 9: So they said we weren't able to go in, and 816 00:39:14,760 --> 00:39:16,680 Speaker 9: they said they were in now that we're here, and 817 00:39:16,800 --> 00:39:17,520 Speaker 9: the candidate that. 818 00:39:17,520 --> 00:39:19,319 Speaker 12: Said you can't go in the spin room, they're telling 819 00:39:19,320 --> 00:39:19,799 Speaker 12: me right now. 820 00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:22,239 Speaker 3: They told them that they wouldn't be let in, but 821 00:39:22,280 --> 00:39:24,919 Speaker 3: they showed up anyway, Rick Davis, was that the right 822 00:39:24,960 --> 00:39:26,720 Speaker 3: move by the organizers of this debate? 823 00:39:28,360 --> 00:39:29,760 Speaker 12: Sure, you got to pay to play. 824 00:39:29,840 --> 00:39:32,680 Speaker 9: I mean, Donald Trump blows off Fox, blows off the RNC, 825 00:39:33,400 --> 00:39:35,600 Speaker 9: you know, won't abide by the rules that the RNC 826 00:39:35,800 --> 00:39:38,520 Speaker 9: set up and then expects to have, you know, carte 827 00:39:38,520 --> 00:39:41,520 Speaker 9: blanche and to access to the spin room and things 828 00:39:41,560 --> 00:39:43,799 Speaker 9: like that. Now, I mean, the only mistake I think 829 00:39:43,840 --> 00:39:46,520 Speaker 9: that they made is instead of talking about Donald Trump 830 00:39:46,520 --> 00:39:49,759 Speaker 9: and using the moment like on air to pitch the 831 00:39:49,800 --> 00:39:52,719 Speaker 9: Donald Trump campaign, they just talked about themselves and their 832 00:39:52,760 --> 00:39:56,000 Speaker 9: grievances and had nothing to do with actually winning a 833 00:39:56,040 --> 00:39:56,839 Speaker 9: presidential race. 834 00:39:56,920 --> 00:39:58,759 Speaker 4: So you know, I did you have left them out? 835 00:39:58,800 --> 00:40:04,360 Speaker 14: Jeanie, Oh no, it's so Unamerican kidding. That's what Kimberly 836 00:40:04,400 --> 00:40:07,520 Speaker 14: Gilfoyle said, is dout do not buying next to her? 837 00:40:07,920 --> 00:40:08,920 Speaker 6: Yes, you can't. 838 00:40:08,960 --> 00:40:12,160 Speaker 14: You can't go in if you don't go to the debate. 839 00:40:12,280 --> 00:40:13,120 Speaker 14: That's the reality. 840 00:40:14,120 --> 00:40:15,160 Speaker 4: I thought they broke up. 841 00:40:15,239 --> 00:40:17,880 Speaker 3: I'm just behind on everything, I guess Geenie Shanse No, 842 00:40:18,000 --> 00:40:19,640 Speaker 3: Thank you, Rick Davis, thank you. 843 00:40:22,480 --> 00:40:24,400 Speaker 4: Thanks for listening to The Sound on podcast. 844 00:40:24,440 --> 00:40:27,560 Speaker 3: Make sure to subscribe if you haven't already, at Apple, Spotify, 845 00:40:27,640 --> 00:40:30,080 Speaker 3: and anywhere else you get your podcasts. And you can 846 00:40:30,080 --> 00:40:33,080 Speaker 3: find us live every weekday from Washington, DC at one 847 00:40:33,120 --> 00:40:35,840 Speaker 3: pm Eastern Time at Bloomberg dot com.