WEBVTT - Kosas Cosmetics Founder Sheena Yaitanes 0:00:02.560 --> 0:00:05.160 Beyond the Beauty is a production of I Heart Radio. 0:00:05.720 --> 0:00:17.239 I'm your host, Bobby Brown. I first saw the makeup 0:00:17.239 --> 0:00:21.880 brand cosas a bunch of years ago, and it looked 0:00:22.320 --> 0:00:25.040 so much like a traditional brand. But it was one 0:00:25.040 --> 0:00:28.960 of the first brands that was clean and looked like 0:00:29.120 --> 0:00:31.040 a regular brand that you would see in all the 0:00:31.080 --> 0:00:35.280 department stores. I tried it and the makeup worked, So 0:00:35.400 --> 0:00:40.120 I'm really curious and interested in how the brand was built, 0:00:40.640 --> 0:00:43.120 and you know, I wanted to talk to the founder, 0:00:43.240 --> 0:00:47.239 Shena Utanus. I was pretty intrigued by not just that 0:00:47.320 --> 0:00:50.920 she's someone that loves beauty that grew up watching her mom, 0:00:51.000 --> 0:00:54.040 but she was super smart, had a science background, got 0:00:54.080 --> 0:00:59.360 her masters in business, was also an actress. But here's 0:00:59.400 --> 0:01:02.400 this girl who has a beauty brand. So I'm very 0:01:02.440 --> 0:01:07.480 curious to find out who is she? Ina utanous Hey, Shana, Hi, Bobby, 0:01:07.800 --> 0:01:09.920 So nice to meet you. It's really nice to meet 0:01:09.959 --> 0:01:15.959 you too. You have some incredible, incredibly interesting bio which 0:01:16.000 --> 0:01:20.360 I can't wait to dive into. Let's dive into it. Yeah, 0:01:20.560 --> 0:01:23.759 but I but I remember the first time I saw 0:01:23.800 --> 0:01:27.600 the brand. I was still working at the old company, 0:01:27.680 --> 0:01:30.200 and you were, you know, you guys had just come out, 0:01:30.720 --> 0:01:34.199 and I just thought how fascinating, Like it was so 0:01:34.400 --> 0:01:37.560 new and different because there was nothing in the clean 0:01:37.640 --> 0:01:44.280 world that resembled like a real makeup product. So tell 0:01:44.280 --> 0:01:47.320 me about the launch. Thank you, Bob, and thank you 0:01:47.360 --> 0:01:50.600 for knowing and noticing that, like was like that was 0:01:50.640 --> 0:01:53.880 like a big revolution and jump I think for clean um. 0:01:53.920 --> 0:01:56.280 But of course, like at the time that Coasts launched, 0:01:56.480 --> 0:01:59.720 there was no such term as clean. It wasn't even 0:01:59.720 --> 0:02:01.640 a thing yet. Well, there was some there was some 0:02:01.720 --> 0:02:04.440 things that people were making in their kitchen and you know, 0:02:04.560 --> 0:02:08.600 granola kind of hippie stuff. Yeah, we had like natural 0:02:08.639 --> 0:02:12.960 and organic and like a sense of like understanding that 0:02:13.000 --> 0:02:15.600 maybe there was some there was some ingredients and conventional 0:02:15.639 --> 0:02:17.840 that people didn't want to use. There was like definitely 0:02:17.919 --> 0:02:20.160 a rise of like oh should we be questioning these 0:02:20.280 --> 0:02:24.360 ingredients that was starting to happen UM. And then I like, 0:02:24.440 --> 0:02:27.040 I love where we've landed now and like the and 0:02:27.080 --> 0:02:29.320 I love the evolution of where things are going because 0:02:29.320 --> 0:02:31.560 I think there was like that big pendulum swing to 0:02:31.760 --> 0:02:35.680 natural and organic and that was tough for people who 0:02:35.680 --> 0:02:39.160 are obsessed with makeup and wearing it. UM. And so 0:02:39.200 --> 0:02:41.120 now I like, I love that we've kind of come 0:02:41.160 --> 0:02:47.639 back around to thoughtful and purposeful. Well, let's let's go 0:02:47.720 --> 0:02:50.200 back for a second. Because you grew up your mother 0:02:50.760 --> 0:02:54.920 worked in cosmetics, she was in retail. Tell me he 0:02:54.960 --> 0:02:57.320 worked at the mall. My mother worked at the mall. 0:02:57.960 --> 0:03:02.400 Um she worked at before I was even born. She 0:03:02.440 --> 0:03:05.639 worked at Clarence Um. And then when I was growing up, 0:03:05.760 --> 0:03:08.919 she worked at Clinique. And I don't know if you 0:03:09.080 --> 0:03:10.880 I'm gonna I'm gonna go ahead and guess you've never 0:03:10.919 --> 0:03:14.400 worked at the mall. But I actually I actually sold 0:03:14.440 --> 0:03:19.160 shoes in high school at the mall. Yes, okay, so yeah, 0:03:19.200 --> 0:03:20.919 I mean it's kind of a rite of passage, right, 0:03:21.520 --> 0:03:25.000 um So, because my mom worked at Clinique, and she 0:03:25.040 --> 0:03:27.799 actually really loved that. She still speaks fondly of like 0:03:27.960 --> 0:03:30.480 how fun it was, because of course your you work 0:03:30.600 --> 0:03:33.960 at shopping, Like how fun is that? Um? And her 0:03:34.000 --> 0:03:36.520 friends would be, you know, like the girl from the 0:03:36.600 --> 0:03:39.680 Landcomb counter or like you know, someone from Chanel and 0:03:39.720 --> 0:03:42.240 then the s a Sta Lauter. And that's how I 0:03:42.280 --> 0:03:46.480 got to know these brands was through the people who 0:03:46.480 --> 0:03:50.320 were my mom's friends who wrapped the brands. And you 0:03:50.440 --> 0:03:53.880 really start to understand like a very early sense of 0:03:53.920 --> 0:03:56.160 like what does DNA mean? What's identity? And like what's 0:03:56.160 --> 0:03:58.640 the difference between these things? And so much of that 0:03:58.720 --> 0:04:02.440 just came through, like the the textures, the smells, the names, 0:04:02.720 --> 0:04:04.920 and they all had a little personality of their own. 0:04:05.000 --> 0:04:08.520 So I got my beauty education on the ground. And 0:04:08.600 --> 0:04:10.600 you must have played with your mom's makeup when you 0:04:10.600 --> 0:04:14.160 were a kid. It's all I played with so Like 0:04:15.120 --> 0:04:20.200 I was a very quiet child, I spent a lot 0:04:20.240 --> 0:04:23.479 of time in my mom's bathroom or in my room 0:04:23.520 --> 0:04:28.280 by myself. Um, I've always been drawn to materials because like, 0:04:28.320 --> 0:04:32.400 I have a compulsion to make things. And what greater 0:04:33.960 --> 0:04:36.760 material or medium than makeup? I mean we had and 0:04:36.760 --> 0:04:38.800 I had so much of it, so much access to it. 0:04:38.800 --> 0:04:40.560 It was like it's like going to the art store. 0:04:40.680 --> 0:04:42.880 Like going into her bathroom and going through her drawers 0:04:42.960 --> 0:04:44.680 was just like going to the art store. And you 0:04:44.760 --> 0:04:46.880 used to make your own makeup when you were a 0:04:46.880 --> 0:04:50.880 little kid, is that correct? Yes, I mean my own makeup. 0:04:51.080 --> 0:04:53.120 I started making my own makeup when I was probably 0:04:53.120 --> 0:04:56.520 like ten. I would at that time. You know, you 0:04:56.600 --> 0:05:00.240 buy those little Monday Tuesday Wednesday like pill cases and 0:05:00.480 --> 0:05:03.520 the jar of vaseline and the eyeshadow and then crush 0:05:03.560 --> 0:05:05.440 it all up and mix it all together, and like 0:05:05.480 --> 0:05:08.400 I would make I actually made some early stuff that 0:05:08.440 --> 0:05:10.760 I'm coming back around to, like the idea of like 0:05:10.800 --> 0:05:15.160 glitter gel highlighter. That's a big one. Yeah, So I 0:05:15.200 --> 0:05:18.720 would make. I would mix makeup. I would mix skincare too, 0:05:19.520 --> 0:05:23.760 and um and nail polish because I was like very 0:05:23.800 --> 0:05:28.360 I love the lackery like an Emily texture of nail polish. 0:05:28.400 --> 0:05:31.520 I think it's such a gorgeous material. And mixing the 0:05:31.520 --> 0:05:34.080 colors was like a fun early thing for me. So 0:05:34.160 --> 0:05:36.400 you were very creative as a kid and did all 0:05:36.440 --> 0:05:38.520 these really cool things. You grew up, you know, with 0:05:38.640 --> 0:05:41.840 your mom's makeup, but you were a smarty pants and 0:05:41.920 --> 0:05:45.800 you ended up studying by biology science at u C. 0:05:46.040 --> 0:05:52.640 I yeah, I did my Um. I mean, here's the thing. 0:05:53.160 --> 0:05:57.280 My parents are immigrants. They moved here, and they moved 0:05:57.279 --> 0:06:00.160 to America from Iran in the seventies when they were 0:06:00.160 --> 0:06:04.160 in college. They were supposed to come here to do 0:06:04.200 --> 0:06:08.040 an exchange program. And at the time, like the relationship 0:06:08.040 --> 0:06:10.240 between Iran and the United States was good, and so 0:06:10.440 --> 0:06:14.320 things were okay, and they came here, they didn't speak English. Um. 0:06:14.360 --> 0:06:16.359 They moved to Texas and they went to college. And 0:06:16.400 --> 0:06:19.600 while they were here, a war started back in their 0:06:19.600 --> 0:06:23.480 home country, and they basically became stateless, Like they couldn't 0:06:23.520 --> 0:06:27.080 go back to their war torn country. They didn't really 0:06:27.120 --> 0:06:30.560 belong here at all. Um, you know, they started to 0:06:30.600 --> 0:06:33.599 face the realities of what it means to be another 0:06:34.160 --> 0:06:38.120 here in the US. They were, you know, and then 0:06:38.120 --> 0:06:39.880 they and then they tried to make the best of it, 0:06:39.960 --> 0:06:44.920 which is two make a better life for their kids. 0:06:45.440 --> 0:06:47.920 And they're both they both have like such a deep 0:06:48.000 --> 0:06:50.680 artistic nature. I watched my mom grow up. She has 0:06:50.880 --> 0:06:54.680 such an amazing sense of color. I like everything I 0:06:54.800 --> 0:06:58.720 learned about mixing colors came from her, Like the emotional 0:06:58.800 --> 0:07:01.719 response that you get I'm putting pink connects to orange, 0:07:01.839 --> 0:07:03.839 Like that's something she taught me when I was a kid. 0:07:04.440 --> 0:07:06.760 And so these are the things that moved her. And 0:07:06.880 --> 0:07:09.960 yet she was filled with such a fear of ever 0:07:10.080 --> 0:07:15.000 pursuing anything creative in her entire life because she was foreign. 0:07:15.760 --> 0:07:19.240 And that takes guts, and it takes showing your heart, 0:07:19.280 --> 0:07:21.640 and it takes so much confidence and courage, which she 0:07:21.680 --> 0:07:24.920 did not have. So I watched this as I grew 0:07:25.000 --> 0:07:29.160 up with my parents not speaking English, and that like 0:07:29.360 --> 0:07:32.120 affects the dynamic of the parent child relationship because in 0:07:32.120 --> 0:07:34.000 a lot of ways, like they can't guide you, you 0:07:34.080 --> 0:07:36.960 have to guide them. And then, yes, my nature was 0:07:37.080 --> 0:07:40.160 artistic from day one, like these are the things that 0:07:40.200 --> 0:07:43.920 I was obsessed with and wanted to spend my life doing. Um, 0:07:43.960 --> 0:07:46.560 But I also had to carry some of that fear too. 0:07:46.720 --> 0:07:49.000 They were afraid for me, which actually like just made 0:07:49.040 --> 0:07:53.360 me afraid too. And so the last thing your parents 0:07:53.480 --> 0:07:55.600 want you to do when they feel that way is 0:07:55.640 --> 0:07:59.360 to do anything risky, like become an artist. That's insane. 0:07:59.800 --> 0:08:04.480 So oh um. I pursued science, which I actually find 0:08:04.520 --> 0:08:08.680 to be a very creative discipline anyway, because you are 0:08:09.480 --> 0:08:12.560 in uncharted territory most of the time, you're trying to 0:08:12.640 --> 0:08:16.040 discover And so that part of it I really did love, 0:08:16.400 --> 0:08:18.920 and I still love, and I never thought it would 0:08:18.920 --> 0:08:20.920 become useful to me, but turns out it has. Well. 0:08:20.920 --> 0:08:22.800 If someone would have told me that in high school, 0:08:22.800 --> 0:08:25.480 maybe I would have gotten better than d's in science 0:08:25.880 --> 0:08:29.720 because there was nothing creative about my science teacher. So 0:08:30.040 --> 0:08:35.000 besides this, besides this brainiac creative girl. You happen to 0:08:35.000 --> 0:08:38.800 be beautiful. You acted. I acted for thirty seconds and 0:08:38.880 --> 0:08:41.560 I did not like it. Okay, but more than thirty seconds. 0:08:41.600 --> 0:08:45.280 You you were in House and you were also Season 0:08:45.320 --> 0:08:50.880 one of Master Chefs. So you cook. I love cooking. Yeah, 0:08:50.960 --> 0:08:54.800 I love cooking. And it's that whole like compulsively making 0:08:54.840 --> 0:08:58.360 things with your hands. There's a theme here. Yeah, no, no, no, 0:08:58.520 --> 0:09:03.280 it's it's quite something else. And then you also started 0:09:03.320 --> 0:09:17.720 a makeup company. You started with eight lipsticks. I started 0:09:17.760 --> 0:09:20.160 with four. Four, all right, I started with ten. You 0:09:20.240 --> 0:09:25.040 started with four? And how did you like? So? How 0:09:25.040 --> 0:09:31.720 did that happen? I had? I still think about this 0:09:31.840 --> 0:09:36.240 a lot, actually, because my love is with color. My 0:09:36.320 --> 0:09:41.200 love is with color and form, and I have what 0:09:41.400 --> 0:09:45.320 feels like a lot of concentrated creative energy that needs 0:09:45.360 --> 0:09:47.120 to come out somehow, and that can come out through 0:09:47.120 --> 0:09:49.360 a lot of different things. And there was a period 0:09:49.400 --> 0:09:52.560 of time where I wanted to really, like more formally 0:09:52.720 --> 0:09:57.079 learn the principles of art. And so I started working 0:09:57.080 --> 0:09:58.880 with an art teacher. And this was right before I 0:09:58.880 --> 0:10:05.200 started COSIS, and um, she was teaching me color theory, 0:10:05.520 --> 0:10:08.000 like we were really understanding and we were working on 0:10:08.040 --> 0:10:12.800 portraiture because like I think, I'm just so fascinated by 0:10:12.920 --> 0:10:16.560 and like I get a lot of pleasure from the 0:10:16.600 --> 0:10:19.280 female form and humans in art, Like that's my that's 0:10:19.320 --> 0:10:21.760 something I love. I'm less drawn to landscapes, more drawn 0:10:21.760 --> 0:10:25.320 to human So you could paint, you paint people and face. 0:10:25.559 --> 0:10:28.440 I paint. I do not paint well, like let's not 0:10:29.960 --> 0:10:32.640 let's not get ahead of ourselves. I love it, but 0:10:32.720 --> 0:10:34.600 I'm not good at it. And like it's like the 0:10:34.640 --> 0:10:36.760 same thing with the piano for me, Like I love it, 0:10:36.800 --> 0:10:40.200 but I'm like not good, you know, and that's okay. Um, 0:10:40.240 --> 0:10:44.160 So I learned. But I did start to learn painting 0:10:45.480 --> 0:10:48.520 and I learned color. And it was in that process 0:10:48.679 --> 0:10:51.439 of like when I was learning how to mix earth 0:10:51.520 --> 0:10:53.600 tones and skin tones, which I had like absolutely no 0:10:53.640 --> 0:10:55.839 idea what the anatomy of these were. It was it's 0:10:55.920 --> 0:10:59.240 so fun. But when I was doing it, like I 0:10:59.280 --> 0:11:03.600 was ending up these piles of skin toned paint and 0:11:03.640 --> 0:11:06.800 they were so gorgeous and so alive, and I was like, 0:11:06.960 --> 0:11:10.319 that's makeup that I want to wear, Like those are 0:11:10.360 --> 0:11:13.440 the colors that I want to wear that I feel 0:11:13.440 --> 0:11:17.120 like you're going to bring to life my whole face, 0:11:17.280 --> 0:11:19.320 and that's what I've been looking for. And yet, like 0:11:19.400 --> 0:11:21.600 every time I try to find a color like that, 0:11:21.720 --> 0:11:23.320 why is it that when I put it on, I 0:11:23.400 --> 0:11:26.240 end up looking worse? And I know that this is 0:11:26.280 --> 0:11:28.800 a podcasting so other people can't say me, but you can. 0:11:28.920 --> 0:11:33.280 I'm so green. My skin tone is really really olive um. 0:11:33.360 --> 0:11:36.360 And so it's like a it's a hard to mix 0:11:36.640 --> 0:11:41.040 with situation, and there aren't a lot of products out 0:11:41.040 --> 0:11:44.920 there that like kind of cater to this tone family. 0:11:45.040 --> 0:11:47.000 And so those piles of paint to me like I 0:11:47.040 --> 0:11:48.640 felt seen by them because I was like, if I 0:11:48.679 --> 0:11:50.520 put those on, I am going to look good. That's 0:11:50.520 --> 0:11:52.600 gonna be great. And then those drove what those first 0:11:52.600 --> 0:11:56.720 four lipstick colors were. Okay, everyone wants a makeup line now, 0:11:56.920 --> 0:11:59.920 but the question is where does someone begin that doesn't 0:12:00.040 --> 0:12:04.200 know anything? You know, how did you find a chemist? 0:12:04.280 --> 0:12:08.440 How did you find the packaging? Great question. I was 0:12:08.520 --> 0:12:13.240 in the makeup chair on I think it was House. 0:12:13.679 --> 0:12:16.320 It was my thirty seconds of acting. See I knew 0:12:16.400 --> 0:12:18.920 it's always like it's like some dog millionaires of life. 0:12:19.360 --> 0:12:22.520 Everything has a reason. So it was in that thirty 0:12:22.520 --> 0:12:24.559 seconds of acting. I was in the makeup chair. I 0:12:24.600 --> 0:12:26.600 was talking to the makeup artist and I told her 0:12:26.679 --> 0:12:28.360 about like I want to have a makeup and at 0:12:28.400 --> 0:12:30.480 that time, by the way, there weren't as many people 0:12:30.520 --> 0:12:32.360 saying they wanted to have a beauty brand. Beauty was 0:12:32.360 --> 0:12:35.600 a place that fashion people were escaping too, because it 0:12:35.640 --> 0:12:37.839 was like a way more laid back business. Like they 0:12:37.840 --> 0:12:40.720 were like fashions too intense, it's to aggro, Like, let's 0:12:40.760 --> 0:12:44.400 go to UM beauty. And so I thought it was 0:12:44.440 --> 0:12:49.120 like relatively chill and laid back as an industry then UM. 0:12:49.160 --> 0:12:50.800 And I asked her and I told her about it, 0:12:50.840 --> 0:12:52.360 and she said, oh, I have a few friends who 0:12:52.360 --> 0:12:55.560 have made some products. And you know, here's the name 0:12:55.600 --> 0:12:59.120 of somebody. I had tried the Google thing. I reached 0:12:59.160 --> 0:13:03.240 out to any chemists, not one of them wrote me back. UM, 0:13:03.320 --> 0:13:06.040 and then she gave me this name and this one 0:13:06.160 --> 0:13:10.200 person wrote me back and that started everything. Wow, So 0:13:10.720 --> 0:13:16.400 how did you sell the first four lipsticks? So I 0:13:16.520 --> 0:13:22.120 made a website and I actually don't think like shopify 0:13:22.400 --> 0:13:26.640 was even around around them. There was something different. I 0:13:26.679 --> 0:13:29.240 had to actually like make a custom website and it 0:13:29.280 --> 0:13:30.960 had four products on it, you know, it was these 0:13:30.960 --> 0:13:34.240 four lipsticks. It was a single page yourself or did 0:13:34.320 --> 0:13:36.400 you have to ask someone to do I had. I 0:13:36.440 --> 0:13:40.080 had to ask somebody, So I had want this, you know. 0:13:40.160 --> 0:13:44.080 I went to this guy's garage and he made me 0:13:44.160 --> 0:13:46.600 a website with one page, and I designed it by 0:13:46.640 --> 0:13:49.760 drawing it on a piece of paper. People are so sophisticated, now, 0:13:49.800 --> 0:13:52.040 aren't they. They're like have all these branding decks and 0:13:52.160 --> 0:13:54.240 like the whole thing. And I was just like, here's 0:13:54.280 --> 0:13:56.920 my website. I put some squares on there. I was like, 0:13:56.960 --> 0:14:00.280 put the face here, the button here, and that was 0:14:00.360 --> 0:14:02.040 kind of it. And it was a single page. And 0:14:02.040 --> 0:14:04.760 then like one day I turned it on and that 0:14:04.880 --> 0:14:07.199 day was the day I received the lipsticks. Like it 0:14:07.240 --> 0:14:09.920 wasn't this like grand master plan. It was just like 0:14:10.280 --> 0:14:13.439 I was so scared to even own this many lipsticks. 0:14:14.480 --> 0:14:17.280 Remember how many was your first order? The minimum the 0:14:17.320 --> 0:14:20.560 minimum order quantity which was so cute, which was a 0:14:20.600 --> 0:14:23.320 thousand pieces per shade. So I had four thousand lipsticks 0:14:23.320 --> 0:14:24.800 in my house and I was like, what does four 0:14:24.840 --> 0:14:27.880 thousand sticks seriously even look like? Like I was like, 0:14:27.920 --> 0:14:30.640 can you give me, like, is it like going to 0:14:30.760 --> 0:14:32.360 fill up one room? What's it gonna look like? Any 0:14:32.480 --> 0:14:37.760 it wasn't It was actually not that big. I was surprised. Um. 0:14:37.840 --> 0:14:40.200 I put them in the den in my house, in 0:14:40.240 --> 0:14:43.880 these little piles, and then that was it. I turned 0:14:43.920 --> 0:14:46.479 on the website and I posted about it on Instagram 0:14:46.520 --> 0:14:49.400 to my five hundred friends and family that followed me, 0:14:50.040 --> 0:14:54.000 and people like people started placing little orders. It was 0:14:54.120 --> 0:14:58.520 so like, I remember how long it took for me 0:14:58.560 --> 0:15:03.560 to make the first and dollars. You know, I love 0:15:04.080 --> 0:15:07.160 hearing this story because so many people You're right, they 0:15:07.160 --> 0:15:10.400 make the decks, they get the investments, they do all 0:15:10.440 --> 0:15:12.280 of this and I and I have people calling me 0:15:12.360 --> 0:15:15.360 all the time. How do I get these two influencer? 0:15:15.400 --> 0:15:17.360 How do I get pressed? And I'm like, you need 0:15:17.360 --> 0:15:19.880 the product you need, Like, if you don't have a 0:15:19.880 --> 0:15:22.200 product that you think is better than what's out there, 0:15:22.720 --> 0:15:25.200 you don't have a company. You can't do it the 0:15:25.240 --> 0:15:29.440 other way around. So honestly, anyone that's listening, I don't 0:15:29.480 --> 0:15:33.000 care if you want to make bras or granola. This 0:15:33.080 --> 0:15:35.200 is how you start a business, and this is how 0:15:35.240 --> 0:15:38.640 you become an entrepreneur. And by the way, I don't 0:15:38.640 --> 0:15:40.840 know how long from the time that you did those 0:15:40.840 --> 0:15:44.520 four lipsticks too, when people started hearing about you, but 0:15:44.680 --> 0:15:47.640 in and I know that you were the number one 0:15:47.680 --> 0:15:51.480 indie brand of the year in two thousand and nineteen. Like, 0:15:52.360 --> 0:15:56.320 that's huge. That was four years later. That was four 0:15:56.400 --> 0:15:59.760 years later. Yeah, it took time. There's so many coast 0:15:59.800 --> 0:16:03.720 of questions because it's become such a giant brand. How 0:16:03.760 --> 0:16:07.440 many employees do you have right now? We have forty? 0:16:07.680 --> 0:16:09.880 Kink you for thinking we're a giant brand. We're a 0:16:09.920 --> 0:16:12.160 teeny tiny brand. But I'm glad that it looks that way. 0:16:12.160 --> 0:16:14.320 But yeah, we have a team of forty. In the 0:16:14.360 --> 0:16:17.440 indie world, you're a giant brand. Okay, I'll take that 0:16:18.200 --> 0:16:21.840 in my small pond. I'm a big fish. Yes. And 0:16:21.960 --> 0:16:26.000 what what keeps you up at night? Oh my god, Bobby, 0:16:26.040 --> 0:16:28.680 when is the last time I slept? Everything? Every little 0:16:28.720 --> 0:16:32.360 thing I would I would say, I mean, I think 0:16:32.560 --> 0:16:39.440 what's very There are a few things. One is I'm 0:16:39.480 --> 0:16:43.360 a person, Like I'm a human being with a heart 0:16:43.520 --> 0:16:46.400 and a soul and bones, and I'm just eight, Like 0:16:46.480 --> 0:16:50.640 I'm just as vulnerable as anybody else because we all are. 0:16:51.360 --> 0:16:55.080 And so I think the like giving up of my 0:16:55.120 --> 0:16:58.720 personhood in some way, or or like not having the 0:17:00.000 --> 0:17:02.600 sensitivity towards like who I am as a person. I 0:17:02.600 --> 0:17:05.320 know that's a super abstract and vague, beyond vague thing 0:17:05.359 --> 0:17:09.080 to say, but I think that sometimes does because like 0:17:09.119 --> 0:17:11.440 it ultimately comes down to this like feeling of being 0:17:11.480 --> 0:17:17.120 misunderstood sometimes or or like misrepresented, and that's that can 0:17:17.280 --> 0:17:21.840 hurt because, Um, I think that we have a drive 0:17:21.880 --> 0:17:24.840 to be seen by those we love as what we 0:17:24.960 --> 0:17:29.960 believe we are. And when you end up doing something 0:17:30.000 --> 0:17:33.000 a little bit more public than you know, you're being 0:17:33.000 --> 0:17:34.600 seen by a lot of people who don't love you 0:17:34.640 --> 0:17:37.359 as well. So like there's a huge amount of misrepresentation 0:17:37.400 --> 0:17:39.720 that can happen, and that sometimes keeps me up at night. 0:17:39.920 --> 0:17:42.200 I mean, don't you think that social has been a 0:17:42.240 --> 0:17:46.400 big like reason how your business grew so fast? Absolutely, 0:17:46.640 --> 0:17:48.960 it's been a big reason. I think that's because of 0:17:49.000 --> 0:17:52.360 the time that the business started in. Like if if 0:17:52.359 --> 0:17:54.480 we were in a different time and social didn't exist, 0:17:54.480 --> 0:17:56.520 then it would have grown fast in another way, because 0:17:56.520 --> 0:17:59.399 like I do believe like I'm here to do this regardless, 0:17:59.400 --> 0:18:01.600 and I'm getting into the time frame that I've been 0:18:01.760 --> 0:18:04.959 planted here in. So yes, it is because of social 0:18:05.080 --> 0:18:09.400 right now, um, to some extent um, But I think 0:18:09.400 --> 0:18:11.879 it's like it's just like one layer deeper. It's like 0:18:11.960 --> 0:18:14.960 because of the love of love, love of doing it. So, 0:18:15.200 --> 0:18:17.919 I mean, your business has grown so much, what are 0:18:17.960 --> 0:18:21.200 you hoping? What are you hoping for the business? And 0:18:21.240 --> 0:18:23.120 then I want to just dive into some of your 0:18:23.160 --> 0:18:26.359 special amazing formulas and products, So what are you what 0:18:26.359 --> 0:18:29.239 are you hoping for the business? I right now, I 0:18:29.240 --> 0:18:34.760 think that our business has grown definitely, but it's really 0:18:34.840 --> 0:18:38.680 just like at the very beginning stage, so early, and 0:18:39.200 --> 0:18:41.560 I haven't even like scratched the surface on like some 0:18:41.640 --> 0:18:43.640 of the things that I want to do, which all 0:18:43.800 --> 0:18:47.280 really have to do with storytelling and product and because 0:18:47.440 --> 0:18:50.679 those are the two places where my heart is. Um, 0:18:50.720 --> 0:18:53.639 there's you know, I want to be able to I 0:18:53.960 --> 0:18:56.040 can't wait to be able to like actually like touch 0:18:56.160 --> 0:19:00.439 people again and be able to have that conver station 0:19:00.920 --> 0:19:06.080 with other women about how they feel about their appearance, um, 0:19:06.240 --> 0:19:11.159 and like what coases can do and what kind of 0:19:11.160 --> 0:19:13.639 support we can bring into like from a product perspective, 0:19:14.240 --> 0:19:17.159 and have that like really like what I'm always looking for, 0:19:17.200 --> 0:19:19.639 which is that feeling of like finally, you know, like 0:19:19.760 --> 0:19:22.280 finally I've been looking for lip color that looks like 0:19:22.280 --> 0:19:24.240 this finally, like I you know, I've been wanting to 0:19:24.280 --> 0:19:26.680 be able to like get this like polished skin look, 0:19:26.720 --> 0:19:29.040 and I never have been able to. And you know, 0:19:29.359 --> 0:19:31.800 like thanks for making this and finally, like I feel 0:19:31.920 --> 0:19:35.639 like I love doing this ritual every day and like 0:19:35.760 --> 0:19:37.879 you know, really enjoy it and it doesn't feel like 0:19:37.920 --> 0:19:40.600 a routine or a chore. Well, your tinted oil has 0:19:40.640 --> 0:19:44.040 been a runaway success, you know. I think that was 0:19:44.080 --> 0:19:48.679 a very unique um formula that I think really you know, 0:19:48.920 --> 0:19:52.119 hit like hit a nerve. So when did you how 0:19:52.119 --> 0:19:53.840 did you think of that? Because there's not a lot 0:19:53.840 --> 0:19:56.800 of tinted oils on the market, No there aren't. I 0:19:56.800 --> 0:19:59.560 mean for me, it was like I liked to use 0:19:59.600 --> 0:20:04.600 oil and I like the look of of a of 0:20:04.680 --> 0:20:06.679 like a foundation, Like I like the look of a 0:20:06.680 --> 0:20:08.679 little bit of complexion product. I think it makes me 0:20:08.720 --> 0:20:11.800 feel like I look dressed. Um, I don't like a 0:20:11.800 --> 0:20:14.280 lot And it's like very specific what I'm looking for, 0:20:14.400 --> 0:20:16.000 Like I want a little bit of my skin to 0:20:16.000 --> 0:20:17.679 show through, but only the parts of my skin that 0:20:17.720 --> 0:20:19.040 I love, and then I want the rest of it 0:20:19.080 --> 0:20:21.600 to all look really even and I want to address 0:20:21.640 --> 0:20:24.200 my redness. I don't want to. I don't want something 0:20:24.200 --> 0:20:26.480 that's going to settle into my pores. And most importantly, 0:20:26.520 --> 0:20:29.240 I wanted to look better and better throughout the day, 0:20:29.760 --> 0:20:32.200 which i've you know, have had a hard time experiencing 0:20:32.280 --> 0:20:34.600 as a person who wears foundation. And I want to 0:20:34.600 --> 0:20:36.879 be able to wear it every day. Frankly too, I 0:20:36.880 --> 0:20:39.040 don't want to save it for special occasions, which is 0:20:39.040 --> 0:20:41.240 how I was feeling. I want to be able to 0:20:41.240 --> 0:20:43.880 get up and put on my favorite face every day quickly. 0:20:44.400 --> 0:20:47.320 But I wanted to look awesome. And that's really how 0:20:47.359 --> 0:20:49.520 that product came to be. It was like how do 0:20:49.560 --> 0:20:52.880 I fulfill all those needs? Um which is usually where 0:20:52.920 --> 0:20:55.120 I start. I'm like, I'm looking for something that makes 0:20:55.119 --> 0:20:57.800 me feel like this, so like what would be the 0:20:57.960 --> 0:21:01.400 ingredient profile of that? And that the ingredient profile turned 0:21:01.440 --> 0:21:04.920 out to be something that I like, tremendously love, which 0:21:04.920 --> 0:21:10.199 are oils. And then I ended up putting pigment inside 0:21:10.200 --> 0:21:12.080 the oils, and then I was like what is this? 0:21:13.200 --> 0:21:16.119 Like this is like pigment in the oil, it's face oil, 0:21:16.640 --> 0:21:20.800 and it's tinted, so it's tinted face oil. And that's 0:21:20.880 --> 0:21:23.320 like how it was named. And you have a new 0:21:23.720 --> 0:21:27.919 serum deodorant. Yes, I never I never ever thought of 0:21:27.920 --> 0:21:30.800 putting those two words together. So could you tell us 0:21:30.840 --> 0:21:33.960 what it is and how you thought that? Totally so 0:21:34.440 --> 0:21:37.879 similarly to the foundation thing, Like, I had this issue 0:21:37.920 --> 0:21:41.960 which was that I have very strong BO and smells 0:21:42.280 --> 0:21:47.239 terrible and ripe and insane, and um, I wanted to 0:21:47.280 --> 0:21:50.679 like not have BO. I mean, it was really like, 0:21:50.760 --> 0:21:53.320 it's really actually that simple. I want to not have BO. 0:21:53.640 --> 0:21:56.959 I had started to hear about like I've been I've 0:21:57.000 --> 0:21:58.760 been looking for things all over the place, Like I 0:21:58.760 --> 0:22:01.640 had tried baking soda on my armfits burned my armpits 0:22:01.640 --> 0:22:04.240 and turned them black. I had tried. I was like, okay, 0:22:04.240 --> 0:22:05.920 maybe if you do like a few drops of lemon 0:22:06.000 --> 0:22:08.560 juice and like some tea tree oil, like that will 0:22:08.600 --> 0:22:10.720 be the thing that you know is like so anti 0:22:10.760 --> 0:22:13.359 microbial that you won't have BeO. None of those things worked. 0:22:13.400 --> 0:22:17.160