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Speaker 1: This podcast is sponsored by Better Help Online Therapy. I'm

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Speaker 1: Michleine Malouf and I'm Nadya Adessi, licensed therapists and hosts

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Speaker 1: T T E R dot Ai. The Black Effect Presents

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Speaker 1: features honest conversations and exclusive interviews, a space for artists,

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Speaker 1: voices with great conversations. Make sure to listen to The

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Speaker 1: Black Effect Presents podcast on I Heart Radio, Apple podcasts

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Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts. And Human Development at

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Speaker 1: Texas A and M again, Texas and M Central University, Houston,

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Speaker 1: So you know I know about that that that Texas

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Speaker 1: A and M experience. The College of Education and Human

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Speaker 1: Development at Texas A and M has a mission of

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Speaker 1: enriching and transforming lives through education and health and developing

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Speaker 1: leaders and professionals and education, sports, business, healthcare, and related

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Speaker 1: fields and industries. He's on the show today discussed his

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Speaker 1: new book, Race Sports and Education, Improving Opportunities and Outcomes

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Speaker 1: of Blackmail College Athletes. Please welcome to Money Making Conversations,

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Speaker 1: Dr John Singer, thank you for having me. I really

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Speaker 1: appreciate this opportunity to have this conversation. Well, I'll tell

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Speaker 1: you after reading the book, are are you know? Because

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Speaker 1: you know Dr Harry Everett's in the book. We were

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Speaker 1: talking to a referencing the book. I'm saying is the

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Speaker 1: book called Race Sports and Education. He this book is

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Speaker 1: about black mail caused athletes, and he suggested that you

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Speaker 1: should include the female experience of the black female college athlete.

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Speaker 1: And your reasoning for just going male was why? Well,

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Speaker 1: I think for me being that this was my first

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Speaker 1: foray into an authored book. It was personal for me.

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Speaker 1: I mean as a black male myself who had hoop

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Speaker 1: dreams and aspirations as well a little boy growing up

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Speaker 1: in Betton Harbor, Michigan, and as someone who has worked

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Speaker 1: more closely with this particular population into my college years

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Speaker 1: and graduate studies and now as a faculty member. It

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Speaker 1: was just important for me to write about what I

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Speaker 1: knew and what I was most passionate about at this

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Speaker 1: moment my my career. So that's kind of why I

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Speaker 1: went against the sage wisdom and advice of Dr Edwards

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Speaker 1: and this particular project. I had this stick with what

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Speaker 1: what was my passion? But you know, you you you

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Speaker 1: know he is the like, let's say, the the the

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Speaker 1: messiah of this particular field of study. You know, when

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Speaker 1: you think about him at the forefront of politics and

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Speaker 1: and black studies and especially from an athletic standpoint, and

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Speaker 1: whenever you look at the espn is you would always

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Speaker 1: they would always hunt him down. What does what does

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Speaker 1: Dr Harry Ewoods has to say? What is he speaking about?

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Speaker 1: And when you look at the footage of him from

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Speaker 1: the sixties, he looks the same, He's just as grey

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Speaker 1: in his in his mustache and his goatee. But he's

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Speaker 1: still brilliant. What what when when we're gonna get to

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Speaker 1: your book? But a person like that, what impact does

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Speaker 1: he have on a person like you? Yeah? So I

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Speaker 1: remember seeing him like an interview clips when I was

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Speaker 1: an undergrad at Michigan State, and I just found myself

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Speaker 1: fascinated with him. I was like, man, he comes out

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Speaker 1: of that tradition of the civil rights movement, mouth comexus

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Speaker 1: and you know, the Black Canthers. But he tied his

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Speaker 1: activism to the context of sport, which really kind of

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Speaker 1: got my attention as a young you know, in my

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Speaker 1: late teens, early twenties, going through undergrad and so it's

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Speaker 1: amazing that, you know, twenty plus years later, not only

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Speaker 1: am I interacting with him, but he's endorsing my books.

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Speaker 1: So he's certainly planning a seed in me. I would

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Speaker 1: say that has started to germinate at this moment in

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Speaker 1: my my journey. Now this book. Who are you trying

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Speaker 1: to reach with this book as far as readers are concerned? Right,

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Speaker 1: So there's a couple of different audiences. Um first and

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Speaker 1: foremost the athletes themselves, and this can include athletes behind

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Speaker 1: this Black Males, because I think there's a message in

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Speaker 1: this book if you really pay attention to the nuances

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Speaker 1: and the narratives of the black males that I do

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Speaker 1: feature in the book, there's something in there, I think

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Speaker 1: for all athletes who are traveling, you know, from high

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Speaker 1: school into college sports. But more specifically, I really want

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Speaker 1: to reach the decision makers, those individuals who are setting

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Speaker 1: policies at the NT double A and member institution level,

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Speaker 1: those who are the practitioners working more directly day to

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Speaker 1: day with these athletes, whether it's academic support for athletics

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Speaker 1: or faculty on these university campuses. So I'm really looking

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Speaker 1: to read and for that matter, people in secondary educations

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Speaker 1: who are responsible for preparing these athletes for higher education,

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Speaker 1: so that those are my my primary audiences. Um and

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Speaker 1: then of course to lay audience people who are just

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Speaker 1: interested in in the topic and sport and education will

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Speaker 1: also find I think some value in this book. Well,

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Speaker 1: they're what I call industry decision makers influencers. People can

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Speaker 1: shape the way people think, the decisions they can make

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Speaker 1: about their future or how they're living currently. And so

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Speaker 1: the book I found fascinating reading, especially We're gonna we

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Speaker 1: don't get the chapters two and three in a minute,

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Speaker 1: But I want to talk about the Black Barbershop. You know,

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Speaker 1: I did a show on MTV called The Barbershop, and

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Speaker 1: it was about entertainment. And one of the things about

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Speaker 1: the Black Barbershop is that you know, you're gonna get

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Speaker 1: your share of sports, you're gonna get your share of politics,

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Speaker 1: and you're gonna get your share of entertainment. What was

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Speaker 1: your take on the Black Barbershop because just the fun part,

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Speaker 1: you know, of our conversation, and I enjoyed the reading

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Speaker 1: of the book, but when you when you get into

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Speaker 1: that barbershop, it's a different space there, man oh man.

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Speaker 1: You know, and my good friend and brother, Richard Milner

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Speaker 1: actually wrote the series forward for the book, and Eve

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Speaker 1: he talked about the Black Barbershop and the beauty shop

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Speaker 1: and how his observations in that space really speak to

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Speaker 1: I mean, there's a lot of theorizing. I know, we

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Speaker 1: as academics of scholars, we you know, we pride us

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Speaker 1: sales and you know, engaging with theory that makes sense

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Speaker 1: of the world. But in the Black Barbershop, that's exactly

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Speaker 1: what you get. It's not in the formal sense, but

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Speaker 1: certainly you have people with keen insights into these issues.

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Speaker 1: So the black barbershop, even my current barber um, you know,

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Speaker 1: I know something about sport, you know, and and the

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Speaker 1: patrons sitting around waiting for their haircut. You started talking

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Speaker 1: about sport boy. You see a different type of type

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Speaker 1: in it, and and whatnot in that space. So absolutely,

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Speaker 1: and I was glad that that brother rich Dr Brother

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Speaker 1: Richard Milner mused that metaphor to introduce my book in

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Speaker 1: his in his Racing Education series for Hybrid Education Prep. Well,

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Speaker 1: you know, it's really funny, you know, because the movie

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Speaker 1: that the Ice Q made, and of course Cedric the

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Speaker 1: entertained and started the very first barbershop was the closest

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Speaker 1: version of the very first one. And all those are good,

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Speaker 1: but the very first one's the closest version of walking

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Speaker 1: into a typical barbershop, you know, opinionated. You always got

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Speaker 1: somebody who's bigger than life in there, and you always

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Speaker 1: have people who sit around and putting information. You have

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Speaker 1: young generations because people women were bringing their young kids,

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Speaker 1: or the fathers are bringing their kids for their first haircuts,

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Speaker 1: and you have older generation people sitting in there, and

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Speaker 1: it was. So it allows you to think about so

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Speaker 1: many different layers of experiences that you can get just

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Speaker 1: by walking in there. And it's all tied to sports,

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Speaker 1: and sports is such a it crosses racial lines, but

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Speaker 1: it is racial, you know, whether it's the black quarterback

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Speaker 1: situation of the you know, I was watching ESPN last night.

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Speaker 1: They did this special call the Year the Black Quarterback.

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Speaker 1: You know, when you talk about Russell Wilson, you're talking

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Speaker 1: about Patrick Mahomes, you're talking about Lamar Jackson, who who's

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Speaker 1: unanimous m v P. And here was a guy who

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Speaker 1: was the fifth quarterback drafted in the year he was drafted,

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Speaker 1: and so because people thought he should be actually trying

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Speaker 1: out for to be a ride receiver and not be

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Speaker 1: trying to try not to be a quarterback. And so

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Speaker 1: you know, these these individuals who are changing the game.

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Speaker 1: How does that affect your book? Yeah, that's interesting. One

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Speaker 1: of the it was in chapter two the case study

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Speaker 1: I did, one of the athletes featured in that case

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Speaker 1: study talking about that, how you know, even as college coach,

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Speaker 1: they were bringing a white quarterback in the black quarterback monnel,

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Speaker 1: that black quarterback with the label of athletes. You know,

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Speaker 1: when clearly, from the perspective of this young man that

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Speaker 1: I feature in chapter two, he was the best quarterback

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Speaker 1: and best athlete on the team and he didn't understand

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Speaker 1: why coaches want to limit his access to that quarterback

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Speaker 1: leadership decision making positions. So certainly the athletes that I've

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Speaker 1: engaged within my research recognized the very point that you're making. Well,

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Speaker 1: you know, I think that a book like yours has

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Speaker 1: to be written and has to be you know, we

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Speaker 1: can't all have we have to have factual information about

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Speaker 1: what is really going on out there. And uh, when

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Speaker 1: I was reading your book and like see you you

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Speaker 1: you you followed three characters because you didn't really give

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Speaker 1: details on exactly who they were, exactly what college they

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Speaker 1: played on, exactly what protein they played on. But you

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Speaker 1: shared their position in college, you share their position when

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Speaker 1: they left college. And the three characters played a major

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Speaker 1: role in how each transition away from the sport based

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Speaker 1: on how the sport treated them. And you know, and

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Speaker 1: and it's really important that people understand that sports is

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Speaker 1: such a you know, everybody wants to be the next

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Speaker 1: you know, Russell Wilson, or the next you know Jair

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Speaker 1: Rice or the next. But then you have this this

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Speaker 1: this collegiate force or this college force out there, and

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Speaker 1: you said the h w c U, and I really

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Speaker 1: versus the HBCU, because those are two options out there,

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Speaker 1: but they are perceived options for success. When I say

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Speaker 1: h w c U, we're talking about historical white college

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Speaker 1: and universities and you have HBCU historical historical college and university.

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Speaker 1: Explain those dynamics for us, my listeners. Yeah. So, I mean,

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Speaker 1: if you really think about prior to the late nineteen

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Speaker 1: sixties and early nineteen seventies, that's where the black talent

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Speaker 1: really emerged. You talking about Jerry Rice, I mean he

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Speaker 1: was He's a product of an hbc and many of

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Speaker 1: the great Prior to the late sixties early seventies, when

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Speaker 1: Harry I was writing about this stuff, when he first

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Speaker 1: began writing about this stuff, all the black talent was there.

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Speaker 1: But once these historically white institutions began to realize there

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Speaker 1: was golden in their heels, as they say, that's when

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Speaker 1: they started cherry picking the best and the brightest. Historian

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Speaker 1: Gerald Eally talked about it was. HBO did a documentary

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Speaker 1: in the late nineties called The Journey of African American athletes.

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Speaker 1: He talked about this mass uh influx of black athletes

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Speaker 1: into these historical institutions in the early seventies. And the

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Speaker 1: real key moment was in nineteen seventy three they talked

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Speaker 1: about in this documentary when Sam damn Cunningham, that's right,

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Speaker 1: came down to Alabama, Alabama. He went down and just

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Speaker 1: ran all over Paul bear Bryant's all white Alabama squad.

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Speaker 1: You had the Alabama fans and the stands of at

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Speaker 1: the late great Eddie Robinson said talking about get us one,

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Speaker 1: get us one, talking about a black athlete, you know,

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Speaker 1: to the dominating. The next year, Alabama certainly brought in

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Speaker 1: Wilbert Jackson absolutely and then just let everybody know about

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Speaker 1: that game. USC dominant, West Coast College, University of Southern

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Speaker 1: California and Sam Bam Cunningham. When you give him a vault,

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Speaker 1: he'd leap over the line. He wouldn't run through the

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Speaker 1: last he'd leap over it, and so and so so

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Speaker 1: it was like there was nothing we've ever seen in

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Speaker 1: college football. And to do it against you know, the

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Speaker 1: vauntage or the legendary you know Bear Bryan team was

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Speaker 1: was was incredible. And also you know the Nebraska team

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Speaker 1: led by Johnny Rogers, and uh, those teams changed the

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Speaker 1: way people saw black athletes. And then when Jimmy Johnson

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Speaker 1: went down to Miami and found that the southern version,

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Speaker 1: the southern tip of Florida where all the black athletes

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Speaker 1: that nobody wanted to recruit, that had all the speed,

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Speaker 1: that's really started changing the face. But then they called

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Speaker 1: the athletes that he recruited convicts. M hm. They called

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Speaker 1: the athletes that know that they recruited Catholics and so

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Speaker 1: so they they named them. So. So when I started

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Speaker 1: reading your book, you know, it just started bringing back memories, doctor,

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Speaker 1: you know, so so you know you I'm one of

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Speaker 1: those industry decision makersy. This is impromptu information you've given

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Speaker 1: me that I'm just I'm just expounding. And just then

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Speaker 1: you know how important that your your book is and

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Speaker 1: needs to be be be studied but also served because

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Speaker 1: sociology changed my life. We're gonna be back in the

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Speaker 1: minute in our next break, because you got me fired up, doctor,

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Speaker 1: You got me fired up. Man. This book is a

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Speaker 1: is a is a great read. I'm talking to a book.

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Speaker 1: I'm talking to Dr John singer his book Proving Opportunities

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Speaker 1: and Alcohols for Blackmail. College athletes will be road back

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Speaker 1: with more money making conversations. We'll be right back with

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Speaker 1: money Making Conversations on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram. Ladies and gentlemen,

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Speaker 1: it's time you stop thinking about your dreams and put

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Speaker 1: some plans into action. You're listening to money Making Conversation.

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Speaker 1: I'm the host of Rashan McDonald. I'm speaking to Dr

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Speaker 1: John Singer. He has a book called Race, Sports and

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Speaker 1: Education and Improving Opportunities and Outcomes for Black Mail College Athletes.

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Speaker 1: My show is about entertainment. My show is about entrepreneurship. Um.

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Speaker 1: I feel it's the topic that you're talking about. It's

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Speaker 1: about money. It's about how the uh the institution we

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Speaker 1: call the n C double a uh. Some people call

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Speaker 1: it a money making institutions, and people have called the plantation.

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Speaker 1: Some people have called it an environment. But I feel that, yes,

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Speaker 1: you can say that, but it also impacts white students

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Speaker 1: as well, white student athletes as well. And so, but

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Speaker 1: we're talking about the black student athletes. And so you

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Speaker 1: track three different talents in your book. Why did you

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Speaker 1: choose these three individuals and why were they stores so

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Speaker 1: unique to your book? Well? Interesting? Right, So that particularly

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Speaker 1: you're talking about chapter two in the book is really

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Speaker 1: is um, that chapter is based on my dissertation work. Um.

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Speaker 1: And one of the reasons I don't you kind of

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Speaker 1: mentioned earlier in our conversation that I don't get specifically

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Speaker 1: about the institution. That's because of h RB protocol universities

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Speaker 1: where you have to protect the confidentiality of your research participants.

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Speaker 1: But this research that I feature of these three black males,

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Speaker 1: One reason I chose in the particulars because they expressed

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Speaker 1: an interest in the topics. So I had a connection

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Speaker 1: with one of the brothers who was an academic counselor

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Speaker 1: in the athletic department, and he told these particular athletes

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Speaker 1: about my, my, my dissertation research, and and they were

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Speaker 1: very interested in and sharing their story and their voices

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Speaker 1: and helping to create knowledge around the topics. So that's

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Speaker 1: kind of why those particular individuals making into the book,

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Speaker 1: because they were willing participants and wanted to share this

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Speaker 1: critical conversation that we had that formed the basis of

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Speaker 1: chapter two. All three in play football college football. Author

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Speaker 1: of them played football, and they were all high levels recruits,

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Speaker 1: you know they were. They were high level bluechip athletes

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Speaker 1: coming out of high school, and they all at some

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Speaker 1: point in time had a step in the NFL beyond

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Speaker 1: their their college days. They were that talented um on

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Speaker 1: the field to play to the point where they all

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Speaker 1: got a shot, with varying degrees of success at the

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Speaker 1: NFL level, But I love the fact that they all

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Speaker 1: arrived in different ways. One was a free agent, one

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Speaker 1: was drafted in the later rounds, and one was drafted

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Speaker 1: in the early rounds. And we all know that that's

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Speaker 1: a salary tied to that. And two of them became

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Speaker 1: are in the fields of in the are in the

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Speaker 1: field of acting, and one in the field of sales,

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Speaker 1: and so which which which is really interesting because in

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Speaker 1: my I'm running into more and more athletes of the

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Speaker 1: gentleman who wanted an oscar. Matthew Cherry was a former

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Speaker 1: professional football player, and so so I'm running into more

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Speaker 1: and more athletes and I and I really the reason

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Speaker 1: the reason I'm really excited about communicating with you because

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Speaker 1: I'm really involved in a lot of HBCU activity, trying

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Speaker 1: to really build a brand of their awareness of what

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Speaker 1: HBCUs are bringing to the table not only in athletics

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Speaker 1: but academics, but also your book is about branding and

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Speaker 1: marketing too, because it's about perception because that we started.

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Speaker 1: Because that's why a lot of kids go to h uh,

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Speaker 1: historical White college university because of the fact that it's

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Speaker 1: perception that I can get drafted or I get a

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Speaker 1: better opportunity to uh, to be seen on TV. That's

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Speaker 1: important to these young people today as it is in

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Speaker 1: the past. Correct. Oh, yeah, absolutely, And that conversation has

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Speaker 1: come up in mind not only my formal resource with

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Speaker 1: black male athletes, but also when I was academic advisor

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Speaker 1: and mentor of a summer Bridge program. A lot of

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Speaker 1: this struggle with the decision to say, Hey, I want

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Speaker 1: to consider HBCU, but I know where I'm at in

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Speaker 1: my career, where we're at in society. It behoo's me

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Speaker 1: to go to the historically white college because of the

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Speaker 1: media visibility, the platform, the resources to get me to

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Speaker 1: the next level. So I've had many conversations with black

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Speaker 1: male athletes over the years about that, you know, decision

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Speaker 1: to consider HBCUs, but to look at the platform and

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Speaker 1: the resources that these historical hit cousy and the even

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Speaker 1: though it's been proven that if you do have the talent,

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Speaker 1: you know, Steve McNair HBCU graduate at quarterback Tennessee Titans, UH,

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Speaker 1: Doug Williams, of course, Gramlin UM Jared Rice Mississippi Valley State,

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Speaker 1: I believed. And then also recently the Houston Texans drafted

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Speaker 1: a young man out of a police South Carolina State

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Speaker 1: officive tackle UH from our HBCU school. So and then

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Speaker 1: also Darre's Leonard last year he was a HBCU grad

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Speaker 1: and made the Pro Bowl. So we're starting to see.

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Speaker 1: And also I know that the NFL is now holding

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Speaker 1: a separate HBCU college combine. So so it's a lot

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Speaker 1: of things that are happening. They may cause that shift,

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Speaker 1: may not be dramatically, but if if that shift started

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Speaker 1: to happen, what would that do in the in the

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Speaker 1: book that you've written, would it would it be Would

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Speaker 1: it be a good thing if that shift started happening

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Speaker 1: towards h or the hbc you're starting to see more

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Speaker 1: quality talent to attend or just as quote last, that's

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Speaker 1: a very interesting question because I talked a little bit

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Speaker 1: about that in the conclusion of my book right where

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Speaker 1: that's a consideration that we have to think about. I

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Speaker 1: think about my dear sister Jamal Hill, who is a

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Speaker 1: fellow Michigan State's partner. We were there in nineties at

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Speaker 1: the same time she talks about that, how now is

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Speaker 1: the time for us to seriously consider that. It's interesting.

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Speaker 1: I'm this Thursday, February thirteenth, I'm giving a talk about

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Speaker 1: my book at Prairieview, a and m um Fred Bonner

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Speaker 1: has what he called the Building on Resilience lecture series,

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Speaker 1: and he asked me to come and talk about my

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Speaker 1: book and you know, implications it has for college sports

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Speaker 1: widely speaking, and so I think it's time to have

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Speaker 1: that conversation. And in light of what herya was referred

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Speaker 1: to as the fourth waves of athlete activism, where athletes

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Speaker 1: are now corporates in their own rights, you know, I mean,

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Speaker 1: but the social media media platform, these athletes are being

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Speaker 1: more empowered to to control their own you know, brand

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Speaker 1: and destiny. So I think it's a serious conversation that

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Speaker 1: we can't ignore this dismissed as I will never be

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Speaker 1: possible because the aller of h h W c US

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Speaker 1: is just too powerful. I think that I don't know,

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Speaker 1: the conversation is right and to be had, well, it's

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Speaker 1: right to be had, but will it be you know, achieved?

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Speaker 1: And I'm not look out. Look, I'm not trying to

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Speaker 1: shut down by school, the University of Houston. I'm just

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Speaker 1: trying to let individuals know there are options, and sometimes

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Speaker 1: special people don't look at HBCU as an option. And

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Speaker 1: I'm just letting people know that if you're talented and

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Speaker 1: you want to be and you do the right things

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Speaker 1: in life, then guess what you can participate in the sport,

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Speaker 1: especially in football. Now that's not showing up in baseball,

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Speaker 1: that's not showing up in basketball like that, but in

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Speaker 1: football has proven that if you got the talent, they

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Speaker 1: find you and you can also and that's that's very true. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: And I'll give you an example. So I referee high

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Speaker 1: school and college basketball here in Texas when I'm not

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Speaker 1: doing my university work. And one of my fellow co

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Speaker 1: officials has a son who is you know, finger this

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Speaker 1: year being recruited and I don't know if he signed

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Speaker 1: on signing day February five, but he told me after

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Speaker 1: his son read my book, he is seriously now considering

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Speaker 1: going to an HPC. You have to read my book.

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Speaker 1: I mean that really did my heart good when I

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Speaker 1: got that text message from him saying that, you know,

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Speaker 1: because he's considering, you know, some of the some of

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Speaker 1: the major Division one schools here in the state of Texas.

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Speaker 1: But now you know, the Texas southerns and the prairie

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Speaker 1: views are in the conversation for this young man and

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Speaker 1: his family. So that that really was red because you

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Speaker 1: do don't care who are you at. Okay, let's let's

429
00:24:53,480 --> 00:24:56,439
Speaker 1: look at the college world is out there. You know,

430
00:24:56,880 --> 00:25:00,680
Speaker 1: if you if you're in the traditional h uh uh,

431
00:25:00,840 --> 00:25:04,479
Speaker 1: historical right collegist Okay, that means that even there that

432
00:25:04,480 --> 00:25:08,159
Speaker 1: it's you have the Power five, the Power five conferences,

433
00:25:08,200 --> 00:25:10,520
Speaker 1: and then like I go to University Houston, it's not

434
00:25:10,560 --> 00:25:13,240
Speaker 1: a Power five conference. You know, it's a lesser conference.

435
00:25:13,280 --> 00:25:16,760
Speaker 1: So even in that world, there's divisions, there's saying you're better,

436
00:25:17,200 --> 00:25:18,800
Speaker 1: you can you can hang out down there, and you

437
00:25:18,800 --> 00:25:22,080
Speaker 1: have the Division two, you have Division one playoff systems,

438
00:25:22,280 --> 00:25:25,440
Speaker 1: and then you have HBCUs. So no matter where you go,

439
00:25:25,920 --> 00:25:28,560
Speaker 1: they're gonna be opportunities for you. And you could be

440
00:25:28,600 --> 00:25:32,399
Speaker 1: perceived like Mrs ed Oliver Oliver when he signed with

441
00:25:32,440 --> 00:25:35,240
Speaker 1: the University of Houston and he's and they said, why

442
00:25:35,280 --> 00:25:37,480
Speaker 1: that's not a poalified school. He would never make it

443
00:25:37,520 --> 00:25:39,680
Speaker 1: guess what he winded up in the number nine picking

444
00:25:39,760 --> 00:25:42,440
Speaker 1: the draft because his talent is still he still gave

445
00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:46,200
Speaker 1: a effort, he still shined. And so I'm just letting

446
00:25:46,240 --> 00:25:48,920
Speaker 1: everybody know when I read your book, not only way

447
00:25:48,920 --> 00:25:51,880
Speaker 1: you supplying with me with information, but you also will

448
00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:54,560
Speaker 1: affirming what I believe. If you if you make the

449
00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:58,480
Speaker 1: right effort, if you put yourself in the right support system,

450
00:25:58,560 --> 00:26:01,480
Speaker 1: and then don't let people swear you with negativity, and

451
00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:03,719
Speaker 1: you can follow your dreams no matter where it leads you.

452
00:26:04,080 --> 00:26:06,960
Speaker 1: That's what the basis of your book is correct, and

453
00:26:07,040 --> 00:26:10,439
Speaker 1: that's right. And these athletes nowadays, they want to get

454
00:26:10,480 --> 00:26:12,480
Speaker 1: on the field or the court. They want to have

455
00:26:12,520 --> 00:26:15,320
Speaker 1: opportunities at play and and and maybe it's a situation

456
00:26:15,359 --> 00:26:18,200
Speaker 1: where they realized, hey, let me, let me come on

457
00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:21,680
Speaker 1: home one of my doctors and one of my doctors

458
00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:25,200
Speaker 1: and not going to study where you know, we looked

459
00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:28,040
Speaker 1: at a young man. He was a five star recruit

460
00:26:28,080 --> 00:26:32,080
Speaker 1: coming out of high school who started at Alabama but

461
00:26:32,200 --> 00:26:37,159
Speaker 1: eventually ended up at at Winston Salem State University, and

462
00:26:37,200 --> 00:26:40,040
Speaker 1: we we we framed that we didn't We presented at

463
00:26:40,040 --> 00:26:42,920
Speaker 1: a conference and we framed it redefining the conveyor belt,

464
00:26:42,960 --> 00:26:45,439
Speaker 1: you know, William Roden's turn, and how these athletes are

465
00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:49,600
Speaker 1: recruited from their communities from early age on through you know,

466
00:26:49,800 --> 00:26:52,960
Speaker 1: high school into college and how this particularly young man

467
00:26:53,160 --> 00:26:56,440
Speaker 1: redefined the conveyor belt, and and looking at his story

468
00:26:56,520 --> 00:27:00,320
Speaker 1: and talking about how he you know, ended up at

469
00:27:00,359 --> 00:27:02,320
Speaker 1: home at the end of the day when he was

470
00:27:02,359 --> 00:27:05,680
Speaker 1: in there that space car Winston Salem State University, even

471
00:27:05,680 --> 00:27:08,800
Speaker 1: though there wasn't the accolade the past to it that

472
00:27:08,880 --> 00:27:11,840
Speaker 1: in Alabama provides at the end of the day as

473
00:27:11,880 --> 00:27:16,320
Speaker 1: a man, he found that landing spot, that where he

474
00:27:16,359 --> 00:27:21,000
Speaker 1: finished his career to be, you know, after him going comfortable.

475
00:27:21,280 --> 00:27:23,680
Speaker 1: So it's pretty comfortable and relatable because that's what it's

476
00:27:23,720 --> 00:27:26,840
Speaker 1: all about, you know, in the end, man, if you're

477
00:27:26,840 --> 00:27:28,920
Speaker 1: trying to pursue your dreams, and I say, who I'm

478
00:27:28,920 --> 00:27:33,560
Speaker 1: speaking to is Dr John Singer Um. His book is

479
00:27:33,560 --> 00:27:37,200
Speaker 1: about it's about letting people know that as a black athlete,

480
00:27:37,600 --> 00:27:40,880
Speaker 1: your experience is different and it should be acknowledged. Because

481
00:27:40,920 --> 00:27:45,080
Speaker 1: you talk about more part college profectors, you talk about tutors,

482
00:27:45,119 --> 00:27:49,000
Speaker 1: you talk about mentors because you know, you you're thrown

483
00:27:49,040 --> 00:27:52,080
Speaker 1: into a world that's really not trying to adjust for you.

484
00:27:53,080 --> 00:27:55,800
Speaker 1: And that's really what can happen to students. And so

485
00:27:56,160 --> 00:27:59,000
Speaker 1: that's all I'm saying is that sure you can be recruited,

486
00:27:59,080 --> 00:28:01,560
Speaker 1: sure you can go to the school, but it's it

487
00:28:01,600 --> 00:28:03,840
Speaker 1: is it accepting who you are as a person, where

488
00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:07,359
Speaker 1: you know as much smaller environment they can allow you

489
00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:09,040
Speaker 1: to grow as a person, because that's all you want.

490
00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:10,760
Speaker 1: When you go to college. You won't grow. You want

491
00:28:10,760 --> 00:28:13,520
Speaker 1: an opportunity to walk away and be a successful person

492
00:28:13,920 --> 00:28:16,920
Speaker 1: in a field that is not athletically driven. And that's

493
00:28:16,920 --> 00:28:18,840
Speaker 1: what the three people that you chose and which I

494
00:28:18,880 --> 00:28:21,840
Speaker 1: liked because you know, one he left he was a

495
00:28:21,880 --> 00:28:23,800
Speaker 1: free agent. You know, he had a family, but he

496
00:28:23,880 --> 00:28:25,840
Speaker 1: still went to l A and guess what, he's a

497
00:28:25,960 --> 00:28:29,360
Speaker 1: he's working as a successful actor. And then one he

498
00:28:29,400 --> 00:28:31,480
Speaker 1: was a he's a late round draft pick, but he

499
00:28:31,520 --> 00:28:34,639
Speaker 1: saved his money, played several years in the NFL. And

500
00:28:34,680 --> 00:28:37,080
Speaker 1: then he doesn't have a wife or a kid, so

501
00:28:37,160 --> 00:28:38,920
Speaker 1: but he saved his money. So he's out there, but

502
00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:43,000
Speaker 1: he's not he's not effectively pursuing his career, like he

503
00:28:43,040 --> 00:28:44,720
Speaker 1: wan't at the pace that he want, but at least

504
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:47,200
Speaker 1: he's doing it. And then the other one it's a salesman.

505
00:28:47,360 --> 00:28:50,240
Speaker 1: He's out there using this academic training, using this the

506
00:28:50,320 --> 00:28:52,720
Speaker 1: things that he learned by going to the school, and

507
00:28:52,760 --> 00:28:55,400
Speaker 1: allowing him to live a successful life. But that's all

508
00:28:55,480 --> 00:28:57,880
Speaker 1: you want from a college, from college education, that's all

509
00:28:57,920 --> 00:29:00,800
Speaker 1: the opportunity you want. College, This college owe you anything.

510
00:29:01,440 --> 00:29:05,600
Speaker 1: Dr Well, you know, one of the things that I

511
00:29:05,640 --> 00:29:08,040
Speaker 1: talked about this in the book, area was saying is

512
00:29:08,080 --> 00:29:10,120
Speaker 1: that at the end of the day, education is an

513
00:29:10,120 --> 00:29:14,360
Speaker 1: activist pursuit, right, And if you don't as an individual,

514
00:29:14,440 --> 00:29:16,280
Speaker 1: even though there's issues that we can talk about with

515
00:29:16,360 --> 00:29:18,880
Speaker 1: the system and the structure, if you know, as an individual,

516
00:29:19,880 --> 00:29:27,080
Speaker 1: don't prioritize that, that's on you. So I think, you know,

517
00:29:27,200 --> 00:29:29,040
Speaker 1: that's one of the messages I do want people to

518
00:29:29,080 --> 00:29:31,800
Speaker 1: take from the book as well that I'm very as

519
00:29:31,840 --> 00:29:34,600
Speaker 1: Herod was said in his endorsement on book, I'm very

520
00:29:34,640 --> 00:29:37,840
Speaker 1: hard on the system and my critique of it, but

521
00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:42,680
Speaker 1: I'm also uh cognizant of the fact that the individual

522
00:29:42,720 --> 00:29:45,640
Speaker 1: has to step up and make it their education a

523
00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:50,600
Speaker 1: priority and or activists pursuit. So, in other words, if

524
00:29:50,600 --> 00:29:53,840
Speaker 1: somebody gives you an opportunity, take advantage of it. Because

525
00:29:53,880 --> 00:29:56,280
Speaker 1: the three people that volunteer to be a part of

526
00:29:56,320 --> 00:30:01,360
Speaker 1: your research. They use their athleticism to be educated, and

527
00:30:01,360 --> 00:30:03,480
Speaker 1: I feel they're live in good lives because they were

528
00:30:03,600 --> 00:30:06,760
Speaker 1: able to go to college. But the the athleticism wasn't

529
00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:09,440
Speaker 1: the end all. It was just a straight to a

530
00:30:09,480 --> 00:30:11,840
Speaker 1: better life. And that's what that was my biggest takeaway

531
00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:13,479
Speaker 1: from your book. In the book, I'm talking about this race,

532
00:30:13,560 --> 00:30:18,280
Speaker 1: sports and education, improving opportunities, which what college education can

533
00:30:18,320 --> 00:30:21,800
Speaker 1: do and out come for blackmail college athletes by man

534
00:30:22,200 --> 00:30:25,680
Speaker 1: Dr John Singer. I'm a fan. Please tell everybody how

535
00:30:25,680 --> 00:30:28,160
Speaker 1: they can locate your book. Do you have a website

536
00:30:28,200 --> 00:30:32,240
Speaker 1: your social media information? Oh? Yeah, Well the best way

537
00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:36,840
Speaker 1: probably is this to go directly to either Harvard Education

538
00:30:36,960 --> 00:30:42,080
Speaker 1: Press website or either Amazon. That's that's really the popular

539
00:30:42,120 --> 00:30:46,680
Speaker 1: way to get the book. Um at this point, Um,

540
00:30:46,720 --> 00:30:51,400
Speaker 1: I am on Twitter, I am on Facebook. UM. So

541
00:30:51,560 --> 00:30:54,080
Speaker 1: I don't have a website at this point for the book.

542
00:30:54,120 --> 00:30:57,600
Speaker 1: But as I talk more about this book and and

543
00:30:57,800 --> 00:31:00,200
Speaker 1: uh it gets more attention, I will be set that

544
00:31:00,360 --> 00:31:03,880
Speaker 1: type of thing. Well, my job is to give your attention, sir,

545
00:31:04,280 --> 00:31:06,600
Speaker 1: because I enjoyed it and I wish you good luck.

546
00:31:06,640 --> 00:31:09,200
Speaker 1: I always know that Rushan McDonald is a friend of

547
00:31:09,240 --> 00:31:11,960
Speaker 1: yours and there your book has only opened my eyes

548
00:31:12,040 --> 00:31:14,360
Speaker 1: to let me know that I'm gonna continue to fight.

549
00:31:14,400 --> 00:31:17,560
Speaker 1: But college changed my life. I didn't play sports. But

550
00:31:17,600 --> 00:31:19,400
Speaker 1: if I didn't go to college, and I didn't pursue

551
00:31:19,400 --> 00:31:21,440
Speaker 1: the opportunity of to college presented to me, I would

552
00:31:21,440 --> 00:31:23,520
Speaker 1: not be the man I am today. If you want

553
00:31:23,520 --> 00:31:26,600
Speaker 1: to listen to any more episodes of Money Making Conversations,

554
00:31:26,720 --> 00:31:29,840
Speaker 1: go to Money Making Conversation dot com. I'm Rushan McDonald.

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