WEBVTT - Dell Raises AI Server Sales Outlook While HP Cuts Jobs 0:00:02.520 --> 0:00:13.200 Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. Bloomberg Tech is a 0:00:13.240 --> 0:00:16.960 lie from coast to coast, with Caroline Hide in New 0:00:17.079 --> 0:00:19.600 York and Ed Ludlow in San Francisco. 0:00:22.960 --> 0:00:25.599 This is Bloomberg Tech coming up. We zero in on 0:00:25.720 --> 0:00:28.840 tech earnings with Dell raising its AI servership and outlook 0:00:28.920 --> 0:00:33.320 well HP announces job cuts, plus Warner Brothers Discovery asking 0:00:33.360 --> 0:00:36.639 bidders for sweetened offers by December first as it explores 0:00:36.680 --> 0:00:40.240 options for a sale, and Nvidia in focus is Doubts 0:00:40.240 --> 0:00:43.680 over the company's AI chip dominance are growing. I'm Jim 0:00:43.720 --> 0:00:46.640 Centeveec in New York in for Caroline Hide and Ed Ludlow. 0:00:46.720 --> 0:00:50.599 Let's get a check on markets right now. Ustocks advancing 0:00:50.640 --> 0:00:53.280 as expectations for an interest rate cut at the fed's 0:00:53.400 --> 0:00:56.360 next meeting are helping to fuel gains before the Thanksgiving break. 0:00:56.760 --> 0:00:59.040 NAZAC one hundred up right now and look at the 0:00:59.080 --> 0:01:02.440 last three days of four percent. This after both the 0:01:02.520 --> 0:01:04.680 S and P five hundred and NAZAC on hundred moved 0:01:04.680 --> 0:01:07.280 away from their last record highs in late October. 0:01:07.280 --> 0:01:08.600 The NAZAK one hundred. 0:01:08.280 --> 0:01:11.959 Down about let's say, three point six percent from that 0:01:12.000 --> 0:01:13.720 all time high. The s and P five hundred, though 0:01:13.959 --> 0:01:16.759 down just a little over one percent. We're also looking 0:01:16.840 --> 0:01:19.600 at tech earnings with Dell and HP. Dell raising its 0:01:19.600 --> 0:01:22.720 annual projections for the AI server market thanks to sustain 0:01:22.840 --> 0:01:26.160 demand for machines needed in the current data boom. Meanwhile, 0:01:26.360 --> 0:01:29.800 HP stock under pressure down two point two percent right now. 0:01:30.000 --> 0:01:32.240 The company now it's four thousand to six thousand job 0:01:32.280 --> 0:01:34.440 cuts over the next couple of years by using more 0:01:34.520 --> 0:01:37.280 AI tools. For more on HP and Dell, let's bring 0:01:37.319 --> 0:01:40.319 in Bloomberg's and Dina Bastina joins us here in New York. 0:01:40.319 --> 0:01:43.800 I want to start with HP. Four thousand to six 0:01:43.840 --> 0:01:45.920 thousand jobs sounds like a lot. And indeed, if we 0:01:45.959 --> 0:01:47.360 go to the six thousand sound it's like a ten 0:01:47.360 --> 0:01:47.800 percent of. 0:01:47.760 --> 0:01:48.640 The company's workforce. 0:01:48.680 --> 0:01:51.800 But that's through twenty twenty eight fiscal years, so we're 0:01:51.840 --> 0:01:53.919 a few years away from that. And if it's AI 0:01:54.040 --> 0:01:56.360 that they're going to replace these people with, AI can 0:01:56.440 --> 0:01:57.640 change a lot between. 0:01:57.360 --> 0:01:57.840 Now and then. 0:01:58.400 --> 0:02:01.720 Sure, And to be clear, each did a similar magnitude 0:02:01.800 --> 0:02:03.240 job cut over the last three years. 0:02:03.240 --> 0:02:04.080 They just finished it. 0:02:04.120 --> 0:02:07.480 They have these kind of periodic efficiency plans. I guess 0:02:07.520 --> 0:02:09.960 what's new about this one is the idea is that 0:02:10.000 --> 0:02:13.640 they are going to use AI tools and models to 0:02:13.800 --> 0:02:18.960 do things like product development, customer customer service sales, and 0:02:19.000 --> 0:02:21.760 that's where you're getting these job cuts. But at the 0:02:21.800 --> 0:02:24.480 same time, even though they're going to be saving money 0:02:24.480 --> 0:02:27.679 that way, they said they actually took they actually came 0:02:27.720 --> 0:02:31.320 in below on their guide for next year for fiscal 0:02:31.639 --> 0:02:33.800 fiscal year profit and that was because of a completely 0:02:33.800 --> 0:02:37.200 different issue around memory price increases. So you had both 0:02:37.240 --> 0:02:39.760 you have these job cuts and it's not you know, 0:02:40.080 --> 0:02:42.840 making the bottom line look where people expected it would 0:02:42.840 --> 0:02:43.160 come in. 0:02:43.360 --> 0:02:47.920 Well, speaking of those price increases, that also hitting Dell, 0:02:48.320 --> 0:02:50.639 So let's let's talk a little bit about Dell. Dell 0:02:50.760 --> 0:02:53.000 is contending with despite strong demand, how is it going 0:02:53.000 --> 0:02:55.120 to make its AI server business more profitable. 0:02:55.720 --> 0:02:58.040 So the AI server business, and that's basically since I 0:02:58.080 --> 0:02:59.960 know you're going to be talking about GPUs in a minute, 0:03:00.120 --> 0:03:03.280 are the servers that have GPUs that go into these 0:03:03.280 --> 0:03:06.359 AI data centers, and the demand for them has been 0:03:06.560 --> 0:03:10.000 very high for Dell and other makers. Of the problem 0:03:10.120 --> 0:03:11.960 is that in order to get some of these deals 0:03:12.000 --> 0:03:14.720 and in order to deploy some of those servers, Dell 0:03:14.840 --> 0:03:18.400 was basically incurring more significant costs. What they're trying to 0:03:18.440 --> 0:03:20.320 do now is pull back from that a little bit 0:03:20.639 --> 0:03:23.600 to widen the profit margin in that business. They've they 0:03:23.639 --> 0:03:26.400 succeeded in the last quarter, they told me, because they 0:03:26.400 --> 0:03:29.120 were able to serve a more diverse group of customers, 0:03:29.120 --> 0:03:31.960 so some of those were a better, more profitable sets 0:03:31.960 --> 0:03:32.320 of deals. 0:03:32.440 --> 0:03:32.639 Yeah. 0:03:32.639 --> 0:03:34.120 I think these rising costs are going to be the 0:03:34.160 --> 0:03:35.320 same throughout the next. 0:03:35.200 --> 0:03:35.840 Year as well. 0:03:36.000 --> 0:03:37.720 You know, always good to see you, Welcome back to 0:03:37.960 --> 0:03:41.640 New York, Happy Thanksgiving as well. Well, let's bring in 0:03:41.720 --> 0:03:44.680 now in talking video because in video shares over the 0:03:44.760 --> 0:03:47.280 last five days taking a hit down more than three percent. 0:03:47.360 --> 0:03:50.400 The stock facing pressures as AI Chip rivals gained ground, 0:03:50.720 --> 0:03:54.480 leaving investors wondering if it's dominance can be sustained. Bloomberg's 0:03:54.520 --> 0:03:57.320 Ryan Vistelica joins us for more So, Ryan, I think 0:03:57.320 --> 0:04:00.280 the big question that investors have after seeing what happened 0:04:00.320 --> 0:04:03.120 with Alphabet in this report in the information earlier this week, 0:04:03.240 --> 0:04:09.800 is can Googles TPUs actually compete with the GPUs from Nvidia? 0:04:09.840 --> 0:04:10.560 What are you hearing? 0:04:11.600 --> 0:04:13.840 Hey, good morning, Thanks for having me. So I would 0:04:13.880 --> 0:04:16.679 say that while there are a lot of differences between 0:04:16.720 --> 0:04:21.880 Innvidia's chips and alphabets. Alphabets are designed for one specific purpose, 0:04:21.960 --> 0:04:25.919 which is working with AI workloads in the cloud, which 0:04:25.960 --> 0:04:28.839 is really the dominant use case for a lot of 0:04:28.880 --> 0:04:31.480 the AI infrastructure that's being done right now. So there 0:04:31.520 --> 0:04:35.720 is certainly a very big market for the TPU chips, 0:04:35.800 --> 0:04:38.920 as we saw with the Anthropic deal that was announced 0:04:38.920 --> 0:04:42.080 a couple of weeks ago and with this report with Meta, 0:04:42.200 --> 0:04:47.240 so that opens up potentially a huge new market for Alphabet, 0:04:47.360 --> 0:04:50.159 and it does put in Vidia's market share under a 0:04:50.200 --> 0:04:52.920 little bit of pressure. Now, this is still very early 0:04:53.040 --> 0:04:55.920 days and it's not like Alphabet is out there selling 0:04:56.000 --> 0:04:58.480 chips to people in the same way that Nvidia is, 0:04:58.760 --> 0:05:02.080 but certainly people are reassessing what our market share is 0:05:02.080 --> 0:05:04.440 going to look like over the coming years. And if 0:05:04.440 --> 0:05:08.440 in Videas is a lot smaller than previously expected, what 0:05:08.480 --> 0:05:10.520 does that mean for the stock? What does that mean 0:05:10.560 --> 0:05:13.120 for the valuation? What does that mean for its expected 0:05:13.120 --> 0:05:14.279 growth rates going forward? 0:05:14.560 --> 0:05:16.680 Yeah, I mean the analyst community, though at this point 0:05:16.720 --> 0:05:21.000 even investors may be a little concerned, but the analyst community, 0:05:21.600 --> 0:05:24.240 they've still got buys on this stock. I mean, there's 0:05:24.240 --> 0:05:27.600 only one analyst who's tracked by Bloomberg. Jay Goldberg over 0:05:27.600 --> 0:05:31.159 at Seaport, who has a sell on in Vidia. 0:05:31.320 --> 0:05:34.159 Is he changing his tune? Are these analysts changing their tune? 0:05:34.680 --> 0:05:34.720 No? 0:05:34.839 --> 0:05:36.719 In fact, I spoke with him yesterday and he said 0:05:36.720 --> 0:05:38.840 he is more negative on Nvidia now than he was 0:05:38.880 --> 0:05:41.200 a couple of weeks ago. I would say that, you know, 0:05:41.320 --> 0:05:45.040 the new concerns about you know, custom silicon and new 0:05:45.240 --> 0:05:48.160 rising competition for in VideA. This comes at a time 0:05:48.160 --> 0:05:51.920 when people are increasingly questioning the AI trade. There is 0:05:52.000 --> 0:05:54.440 a lot of debate right now about the amount of 0:05:54.440 --> 0:05:57.080 spending going on, how durable is this going to be, 0:05:57.080 --> 0:06:00.600 how sustainable, what kind of returns our companies see on this? 0:06:00.680 --> 0:06:03.240 And if they're not seeing big returns on this investment, 0:06:03.600 --> 0:06:05.719 are is a going to pull back on their AI 0:06:05.760 --> 0:06:08.799 spending going forward? And VideA is really at the heart 0:06:08.920 --> 0:06:11.120 of a lot of AI debate right now. And then 0:06:11.160 --> 0:06:14.040 you add in this new one where what does their 0:06:14.120 --> 0:06:16.800 market share look like? What about competition? That is just 0:06:16.839 --> 0:06:20.039 another reason for people to be skeptical. Although analysts so 0:06:20.160 --> 0:06:23.360 far are holding firm and remain pretty positive. 0:06:23.600 --> 0:06:25.800 Yeah, in Vidia shares up thirty two percent over the 0:06:25.839 --> 0:06:28.680 last year, Bloomberg's Ryan Vistellica. Happy Thanksgiving, Ryan, Thanks for 0:06:28.760 --> 0:06:31.880 joining us. Well, let's get more on the wider tech markets. 0:06:31.920 --> 0:06:35.279 Nancy Tangler, CEO and CIO of Laffer Tangler Investment. She 0:06:35.360 --> 0:06:38.680 says there's more room to run for AI stocks, writing quote, 0:06:38.920 --> 0:06:41.279 since we are in the early stages of the AI 0:06:41.320 --> 0:06:45.400 adoption and investment cycle, we believe the providers of the technology, 0:06:45.440 --> 0:06:49.400 the picks and shovels, will continue to produce enviable earnings growth. 0:06:49.720 --> 0:06:53.560 Nancy joins us, Now, what's a more promising pick and 0:06:53.800 --> 0:06:54.359 or shovel? 0:06:54.839 --> 0:06:56.679 Is it alphabet or is it in video? Nancy? 0:06:59.680 --> 0:07:02.520 Thanks, you're having tim You know, I'm actually going to 0:07:02.600 --> 0:07:05.800 go We own them both, and I'm going to go 0:07:05.839 --> 0:07:08.359 with Nvidia. And the reason for that is I think 0:07:08.680 --> 0:07:12.360 analysts are forgetting our investors are not focusing on Kuda, 0:07:12.440 --> 0:07:16.920 which is the software system that developers use around the 0:07:17.520 --> 0:07:21.360 Nvidia chips, Blackwell and then soon to be Reuben and 0:07:21.400 --> 0:07:24.200 I think it's analogous to Apple and the App Store. 0:07:24.240 --> 0:07:27.000 So you know, it was just a handset company when 0:07:27.000 --> 0:07:28.800 we were buying it. I was told that every time 0:07:28.840 --> 0:07:31.120 I talked about it on the air, but it was 0:07:31.160 --> 0:07:33.760 really the app store and services that we were buying, 0:07:33.880 --> 0:07:37.360 and this I think is analogous to that. If they lose, 0:07:37.480 --> 0:07:39.440 you know, if they go from eighty percent to seventy 0:07:39.520 --> 0:07:42.239 nine percent market share, I can live with that because 0:07:42.280 --> 0:07:44.600 I think the earnings growth is going to continue. 0:07:44.680 --> 0:07:46.160 And let'sten forget. 0:07:45.920 --> 0:07:48.840 AMD is in the wings and we also own that 0:07:49.120 --> 0:07:50.720 and Broadcom which. 0:07:50.520 --> 0:07:51.800 Is developing the TPUs. 0:07:51.880 --> 0:07:53.960 So I think there's a lot of ways to make 0:07:54.000 --> 0:07:54.960 money in this trade. 0:07:55.040 --> 0:07:57.120 At what point do we move meond the so called 0:07:57.120 --> 0:07:59.640 picks and shovels of the AI trade and start to 0:07:59.680 --> 0:08:05.320 see the increase in i don't know efficiency, the increase 0:08:05.360 --> 0:08:08.160 in productivity in non technology companies. 0:08:09.960 --> 0:08:12.120 So we listened to the company's tim and let me 0:08:12.160 --> 0:08:14.560 give you one great example. We've talked about it before, 0:08:14.640 --> 0:08:17.440 but Walmart is our poster child of our investing theme, 0:08:17.480 --> 0:08:20.280 which is an old economy company that is pivoted to 0:08:20.280 --> 0:08:22.800 the new technologies and is now going to be listed 0:08:22.800 --> 0:08:25.880 on the NASDAK lets. Remember, so they had six percent 0:08:25.920 --> 0:08:29.080 revenue growth, pretty good for Walmart, but twenty seven percent 0:08:29.120 --> 0:08:32.240 in e commerce That was also interesting to me. But 0:08:32.280 --> 0:08:35.960 what really got my attention was that delivery speeds were 0:08:36.760 --> 0:08:40.640 thirty five percent of digital orders are arriving in under 0:08:40.720 --> 0:08:45.600 three hours. They're also using automation in the fulfillment center, 0:08:45.640 --> 0:08:51.400 so fifty percent of their orders are fulfilled automatically via robot. 0:08:51.760 --> 0:08:54.679 We own the company that did all that for them, Symbotic, 0:08:55.360 --> 0:08:58.240 So that's a second or maybe even third derivative player 0:08:59.080 --> 0:09:00.000 in AI. 0:09:00.200 --> 0:09:02.840 So I think it's broadening out. We're hearing it from 0:09:03.280 --> 0:09:03.920 all across. 0:09:04.000 --> 0:09:07.200 You know, Raytheon talked about how they were utilizing AI 0:09:08.080 --> 0:09:11.680 in order to improve supply supply log. 0:09:11.559 --> 0:09:14.600 Jams that's a stock we own, and TGLR, all of 0:09:14.600 --> 0:09:17.719 these we own there actually, So I think it's important 0:09:17.760 --> 0:09:20.520 to start listening to the companies paying attention to who's 0:09:20.559 --> 0:09:24.280 seeing margin expansion, and we're definitely seeing it at the 0:09:24.280 --> 0:09:25.000 company level. 0:09:25.280 --> 0:09:25.559 Nancy. 0:09:25.559 --> 0:09:27.360 If we were talking a week ago, I think we'd 0:09:27.679 --> 0:09:31.199 have started our conversation focused on the idea of a bubble, 0:09:31.520 --> 0:09:34.960 maybe concerns about CAPEX spending, the handwringing that we saw 0:09:35.160 --> 0:09:38.160 last week over some of these valuations that has seemed 0:09:38.160 --> 0:09:41.920 to receded received just a little bit this week. But 0:09:42.120 --> 0:09:45.440 you've been through multiple cycles and I'm wondering how you 0:09:45.600 --> 0:09:49.320 view the whole AI bubble talk right now, compared to 0:09:49.640 --> 0:09:51.480 let's say, the tech boom of the late nineties and 0:09:51.520 --> 0:09:53.120 bust as well. 0:09:53.320 --> 0:09:53.520 Well. 0:09:53.600 --> 0:09:55.360 I wish I was as clever as ed Yar Danny 0:09:55.360 --> 0:09:57.360 because he coined this phrase too, But I wrote a 0:09:57.360 --> 0:09:58.920 piece called the bubble and Bubble Talk. 0:10:00.160 --> 0:10:02.079 I think it's important to note a couple of things. 0:10:02.120 --> 0:10:05.000 In the nineties, from ninety six to two thousand, the 0:10:05.400 --> 0:10:10.719 growth stocks that whose valuations were skyrocketing were actually experiencing 0:10:10.800 --> 0:10:11.880 contracting earnings. 0:10:11.920 --> 0:10:15.080 We're not seeing that now. Growth. The growth stocks in. 0:10:14.960 --> 0:10:19.360 This particular technological revolution are experiencing about twenty percent growth 0:10:19.360 --> 0:10:24.280 on average. Cap X was also something that was healthy 0:10:24.360 --> 0:10:28.680 and then accelerated through the entire decade. We're just now 0:10:28.720 --> 0:10:30.960 starting to see that ramp up in the last couple 0:10:31.000 --> 0:10:31.640 of years. 0:10:31.720 --> 0:10:33.439 So I think it's important. 0:10:33.520 --> 0:10:36.400 And then these companies have fortress balance sheets and all this. 0:10:37.960 --> 0:10:39.480 I don't want to say I am going to say 0:10:39.480 --> 0:10:43.000 nonsense around Oracle. I think it's important to remember that 0:10:43.640 --> 0:10:45.560 this is a company that's always had a ton of debt. 0:10:45.840 --> 0:10:48.480 Debt to equity was four hundred and twenty seven percent 0:10:48.480 --> 0:10:50.880 at the end of the quarter. That's down from seven 0:10:51.000 --> 0:10:53.560 hundred and eighty percent year over year. This is all 0:10:53.640 --> 0:10:58.480 before they issued the eighteen billion dollars in debt for 0:10:59.440 --> 0:11:03.400 the open Ai data center build out. That this company 0:11:03.520 --> 0:11:07.880 has a history of using debt. But the PPE is 0:11:07.960 --> 0:11:09.959 up one hundred and thirty percent year over year, while 0:11:10.000 --> 0:11:13.320 debt is only up nine So debt to equity will decline. 0:11:13.400 --> 0:11:15.360 So you're not concerned at all about the price of 0:11:15.400 --> 0:11:20.559 five year CDSS for Oracle rising to the highest going 0:11:20.600 --> 0:11:22.720 back to October twenty twenty two. That's not concerning you. 0:11:23.920 --> 0:11:24.200 It is. 0:11:24.280 --> 0:11:25.360 It's a par trade though. 0:11:25.559 --> 0:11:28.560 What concerns me more is the concentration in the market 0:11:28.640 --> 0:11:31.720 around open Ai, and I think that has to sort 0:11:31.760 --> 0:11:34.680 itself out now. Such in a della would tell you 0:11:34.720 --> 0:11:37.120 that data centers are fungible. If we don't use it 0:11:37.160 --> 0:11:39.640 for this, we'll use it for that, and I think 0:11:39.679 --> 0:11:44.000 that's certainly true. But I am concerned about the SPEN. 0:11:44.120 --> 0:11:46.120 I mean, that's a company with a burn rate, right 0:11:46.559 --> 0:11:51.520 open Ai ten billion revenues and trillions and spend. Oracle 0:11:51.559 --> 0:11:55.560 has other businesses they can change shift directions use data 0:11:55.559 --> 0:11:56.720 center for cloud computing. 0:11:57.200 --> 0:11:58.640 I don't like the par trade, but. 0:11:58.640 --> 0:12:00.640 I think we were added to it a couple of 0:12:00.679 --> 0:12:03.240 days ago and I think I think from here we're 0:12:03.240 --> 0:12:07.000 going to be talking about fundamentals instead of it became 0:12:07.040 --> 0:12:10.480 the post, it became the narrative stock for this. 0:12:10.480 --> 0:12:13.240 This bubble is overdone. We're not in a bubble. 0:12:13.360 --> 0:12:15.720 Yeah, those September highs that we saw for Oracle, I 0:12:15.720 --> 0:12:18.680 mean we're done significantly from those, but still up seven 0:12:18.720 --> 0:12:20.160 percent over the last year. 0:12:20.160 --> 0:12:21.679 In about twenty percent so far this year. 0:12:21.720 --> 0:12:24.920 Nancy Tangler of Laffer Tangler Investments always good to see 0:12:24.920 --> 0:12:28.080 you happy Thanksgiving. Well, Uber is going to begin offering 0:12:28.160 --> 0:12:30.559 driver list trips and we ride vehicles around parts of 0:12:30.600 --> 0:12:33.600 Abu Dhabi. The new milestone follows the two companies first 0:12:33.640 --> 0:12:36.480 launching a ride service with safety operators behind the wheel 0:12:36.520 --> 0:12:39.400 almost a year ago. They intend to expand their driver 0:12:39.440 --> 0:12:42.480 list vehicle operating territory at Abu Dhabi and extend their 0:12:42.520 --> 0:12:47.280 partnership to Dubai soon. Well, coming up, holiday shopping season 0:12:47.360 --> 0:12:50.520 is here and with it new online scams. We're going 0:12:50.559 --> 0:12:52.240 to discuss what to look out for it how to 0:12:52.240 --> 0:12:53.280 protect yourself next. 0:12:53.520 --> 0:12:54.680 This is Bloomberg Tech. 0:13:07.040 --> 0:13:09.920 Holiday shopping sales seem to start earlier and earlier, but 0:13:10.000 --> 0:13:12.960 this year's Black Friday and Cyber Monday deals might not 0:13:13.040 --> 0:13:16.360 be a steep. Bloomberg opinion columnist Andrea Felstaid has a 0:13:16.360 --> 0:13:19.520 peace out, and she writes that tariffs will cause retailers 0:13:19.559 --> 0:13:23.040 to offer smaller discounts. In the quest for deals, shoppers 0:13:23.040 --> 0:13:25.400 may be tempted to turn to new websites or click 0:13:25.480 --> 0:13:28.640 ads for deals that turn out to be scams. Teresa 0:13:28.679 --> 0:13:31.680 Payton is former White House CIO and current CEO of 0:13:31.679 --> 0:13:33.760 the cybersecurity firm Forderless Solutions. 0:13:34.120 --> 0:13:36.400 She joins us for more good to have you on 0:13:36.440 --> 0:13:37.040 the program. 0:13:37.160 --> 0:13:39.800 You know, I'm always thinking that we're in this day 0:13:39.840 --> 0:13:42.640 and age where it can easily become victims of fraud 0:13:42.720 --> 0:13:45.400 or victims of scams. But why does it happen with 0:13:45.520 --> 0:13:48.960 increased frequency during heavy shoppy seasons like Black Friday. 0:13:50.080 --> 0:13:52.960 Well, we're all busy and many of us are looking 0:13:53.000 --> 0:13:55.760 for extra deals and extra bargains this year, like you 0:13:55.840 --> 0:14:00.240 mentioned earlier, because of the tariffs, and with that, we're 0:14:00.280 --> 0:14:04.400 getting bombarded on social media with things that look really 0:14:04.440 --> 0:14:06.960 cool and hot, and we want to make sure we 0:14:07.000 --> 0:14:09.920 get the deal, we get it quickly before they run out. 0:14:10.480 --> 0:14:15.199 And don't forget, criminals and fraudsters now have AI as 0:14:15.200 --> 0:14:17.520 a tool at their fingertips, and so it's making it 0:14:17.760 --> 0:14:20.360 very cost effective for them to target you and me 0:14:20.440 --> 0:14:21.640 while we do our holiday shop. 0:14:21.720 --> 0:14:22.800 Okay, so I want to get to what we can 0:14:22.840 --> 0:14:24.800 do to protect ourselves. But before we do that, Teresa, 0:14:24.880 --> 0:14:27.240 how are they using AI to target us? What does 0:14:27.240 --> 0:14:29.000 that look like? And how could that look differently than 0:14:29.040 --> 0:14:30.080 the scams that we're used to. 0:14:30.880 --> 0:14:34.760 Yeah, so they're basically reverse engineering websites that you or 0:14:34.760 --> 0:14:37.640 I might go to, the legitimate websites, and then they're 0:14:37.960 --> 0:14:41.160 doing things like a play on the name and then 0:14:41.200 --> 0:14:46.320 setting up imposter social media accounts and basically jumping. 0:14:46.000 --> 0:14:46.720 Into your feed. 0:14:46.840 --> 0:14:49.520 Then you follow this great deal and then the next 0:14:49.560 --> 0:14:51.920 thing you know, you're buying from a scammer or a 0:14:52.000 --> 0:14:54.480 fraudster and not from the actual website that you think 0:14:54.520 --> 0:14:59.360 you're visiting. They're also spinning up businesses using bots to 0:14:59.400 --> 0:15:02.200 actually give them them sells great reviews. So it all 0:15:02.240 --> 0:15:04.640 looks like it's on the up and up, But just 0:15:04.720 --> 0:15:06.720 a little bit of diligence and a little bit of research, 0:15:06.760 --> 0:15:09.280 you'll be able to figure out and spot the scam 0:15:09.400 --> 0:15:11.280 sites and the fraud sites pretty easily. 0:15:11.360 --> 0:15:14.000 Okay, you mentioned diligence and research. You shared with our 0:15:14.040 --> 0:15:18.120 team reputation checkers for websites. I'd never actually even heard 0:15:18.160 --> 0:15:21.120 of these or used them before. Should these be part 0:15:21.160 --> 0:15:24.000 of our diet when it comes to healthy shopping? 0:15:24.800 --> 0:15:26.840 Yeah, I love the fact that you brought this up 0:15:26.880 --> 0:15:31.280 because I personally use these websites, especially if I'm going 0:15:31.280 --> 0:15:33.720 to a site I've never ordered from before. Even if 0:15:33.760 --> 0:15:35.960 I have a friend or a relative tell me they've 0:15:36.040 --> 0:15:39.840 used a site, so things like scam Advisor, you aurl, Void, 0:15:40.320 --> 0:15:42.920 trust Pilot, and I will post these on my social 0:15:42.960 --> 0:15:46.960 media accounts. These websites will actually tell you how old 0:15:46.960 --> 0:15:50.360 the domain name is. It could be legitimately a brand 0:15:50.400 --> 0:15:53.320 new business, or it might be a scamra frauds, you're 0:15:53.360 --> 0:15:54.720 taking advantage of holidays. 0:15:55.080 --> 0:15:56.119 So it'll also. 0:15:55.880 --> 0:16:00.520 Tell you whether or not security companies or consumers reported 0:16:00.640 --> 0:16:01.840 issues with these sites. 0:16:02.080 --> 0:16:04.520 And of course old school still rules. 0:16:05.000 --> 0:16:07.680 The Better Business Bureau is a great place to check 0:16:07.720 --> 0:16:08.920 on a domain name as well. 0:16:09.040 --> 0:16:12.120 Okay, so I think that for me, at least one 0:16:12.160 --> 0:16:14.760 area that I always think of as a backstop is 0:16:15.360 --> 0:16:18.680 the way I pay. And I'm only using credit cards 0:16:19.040 --> 0:16:21.560 on these websites because I feel like if I have 0:16:21.640 --> 0:16:25.480 an issue then I can just call my credit card 0:16:25.560 --> 0:16:29.080 company and they can protect me. Are people using other 0:16:29.120 --> 0:16:32.160 payment solutions that might not have that same level of protection. 0:16:33.240 --> 0:16:35.160 Yeah, this is the tough part, and I agree with you. 0:16:35.320 --> 0:16:38.960 I only use a credit card when I am shopping online. 0:16:39.040 --> 0:16:42.280 I do not use my debit card. I don't use 0:16:42.360 --> 0:16:46.680 gift cards to shop online. What's happening is a lot 0:16:46.720 --> 0:16:49.840 of these scam sites and fraud sites will say things 0:16:49.920 --> 0:16:54.320 like we only accept Venmo or zell, we only accept 0:16:54.560 --> 0:16:58.800 gift cards, we only accept wire transfers. So they might say, well, 0:16:58.960 --> 0:17:01.360 for this to work, we're international, we have to have 0:17:01.400 --> 0:17:04.960 a wire transfer. These are red flags when a merchant 0:17:05.040 --> 0:17:07.840 tells you they will only accept those form of payment 0:17:07.920 --> 0:17:11.520 and they won't accept credit card. Chances are you're dealing 0:17:11.520 --> 0:17:14.520 with a fraudster because they know the credit card companies 0:17:14.520 --> 0:17:17.399 will actually come after them and shut them down, so 0:17:17.440 --> 0:17:19.600 they want you to use these other forms of payment. 0:17:20.000 --> 0:17:22.520 Other red flags maybe a price is too good to 0:17:22.560 --> 0:17:23.680 be true. 0:17:23.920 --> 0:17:26.920 Yeah, So if you see things like seventy to ninety 0:17:26.920 --> 0:17:31.560 percent off during the holiday season, that is typically a 0:17:31.600 --> 0:17:34.160 red flag. Now, unless you're on sort of a household 0:17:34.280 --> 0:17:38.159 name website that you navigated to on your own, you 0:17:38.200 --> 0:17:40.440 didn't follow a link in social media, you didn't follow 0:17:40.520 --> 0:17:41.959 link in an email or text. 0:17:42.400 --> 0:17:44.640 So if it's too good to be true, also look 0:17:44.640 --> 0:17:47.399 at that domain name. When in doubt. 0:17:47.560 --> 0:17:50.560 There's a website called VirusTotal dot com. You can use 0:17:50.600 --> 0:17:53.639 it for free. Copy and paste that website in there, 0:17:53.840 --> 0:17:56.400 and it'll actually evaluate the URL and tell you whether 0:17:56.480 --> 0:17:58.640 or not you might be dealing with the scam site. 0:17:58.760 --> 0:18:00.840 Okay, Teresa, before we let you go, if you do 0:18:01.000 --> 0:18:05.320 somehow become a victim of not necessarily a cyber attack, 0:18:05.440 --> 0:18:08.680 but maybe an attack on your identity or some sort 0:18:08.720 --> 0:18:10.520 of scam, what should be the first thing you do? 0:18:11.400 --> 0:18:13.440 Yeah, first thing you do is you want to call 0:18:13.480 --> 0:18:16.240 your bank. So whatever payment method you used, you need 0:18:16.280 --> 0:18:18.560 to lock down your life. The next thing to think 0:18:18.560 --> 0:18:21.240 about is actually you can report it at the FBI, 0:18:21.280 --> 0:18:24.639 to IC three dot gov and the FTC FTC dot gov. 0:18:25.080 --> 0:18:28.280 But also there is a nonprofit resource that is free 0:18:28.280 --> 0:18:32.199 to use called the Identity Resource Theft Center. It's a 0:18:32.240 --> 0:18:36.359 great nonprofit. I've referred people there and they will actually 0:18:36.359 --> 0:18:37.320 give you a checklist. 0:18:38.160 --> 0:18:39.639 You can talk to a real human. 0:18:39.359 --> 0:18:41.800 Being and work on getting your peace of mind and 0:18:41.840 --> 0:18:42.879 your identity back. 0:18:43.520 --> 0:18:46.800 Teresa, Payton, CEO of Forder Lists Solutions, thank you so 0:18:46.880 --> 0:18:48.240 much for joining us. 0:18:48.840 --> 0:18:49.359 Coming out, the. 0:18:49.400 --> 0:18:52.320 US face is a potential electricity crisis due to a 0:18:52.400 --> 0:18:55.600 surge in demand to power AI data centers. We've got 0:18:55.600 --> 0:19:12.320 the details. Next, this is Bloomberg Tech. Well, today we 0:19:12.359 --> 0:19:14.560 take a look at America's power system. It was already 0:19:14.600 --> 0:19:18.160 under stress even before the AI boom. Now with AI 0:19:18.280 --> 0:19:21.800 data centers coming online, a new Schneider Electric analysis foresees 0:19:21.840 --> 0:19:25.520 the US facing a potential electricity crisis. This is the 0:19:25.640 --> 0:19:28.800 surgeon demand comes at odds with the reality of aged 0:19:28.840 --> 0:19:33.080 and vulnerable grids. Bloomberg's ESG reporter Alistair Marsh joins us 0:19:33.080 --> 0:19:38.080 from No More. Alistair, how does electricity crisis manifest in 0:19:38.160 --> 0:19:41.440 the United States? Certainly higher bills as part of that, 0:19:41.480 --> 0:19:44.600 but are we talking rolling blackouts here for many Americans? 0:19:46.680 --> 0:19:50.400 Well, essentially, the Schneider Electric data shows that the massive 0:19:50.440 --> 0:19:52.840 amount of power demands to power demand in the US 0:19:52.840 --> 0:19:55.560 has basically been flat for about two decades, and all 0:19:55.600 --> 0:20:00.240 of a sudden with the advent of Aisle, the last 0:20:00.240 --> 0:20:03.399