1
00:00:02,040 --> 00:00:06,880
Speaker 1: Welcome to the solid verbal holl that for me, I'm

2
00:00:06,880 --> 00:00:09,680
Speaker 1: a man, I'm forty. I've heard so many players say, well,

3
00:00:09,720 --> 00:00:11,640
Speaker 1: I want to be happy. You want to be happy

4
00:00:11,640 --> 00:00:16,000
Speaker 1: for Dake Edith Steak. Is that woo woom? And Dan

5
00:00:16,360 --> 00:00:20,560
Speaker 1: and Tye, welcome back to the Calburbo boys and girls.

6
00:00:20,800 --> 00:00:24,760
Speaker 1: My name is ty Hildebranton, joining me as always over

7
00:00:24,800 --> 00:00:28,800
Speaker 1: there in Dan near tropical Chicago, Illinois, the one and

8
00:00:28,840 --> 00:00:32,159
Speaker 1: only frigid Dan Rubinstein, Sir, how are you?

9
00:00:33,000 --> 00:00:36,080
Speaker 2: I'm pretty good, ty I was a few hours ago

10
00:00:36,760 --> 00:00:40,720
Speaker 2: with a shovel digging into or attempting to dig into

11
00:00:40,840 --> 00:00:46,960
Speaker 2: the cold, icy morass of sadness that is the piles

12
00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:51,040
Speaker 2: of rock hard frozen snow that are in front of

13
00:00:51,080 --> 00:00:53,320
Speaker 2: my garage because I needed to get to teach Tye

14
00:00:53,400 --> 00:00:57,160
Speaker 2: TJ Trader Joe's. I needed my vaguely artisanal creative snacks

15
00:00:57,360 --> 00:01:01,120
Speaker 2: that you loathe but probably secretly loved. And I was

16
00:01:01,160 --> 00:01:05,360
Speaker 2: thinking of myself or deep into winter, deep into winter,

17
00:01:05,480 --> 00:01:09,720
Speaker 2: in this blustery, icy Midwestern time of I was gonna say,

18
00:01:09,720 --> 00:01:12,200
Speaker 2: of hours, but there are probably people listening in Tucson

19
00:01:12,319 --> 00:01:15,520
Speaker 2: and La Joia and del Rey or something like that

20
00:01:15,520 --> 00:01:18,240
Speaker 2: that are enjoying themselves plenty, and I'm thinking to myself,

21
00:01:19,560 --> 00:01:22,680
Speaker 2: I can't help but think that certain college football teams

22
00:01:22,680 --> 00:01:25,080
Speaker 2: even feel this way when it's warm out. Yeah, it's

23
00:01:25,080 --> 00:01:28,600
Speaker 2: true that they're just they're taking any possible tool to

24
00:01:28,760 --> 00:01:32,039
Speaker 2: try and jostle, to try and loosen the situation they're

25
00:01:32,040 --> 00:01:35,320
Speaker 2: in to clear a pathway, and no matter what they do,

26
00:01:35,959 --> 00:01:38,720
Speaker 2: they can't seem to make headway. Luckily, I have a

27
00:01:38,720 --> 00:01:40,400
Speaker 2: car with pretty big tires and I chanced it and

28
00:01:40,480 --> 00:01:44,440
Speaker 2: it was fine. But I was thinking to myself, in

29
00:01:44,480 --> 00:01:48,480
Speaker 2: the dead of winter, who finds themselves in this type

30
00:01:48,520 --> 00:01:55,560
Speaker 2: of situation metaphorical situation as it were. And I asked Twitter,

31
00:01:55,760 --> 00:01:58,560
Speaker 2: there are a lot of teams, a lot of teams

32
00:01:58,560 --> 00:02:01,360
Speaker 2: in an icy morass. So I brought the idea to you.

33
00:02:01,760 --> 00:02:03,560
Speaker 2: And I needed to make some dough babies as well,

34
00:02:03,560 --> 00:02:05,880
Speaker 2: because I needed to reverse that type of sad thinking.

35
00:02:06,080 --> 00:02:08,000
Speaker 2: So I did that recently and I got even more

36
00:02:08,080 --> 00:02:10,799
Speaker 2: thinking about the teams we might talk about today. How

37
00:02:10,800 --> 00:02:14,320
Speaker 2: do you get out of this icy the icy douldrums.

38
00:02:14,000 --> 00:02:16,800
Speaker 1: Perma frost. You're talking about permafrost.

39
00:02:16,160 --> 00:02:18,640
Speaker 2: A topic, and permafrost that's what I'm talking And I

40
00:02:18,760 --> 00:02:21,840
Speaker 2: submit the teams to you for your thoughts and for

41
00:02:21,919 --> 00:02:26,160
Speaker 2: our conversation. And here we are ready to and I'm

42
00:02:26,160 --> 00:02:33,240
Speaker 2: going to say, throw some comforting positivity Coco on this frozen.

43
00:02:33,080 --> 00:02:35,320
Speaker 1: Icy soltivity. Coco.

44
00:02:35,560 --> 00:02:39,359
Speaker 2: Continue, Yeah, not just warmth, but delicious warmth, because I

45
00:02:39,680 --> 00:02:41,840
Speaker 2: want to look at these situations in terms of not

46
00:02:42,000 --> 00:02:45,600
Speaker 2: just be problem oriented, but solution oriented. And this is

47
00:02:45,639 --> 00:02:49,440
Speaker 2: where we find ourselves on this very icy, cold, Midwestern

48
00:02:49,440 --> 00:02:50,560
Speaker 2: Monday afternoon.

49
00:02:50,720 --> 00:02:53,280
Speaker 1: Boy, this weather thing for you in Chicago has really

50
00:02:53,280 --> 00:02:55,240
Speaker 1: been an existential experience, hasn't it.

51
00:02:57,200 --> 00:03:00,440
Speaker 2: I get apologies from people I know here, from Jody

52
00:03:00,480 --> 00:03:03,080
Speaker 2: with an I and her friends and family saying it's bad,

53
00:03:03,200 --> 00:03:06,360
Speaker 2: and it's usually bad, but it's not like this, which

54
00:03:06,400 --> 00:03:09,119
Speaker 2: I don't know how to interpret, but it has affected me. Yes,

55
00:03:09,600 --> 00:03:10,440
Speaker 2: just trying to be honest.

56
00:03:10,560 --> 00:03:13,680
Speaker 1: Look, it's cold out there. You're getting a ton of snow.

57
00:03:13,720 --> 00:03:16,680
Speaker 1: We got thirty inches and we got five more on

58
00:03:16,840 --> 00:03:21,880
Speaker 1: Super Bowl Sunday, so it's a long cold winter for

59
00:03:22,000 --> 00:03:25,119
Speaker 1: many of us listening wherever you may be, we wish

60
00:03:25,200 --> 00:03:27,600
Speaker 1: you all the best. We thank you so much for

61
00:03:27,600 --> 00:03:30,680
Speaker 1: giving us your undying support. Don't forget to go on

62
00:03:30,720 --> 00:03:32,919
Speaker 1: out to our website at solidverbal dot com. If you're

63
00:03:32,919 --> 00:03:35,040
Speaker 1: new to the show, if you want to subscribe to

64
00:03:35,120 --> 00:03:40,320
Speaker 1: our content, either via podcast or via the newsletter, you

65
00:03:40,320 --> 00:03:42,960
Speaker 1: can find all the information there. We also do have

66
00:03:43,000 --> 00:03:46,160
Speaker 1: a Patreon which you can find at verballers dot com.

67
00:03:46,320 --> 00:03:49,360
Speaker 1: Took a little bit of a breather throughout the remainder

68
00:03:49,480 --> 00:03:52,839
Speaker 1: of January after the National Championship, but now that we're

69
00:03:52,880 --> 00:03:55,280
Speaker 1: through and into February, we've got all sorts of cool

70
00:03:55,280 --> 00:03:59,560
Speaker 1: stuff planned no pun intended. We've got some off topic

71
00:04:00,640 --> 00:04:03,320
Speaker 1: which has always been in very high demand among the

72
00:04:03,320 --> 00:04:05,840
Speaker 1: most loyal overballers. That is now going to be a

73
00:04:05,880 --> 00:04:09,160
Speaker 1: Patreon only things. So going out to verballers dot com

74
00:04:09,160 --> 00:04:11,840
Speaker 1: if you want more info on what you can expect

75
00:04:11,840 --> 00:04:15,800
Speaker 1: to find, But we do appreciate the support near and far.

76
00:04:16,360 --> 00:04:19,760
Speaker 1: Follow along on social media all the usual hotspots. There's

77
00:04:19,800 --> 00:04:22,080
Speaker 1: a Twitch channel with now. Of course, because of the

78
00:04:22,120 --> 00:04:25,200
Speaker 1: news of the new college football game. At some point,

79
00:04:25,240 --> 00:04:28,000
Speaker 1: presumably in our natural lives, we're going to be streaming

80
00:04:28,000 --> 00:04:30,240
Speaker 1: a little bit more of that NCAA fourteen stuff, just

81
00:04:30,279 --> 00:04:34,599
Speaker 1: to keep the whistle nice and wet. What now, Daniel,

82
00:04:35,400 --> 00:04:41,840
Speaker 1: before we get into that icy permafrost layer of college football? Yeah,

83
00:04:41,880 --> 00:04:44,920
Speaker 1: I don't should I play the breaking news me to why?

84
00:04:45,160 --> 00:04:51,920
Speaker 1: It's a fun sound. But the hell, I'm not yelling.

85
00:04:52,160 --> 00:04:57,719
Speaker 1: I'm just trying to play cool. Okay, still kind of

86
00:04:57,720 --> 00:04:59,720
Speaker 1: getting over my vocal thing. But we've got a Big

87
00:04:59,760 --> 00:05:04,240
Speaker 1: Ten schedule, right. Remember remember this point in time, maybe

88
00:05:04,279 --> 00:05:07,799
Speaker 1: like six months ago, maybe a little longer. I didn't

89
00:05:07,800 --> 00:05:11,240
Speaker 1: do the math. I remember waiting on edge to figure

90
00:05:11,279 --> 00:05:13,559
Speaker 1: out what's the Big Ten gonna do? Now that they've

91
00:05:14,000 --> 00:05:19,320
Speaker 1: plugged the season back in we had an abbreviated Big

92
00:05:19,360 --> 00:05:22,719
Speaker 1: Ten schedule. Conference already. This is a much much different

93
00:05:22,839 --> 00:05:25,960
Speaker 1: dynamic because this is a normal schedule. We've got a

94
00:05:26,000 --> 00:05:29,640
Speaker 1: normal schedule for all the Big Ten teams here. It

95
00:05:29,760 --> 00:05:34,160
Speaker 1: came out any immediate thoughts in looking at some of

96
00:05:34,200 --> 00:05:36,120
Speaker 1: these draws.

97
00:05:36,560 --> 00:05:39,840
Speaker 2: Kind of a spicy non conference light for the Big

98
00:05:39,880 --> 00:05:46,120
Speaker 2: Ten between Washington, Oregon, Auburn, Colorado, Notre Dame for Purdue.

99
00:05:46,240 --> 00:05:51,120
Speaker 2: In addition to Oregon states, there's some Oklahoma and Nebraska matchup,

100
00:05:51,279 --> 00:05:54,279
Speaker 2: so there are some I think what Indiana has, Cincinnati,

101
00:05:54,680 --> 00:05:58,080
Speaker 2: there's some high quality teams, Michigan State, Miami. A lot

102
00:05:58,120 --> 00:06:01,560
Speaker 2: of intrigue, I would say in early to mid September

103
00:06:01,600 --> 00:06:03,800
Speaker 2: and then We've got a Dublin game if I'm reading

104
00:06:03,880 --> 00:06:06,440
Speaker 2: this correctly, between Illinois and Nebraska Week.

105
00:06:06,360 --> 00:06:08,840
Speaker 1: Zero, yep, a natural game to play in Dublin.

106
00:06:08,960 --> 00:06:14,880
Speaker 2: Sure, your classic ALLIONI fans across Ireland will be very

107
00:06:14,880 --> 00:06:15,440
Speaker 2: pumped up.

108
00:06:16,000 --> 00:06:22,239
Speaker 1: Lot you know that Illinois schedule. Yeah, it's not too bad.

109
00:06:23,640 --> 00:06:26,560
Speaker 1: It's not too bad. What about that Illinois roster? Though?

110
00:06:27,000 --> 00:06:30,600
Speaker 1: The Illini roster different story, but its schedules go okay

111
00:06:31,080 --> 00:06:33,039
Speaker 1: as schedules go. I think got an away game against

112
00:06:33,040 --> 00:06:37,480
Speaker 1: Penn State, and of course they're home against Wisconsin in there.

113
00:06:37,520 --> 00:06:40,640
Speaker 1: But in looking over all these schedules, I looked at Illinois,

114
00:06:40,680 --> 00:06:44,239
Speaker 1: I was like, damn this. If Brett Bielima could spin

115
00:06:44,440 --> 00:06:48,400
Speaker 1: some sort of magic in Champagne, it's not an impossible

116
00:06:48,440 --> 00:06:50,320
Speaker 1: schedule to get to that six win mark.

117
00:06:50,960 --> 00:06:53,320
Speaker 2: No, I mean you miss what the Michigan schools in

118
00:06:53,360 --> 00:06:56,400
Speaker 2: Ohio state that's always somewhat of a positive, and they

119
00:06:56,440 --> 00:06:59,520
Speaker 2: miss Indiana. I mean you're talking about that's a losable

120
00:06:59,560 --> 00:07:04,360
Speaker 2: and exceedingly losable game. So sure, a nice soft takeoff

121
00:07:04,440 --> 00:07:08,919
Speaker 2: for the Brett Beila My era for Illinois. Michigan's back

122
00:07:08,960 --> 00:07:13,600
Speaker 2: half of the schedule is pretty dicey, as I think

123
00:07:13,600 --> 00:07:16,480
Speaker 2: we enter into the twilight part of Jim Harbaugh's tenure

124
00:07:16,480 --> 00:07:20,760
Speaker 2: in ann Arbor. It's northwestern Michigan State, Indiana, Penn State, Maryland,

125
00:07:21,520 --> 00:07:23,720
Speaker 2: and Ohio State. At least Ohio states in ann Arbor.

126
00:07:23,800 --> 00:07:27,200
Speaker 2: But it's not an amazing stretch. Ohio State starts off

127
00:07:27,200 --> 00:07:29,920
Speaker 2: with what we assume to be a pretty tough one too,

128
00:07:30,200 --> 00:07:32,640
Speaker 2: with Minnesota Tanna Morgan going to be there to at

129
00:07:32,680 --> 00:07:36,720
Speaker 2: least twenty twenty eight, and Oregon in Columbus returning the

130
00:07:36,720 --> 00:07:39,040
Speaker 2: favor that never was this past year, of course, with

131
00:07:39,520 --> 00:07:41,480
Speaker 2: the Big Ten and Pac twelve not competing in non

132
00:07:41,480 --> 00:07:44,240
Speaker 2: conference games, so we'll see what Oregon looks like. I

133
00:07:44,280 --> 00:07:46,000
Speaker 2: think that defense is going to be pretty interesting for

134
00:07:46,040 --> 00:07:48,480
Speaker 2: the Ducks against a first year quarterback for Ohio State,

135
00:07:49,160 --> 00:07:51,920
Speaker 2: Penn State getting Wisconsin and Auburn in the.

136
00:07:51,800 --> 00:07:55,080
Speaker 1: First two of three weeks. Yeah, I think could be challenging.

137
00:07:55,160 --> 00:07:58,600
Speaker 1: That's going to be tough. I stand by the fact

138
00:07:58,640 --> 00:08:01,440
Speaker 1: that I think Penn State is going to be a

139
00:08:01,480 --> 00:08:05,200
Speaker 1: little bit better off maybe than we'd expect. The quarterback thing,

140
00:08:05,240 --> 00:08:07,840
Speaker 1: to me is a huge unknown at this point. It

141
00:08:07,880 --> 00:08:10,400
Speaker 1: was last year, it's an even bigger deal this year.

142
00:08:10,440 --> 00:08:13,200
Speaker 1: What jumped out about the Penn State schedule to me

143
00:08:14,040 --> 00:08:19,040
Speaker 1: is that it feels like there's adequate buffer. You don't

144
00:08:19,040 --> 00:08:23,720
Speaker 1: have any murderers rose situations on that schedule. You've got

145
00:08:23,720 --> 00:08:26,880
Speaker 1: Wisconsin and then sort of a down week before you've

146
00:08:26,880 --> 00:08:30,360
Speaker 1: got Auburn. Then you've got Villanova before you've got Indiana.

147
00:08:31,000 --> 00:08:35,280
Speaker 1: I guess Iowa after Indiana is maybe the one spot,

148
00:08:35,320 --> 00:08:40,040
Speaker 1: but otherwise Illinois before Ohio State, Maryland before Michigan, Rutgers

149
00:08:40,080 --> 00:08:43,040
Speaker 1: before Michigan State, that's a decent setup for them.

150
00:08:43,559 --> 00:08:46,120
Speaker 2: Sure. I look at the Iowa schedule as well in

151
00:08:46,240 --> 00:08:49,800
Speaker 2: terms of perennially good to very good to excellent teams,

152
00:08:50,120 --> 00:08:53,600
Speaker 2: a category Iowa fits into somewhere. The back half of

153
00:08:53,640 --> 00:08:56,120
Speaker 2: their schedule is at a Wisconsin team who looks like

154
00:08:56,160 --> 00:08:59,920
Speaker 2: they've taken a pretty big step back on offense, Northwestern

155
00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:03,080
Speaker 2: who will be starting a new quarterback, Minnesota at home,

156
00:09:03,200 --> 00:09:06,200
Speaker 2: Illinois at home, Northwestern on the road, and that rivalry

157
00:09:06,240 --> 00:09:12,280
Speaker 2: game missing Michigan, Ohio State, Michigan State. Not that Michigan

158
00:09:12,320 --> 00:09:14,960
Speaker 2: and Michigan State coming off of last year are all

159
00:09:15,000 --> 00:09:17,160
Speaker 2: that dangerous, but you never know. With the year two

160
00:09:17,200 --> 00:09:19,320
Speaker 2: of Mel Tucker and a bounce back year from Jim

161
00:09:19,360 --> 00:09:22,480
Speaker 2: Harbaugh's a that's a nice road. It's tough to open

162
00:09:22,520 --> 00:09:24,960
Speaker 2: with Indiana and Iowa State, and Iowa State's on the

163
00:09:25,000 --> 00:09:29,800
Speaker 2: road for Iowa, but otherwise a pretty nice slate for

164
00:09:29,840 --> 00:09:34,440
Speaker 2: the Hawks. This is a territory we like to own,

165
00:09:34,720 --> 00:09:38,959
Speaker 2: a nice, easy rollout for Iowa football. It's it's kind

166
00:09:38,960 --> 00:09:40,280
Speaker 2: of nice.

167
00:09:40,440 --> 00:09:44,120
Speaker 1: It's not bad. It is really not bad, really not

168
00:09:44,160 --> 00:09:44,760
Speaker 1: bad at all.

169
00:09:45,920 --> 00:09:50,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, Northwestern misses Ohio State, though Michigan and Wisconsin are

170
00:09:50,640 --> 00:09:55,319
Speaker 2: both on the road. They have a tough stretch in there, Michigan, Minnesota, Iowa, Wisconsin.

171
00:09:55,640 --> 00:09:59,080
Speaker 2: If those teams are hitting anywhere near their ceiling, that's

172
00:09:59,120 --> 00:10:01,480
Speaker 2: a tough one for Northway Western working in a new

173
00:10:01,559 --> 00:10:04,960
Speaker 2: quarterback and a new defensive coordinator. Who I mean, the

174
00:10:05,000 --> 00:10:10,320
Speaker 2: produced schedule looks real tricky. Notre Dame, Iowa, Ohio State,

175
00:10:10,320 --> 00:10:14,120
Speaker 2: and Northwestern all on the road. I was I felt

176
00:10:14,120 --> 00:10:15,480
Speaker 2: like I was on an island. And this is where

177
00:10:15,520 --> 00:10:17,160
Speaker 2: I like to pat myself on the back that I

178
00:10:17,240 --> 00:10:23,040
Speaker 2: didn't fully understand the Jeff Brohm adoration during that Louisville flirtation.

179
00:10:24,480 --> 00:10:28,120
Speaker 2: And I think we've reached a point where if they

180
00:10:28,120 --> 00:10:30,480
Speaker 2: don't make a bowl game this year, I don't know

181
00:10:30,520 --> 00:10:32,280
Speaker 2: what his buyout is. I know he's getting paid a

182
00:10:32,280 --> 00:10:34,280
Speaker 2: whole bunch of money, and I don't know how long

183
00:10:34,280 --> 00:10:35,760
Speaker 2: you can pay a coach a lot of money to

184
00:10:35,800 --> 00:10:38,000
Speaker 2: go four and eight and wow, that's.

185
00:10:37,800 --> 00:10:41,480
Speaker 1: Where we're out With't has your Jeff Brom river of

186
00:10:41,600 --> 00:10:43,439
Speaker 1: enthusiasm hit its crest?

187
00:10:44,160 --> 00:10:45,960
Speaker 2: Well, I'm saying I was on an island that I

188
00:10:46,000 --> 00:10:49,880
Speaker 2: wasn't that enthusiastic about Jeff Brom. That a lot of

189
00:10:50,240 --> 00:10:53,840
Speaker 2: a lot of that leverage came from him being from

190
00:10:53,920 --> 00:10:58,040
Speaker 2: Louisville and that job opening up. But I understood that

191
00:10:58,080 --> 00:11:00,520
Speaker 2: things had gotten a little bit interesting, and defense took

192
00:11:00,520 --> 00:11:03,000
Speaker 2: a nice step forward early on in his tenure in

193
00:11:03,040 --> 00:11:07,120
Speaker 2: West Lafayette. But this is me patting myself on the back,

194
00:11:07,160 --> 00:11:09,839
Speaker 2: thinking I may have gotten it right back then. I

195
00:11:09,880 --> 00:11:12,440
Speaker 2: hope it's not the case, but it's tough times there.

196
00:11:12,559 --> 00:11:14,599
Speaker 1: This is the issue for Purdue. Sure, they've got a

197
00:11:14,679 --> 00:11:17,960
Speaker 1: road game against Yukon, but also a road game against

198
00:11:17,960 --> 00:11:23,240
Speaker 1: Notre Dame, against Iowa, against Nebraska, against Ohio State, and

199
00:11:23,280 --> 00:11:25,000
Speaker 1: against Northwestern.

200
00:11:25,360 --> 00:11:27,959
Speaker 2: I mean the clear when you look at Purdue and

201
00:11:28,120 --> 00:11:32,400
Speaker 2: what they do and don't have. Yeah, it's brutal Yukon

202
00:11:32,559 --> 00:11:36,840
Speaker 2: is almost assuredly a win. Illinois there's a good shot

203
00:11:37,200 --> 00:11:39,000
Speaker 2: at it being a win, a good shot because it's

204
00:11:39,000 --> 00:11:43,640
Speaker 2: at home and whatever. And then after that Nebraska is

205
00:11:43,679 --> 00:11:46,200
Speaker 2: on the road, Michigan State's at home. There's a decent

206
00:11:46,240 --> 00:11:52,120
Speaker 2: shot there. But otherwise I guess if Wisconsin continues to

207
00:11:52,160 --> 00:11:54,920
Speaker 2: look kind of underwhelming on offense, there's a shot there.

208
00:11:54,960 --> 00:11:58,760
Speaker 2: But it's a big, big shrug for me. I'm Purdue

209
00:11:58,800 --> 00:12:01,320
Speaker 2: football right now. I have not done a deep dive

210
00:12:01,360 --> 00:12:04,200
Speaker 2: of their roster, their injuries, the position battles, whatever. It's

211
00:12:04,679 --> 00:12:07,839
Speaker 2: again the icy morass of February. I like that word

212
00:12:07,880 --> 00:12:10,400
Speaker 2: a lot today for whatever reason. But this is this

213
00:12:10,520 --> 00:12:14,360
Speaker 2: is tough winter term sledding. You know, it dawned to

214
00:12:14,440 --> 00:12:20,000
Speaker 2: me this sound now that we got Brett Bielama back.

215
00:12:22,000 --> 00:12:25,160
Speaker 2: I just need to chop off the gobble or alan

216
00:12:25,240 --> 00:12:29,600
Speaker 2: erotic unless it's in reference to November, which once again

217
00:12:29,720 --> 00:12:32,160
Speaker 2: is a month filled with turkey gobbles, and we let

218
00:12:32,280 --> 00:12:35,600
Speaker 2: him get his feet under him September October, and then

219
00:12:35,600 --> 00:12:36,880
Speaker 2: this is where Illinois shines.

220
00:12:37,200 --> 00:12:40,400
Speaker 1: So I need a novembert version and then just a

221
00:12:40,480 --> 00:12:42,920
Speaker 1: regular borderline erotic version without the gobble.

222
00:12:44,160 --> 00:12:50,199
Speaker 2: That's correct. You need it October, Yeah, exactly December.

223
00:12:50,840 --> 00:12:54,680
Speaker 1: All right, so not a lot of news, Dan. Shall

224
00:12:54,720 --> 00:12:56,560
Speaker 1: we get into our topic, d jure?

225
00:12:57,200 --> 00:12:59,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, I didn't really enjoy the Super Bowl all that much.

226
00:12:59,520 --> 00:13:02,120
Speaker 1: No, that's the only commercials were the best part of

227
00:13:02,120 --> 00:13:03,520
Speaker 1: the game? Were they good?

228
00:13:03,559 --> 00:13:04,880
Speaker 2: I didn't pay too close attention.

229
00:13:05,320 --> 00:13:07,480
Speaker 1: I enjoyed it is in there. Yeah, there's a.

230
00:13:07,400 --> 00:13:09,240
Speaker 2: Will Farrell one for GM.

231
00:13:09,440 --> 00:13:15,320
Speaker 1: Terrific Beard, terrific Beard. Yeah. Yeah, let's get to our game,

232
00:13:16,720 --> 00:13:24,199
Speaker 1: yours call this. I say, we're talking college football perma frost.

233
00:13:24,600 --> 00:13:27,720
Speaker 1: If you go to Wikipedia, look a little bit more.

234
00:13:27,760 --> 00:13:31,200
Speaker 1: What is perma frost? Dan, Well, I'll tell you it

235
00:13:31,280 --> 00:13:37,040
Speaker 1: is ground that continuously remains below zero degrees celsius thirty

236
00:13:37,040 --> 00:13:42,040
Speaker 1: two fahrenheit for two or more years, located on land

237
00:13:42,840 --> 00:13:47,840
Speaker 1: or under the ocean. So I cannot think of anything

238
00:13:47,880 --> 00:13:51,440
Speaker 1: more fitting to talk about here with relation to the season,

239
00:13:51,480 --> 00:13:54,840
Speaker 1: with relation to the teams that we're going to discuss. Now,

240
00:13:54,880 --> 00:14:01,120
Speaker 1: it should be noted permafrost can thaw. It can thaw.

241
00:14:01,800 --> 00:14:05,959
Speaker 1: Takes extra effort and warmth and cocoa positivity. I mean,

242
00:14:05,960 --> 00:14:09,920
Speaker 1: it takes like global warming. It takes a real event, Okay,

243
00:14:10,000 --> 00:14:13,360
Speaker 1: to thaw out the permafrost. But it can be done.

244
00:14:13,720 --> 00:14:15,000
Speaker 1: And I think we're going to look at some of

245
00:14:15,040 --> 00:14:18,480
Speaker 1: these teams here today, gonna try and evaluate what has

246
00:14:18,760 --> 00:14:22,680
Speaker 1: what has gone wrong? How have these teams sunk into

247
00:14:22,720 --> 00:14:27,600
Speaker 1: these depths, gotten this cold? Have they hit rock bottom?

248
00:14:28,120 --> 00:14:28,360
Speaker 2: M hm?

249
00:14:29,160 --> 00:14:32,680
Speaker 1: Is there any obvious optimism in sight all of these things.

250
00:14:33,760 --> 00:14:39,240
Speaker 1: Let's start with Virginia Tech. Okay, yours call this nice

251
00:14:40,240 --> 00:14:42,880
Speaker 1: Virginia Tech. So I'm looking at Virginia Tech right now

252
00:14:44,480 --> 00:14:48,800
Speaker 1: over the last couple seasons, and of course they've had

253
00:14:48,920 --> 00:14:53,320
Speaker 1: justin Fuente there last four years running. It has certainly

254
00:14:53,400 --> 00:14:56,800
Speaker 1: been a little bit of a case in terms of

255
00:14:56,840 --> 00:15:01,680
Speaker 1: the on field results of diminishing return. Ten and four

256
00:15:01,760 --> 00:15:02,560
Speaker 1: his first year.

257
00:15:03,640 --> 00:15:07,440
Speaker 2: By the way, it's five years now, fiveteen, seventeen, eighteen, nineteen,

258
00:15:07,480 --> 00:15:08,320
Speaker 2: twenty seasons.

259
00:15:08,400 --> 00:15:11,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, oh my gosh, I counted wrunk five years right, yep.

260
00:15:12,320 --> 00:15:14,560
Speaker 1: So ten and four the first year they win the

261
00:15:14,560 --> 00:15:21,240
Speaker 1: Belk Bowl, everyone's all excited about justin Flente. After that, though,

262
00:15:21,840 --> 00:15:25,160
Speaker 1: nine and four, with the loss in the What Camping

263
00:15:25,200 --> 00:15:29,480
Speaker 1: World Bowl to Oklahoma State a year after six and seven,

264
00:15:29,840 --> 00:15:32,000
Speaker 1: if you count the bowl loss in the Military Bowl

265
00:15:32,040 --> 00:15:38,160
Speaker 1: against Cincinnati twenty nineteen eight and five if you count

266
00:15:38,160 --> 00:15:43,640
Speaker 1: the bowl loss in the Belk Bowl against Kentucky, and

267
00:15:43,680 --> 00:15:45,960
Speaker 1: then you know this past season.

268
00:15:45,760 --> 00:15:48,520
Speaker 2: Five and five in the ACC, which is where they've

269
00:15:48,560 --> 00:15:50,440
Speaker 2: been sort of five and three, four and four, and

270
00:15:50,440 --> 00:15:52,600
Speaker 2: so five and five with ten ACC games, you're talking

271
00:15:52,600 --> 00:15:55,040
Speaker 2: about another five hundred seasons, So the equivalent in a

272
00:15:55,080 --> 00:15:57,360
Speaker 2: normal year of another four and four year in the ACC.

273
00:15:57,600 --> 00:15:59,520
Speaker 2: For all all the good that they may do in

274
00:15:59,560 --> 00:16:02,440
Speaker 2: winning game, they bring loss to the table as well.

275
00:16:02,720 --> 00:16:05,240
Speaker 2: And the first season, it should be noted without I

276
00:16:05,280 --> 00:16:09,200
Speaker 2: believe Bud Foster, the transition to Justin Hamilton occurred.

277
00:16:09,040 --> 00:16:11,640
Speaker 1: Correct, So didn't play in the bowl game, like a

278
00:16:11,680 --> 00:16:13,640
Speaker 1: bunch of teams opted out of that Bowl game. But

279
00:16:14,240 --> 00:16:16,320
Speaker 1: you can make a very strong case here that things

280
00:16:16,320 --> 00:16:19,320
Speaker 1: are trending in a bad direction. You brought up something

281
00:16:19,400 --> 00:16:23,160
Speaker 1: interesting on the recruiting front, which all of this stems

282
00:16:23,200 --> 00:16:27,440
Speaker 1: back to recruiting. But if you could for our captive audience,

283
00:16:27,520 --> 00:16:31,520
Speaker 1: dan number of blue chips over the last couple of

284
00:16:31,560 --> 00:16:34,440
Speaker 1: seasons for Virginia Tech relative to some of their peers

285
00:16:34,440 --> 00:16:36,000
Speaker 1: in the ACC, well.

286
00:16:35,840 --> 00:16:38,720
Speaker 2: Just the last five classes have featured five seven to

287
00:16:38,840 --> 00:16:41,640
Speaker 2: seven to one and now zero blue chip players. And

288
00:16:42,240 --> 00:16:45,480
Speaker 2: if Virginia Tech to me, and they're a little bit

289
00:16:45,480 --> 00:16:47,920
Speaker 2: different than some of the other programs on the list

290
00:16:47,920 --> 00:16:50,920
Speaker 2: we're going to discuss. This is all relative to the permafrost,

291
00:16:51,040 --> 00:16:55,240
Speaker 2: because I mean, they've won games, they've been competitive against

292
00:16:55,320 --> 00:16:59,720
Speaker 2: good teams. But in terms of the trajectory, it's getting

293
00:16:59,760 --> 00:17:03,480
Speaker 2: cold and colder. And I think in twenty eighteen when

294
00:17:03,480 --> 00:17:05,919
Speaker 2: the Edmonds brothers both got drafted in the first round,

295
00:17:06,160 --> 00:17:09,320
Speaker 2: there were five hockey players drafted in that draft. In

296
00:17:09,359 --> 00:17:12,280
Speaker 2: the last two years they've been one total. So there's

297
00:17:12,480 --> 00:17:14,720
Speaker 2: a direction that Virginia Tech is heading, so much so

298
00:17:14,880 --> 00:17:17,959
Speaker 2: that Wit Babcock, the ad of the Hokies, had to

299
00:17:18,080 --> 00:17:21,240
Speaker 2: issue a vote of confidence that yes, I've called a

300
00:17:21,240 --> 00:17:24,320
Speaker 2: press conference, but no, it isn't to fire and announce

301
00:17:24,640 --> 00:17:27,400
Speaker 2: that we're letting justin fu when day go, because that's

302
00:17:27,440 --> 00:17:31,199
Speaker 2: where the program looks like it's heading. In terms of

303
00:17:31,720 --> 00:17:33,560
Speaker 2: and this, I think it comes down to vision. I

304
00:17:33,560 --> 00:17:35,760
Speaker 2: think it comes down to the little things, which is

305
00:17:35,920 --> 00:17:38,359
Speaker 2: there are very few head coaches who can sustain a

306
00:17:38,359 --> 00:17:41,720
Speaker 2: pretty high level of success. Virginia Tech is a big

307
00:17:41,760 --> 00:17:45,400
Speaker 2: time program. They are a big time program. And Frank Biemer,

308
00:17:45,560 --> 00:17:54,080
Speaker 2: now in retrospect, we're probably not giving him enough cred respect, whatever.

309
00:17:54,600 --> 00:17:57,760
Speaker 2: And so when you look at the general direction of

310
00:17:57,800 --> 00:18:01,480
Speaker 2: Virginia Tech, I think it comes down toquarterback. Interesting year

311
00:18:01,560 --> 00:18:05,119
Speaker 2: from Jared Gerrod Evans, he leaves after a year to

312
00:18:05,119 --> 00:18:07,760
Speaker 2: go to the NFL. Wanted to get out of Virginia Tech.

313
00:18:07,800 --> 00:18:10,040
Speaker 2: Maybe he believed he was an NFL pick, whatever, he

314
00:18:10,200 --> 00:18:13,239
Speaker 2: was not not an NFL quarterback promising freshman year from

315
00:18:13,280 --> 00:18:17,359
Speaker 2: Josh Jackson, he leaves, Ryan Willis Kansas transfer not the answer.

316
00:18:17,480 --> 00:18:22,320
Speaker 2: Hendon Hooker Promising has injury issues and weird we don't

317
00:18:22,520 --> 00:18:24,920
Speaker 2: find information about him early on in the season why

318
00:18:24,920 --> 00:18:26,960
Speaker 2: he's not playing. It looks like it was an illness.

319
00:18:27,359 --> 00:18:30,919
Speaker 2: And then it's up Braxton Burmeister team Quincy Patterson, a

320
00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:34,320
Speaker 2: Blue Ship quarterback. He's now at North Dakota State for

321
00:18:34,560 --> 00:18:37,920
Speaker 2: somebody who turned Paxton Lynch into a first round draft pick.

322
00:18:38,680 --> 00:18:41,480
Speaker 2: There's something about this Virginia Tech offense. They can't run

323
00:18:41,480 --> 00:18:45,160
Speaker 2: the ball all the sudden. Khail Herbert's amazing, There's no

324
00:18:46,320 --> 00:18:49,440
Speaker 2: there's no solid ground to this offense. And we're talking

325
00:18:49,480 --> 00:18:53,199
Speaker 2: about also, what was a probable top ten in the

326
00:18:53,280 --> 00:18:57,120
Speaker 2: country defense in twenty seventeen that has completely fallen off

327
00:18:57,200 --> 00:19:01,040
Speaker 2: had its moments this year. So there's some combination of

328
00:19:02,040 --> 00:19:09,000
Speaker 2: Justin fo wenteo not connecting with his assistance, not connecting

329
00:19:09,000 --> 00:19:12,640
Speaker 2: with players on his roster, not connecting with recruits, not

330
00:19:12,720 --> 00:19:16,119
Speaker 2: necessarily making Virginia Tech a destination that people want to

331
00:19:16,640 --> 00:19:20,360
Speaker 2: go to and remain at that And I know he's

332
00:19:20,359 --> 00:19:22,720
Speaker 2: got a pretty big buyout, So who knows what the

333
00:19:22,760 --> 00:19:26,199
Speaker 2: future holds for Justin fwente in terms of longevity in

334
00:19:26,240 --> 00:19:29,840
Speaker 2: Blacksburg again, a big time program. No matter what they've

335
00:19:29,880 --> 00:19:31,760
Speaker 2: done year in and year out these past few years,

336
00:19:32,080 --> 00:19:34,280
Speaker 2: this is a team that it's very difficult to talk

337
00:19:34,320 --> 00:19:37,040
Speaker 2: about the teams who have succeeded in the ACC without

338
00:19:37,080 --> 00:19:40,239
Speaker 2: including Virginia Tech, who would recruit three stars and get

339
00:19:40,280 --> 00:19:42,840
Speaker 2: him drafted pretty high, would get them on all ACC

340
00:19:43,000 --> 00:19:47,000
Speaker 2: teams first and second teams, just doesn't exist. That just

341
00:19:47,119 --> 00:19:49,960
Speaker 2: does not exist in Blacksburg right now. And it's hard

342
00:19:50,000 --> 00:19:55,920
Speaker 2: to see Justin Fuente having some sort of revelation and

343
00:19:56,320 --> 00:19:58,639
Speaker 2: nailing a second act at this point. It's hard to

344
00:19:58,680 --> 00:20:02,719
Speaker 2: turn around a program that is now just sort of

345
00:20:02,760 --> 00:20:08,600
Speaker 2: stuck in that five hundred ish area without really threatening

346
00:20:08,640 --> 00:20:12,960
Speaker 2: good teams in the conference. And so I think they're

347
00:20:13,000 --> 00:20:16,560
Speaker 2: stuck as long as he's there, And yeah, I don't.

348
00:20:16,600 --> 00:20:18,600
Speaker 2: I mean to you when you watch Virginia Tech and

349
00:20:18,640 --> 00:20:22,600
Speaker 2: you see Hendon Hooker look electric one week and then

350
00:20:23,080 --> 00:20:27,360
Speaker 2: has like does look fully unprepare the next week, it's

351
00:20:27,400 --> 00:20:30,959
Speaker 2: hard to see growth. It's hard to see course reversal.

352
00:20:31,720 --> 00:20:34,879
Speaker 2: And their ceiling is still a big time program that

353
00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:40,160
Speaker 2: develops underrated players in the Mid Atlantic region and can

354
00:20:40,200 --> 00:20:46,479
Speaker 2: get to fringe New Year six territory. But and I

355
00:20:46,520 --> 00:20:50,000
Speaker 2: still don't. I don't change the ceiling, and I don't

356
00:20:50,119 --> 00:20:52,760
Speaker 2: change my perception of the program overall based on these

357
00:20:52,800 --> 00:20:57,119
Speaker 2: past few years. But it's hard to see, uh, that

358
00:20:57,160 --> 00:20:59,280
Speaker 2: course correction under Fwente it is.

359
00:21:00,400 --> 00:21:07,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm big on trends. When I'm watching a team

360
00:21:08,560 --> 00:21:13,040
Speaker 1: and I think back to the early days of I

361
00:21:13,080 --> 00:21:15,920
Speaker 1: think it was Brian Kelly at Notre team like year

362
00:21:15,960 --> 00:21:19,160
Speaker 1: two or year one. But the bowl game they played,

363
00:21:19,160 --> 00:21:22,639
Speaker 1: the Champs Sports Bowl, I remember against Florida State. That

364
00:21:22,720 --> 00:21:25,400
Speaker 1: was sort of like the apex of the season, and

365
00:21:25,440 --> 00:21:27,680
Speaker 1: they had been building to that point. They were playing

366
00:21:27,760 --> 00:21:33,320
Speaker 1: really well, playing hard. This was not a great football team,

367
00:21:33,320 --> 00:21:35,399
Speaker 1: but it was apparent that they were building and that

368
00:21:35,440 --> 00:21:37,919
Speaker 1: they were getting better, and they were gaining some steam

369
00:21:37,960 --> 00:21:45,160
Speaker 1: in momentum, and that carried through to subsequent seasons. Even

370
00:21:45,200 --> 00:21:47,000
Speaker 1: if it wasn't the best football team, there was at

371
00:21:47,080 --> 00:21:50,800
Speaker 1: least a consistency of effort and to some extent a

372
00:21:50,880 --> 00:21:56,720
Speaker 1: consistency of results. Would you associate Virginia Tech football with

373
00:21:57,440 --> 00:22:01,359
Speaker 1: the word consistent at this point?

374
00:22:01,560 --> 00:22:06,760
Speaker 2: I mean they've been consistently mediocre. They are consistently inconsistent.

375
00:22:07,640 --> 00:22:08,400
Speaker 1: Right, there's.

376
00:22:10,040 --> 00:22:14,560
Speaker 2: If you can't figure out quarterback, and maybe I'm too

377
00:22:14,640 --> 00:22:16,920
Speaker 2: scarred from watching Braxton Burmeister with.

378
00:22:16,960 --> 00:22:20,080
Speaker 1: Orgon they have two scholarship quarterbacks.

379
00:22:20,320 --> 00:22:24,160
Speaker 2: What I'm saying if after five years and Braxton Burmeister,

380
00:22:24,359 --> 00:22:26,040
Speaker 2: he made some plays late in the year, he had

381
00:22:26,040 --> 00:22:29,080
Speaker 2: a good game against Virginia, made plays against Clemson, but

382
00:22:29,480 --> 00:22:31,360
Speaker 2: you know they got blown out by Pitt and Clemson.

383
00:22:31,480 --> 00:22:32,000
Speaker 1: It was ugly.

384
00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:34,119
Speaker 2: I think they gave up ninety plus points and he

385
00:22:34,200 --> 00:22:38,199
Speaker 2: led them to no second half touchdowns? Is that what

386
00:22:38,240 --> 00:22:40,600
Speaker 2: I'm saying against Pitt and Clemson Pitt on the road.

387
00:22:41,280 --> 00:22:45,000
Speaker 2: So in terms of where the program is today in February,

388
00:22:46,440 --> 00:22:49,600
Speaker 2: it's hard to see after five years if you don't

389
00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:58,080
Speaker 2: have a clear answer or interesting battle for quarterback it's

390
00:22:58,080 --> 00:22:59,679
Speaker 2: hard to see this turning out, all right. We like

391
00:22:59,680 --> 00:23:03,119
Speaker 2: to talk about you get one chance to hit the

392
00:23:03,160 --> 00:23:06,240
Speaker 2: reset button. If you're an amazing coach with a ton

393
00:23:06,280 --> 00:23:09,040
Speaker 2: of leverage and goodwill within a program, you might get too.

394
00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:13,000
Speaker 2: I've seen that sort of conversation bandied about different places.

395
00:23:14,680 --> 00:23:18,080
Speaker 2: We're at the point now where there's just a full

396
00:23:18,200 --> 00:23:22,159
Speaker 2: lack of quarterbacks wanting to play for Virginia Tech and

397
00:23:22,240 --> 00:23:26,480
Speaker 2: stay at Virginia Tech and Hooper promising he leaves for Tennessee, right, and.

398
00:23:26,400 --> 00:23:29,040
Speaker 1: So there it is. That's that's the point. That's the

399
00:23:29,880 --> 00:23:30,920
Speaker 1: that's the point.

400
00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:36,080
Speaker 2: It's there seems to be something amiss with player quality

401
00:23:36,160 --> 00:23:38,600
Speaker 2: players and what we saw Caleb Farley opt out, which

402
00:23:38,640 --> 00:23:41,720
Speaker 2: is okay, that's a personal decision dealing with far bigger

403
00:23:41,760 --> 00:23:43,919
Speaker 2: issues than just football this past year. He was a

404
00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:46,479
Speaker 2: bright spot on that defense in the twenty nineteen season.

405
00:23:47,080 --> 00:23:51,160
Speaker 2: But it almost seems like a day to day Virginia

406
00:23:51,280 --> 00:23:55,720
Speaker 2: Tech internal issue that has yet to be dealt with successfully.

407
00:23:55,880 --> 00:23:57,600
Speaker 2: Well just yes, total guess on my part.

408
00:23:57,840 --> 00:24:01,000
Speaker 1: The whole thing watching Virginia Tech week to week kind

409
00:24:01,000 --> 00:24:03,800
Speaker 1: of felt day to day and week to week you

410
00:24:03,880 --> 00:24:06,840
Speaker 1: never really knew what you were going to get. I

411
00:24:06,880 --> 00:24:10,040
Speaker 1: think that there is a talent issue. I don't think

412
00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:13,560
Speaker 1: it's an admiration to look at that number of blue chips,

413
00:24:13,920 --> 00:24:18,600
Speaker 1: see it dwindle. They were tenth in recruiting in the

414
00:24:18,600 --> 00:24:23,480
Speaker 1: ACC this last cycle. I'm not going to act like

415
00:24:23,560 --> 00:24:27,240
Speaker 1: Virginia Tech is some juggernaut into the recruiting game, but

416
00:24:27,240 --> 00:24:30,280
Speaker 1: they should be better than tenth. Tough place to recruit too,

417
00:24:30,320 --> 00:24:32,840
Speaker 1: I understand that, but it's it should be better than tenth.

418
00:24:33,000 --> 00:24:38,080
Speaker 1: And when you see guys outgoing and there are questions

419
00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:40,760
Speaker 1: about the guys incoming, even on the transfer portal, you

420
00:24:40,760 --> 00:24:42,640
Speaker 1: know there were guys that they could have gone out

421
00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:44,920
Speaker 1: and made more of an attempt to bring in that

422
00:24:45,000 --> 00:24:50,240
Speaker 1: they didn't, and over time that adds up. So we

423
00:24:50,240 --> 00:24:52,719
Speaker 1: had a fuente on the show. We loved having them

424
00:24:52,760 --> 00:24:54,199
Speaker 1: on the show. I think we're a little partial to

425
00:24:54,200 --> 00:24:56,920
Speaker 1: guys we've had on the show, but.

426
00:24:57,040 --> 00:24:59,280
Speaker 2: It doesn't mean anything but ultimately do well.

427
00:24:59,320 --> 00:25:01,200
Speaker 1: We talked about the honorable Bump for a while.

428
00:25:01,320 --> 00:25:04,960
Speaker 2: Of course, of course they were I really liked watching

429
00:25:05,160 --> 00:25:08,399
Speaker 2: Evans the JC transfer early on. I thought they were

430
00:25:08,400 --> 00:25:13,040
Speaker 2: buying themselves time to develop. Whoever, and it just didn't happen.

431
00:25:13,320 --> 00:25:17,040
Speaker 2: It didn't happen for them, and we keep we kept herring,

432
00:25:17,359 --> 00:25:20,159
Speaker 2: hearing justin Flante's name come up for jobs, open jobs,

433
00:25:20,200 --> 00:25:23,160
Speaker 2: and then it just sort of dissolved into the ether.

434
00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:25,320
Speaker 2: Was he going to Miami's he going to Florida State?

435
00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:25,920
Speaker 2: He's going here?

436
00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:27,399
Speaker 1: And I don't know.

437
00:25:27,520 --> 00:25:29,919
Speaker 2: Maybe there's a reason for that. Maybe there's that reason

438
00:25:29,920 --> 00:25:33,719
Speaker 2: for that that when people started digging into what's happening

439
00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:35,320
Speaker 2: in Blacks Park, they're like, I think we're good.

440
00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:38,800
Speaker 1: Where should we go next?

441
00:25:40,320 --> 00:25:45,879
Speaker 2: You was call this, I don't know, you tell me time.

442
00:25:45,760 --> 00:25:49,080
Speaker 1: About Arizona, Dan, Let's talk about Arizona. Let's talk about Arizona.

443
00:25:49,119 --> 00:25:54,200
Speaker 2: Who at least there's it's easier to flavor this snow

444
00:25:54,240 --> 00:25:56,360
Speaker 2: melting Coco because there's a new head coach.

445
00:25:56,280 --> 00:26:02,160
Speaker 1: Snow melting Coco, Jetfish, the new head football coach. Let's

446
00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:05,040
Speaker 1: take a look back here at the last I don't

447
00:26:05,080 --> 00:26:09,119
Speaker 1: know ten or so years of Arizona football. Kevin someone

448
00:26:09,240 --> 00:26:15,920
Speaker 1: was there. Didn't go to a bowl. We had rich

449
00:26:16,000 --> 00:26:22,680
Speaker 1: Rod for six seasons, did make the Fiesta Bowl in

450
00:26:22,800 --> 00:26:25,879
Speaker 1: twenty fourteen going ten and four, lost that game, but

451
00:26:26,080 --> 00:26:29,720
Speaker 1: still ten and three season regular season's a pretty big

452
00:26:29,720 --> 00:26:32,640
Speaker 1: deal at Arizona. Beyond that, it was mostly a five

453
00:26:32,720 --> 00:26:36,000
Speaker 1: hundred team under rich Rod. Even if you go back

454
00:26:36,040 --> 00:26:41,359
Speaker 1: to the Stoops era of Arizona football, it sort of

455
00:26:41,560 --> 00:26:43,679
Speaker 1: ended up four and eight, but was mostly like a

456
00:26:43,720 --> 00:26:46,760
Speaker 1: three and eight or five and seven. But they were

457
00:26:46,800 --> 00:26:48,040
Speaker 1: a hard out. A lot of those are.

458
00:26:48,160 --> 00:26:50,480
Speaker 2: They were hard out, even in the down ish or

459
00:26:50,480 --> 00:26:52,560
Speaker 2: the average ish, the four and five and the Pac

460
00:26:52,640 --> 00:26:56,600
Speaker 2: ten twelve, five and four. Arizona was largely a hard

461
00:26:56,640 --> 00:26:59,679
Speaker 2: out because they would put guys on the field like

462
00:27:00,160 --> 00:27:04,400
Speaker 2: Kadeem Carry, like JJ Taylor, like even a new Solomon

463
00:27:04,520 --> 00:27:06,879
Speaker 2: was looked to be a pretty good BJ Danker like

464
00:27:07,200 --> 00:27:09,160
Speaker 2: a year and in yeow Khalil Tate. At the end,

465
00:27:09,600 --> 00:27:12,399
Speaker 2: they had certain weapons that it didn't matter who they

466
00:27:12,440 --> 00:27:15,359
Speaker 2: were playing. They had these gravitational guys running a pretty

467
00:27:15,440 --> 00:27:19,120
Speaker 2: lethal rich Rod offense, and they were a tough out.

468
00:27:19,359 --> 00:27:20,719
Speaker 2: You were going to have to beat them fifty two

469
00:27:20,760 --> 00:27:23,600
Speaker 2: to forty nine at one forty four am to get

470
00:27:23,640 --> 00:27:26,680
Speaker 2: out of Tucson with a win sometimes, and I don't

471
00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:29,800
Speaker 2: know if that's necessarily their season their ceiling, excuse me,

472
00:27:30,440 --> 00:27:34,359
Speaker 2: but they've long been a hard out outside of I

473
00:27:34,400 --> 00:27:36,159
Speaker 2: guess the end of the Stoops the beginning of the

474
00:27:36,240 --> 00:27:39,120
Speaker 2: end of the Stoops era and what it was either

475
00:27:39,119 --> 00:27:41,600
Speaker 2: twenty fifteen or twenty sixteen where Arizona was pretty down

476
00:27:41,680 --> 00:27:44,119
Speaker 2: under rich Rod and then he of course leaves amid

477
00:27:44,440 --> 00:27:50,200
Speaker 2: bigger circumstances internally, but someone hire was kind of a disaster,

478
00:27:50,240 --> 00:27:52,960
Speaker 2: and that culminated with would they lose by seventy to

479
00:27:53,040 --> 00:27:57,480
Speaker 2: ASU this year? Yeah, we should also point out that

480
00:27:58,400 --> 00:28:04,080
Speaker 2: twenty twenty results since circumstances are different in the twenty

481
00:28:04,160 --> 00:28:07,360
Speaker 2: thirteen year, a twenty seventeen or whatever. But the fact

482
00:28:07,440 --> 00:28:11,760
Speaker 2: remains Arizona has a ceiling of a pretty good program

483
00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:15,439
Speaker 2: and are now in your your permafrost zone.

484
00:28:16,040 --> 00:28:18,600
Speaker 1: They're in the perma frost zone. So I guess the

485
00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:22,480
Speaker 1: most obvious place to start is in the recruiting game.

486
00:28:22,520 --> 00:28:24,640
Speaker 1: If we're going to talk about it with Virginia Tech,

487
00:28:25,240 --> 00:28:27,679
Speaker 1: let's talk about it with Arizona. You have to go

488
00:28:27,800 --> 00:28:31,439
Speaker 1: back to twenty seventeen to find the first cycle that

489
00:28:31,560 --> 00:28:36,240
Speaker 1: Arizona isn't ranked eleventh in the PAC twelve in recruiting.

490
00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:39,120
Speaker 1: It has not been a strong couple of years on

491
00:28:39,160 --> 00:28:42,800
Speaker 1: the recruiting front. Why is that, Dan? Why is there

492
00:28:42,840 --> 00:28:46,280
Speaker 1: a reason that athletes wouldn't want to go to Tucson

493
00:28:46,480 --> 00:28:49,680
Speaker 1: as just a destination, totally separate from the fact that

494
00:28:50,200 --> 00:28:52,080
Speaker 1: you know, maybe the scheme doesn't fit what they do

495
00:28:52,160 --> 00:28:54,600
Speaker 1: blah blah blah. But is there is there a knock

496
00:28:54,640 --> 00:28:56,080
Speaker 1: on Tucson as a destination.

497
00:28:57,640 --> 00:28:59,880
Speaker 2: I mean, Tucson's fine. I've been to Tucson. It's war

498
00:29:00,560 --> 00:29:03,840
Speaker 2: It's a school that's into athletics. They've had what national

499
00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:07,640
Speaker 2: champion basketball softball teams shout out was Jenny Finch right,

500
00:29:07,760 --> 00:29:10,520
Speaker 2: that was their incredible pitcher way back when. So it's

501
00:29:10,520 --> 00:29:11,760
Speaker 2: a school that's enthusiastic.

502
00:29:11,800 --> 00:29:12,520
Speaker 1: If you've watched.

503
00:29:12,360 --> 00:29:15,000
Speaker 2: Arizona game against a bigger opponent at home, especially at

504
00:29:15,120 --> 00:29:18,800
Speaker 2: night at stadium, can get rockin. There's enthusiasm for sports.

505
00:29:18,840 --> 00:29:22,560
Speaker 2: It is a basketball school. There is the element of

506
00:29:22,840 --> 00:29:26,640
Speaker 2: LA being the major population zone nearby where there are

507
00:29:26,680 --> 00:29:29,600
Speaker 2: a lot of talented players. Arizona just has a tougher

508
00:29:29,680 --> 00:29:34,200
Speaker 2: task in that they don't have the pick of the

509
00:29:34,200 --> 00:29:37,880
Speaker 2: best players in Southern California ASU right now based on

510
00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:40,640
Speaker 2: just the profile that's been raised by Herm Edwards and

511
00:29:40,680 --> 00:29:43,320
Speaker 2: some of their results big games, and.

512
00:29:44,840 --> 00:29:45,640
Speaker 1: If you're a.

513
00:29:45,520 --> 00:29:47,880
Speaker 2: Top offensive player, you have Chip Kelly, you have a

514
00:29:47,880 --> 00:29:49,920
Speaker 2: good quarterback at USC to throw balls to you or

515
00:29:49,920 --> 00:29:50,720
Speaker 2: hand the ball off to you.

516
00:29:50,720 --> 00:29:51,040
Speaker 1: Whatever.

517
00:29:51,120 --> 00:29:54,719
Speaker 2: Then Oregon's recruiting Southern California. Well, what Arizona needs to

518
00:29:54,760 --> 00:29:59,880
Speaker 2: me is either some sort of mastermind like rich Rod

519
00:30:00,280 --> 00:30:03,480
Speaker 2: where he's going to have such a specific system where

520
00:30:03,480 --> 00:30:06,040
Speaker 2: he can just identify some players who are a little

521
00:30:06,040 --> 00:30:08,880
Speaker 2: bit more raw and mold them to his system. Maybe

522
00:30:08,960 --> 00:30:12,000
Speaker 2: it you know, a new Solomon Khalil Tate, whatever that

523
00:30:12,040 --> 00:30:15,040
Speaker 2: he is. He has such a successful football mind that

524
00:30:15,080 --> 00:30:17,320
Speaker 2: he can make it work. Or it's somebody who can

525
00:30:17,320 --> 00:30:20,640
Speaker 2: come in and tear everything down to the studs, lay

526
00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:23,600
Speaker 2: down a new foundation and say this is what a

527
00:30:23,640 --> 00:30:26,120
Speaker 2: winning culture is. This is this is the type of

528
00:30:26,120 --> 00:30:28,560
Speaker 2: player we're going to bring in. These are the types

529
00:30:28,600 --> 00:30:31,920
Speaker 2: of coaches that I have found across the country to

530
00:30:31,960 --> 00:30:35,200
Speaker 2: come in who have connections to top high schools and

531
00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:40,760
Speaker 2: high school coaches are will feel comfortable having me recruit them. Whatever,

532
00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:45,640
Speaker 2: and Arizona can succeed. Arizona can absolutely be that hard

533
00:30:45,680 --> 00:30:47,600
Speaker 2: out be an eight and four, seven and five, nine

534
00:30:47,600 --> 00:30:50,000
Speaker 2: and three if everything goes well type of program. Once again,

535
00:30:50,680 --> 00:30:54,320
Speaker 2: it's hard for me to see that in Jedfish with

536
00:30:54,560 --> 00:30:59,480
Speaker 2: the lack of program building experience. Rich Rod had that

537
00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:02,840
Speaker 2: obviously having someone had that, but things were trending pretty downward,

538
00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:05,080
Speaker 2: and things were trending downward for rich Rod as well.

539
00:31:05,640 --> 00:31:09,400
Speaker 2: But the hire of Jedfish when the story started coming

540
00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:12,840
Speaker 2: out that that was the president's preference, not the AD's preference,

541
00:31:13,120 --> 00:31:17,040
Speaker 2: and that Brett Brennan enthusiastically allegedly wanted that Arizona job,

542
00:31:17,080 --> 00:31:18,959
Speaker 2: with what he's done at San Jose State being as

543
00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:24,000
Speaker 2: impressive as it was him not getting the job. There

544
00:31:24,040 --> 00:31:28,720
Speaker 2: are certain reasons that programs can stay down, and that

545
00:31:28,880 --> 00:31:31,280
Speaker 2: is the type of decision making at the top stays

546
00:31:31,320 --> 00:31:34,080
Speaker 2: consistently bad. And we're going to get to Kansas, and

547
00:31:34,120 --> 00:31:37,120
Speaker 2: I worry about that with Arizona. I like Jedfish as hires.

548
00:31:37,840 --> 00:31:40,280
Speaker 2: I am curious to see, Like, how do you succeed

549
00:31:40,320 --> 00:31:42,560
Speaker 2: at Arizona. Well, you got to convince talented players to

550
00:31:42,560 --> 00:31:44,600
Speaker 2: come to Tucson. You got to go to Texas a

551
00:31:44,640 --> 00:31:46,880
Speaker 2: little bit. I would if I were Arizona, go to

552
00:31:46,880 --> 00:31:48,640
Speaker 2: the Midwest and see who you know.

553
00:31:48,840 --> 00:31:52,920
Speaker 1: Iowas Rovenstein, sign me up first bust to Tucson.

554
00:31:53,400 --> 00:31:55,239
Speaker 2: Well, here's the thing, what are you selling if you're

555
00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:59,520
Speaker 2: Arizona you're selling warmth. You're selling attractive humans on your

556
00:31:59,560 --> 00:32:02,040
Speaker 2: warm can. So you got to go to cold places

557
00:32:02,040 --> 00:32:05,000
Speaker 2: sometimes and say, you know, it's not the worst idea.

558
00:32:05,160 --> 00:32:09,120
Speaker 2: And I agree with you on the recruiting front. You know,

559
00:32:09,280 --> 00:32:12,600
Speaker 2: just looking at these numbers, it pops off the page

560
00:32:12,600 --> 00:32:15,520
Speaker 2: at you that this is a place where you could

561
00:32:15,680 --> 00:32:20,680
Speaker 2: very easily sell the weather. Like sure, it's easy to

562
00:32:20,680 --> 00:32:23,200
Speaker 2: say now in the dead of winter, but when you're

563
00:32:23,240 --> 00:32:24,719
Speaker 2: in the permafrost, you need something.

564
00:32:24,760 --> 00:32:28,000
Speaker 1: You need some warmth. Arizona's got the warmth, they're clearly

565
00:32:28,040 --> 00:32:30,680
Speaker 1: not selling it. And so I don't know what it

566
00:32:30,720 --> 00:32:34,960
Speaker 1: takes to to invigorate that program with more talent, but

567
00:32:35,000 --> 00:32:37,640
Speaker 1: I think that's where it starts. And you know, I

568
00:32:37,640 --> 00:32:39,479
Speaker 1: think of a guy at James Franklin, like he's not

569
00:32:39,480 --> 00:32:43,480
Speaker 1: going to Arizona, but James Franklin can recruit. You need

570
00:32:43,480 --> 00:32:46,040
Speaker 1: to start with somebody who can recruit the hell out

571
00:32:46,080 --> 00:32:47,360
Speaker 1: of that program.

572
00:32:46,920 --> 00:32:50,040
Speaker 2: And recruit to a vision. Say this is not just

573
00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:52,280
Speaker 2: we're building something special, be a part of things. On

574
00:32:52,320 --> 00:32:53,960
Speaker 2: the ground floor, were like, this is how we're going

575
00:32:54,040 --> 00:32:56,320
Speaker 2: to use you, this is our vision for the program,

576
00:32:56,360 --> 00:32:58,240
Speaker 2: this is the type of defense we're running. This is

577
00:32:58,240 --> 00:33:00,120
Speaker 2: how you're going to be used in this defense. This

578
00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:02,160
Speaker 2: is how we're going to develop you. There needs to

579
00:33:02,160 --> 00:33:05,040
Speaker 2: be a specificity about it. Maybe Jedfish has it. I'm

580
00:33:05,080 --> 00:33:06,960
Speaker 2: hoping he does. That would be incredible if he does.

581
00:33:07,200 --> 00:33:10,280
Speaker 2: But there needs to be a specificity that I don't

582
00:33:10,280 --> 00:33:13,600
Speaker 2: believe Kevin Someone had in twenty eighteen or seventeen or

583
00:33:13,600 --> 00:33:16,640
Speaker 2: whenever he was brought in that you try to grab

584
00:33:16,640 --> 00:33:19,440
Speaker 2: a big name because suddenly he just wants a job

585
00:33:19,480 --> 00:33:21,719
Speaker 2: and you can afford him. That's how you set your

586
00:33:21,760 --> 00:33:24,320
Speaker 2: program back, both in terms of culture, in terms of

587
00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:26,880
Speaker 2: talent level, in terms of recruiting, in terms of reputation.

588
00:33:27,560 --> 00:33:30,680
Speaker 2: Arizona just lost to their arrival by sixty three points. Again,

589
00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:34,600
Speaker 2: it's twenty twenty, but that's a pretty far fall off

590
00:33:34,640 --> 00:33:37,280
Speaker 2: from where Arizona should be. I mean, they won what

591
00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:42,760
Speaker 2: ten games in twenty fourteen. I just Arizona is not

592
00:33:42,800 --> 00:33:45,520
Speaker 2: a hopeless place in the way that places like Vanderbilt

593
00:33:45,520 --> 00:33:49,040
Speaker 2: in Kansas or Rutgers and maybe not anymore, but can be.

594
00:33:49,560 --> 00:33:52,160
Speaker 2: I think Tuson's in a much better place in terms

595
00:33:52,160 --> 00:33:54,520
Speaker 2: of being set up to win. I know they redid

596
00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:59,520
Speaker 2: their facilities relatively recently. I just think it's very tricky.

597
00:34:00,040 --> 00:34:04,960
Speaker 2: And if you hire two guys who are not fits

598
00:34:05,440 --> 00:34:10,080
Speaker 2: in a row, you're talking about maybe a decade of permafrost.

599
00:34:10,120 --> 00:34:13,440
Speaker 1: That's your permafrost. Yeah. Jed Fish, by the way, would

600
00:34:13,440 --> 00:34:18,880
Speaker 1: not pass the Hudson News test. No, he looks a

601
00:34:18,920 --> 00:34:20,759
Speaker 1: lot like the guy who coached me in baseball when

602
00:34:20,760 --> 00:34:22,760
Speaker 1: I was eleven years old. Nice guys.

603
00:34:22,760 --> 00:34:27,800
Speaker 2: The Patriots quarterbacks coach or something so bounced around a lot.

604
00:34:27,880 --> 00:34:31,439
Speaker 1: Yes, the quarterbacks coach for the New England Patriots, and

605
00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:36,680
Speaker 1: was also i think the assistant oc some sort of

606
00:34:36,680 --> 00:34:40,040
Speaker 1: offensive assistant for the Rams right as well, So he's

607
00:34:40,080 --> 00:34:42,879
Speaker 1: got some experience. Like you said, he's bounced around. Could

608
00:34:42,920 --> 00:34:45,920
Speaker 1: be a fine head coach. Definitely doesn't pass the Hudson

609
00:34:45,960 --> 00:34:51,879
Speaker 1: News test and came in under yeah, some awkward circumstances

610
00:34:51,880 --> 00:34:54,640
Speaker 1: where maybe there was a split at the top among

611
00:34:54,680 --> 00:34:57,240
Speaker 1: who they really wanted to lead that program. Right.

612
00:34:58,080 --> 00:35:00,520
Speaker 2: This is, by the way, is from Roger Sherman. Here's

613
00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:03,480
Speaker 2: my stat of the day. Since twenty ten, only thirty

614
00:35:03,520 --> 00:35:06,279
Speaker 2: three NFL quarterbacks have managed to start eight games and

615
00:35:06,280 --> 00:35:09,759
Speaker 2: throw more interceptions than touchdowns. Four of the thirty three

616
00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:13,160
Speaker 2: have had Jedfish as a quarterbacks coach or offensive coordinator

617
00:35:14,760 --> 00:35:18,480
Speaker 2: in six seasons coaching NFL teams, coaching four NFL teams,

618
00:35:18,680 --> 00:35:21,080
Speaker 2: the only Fish quarterback who did not throw more interceptions

619
00:35:21,080 --> 00:35:22,400
Speaker 2: than touchdowns is Jared Goff.

620
00:35:22,600 --> 00:35:24,320
Speaker 1: No, that's brutal.

621
00:35:24,960 --> 00:35:28,440
Speaker 2: That's Matt Hasselback, Chad Henny Blake, Bortles, Goff, Goff, and

622
00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:31,800
Speaker 2: twenty twenty Cam Newton. Now, I'm not going to go

623
00:35:31,840 --> 00:35:34,839
Speaker 2: into those seasons. Everything's not always on a coach. There

624
00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:39,000
Speaker 2: are circumstances beyond a coach's control. But in terms of

625
00:35:39,040 --> 00:35:41,879
Speaker 2: what Arizona may have had available to them, in terms

626
00:35:41,920 --> 00:35:45,680
Speaker 2: of coaches wanting to come to Tucson with a specific vision,

627
00:35:47,400 --> 00:35:51,280
Speaker 2: it's definitely riskier. It definitely seems riskier.

628
00:35:51,880 --> 00:35:52,160
Speaker 1: Yeah.

629
00:35:52,880 --> 00:35:55,960
Speaker 2: Roger Sherman of The Ringer just got engaged.

630
00:35:55,960 --> 00:35:56,959
Speaker 1: Congratulations Roger.

631
00:35:57,000 --> 00:35:58,720
Speaker 2: He did just get We love Roger the best.

632
00:35:58,840 --> 00:36:02,520
Speaker 1: Good dude. All Right, where are we going next? You

633
00:36:02,800 --> 00:36:06,720
Speaker 1: was gone? I might have to keep that sound around

634
00:36:07,239 --> 00:36:08,800
Speaker 1: for a while. Okay, it's beautiful. Do you want to

635
00:36:08,800 --> 00:36:11,560
Speaker 1: talk about Kansas a little bit? Sure?

636
00:36:12,400 --> 00:36:12,680
Speaker 2: Yeah?

637
00:36:12,760 --> 00:36:15,160
Speaker 1: Okay. So one of the bullets here we jotted down

638
00:36:15,160 --> 00:36:19,560
Speaker 1: in our shared doc was has the team hit rock bottom?

639
00:36:19,920 --> 00:36:23,080
Speaker 1: If they haven't, they're kind of bobbing along the bottom.

640
00:36:23,280 --> 00:36:26,600
Speaker 1: It's hard to get worse. They kind of playing Texas.

641
00:36:26,600 --> 00:36:29,960
Speaker 1: They seem to do pretty well against Texas. Sometimes it's

642
00:36:29,960 --> 00:36:33,120
Speaker 1: hard to do worse. It really is hard to do

643
00:36:33,200 --> 00:36:37,000
Speaker 1: worse what we've seen at Kansas. Just to recap over

644
00:36:37,040 --> 00:36:40,399
Speaker 1: the last let's go back to the Weiss era, all right,

645
00:36:40,480 --> 00:36:43,839
Speaker 1: twenty twelve, one and eleven, three and nine, three and

646
00:36:43,960 --> 00:36:47,840
Speaker 1: nine oh and twelve, two and ten, one and eleven,

647
00:36:48,160 --> 00:36:52,279
Speaker 1: three and nine, three and nine oh and nine. In

648
00:36:52,360 --> 00:36:54,879
Speaker 1: twenty twenty, you got to go back to the Mark

649
00:36:54,960 --> 00:36:59,600
Speaker 1: Mangino era of Kansas football when they went to the

650
00:36:59,600 --> 00:37:03,680
Speaker 1: Orange Bowl. You remember that season, twelve and one walling

651
00:37:03,760 --> 00:37:08,239
Speaker 1: the Orange Bowls, big deal. But outside of that, you

652
00:37:08,280 --> 00:37:11,560
Speaker 1: are not going to find any double digit wins going

653
00:37:11,960 --> 00:37:16,600
Speaker 1: way back, way way back in Kansas football, way way

654
00:37:16,600 --> 00:37:19,120
Speaker 1: back in Kansas football. I'm scrolling up here on Wikipedia.

655
00:37:19,800 --> 00:37:22,480
Speaker 1: I've got a ten in one season in nineteen oh

656
00:37:22,520 --> 00:37:27,919
Speaker 1: five under Bert Kennedy. But otherwise there's a couple nine

657
00:37:27,960 --> 00:37:31,480
Speaker 1: win seasons in there. It's a it's a basketball.

658
00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:34,360
Speaker 2: School, right, yeah, I mean, at least it used to be.

659
00:37:34,400 --> 00:37:36,719
Speaker 2: Are they still got a basketball there?

660
00:37:36,760 --> 00:37:39,520
Speaker 1: I don't think they're that good this year, okay, But

661
00:37:40,239 --> 00:37:43,919
Speaker 1: nonetheless this is not a football program that is rich

662
00:37:44,000 --> 00:37:47,920
Speaker 1: with any tradition. They tried to go the root of

663
00:37:48,000 --> 00:37:51,840
Speaker 1: some splash hires with like a Charlie Weiss trying it

664
00:37:51,880 --> 00:37:58,200
Speaker 1: again now with a less Miles. Yeah. I was okay

665
00:37:58,200 --> 00:38:01,640
Speaker 1: with the less Miles higher mm hmmm. I think the

666
00:38:01,719 --> 00:38:04,520
Speaker 1: logic was that they got so bad under David Baty

667
00:38:05,600 --> 00:38:08,880
Speaker 1: that bringing someone in with a lot of enthusiasm like

668
00:38:08,960 --> 00:38:13,560
Speaker 1: less Miles might be enough to energize the program. I

669
00:38:13,560 --> 00:38:18,400
Speaker 1: don't know if I was right about that. Dan in Spurts, yes,

670
00:38:18,440 --> 00:38:22,759
Speaker 1: can they get up for games, yes, Texas sure. But

671
00:38:23,160 --> 00:38:27,200
Speaker 1: in terms of building any kind of lasting success, I

672
00:38:27,239 --> 00:38:30,520
Speaker 1: think you're on the money about like what you said

673
00:38:30,520 --> 00:38:34,040
Speaker 1: with Arizona, you need a guy who's either a creative

674
00:38:34,040 --> 00:38:36,560
Speaker 1: genius or somebody who can come in and recruit to

675
00:38:36,640 --> 00:38:41,279
Speaker 1: a very very specific play in Otherwise, I don't know

676
00:38:41,280 --> 00:38:41,799
Speaker 1: how you do it.

677
00:38:42,440 --> 00:38:47,080
Speaker 2: You have to get lucky. At this point with Kansas

678
00:38:47,640 --> 00:38:51,160
Speaker 2: there seems to be and Jeff Long went way back

679
00:38:51,239 --> 00:38:53,960
Speaker 2: with with less Miles and hired less Miles. Jeff Long

680
00:38:54,040 --> 00:38:57,560
Speaker 2: came over to Lawrence. He was the ad at Arkansas.

681
00:38:57,760 --> 00:39:00,319
Speaker 2: Less Miles just hired Mike to Board to be new

682
00:39:00,320 --> 00:39:05,000
Speaker 2: offensive coordinator who has had stretches of interesting offenses, improve

683
00:39:05,080 --> 00:39:07,600
Speaker 2: things a little bit in Indiana, but like is not

684
00:39:08,520 --> 00:39:12,040
Speaker 2: is in his sixties, You're not reinvigorating things with Mike Debord.

685
00:39:12,160 --> 00:39:14,240
Speaker 2: Maybe if you, if all the talent is in place,

686
00:39:14,280 --> 00:39:17,560
Speaker 2: you can have a pretty decent offense. But there is

687
00:39:17,600 --> 00:39:20,960
Speaker 2: an element at this point with how Kansas is hired.

688
00:39:21,360 --> 00:39:24,080
Speaker 2: With the reputation Kansas has just in terms on the

689
00:39:24,120 --> 00:39:27,279
Speaker 2: recruiting trail, with the recent results when you look at

690
00:39:27,320 --> 00:39:30,680
Speaker 2: recent scoreboards, there has to be an element of self

691
00:39:30,680 --> 00:39:33,800
Speaker 2: sabotage internally. There has to be an element. Remember the

692
00:39:33,840 --> 00:39:39,320
Speaker 2: episode of The Office where Michael Scott he alfredo pasta

693
00:39:39,920 --> 00:39:45,640
Speaker 2: before running a five k to carbload, like that's there's

694
00:39:45,680 --> 00:39:50,560
Speaker 2: something about the Kansas athletic department and football program that

695
00:39:50,640 --> 00:39:54,440
Speaker 2: there is. You're starting out with alfredo sauce in your gut.

696
00:39:54,960 --> 00:39:58,040
Speaker 2: Oh no, and so they have to get lucky now.

697
00:39:58,080 --> 00:40:01,719
Speaker 2: They tried to go outside with hiring Turner Gill way

698
00:40:01,719 --> 00:40:05,160
Speaker 2: back when, and that obviously didn't work out. But there

699
00:40:05,200 --> 00:40:08,840
Speaker 2: has to be an element with Kansas football of we

700
00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:14,239
Speaker 2: are a blank program, we are a blitz, like crazy

701
00:40:14,719 --> 00:40:18,800
Speaker 2: take chances on defense recruiting this specific type of player.

702
00:40:18,800 --> 00:40:21,320
Speaker 2: We're just going to recruit a bunch of the fastest

703
00:40:21,360 --> 00:40:25,000
Speaker 2: three star safeties we can possibly find in the lower

704
00:40:25,080 --> 00:40:28,640
Speaker 2: planes in Southwest whatever, who want to play immediately. And

705
00:40:28,719 --> 00:40:31,040
Speaker 2: this is what we are. We are an option team.

706
00:40:31,040 --> 00:40:32,719
Speaker 2: You don't have to be an option team. We are

707
00:40:32,840 --> 00:40:35,279
Speaker 2: a spread team with this type of quarterback and he's

708
00:40:35,280 --> 00:40:38,799
Speaker 2: going to play early. But before you can go out

709
00:40:38,800 --> 00:40:41,600
Speaker 2: and even find a coach, there has to be an

710
00:40:41,640 --> 00:40:46,480
Speaker 2: element of we cannot find a retread and that's what

711
00:40:46,520 --> 00:40:49,200
Speaker 2: they've messed up doing with Charlie Weiss and Les Miles.

712
00:40:49,320 --> 00:40:51,239
Speaker 2: You know, David Beatty was okay. He's a hungry, younger

713
00:40:51,280 --> 00:40:53,360
Speaker 2: player with a good reputation, recruited well for Texas A

714
00:40:53,440 --> 00:40:56,640
Speaker 2: and m didn't work out. There has to be an

715
00:40:56,680 --> 00:41:01,160
Speaker 2: element of going out spending money. And what do we

716
00:41:01,200 --> 00:41:05,000
Speaker 2: see with Baylor as they were down and out obviously

717
00:41:05,040 --> 00:41:07,799
Speaker 2: with everything that happened, and rightfully so, and they go

718
00:41:07,880 --> 00:41:09,680
Speaker 2: and they hire Matt Rule. They pay him a ton

719
00:41:09,719 --> 00:41:12,520
Speaker 2: of money and he has complete autonomy. He had taken

720
00:41:12,560 --> 00:41:14,600
Speaker 2: a program that you know, Tap Temple was actually in

721
00:41:14,600 --> 00:41:16,840
Speaker 2: a pretty decent place. Al Golden was pretty good whatever.

722
00:41:17,160 --> 00:41:20,960
Speaker 2: But Temple was in a pretty good place and he

723
00:41:21,080 --> 00:41:23,319
Speaker 2: got them to New Heights. He was able to go

724
00:41:23,360 --> 00:41:27,000
Speaker 2: to a place that has certain limitations and maximize the

725
00:41:27,400 --> 00:41:28,360
Speaker 2: abilities there.

726
00:41:28,840 --> 00:41:29,600
Speaker 1: Kansas has to.

727
00:41:29,560 --> 00:41:32,440
Speaker 2: Go out and find you know, if it's Lance Leopold,

728
00:41:32,440 --> 00:41:36,879
Speaker 2: whoever that says here is a seven year deal, We're

729
00:41:36,880 --> 00:41:38,680
Speaker 2: not even going to talk to you for the first

730
00:41:38,719 --> 00:41:42,319
Speaker 2: three years. Here is a great assistant pool. These are

731
00:41:42,360 --> 00:41:47,280
Speaker 2: the facilities upgrades you asked for, and that coach needs

732
00:41:47,320 --> 00:41:52,319
Speaker 2: to have that specific vision that is uninterrupted by management.

733
00:41:53,080 --> 00:41:56,800
Speaker 2: And short of that, Kansas is going to be mired

734
00:41:57,360 --> 00:42:00,799
Speaker 2: in this not even mediocrity, but that per Frost. And

735
00:42:00,880 --> 00:42:04,040
Speaker 2: so this is not a program with as you mentioned,

736
00:42:04,080 --> 00:42:06,160
Speaker 2: this is not a program with a winning reputation of

737
00:42:06,239 --> 00:42:08,040
Speaker 2: winning history. You go back to, you know, the Mark

738
00:42:08,120 --> 00:42:10,600
Speaker 2: Man Juno years were pretty good until they weren't. But

739
00:42:10,719 --> 00:42:12,919
Speaker 2: Todd Reesing was pretty good. They've had players that they've

740
00:42:12,960 --> 00:42:16,359
Speaker 2: developed into NFL players have gone on to transfer other

741
00:42:16,440 --> 00:42:18,640
Speaker 2: places to finish their development to get to the NFL.

742
00:42:19,080 --> 00:42:25,440
Speaker 2: But it's not impossible. It's not impossible. But it means patience,

743
00:42:25,840 --> 00:42:30,600
Speaker 2: it means identity, and it means kind of the if

744
00:42:30,719 --> 00:42:33,600
Speaker 2: all of my instincts are wrong, then the opposite must

745
00:42:33,640 --> 00:42:37,279
Speaker 2: be right. And so if Jeff Long's instinct is I'm

746
00:42:37,280 --> 00:42:40,080
Speaker 2: gonna hire Less Miles who bombed out allegedly an interview

747
00:42:40,120 --> 00:42:43,520
Speaker 2: with Houston and hope for the best with him, Yay,

748
00:42:43,560 --> 00:42:51,080
Speaker 2: he's vegan, now, okay, cool? But also you want somebody

749
00:42:51,080 --> 00:42:55,080
Speaker 2: who's so hungry that they have binders full of their

750
00:42:55,160 --> 00:42:57,719
Speaker 2: plan as to what they're do when they're finally a

751
00:42:57,760 --> 00:43:00,400
Speaker 2: head coach at a Power five school and are just

752
00:43:00,440 --> 00:43:04,040
Speaker 2: going to go balls to the wall. That's not Less Miles.

753
00:43:04,920 --> 00:43:06,640
Speaker 2: That's just not Less Miles.

754
00:43:06,840 --> 00:43:07,200
Speaker 1: And so.

755
00:43:09,000 --> 00:43:12,120
Speaker 2: It's fine that he's a funny dude and dyes his

756
00:43:12,120 --> 00:43:14,840
Speaker 2: hair and is good in front of a microphone, whatever,

757
00:43:15,800 --> 00:43:20,360
Speaker 2: But Kansas needs to try at least five times harder

758
00:43:20,400 --> 00:43:23,239
Speaker 2: than everybody else to convince a good coach to come

759
00:43:23,239 --> 00:43:25,440
Speaker 2: to Kansas. And it's going to be money and it's

760
00:43:25,440 --> 00:43:27,799
Speaker 2: going to be autonomy, and anything short of that it's

761
00:43:27,840 --> 00:43:29,120
Speaker 2: just another two and ten season.

762
00:43:29,960 --> 00:43:31,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, there is a little bit of a Wizard of

763
00:43:32,000 --> 00:43:35,839
Speaker 1: Oz quality to bringing in Less Miles, isn't there. It's

764
00:43:35,880 --> 00:43:40,759
Speaker 1: great to have the funny man who everyone likes and

765
00:43:41,120 --> 00:43:44,080
Speaker 1: can relate to and likes to talk about in the

766
00:43:44,080 --> 00:43:47,359
Speaker 1: Twitter sphere, but at some point you got to produce Dan,

767
00:43:48,880 --> 00:43:51,000
Speaker 1: And it just doesn't feel like this thing's headed in

768
00:43:51,000 --> 00:43:54,680
Speaker 1: the right direction. It hasn't been for a while. And

769
00:43:56,000 --> 00:43:58,680
Speaker 1: I recall I think it was our friend Stu Mandel

770
00:43:58,960 --> 00:44:02,359
Speaker 1: when they hired less Miles. He's very skeptical of the move,

771
00:44:02,600 --> 00:44:05,960
Speaker 1: very skeptical of the move, but acknowledged like, hey, if

772
00:44:05,960 --> 00:44:08,040
Speaker 1: he can get a little bit of momentum going, and

773
00:44:08,160 --> 00:44:11,440
Speaker 1: he's got a personality that maybe could turn people onto

774
00:44:11,440 --> 00:44:16,359
Speaker 1: the program and build some enthusiasm. Everyone acknowledged right from

775
00:44:16,440 --> 00:44:19,759
Speaker 1: day one that it was a transitional hire that he

776
00:44:19,840 --> 00:44:24,000
Speaker 1: was hoping to, you know, maybe breed the next great

777
00:44:24,080 --> 00:44:30,880
Speaker 1: coach who could step in and fulfill that Kansas destiny. Dan, Well,

778
00:44:30,920 --> 00:44:32,120
Speaker 1: here's the thing happened.

779
00:44:32,719 --> 00:44:35,560
Speaker 2: The Kansas administration also needs to decide because we saw

780
00:44:35,600 --> 00:44:39,960
Speaker 2: stories recently of should Kansas be a football school? Should

781
00:44:40,000 --> 00:44:43,800
Speaker 2: Kansas field a football team? Where if you're going to

782
00:44:43,880 --> 00:44:46,040
Speaker 2: pay somebody four or five million dollars to be a

783
00:44:46,080 --> 00:44:52,239
Speaker 2: head coach, you can't be less Miles. Like the investment

784
00:44:52,320 --> 00:44:56,720
Speaker 2: needs to be there, not just monetarily, but belief, trust,

785
00:44:56,800 --> 00:45:00,840
Speaker 2: vision kind of thing that if you are not all

786
00:45:00,840 --> 00:45:05,799
Speaker 2: in on football. That's cool, totally good, but don't throw

787
00:45:05,920 --> 00:45:09,000
Speaker 2: five million dollars into a furnace. Don't throw four million

788
00:45:09,040 --> 00:45:11,640
Speaker 2: dollars into a furnace. It's irresponsible and it can be

789
00:45:11,760 --> 00:45:15,880
Speaker 2: used in better ways. So that Kansas decision needs to

790
00:45:15,880 --> 00:45:19,600
Speaker 2: be made. And it just doesn't seem that like when

791
00:45:19,600 --> 00:45:21,839
Speaker 2: you hire less Miles, you don't hire somebody with a vision,

792
00:45:21,880 --> 00:45:24,279
Speaker 2: You don't hire somebody with a certain degree of hunger.

793
00:45:24,320 --> 00:45:25,839
Speaker 2: You hire somebody who wants to be a head coach.

794
00:45:25,920 --> 00:45:26,319
Speaker 1: That's it.

795
00:45:27,320 --> 00:45:30,879
Speaker 2: And so I'm not looking at Kansas as impossible. I'm

796
00:45:30,920 --> 00:45:33,640
Speaker 2: looking at Kansas as you.

797
00:45:33,640 --> 00:45:36,840
Speaker 1: Really, really really really.

798
00:45:36,520 --> 00:45:41,760
Speaker 2: Need to have every tool available to you to burn

799
00:45:41,840 --> 00:45:46,120
Speaker 2: this thing down and start over. And anything short of

800
00:45:46,120 --> 00:45:48,360
Speaker 2: that is just not and I'm talking. I mean, what

801
00:45:48,440 --> 00:45:51,759
Speaker 2: is the Kansas football ceiling. If Kansas, instead of hiring

802
00:45:51,880 --> 00:45:54,760
Speaker 2: less Miles, they went out and hired Matt Ruhle somehow,

803
00:45:54,880 --> 00:45:58,040
Speaker 2: or they hired you know, Sean Lewis at Kent State,

804
00:45:58,120 --> 00:46:01,080
Speaker 2: or they hired somebody who has done a really interesting job,

805
00:46:01,120 --> 00:46:04,480
Speaker 2: a younger guy. Whatever, what's Kansas's ceiling as a program

806
00:46:04,560 --> 00:46:07,759
Speaker 2: over you know, three years, they should be able to

807
00:46:07,760 --> 00:46:09,080
Speaker 2: make a bowling.

808
00:46:09,640 --> 00:46:11,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's I think that's my point. That's the

809
00:46:11,680 --> 00:46:14,120
Speaker 1: great irony in this. Kansas has been really bad, right,

810
00:46:14,120 --> 00:46:16,840
Speaker 1: They're they're plumbing the depths of college football in the

811
00:46:16,840 --> 00:46:22,840
Speaker 1: Big Twelve. But is it really impossible to get a

812
00:46:22,880 --> 00:46:25,200
Speaker 1: little bit of momentum and find yourself middle of the

813
00:46:25,200 --> 00:46:31,680
Speaker 1: pack in the Big Twelve? Kansas have hired Chris Climbing. Yeah,

814
00:46:31,680 --> 00:46:34,440
Speaker 1: I was thinking of that too. It's it's very gettable,

815
00:46:35,280 --> 00:46:40,759
Speaker 1: that nice, meaty middle portion of the Big Twelve. Not

816
00:46:40,880 --> 00:46:43,759
Speaker 1: hard to rise it to that level. So you know,

817
00:46:43,800 --> 00:46:46,800
Speaker 1: they're in this awkward spot now where they're clearly not

818
00:46:46,960 --> 00:46:51,239
Speaker 1: building a program. But if they find the right guy,

819
00:46:51,880 --> 00:46:53,600
Speaker 1: I think in a matter of a couple of years,

820
00:46:53,600 --> 00:46:55,560
Speaker 1: could they find themselves in that middle of a pack.

821
00:46:55,600 --> 00:46:58,280
Speaker 1: I'm Nott's say they're going to contend, but if you're Kansas,

822
00:46:58,360 --> 00:47:00,760
Speaker 1: you'll take middle of a pack any day of the week.

823
00:47:01,160 --> 00:47:03,719
Speaker 1: Of course, I think it's totally doable. But I don't

824
00:47:03,719 --> 00:47:06,520
Speaker 1: think Les Miles is the guy. I was enthusiastic about

825
00:47:06,560 --> 00:47:09,799
Speaker 1: the hire on day one, Not so much not at

826
00:47:09,800 --> 00:47:11,080
Speaker 1: this point. I know better now.

827
00:47:12,080 --> 00:47:14,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, And what it also is going to be is

828
00:47:14,960 --> 00:47:17,840
Speaker 2: hiring somebody not just with I mean, doesn't have to

829
00:47:17,880 --> 00:47:19,600
Speaker 2: be a Power five track record, doesn't have to be

830
00:47:19,600 --> 00:47:22,160
Speaker 2: a head coaching track record, but it has to be

831
00:47:22,320 --> 00:47:26,160
Speaker 2: somebody with a force of personality to go with that

832
00:47:26,400 --> 00:47:30,000
Speaker 2: organizational and cultural vision. It has to be that person

833
00:47:30,040 --> 00:47:32,680
Speaker 2: who is going to say, this is how we practice

834
00:47:32,719 --> 00:47:34,399
Speaker 2: on day one, this is how we practice on day two,

835
00:47:34,440 --> 00:47:36,399
Speaker 2: this is how we recruit. Here is our messaging. Here

836
00:47:36,480 --> 00:47:40,680
Speaker 2: is you know somebody who has that three do better

837
00:47:40,719 --> 00:47:44,920
Speaker 2: corporate jargon? For me, ty that holistic three sixty thinking.

838
00:47:44,760 --> 00:47:49,400
Speaker 1: Right, right, he's got thirty thousand foot view, has the

839
00:47:49,440 --> 00:47:51,640
Speaker 1: whole thing figured out from soup to nuts, you know

840
00:47:51,680 --> 00:47:52,399
Speaker 1: it right.

841
00:47:52,480 --> 00:47:56,879
Speaker 2: But that's not necessarily how athletic directors. Athletic directors think,

842
00:47:56,880 --> 00:47:59,319
Speaker 2: and maybe that's why search firms get involved, because they

843
00:47:59,320 --> 00:48:02,480
Speaker 2: have to go to athletic directors and say, yeah, don't

844
00:48:02,560 --> 00:48:05,319
Speaker 2: hire Will mus Champ to be a head coach. It's

845
00:48:05,400 --> 00:48:08,200
Speaker 2: it's not necessarily clear that he's learned from his mistakes

846
00:48:08,239 --> 00:48:11,960
Speaker 2: things like that, and so it's a it's a tough ask.

847
00:48:12,320 --> 00:48:13,640
Speaker 2: I mean, if you're a coach, why would you go

848
00:48:13,680 --> 00:48:15,759
Speaker 2: to Kansas? If you're Chris Climban, why would you go

849
00:48:15,800 --> 00:48:18,480
Speaker 2: to Kansas When Kansas State operationally is in a much

850
00:48:18,520 --> 00:48:19,080
Speaker 2: better place.

851
00:48:19,360 --> 00:48:19,839
Speaker 1: I get that.

852
00:48:20,360 --> 00:48:22,320
Speaker 2: The answer is, you have to pay him seven million dollars.

853
00:48:22,440 --> 00:48:24,399
Speaker 2: You have to give him a seven million, seven year

854
00:48:24,440 --> 00:48:29,040
Speaker 2: contracts something like that, right, And it's it's going to

855
00:48:29,120 --> 00:48:32,120
Speaker 2: take a big swing, and less miles was not a

856
00:48:32,120 --> 00:48:32,640
Speaker 2: big swing.

857
00:48:33,840 --> 00:48:37,000
Speaker 1: Why don't we do one more team? Sure, we do

858
00:48:37,040 --> 00:48:39,560
Speaker 1: one more team and then rapid fire. How's that?

859
00:48:39,560 --> 00:48:40,560
Speaker 2: That's great, let's do it.

860
00:48:41,840 --> 00:48:49,200
Speaker 1: You was cool? South Carolina, Dan, South Carolina speaking of

861
00:48:49,239 --> 00:48:56,000
Speaker 1: Will must Champ. Will must Champ relieved of duties after

862
00:48:56,080 --> 00:48:59,840
Speaker 1: the twenty twenty season. I guess during the twenty twenty s,

863
00:49:00,400 --> 00:49:06,719
Speaker 1: right it look this, this was always a very curious hire. Right.

864
00:49:07,040 --> 00:49:10,359
Speaker 1: And there was a nine win season in year two

865
00:49:10,400 --> 00:49:13,800
Speaker 1: of mush Champ at South Carolina where we started writing

866
00:49:13,840 --> 00:49:16,640
Speaker 1: and reading stories about how he had learned from his

867
00:49:16,719 --> 00:49:21,879
Speaker 1: past experience, and over the course of time, I just

868
00:49:22,080 --> 00:49:26,120
Speaker 1: I think that just kind of lost steam. It lost steam. Well,

869
00:49:26,200 --> 00:49:30,960
Speaker 1: mush Champ reverted back to the mean, and what we

870
00:49:31,040 --> 00:49:35,879
Speaker 1: got instead was sort of a bowl eligible ish run

871
00:49:35,920 --> 00:49:38,120
Speaker 1: of things here six and seven, year one, nine, four

872
00:49:38,200 --> 00:49:42,000
Speaker 1: year two, seven and six, four and eight, two and

873
00:49:42,040 --> 00:49:46,720
Speaker 1: eight in twenty twenty, in the awkward season. Now. You know, look,

874
00:49:46,800 --> 00:49:49,640
Speaker 1: this is this is Will mush Champ stepping into a

875
00:49:49,719 --> 00:49:54,719
Speaker 1: spot that had been long occupied by Steve Spurrier, so

876
00:49:54,800 --> 00:49:58,800
Speaker 1: big shoes to fill. Right, Look, South Carolina finds itself

877
00:49:58,800 --> 00:50:02,440
Speaker 1: in the spot now with Shane Beemer. They were just

878
00:50:02,680 --> 00:50:06,239
Speaker 1: kind of treading water under wolmush Camp. And I guess

879
00:50:06,239 --> 00:50:07,759
Speaker 1: the question is where do they go from here? I

880
00:50:07,760 --> 00:50:09,879
Speaker 1: don't feel like this is as big of a thaw

881
00:50:10,000 --> 00:50:12,640
Speaker 1: job as some of the other schools, certainly not as

882
00:50:12,640 --> 00:50:15,520
Speaker 1: big as the likes of a Kansas right.

883
00:50:15,680 --> 00:50:18,000
Speaker 2: Oh, of course, yeah, It's all relative though, because of

884
00:50:18,040 --> 00:50:20,719
Speaker 2: where South Carolina and we could talk about Tennessee, we

885
00:50:20,719 --> 00:50:22,879
Speaker 2: could talk about Michigan. Obviously, Kansas is in a much

886
00:50:22,920 --> 00:50:25,480
Speaker 2: worse place. Arizona in a much worse place than a

887
00:50:25,520 --> 00:50:32,400
Speaker 2: school like South Carolina or Michigan. But also, South Carolina

888
00:50:32,440 --> 00:50:36,479
Speaker 2: is not a powerhouse program. They got I'm not saying

889
00:50:36,560 --> 00:50:38,440
Speaker 2: they got lucky with Steve Spurrier because they were just

890
00:50:38,480 --> 00:50:41,080
Speaker 2: flat out really good with Steve Spurrier, but they timing wise,

891
00:50:41,120 --> 00:50:44,640
Speaker 2: they got quite lucky that Steve Spurrier was available, and

892
00:50:44,680 --> 00:50:46,799
Speaker 2: that Steve Spurrier wanted to hang around in Columbia for

893
00:50:46,840 --> 00:50:51,239
Speaker 2: a decade. That's amazing to have that sort of personality,

894
00:50:51,560 --> 00:50:54,640
Speaker 2: that sort of legendary coach who wanted to come to

895
00:50:54,680 --> 00:50:59,120
Speaker 2: your school. Lou Holtz did not work out South Carolina. No,

896
00:50:59,320 --> 00:51:03,040
Speaker 2: he went five and seven twice Brad Scott that ended

897
00:51:03,080 --> 00:51:05,719
Speaker 2: in disaster. You know, you're just this is not a

898
00:51:05,960 --> 00:51:10,480
Speaker 2: power program. But South Carolina does need that element because

899
00:51:10,520 --> 00:51:11,960
Speaker 2: they're not far from talent.

900
00:51:12,440 --> 00:51:12,719
Speaker 1: They are.

901
00:51:12,800 --> 00:51:15,800
Speaker 2: They happen to be a far less sexy school in

902
00:51:15,840 --> 00:51:18,959
Speaker 2: their own state of those two Power five programs. That's

903
00:51:19,000 --> 00:51:22,200
Speaker 2: a setback if you're in the Atlanta metro area, if

904
00:51:22,200 --> 00:51:25,480
Speaker 2: you're in the Charlotte metro area, there's talent available to

905
00:51:26,640 --> 00:51:29,320
Speaker 2: come to Columbia South Carolina. But what are you pointing

906
00:51:29,320 --> 00:51:32,960
Speaker 2: to recently with Will must champion with the game Cocks.

907
00:51:33,000 --> 00:51:35,440
Speaker 2: You're pointing to one year the offense is interesting, but

908
00:51:35,520 --> 00:51:37,560
Speaker 2: the defense is a nightmare. The next year the defense

909
00:51:37,640 --> 00:51:39,560
Speaker 2: is interesting, with the offense is a nightmare, and they're

910
00:51:39,560 --> 00:51:42,720
Speaker 2: dealing with quarterback injuries, and they'll have an interesting player

911
00:51:42,760 --> 00:51:45,560
Speaker 2: like Deebo Samuel, But it feels like a blip. How

912
00:51:45,600 --> 00:51:48,120
Speaker 2: long ago does Deebo Samuel feel like he was in Colombia.

913
00:51:49,320 --> 00:51:50,719
Speaker 2: It feels like a minute and it's been.

914
00:51:50,640 --> 00:51:51,400
Speaker 1: Like a year and a half.

915
00:51:51,640 --> 00:51:58,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, So I am confident that South Carolina has an

916
00:51:58,000 --> 00:52:02,319
Speaker 2: interesting ceiling. But I'm also confident that it's getting more

917
00:52:02,320 --> 00:52:07,080
Speaker 2: and more difficult, because if you are a good player

918
00:52:07,440 --> 00:52:10,800
Speaker 2: who is of SEC caliber, you're going to go to Georgia, Florida, Clemson.

919
00:52:11,200 --> 00:52:13,400
Speaker 2: You're going to go to a school that's in that

920
00:52:13,480 --> 00:52:16,280
Speaker 2: state or that's in that division and have a better

921
00:52:16,400 --> 00:52:21,080
Speaker 2: chance of maximizing your potential. I look at how Shane

922
00:52:21,080 --> 00:52:24,880
Speaker 2: Biemer retained Mike Bobo and immediately had him hired away

923
00:52:25,880 --> 00:52:28,880
Speaker 2: as not the best sign. Now I don't love Mike Bobo.

924
00:52:28,920 --> 00:52:32,680
Speaker 2: He's fine, He's had some success, but there is an

925
00:52:32,760 --> 00:52:36,319
Speaker 2: element of a new coach coming in and reacting to

926
00:52:36,360 --> 00:52:39,920
Speaker 2: his hires with a wow, Oh I really this is

927
00:52:39,920 --> 00:52:44,200
Speaker 2: an interesting staff. This is a wow good pull that

928
00:52:44,360 --> 00:52:47,759
Speaker 2: tells me the coach can recruit both in terms of

929
00:52:47,760 --> 00:52:50,960
Speaker 2: assistant coaches and on the trail the high school, the

930
00:52:50,960 --> 00:52:55,640
Speaker 2: transfer portal to JC. So everything I've heard about Shane

931
00:52:55,680 --> 00:52:59,120
Speaker 2: Biemer is interesting, But South Carolina is also on kind

932
00:52:59,160 --> 00:53:05,080
Speaker 2: of a weird treadmill between Vanderbilt and the Power schools.

933
00:53:05,840 --> 00:53:08,560
Speaker 2: Then you know they don't have the reputation historically as Tennessee.

934
00:53:08,920 --> 00:53:11,040
Speaker 2: They haven't put together a unit as good as recent

935
00:53:11,160 --> 00:53:15,960
Speaker 2: Kentucky defenses. Like what are you selling modern South Carolina

936
00:53:16,040 --> 00:53:22,040
Speaker 2: football on? It's a difficult question to answer. And so

937
00:53:22,040 --> 00:53:25,160
Speaker 2: South Carolina right now in terms of permafrost, they need

938
00:53:25,160 --> 00:53:28,359
Speaker 2: to find a quarterback, they need to find a very

939
00:53:28,400 --> 00:53:34,319
Speaker 2: specific on field vision, and they need to recruit like crazy.

940
00:53:35,000 --> 00:53:37,319
Speaker 2: They need to pull in state guys like they were

941
00:53:37,320 --> 00:53:40,839
Speaker 2: doing with Spurrier, with Lattimore, with Clowney guys like that.

942
00:53:40,880 --> 00:53:43,720
Speaker 2: Easier said than done given the superpowers in the area,

943
00:53:44,360 --> 00:53:47,680
Speaker 2: but recruiting has to be priority one, two, and three,

944
00:53:47,800 --> 00:53:51,120
Speaker 2: and there has to be an almost unparalleled culture built

945
00:53:51,120 --> 00:53:54,279
Speaker 2: in Columbia. Is that is very different than what Will

946
00:53:54,320 --> 00:53:58,200
Speaker 2: must Champ had there because the ugliness of the end

947
00:53:58,200 --> 00:54:02,000
Speaker 2: of the muss Champ era can ever be seen again.

948
00:54:03,280 --> 00:54:06,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was not a good way to close out

949
00:54:07,200 --> 00:54:08,040
Speaker 1: for wilmush No.

950
00:54:08,280 --> 00:54:12,280
Speaker 2: And the disappointing thing is they'd bring in this recruit

951
00:54:12,360 --> 00:54:13,960
Speaker 2: or that recruit and then they would feel the top

952
00:54:14,000 --> 00:54:16,560
Speaker 2: thirty defense like I mentioned, but then the offense would

953
00:54:16,600 --> 00:54:19,640
Speaker 2: be a nightmare or they would have an interesting offense

954
00:54:19,640 --> 00:54:23,120
Speaker 2: and the defense would get gashed on the ground like

955
00:54:23,160 --> 00:54:26,799
Speaker 2: we've seen the last couple of years, and it has

956
00:54:26,880 --> 00:54:29,359
Speaker 2: to be I mean, if the Shane Biemer thing works out,

957
00:54:29,840 --> 00:54:33,279
Speaker 2: it's going to work out because he hires amazing assistance

958
00:54:33,840 --> 00:54:39,400
Speaker 2: and puts together Probably he'll need a top seventeen to

959
00:54:39,440 --> 00:54:43,800
Speaker 2: eighteen class annually to get this program anywhere near seven

960
00:54:43,840 --> 00:54:48,560
Speaker 2: and five, eight and four on a consistent basis, right,

961
00:54:49,480 --> 00:54:51,600
Speaker 2: I mean, are you It's hard to know. Shane Beemer

962
00:54:51,719 --> 00:54:56,120
Speaker 2: is not somebody who has called amazing offenses or defense.

963
00:54:56,160 --> 00:54:58,560
Speaker 2: He's been a special teams coordinator and seems well regarded

964
00:54:58,560 --> 00:55:01,440
Speaker 2: as a human, which is a great first step. They

965
00:55:01,480 --> 00:55:04,120
Speaker 2: made the higher relatively quickly because of his history in

966
00:55:04,120 --> 00:55:08,319
Speaker 2: Columbia whatever. But yeah, that's South Carolina treadmill where you're

967
00:55:08,360 --> 00:55:10,720
Speaker 2: never going to recruit as well as at least two teams,

968
00:55:10,719 --> 00:55:13,200
Speaker 2: maybe even three teams. Considering what Tennessee has been able

969
00:55:13,239 --> 00:55:15,399
Speaker 2: to do on the trail, You're never gonna be able

970
00:55:15,400 --> 00:55:18,000
Speaker 2: to recruit as well as them. And maybe I'm wrong.

971
00:55:18,120 --> 00:55:19,960
Speaker 2: I'm always open to that. I'm wrong all the time.

972
00:55:20,280 --> 00:55:23,520
Speaker 2: But that's that's that first challenge. And then the second

973
00:55:23,600 --> 00:55:27,719
Speaker 2: challenge is how do you keep people there? How do

974
00:55:27,760 --> 00:55:31,279
Speaker 2: you keep assistance? Like, what is the assistant pool going

975
00:55:31,320 --> 00:55:33,920
Speaker 2: to look like? If all of a sudden, an offensive

976
00:55:33,960 --> 00:55:36,480
Speaker 2: coordinator defensive coordinator pops and they put together a top

977
00:55:36,520 --> 00:55:40,120
Speaker 2: ten twelve unit. What kind of commitment to South Carolina

978
00:55:40,200 --> 00:55:44,640
Speaker 2: have because it's not necessarily seen as a coordinator destination

979
00:55:44,800 --> 00:55:46,239
Speaker 2: like some other schools in that area are.

980
00:55:46,920 --> 00:55:51,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, and look, they've done okay on the recruiting trail.

981
00:55:51,080 --> 00:55:53,840
Speaker 1: You know, they're about middle of the pack in the SEC,

982
00:55:54,000 --> 00:55:55,759
Speaker 1: and in given year they've been middle of the pack

983
00:55:55,840 --> 00:55:59,600
Speaker 1: this year, not as much this year dead last, but right,

984
00:55:59,680 --> 00:56:03,719
Speaker 1: you know, I think we consider the extenuating circumstances and

985
00:56:03,719 --> 00:56:06,680
Speaker 1: maybe take it with a grain of salt, But the

986
00:56:06,719 --> 00:56:11,120
Speaker 1: SEC is just so flush with talent that you got

987
00:56:11,120 --> 00:56:13,920
Speaker 1: to compete on that level, got to reel some of

988
00:56:13,960 --> 00:56:17,200
Speaker 1: these four and five stars in. And to your point,

989
00:56:17,239 --> 00:56:20,279
Speaker 1: you got to have coaches who can build towards a

990
00:56:20,320 --> 00:56:25,480
Speaker 1: vision and who can build some momentum, you know, build

991
00:56:25,480 --> 00:56:28,480
Speaker 1: the system, build this thing so that it hits critical

992
00:56:28,520 --> 00:56:32,680
Speaker 1: mass and recruits to itself. Well, mushhamp was certainly not

993
00:56:32,760 --> 00:56:33,440
Speaker 1: able to do that.

994
00:56:34,440 --> 00:56:37,279
Speaker 2: I'm at least happy that they didn't go in that

995
00:56:37,360 --> 00:56:42,120
Speaker 2: direction twice in a row where they didn't say, okay,

996
00:56:42,520 --> 00:56:46,160
Speaker 2: Will Muschamp didn't work out, We're going to hold off

997
00:56:46,200 --> 00:56:48,440
Speaker 2: and see if Gus Maleson still has a job, and

998
00:56:48,480 --> 00:56:51,040
Speaker 2: we're going to grab him if he doesn't. That's again

999
00:56:51,080 --> 00:56:52,799
Speaker 2: one of those things that can set a program. Gus

1000
00:56:52,800 --> 00:56:58,320
Speaker 2: Malson very good coach, but situationally, is Gus Malson hungry

1001
00:56:58,520 --> 00:57:01,719
Speaker 2: to build up South Carolina at this moment probably not,

1002
00:57:02,160 --> 00:57:04,040
Speaker 2: probably not wanted to make it work with Auburn.

1003
00:57:04,080 --> 00:57:05,320
Speaker 1: I like the Shane Beemer higher.

1004
00:57:06,200 --> 00:57:08,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it's it's good, not necessarily to go

1005
00:57:08,600 --> 00:57:12,719
Speaker 2: you know, hothead to a known nicer guy, or to

1006
00:57:12,800 --> 00:57:15,240
Speaker 2: go defense and then offense whatever. I think that's dumb.

1007
00:57:15,320 --> 00:57:17,360
Speaker 2: You just got to go to the best possible guy

1008
00:57:17,400 --> 00:57:18,800
Speaker 2: you can find. That's Shane Beemer.

1009
00:57:18,840 --> 00:57:19,280
Speaker 1: That's great.

1010
00:57:19,800 --> 00:57:24,480
Speaker 2: But going double retread is just always going to fail.

1011
00:57:25,040 --> 00:57:28,720
Speaker 1: To me, it's just always going to fail. All Right,

1012
00:57:28,760 --> 00:57:30,080
Speaker 1: We're at about an hour here.

1013
00:57:30,040 --> 00:57:33,680
Speaker 2: Dan, Okay, do you want to hit a couple rapid fire.

1014
00:57:33,560 --> 00:57:40,080
Speaker 1: To rapid fire? Yours go this Syracuse? Dan? Where are

1015
00:57:40,120 --> 00:57:43,960
Speaker 1: we at with Syracuse? Syracuse won ten games two years ago,

1016
00:57:44,080 --> 00:57:47,880
Speaker 1: went one and ten this year yeah, five and seven,

1017
00:57:47,880 --> 00:57:50,920
Speaker 1: in between four and four, four and eight. Excuse me.

1018
00:57:50,960 --> 00:57:54,800
Speaker 1: The first two years of Dino Babers, Scott Schaeffer Arrow

1019
00:57:54,920 --> 00:57:59,960
Speaker 1: is a mess. Doug Barone was okay, Ryan Assam is fine.

1020
00:57:59,800 --> 00:58:03,640
Speaker 1: One two pinch Stripe Bulls pretty good. You got to

1021
00:58:03,680 --> 00:58:06,480
Speaker 1: go back to the nineties to find the last time

1022
00:58:06,520 --> 00:58:07,640
Speaker 1: that Syracuse was.

1023
00:58:08,440 --> 00:58:09,520
Speaker 2: Paul past Slone.

1024
00:58:09,960 --> 00:58:12,400
Speaker 1: That was Paul Pascaloney, that was Donovan McNab.

1025
00:58:13,240 --> 00:58:18,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, so that was Big East too as the conference.

1026
00:58:18,440 --> 00:58:22,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, Syracuse is in my view, a much much much

1027
00:58:22,920 --> 00:58:25,680
Speaker 1: much much much much much much much much colder version

1028
00:58:26,680 --> 00:58:30,760
Speaker 1: of Arizona with a sprinkle of Kansas and that it's

1029
00:58:30,760 --> 00:58:33,720
Speaker 1: a basketball school. You need a coach with that vision.

1030
00:58:33,800 --> 00:58:35,560
Speaker 1: And I thought Dino Babers was that guy.

1031
00:58:35,960 --> 00:58:40,080
Speaker 2: I think I I kind of still like Dino Babers

1032
00:58:40,360 --> 00:58:43,200
Speaker 2: me too. I think Dino Babers is a pretty good

1033
00:58:43,280 --> 00:58:47,160
Speaker 2: coach who found himself in a situation in Syracuse. Now what,

1034
00:58:47,280 --> 00:58:49,240
Speaker 2: he's at Eastern Illinois for two years, then he's at

1035
00:58:49,240 --> 00:58:51,880
Speaker 2: Bowling Green for two years. Bowling Green not an easy

1036
00:58:51,880 --> 00:58:54,600
Speaker 2: place to win, although they've had some pretty good coach

1037
00:58:54,640 --> 00:58:58,760
Speaker 2: but Urban Meyer was there way back when, but he

1038
00:58:58,920 --> 00:59:02,160
Speaker 2: didn't hang out at either of those places long enough

1039
00:59:02,200 --> 00:59:06,840
Speaker 2: to sustain success. And Syracuse is it's a tough job.

1040
00:59:06,880 --> 00:59:09,040
Speaker 2: You mentioned the basketball school, it's in a dome. It's

1041
00:59:09,160 --> 00:59:12,680
Speaker 2: I think Syracuse is alarmingly closer to ann Arbor than

1042
00:59:12,720 --> 00:59:16,040
Speaker 2: it is to Miami, just in terms of the conference

1043
00:59:16,080 --> 00:59:19,720
Speaker 2: affiliation and recruiting to play ACC football. I don't know.

1044
00:59:19,760 --> 00:59:22,439
Speaker 2: It just there's there's a sense to me that high

1045
00:59:22,440 --> 00:59:25,240
Speaker 2: three stars in that area are much more likely to

1046
00:59:25,280 --> 00:59:29,280
Speaker 2: go to Indiana or Purdue or Penn State, you know what. Like,

1047
00:59:29,280 --> 00:59:32,280
Speaker 2: It's just there's not much to choose from in Is

1048
00:59:32,320 --> 00:59:34,360
Speaker 2: it Western or Central New York? I always forget. I

1049
00:59:34,360 --> 00:59:39,040
Speaker 2: think it's Central New York. It's but north central, north central.

1050
00:59:39,080 --> 00:59:39,400
Speaker 1: Okay.

1051
00:59:39,760 --> 00:59:42,440
Speaker 2: I don't blame Dino Baber's for taking that job because

1052
00:59:42,440 --> 00:59:44,720
Speaker 2: he had been an assistant for so so, so long.

1053
00:59:45,160 --> 00:59:47,080
Speaker 2: And when you have that opportunity to coach at power

1054
00:59:47,120 --> 00:59:49,520
Speaker 2: five school, you jump on it because you see where

1055
00:59:49,520 --> 00:59:54,320
Speaker 2: it can lead. Now, Syracuse has that geographic disadvantage with recruiting,

1056
00:59:54,760 --> 00:59:57,920
Speaker 2: It has that disadvantage of your taking on teams in

1057
00:59:57,960 --> 01:00:00,360
Speaker 2: your conference that are in It's night and day in

1058
01:00:00,440 --> 01:00:04,240
Speaker 2: terms of location. I don't know, it's you have to

1059
01:00:04,280 --> 01:00:06,680
Speaker 2: get so lucky, you have to get Duke's point guards,

1060
01:00:06,800 --> 01:00:11,000
Speaker 2: run your offense or something wild like that, and he

1061
01:00:11,080 --> 01:00:14,040
Speaker 2: may have just missed his window. Dino Babers to make

1062
01:00:14,080 --> 01:00:16,760
Speaker 2: a leap after that ten and three season. The thing

1063
01:00:16,800 --> 01:00:19,400
Speaker 2: I like about Dino Babers is everybody seems to respond

1064
01:00:19,440 --> 01:00:23,640
Speaker 2: to him pretty well personally. He's made good coordinator hires,

1065
01:00:24,160 --> 01:00:26,360
Speaker 2: not always. I don't love Sterling Gilbert, but I like

1066
01:00:26,400 --> 01:00:29,000
Speaker 2: Tony White from San Diego State, and I like what

1067
01:00:29,520 --> 01:00:31,680
Speaker 2: Sean Lewis did there was I think his first two

1068
01:00:31,760 --> 01:00:34,600
Speaker 2: years Dino Baber's first two years in north central New York.

1069
01:00:35,200 --> 01:00:38,439
Speaker 2: So the Syracuse job is going to be difficult, and

1070
01:00:38,920 --> 01:00:42,960
Speaker 2: I still like Dino Babers, but it's another one of

1071
01:00:43,000 --> 01:00:49,160
Speaker 2: those places that the specificity and vision, even if they're amazing,

1072
01:00:50,080 --> 01:00:53,520
Speaker 2: the talent availability is always going to be such a

1073
01:00:53,840 --> 01:00:58,320
Speaker 2: tough mountain to climb. It might be one of those

1074
01:00:58,880 --> 01:01:01,480
Speaker 2: lightning in a bottle, get your grungy Eric Dungee, random

1075
01:01:01,520 --> 01:01:06,080
Speaker 2: talented quarterback from Portland, Oregon. And if you're not able

1076
01:01:06,080 --> 01:01:08,040
Speaker 2: to get lightning in a bottle, if you're not able

1077
01:01:08,080 --> 01:01:10,800
Speaker 2: to get a couple of interesting transfers from somewhere in

1078
01:01:10,800 --> 01:01:15,760
Speaker 2: the area. It's tough to expect annual bull berths.

1079
01:01:15,880 --> 01:01:16,600
Speaker 1: It just is.

1080
01:01:16,960 --> 01:01:21,600
Speaker 2: And I'm still optimistic because there is that weirdness and

1081
01:01:21,640 --> 01:01:24,960
Speaker 2: that dedication to sports that Syracuse has, and I still

1082
01:01:24,960 --> 01:01:28,240
Speaker 2: do like how Dino Babers seems to, uh what am I?

1083
01:01:28,400 --> 01:01:31,800
Speaker 2: What am I looking for to resonate with players?

1084
01:01:32,440 --> 01:01:33,320
Speaker 1: Right, But.

1085
01:01:35,040 --> 01:01:37,440
Speaker 2: There is that element of you're gonna need a lot

1086
01:01:37,480 --> 01:01:39,720
Speaker 2: more injury luck than they've had these past couple of years,

1087
01:01:39,960 --> 01:01:42,240
Speaker 2: and you just be able to You need to be

1088
01:01:42,280 --> 01:01:45,320
Speaker 2: able to evaluate three times better than everybody else. So

1089
01:01:45,600 --> 01:01:49,560
Speaker 2: I don't know, let's do real quick hit me, I'll

1090
01:01:49,560 --> 01:01:52,360
Speaker 2: go quicker than that. Sorry, you want to do Michigan,

1091
01:01:52,440 --> 01:01:53,360
Speaker 2: you want to do Vanderbilt.

1092
01:01:55,880 --> 01:02:00,000
Speaker 1: Let's do Michigan State and Vanderbilt to close it out. Well,

1093
01:02:00,120 --> 01:02:02,440
Speaker 1: he's dunk on Michigan and Tennessee, so we'll leave them

1094
01:02:02,440 --> 01:02:05,160
Speaker 1: out of this. But right, let's go Michigan State, Let's

1095
01:02:05,160 --> 01:02:09,360
Speaker 1: go Vandy. So you know, I look, Vanderbilt, I think

1096
01:02:09,440 --> 01:02:16,600
Speaker 1: is the easy one. Vanderbilt is perennially bottom tier of

1097
01:02:17,120 --> 01:02:20,040
Speaker 1: the SEC. James Franklin had a little bit of success there.

1098
01:02:20,320 --> 01:02:23,400
Speaker 1: I think we're really excited about Derek Mason hire everyone

1099
01:02:23,440 --> 01:02:26,200
Speaker 1: we talked to at the time of that hire was

1100
01:02:26,280 --> 01:02:28,280
Speaker 1: super thrilled that he would go there and thought it

1101
01:02:28,320 --> 01:02:31,240
Speaker 1: was going to work out long haul. It didn't. But

1102
01:02:33,280 --> 01:02:36,280
Speaker 1: now bring in Clark Lee. He's a guy who very

1103
01:02:36,280 --> 01:02:39,880
Speaker 1: clearly wanted that job. He was all in on that job,

1104
01:02:40,000 --> 01:02:42,360
Speaker 1: did a good job at Notre Dame on the defensive

1105
01:02:42,360 --> 01:02:45,760
Speaker 1: side of the football, has a familiarity with Vandy, so

1106
01:02:45,880 --> 01:02:50,160
Speaker 1: we wish him well. But Vandy's got to bring in talent.

1107
01:02:50,280 --> 01:02:53,160
Speaker 2: Dan recruiting to a school in a city with high

1108
01:02:53,240 --> 01:02:57,880
Speaker 2: academic entry points, you're recruiting against Georgia Tech and Notre

1109
01:02:57,960 --> 01:03:00,840
Speaker 2: Dame and Duke and Northwestern, and you know some of

1110
01:03:00,840 --> 01:03:05,680
Speaker 2: those are in bigger cities. But the level of competition

1111
01:03:05,800 --> 01:03:08,120
Speaker 2: Vanderbilt is going to be facing relative to the Big

1112
01:03:08,160 --> 01:03:11,240
Speaker 2: ten West, relative to what George Attacker Duke is facing,

1113
01:03:12,040 --> 01:03:14,680
Speaker 2: you're gonna get embarrassed a lot, at least at first,

1114
01:03:14,880 --> 01:03:19,040
Speaker 2: And to get embarrassed with a very tricky course load,

1115
01:03:19,480 --> 01:03:24,280
Speaker 2: it's I mean, you're eventually, maybe maybe going to be

1116
01:03:24,280 --> 01:03:27,800
Speaker 2: a part of a rebuild. But I think you're right.

1117
01:03:27,880 --> 01:03:33,400
Speaker 2: I think that there can be something solidly built at Vanderbilt.

1118
01:03:33,440 --> 01:03:37,440
Speaker 2: I think Nashville can be a plus, But I think

1119
01:03:37,640 --> 01:03:40,520
Speaker 2: Clark Lee is gonna have to absolutely nail these assistant hires.

1120
01:03:40,920 --> 01:03:46,480
Speaker 2: He's going to have to I expand, I guess the

1121
01:03:46,560 --> 01:03:49,640
Speaker 2: Vanderbilt brand nationally. I don't know how you do that

1122
01:03:49,760 --> 01:03:53,600
Speaker 2: immediately other than I guess selling Nashville, selling academics. But

1123
01:03:54,440 --> 01:03:58,520
Speaker 2: then you're competing with Stanford like it's a tough sell.

1124
01:03:58,760 --> 01:04:04,000
Speaker 2: It's an absolutely tough sell. And so I don't know.

1125
01:04:04,080 --> 01:04:05,720
Speaker 2: I don't know that there's a commitment from the school,

1126
01:04:05,720 --> 01:04:08,280
Speaker 2: from the athletic department in terms of what they're up

1127
01:04:08,320 --> 01:04:09,320
Speaker 2: against in the conference.

1128
01:04:09,640 --> 01:04:12,960
Speaker 1: I think about the Jeff Collins experiment at Atlanta, and

1129
01:04:13,120 --> 01:04:15,680
Speaker 1: he's just selling to tell out of Atlanta. And there

1130
01:04:15,720 --> 01:04:18,840
Speaker 1: have been embarrassing moments. Right you've watched Tech football, you

1131
01:04:18,880 --> 01:04:21,400
Speaker 1: know there have been embarrassing moments. But I also feel

1132
01:04:21,440 --> 01:04:24,120
Speaker 1: like there is a little bit of steam. It is

1133
01:04:24,120 --> 01:04:26,520
Speaker 1: a little bit of steam on Georgia Tech. And they

1134
01:04:26,560 --> 01:04:30,080
Speaker 1: were plucky in spots this year. They played hard. I

1135
01:04:30,120 --> 01:04:32,200
Speaker 1: don't know if that translates to on field success. A

1136
01:04:32,240 --> 01:04:35,120
Speaker 1: lot of times it does, but at least you get

1137
01:04:35,120 --> 01:04:37,400
Speaker 1: the sense that there's a very clear direction and a

1138
01:04:37,400 --> 01:04:41,240
Speaker 1: lot of enthusiasm around that direction. So can quarkly do

1139
01:04:41,320 --> 01:04:45,160
Speaker 1: something similar in Nashville. We'll see.

1140
01:04:45,400 --> 01:04:48,960
Speaker 2: I mean history says probably not. The idea though that

1141
01:04:49,000 --> 01:04:52,760
Speaker 2: he went there, that he's from there, that there is

1142
01:04:52,800 --> 01:04:56,480
Speaker 2: going to be a buy in and doggedness to Clark

1143
01:04:56,560 --> 01:05:00,920
Speaker 2: Lee that perhaps wasn't there for some pre previously failed

1144
01:05:00,960 --> 01:05:05,400
Speaker 2: head coaches. And again the deck is stacked against clark Lay.

1145
01:05:06,120 --> 01:05:09,480
Speaker 2: But in terms of the creativity involved in figuring out

1146
01:05:09,480 --> 01:05:13,960
Speaker 2: solutions to problems, in having a very specific kind of

1147
01:05:14,040 --> 01:05:16,320
Speaker 2: player in mind that fits what he's trying to do

1148
01:05:16,360 --> 01:05:17,919
Speaker 2: on both sides of the ball and what he's trying

1149
01:05:17,920 --> 01:05:20,560
Speaker 2: to do with that culture. I think that is an

1150
01:05:20,560 --> 01:05:24,840
Speaker 2: advantage that he is going to try to unearth every

1151
01:05:24,920 --> 01:05:28,800
Speaker 2: possible recruit, turn over every stone he has. He seems

1152
01:05:28,840 --> 01:05:31,040
Speaker 2: to have a good reputation, He was in demand last

1153
01:05:31,080 --> 01:05:33,240
Speaker 2: year as a head coach, interviewed at a few different places.

1154
01:05:33,680 --> 01:05:36,680
Speaker 2: So I think he has a better chance of succeeding

1155
01:05:37,320 --> 01:05:40,400
Speaker 2: than perhaps Derek Mason did, who had his moments, and

1156
01:05:40,440 --> 01:05:43,760
Speaker 2: certainly James Franklin did well, but at least on the field,

1157
01:05:44,640 --> 01:05:49,720
Speaker 2: I am. I'm very cautious, but there is that element

1158
01:05:50,120 --> 01:05:54,919
Speaker 2: of personal buy in that I can get seduced into

1159
01:05:55,200 --> 01:05:58,480
Speaker 2: enjoying seduced seduced. It didn't work out for Jim Harbor,

1160
01:05:58,560 --> 01:06:01,000
Speaker 2: or hasn't necessarily worked out for Jim Harba always, but

1161
01:06:01,200 --> 01:06:02,440
Speaker 2: he still had some good seasons.

1162
01:06:02,800 --> 01:06:05,000
Speaker 1: Final one very quickly Michigan State go.

1163
01:06:06,720 --> 01:06:08,600
Speaker 2: They're not necessarily in a permafrost situation.

1164
01:06:08,680 --> 01:06:09,200
Speaker 1: It's year two.

1165
01:06:09,240 --> 01:06:11,320
Speaker 2: They don't have a clear quarterback of the future, which

1166
01:06:11,360 --> 01:06:13,960
Speaker 2: is troubling. They lost a couple big recruits to Michigan,

1167
01:06:14,720 --> 01:06:19,400
Speaker 2: but it's still pretty early to I mean, if Meltucker's

1168
01:06:19,440 --> 01:06:22,520
Speaker 2: loan season is twenty twenty as a new head coach,

1169
01:06:23,120 --> 01:06:25,840
Speaker 2: I'm only to give him some time. The returns recruiting

1170
01:06:25,840 --> 01:06:31,640
Speaker 2: aren't amazing, but Michigan State can sell a relatively recent

1171
01:06:31,720 --> 01:06:35,440
Speaker 2: defensive identity and try to rebuild things on offense.

1172
01:06:35,760 --> 01:06:37,160
Speaker 1: So I'm not.

1173
01:06:37,200 --> 01:06:41,800
Speaker 2: Super down on Michigan State. But I enjoy Meltucker. I

1174
01:06:41,880 --> 01:06:44,840
Speaker 2: enjoy what his ceiling might be as a recruiter as

1175
01:06:44,880 --> 01:06:48,680
Speaker 2: a program organizer. But I'm going to need to see

1176
01:06:49,400 --> 01:06:51,920
Speaker 2: a promising young quarterback in the next year and a

1177
01:06:51,920 --> 01:06:59,040
Speaker 2: half before I anticipate thawing. To me, do that makes sense?

1178
01:06:59,240 --> 01:06:59,920
Speaker 1: Are you? Like?

1179
01:07:00,560 --> 01:07:03,080
Speaker 2: Even when we were talking about big ten schedules. It

1180
01:07:03,160 --> 01:07:05,640
Speaker 2: was like, Wow, they have Michigan, Michigan State, Penn State,

1181
01:07:05,720 --> 01:07:07,200
Speaker 2: Like there is still something in the back of my

1182
01:07:07,240 --> 01:07:10,520
Speaker 2: mind saying Michigan State is a tough out on a schedule.

1183
01:07:10,880 --> 01:07:13,520
Speaker 2: Even if that's not necessarily the case, they still have

1184
01:07:13,600 --> 01:07:16,240
Speaker 2: that reputation. To me, it doesn't matter on the football field,

1185
01:07:16,760 --> 01:07:21,120
Speaker 2: but I think there is that element of these NFL

1186
01:07:21,160 --> 01:07:23,560
Speaker 2: players went to Michigan State. Sure, this is what it

1187
01:07:23,600 --> 01:07:26,040
Speaker 2: looked like when we were in the Rose Bowl or

1188
01:07:26,080 --> 01:07:28,760
Speaker 2: the playoff. Don't look at the results in the last decade.

1189
01:07:29,120 --> 01:07:33,520
Speaker 2: There is that element of Michigan State has recently played

1190
01:07:33,600 --> 01:07:39,760
Speaker 2: and won big time football games that Kansas, South Carolina, Arizona,

1191
01:07:39,840 --> 01:07:43,560
Speaker 2: all these other schools can't come anywhere near saying well

1192
01:07:43,600 --> 01:07:45,760
Speaker 2: and hey, look I can sell Michigan State.

1193
01:07:45,920 --> 01:07:49,440
Speaker 1: Well there's recent success in the last decade. Yeah, and

1194
01:07:49,440 --> 01:07:51,120
Speaker 1: that's more than a lot of the schools that we

1195
01:07:51,160 --> 01:07:56,760
Speaker 1: talked about today can say they were in a playoff

1196
01:07:56,760 --> 01:08:01,520
Speaker 1: semifinal like five six years ago, lost, but they were

1197
01:08:01,560 --> 01:08:03,080
Speaker 1: in some big games or in the Cotton Bowl, the

1198
01:08:03,160 --> 01:08:06,520
Speaker 1: Rose Bowl. You know. So this is a program, like

1199
01:08:06,560 --> 01:08:09,160
Speaker 1: you said, with some real history. They've got the recent

1200
01:08:09,200 --> 01:08:15,040
Speaker 1: success of turning out really good defenses. I don't know

1201
01:08:15,080 --> 01:08:16,880
Speaker 1: how hard you want to sell on Kirk Cousins, but

1202
01:08:16,960 --> 01:08:20,759
Speaker 1: there's a starting NFL quarterback. And look, it's a program

1203
01:08:20,800 --> 01:08:25,840
Speaker 1: that I think could point to stability. Stability over the

1204
01:08:25,920 --> 01:08:28,640
Speaker 1: last decade plus that is not something a lot of

1205
01:08:28,640 --> 01:08:31,519
Speaker 1: college football programs have towards the Enna got a little

1206
01:08:31,560 --> 01:08:36,080
Speaker 1: sour with D'Antonio, but still a Bowl team upon his exit.

1207
01:08:36,800 --> 01:08:39,320
Speaker 1: Now you bring in mel Tucker, twenty twenty is a

1208
01:08:39,360 --> 01:08:41,160
Speaker 1: weird year. I think you got to give it some time.

1209
01:08:42,000 --> 01:08:45,080
Speaker 1: But he's a guy who they obviously were very excited about.

1210
01:08:45,080 --> 01:08:47,680
Speaker 1: They paid him a lot of money, come over from Colorado, right,

1211
01:08:47,800 --> 01:08:48,519
Speaker 1: a ton of money.

1212
01:08:48,560 --> 01:08:50,680
Speaker 2: Well, and it's not like that program was built on

1213
01:08:50,720 --> 01:08:53,360
Speaker 2: the back of blue chip recruiting. Eventually recruiting got to

1214
01:08:53,400 --> 01:08:58,559
Speaker 2: an interesting place, remarked Antonio. But there's still an element

1215
01:08:58,680 --> 01:09:03,200
Speaker 2: of Tucker seems to have a big enough personality that

1216
01:09:03,560 --> 01:09:06,200
Speaker 2: they're going to need to go five and seven, six

1217
01:09:06,240 --> 01:09:07,800
Speaker 2: and six, and they're going to need a guy to

1218
01:09:07,840 --> 01:09:10,320
Speaker 2: pop as an All American. They're going to need a

1219
01:09:10,360 --> 01:09:13,519
Speaker 2: guy to pop as a thousand yard rusher or you know,

1220
01:09:13,640 --> 01:09:16,560
Speaker 2: making plays that end up on the Instagram feed of

1221
01:09:16,600 --> 01:09:18,960
Speaker 2: Sports Center or whatever the metric is. For success in

1222
01:09:19,000 --> 01:09:23,280
Speaker 2: twenty twenty one, they're going to need that initial chunk

1223
01:09:23,360 --> 01:09:23,920
Speaker 2: to build on.

1224
01:09:24,400 --> 01:09:28,720
Speaker 1: No, I agree. All right, Well this has been fun. Dan.

1225
01:09:30,600 --> 01:09:32,680
Speaker 1: Thank you for imparting some of your wisdom. I know

1226
01:09:32,720 --> 01:09:36,639
Speaker 1: you're very passionate about the nonsense. Yeah, and I wish

1227
01:09:36,640 --> 01:09:40,000
Speaker 1: you best luck in thawing that Chicago firmer frost. It's

1228
01:09:40,040 --> 01:09:40,880
Speaker 1: been cold out there.

1229
01:09:42,120 --> 01:09:43,640
Speaker 2: I looked at the ten day, I looked at the

1230
01:09:43,640 --> 01:09:48,559
Speaker 2: three week. I've been looking at forecasts, and it hasn't

1231
01:09:49,120 --> 01:09:50,240
Speaker 2: hasn't got me going.

1232
01:09:50,080 --> 01:09:52,479
Speaker 1: TI When in March is it going to start to

1233
01:09:53,920 --> 01:09:54,960
Speaker 1: come back to normalcy?

1234
01:09:55,680 --> 01:09:58,639
Speaker 2: I think early March it'll get into the high thirties forties,

1235
01:09:59,200 --> 01:10:01,840
Speaker 2: which is apparently tropical for these parts.

1236
01:10:02,760 --> 01:10:03,760
Speaker 1: All right, I mean.

1237
01:10:03,680 --> 01:10:06,160
Speaker 2: I'm wearing long dance to Trader Joe's. This is no

1238
01:10:06,200 --> 01:10:06,760
Speaker 2: way to live.

1239
01:10:06,880 --> 01:10:09,040
Speaker 1: You're going two socks, right, you always wear two socks,

1240
01:10:09,120 --> 01:10:09,559
Speaker 1: tu socks?

1241
01:10:09,600 --> 01:10:11,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, I got a pair of regular socks, cotton socks

1242
01:10:11,479 --> 01:10:14,080
Speaker 2: under my wool socks, got long dance, got a big

1243
01:10:14,080 --> 01:10:15,879
Speaker 2: old jacket and beanie.

1244
01:10:15,920 --> 01:10:17,760
Speaker 1: And you've been you've been out of California for a

1245
01:10:17,800 --> 01:10:20,760
Speaker 1: while now. Usually it starts to like you, yeah, to

1246
01:10:20,760 --> 01:10:21,479
Speaker 1: get used to it.

1247
01:10:22,479 --> 01:10:25,200
Speaker 2: But in New York, I didn't have to shovel I

1248
01:10:25,200 --> 01:10:27,479
Speaker 2: didn't have to drive. I didn't have to shovel out

1249
01:10:27,520 --> 01:10:29,799
Speaker 2: before I drove. You just walk out of your building

1250
01:10:29,880 --> 01:10:32,000
Speaker 2: and get on the train or something like that. It

1251
01:10:32,000 --> 01:10:35,000
Speaker 2: doesn't impact your day to day as much. All Right,

1252
01:10:36,000 --> 01:10:38,320
Speaker 2: I swear to you, I'm gonna have learned eventually to

1253
01:10:38,360 --> 01:10:39,719
Speaker 2: complain less. I pumped.

1254
01:10:40,400 --> 01:10:41,479
Speaker 1: Sorry, I'm gonna.

1255
01:10:41,760 --> 01:10:44,200
Speaker 2: That's my friends here, I know, I know we're all

1256
01:10:44,200 --> 01:10:44,800
Speaker 2: friends here.

1257
01:10:45,240 --> 01:10:50,080
Speaker 1: Listen. Solid verbal dot com is the website for Bowlers.

1258
01:10:50,120 --> 01:10:54,519
Speaker 1: Dot com is the Patreon twice a week now in

1259
01:10:54,560 --> 01:10:57,120
Speaker 1: this year off season. I think the show we're doing

1260
01:10:57,160 --> 01:11:00,400
Speaker 1: on Thursday is going to be a Valentine's theme show. Ooh,

1261
01:11:01,200 --> 01:11:03,639
Speaker 1: you know, we talked a lot about thawing the perma frost.

1262
01:11:04,080 --> 01:11:06,320
Speaker 1: Maybe we do that courtesy of Valentine's showdown.

1263
01:11:07,400 --> 01:11:12,320
Speaker 2: I'm ready, I'm absolutely ready. We're gonna thaw things out emotional.

1264
01:11:12,560 --> 01:11:15,280
Speaker 1: For that guy over there, my good friend Dan Rubinstein,

1265
01:11:15,800 --> 01:11:20,120
Speaker 1: for myself, Ty Hildenbrand. As always, stay safe, stay warm,

1266
01:11:21,160 --> 01:11:22,360
Speaker 1: stay healthy, and stay salty.

1267
01:11:23,000 --> 01:11:23,280
Speaker 2: Nice