WEBVTT - Performing, Panic, & Perseverance 0:00:08.720 --> 0:00:11.560 This is the Anxiety Bites podcast and I am your host, 0:00:11.720 --> 0:00:18.320 Jen Kirkman. Today I am talking to all around anxiety 0:00:18.400 --> 0:00:23.840 expert Lisa Jacob, who also has anxiety and panic herself. 0:00:24.480 --> 0:00:28.880 Lisa was a child actor and she's most famous for 0:00:28.960 --> 0:00:32.720 her roles in Mrs. Doubt Fire and Independent State, two 0:00:32.720 --> 0:00:35.240 movies that came out in the nineties. I'm sure you're 0:00:35.280 --> 0:00:37.520 familiar no matter how old you are, but I wanted 0:00:37.560 --> 0:00:40.240 to talk to Lisa about making a change in your 0:00:40.720 --> 0:00:43.480 career now. She chose to leave her career in acting, 0:00:43.520 --> 0:00:49.040 but not exactly to immediately segue into helping people with anxiety. 0:00:49.159 --> 0:00:52.240 She wandered around for a while, not not exactly sure 0:00:52.320 --> 0:00:55.240 where life would eventually take her. And those kind of 0:00:55.240 --> 0:00:59.800 stories really intrigued me because that kind of uncertainty can 0:01:00.160 --> 0:01:03.960 so much anxiety, and for me being an entertainment myself, 0:01:04.120 --> 0:01:06.920 I wanted to start this podcast because something was calling 0:01:06.959 --> 0:01:09.840 me to do anything that I was qualified to do 0:01:10.400 --> 0:01:13.240 to help people, and I think I'm qualified to talk 0:01:13.280 --> 0:01:16.320 to people who can help you. Let's start there. Lisa 0:01:16.360 --> 0:01:17.920 and I talk about a lot of things. We bond 0:01:17.959 --> 0:01:21.360 over panic attacks. Now I will say this episode, I'm 0:01:21.400 --> 0:01:24.520 a little chatty. I just sometimes I just connect with 0:01:24.560 --> 0:01:27.840 a guest where I feel like we're just out for 0:01:27.880 --> 0:01:30.520 coffee together. And you might think, God, this is a 0:01:30.520 --> 0:01:33.039 lot of gin, but I just I don't know. I 0:01:33.040 --> 0:01:35.720 just wanted to tell her everything, and I did get 0:01:35.760 --> 0:01:39.039 to ask her every single thing I had planned. But 0:01:39.640 --> 0:01:41.800 you know, if you're still on the fence about me, 0:01:41.880 --> 0:01:43.560 you might be like, it's kind of a lot of 0:01:43.600 --> 0:01:45.880 gen in this episode. But maybe I had too much 0:01:45.880 --> 0:01:48.640 coffee that day. And you know, my A d h 0:01:48.720 --> 0:01:53.160 D makes me real chatty. Anyway, so today. Lisa is 0:01:53.200 --> 0:01:59.120 a mental wellness educator trained and specializing in workshop retreat facilitation. 0:02:00.040 --> 0:02:03.520 She creates custom content about anxiety for corporate events. She's 0:02:03.560 --> 0:02:07.720 a keynote speaker for all types of organizations. She teaches 0:02:07.800 --> 0:02:11.920 yoga and writing for managing anxiety, depression, or trauma. She's 0:02:11.960 --> 0:02:15.919 also the podcast host of I Said That Backwards, That's okay, 0:02:15.960 --> 0:02:18.360 I'm leaving it in. She's the host of the podcast 0:02:18.400 --> 0:02:23.160 Embrace You're Weird, where she talks very personally about her 0:02:23.240 --> 0:02:27.440 own anxiety and interviews a lot of veterans, and she 0:02:27.560 --> 0:02:30.360 does a lot of work with war veterans On PTSD. 0:02:30.520 --> 0:02:33.960 We get into how a former child actress is actually 0:02:34.120 --> 0:02:38.120 so instrumental in the lives of many veterans. As she 0:02:38.240 --> 0:02:41.640 calls herself, she is a pacifist Canadian vegetarian and she 0:02:41.720 --> 0:02:43.880 never thought it would be something she was doing either. 0:02:44.480 --> 0:02:47.360 She's written two books. One is called You Look Like 0:02:47.400 --> 0:02:50.480 That Girl, a child actor stops pretending and finally grows up. 0:02:50.520 --> 0:02:54.040 And her latest book, Not Just Me, Anxiety, Depression and 0:02:54.160 --> 0:02:56.520 Learning to Embrace You're Weird. Now, for any of you 0:02:56.600 --> 0:03:00.000 who have anxiety and you've never purchased a book about anxiety, 0:03:00.040 --> 0:03:03.600 I really recommend the book Not Just Me, because not 0:03:03.720 --> 0:03:06.639 only do you have Lisa's personal stories, you have stories 0:03:06.680 --> 0:03:11.560 from people that she has worked with as well, and 0:03:11.639 --> 0:03:16.560 she has a lot of facts about anxiety, panic, social anxiety. 0:03:16.639 --> 0:03:19.680 It's a really good starting point if you want a 0:03:19.800 --> 0:03:23.519 nice overall book that can help you feel like you're 0:03:23.520 --> 0:03:26.079 not the only one. It's not some doctor talking to 0:03:26.120 --> 0:03:28.360 you based on studies they've done, but it's a real person. 0:03:29.160 --> 0:03:32.680 And of course everything is linked in the show notes. 0:03:32.720 --> 0:03:35.080 So if you want to take one of Lisa's online 0:03:35.120 --> 0:03:38.120 anxiety management workshops, if you want to take one of 0:03:38.120 --> 0:03:41.560 her donation based yoga classes online, and of course, if 0:03:41.600 --> 0:03:45.080 you want to get her books, go to her website. Again, 0:03:45.280 --> 0:03:49.000 all of that is in the show notes. What I 0:03:49.040 --> 0:03:51.840 really like about Lisa is I can just tell that 0:03:51.960 --> 0:03:54.440 she is meant to do this because she lights up 0:03:55.160 --> 0:03:58.600 when she talks about helping other people with anxiety. And 0:03:58.640 --> 0:04:01.680 I'm so glad that she does what she does. We 0:04:01.760 --> 0:04:05.680 need seventy million more of her to help with I 0:04:05.720 --> 0:04:09.080 think what is probably a global pandemic, part two, which 0:04:09.160 --> 0:04:12.840 is anxiety. So I hope you enjoy my conversation with Lisa, 0:04:13.320 --> 0:04:18.960 and again, sorry for all the gim thank you for 0:04:19.040 --> 0:04:21.640 being here. Lisa, I'm really excited. I feel like you're 0:04:21.680 --> 0:04:26.120 a real um kindred spirit. Oh I'm I'm so thrilled 0:04:26.160 --> 0:04:28.680 to meet you and so excited to talk about all 0:04:28.720 --> 0:04:31.560 this stuff. Well, you know, I've I've been geeking out 0:04:31.600 --> 0:04:33.440 on your work all week. So I've been listening to 0:04:33.480 --> 0:04:36.360 your podcast. Which are you still doing? Are their new 0:04:36.440 --> 0:04:40.080 episodes up? Because I've been going way back. Yeah, I 0:04:40.160 --> 0:04:42.520 have a new episode that came out a couple of 0:04:42.520 --> 0:04:45.560 weeks ago. I'll agree. I work with a lot of veterans, 0:04:45.640 --> 0:04:48.640 and so my most recent episode was with someone who 0:04:48.680 --> 0:04:52.120 is actually currently in the military. Talking about moral injury 0:04:52.279 --> 0:04:54.520 and post traumatic stress and all those kinds of stuff. 0:04:54.560 --> 0:04:57.760 Oh yeah, and your podcast is called Embrace Your Weird. Yes, 0:04:58.160 --> 0:04:59.920 it's so you guys will love it after of cour 0:05:00.200 --> 0:05:02.719 after you listen to this episode, go download Embrace Your Weird. 0:05:02.880 --> 0:05:05.320 Lisa is in her closet because the sound is best 0:05:05.360 --> 0:05:08.400 from there, and she is just it's a lot of 0:05:08.440 --> 0:05:10.840 the episodes are just you talking to us, and it's 0:05:11.120 --> 0:05:14.440 very soothing, and you're just you remind me of I'm 0:05:14.440 --> 0:05:17.080 gonna compliment myself right now. You remind me of me 0:05:17.120 --> 0:05:19.680 in the sense that when we talk about anxiety, we 0:05:19.680 --> 0:05:22.160 seem to light up, you know what I mean, which 0:05:22.200 --> 0:05:25.560 is strange, right, because it's a topic that I think 0:05:25.640 --> 0:05:29.960 most people are so reluctant to talk about, and then 0:05:30.000 --> 0:05:32.800 when they do talk about it, they kind of talk 0:05:32.880 --> 0:05:36.960 about it like this, and they get really quiet and 0:05:37.000 --> 0:05:40.480 just filled with shame. And then there are people like 0:05:40.600 --> 0:05:44.120 us who are like, oh my god, yeah, like, just 0:05:44.480 --> 0:05:48.479 crack this ship open, let's go, And yeah, I always 0:05:48.520 --> 0:05:50.560 feel so good when I can talk to somebody else 0:05:51.360 --> 0:05:53.839 who really kind of feels the same way, and we'll 0:05:53.880 --> 0:05:55.840 get through you know, your whole history of all your 0:05:55.880 --> 0:05:59.200 hearing anxieties and and all that. But it's interesting because 0:05:59.240 --> 0:06:01.440 so I I think you and I I'm a little older. 0:06:01.480 --> 0:06:03.440 So I don't mean to say you're my age I am. 0:06:03.480 --> 0:06:07.000 I am older everybody. Um, I'm four years older. And 0:06:07.240 --> 0:06:08.760 but I don't know if you relate to this growing 0:06:08.839 --> 0:06:11.119 up pre internet. I know you and I started having 0:06:11.200 --> 0:06:14.520 panic and anxiety attacks rather young, way before the Internet, 0:06:14.560 --> 0:06:18.880 I mean, you know, and like you, I felt like 0:06:18.920 --> 0:06:21.640 I was probably going insane, and I thought, once everyone 0:06:21.640 --> 0:06:23.680 finds out, I will live in a hospital the rest 0:06:23.720 --> 0:06:25.440 of my life. And you know, I was really not 0:06:25.480 --> 0:06:27.600 even trying to be funny. I really thought that. So 0:06:27.640 --> 0:06:29.880 I thought, keep this a secret as long as possible 0:06:30.200 --> 0:06:32.400 until I absolutely can't live this way, and then I'll 0:06:32.480 --> 0:06:36.000 basically like turn myself in, you know. And I was 0:06:36.040 --> 0:06:38.599 completely serious. I mean, I thought that was really you know, 0:06:38.760 --> 0:06:41.840 there was only your crazy like a bugs Bunny cartoon 0:06:41.880 --> 0:06:44.760 like boa and you're normal. There was nothing else that 0:06:44.839 --> 0:06:47.520 was it. Those were the two options. Yeah, And so 0:06:47.600 --> 0:06:50.080 I thought, I'm not normal, but I guess I'll wait 0:06:50.120 --> 0:06:52.680 until i'm you know, doing like the bugs Bunny cartoon 0:06:52.680 --> 0:06:58.240 and going so basically I felt really alone, right, and 0:06:59.400 --> 0:07:01.560 so then you know, years go by, and I I 0:07:01.920 --> 0:07:04.880 called myself like an anxious and recovering and former fear 0:07:04.880 --> 0:07:06.920 of flyer, and I still panic attacks a couple of 0:07:06.960 --> 0:07:09.480 times a year. But it's so like, oh whatever, you know. 0:07:10.760 --> 0:07:16.800 But I had this really naive notion that young people, 0:07:16.960 --> 0:07:22.240 although they have you know, obviously every generation has ridiculous 0:07:22.280 --> 0:07:25.920 things to deal with societally and personally. But I thought, well, 0:07:25.960 --> 0:07:27.920 the one area where young people are luckier than me 0:07:28.560 --> 0:07:30.680 is that they can just type the word anxiety into 0:07:30.760 --> 0:07:33.840 the computer and they'll get all the help they need, 0:07:33.880 --> 0:07:35.320 and there's so much free stuff out there and they 0:07:35.320 --> 0:07:39.160 won't feel alone. And I really thought that. And it 0:07:39.200 --> 0:07:41.680 wasn't until by being a comedian going on the road 0:07:41.960 --> 0:07:44.000 that young people were coming to my shows and they 0:07:44.000 --> 0:07:46.800 were saying um in the meet and greet line after Hey, 0:07:46.800 --> 0:07:49.160 thanks for talking about anxiety on stage, and I'd be like, oh, 0:07:49.200 --> 0:07:51.040 And the minute they say that, I write a story 0:07:51.080 --> 0:07:53.840 for them. Oh, they're in therapy, they're doing great. I'm like, oh, good, 0:07:53.880 --> 0:07:56.080 good to meet another one by. And I would get 0:07:56.160 --> 0:07:58.000 d M s from them on social media later after 0:07:58.040 --> 0:08:00.040 the show saying well, how do you handle it? And 0:08:00.040 --> 0:08:01.520 I'm like what do you mean you don't know, like 0:08:01.880 --> 0:08:04.000 not in a route weight, but like I'm blown away 0:08:04.040 --> 0:08:07.120 here that I thought maybe you guys had figured it out. 0:08:07.880 --> 0:08:11.320 And I realized where I was being a typical anxious 0:08:11.320 --> 0:08:14.200 person is that I thought I was the only like 0:08:14.240 --> 0:08:16.360 I knew I wasn't the only one who had anxiety, 0:08:16.400 --> 0:08:18.119 but I thought I was the only one who felt alone. 0:08:18.200 --> 0:08:20.480 And I thought it was because of the Internet not 0:08:20.600 --> 0:08:22.640 being there, And that's not what I mean. It could 0:08:22.640 --> 0:08:25.160 be one of the reasons, but that's why it's such 0:08:25.160 --> 0:08:28.840 an epidemic. Rights Even with all of the voices saying 0:08:28.880 --> 0:08:31.520 it's okay, I have anxiety too, and you can google 0:08:31.560 --> 0:08:34.000 it and a lot of help comes up, people still 0:08:34.040 --> 0:08:39.240 feel alone and ashamed, and that is heartbreaking. It really 0:08:39.480 --> 0:08:43.920 is heartbreaking. And that is exactly why I started doing 0:08:43.960 --> 0:08:48.120 the work that I do, because when I wrote my 0:08:48.280 --> 0:08:52.520 two books and went out and did book tours and was, 0:08:53.080 --> 0:08:57.120 you know, reading passages and doing talks in colleges and 0:08:57.200 --> 0:09:00.520 high schools, I would have that exact act the same 0:09:00.559 --> 0:09:04.160 situation where at the end of the talk people would 0:09:04.160 --> 0:09:07.600 come up to me, often times younger people, and be like, 0:09:08.400 --> 0:09:11.720 I have anxiety too. I've never told anyone I have 0:09:11.960 --> 0:09:16.400 no clue what to do about this, please help, And 0:09:16.520 --> 0:09:20.720 I think you know that first step. Even though some 0:09:20.920 --> 0:09:24.600 of the stigma is starting to diminish around this stuff, 0:09:25.160 --> 0:09:29.760 it can still be really hard to admit to yourself, Yeah, 0:09:30.080 --> 0:09:33.400 you're struggling with these things that you need help from 0:09:33.520 --> 0:09:36.640 someone else. And I think so a lot of us 0:09:36.679 --> 0:09:41.480 are still getting getting stuck with with labels and terminology 0:09:41.559 --> 0:09:44.440 and all those sorts of things. I've definitely gotten emails 0:09:44.440 --> 0:09:46.719 from people saying, you know, I know you do. You 0:09:46.760 --> 0:09:48.480 know help people anxiety, but you can't help me have 0:09:48.800 --> 0:09:52.120 it worse than anyone. And you know I I would 0:09:52.200 --> 0:09:55.000 if I were a psychiatrist, I would probably delve deeper 0:09:55.040 --> 0:09:58.920 into I think you want that to be true, just 0:09:58.960 --> 0:10:01.240 because it would be at least an answer. I can't 0:10:01.240 --> 0:10:03.320 be helped. I mean, no one wants to find out 0:10:03.320 --> 0:10:05.080 you can live with this every day and just feel 0:10:05.080 --> 0:10:07.440 a little bit um, you know, like you live with 0:10:07.480 --> 0:10:09.240 it every day and you have your your tools and 0:10:09.240 --> 0:10:11.440 your coping mechanisms. I don't know if that's all that 0:10:11.480 --> 0:10:15.200 attractive to people in the sense, right, Yeah, And I 0:10:15.240 --> 0:10:18.920 think it does become kind of like a security blanket 0:10:19.200 --> 0:10:23.479 in some ways. And I also find it really interesting, 0:10:23.760 --> 0:10:28.520 especially with people who are artists who have anxiety, who 0:10:28.640 --> 0:10:33.920 tie this idea of, well, my my art, my writing, 0:10:34.000 --> 0:10:38.400 my comedy, my music all comes from the same place 0:10:38.559 --> 0:10:42.440 that my anxiety or my depression comes from. So if 0:10:42.520 --> 0:10:46.079 I deal with my anxiety and my depression, what happens 0:10:46.160 --> 0:10:49.480 to my art? And I think we get really tied 0:10:49.640 --> 0:10:55.800 into this idea of like the tragic suffering artists. And 0:10:56.160 --> 0:11:00.840 I know personally that like, when I'm depressed, my writing 0:11:00.960 --> 0:11:05.360 is crap. That's right, Like I do better work when 0:11:05.400 --> 0:11:09.360 I feel okay, And so being able to kind of 0:11:09.440 --> 0:11:14.199 tap into well, what is it about feeling a little 0:11:14.200 --> 0:11:17.640 bit better that freaks you out? You know, what is 0:11:17.679 --> 0:11:19.680 it that you feel like you would have to let 0:11:19.760 --> 0:11:23.040 go of? Oh that's a great question. You know, what 0:11:23.200 --> 0:11:26.520 is it that you feel like you would then have 0:11:26.720 --> 0:11:30.760 to move forward and do if you weren't so burdened 0:11:30.800 --> 0:11:34.599 by the anxiety. So I think it gets super, super messy. 0:11:34.760 --> 0:11:37.800 Do you find that people's answers are once they tell 0:11:37.840 --> 0:11:39.960 you what they're afraid of, they're kind of illogical and 0:11:40.040 --> 0:11:42.160 like that that fear would never come to pass anyway, 0:11:42.240 --> 0:11:46.880 Or are they legitimate fears. I think it's a bit 0:11:46.920 --> 0:11:52.200 above I think for me, definitely, my my fears around it. 0:11:52.280 --> 0:11:57.160 We're we're illogical, but um yeah, I mean everybody is 0:11:57.200 --> 0:11:59.959 coming from a different place with it. Everybody gets different 0:12:00.720 --> 0:12:05.760 messages around what it means to have anxiety, to have 0:12:06.080 --> 0:12:09.040 mental wellness issues, you know, back from when we were 0:12:09.040 --> 0:12:12.439 a kid, like what messages did you get from your family? 0:12:12.559 --> 0:12:15.480 What did you see around you? And how are you 0:12:15.600 --> 0:12:19.440 carrying that forward into your into your life today. It's interesting. 0:12:19.480 --> 0:12:22.760 You know, Elizabeth Gilbert, the author of Course Um, in 0:12:22.800 --> 0:12:25.240 her book I Think It's Big Magic, she talks about 0:12:25.280 --> 0:12:28.320 that the artist as the you know, person that has 0:12:28.400 --> 0:12:30.560 demons and you know, I need my demons to do 0:12:30.679 --> 0:12:33.280 my art. And she says something I'm paraphrasing, like, well, 0:12:33.280 --> 0:12:36.280 the demons can inform what you want to talk about, 0:12:36.400 --> 0:12:39.720 the angels do the work. Something like that. Isn't that? 0:12:39.400 --> 0:12:41.680 So I totally got goose bumps with that. I got 0:12:41.720 --> 0:12:44.800 into just repeating you don't have to torture yourself and 0:12:44.840 --> 0:12:47.920 live that way. You recall, right, And so to any 0:12:48.000 --> 0:12:50.640 artists out there, trust me, you'll never forget how this 0:12:50.720 --> 0:12:53.679 anxiety feels. So if you need it for your art, 0:12:53.760 --> 0:12:56.559 and you get healthy, you'll be able to recall it 0:12:57.120 --> 0:13:00.400 no problem, you know. Um. But it's it's not even 0:13:00.440 --> 0:13:02.720 like I don't even think that's people's worry. They worry 0:13:02.760 --> 0:13:04.440 that it's like this is who I am, you know, 0:13:04.559 --> 0:13:07.599 and and they're allowed to change, you know, and to 0:13:07.720 --> 0:13:10.520 hell with anyone who doesn't like it, you know. Um. 0:13:10.679 --> 0:13:14.719 So that brings me to you, So okay when you um, 0:13:14.720 --> 0:13:16.680 I'm just looking at my notes because I get I've 0:13:16.760 --> 0:13:18.760 a d D. I'm like a d D theater. I'm like, 0:13:18.880 --> 0:13:20.319 I keep saying what I'm going to ask you, and 0:13:20.360 --> 0:13:24.559 then I keep being like, but wait, um, so you 0:13:24.760 --> 0:13:26.640 left acting at you were a child actor and you 0:13:26.720 --> 0:13:29.439 left acting in two thousand one at age twenty two. 0:13:30.840 --> 0:13:36.240 And I'm so fascinated by this because there's a million 0:13:36.600 --> 0:13:38.160 ways I could go with this, but I want to 0:13:38.200 --> 0:13:42.000 talk all around the sense of like the irony right 0:13:42.160 --> 0:13:47.360 of it wasn't acting that gave you anxiety, Like you 0:13:47.640 --> 0:13:50.000 just a person with anxiety happened to be an actor 0:13:50.280 --> 0:13:52.800 and you felt that there was just something else you 0:13:52.800 --> 0:13:55.000 needed to do, but you didn't know what it was yet. 0:13:55.040 --> 0:13:57.280 That is what's so interesting to me, is like you're 0:13:57.320 --> 0:14:00.760 getting this calling, but whoever's calling you is not giving 0:14:00.760 --> 0:14:02.880 you all the information. It's like you're getting hang up 0:14:02.920 --> 0:14:05.160 calls from your destiny and you're like, what am I 0:14:05.160 --> 0:14:07.880 supposed to? But you know you have to leave, and 0:14:07.960 --> 0:14:11.480 so you do. And it's such a great testament to 0:14:12.200 --> 0:14:16.560 patience and trusting and following your heart. But I know 0:14:16.600 --> 0:14:18.920 that you originally left thinking maybe wanted to be a writer, 0:14:19.080 --> 0:14:22.320 and so just take us through leaving and was there 0:14:22.360 --> 0:14:24.480 any sense in your head yet that you wanted to 0:14:24.520 --> 0:14:28.320 work with people who have anxiety? I love I love 0:14:28.640 --> 0:14:33.360 I love hearing like your interpretation of that story and 0:14:33.400 --> 0:14:36.280 that time because it makes me sound like I had 0:14:36.320 --> 0:14:39.640 my ship together and I was just really wise and 0:14:39.760 --> 0:14:47.080 intuitive and absolutely none of that is true. Um yeah, 0:14:47.240 --> 0:14:50.440 so I was. You know, I was twenty two, I 0:14:50.480 --> 0:14:52.560 was in l A. I had been working as an 0:14:52.600 --> 0:14:55.080 actor since I was four, so I was like eighteen 0:14:55.160 --> 0:14:59.960 years into this career. I had, you know, done Mrs 0:15:00.000 --> 0:15:04.440 out Fire, I had done Independence Day and everybody kept 0:15:04.440 --> 0:15:06.880 telling me I was living the dream life, like I 0:15:06.960 --> 0:15:10.520 had won the Golden ticket. I was doing the best 0:15:10.680 --> 0:15:12.880 possible thing with my life that a human who do. 0:15:14.040 --> 0:15:18.160 And I was miserable. I mean, my depression was really bad. 0:15:18.960 --> 0:15:23.080 I had horrible anxiety. I have a panic disorder, so 0:15:23.160 --> 0:15:27.000 I was having three and four panic attacks a day. Um, 0:15:27.560 --> 0:15:32.880 I was a mess. All I knew was that I 0:15:32.920 --> 0:15:36.920 did not want to be one of those stereotypical child 0:15:36.960 --> 0:15:40.360 actor train wrecks. I knew I did not want that 0:15:40.480 --> 0:15:46.200 to be my path. I was becoming increasingly aware of 0:15:46.640 --> 0:15:51.320 the realities of the film industry, the superficiality, the misogyny, 0:15:51.440 --> 0:15:55.360 the competition, all of those things that I didn't feel 0:15:55.480 --> 0:16:00.520 like that was an authentic part of my path forward. 0:16:01.120 --> 0:16:04.120 I had enjoyed my time being an actor, but I 0:16:04.200 --> 0:16:07.640 felt very strongly that it was done. I got thrown 0:16:07.680 --> 0:16:11.160 out of high school while filming, mused doubt fire, So 0:16:11.480 --> 0:16:14.360 I had never graduated from high school. Well, this is 0:16:14.400 --> 0:16:16.040 a great story too, if you want to share with 0:16:16.080 --> 0:16:17.960 my listeners, because I'm sure we'll have a lot of 0:16:17.960 --> 0:16:21.000 crossover from the comedy world. That the Robin Williams, sweet 0:16:21.040 --> 0:16:23.160 sweet sweet man that he is. I mean, I've only 0:16:23.200 --> 0:16:24.560 met him once. I didn't know him like you did, 0:16:24.560 --> 0:16:27.280 but that he wrote a letter to your high school, right, 0:16:27.880 --> 0:16:32.440 Yeah he did so. Um, we were a few months 0:16:32.480 --> 0:16:38.360 into filming doubtfire. I was doing correspondence school again pre 0:16:38.520 --> 0:16:45.120 internet uh learning back then, so I was, you know, 0:16:45.280 --> 0:16:47.880 sending my school work back and forth to to my 0:16:47.960 --> 0:16:50.960 high school. And my high school just sent a letter 0:16:51.000 --> 0:16:52.560 one time and said, you know, this is too much 0:16:52.600 --> 0:16:55.080 work for our teachers having to put together you know, 0:16:55.120 --> 0:16:59.600 steady packets for you, Um, don't come back when you 0:16:59.680 --> 0:17:05.040 finished filming. Don't come back. UM. Super devastating for a 0:17:05.080 --> 0:17:09.480 fourteen year old to have your formal education just sort 0:17:09.520 --> 0:17:13.359 of ended like that. And uh so Robin saw that 0:17:13.440 --> 0:17:17.199 I was upset and wrote a letter to my high school, 0:17:18.200 --> 0:17:21.560 which is which I still have. It's so sweet. I 0:17:21.600 --> 0:17:23.680 actually have it up on my website if anybody wants 0:17:23.720 --> 0:17:26.280 to see it. It's a m hello at Leasta Jacob 0:17:26.320 --> 0:17:29.639 dot com. But I will link it in the show notes. 0:17:29.680 --> 0:17:31.800 Will link it in the show notes. I was so 0:17:31.960 --> 0:17:35.920 touched by the letter that he wrote, just saying like, Hey, 0:17:35.920 --> 0:17:39.600 this kid is trying to balance her education and her career. 0:17:39.800 --> 0:17:43.320 Can you please like help her with that? And so 0:17:43.359 --> 0:17:46.760 the high school got the letter and they framed the 0:17:46.840 --> 0:17:49.240 letter and they put it up in the principal's office. 0:17:49.280 --> 0:17:52.359 But they didn't ask me to come back to school. 0:17:52.720 --> 0:17:56.800 And this was in Canada. The school wasn't we're from 0:17:56.840 --> 0:18:01.760 outside of Toronto. Yeah that is, But that doesn't that 0:18:02.040 --> 0:18:07.440 just encapsulate everything that is so weird about the way 0:18:07.480 --> 0:18:10.400 people react to someone in the business, Like, oh my god, 0:18:10.400 --> 0:18:13.040 a letter from Robin Williams. We're not gonna digest the 0:18:13.119 --> 0:18:16.119 content of it. We're just gonna idolize him, put it 0:18:16.119 --> 0:18:18.240 on the wall. But treat the real actor. We know 0:18:18.320 --> 0:18:21.119 in real life, bye bye, you can't come back. And 0:18:21.160 --> 0:18:23.280 then at the same time, you're hearing you're living the dream, 0:18:23.520 --> 0:18:27.359 and it's like, how nobody knows what you're living, you know, 0:18:27.560 --> 0:18:29.960 and it's if it's not the dream for you, it's 0:18:29.960 --> 0:18:31.879 not the dream. And I think that frustrates people, like 0:18:31.920 --> 0:18:33.520 who you're good at acting when you mean you don't 0:18:33.560 --> 0:18:34.960 love it. It's like, I don't know, maybe you were 0:18:34.960 --> 0:18:38.040 just only supposed to do it until you were, um, 0:18:38.440 --> 0:18:40.199 twenty two, you know, maybe you weren't supposed to do 0:18:40.200 --> 0:18:43.960 it forever. I really think that's true. I mean, and like, 0:18:44.040 --> 0:18:48.880 let's look at other people in quote unquote normal jobs, right, 0:18:49.240 --> 0:18:52.959 A lot of people do something for eighteen years and decide, 0:18:52.960 --> 0:18:55.480 you know, what, it's time to change paths, and it's 0:18:55.600 --> 0:19:00.080 not this huge dramatic thing where people are shocked and 0:19:00.119 --> 0:19:03.239 have opinions about it. Um. But I you know, I 0:19:03.280 --> 0:19:05.719 got to this point where I really felt like I 0:19:05.800 --> 0:19:08.439 needed to make a change. I needed to leave l 0:19:08.480 --> 0:19:11.560 A and I needed to try to figure out who 0:19:11.640 --> 0:19:15.479 I was underneath the actor, because that is who I 0:19:15.560 --> 0:19:18.760 had been since I was four years old. So it 0:19:19.320 --> 0:19:22.679 really took a while for me. I eventually got my 0:19:22.760 --> 0:19:26.360 g E D. I went to college. I had always 0:19:26.440 --> 0:19:29.520 loved writing, so I kind of went back to that 0:19:29.880 --> 0:19:34.720 did you study writing in college? I didn't because amazing 0:19:34.960 --> 0:19:38.840 because I was so terrified to let anybody read any 0:19:38.880 --> 0:19:42.520 of my writing. I couldn't handle doing it. In college, 0:19:42.720 --> 0:19:46.600 I studied sociology, um, because I felt like I didn't 0:19:46.840 --> 0:19:50.399 understand regular society. I felt like I had kind of 0:19:50.440 --> 0:19:53.760 grown up in this weird movie subculture. Yeah, it's almost 0:19:53.760 --> 0:19:56.160 like coming out of a cult. I mean, not as extreme, 0:19:56.280 --> 0:19:59.480 but it has its own languages and abbreviations. You know, 0:19:59.560 --> 0:20:02.520 it has a his own society. And so you're like, oh, 0:20:02.640 --> 0:20:09.280 here I am in a different world. You know. Yeah, 0:20:09.800 --> 0:20:12.239 we'll be right back after this coake message from one 0:20:12.280 --> 0:20:26.639 of our sponsors. So It wasn't until after college that 0:20:26.800 --> 0:20:30.200 I started writing more as as a way to really 0:20:30.240 --> 0:20:34.840 process my own feelings on leaving l A and trying 0:20:34.880 --> 0:20:39.000 to find my path forward. And I ended up writing 0:20:39.040 --> 0:20:43.600 my memoir because I wanted to just as sort of Catharsis, 0:20:44.080 --> 0:20:48.800 get it out and get on the page that memoir everybody, um, 0:20:48.840 --> 0:20:50.560 which I read it and it's great. It's called you 0:20:50.560 --> 0:20:52.720 Look like that Girl, a child actor stops pretending and 0:20:52.760 --> 0:20:55.280 finally grows up. Get it everywhere you get books. And 0:20:55.280 --> 0:21:00.560 I came out, yes, yeah, so you wrote your memoir 0:21:00.680 --> 0:21:04.800 after college? Yeah? And then you know, it was the 0:21:04.800 --> 0:21:07.040 thing that we just talked about that you know, people 0:21:07.119 --> 0:21:09.000 kept coming up to me because in the memoir I 0:21:09.000 --> 0:21:12.360 do talk about having anxiety, and they just said, can 0:21:12.480 --> 0:21:14.760 we please talk more about this? So there need to 0:21:14.760 --> 0:21:18.480 go a second book. Um. So the second second book 0:21:19.119 --> 0:21:25.080 is all about anxiety, depression, panicked trauma, and I interview 0:21:25.080 --> 0:21:27.520 a lot of other people and talk about kind of 0:21:27.520 --> 0:21:30.800 the latest research on what works and what doesn't, because 0:21:31.440 --> 0:21:34.359 I just felt like that was something that we all needed. 0:21:35.040 --> 0:21:36.800 This book is so great. It's uponed not just me, 0:21:36.880 --> 0:21:39.800 anxiety depression and learning to embrace your weird and what 0:21:39.920 --> 0:21:41.800 I love about this book too. I think if anyone 0:21:41.840 --> 0:21:44.680 has to buy one book about anxiety, to start with 0:21:44.760 --> 0:21:48.399 by this, because yeah, like you said, it's one chapter, 0:21:48.440 --> 0:21:50.920 will be your personal story, and then you give case 0:21:50.960 --> 0:21:53.639 examples and people you've worked with and you've worked with 0:21:53.640 --> 0:21:57.000 with war veterans, and I mean you get into every 0:21:57.040 --> 0:22:00.240 single kind of anxiety and panic and everything in this book. 0:22:00.320 --> 0:22:03.480 So highly recommend. So anyway, so you didn't really know 0:22:03.600 --> 0:22:07.240 that this was a career path until after the first 0:22:07.280 --> 0:22:09.840 memoir and then so then did you start working with 0:22:09.920 --> 0:22:13.560 people after that as you were writing the second book? Yeah, 0:22:13.680 --> 0:22:16.760 it kind of evolved. As I was writing the second book, 0:22:17.080 --> 0:22:23.760 I started working with organizations that that helps support combat veterans. 0:22:24.280 --> 0:22:27.680 So I started co leading retreats where I would teach. 0:22:27.720 --> 0:22:29.600 I'm a yoga teacher as well, so I would teach 0:22:29.680 --> 0:22:34.119 yoga and meditation, therapeutic writing. And then I started working 0:22:34.119 --> 0:22:37.919 one on one with people and then teaching mindfulness classes, 0:22:38.240 --> 0:22:41.600 and it all just kind of evolved, and in a 0:22:41.640 --> 0:22:45.439 way that I think it's a total shock to me 0:22:45.560 --> 0:22:49.120 because thinking of me as a teacher, like I don't 0:22:49.160 --> 0:22:51.520