Speaker 1: Find Down with Jane Kramer and Michael Coffin and I'm
Speaker 1: her radio podcast.
Speaker 2: You know, we always do this show right after lunch,
Speaker 2: and it's actually it's and there's been times where I
Speaker 2: haven't eaten lunch beforehand, Wolf, and it's not a good sight.
Speaker 2: I could probably go back and in the first couple
Speaker 2: of minutes back, Oh, I didn't have lunch that day?
Speaker 1: Yeah, did you have lunch beforehand?
Speaker 3: I had a bar.
Speaker 2: You know what I want to have that I haven't
Speaker 2: had a while? What tunefish?
Speaker 3: It actually sounds really good.
Speaker 1: Out of a tunic can.
Speaker 3: That sounds good with some mayonnaise, some light mayo, a
Speaker 3: little celery. Yeah, can you make that tomorrow?
Speaker 1: Sounds great?
Speaker 3: I actually would love that right now.
Speaker 1: I know it sounds amazing.
Speaker 3: And then we'll eat it on air because Mark loves
Speaker 3: when we eat.
Speaker 2: And that's a perfect thing to be on air. A
Speaker 2: lot of souff smacking. Oh, that'll drive Mark up the wall.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: If I'm taking some deep breaths, it's because I've got
Speaker 3: some new puppies on my chest.
Speaker 1: Everyone's dying to see.
Speaker 3: You know what's really funny about getting a boob job
Speaker 3: is my friends that have gotten boob jobs before, They're
Speaker 3: always like you want to see it? And I'm like, yeah, sure,
Speaker 3: like I mean weirdo. But now I'm like every person,
Speaker 3: I'm like, you want to see my boobs and I'm like,
Speaker 3: unzipping my I don't know what it is. I thought.
Speaker 3: I started laughing to myself last night because before I
Speaker 3: was that person that was like, I mean sure, yeah,
Speaker 3: like I'll see And now I'm like every neighbor girl
Speaker 3: I've showed my boobs do I'm like, you want to
Speaker 3: see him? And I'm like flipping my boobs open?
Speaker 2: Does it feel like artificial? So it doesn't seem as
Speaker 2: like intimate or.
Speaker 3: Something I think it feel. I mean, it's it's not
Speaker 3: that I mean, yes, are they artificial, Sure, they're fake,
Speaker 3: but it's like a new toy almost like you want
Speaker 3: to see my new toy.
Speaker 1: You got a new car, check come check out out.
Speaker 3: It's almost not as like, for example, I was embarrassed
Speaker 3: when I would show my boobs to my like I
Speaker 3: would always hide, like my doctor, doctor unger who did
Speaker 3: my boobs in Nashville, Like he was like my ariolas
Speaker 3: looked like dinner plates. So it's like, you know, the
Speaker 3: last time I showed my girlfriends, they were like and
Speaker 3: had like the gasp thing. So it's like, now I'm like,
Speaker 3: you want to see my babies, Like I'm like proud
Speaker 3: of them in a weird way, and maybe they're not
Speaker 3: as Yeah, it's not as like I don't know, it
Speaker 3: sound as like ooh, like I'm like afraid to show them,
Speaker 3: or I'm scared to show them, or I'm embarrassed or something.
Speaker 2: So you think it's more of a confidence proud thing
Speaker 2: instead of like you don't even feel like they're yours
Speaker 2: yet because they're these brand new things that you haven't had.
Speaker 3: Yeah, both, Like I think once I'm like they settle
Speaker 3: and the scars are healed, I'm not going to be like,
Speaker 3: check out my books. I think right now they Yeah,
Speaker 3: they don't feel like mine for sure. So that's why
Speaker 3: it's like it doesn't feel as but eventually I'm not
Speaker 3: going to be like, yeah, you want to see you know,
Speaker 3: unless like a girlfriend who's thinking about it. But I'm
Speaker 3: not going to show Molly. But Molly's like, let me see,
Speaker 3: and I'm like okay, and I'm like unzipping my thing
Speaker 3: like and hoping, you.
Speaker 1: Know, at the bus stop before the kids get there.
Speaker 3: Literally that's what it was. But yeah, it's I'm right,
Speaker 3: I'm seven days. So now it just feels heavy, like
Speaker 3: just like a tightness. But I have no I have
Speaker 3: no regrets. I just want the tightness, heaviness feeling to
Speaker 3: go away, because that's the mornings and the nights suck
Speaker 3: because it just feels really heavy. And they're a lot
Speaker 3: bigger than I thought they would be. But the doctor
Speaker 3: said they're going to go down, see which because I
Speaker 3: want small. I want it small. And I here's the thing,
Speaker 3: you know, it's it's so weird to even kind of
Speaker 3: talk about because I think women should embrace their bodies.
Speaker 3: I shouldn't have felt uncomfortable about my boobs, but I
Speaker 3: mean you would see me even when you'd come in
Speaker 3: the shower, I'd kind of like hide my boobs because
Speaker 3: it was just And I think women should embrace their
Speaker 3: bodies no matter what. But I also think it's okay
Speaker 3: to do what you want to do, to have that
Speaker 3: extra confidence.
Speaker 2: Too, right, I think that's the thing, right, like society
Speaker 2: or people and especially I mean I can't I can
Speaker 2: only understand to a certain extent because I'm not a woman.
Speaker 2: So I can't even imagine the pressure that you know,
Speaker 2: society has put on women over the years. And but
Speaker 2: I think it's okay. If someone wants to alter it
Speaker 2: for their own personal reasons of feeling more confident for
Speaker 2: whatever reason, then yeah, sure, I don't think they should
Speaker 2: be shamed about it. And they also should be shamed
Speaker 2: if they love their body the way it is. Yeah,
Speaker 2: it doesn't you know, there's a there's that fine line there.
Speaker 2: But I don't think you all need to feel ashamed
Speaker 2: or feel like you have to explain or defend yourself
Speaker 2: for your decisions on your body.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, because I've heard, like some people be like,
Speaker 3: well why would you change what God gave you? And
Speaker 3: then the other thing is like you should embrace your body,
Speaker 3: and like I am, I'm embracing it. I'm just also
Speaker 3: doing what I want to do.
Speaker 1: Too, which is tertrially fun.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and it's all good either way. But I'm already
Speaker 3: kind of I'm like all right, like, hey, they're a
Speaker 3: little more confident.
Speaker 1: Yeah good.
Speaker 3: I think the thing with my daughter, because someone did
Speaker 3: DM me and said what will you tell your daughter?
Speaker 3: And I think I would have I feel like that's
Speaker 3: gonna sound like a total hypocrite. Right now, I feel
Speaker 3: like I would have. I know friends that have had
Speaker 3: them done when they were eighteen, nineteen twenty, when they're younger,
Speaker 3: and in my mind, I always go, we'll love yourself.
Speaker 3: And then I always say, wait till after kids, because
Speaker 3: if you have a boob job before kids, your boobs
Speaker 3: are going to get ruined and destroyed. But then the
Speaker 3: same time, if it helps you get get confidence, but
Speaker 3: then I would never like to Jolie if she's like,
Speaker 3: I want a nose job, I'd be like, baby girl, no, Like,
Speaker 3: you have the most beautiful nose. But how could I
Speaker 3: say that when I'm like, well, mommy got boobs to
Speaker 3: make yourself feel better.
Speaker 2: And I think I think a similar a similar analogy
Speaker 2: to this is like tattoos, right, Like jan and I
Speaker 2: both have tattoos. Jolie the last couple of mornings has
Speaker 2: drawn all over herself in the morning with a marker
Speaker 2: saying they're tattoos, and I love tattoos.
Speaker 3: I want tattoos, and you have a sleeve tattoo.
Speaker 2: So you know, But it's one of those things when
Speaker 2: the kids become of age. Right, even though we have
Speaker 2: a lot and it's like we can't be hypocrite and
Speaker 2: say no, you can't get one. But at the same
Speaker 2: time we're gonna be like, well, volunteers, wait, you know,
Speaker 2: and it's we look at them different, like their body
Speaker 2: is this sacred thing, you know, that we've created and
Speaker 2: we love so much and we want to protect it
Speaker 2: and we want them to feel beautiful the way that
Speaker 2: they God made them. But then we look at ourselves
Speaker 2: they're like, I want this, I want that. So it
Speaker 2: is it is a similar analogy to that on how
Speaker 2: we handle decisions we've made or changes we've made to
Speaker 2: ourselves and how not to be hypocritical but also supportive
Speaker 2: to kids.
Speaker 3: Well, and that's why I hope that the conversation because
Speaker 3: when I was eighteen, I mean I've I had flat
Speaker 3: boobs all the way up until I was pregnant, like
Speaker 3: I didn't care, like I liked smaller boobs, and these
Speaker 3: still will be very small when they go down. But
Speaker 3: you know, if Jolie wants big boobs, that will be
Speaker 3: hard when she's at a younger age because I'm going
Speaker 3: to be like, you don't need the big boobs, like
Speaker 3: wait till after you have kids, and then lift the
Speaker 3: suckers up and then if you want bigger boobs in.
Speaker 3: But like, because my dad he called me and he's like, hey,
Speaker 3: I was watching your Instagram. He's like, why are you
Speaker 3: getting boobs? You know? And I ended up talking to
Speaker 3: him and I'm like, cause I'm a thirty seven year
Speaker 3: old woman and f had two kids and they're saggy,
Speaker 3: and I just want to have a little confidence boost dad,
Speaker 3: And you know, but I appreciate you and I know
Speaker 3: that you love me for me. So it's even when
Speaker 3: the kids are thirty seven, thirty eight years old, we're
Speaker 3: still going to be like, you don't need to change anything.
Speaker 3: You're beautiful just the way you are. But it is
Speaker 3: about just being like, you know, I don't know. That's hard.
Speaker 1: The positive here is that.
Speaker 3: I'll have perky chits.
Speaker 1: That is one of the funnies.
Speaker 2: Another is if the kid, if Jolie wanted to get
Speaker 2: something down there, Jace wanted to get something done, whatever
Speaker 2: it is, you know, it's ultimately our decision financially until
Speaker 2: they're able to pay for it themselves. So really it's
Speaker 2: not like when they are eighteen nineteen twenty, we still
Speaker 2: have the final say and we're not going to let
Speaker 2: Jolie convince us when she's twenty years old that she
Speaker 2: has to have boobs, she has to have this done,
Speaker 2: you know.
Speaker 1: What I mean?
Speaker 3: Well, I don't even know if we want to touch
Speaker 3: on this topic, but what happens if they come to
Speaker 3: you at twelve thirteen and want to do gender reconstruction?
Speaker 3: And you know, we got to tread lightly in this
Speaker 3: topic too, because that's something where if they are identifying
Speaker 3: with like if now I think you know, I don't
Speaker 3: even know if we shoul go here, But I'm just
Speaker 3: saying no, I'm I'm just I'm just saying, like, if
Speaker 3: they're if they're twelve thirteen, however old there and I
Speaker 3: don't know. I haven't done enough research. I'm not, but
Speaker 3: I've been I've heard and read stories of kids being
Speaker 3: twelve years old and saying, I am a female, I
Speaker 3: was raised or genetically female, but like I am, I
Speaker 3: want to be a male. I want to go through
Speaker 3: the process of being a male. Like how could we
Speaker 3: as parents say no to that.
Speaker 2: I wouldn't say flat out no because I wouldn't want
Speaker 2: to shut the door on maybe feelings that I don't understand,
Speaker 2: but they are having but I would say, say they're
Speaker 2: thirteen and they're having this talk with us or whatever.
Speaker 2: I would say, come back to us in five years.
Speaker 2: Talk to us in five years, because they're thirteen years old.
Speaker 2: They're in the most impressionable timeline of their lives, right
Speaker 2: the teenage years. If you still feel this way, you
Speaker 2: can still if you feel like Jace, if you feel
Speaker 2: like you're there's a girl inside of you, you feel like
Speaker 2: you're meant to be a girl, fine, act that way,
Speaker 2: be that way, dress that way, whatever it means to you.
Speaker 1: Do that.
Speaker 2: Let the physical transformation from a surgical standpoint be the
Speaker 2: last step. That doesn't have to be the first step.
Speaker 2: Let that be the last step. And if that's still
Speaker 2: the case when you're eighteen or early twenties, okay, sure,
Speaker 2: but I'm not gonna let a thirteen year old dictate
Speaker 2: just because they're trying to find themselves and because of
Speaker 2: the awareness of today's society with this topic, you know,
Speaker 2: it's something that they could it is now. It is
Speaker 2: now something people feel more comfortable identifying with. Right Like
Speaker 2: when we were growing up, it wasn't really.
Speaker 3: A I didn't know a transgender.
Speaker 2: Right like, finding yourself this wasn't part of the options available.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean gay. I have found out gay when
Speaker 3: I was in high school and transgender in my twenties.
Speaker 2: Right, so, you know, but now because it's out there more,
Speaker 2: it's it's you know, more talked about. Kids learn about
Speaker 2: it at a younger age, and so it becomes this
Speaker 2: I won't I'm not calling it an option, but it
Speaker 2: becomes a possible direction if a kid's trying to find
Speaker 2: himself at this impressionable age.
Speaker 3: We've had Billy Lee on our show probably like a
Speaker 3: year and a half ago, and we've actually remained friends.
Speaker 3: She's transgender, and we still DM we still talk, and
Speaker 3: you know, I think kind of what I took away
Speaker 3: from that is you don't want your kids to go
Speaker 3: through hardships or be bullied or I mean even from
Speaker 3: the little thing of when like, you know, I found
Speaker 3: out Jase had a stigmatism in his eyes and he's
Speaker 3: gonna get glasses. I'm like, oh God, kids are gonna
Speaker 3: make fun of him. It's like, you don't want your
Speaker 3: child to have hard.
Speaker 2: Just have to deal with adversity, even though we all
Speaker 2: know that's what makes you stronger.
Speaker 3: They add, it's what makes us stronger, and it's like
Speaker 3: that they need that, but also like to add more
Speaker 3: on top of it and more bullies.
Speaker 2: Like that's just like I would be interested. I don't
Speaker 2: know if we could get him on the show. But
Speaker 2: Dwayne Wade and Gabrielle Union, so their son, you know,
Speaker 2: he's like eleven, oh identify is came out to his
Speaker 2: parents to say I identify as a female, and they've
Speaker 2: been unbelievably supportive and I respect the heck out of that,
Speaker 2: and I would like to think we would be the
Speaker 2: same way. But this question we're talking about would be
Speaker 2: interesting to propose to them, be like, okay, your son
Speaker 2: now daughter, however they identify? They said they you know,
Speaker 2: they want to be recognized as a female. They're young teens,
Speaker 2: however old they are asked that question to them, they
Speaker 2: proposed to sex change, say mom and dad, and obviously
Speaker 2: they have the money to do it, like mom and dad.
Speaker 3: I actually think I read something like.
Speaker 2: I would like to have a physical sex change. What
Speaker 2: they would say to their child that's of that age
Speaker 2: and wants to identify.
Speaker 3: Her name is what is it? Zia?
Speaker 1: Yeah, Zia, she's thirteen.
Speaker 3: She came out at eleven, right, here, there you go.
Speaker 3: And I think the bottom line is that whatever we
Speaker 3: want to do to our bodies, from breast augmentations to
Speaker 3: transgenders to our kids, it's just about really leaning in
Speaker 3: because and I know I'm not trying to bring this
Speaker 3: back around, like, but I did it when I wanted
Speaker 3: to do it on my terms what I wanted, not
Speaker 3: because I was trying to you know, have big boobs
Speaker 3: because I thought Mike would like it or whatever. Like,
Speaker 3: It's about like doing it for yourself, not for popularity,
Speaker 3: not for this, not for anything. So that's I think
Speaker 3: whatever direction you go from, whatever you want to do
Speaker 3: to change yourself or make yourself feel better, I think
Speaker 3: instead of bullying or being mean or passing judgment just
Speaker 3: because you don't understand doesn't mean that it's it's you
Speaker 3: should do what you want to do to make you
Speaker 3: happy and who you feel.
Speaker 2: And it stands the test of time. Yeah right, It's
Speaker 2: not a it's not a knee jerk reaction in or decision.
Speaker 2: It's something that you've talked about and thought about for
Speaker 2: years and playing around so you know it's gonna be
Speaker 2: this is we have a perfect guest for this kind
Speaker 2: of stuff today because we have a doctor Hillary Goldsher,
Speaker 2: who's a clinical psychologist for a private pri just in
Speaker 2: Beverly Hills in Los Angeles. So we're gonna take a
Speaker 2: break and then get her on and we have some
Speaker 2: topics around kids that we want to talk about.
Speaker 3: Yeah, some hot topics between Mike and I.
Speaker 1: Sure, let's take a break, all right.
Speaker 2: So, like we said, guys, we have doctor Hillary Goldchure
Speaker 2: with us, who is a clinical psychologist in Beverly Hills
Speaker 2: and Hillary, doctor Goldsher.
Speaker 1: What would you would you what do you like to
Speaker 1: go by Hillary?
Speaker 4: Doctor Hillary?
Speaker 1: You're like, I worked hard for that doctor called me
Speaker 1: doctor Hill. Yeah. Right.
Speaker 2: So you know, obviously nowadays with with schooling and kids
Speaker 2: and kind of all the changes that you know, society
Speaker 2: isn't used to along along that lines, Jana and I
Speaker 2: have have had a lot of discussions around schooling in
Speaker 2: our kids' future and what that looks like. And we
Speaker 2: both grew up public school. You know, you go to school,
Speaker 2: I mean, blue collar type mentality, right, you go, you
Speaker 2: don't miss you do this, And nowadays we just hear
Speaker 2: a lot more things changing with co ops, with homeschooling,
Speaker 2: it looks a lot different these days, and Janna brought
Speaker 2: to me recently about the idea of was it doing
Speaker 2: like a co op with some friends or a homeschool.
Speaker 3: So okay, so this is just to kind of give
Speaker 3: a little other sidebar. At times, I'll have to go
Speaker 3: do a movie, right and it's you know, like we
Speaker 3: just got done doing one in Vancouver and the whole
Speaker 3: entire you know, it's a six six weeks in Vancouver,
Speaker 3: and you know, in in July we're having to go
Speaker 3: a month to Connecticut, and luckily that that time is
Speaker 3: not during school time. But I started to kind of
Speaker 3: have a little anxiety around it because you know, when
Speaker 3: Jolie starts kindergarten in August and her public school, which
Speaker 3: again I've always been like public, public, public. We're in
Speaker 3: a great school zone. But she can only miss eight days.
Speaker 3: And I know for us and our family, we're better together.
Speaker 3: Mike and I are better together. I think we're better
Speaker 3: as a family unit. But then I started to think,
Speaker 3: am I being selfish by then taking the kids away
Speaker 3: from their you know, activity, their activities or is it
Speaker 3: cool because I'm like, hey, we're going to go explore
Speaker 3: a different state now, and we're going to go here
Speaker 3: and we're going to go to this museum and we're
Speaker 3: going to see this. And you know, the kids a
Speaker 3: private school, you can they just give your homework and
Speaker 3: it is what it is. And it's again like for us,
Speaker 3: like I think, am like am I being selfish by
Speaker 3: wanting that for our family and for the kids?
Speaker 5: Yeah, when we think of these sort of dilemmas which
Speaker 5: are the details are different, but are on the hearts
Speaker 5: and minds that I think so many people right now
Speaker 5: in the face of the pandemic in the aftermath, it's
Speaker 5: kind of making people rethink what is education going.
Speaker 4: To look like for our family? For many reasons.
Speaker 5: And I like to take a step back and really
Speaker 5: recognize that most often when you're making these kind of decisions,
Speaker 5: this may sound obvious, but really leaning into the fact
Speaker 5: that there are trade offs, that it's imperfect, that no
Speaker 5: matter what choice you make, what decision you come to
Speaker 5: as a family, there's going to be pros and cons
Speaker 5: on both sides, And it's so hard as parents to
Speaker 5: sit in the sort of messiness of that because there's
Speaker 5: just a truth to it. Right, whatever decision you make,
Speaker 5: and maybe we'll talk it out and think through for
Speaker 5: your family where it makes most sense to leave you folks.
Speaker 5: But if you take her out of the public school setting,
Speaker 5: there are trade offs, so she may miss the local
Speaker 5: feel of walking to school, you know, the regular activities,
Speaker 5: all of those things, right, And if you take her
Speaker 5: to private school and you have the opportunity to have
Speaker 5: sort of a more expansive lifestyle with more family time,
Speaker 5: there's pros and cons there as well. So I think
Speaker 5: stepping back and really accepting that part of your job
Speaker 5: here as parents is to sort of deeply lean into
Speaker 5: that truth, almost as like an energetic example to the
Speaker 5: kids that like life is a little messy, like it's
Speaker 5: full of trade offs, and when we make decisions, we
Speaker 5: have to accept that and sort of be resilient and
Speaker 5: be flexible and be spontaneous and to get to the
Speaker 5: micro part of what you're talking about. I mean, those
Speaker 5: are very real considerations, and it's sort of like coming
Speaker 5: together as a family and figuring out what's our family culture,
Speaker 5: what are our family values? How are we going to
Speaker 5: prioritize this stuff? And that is such a hard question.
Speaker 5: I mean, how do you prioritize family time and expansive
Speaker 5: sort of lifestyle relative to her soccer games with her
Speaker 5: friends or you know, welcome to school and having everything
Speaker 5: so local. That's a tough one, but it's like that's
Speaker 5: the deep dive that you guys have to do to
Speaker 5: start to decide how do we prioritize and how does
Speaker 5: that lead us to the path we're meant to be on.
Speaker 3: I kind of have a twofold question. I know that's
Speaker 3: not the right thing to do, but you know, the
Speaker 3: first one is how can like, how do you do
Speaker 3: that when we have different views as parents? And then
Speaker 3: also another one too is I know, kids are so adaptable.
Speaker 3: I mean, I don't know if that's the right word,
Speaker 3: but they're you know, with the masks and stuff, like,
Speaker 3: I know, they're still I got an email from this
Speaker 3: school like they still have to wear their masks in
Speaker 3: the public school and for some reason, I don't know
Speaker 3: what it is, but isn't there some isn't that going
Speaker 3: to like psychologically mess them up a little bit? I
Speaker 3: mean the fact that my two year old son for
Speaker 3: the past year and a half has just you know,
Speaker 3: I mean, he's the most he's so afraid of going
Speaker 3: outside the house now because and I'm like, have just
Speaker 3: is he just going to be filled with anxiety now
Speaker 3: because we go five minutes away from home, he's like
Speaker 3: home home, home home, because he's not used to he
Speaker 3: was quarantined. He's used to being quarantined and we're not
Speaker 3: allowed to leave. And then like with my daughter too
Speaker 3: in the mass, it's like, is that like messing them
Speaker 3: up psychologically with having to like hide our faces? And
Speaker 3: I don't know it. Just as a parent, I'm like,
Speaker 3: how do I like help them with that?
Speaker 5: Yes, I'm so glad you're asking this question because this
Speaker 5: comes up all the time and work that I do
Speaker 5: with parents in sessions and in lectures, et cetera. But
Speaker 5: it's I think we have to make a distinction between
Speaker 5: who impact a community crisis like COVID is going to
Speaker 5: have on ourselves or our kids and potential long lasting effects.
Speaker 5: So of course we don't know for sure, or we
Speaker 5: don't have data on COVID and kids. It's not available
Speaker 5: to us yet, right, But we use other studies and
Speaker 5: evidence that we have around kids to make really good hypotheses.
Speaker 5: And my hypotheses, and I think my industry's hypotheses are
Speaker 5: that there's an increase in anxiety amongst our kids and
Speaker 5: amongst ourselves. I mean, if we're affected, or some of
Speaker 5: us are affected, how are our kids not going to
Speaker 5: be affected? Right, So embracing that that's a truth, but
Speaker 5: also recognizing that much like other anxieties that they can
Speaker 5: resolve with time, they can be addressed with support and
Speaker 5: with resilience and with empathy and strategic sort of plans
Speaker 5: in place. So for kids, some kids, not all kids,
Speaker 5: but some kids have a version of what you were
Speaker 5: talking about with your two year old, where they're now
Speaker 5: worried to go outside. They're worried to be exposed to germs,
Speaker 5: they're worried to be not physically or socially distanced. Right,
Speaker 5: So leading into that, having a conversation with them about it,
Speaker 5: saying to your son too, I have a three year
Speaker 5: old and I have a six year old, so I'm
Speaker 5: in it. I have two little boys, saying to your
Speaker 5: son a version of gosh, I noticed, I noticed that
Speaker 5: when we go outside or when we go do things,
Speaker 5: that a party really wants to go home.
Speaker 4: And I get it. I get it. You feel nervous.
Speaker 4: We've been inside for so long.
Speaker 5: It's so different to go outside. Not trying to fix
Speaker 5: it in the moment not trying to repair it, but
Speaker 5: to really honor those feelings. Much in the same way,
Speaker 5: if you were talking to your husband and saying, I'm
Speaker 5: anxious about this, if he was like, oh, no, no, no,
Speaker 5: it's going to be fine. That when you feel super
Speaker 5: validating that, when you feel super supportive, right, you would
Speaker 5: want them to say a version of like, oh my god,
Speaker 5: I'm so sorry you're feeling that way.
Speaker 4: It's the same for our kids.
Speaker 5: We want to say to them, I noticed you're feeling
Speaker 5: that's so hard, that's so scary, and then later say,
Speaker 5: you know, I was thinking again.
Speaker 4: About how you were feeling anxious about going outside.
Speaker 5: If we could come up with some ideas what could
Speaker 5: we do and like take out a piece of paper,
Speaker 5: what can we do?
Speaker 4: We could bring your favorite we could.
Speaker 5: Hold hands the whole time, to have a secret code
Speaker 5: where it's getting really hard, so I know, to give
Speaker 5: you a snuggle, you know, those kinds of things, so
Speaker 5: that you're doing sort of a two part validating strategy
Speaker 5: and also like giving him some robust skills and like, well,
Speaker 5: what do I do when.
Speaker 4: I feel those things?
Speaker 3: Right, there's something that you had brought up, I think
Speaker 3: on a past podcast. I don't think we were talking
Speaker 3: to an actual, you know, specialist about Jolie's anxiety and
Speaker 3: if it's if it's if we've maybe taught her, remember
Speaker 3: how you're like you don't want her to get uh oh?
Speaker 2: Where it felt it felt like codependent almost where our
Speaker 2: daughter has a natural uh direction towards the dramatic. Okay,
Speaker 2: she's five years old and she is she is a
Speaker 2: drama queen princess dve already and we love her for it,
Speaker 2: and we've done these. Janet did a great job like
Speaker 2: doing like breathing exercises with her right and it's amazing
Speaker 2: the fact that she's able to do that. She's even
Speaker 2: we have a video of her doing it to our
Speaker 2: son when he was upset. It's like, oh, Jane's just
Speaker 2: breathed and it's great. But then when she gets super upset,
Speaker 2: she's like I can't breathe. I can't breathe, Like help
Speaker 2: me breathe, help me breathe. And you know it's like,
Speaker 2: obviously the protective parent I mean wants to be like, okay,
Speaker 2: let's do this like I got you, and then the
Speaker 2: other part of me is like, am I enabling codependency?
Speaker 2: Is she always going to need someone else to help
Speaker 2: her breathe is, you know, But I don't want to
Speaker 2: be like you got to do it yourself.
Speaker 1: So it's like like you did to.
Speaker 3: Me when I'm having a panic attack. You can breathe.
Speaker 3: You're fine, You're breathing right now. Yeah, it's like what
Speaker 3: he said one time. That's fun.
Speaker 1: That was a long time ago, it was.
Speaker 5: But yeah, when we have them in our home and
Speaker 5: they're under the age of eighteen, our job is to
Speaker 5: do everything we can to fill them with the right
Speaker 5: resources and tools and support and guidance to get through
Speaker 5: your hard stuff. We think about us. You're an adult, Jenna,
Speaker 5: and you still have anxiety, and you still struggle with
Speaker 5: how to deal with it, as many many millions of
Speaker 5: people around the world do, and you need support from
Speaker 5: your loved ones.
Speaker 4: Sometimes you might need support from a professional.
Speaker 5: Right. We wouldn't want to cut that off for you.
Speaker 5: We definitely don't want to cut it off for Jobili,
Speaker 5: who's five, Right, So I understand your concern. There's a
Speaker 5: difference between coddling and not providing opportunities for your daughter
Speaker 5: to take responsibility when it comes to feelings. We want
Speaker 5: to air on the side of Wow, I'm so sorry
Speaker 5: this is so hard for you. Here's some ideas of
Speaker 5: what we can do in this moment. I'm right here
Speaker 5: with you, right and sure you don't have to take
Speaker 5: it on.
Speaker 4: That you have to fix it in that moment.
Speaker 5: I mean kind of as you guys are sort of
Speaker 5: looking at each other and rowing eyes at each other.
Speaker 4: That like, right, Jana. Part of I think what.
Speaker 5: You want in the moment when you're feeling anxiety is
Speaker 5: someone to go like, I'm so sorry you're feeling this way.
Speaker 5: I'm here with you until it feels better. That's a
Speaker 5: version of what you can do with your daughter too,
Speaker 5: and she can't catch your breath and she just can't
Speaker 5: get on top of it. For you, guys, not to panic,
Speaker 5: I know that's so hard. Love, We'll just all sit
Speaker 5: here together until you can catch your breath right here,
Speaker 5: you know, kind of things as opposed to like escalating
Speaker 5: with her. Oh my god, what I need to do?
Speaker 5: Am I doing too much? Am I doing too little?
Speaker 5: Like I'm right here, I'm right here, Love. When you're
Speaker 5: ready to breathe, I'm going to breathe with you. You know
Speaker 5: kind of thing that like you're escalating you know, I
Speaker 5: hate to use the word drama, but to borrow it
Speaker 5: from you, since that's the feel you get, that you're
Speaker 5: not contributing to it with your own panic or your
Speaker 5: own uncertainty about what you're doing. You're just leaning into
Speaker 5: the idea of like, right here with you, we're all
Speaker 5: going to be together until it starts to feel better.
Speaker 4: I know it's instead what's the next second, what's the
Speaker 4: next thing, what's the next thing?
Speaker 5: And kind of escalating with her. And I always tell
Speaker 5: parents that doesn't mean it's not messy. It doesn't mean
Speaker 5: it's not hard to get in that for you guys,
Speaker 5: just because you're saying those things, because you're doing the
Speaker 5: quote right thing in the moment, doesn't mean inside you're
Speaker 5: not dying, doesn't mean inside your heart isn't breaking.
Speaker 4: It doesn't mean it doesn't feel messy and yucky. Right.
Speaker 5: I like to say all the time I feel this
Speaker 5: way in my own household, that like, if it feels
Speaker 5: kind of messy and uncomfortable, I know I'm doing the
Speaker 5: right thing. I'm not all the time, but when I'm
Speaker 5: having tricky moments with my kids, that means I'm sitting
Speaker 5: in the mess that means I'm not trying to fix
Speaker 5: and I'm not trying to force them to make it
Speaker 5: go away. I'm sort of saying, in this family, we
Speaker 5: honor tricky feelings. I'm here with you, and I'll be
Speaker 5: here with you until it passes. So that's like the
Speaker 5: narrative you want to send rather than getting over fixated
Speaker 5: on what the intervention is in the moment.
Speaker 4: If that makes sense, No.
Speaker 1: I love it.
Speaker 2: I want to shift gears here for a second to
Speaker 2: more like the education aspect, like with children, and you know,
Speaker 2: with especially with the pandemic stuff, with ideas of co
Speaker 2: ops and homeschooling becoming more relevant, right and those options
Speaker 2: being more available. I again, I know, like I'll explain
Speaker 2: at the beginning, was I just come from a family.
Speaker 2: It's like you don't miss school. You go to school,
Speaker 2: you come home, you do your homework, all that stuff.
Speaker 2: And I know we have some friends at homeschool are
Speaker 2: doing a co op and part of their motivation is
Speaker 2: to kind of control the curriculum right, kind of dictate
Speaker 2: what they think their kids should be learning and not learning.
Speaker 2: My personal opinion conflicts with that, just because I would
Speaker 2: still like, sure are Julie and Jay's gonna be chemists
Speaker 2: or biologists.
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 2: Maybe, but if you take away history or science or
Speaker 2: these general knowledge things that you learn in grade school
Speaker 2: in high school, like how well rounded can you be
Speaker 2: if you're just being like, oh, I only use this
Speaker 2: in my life, So my kids are just gonna learn A,
Speaker 2: B and C. So I just have a hard time
Speaker 2: with it. I know we hurt.
Speaker 1: Jane and I have discussed it a little bit.
Speaker 3: I think you still have to pass like a certain
Speaker 3: like there's still a certain test, like to go to
Speaker 3: the next grade, Like you have to know certain things right.
Speaker 5: In public school private school. I'm not sure that that
Speaker 5: is true.
Speaker 2: Interesting, So I guess my question to you is, you know,
Speaker 2: I'm sure, just like anything right, there's a give and
Speaker 2: take on each side. But what's your personal opinion when
Speaker 2: it comes to the education aspect for young kids and
Speaker 2: kind of your belief?
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's such a good question, and I have to
Speaker 5: admit that in the sort of during and in the aftermath,
Speaker 5: if we can call it that of COVID, I too
Speaker 5: have kind of been reevaluating my personal relationship with public
Speaker 5: education versus private education. It's given us all kind of
Speaker 5: a window into oh, maybe we can tailor make our
Speaker 5: educational journey for our kids in a way that we
Speaker 5: really hadn't thought about or didn't feel possible, and you know,
Speaker 5: sort of trying to decide what I make of that.
Speaker 5: And I too, wrestle with the idea of I want
Speaker 5: my kids to be resilient and sort of meet challenges and.
Speaker 4: Not be overly uh overly.
Speaker 5: Guided, so that can there's room for struggle, So there's
Speaker 5: room for you know, resilience building, and there's room for
Speaker 5: them to find their own path and make their own
Speaker 5: mistakes and pick themselves up.
Speaker 4: Uh.
Speaker 5: Also, I've been thinking about the importance of meeting a
Speaker 5: child where they are and having dedicated, like minded, really
Speaker 5: really warm, lovely teachers to think about my children more
Speaker 5: deeply than in a public school setting. And so those
Speaker 5: things are really on my mind. And I have to say,
Speaker 5: for me, I mean, and perhaps.
Speaker 4: Not surprisingly since I am a psychologists, but for me,
Speaker 4: you know, the idea that.
Speaker 5: Who my child is and who the rest of the
Speaker 5: children are around my child, and what best meets both
Speaker 5: my individual individual child means I'm thinking my six year
Speaker 5: old at the moment and the rest of the children's
Speaker 5: needs and the dynamics of the classroom feel really important
Speaker 5: to me. That probably leads me in the direction of
Speaker 5: a private school personally. And I too struggle a great amount,
Speaker 5: frankly with the idea of what a private school public
Speaker 5: school setting can offer in terms of the child kind
Speaker 5: of having to find their own way. So I think
Speaker 5: it's important to suss out if you go to the
Speaker 5: private school direction, kind of what's the balance there and
Speaker 5: what ways does a private school encourage and implement very
Speaker 5: clear ways on how children develop on their own way
Speaker 5: of thinking, a sense of responsibility, how they handle mistakes
Speaker 5: and failures, or is that kind of dynamic environment encouraged
Speaker 5: or is it a little bit too narrow.
Speaker 4: For those things to occur for sure? Right?
Speaker 5: And I think that if you can look, I mean,
Speaker 5: and we're talking about a pretty privileged problem. I want
Speaker 5: to acknowledge not everyone has researchs to send their children
Speaker 5: to private schoo and I really want to acknowledge that,
Speaker 5: and and not not everyone gets gets to have this discussion,
Speaker 5: right if you're fortunate not to have it, really being
Speaker 5: able to do a deep dive into what the private
Speaker 5: school setting is and can you leave in those dynamics
Speaker 5: that naturally more naturally occur in a public school setting.
Speaker 5: In theory, can do that you have the best of
Speaker 5: both worlds.
Speaker 2: In theory in theory. In theory I have. I think
Speaker 2: one of my biggest fears around kind of really changing
Speaker 2: my mindset around it being more open to private or
Speaker 2: homeschool or co opera whatever it looks like, is it's like,
Speaker 2: I feel like the whole culture change right where back
Speaker 2: in the day quote unquote, you know, come home, you
Speaker 2: get bad grade, your parents ask you, like, what did
Speaker 2: you do wrong? And nowadays the whole joke about they
Speaker 2: go to the they go to the teachers, it's like,
Speaker 2: what did you do wrong? Right, It's not their kids' fault,
Speaker 2: it's the teacher's fault that they didn't know the information.
Speaker 2: So along with that kind of running trend, I fear that,
Speaker 2: you know, maybe parents that do co op or do
Speaker 2: homeschool or private school maybe are trying to take some
Speaker 2: of the parenting off of themselves and really control what
Speaker 2: their kids learn by having the teacher teach them everything
Speaker 2: they need to teach, right, so then it's not on
Speaker 2: the parents to teach them anything when the kids get home.
Speaker 2: And I have an issue with that right, because I
Speaker 2: feel like we're very hands on parents. We take pride
Speaker 2: in being the parents, and I think parents just put
Speaker 2: too much on teachers plates and expectations that they expect
Speaker 2: their kids to learn everything from top to bottom, and
Speaker 2: they come home they don't know it. It's a teacher's fault.
Speaker 2: It's like, no, no, you're a parent, you still have to
Speaker 2: teach them. And so I make up that unfair stereotype
Speaker 2: of that's the kind of parents that are doing the alternatives,
Speaker 2: which is completely unfair for me to say. I'm not
Speaker 2: saying that all of them are like that. That's it's
Speaker 2: just like my fear is that's the kind of surrounding
Speaker 2: that our children.
Speaker 1: Would be in.
Speaker 4: Yeah, well, I love that you're thinking about that, actually.
Speaker 5: And I think that you can account for that or
Speaker 5: buffer that potential dynamic in your own family culture, right
Speaker 5: that if you decided to co operate homeschool or private school,
Speaker 5: et cetera, that at the beginning, you sit down with Jolly,
Speaker 5: who I think you said, is five and is ready
Speaker 5: to participate in a version of the following conversation. So
Speaker 5: mom and Dad made this decision, We're going to homeschool
Speaker 5: you and that we have amazing teachers, and we have
Speaker 5: a wonderful classroom setting. It's going to be exciting and
Speaker 5: fun and hear all the things that you're going to
Speaker 5: get to learn about and experience. And also mom and
Speaker 5: dad are going to be super involved in this because
Speaker 5: we are dedicated to your education. It is our job
Speaker 5: to make sure that you're exposed to all the things
Speaker 5: that we think are important so you can be a
Speaker 5: good citizen in the world, so you can make a
Speaker 5: decision about doing something you love. So you're going to
Speaker 5: see your teachers being really invested and involved you learning,
Speaker 5: but you're also going to see mom and dad really
Speaker 5: investing involved in what you're learning and so that you
Speaker 5: can you can continue. There's a continuum and you can
Speaker 5: bring that dynamic that you're talking about, which I kind
Speaker 5: of love home. I mean, I understand you're not wanting
Speaker 5: to uh accuse teachers of.
Speaker 4: Uh not doing enough or or parents are et cetera.
Speaker 5: Right, that that's not what you're getting up, But write
Speaker 5: the idea of like, wait, I don't want to.
Speaker 4: Hand this off. I want to participate.
Speaker 5: And you can do that by bringing in you know,
Speaker 5: supplemental projects, you know, books that you're interested in by
Speaker 5: having regular dialogue with your daughter or the teachers about
Speaker 5: what's happening, what's not happening, and and supplementing through your
Speaker 5: own teachings, through your own experiences that you have, and
Speaker 5: just talking about what's important to you so that if
Speaker 5: you're noticing she's not completing the homework or reading that
Speaker 5: she's supposed to be doing, but that that you.
Speaker 4: Take that on. This is something really important, Mom and dad,
Speaker 4: we really are invested.
Speaker 5: And the idea of responsibility and your responsibility this week
Speaker 5: is to read three bucks.
Speaker 3: Yeah for sure, right, Yeah, that.
Speaker 5: Those important kind of life values and sort of parental
Speaker 5: insights are not lost just because you've you've done a
Speaker 5: different academic growth.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: And I just I mean I never and like you said,
Speaker 3: like it seems so privileged to be talking about private school,
Speaker 3: and honestly, like I'm the cheapest person out there, and
Speaker 3: I've always been like, I am never sending my kids
Speaker 3: to private school. And that's why I wanted to have
Speaker 3: a conversation because I feel selfish that I'm because I
Speaker 3: want the family to be together, Like that's the only
Speaker 3: reason why. Because when I heard eight days, I was like, what,
Speaker 3: like then I'm like, I could never go a month
Speaker 3: without seeing, you know, my kids, and so it's you know,
Speaker 3: just kind of talking that out. But I think, you know, again,
Speaker 3: it's just like us having a conversation what's best for
Speaker 3: our family and you know, when, if, if, and when
Speaker 3: that happens that you know, I book ever the series
Speaker 3: in Vancouver or whatever. You know, like what that looks like,
Speaker 3: and you know how we make it work and how
Speaker 3: our values might have to you know, mold a little
Speaker 3: bit together. But I kind of want to switch gears
Speaker 3: though on couples post pandemic, because I feel like, you know,
Speaker 3: we saw a lot of divorces, but I also think
Speaker 3: it's helped a lot of marriages. To what's one of
Speaker 3: the things that you saw that has been that was
Speaker 3: beneficial for couples during the pandemic and post pandemic.
Speaker 5: Yes, well, a number of things come to mind, but
Speaker 5: what rises to the top is the sort of mixed
Speaker 5: bag of dynamics that have shown up.
Speaker 4: So couples have been required.
Speaker 5: To be physically and mentally and emotionally in the same
Speaker 5: space way more than they were a higher and in
Speaker 5: many of the couples that I've worked with that provoked
Speaker 5: issues to reveal themselves and oftentimes folks found themselves in
Speaker 5: my virtual office when they wouldn't have been right.
Speaker 4: And so although it started.
Speaker 5: Tricky or sort of conflictual, it provided an opportunity for vulnerability, authenticity,
Speaker 5: and eventually sort of connection and closeness.
Speaker 4: So really this exposure to one another.
Speaker 5: And I say it's bad because I've had both effects.
Speaker 5: I mean, I had lots of folks to come into
Speaker 5: my office and feeling like pet peeves about their partner,
Speaker 5: their frustrations with their partner, the lack of intimacy, lack
Speaker 5: of communication, difficulty dealing with conflict was just enhanced and
Speaker 5: increased given all the time they were spending together.
Speaker 4: And it gave them an opportunity.
Speaker 5: To face it and think about it rather than suppress it,
Speaker 5: dismiss it, avoid.
Speaker 3: It and what like. Because for me, I think one
Speaker 3: of the things that I have a hard time with
Speaker 3: is in the moment when we're having an argument. And
Speaker 3: we talked about this a few podcasts ago, but I'm like,
Speaker 3: it's over, it's done. Like I'm like, this is the
Speaker 3: end of the world. Like, how do you not go
Speaker 3: to that place when when you're in the like here
Speaker 3: it is again. This is the same fight, and it's
Speaker 3: not resolving, and it's not changing, and and it's and
Speaker 3: it's that blow up fight. But to not go to
Speaker 3: because he goes to the bedroom and he's like, it's
Speaker 3: just another fight. We'll be fine, and I'm like, you know,
Speaker 3: like this is the end of the world, Like I
Speaker 3: can't do this anymore, you know, And he's just like.
Speaker 1: Sweet till you get the email from the lawyer tomorrow, okay.
Speaker 4: And I was gonna ask you you actually say that
Speaker 4: out loud.
Speaker 3: I did say that the last time. Yeah, and shamefully
Speaker 3: I did say that the last time.
Speaker 1: But yeah, it's been a long time since you have it.
Speaker 3: It's been a long time since I've said that. And
Speaker 3: I think it's because I I'm not going to make
Speaker 3: an excuse for it, but you know, in those moments,
Speaker 3: it's just feels so much that I'm like, how do
Speaker 3: I not let it just take over all of me?
Speaker 3: So that way I can just be like, it's just
Speaker 3: a fight, we will be fine. Things need to change
Speaker 3: and grow, but it's not the end of the world,
Speaker 3: and I don't need to throw in the I can't
Speaker 3: do this anymore. Expect a letter from Rose.
Speaker 4: Yes, yeah, but I would I would do this.
Speaker 5: I mean, and it's it's much easier to do this
Speaker 5: in an objective, calm moment, but a good exercise sort
Speaker 5: of trying to make a verbal agreement to not go
Speaker 5: there is is a really good idea. Doesn't mean you
Speaker 5: never will, doesn't mean you won't make them say, I
Speaker 5: mean that's what it is human and through the.
Speaker 4: World together as a couple.
Speaker 5: Right, Let's at least try to commit to the idea of, like,
Speaker 5: I'm really going to try not to do that. I'm
Speaker 5: going to try not to leave that collateral damage along
Speaker 5: with the difficulty that comes from the conflict. And I
Speaker 5: think one of the ways that will help you do
Speaker 5: that will help both you do it, depending on if
Speaker 5: that comes up mutually, is leaning much more into the feeling.
Speaker 5: So instead of leaning into the narrative of like, oh
Speaker 5: my god, here we go again. We're never gonna get
Speaker 5: through this. It's always going to be like this, things
Speaker 5: will never.
Speaker 4: Change, we can't make it.
Speaker 5: Really leaning into the feeling, either out loud or to
Speaker 5: yourself or both of like I feel so hopeless, I
Speaker 5: feel so scared, soangous, so angry, you know whatever, the
Speaker 5: feelings are going to come up and be able to
Speaker 5: if it's a safe enough space, be able to say that.
Speaker 4: You could even say out loud, God.
Speaker 5: I'm in that moment where I feel like saying to you,
Speaker 5: we're never going to work, we're never going to laugh.
Speaker 5: But instead I'm going to tell you I'm so angry
Speaker 5: at you. I'm so angry at you that you just
Speaker 5: can't get this. I'm so angry that you won't put
Speaker 5: your arms around me right now, I'm so disappointed that
Speaker 5: this happened again, and that will there's a relief, there's
Speaker 5: like a tension relief that comes from saying our true, deep,
Speaker 5: vulnerable feelings that mitigates the need to say those other
Speaker 5: things because we feel so triggered right and you probably
Speaker 5: notice this with your kids at least sometimes that if
Speaker 5: you're able to name the feeling that there's a it's
Speaker 5: like letting the air out of the balloon. That's a
Speaker 5: way to help keep yourself from being heightened. And if
Speaker 5: it doesn't feel safe, for lack of a better word,
Speaker 5: to say that to Mike in the moment, for whatever
Speaker 5: sets of reasons, at least even saying that to yourself,
Speaker 5: Like what's like, what am I really feeling deeply here
Speaker 5: right now?
Speaker 4: Why am I so triggered? I'm really scared?
Speaker 3: I love that, Like I just feel hopeless. Like that's
Speaker 3: because that's such a vulnerable and hopefully you know that's
Speaker 3: just a way for you to settle.
Speaker 2: Yeah, if I heard that from you, like you came
Speaker 2: in the room instead of saying you're going to get
Speaker 2: an email from tomorrow being like, I just feel so
Speaker 2: hopeless right now.
Speaker 1: Yahyeah, that's it.
Speaker 5: I mean, it gives me like the chills like talking
Speaker 5: about it, because it's such a connecting, vulnerable thing and
Speaker 5: it's having a.
Speaker 4: Dynamic way of fighting.
Speaker 5: Is intimacy building, right, it is because if you say
Speaker 5: it them, I feel hopeless, I feel scared, then you
Speaker 5: can hear that and probably feel empathy or compassion or
Speaker 5: love or a desire to comfort her or something, and
Speaker 5: you're being vulnerable. So instead of hearing about Rose the lawyer,
Speaker 5: you're hearing about like, oh, she's scared inside right.
Speaker 4: For sure, closer to her. And so look, we.
Speaker 5: Don't we don't, we don't that like a thousand of
Speaker 5: that every time, But to the extent that we can
Speaker 5: start weaving that into how we do conflict.
Speaker 4: It makes such a big difference.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I think that's we need to learn how
Speaker 3: to do conflict better because we both want to be heard,
Speaker 3: and that's you know, our biggest thing with our therapist
Speaker 3: is trying to like that's I think the most escalates us. Yeah,
Speaker 3: that's because we're just really one one one. We'd keep
Speaker 3: going louder and louder and lotder, but so definitely we
Speaker 3: gotta we'll work on our conflict. But we we so
Speaker 3: appreciate you coming on and just talking about everything. I
Speaker 3: could talk to you all day, but I know that
Speaker 3: you've got clients. Can where can our listeners find you?
Speaker 3: Reach out? And can they actually use you as a
Speaker 3: psychiatrist too?
Speaker 4: Yeah? Yeah, so so two ways.
Speaker 5: Yeah, So you can find me at my website, which
Speaker 5: is doctor Hillarygoldsure dot.
Speaker 4: Com and it's g O L D S H E R.
Speaker 5: And then I'm just doing a relaunch of my instagram
Speaker 5: and it's at doctor Hillary LA and it will be
Speaker 5: populated with content in like the next two weeks or so,
Speaker 5: and it will be sort of chop full of like
Speaker 5: parenting stuff, a couple stuff, and self care stuff. So
Speaker 5: if you follow now it will be pretty empty, but
Speaker 5: issue if you stay for a couple of weeks, it
Speaker 5: will be it'll be populated soon. So yes, I'm taking
Speaker 5: clients and right now everything is still virtual giving COVID,
Speaker 5: but that makes my schedule a bit more flexible.
Speaker 3: Awesome, Well, thank you so much.
Speaker 4: Thanks for having me.
Speaker 1: So glad to talk to you guys, you too, thank you.
Speaker 3: Sure we'll talk to you again. Okay, good bye bye.
Speaker 3: I loved having like a real clinical therapist on psychiatrists.
Speaker 2: No, it's it's good to talk through that stuff. And
Speaker 2: I think, you know, on the topic of the education things.
Speaker 2: It's just it's interesting to just have the conversations more,
Speaker 2: you know, around just the possibilities of education and what
Speaker 2: that looks like and to get out of at least
Speaker 2: my own narrow mind and think about possibilities.
Speaker 3: Yeah, because we have friends that you're like co up,
Speaker 3: you know, like you're in a homeschool wow. And then
Speaker 3: then it's like, oh, actually, I really kind of like
Speaker 3: the sounds of homeschool now, you know, and because of
Speaker 3: certain COVID things or this or that or the other,
Speaker 3: and it's just we just don't want to mess up.
Speaker 3: I don't want to mess up as a parent, So
Speaker 3: I just want to make the best decision. I'm trying
Speaker 3: not to be selfish, but yet I'm being selfish because
Speaker 3: I don't want to be without my family during a movie.
Speaker 3: I'm scheduling. I literally scheduled the next movie so that
Speaker 3: I don't miss you know, Jolie's first day kindergarten, and
Speaker 3: then we don't have to be separated, right, But there's
Speaker 3: going to come of time where you know, I guess
Speaker 3: and this is all champagne freaking problems, but I just
Speaker 3: I wanted to talk about really just like how it
Speaker 3: might affect.
Speaker 1: Think about though. Everyone deals with this to an extent
Speaker 1: based around their careers. So whatever your career is.
Speaker 2: Right, you have to whether it's to move, yet you
Speaker 2: might have to move for another opportunity. You might have
Speaker 2: to you know, change your schedule because of how the
Speaker 2: other person's work schedule is. So that everyone deals with
Speaker 2: this on a different spectrum. This is just ours because
Speaker 2: of the you know, occupation that you have outside of
Speaker 2: the things that we do, and so it's just our
Speaker 2: obstacle to face as a Family's.
Speaker 3: Just so hard, you know, with my boob job and.
Speaker 2: Well I think that wraps up another episode. I gotta
Speaker 2: take some pills, all right until next week.
Speaker 4: L