WEBVTT - 2/23/26: Mexico Cartel Violence Explodes, Big Tech Freaks Over Data Center Backlash 0:00:00.080 --> 0:00:01.599 Hey, guys, Saga and Crystal here. 0:00:01.680 --> 0:00:05.200 Independent media just played a truly massive role in this election, 0:00:05.360 --> 0:00:07.840 and we are so excited about what that means for 0:00:07.880 --> 0:00:08.720 the future of this show. 0:00:08.880 --> 0:00:10.760 This is the only place where you can find honest 0:00:10.760 --> 0:00:13.239 perspectives from the left and the right that simply does 0:00:13.320 --> 0:00:14.680 not exist anywhere else. 0:00:14.760 --> 0:00:17.080 So if that is something that's important to you, please 0:00:17.120 --> 0:00:19.599 go to Breakingpoints dot com. Become a member today and 0:00:19.640 --> 0:00:22.800 you'll get access to our full shows, unedited, ad free, 0:00:22.800 --> 0:00:25.600 and all put together for you every morning in your inbox. 0:00:25.680 --> 0:00:27.560 We need your help to build the future of independent 0:00:27.560 --> 0:00:29.920 news media and we hope to see you at Breakingpoints 0:00:29.960 --> 0:00:33.760 dot com. 0:00:33.800 --> 0:00:36.800 All right, guys, we've been following some significant unrest in 0:00:37.080 --> 0:00:40.519 Mexico after the killing of a topcartel leader. We can 0:00:40.520 --> 0:00:44.200 put this article up on the screen from the Associated Press. 0:00:45.080 --> 0:00:49.519 They say here that Mexican Army kills leader of powerful 0:00:49.560 --> 0:00:53.040 Hollisco New Generation cartel during operation to capture him. The 0:00:53.080 --> 0:00:56.319 Mexican Army called the leader of that cartel, Elmencho he's 0:00:56.360 --> 0:00:59.520 known as on Sunday, decapitating what had become Mexico's most 0:00:59.520 --> 0:01:03.680 powerful drug cartel and thrusting swaws of the nation into chaos. 0:01:04.240 --> 0:01:06.720 Cars burned out by cartel members blocked roads more than 0:01:06.720 --> 0:01:09.200 two hundred and fifty points in twenty Mexican states. Authority 0:01:09.280 --> 0:01:13.880 said and left smoke billowing into the air. Olisco's capital, Guadalajara, 0:01:13.920 --> 0:01:16.200 was turned into a ghost town Sunday night as civilians 0:01:16.280 --> 0:01:18.959 hunkered down. School was canceled Monday in several states, and 0:01:19.040 --> 0:01:22.440 authorities in a variety of states reported at least fourteen dead, 0:01:22.520 --> 0:01:26.600 including seven National Guard troops. Joining us to discuss these 0:01:26.640 --> 0:01:30.760 developments is the Latin America Desk head of drop Site News, 0:01:30.840 --> 0:01:32.920 Jose Luis Granados saiha. 0:01:32.600 --> 0:01:35.240 Great to see Jose, Good to see you. See you again, Hi. 0:01:36.080 --> 0:01:38.240 So we can put some of these images up on 0:01:38.319 --> 0:01:41.360 the screen of you know, cars burning, you can see 0:01:41.440 --> 0:01:43.480 fires all over the place, and guys, you can just 0:01:43.560 --> 0:01:46.639 let this run. As Jose brings us up to speed. 0:01:47.000 --> 0:01:50.560 You'll just give us a sense of what the mood 0:01:50.680 --> 0:01:53.360 is there in Mexico and how significant of a development 0:01:53.400 --> 0:01:53.760 this is. 0:01:54.800 --> 0:01:57.200 You know, in terms of how significant is this is 0:01:57.280 --> 0:02:01.920 probably the biggest fish they could possibly catch. Nemesio Sea Mencho, 0:02:02.040 --> 0:02:04.840 as he's more commonly known, was the major player when 0:02:04.840 --> 0:02:07.160 it came to organized crime here. It can't be overstated 0:02:07.200 --> 0:02:11.520 how significant, how big of an impact against organized crime 0:02:11.520 --> 0:02:14.960 groups this well capture and then his subsequent death really 0:02:15.000 --> 0:02:17.160 is for Mexico. And that's why we saw sort of 0:02:17.520 --> 0:02:20.360 this response in the streets from his associates in these 0:02:20.440 --> 0:02:26.680 organized crime groups Carteljlisco, cj NNG or Las Cuatro Letras, 0:02:26.720 --> 0:02:29.440 the four letters. They have various names. They're kind of 0:02:29.840 --> 0:02:32.840 they are the largest organized crime group here, the most powerful, 0:02:32.880 --> 0:02:36.040 the most well connected. It's said that they were rivaling, 0:02:36.240 --> 0:02:39.480 you know, Intertransnational Corporation in terms of their reach and 0:02:39.600 --> 0:02:43.280 their international business connections. What was interesting about them is 0:02:43.320 --> 0:02:45.760 that they sort of were, in a way a kind 0:02:45.800 --> 0:02:48.360 of a new manifestation of organized crime groups. I think 0:02:48.400 --> 0:02:50.920 a lot of times people think of the cartels you 0:02:50.960 --> 0:02:51.520 know of. 0:02:51.680 --> 0:02:56.280 You know, Sinaloa, El Chapel, right, Felix Ariano, all of 0:02:56.320 --> 0:02:59.320 these different groups from you know, the series Netflix that 0:02:59.360 --> 0:03:02.200 covered the the Mexican organized crime situation. 0:03:02.560 --> 0:03:04.280 This one was a little bit different in that they 0:03:04.280 --> 0:03:08.520 were able to fill a vacuum incredibly quickly, grow incredibly quickly. 0:03:08.560 --> 0:03:11.400 And that's because they operated sort of learning the lessons 0:03:11.400 --> 0:03:14.440 of the previous cartel groups of not necessarily kind of 0:03:14.480 --> 0:03:17.920 wanting to virtual vertically integrate everything. They were kind of 0:03:17.919 --> 0:03:22.040 almost like a franchise model, where you know, people kind 0:03:22.040 --> 0:03:26.079 of pay tribute to the central organization without necessarily being 0:03:26.080 --> 0:03:28.519 tied to it. And that's generally true of organized crime groups. 0:03:28.639 --> 0:03:30.880 They're far less organized that I think people think. 0:03:31.160 --> 0:03:32.320 But this is of course huge. 0:03:32.360 --> 0:03:34.560 I mean, he was the top of this organized crime group. 0:03:34.600 --> 0:03:37.800 They had presence quite literally in every corner of this country, 0:03:37.920 --> 0:03:41.200 obviously mostly concentrated in the states where they were most active, 0:03:41.280 --> 0:03:43.520 like Kalisco, and that's where we saw the most violence. 0:03:43.560 --> 0:03:46.080 And I think to explain that, obviously we all saw 0:03:46.080 --> 0:03:49.080 these scenes of you know, billowing cars and roads being blocked, 0:03:49.120 --> 0:03:52.120 and of course, you know those are disturbing to see, 0:03:52.240 --> 0:03:54.360 but they shouldn't be overstated. You know, the article that 0:03:54.400 --> 0:03:56.880 you read to introduce this piece talked about the chaos 0:03:56.880 --> 0:03:59.480 and things like that. But that's precisely what these groups 0:03:59.520 --> 0:04:01.920 wanted to do. So they had their leader captured, and 0:04:02.000 --> 0:04:04.160 so as an act of protest you can think of, 0:04:04.480 --> 0:04:07.680 they go and unleash these kinds of acts of violence, 0:04:07.720 --> 0:04:10.760 these acts of intimidation in a sense, to send a 0:04:10.760 --> 0:04:13.000 message to say they're unhappy with what just happened to 0:04:13.040 --> 0:04:16.040 deliver a message to the federal government, the Mexican government, 0:04:16.040 --> 0:04:19.400 which was responsible for this operation, but also to show 0:04:19.640 --> 0:04:22.200 who's the strong actor, because now there's going to be, 0:04:22.520 --> 0:04:24.840 as always happens when you take out the top, when 0:04:24.880 --> 0:04:27.719 you decapitate these organizations, a bit of a competition in 0:04:27.800 --> 0:04:30.440 terms of who's going to now try to compete to 0:04:30.440 --> 0:04:32.680 become the new head of the organization. And what we 0:04:32.720 --> 0:04:35.799 saw yesterday in a sense is that is people trying 0:04:35.800 --> 0:04:37.960 to flex their own muscle to show, Look how many 0:04:37.960 --> 0:04:40.520 men I can mobilize, Look how much you know unrest 0:04:40.560 --> 0:04:42.760 I can cause I'm the one who should really rise. 0:04:42.640 --> 0:04:44.280 Up to be the next leader of this organization. 0:04:44.360 --> 0:04:47.200 That's very interesting. I didn't realize that, Jose as I 0:04:47.279 --> 0:04:49.320 understand it as well. Part of the reason that they 0:04:49.360 --> 0:04:52.040 do this is to inflict pain on the Mexican government. 0:04:52.160 --> 0:04:54.880 Not only is it bad publicity, but you know, there's 0:04:54.920 --> 0:04:57.960 a significant number of US tourists who are in the 0:04:58.040 --> 0:05:00.320 region who are you know, some of them were altering 0:05:00.360 --> 0:05:02.800 in place in their hotels, and obviously you know these 0:05:02.800 --> 0:05:06.720 things go viral or impact their tourism industry. How does 0:05:06.760 --> 0:05:10.560 the Mexican government come to the conclusion to carry out 0:05:10.560 --> 0:05:12.839 something like this, because we've seen in the past, you know, 0:05:12.880 --> 0:05:15.320 with the Chapitos, that famous raid and there was a 0:05:15.400 --> 0:05:18.320 massive gunfight and people were you know, there were bullets 0:05:18.320 --> 0:05:21.200 spraying in the streets and all of that. So they 0:05:21.320 --> 0:05:23.800 know this is going to happen. How do they come 0:05:23.839 --> 0:05:26.560 to the conclusion ultimately to conduct a raid like this? 0:05:27.080 --> 0:05:30.160 So here in Mexico we have a National Security Cabinet, 0:05:30.320 --> 0:05:32.640 and that is essentially the body that's tess with making 0:05:32.680 --> 0:05:36.360 these difficult decisions. And part of the kind of calculation 0:05:36.600 --> 0:05:38.960 is that, in fact, under the previous government, now the 0:05:39.120 --> 0:05:42.240 Shinbam's predecessor, Nopus Obrador, there was that famous case where 0:05:42.240 --> 0:05:45.800 one of n Champo's sons was ultimately let go because 0:05:45.960 --> 0:05:48.839 they made the evaluation that the kind of violence that 0:05:48.920 --> 0:05:51.400 this was going to unleash was basically not worth it. 0:05:51.440 --> 0:05:54.400 You know, there was a calculation link should we proceed 0:05:54.440 --> 0:05:57.640 with his detention and allow them to unleash the kind 0:05:57.680 --> 0:05:59.840 of violence that we expect them to, or should we 0:05:59.880 --> 0:06:01.640 come to walk away and find a better moment for this. 0:06:02.000 --> 0:06:04.599 I think what's important about this one is that there's 0:06:04.640 --> 0:06:07.479 a couple of things. One there was important intelligence that 0:06:07.560 --> 0:06:09.800 was shared from the United States. Apparently both the US 0:06:09.880 --> 0:06:12.040 government the Mexican government have now said as much that 0:06:12.080 --> 0:06:15.400 there was key intelligence here. It sounds like they knew 0:06:15.400 --> 0:06:17.280 where he was, that this was a good chance to 0:06:17.320 --> 0:06:20.040 grab him where he wasn't being heavily protected, where they 0:06:20.040 --> 0:06:22.440 were less able to kind of mobilize, and so it 0:06:22.520 --> 0:06:24.680 seems that that's the reason they took the decision. This 0:06:24.800 --> 0:06:26.839 was a good moment, they had good intelligence, they could 0:06:26.920 --> 0:06:28.920 act on it. But the other one was also kind 0:06:28.920 --> 0:06:31.920 of understanding that they needed it to strike against these 0:06:32.000 --> 0:06:33.960 organized crime groups. They needed to I think, in a 0:06:33.960 --> 0:06:37.000 lot of ways send a message, not just to the 0:06:37.120 --> 0:06:40.080 organized crimes groups themselves, to say that we're serious about 0:06:40.120 --> 0:06:42.599 going after you, that this is a different kind of 0:06:42.640 --> 0:06:46.440 administration in terms of a much stronger, heavier hand when 0:06:46.440 --> 0:06:48.440 it comes to these groups, but also a message to 0:06:48.480 --> 0:06:50.960 Donald Trump to the White House to say you know 0:06:51.520 --> 0:06:53.600 that right now, the debate that seems to be happening 0:06:54.080 --> 0:06:56.800 in the United States is whether there should be unilateral 0:06:56.839 --> 0:06:59.520 military action by the United States in Mexico. Mexico obviously 0:06:59.520 --> 0:07:01.560 has said no, that's a redline for this government. They 0:07:01.560 --> 0:07:04.080 would view it as a violation of sovereignty. But you 0:07:04.160 --> 0:07:06.800 have to continually make that case because Donald Trump has 0:07:06.839 --> 0:07:09.800 said on many occasions he wants to send troops into Mexico, 0:07:09.880 --> 0:07:12.880 he wants to use drone strikes, and Mexican President Glaudias 0:07:12.880 --> 0:07:15.080 Shambam has said, you can share intelligence, but when it 0:07:15.120 --> 0:07:17.520 comes to military action, we conduct it because this is 0:07:17.560 --> 0:07:19.720 our territory. And I think this is in a lot 0:07:19.760 --> 0:07:21.800 of ways really good for the Mexican government in that 0:07:21.840 --> 0:07:24.920 sense to say, look, share this information, we can act 0:07:24.960 --> 0:07:27.120 on it, and we can take care of it. And obviously, 0:07:27.160 --> 0:07:30.680 now the task is to deal with the fallout, to 0:07:30.720 --> 0:07:34.120 deal with these incidents. Although they've largely been under control. 0:07:34.360 --> 0:07:36.680 As of yesterday, ninety percent of all the roadblocks had 0:07:36.680 --> 0:07:39.360 been stopped, had been kind of, you know, de established. 0:07:39.600 --> 0:07:42.360 But you know, this morning, Gladysheimmum's in her morning press 0:07:42.400 --> 0:07:45.480 conference now and she's giving the message as we speak, 0:07:45.800 --> 0:07:47.880 essentially giving the same thing that things are now fully 0:07:47.920 --> 0:07:48.440 under control. 0:07:49.000 --> 0:07:51.400 Sure is there a fear that you know, you're sort 0:07:51.400 --> 0:07:53.120 of damned if you do, damned if you don't, if 0:07:53.120 --> 0:07:56.880 you don't strike this cartel leader and take him out. 0:07:56.960 --> 0:07:59.240 Then the US government says, see, they're not dealing with 0:07:59.280 --> 0:08:01.200 the cartels. We have to go out and take you 0:08:01.240 --> 0:08:04.200 in a lateral action. But then when you do take 0:08:04.240 --> 0:08:06.680 out the cartile leader, it leads not just to these 0:08:06.720 --> 0:08:09.040 flare ups, but the expectation is there probably will be 0:08:09.080 --> 0:08:12.120 some sort of turf war and potential increased violence, and 0:08:12.160 --> 0:08:14.000 then the US government can look at that. Trump can 0:08:14.040 --> 0:08:15.800 look at that and say, see, look at all this 0:08:16.000 --> 0:08:18.360 escalating violence they need as we have to go in. 0:08:19.080 --> 0:08:21.400 Yeah, and it's quite likely that there'll be some actors 0:08:21.440 --> 0:08:23.720 who will make that kind of case and say, well, 0:08:23.760 --> 0:08:26.680 look look at everything that's happening. You don't have under control. 0:08:26.680 --> 0:08:29.960 And that's actually why I think we saw online yesterday 0:08:30.120 --> 0:08:33.640 just fake images, artificial intelligence. There was this image of 0:08:33.640 --> 0:08:36.400 a plane on fire that was not real whatsoever. You know, 0:08:36.440 --> 0:08:39.800 somebody apparently triggered an alarm inside of the airport in 0:08:39.840 --> 0:08:42.120 Gua la Dajada and that made some people panic, and 0:08:42.160 --> 0:08:45.280 then somebody took that image and said, look, the commandos 0:08:45.280 --> 0:08:47.520 from the organized crime groups have taken over the airport 0:08:47.640 --> 0:08:49.520 because they want to sow this chaos. They want to 0:08:49.520 --> 0:08:52.160 sow this kind of sense of a lack of control 0:08:52.200 --> 0:08:55.080 in order to I think in one in one regard 0:08:55.160 --> 0:08:57.800 try to support this argument that it's out of control 0:08:57.840 --> 0:09:00.120 and the Mexican government can't handle it, but also to 0:09:00.559 --> 0:09:02.920 try to I said at the beginning, to to send 0:09:02.920 --> 0:09:05.600 this message that they are more powerful than perhaps people 0:09:06.160 --> 0:09:06.720 account for. 0:09:06.920 --> 0:09:07.079 Right. 0:09:07.559 --> 0:09:09.559 And you know, I think on one of the reasons 0:09:09.559 --> 0:09:11.880 they also acted yesterday is that there's very small windows 0:09:11.920 --> 0:09:14.360 of opportunity. These are wildly actors. I mean, how many 0:09:14.360 --> 0:09:17.640 times did El Chapo escape from custody? Right, it's only 0:09:17.640 --> 0:09:20.120 because he's been extradited and it's more difficult for him 0:09:20.160 --> 0:09:23.000 to be able to kind of engage in the bribery 0:09:23.000 --> 0:09:24.559 that it takes to be able to get free, that 0:09:24.640 --> 0:09:27.160 he's still in custody today. And so I think that 0:09:27.200 --> 0:09:30.120 window they saw it as as a good one to act, 0:09:30.400 --> 0:09:33.280 and yes, cognizant of the consequences in terms of what 0:09:33.320 --> 0:09:37.720 will happen next. The case of is curious too, because 0:09:38.040 --> 0:09:40.720 you know, for example, with the you know, the X 0:09:41.440 --> 0:09:43.400 I don't know what to call it, kids, he wasn't extradite, 0:09:43.400 --> 0:09:46.600 and the kidnapping of El Mayo, you know, that created 0:09:46.640 --> 0:09:49.920 a lot of unrest as well, But I think that's 0:09:49.960 --> 0:09:54.160 because there was already kind of a dispute internally between 0:09:54.240 --> 0:09:57.800 rival factions inside of that cartel where you had the 0:09:57.880 --> 0:10:00.280 Chapito's and the Maitos, and so that that's part of 0:10:00.280 --> 0:10:02.480 why we saw so much more violence, and this one 0:10:02.679 --> 0:10:05.240 it doesn't look like there's a natural successor a lot 0:10:05.280 --> 0:10:08.560 of his closest associates and Mental's closest associates are either 0:10:08.760 --> 0:10:11.320 dead or in jail, and so you know, his son 0:10:11.360 --> 0:10:15.520 is already detained, his daughters are not that active, so 0:10:15.559 --> 0:10:17.760 it's not clear who will take over. There's likely going 0:10:17.800 --> 0:10:20.640 to be a lot of internal power disputes and they're 0:10:20.679 --> 0:10:22.959 going to do it through violence, and so there it's 0:10:22.960 --> 0:10:25.920 important to see in terms of what's the actual capacity 0:10:26.360 --> 0:10:29.240 of the Mexican National Guard, the Mexican armed forces to 0:10:29.440 --> 0:10:32.800 ensure security, particularly in these kinds of hot spots where 0:10:32.800 --> 0:10:36.000 they are most active. That really is the major challenge today, Jose. 0:10:36.160 --> 0:10:40.960 How does the Mexican government deal with the It's kind 0:10:41.000 --> 0:10:42.840 of a maybe too broad of a question, but with 0:10:43.200 --> 0:10:46.720 US security, so like, for example, you've had the US 0:10:46.800 --> 0:10:49.960 intelligence sharing that happened that led to this red but 0:10:50.040 --> 0:10:52.480 we also saw earlier there was an incident. Maybe you 0:10:52.520 --> 0:10:56.720 can tell us about where a drug dealer international fugitive 0:10:56.760 --> 0:10:59.040 was seized by the United States, and cash Betel took 0:10:59.080 --> 0:11:01.440 credit for it, but the Mexicans were like, hey man, 0:11:01.520 --> 0:11:03.320 you weren't supposed to talk about that, Like, we don't 0:11:03.360 --> 0:11:06.440 like to acknowledge how much we share back and forth. 0:11:07.200 --> 0:11:11.160 Does how does a Mexican government handle that domestically? Like 0:11:11.240 --> 0:11:14.760 why are they so reticent to admit US cooperation to 0:11:14.880 --> 0:11:17.640 the Mexican public? Is there a political dynamic I'm missing? 0:11:17.679 --> 0:11:18.439 How does that work? 0:11:19.200 --> 0:11:19.520 Yeah? 0:11:19.559 --> 0:11:23.200 So the case you're referred to as this Canadian apparently 0:11:23.200 --> 0:11:26.160 an Olympic athlete who was accused of being you know, 0:11:26.280 --> 0:11:29.040 well positioned an important player in organized crimes. And yeah, 0:11:29.080 --> 0:11:32.439 it's still actually not clear exactly whether or not he 0:11:32.520 --> 0:11:34.880 turned himself in, whether it was an operation, was it 0:11:34.880 --> 0:11:38.880 done by Mexican forces, did the FBI participate directly? That 0:11:38.920 --> 0:11:42.760 would be extraordinary unusual. I have trouble believing cash Hotel 0:11:42.840 --> 0:11:45.360 sometimes because we know he has a pension for wanting 0:11:45.400 --> 0:11:47.880 to tell his own story in his own way that 0:11:48.000 --> 0:11:50.679 kind of inflates his role in all of this. So 0:11:51.559 --> 0:11:53.840 I would you know, be hesitant to believe to take 0:11:53.920 --> 0:11:57.000 his you know, totally as believable. But are You're right, 0:11:57.080 --> 0:12:00.560 there is a certain kind of reluctance on the Mexican 0:12:00.600 --> 0:12:02.480 government to admit this, and a lot of that is 0:12:02.520 --> 0:12:05.840 because of the nationalist sentiment. More and her political party 0:12:06.080 --> 0:12:09.280 is a very Mexican nationalist movement. It's kind of one 0:12:09.280 --> 0:12:13.800 of the pillars of their political ideology. And it is seen, 0:12:13.840 --> 0:12:19.199 as you know, almost as offensive that we would need 0:12:19.200 --> 0:12:21.360 the support of the United States for all of this. Right, 0:12:21.480 --> 0:12:24.120 That's why it's such a hard line to not permit 0:12:24.240 --> 0:12:26.720 unilateral military action by the United States or even the 0:12:26.720 --> 0:12:30.319 presence of US troops in actual operations. They are Uria's 0:12:30.320 --> 0:12:32.800 troops here for trainings when was recently approved by the 0:12:32.800 --> 0:12:36.640 Mexican Senate, for example. So there's a there's a dislike 0:12:36.720 --> 0:12:40.440 for it amongst the population, and I think because people 0:12:40.480 --> 0:12:42.280 are worried that it would be a super slope. Right, 0:12:42.360 --> 0:12:45.760 How do US entanglements abroad always begin. It always starts 0:12:45.800 --> 0:12:48.160 with that, with training, with advice. Oh, well, we should 0:12:48.280 --> 0:12:50.760 use some information. But you are right to point out 0:12:50.760 --> 0:12:53.720 that there's an extraordinary amount of information sharing, in fact, 0:12:53.840 --> 0:12:57.120 more than we probably know. Gladys Sheinbaum and Donald Trump 0:12:57.120 --> 0:12:59.240 apparently had more than a dozen phone calls. But we 0:12:59.320 --> 0:13:01.280 only really know that details of a handful of them. 0:13:01.400 --> 0:13:03.920 So they're obviously high level negotiations. And that's how the 0:13:03.920 --> 0:13:06.560 Mexican government likes to do things, I think, particularly with 0:13:07.000 --> 0:13:09.280 the administration we have in the United States now, where 0:13:09.520 --> 0:13:12.000 you know, they are boastful and they like to, you know, 0:13:12.160 --> 0:13:15.040 stretch the truth, to be polite about it, right, And 0:13:15.120 --> 0:13:18.040 so she's like I often, she says, I often don't 0:13:18.080 --> 0:13:20.520 like to respond to whatever his public statements he makes. 0:13:20.800 --> 0:13:22.959 We have our conversations. They happen at the table, they 0:13:22.960 --> 0:13:25.280 happen behind closed doors. That's what's actually important in the 0:13:25.320 --> 0:13:26.440 bilateral relationship. 0:13:26.559 --> 0:13:26.920 Got it? 0:13:26.960 --> 0:13:29.640 And how did most Mexicans feel about how Shinbaum is 0:13:29.720 --> 0:13:31.600 navigating the relationship with the US. 0:13:32.160 --> 0:13:35.160 Well, I think they would be feel encouraged. I think 0:13:35.200 --> 0:13:38.080 they are feel very positive about it. She has extraordinarily 0:13:38.160 --> 0:13:41.040 high approval ratings. They oscillate between seventy and eighty percent. 0:13:41.080 --> 0:13:44.720 I mean the kinds of approval ratings people are unheard 0:13:44.720 --> 0:13:47.040 of in most parts of the world, and part of it, 0:13:47.160 --> 0:13:49.960 you know, one of the places where she does receive criticism, 0:13:50.040 --> 0:13:52.160 where people feel like more needs to be done, is 0:13:52.160 --> 0:13:56.199 precisely aroun of security under the previous administration of Lopos Obradorda, 0:13:56.200 --> 0:13:59.319 there was a pretty major shift in the security strategy 0:13:59.600 --> 0:14:01.640 where they went from an all out war, you know, 0:14:01.640 --> 0:14:04.280 they stopped talking about war, they stopped talking about, you know, 0:14:04.720 --> 0:14:08.880 the war against the cartels, and instead started focusing more 0:14:08.920 --> 0:14:14.240 on investigation prevention above all, this philosophy of investing in 0:14:14.320 --> 0:14:16.720 communities and in young people to try to dissuade them 0:14:16.760 --> 0:14:18.760 from organized crimeums. And I think in a lot of 0:14:18.800 --> 0:14:23.080 ways it was affected. But we're also dealing with really violent, 0:14:23.480 --> 0:14:27.960 heavily armed, and extremely well funded organizations where social investment 0:14:28.040 --> 0:14:29.760 is not going to be enough, right, And I do 0:14:29.840 --> 0:14:32.920 think that with Glaudy Scheinbaum, and she probably wouldn't say 0:14:33.080 --> 0:14:35.120 as much so as to not seem as if she's 0:14:35.160 --> 0:14:39.160 disagreeing with her predecessor because of the important place he 0:14:39.200 --> 0:14:41.920 occupies in the kind of political imaginary in this country. 0:14:42.040 --> 0:14:44.680 But I do think has taken a far more aggressive 0:14:44.720 --> 0:14:47.920 approach of wanting to go after these major figures of 0:14:48.120 --> 0:14:51.160 I think part of it is naturally due to the 0:14:51.160 --> 0:14:53.360 pressure of the United States to kind of, you know, 0:14:53.760 --> 0:14:57.240 have more things to show off in terms of successes. 0:14:58.080 --> 0:15:00.000 But I do think that a lot of people are 0:15:00.080 --> 0:15:05.160 are feeling reassured, you know, a feeling like actions are 0:15:05.160 --> 0:15:08.480 being done and that steps are being taken to attend 0:15:08.480 --> 0:15:09.800 to the kind of quality. 0:15:09.440 --> 0:15:10.160 Of life things. 0:15:10.560 --> 0:15:12.560 You know, organized crime grofts have been active here in 0:15:12.600 --> 0:15:15.560 this country for decades, right, but it's sort of their 0:15:15.840 --> 0:15:19.040 their interventions there. They're the way that they actually affect 0:15:19.040 --> 0:15:20.800 the day to day of people that really kind of 0:15:20.920 --> 0:15:24.160 undermines their confidence and the ability the state to handle this. 0:15:24.320 --> 0:15:24.960 Right, So, the. 0:15:25.000 --> 0:15:28.760 Kidnappings, the extortion, all of that, actually under her security 0:15:28.840 --> 0:15:32.240 chief or Madragracia Hartfuch, who incidentally was once a target 0:15:32.280 --> 0:15:35.600 of the very man who was killed yesterday, has been 0:15:35.600 --> 0:15:39.320 far more on investigation and actually you know, going after 0:15:39.480 --> 0:15:41.960 the money that provides them the ability to engage in 0:15:42.000 --> 0:15:44.400 all of this. And you know, we're seeing a very 0:15:44.440 --> 0:15:48.080 slight increase I think in the approval ratings when it 0:15:48.080 --> 0:15:50.800 comes to security here in Mexico because of that small 0:15:50.800 --> 0:15:53.600 shift but important shift in her security strategy. 0:15:53.840 --> 0:15:54.480 So interesting. 0:15:54.920 --> 0:15:57.280 One more question I have for you on a somewhat 0:15:57.280 --> 0:15:59.240 separate note, and I asked the same question of Professor 0:15:59.320 --> 0:16:02.440 Jeffrey Sachs, who we had on a bit earlier, and 0:16:02.480 --> 0:16:04.440 this is with regard to Cuba. I'm sure you saw 0:16:04.480 --> 0:16:07.160 Supreme Court struck down Trump's ability to levy tariffs, you know, 0:16:07.280 --> 0:16:10.080 latterly using the AIPA authority. He had used this to 0:16:10.120 --> 0:16:13.480 threaten Mexico and to threaten shine Bomb to try to 0:16:13.600 --> 0:16:17.160 enforce this illegal oil embargo with Cuba. Do you think 0:16:17.200 --> 0:16:20.200 that that decision changes the calculus at all for the 0:16:20.240 --> 0:16:21.240 Shinebomb government? 0:16:22.120 --> 0:16:24.120 Well, it looks like Trump is going to go forward 0:16:24.120 --> 0:16:27.120 with it no matter what. And you know, Mexico has 0:16:27.120 --> 0:16:30.040 been threatened with tariffs on half a dozen occasions and 0:16:30.080 --> 0:16:32.640 has been able to talk their way out of it 0:16:32.680 --> 0:16:34.960 almost every single time, even this most recent one where 0:16:35.000 --> 0:16:37.040 he announced these kind of across the board tariffs on 0:16:37.080 --> 0:16:40.840 every country once again. Countries, Canada, Mexico and that's part 0:16:40.840 --> 0:16:43.480 of the USMCA are not are exempt from it. And 0:16:43.560 --> 0:16:46.520 so the thing about this one, in particular, the one 0:16:46.520 --> 0:16:49.440 about Cuba, is that my reading of it, it was 0:16:50.120 --> 0:16:54.720 primarily addressed to Mexico. Mexico, stopped sending your oil to Cuba, 0:16:54.840 --> 0:16:56.960 or We're going to impose this tariff on you. And 0:16:57.040 --> 0:16:59.520 I think the fact that we saw the government respond 0:16:59.680 --> 0:17:04.960 and suspended shipments tells us that in those closed doors negotiations. 0:17:05.280 --> 0:17:07.840 There was definitely a very clear threat to say that 0:17:07.880 --> 0:17:09.679 this one's serious. You're not gonna be able to talk 0:17:09.680 --> 0:17:11.720 your way out of this one, that we want to 0:17:11.920 --> 0:17:15.000 choke off the supply of oil to Cuba, and so 0:17:15.280 --> 0:17:17.320 you better play ball. And that's why we've seen them 0:17:17.359 --> 0:17:19.720 suspended because I think, you know, there's a lot of 0:17:20.200 --> 0:17:22.199 voices out there who are saying, well, why don't they 0:17:22.240 --> 0:17:24.320 just break the blockade, right, why don't they just kind 0:17:24.320 --> 0:17:27.000 of challenge colls bluff? You know, the United States is 0:17:27.040 --> 0:17:30.720 having some tricky economics numbers coming published out now, not 0:17:30.840 --> 0:17:32.720 less job creation, all of that. Can they really afford 0:17:32.760 --> 0:17:34.479 to put a tariff on its number one trading partner? 0:17:34.760 --> 0:17:36.600 And I think they would the end, I think they've 0:17:36.640 --> 0:17:39.560 transmitted that message to the Mexican government that this is serious, 0:17:39.560 --> 0:17:41.720 and so the only way out of this for the 0:17:41.760 --> 0:17:45.160 Mexican government is through negotiation, some kind of diplomatic breakthrough 0:17:45.359 --> 0:17:48.680 to convince them that if they don't allow Mexico or 0:17:48.720 --> 0:17:50.919 any other country to provide oil, then they're going to 0:17:50.960 --> 0:17:53.760 produce a massive humanitarian crisis, which itself is going to 0:17:53.760 --> 0:17:56.160 produce a huge refugee crisis, which is going to land 0:17:56.160 --> 0:17:58.879 on your doorstep, United States. So I think that's the 0:17:58.960 --> 0:18:00.960 kind of angle that they been pushing for, and it 0:18:01.000 --> 0:18:03.480 seems to be working. There seems to be your rumors 0:18:03.520 --> 0:18:06.240 of at least setting some oil come in so that 0:18:07.280 --> 0:18:10.560 the situation doesn't become such a big problem that we see, 0:18:10.720 --> 0:18:14.000 you know, millions of Cubans trying to leave the island 0:18:14.040 --> 0:18:17.360 because if they get no oil, we're talking about basically 0:18:17.359 --> 0:18:20.920 the collapse of society, right, you know, nothing works without energy, 0:18:20.960 --> 0:18:23.960 there's no food, there's no hospitals, there's no schools. I mean, 0:18:24.119 --> 0:18:27.240 it'll be a nightmare scenario for the Cuban people, which 0:18:27.240 --> 0:18:30.080 would absolutely produce a refugee crisis in the region and 0:18:30.160 --> 0:18:32.919 for the United States. And I don't think Marco Rubio 0:18:33.000 --> 0:18:35.320 Stephen Miller want to be tagged with that to say 0:18:35.400 --> 0:18:37.720 you're the reason there's a new migrants crisis here in 0:18:37.720 --> 0:18:38.399 the United States. 0:18:38.480 --> 0:18:41.960 Good point, we will say, Jose thank you so much. 0:18:42.160 --> 0:18:43.320 Great to have your analysis. 0:18:43.520 --> 0:18:45.200 No, thank you very much for inviting me. We'll see 0:18:45.240 --> 0:18:45.720 you next Tore. 0:18:48.640 --> 0:18:50.920 All right, guys, you know we have been tracking closely 0:18:51.000 --> 0:18:54.040 here some of the local pushback against data centers being 0:18:54.080 --> 0:18:57.120