WEBVTT - Covid Swabs Supply Depends on Two Cousins 0:00:01.800 --> 0:00:04.400 This is Bloomberg Business Week. I'm Carol Masser and I'm 0:00:04.440 --> 0:00:07.280 Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stanibek. We're here every day bringing 0:00:07.280 --> 0:00:09.799 you the latest news from the world of business and finance, 0:00:09.840 --> 0:00:13.600 plus technology, politics, economics, all harnessing the power of Business 0:00:13.640 --> 0:00:17.119 Week reporters and editors, not to mention our journalists and 0:00:17.120 --> 0:00:19.480 analyst in more than one d and twenty countries. You 0:00:19.520 --> 0:00:22.840 can download Bloomberg Business Week and iTunes, SoundCloud, or Bloomberg 0:00:22.840 --> 0:00:24.840 dot com. You can also listen to our radio show 0:00:24.840 --> 0:00:27.560 at two pm Eastern Time on Bloomberg Radio or watch 0:00:27.600 --> 0:00:34.280 us on YouTube search Bloomberg Global News. The global COVID 0:00:34.360 --> 0:00:37.440 cases a hundred and twenty one point three million deaths 0:00:37.479 --> 0:00:40.239 topping two point six eight million. So let's get an 0:00:40.280 --> 0:00:41.839 update on kind of where we are. Let's bring in 0:00:41.880 --> 0:00:45.239 Alexander White, Assistant Professor of sociology and the History of 0:00:45.280 --> 0:00:48.040 Medicine at Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health, which 0:00:48.080 --> 0:00:50.800 is supported by Michael R. Bloomberg, founder of Bloomberg LP 0:00:50.920 --> 0:00:55.160 and Bloomberg Philanthropies. Alexander on the phone in Baltimore, Alexander, 0:00:55.360 --> 0:00:57.880 nice to have you here. It does feel like vaccines 0:00:57.880 --> 0:01:01.320 are getting out to more people globally, certainly here in 0:01:01.360 --> 0:01:04.000 the United States. At the same time, you know, we 0:01:04.000 --> 0:01:05.679 still have a lot of cases, and we still have 0:01:05.800 --> 0:01:08.720 areas of the world that are going into lockdown. How 0:01:08.720 --> 0:01:11.080 do you see kind of where we are when it 0:01:11.120 --> 0:01:14.640 comes to COVID nineteen. Hi, thank you, thank you so 0:01:14.760 --> 0:01:16.360 much for having me. So I think we're we're in 0:01:16.400 --> 0:01:22.640 an interesting I think we're an interesting inflection point um 0:01:22.760 --> 0:01:25.760 with with the pandemic. We're obviously we're seeing large and 0:01:25.840 --> 0:01:28.960 much higher rates of vaccination, but we're also seeing concerning 0:01:29.040 --> 0:01:32.560 risers in cases. So at this moment, you know, it's 0:01:32.640 --> 0:01:37.000 very critical that we remain um masking, we remain social distancing, 0:01:37.000 --> 0:01:40.640 while also getting out as many vaccines as possible. Well, 0:01:40.680 --> 0:01:43.240 and to that point, we have often talked here on 0:01:43.240 --> 0:01:47.520 Bloomberg about the difficulty in reaching all populations. Are all 0:01:47.560 --> 0:01:50.559 populations wanting to take the vaccine, but it does seem 0:01:50.600 --> 0:01:53.160 like increasingly the story is people want to take the vaccine, 0:01:53.160 --> 0:01:55.600 but they can't always figure out how to sign up 0:01:55.600 --> 0:01:57.640 for it, or they don't have access to the technology 0:01:57.640 --> 0:01:59.360 to sign up, or they just can't get to a 0:01:59.400 --> 0:02:04.559 place to get the actual vaccine. How are you seeing that. Yeah, 0:02:04.560 --> 0:02:07.000 that that's exactly right. UM. I think it's a very 0:02:07.040 --> 0:02:10.040 serious concern. You know, in the early days of when 0:02:10.040 --> 0:02:12.240 the vaccine was being rolled out in the United States especially, 0:02:12.280 --> 0:02:18.000 the concern was overwhelmingly about vaccine hesitancy, especially in UM, black, 0:02:18.040 --> 0:02:24.240 Indigenous and minority populations that have historically been UM negatively 0:02:24.240 --> 0:02:29.079 exposed to public health interactions, incidences of medical race and etcetera. 0:02:29.280 --> 0:02:31.680 What we're seeing now is actually, you know, in many ways, 0:02:31.800 --> 0:02:37.000 the those initial concerns about vaccine hesitancy and really dropping. 0:02:37.320 --> 0:02:40.080 And what's much more serious is you you know, as 0:02:40.160 --> 0:02:45.520 you mentioned, increasing access to vaccine, increasing accessibility on how 0:02:45.680 --> 0:02:49.079 to to access a vaccine, how to access technology and 0:02:49.120 --> 0:02:51.960 allow you to sign up UM, and and these issues 0:02:52.000 --> 0:02:54.160 which are becoming more and more important as we scale 0:02:54.240 --> 0:02:56.560 up the vaccine delivery across the country. Well, let's talk 0:02:56.600 --> 0:02:59.840 about this organization that you've been working with, communivacs Exactly. 0:03:00.000 --> 0:03:01.680 Who are they, what are they, what are they setting 0:03:01.680 --> 0:03:06.079 out to do? Yes, so, UM Communitas is a national 0:03:06.080 --> 0:03:10.000 alliance of social scientists, public health experts, and community advocates 0:03:10.040 --> 0:03:14.400 who seek your last sting solutions to this particular serious problem. 0:03:14.440 --> 0:03:17.320 As we all know, in the United States historically underserved, 0:03:17.639 --> 0:03:20.720 underserved in the realm of healthcare. Black, Indigenous and Latin 0:03:20.919 --> 0:03:25.520 populations have endured negative health and economic impacts from COVID 0:03:25.600 --> 0:03:29.639 from COVID nineteen pandemic at tragic and disproportionate rates. And 0:03:29.680 --> 0:03:33.040 while these communities could benefit greatly from safe and effective 0:03:33.080 --> 0:03:37.360 to the nineteen vactinations, longstanding biases and barriers hinder their 0:03:37.400 --> 0:03:41.280 access to the vaccine. And you know, our coalition is 0:03:41.280 --> 0:03:44.240 is strengthening an attempting to strengthen national and local COVID 0:03:44.280 --> 0:03:48.040 vactination efforts in the United States by really putting communities 0:03:48.080 --> 0:03:50.360 of color at the center of these endeavors, with the 0:03:50.400 --> 0:03:53.520 goal of building towards not only the equitable delivery of 0:03:53.560 --> 0:03:56.640 COVID nineteen vaccines around the country, but also pushed towards 0:03:56.640 --> 0:04:01.320 collaborative and equitable public health service the place minoritized community 0:04:01.360 --> 0:04:05.640 is really at the center of decision making. Alexander's Alexand 0:04:05.720 --> 0:04:07.160 let me just let me just jump in for a second. 0:04:07.160 --> 0:04:08.800 Is it safe to say that the problem is because 0:04:08.800 --> 0:04:12.400 I'm curious, how come there isn't the same access to 0:04:12.480 --> 0:04:16.200 all communities within the United States? And is it kind 0:04:16.200 --> 0:04:19.719 of similar to great healthcare. It isn't the same access 0:04:19.800 --> 0:04:22.400 to all communities of the United States. So there's a bigger, 0:04:22.440 --> 0:04:26.240 broader problem here. It's not just vaccine distribution, but it 0:04:26.240 --> 0:04:29.839 it really digs more deeply into you know, the access 0:04:29.880 --> 0:04:34.360 to overall great health care here exactly exactly, and it 0:04:34.440 --> 0:04:36.440 is it is a bigger problem, brother problem, and it's 0:04:36.440 --> 0:04:39.960 something that you know, we can't get account very seriously. One. 0:04:40.120 --> 0:04:42.679 You know, in the United States, we've seen public health 0:04:42.680 --> 0:04:46.200 funding really decrease UM acutely in the last twenty years, 0:04:46.240 --> 0:04:49.119 but also really over the over a longer period of time, 0:04:49.600 --> 0:04:52.119 UM such that you know, as we've as we've seen 0:04:52.480 --> 0:04:56.520 we've been generally unprepared for large scale UM pandemics of 0:04:56.839 --> 0:04:59.120 this sort. And there's a result. You know, we've especially 0:04:59.160 --> 0:05:04.360 seen lack of public health support, funding and investment in 0:05:04.760 --> 0:05:08.440 underserved communities that would all already be UM as a 0:05:08.440 --> 0:05:11.599 result of systemic launch of systemic and equalities such as 0:05:11.640 --> 0:05:16.640 segregation or even out of housing situation, or broader lack 0:05:16.720 --> 0:05:22.359 of infrastructure support really without the out access to healthcare, 0:05:22.560 --> 0:05:25.440 to public health intervention. And also, you know, as we 0:05:25.480 --> 0:05:29.239 see most pressingly in this case, a lack of access 0:05:29.320 --> 0:05:33.320 to UM to these vaccines. So it's a critical, critical problem. Hey, 0:05:33.320 --> 0:05:35.120 you just got about thirty seconds here in terms of 0:05:35.160 --> 0:05:36.720 the work that you guys are doing at community acts, 0:05:36.760 --> 0:05:38.800 do you see that you're making progress and reaching out 0:05:38.839 --> 0:05:41.200 to these communities to make sure they do have that 0:05:41.279 --> 0:05:44.720 access to getting the COVID vaccine just quickly. Yeah, we 0:05:44.760 --> 0:05:47.120 are seeing progress, and I think it's very exciting. We're 0:05:47.360 --> 0:05:50.599 working in local communities across the country and we're amassing 0:05:50.680 --> 0:05:54.400 not only you know, great um strategies for increasing access, 0:05:54.480 --> 0:05:58.040 increasing transportation drives and things to too sites, but also 0:05:58.520 --> 0:06:01.320 you know, we're seeing ways of really building a collaborative 0:06:01.360 --> 0:06:04.240 public health care campaign for the future. COVID nineteen backs 0:06:04.279 --> 0:06:07.520 bactinae Um. Your mission is really only the beginning. Well, 0:06:07.560 --> 0:06:09.880 good luck with with all of your work. Great to 0:06:09.920 --> 0:06:12.960 hear about it. Alexander White. He is Assistant Professor of 0:06:13.000 --> 0:06:15.920 Sociology in the History of Medicine at Johns Hopkins Bloomberg 0:06:15.920 --> 0:06:19.320 School of Public Health, of course, supported by Michael R. Bloomberg, founder, 0:06:19.320 --> 0:06:22.839 Bloomberg LP and Bloomberg Philanthropies. Alexander joining us on the 0:06:22.880 --> 0:06:26.960 phone in Baltimore. This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol 0:06:27.040 --> 0:06:32.400 Masser and Bloomberg Quick takes Tim Stinovich from Bloomberg Radio. So, yeah, 0:06:32.480 --> 0:06:34.520 it's been a pretty busy week for this next reporter 0:06:34.760 --> 0:06:37.479 and the venerable Wall Street firm, Goldman Sax. We've got 0:06:37.520 --> 0:06:41.159 two stories, not one, two stories about Goldman today on 0:06:41.200 --> 0:06:44.080 the Bloomberg terminal. They are the most read number one 0:06:44.120 --> 0:06:46.440 and two in the past eight hours on the Bloomberg 0:06:46.680 --> 0:06:49.520 reporting on Goldman Street. Not Rajan, He's our finance reporter 0:06:49.560 --> 0:06:52.000 at Bloomberg News. He joins us on the phone in 0:06:52.040 --> 0:06:56.120 New York City. You've had a busy week. Well, it's 0:06:56.160 --> 0:06:59.000 a prominent institution. I was making you. What can I do? 0:06:59.640 --> 0:07:02.679 I know, Oh, I know, indeed indeed, so listen. First 0:07:02.680 --> 0:07:05.640 of all, let's talk about that move down south to 0:07:05.680 --> 0:07:07.960 West Palm Beach by government. It feels like it's picking 0:07:08.040 --> 0:07:12.960 up some momentum in reality to it. Oh absolutely. If 0:07:12.960 --> 0:07:15.920 you remember back in December, we talked about how government's 0:07:15.960 --> 0:07:20.120 act executives were weighing the option of centering their asset 0:07:20.200 --> 0:07:24.080 management business uh somewhere in South Florida. They were looking 0:07:24.080 --> 0:07:27.360 at offices in between the Miami to Palm Beach corridor. 0:07:28.160 --> 0:07:30.520 The idea of being you create a new hub and 0:07:30.560 --> 0:07:34.520 that pretty much fits in line with the David Solomon's 0:07:34.520 --> 0:07:38.480 strategy of moving more jobs into cheaper lookouts to trim 0:07:38.480 --> 0:07:42.360 expenses for the Bank Florida. Of course, garners more interest 0:07:42.440 --> 0:07:46.480 just because this is also the time in our economy, 0:07:46.520 --> 0:07:48.640 in fact, in New York's economy, if you may were, 0:07:48.920 --> 0:07:52.360 a number of firms from this experience of remote working. 0:07:52.360 --> 0:07:56.040 Over the last year have had serious conversations and this 0:07:56.120 --> 0:07:59.120 is the discussion that is happening across many boardrooms in 0:07:59.160 --> 0:08:02.920 corporate America is do you really need all your employees 0:08:03.000 --> 0:08:06.120 to be working out a one big central location or 0:08:06.400 --> 0:08:11.000 prominent cities when you could offer uh possibly ostensibly a 0:08:11.000 --> 0:08:14.080 better standard of living in cheaper cities further away from 0:08:14.120 --> 0:08:17.320 the center. And the experience of remote working, the experience 0:08:17.360 --> 0:08:21.400 of working almost seamlessly for many of the big firms 0:08:21.440 --> 0:08:25.560 from disparate locations, has given rise to this idea, to 0:08:25.680 --> 0:08:28.320 the art of the possible, and they realized that they 0:08:28.400 --> 0:08:31.880 could move more jobs away from big city centers like 0:08:32.160 --> 0:08:36.720 New York, Chicago, San Francisco and still function properly and 0:08:37.120 --> 0:08:39.400 improve the bottom line. So, and this is what what 0:08:39.600 --> 0:08:44.400 David Salomon calls is it high value cities. That is 0:08:44.760 --> 0:08:47.959 that is indeed a very goverment terminology, high value locations. 0:08:48.000 --> 0:08:51.720 But simply put, it translates to locations that are not 0:08:53.000 --> 0:08:55.520 as expensive as New York City. Yeah, well wasn't you 0:08:55.520 --> 0:08:57.560 know shred. Does it come down to that it's just 0:08:57.600 --> 0:09:00.320 about cutting costs or is it? Is it some thing more? 0:09:00.360 --> 0:09:02.360 Because it does feel very much I feel like the 0:09:02.400 --> 0:09:04.440 conversations we've been having with you as of late, if 0:09:04.480 --> 0:09:07.400 David Solomon, he calls himself a modern CEO, you know, 0:09:07.480 --> 0:09:10.360 really kind of remaking Goldman to some extent in his 0:09:10.440 --> 0:09:13.600 own image, but maybe also for the twenty one century. 0:09:15.200 --> 0:09:17.000 I mean, one thing that we have to be clear 0:09:17.040 --> 0:09:18.959 about it this is this idea of moving jobs to 0:09:19.040 --> 0:09:21.559 high value locations at Goldman has been underway for about 0:09:21.559 --> 0:09:24.040 a decade. Uh. You know, in the last and years 0:09:24.040 --> 0:09:27.600 we've seen places like Salt Lake City in Utah, Dallas 0:09:27.840 --> 0:09:30.720 in Texas where where you've already shifted in a number 0:09:30.720 --> 0:09:34.600 of jobs because Goldman did realize that it could. Gonner 0:09:34.679 --> 0:09:38.000 benefits from moving jobs there. A lot of their jobs 0:09:38.040 --> 0:09:41.720 that especially back office roles in their new consumer operations, 0:09:41.760 --> 0:09:44.920 are are centered out as Salt Lake City. They have 0:09:45.040 --> 0:09:48.480 also moved a number of legal compliance and similar roles 0:09:48.679 --> 0:09:51.240 to places like Dallas. So it is a shift that's 0:09:51.280 --> 0:09:55.160 been happening. But under Solomon, I think Goldman has leaned 0:09:55.160 --> 0:09:57.720 a little harder into the strategy. You've heard them talk 0:09:57.760 --> 0:10:01.280 and earning s calls and at conferences that the experience 0:10:01.280 --> 0:10:03.720 of the pandemic has taught them that they were not 0:10:03.880 --> 0:10:07.200 giving themselves enough credit for how well they could operate 0:10:07.320 --> 0:10:10.280 from a varied number of locations. And at the end 0:10:10.280 --> 0:10:11.840 of the day, if it is going to help with 0:10:11.880 --> 0:10:15.600 the bottom line, why shy away from it? Yeah? Why not? Right? Hey, listen, 0:10:15.600 --> 0:10:19.319 your second most read story on the Bloomberg Today has 0:10:19.559 --> 0:10:22.559 a talk about Goldmen bankers, Goldman analysts, those first year 0:10:22.559 --> 0:10:25.440 analysts begging to work only eighty hour weeks. Basically, they're 0:10:25.440 --> 0:10:28.040 pushing back. Just got about thirty five seconds. What do 0:10:28.040 --> 0:10:30.920 we need to know about this story? Well, the most 0:10:30.920 --> 0:10:33.160 important thing you need to know is if I ever 0:10:33.360 --> 0:10:36.280 beg for saying, please let me work only eight hours 0:10:36.320 --> 0:10:38.320 a week, please take me to the back Ellen shoot me. 0:10:38.520 --> 0:10:41.000 But that is the reality of Wall three. You you 0:10:41.200 --> 0:10:44.320 work these big crazy ears for the big bugs. The 0:10:44.360 --> 0:10:47.559 hope is or the real it clashes against this idea 0:10:47.640 --> 0:10:50.720 that the softer kind of Wall Street was promoting a 0:10:50.720 --> 0:10:53.760 better work life balance. But this, in this past twelve 0:10:53.760 --> 0:10:57.360 months of crazy banking business, it seems uh that dream 0:10:57.400 --> 0:10:59.840 hasn't quite fanned out. They just want to shower, They 0:10:59.880 --> 0:11:01.679 just want to each tree. They're just asking for a 0:11:01.720 --> 0:11:04.400 little bit of time. Sounds like they just had a 0:11:04.480 --> 0:11:08.960 kid and they're trying to juggle who work and life. Yeah, 0:11:09.040 --> 0:11:11.280 we all can relate to that. Alright, three great stuff. 0:11:11.600 --> 0:11:13.840 Really appreciate it. Tree not a rag. And he's finance 0:11:13.920 --> 0:11:16.080 reporter at Bloomberg News joining us on the phone in 0:11:16.120 --> 0:11:19.760 New York City. This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol 0:11:19.840 --> 0:11:24.679 Messer and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stinovich from Bloomberg Radio. Well, 0:11:24.679 --> 0:11:27.719 this week's cover story is about an essential business during 0:11:27.720 --> 0:11:29.800 the pandemic that also happens to be the one company 0:11:29.800 --> 0:11:32.040 in the US that makes a very important thing for 0:11:32.080 --> 0:11:35.000 COVID tests. And it also is about the two feuding 0:11:35.040 --> 0:11:38.120 cousins behind the business. The tale told by Bloomberg News 0:11:38.160 --> 0:11:41.280 technology reporter Olivia Carvel. She joins us right here in 0:11:41.320 --> 0:11:44.160 our interactor Broker's studio along with Bloomberg Business Week editor 0:11:44.240 --> 0:11:48.199 Joel Webber on the Access line in Brooklyn. First of all, Joel, 0:11:48.600 --> 0:11:52.400 I mean, who knew so much was going on behind 0:11:52.840 --> 0:11:57.240 those very important nasal swaps? That's right. This is I 0:11:57.280 --> 0:12:00.480 think one of my favorite stories that we've bushed over 0:12:00.480 --> 0:12:03.360 the last year. UM. I think it's a great untold 0:12:03.400 --> 0:12:07.800 story of the pandemic. UM, which is basically, imagine having 0:12:07.840 --> 0:12:11.200 a business that, UM, you know, a year ago, you 0:12:11.280 --> 0:12:14.080 basically the world discovers, Um, we're gonna need a lot 0:12:14.160 --> 0:12:17.160 more nasal swabs than you. Happen to be basically one 0:12:17.200 --> 0:12:19.960 of two companies in the world that makes them. And 0:12:20.000 --> 0:12:23.600 it's a company called called Puritan. It's a closely held 0:12:23.640 --> 0:12:27.120 family company in Maine. UM, at the very outside of 0:12:27.120 --> 0:12:30.120 the pandemic, we happen to have done a photo shoot UM, 0:12:30.160 --> 0:12:34.960 basically showing their their operation and UM Olivia came to 0:12:35.080 --> 0:12:37.400 us a couple of months later and said, by the way, 0:12:37.400 --> 0:12:40.160 do you guys know about this epic lawsuit between the 0:12:40.320 --> 0:12:43.400 two cousins who own the business. And we're like, no, 0:12:43.679 --> 0:12:46.440 tell us more so, Olivia, tell us more. Who are 0:12:46.480 --> 0:12:49.120 the owners and what are they fusing over? Yeah, well 0:12:49.160 --> 0:12:52.640 thanks for having me, UM. The owners of Puriton is 0:12:53.040 --> 0:12:57.280 Timothy Tinpltt and John Cartwright, the both based up in Maine. 0:12:57.360 --> 0:13:00.400 This is a family business. It's been around for you know, 0:13:00.440 --> 0:13:04.680 more than a hundred years now, and they haven't liked 0:13:04.720 --> 0:13:07.160 each other for a really long time. One of the 0:13:07.160 --> 0:13:10.480 most fascinating things about reporting the story is the timing 0:13:10.520 --> 0:13:13.120 of it all. Like in the lead up to the pandemic, 0:13:13.280 --> 0:13:16.920 probably two years before COVID really hit or became a 0:13:16.960 --> 0:13:20.080 household name, they stopped speaking to each other. One of 0:13:20.080 --> 0:13:22.319 them just walked out of a meeting and refused to 0:13:22.360 --> 0:13:25.280 have anything to do with the other. And um, they 0:13:25.320 --> 0:13:27.440 refused to be in the same room, didn't want to 0:13:27.440 --> 0:13:29.880 talk to each other, And that led to some really 0:13:30.400 --> 0:13:35.280 big problems inside the company. There was their manufacturing equipment 0:13:35.440 --> 0:13:38.720 wasn't being modernized, they weren't updating their technology. Their back 0:13:38.720 --> 0:13:42.000 office technology system was twenty years old. They had and 0:13:42.080 --> 0:13:48.600 updated their wages or given staff salary increases, and then, um, 0:13:48.640 --> 0:13:52.160 three weeks literally three weeks before the White House called 0:13:52.200 --> 0:13:54.560 this company to say we need you to ramp up 0:13:54.679 --> 0:13:57.840 swab production, one of them filed a lawsuit against the 0:13:57.880 --> 0:14:00.920 other to dissolve the entire business all right, and then 0:14:00.960 --> 0:14:05.040 walks in the government exactly. Yeah, that brought them all together, 0:14:05.080 --> 0:14:07.600 and they're not happy and living happily living, you know, 0:14:07.960 --> 0:14:10.560 ever after. Well, that's a really interesting part of the 0:14:10.600 --> 0:14:12.800 story is that the government was like, we need you 0:14:12.840 --> 0:14:15.680 to sit aside your differences for the good of the country, 0:14:15.760 --> 0:14:18.920 and they said that they would, but we access the 0:14:19.000 --> 0:14:22.880 legal file and inside private courtroom sessions, they continued to 0:14:22.920 --> 0:14:27.960 fight and are still fighting to this day. Which, um, 0:14:28.080 --> 0:14:30.040 you know, let's let's go ahead and talk about the 0:14:30.040 --> 0:14:33.360 money here. Um, how much money is the US government 0:14:33.480 --> 0:14:36.840 put into making sure period and keeps coming Over the 0:14:36.840 --> 0:14:40.080 past year, They've invested two hundred and fifty million dollars 0:14:40.200 --> 0:14:43.400 into the company and plans are underway for another facility 0:14:43.400 --> 0:14:45.960 in Tennessee. So that's only going to go up. I mean, 0:14:46.000 --> 0:14:47.640 why don't they get along? And I know in your 0:14:47.640 --> 0:14:49.320 story you talk about that it might have started as 0:14:49.360 --> 0:14:52.040 they were kids. I mean, but it's noticeable. Employees know it, 0:14:52.080 --> 0:14:55.400 and it wasn't until right the President visited that they 0:14:55.400 --> 0:14:58.720 were actually seen together. Yeah. I think that they're just 0:14:59.000 --> 0:15:02.400 both really stubborn. Um, they both have their own vision 0:15:02.480 --> 0:15:04.560 for how they see the future of the company going. 0:15:05.080 --> 0:15:08.200 Puritan has actually got a sister business called Hardwood, which 0:15:08.240 --> 0:15:12.000 started out making minted toothpicks like a hundred years ago. 0:15:12.400 --> 0:15:15.320 And John Cartwright, one of the cousins, is really heavily 0:15:15.360 --> 0:15:17.840 involved in the hardwood side of the business, and Timothy 0:15:17.880 --> 0:15:21.000 Template is involved in the Puritan the medical side, And 0:15:21.040 --> 0:15:23.960 as these two companies had kind of gone in different directions, 0:15:24.320 --> 0:15:28.400 they really felt struggled to kind of work together to 0:15:28.480 --> 0:15:31.120 see a future for both of them. So, you know, 0:15:31.200 --> 0:15:33.680 just two stubborn people who had their own vision and 0:15:33.720 --> 0:15:37.640 just didn't want to back down. Okay, so you got 0:15:37.680 --> 0:15:40.320 to spend some time in me in the summer, which 0:15:40.360 --> 0:15:44.080 made the reporting like so much greater, Carol. Just to 0:15:44.120 --> 0:15:47.080 have Olivia basically being like pitching the story and then 0:15:47.080 --> 0:15:48.560 being like, by the way, I'm going to be in 0:15:48.680 --> 0:15:50.320 Vain for a little while. I was like, oh my god, 0:15:50.320 --> 0:15:52.680 you can't make this up. Amazing. So you got to 0:15:52.760 --> 0:15:57.440 know basically everyone in Guilford. So put us on the 0:15:57.840 --> 0:16:00.640 wasn't that hard, Jol. There are only fifty a hundred 0:16:00.760 --> 0:16:05.240 people who live in Guilford. Tell us about the company 0:16:05.280 --> 0:16:08.600 and how it fits into mean and the meaning of 0:16:08.640 --> 0:16:12.560 it all. Yeah, Well, Guildford is a tiny town. There 0:16:12.640 --> 0:16:15.640 is one restaurant there, which also serves as the local bar. 0:16:15.840 --> 0:16:19.280 There's no Starbucks, there's no McDonald's. Like very very small 0:16:19.320 --> 0:16:23.440 town America and Hardwood Puritan or the business is the 0:16:23.440 --> 0:16:25.760 biggest part of the whole town. They do a lot 0:16:25.800 --> 0:16:30.040 for the for the town. They often put on fireworks shows, 0:16:30.160 --> 0:16:33.760 they donate playground equipment, They help maintain the local parks. 0:16:34.200 --> 0:16:37.640 Everyone who lives in Guilford knows the company had has 0:16:37.640 --> 0:16:40.240 either worked there, had a family member who worked there, 0:16:40.720 --> 0:16:44.960 or you know, knows the owners specifically. Everyone knows where 0:16:45.000 --> 0:16:47.800 they grew up. They can point out their homes. John 0:16:47.840 --> 0:16:51.160 Cartwright has quite a big, sprawling estate on one of 0:16:51.200 --> 0:16:54.800 the highways hitting out of Guilford, and people actually direct, 0:16:55.440 --> 0:16:58.480 you know, make directions based around his home. They're like, oh, 0:16:58.560 --> 0:17:01.680 take a lift after the John's giant white mansion on 0:17:01.720 --> 0:17:05.520 the corner. So that the feud between the owners was 0:17:05.600 --> 0:17:09.280 really really well known in the town as well. Okay, 0:17:09.320 --> 0:17:12.680 so you've spent months on this story. What's your favorite 0:17:13.800 --> 0:17:16.320 detail from all the report, the great reporting that you did, 0:17:16.400 --> 0:17:18.560 and just have about thirty thirty five seconds. Yeah, sure, 0:17:18.760 --> 0:17:21.480 I think it was really going through the court documents 0:17:21.520 --> 0:17:24.840 and seeing just the extent of the fight. They disagreed 0:17:24.880 --> 0:17:28.400 on everything from the location of the case to delaying 0:17:28.400 --> 0:17:31.480 the case when the pandemic hit, to expediting it to 0:17:31.880 --> 0:17:34.879 putting it off all together. And then when Bloomberg filed 0:17:34.920 --> 0:17:38.320 a motion to access the legal documents, they actually disagreed 0:17:38.359 --> 0:17:40.720 on how to respond to that as well. One of 0:17:40.760 --> 0:17:42.920 them said, no, we're going to fight it and push back, 0:17:43.000 --> 0:17:45.439 and the other said, oh, it's okay, go for it, 0:17:45.480 --> 0:17:47.520 like you can access the documents if you want them. 0:17:47.600 --> 0:17:52.119 So just the extent of their disagreement was unbelievable. All Right. 0:17:52.200 --> 0:17:53.920 I do say there's several times, but I do feel 0:17:53.920 --> 0:17:56.160 like this could be again like a Netflix or Amazon 0:17:56.240 --> 0:17:58.400 series because it's amazing and what I hear is there's 0:17:58.400 --> 0:18:00.320 going to be an Olivia Crevell Street and gil Ford. No, 0:18:00.440 --> 0:18:04.119 I don't know that. Uh, it's a great story. Um, 0:18:04.200 --> 0:18:06.600 so much information and we'll put it out on Twitter 0:18:06.640 --> 0:18:09.200 and I highly recommend everybody check it out. M Olivia, 0:18:09.240 --> 0:18:12.240 thank you, Olivia Carvell of Bloomberg News, along with Joe 0:18:12.280 --> 0:18:20.200 Webber of Bloomberg Business Week. I'm Broom mac Journal. Yeah, 0:18:20.240 --> 0:18:25.240 but you let me drive no no, no, d N please, 0:18:25.359 --> 0:18:32.560 I'll drivel lets me. I want to drive, just drive baby, 0:18:35.040 --> 0:18:44.720 it's good questions drying yea, this is the drive to 0:18:44.800 --> 0:18:48.160 the globe. Give me thanks. We'll drying us to dawn 0:18:48.440 --> 0:18:51.640 on Bloomberg Radio. And gotta say, taken just a leg 0:18:51.680 --> 0:18:54.000 down in the last hour or so, and we are 0:18:54.000 --> 0:18:56.119 pretty much at our loads of the session when it 0:18:56.160 --> 0:18:58.440 comes to those major equity averages down one point five 0:18:58.760 --> 0:19:01.320 on the SNP DAL off half a percent, and the 0:19:01.400 --> 0:19:05.200 NASDAC really taking it. The biggest decliner on a percentage 0:19:05.200 --> 0:19:08.440 basis down three or decline a four hundred six points. 0:19:08.520 --> 0:19:10.920 Let's get into it with Alan Zaffron, founding partner and 0:19:11.000 --> 0:19:14.000 co ce io at i e Q Capital eleven point 0:19:14.040 --> 0:19:16.800 six billion in assets under management, joining us once again 0:19:17.080 --> 0:19:20.120 from Foster City, California. Allen, nice to have you here 0:19:20.160 --> 0:19:24.440 with Tim and me. So, okay, how do you see 0:19:24.520 --> 0:19:28.119 like a trade like today where we're seeing more momentum 0:19:28.600 --> 0:19:31.159 to the downside pickup on the equity trade, particularly the 0:19:31.200 --> 0:19:34.720 tech trade. And one day after the FED where some 0:19:34.840 --> 0:19:37.000 said you know where Jpal came out and said, listen, 0:19:37.040 --> 0:19:41.280 we're gonna keep rates low for some time. Yeah, Carol, Tim, 0:19:41.320 --> 0:19:43.720 thanks for having me back on the show and today 0:19:43.760 --> 0:19:46.640 as a microcosm of the battle we're going to see 0:19:46.640 --> 0:19:48.600 in the next three to six months, and it's the 0:19:48.600 --> 0:19:53.760 battle between rising rates and inflation scares stopping this massive 0:19:53.840 --> 0:19:57.119 large cap growth rat had for many years, versus the 0:19:57.160 --> 0:20:00.680 fact that if inflation is kept under control, you're actually 0:20:00.680 --> 0:20:04.080 gonna have productivity growth, really nice world GDP growth, actually 0:20:04.119 --> 0:20:07.879 earnings growth better than expected, and that drives stocks higher. 0:20:08.040 --> 0:20:10.959 So what's really spooking the market is something called the 0:20:11.000 --> 0:20:14.960 base effects. The next three months, when we talk about inflation, 0:20:15.200 --> 0:20:17.560 it's gonna look like it's going crazy because in March 0:20:17.840 --> 0:20:21.040 and April and May last year, prices were falling, and 0:20:21.160 --> 0:20:24.479 we compare inflation year over year, it's gonna look terrible 0:20:24.520 --> 0:20:26.480 for the next three months. It's going to spook everybody. 0:20:26.520 --> 0:20:31.720 This tenure is headed to two question. We have to listen. 0:20:31.760 --> 0:20:34.840 It could be weaks. I mean, this market is moving quickly, right, 0:20:35.080 --> 0:20:38.680 but the short end isn't going anywhere, because al told 0:20:38.720 --> 0:20:41.520 you is staying there if you believe him three more years, 0:20:41.520 --> 0:20:43.879 if you believe the futures market at least two more years. 0:20:43.880 --> 0:20:48.680 So the kurb Stevens but two isn't a problem. It's 0:20:48.720 --> 0:20:51.879 the speed at which this moves. The market can't calibrate 0:20:51.960 --> 0:20:54.720 quickly enough, right, It has to move and fits and starts. 0:20:54.760 --> 0:20:58.000 But that the question, Tim is really is this inflation 0:20:58.119 --> 0:20:59.800 going to be tolerable or is it going to get 0:20:59.840 --> 0:21:01.880 out control? I will tell you that we still believe 0:21:01.920 --> 0:21:04.919 it's tolerable, which is what J believe it, which is 0:21:05.000 --> 0:21:07.600 kind of what Alan J. Powell seemed to say. To 0:21:07.640 --> 0:21:09.520 hang on a second though, because Tim and I were like, 0:21:09.600 --> 0:21:11.720 what did he say? Did he say baked defect? What 0:21:11.840 --> 0:21:16.480 did you say? The base effects base? Okay? Meaning what? 0:21:17.600 --> 0:21:20.439 So you're comparing year when you read about what's going on, 0:21:20.520 --> 0:21:25.200 you compare year over year statistics. If I'm arbitrarily comparing 0:21:25.720 --> 0:21:29.200 last March, April and May when we're in the throes 0:21:29.320 --> 0:21:32.439 of locking down and prices were falling, and now you 0:21:32.440 --> 0:21:35.560 look at prices this year, we will look like we're 0:21:35.600 --> 0:21:39.680 speed up extraordinarily because you're comparing rising prices this year 0:21:39.720 --> 0:21:42.640 with falling prices last year. By the time we get 0:21:42.680 --> 0:21:45.880 to July and August, even though prices this year are 0:21:45.920 --> 0:21:49.639 going up, prices last year we're also going up. So 0:21:49.680 --> 0:21:52.560 the spread will begin to narrow and it will calm down. 0:21:52.600 --> 0:21:57.080 Investors at the rate of inflation again is moderating. We 0:21:57.119 --> 0:21:58.800 have to get past the next three or four months 0:21:58.840 --> 0:22:01.920 to see the mod rating rate of inflation, which tim 0:22:01.960 --> 0:22:05.320 will probably stop long term rates from going higher. And 0:22:05.359 --> 0:22:09.280