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Speaker 1: Dear listener, This episode is about the recent mass shooting

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Speaker 1: in Uvalde, Texas. There are no graphic descriptions, but do

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Speaker 1: please take care before listening. Posuit George Gattisa is eighty

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Speaker 1: three years old. On Tuesday, May twenty fourth, he was

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Speaker 1: getting ready for his lunch break on the west side

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Speaker 1: of Uvalde, Texas. It was around noon.

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Speaker 2: I went into a convenience store to buy a newspaper,

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Speaker 2: and coming out the parking lot, I saw police cars,

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Speaker 2: sheriffs department cars moving out at a high rate of speed.

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Speaker 2: I bet they were doing one hundred mile an hour.

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Speaker 1: George thought they were chasing a smuggler. He says that

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Speaker 1: had happened recently in town, so he didn't worry. George

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Speaker 1: has lived in Uvaldi for almost seventy years. He went

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Speaker 1: to school here, then he became a teacher for twelve years.

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Speaker 1: He was also the mayor of Uvaldi. He knows his city,

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Speaker 1: so he wasn't too worried about the police cars. He

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Speaker 1: went home and took a nap. About an hour later,

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Speaker 1: George woke up and that's when he learned about the news.

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Speaker 2: I had the TV on and Evaldi a shooter and

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Speaker 2: barricaded in school, and I couldn't believe. I thought I

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Speaker 2: was dreaming for a while, because something like that had

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Speaker 2: never occurred here in Uvalde.

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Speaker 1: George says there were ambulance sirens blaring and helicopters circling NonStop.

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Speaker 1: In that moment, he knew that his community would forever

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Speaker 1: be changed from Fudromedia and PRX. It's Latino Usa. I'm

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Speaker 1: Maria in no Josa today. Uvalde resiste, Uvaldi resists. By now,

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Speaker 1: you've probably heard a lot about the devastating massacre that

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Speaker 1: took place in Uvalde. An eighteen year old man, Salvador

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Speaker 1: Ramos entered rob Elementary school, and he shot and murdered

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Speaker 1: nineteen children between the ages of nine and eleven, and

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Speaker 1: two teachers. He also wounded seventeen others. Just days after

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Speaker 1: turning eighteen years old, Ramos bought two assault rifles and

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Speaker 1: several hundred rounds of ammunition from a federally licensed gun dealer.

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Speaker 1: The Uvaldi massacre is the deadliest mass school shooting in

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Speaker 1: the US since Sandy Hook Elementary in Newtown, Connecticut, almost

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Speaker 1: a decade ago. This tragedy comes just days after ten

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Speaker 1: black people were killed by a white supremacist in Buffalo,

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Speaker 1: New York, who was also eighteen years old, and more

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Speaker 1: than twenty mass shootings have taken place in the last

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Speaker 1: few days after Uvaldi. Uvaldi is over eighty percent Latino,

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Speaker 1: and the ripple effects of this mass shooting have been

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Speaker 1: felt across the entire community of nearly twenty five thousand people,

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Speaker 1: but also among Latinos and Latinas all around the country.

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Speaker 1: Josue George Garza, who we just heard from in the

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Speaker 1: beginning of the episode, was one of the few Mexican

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Speaker 1: American teachers at rob Elementary back in the nineteen sixties.

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Speaker 1: In those years, the majority of the students were also

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Speaker 1: Latinos as they are today, but the mostly white teachers

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Speaker 1: and administration discriminated against students and tried to force them

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Speaker 1: to assimilate. In the year nineteen sets, after George was

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Speaker 1: denied the renewal of his contract to teach at rob Elementary,

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Speaker 1: students parents and teachers became angered, and they rallied to

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Speaker 1: demand his reinstatement along with better conditions in the school.

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Speaker 1: They held one of the longest school walkouts in the nation.

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Speaker 1: It lasted six weeks. Though George did not get his

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Speaker 1: job back. His history with rob Elementary continued for generations.

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Speaker 1: It's the school where his great granddaughter recently went.

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Speaker 2: She was in that room a year ago. She got

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Speaker 2: promoted to the fifth grade, so she transferred to another school.

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Speaker 2: If it would have happened a year ago, she would

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Speaker 2: have been there.

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Speaker 1: Many families who were impacted directly and indirectly are still

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Speaker 1: grappling with the aftermath of the shooting, and many in

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Speaker 1: the community still have a lot of questions about just

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Speaker 1: what happened. There have been conflicting reports about how local, state,

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Speaker 1: and federal law enforcement responded to the shooting. Law enforcement

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Speaker 1: was there, they didn't engage immediately.

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Speaker 3: It was reported that a school district police officer confronted

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Speaker 3: the suspect it was making entry not accurate.

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Speaker 4: He walked in uninstructed initially.

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Speaker 1: There's also been criticism of law enforcement that took more

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Speaker 1: than an hour to enter the classroom, and criticism for

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Speaker 1: not providing news updates in Spanish to this predominantly Latino community.

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Speaker 1: Some here in the community say this disregard for Uvaldi's

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Speaker 1: Spanish speaking community, as well as the lack of trust

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Speaker 1: in law enforcement, illustrates a deeper divide that's been going

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Speaker 1: on in this city for decades. So today we want

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Speaker 1: to tell this story of resistance of this Mexican American community,

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Speaker 1: how the people here stood up against segregation and oppression,

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Speaker 1: and how today, after such a devastating tragedy, Uvalde is

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Speaker 1: trying to heal, because Uvalde is much more than just

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Speaker 1: the recent headlines. To understand the complexities and the nuances

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Speaker 1: of this community, We're going to hear from two people

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Speaker 1: who call Uvaldi home, George Garza, the former teacher and mayor,

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Speaker 1: and Monica Munos Martinez, a historian at the University of

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Speaker 1: Texas at Austin who studies violence against Mexican Americans by

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Speaker 1: law enforcement. We're going to start now with my conversation

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Speaker 1: with Josue George Garisa. George, welcome to Latino, USA. Thank you. So.

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Speaker 1: First of all, we're speaking just a little more than

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Speaker 1: a week after the tragedy in Uvaldi, and I just

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Speaker 1: want to check in with you and ask how you're doing. George.

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Speaker 2: I'm doing well. Six months ago I lost my wife

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Speaker 2: and that she passed away, but I was grieving also

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Speaker 2: when this came up, and a greve the whole situation.

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Speaker 2: But I'm handling it pretty well my family and I.

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Speaker 1: I'm so sorry for your lost George, and I know

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Speaker 1: that this can't be easy. So I want to thank

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Speaker 1: you for speaking with us today, because you actually have

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Speaker 1: a very unique connection to Uvaldi's history, and I'm wondering

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Speaker 1: if you can tell me a little bit more about that.

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Speaker 2: I'm from Uvaldi. I wasn't born here, but I came

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Speaker 2: to Evaldi when I was in the ninth grade and

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Speaker 2: I adopted Valdis as my home, and my parents transferred

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Speaker 2: after seven years back to San Antonio, and I stayed

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Speaker 2: here and I'm married here.

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Speaker 4: But I had.

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Speaker 2: Goals that I had set for myself, and I have

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Speaker 2: always strived to meet him. There was what was instilled

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Speaker 2: in me by my father and mother. I stayed in

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Speaker 2: Uvaldi because it had a lot of possibilities.

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Speaker 1: I find it interesting that Uvaldi, for you as a

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Speaker 1: young man, was a place of a lot of hope

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Speaker 1: and possibility. And yet you can talk to us about

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Speaker 1: a particular kind of history in this city. So for

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Speaker 1: people who are not and there are a lot of

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Speaker 1: us who are not from this part of Texas, right,

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Speaker 1: can you give us a history of the community that

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Speaker 1: you are a part of.

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Speaker 2: We moved to Euvaldi in January the twenty first, nineteen

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Speaker 2: fifty five, and I didn't like Uvaldi at the time,

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Speaker 2: and there was a lot of racial discrimination. There were

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Speaker 2: two towns within Uvalde, the Mexican town and the Anglo town,

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Speaker 2: and it was divided by race and the burial where

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Speaker 2: the white folks lived and one where the Mexicans lived.

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Speaker 2: And we sort of kept our boundaries to ourselves. But

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Speaker 2: in school, when I enroll in junior high or high school,

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Speaker 2: you could sense that there was some sort of maintaining

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Speaker 2: a tradition of separation. But I met the's that of it,

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Speaker 2: and so, by the grace of God, I graduated from

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Speaker 2: high school in nineteen fifty eight, and shortly thereafter I

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Speaker 2: went to the army.

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Speaker 1: I'm wondering if you can talk a little bit about

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Speaker 1: what happens when you are discharged from the army in

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Speaker 1: nineteen sixty two and you kind of come back to

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Speaker 1: Uvaldi and you decide to become a school teacher. So

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Speaker 1: tell me about that decision.

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Speaker 2: At that point in time, Valdi was separated in a

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Speaker 2: very unique manner. It was a de facto segregation. For instance,

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Speaker 2: rob Elementary School was deep in the Mexican burial and

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Speaker 2: there was no way an Anglo kid could go because

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Speaker 2: they didn't live there in that vicinity.

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Speaker 1: But let me just understand what you're saying. In the

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Speaker 1: history of the segregation of Uvaldi, it was very clear

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Speaker 1: that rob Elementary was a school for the Mexican kids.

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Speaker 1: Is that what you're saying?

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Speaker 2: Well, and the they built the school in nineteen fifty

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Speaker 2: five deep in the Mexican section of town, So who

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Speaker 2: was going to go to that school? Ninety nine percent

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Speaker 2: or ninety eight percent were Mexican Americans. The other school, Dalton,

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Speaker 2: was built deep in the barrio or the section where

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Speaker 2: mostly middle class Anglo families lived, so they were considered

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Speaker 2: neighborhood schools, but we considered it the facto segregation. And

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Speaker 2: I could tell in school where I was teaching that

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Speaker 2: we would get hand me down from the other schools

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Speaker 2: predominantly Anglo. And the school was very limited forest, playground equipment, books,

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Speaker 2: sometimes our workbooks. The students had to buy them was

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Speaker 2: they didn't have any money.

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Speaker 1: So George, can you describe for me, for example, the

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Speaker 1: environment inside the school, like what was it like, especially

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Speaker 1: with teachers and administrators, how were they interacting with students.

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Speaker 2: For example, we had some good teachers at rob Elementary school,

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Speaker 2: but it was the administrator of the school, the principal,

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Speaker 2: that was not as enthused about the students. And students

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Speaker 2: they would bring putlock to the cafeteria and someone would

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Speaker 2: bring the bean, somebody who bring tortillas and piccadillo and

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Speaker 2: piccola ayo, and they would separate themselves into a different

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Speaker 2: area of the cafeteria and started sharing the Mexican food.

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Speaker 2: Then the Anglo kids would go, hey, give me a taco.

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Speaker 2: I'll get my sandwich if they I'll trade the sandwich

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Speaker 2: for a taco, And the administration didn't like that, so

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Speaker 2: they kind of put that down, you can't do that.

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Speaker 1: Wow, okay, So the students wanted to learn from each other,

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Speaker 1: but administrators weren't happy about that. So what else was

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Speaker 1: happening at the school.

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Speaker 2: You couldn't speak Spanish, the kids couldn't speak Spanish. There

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Speaker 2: was a punishment if you were caught speaking Spanish in

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Speaker 2: the playground or in the halls or what have you.

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Speaker 1: You know, this is really important for people to hear.

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Speaker 1: There are many Latinos and Latinas who will look at

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Speaker 1: others and say well, how is it that you don't

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Speaker 1: speak Spanish and then you hear about these stories. So George,

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Speaker 1: can you tell me what the punishment punishments were at

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Speaker 1: rob Elementary School. If you were caught speaking Spanish, what

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Speaker 1: would happen to you?

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Speaker 2: It depends, It depended on the teacher. At one time,

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Speaker 2: we were about four or five Hispanic teachers teaching, and

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Speaker 2: there was different kind of Hispanic teachers in the whole system.

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Speaker 2: He was supposed to administer two or three licks with

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Speaker 2: a board paddle we called it. But there were some

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Speaker 2: of us that were non conformists. I mean, I consider

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Speaker 2: myself one of those. I'd hear a kids speaking Spanish

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Speaker 2: and playground, oh say, hey, be careful, and oh okay.

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Speaker 2: Another was a conformist okay, okay, come here, you're speaking

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Speaker 2: Spanish and gave you one lick with a board kind

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Speaker 2: of soft. Now they were super conformist, and they will

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Speaker 2: give you three hard licks like they were supposed to.

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Speaker 1: You were saying that there were Latino teachers in the

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Speaker 1: school who were, as you're saying that, super conformist. In

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Speaker 1: other words, they were giving even more intense punishment to

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Speaker 1: any kid that was called speaking Spanish. Is that what

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Speaker 1: you're saying?

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Speaker 2: Yes?

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Speaker 1: And there were also white teachers who were paddling the

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Speaker 1: students for speaking Spanish. What did that look like?

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Speaker 2: Maybe some Anglo teachers would take it to the extreme,

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Speaker 2: and there were some that did, especially in junior high.

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Speaker 2: But the students at a certain point in time, they

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Speaker 2: started to rebel against this type of system. They started

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Speaker 2: asserting themselves. And I know an incident where three cousins

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Speaker 2: were talking to each other real loud in Spanish and

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Speaker 2: the Mexican American principal or assistant principle hollered at him

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Speaker 2: real loud, Hey boys, are you going to be Mexicans

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Speaker 2: all your life? Because I was speaking Spanish and one

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Speaker 2: of them was a fair bride student said yes, sir,

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Speaker 2: we're going to be Mexican soul in our lives and

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Speaker 2: you too, you too can't be in Yeah, assistant principal

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Speaker 2: told me, you know, that kid really taught me something,

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Speaker 2: he said, and.

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Speaker 1: That resistance only grew. In fact, George, in nineteen seventy

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Speaker 1: there was a six week school walkout in Uvaldi, and

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Speaker 1: that started because your contract at rob wasn't renewed. But

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Speaker 1: it wasn't just that, right, I mean students were demanding change.

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Speaker 1: They wanted more Mexican American teachers at their schools, and

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Speaker 1: they wanted to be able to speak Spanish. And I'm wondering,

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Speaker 1: what was that moment like for you.

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Speaker 2: Well, my name was Mud because I was blamed for

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Speaker 2: the walkout and I kept telling the people I wasn't

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Speaker 2: the leader of it. I was a participant.

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Speaker 1: And these were pretty tense. I mean this part of

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Speaker 1: Texas in terms of Latinos and Latinas standing up to

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Speaker 1: kind of white Texas authority, this was very radical. I

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Speaker 1: think it's important to kind of put into history. This

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Speaker 1: was a time when Latinos and Latina's, Mexican Americans, Mexicanos

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Speaker 1: and Tejas were organizing La Rasa Nia Party. There were

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Speaker 1: the brown Berets. There was a lot of activism around

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Speaker 1: students and education, and so during the walkouts, the Texas

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Speaker 1: Rangers were called in to the city of Uvalde.

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Speaker 2: The chief of police at one time wanted to make

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Speaker 2: a mass arrest, you know, and the mayor Victosi, he said, no, no, no,

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Speaker 2: where are you going to put on? The jail is

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Speaker 2: not big enough and he sort of used his head

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Speaker 2: and he was rather rational, you know, he said, they

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Speaker 2: want to marsh without a permit letter Mars even though

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Speaker 2: they were Texas Rangers there, and we weren't afraid of them.

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Speaker 1: You weren't afraid of the Texas rangers coming down trying

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Speaker 1: to squash a peaceful student teacher walkout.

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Speaker 2: We weren't. I don't think we were failing timidated. We

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Speaker 2: weren't afraid of them. As long as we've kept it peaceful,

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Speaker 2: the government has to guarantee you the right to do that,

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Speaker 2: andamos noamos. The students lost one of your school, and

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Speaker 2: the school board was very adamant in not making any

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Speaker 2: changes to favor the Mexican Americans, not even the food

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Speaker 2: in the cafeteria.

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Speaker 1: So the school ends up not making any changes. But

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Speaker 1: you all didn't stop there. So what happened after that?

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Speaker 2: I kept telling the people was not over. We had

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Speaker 2: a lawyer from San Antonio, mister Pat Maloney Senior, and

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Speaker 2: another attorney, Jesse Gamez, that took our case to federal court,

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Speaker 2: and we had a monster for a federal judge. He

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Speaker 2: didn't be leaving giving an inch to the Mexican American

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Speaker 2: people that in the walkout situation, and we lost the

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Speaker 2: case in del Rio. The judge dismissed it. There was

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Speaker 2: no discrimination and you valued no segregation whatsoever.

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Speaker 1: And wow, wow.

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Speaker 2: Some of my older Mexican American friends said, he none, Ghanas,

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Speaker 2: you can beat the system. Well, mister Maloney contacted Maldale.

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Speaker 2: They took our case and appealed it to the Fifth

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Speaker 2: Court of Appeals in the Orleans and the Fifth Court

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Speaker 2: overruled judge would they overruled.

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Speaker 1: Him, so you had to take it to a higher court.

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Speaker 1: But in fact you did win. The schools were forced

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Speaker 1: to change. The community kept pressuring officials and eventually schools

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Speaker 1: started offering bilingual classes. There were more Mexican Americans teachers

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Speaker 1: who were hired, and Latinos in general were more present

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Speaker 1: in leadership positions in town. In fact, in the nineteen nineties,

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Speaker 1: you even decide to run for mayor of Uvaldi and

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Speaker 1: you win, and you were mayor for twelve years.

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Speaker 2: You know, when I was elected mayor, I had connections

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Speaker 2: to La Razonia in Crystal City. I taught school there

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Speaker 2: one year and the council was very, very experienced, and

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Speaker 2: we were all Hispanics except one, but we all work together.

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Speaker 1: Things are quite different now. The mayor of Uvaldi is

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Speaker 1: white in a city that is overwhelmingly Latino and Latina,

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Speaker 1: and I think a lot of people find out a

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Speaker 1: little surprising, so I better keep us on.

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Speaker 2: In my opinion, it's voter suppression.

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Speaker 1: Can you tell me exactly what that looks like? In Uvalde?

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Speaker 2: When we have city elections, school board elections and general elections,

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Speaker 2: we gather around the polling places passing out cards to

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Speaker 2: the people. Many first time voters come and they've never

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Speaker 2: seen a ballot before, and we work with them. But

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Speaker 2: sometime back, the mayor at the time, they passed an

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Speaker 2: ortonance that you couldn't put karapitas into the pulling place too.

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Speaker 2: You can people, you can meet the people before they

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Speaker 2: go into the pulling place. And they set a setback

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Speaker 2: and the Hispanic councilman voted for it. And then they

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Speaker 2: tried to pass another one that if an ordnance that

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Speaker 2: if I go give prospective voter a card to ask

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Speaker 2: them to vote for me, I could face a misdemeanor

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Speaker 2: charge of five hundred dollars fine. And of course we

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Speaker 2: got together and it didn't pass. Our city councilman stood

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Speaker 2: for them and said no.

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Speaker 1: You know Georgia's story in Uvaldi is one of resiliens.

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Speaker 1: You stayed in the city to try to make your

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Speaker 1: dreams come true, and you did. You have your career,

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Speaker 1: your beautiful family, but you actually had to fight for

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Speaker 1: all of that. I mean, there was inten one activism

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Speaker 1: against racism and injustice in Uvaldi. And I'm wondering, as

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Speaker 1: you're looking at your city now in this much pain,

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Speaker 1: is is there a part of you that says this

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Speaker 1: history of activism is in fact part of Uvaldi's soul.

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Speaker 1: And I'm wondering if you've been wanting to see that

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Speaker 1: kind of activism come back in this moment.

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Speaker 2: Yes, but we have lost our will to stand up.

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Speaker 2: You know, I've got grand kids that can speak Spanish

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Speaker 2: or won't speak Spanish what I mean, And I'm the

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Speaker 2: biggest Chicano activist I want to think that at one

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Speaker 2: time at all and can't even speak Spanish, And I said, well,

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Speaker 2: where are we here to? Don't forget our culture.

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Speaker 1: I see mismo borgueto Luca and piso bordefen there eli

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Speaker 1: de Espanol in las squire less, I see mismo respeto

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Speaker 1: ti and thank you for giving all of us a

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Speaker 1: very unique and special portrait of the city that you

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Speaker 1: love muchas Gracias Posue George Garsa pray for you Alde

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Speaker 1: coming up on Latino USA. A conversation with historian Monica

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Speaker 1: munjos Martinez about her hometown Uvaldi. Stay with us, Yes, hey,

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Speaker 1: we're back. Before the break, we heard from Josue George Garza,

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Speaker 1: the former rob elementary school teacher who participated in one

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Speaker 1: of the longest school walkouts in the country and who

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Speaker 1: later became mayor of Uvaldi. And now we're going to

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Speaker 1: speak with historian Monica Mugnos Martinez. Monigua is a professor

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Speaker 1: at UT Austin and she's from Uvaldi. For many years,

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Speaker 1: she's been studying violence against Mexican Americans on the border

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Speaker 1: and her project Mapping Violence documents forgotten cases of racial

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Speaker 1: violence in Texas in the early twentieth century. Last year,

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Speaker 1: Monica was awarded a MacArthur Genius Grant for her research.

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Speaker 1: But though Monica has been studying this as an academic,

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Speaker 1: the Uvaldi tragedy hit very close to home. Here's our conversation, Ola, Monica,

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Speaker 1: so welcome to let you know USA, and I just

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Speaker 1: want to thank you so much for being here. And

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Speaker 1: I want to ask, actually, can you tell me where

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Speaker 1: you are right now?

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Speaker 5: I'm in Austin. So we drove back on Sunday, Okay,

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Speaker 5: and have been driving to San Antonio to visit family

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Speaker 5: there as well, who have also been impacted by this tragedy.

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Speaker 5: People from Uvaldi who have left the town live in

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Speaker 5: San Antonio, they live in Austin. Everybody's devastated. Everybody in

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Speaker 5: Uvaldi is only one degree of separation from the victims.

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Speaker 5: If people don't know the children or the teachers personally,

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Speaker 5: they know their parents or their grandparents, or their aunts

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Speaker 5: or their uncles. Everybody has been is shattered by this.

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Speaker 5: I mean I have, for example, two cousins who know.

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Speaker 5: One of them used to be a teacher at rob

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Speaker 5: another was classmates with Idma Gottacia and with Tony Gatticia,

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Speaker 5: and she also is coworkers with one of the parents

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Speaker 5: who lost a child. That's an example of two people

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Speaker 5: who live in San Antonio, who haven't lived in Uvaldi

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Speaker 5: for over a decade, and they're shattered. The depth of

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Speaker 5: grief is unimaginable. It extends far beyond Uvaldi. But for

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Speaker 5: the people who live in Valdi and the news of

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Speaker 5: the tragedy was announced. It was not a question of

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Speaker 5: whether or not people would know the victims, it was

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Speaker 5: how many. I should also say, for example, in terms

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Speaker 5: of the impact, that my mother worked for the Evaldi

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Speaker 5: School district for over thirty five years, and before she

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Speaker 5: was an educator, she was a student who walked out

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Speaker 5: in the Evaldi School walkouts. So her whole life she

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Speaker 5: has been working to create the best educational opportunity for

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Speaker 5: the children in Uvaliti. And she's just one of the

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Speaker 5: educators who have given their lives. It's devastating to think

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Speaker 5: of the teachers who had to physically give their lives.

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Speaker 1: For the children.

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Speaker 5: And so this is a tragedy not just for the

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Speaker 5: town but for in Uvaldi, where the school is the

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Speaker 5: social fabric that ties people together. For this to be

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Speaker 5: an attack on the schools is horryfic.

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Speaker 1: I've been trying to keep it together because I'm like,

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Speaker 1: I'm not going to cry in these interviews, but you

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Speaker 1: have brought it so home money guy, I mean, it's

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Speaker 1: just like you're like, look, I'm you know, I'm a

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Speaker 1: product of these schools. But the school in terms of

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Speaker 1: what it represents for Uvalde, and as you say, Uvaldi.

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Speaker 1: It's not just like a regular school because it is

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Speaker 1: in this school and the whole educational system. The structural

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Speaker 1: inequality of this schools in Nouvaldi is what led to

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Speaker 1: the protests and the walkout, which like enlightens so many

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Speaker 1: people like your mom, And so it is like I mean,

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Speaker 1: in your words, tell me, because it isn't just an

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Speaker 1: attack on a school, but you're saying there's a much

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Speaker 1: bigger attack here, and I want you to kind of

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Speaker 1: put that to words.

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Speaker 5: I think when people are trying to understand the depths

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Speaker 5: of grief. So I haven't lived in Uvaldi in twenty years.

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Speaker 5: My family has lived there, My family still lives there.

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Speaker 5: I have cousins in those schools, little cousins. So even

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Speaker 5: somebody like me who hasn't lived there in twenty years,

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Speaker 5: when I start to try to list all of the

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Speaker 5: people who I know who are impacted, my mind can't compute.

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Speaker 5: And when you think about the impact on the families,

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Speaker 5: what has become so challenging in terms of providing resources

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Speaker 5: for families is that when we think about the victims,

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Speaker 5: people think about the immediate families. But in Uvality, there

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Speaker 5: is no just immediate family. People don't use that term.

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Speaker 5: You know, that's my first cousin, or that's we don't

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Speaker 5: use that language. If a child that was lost is

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Speaker 5: being warned by their parents, by their theos, and their

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Speaker 5: theos by their cousins and cousins. There is multiple generations

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Speaker 5: of cousins, it's by their grandparents and great grandparents, it's

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Speaker 5: by their neighbors. An attack on the schools in a

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Speaker 5: place like Euvaldi that is so under resourced, the schools

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Speaker 5: are the lifeblood of the community. It is where children

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Speaker 5: are nurtured, where they are encouraged to dream and to

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Speaker 5: think big. It's horrific that now you hear kids that

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Speaker 5: are scared to go to school, and so for that

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Speaker 5: belief in a community structure to be shaken, it devastates

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Speaker 5: me to think about that not feeling safe for kids.

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Speaker 1: Right And as a historian, you're thinking so much about

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Speaker 1: the long tale of this event, So can you tell

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Speaker 1: me about what you knew and understood about the walkouts

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Speaker 1: and is it still a very present story or do

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Speaker 1: you think that because of this tragedy, the resistance, the

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Speaker 1: protest movement, the walkouts will actually get another hearing or not.

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Speaker 5: People in umility want to come together. People are looking

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Speaker 5: for love and comfort and encouragement. But in terms of

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Speaker 5: the communities try it is complicated by a longer history.

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Speaker 5: In the eighteen fifties, there was the Uvaldi County past

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Speaker 5: an ordinance that Mexicans couldn't travel through the county without

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Speaker 5: a passport that was issued by white officials. So the

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Speaker 5: history of discrimination in the community is deep. And of

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Speaker 5: course before Anglo settlers came to Uvaldi, there were indigenous people,

431
00:29:30,960 --> 00:29:35,200
Speaker 5: so there's a deeper history in Uvaldi. What the school

432
00:29:35,200 --> 00:29:40,840
Speaker 5: walkouts in nineteen seventy exposed was that Brownbee Board of Education,

433
00:29:41,960 --> 00:29:47,240
Speaker 5: the Supreme Court decision that mandated that segregation end didn't

434
00:29:47,280 --> 00:29:52,240
Speaker 5: reach places like Uvaldi, and so it's over a decade

435
00:29:52,280 --> 00:29:56,320
Speaker 5: later that students in Uvaldi and parents. Some of the

436
00:29:56,320 --> 00:29:59,440
Speaker 5: photographs that I have of the walkout are elementary school

437
00:29:59,480 --> 00:30:04,240
Speaker 5: students walking outside of rob because it was the school

438
00:30:04,600 --> 00:30:08,520
Speaker 5: that exposed the inequality between the Mexican schools and the

439
00:30:08,560 --> 00:30:11,760
Speaker 5: white schools in town. Some of the memories that my

440
00:30:11,880 --> 00:30:15,320
Speaker 5: dia Oka Munotrodriguez, who she shared with me when I

441
00:30:15,440 --> 00:30:18,760
Speaker 5: was conducting research about the walkout, was that she remembered

442
00:30:19,280 --> 00:30:23,280
Speaker 5: walking into buildings for school board meetings with Texas Rangers

443
00:30:23,320 --> 00:30:27,160
Speaker 5: on rooftop with rifles pointed down at them. So the

444
00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:30,800
Speaker 5: kind of intimidation was not just through local community members

445
00:30:30,840 --> 00:30:32,640
Speaker 5: but also by the state police.

446
00:30:35,360 --> 00:30:38,240
Speaker 1: When I'm thinking about, on the one hand, this picture

447
00:30:38,400 --> 00:30:43,480
Speaker 1: of Uvaldi, which is like everybody knows each other, Familia Gargno.

448
00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:51,840
Speaker 1: This history of structural racism and segregation and also resistance

449
00:30:51,920 --> 00:30:56,280
Speaker 1: met with violence, and that is part of basically the

450
00:30:56,360 --> 00:30:59,800
Speaker 1: Texas Rangers and law enforcement in general in Texas targeting

451
00:31:00,080 --> 00:31:04,040
Speaker 1: the know natint communities for decades. But there's something that

452
00:31:04,200 --> 00:31:08,240
Speaker 1: seems that needs to be put together with that history

453
00:31:08,320 --> 00:31:12,760
Speaker 1: of violence law enforcement, Texas Rangers and what's happening now

454
00:31:12,920 --> 00:31:16,760
Speaker 1: in terms of the conversation around law enforcement in Uvaldi

455
00:31:17,840 --> 00:31:20,320
Speaker 1: or should we not be making that connection.

456
00:31:20,520 --> 00:31:24,640
Speaker 5: While things have certainly changed. Uvaldi is one of the

457
00:31:24,720 --> 00:31:28,000
Speaker 5: most heavily policed cities in the country.

458
00:31:28,440 --> 00:31:31,880
Speaker 1: Why is that? So I haven't heard that from anyone.

459
00:31:32,000 --> 00:31:35,880
Speaker 1: So you're saying Uvaldi is one of the most policed

460
00:31:36,040 --> 00:31:38,760
Speaker 1: cities not just in Texas but in the country, and

461
00:31:38,880 --> 00:31:41,360
Speaker 1: that would be why so in.

462
00:31:41,440 --> 00:31:44,320
Speaker 5: Terms of just the share police presence. So not only

463
00:31:44,400 --> 00:31:48,120
Speaker 5: do you have a school district police force for the

464
00:31:48,240 --> 00:31:53,200
Speaker 5: Valdi CISD. You also have local police. You have county police,

465
00:31:53,280 --> 00:31:56,480
Speaker 5: you know, the Sheriff's office and deputies. But you also

466
00:31:56,640 --> 00:32:00,640
Speaker 5: at this moment have Texas Department of Public say Texas

467
00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:04,920
Speaker 5: DPS officers in Uvalde County because Euvaldy is one of

468
00:32:04,960 --> 00:32:07,760
Speaker 5: the counties that signed up for Operation Loan Star. And

469
00:32:07,880 --> 00:32:12,600
Speaker 5: in addition, you also have a heavy border patrol presence.

470
00:32:13,600 --> 00:32:17,000
Speaker 5: Law enforcement is one of the only employment opportunities in

471
00:32:17,120 --> 00:32:21,360
Speaker 5: Uvaldy and so one of the best jobs in Uvality

472
00:32:21,480 --> 00:32:23,760
Speaker 5: is if you can graduate from high school and successfully

473
00:32:23,800 --> 00:32:26,360
Speaker 5: take the training and become a Border patrol agent. And

474
00:32:26,440 --> 00:32:28,320
Speaker 5: so that's e when people are thinking about why is

475
00:32:28,360 --> 00:32:32,680
Speaker 5: it difficult to have conversations about guns and police. There

476
00:32:32,760 --> 00:32:38,760
Speaker 5: is a strong culture supporting law enforcement. Victims, parents and

477
00:32:38,920 --> 00:32:42,560
Speaker 5: family members are members of the Border patrol and local

478
00:32:42,640 --> 00:32:49,080
Speaker 5: law enforcement. But if you believe that more police makes

479
00:32:49,160 --> 00:32:56,120
Speaker 5: people more safe, Uvality proves otherwise because from school to city,

480
00:32:56,440 --> 00:33:02,920
Speaker 5: to county to state to federal police, that large police

481
00:33:02,960 --> 00:33:06,080
Speaker 5: presence did not prevent this massacre.

482
00:33:07,120 --> 00:33:13,760
Speaker 1: It's so horrible, Monica, It's just so horrible. We're all traumatized.

483
00:33:15,760 --> 00:33:20,560
Speaker 1: But that question is in people's minds. Certainly for every

484
00:33:20,840 --> 00:33:25,000
Speaker 1: Latino and Latina. We're just like Ki Baso.

485
00:33:25,760 --> 00:33:29,560
Speaker 5: There's an ongoing investigation. As a historian, I have written

486
00:33:29,600 --> 00:33:34,560
Speaker 5: about massacres and police violence and racial violence of the past,

487
00:33:34,880 --> 00:33:37,480
Speaker 5: the last you know, one hundred years ago. But I've

488
00:33:37,520 --> 00:33:41,120
Speaker 5: also been called to testify for Congress in the aftermath

489
00:33:41,320 --> 00:33:44,719
Speaker 5: of massacres, like an Albaso. So weeks after the El

490
00:33:44,840 --> 00:33:48,080
Speaker 5: Baso massacre, I traveled to Albaso to testify in front

491
00:33:48,080 --> 00:33:53,760
Speaker 5: of Congress about the history but also the increased violence

492
00:33:54,040 --> 00:33:58,760
Speaker 5: facing Latino communities, hate crimes, and so what I first

493
00:33:58,840 --> 00:34:02,600
Speaker 5: heard about the massacre was at that time it wasn't

494
00:34:02,600 --> 00:34:07,520
Speaker 5: a massacre, just to shooting. And so I panicked and

495
00:34:07,600 --> 00:34:10,520
Speaker 5: I thought, is this somebody who came to our town.

496
00:34:10,680 --> 00:34:12,560
Speaker 5: Did they look up the census, did they see the

497
00:34:12,640 --> 00:34:15,880
Speaker 5: high numbers? And did they target the town because of it?

498
00:34:16,560 --> 00:34:18,960
Speaker 5: But people need to be asking questions about what were

499
00:34:19,000 --> 00:34:21,440
Speaker 5: the laws that were passed or the laws that were

500
00:34:21,480 --> 00:34:25,800
Speaker 5: passed since El Baso that made it easier for this

501
00:34:26,160 --> 00:34:31,640
Speaker 5: person to buy these weapons of war. And because I'm

502
00:34:31,640 --> 00:34:37,120
Speaker 5: from Uvaldi, I grew up hunting. My dad taught me

503
00:34:37,280 --> 00:34:40,120
Speaker 5: how to hunt me and my sister. He also told

504
00:34:40,239 --> 00:34:42,600
Speaker 5: us taught us to fear guns. Rank This is not

505
00:34:43,200 --> 00:34:44,840
Speaker 5: this is something that he taught us to do. His

506
00:34:45,000 --> 00:34:48,200
Speaker 5: father taught him how to hunt for food because he

507
00:34:48,320 --> 00:34:52,280
Speaker 5: worked at a mine. It wasn't enough income to support

508
00:34:52,800 --> 00:34:57,440
Speaker 5: his family. But guns, the gun culture in Uvaldi is

509
00:34:57,520 --> 00:35:01,960
Speaker 5: also a part of people's identity. There's multiple gun shops.

510
00:35:03,000 --> 00:35:06,360
Speaker 5: You can't find mental health resources in Uvaliti. For loved

511
00:35:06,400 --> 00:35:09,239
Speaker 5: ones and family that I have in Uvaliti who have

512
00:35:09,400 --> 00:35:12,719
Speaker 5: needed help, we've had to help them drive to San Antonio,

513
00:35:13,560 --> 00:35:17,960
Speaker 5: which means missing work, paying for gas, and paying for

514
00:35:18,120 --> 00:35:21,040
Speaker 5: food to get people help when they need it. Most

515
00:35:21,080 --> 00:35:23,879
Speaker 5: people in Uvaldi cannot support that, but they can drive

516
00:35:23,920 --> 00:35:28,400
Speaker 5: across town easily and buy these weapons of war. So,

517
00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:31,120
Speaker 5: when I'm thinking about the kinds of images of policing,

518
00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:34,799
Speaker 5: these are laws that was legal for the gun shop

519
00:35:34,960 --> 00:35:35,360
Speaker 5: to do that.

520
00:35:37,360 --> 00:35:40,279
Speaker 1: Monticu, I have a question, and it's actually based on

521
00:35:40,440 --> 00:35:44,040
Speaker 1: something that you wrote. This is from a forthcoming essay

522
00:35:44,120 --> 00:35:47,440
Speaker 1: about the twenty nineteen massacre in l Baso, where a

523
00:35:47,480 --> 00:35:50,480
Speaker 1: white supremacist shot and killed twenty three Latinos and Latinas

524
00:35:50,480 --> 00:35:54,080
Speaker 1: at a Walmart. In your essay, you write quote, the

525
00:35:54,239 --> 00:35:57,000
Speaker 1: children growing up in border communities will learn the hard

526
00:35:57,120 --> 00:36:00,320
Speaker 1: truths of the recent past in due time. When they do,

527
00:36:00,560 --> 00:36:03,440
Speaker 1: they should also learn that in the face of forces

528
00:36:03,520 --> 00:36:06,760
Speaker 1: that attempted to malign them or make them more vulnerable

529
00:36:06,840 --> 00:36:11,719
Speaker 1: to death, border communities collectively worked to protect them. It

530
00:36:11,880 --> 00:36:14,160
Speaker 1: is a long tradition that they should no longer have

531
00:36:14,400 --> 00:36:19,120
Speaker 1: to bear. But for centuries, fronterrisos have shown a commitment

532
00:36:19,480 --> 00:36:23,600
Speaker 1: to remembering their lost loved ones, repairing broken humanity, and

533
00:36:23,719 --> 00:36:28,600
Speaker 1: building a more just future. So, Monica, can you tell

534
00:36:28,680 --> 00:36:29,960
Speaker 1: me a little bit more about.

535
00:36:29,760 --> 00:36:38,480
Speaker 5: That I had as it's a very difficult paragraph to

536
00:36:38,600 --> 00:36:45,760
Speaker 5: hear in the context of this now being a story

537
00:36:45,840 --> 00:36:46,920
Speaker 5: of by a home.

538
00:36:46,800 --> 00:36:52,360
Speaker 1: Community, because you wrote that not ever imagining that ud

539
00:36:52,480 --> 00:36:55,000
Speaker 1: would be the site of a massacre.

540
00:36:55,520 --> 00:36:57,920
Speaker 5: I wrote it, and I have given testimony and I

541
00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:01,640
Speaker 5: have given interviews worried that could happen, because this could

542
00:37:01,640 --> 00:37:02,320
Speaker 5: happen anywhere.

543
00:37:02,640 --> 00:37:06,200
Speaker 1: So you the thought that it could happen in Uvaldi

544
00:37:06,360 --> 00:37:08,680
Speaker 1: was something that you were like a skip boiled by side.

545
00:37:09,120 --> 00:37:13,840
Speaker 5: Unfortunately, Yes, especially when we see the patterns of violence

546
00:37:14,120 --> 00:37:18,200
Speaker 5: and the access to weapons of war. So when you

547
00:37:18,239 --> 00:37:22,280
Speaker 5: think about a community that has such ready access, easy access.

548
00:37:23,480 --> 00:37:27,399
Speaker 5: But for me, what was also what's hard to hear

549
00:37:27,560 --> 00:37:35,719
Speaker 5: about that paragraph is that I don't have those families,

550
00:37:36,080 --> 00:37:39,760
Speaker 5: and those people who are picking up the broken pieces

551
00:37:39,800 --> 00:37:43,800
Speaker 5: of humanity are my family, and they are my friends,

552
00:37:44,600 --> 00:37:47,680
Speaker 5: and they are my former teachers, and that's important that

553
00:37:47,880 --> 00:37:51,000
Speaker 5: nobody should have to bear. But in a townike Euvality,

554
00:37:51,080 --> 00:37:54,480
Speaker 5: where there are not enough resources, that's what shatters me.

555
00:37:55,160 --> 00:37:57,840
Speaker 5: A member of my family was the justice of the

556
00:37:57,920 --> 00:38:04,400
Speaker 5: peace that had to identify the remains of the victims.

557
00:38:05,560 --> 00:38:09,279
Speaker 5: And so when I heard not only when we were

558
00:38:09,320 --> 00:38:11,880
Speaker 5: waiting for news about whether our little customs were okay,

559
00:38:13,360 --> 00:38:15,000
Speaker 5: then when I heard the news that it was going

560
00:38:15,080 --> 00:38:17,479
Speaker 5: to be my family member having to do that work,

561
00:38:18,440 --> 00:38:24,279
Speaker 5: that unspeakable task to help the family start to heal,

562
00:38:25,000 --> 00:38:27,120
Speaker 5: to get those bodies back to their loved ones. That

563
00:38:27,239 --> 00:38:31,680
Speaker 5: he had to be in that sight of horror because

564
00:38:31,680 --> 00:38:34,600
Speaker 5: he balatly doesn't have a medical examiner. So this is

565
00:38:34,680 --> 00:38:37,560
Speaker 5: what I have been living with that as a historian,

566
00:38:38,400 --> 00:38:42,200
Speaker 5: as somebody who's been warning about the threat of con

567
00:38:42,280 --> 00:38:46,000
Speaker 5: violence to marginalize communities, to communities of people of color,

568
00:38:47,200 --> 00:38:51,560
Speaker 5: that my mind could understand that this could happen, but

569
00:38:52,360 --> 00:38:54,080
Speaker 5: knowing that it was going to be my loved ones

570
00:38:54,120 --> 00:38:56,960
Speaker 5: and friends and family putting together the pieces of broken

571
00:38:57,080 --> 00:39:00,759
Speaker 5: humanity is something that has made me worry. And I

572
00:39:00,960 --> 00:39:06,680
Speaker 5: know family members with victims, family members with victims, of

573
00:39:06,760 --> 00:39:10,800
Speaker 5: children and of teachers who have still not yet received

574
00:39:11,760 --> 00:39:16,880
Speaker 5: mental health counseling or support. I am now hearing about

575
00:39:17,080 --> 00:39:21,520
Speaker 5: children high school age, middle school age children that survived

576
00:39:21,560 --> 00:39:25,920
Speaker 5: the atrocities at rob who have not received mental health support.

577
00:39:26,600 --> 00:39:31,560
Speaker 5: I am hearing and know about families that don't know

578
00:39:32,480 --> 00:39:35,920
Speaker 5: what kinds of signs of trauma to look for in

579
00:39:36,040 --> 00:39:39,560
Speaker 5: their children or in the adults in their lives. And

580
00:39:39,719 --> 00:39:43,920
Speaker 5: so I am afraid. I know that the resources are

581
00:39:44,000 --> 00:39:46,600
Speaker 5: not reaching people where they are. He validly needs a

582
00:39:46,640 --> 00:39:51,239
Speaker 5: classroom by classroom, block by block response to help people

583
00:39:51,360 --> 00:39:54,560
Speaker 5: in the aftermath of this tragedy, and it hasn't happened yet.

584
00:39:55,680 --> 00:39:58,239
Speaker 5: And so, as a historian who studies not only racial

585
00:39:58,320 --> 00:40:02,960
Speaker 5: violence but the long africanath that's my hometown, those are

586
00:40:03,000 --> 00:40:06,320
Speaker 5: the people that I'm worried about receiving the support that

587
00:40:06,400 --> 00:40:10,560
Speaker 5: they need. I'm worried now I'm trying to raise the

588
00:40:10,640 --> 00:40:15,640
Speaker 5: alarm about the trauma that is not being.

589
00:40:15,480 --> 00:40:19,200
Speaker 1: Addressed to close. I want to thank you actually for

590
00:40:19,440 --> 00:40:23,640
Speaker 1: being very specific about tending to families needs and the

591
00:40:23,719 --> 00:40:27,400
Speaker 1: community's needs. But I'm asking you about how you're going

592
00:40:27,480 --> 00:40:28,360
Speaker 1: to take care of yourself.

593
00:40:29,920 --> 00:40:34,000
Speaker 5: I have therapy, so that's number one. People should seek counseling.

594
00:40:34,200 --> 00:40:36,759
Speaker 5: People should take advantage of the resources that are available.

595
00:40:37,360 --> 00:40:41,080
Speaker 5: That information should be circulated widely. I'm trying to take

596
00:40:41,120 --> 00:40:44,120
Speaker 5: care of my family and friends and make sure that

597
00:40:44,200 --> 00:40:47,200
Speaker 5: they have access to resources. So I've been making appointments

598
00:40:48,320 --> 00:40:50,839
Speaker 5: for family and friends and loved ones, and it's been

599
00:40:50,920 --> 00:40:54,240
Speaker 5: too hard. It's been too hard to make that happen.

600
00:40:55,840 --> 00:40:58,560
Speaker 5: But that is one thing that I'm doing, is turning

601
00:40:58,600 --> 00:41:05,600
Speaker 5: it into advocacy. Writing to elected officials, writing to charities

602
00:41:05,600 --> 00:41:08,759
Speaker 5: that are in Uvaldi about the needs, the gaps that

603
00:41:08,880 --> 00:41:12,759
Speaker 5: I see, writing to you know, the directors of the

604
00:41:12,800 --> 00:41:15,560
Speaker 5: Red Cross that are in Nouvalde and saying you need

605
00:41:15,640 --> 00:41:19,640
Speaker 5: to get into the community. I mean that is learning

606
00:41:19,760 --> 00:41:23,880
Speaker 5: from the long tradition of people in Evaldi who have

607
00:41:24,000 --> 00:41:30,360
Speaker 5: fought for social and civil rights, that we have to

608
00:41:30,520 --> 00:41:35,000
Speaker 5: turn this into making a better future. This living with guns,

609
00:41:35,760 --> 00:41:39,320
Speaker 5: living with weapons of war is not a safe future.

610
00:41:43,640 --> 00:41:48,279
Speaker 1: That was historian Monticae Munos Martinez, Monica, thank you so

611
00:41:48,400 --> 00:42:01,400
Speaker 1: much for being here. We really appreciate it. And just

612
00:42:01,560 --> 00:42:04,799
Speaker 1: as historians like Monica trying to make sense of these

613
00:42:04,880 --> 00:42:10,239
Speaker 1: tragedies for future generations, journalists play another crucial role in

614
00:42:10,360 --> 00:42:14,840
Speaker 1: moments like this. We're documenting history as it's happening, and

615
00:42:15,239 --> 00:42:19,800
Speaker 1: it's a big responsibility making sure we're sensitive to the victims,

616
00:42:19,840 --> 00:42:24,520
Speaker 1: to their families, and to their communities, and we're also

617
00:42:24,719 --> 00:42:29,400
Speaker 1: trying to give nuance to their story. Stella Chavez is

618
00:42:29,560 --> 00:42:34,320
Speaker 1: a bilingual journalist with public radio station ker in Dallas.

619
00:42:34,920 --> 00:42:38,120
Speaker 1: She traveled to Evaldi the weekend after the massacre, and

620
00:42:38,520 --> 00:42:41,600
Speaker 1: Stella shares what it's been like to report on these

621
00:42:41,680 --> 00:42:47,120
Speaker 1: tragedies and how communities come together to heal. Here's Stella

622
00:42:47,280 --> 00:42:49,120
Speaker 1: Chavez now in her own words.

623
00:42:57,120 --> 00:43:00,560
Speaker 6: I'm Stella Chaves and I'm a reporter at k EERA

624
00:43:00,760 --> 00:43:06,439
Speaker 6: in Dallas. I cover immigration and demographics here. I volunteered

625
00:43:07,320 --> 00:43:11,560
Speaker 6: to go to Uvalde because when the news broke about

626
00:43:11,560 --> 00:43:15,439
Speaker 6: the shooting at rob Elementary and we started learning more

627
00:43:15,719 --> 00:43:20,920
Speaker 6: about the victims, the fact that nineteen children had been killed,

628
00:43:22,160 --> 00:43:27,080
Speaker 6: it was very shocking to hear and upsetting my husband

629
00:43:27,120 --> 00:43:30,600
Speaker 6: and I don't have kids, but I used to cover education,

630
00:43:31,239 --> 00:43:34,880
Speaker 6: so going to schools is something I'm very familiar with,

631
00:43:35,680 --> 00:43:40,440
Speaker 6: going into classrooms, interviewing kids, and especially kids that age.

632
00:43:40,560 --> 00:43:42,880
Speaker 6: I mean, some of the best interviews I've had with

633
00:43:43,200 --> 00:43:48,680
Speaker 6: children have been in elementary schools. They're very curious about

634
00:43:48,719 --> 00:43:52,080
Speaker 6: everything about the equipment that you're using. And you know,

635
00:43:52,480 --> 00:43:54,279
Speaker 6: some kids have called me, oh, you're the Are you

636
00:43:54,400 --> 00:44:01,200
Speaker 6: the news lady? Because I speak Spanish, I felt like

637
00:44:01,360 --> 00:44:05,120
Speaker 6: I could also play a role in helping tell stories

638
00:44:05,440 --> 00:44:09,120
Speaker 6: of the families who maybe Spanish is their first language.

639
00:44:10,120 --> 00:44:14,600
Speaker 6: And the size of Uvalde is close to what the

640
00:44:14,760 --> 00:44:17,759
Speaker 6: size of my hometown was when I was growing up.

641
00:44:18,320 --> 00:44:22,400
Speaker 6: Everything I had heard before going to Valde sounded familiar.

642
00:44:28,280 --> 00:44:33,080
Speaker 6: The drive from Waksachi to Uvalde is typically.

643
00:44:32,760 --> 00:44:35,879
Speaker 1: Around five hours. On the way down.

644
00:44:36,880 --> 00:44:40,920
Speaker 6: Whereas normally I would listen to maybe a podcast or

645
00:44:41,440 --> 00:44:44,400
Speaker 6: catch up on news, this time I just chose to

646
00:44:44,560 --> 00:44:48,560
Speaker 6: listen to music because that would give me just time

647
00:44:48,640 --> 00:44:51,560
Speaker 6: to think about what I was going to do when

648
00:44:51,640 --> 00:44:57,320
Speaker 6: I got there. When I got to Uvalde, it was

649
00:44:57,400 --> 00:45:01,520
Speaker 6: around five thirty PM and and I happened to find

650
00:45:01,560 --> 00:45:04,800
Speaker 6: a parking spot on the town square. There were a

651
00:45:04,920 --> 00:45:07,799
Speaker 6: ton of people on the square, you know, visitors from

652
00:45:07,840 --> 00:45:12,640
Speaker 6: all over, and there was the makeshift memorial that was,

653
00:45:13,560 --> 00:45:16,480
Speaker 6: you know, growing pretty rapidly because so many people were

654
00:45:16,600 --> 00:45:24,719
Speaker 6: leaving flowers and teddy bears and messages. Even though I've

655
00:45:24,840 --> 00:45:29,560
Speaker 6: been reporting for many years, it's never easy to go

656
00:45:29,760 --> 00:45:32,920
Speaker 6: up to people who are grieving, and so I was

657
00:45:33,040 --> 00:45:37,160
Speaker 6: really conscious of what I was going to say to

658
00:45:37,280 --> 00:45:39,759
Speaker 6: people as I approached them, to ask them if they

659
00:45:39,800 --> 00:45:43,480
Speaker 6: would talk with me. If somebody was silently praying or

660
00:45:43,719 --> 00:45:47,319
Speaker 6: just meditating, I didn't want to bother them, but if

661
00:45:47,360 --> 00:45:49,839
Speaker 6: they were kind of standing back, I would approach them.

662
00:45:50,440 --> 00:45:51,200
Speaker 1: What is your name?

663
00:45:51,520 --> 00:45:52,600
Speaker 5: Caitlyn Gonzalez.

664
00:45:53,280 --> 00:45:56,439
Speaker 6: One of the most compelling stories I heard came from

665
00:45:56,840 --> 00:45:58,799
Speaker 6: ten year old Caitlin Gonzalez.

666
00:45:59,000 --> 00:46:01,359
Speaker 3: I am ten years old and I am a fourth grader.

667
00:46:01,400 --> 00:46:03,680
Speaker 7: I rab elementary, and she.

668
00:46:03,840 --> 00:46:06,719
Speaker 6: Told me about hiding in her classroom.

669
00:46:07,160 --> 00:46:10,680
Speaker 7: I was across from the room where the kids were

670
00:46:10,719 --> 00:46:12,920
Speaker 7: hot hostage and where a lot of most of the

671
00:46:13,040 --> 00:46:16,040
Speaker 7: kids passed away, and she.

672
00:46:16,160 --> 00:46:19,160
Speaker 6: Said that all of the kids in the classroom across

673
00:46:19,280 --> 00:46:20,680
Speaker 6: the hallway were her friends.

674
00:46:21,040 --> 00:46:23,120
Speaker 8: It's been really hard because I lost a lot of

675
00:46:23,200 --> 00:46:24,239
Speaker 8: my best friends.

676
00:46:25,200 --> 00:46:28,759
Speaker 6: But two of the students were her best friends, Jacquelinks

677
00:46:29,200 --> 00:46:32,360
Speaker 6: and Torres, and they ended up being killed.

678
00:46:33,600 --> 00:46:34,920
Speaker 9: I'm doing really well.

679
00:46:34,920 --> 00:46:38,680
Speaker 10: But I just need to stay strong for my family

680
00:46:38,760 --> 00:46:42,560
Speaker 10: and friends, and a lot of people have donated to

681
00:46:42,680 --> 00:46:43,759
Speaker 10: my friends and me.

682
00:46:44,200 --> 00:46:46,400
Speaker 5: It just it was it was heartbreaking to hear that.

683
00:46:49,920 --> 00:46:53,640
Speaker 6: Hearing Caitlin's story like that, being one of the first

684
00:46:53,719 --> 00:46:58,239
Speaker 6: interviews when I got there was in some ways what

685
00:46:58,480 --> 00:47:00,960
Speaker 6: kind of helped keep me going for the rest of

686
00:47:01,000 --> 00:47:06,440
Speaker 6: the weekend, because it filled me with not just sadness

687
00:47:07,200 --> 00:47:10,680
Speaker 6: and horror the thought that this could happen, but also

688
00:47:10,880 --> 00:47:15,600
Speaker 6: just anger that I really wanted to find officials to

689
00:47:15,800 --> 00:47:18,879
Speaker 6: like ask the questions like why did it take so long?

690
00:47:19,040 --> 00:47:31,360
Speaker 6: Like why weren't they saved. I think my role is

691
00:47:31,440 --> 00:47:36,480
Speaker 6: just to listen and to report as accurately as possible.

692
00:47:36,800 --> 00:47:41,239
Speaker 6: I mean, whatever they say is their truth. It's not

693
00:47:41,760 --> 00:47:44,520
Speaker 6: my story to tell, it's their story to tell. And

694
00:47:44,640 --> 00:47:47,640
Speaker 6: I think it's important to get all of that nuance

695
00:47:47,760 --> 00:47:51,360
Speaker 6: in there and the reporting. I think it's important to

696
00:47:51,600 --> 00:47:56,719
Speaker 6: remember that even if a community is predominantly Latino, we

697
00:47:56,800 --> 00:48:03,359
Speaker 6: shouldn't make assumptions about people and their feelings about really

698
00:48:03,880 --> 00:48:09,399
Speaker 6: difficult topics, whether it's the Second Amendment or mass shootings

699
00:48:09,760 --> 00:48:13,440
Speaker 6: or whatever the topic is. I think it's important to

700
00:48:13,560 --> 00:48:17,120
Speaker 6: remember that these communities are very diverse. So, yes, it's

701
00:48:17,200 --> 00:48:22,160
Speaker 6: predominantly Latino. Yes it's not far from the border, but

702
00:48:22,360 --> 00:48:23,680
Speaker 6: not everyone feels the same.

703
00:48:27,080 --> 00:48:28,920
Speaker 7: Good afternoon, and we're coming on the air because of

704
00:48:28,960 --> 00:48:31,160
Speaker 7: an awful scene playing out today in Texas.

705
00:48:31,400 --> 00:48:34,560
Speaker 8: Now from Uvaldi, Live now from Uvalde, Texas.

706
00:48:34,880 --> 00:48:36,040
Speaker 5: In Uvalde, Texas.

707
00:48:36,360 --> 00:48:40,200
Speaker 6: So one of the things I hate about covering a

708
00:48:40,239 --> 00:48:46,319
Speaker 6: big event is the fact that everybody from everywhere, from

709
00:48:46,520 --> 00:48:52,080
Speaker 6: across the country and sometimes from around the world, descend

710
00:48:52,280 --> 00:48:55,040
Speaker 6: on this one place. And when it's a small community

711
00:48:55,400 --> 00:48:58,200
Speaker 6: like Uvalde, I just have to think. And this is

712
00:48:58,239 --> 00:48:59,920
Speaker 6: what went through my mind as I pulled into the

713
00:49:00,080 --> 00:49:03,719
Speaker 6: town square, like, oh my gosh, everyone is here, all

714
00:49:03,800 --> 00:49:08,600
Speaker 6: of these big TV trucks. What must people be thinking.

715
00:49:10,080 --> 00:49:13,800
Speaker 6: I was walking through HB I had to go in

716
00:49:13,880 --> 00:49:18,120
Speaker 6: there for something, and I overheard a couple of employees

717
00:49:18,320 --> 00:49:21,719
Speaker 6: talking and I just remember hearing one guy say, Wow,

718
00:49:21,760 --> 00:49:24,440
Speaker 6: there are a lot of new people here. Because I

719
00:49:24,520 --> 00:49:27,279
Speaker 6: guess it's such a small community. Everyone knows each other,

720
00:49:27,480 --> 00:49:30,440
Speaker 6: so they probably usually see the same familiar faces in

721
00:49:30,520 --> 00:49:34,000
Speaker 6: the store. But on this particular day, like they noticed

722
00:49:34,000 --> 00:49:38,320
Speaker 6: there were people they hadn't seen before, and that just

723
00:49:38,440 --> 00:49:41,840
Speaker 6: kind of stuck with me. I'm not saying that we

724
00:49:41,920 --> 00:49:46,200
Speaker 6: shouldn't all be there, but I think that it's important

725
00:49:46,239 --> 00:49:48,520
Speaker 6: for all of us to check ourselves when we go

726
00:49:48,680 --> 00:49:52,080
Speaker 6: up to people and talk to them, not be too persistent,

727
00:49:52,560 --> 00:49:56,480
Speaker 6: and if someone says no, walk away, like, don't force it.

728
00:49:56,680 --> 00:50:05,080
Speaker 6: Don't force a mic into someone's face. I left Duvalde

729
00:50:05,920 --> 00:50:10,359
Speaker 6: Monday afternoon, and I actually didn't drive home. I drove

730
00:50:10,520 --> 00:50:14,200
Speaker 6: to a friend's house who lives outside of San Antonio

731
00:50:14,800 --> 00:50:17,920
Speaker 6: because it was already late. I didn't want to fall

732
00:50:17,960 --> 00:50:21,680
Speaker 6: asleep on the road driving back to Waxahachi, and I

733
00:50:21,760 --> 00:50:25,360
Speaker 6: also still had work to do. On the drive to

734
00:50:25,760 --> 00:50:29,520
Speaker 6: my friend's house, I listened to some news and PR

735
00:50:29,760 --> 00:50:32,680
Speaker 6: and the local public radio station, and then I just

736
00:50:32,760 --> 00:50:37,520
Speaker 6: put on music and there was one song and I

737
00:50:37,600 --> 00:50:40,799
Speaker 6: don't even remember the name of the song, but it's

738
00:50:40,840 --> 00:50:44,560
Speaker 6: a song that's a little bit more melancholy, and I

739
00:50:44,880 --> 00:50:47,759
Speaker 6: felt myself getting a little emotional as I listened to

740
00:50:47,880 --> 00:50:51,200
Speaker 6: that song, because I think it was the first time

741
00:50:52,040 --> 00:50:54,920
Speaker 6: during the entire weekend where I had just it was

742
00:50:55,080 --> 00:51:00,319
Speaker 6: just me and my thoughts, even though it was an

743
00:51:00,400 --> 00:51:05,680
Speaker 6: exhausting trip, emotionally, mentally, physically draining. I'm really glad that

744
00:51:05,760 --> 00:51:07,879
Speaker 6: I went. I would not have it any other way.

745
00:51:17,440 --> 00:51:21,520
Speaker 1: Coming up on Latino USA, I speak with Nelba Marquis Green.

746
00:51:22,120 --> 00:51:25,719
Speaker 1: Her daughter Anna, Grace was killed at the Sandy Hook

747
00:51:25,840 --> 00:51:30,319
Speaker 1: massacre almost a decade ago. Since then, Nelba has been

748
00:51:30,400 --> 00:51:34,080
Speaker 1: on a mission to help bring awareness on how best

749
00:51:34,200 --> 00:52:25,120
Speaker 1: to help families impacted by gun violence. Stay with us, yes, hey,

750
00:52:25,320 --> 00:52:29,400
Speaker 1: we're back. Throughout this episode, we've heard a lot about

751
00:52:29,520 --> 00:52:34,120
Speaker 1: the Uvaldi community, from its beautiful, rich Mexican American culture

752
00:52:34,200 --> 00:52:37,719
Speaker 1: and its history of resistance, to how journalists are trying

753
00:52:37,800 --> 00:52:41,000
Speaker 1: to document the story of a community after a tragedy.

754
00:52:41,680 --> 00:52:45,080
Speaker 1: But a question that lingers for many after every single

755
00:52:45,239 --> 00:52:48,880
Speaker 1: mass shooting is how can we help families and communities

756
00:52:49,000 --> 00:52:54,720
Speaker 1: affected by these tragedies. This is a question that Nelba

757
00:52:54,960 --> 00:52:59,359
Speaker 1: Marguez Green thinks about every single day since her daughter

758
00:53:00,200 --> 00:53:04,240
Speaker 1: Grace was killed almost a decade ago at the Sandy

759
00:53:04,440 --> 00:53:09,640
Speaker 1: Hook massacre in Newtown, Connecticut, where twenty children were murdered.

760
00:53:10,280 --> 00:53:15,840
Speaker 1: Anna was just six years old. Over the last decade,

761
00:53:15,920 --> 00:53:18,840
Speaker 1: Nelba has been on a mission to put families affected

762
00:53:18,920 --> 00:53:22,279
Speaker 1: by mass shootings and their needs at the forefront of

763
00:53:22,320 --> 00:53:26,080
Speaker 1: the country's conversation about gun violence. I recently got on

764
00:53:26,160 --> 00:53:29,840
Speaker 1: a video call with Nelba to talk about solidarity and

765
00:53:30,440 --> 00:53:33,279
Speaker 1: about how nature has helped her heal and what she

766
00:53:33,480 --> 00:53:35,799
Speaker 1: wants all of us to do in this moment. Even

767
00:53:35,840 --> 00:53:41,240
Speaker 1: though we feel powerless, Ola Nelba.

768
00:53:41,280 --> 00:53:44,839
Speaker 8: Ola almosts we are still here. Yeah.

769
00:53:45,880 --> 00:53:48,160
Speaker 1: So, first of all, thank you for taking the time

770
00:53:48,280 --> 00:53:50,440
Speaker 1: to speak with me. It means a lot to me

771
00:53:50,560 --> 00:53:52,000
Speaker 1: that you would make the time. I'm sure that you

772
00:53:52,120 --> 00:53:53,959
Speaker 1: are very, very busy these days.

773
00:53:54,520 --> 00:53:58,520
Speaker 8: Honestly, it's less the busyness and more the protection of

774
00:53:58,680 --> 00:54:01,800
Speaker 8: heart and energy and try to balance all of the

775
00:54:01,840 --> 00:54:04,840
Speaker 8: pieces that go into survivorship, especially in a week like

776
00:54:04,920 --> 00:54:07,800
Speaker 8: this that is incredibly full of sorrow.

777
00:54:08,040 --> 00:54:09,959
Speaker 1: Right So, ned, but I'm just going to go ahead

778
00:54:09,960 --> 00:54:12,200
Speaker 1: and tell everybody our story. You may think like I

779
00:54:12,239 --> 00:54:13,920
Speaker 1: don't have a story with Madia, but I feel like

780
00:54:13,960 --> 00:54:16,719
Speaker 1: I have a story with you, okay. And it has

781
00:54:16,840 --> 00:54:20,719
Speaker 1: to do with social media, which you're like mostly super positive,

782
00:54:21,200 --> 00:54:23,640
Speaker 1: and it feels like people are mostly super positive with you.

783
00:54:23,960 --> 00:54:25,680
Speaker 1: And the weird thing is is that you and I

784
00:54:26,640 --> 00:54:29,920
Speaker 1: we don't engage over the tragedy at Sandy Hook at

785
00:54:29,960 --> 00:54:34,320
Speaker 1: first we engage because I'm seeing you posting about birds

786
00:54:34,840 --> 00:54:37,960
Speaker 1: in a town in Connecticut that I happen to have

787
00:54:38,080 --> 00:54:41,120
Speaker 1: a house very near, and I think that was like

788
00:54:41,560 --> 00:54:45,120
Speaker 1: I was looking at your postings about the eagles and

789
00:54:45,280 --> 00:54:49,040
Speaker 1: your messages about hope and strength and solidarity, and that's

790
00:54:49,640 --> 00:54:53,200
Speaker 1: that's how I feel connected to you, Nel. But we've

791
00:54:53,239 --> 00:54:55,719
Speaker 1: actually never really talked about any of these issues that

792
00:54:55,719 --> 00:54:56,840
Speaker 1: we're going to talk about today.

793
00:54:57,200 --> 00:55:02,239
Speaker 8: No, we haven't. And the actually bird kayaking, spending a

794
00:55:02,239 --> 00:55:04,520
Speaker 8: little bit more time out in nature and making that

795
00:55:04,640 --> 00:55:07,960
Speaker 8: connection to something not all new to me, but certainly

796
00:55:08,080 --> 00:55:10,600
Speaker 8: that ramped up in the beginning of COVID when we

797
00:55:10,760 --> 00:55:15,320
Speaker 8: were sent home and things were different. So I'm grateful

798
00:55:15,400 --> 00:55:18,800
Speaker 8: to have found them. They've become great outlets for grief.

799
00:55:21,800 --> 00:55:23,760
Speaker 1: Can you tell me a little bit about that, because

800
00:55:24,640 --> 00:55:27,319
Speaker 1: you I don't know what you do, but you got

801
00:55:27,360 --> 00:55:29,880
Speaker 1: a camera or something, because you have these pretty incredible

802
00:55:29,960 --> 00:55:33,960
Speaker 1: shots of the eagles. My eagle, it's like, oh, it's passing,

803
00:55:34,040 --> 00:55:35,920
Speaker 1: and I'm like, look at Nailba. She was able to

804
00:55:36,000 --> 00:55:38,000
Speaker 1: get a picture of the eagles.

805
00:55:38,239 --> 00:55:41,320
Speaker 8: It's so many of these spaces I don't know about

806
00:55:41,360 --> 00:55:44,439
Speaker 8: for you and in your history, but for me going

807
00:55:44,480 --> 00:55:47,759
Speaker 8: out and hiking and kayaking and birding. For me when

808
00:55:47,840 --> 00:55:50,400
Speaker 8: I was a young person, we're just kind of framed

809
00:55:50,520 --> 00:55:55,120
Speaker 8: as activities white people did. So we moved to this

810
00:55:55,480 --> 00:55:58,239
Speaker 8: home and I saw other people doing this and I said,

811
00:55:58,320 --> 00:56:00,800
Speaker 8: I want, I want to do that. Thishear not not

812
00:56:01,120 --> 00:56:05,280
Speaker 8: be for me. So I got a camera, a beginner camera,

813
00:56:05,480 --> 00:56:08,359
Speaker 8: and I started, you know, asking people, tell me where

814
00:56:08,920 --> 00:56:10,920
Speaker 8: the birds are, tell me where the beauty is. And

815
00:56:11,239 --> 00:56:14,640
Speaker 8: I started, I'm kind of an eagle whisper. Now I

816
00:56:14,760 --> 00:56:16,920
Speaker 8: know where they are, I know where they nest, and

817
00:56:17,080 --> 00:56:20,840
Speaker 8: I get my camera and I just take in their beauty.

818
00:56:22,360 --> 00:56:24,759
Speaker 1: I feel really blessed because this weekend we went out

819
00:56:24,800 --> 00:56:27,279
Speaker 1: on the kayak on the lake and my son was

820
00:56:27,360 --> 00:56:29,839
Speaker 1: with me, and he's a spotter. He said, look up there,

821
00:56:29,840 --> 00:56:32,040
Speaker 1: and I happened to have the binoculars and I was

822
00:56:32,120 --> 00:56:36,560
Speaker 1: able to follow an eagle, white tail, whitehead sorry in

823
00:56:36,640 --> 00:56:39,840
Speaker 1: the distance far Nilba, but I was able to follow

824
00:56:39,920 --> 00:56:41,640
Speaker 1: the eagle. And I was like, this is like the

825
00:56:41,719 --> 00:56:45,239
Speaker 1: precursor to your conversation with Nilmah. And I really appreciated that.

826
00:56:45,920 --> 00:56:49,239
Speaker 1: So I wanted to talk a little bit. You're the

827
00:56:49,360 --> 00:56:51,399
Speaker 1: focus of what you want to talk about in these

828
00:56:51,520 --> 00:56:55,320
Speaker 1: moments is about what we need to be doing more of,

829
00:56:56,040 --> 00:56:59,120
Speaker 1: And actually I was on your Twitter feed it says

830
00:56:59,200 --> 00:57:01,120
Speaker 1: we need to learn learn to be a people who

831
00:57:01,239 --> 00:57:05,880
Speaker 1: ask more of the powerful and less of those hurting.

832
00:57:06,760 --> 00:57:09,439
Speaker 8: What I am sensing right now, if you go back

833
00:57:09,520 --> 00:57:13,040
Speaker 8: far enough, my first tweet after the most recent events

834
00:57:13,080 --> 00:57:17,040
Speaker 8: in Texas are stay here, right, stay here. I sense

835
00:57:17,240 --> 00:57:21,720
Speaker 8: a level of helplessness, hopelessness, and desperation at the state

836
00:57:21,800 --> 00:57:25,560
Speaker 8: of this world, and certainly in many ways fueled by

837
00:57:25,680 --> 00:57:30,840
Speaker 8: this latest highly publicized shooting, and understandably so. But in

838
00:57:31,000 --> 00:57:34,200
Speaker 8: that desperation, I believe we're asking the wrong people to

839
00:57:34,320 --> 00:57:37,880
Speaker 8: do more. And that's where that stems from. To me,

840
00:57:38,160 --> 00:57:41,360
Speaker 8: to be demanding of families that need to be protected,

841
00:57:42,000 --> 00:57:44,920
Speaker 8: that need to be cared for, that need to be comforted,

842
00:57:45,040 --> 00:57:48,360
Speaker 8: that need to be held up. Literally. I remember in

843
00:57:48,400 --> 00:57:50,960
Speaker 8: the first days, the funeral week as we would call

844
00:57:51,040 --> 00:57:53,120
Speaker 8: it here, you know, I had to be helped in

845
00:57:53,200 --> 00:57:56,760
Speaker 8: the shower. I couldn't There wasn't much I could do alone.

846
00:57:57,240 --> 00:58:01,800
Speaker 8: So at this point, the survival of people of families,

847
00:58:02,120 --> 00:58:04,960
Speaker 8: including those most impacted, but all of us in this

848
00:58:05,120 --> 00:58:13,000
Speaker 8: survivor family, is very important to me. I only speak

849
00:58:13,040 --> 00:58:15,040
Speaker 8: for myself. I can't say these are right decisions for

850
00:58:15,120 --> 00:58:17,560
Speaker 8: every family. I want to make that super clear. But

851
00:58:18,040 --> 00:58:21,880
Speaker 8: in general, the practice of asking more of those with

852
00:58:22,080 --> 00:58:26,240
Speaker 8: less power is something we do when we feel helpless

853
00:58:26,560 --> 00:58:29,840
Speaker 8: and we are not focused. And I'm a therapist. I'm

854
00:58:29,840 --> 00:58:32,040
Speaker 8: a marriage and family therapist. We think systemically, and that's

855
00:58:32,080 --> 00:58:35,480
Speaker 8: one of the basic tenets of systems theory that you

856
00:58:35,760 --> 00:58:39,280
Speaker 8: actually ask for change from those most in power, which

857
00:58:39,320 --> 00:58:41,840
Speaker 8: is why when I was in private practice, somebody would

858
00:58:41,840 --> 00:58:43,560
Speaker 8: bring their kid. They would want to drop off their

859
00:58:43,560 --> 00:58:46,680
Speaker 8: ten year old in my office and say fix them.

860
00:58:47,440 --> 00:58:50,480
Speaker 8: And I would say, will you come? You have to

861
00:58:50,680 --> 00:58:54,240
Speaker 8: come to therapy because what's happening here is probably that

862
00:58:54,320 --> 00:58:56,920
Speaker 8: this young person is presenting symptoms. But my guess is

863
00:58:56,960 --> 00:59:00,240
Speaker 8: that this is a systemic issue and it's happening now.

864
00:59:00,400 --> 00:59:02,280
Speaker 8: I know that we're asking because we're desperate. I know

865
00:59:02,360 --> 00:59:04,880
Speaker 8: that ninety nine percent of the people asking aren't ghoules,

866
00:59:05,080 --> 00:59:07,160
Speaker 8: but it does feel like a ghoulish ask.

867
00:59:08,160 --> 00:59:11,200
Speaker 1: The people that you want us to ask, the people

868
00:59:11,280 --> 00:59:14,520
Speaker 1: in power. And you're a very religious person, Well, you said,

869
00:59:14,600 --> 00:59:17,200
Speaker 1: we will never resolve the problem of gun violence in

870
00:59:17,280 --> 00:59:21,480
Speaker 1: America without examining the ways the church is complicit. Write

871
00:59:21,520 --> 00:59:25,040
Speaker 1: that one down. So when you're saying go to the powerful,

872
00:59:25,160 --> 00:59:27,360
Speaker 1: what do you mean? What do you want us to

873
00:59:27,440 --> 00:59:28,120
Speaker 1: take away from that?

874
00:59:28,680 --> 00:59:30,560
Speaker 8: I do think there are a number of people sitting

875
00:59:30,600 --> 00:59:33,400
Speaker 8: back right now feeling pretty powerless, wanting to be helpful,

876
00:59:34,080 --> 00:59:38,520
Speaker 8: and that's why these screams and cries are emanating from them.

877
00:59:38,880 --> 00:59:42,160
Speaker 8: One really simple thing we can do is ask in

878
00:59:42,240 --> 00:59:43,320
Speaker 8: our church communities.

879
00:59:43,520 --> 00:59:43,760
Speaker 11: I am.

880
00:59:44,400 --> 00:59:45,880
Speaker 8: I don't know if I would call myself religious, but

881
00:59:45,920 --> 00:59:49,280
Speaker 8: I do love Jesus, you know very much, and I

882
00:59:49,400 --> 00:59:51,120
Speaker 8: know what it's like to be a part of church

883
00:59:51,160 --> 00:59:53,960
Speaker 8: systems that I have learned. Don't support people, are a

884
00:59:54,040 --> 00:59:57,480
Speaker 8: part of tradition, but don't support people, don't support liberation,

885
00:59:57,760 --> 01:00:01,560
Speaker 8: don't support helping the hurting in ways that in ways

886
01:00:01,600 --> 01:00:02,240
Speaker 8: that make sense.

887
01:00:02,880 --> 01:00:06,919
Speaker 1: So you're I misinterpreted that, so your experience is much

888
01:00:07,040 --> 01:00:08,080
Speaker 1: more spiritual.

889
01:00:09,040 --> 01:00:12,160
Speaker 8: I'm a one hundred percent like lover of Jesus. What

890
01:00:12,320 --> 01:00:15,760
Speaker 8: I do know is that there are cultures within Christianity

891
01:00:16,400 --> 01:00:19,400
Speaker 8: that aren't helping us or aren't rising to the moment.

892
01:00:19,560 --> 01:00:22,000
Speaker 8: So one place I feel like we could make change

893
01:00:22,400 --> 01:00:25,080
Speaker 8: is in church communities. Another place I think we could

894
01:00:25,120 --> 01:00:28,560
Speaker 8: make change is with our lawmakers. But anybody asking me

895
01:00:28,760 --> 01:00:30,720
Speaker 8: right now to release a crime scene photo to said

896
01:00:30,760 --> 01:00:33,000
Speaker 8: cruise is going to get, you know, a less than

897
01:00:33,040 --> 01:00:35,960
Speaker 8: holy response from me. So I would like us to

898
01:00:36,040 --> 01:00:39,360
Speaker 8: move away from that and instead do other things. We

899
01:00:39,480 --> 01:00:41,600
Speaker 8: got to vote these folks out. We got to elect

900
01:00:41,760 --> 01:00:45,320
Speaker 8: good people to office right, people who are not in

901
01:00:45,360 --> 01:00:47,959
Speaker 8: the pockets of the NRA. We have to These things

902
01:00:48,040 --> 01:00:52,120
Speaker 8: aren't hard, but it is easier to ask me, neva

903
01:00:52,800 --> 01:00:59,480
Speaker 8: release a photo. We are holding up entire families. Survivors

904
01:00:59,560 --> 01:01:01,680
Speaker 8: often are the ones that people look to for leadership

905
01:01:01,720 --> 01:01:06,320
Speaker 8: and courage. And I've got a mom, my daughter, and

906
01:01:06,400 --> 01:01:09,360
Speaker 8: my son, have cousins, I have a seventeen year old

907
01:01:09,400 --> 01:01:12,560
Speaker 8: who survived. We answer to them. We don't answer to

908
01:01:12,640 --> 01:01:15,640
Speaker 8: these cries. And you know, I'm Puerto Rican. We are

909
01:01:15,720 --> 01:01:17,840
Speaker 8: loyal to family, and I have to do what's in

910
01:01:17,920 --> 01:01:20,800
Speaker 8: the best interests of my family, not the world's cries.

911
01:01:26,160 --> 01:01:28,919
Speaker 1: You have been saying that you want people when they're

912
01:01:28,960 --> 01:01:31,520
Speaker 1: saying how to help, You're like, well, think about the families.

913
01:01:31,960 --> 01:01:34,880
Speaker 1: So what is that message? You think you're doing one thing,

914
01:01:34,960 --> 01:01:38,320
Speaker 1: but you're not actually being effective. What do you want

915
01:01:38,400 --> 01:01:39,600
Speaker 1: us to understand in that moment?

916
01:01:40,360 --> 01:01:42,040
Speaker 8: First of all, I have to thank you for asking

917
01:01:42,120 --> 01:01:45,000
Speaker 8: these incredibly nuanced questions, because I haven't been asked them

918
01:01:45,040 --> 01:01:46,800
Speaker 8: in this way, So thank you for giving me the time.

919
01:01:47,520 --> 01:01:50,360
Speaker 8: It is incredibly easy right now to develop a program

920
01:01:50,520 --> 01:01:52,720
Speaker 8: or a formula and say this is what works for families,

921
01:01:52,840 --> 01:01:55,520
Speaker 8: but we know that there is no one size fits

922
01:01:55,560 --> 01:01:59,880
Speaker 8: all model. Right getting to know people personally will really

923
01:02:00,080 --> 01:02:02,480
Speaker 8: help you be an effective comforter because what works for

924
01:02:02,560 --> 01:02:06,440
Speaker 8: me might not work for the next person. However, best

925
01:02:06,560 --> 01:02:10,160
Speaker 8: practice tells us that after a traumatic event like this,

926
01:02:10,600 --> 01:02:12,800
Speaker 8: the first six months to a year is not the

927
01:02:12,920 --> 01:02:16,840
Speaker 8: time to be making decisions and choices like moving, like

928
01:02:17,000 --> 01:02:20,560
Speaker 8: all of these things we ask of families, because it's

929
01:02:20,720 --> 01:02:25,160
Speaker 8: really about survival. It's really about first year, maybe first

930
01:02:25,160 --> 01:02:28,200
Speaker 8: sixteen months. You know half of I know, I have

931
01:02:28,280 --> 01:02:30,720
Speaker 8: a lot of hair, you can see it, but half

932
01:02:30,760 --> 01:02:33,360
Speaker 8: of my hair fell out. Half of my hair fell out,

933
01:02:33,440 --> 01:02:37,600
Speaker 8: right like my body lost the ability to metabolize iron

934
01:02:38,280 --> 01:02:43,120
Speaker 8: due to the stress of the shooting. So the first

935
01:02:43,240 --> 01:02:46,640
Speaker 8: six months to a year really about survival, really about

936
01:02:47,400 --> 01:02:51,200
Speaker 8: helping these families with basic data day tasks regulate their body,

937
01:02:51,320 --> 01:02:54,480
Speaker 8: regulate their hearts, regulate their brains. With all of the

938
01:02:54,680 --> 01:02:59,200
Speaker 8: things we know, movement and beauty and nature and all

939
01:02:59,440 --> 01:03:02,240
Speaker 8: of the things that we know are really helpful. We

940
01:03:02,480 --> 01:03:06,439
Speaker 8: immediately think that supporting families means driving them to action,

941
01:03:07,000 --> 01:03:09,360
Speaker 8: and that could be helpful for some families, it's not

942
01:03:09,560 --> 01:03:12,600
Speaker 8: helpful for all families. I talk to families that say,

943
01:03:12,760 --> 01:03:15,080
Speaker 8: I feel forgotten because i don't have a foundation, I

944
01:03:15,200 --> 01:03:17,800
Speaker 8: feel forgotten because I've never been on TV. I feel

945
01:03:17,840 --> 01:03:21,160
Speaker 8: forgotten because I'm not in Washington. So I'm sensitive also

946
01:03:21,280 --> 01:03:23,040
Speaker 8: to those families. Does that make sense?

947
01:03:23,400 --> 01:03:27,680
Speaker 1: Hmm? You talk about solidarity, would you tell us a

948
01:03:27,720 --> 01:03:30,320
Speaker 1: little bit about acts of solidarity that helped you and

949
01:03:30,440 --> 01:03:32,840
Speaker 1: that continue to help you in this well decade.

950
01:03:32,920 --> 01:03:35,959
Speaker 8: Frankly, when my kids were little, two of the first

951
01:03:36,160 --> 01:03:39,880
Speaker 8: phrases I ever taught them was I need help and

952
01:03:40,040 --> 01:03:42,240
Speaker 8: how can I help you? I wanted them to be

953
01:03:42,400 --> 01:03:45,280
Speaker 8: kids that could both ask for help and ask how

954
01:03:45,280 --> 01:03:47,720
Speaker 8: they could be helpful. And I think those are still

955
01:03:47,880 --> 01:03:51,000
Speaker 8: things that feel like acts of solidarity to me when

956
01:03:51,120 --> 01:03:54,160
Speaker 8: I am with people or in communion with people or

957
01:03:54,200 --> 01:03:58,400
Speaker 8: groups that allow me to say I need help or

958
01:03:58,520 --> 01:04:00,960
Speaker 8: ask me can I be helpful? Or when I can

959
01:04:01,080 --> 01:04:04,600
Speaker 8: ask how can I be helpful? So It's really very simple.

960
01:04:04,720 --> 01:04:06,920
Speaker 8: It is being present for families in a way that

961
01:04:07,080 --> 01:04:10,040
Speaker 8: centers the person most hurting. It is being present for

962
01:04:10,160 --> 01:04:13,000
Speaker 8: families in a way that allows them to be vulnerable

963
01:04:13,040 --> 01:04:15,440
Speaker 8: with you and is not over promising and under delivering.

964
01:04:15,440 --> 01:04:16,760
Speaker 8: A lot of people are going to go to Texas,

965
01:04:16,800 --> 01:04:18,120
Speaker 8: a lot of people are going to come to Sandy

966
01:04:18,160 --> 01:04:20,320
Speaker 8: Hook and they're going to say, I'm going to fix

967
01:04:20,560 --> 01:04:23,960
Speaker 8: your thing, and there's nothing that can fix this, right,

968
01:04:24,040 --> 01:04:25,280
Speaker 8: So we just need you to be present.

969
01:04:26,120 --> 01:04:30,280
Speaker 1: So, if I'm not mistaken, Nelba, you were the only

970
01:04:30,400 --> 01:04:33,880
Speaker 1: Latino family from Sandy Hook. Yes, And I've thought a

971
01:04:33,920 --> 01:04:37,040
Speaker 1: lot about well, the horror right because as we have

972
01:04:37,160 --> 01:04:40,680
Speaker 1: seen now twice in Texas, it has been I believe

973
01:04:41,240 --> 01:04:44,840
Speaker 1: a very targeted right in Elpaso definitively a hate crime,

974
01:04:44,920 --> 01:04:47,680
Speaker 1: and here I would consider it a hate crime as well.

975
01:04:48,400 --> 01:04:50,600
Speaker 1: There's something that has I mean, this is at a

976
01:04:50,640 --> 01:04:52,560
Speaker 1: whole other level. And I have in fact been thinking

977
01:04:52,600 --> 01:04:57,120
Speaker 1: about you, like, how does Niedba process this because it

978
01:04:57,280 --> 01:04:58,800
Speaker 1: is at a whole other level.

979
01:04:59,760 --> 01:05:03,800
Speaker 8: This was not the only tragedy that has hit me

980
01:05:03,840 --> 01:05:08,080
Speaker 8: in this way. I was already reeling from Buffalo when

981
01:05:08,160 --> 01:05:11,240
Speaker 8: the elders in community of Buffalo were impacted, just like

982
01:05:11,320 --> 01:05:14,120
Speaker 8: the Emmanuel Nine. Because my daughter was not just Puerto Rican,

983
01:05:14,200 --> 01:05:18,120
Speaker 8: she was also black. These types of tragedies do hit

984
01:05:18,880 --> 01:05:24,560
Speaker 8: in a really deep way, but so does the draw

985
01:05:25,240 --> 01:05:30,640
Speaker 8: of the resilience of my people and my culture. I

986
01:05:30,800 --> 01:05:34,600
Speaker 8: am not the only woman in my family who has

987
01:05:34,960 --> 01:05:41,800
Speaker 8: suffered through something horrible and still stayed present and vulnerable

988
01:05:41,920 --> 01:05:46,480
Speaker 8: but also real in a way that was right for her.

989
01:05:46,600 --> 01:05:50,600
Speaker 8: So I feel like I come from a long line

990
01:05:51,280 --> 01:05:55,680
Speaker 8: of women and a culture that where this stance I'm

991
01:05:55,760 --> 01:06:01,480
Speaker 8: taking of realness with vulnerability, with what people see us, strength,

992
01:06:01,640 --> 01:06:04,120
Speaker 8: with faith and hope. I'm not the only one and

993
01:06:04,200 --> 01:06:07,040
Speaker 8: I'm not unique. So in this moment, I am drawing

994
01:06:07,120 --> 01:06:10,520
Speaker 8: deeply from my faith, deeply from the strength and support

995
01:06:10,560 --> 01:06:13,960
Speaker 8: of my family and community, and the things that I

996
01:06:14,520 --> 01:06:19,240
Speaker 8: know in my spirit are true, like what decisions are right,

997
01:06:19,720 --> 01:06:22,360
Speaker 8: which ones are not right? And that's the only thing

998
01:06:22,400 --> 01:06:29,000
Speaker 8: I can draw on if people take example from that, Okay,

999
01:06:29,280 --> 01:06:32,000
Speaker 8: but really, I'm on Twitter as like a daily diary

1000
01:06:32,120 --> 01:06:34,760
Speaker 8: to be like, Hey, guys, on my deck looking at

1001
01:06:34,800 --> 01:06:37,120
Speaker 8: birds today, what are you guys doing? Anybody want to

1002
01:06:37,120 --> 01:06:38,040
Speaker 8: go to crossco.

1003
01:06:38,440 --> 01:06:41,640
Speaker 1: So as I was looking through your feed I was like,

1004
01:06:42,040 --> 01:06:44,240
Speaker 1: I was like, listen, y'all are coming at me a

1005
01:06:44,280 --> 01:06:46,560
Speaker 1: little bit too hard. I think it's time for me

1006
01:06:46,640 --> 01:06:49,000
Speaker 1: to get off of Twitter. I'm going to Costco. You

1007
01:06:49,080 --> 01:06:51,760
Speaker 1: guys need anything. I just think it was kind of

1008
01:06:52,200 --> 01:06:56,640
Speaker 1: adorable that moment. And Yeah, as we're wrapping up, there

1009
01:06:56,760 --> 01:06:59,320
Speaker 1: is that realness you are trying. What are you're trying

1010
01:06:59,360 --> 01:07:01,520
Speaker 1: to say something with that realness to all of us.

1011
01:07:02,440 --> 01:07:07,800
Speaker 8: No one is getting out of this without community and

1012
01:07:07,880 --> 01:07:13,280
Speaker 8: without relationships. And I remember in my heart both the

1013
01:07:13,560 --> 01:07:19,720
Speaker 8: examples of terrible solidarity but also the examples of beautiful, vulnerable,

1014
01:07:21,000 --> 01:07:24,880
Speaker 8: awkward solidarity that mattered. I remember the number of people

1015
01:07:24,880 --> 01:07:26,720
Speaker 8: who would show up at our house just so just yesterday,

1016
01:07:27,080 --> 01:07:29,320
Speaker 8: just yesterday, there was a woman. I mean, I have

1017
01:07:29,400 --> 01:07:31,360
Speaker 8: a ring, so I see you, but people think they

1018
01:07:31,400 --> 01:07:33,520
Speaker 8: don't see me when they come to my doorstep. And

1019
01:07:33,640 --> 01:07:38,400
Speaker 8: she dropped off a bag with a napkin, embroidered napkin,

1020
01:07:38,440 --> 01:07:40,640
Speaker 8: and it said, girl, you're not free chips and salsa,

1021
01:07:40,880 --> 01:07:44,240
Speaker 8: you are guac. You are a side of guak. And

1022
01:07:44,760 --> 01:07:47,760
Speaker 8: it's in that spirit that and we have to have humor.

1023
01:07:48,120 --> 01:07:51,440
Speaker 8: Humor has helped me so much. Without humor, I have

1024
01:07:51,600 --> 01:07:54,600
Speaker 8: someone in Canada. His name is Steve and his job

1025
01:07:54,720 --> 01:07:56,600
Speaker 8: is to send me a daily joke, right just to

1026
01:07:56,760 --> 01:08:01,480
Speaker 8: keep me grounded. So yeah, we try our best every

1027
01:08:01,560 --> 01:08:03,040
Speaker 8: day to just kind of show up.

1028
01:08:03,800 --> 01:08:07,680
Speaker 1: So again, from your fabulous Twitter feed, this one says,

1029
01:08:07,960 --> 01:08:11,400
Speaker 1: good morning whenos Dias. Today is Tuesday, May thirty first,

1030
01:08:11,680 --> 01:08:14,720
Speaker 1: in the year twenty twenty two. Where I live, the

1031
01:08:14,840 --> 01:08:18,400
Speaker 1: lilacs are wild and the mourning doves are cooing. This

1032
01:08:18,680 --> 01:08:21,439
Speaker 1: is where I do mourning prayer, the beauty and the

1033
01:08:21,560 --> 01:08:25,880
Speaker 1: bitter commingling, and you just I'm like, girl, I'm really

1034
01:08:25,920 --> 01:08:28,759
Speaker 1: glad that you are a marriage counselor and a marriage

1035
01:08:28,800 --> 01:08:31,639
Speaker 1: therapist so that you can help people find the love

1036
01:08:31,720 --> 01:08:34,240
Speaker 1: that you and your partner have for your family and

1037
01:08:34,320 --> 01:08:35,040
Speaker 1: for the rest of us.

1038
01:08:35,479 --> 01:08:38,280
Speaker 8: I want to say one more thing, please. I didn't

1039
01:08:38,280 --> 01:08:42,280
Speaker 8: write before Anna died. I didn't know I had words.

1040
01:08:42,960 --> 01:08:45,559
Speaker 8: But when my daughter was killed and they allowed us

1041
01:08:45,600 --> 01:08:50,400
Speaker 8: back in the school to pick up belongings that weren't

1042
01:08:51,720 --> 01:08:55,320
Speaker 8: covered in something that they could not give us, they

1043
01:08:55,479 --> 01:08:57,880
Speaker 8: handed us a piece of paper and the piece of

1044
01:08:57,960 --> 01:09:01,880
Speaker 8: paper was taken down from the Hopes and Dreams board

1045
01:09:02,600 --> 01:09:06,720
Speaker 8: in Anna Grace's classroom, and what she had written on

1046
01:09:06,800 --> 01:09:10,000
Speaker 8: her Hopes and Dreams board, and they had asked the

1047
01:09:10,120 --> 01:09:12,800
Speaker 8: children to write down their hopes and dreams. Was I

1048
01:09:12,920 --> 01:09:15,720
Speaker 8: want to write. I want to write when I can,

1049
01:09:16,920 --> 01:09:20,160
Speaker 8: and on the paper and I have it somewhere is

1050
01:09:20,280 --> 01:09:23,720
Speaker 8: a like a book cover and it's like a book

1051
01:09:23,760 --> 01:09:26,160
Speaker 8: about dogs. It's like she was obsessed with dogs. We

1052
01:09:26,200 --> 01:09:28,040
Speaker 8: were going to get a dog, and you know, she

1053
01:09:28,200 --> 01:09:31,960
Speaker 8: passed away. So when I write, I feel like I

1054
01:09:32,040 --> 01:09:34,960
Speaker 8: write in that spirit. Write. I write when I can.

1055
01:09:35,200 --> 01:09:37,680
Speaker 8: If people take beauty, hope inspiration, that's great. But I

1056
01:09:37,800 --> 01:09:40,240
Speaker 8: write and I write when I can. And I just

1057
01:09:40,400 --> 01:09:43,120
Speaker 8: wanted to end our segment with a nod to my

1058
01:09:43,320 --> 01:09:48,400
Speaker 8: daughter and yeah, thank you for asking these nuanced questions.

1059
01:09:48,400 --> 01:09:50,880
Speaker 1: I'm so glad I did this, and we are so

1060
01:09:51,000 --> 01:10:03,160
Speaker 1: glad that Anna spirit is with us. That was Melva

1061
01:10:03,479 --> 01:10:06,960
Speaker 1: Marquez Green, Melva, thank you so much for being with

1062
01:10:07,120 --> 01:10:14,719
Speaker 1: us today. Muchisi mas Graskaz And now, dear listener, before

1063
01:10:14,760 --> 01:10:17,000
Speaker 1: we end our show, we want to take a moment

1064
01:10:17,680 --> 01:10:21,400
Speaker 1: and have our Futuro Media team read the names of

1065
01:10:21,600 --> 01:10:24,839
Speaker 1: all of the lives lost in Uvaldi, Texas.

1066
01:10:30,000 --> 01:10:37,639
Speaker 4: Nave Alisa Brabo, ten years old, Jacqueline Cassarrees, age nine,

1067
01:10:40,600 --> 01:10:43,160
Speaker 4: mckaina Lee l Rad ten years.

1068
01:10:43,000 --> 01:10:55,679
Speaker 11: Old, Jose Manuel Flores Junior ten, Eleana Amaya Garcia age nine.

1069
01:10:57,560 --> 01:11:01,400
Speaker 1: Irma Linda Garcia forty eight.

1070
01:11:03,439 --> 01:11:11,480
Speaker 7: Uzia Serrio Garcia ten years old, Amerie Joe Garza.

1071
01:11:12,080 --> 01:11:22,439
Speaker 3: Ten, Xavier James Lopez aged ten, Jace Carmelo Luevanos ten years.

1072
01:11:22,240 --> 01:11:32,960
Speaker 7: Old, Tees Mari Mata aged ten, Miranda gil Mathis eleven years.

1073
01:11:32,800 --> 01:11:41,519
Speaker 10: Old, Eva Mireles forty four years old, Alithia Ramirez ten,

1074
01:11:43,560 --> 01:11:46,839
Speaker 10: Annabel Juadelupe Rodriguez aged ten.

1075
01:11:48,280 --> 01:11:52,160
Speaker 3: Maipe Juliana Rodriguez ten.

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01:11:52,120 --> 01:11:58,280
Speaker 11: Years old, Alexandria Lexi Rubio age.

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01:11:58,080 --> 01:12:04,960
Speaker 1: Ten, Layela Marie Salasar age eleven.

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01:12:06,479 --> 01:12:15,240
Speaker 9: Jayla Nicole Silgero aged ten, Eleana Torres ten years old.

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Speaker 1: And Rujelio Fernandez Torres, who was also ten years old.

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Speaker 1: This episode was produced by Victoria Strada and Rinaldo Leanos Junior.

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01:12:42,439 --> 01:12:45,760
Speaker 1: It was edited by Marta Martinez and Daisy Contreras and

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01:12:45,960 --> 01:12:50,040
Speaker 1: mixed by Julia Caruso and Lia Shaw. Fact checking by

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01:12:50,120 --> 01:12:52,880
Speaker 1: Patrisa Subran. We want to give a special thanks to

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01:12:53,040 --> 01:12:56,639
Speaker 1: Nicole Foy and Marta Praskowski who wrote about the nineteen

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01:12:56,760 --> 01:13:00,679
Speaker 1: seventy school walkouts in Nuvaldi for the l pas So Times.

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01:13:01,160 --> 01:13:03,560
Speaker 1: We also want to thank Texas Public Radio k e

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01:13:03,800 --> 01:13:07,879
Speaker 1: r A and Sofia Sanchez. The Latino USA team includes

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01:13:07,960 --> 01:13:12,800
Speaker 1: Andrea Lopez Grusado, Mike Sargent, Julieta Martinelli, Alejandra Salasad and

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01:13:12,880 --> 01:13:16,719
Speaker 1: Julia Rocha, with help from Raoul Perez. Our editorial director

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01:13:16,720 --> 01:13:20,280
Speaker 1: is Julio Ricardo Barella. Our director of Engineering is Stephanie Lebau.

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01:13:20,680 --> 01:13:24,760
Speaker 1: Our associate engineer is Gabriela Bayez and jj Carubin. Our

1092
01:13:24,840 --> 01:13:28,679
Speaker 1: marketing manager is Luis Luna. Our theme music was composed

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01:13:28,680 --> 01:13:32,280
Speaker 1: by Zenia Rouinos. I'm your host and executive producer Maria Jojosa.

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01:13:32,400 --> 01:13:34,840
Speaker 1: Join us again on our next episode. Remember to see

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01:13:34,920 --> 01:13:37,800
Speaker 1: us on all of your social media and more than

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01:13:37,840 --> 01:13:39,679
Speaker 1: ever not de vayes Choo.

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01:13:42,320 --> 01:13:46,280
Speaker 3: Latino USA is made possible in part by the Annie

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01:13:46,640 --> 01:13:50,360
Speaker 3: Casey Foundation, creates a brighter future for the nation's children

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01:13:50,600 --> 01:13:55,720
Speaker 3: by strengthening families, building greater economic opportunity, and transforming communities.

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01:13:56,360 --> 01:14:02,599
Speaker 3: The Heising Simons Foundation unlocking knowledge, opportunity and possibilities more

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01:14:02,800 --> 01:14:09,120
Speaker 3: at hsfoundation dot org and funding for latinousas Coverage of

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01:14:09,200 --> 01:14:11,880
Speaker 3: a culture of health is made possible in part by

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01:14:11,920 --> 01:14:14,200
Speaker 3: a grant from the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation.