Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, Radio News.
Speaker 2: This week, we're heading to Ghana. Recently, the country has
Speaker 2: made headlines for anti LGBTQ legislation that, if passed, could
Speaker 2: have implications on Ghana's effort to reboost its economy.
Speaker 1: For Ghana, there's a human rights issue, but there is
Speaker 1: also a very critical economic issue because it's trying to
Speaker 1: work through this dead crisis.
Speaker 2: In May, the country Supreme Court started hearing legal arguments
Speaker 2: on a bill that seeks to punish people who identify
Speaker 2: as LGBTQ. This week, I discussed with Bloomberg Senior reporter
Speaker 2: Yinka Ibukhan, who's based in Akra, about the possible consequences
Speaker 2: of this legislation being approved not only for Ghana, but
Speaker 2: also for the international financial institutions. I'm Jennifer's Abisaja and
Speaker 2: this is the Next Africa Podcast, bringing you one story
Speaker 2: each week from the continent driving the future of global
Speaker 2: growth with the context only Bloomberg can provide. Jinka, Hi,
Speaker 2: how are you? Thanks for joining us this week?
Speaker 3: Thanks for having me.
Speaker 2: You recently wrote an article about the proposed human sexual
Speaker 2: Rights and Family Values bill in Ghana. You're sitting in
Speaker 2: Akra right now, so you're perfectly primed to give us
Speaker 2: an overview of it. What does it entail?
Speaker 1: This bill punishes identifying as LGBTQ with up to three
Speaker 1: years in jail. It criminalizes LGBTQ groups, It criminalizes support
Speaker 1: for LGBTQ groups. But it also forces people to report
Speaker 1: anyone who they know is LGBTQ or also face punishment.
Speaker 1: And that could include teachers, coworkers, and even family members.
Speaker 1: So in that sense, it's quite a draconian bill, even
Speaker 1: when you look at other anti LGBTQ.
Speaker 3: Bills that have spread. This bill was a long time coming.
Speaker 1: It was introduced in parliament in twenty twenty one in Ghana.
Speaker 4: Those in favor and those against say no a Human
Speaker 4: Sexual Arized and Family Values Bill twenty twenty one. It's
Speaker 4: read a third time and passed.
Speaker 1: But only in February was it passed by lawmakers. Now,
Speaker 1: two citizens are challenging the bill's constitutionality as a Supreme Court.
Speaker 1: Actually they're challenging its constitutionality. Ghana is a signatory to
Speaker 1: a lot of human rights agreements.
Speaker 3: The argument is that this bill.
Speaker 1: Goes against these agreements, but also goes against Ghana's own constitution,
Speaker 1: including the rights of association, the freedom of expression, which
Speaker 1: are also challenged by this bill.
Speaker 2: So this could potentially mean a number of implications for
Speaker 2: Ghana if this actually becomes law. Can you explain that.
Speaker 1: I mean, the first implication for this kind of bill
Speaker 1: for any country, including Ghana, is that you're restricting the
Speaker 1: rights of your LGBTQ minority. So that in itself is
Speaker 1: a big implication. But in addition to that, Ghana is
Speaker 1: on a pretty precarious situation because it's actually currently going
Speaker 1: through a debt crisis and really needs all the financial
Speaker 1: support it can get. And the main people that are
Speaker 1: coming to its aid right now the World Bank and
Speaker 1: the IMF, and they have very strict non discrimination standards,
Speaker 1: and so this bill actually now calls into question that
Speaker 1: financial support.
Speaker 2: So let's pick that apart, Yinka just a bit. You
Speaker 2: mentioned the IMF and the World Bank. What are their
Speaker 2: stances right now in terms of non discrimination to those
Speaker 2: who they're lending to.
Speaker 1: So the standards of non discrimination impact all marginalized groups
Speaker 1: in recipient countries of development finance support, so that includes women,
Speaker 1: young children, people living with disabilities, ethnic minorities. But increasingly
Speaker 1: we're having it spelled out that sexual minorities also should
Speaker 1: be considered marginalized groups, and that's certainly the case for
Speaker 1: the Worldorld Bank that has a policy that specifies that
Speaker 1: sexual minorities are considered marginalized groups and need to be
Speaker 1: protected and also need to have access to projects that
Speaker 1: are financed by the World Bank. What this bill's proposes
Speaker 1: would actually make it more difficult for LGBTQ minorities in
Speaker 1: Ghana to access World Bank projects.
Speaker 2: When you put it like that, Yinka, it seems very
Speaker 2: clear that these laws would not be beneficial to Ghana
Speaker 2: potentially getting funding from these institutions. But it also puts
Speaker 2: these institutions in a pretty difficult situation that they have
Speaker 2: to essentially walk a fine line in terms of what
Speaker 2: they are policing and what they're not.
Speaker 1: It's definitely a fine line because any stance they take
Speaker 1: openly would be perceived as Western influence. Even though the
Speaker 1: World Bank is the World Bank, there's this sense that
Speaker 1: it is a Western organization and that it shouldn't be
Speaker 1: imposing Western values on countries because it is very much
Speaker 1: being framed as.
Speaker 3: A sovereignty issue.
Speaker 1: But that's the framing of the situation, and that makes
Speaker 1: it more difficult for organization perceived as Western like the
Speaker 1: World Back and the ims to speak against it or
Speaker 1: act against it. But there's also some dishonesty about the
Speaker 1: bills because we're framing it as a sovereignty issue. But
Speaker 1: these ideas actually in large part exports it.
Speaker 2: When you say, Yinka that these family values not necessarily
Speaker 2: are coming from Ghana or from Africa, I mean, where
Speaker 2: would you say they originate from? Then? How did this
Speaker 2: become an African story in twenty twenty four.
Speaker 1: So it's actually well documented that there is so called
Speaker 1: pro family movement that's come mostly from the US that
Speaker 1: is spreading this anti LGBTQ agenda, and you're seeing it
Speaker 1: in the US with a legislation against the abortion, against
Speaker 1: the just restricting access to contraceptives, this idea that you know,
Speaker 1: you need to protect the family by ensuring that women
Speaker 1: can have as many children as possible.
Speaker 3: And also the family in that.
Speaker 1: Context is defined as the union between a man and
Speaker 1: a woman who have a responsibility to create to keep
Speaker 1: the population growing, and so anything that's seen as challenging that,
Speaker 1: including having same sex unions or same sex couples, is
Speaker 1: something that this group, which is mostly far right US
Speaker 1: evangelical is spreading and in Africa it's gotten more attraction
Speaker 1: than elsewhere, and so Ghana is only one of the
Speaker 1: pieces where it's had an influence.
Speaker 2: After the break, we'll discuss why anti LGBTQ laws are
Speaker 2: spreading across the continent and zero in on Uganda's recently
Speaker 2: passed legislation.
Speaker 1: Ghana is the latest African country to Pastor Konian laws
Speaker 1: aimed at the community, after Uganda introduced harsh new measures
Speaker 1: last year.
Speaker 2: Okay, Yinka, let's focus on another country. We've just heard
Speaker 2: there that Uganda passed similar legislation to what we are
Speaker 2: seeing in Ghana. Remind us what happened there.
Speaker 1: Uganda has in a way become the original headquarters for
Speaker 1: this mostly US led pro family movement, and in twenty
Speaker 1: four team introduced for the first time anti LGBTQ legislation
Speaker 1: that was considered quite draconian, so much so that it
Speaker 1: was called the Kilder Gays Bill. That legislation was eventually
Speaker 1: struck out by the courts, but was reintroduced very recently
Speaker 1: and became law in twenty twenty three. As much as
Speaker 1: the LGBTQ agenda has recorded some success in Uganda. The
Speaker 1: activist community in Uganda has also fought really hard over
Speaker 1: now over a decade.
Speaker 2: And Yinka, maybe let's go back to Ghana. Of the
Speaker 2: people you spoke with in the country and in particular
Speaker 2: the economic consequences of this potential bill if it were
Speaker 2: to become law, what are their biggest concerns about this?
Speaker 1: I mean, the average Canayan is not really following the
Speaker 1: legal process that's leading to this bill, and even less
Speaker 1: looking at the economic implication. They're facing enough challenges with
Speaker 1: higher inflation, high cost of living, a depreciating currency.
Speaker 3: They have a lot on their hands.
Speaker 1: They're not really looking at the LGBTQ minority and what
Speaker 1: Parliament is doing. However, Ghana is in an election year,
Speaker 1: so what you're seeing is that politicians and religious.
Speaker 3: Leaders, traditional leaders.
Speaker 1: Are politicizing this bill and kind of making it a
Speaker 1: bigger deal than it is to the average Ghanian. But
Speaker 1: because it's election, everything is a big deal right now.
Speaker 1: Everything is a potential to sway the vote one way.
Speaker 3: Or the other.
Speaker 2: I mean, back to the funding aspect of it, because
Speaker 2: you bring up the struggles that the Ghanaian economy is
Speaker 2: going through. I mean, what does that mean then? For
Speaker 2: potential funding from the World Bank, Is that on hold
Speaker 2: until we get more clarity on this bill.
Speaker 1: No, now it's business as usual. Everything is continuing. The
Speaker 1: stands of the World Bank is that it doesn't comment
Speaker 1: on a bill, it has to wait for it to
Speaker 1: become law. So for now everything continues as usual. But
Speaker 1: we do know that in Uganda after the bill became law,
Speaker 1: the World Bank halted new funding to Uganda, so there
Speaker 1: is a precedent for halting funding to a country that
Speaker 1: adopts anti LGBTQ legislation. But as far as Ghana goes,
Speaker 1: this is still the bill. World Bank is still funding.
Speaker 1: The IMF is also continuing as planned. But the fear
Speaker 1: is really that if the bill does become law, that
Speaker 1: funding and the IMF program could be put into jeopardy,
Speaker 1: and that by virtue of the IMF program going into
Speaker 1: jeopardy or being impacted, we could have twenty billion of
Speaker 1: external debt restructuring also being impacted, which would be catastrophic
Speaker 1: for Ghana at this.
Speaker 2: Point and our thanks to Yinka there for that reporting.
Speaker 2: As Yinka described, the family values movement is coming at
Speaker 2: a time where sub Saharan Africa is facing an acute
Speaker 2: funding squeeze spurned on by higher borrowing costs in the West,
Speaker 2: so support from the international institutions is critical. But also
Speaker 2: critical is how these financial lenders handle the erosion of
Speaker 2: human rights in Ghana and how that could potentially set
Speaker 2: a precedent for what we're likely to see in other countries.
Speaker 2: You can read more on that story on Bloomberg dot com.
Speaker 2: The Next Africa podcast is available every week wherever you
Speaker 2: usually get your podcast. I'm Jennifer Zabasaja. Thanks as always
Speaker 2: for listening and