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Speaker 1: Draft is now officially open. Welcome to Draft season. I

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Speaker 1: am John Schmelke.

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Speaker 2: It's all brought to you by Moody's, a proud partner

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Speaker 2: of the Giants, uniting the brightest minds to turn today's

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Speaker 2: risk into tomorrow's opportunities.

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Speaker 1: Learn more at moodies dot com.

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Speaker 2: As always, we're joined by Tony Pauline, who writes for

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Speaker 2: sports Keta on the NFL Draft, Tony, we got a

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Speaker 2: busy few weeks coming here.

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Speaker 1: We got three weeks before the combine.

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Speaker 2: We're gonna do our are your rather top ten ranks

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Speaker 2: at each position group this week. Next week you're gonna

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Speaker 2: have a mock draft at We'll also take some fan

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Speaker 2: questions if you want to send them to us on Twitter,

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Speaker 2: feel free, and then we're gonna have our Combine preview

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Speaker 2: and then our Combine reviews. So that'll take us through

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Speaker 2: the first week of March, and then we're like seven

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Speaker 2: weeks away from the NFL Draft, so it comes fast,

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Speaker 2: my friend.

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Speaker 3: It does. And then right after the combine, you know,

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Speaker 3: we'll have free agency, which a lot of people will

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Speaker 3: be very excited about, but we also have Pro days.

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Speaker 3: And the pro days are crazy because you will have

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Speaker 3: three and four prod per day, five sometimes six days

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Speaker 3: a week. And what happens is the guys who didn't

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Speaker 3: work out the combine or the guys who were not

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Speaker 3: invited to combine will be working out for NFL scouts.

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Speaker 3: So yeah, seven weeks been, it goes fast because really

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Speaker 3: from the combine on the month of March, as far

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Speaker 3: as I'm concerned, is just the craziest time of the year,

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Speaker 3: specifically because of those crow days.

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Speaker 2: So, Tony, I was going through your top tens and

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Speaker 2: we'll get to the specifically first, but a general question first.

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Speaker 2: I went through here, and I'm not sure if these

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Speaker 2: these grades are final yet, but you have like rounds

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Speaker 2: listed right and right now I counted twenty one guys

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Speaker 2: with first round grades. That's not inclouding your one slash

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Speaker 2: two guys. Those are just the guys that you have

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Speaker 2: a first round number on. And again that's going to change,

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Speaker 2: as Tony just said, as he finishes his scouting process.

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Speaker 2: Do you expect that number to decrease or increase as

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Speaker 2: you go deeper into.

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Speaker 3: This, It'll probably increase. I mean, right since I sent

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Speaker 3: it to you, there's twenty guys to have sure first

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Speaker 3: round grades. And it's always changing because I'm always watching film.

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Speaker 3: So really, right now I'm in the middle actually through

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Speaker 3: getting through Georgia in the SECC, so that number will

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Speaker 3: change based on my views. It will change again because

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Speaker 3: let's say a guy like Isaiah Bond, the smaller receiver,

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Speaker 3: if he doesn't run super fast, he's gonna fall. You know,

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Speaker 3: you expect Isaiah Bond to at least get in the

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Speaker 3: under four fours. So based on some of the testing scores,

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Speaker 3: that will change. And of course the medicals. Eventually some

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Speaker 3: of these some of the stuff will come out about

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Speaker 3: these guys medicals, maybe issues that they had previously or

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Speaker 3: they were red flag. That's also going to change. The

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Speaker 3: character stuff. I mean, I don't expect it to change

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Speaker 3: that much. I know most of the character issues unless

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Speaker 3: somebody does something really stupid between now and the draft.

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Speaker 1: Okay, so let's get it to it, Tony. We have

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Speaker 1: the quarterbacks first.

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Speaker 2: You have deeper than ten here for a lot of

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Speaker 2: these position groups, which is great and it's funny the

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Speaker 2: way I categorize it, Tony. Maybe not as good as

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Speaker 2: the top is last year's class, with nobody as great

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Speaker 2: as high.

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Speaker 1: As the Jayden Daniels and the Drake Mays and the

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Speaker 1: Caleb Williams. We've been through that before.

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Speaker 2: But unlike last year, where after you got past the

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Speaker 2: first six guys, right, Spencer Ratler wasn't taken to a

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Speaker 2: round five. You have a good you know, seven eight

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Speaker 2: guys between rounds two and five.

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Speaker 3: Right, it's nowhere. It's nowhere near as good at the

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Speaker 3: top of the draft. No one expects that. But there

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Speaker 3: are a good number of players after that. Some of

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Speaker 3: them have got outstanding physical skills and just need to

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Speaker 3: be coached up. Some of them don't have great physical

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Speaker 3: skills and may just need to be in the right system.

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Speaker 3: I mean, you talk about Jalen Milro, one of my

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Speaker 3: favorite guys. You watched Jaln Milroe up to that Georgia game,

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Speaker 3: and you look like a short fire top twelve pick.

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Speaker 3: It was all downhill for him afterwards. You mentioned last

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Speaker 3: week at the Senior Bowl how Jaln Milroll never wanted

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Speaker 3: to show off his strong arm. He kept with those

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Speaker 3: five and eight yard dump off passes, and we I

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Speaker 3: mentioned late in the season that Jalen Milroe was winning

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Speaker 3: games with its legs. So it seems to me that

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Speaker 3: Jalen Miller. Milroe has lost a lot of confidence in

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Speaker 3: his passing, his passing abilities. You got to get him

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Speaker 3: coached up. If you get him coached up, you know

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Speaker 3: he goes late first round. I don't think he's gonna

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Speaker 3: fall out the first round. You could have an outstanding

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Speaker 3: quarterback in your hands. Literally the same thing with quinn Ewers.

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Speaker 3: Quinn Ewers is he's got a terrific rodical arm. You know,

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Speaker 3: he's a smart, tough passer, doesn't make a lot of mistakes,

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Speaker 3: had a lot of talents around them. Just may may

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Speaker 3: need to play in the right system, as would Jackson Dart,

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Speaker 3: who a lot of people like Jackson Dart is a

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Speaker 3: mid first round pick. I just don't see it. I

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Speaker 3: was hoping that we see, you know, a big time

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Speaker 3: arm at the senior ball. We did not. I think

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Speaker 3: he's a Day two pick, a second round pick. But

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Speaker 3: if you put a me in timing sort of a

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Speaker 3: timing type of offense, sort of like the San Francisco

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Speaker 3: forty nine ers run, I think Jackson Dart will be

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Speaker 3: uh will be very successful at the next level. Then

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Speaker 3: you've got Riley, Leonard cal McCord, Will Howard Tyler, shuck.

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Speaker 3: These are guys that have got outstanding physical skills. They

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Speaker 3: all have NFL arms, but they stared down receivers. They

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Speaker 3: need help on with their accrescy. They need to improve

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Speaker 3: their accuracy in their past placement. But they have a

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Speaker 3: tremendous amount of upside. They've got good size as well.

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Speaker 3: So there are more guys that are developmental quarterbacks. And

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Speaker 3: if coach dright, you take them late in day two,

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Speaker 3: early in day three, really through the middle quart of

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Speaker 3: day three, you could hit a home run.

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Speaker 1: Ah yeah, you.

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Speaker 2: Gotta have these guys split up into tiers. I know

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Speaker 2: you didn't do this on purpose, just naturally. That's kind

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Speaker 2: of where the grades have wound up. So at the

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Speaker 2: top of your Warden Sanders, how close do you have

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Speaker 2: those guys, Tony? And do you think the consensus seems

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Speaker 2: to be right now that Ward's gonna go before Sanders?

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Speaker 2: Do you still think there's a chance that could flip

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Speaker 2: before we get the draft day or no?

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Speaker 3: I mean I would be surprised. I reported this as

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Speaker 3: sports skied at the Senior Bowl. Actually, I think it's

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Speaker 3: from the shrine ball that the consensus was cam Warden's

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Speaker 3: gonna be the first quarterback selected and if the draft

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Speaker 3: were held right now, he would be selected by the

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Speaker 3: Tennessee Titans. You know, I like Shador Sanders. There are

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Speaker 3: some people that are very concerned about the Dion factors

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Speaker 3: something else. I reported that, you know, if Sanders doesn't

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Speaker 3: play well, or if he's getting sacked or something. You know,

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Speaker 3: Dion's got that bully pit, bully pulpit at the as

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Speaker 3: head coach of the University of Colorado to air the

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Speaker 3: grievances about, you know, his son not playing well, the

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Speaker 3: blame other people. That does concern some people.

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Speaker 2: I think, by the way, Shador himself seems like a

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Speaker 2: pretty well put together, sure kid, both.

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Speaker 3: Of the both of the Sanders kids, both of them do.

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Speaker 3: But that doesn't that's not gonna stop Dad, because Dad

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Speaker 3: from being a dad. I mean, you know, everybody wants

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Speaker 3: to protect their kids. And if Dad see something, you know, wrong,

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Speaker 3: he's going to express those or he's going to criticize it.

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Speaker 3: And we all don't have the bully pulpit that Deon

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Speaker 3: Sanders does.

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Speaker 1: So I absolutely agree with you that I speak for yourself. Tony.

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Speaker 3: There there you go. Uh So, I agree with you

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Speaker 3: that is something I think what's going to happen is

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Speaker 3: I think of a team if both quarterbacks are there,

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Speaker 3: a team is really going to have to like Shador

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Speaker 3: Sanders much more than cam Ward to take Shador Sanders

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Speaker 3: over cam Ward. I think if it's very close. The

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Speaker 3: vibe I'm getting right now though, is that if it's

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Speaker 3: very close, they're gonna lean towards Ward.

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Speaker 2: Do you think Sanders gets out of the top six,

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Speaker 2: I'll say, because that's what the Raiders are selecting, I'd

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Speaker 2: be shocked.

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Speaker 3: I think the Raiders are gonna have to trade up

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Speaker 3: to get a quarterback. And you know, when you look

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Speaker 3: at you got the two other kids, you got Abdul

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Speaker 3: Carter and Travis Hunter, and then it kind of drops

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Speaker 3: you off after that. I mean, you're gonna take Mason

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Speaker 3: Graham before shoot door Sanders. You're gonna take McMillan, the

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Speaker 3: receiver out of Arizona before door Sanders. I think there'll

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Speaker 3: be the opportunity for a team like the Raiders that

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Speaker 3: are in desperate need of a quarterback to trade up

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Speaker 3: and get Sanders if he gets past the Giant selection.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'd be surprised if those weren't the force four

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Speaker 2: players taken to be honest with you, if those aren't

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Speaker 2: the first four players, Tony, I'd be surprised.

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Speaker 1: I'm with you, all right.

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Speaker 2: Your next group and your grades are kind of close

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Speaker 2: on these three guys. Is Miro who you mentioned? You

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Speaker 2: still think he's first round? They'll get in there, right

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Speaker 2: Quinn or a start?

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Speaker 1: Do you think?

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Speaker 2: How close do you think those guys are? How confident

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Speaker 2: are you that Milro's gonna be your third guy?

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Speaker 1: Gone?

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Speaker 3: Yeah? I think you know. The thing about Mirro is

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Speaker 3: I just as I mentioned before, the passing has seemed

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Speaker 3: to go away from him. He's got the great physical skills,

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Speaker 3: he is a high character guy. He is well liked

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Speaker 3: by everybody. He is a leader. It may be a

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Speaker 3: situation where he just needs proper coaching. I mean, Alabama

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Speaker 3: just hired Ryan Grubb, who basically developed Michael Pennix, probably

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Speaker 3: a year or two late. As far as Jalen Milro

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Speaker 3: is concerned, I still think with those physical skills, the

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Speaker 3: way he's going to interview, and his upside, he's the

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Speaker 3: first round pick. I also think, even though I have

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Speaker 3: a second round greade on Queen Youwers, I think Queen

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Speaker 3: Youwers could land in the bottom part of round one,

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Speaker 3: either by a team maybe the Rams, maybe the Lions

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Speaker 3: that have an aging quarterback and want to get a

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Speaker 3: young guy in the pipeline, or a team that moves

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Speaker 3: from the late sorry, from the early part of round

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Speaker 3: two into the late part of round one to get

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Speaker 3: a sigmal caller.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I was, honestly, I was surprised, Tony, because you've

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Speaker 2: been fairly critical of quin Yours over the course of

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Speaker 2: the I think maybe that was you kind of fighting

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Speaker 2: back on people that were calling him a first round

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Speaker 2: there maybe, and that was kind of the source of

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Speaker 2: where you were coming from on it.

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Speaker 1: But I was surprised to see you have him ahead

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Speaker 1: of Dart.

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Speaker 3: To be honest with you, Well, top ten remember they

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Speaker 3: were we were in the New York area and people

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Speaker 3: were talking about the Giants taking Queen Yours as a

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Speaker 3: top ten pick. He was never that type of player.

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Speaker 3: He never was. I think what you weres The thing

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Speaker 3: about Dart is I like him as a quarterback, just

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Speaker 3: the physical skills. We didn't see the big arm that

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Speaker 3: has been my concern about Jackson Dart. If you take

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Speaker 3: Jackson Dart, I think you're giving a lot away with

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Speaker 3: the vertical game because he doesn't have that vertical arm

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Speaker 3: which quin viewers does. I mean, quinn Ewers is basically

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Speaker 3: a gun slinger.

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Speaker 2: I was surprised told you that you with Leonard ahead

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Speaker 2: of McCord and Howard. I was surprised by that given

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Speaker 2: what we saw from him over the course of the year.

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Speaker 3: See here's the thing about McCord and Howard that really

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Speaker 3: concerns me. It concerned me on film, it concerned me

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Speaker 3: when I saw him live. They have a tendency to

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Speaker 3: stare down the primary target. Both Ohio State guys who

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Speaker 3: played the port Ohiose at one point or another. Mccordy

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Speaker 3: was really bad staring down the primary target in two

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Speaker 3: thousan in twenty three. He did improve in twenty twenty four.

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Speaker 3: Will Howard same thing. I mean, it's very slow to

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Speaker 3: move their head from the primary target that will kill

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Speaker 3: you on someday. They got great physical skills. I think

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Speaker 3: that Riley Leonard really improved as a passer. We talked

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Speaker 3: about that. Jim Nagy also mentioned that really through the

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Speaker 3: second half of the twenty twenty four season, didn't have

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Speaker 3: great talent around him as far as the receivers were concerned.

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Speaker 3: At times was running for his life. But he's an

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Speaker 3: outstanding athlete who unlike McCord and Howard, the staring down

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Speaker 3: of the quarterback, slow moving your head from the primary target,

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Speaker 3: that is a big red flag for me.

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Speaker 1: All right, fair enough?

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Speaker 2: And then the guys at the back end, Tyler Shook, well,

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Speaker 2: I know some people were talking about as like a

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Speaker 2: day two pick off of the Senior Bowl, which I

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Speaker 2: think you know, he was fine the Senior Bowl. I

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Speaker 2: don't think nothing blew me away. Britty Cook from his

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Speaker 2: oor sor shrine. And then Dylan Gabriel Oregon, who you

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Speaker 2: all have for his Day three picks. All right, let

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Speaker 2: you go to the running back spot here, Tony. And

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Speaker 2: just to show you how deep it is, you listed

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Speaker 2: ten guys and we're not even out of the third

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Speaker 2: round here, dude, Like, how about sure how many other

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Speaker 2: third rounders or you might have after these top ten,

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Speaker 2: but this is a great group.

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Speaker 1: You have Ashton genty obviously he is the first round.

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Speaker 2: There, three second round picks in Caleb Johnson, Amari and

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Speaker 2: Hampton and Quinn Shawn Jenkins.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and actually Simpson and eighteen of my last third

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Speaker 3: round picks. Then he going to the fourth round of

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Speaker 3: Kyle Managy of Rutgers, And I mean, it's just the

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Speaker 3: opposite of last year, right because we didn't see going

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Speaker 3: into the draft. We didn't figure a quarterback would be

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Speaker 3: selected before a running back would be selected before the

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Speaker 3: third round. And you had one guy that was taken

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Speaker 3: late in round two coming off of major injury. And

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Speaker 3: the thing about this is it's a diverse group, if

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Speaker 3: I could use that word. I mean Ashton Genty is

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Speaker 3: a three down back, terrific pass catcher out of the backfield,

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Speaker 3: can pick and choose his way on the inside, has

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Speaker 3: a speed and agility to turn the corner. Is going

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Speaker 3: to grate as a top six player in this draft.

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Speaker 3: Probably he's not going to be selected into the mid

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Speaker 3: first round because of the valuization the way they value

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Speaker 3: running backs. Still an outstanding player. I have Caleb Johnson

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Speaker 3: rated higher than Omarrian Hampton primarily because I think Caleb

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Speaker 3: Johnson does a couple of things. He's got more versatile game.

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Speaker 3: He can turn the corner and get around the outside

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Speaker 3: with j O'maron Hampton struggles to do. I like them both,

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Speaker 3: but I think that Caleb Johnson in the past, we've

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Speaker 3: seen Iowa running backs that basically go downhill and are

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Speaker 3: fast cale Johnson can do that, but he also shows

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Speaker 3: the ability to make defenders miss. He also shows a

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Speaker 3: lot of creativity in his game, also shows himself to

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Speaker 3: be a solid pass catcher of the backfield for what

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Speaker 3: was really a bad Iowa offense.

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Speaker 2: I don't think we've talked about Amari and Hampton Tony

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Speaker 2: more than like ten seconds on this podcast over the

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Speaker 2: last four or five months. So why don't you kind

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Speaker 2: of give a fans a breakdown of what he's all

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Speaker 2: about is I'm sure not a lot of people were

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Speaker 2: locked into North Carolina football this season, especially after Drake

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Speaker 2: May left last year.

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Speaker 3: Big, powerful guy. I have an early second round grade

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Speaker 3: on him. Grinds it out on the inside those guys

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Speaker 3: that he's rarely brought down by the first defender, rarely

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Speaker 3: brought down by a single defender. Deceptively fast too. I mean,

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Speaker 3: if there's a lane, he's gonna run in the mid

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Speaker 3: four force. He can beat defenders into the open field.

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Speaker 3: Not a real good lateral runner, not a guy that's

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Speaker 3: going to turn the perimeter, which Johnson can do. He's

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Speaker 3: also a decent pass catcher out of the backfield. I

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Speaker 3: think if it was twenty years ago where running backs

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Speaker 3: were really highly prioritized. I think on Marion Hampton's potentially

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Speaker 3: late a mini first round pick, but because of the

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Speaker 3: fact that you know you want versatility, you want guys

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Speaker 3: who can run on the outside, who can turn the perimeter.

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Speaker 3: That's why Hampton's going to be downgraded a bit.

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Speaker 2: Then you got Jenkins. We've talked about good between the tackles. Guy,

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Speaker 2: he's not gonna run great. We talked about him by

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Speaker 2: a bunch. Jordan James, Tony, I know, guy that is

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Speaker 2: close to your heart. And these third round picks are

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Speaker 2: good players.

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Speaker 3: Man.

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Speaker 2: I'm going to go through the six guys and you

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Speaker 2: can pick out how whoever you want to hit on

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Speaker 2: Jordan James, Damian Martinez, Cam Scattaboo, Treviaon Henderson, Dylan Simpson,

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Speaker 2: and then Trevor Aten.

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Speaker 1: Some good players there, man.

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Speaker 3: You know, I'll go start with the last one atn

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Speaker 3: Hey Dn looks hit or miss. I mean, you watch

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Speaker 3: some of the games where Georgia gave him the ball

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Speaker 3: and he was the primary offensive threat, and he's he's tremendous.

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Speaker 3: I mean, he creates the yardage on the inside, sets

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Speaker 3: up defenders and makes them miss. Has the agility to

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Speaker 3: turn the corner, tremendous pass catcher out of the backfield.

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Speaker 3: But there are games where he's just streaky, where he

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Speaker 3: runs east west rather than turning it up the field.

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Speaker 3: Travion Henderson, I spoke at at length. I have him

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Speaker 3: as a third rounder. Maybe he goes a little bit

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Speaker 3: later because of injuries. But the guy, well you gotta

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Speaker 3: do is watch Ohio State and when they need a

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Speaker 3: big play, he basically he produced camp Scattibow. I know

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Speaker 3: a lot of people love him, how can you not

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Speaker 3: like him? Reminds me a lot of Brian Leonard, who

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Speaker 3: was the second round pick out of Rutgers years ago. Big,

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Speaker 3: not a big down a toll guy, but a big

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Speaker 3: guy who loves physical contact. But again, the versatility, the

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Speaker 3: inability to turn the outside, turn the corner speed. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: he's a four to six guy, and that's and as

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Speaker 3: far as I'm concerned, reduces his appeal. I love Damian

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Speaker 3: Martinez and I know that he transferred from Oregon State

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Speaker 3: to Miami. They had good running backs there, so he

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Speaker 3: was not the feature runner. He was a situational runner,

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Speaker 3: and that may be good because he didn't get a

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Speaker 3: lot of wear and tear last year. But he is

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Speaker 3: a guy who's two hundred and forty pounds, but he

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Speaker 3: runs like he's two hundred and fifteen pounds. He's quick,

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Speaker 3: he's elusive, he makes defenders miss, terrific pass catcher of

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Speaker 3: the backfield. Again, I have him as a third round pick.

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Speaker 3: He could slide a little bit later, but as far

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Speaker 3: as I'm concerned, Martinez could be one of the steals

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Speaker 3: at the running back position, depending on where he selected.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'll just throw one more thing there about atm

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Speaker 2: You know, I don't know if he was banged up

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Speaker 2: at the end of the year for Georgia. He didn't

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Speaker 2: seem to have that same type of pop that I

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Speaker 2: thought we saw for maybe when he was at Florida.

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Speaker 2: But at the Senior Bowl when we saw him Tony,

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Speaker 2: he had that pop again. He had some nice burst

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Speaker 2: to his game. So I wonder if he was playing

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Speaker 2: through something at the end of the year there, which

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Speaker 2: I think would be interesting if we could find that out.

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Speaker 3: Two up and down. But again, I mean when you

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Speaker 3: watch him at the top of his game against teams

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Speaker 3: like Auburn, games against Auburn I mean he's a one

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Speaker 3: man show.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, let's go to tight end.

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Speaker 2: And I think it's telling that we're gonna do tight

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Speaker 2: end before we do wide receiver, given the classes. But

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Speaker 2: you have seven tight ends here and all of them

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Speaker 2: are third round are better except for one Terrence Ferguson, who,

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Speaker 2: by the way, from Oregon. We talked about him on

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Speaker 2: a Senior Bowl review. I would have him in the

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Speaker 2: third round. So I think you're looking at seven potential,

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Speaker 2: you know, top three round tight ends here. There could

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Speaker 2: be more break down this list for me. You got

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Speaker 2: two first rounders and leveland and Warren, and I wonder

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Speaker 2: if Elijah Royal might start getting into that conversation too.

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Speaker 3: I struggle. I can understand it after the Senior Bowl performance,

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Speaker 3: and I think he's gonna run spectacularly well, but he's

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Speaker 3: more of a moved tight end type. I don't you know,

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Speaker 3: you're not gonna use him as a blocker. You're probably

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Speaker 3: not gonna use clos You're probably not gonna use Closton

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Speaker 3: Loveland as a blocker all that much, although we can

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Speaker 3: he can black. No, Loveland is coming off of a

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Speaker 3: shoulder injury, and as far as i'm concerned. I have

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Speaker 3: him reading slightly higher than Warren. And I know everybody

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Speaker 3: likes warm, but I look at Loveland. He plays faster.

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Speaker 3: I'm sure he's going to run faster. He's more of

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Speaker 3: a natural pass catcher. That's nothing against Warren, It's just

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Speaker 3: that that's the way Loveland has played the past three

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Speaker 3: years at Michigan, which is why I have him grated

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Speaker 3: slightly higher. Want to see what the testing numbers are.

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Speaker 3: In my opinion, the guy who is kind of being

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Speaker 3: dismissed and ignored, who I think people are going to

397
00:17:24,640 --> 00:17:26,359
Speaker 3: scout you's going to fall in love with. Who's going

398
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Speaker 3: to be a terrific players of Randy Gatson of Syracuse

399
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Speaker 3: former receiver checks in at the Shrine Bowl six two

400
00:17:33,960 --> 00:17:36,879
Speaker 3: and a half, two hundred and forty seven pounds, thirty

401
00:17:36,880 --> 00:17:39,600
Speaker 3: three and a half inch arms, hands that are almost

402
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Speaker 3: ten inches and he plays the tight end position. Why

403
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Speaker 3: he played the receiver position, I mean, you watched the film.

404
00:17:47,840 --> 00:17:50,560
Speaker 3: We saw him at the Shrine Bawl. Just the natural

405
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Speaker 3: pass catcher, bloodlines, his dad was the receiver in the NFL.

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Speaker 3: He's just got to learn to be a complete tight end.

407
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Speaker 3: But the upside on this guy is absolutely sensational, and

408
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Speaker 3: I think he's gonna slip after the big names, the Lovelands,

409
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Speaker 3: the Warrens, your Warriors, the Mason Taylor, and he's gonna

410
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Speaker 3: go somewhere in the third round. He's got the potential,

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Speaker 3: in my opinion, to be a dynamic number one tight

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Speaker 3: end on Sunday.

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Speaker 2: And then you have Harold Fannon Junior with him in

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Speaker 2: the third round as alt, who we talked a lot

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Speaker 2: about with our Senior Bowl review.

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Speaker 1: All right, let's go to the wide receiver class here, Tony.

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Speaker 2: I'm taking a look at this list here, and this

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Speaker 2: is not the type of classes we've seen in years past,

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Speaker 2: where you know, we only have seven players here with

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Speaker 2: first or seventh round grades, which I think last year

421
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Speaker 2: we were over ten with first or second round games

422
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Speaker 2: in the wide receiver spot. So your three first round

423
00:18:38,400 --> 00:18:41,719
Speaker 2: guys will start there are Travis Hunter, Tech McMillan, and

424
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Speaker 2: then Luther Burden.

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Speaker 3: I mean Hunter is gonna be highly graded because of

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Speaker 3: the fact that he's a receiver who can also play cornerback.

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Speaker 3: That's the way I view him. Maybe I'm gonna watch

428
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Speaker 3: more film and I'll think otherwise, But when I watched

429
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Speaker 3: him at cornerback. He was solid, but there were a

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Speaker 3: lot of lapses there, and lapses at the cornerback position

431
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Speaker 3: on Sunday could lead to ruin. He's a natural receiver

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Speaker 3: who could also you know, return kicks. Won the Heisman Trophy.

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Speaker 3: I like Travis Hunter, but I don't think he's the

434
00:19:10,320 --> 00:19:14,359
Speaker 3: generational talent in this draft as other players in the past.

435
00:19:14,440 --> 00:19:16,000
Speaker 3: I think, you know, he's going to come in with

436
00:19:16,040 --> 00:19:18,760
Speaker 3: a lot of hypeend's going to be Travis Hunter twenty

437
00:19:18,760 --> 00:19:21,240
Speaker 3: four to seven headed towards the draft. He's a really

438
00:19:21,240 --> 00:19:23,840
Speaker 3: good player. I don't think he's a special talent as

439
00:19:23,880 --> 00:19:26,560
Speaker 3: far as an NFL prospect is concerned. I happen to

440
00:19:26,640 --> 00:19:29,639
Speaker 3: like Tech McMillan a lot, the receiver out of Arizona.

441
00:19:29,760 --> 00:19:31,879
Speaker 2: Let me ask a totally real quick then, if Hunter

442
00:19:32,080 --> 00:19:34,240
Speaker 2: was just a wide receiver, would you have him rated

443
00:19:34,280 --> 00:19:35,200
Speaker 2: ahead of Tech McMillan.

444
00:19:35,600 --> 00:19:38,879
Speaker 3: No. No, I think McMillan is much more. I mean,

445
00:19:38,920 --> 00:19:43,160
Speaker 3: he's got bigger, better, big playability. But McMillan, in my opinion,

446
00:19:43,280 --> 00:19:48,280
Speaker 3: is a game dominating, game controlling receiver played on an

447
00:19:48,320 --> 00:19:50,960
Speaker 3: Arizona offense that didn't have a lot of talent. The

448
00:19:51,040 --> 00:19:54,040
Speaker 3: defense knew the ball was going in his direction. They

449
00:19:54,040 --> 00:19:58,800
Speaker 3: couldn't stop him. Long arms, big hands, very natural. Remember,

450
00:19:58,960 --> 00:20:01,359
Speaker 3: Travis Hunter had a a lot of good talent around him.

451
00:20:01,440 --> 00:20:06,439
Speaker 3: I mean we saw three receivers and Shepherd, Jonte, and

452
00:20:06,560 --> 00:20:09,560
Speaker 3: Horn produced at the Shrine Bowl and they played very

453
00:20:09,600 --> 00:20:13,520
Speaker 3: well all three days at the Shrine Ball. I mean

454
00:20:13,520 --> 00:20:16,680
Speaker 3: in Arizona, McMillan was basically by himself and he didn't

455
00:20:16,680 --> 00:20:19,320
Speaker 3: have shudor Sanders draw on them the ball. Yet. He

456
00:20:19,359 --> 00:20:22,879
Speaker 3: was a dominant receiver the past two years. He's not

457
00:20:22,920 --> 00:20:24,760
Speaker 3: going to run super fast. I don't know that he's

458
00:20:24,760 --> 00:20:26,359
Speaker 3: going to test off the charts as far as the

459
00:20:26,400 --> 00:20:29,080
Speaker 3: three cone and the short shut and things like that.

460
00:20:29,440 --> 00:20:32,680
Speaker 3: He's just a big bodied, natural receiver who I think

461
00:20:32,920 --> 00:20:36,160
Speaker 3: is going to be a dominant game controller and also

462
00:20:36,200 --> 00:20:37,600
Speaker 3: a tremendous red zone threat.

463
00:20:38,040 --> 00:20:39,920
Speaker 2: How about Burden, He was the guy that was talked

464
00:20:39,960 --> 00:20:41,800
Speaker 2: about as a top ten pick heading into the year.

465
00:20:41,840 --> 00:20:43,320
Speaker 2: He had a bit of a quiet year, dealt with

466
00:20:43,320 --> 00:20:46,360
Speaker 2: some injuries. Where do you think NFL teams see him?

467
00:20:46,359 --> 00:20:48,720
Speaker 2: And he's more of a run after catch guy. He's

468
00:20:48,800 --> 00:20:50,520
Speaker 2: very unpolished in terms of his rout tree.

469
00:20:51,000 --> 00:20:53,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, and he's not super fast. He's got a good

470
00:20:53,080 --> 00:20:55,439
Speaker 3: bill five to eleven, two hundred and eight pounds. He

471
00:20:55,560 --> 00:20:58,720
Speaker 3: catches the ball very well. I mean, I think he's

472
00:20:58,720 --> 00:21:01,520
Speaker 3: got the potential to be a solid number one receiver,

473
00:21:02,080 --> 00:21:05,320
Speaker 3: but he's not a game breaking threat. He doesn't have

474
00:21:05,359 --> 00:21:08,160
Speaker 3: an expanded route tree. It's going to have to work

475
00:21:08,160 --> 00:21:10,439
Speaker 3: on some areas of his game. I think you're looking

476
00:21:10,680 --> 00:21:14,200
Speaker 3: as far as Burden's concern as a mid first round pick,

477
00:21:14,280 --> 00:21:17,560
Speaker 3: depending on what the New Orleans Saints do, all.

478
00:21:17,520 --> 00:21:19,560
Speaker 1: Right, And then you have in the round one start

479
00:21:19,600 --> 00:21:20,000
Speaker 1: a round two.

480
00:21:20,000 --> 00:21:23,240
Speaker 2: We've talked about a Mecca Buka, a good all round player,

481
00:21:23,320 --> 00:21:26,400
Speaker 2: solid wide receiver, Isaiah Bond. You talked about smaller guy

482
00:21:26,480 --> 00:21:28,720
Speaker 2: getna be really fast. That's one of these second round

483
00:21:28,760 --> 00:21:30,280
Speaker 2: guys who I think you're interesting. We have not talked

484
00:21:30,280 --> 00:21:33,080
Speaker 2: about them a ton. You have Matthew Golden out of Texas,

485
00:21:33,080 --> 00:21:34,320
Speaker 2: which you know a lot of people see him as

486
00:21:34,320 --> 00:21:34,919
Speaker 2: a first round there.

487
00:21:34,920 --> 00:21:35,920
Speaker 1: I have not watched him yet.

488
00:21:36,080 --> 00:21:39,680
Speaker 2: And then you have elc iamin Er out of Stanford,

489
00:21:39,680 --> 00:21:41,240
Speaker 2: who was supposed to be at the Senior Bowl ended

490
00:21:41,320 --> 00:21:41,919
Speaker 2: up not going.

491
00:21:42,840 --> 00:21:44,280
Speaker 1: Those are two guys you have in around two.

492
00:21:45,560 --> 00:21:48,760
Speaker 3: Gold is a guy that if we do the show again,

493
00:21:48,880 --> 00:21:51,119
Speaker 3: right before the draft could be rated much higher. I

494
00:21:51,119 --> 00:21:53,200
Speaker 3: got to watch a lot more of them, obviously, want

495
00:21:53,240 --> 00:21:56,200
Speaker 3: to see the testing numbers. People think he's the first rounder.

496
00:21:56,280 --> 00:21:59,600
Speaker 3: I'm not going to dismiss that opinion right now. I

497
00:21:59,680 --> 00:22:02,160
Speaker 3: just don't think I agree with that opinion right now.

498
00:22:02,400 --> 00:22:04,800
Speaker 3: That could change. I am man of some people had

499
00:22:04,840 --> 00:22:07,000
Speaker 3: him as a first round pick. I don't see you.

500
00:22:07,680 --> 00:22:10,159
Speaker 3: He's got decent size, he's got very good hands. The

501
00:22:10,200 --> 00:22:12,800
Speaker 3: speed and the quickness kind of concern. He's not beating

502
00:22:12,840 --> 00:22:16,359
Speaker 3: anybody down the field when you watch the game is explosive.

503
00:22:16,440 --> 00:22:19,480
Speaker 2: It all like he's never like exploding past people, you

504
00:22:19,520 --> 00:22:20,040
Speaker 2: know what I mean.

505
00:22:20,720 --> 00:22:24,000
Speaker 3: He's not overly quick. He's very good at catching the ball.

506
00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:26,640
Speaker 3: There's a place for that on Sunday. I just don't

507
00:22:26,640 --> 00:22:28,439
Speaker 3: think there's a place for that, you know, in the

508
00:22:28,440 --> 00:22:31,040
Speaker 3: top thirty two picks. And people at some point time

509
00:22:31,440 --> 00:22:35,560
Speaker 3: had him as a mid first rounder. Jalen Nowell, I mean,

510
00:22:35,640 --> 00:22:38,960
Speaker 3: I think he was tremendous at the Senior Bowl. I

511
00:22:39,119 --> 00:22:41,439
Speaker 3: had him as a Day three pick. With that speed,

512
00:22:41,520 --> 00:22:44,880
Speaker 3: with that quickness, with the ability to consistently separate from

513
00:22:44,920 --> 00:22:47,520
Speaker 3: defenders throughout the routes. I think that's going to help

514
00:22:47,600 --> 00:22:52,720
Speaker 3: his draft doc. I liked ty Felton, who had his

515
00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:56,280
Speaker 3: moments at the Senior Ball, wasn't a consistent dominant threat,

516
00:22:56,320 --> 00:22:58,920
Speaker 3: but he watched the film. He's supposed to run in

517
00:22:58,960 --> 00:23:01,040
Speaker 3: the low four fours. He shows himself to be a

518
00:23:01,040 --> 00:23:03,879
Speaker 3: good vertical receiver and he catches the underneath passes just

519
00:23:03,920 --> 00:23:04,320
Speaker 3: as well.

520
00:23:04,400 --> 00:23:06,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, he was winning one on ones very consistently that week,

521
00:23:06,840 --> 00:23:08,960
Speaker 2: and he was catching everything. And then you have Jaden Higgins,

522
00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:11,520
Speaker 2: George Dakoby at of Miami, and Tes Johnson, guys that

523
00:23:11,560 --> 00:23:13,920
Speaker 2: we talked about in our Senior Bowl and shrin Bowl reviews.

524
00:23:13,960 --> 00:23:15,840
Speaker 2: You guys to go check out those shows if you

525
00:23:15,880 --> 00:23:17,480
Speaker 2: want more on that. All right, let's go to the

526
00:23:17,520 --> 00:23:20,080
Speaker 2: offensive line class here, Tony. And you know last year

527
00:23:20,160 --> 00:23:23,320
Speaker 2: was such a good offensive tackle class that were like, ah,

528
00:23:23,320 --> 00:23:25,000
Speaker 2: this year is not as good. But as I've looked

529
00:23:25,000 --> 00:23:27,240
Speaker 2: at more and more of these guys, you're still gonna

530
00:23:27,240 --> 00:23:29,160
Speaker 2: have a ton of offensive linemen picked in the first

531
00:23:29,160 --> 00:23:30,760
Speaker 2: three rounds and I think are gonna be pretty good

532
00:23:30,840 --> 00:23:31,800
Speaker 2: NFL players.

533
00:23:32,240 --> 00:23:34,960
Speaker 3: And a lot of interior guys. I mean, the big

534
00:23:35,040 --> 00:23:38,040
Speaker 3: question mark is at the tackle position. Are these college

535
00:23:38,040 --> 00:23:40,879
Speaker 3: tackles going to be pushed into guard or even center.

536
00:23:41,240 --> 00:23:43,919
Speaker 3: You start at the top with Will Campbell. You know

537
00:23:43,960 --> 00:23:46,560
Speaker 3: a lot of people are projecting Will Campbell to play

538
00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:50,320
Speaker 3: guard because of arm length. I've not heard anything about

539
00:23:50,440 --> 00:23:53,760
Speaker 3: Will Campbell having arms under thirty three inches, the way

540
00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:56,600
Speaker 3: we did about Peter Skronsky, who we talked about years

541
00:23:56,640 --> 00:23:59,400
Speaker 3: ago on this podcast. In the lead up to the draft,

542
00:23:59,520 --> 00:24:02,720
Speaker 3: even before the comment, before the official measurements, I was

543
00:24:02,720 --> 00:24:05,240
Speaker 3: out there saying, I'm hearing he got thirty two inch arms.

544
00:24:05,280 --> 00:24:07,119
Speaker 3: I think it was thirty two and a half that

545
00:24:07,160 --> 00:24:10,200
Speaker 3: came to fruition. I can't I've not heard that about

546
00:24:10,200 --> 00:24:13,880
Speaker 3: Will Campbell except on the outside. We'll see what happens.

547
00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:17,760
Speaker 3: The thing what Campbell is this. He's athletic, he's long,

548
00:24:18,160 --> 00:24:20,840
Speaker 3: he moves well. He can be a good pass protector.

549
00:24:21,160 --> 00:24:24,120
Speaker 3: He just doesn't block with the nasty attitude. That's something

550
00:24:24,200 --> 00:24:27,280
Speaker 3: I said early in the season on these podcasts in

551
00:24:27,320 --> 00:24:30,439
Speaker 3: September when we were watching Will Campbell. That's gonna be

552
00:24:30,440 --> 00:24:33,159
Speaker 3: a concern from teams. He's gonna be drilled about that

553
00:24:33,200 --> 00:24:35,840
Speaker 3: at the combine. Why aren't you working to finish off

554
00:24:35,880 --> 00:24:38,679
Speaker 3: block of defenders. Why does it seem that you're standing

555
00:24:38,720 --> 00:24:41,840
Speaker 3: around the times rather than really trying to knock somebody

556
00:24:41,880 --> 00:24:44,119
Speaker 3: on their rear end. And then you got guys like

557
00:24:44,480 --> 00:24:48,800
Speaker 3: Kelvin Banks, Josh Connolly, I got another tackle in between there.

558
00:24:49,040 --> 00:24:53,880
Speaker 3: Who college tackles do they project to guard? My opinion

559
00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:56,600
Speaker 3: is leave them at left tackle until they prove they

560
00:24:56,640 --> 00:25:00,840
Speaker 3: can't play left tackle. But they're both athletic guys who

561
00:25:00,880 --> 00:25:04,520
Speaker 3: move incredibly well where I think would be a terrific

562
00:25:04,560 --> 00:25:08,280
Speaker 3: in his own blocking system, have a high upside. They're

563
00:25:08,320 --> 00:25:11,280
Speaker 3: just not long, tall, big bodied tackles, which a lot

564
00:25:11,320 --> 00:25:13,960
Speaker 3: of teams like. And then, as far as I'm concerned,

565
00:25:14,320 --> 00:25:17,960
Speaker 3: Josh Simmons is the is the variable here. He's the

566
00:25:17,960 --> 00:25:20,560
Speaker 3: guy who could go much earlier than people think. If

567
00:25:20,560 --> 00:25:23,680
Speaker 3: he gets good medical reports on that knee injury that

568
00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:26,639
Speaker 3: knocked him out during New Yorkgan game, or if the

569
00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:29,439
Speaker 3: reports come back bad, he could go later. Fact is this,

570
00:25:30,280 --> 00:25:33,160
Speaker 3: if Josh Simmons played a full season and he continued

571
00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:35,560
Speaker 3: to develop as he was early in the two thousand

572
00:25:35,560 --> 00:25:38,560
Speaker 3: and four season. Off of twenty twenty three, in my opinion,

573
00:25:38,680 --> 00:25:41,240
Speaker 3: Josh Simmons is probably the first offensive tackle take him

574
00:25:41,400 --> 00:25:45,320
Speaker 3: and a definite first round pick. He's athletic, fundamentally sound,

575
00:25:45,640 --> 00:25:48,640
Speaker 3: tremendous pass protector, shows the ability to get on second

576
00:25:48,720 --> 00:25:51,840
Speaker 3: level block in motion. Needs to improve his strength. But

577
00:25:52,280 --> 00:25:55,159
Speaker 3: we now have a situation where he was injured, a

578
00:25:55,280 --> 00:25:58,359
Speaker 3: season ending injury in October, which is sort of a

579
00:25:58,400 --> 00:26:01,439
Speaker 3: red flag and a variable that teams will look at.

580
00:26:01,280 --> 00:26:03,359
Speaker 1: Differently, no question. All right.

581
00:26:03,359 --> 00:26:04,760
Speaker 2: Then we got a bunch of guys here that we

582
00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:09,879
Speaker 2: talked about in our Senior Bowl review Marcus Bow Arman Membo, Well,

583
00:26:09,920 --> 00:26:11,040
Speaker 2: I want to ask you about it? Is he as

584
00:26:11,160 --> 00:26:14,520
Speaker 2: he wasn't there? Ariante Urser talked about Jonah seven, THEA.

585
00:26:14,520 --> 00:26:16,960
Speaker 2: We talked about Wyatt Milan, We talked about Grey's able,

586
00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:19,600
Speaker 2: We talked about so three guys that wanted to Senior Bowl.

587
00:26:20,320 --> 00:26:24,159
Speaker 2: They could be available top of the second round. Tyler Booker,

588
00:26:24,200 --> 00:26:27,119
Speaker 2: the guard out of Alabama. Arman Membo, you haven't listened

589
00:26:27,119 --> 00:26:28,560
Speaker 2: as a guard, and a lot of people think of me,

590
00:26:28,640 --> 00:26:30,879
Speaker 2: think he's a tackle, so do I out of Missouri.

591
00:26:31,200 --> 00:26:34,680
Speaker 2: And then you have Donovan Jackson, you have a third

592
00:26:34,760 --> 00:26:37,240
Speaker 2: round grade on him out of Ohio State. Your thought

593
00:26:37,320 --> 00:26:40,119
Speaker 2: kind of on that group and how you think they

594
00:26:40,200 --> 00:26:41,000
Speaker 2: might look on day two?

595
00:26:42,400 --> 00:26:44,840
Speaker 3: Booker could go round one. I mean he is a

596
00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:48,000
Speaker 3: big bodied guy. Want to see his measurements, you know,

597
00:26:48,320 --> 00:26:50,960
Speaker 3: is he in the mid to high three forties and

598
00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:53,400
Speaker 3: how does he run? He is a guy that once

599
00:26:53,440 --> 00:26:55,840
Speaker 3: he's engaged at the point of attack with a defender

600
00:26:56,080 --> 00:26:59,320
Speaker 3: came over, he controls the opponents at the point of attack.

601
00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:02,480
Speaker 3: He's a dominant roun blocker. Was also very good and

602
00:27:02,680 --> 00:27:06,800
Speaker 3: pass protection. Surprisingly, he shows some ability when asked to

603
00:27:06,880 --> 00:27:10,080
Speaker 3: kick out and pull across the line of scrimmage. But again,

604
00:27:10,280 --> 00:27:12,640
Speaker 3: the three hundred and forty pounds size, it didn't hurt

605
00:27:12,720 --> 00:27:15,959
Speaker 3: JC Latham last year. We'll see how teams look at that.

606
00:27:16,160 --> 00:27:17,840
Speaker 3: Want to see what his official I say three forty

607
00:27:17,880 --> 00:27:20,960
Speaker 3: eight because that's what he's estimated to be at. We'll

608
00:27:21,000 --> 00:27:24,120
Speaker 3: see what his official measurements are at the combine, if

609
00:27:24,119 --> 00:27:26,240
Speaker 3: in fact he measures, and we'll see what his testing

610
00:27:26,320 --> 00:27:29,919
Speaker 3: numbers are. As far as membos concern I think maybe

611
00:27:29,960 --> 00:27:32,119
Speaker 3: the measurements at the Senior Bawl before he had to

612
00:27:32,160 --> 00:27:35,120
Speaker 3: pull out with what was reported as hood poisoning may

613
00:27:36,040 --> 00:27:38,760
Speaker 3: may kind of ease my concerns as far as him

614
00:27:38,800 --> 00:27:41,800
Speaker 3: playing tackle at the next level. But going back to

615
00:27:41,840 --> 00:27:44,280
Speaker 3: the twenty twenty three film when I first rated him,

616
00:27:44,320 --> 00:27:45,560
Speaker 3: I always thought he was going to be a guard

617
00:27:45,600 --> 00:27:48,720
Speaker 3: because he's a little bit shorter than everybody else. But

618
00:27:48,800 --> 00:27:52,720
Speaker 3: he's powerful, he's explosive, he controls one on one blocking.

619
00:27:52,760 --> 00:27:54,879
Speaker 3: He's also very good on his feet, gets out to

620
00:27:54,920 --> 00:27:58,600
Speaker 3: the second level and come block in motion. Donovan Jackson,

621
00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:00,600
Speaker 3: you know we talked about Josh Simmons. Well, what happened

622
00:28:00,640 --> 00:28:02,800
Speaker 3: was when Josh Simmons went down a couple gay a

623
00:28:02,880 --> 00:28:05,800
Speaker 3: couple of games later, Donovan Jackson had to slide out

624
00:28:05,800 --> 00:28:08,400
Speaker 3: from guard to left tackle and he did a decent job.

625
00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:11,160
Speaker 3: And prior to that, he was actually doing a terrific

626
00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:15,240
Speaker 3: job at offensive guard. Coming into the twenty twenty three season,

627
00:28:15,520 --> 00:28:17,600
Speaker 3: a lot of people thought Donovan Jackson could be a

628
00:28:17,600 --> 00:28:19,879
Speaker 3: first round pick, but he had a terrible campaign in

629
00:28:19,880 --> 00:28:23,600
Speaker 3: twenty twenty three, made the right choice, went back to school,

630
00:28:24,240 --> 00:28:27,440
Speaker 3: had a real good campaign at guard, and then was

631
00:28:27,480 --> 00:28:31,080
Speaker 3: okay to tackle. I project him strictly as a guard.

632
00:28:31,440 --> 00:28:34,879
Speaker 3: The only reason I have him rated lower in my

633
00:28:35,840 --> 00:28:39,040
Speaker 3: offensive line rankings is because there's so many guys ahead

634
00:28:39,040 --> 00:28:41,040
Speaker 3: of him. I mean, you mentioned it. It's a pretty

635
00:28:41,040 --> 00:28:43,800
Speaker 3: deep class. We just don't have any We don't have

636
00:28:43,880 --> 00:28:47,120
Speaker 3: the numbers, the quality, or the quantity at the offensive

637
00:28:47,160 --> 00:28:49,320
Speaker 3: tackle position, which is what a lot of people want

638
00:28:49,360 --> 00:28:49,800
Speaker 3: to see.

639
00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:52,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, so, just so fans though, you have Ursery seven

640
00:28:52,240 --> 00:28:54,720
Speaker 2: Am Millium with second round grades Zabels kind of a

641
00:28:54,760 --> 00:28:55,440
Speaker 2: two to three.

642
00:28:55,560 --> 00:28:58,440
Speaker 1: Then you have Donovan Jackson, Dylan Fairchild.

643
00:28:58,000 --> 00:29:01,400
Speaker 2: A guard out of Georgia, Emery Jones of LSU tackle guard,

644
00:29:01,440 --> 00:29:04,600
Speaker 2: Cameron Williams, Texas tackle. We've talked about him a lot

645
00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:07,520
Speaker 2: as third rounders, along with Charles Grant, and then Anthony

646
00:29:07,520 --> 00:29:09,560
Speaker 2: Belton who had a nice senior Bowl from North Carolina

647
00:29:09,600 --> 00:29:13,240
Speaker 2: State as a third fourth round pick. Draft season is

648
00:29:13,280 --> 00:29:15,600
Speaker 2: brought to you by Moody. He's a proud partner of

649
00:29:15,640 --> 00:29:19,520
Speaker 2: the New York Football Giants. Decode Risk, Unlock Opportunity. Learnmore

650
00:29:19,520 --> 00:29:22,080
Speaker 2: at Moody's dot com. All right, Toty, let's up to

651
00:29:22,120 --> 00:29:25,479
Speaker 2: the defensive side, hole ball, defensive tackle. We haven't had

652
00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:28,720
Speaker 2: a good defensive tackle class in a while in my opinion,

653
00:29:29,040 --> 00:29:31,400
Speaker 2: Why don't your rapid fires through your top ten here?

654
00:29:31,440 --> 00:29:33,160
Speaker 2: And then we could dive into players in more detail.

655
00:29:33,520 --> 00:29:36,160
Speaker 3: Well, Mason Grant first round choice going to be a

656
00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:38,480
Speaker 3: top ten pick is number one. Kenneth Grant, who I

657
00:29:38,640 --> 00:29:40,160
Speaker 3: like a lot, who I think could actually be a

658
00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:42,320
Speaker 3: better player two or three years down the road, also

659
00:29:42,360 --> 00:29:45,200
Speaker 3: has a first round grade. Walter Nolan has a first

660
00:29:45,240 --> 00:29:47,720
Speaker 3: round grade despite the fact I thought he was disappointing

661
00:29:48,480 --> 00:29:50,880
Speaker 3: during the Senior Ball, and then ty Leek Williams of

662
00:29:50,880 --> 00:29:54,240
Speaker 3: Ohio State also as a first round grade. After that,

663
00:29:54,320 --> 00:29:57,440
Speaker 3: I got Derek Harmon as a late first early second rounder, TJ.

664
00:29:57,640 --> 00:30:02,080
Speaker 3: Sanders South Carolina as the second Dion Walker who's falling

665
00:30:02,160 --> 00:30:05,800
Speaker 3: fast as a late second rounder, ty Robinson of Nebraska

666
00:30:05,840 --> 00:30:08,680
Speaker 3: who can play a variety of spots up front as

667
00:30:08,760 --> 00:30:12,400
Speaker 3: a early third rounder, and then Jordan Phillips of Maryland,

668
00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:14,960
Speaker 3: the nose tackle type who showed a lot of athleticism

669
00:30:15,040 --> 00:30:18,160
Speaker 3: during shrine Bol practices. He also has a third round grade.

670
00:30:18,280 --> 00:30:19,000
Speaker 1: It's a great group.

671
00:30:19,080 --> 00:30:22,320
Speaker 2: Tony Mason Graham, do you see him as kind of

672
00:30:22,320 --> 00:30:26,520
Speaker 2: the next position player up after we talk about the

673
00:30:26,560 --> 00:30:29,080
Speaker 2: Travis Hunters and Abdull Carter. Is he in that next

674
00:30:29,080 --> 00:30:31,880
Speaker 2: group with the tech mcmillans and kind of that next

675
00:30:31,880 --> 00:30:32,920
Speaker 2: group of position players.

676
00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:36,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, I have. I'm looking at my overall board right now,

677
00:30:36,240 --> 00:30:39,600
Speaker 3: and that's the wrong one. I'm hang on one second here,

678
00:30:39,600 --> 00:30:43,400
Speaker 3: I'm looking at my overall board right now and Mason

679
00:30:43,400 --> 00:30:46,520
Speaker 3: Graham is number five, So yeah, I will talk about

680
00:30:46,600 --> 00:30:51,880
Speaker 3: Jally McMillan, but he's right there with Tech McMillan, Will Johnson,

681
00:30:52,240 --> 00:30:58,240
Speaker 3: Will Campbell, MIKEL Williams. I would be surprised if Graham

682
00:30:58,280 --> 00:31:00,000
Speaker 3: gets out of the top eight of the draft.

683
00:31:00,680 --> 00:31:02,360
Speaker 2: All right, And then when you think Grant is going

684
00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:05,520
Speaker 2: to start getting thought about by teams given his size

685
00:31:05,560 --> 00:31:07,720
Speaker 2: and athleticism, yeah, I.

686
00:31:07,600 --> 00:31:12,680
Speaker 3: Think somewhere between twelve to eighteen. Maybe he tests much

687
00:31:12,720 --> 00:31:16,840
Speaker 3: better and he surprises. This thing goes earlier. I think

688
00:31:16,880 --> 00:31:21,640
Speaker 3: the way to compare Graham versus Grant is Mason Graham

689
00:31:21,720 --> 00:31:24,960
Speaker 3: is the safer pick. Mason Graham is the sure thing.

690
00:31:25,280 --> 00:31:29,000
Speaker 3: You know what you're getting with Mason Graham. Kenneth Grant

691
00:31:29,040 --> 00:31:33,320
Speaker 3: is bigger, he's more athletics, he's more explosive, but he's

692
00:31:33,320 --> 00:31:36,080
Speaker 3: not nearly as polished. So when sometimes when you get

693
00:31:36,080 --> 00:31:39,040
Speaker 3: those bigger defensive tackles three hundred and forty plus pounds,

694
00:31:39,280 --> 00:31:41,719
Speaker 3: they can go either way. I love Kenneth Grant. I mean,

695
00:31:41,760 --> 00:31:45,160
Speaker 3: Kenneth Grant's a guy that, while Mason Graham is explosive

696
00:31:45,240 --> 00:31:47,640
Speaker 3: up the field, about.

697
00:31:47,160 --> 00:31:50,560
Speaker 2: That, it's probably something again trying to tell Tony about

698
00:31:50,560 --> 00:31:52,760
Speaker 2: one of his players, and Tony's always on the phone

699
00:31:52,840 --> 00:31:54,320
Speaker 2: trying to get info on these guys.

700
00:31:54,320 --> 00:31:54,720
Speaker 1: Man.

701
00:31:55,080 --> 00:31:58,040
Speaker 3: While Mason Graham is more explosive up the field, Kenneth

702
00:31:58,080 --> 00:32:00,840
Speaker 3: Grant can get out on the chase to play in pursuit.

703
00:32:02,480 --> 00:32:07,440
Speaker 3: So that's why I say Grant's got more upside than

704
00:32:07,480 --> 00:32:10,360
Speaker 3: Mason Graham, which means two or three years he could

705
00:32:10,360 --> 00:32:11,680
Speaker 3: potentially be the better player.

706
00:32:12,720 --> 00:32:15,640
Speaker 2: Interesting, all right, and then you have Tyler Williams you mentioned,

707
00:32:15,640 --> 00:32:19,320
Speaker 2: and Walter Nolan Derek Harmon with a borderline first round grade.

708
00:32:19,360 --> 00:32:22,600
Speaker 2: You're looking at it like seventeen twenty to thirty two

709
00:32:22,680 --> 00:32:24,680
Speaker 2: for those guys.

710
00:32:24,200 --> 00:32:28,000
Speaker 3: I think both. I think Nolan is somewhere bottom half

711
00:32:28,040 --> 00:32:31,080
Speaker 3: around one. I think Tyler Williams is bottom half a

712
00:32:31,120 --> 00:32:33,400
Speaker 3: round one. I think Harmon, if he gets in a

713
00:32:33,400 --> 00:32:35,760
Speaker 3: fresh round, which I think is a definite possibility, is

714
00:32:35,760 --> 00:32:39,720
Speaker 3: bottom half around one. Remember, defensive tackle is a priority

715
00:32:39,760 --> 00:32:42,680
Speaker 3: positioned come draft d A. I mean, people talk about

716
00:32:42,680 --> 00:32:46,480
Speaker 3: the quarterbacks because in the media, but teams want to

717
00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:49,040
Speaker 3: see left tackles, which we don't really think we have

718
00:32:49,080 --> 00:32:51,840
Speaker 3: that many of this year. Cornerbacks, which we don't think

719
00:32:51,840 --> 00:32:54,520
Speaker 3: we have that many of this year and defensive tackles,

720
00:32:54,680 --> 00:32:56,600
Speaker 3: and there are a good number of defensive tackles that

721
00:32:56,600 --> 00:32:58,320
Speaker 3: could end up as Round one picks. Yeah.

722
00:32:58,360 --> 00:33:00,120
Speaker 2: I mean there are people that think now Tony, to

723
00:33:00,160 --> 00:33:02,120
Speaker 2: be honest with you, that having a really good pass

724
00:33:02,160 --> 00:33:04,479
Speaker 2: rushing three technique is more valuable than having an edge

725
00:33:04,560 --> 00:33:06,840
Speaker 2: rusher now, because you're closer to the quarterback.

726
00:33:07,360 --> 00:33:09,360
Speaker 3: Not only that is you know you got guys in

727
00:33:09,400 --> 00:33:11,520
Speaker 3: the middle who can occupy the blockers and that will

728
00:33:11,520 --> 00:33:13,920
Speaker 3: free things up for your edge rushers on the outside.

729
00:33:14,200 --> 00:33:16,680
Speaker 1: All right, And then we talked about Dean Walker a bunch. TJ.

730
00:33:16,760 --> 00:33:18,440
Speaker 2: Sanders was at the Senior Bowl. I don't think we

731
00:33:18,520 --> 00:33:20,840
Speaker 2: talked about him in our Senior Bowl review. I thought

732
00:33:20,840 --> 00:33:22,680
Speaker 2: he was pretty good. I don't think he like jump

733
00:33:22,760 --> 00:33:24,440
Speaker 2: out of Me is like WHOA like TJ.

734
00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:26,960
Speaker 1: Sanders. Unbelievable but good, solid player.

735
00:33:27,920 --> 00:33:30,280
Speaker 3: He has the ability to be incredible. You go whack

736
00:33:30,320 --> 00:33:33,440
Speaker 3: and you watch and I don't great gut players on

737
00:33:33,440 --> 00:33:36,120
Speaker 3: one game alone. You shouldn't do that. But you go

738
00:33:36,200 --> 00:33:38,720
Speaker 3: back and you watch TJ. Sanders in twenty twenty three

739
00:33:38,720 --> 00:33:41,280
Speaker 3: against Georgia, good Georgia offensive line, and he was dominant

740
00:33:41,280 --> 00:33:43,880
Speaker 3: and he has the ability just to take over games.

741
00:33:44,160 --> 00:33:47,640
Speaker 3: He's got good size, he's incredibly quick. He's also a

742
00:33:47,760 --> 00:33:50,400
Speaker 3: very athletic. And what that means is he can actually

743
00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:52,440
Speaker 3: play in a variety of systems. He can play in

744
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:54,600
Speaker 3: a foreman front, he can play in a three man front.

745
00:33:55,160 --> 00:33:59,040
Speaker 3: And you know, you he's consistently making or I shouldn't

746
00:33:59,080 --> 00:34:01,960
Speaker 3: say consistently, but he has the ability to basically take

747
00:34:01,960 --> 00:34:05,480
Speaker 3: over games and make game changing type of plays. Yep.

748
00:34:05,560 --> 00:34:07,320
Speaker 2: And then you have Deon Walker, who he talked a

749
00:34:07,360 --> 00:34:09,520
Speaker 2: lot about. We know him, Ty Robinson, We've talked about

750
00:34:09,560 --> 00:34:11,600
Speaker 2: a lot. Jordan Phillips out of Maryland. He was a trime.

751
00:34:11,640 --> 00:34:14,880
Speaker 2: We talked about him in the Shrine Review. Yye Block

752
00:34:15,080 --> 00:34:18,640
Speaker 2: from Iowa. Josh Farmer, Florida State, Warren Brinston, Georgia. All

753
00:34:18,680 --> 00:34:20,520
Speaker 2: Senior Bowl and Shrine Bowl guys. We talked about all

754
00:34:20,560 --> 00:34:23,520
Speaker 2: those guys on previous programs. All right, let's go to

755
00:34:23,560 --> 00:34:27,480
Speaker 2: the defensive end position, Tony. This is mostly your bigger,

756
00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:29,960
Speaker 2: you know, guys that play the edge. And then we

757
00:34:30,000 --> 00:34:32,000
Speaker 2: have some of the outside linebackers in your next group

758
00:34:32,040 --> 00:34:33,880
Speaker 2: that are more of the stand up pass rusher types.

759
00:34:35,520 --> 00:34:37,359
Speaker 2: It's not you know, you know, just have a ton

760
00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:39,120
Speaker 2: of big defensive ends anymore. A lot of these pass

761
00:34:39,160 --> 00:34:41,360
Speaker 2: rushers are two hundred and fifty punds, stand up guys.

762
00:34:41,640 --> 00:34:43,320
Speaker 2: But you do have some pretty good players here, and

763
00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:45,319
Speaker 2: some and many that could go in the first round.

764
00:34:45,800 --> 00:34:48,040
Speaker 3: I think what you have here is you have guys

765
00:34:48,120 --> 00:34:50,880
Speaker 3: that have a lot of ability but need to finish

766
00:34:50,960 --> 00:34:53,360
Speaker 3: their games, really need to polish their games. Mikel Williams,

767
00:34:53,440 --> 00:34:58,040
Speaker 3: Nick Scourton, Michael Green of Marshall, who you could easily

768
00:34:58,120 --> 00:35:01,640
Speaker 3: put on an outside linebacker board. I do defensive end

769
00:35:01,719 --> 00:35:04,520
Speaker 3: outside linebacker versus edge because I'm old school and I'm

770
00:35:04,520 --> 00:35:07,600
Speaker 3: cut at stubborn. But those three guys, you know, are

771
00:35:07,719 --> 00:35:10,440
Speaker 3: terrific hats rushers who just got to get bigger and

772
00:35:10,480 --> 00:35:13,080
Speaker 3: stronger and complete their games. Same thing with you know,

773
00:35:13,200 --> 00:35:16,840
Speaker 3: Chimar Turner of Texas A and m Shimar Stewart have size,

774
00:35:17,640 --> 00:35:21,440
Speaker 3: They've shown ability, but again they need to elevate their games.

775
00:35:21,560 --> 00:35:23,040
Speaker 3: Those guys real quick.

776
00:35:23,040 --> 00:35:25,920
Speaker 1: You have you have Turner is an end, not a tackle, huh.

777
00:35:26,120 --> 00:35:28,480
Speaker 3: Two hundred and ninety pounds I mean in three man front,

778
00:35:28,560 --> 00:35:32,040
Speaker 3: I think he could play both end or tackle. But again,

779
00:35:32,080 --> 00:35:35,480
Speaker 3: both of those guys have got tremendous ability. They just

780
00:35:35,560 --> 00:35:38,319
Speaker 3: have to, you know, step up their game. Where the

781
00:35:38,360 --> 00:35:41,240
Speaker 3: next guy on my board is JT two and Mela

782
00:35:41,560 --> 00:35:45,040
Speaker 3: of Ohio State, who has shown the ability to be

783
00:35:45,520 --> 00:35:48,399
Speaker 3: a dominant player the past two years at Ohio State.

784
00:35:48,880 --> 00:35:52,960
Speaker 3: He's there, he just needs consistency. He's more polished than

785
00:35:53,000 --> 00:35:55,600
Speaker 3: the guys which I just mentioned. But the problem with

786
00:35:55,640 --> 00:35:59,040
Speaker 3: to him Moloe is he's not He's very streaky. You know,

787
00:35:59,080 --> 00:36:01,680
Speaker 3: he'll show up and he'll dominate a couple of series,

788
00:36:01,760 --> 00:36:05,279
Speaker 3: helped dominate a ham and then he will disappear or

789
00:36:05,480 --> 00:36:09,160
Speaker 3: for stretches, which you know is a problem. Came back

790
00:36:09,200 --> 00:36:12,000
Speaker 3: to Oileo State did win a national championship. I don't

791
00:36:12,040 --> 00:36:15,160
Speaker 3: know that he's improved his draft grade from where it

792
00:36:15,239 --> 00:36:15,879
Speaker 3: was a year ago.

793
00:36:16,840 --> 00:36:19,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then you have Landon Jackson in the second round,

794
00:36:19,120 --> 00:36:21,920
Speaker 2: someone we talked about. He's the Senior Bowl. Jordan Birch

795
00:36:22,080 --> 00:36:23,719
Speaker 2: is someone that we've talked about for two years. The

796
00:36:23,719 --> 00:36:25,880
Speaker 2: hell on this show, Tony a bigger guy at two

797
00:36:25,920 --> 00:36:29,440
Speaker 2: hundred ninety four pounds and then tyron Ingram Dawkins I

798
00:36:29,480 --> 00:36:30,560
Speaker 2: think is interesting.

799
00:36:30,280 --> 00:36:31,520
Speaker 1: With him in the third round, he was at the

800
00:36:31,520 --> 00:36:33,399
Speaker 1: Senior Bowl. We didn't really talk much about him.

801
00:36:33,840 --> 00:36:35,799
Speaker 2: Baron Sorel out of Texas, he was there, and then

802
00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:38,560
Speaker 2: Ashton j a Loot out of Louisville. We talked more

803
00:36:38,560 --> 00:36:40,320
Speaker 2: about last year than this year. Anybody who want to

804
00:36:40,400 --> 00:36:41,840
Speaker 2: feature from that last group.

805
00:36:42,080 --> 00:36:44,359
Speaker 3: Well, I mean, Birch, you don't know what you're getting Burch,

806
00:36:44,480 --> 00:36:46,400
Speaker 3: just like some of the guys I've talked about before.

807
00:36:46,480 --> 00:36:50,880
Speaker 3: If Jordan Birch had played the way he was capable

808
00:36:50,960 --> 00:36:54,360
Speaker 3: of this season, he's a top fifteen pick. He's a

809
00:36:54,400 --> 00:36:57,000
Speaker 3: mid first round pick. There was a lot of inconsistency.

810
00:36:57,040 --> 00:36:59,400
Speaker 3: There's a lot of injury, but when he's on the field,

811
00:36:59,400 --> 00:37:01,920
Speaker 3: he's dominant. He just doesn't do it enough, and a

812
00:37:01,920 --> 00:37:04,960
Speaker 3: lot of it is because he's injured. Tyler Ingram Dawkins

813
00:37:05,000 --> 00:37:08,640
Speaker 3: is a terrific pass rushing edge. Kind of surprised he

814
00:37:08,760 --> 00:37:11,480
Speaker 3: entered the draft. He shows a lot of speed, He

815
00:37:11,560 --> 00:37:14,400
Speaker 3: shows a place with great leverage and ped level. Just

816
00:37:14,400 --> 00:37:16,040
Speaker 3: needs to get a little stronger. It just needs a

817
00:37:16,080 --> 00:37:19,719
Speaker 3: bigger body of work. Astin Gillette, I mean, is he

818
00:37:19,760 --> 00:37:23,319
Speaker 3: an end is the defensive tackle. I was down on

819
00:37:23,400 --> 00:37:27,560
Speaker 3: him because the stats weren't there this year compared to

820
00:37:27,680 --> 00:37:29,839
Speaker 3: last year when he blew it up. But when you

821
00:37:29,920 --> 00:37:32,120
Speaker 3: watch him you see a lot of quickness, you see

822
00:37:32,160 --> 00:37:34,960
Speaker 3: a lot of explosion, you see a lot of upside potential.

823
00:37:35,040 --> 00:37:38,000
Speaker 3: I think with Gillette two and a half and a

824
00:37:38,000 --> 00:37:40,120
Speaker 3: half two hundred and seventy five pounds, it's just a

825
00:37:40,160 --> 00:37:43,560
Speaker 3: fit sort of thing. It's a scheme the type of situation.

826
00:37:44,000 --> 00:37:45,759
Speaker 3: Are you gonna use him as a defensive end in

827
00:37:45,840 --> 00:37:48,200
Speaker 3: a format front, which is basically what he played at Louisville.

828
00:37:48,320 --> 00:37:50,000
Speaker 3: Are you gonna kick him inside? You're you gonna put

829
00:37:50,000 --> 00:37:51,719
Speaker 3: it put him in a three man front. I just

830
00:37:51,760 --> 00:37:53,600
Speaker 3: think he needs to be put in the right system.

831
00:37:53,840 --> 00:37:55,120
Speaker 1: Now, I'm with you kind of a tweener.

832
00:37:55,160 --> 00:37:56,719
Speaker 2: You got to figure out where that body type fits

833
00:37:56,719 --> 00:37:58,719
Speaker 2: in on your defensive line. All right, look at the

834
00:37:58,719 --> 00:38:01,279
Speaker 2: linebacker Tony and this is a nomination of off ball

835
00:38:01,320 --> 00:38:04,719
Speaker 2: guys and handing the dirt edge rusher. So I don't

836
00:38:04,719 --> 00:38:06,840
Speaker 2: know how you want to separate them your your first

837
00:38:07,239 --> 00:38:11,160
Speaker 2: three guys, though Jayalen Walker has done both, or guys

838
00:38:11,200 --> 00:38:12,640
Speaker 2: that play more at the hand in the dirt on

839
00:38:12,680 --> 00:38:13,320
Speaker 2: the outside.

840
00:38:14,080 --> 00:38:15,520
Speaker 3: I mean, Abdul Carter is going to be a very

841
00:38:15,560 --> 00:38:17,640
Speaker 3: early pick. He was. He's been my number one player

842
00:38:17,640 --> 00:38:19,560
Speaker 3: on my board for the longest time. I'm glad to

843
00:38:19,560 --> 00:38:21,560
Speaker 3: see the other people are starting to agree with that.

844
00:38:21,880 --> 00:38:24,239
Speaker 1: Man caught off to you, Tony, Tony, you're a trendsetter, man,

845
00:38:24,280 --> 00:38:26,360
Speaker 1: you are, you are setting the trends, dude. People are

846
00:38:26,920 --> 00:38:28,600
Speaker 1: following you along. Man, you like the pied Piper.

847
00:38:29,120 --> 00:38:31,520
Speaker 3: Just right right. Remember just spell my name correctly on

848
00:38:31,560 --> 00:38:35,080
Speaker 3: the check when you send it to me, please. I

849
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:38,400
Speaker 3: thought that Penn State kind of did Abdul Carter disservice

850
00:38:38,480 --> 00:38:40,560
Speaker 3: lining them up at Defense Van. I understand why they

851
00:38:40,600 --> 00:38:42,840
Speaker 3: did it. They did it because that's what they needed

852
00:38:42,880 --> 00:38:45,480
Speaker 3: for them to win. But Abdul Calrter is much more

853
00:38:45,560 --> 00:38:47,200
Speaker 3: than an edge rusher. I mean, he is a guy

854
00:38:47,239 --> 00:38:49,240
Speaker 3: that complaints space. You go back and watch the twenty

855
00:38:49,280 --> 00:38:52,640
Speaker 3: twenty three film when he was basically a linebacker, and

856
00:38:52,680 --> 00:38:56,279
Speaker 3: he can do it all. Jalen Walker granted, I have

857
00:38:56,600 --> 00:38:59,520
Speaker 3: sentimental feelings towards his play because when I watched them

858
00:38:59,560 --> 00:39:01,280
Speaker 3: over with the song and when he was a backup

859
00:39:01,320 --> 00:39:04,719
Speaker 3: in twenty twenty three, I said, watch this guy. There's

860
00:39:04,760 --> 00:39:07,800
Speaker 3: always one player that pops up, you know, in April,

861
00:39:08,280 --> 00:39:10,359
Speaker 3: and the talking heads will say, hey, this guy's gonna

862
00:39:10,360 --> 00:39:12,760
Speaker 3: go much earlier. I think it's gonna be Jalen Walker.

863
00:39:12,800 --> 00:39:14,839
Speaker 3: All he's got to do is test well. But when

864
00:39:14,880 --> 00:39:17,759
Speaker 3: you watch the film on Jalen Walker, he's an explosive

865
00:39:17,800 --> 00:39:19,880
Speaker 3: pass rusher. I mean to the point where he's beating

866
00:39:20,080 --> 00:39:24,120
Speaker 3: offensive tackles, bigger offensive tackles with inside moves, not just

867
00:39:24,200 --> 00:39:27,280
Speaker 3: wide edge rushers. But he also makes plays in space.

868
00:39:27,560 --> 00:39:31,000
Speaker 3: I mean he's tremendous speed. Laterally in pursuit he gets

869
00:39:31,040 --> 00:39:35,240
Speaker 3: depth on his past drops. I have Jaalen Walker highly

870
00:39:35,320 --> 00:39:37,279
Speaker 3: highly rated. I mean when I say highly raded, he's

871
00:39:37,280 --> 00:39:40,279
Speaker 3: in my top six as far as overall players. Let's

872
00:39:40,280 --> 00:39:42,120
Speaker 3: see what happens. I have a feeling that Walker is

873
00:39:42,160 --> 00:39:44,319
Speaker 3: a guy that's going to be talked about as we

874
00:39:44,320 --> 00:39:45,120
Speaker 3: move towards the draft.

875
00:39:45,239 --> 00:39:48,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, way, people, some people have I started interrupting some

876
00:39:48,040 --> 00:39:50,359
Speaker 2: people of Michael Williams ahead of him, his teammate out

877
00:39:50,400 --> 00:39:52,000
Speaker 2: of Georgia head of Jayalen Walker.

878
00:39:52,040 --> 00:39:54,560
Speaker 1: I don't see it. I've watched both guys. I just

879
00:39:54,680 --> 00:39:56,080
Speaker 1: I don't think Walker just is.

880
00:39:56,080 --> 00:39:59,120
Speaker 2: So much more burst and athleticism to him than than

881
00:39:59,160 --> 00:40:01,000
Speaker 2: Williams does, at least my opinion.

882
00:40:00,880 --> 00:40:03,160
Speaker 3: And he's strong for his size, and he can do

883
00:40:03,200 --> 00:40:05,719
Speaker 3: more things. Listen, you could put Jalen Walker on the

884
00:40:05,760 --> 00:40:08,759
Speaker 3: field on third and six, and you can use them

885
00:40:08,800 --> 00:40:11,160
Speaker 3: as a pass rusher or you can use them a coverage.

886
00:40:11,239 --> 00:40:13,480
Speaker 3: You put Michael Williams on the field in third six,

887
00:40:13,560 --> 00:40:16,319
Speaker 3: it's strictly as a pass rusher. So that's why I

888
00:40:16,440 --> 00:40:20,239
Speaker 3: really like Jalen Walker. James Pierce. I am not as

889
00:40:20,320 --> 00:40:23,680
Speaker 3: high as other people are. Yeah he's passed, Yeah he's

890
00:40:23,680 --> 00:40:27,120
Speaker 3: a terrific pass rusher, but he's thin. I mean he's

891
00:40:27,160 --> 00:40:29,839
Speaker 3: a small guy and that's not really gonna work. Well.

892
00:40:29,880 --> 00:40:31,759
Speaker 3: He's gonna have to get bigger, he's gonna have to

893
00:40:31,760 --> 00:40:33,920
Speaker 3: get stronger, and he's gonna have to keep that quickness

894
00:40:33,920 --> 00:40:37,040
Speaker 3: and speed on the field. John Campbell, if there is

895
00:40:37,600 --> 00:40:41,719
Speaker 3: he hands down the best off ball space linebacker, if

896
00:40:41,719 --> 00:40:43,399
Speaker 3: you will, whatever you like to call it. I mean,

897
00:40:43,440 --> 00:40:46,239
Speaker 3: he is the guy that whether it's stacking against the run,

898
00:40:46,480 --> 00:40:49,920
Speaker 3: whether it's covering the pass, he's not a bad pass rusher.

899
00:40:50,000 --> 00:40:52,239
Speaker 3: They didn't use him in that capacity too much at

900
00:40:52,280 --> 00:40:54,600
Speaker 3: Alabama because they didn't need to, but he was the

901
00:40:54,640 --> 00:40:57,600
Speaker 3: guy that you know on third and six, can cover

902
00:40:57,719 --> 00:40:59,839
Speaker 3: tight ends down the field, covers a lot of air,

903
00:41:00,160 --> 00:41:05,320
Speaker 3: very athletic, your first you know, traditional say four to

904
00:41:05,400 --> 00:41:08,640
Speaker 3: three week side of strong side type linebacker.

905
00:41:08,239 --> 00:41:10,520
Speaker 2: And then you have four straight up second round picks.

906
00:41:10,560 --> 00:41:14,520
Speaker 2: One is Ola Fami Oladaijo. He's your one, two, three, four, five,

907
00:41:14,560 --> 00:41:16,799
Speaker 2: sixth ranked player here. He's in the second round. We

908
00:41:16,800 --> 00:41:19,000
Speaker 2: talked a ton about him. Then the other three guys

909
00:41:19,000 --> 00:41:21,920
Speaker 2: are all off ball linebackers. Danny Stutsman out of Oklahoma,

910
00:41:22,600 --> 00:41:24,880
Speaker 2: Nick Martin out of Oklahoma State, and then course In

911
00:41:24,960 --> 00:41:26,320
Speaker 2: Swesinger out of UCLA.

912
00:41:26,400 --> 00:41:29,680
Speaker 3: Tony Yeah, Stutsman is Stutsman is that he's a studd.

913
00:41:30,160 --> 00:41:33,200
Speaker 3: I mean he is a tough, stout run defender. Didn't

914
00:41:33,239 --> 00:41:35,560
Speaker 3: play in the Senior boat because he was injured. I

915
00:41:35,560 --> 00:41:37,920
Speaker 3: know there was a legitimate injury late in the season.

916
00:41:38,120 --> 00:41:40,279
Speaker 3: The question with him is coverage, and we saw a

917
00:41:40,280 --> 00:41:43,520
Speaker 3: lot of linebackers fail and coverage. But again, a real

918
00:41:43,600 --> 00:41:46,760
Speaker 3: good two down linebacker who has the athleticism to develop

919
00:41:46,800 --> 00:41:49,479
Speaker 3: into coverage. Nick Martin is a personal favorite of mine.

920
00:41:49,520 --> 00:41:52,319
Speaker 3: I know he struggled some injuries points this year, but

921
00:41:52,400 --> 00:41:55,400
Speaker 3: I mean he is an explosive sideline to sideline guy

922
00:41:55,760 --> 00:41:57,960
Speaker 3: who will fire up the field defending the run of

923
00:41:58,040 --> 00:42:01,840
Speaker 3: rushing the passer, who can also cover covered tight ends

924
00:42:01,880 --> 00:42:05,520
Speaker 3: in passing downs, swassengers interesting. There are a lot of

925
00:42:05,520 --> 00:42:07,920
Speaker 3: people who like him. I mean again sort of like

926
00:42:08,000 --> 00:42:11,080
Speaker 3: Jah Carter, jahadd Campbell in the sense that he is

927
00:42:11,120 --> 00:42:14,080
Speaker 3: a pure off the ball linebacker, you know, ten fifteen

928
00:42:14,160 --> 00:42:17,280
Speaker 3: yards down the field in coverage, pursuing the plays. Laterally,

929
00:42:17,560 --> 00:42:20,520
Speaker 3: it's gonna be in pulled out of the Senior Bowl late,

930
00:42:20,600 --> 00:42:23,120
Speaker 3: which I know, which was a big disappointment to teams

931
00:42:23,120 --> 00:42:25,680
Speaker 3: because they wanted to see him a person. Be interesting

932
00:42:25,680 --> 00:42:28,040
Speaker 3: to see how he tests. He's gonna run relatively well.

933
00:42:28,200 --> 00:42:30,960
Speaker 3: He's got good playing speed, but teams are gonna want

934
00:42:30,960 --> 00:42:33,640
Speaker 3: to see decent forty times as well at the combine.

935
00:42:33,800 --> 00:42:35,360
Speaker 2: Then you have done him in as Araku out of

936
00:42:35,400 --> 00:42:38,560
Speaker 2: Boston College, Tony as a borderline second round early third

937
00:42:38,640 --> 00:42:41,080
Speaker 2: round pick, Barry Carter of Clemson that thing we talked

938
00:42:41,120 --> 00:42:44,359
Speaker 2: about last year as an off ball guy, speed guy,

939
00:42:44,440 --> 00:42:46,960
Speaker 2: silent the sideline. And then you have the Kyle Kurdard

940
00:42:47,000 --> 00:42:49,879
Speaker 2: and Jack Sawyer two kind of solid edges we've talked about.

941
00:42:49,880 --> 00:42:51,880
Speaker 2: And would you have prince ly human Mialen kind of

942
00:42:51,880 --> 00:42:54,000
Speaker 2: in this group two kind of in that range.

943
00:42:54,239 --> 00:42:57,239
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean he's basically a step down. I have

944
00:42:57,320 --> 00:43:01,359
Speaker 3: him as a fourth rounder. I mean flan ability at

945
00:43:01,400 --> 00:43:03,759
Speaker 3: the senior ball, but really we didn't show a lot

946
00:43:03,760 --> 00:43:07,000
Speaker 3: of consistency, and that is the mo for his college career.

947
00:43:07,160 --> 00:43:10,520
Speaker 3: I mean, there were times where he just took over games,

948
00:43:10,880 --> 00:43:13,760
Speaker 3: and then there's other series other half of the games

949
00:43:13,760 --> 00:43:15,920
Speaker 3: where you're like, was this guy even on the field.

950
00:43:16,160 --> 00:43:18,400
Speaker 3: So I think that's gonna be a big concern for teams.

951
00:43:18,920 --> 00:43:21,879
Speaker 3: He's got great potential, though I can understand why why

952
00:43:21,880 --> 00:43:25,000
Speaker 3: people would like him. I just don't see the consistency there.

953
00:43:25,239 --> 00:43:27,279
Speaker 2: All right, let's jump to the defensive backstone, and you've

954
00:43:27,320 --> 00:43:29,640
Speaker 2: sorted the corners in safeties together. This is not a

955
00:43:29,680 --> 00:43:33,719
Speaker 2: great group this year. I think you're probably you might

956
00:43:33,760 --> 00:43:36,480
Speaker 2: only have one first round pick. Malki Starks at safety

957
00:43:36,520 --> 00:43:38,480
Speaker 2: could slide into this first round, I think still, and

958
00:43:38,520 --> 00:43:39,359
Speaker 2: I think that's a good chance.

959
00:43:39,400 --> 00:43:41,960
Speaker 1: So maybe one corner, one safety. Why don't you break

960
00:43:42,000 --> 00:43:42,440
Speaker 1: it down for us?

961
00:43:42,440 --> 00:43:44,799
Speaker 2: Why don't we go through the corners first and then

962
00:43:44,840 --> 00:43:46,680
Speaker 2: we'll kind of split the safeties off a little bit.

963
00:43:48,000 --> 00:43:50,680
Speaker 3: Will Johnson, you go back in the twenty twenty three

964
00:43:50,760 --> 00:43:53,200
Speaker 3: film on Will Johnson. He looks like a top ten pick.

965
00:43:53,239 --> 00:43:55,840
Speaker 3: You go in twenty twenty four You're like, what happened?

966
00:43:56,280 --> 00:43:58,520
Speaker 3: And it was. It's a question of was it a

967
00:43:58,560 --> 00:44:01,799
Speaker 3: schematic thing because you was consistently playing backed off the

968
00:44:01,840 --> 00:44:04,640
Speaker 3: line of scrimmage, manoff coverage, and he was giving up

969
00:44:05,000 --> 00:44:08,439
Speaker 3: a lot of receptions. So it's gonna be it's gonna

970
00:44:08,440 --> 00:44:11,040
Speaker 3: be determined between it's gonna be. He's gonna be asked

971
00:44:11,040 --> 00:44:14,960
Speaker 3: about it, as is his defensive coordinator, Wink Martindale as

972
00:44:15,000 --> 00:44:17,480
Speaker 3: to you know, was this the game plan with Will

973
00:44:17,520 --> 00:44:19,719
Speaker 3: Johnson because he gave up a lot of receptions this

974
00:44:19,800 --> 00:44:22,520
Speaker 3: year and he was constantly backed off the line of scrimmage.

975
00:44:22,600 --> 00:44:27,120
Speaker 3: But again the twenty twenty three film, he was absolutely dominant, dominant.

976
00:44:27,400 --> 00:44:30,840
Speaker 3: Then there's Ben Morrison, who started off slowly had the

977
00:44:30,920 --> 00:44:33,279
Speaker 3: hip injury, but a can you go back to the

978
00:44:33,280 --> 00:44:35,840
Speaker 3: two tenty twenty three film when he was at the

979
00:44:35,880 --> 00:44:38,160
Speaker 3: top of his game and he was like, Wow, I mean,

980
00:44:38,200 --> 00:44:41,640
Speaker 3: this guy is a shutdown top fifteen pick at the

981
00:44:41,719 --> 00:44:45,160
Speaker 3: cornerback position because he was so good. Shotton Revel, I

982
00:44:45,200 --> 00:44:48,240
Speaker 3: think Revel was the guy who his game was progressing

983
00:44:48,560 --> 00:44:51,439
Speaker 3: incredible size speed numbers. It's gonna go about six foot two,

984
00:44:51,640 --> 00:44:55,400
Speaker 3: one hundred and ninety pounds legitimately runs in the four threes.

985
00:44:55,560 --> 00:44:58,640
Speaker 3: I saw a lot of development in his game, especially

986
00:44:58,680 --> 00:45:01,120
Speaker 3: was with his ability to plays with his back to

987
00:45:01,160 --> 00:45:03,120
Speaker 3: the ball and get his head back around track to

988
00:45:03,160 --> 00:45:05,800
Speaker 3: pass in the air in the early part of twenty

989
00:45:05,880 --> 00:45:10,040
Speaker 3: twenty four, but he suffered the knee injury in practice

990
00:45:10,160 --> 00:45:13,080
Speaker 3: which kind of ended his season. So he's kind of

991
00:45:13,080 --> 00:45:16,080
Speaker 3: a wild card as far as the draft is concern.

992
00:45:16,360 --> 00:45:18,160
Speaker 3: And then one of my favorite guys and someone who

993
00:45:18,239 --> 00:45:20,319
Speaker 3: I think can go much higher than everyone thinks is

994
00:45:20,360 --> 00:45:24,960
Speaker 3: ja Jahade Baron of Texas played a little nickel, played

995
00:45:24,960 --> 00:45:27,560
Speaker 3: on the edge. Did it all very very well?

996
00:45:28,400 --> 00:45:30,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, And you know those are your guys that you

997
00:45:31,000 --> 00:45:33,640
Speaker 2: have at corner in the first and second round. And

998
00:45:33,680 --> 00:45:35,480
Speaker 2: then you have Treomos kind of coming in at the

999
00:45:35,520 --> 00:45:37,720
Speaker 2: back end of that second round, Tony and then Kobe Bryant,

1000
00:45:37,760 --> 00:45:39,480
Speaker 2: a guy that we saw at Kansas.

1001
00:45:39,560 --> 00:45:40,160
Speaker 1: This is funny.

1002
00:45:40,680 --> 00:45:43,480
Speaker 2: I was rewatching some of the wide receiver dB one

1003
00:45:43,520 --> 00:45:46,319
Speaker 2: on ones at the Senior Bowl. Tray Amos like this

1004
00:45:46,360 --> 00:45:48,680
Speaker 2: disappears like I feel like midway through the week and

1005
00:45:48,719 --> 00:45:50,279
Speaker 2: I didn't even notice it at the time. When I

1006
00:45:50,320 --> 00:45:51,480
Speaker 2: rewatched the table, I'm like, why is it?

1007
00:45:51,560 --> 00:45:53,239
Speaker 1: Tre Amos taking more reps.

1008
00:45:54,440 --> 00:45:56,600
Speaker 3: And you know, some people had him as a mid

1009
00:45:56,600 --> 00:45:58,759
Speaker 3: first round pick. I never saw with tre Ambos. I

1010
00:45:58,800 --> 00:46:01,040
Speaker 3: just thought he was in a nice cornerback. Remember Mississippi's

1011
00:46:01,080 --> 00:46:04,520
Speaker 3: his third school started at Louisiana, then went to Alabama,

1012
00:46:04,760 --> 00:46:07,080
Speaker 3: that played last year at Mississippi, and I always thought

1013
00:46:07,080 --> 00:46:09,600
Speaker 3: he was a nice cornerback with upside. I just never

1014
00:46:09,640 --> 00:46:13,160
Speaker 3: saw a polished player that deserved you know, top thirty

1015
00:46:13,200 --> 00:46:16,000
Speaker 3: two mentioned in this game, you mentioned, you know, he

1016
00:46:16,080 --> 00:46:19,120
Speaker 3: was basically uninspired at the Senior Ball. Then he went

1017
00:46:19,160 --> 00:46:21,879
Speaker 3: down with the injury, walked back into the locker room

1018
00:46:21,880 --> 00:46:22,839
Speaker 3: and we didn't see him again.

1019
00:46:23,520 --> 00:46:27,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then Maxwell Harriston laya Kobe Bryant Harriston. We

1020
00:46:27,000 --> 00:46:28,960
Speaker 2: talked to him at the Senior Bowl. Brian did a

1021
00:46:28,960 --> 00:46:32,120
Speaker 2: great job at the Shrine Bowl as potential third rounders.

1022
00:46:32,120 --> 00:46:34,040
Speaker 2: And how about safety Tony Obviously this is not a

1023
00:46:34,040 --> 00:46:36,360
Speaker 2: class that year head over here is over now.

1024
00:46:36,480 --> 00:46:41,480
Speaker 3: I mean Malachi Starks at Georgia, very athletic, very explosive,

1025
00:46:41,960 --> 00:46:44,800
Speaker 3: shows some ability when he's placed over the slot receiver,

1026
00:46:44,880 --> 00:46:47,279
Speaker 3: though he's got to polish his ball skills. One of

1027
00:46:47,280 --> 00:46:50,760
Speaker 3: the more natural free safeties, if you will, center fielders,

1028
00:46:50,760 --> 00:46:54,080
Speaker 3: and this year's draft probably the only natural center fielder

1029
00:46:54,600 --> 00:46:56,480
Speaker 3: that's going to go early in the draft. It's going

1030
00:46:56,560 --> 00:46:58,920
Speaker 3: to be some people had him as an early first

1031
00:46:59,000 --> 00:47:03,239
Speaker 3: round pick. I think more mid to bottom half. Maybe

1032
00:47:03,360 --> 00:47:06,640
Speaker 3: team the Miami Dolphins desperately need a safety. Colts could

1033
00:47:06,680 --> 00:47:08,360
Speaker 3: use the safety, so I think he goes somewhere in

1034
00:47:08,360 --> 00:47:11,600
Speaker 3: that range. And then you have in Nick Emminawari of

1035
00:47:11,640 --> 00:47:15,560
Speaker 3: South Carolina and Malik Verden of Iowa State. You've got

1036
00:47:15,560 --> 00:47:19,759
Speaker 3: your linebacker side safeties. You've got your natural strong safeties

1037
00:47:19,840 --> 00:47:22,920
Speaker 3: who also show solid ball skills. I mean, these guys

1038
00:47:22,920 --> 00:47:25,040
Speaker 3: can make plays when the balls in the air. They're

1039
00:47:25,080 --> 00:47:28,080
Speaker 3: just not up the field run defending safeties. It'll be

1040
00:47:28,160 --> 00:47:31,560
Speaker 3: interesting to see when teams select these guys, do they

1041
00:47:31,640 --> 00:47:35,040
Speaker 3: draft them as safeties or are they drafting him drafting

1042
00:47:35,080 --> 00:47:40,080
Speaker 3: either of these guys as linebackers, specifically one gap linebackers,

1043
00:47:40,080 --> 00:47:43,080
Speaker 3: because that's been the trend the past five six years

1044
00:47:43,120 --> 00:47:43,520
Speaker 3: or so.

1045
00:47:44,040 --> 00:47:47,440
Speaker 2: Hi, Tony, is you continuing and soon completing all your

1046
00:47:47,440 --> 00:47:50,400
Speaker 2: filmwork on this class? Anything else jump out at you

1047
00:47:50,440 --> 00:47:52,080
Speaker 2: in general about this class that that you think fan

1048
00:47:52,120 --> 00:47:54,759
Speaker 2: should No one understands well.

1049
00:47:54,960 --> 00:47:58,120
Speaker 3: I mean we talked about the top guys. But what

1050
00:47:58,239 --> 00:48:00,560
Speaker 3: I think is going to happen I've said before, and

1051
00:48:00,560 --> 00:48:04,120
Speaker 3: I apologize if I'm being redundant, is there is great

1052
00:48:04,200 --> 00:48:07,000
Speaker 3: depth in the later rounds of Day three. I mean

1053
00:48:07,080 --> 00:48:09,040
Speaker 3: and late in the draft. There's gonna be a lot

1054
00:48:09,040 --> 00:48:11,839
Speaker 3: of depth because of the fact that that COVID year

1055
00:48:11,880 --> 00:48:14,360
Speaker 3: is ending and you're gonna have a lot of fifth, sixth,

1056
00:48:14,360 --> 00:48:17,560
Speaker 3: and even seven year seniors. And what's gonna happen at

1057
00:48:17,600 --> 00:48:20,160
Speaker 3: the end of the draft where people really don't pay

1058
00:48:20,200 --> 00:48:22,600
Speaker 3: too much attention, is you're gonna have guys who are

1059
00:48:22,600 --> 00:48:24,879
Speaker 3: not selected, who have drafta book graades, just like you're

1060
00:48:24,920 --> 00:48:27,160
Speaker 3: only gonna have three hundred and twenty five guys to combine,

1061
00:48:27,239 --> 00:48:29,399
Speaker 3: and you could literally give out four hundred and fifty

1062
00:48:29,440 --> 00:48:33,160
Speaker 3: invitations because the guys are deserving. So while you don't

1063
00:48:33,200 --> 00:48:35,600
Speaker 3: have the great quality of the knockout quality at the top,

1064
00:48:35,680 --> 00:48:37,560
Speaker 3: say as we did last year, it's gonna be a

1065
00:48:37,600 --> 00:48:39,839
Speaker 3: lot of good depth later on in Day three.

1066
00:48:40,640 --> 00:48:42,920
Speaker 2: Tony always a pleasure, my friend, will be back with

1067
00:48:43,440 --> 00:48:45,600
Speaker 2: your mock draft next week. And if folks we want

1068
00:48:45,600 --> 00:48:47,799
Speaker 2: to send in questions for Tony and I send them

1069
00:48:47,840 --> 00:48:49,000
Speaker 2: into our Twitter handles.

1070
00:48:49,040 --> 00:48:51,160
Speaker 1: I'm at Schmelk Tony, what's your Twitter.

1071
00:48:50,960 --> 00:48:53,279
Speaker 3: Handle at Tony Pauline.

1072
00:48:53,360 --> 00:48:54,879
Speaker 2: There we go nice and easy. We keep it simple

1073
00:48:54,920 --> 00:48:56,680
Speaker 2: for you guys, So send then your questions. I'll put

1074
00:48:56,680 --> 00:48:58,080
Speaker 2: a tweet up. You can reply to that as well.

1075
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Speaker 2: At some point at the end of the day on

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Speaker 2: and next week, at some point, get those questions in.

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Speaker 2: We'll do that in Tony's mock draft. Then we'll have

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Speaker 2: our Combine preview. I'll see Tony down there. He'll jump

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Speaker 2: on Big B Killef live with us when we're in Innianapolis.

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Speaker 2: I'm getting all mixed up, and then we'll do our

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Speaker 2: Cobbyed review when we get back, probably on Tuesday, because

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Speaker 2: I think offensive linemen are doing Monday workouts right or

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Speaker 2: something like that.

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Speaker 1: Are they Sunday Sunday?

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Speaker 3: Sunday late Sunday? Okay, I'm I'm taking a late flight

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Speaker 3: out Sunday so to make sure I catch them up.

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Speaker 3: Because last year they had the specialists that the kickers

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Speaker 3: go before the offensive lineman, and the offensive lineman didn't

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Speaker 3: start to like afternoon on Sunday and a lot of

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Speaker 3: just about everybody left. So this year I think they

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Speaker 3: pushed the specialist to Friday, and it's the offensive lineman

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Speaker 3: have the field all to themselves on Sunday.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm leaving on Friday night, so I will watch

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Speaker 2: those drills. Luckily, NFL Network does a great job broadcasting

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Speaker 2: all of those drills and they show all the players.

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Speaker 2: So I will have that on the DVR and I

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Speaker 2: will sort through that over the weekend and then Tony

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Speaker 2: and I will review that on the Monday after the combine,

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Speaker 2: but two more shows before then. Make sure you come

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Speaker 2: in and check us out. It's all brought to you

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Speaker 2: by Moody's, a proud sponsor of the New York Giants.

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Speaker 2: For Tony Pauline, I'm John Schmulck. We will see you

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Speaker 2: next week.