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Speaker 1: Hello the Internet, and welcome to this episode of The

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Speaker 1: Weekly Zeitgeist. Uh. These are some of our favorite segments

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Speaker 1: from this week, all edited together into one NonStop infotainment

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Speaker 1: laugh stravaganza. Uh yeah, So, without further ado, here is

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Speaker 1: the Weekly Zeitgeist. Hey, speaking of cracked videos, Miles, we

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Speaker 1: are thrilled to be joined by one of my favorite

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Speaker 1: actors from those videos, also a brilliant and talented producer

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Speaker 1: of the must Watch Some More News with Cody Johnson podcast,

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Speaker 1: host of Even More News and the dearly Departed Worst

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Speaker 1: Year Ever. It is the brilliant, the talented Katie Start.

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Speaker 1: I can speak now. I'm here, Hi guys. I love

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Speaker 1: being here. You always make me feel so good about myself.

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Speaker 1: It's great to have you big fans. And you you

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Speaker 1: recently relocated up to the mountains, did it? Sure is.

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Speaker 1: I'm not going to share the specifics of the mountains.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's a big, big mountain range, but I'm

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Speaker 1: not gonna tell my specific town. It has been a journey.

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Speaker 1: It's just like I threw a bomb in the middle

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Speaker 1: of my life and it's good. But it's a big adventure.

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Speaker 1: I'm up here. Are you nimble? Are you good with change.

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Speaker 1: I am good with change, the highly adaptable. I thought

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Speaker 1: for a while maybe I didn't, but the last few

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Speaker 1: years have shown me that I am. This is There's

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Speaker 1: so many reasons why I decided to do it, one

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Speaker 1: of which is that my folks are in the area

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Speaker 1: and they're getting older and I deeply missed them ever

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Speaker 1: since I left for college when I was eighteen, and

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Speaker 1: so it's kind of like now we're never affordability. But also,

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Speaker 1: I don't want to say emerged from the pandemic, because

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Speaker 1: we are still in the pandemic, but I emerged from

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Speaker 1: the lockdown period of the pandemic with a different world.

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Speaker 1: You know, I'm in my late thirties now, and that

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Speaker 1: was like the tail end of the youthfulness. Now everyone's

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Speaker 1: having babies and are married and whatnot, and it's exciting,

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Speaker 1: but you know, I don't actually see my my closest

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Speaker 1: friends that often when I'm in l A. Anyway, you

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Speaker 1: said the time you moved to was like a place

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Speaker 1: you went for vacation. Growing up, The only place we

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Speaker 1: ever vacation was up here because I grew up in

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Speaker 1: You know, this was just the family thing. My whole

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Speaker 1: life and my parents. It was always the dream to

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Speaker 1: retire here, and they made that happen. And in my

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Speaker 1: mind this was something that, you know, like I would

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Speaker 1: maybe get a spot up here when I'm old, you know,

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Speaker 1: or like someday keep my parents place and have that

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Speaker 1: be a family spot. But it's just it's reimagining what

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Speaker 1: that dream looks like. And I did date someone briefly

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Speaker 1: a while back, and that was a big mistake. Um

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Speaker 1: up here up here? Yeah yeah, yeah, he just was

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Speaker 1: so dusty all the time. You said he'd he'd scream

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Speaker 1: at you when you talk to is a divining rod. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: And then once he brought up Jordan Peterson, I was like, later,

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Speaker 1: that's where I gonna keep your room clean. Yeah. But

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Speaker 1: but what that did show me was that it's not

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Speaker 1: just old people up here, or that there are more

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Speaker 1: things to do. There's different spots and there's lots and

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Speaker 1: it's changing. And so immediately after being up here, I

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Speaker 1: had vaguely tweeted about the mountains and then somebody reached

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Speaker 1: out from Twitter saying, if it happens to be x Mountains,

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Speaker 1: let me know, and it was, and she lives in

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Speaker 1: this town and her and her like it's just changing.

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Speaker 1: People are doing what I'm doing, and while it is

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Speaker 1: pretty conservative, it is changing. Democratic primary went for burning here,

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Speaker 1: So you know, it's been really exciting and challenge chang

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Speaker 1: and and I don't regret it. Ala, You're kind of

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Speaker 1: living the dream of like I. You know, my version

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Speaker 1: of that was Ocean City, New Jersey, And every time

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Speaker 1: I go there, I'm always like, man, what if I

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Speaker 1: just like moved here and like there there's only like

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Speaker 1: a couple of thousand people during the winter there, and

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Speaker 1: it's but it's still like, I don't know, nice, and

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Speaker 1: you're close to the ocean, and the high school is good.

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Speaker 1: I I hang out at the local high schools kids.

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Speaker 1: The teams are so cool in town for the kids.

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Speaker 1: You got Yeah, no, I well, Jack, there's something to that,

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Speaker 1: you know, not that everybody should do exactly what I'm doing,

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Speaker 1: but I do think that you have to think about

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Speaker 1: we all not you have to think about what is

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Speaker 1: important and acknowledge that we don't have very much time

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Speaker 1: here and the world is changing rapidly and intensely. And

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Speaker 1: so if there is something that you want to do

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Speaker 1: that brings you some peace, or if there is something

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Speaker 1: that you want to do that. You will say someday

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Speaker 1: I wish I had explored that I don't. I don't

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Speaker 1: see why not, because you can work from home. The

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Speaker 1: challenging thing for me will be that I still want

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Speaker 1: to act. I've done significantly less of that. But the

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Speaker 1: whole reason I was able to do this is because

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Speaker 1: my good friend Molanna. They put me in a bunch

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Speaker 1: of commercials and you know, but but auditions are all

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Speaker 1: online and zoom whatnot, and so like if you talk

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Speaker 1: to your I mean, I just encourage everybody to think

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Speaker 1: look at their lives a little differently. Maybe we have

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Speaker 1: we always kind of thank you, thank you for my house,

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Speaker 1: I love you, shout out Milanavine, true all praise. But yeah,

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Speaker 1: I think everybody you know, you have those moments where

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Speaker 1: you think of like, oh, my life will be good

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Speaker 1: if I live this very specific way. You grow up

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Speaker 1: thinking like, oh my life will be this as an

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Speaker 1: adult word, this will be my job and I'll like

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Speaker 1: that and I'll live here. But very quickly like you

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Speaker 1: learned to kind of distill those things down to like

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Speaker 1: very simple things, and like sometimes like I don't maybe

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Speaker 1: I don't need to live in X city or live

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Speaker 1: in or work in ex industry. It's really about what

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Speaker 1: my environment is and when my day to day life

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Speaker 1: actually is like right, right, yeah, So it's always interestingly

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Speaker 1: like to kind of take that on and think like, oh, ship,

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Speaker 1: like actually, I really kind of just want to sit

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Speaker 1: near a river a lot like that might be more

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Speaker 1: exciting to me than to go to bars all the

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Speaker 1: time or some ship where I've had friends do that

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Speaker 1: who suddenly they're like, no, I realized, I I've I've

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Speaker 1: I've focused my needs. It really it was hammered home

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Speaker 1: to me with I mean over and over over the

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Speaker 1: past few years, but with Roe v Wade mm hmm.

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Speaker 1: That was so devastating. And I was in my place

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Speaker 1: in l A and I wanted to get out. I

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Speaker 1: just needed to go and reconnect with nature or something.

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Speaker 1: And then you have to it's brutally hot, you have

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Speaker 1: to battle tons of trafficy it anywhere, and it's parking

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Speaker 1: and I felt claustrophobic first here you have a bad

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Speaker 1: day and I end up by going in kayaking, right, Okay, cool,

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Speaker 1: that's different. We'll see and then I can always we'll see,

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Speaker 1: my life is long. If this doesn't work out for me,

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Speaker 1: then I can always revalue the other kayak spot right

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Speaker 1: the wind? My God, that sounds like a Bob Seeker song,

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Speaker 1: doesn't it? Right the wind? It might be well, maybe

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Speaker 1: he should have thought of riding the wind instead of

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Speaker 1: going against it. Maybe it would have been a very

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Speaker 1: different message. What is something from your search history? Okay?

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Speaker 1: I was really excited for this question this week because

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Speaker 1: I did a radical History timeline workshop for a community,

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Speaker 1: and it's a workshop that I've done in the past,

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Speaker 1: and I've been looking up I've been basically going into

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Speaker 1: the Los Ange List newspaper archives looking up different words

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Speaker 1: like Hindu and Indian and Hadgie just to see what's

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Speaker 1: out there. And I discovered that there is a there

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Speaker 1: was a like a Syrian circus troupe from the turn

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Speaker 1: of the century or maybe maybe it was like thirties, No,

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Speaker 1: I think it was there. We go, I just did

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Speaker 1: the search that you just I'm not like independently familiar

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Speaker 1: with this, but look at that like picture in there.

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Speaker 1: It's like all these like Arab circus folks, and this

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Speaker 1: was a part of American history. We literally had Arab

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Speaker 1: circuits folks in you know, eight yeah. Yeah, So it

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Speaker 1: was like starting in the late nineteen century into the

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Speaker 1: early twentieth century. Who is Bob ker right? It was

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Speaker 1: probably some guy Bob, but they're like, we need to

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Speaker 1: name it. Make it just in true like old timey fashion.

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Speaker 1: Bob gers arabs, let me see them. Why has no

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Speaker 1: one made a movie about this? Like I feel like, like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: they're called if you look at this article, is called

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Speaker 1: the Jabbor Carnival and the Circus Company, and then they

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Speaker 1: called it like the Oriental Carnival. Like this is like

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Speaker 1: a great movie right here. Yeah. Oh, they actually just

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Speaker 1: made that movie called What's that Midnight Alley? But then

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Speaker 1: they just recast it as all white people? What what's

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Speaker 1: the what's that? Fuck? I'm not this joke failed many levels.

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Speaker 1: Conn Alley Nightmare Alley was what I was thinking. Anyways,

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Speaker 1: that was a movie that came out about the carnival,

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Speaker 1: but it starts Bradley Cooper. Anyways, this is dope? What what?

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Speaker 1: So you just kind of have access to the newspaper

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Speaker 1: ARCHI does everybody have access to that? Or is that

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Speaker 1: like a subscription service? I think everyone does have access

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Speaker 1: to it. I was the archive I was looking up?

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Speaker 1: Was I think it was? You see reverse Side's archive,

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Speaker 1: which is accessible. And then I was also I have access.

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Speaker 1: I was a USC fellow this past year, so I

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Speaker 1: have access to USC's library right now. Okay, I mean

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Speaker 1: that's pretty cool. I'm happy for you, you know, even

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Speaker 1: though I'm a brilliant, but yes, I appreciate that for you. Listen,

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Speaker 1: I'm also a Bruin. I'm just like in l a bruin. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I don't. Look, it's interchangeable. Once you get popping like

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Speaker 1: you are getting, you can't. You can't and you're like

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Speaker 1: a local for sure. All those rich parents spending money

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Speaker 1: to get their kids into the end of the school

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Speaker 1: actually buys some buy some really nice libraries. So that's yeah,

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Speaker 1: a lot of books. Oh yeah. Oh, and the in

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Speaker 1: the fences around the campus. You can barely top those

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Speaker 1: ships the finest, no matter how desperate you might be.

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Speaker 1: What is something you think is overrated? Now? I thought

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Speaker 1: about this question a lot because I'm like, I feel like,

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Speaker 1: no matter what I'm gonna say, I'm I'm going to

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Speaker 1: get in trouble. But i feel like I've already got

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Speaker 1: controlled for this quite enough times. The good news is

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Speaker 1: this show does not matter. You can go nuts Okay,

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Speaker 1: so I'm gonna say something controversial, and I'm going to

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Speaker 1: say something I think is overrated. Is the movie Blade Runner. Wow.

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Speaker 1: I've actually heard this a couple of times in the

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Speaker 1: not too distant past. I feel like there is a

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Speaker 1: a Blade Runner backlash. It's not good. I mean, you

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Speaker 1: can talk about it being a technical marvel and like

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Speaker 1: all these things, but I'm like, if you're talking about

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Speaker 1: like narrative storytelling, I'm like, it's not there to take

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Speaker 1: but one everybody clear out. I think it is for

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Speaker 1: some people. I have like a friend who anytime they

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Speaker 1: see someone's talking about Blade Runner, Like when someone on

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Speaker 1: Twitter is like, what movie do you think that you

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Speaker 1: don't like? That's like lauded or something, and someone's like

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Speaker 1: blade Runner. He like sends it to me and he

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Speaker 1: was like, I'm upset, and I'm like, it's not a

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Speaker 1: good movie. So also, I know you were looking for support,

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Speaker 1: but I know I was, like I said, and I'm

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Speaker 1: just like, do they're gonna love this way? But particularly

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Speaker 1: was I had it. I think it was hinge, like

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Speaker 1: the dating app that was. I can't remember how exactly

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Speaker 1: the question was worded, but it was like an unpopular

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Speaker 1: opinion you have or something, and I had put like

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Speaker 1: Blade Runners not a good film, and of course, like

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Speaker 1: some guy who has like feminists in his profile like

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Speaker 1: matched with me just to tell me that I was wrong.

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Speaker 1: I was like going to roll people up. I'm doing

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Speaker 1: this because I'm a feminist and I want you to

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Speaker 1: avoid the embarrassment of having that take. So I have

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Speaker 1: to explain to you why you're wrong. Did you see

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Speaker 1: Blade Runner twenty whatever? Yeah, No, I didn't. I saw

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Speaker 1: a Blade Runner. I think the final cut like two

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Speaker 1: or three years ago. I think I think maybe summer.

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Speaker 1: There's a theater in Austin called the Paramount and like

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Speaker 1: every year they have like a summer classic film series,

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Speaker 1: and so they played Blade Runner, and I'm like, Okay,

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Speaker 1: it's gonna be the first time I'm gonna watch it.

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Speaker 1: It's gonna be in a theater. It's gonna be like

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Speaker 1: the like the cut that everyone's like, this is the

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Speaker 1: best one. And then I was like, no, it's like

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Speaker 1: this isn't for me. So I think that's like always

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Speaker 1: in my mind now. Yeah, the I think my appreciation

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Speaker 1: for the original Blade Runner is hurt by having seen

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Speaker 1: Blade Runner, because I think it is also somewhat boring,

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Speaker 1: also a technical marvel and just like all the things

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Speaker 1: that are beautiful about the original Blade Runner are like

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Speaker 1: advanced by Blade Run in some ways. This is again

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Speaker 1: I am getting on this island with you, and I

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Speaker 1: know it is about to get bombed, but I'm I'm

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Speaker 1: okay with that. I agree. Blade Runner is like one

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Speaker 1: of those movies that was important and like it brought

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Speaker 1: in a lot of like cool synth vibes andto like

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Speaker 1: soundtracks and created a very cool aesthetic. But watching it now,

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Speaker 1: it is a John Belushi situation for me where I'm like,

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Speaker 1: I appreciate what he did and we wouldn't have Chris

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Speaker 1: Farley without John Belushi. But it doesn't it doesn't work

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Speaker 1: for me now when I watch it. Find a new angle.

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Speaker 1: That that's my that's my general vibe is find a

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Speaker 1: new angle. Yeah, yeah for sure. Also, like can a

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Speaker 1: replicant consent anyway? You know, Like that's the other That's

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Speaker 1: the thing I see people argue about all the time,

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Speaker 1: like kind of a weird lit miss test for people

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Speaker 1: who you're like, well, you know, what is consent if

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Speaker 1: they're like a fake being? And I'm like, this is

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Speaker 1: so weird that this conversation you want to have like

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Speaker 1: upfront about the film Blade Runner Book. Okay mm hmm.

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Speaker 1: Also shout out to art house theaters like that just

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Speaker 1: will show an old ass movie like every once in

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Speaker 1: a while. I think that's we have a lot of

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Speaker 1: them in l a and like Austin, it makes sense

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Speaker 1: to that they're there. I went to the town I

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Speaker 1: grew up in, Wheeling, West Virginia, which much smaller, and

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Speaker 1: went to the place where I went to see my

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Speaker 1: first movie, Rocky four, in downtown Wheeling, West Virginia, and

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Speaker 1: the theater no longer existed, but across the street they

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Speaker 1: had turned an old church into like a weird like

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Speaker 1: art house theater and community theater, so like they had

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Speaker 1: movie like old classic movies and like you know, community

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Speaker 1: theater revivals of of old plays. It was it was

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Speaker 1: pretty dope. Shut up. Do they have like stained glass still? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: Yeah it loo. Yeah, it was very cool. What is

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Speaker 1: something you think is underrated? Well, this is like loosely

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Speaker 1: related to a tweet that had stuck with me, and

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Speaker 1: it has to do with like the like Discovery, HBO,

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Speaker 1: Max stuff that's happening and you know, every day They're

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Speaker 1: just like these shows have disappeared from HBO, and it's

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Speaker 1: like a lot of shows that I never got the

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Speaker 1: chance to watch because I program films for a few festivals.

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Speaker 1: So from September to April, that's like all I'm doing

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Speaker 1: is watching films like submissions and stuff, and so I'm

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Speaker 1: really behind on TV. Like I just watched Squid Game

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Speaker 1: like three months ago, and I was like, there's a

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Speaker 1: show I really like called Starstruck on HBO Max. I

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Speaker 1: don't know. It's so good, it's so funny, and it's

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Speaker 1: been picked up for a third season. But now I'm like,

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Speaker 1: will it still be there? Because it's a Max original

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Speaker 1: and I think the Max originals are kind of all

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Speaker 1: in question right now. And I feel like it's a

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Speaker 1: show that a lot of people don't talk about or

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Speaker 1: know about, and just really funny, charming, well have written.

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Speaker 1: You know, I got some South Asians in there, which

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Speaker 1: is awesome. It's just yeah, it's just really fun and

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Speaker 1: I like that it's a kind of a slice of

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Speaker 1: life show because I think I feel like in a

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Speaker 1: lot of movies and TV, like if there's not like

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Speaker 1: an explosion or a car chase, they're just like it's

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Speaker 1: boring whatever, but I was like, no, like this is

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Speaker 1: really fun and it's cute, and um, I want more

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Speaker 1: people to watch it. So watch the Starstruck on HBO

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Speaker 1: Max and Gray that it doesn't leave. Yeah, it's also

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Speaker 1: great because the premise is so grounded. You know, it's

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Speaker 1: like what if this person who works at a movie theater,

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Speaker 1: you know, like then somehow crosses path with like the

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Speaker 1: biggest action star in the world and they're dating and

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Speaker 1: watching like the clash of the two worlds. I love

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Speaker 1: like that first episode or like the paparazzi thinks she's

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Speaker 1: the house cleaner and she's like, oh sorry, He's like

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Speaker 1: this look, isn't it And she just takes a bag

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Speaker 1: of I'm not going to attempt to do her New

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Speaker 1: zealand she takes like her bag of trash like around

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Speaker 1: the corner. She's like like embarrassed to be like, no,

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Speaker 1: I'm do you know what, I'm the cleaning lady and

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna go to my job. And then the her

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Speaker 1: her roommate Kate, is so funny too. I love that character. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's it's a it's such a good show and that

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Speaker 1: sense and I have a feeling it will probably be

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Speaker 1: like one of those HBO Max shows that I know

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Speaker 1: they said, like the good one or you know the

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Speaker 1: good ones, the ones that will make it one that

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Speaker 1: being like full on HBO shows, And I feel like it,

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Speaker 1: you know, it's it meets that standard for sure, Hope.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, h have you seen a Jack? Yeah? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: we did a streaming corner. Oh that's right. Yeah, my

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Speaker 1: favorite scene I got. I have to give it up

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Speaker 1: to Kate so many times. There's that one scene where

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Speaker 1: they go to the premiere and she has like four

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Speaker 1: cocktails in her hands and she goes up to rose

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Speaker 1: Matafeo's character and she's like, I told them these are

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Speaker 1: for my boyfriend. Idiots. Like she's so stoked that got

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Speaker 1: these free drinks, and I'm like, I love when you

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Speaker 1: capture that like essence of like people being like, yo, dude,

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Speaker 1: I'm in this like new fancy place and I'm kinda yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'm having you got to look for what it's worth.

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Speaker 1: YEA A great show. Yeah, it's it is. You will like,

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Speaker 1: like I feel like, no no matter who you are,

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Speaker 1: if you listen to the show you enjoy, you, you

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Speaker 1: will like that show that's like I feel like one

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Speaker 1: of the most straight down the middle should be more

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Speaker 1: popular than it is. Great underrated pick now yeh, damn,

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Speaker 1: I didn't know you like programmed film festivals and ship.

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Speaker 1: I can't believe that guy came at you with a

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Speaker 1: with a blade runner like explanation. He probably probably didn't

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Speaker 1: know what he was about to get into. I don't

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Speaker 1: want to be like this, not but I was like, well,

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Speaker 1: I said film and journalism, and I work there. But

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Speaker 1: that's like besides the point, like you're everyone's entitled to

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Speaker 1: their opinion. But yeah, I think the first thing he

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Speaker 1: was like, is this about the new one? Because if

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Speaker 1: it's not, then this is a bad take or whatever.

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Speaker 1: Oh my god, again, y'all, don't get so attached to

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Speaker 1: these fucking things that you think that's in attack on you.

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Speaker 1: If someone doesn't funk with it, like for real, like

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Speaker 1: step one to becoming an adult, he's sucking let go of,

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Speaker 1: you know, getting so turned up if someone doesn't like

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Speaker 1: some ship that you love, Derek, what's something you think

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Speaker 1: is underrated? Harvey Guian from What We Do in the Shadows?

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, oh yeah, yeah, that dude, Like there are

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Speaker 1: a couple of photos that came out the other day.

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Speaker 1: I think he was at an award show and just

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Speaker 1: like super high fem you know, very glittery, and the

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Speaker 1: buying me was just like yes, I want it. And

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Speaker 1: then they even like folded that into the show with

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Speaker 1: his sexuality. But like he's got great timing. I hear

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Speaker 1: really good things about the Librarians the show, But I'm

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Speaker 1: not going to watch a show about magicians or librarians.

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Speaker 1: I like, I'm going to watch I'm not gonna watch

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Speaker 1: a show about like, wait, what's that? What makes the

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Speaker 1: doing decimal system dangerous? Wait? He is in a show

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Speaker 1: called The Librarians. Yeah, it was on I think Sci

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Speaker 1: Fi Network, or you mean the Magicians? No, no, no,

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Speaker 1: the Librarians. Because my who is my partner keeps urging

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Speaker 1: it like we gotta watch this afterwards, I'm like, I

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Speaker 1: will watch a handful of episodes, but I'm drawn the

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Speaker 1: line after like five mm hm. This is wild. On

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Speaker 1: his Wikipedia page, it says Harvey Gean he had his

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Speaker 1: name is Javier, but he went by Harvey because quote

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Speaker 1: his teachers could not pronounce his first name. Damn. That's

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Speaker 1: so this dude isn't lives in Orange County, that's the

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Speaker 1: most racist ship ever. Do you you're really doing that

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Speaker 1: in southern California. It was willful mispronunciation. That is not

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Speaker 1: trying man. That shows so funny. I just I just

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Speaker 1: watched a clip of of Matthew Berry saying you you

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Speaker 1: are truly are the biggest bastard in New York City

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Speaker 1: that you haven't seen it. It's just one of the

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Speaker 1: great line deliveries of all time. Amazing. Let's uh, let's

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Speaker 1: take a quick break and we will be right back

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Speaker 1: to talk about dr Oz And we're back, and I

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Speaker 1: wanted to talk briefly about the upcoming Brazilian election. We've

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Speaker 1: kind of mentioned it in passing before. But you know,

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Speaker 1: as we've discussed recently on the show, the US is

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Speaker 1: out loud kind of fascist tendencies of late our part

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Speaker 1: of a global trend. Like, you know, fascism is capitalism's

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Speaker 1: response to the failure of capitalism, and like when the

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Speaker 1: market economy makes it clear that a leftward movement is

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Speaker 1: necessary because like just leaving it to the market is

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Speaker 1: not working, capitalist societies will reliably respond with fascism of

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Speaker 1: some sort. Like it. It really is, like I don't know,

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Speaker 1: sometimes helpful to just think of it as like a body,

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Speaker 1: like and like America has a immune system, and like

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Speaker 1: all capitalist countries with like that sort of make up

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Speaker 1: their immune systems. Response is fascism like whenever, whenever things

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Speaker 1: are are going badly, Like that's one of the options

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Speaker 1: they throw out, is to just have a complete break

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Speaker 1: with reality. And like I bring that idea up, that

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Speaker 1: metaphor of like the body politic up mostly because America

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Speaker 1: is so averse to socialism that it feels like America

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Speaker 1: is allergic to socialism that it's just like, we can't

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Speaker 1: do this. The branding around hating socialism is is really

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Speaker 1: quite remarkable when it's such an obvious answer everything that

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00:23:54,600 --> 00:23:59,119
Speaker 1: people complain about, everything that they that's wrong. And also

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00:23:59,480 --> 00:24:03,159
Speaker 1: we don't have of pure capitalism. There there are experiments

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00:24:03,200 --> 00:24:05,479
Speaker 1: all like we already have bits of it, you know,

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Speaker 1: like like this integrated elements of socialism. It's like, why

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Speaker 1: is this something so fearful you have to be afraid of? Yeah,

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00:24:14,440 --> 00:24:17,000
Speaker 1: it's just why. I mean, it's it's like created a

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Speaker 1: like a instant reflexing people to hear the word socialism

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Speaker 1: or communism and they immediately think I'm eating dirt in

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Speaker 1: a hut, and I have to give the government will

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Speaker 1: come from my television and WiFi, and I will give

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Speaker 1: that up so I can pick up a fucking sickle

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Speaker 1: and you know, go do yardwork or whatever. And so

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00:24:40,200 --> 00:24:43,960
Speaker 1: there's like always just like it's just dismissed like offhand immediately,

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Speaker 1: and then it's just there's like that funny there's like

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Speaker 1: that Simpsons episode where like Lisa's talking about like everyone's

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00:24:49,840 --> 00:24:51,600
Speaker 1: getting all riled up, and she's like, what if there

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Speaker 1: was like a like a system where like healthcare could

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Speaker 1: be provided, Like yeah, that sounds good, and like other

424
00:24:57,200 --> 00:25:00,080
Speaker 1: people someone's like, wait does that socialism and someone and

425
00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:04,200
Speaker 1: she's like, well it has element. They're like even though

426
00:25:04,240 --> 00:25:06,879
Speaker 1: they were on board with every single thing up until

427
00:25:06,880 --> 00:25:10,399
Speaker 1: they hear the fucking word, right, which is really wild,

428
00:25:10,640 --> 00:25:13,800
Speaker 1: Like how that just like the dots just don't connect

429
00:25:13,880 --> 00:25:16,800
Speaker 1: or are purposefully made to not connect in most people's minds.

430
00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:18,679
Speaker 1: And that town that I was talking about, that like

431
00:25:18,840 --> 00:25:21,680
Speaker 1: is my version of where you moved, Katie. It's like

432
00:25:22,200 --> 00:25:24,840
Speaker 1: there was a house that had a yard sign that

433
00:25:24,880 --> 00:25:28,840
Speaker 1: said Socialism has no home here, And I was so

434
00:25:29,000 --> 00:25:32,000
Speaker 1: tempted to just stop and ask them, like what what

435
00:25:32,080 --> 00:25:34,840
Speaker 1: do you think socialism, or just say what socialism? Or

436
00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:41,840
Speaker 1: just go what socialism? Yeah, exactly what socialism? Oh what's that? Right? Oh?

437
00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:45,120
Speaker 1: Oh man, you don't want to know. They'll make you

438
00:25:45,840 --> 00:25:50,080
Speaker 1: share with the needy. Well, not directly, it's just that

439
00:25:50,119 --> 00:25:52,480
Speaker 1: they would probably tax people at a higher rate, which

440
00:25:52,480 --> 00:25:55,120
Speaker 1: I'm not really part of that scheme, so it would

441
00:25:55,160 --> 00:25:58,240
Speaker 1: probably create better outcomes for people. I don't know, I mean, yeah,

442
00:25:58,240 --> 00:25:59,960
Speaker 1: that the idea like, oh, I'm going to be paid

443
00:26:00,119 --> 00:26:04,480
Speaker 1: a lot for nothing. You already are, buddy, And also

444
00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:07,800
Speaker 1: you are paying for your trash and your waste to

445
00:26:07,840 --> 00:26:10,560
Speaker 1: be removed from your home, and for water to come

446
00:26:10,560 --> 00:26:14,400
Speaker 1: to your home, and all sorts of things that are

447
00:26:14,480 --> 00:26:17,800
Speaker 1: basically on a socialist model in a lot of places, exactly.

448
00:26:18,359 --> 00:26:21,879
Speaker 1: And yeah, but but also we leave out of the

449
00:26:22,119 --> 00:26:29,280
Speaker 1: conversation the fact that billionaires and corporations get to skirt

450
00:26:29,840 --> 00:26:33,880
Speaker 1: and avoid taxes and you know, exploit people in order

451
00:26:33,920 --> 00:26:36,800
Speaker 1: to make there's so much money. There's so much wealth

452
00:26:38,080 --> 00:26:42,240
Speaker 1: that is being hoarded, and so like there's a I

453
00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:45,960
Speaker 1: understand that the logistics are great because nobody's ever actually

454
00:26:46,000 --> 00:26:49,760
Speaker 1: done it here, right, Like, there's a way to do

455
00:26:49,800 --> 00:26:53,359
Speaker 1: this where you're not feeling this difference. You're all you're

456
00:26:53,400 --> 00:26:56,320
Speaker 1: actually feeling is like, oh, now I have health insurance,

457
00:26:57,720 --> 00:27:00,760
Speaker 1: you know, and like this whole argument of well I

458
00:27:00,800 --> 00:27:02,800
Speaker 1: want to go to my doctor, Well yeah, you you

459
00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:07,280
Speaker 1: get to go to any doctor. Yeah. Brazil is a

460
00:27:07,280 --> 00:27:11,240
Speaker 1: great illustration of this sort of duality. They have a

461
00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:15,600
Speaker 1: actual like socialist alternative that is running for president and

462
00:27:15,680 --> 00:27:20,399
Speaker 1: Lula former president and has outside support after the current

463
00:27:20,560 --> 00:27:25,640
Speaker 1: authoritarian term of Bolsonaro and then bolson like they they

464
00:27:25,680 --> 00:27:30,600
Speaker 1: basically have the two options fascism and socialism on the ticket,

465
00:27:31,119 --> 00:27:36,280
Speaker 1: and socialism is has the vast majority of the support

466
00:27:36,359 --> 00:27:39,480
Speaker 1: according to opinion polls, which we've learned not to trust

467
00:27:39,480 --> 00:27:43,480
Speaker 1: in this country. But at least it seems like Bolsonaro

468
00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:47,520
Speaker 1: and the people who have access to the levels of

469
00:27:47,560 --> 00:27:51,520
Speaker 1: power are concerned about about the results of the opinion

470
00:27:51,560 --> 00:27:56,439
Speaker 1: polls because he has been basically claiming that the the

471
00:27:56,560 --> 00:28:01,840
Speaker 1: upcoming election on October two is going to be fraudulent.

472
00:28:02,480 --> 00:28:05,879
Speaker 1: It's like, even though there's never been a problem with

473
00:28:05,960 --> 00:28:09,639
Speaker 1: fraud in the history of Brazilian elections, and in fact,

474
00:28:09,720 --> 00:28:13,520
Speaker 1: Brazil is one of the only like massive countries that

475
00:28:13,920 --> 00:28:17,320
Speaker 1: reports the results of their voting the same day, like

476
00:28:17,359 --> 00:28:21,080
Speaker 1: they have it like that locked down. He's like, nah,

477
00:28:21,240 --> 00:28:25,360
Speaker 1: it's it's too susceptible. It's too susceptible to being rigged.

478
00:28:25,560 --> 00:28:30,040
Speaker 1: And he's like picked out this very you know, a

479
00:28:30,160 --> 00:28:35,040
Speaker 1: hypothetical tech scenario that people are like, well, I mean

480
00:28:35,080 --> 00:28:38,920
Speaker 1: that could happen, but like it's you know, there's like

481
00:28:38,920 --> 00:28:41,920
Speaker 1: a point zero zero one percent chance and like now,

482
00:28:42,280 --> 00:28:45,480
Speaker 1: like we we can guard against that and we would

483
00:28:45,480 --> 00:28:48,480
Speaker 1: know if it happened. He's like, nah, that's we can't

484
00:28:48,520 --> 00:28:53,320
Speaker 1: hold this election because because the voting machines. It's really

485
00:28:53,680 --> 00:28:59,680
Speaker 1: like he's just reading from the Trump playbook in a way. Yeah,

486
00:29:00,080 --> 00:29:03,240
Speaker 1: very very straightforward. I mean not that that's why, but

487
00:29:03,560 --> 00:29:06,400
Speaker 1: that that gave people like oh yeah, that kind of works. Okay,

488
00:29:06,480 --> 00:29:09,840
Speaker 1: this is a this is a wife. But it's kind

489
00:29:09,840 --> 00:29:11,360
Speaker 1: of one of those things too, because like you know,

490
00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:15,120
Speaker 1: they've they've before the like Workers Party was in power

491
00:29:15,160 --> 00:29:18,520
Speaker 1: in Brazil and for a while, like talk saying ship

492
00:29:18,680 --> 00:29:22,040
Speaker 1: that was even remotely close to like privatizing a public service,

493
00:29:22,040 --> 00:29:25,080
Speaker 1: people would have lost their fucking ship over the idea.

494
00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:28,400
Speaker 1: And it's just funny how like an economic crisis and

495
00:29:28,440 --> 00:29:31,040
Speaker 1: a few other things compound and like immediately kind of

496
00:29:31,360 --> 00:29:33,400
Speaker 1: people are like, oh wait, actually no, let's try this

497
00:29:33,440 --> 00:29:36,160
Speaker 1: other thing now. And it's always interesting how these sort

498
00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:39,920
Speaker 1: of like a crisis that's a corruption scandal, can all

499
00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:42,800
Speaker 1: kind of come together and people suddenly associate one with

500
00:29:42,880 --> 00:29:45,680
Speaker 1: the other and boom, now you have like the table

501
00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:48,360
Speaker 1: set for some other coon to come in and offer

502
00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:53,160
Speaker 1: something quote unquote different. Well, the past few years, I've

503
00:29:53,240 --> 00:29:59,760
Speaker 1: been seismic in showing people all the cracks and how

504
00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:05,040
Speaker 1: desperately important all of these everything that comes along with

505
00:30:05,080 --> 00:30:10,120
Speaker 1: the socialist candidate is two their present into their future,

506
00:30:10,520 --> 00:30:14,040
Speaker 1: and it does I know you can't really pay too

507
00:30:14,120 --> 00:30:16,280
Speaker 1: much attention to opinion polls, but it does feel good

508
00:30:16,720 --> 00:30:20,800
Speaker 1: to see that when there is a socialist candidate on

509
00:30:20,880 --> 00:30:25,920
Speaker 1: the fucking ticket, that the support is there. And I

510
00:30:25,960 --> 00:30:30,680
Speaker 1: think that's really encouraging in general. But it's as encouraging

511
00:30:30,840 --> 00:30:35,240
Speaker 1: as it is scary to see the two sizes coming

512
00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:39,440
Speaker 1: up against each other like this, because I mean, we

513
00:30:39,680 --> 00:30:44,080
Speaker 1: absolutely have offered a playbook, and the fact that it

514
00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:46,440
Speaker 1: got as far as it did here in America when

515
00:30:46,480 --> 00:30:49,400
Speaker 1: we're supposed to have all these checks and balances protecting

516
00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:53,880
Speaker 1: against it, makes me terrified for other places that don't

517
00:30:53,920 --> 00:30:58,200
Speaker 1: you know that are much more easily manipulated and easily

518
00:30:58,360 --> 00:31:03,080
Speaker 1: to I mean that was our first coup, you know,

519
00:31:03,240 --> 00:31:05,480
Speaker 1: and like other places, I have more history with it,

520
00:31:05,600 --> 00:31:11,080
Speaker 1: so it's it's definitely scary, not just in Brazil but everywhere. Yeah,

521
00:31:11,120 --> 00:31:14,400
Speaker 1: I mean it's like just the idea, like as as

522
00:31:14,480 --> 00:31:16,880
Speaker 1: we've laid it out, like they have a right wing

523
00:31:17,040 --> 00:31:22,440
Speaker 1: kind of militaristic dictatorial person in power, then there is

524
00:31:22,520 --> 00:31:27,720
Speaker 1: a socialist alternative that is like charging towards power that

525
00:31:27,960 --> 00:31:32,920
Speaker 1: in my mind, you know, having paid attention to history

526
00:31:33,080 --> 00:31:36,479
Speaker 1: for the past like fifty years, that reads to me

527
00:31:36,520 --> 00:31:39,560
Speaker 1: as like, oh, this is gonna this is gonna go bad.

528
00:31:39,680 --> 00:31:41,800
Speaker 1: But the way the New York Times is writing about it,

529
00:31:41,800 --> 00:31:44,880
Speaker 1: they're like Brazil's last coup in four led to a

530
00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:48,640
Speaker 1: brutal twenty one year military dictatorship. The middle class supported it,

531
00:31:48,720 --> 00:31:51,080
Speaker 1: business people supported it, the press supported it, and the

532
00:31:51,160 --> 00:31:56,000
Speaker 1: US supported it, and but well, get rid of every

533
00:31:56,040 --> 00:31:59,160
Speaker 1: other group they mentioned before it, Well none of these

534
00:31:59,160 --> 00:32:02,719
Speaker 1: players support a coup now. And I'm like, is that true,

535
00:32:03,960 --> 00:32:08,120
Speaker 1: because like it has the CIA and the US and

536
00:32:08,200 --> 00:32:12,880
Speaker 1: like all the you know, international multinational corporations, like have

537
00:32:13,040 --> 00:32:18,240
Speaker 1: they so thrown out that like sort of Domino's ideal

538
00:32:18,600 --> 00:32:22,840
Speaker 1: of like, well, if if Brazil falls, then we're we're next,

539
00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:25,360
Speaker 1: and we need to like make sure that doesn't happen.

540
00:32:25,840 --> 00:32:28,160
Speaker 1: I don't know, there's just like something about this that

541
00:32:28,360 --> 00:32:32,920
Speaker 1: like doesn't feel like we're taking the possibility of a

542
00:32:33,080 --> 00:32:39,760
Speaker 1: coup of an assassination of the socialists leadership seriously enough. Well,

543
00:32:39,760 --> 00:32:42,479
Speaker 1: I mean there's definitely there's been Yeah, there's been, right

544
00:32:42,840 --> 00:32:46,400
Speaker 1: violence against a lot of the leftist there. That's I mean,

545
00:32:46,440 --> 00:32:51,520
Speaker 1: that's that's that's happening now right there definitely in that phase,

546
00:32:51,600 --> 00:32:57,680
Speaker 1: or there's there is already terrible like partisan violence, right. Yeah,

547
00:32:57,720 --> 00:33:02,479
Speaker 1: that doesn't seem like you're very accurate. I'm agreeing with

548
00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:05,200
Speaker 1: what you're saying, especially if you look around the world,

549
00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:09,280
Speaker 1: I mean Russia, Okay, there's just people are doing it,

550
00:33:09,360 --> 00:33:12,320
Speaker 1: are doing the thing. These leaders are doing the things

551
00:33:12,400 --> 00:33:14,880
Speaker 1: that you think, yeah, but it would be bad if

552
00:33:14,880 --> 00:33:16,760
Speaker 1: they actually did it, but they're doing it. They don't care.

553
00:33:16,800 --> 00:33:18,480
Speaker 1: They're going to push it and get away with it,

554
00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:22,000
Speaker 1: you know. Or what's going to happen in China with Taiwan,

555
00:33:22,200 --> 00:33:25,560
Speaker 1: you know it's I mean, yeah, like you're just like

556
00:33:25,600 --> 00:33:29,440
Speaker 1: with Trump, right, there's there's definitely a type of politician

557
00:33:29,560 --> 00:33:32,520
Speaker 1: now that's like just like a raptor in Jurassic Park,

558
00:33:32,640 --> 00:33:37,280
Speaker 1: just testing defenses like wesnesses and they're just waiting for

559
00:33:37,360 --> 00:33:39,560
Speaker 1: the fence to be off and they're gonna just walk

560
00:33:39,680 --> 00:33:42,320
Speaker 1: right through. Like that's there's that's you can tell for

561
00:33:42,400 --> 00:33:43,840
Speaker 1: you just I mean, just like it right now, Like

562
00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:46,680
Speaker 1: even in the US with all the these secretaries of

563
00:33:46,680 --> 00:33:48,400
Speaker 1: state or the people who are going to oversee like

564
00:33:48,400 --> 00:33:51,520
Speaker 1: elections and things like that. There already we're already seeing

565
00:33:51,560 --> 00:33:54,200
Speaker 1: people who come in who are embracing like this like

566
00:33:54,280 --> 00:33:57,520
Speaker 1: dumb election fraud bullshit, and so they're starting like from

567
00:33:57,560 --> 00:34:00,120
Speaker 1: that one touch of defence, they're like, okay, so the

568
00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:02,160
Speaker 1: next one, We've got to make sure there's stooges in

569
00:34:02,200 --> 00:34:05,479
Speaker 1: these positions for the next time we touch the fence

570
00:34:05,800 --> 00:34:09,560
Speaker 1: it is not on. And yeah, it bit by bit

571
00:34:09,920 --> 00:34:13,160
Speaker 1: there it is eroding. And like some people, I mean

572
00:34:13,200 --> 00:34:15,319
Speaker 1: many people are are sort of sounding the alarm, but

573
00:34:15,320 --> 00:34:18,560
Speaker 1: I think most people are kind of unaware of like

574
00:34:18,920 --> 00:34:22,920
Speaker 1: how cynical their moves are, especially for something like you know,

575
00:34:22,960 --> 00:34:24,839
Speaker 1: when when it comes to maintaining power in the sense,

576
00:34:25,600 --> 00:34:27,880
Speaker 1: yeah fuck it, we can there's a way to do it.

577
00:34:27,920 --> 00:34:29,520
Speaker 1: If you just get these people to agree, and then

578
00:34:29,520 --> 00:34:34,000
Speaker 1: the fucking rules don't matter. Well, also, you can just

579
00:34:34,160 --> 00:34:37,360
Speaker 1: say whatever the funk you want and make it true.

580
00:34:38,280 --> 00:34:43,080
Speaker 1: You know, Donald Trump has moral his beautiful home rated,

581
00:34:43,200 --> 00:34:47,279
Speaker 1: his beautiful, beautiful home is rated, and he says, you know,

582
00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:51,680
Speaker 1: I didn't do anything wrong. But also Obama still documents

583
00:34:51,760 --> 00:34:54,680
Speaker 1: and ID classified my documents. Which one is it, buddy,

584
00:34:54,719 --> 00:34:57,200
Speaker 1: doesn't matter. He just threw verbal vomit out there. And

585
00:34:57,239 --> 00:34:59,400
Speaker 1: now pick your pick your poison of an excuse that

586
00:34:59,480 --> 00:35:02,520
Speaker 1: you can have if you're talking about this, you know,

587
00:35:02,719 --> 00:35:05,640
Speaker 1: and it doesn't matter whether or not that's true. And

588
00:35:06,200 --> 00:35:09,920
Speaker 1: there are so much going on all at once that

589
00:35:10,000 --> 00:35:13,600
Speaker 1: it's all people can do to pay their bills to

590
00:35:14,239 --> 00:35:17,840
Speaker 1: you know, make sure that their kids get to school

591
00:35:17,840 --> 00:35:23,560
Speaker 1: and they're not shocked. Like it's chaos, and so you

592
00:35:23,600 --> 00:35:26,359
Speaker 1: don't have room for most people's daily lives. They don't

593
00:35:26,400 --> 00:35:29,800
Speaker 1: have room to to separate the truth from the fiction. Yeah,

594
00:35:29,880 --> 00:35:32,040
Speaker 1: to that point of like you can say whatever you want.

595
00:35:32,040 --> 00:35:35,480
Speaker 1: A fifth of the country has now lost faith in

596
00:35:35,520 --> 00:35:38,080
Speaker 1: the election systems, even though there there is no problem

597
00:35:38,160 --> 00:35:41,440
Speaker 1: with the election systems. A fifth of Brazilian voters like

598
00:35:41,520 --> 00:35:44,640
Speaker 1: just based on the what would seem to be a

599
00:35:44,719 --> 00:35:47,959
Speaker 1: very straightforward he starts hearing that he's going to lose

600
00:35:48,000 --> 00:35:51,080
Speaker 1: the next election and suddenly is worried about fraud. Like

601
00:35:51,120 --> 00:35:54,320
Speaker 1: that seems like a very fairly straightforward thing. But suddenly

602
00:35:54,320 --> 00:35:56,279
Speaker 1: a fifth of the country has lost faith in faith

603
00:35:56,320 --> 00:35:59,000
Speaker 1: in the election system. Another thing that they brought up,

604
00:35:59,320 --> 00:36:02,000
Speaker 1: And I mean it could just be as hardcore supporters. Yeah,

605
00:36:02,040 --> 00:36:04,719
Speaker 1: it could be sure, because they're they're like, yeah, that's right,

606
00:36:04,800 --> 00:36:07,280
Speaker 1: that's bullshit. So then when you're pulled out of people,

607
00:36:07,520 --> 00:36:10,919
Speaker 1: I'm in the column of agreeing with Bulsonaro. The other

608
00:36:10,960 --> 00:36:13,680
Speaker 1: thing that they point to in that realm is that

609
00:36:14,120 --> 00:36:19,600
Speaker 1: they're like, and there's he he really loosened like gun restrictions.

610
00:36:19,640 --> 00:36:23,520
Speaker 1: So now like there are so many Brazilians who are armed,

611
00:36:24,000 --> 00:36:28,720
Speaker 1: six hundred thousand, over six hundred thousands. Could you imagine

612
00:36:28,760 --> 00:36:32,160
Speaker 1: that many people with guns in the US it is

613
00:36:32,880 --> 00:36:36,920
Speaker 1: seventy two millions. Not say it's not a danger in Brazil.

614
00:36:36,960 --> 00:36:39,520
Speaker 1: I'm just saying like it. I feel like sometimes we

615
00:36:39,560 --> 00:36:43,320
Speaker 1: don't realize how dangerous. Yeah, so wild, how many guns,

616
00:36:43,320 --> 00:36:45,759
Speaker 1: Like even if you were to ban them tomorrow, there

617
00:36:45,800 --> 00:36:49,840
Speaker 1: are so many guns people if someone like texting me

618
00:36:50,080 --> 00:36:53,160
Speaker 1: with their dad found a gun they forgot about, like

619
00:36:53,200 --> 00:36:56,240
Speaker 1: in the garage. They're like, look what I found. Forgot

620
00:36:56,239 --> 00:36:58,560
Speaker 1: about this when you're like, we live in a place

621
00:36:58,600 --> 00:37:01,520
Speaker 1: where people are like, whoops, see I have this old,

622
00:37:01,920 --> 00:37:06,279
Speaker 1: you know gun here in the garage. I forgot about that. Yeah,

623
00:37:06,640 --> 00:37:09,920
Speaker 1: when one of my relatives passed, they found a handgun

624
00:37:10,080 --> 00:37:12,080
Speaker 1: and like the process of like figuring out what to

625
00:37:12,160 --> 00:37:14,560
Speaker 1: do with it and like how to get rid of it,

626
00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:18,480
Speaker 1: and like it's crazy because it's like such a a

627
00:37:18,719 --> 00:37:22,799
Speaker 1: deadly weapon that is horrifying and like shouldn't exist, and

628
00:37:22,920 --> 00:37:24,759
Speaker 1: like you have to you know, reach out to the

629
00:37:24,760 --> 00:37:27,719
Speaker 1: police and uh, you know, do all these things. But

630
00:37:28,120 --> 00:37:31,560
Speaker 1: they are sold like you know, like their squork guns.

631
00:37:31,640 --> 00:37:36,080
Speaker 1: In the United States. There just so so easy to get,

632
00:37:36,320 --> 00:37:38,360
Speaker 1: which is what our next story is going to be about.

633
00:37:38,400 --> 00:37:50,120
Speaker 1: After we take a quick break and we're back and

634
00:37:50,200 --> 00:37:55,360
Speaker 1: we're thrilled to be joined by super producer Tricia mccourgee. Hello, Hello,

635
00:37:56,760 --> 00:37:59,000
Speaker 1: how's your phone? First of all, that's how what I

636
00:37:59,160 --> 00:38:02,000
Speaker 1: was getting. It is still with me, Jack, but it

637
00:38:02,120 --> 00:38:05,880
Speaker 1: is disintegrating. Unfortunately, there's like those weird streaks coming in

638
00:38:05,920 --> 00:38:11,600
Speaker 1: from the corners. So it's haunted. Your phone is haunted

639
00:38:11,800 --> 00:38:17,719
Speaker 1: and trying to leave this plane of existence. So Tricia

640
00:38:17,960 --> 00:38:21,840
Speaker 1: is bringing you. You're bringing us a story about how

641
00:38:22,760 --> 00:38:25,520
Speaker 1: we can use technology for some of the things that

642
00:38:26,640 --> 00:38:29,719
Speaker 1: I talked about in his show, and and also just

643
00:38:30,080 --> 00:38:33,200
Speaker 1: to add to the conversation we're just having. Yeah, thank

644
00:38:33,239 --> 00:38:36,400
Speaker 1: you for having me. And I'm just so happy to

645
00:38:36,480 --> 00:38:39,759
Speaker 1: be here and be talking about language with you. I

646
00:38:39,800 --> 00:38:42,080
Speaker 1: was listening to your podcast the past couple of weeks

647
00:38:42,080 --> 00:38:45,480
Speaker 1: and it is incredible and just like Myles said, definitely

648
00:38:45,480 --> 00:38:48,879
Speaker 1: got a little tear eyed. Um. Yeah, I was just

649
00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:51,520
Speaker 1: thinking about how in the end of the first episode,

650
00:38:51,560 --> 00:38:55,480
Speaker 1: when you're talking with your kids and they know, I mean,

651
00:38:55,560 --> 00:38:59,040
Speaker 1: obviously they're pretty young, but they know that their language

652
00:38:59,080 --> 00:39:01,480
Speaker 1: is something that's import written to them, something that's been

653
00:39:01,520 --> 00:39:05,040
Speaker 1: disappearing and been taken away and been kind of stolen

654
00:39:05,040 --> 00:39:09,120
Speaker 1: and erased. Um. And I also, I mean, I didn't

655
00:39:09,120 --> 00:39:12,399
Speaker 1: speak English until I was five. I spoke Bangla, but

656
00:39:12,640 --> 00:39:15,759
Speaker 1: I've completely forgotten so much of it. I don't know

657
00:39:15,760 --> 00:39:18,520
Speaker 1: how to read it write. So now it's like I'm

658
00:39:18,560 --> 00:39:21,360
Speaker 1: in my twenties and I'm trying to relearn and re

659
00:39:21,480 --> 00:39:24,120
Speaker 1: teach myself all these things, which is so much more

660
00:39:24,160 --> 00:39:27,799
Speaker 1: difficult than just knowing it in the first place. Yeah, well,

661
00:39:27,880 --> 00:39:30,359
Speaker 1: you know, we we talked about this kind of stuff too,

662
00:39:30,440 --> 00:39:33,480
Speaker 1: because I think if if children grow up with the language,

663
00:39:34,000 --> 00:39:36,640
Speaker 1: like they learn it really fast and then they sort

664
00:39:36,640 --> 00:39:39,200
Speaker 1: of start to level off, and if it don'ts start learning,

665
00:39:39,239 --> 00:39:42,919
Speaker 1: they learned pretty slow typically and then sort of take off.

666
00:39:43,000 --> 00:39:46,360
Speaker 1: And so we one as as we're sort of building

667
00:39:46,400 --> 00:39:49,560
Speaker 1: these environments where kids can be raised in the language,

668
00:39:49,640 --> 00:39:51,919
Speaker 1: Like right after this, I'm going to our language nest

669
00:39:51,960 --> 00:39:55,000
Speaker 1: to go work with kids, you know. So it's funny

670
00:39:55,080 --> 00:39:58,080
Speaker 1: because sometimes we're working with the kids and kids can

671
00:39:58,160 --> 00:40:01,680
Speaker 1: just be handful. Sometimes I like, these kids are gonna

672
00:40:01,719 --> 00:40:04,719
Speaker 1: kill this language because they're so tough to But I'm

673
00:40:04,719 --> 00:40:07,440
Speaker 1: just kidding. I love they're so fun They're so funny,

674
00:40:07,560 --> 00:40:09,640
Speaker 1: and you know, like my kids they make jokes all

675
00:40:09,640 --> 00:40:11,960
Speaker 1: the time, like if you spoke cling ITTs like you

676
00:40:12,200 --> 00:40:14,920
Speaker 1: catch My middle daughter, I was like, I said, and

677
00:40:15,000 --> 00:40:16,839
Speaker 1: play it. What do you know about flingott? And she says,

678
00:40:16,920 --> 00:40:19,120
Speaker 1: but you know, so of course she says that right

679
00:40:22,520 --> 00:40:27,880
Speaker 1: resonates with me. Yeld old, we all the fart jokes,

680
00:40:27,920 --> 00:40:30,439
Speaker 1: all the other things, right, And they're they're really fun.

681
00:40:30,520 --> 00:40:33,840
Speaker 1: But the other thing is, like we do have adults

682
00:40:33,840 --> 00:40:36,960
Speaker 1: who have a tremendous amount of trauma. And I think

683
00:40:36,960 --> 00:40:41,480
Speaker 1: people who sometimes come here to the United States can

684
00:40:41,520 --> 00:40:45,760
Speaker 1: relate to this. Like sometimes your parents will stop speaking

685
00:40:45,760 --> 00:40:48,200
Speaker 1: to you to protect you just so you don't have

686
00:40:48,239 --> 00:40:51,040
Speaker 1: an accent, and people don't you know, people are just mean.

687
00:40:51,480 --> 00:40:53,520
Speaker 1: And also they'll put you in ESL classes. I have

688
00:40:53,520 --> 00:40:55,839
Speaker 1: a friend he was He's Korean and they just they

689
00:40:55,880 --> 00:40:58,080
Speaker 1: put him in the s L because he's Korean. Like

690
00:40:58,280 --> 00:41:03,239
Speaker 1: he spoke English just fine. And so there's these, you know,

691
00:41:03,600 --> 00:41:06,480
Speaker 1: stigmas that are out there. But and for Native Americans,

692
00:41:06,560 --> 00:41:10,480
Speaker 1: like when when folks went to boarding school, they were tortured,

693
00:41:11,000 --> 00:41:14,160
Speaker 1: they put chemicals and kids mouths. They they had them

694
00:41:14,200 --> 00:41:18,080
Speaker 1: put their tongues on the frozen flagpoles like there, picking

695
00:41:18,160 --> 00:41:21,160
Speaker 1: them up by their hair, doing like such horrible stuff

696
00:41:21,200 --> 00:41:23,800
Speaker 1: that a lot of folks as they became parents, And

697
00:41:23,880 --> 00:41:25,360
Speaker 1: so I got to make sure that doesn't happen to

698
00:41:25,360 --> 00:41:28,320
Speaker 1: my kids. And then as you grow up, like you

699
00:41:28,320 --> 00:41:32,839
Speaker 1: you're denied this stuff that is actually essential for your survival.

700
00:41:33,239 --> 00:41:35,719
Speaker 1: So sometimes coming back to the language, it's not just

701
00:41:35,840 --> 00:41:38,680
Speaker 1: the difficulty of learning a language, but it's all this

702
00:41:38,840 --> 00:41:42,120
Speaker 1: other stuff too, as you have to heal and reconnect,

703
00:41:42,320 --> 00:41:46,000
Speaker 1: which is wonderful, but sometimes you gotta overcome a lot

704
00:41:46,080 --> 00:41:50,000
Speaker 1: of pain to do that. Mhmm. Interesting you were you

705
00:41:50,040 --> 00:41:54,000
Speaker 1: were looking into like kind of the double edged sword

706
00:41:54,040 --> 00:41:56,600
Speaker 1: that is technology when it when it comes to this

707
00:41:56,719 --> 00:41:59,920
Speaker 1: sort of stuff, right, yeah, exactly. So, as I was

708
00:42:00,040 --> 00:42:03,440
Speaker 1: talking about, I'm relearning Bangala, which is my native language,

709
00:42:03,520 --> 00:42:06,200
Speaker 1: and one thing that I've been doing recently to help

710
00:42:06,239 --> 00:42:09,880
Speaker 1: me is that I downloaded the keyboard with the Bengali alphabet,

711
00:42:10,320 --> 00:42:13,680
Speaker 1: and that just got me thinking about how I think

712
00:42:13,800 --> 00:42:16,000
Speaker 1: the fact that so many people around the world have

713
00:42:16,120 --> 00:42:20,400
Speaker 1: access to technology and the internet now it's much it's easy,

714
00:42:20,880 --> 00:42:22,840
Speaker 1: you know, to think in English or to think in

715
00:42:22,920 --> 00:42:26,080
Speaker 1: Spanish or Mandarin, when these are these really big languages

716
00:42:26,080 --> 00:42:28,359
Speaker 1: that a lot of people can use to communicate. Um.

717
00:42:28,920 --> 00:42:31,919
Speaker 1: I imagine if you're in a community without a ton

718
00:42:31,960 --> 00:42:35,239
Speaker 1: of access to the outside world constantly, it would be

719
00:42:35,400 --> 00:42:39,680
Speaker 1: much easier to just continue speaking your native language. But

720
00:42:40,160 --> 00:42:42,880
Speaker 1: just like we've talked about previously in the show, technology

721
00:42:42,960 --> 00:42:46,200
Speaker 1: has a lot of negative effects. You know, We've talked

722
00:42:46,200 --> 00:42:51,040
Speaker 1: about mental health, we've talked about misinformation, but I was

723
00:42:51,120 --> 00:42:54,840
Speaker 1: kind of just thinking how can technology be used to

724
00:42:55,080 --> 00:43:00,520
Speaker 1: preserve languages and revitalized languages? And yeah, I was before

725
00:43:00,560 --> 00:43:03,920
Speaker 1: I start kind of talking about my own research. Ny,

726
00:43:04,120 --> 00:43:08,000
Speaker 1: what are your thoughts about technology? Yeah, I think it can.

727
00:43:08,040 --> 00:43:11,200
Speaker 1: It can lend itself and in so many different ways,

728
00:43:11,239 --> 00:43:15,279
Speaker 1: Like we connect through zoom, we zoom and a lot

729
00:43:15,360 --> 00:43:18,719
Speaker 1: of our classes and we have been even before the pandemic,

730
00:43:18,800 --> 00:43:22,880
Speaker 1: Like we're using that because we have over sixty sounds.

731
00:43:22,880 --> 00:43:24,640
Speaker 1: And the thing get language and if you need to

732
00:43:24,640 --> 00:43:30,000
Speaker 1: hear the difference between and uh, you know, like we

733
00:43:30,040 --> 00:43:32,400
Speaker 1: have so many different sounds that all sound the same,

734
00:43:32,520 --> 00:43:36,120
Speaker 1: but they are distinctively different sounds. And and you might

735
00:43:36,160 --> 00:43:40,719
Speaker 1: be saying, you know, butt hole instead of saying something else, right,

736
00:43:40,800 --> 00:43:45,800
Speaker 1: Or feather and fart feather is on, like downy feathers

737
00:43:46,440 --> 00:43:51,279
Speaker 1: on and a fart is flat, and like that's such

738
00:43:51,320 --> 00:43:55,359
Speaker 1: a those are so close together, right, and so we

739
00:43:55,719 --> 00:43:58,720
Speaker 1: intentionally do you think they're intentional close together because farts

740
00:43:58,719 --> 00:44:02,120
Speaker 1: are somewhat soft featheries, well, they can kind of kind

741
00:44:02,120 --> 00:44:04,640
Speaker 1: of float out there and come down to the surface.

742
00:44:06,200 --> 00:44:09,799
Speaker 1: But and and so I kind of became obsessed with

743
00:44:09,920 --> 00:44:13,799
Speaker 1: finding really high fidelity so people can hear, because we

744
00:44:13,960 --> 00:44:16,719
Speaker 1: tried to teach through the telephone and it was very

745
00:44:16,719 --> 00:44:19,160
Speaker 1: difficult because some people couldn't even hear the end of

746
00:44:19,200 --> 00:44:23,160
Speaker 1: a word. And then when sometimes things would come out

747
00:44:23,160 --> 00:44:26,720
Speaker 1: through educational technologies, you'd be it sounds like you're listening

748
00:44:26,719 --> 00:44:30,640
Speaker 1: to some bootleg downloaded MP three, you know, just the

749
00:44:30,680 --> 00:44:34,160
Speaker 1: way it's compressing the audio. And so we found that

750
00:44:34,320 --> 00:44:37,000
Speaker 1: Zoom you could get into the options and have it

751
00:44:37,200 --> 00:44:40,960
Speaker 1: uncompressed audio, and that really helped. And then even going back,

752
00:44:41,120 --> 00:44:45,120
Speaker 1: we've had languages recorded. You know, the earliest recordings we

753
00:44:45,200 --> 00:44:47,760
Speaker 1: have are pyre the late eighteen hundreds early nineteen hundreds

754
00:44:48,080 --> 00:44:50,640
Speaker 1: and those around wax cylinders, and we had ones recorded

755
00:44:50,680 --> 00:44:53,759
Speaker 1: on wires than real the real and so we have

756
00:44:54,120 --> 00:44:58,040
Speaker 1: a lot of documentation of our language thanks to technology.

757
00:44:58,120 --> 00:45:00,640
Speaker 1: And now now the technology is in these earning apps.

758
00:45:00,680 --> 00:45:03,560
Speaker 1: Like there's a group that we work with and I'm

759
00:45:03,600 --> 00:45:07,279
Speaker 1: on the board called seven Thousand Languages that they fund

760
00:45:07,360 --> 00:45:09,879
Speaker 1: raised and they say, if we raise enough money, will

761
00:45:09,920 --> 00:45:13,160
Speaker 1: come in and develop a learning app for free. You know,

762
00:45:13,320 --> 00:45:16,320
Speaker 1: like we will not. We're trying not to charge anybody.

763
00:45:16,400 --> 00:45:19,640
Speaker 1: But then sometimes if those technologies exist, people be like, well,

764
00:45:20,480 --> 00:45:23,520
Speaker 1: we almost died but then we got Rosetta Stott. So

765
00:45:24,200 --> 00:45:26,360
Speaker 1: but then, but then people don't do the work to

766
00:45:26,480 --> 00:45:28,520
Speaker 1: learn the language and to use it, and so you

767
00:45:28,719 --> 00:45:32,040
Speaker 1: have to it has to be the human beings changing

768
00:45:32,080 --> 00:45:35,919
Speaker 1: their lives, creating that room. But I think technology can

769
00:45:36,040 --> 00:45:38,600
Speaker 1: be as long as it's just a tool in the

770
00:45:38,640 --> 00:45:41,480
Speaker 1: box and it's not it's not the car that it's

771
00:45:41,520 --> 00:45:45,480
Speaker 1: not the self driving car that takes you there. Right. Yeah.

772
00:45:45,560 --> 00:45:48,560
Speaker 1: So I was actually reading about something that sounds quite

773
00:45:48,560 --> 00:45:51,720
Speaker 1: similar to what you're talking about. It's a website called

774
00:45:51,920 --> 00:45:56,319
Speaker 1: First Voices. Have you heard of it? Yeah, it's great, Okay, Yes,

775
00:45:56,560 --> 00:45:58,600
Speaker 1: I was just going through and I I thought it

776
00:45:58,640 --> 00:46:01,839
Speaker 1: was so awesome. You can select a language and see

777
00:46:01,960 --> 00:46:06,680
Speaker 1: different words, phrases, songs, stories, and the alphabet with like

778
00:46:06,719 --> 00:46:10,640
Speaker 1: pretty high fidelity recordings and also so interesting that low

779
00:46:10,719 --> 00:46:14,080
Speaker 1: quality recordings can just take away so much from language.

780
00:46:14,120 --> 00:46:17,440
Speaker 1: That's something that I didn't really think about. And actually,

781
00:46:17,440 --> 00:46:20,319
Speaker 1: one interesting thing that I noticed on that website was

782
00:46:21,320 --> 00:46:28,160
Speaker 1: because I imagine in many realms technology is can be exploited,

783
00:46:28,440 --> 00:46:31,160
Speaker 1: and as much as we want to preserve indigenous languages,

784
00:46:31,239 --> 00:46:34,280
Speaker 1: we don't want them to be exploited. So I thought

785
00:46:34,320 --> 00:46:38,160
Speaker 1: it was this really cool feature where each tribes archive

786
00:46:38,239 --> 00:46:41,640
Speaker 1: has an administrator who can make certain recordings private so

787
00:46:41,680 --> 00:46:44,799
Speaker 1: that only members of that community can access them. So

788
00:46:44,880 --> 00:46:48,040
Speaker 1: they do this for things like prayers or sacred songs,

789
00:46:48,560 --> 00:46:50,439
Speaker 1: so that only the people who are supposed to listen

790
00:46:50,440 --> 00:46:55,600
Speaker 1: to them can but they're still preserved and documented. And

791
00:46:55,640 --> 00:46:58,160
Speaker 1: so yeah, I was wondering, like, what do you think

792
00:46:58,200 --> 00:47:01,920
Speaker 1: in terms of privacy or technology being used, you know,

793
00:47:02,000 --> 00:47:06,080
Speaker 1: can it can it harm indigenous or Native communities if

794
00:47:06,120 --> 00:47:10,320
Speaker 1: we don't know enough about that their actual priorities and interests. Well,

795
00:47:10,360 --> 00:47:13,440
Speaker 1: I think I'm always nervous about being exploited because it

796
00:47:13,520 --> 00:47:16,359
Speaker 1: just tends. It just tends to happen, right, And so

797
00:47:17,280 --> 00:47:20,560
Speaker 1: this raven shirt that was on the whole, like, they'll

798
00:47:20,600 --> 00:47:24,440
Speaker 1: probably be fifty copies of it made by you know,

799
00:47:24,920 --> 00:47:29,040
Speaker 1: non indigenous people's yet tomorrow, right, and so that that

800
00:47:29,120 --> 00:47:32,759
Speaker 1: tends to happen. But and we have these conversations too,

801
00:47:32,800 --> 00:47:36,480
Speaker 1: because there's these databases when I think it's called more Coutu,

802
00:47:36,520 --> 00:47:39,160
Speaker 1: I might have said that wrong, but where basically you

803
00:47:39,200 --> 00:47:41,800
Speaker 1: can set access levels so if you're of the clan,

804
00:47:42,239 --> 00:47:44,480
Speaker 1: you can have access to a whole bunch more information.

805
00:47:44,760 --> 00:47:48,480
Speaker 1: And we have conversations like that as well, where before

806
00:47:48,719 --> 00:47:51,319
Speaker 1: not everything was for everybody, but then you also have

807
00:47:51,400 --> 00:47:56,000
Speaker 1: a language that's really close got close to death. And

808
00:47:56,000 --> 00:47:58,160
Speaker 1: as we try to sort of push the language everywhere,

809
00:47:58,600 --> 00:48:00,719
Speaker 1: sometimes we have to have conversation it is about well

810
00:48:01,120 --> 00:48:03,319
Speaker 1: maybe it is for everybody now, but you just you

811
00:48:03,360 --> 00:48:06,840
Speaker 1: don't translate it because you've got full encryption, like Plankett

812
00:48:06,920 --> 00:48:10,879
Speaker 1: is fully encrypted. And so we had co talkers who

813
00:48:10,920 --> 00:48:13,360
Speaker 1: were in World War Two, and you know, people couldn't

814
00:48:13,560 --> 00:48:15,799
Speaker 1: of course, you couldn't understand what they're saying, right, And

815
00:48:15,840 --> 00:48:18,920
Speaker 1: so but I think as we sort of look at

816
00:48:18,920 --> 00:48:23,719
Speaker 1: those things to just store information make it accessible for me,

817
00:48:23,760 --> 00:48:25,600
Speaker 1: I always want to say, like what's going to get

818
00:48:25,640 --> 00:48:29,759
Speaker 1: people to it? And what's how can we remove any barriers?

819
00:48:29,760 --> 00:48:34,160
Speaker 1: So like we fought for a number of years at

820
00:48:34,160 --> 00:48:36,880
Speaker 1: the University of Alaska Southeast to say, can't we just

821
00:48:36,960 --> 00:48:39,040
Speaker 1: make these classes a free option, Like if you want

822
00:48:39,040 --> 00:48:40,759
Speaker 1: to learn your indigenous language, why do you got to

823
00:48:40,800 --> 00:48:43,160
Speaker 1: pay the State of Alaska? Why do you gotta pay tuition?

824
00:48:43,840 --> 00:48:46,360
Speaker 1: And so we we started supplementing that with lots of

825
00:48:46,400 --> 00:48:49,600
Speaker 1: scholarships for Indigenous people, and then we just said if

826
00:48:49,640 --> 00:48:52,120
Speaker 1: you don't want the college credit. You could just join us.

827
00:48:52,120 --> 00:48:54,560
Speaker 1: It's free, you could just check it out and just

828
00:48:54,560 --> 00:48:57,399
Speaker 1: just try and create these safe spaces for learning, these

829
00:48:57,520 --> 00:49:00,919
Speaker 1: safe spaces for using. So I think it can be good.

830
00:49:00,960 --> 00:49:04,320
Speaker 1: And then you can have maybe information that's pretty sensitive,

831
00:49:04,400 --> 00:49:08,720
Speaker 1: because if we just told you in English, like where

832
00:49:08,719 --> 00:49:11,680
Speaker 1: one of our medicine people were buried, some would go

833
00:49:11,680 --> 00:49:13,640
Speaker 1: and dig him up and steal all their stuff like that.

834
00:49:13,800 --> 00:49:16,520
Speaker 1: That's just what happens to us. Like I was in

835
00:49:16,600 --> 00:49:20,440
Speaker 1: his training and this is Banana's so as in this

836
00:49:20,560 --> 00:49:23,680
Speaker 1: training called the Native American Graves and Protection Act, And

837
00:49:23,680 --> 00:49:26,600
Speaker 1: this guy said, there's about two million Native Americans today,

838
00:49:26,680 --> 00:49:30,080
Speaker 1: this is twenty years ago. And there are more Native

839
00:49:30,080 --> 00:49:36,160
Speaker 1: American human remains in colleges and universities and museums then

840
00:49:36,200 --> 00:49:39,920
Speaker 1: there are walking the earth today. And I said, can

841
00:49:39,960 --> 00:49:42,759
Speaker 1: you repeat that, because I don't think it's not registering

842
00:49:42,880 --> 00:49:46,720
Speaker 1: in my brain, and so he did. And so for

843
00:49:46,719 --> 00:49:50,560
Speaker 1: for me, like everything that you could conceive of has

844
00:49:50,600 --> 00:49:54,400
Speaker 1: been taken from us. And so I think what's important

845
00:49:54,520 --> 00:50:01,520
Speaker 1: is technology and money and then totally reforming education. And

846
00:50:01,600 --> 00:50:04,719
Speaker 1: I think the reform that I could imagine, because like,

847
00:50:04,760 --> 00:50:07,240
Speaker 1: if you live in Alaska, you want to graduate high school,

848
00:50:07,640 --> 00:50:10,080
Speaker 1: you gotta take one semester of an Alaska native language.

849
00:50:10,320 --> 00:50:13,080
Speaker 1: You just you just have to do it. And so

850
00:50:13,239 --> 00:50:16,080
Speaker 1: for for me, I think I think the technology can

851
00:50:16,120 --> 00:50:20,200
Speaker 1: certainly help. I think sometimes we'll chase the technology and

852
00:50:20,239 --> 00:50:22,600
Speaker 1: it was sunset and then we'll lose, Like we had

853
00:50:22,600 --> 00:50:24,960
Speaker 1: a bunch of stuff that was in flash and we

854
00:50:24,960 --> 00:50:27,439
Speaker 1: can't do anything with you you can watch it now,

855
00:50:28,000 --> 00:50:30,160
Speaker 1: but you can't really do anything with it, like as

856
00:50:30,160 --> 00:50:35,360
Speaker 1: far as an interactive platform anymore. Real. Yeah, Like I

857
00:50:35,640 --> 00:50:38,680
Speaker 1: think when I was growing up and fascinated to learn

858
00:50:39,120 --> 00:50:45,320
Speaker 1: of the Native American civilizations that we're here before colonialization,

859
00:50:45,960 --> 00:50:50,120
Speaker 1: the narrative I always heard was, but Native American civilizations

860
00:50:50,120 --> 00:50:52,319
Speaker 1: were like an oral tradition, so like we don't have

861
00:50:52,360 --> 00:50:55,759
Speaker 1: any of like we don't have like their records basically,

862
00:50:56,280 --> 00:51:00,000
Speaker 1: and like the the degree to which that's not true,

863
00:51:00,239 --> 00:51:04,680
Speaker 1: and that there's an entire galaxy of like unstudied philosophy

864
00:51:04,760 --> 00:51:10,440
Speaker 1: and literature from the history of indigenous tribes that like

865
00:51:10,960 --> 00:51:15,160
Speaker 1: goes untouched or unexplored, just because like to your point

866
00:51:15,200 --> 00:51:20,320
Speaker 1: earlier about the language is not being used but being

867
00:51:20,440 --> 00:51:25,280
Speaker 1: usable and translatable, like that that feels like it should

868
00:51:25,280 --> 00:51:30,480
Speaker 1: be the growth area of the future of academia is

869
00:51:30,560 --> 00:51:36,120
Speaker 1: like there is a whole world that is totally that

870
00:51:36,120 --> 00:51:40,040
Speaker 1: that gave us the many of the best ideas of

871
00:51:40,080 --> 00:51:43,560
Speaker 1: the past five hundred years, like many of the ideas

872
00:51:43,640 --> 00:51:46,640
Speaker 1: that like America today is like we came up with this,

873
00:51:46,640 --> 00:51:50,719
Speaker 1: this is America's like grand tradition, and we came up

874
00:51:50,719 --> 00:51:54,080
Speaker 1: with democracy and like all these all the different like

875
00:51:54,160 --> 00:51:57,440
Speaker 1: the way that the checks and balances work and the

876
00:51:57,840 --> 00:52:01,160
Speaker 1: contradictions of American government is like that ship. You stole

877
00:52:01,239 --> 00:52:08,480
Speaker 1: that from indigenous and Native tribal societies and then like

878
00:52:08,840 --> 00:52:12,040
Speaker 1: just tried to bury them and tried to bury that reality.

879
00:52:12,120 --> 00:52:15,600
Speaker 1: And like the fact that it just sits there and

880
00:52:15,719 --> 00:52:19,000
Speaker 1: is unstudied is like it I get. I don't know

881
00:52:19,080 --> 00:52:23,120
Speaker 1: how academia like reconciles that other than to just ignore

882
00:52:23,160 --> 00:52:25,400
Speaker 1: the funk out of it. Yeah, yeah, I got. I

883
00:52:25,440 --> 00:52:28,359
Speaker 1: got a friend named Mike Navarro and we both work

884
00:52:28,400 --> 00:52:31,600
Speaker 1: at the university, and I always call him Dave Navarro

885
00:52:31,920 --> 00:52:38,160
Speaker 1: like in meetings, which is so I'm like, how damn

886
00:52:38,160 --> 00:52:43,239
Speaker 1: it's well you are writing a paper about this saying like, Okay,

887
00:52:43,280 --> 00:52:48,400
Speaker 1: it's not too late for science to decolonize itself because science, sciences,

888
00:52:48,400 --> 00:52:53,640
Speaker 1: and mathematics in America are super colonial by just excluding people,

889
00:52:53,719 --> 00:52:56,359
Speaker 1: and so we've got centuries where they could have been

890
00:52:56,440 --> 00:52:59,880
Speaker 1: learning so much like we've been fishing and cutting fish

891
00:53:00,320 --> 00:53:04,000
Speaker 1: right here since there were mammoths walking around, like we

892
00:53:04,000 --> 00:53:07,560
Speaker 1: were walking around with them, speaking our same language, doing

893
00:53:07,600 --> 00:53:10,600
Speaker 1: our same stuff, you know. And so with with that

894
00:53:10,840 --> 00:53:15,440
Speaker 1: unbroken chain of knowledge like that could be coming into

895
00:53:15,560 --> 00:53:18,319
Speaker 1: science in ways that doesn't threaten it. Like so I

896
00:53:18,360 --> 00:53:21,640
Speaker 1: had a dean who was not a good person to

897
00:53:21,719 --> 00:53:26,040
Speaker 1: work with and and he said, indigenous ecological knowledge is

898
00:53:26,080 --> 00:53:29,400
Speaker 1: a threat to natural sciences. And I said, what the

899
00:53:29,400 --> 00:53:32,440
Speaker 1: hell are you talking about? Like this is all additive stuff.

900
00:53:32,480 --> 00:53:34,680
Speaker 1: It's not a one thing or the other. And it's

901
00:53:34,680 --> 00:53:38,279
Speaker 1: not ecological knowledge. It's just indigenous science. Like we have

902
00:53:38,400 --> 00:53:40,800
Speaker 1: science too, we have knowledge, we have all this stuff.

903
00:53:41,360 --> 00:53:44,040
Speaker 1: But I think it freaks him out because we'll say, oh, yeah,

904
00:53:44,080 --> 00:53:45,839
Speaker 1: well this guy got turned into a salmon and he

905
00:53:45,880 --> 00:53:47,399
Speaker 1: was a salmon for a year and he came back

906
00:53:47,400 --> 00:53:50,000
Speaker 1: and that's how we know this stuff. And that's just

907
00:53:50,040 --> 00:53:55,319
Speaker 1: not acceptable for them, right. Yeah. Underscores that mindset too.

908
00:53:55,320 --> 00:53:57,480
Speaker 1: It's like, no, this is the one true thing I

909
00:53:57,520 --> 00:53:59,360
Speaker 1: don't know. Yeah, maybe you've been looking at it for

910
00:53:59,400 --> 00:54:01,319
Speaker 1: a long time. I'm either, but that's a threat to

911
00:54:01,440 --> 00:54:05,920
Speaker 1: my like supremacy ideology where I know everything, so please

912
00:54:06,200 --> 00:54:09,080
Speaker 1: Like it's it's such a transparent way to say that

913
00:54:09,120 --> 00:54:12,319
Speaker 1: it's actually a threat to that, Like, I'm sorry, how

914
00:54:12,800 --> 00:54:15,840
Speaker 1: because then it because I feel free. It had the

915
00:54:15,880 --> 00:54:21,000
Speaker 1: idea that we know everything right and we're rightfully where

916
00:54:21,040 --> 00:54:23,480
Speaker 1: we are because of that and not because we're stealing

917
00:54:23,520 --> 00:54:26,160
Speaker 1: ideas and then absconding with them back to Europe. Like

918
00:54:26,200 --> 00:54:29,240
Speaker 1: I thought of something interesting when I was in the world. Actually,

919
00:54:30,640 --> 00:54:36,280
Speaker 1: let me write this down. Yeah, I was kind of curious, um,

920
00:54:36,400 --> 00:54:39,279
Speaker 1: because there's a lot of linguistic theories out there. One

921
00:54:39,280 --> 00:54:42,680
Speaker 1: of them is that the language you speak determines how

922
00:54:42,800 --> 00:54:47,239
Speaker 1: you see the world. And I was wondering when, like,

923
00:54:48,239 --> 00:54:51,000
Speaker 1: can you tell us about some of the ways that

924
00:54:51,160 --> 00:54:55,200
Speaker 1: speaking to get changes how you perhaps see the world. Yeah,

925
00:54:55,239 --> 00:54:58,040
Speaker 1: that's a really interesting question. As when I was studying

926
00:54:58,080 --> 00:55:01,320
Speaker 1: in Hawaii, and as learning Hawaii in and us speaking

927
00:55:01,400 --> 00:55:05,600
Speaker 1: with a guy who's tomorrow from Guama seems Tin Pungey

928
00:55:06,160 --> 00:55:09,680
Speaker 1: and this friend of mine Dajoe, who's mohawk, and and

929
00:55:09,719 --> 00:55:12,040
Speaker 1: I was asked myself, when you speak your own language.

930
00:55:12,040 --> 00:55:14,200
Speaker 1: When speak a different language, are you a different person?

931
00:55:15,040 --> 00:55:16,799
Speaker 1: And we all had to think about that for a while,

932
00:55:17,000 --> 00:55:19,319
Speaker 1: and most people said, well, I'm the same person, but

933
00:55:19,440 --> 00:55:23,040
Speaker 1: I think differently. And so I noticed as I started

934
00:55:23,080 --> 00:55:24,759
Speaker 1: to learn more and more than get like if I

935
00:55:24,800 --> 00:55:27,160
Speaker 1: get really mad at a friend of mine, I would

936
00:55:27,160 --> 00:55:29,200
Speaker 1: speak to them and think it first, even if they

937
00:55:29,200 --> 00:55:31,400
Speaker 1: didn't understand it. Then I would say, I need to

938
00:55:31,400 --> 00:55:34,160
Speaker 1: ground myself in my language for a second before I

939
00:55:34,200 --> 00:55:37,080
Speaker 1: talk to you about why I'm mad that we got

940
00:55:37,160 --> 00:55:39,160
Speaker 1: in a fight while we're playing basketball, or its just

941
00:55:39,200 --> 00:55:41,960
Speaker 1: like weird things, you know. But then when you can

942
00:55:42,040 --> 00:55:46,759
Speaker 1: talk to these elders and uh, for some of them,

943
00:55:46,800 --> 00:55:49,280
Speaker 1: they're kind of on their deathbed and we're sending videos

944
00:55:49,320 --> 00:55:51,640
Speaker 1: back and forth to each other through their family members,

945
00:55:52,560 --> 00:55:55,240
Speaker 1: and like just this idea, like we can share stuff

946
00:55:55,320 --> 00:55:59,280
Speaker 1: that it might be impossible to actually translate the impact

947
00:55:59,400 --> 00:56:02,000
Speaker 1: of this off and then we can sort of there's

948
00:56:02,040 --> 00:56:04,480
Speaker 1: a whole bunch of concepts, like just concept after the

949
00:56:04,600 --> 00:56:07,719
Speaker 1: concept that I think doesn't always translate because we're not

950
00:56:07,760 --> 00:56:11,120
Speaker 1: just saying the same thing in a different language. We're

951
00:56:11,680 --> 00:56:15,400
Speaker 1: touching base with with these different realities and these different

952
00:56:15,440 --> 00:56:17,840
Speaker 1: things and then I had an uncle who was His

953
00:56:17,920 --> 00:56:22,320
Speaker 1: name was plain Paul Jackson, and his name certainly sounds

954
00:56:22,320 --> 00:56:24,560
Speaker 1: like big rabbit, but he get mad if I said,

955
00:56:24,640 --> 00:56:29,960
Speaker 1: is that big rabbit? He get doctor it sounds like

956
00:56:30,080 --> 00:56:33,760
Speaker 1: But he was a wonderful teacher, but he would get

957
00:56:33,800 --> 00:56:36,359
Speaker 1: mad if I wrote stuff down, because I would write down.

958
00:56:36,360 --> 00:56:38,719
Speaker 1: I write down everything I hear. I just carry these

959
00:56:38,760 --> 00:56:41,279
Speaker 1: notebooks and I just I would just go to the

960
00:56:41,320 --> 00:56:43,800
Speaker 1: elders and talk to them and just write down everything

961
00:56:43,920 --> 00:56:46,279
Speaker 1: and try and like put these pieces together because I

962
00:56:46,400 --> 00:56:50,200
Speaker 1: felt an urgency to learn as much as I can

963
00:56:50,239 --> 00:56:53,800
Speaker 1: so I can teach it to people. And he said,

964
00:56:53,840 --> 00:56:56,440
Speaker 1: stop writing it down. Your your brain is gonna get weak.

965
00:56:56,800 --> 00:56:59,600
Speaker 1: And then there was an an elder who was quite

966
00:56:59,680 --> 00:57:03,279
Speaker 1: cons a nation that's north of us, and she said,

967
00:57:03,320 --> 00:57:05,520
Speaker 1: you know people used Her name is Katherine Atla. She said,

968
00:57:06,120 --> 00:57:08,959
Speaker 1: people said that we were inferior because we didn't write

969
00:57:08,960 --> 00:57:11,239
Speaker 1: things down. But I could tell you a story that

970
00:57:11,280 --> 00:57:14,520
Speaker 1: takes ten days to tell, and you would have to

971
00:57:14,520 --> 00:57:17,440
Speaker 1: read that story because you can't remember that amount of

972
00:57:17,480 --> 00:57:21,280
Speaker 1: information anymore. And so as also sort of challenging those

973
00:57:21,320 --> 00:57:24,600
Speaker 1: types of things. And so I think yes, because as

974
00:57:24,640 --> 00:57:27,960
Speaker 1: you learn, cling get it. Also it just unlocks some

975
00:57:28,000 --> 00:57:30,440
Speaker 1: stuff on the land, like if a language has been

976
00:57:30,480 --> 00:57:34,760
Speaker 1: in one place for over fifteen thousand years, like it

977
00:57:34,920 --> 00:57:38,800
Speaker 1: is embedded in the landscape. Like we had a bear

978
00:57:38,840 --> 00:57:40,880
Speaker 1: that chased us off a couple of years ago while

979
00:57:40,880 --> 00:57:44,080
Speaker 1: we're smoking fish, and there are three of us there,

980
00:57:44,120 --> 00:57:46,160
Speaker 1: and we're all working on the fish without chasing the

981
00:57:46,160 --> 00:57:49,040
Speaker 1: sliw garage. And so I decided to stay and work

982
00:57:49,080 --> 00:57:51,920
Speaker 1: on the fish and just watch it and punked the

983
00:57:51,960 --> 00:57:54,560
Speaker 1: horn us in a van like I'm not gonna I'm

984
00:57:54,560 --> 00:57:57,960
Speaker 1: not going one on one with no bear. That's a

985
00:57:58,040 --> 00:58:01,680
Speaker 1: loose situation. But yeah, beat the horn and it would

986
00:58:01,720 --> 00:58:04,440
Speaker 1: take off. And then this buddy of mine, his name

987
00:58:04,520 --> 00:58:08,480
Speaker 1: was Wayne Price, is an amazing carver, and he said, well,

988
00:58:08,600 --> 00:58:10,920
Speaker 1: uncle Smidy, so if you speak clan, get to the

989
00:58:10,920 --> 00:58:12,600
Speaker 1: bears that will leave you alone. And I said, of

990
00:58:12,640 --> 00:58:15,320
Speaker 1: course I knew that, but the bear scared me and

991
00:58:15,360 --> 00:58:20,120
Speaker 1: I forgotten silly. So then not even ten minutes later,

992
00:58:20,160 --> 00:58:23,640
Speaker 1: I'm outside, you know, getting the smoke going again in

993
00:58:23,640 --> 00:58:26,520
Speaker 1: the smoke house, and that bear comes walking up and

994
00:58:26,560 --> 00:58:32,160
Speaker 1: I just said to it and shudn't get yeah na,

995
00:58:36,800 --> 00:58:39,439
Speaker 1: So he said, this is st yours. You know where

996
00:58:39,440 --> 00:58:41,520
Speaker 1: your food is. It's it's in the river. Maybe go

997
00:58:41,600 --> 00:58:44,360
Speaker 1: to the river. You know, sorry, but this is this

998
00:58:44,520 --> 00:58:47,600
Speaker 1: for us. And the way it looked at me and left,

999
00:58:48,320 --> 00:58:51,439
Speaker 1: I knew it was never coming back. And it didn't write.

1000
00:58:51,480 --> 00:58:54,640
Speaker 1: And so we have connections to things and people can

1001
00:58:54,760 --> 00:58:57,680
Speaker 1: be part of those connections like you can. You don't

1002
00:58:57,760 --> 00:59:01,760
Speaker 1: have to be a colonizing force. You have agency, you

1003
00:59:01,880 --> 00:59:04,720
Speaker 1: have decisions, but you also have to push back on

1004
00:59:04,760 --> 00:59:07,880
Speaker 1: these ideas that if we do it, something bad is

1005
00:59:07,880 --> 00:59:11,240
Speaker 1: gonna like cased to argue with these politicians. And so

1006
00:59:11,320 --> 00:59:17,080
Speaker 1: we had this wonderful, wonderful person named Elizabeth Parach thinking names.

1007
00:59:19,440 --> 00:59:22,600
Speaker 1: She was a pivotal member of an amazing team of

1008
00:59:22,640 --> 00:59:27,400
Speaker 1: folks who got an anti discrimination bill passed in seven

1009
00:59:28,360 --> 00:59:30,760
Speaker 1: And so these have signs up that said like no

1010
00:59:30,920 --> 00:59:33,720
Speaker 1: Indians allowed and no Indians and dogs allowed, Like you

1011
00:59:33,720 --> 00:59:36,680
Speaker 1: could just put that up and your businesses or whatever.

1012
00:59:37,720 --> 00:59:40,120
Speaker 1: And so the the reason they passed this lass that

1013
00:59:40,240 --> 00:59:43,360
Speaker 1: you couldn't put those signs up. And this one like

1014
00:59:43,480 --> 00:59:47,240
Speaker 1: senator who has a street named after him, he said,

1015
00:59:47,920 --> 00:59:51,480
Speaker 1: all right, he said, who are you to think you

1016
00:59:51,520 --> 00:59:54,040
Speaker 1: can come mingle with us with five thousand years of

1017
00:59:54,040 --> 00:59:57,800
Speaker 1: recorded civilization, and then they also said things like if

1018
00:59:57,840 --> 01:00:01,560
Speaker 1: you put people together, you're just gonna have more racial

1019
01:00:02,040 --> 01:00:06,200
Speaker 1: division and more more fighting basically, and then it's like

1020
01:00:06,280 --> 01:00:08,680
Speaker 1: flash forward, like seven years later, we're trying to get

1021
01:00:09,000 --> 01:00:12,200
Speaker 1: Native language is made as the co official languages of Alaska,

1022
01:00:12,240 --> 01:00:14,760
Speaker 1: which we did. One of the big arguments that this

1023
01:00:14,840 --> 01:00:16,880
Speaker 1: guy setting he said, if you try and make the

1024
01:00:16,960 --> 01:00:19,760
Speaker 1: language is equal, you're just going to have more racial

1025
01:00:19,760 --> 01:00:22,959
Speaker 1: division and fighting. And I said, seventy years you can't

1026
01:00:22,960 --> 01:00:28,320
Speaker 1: even think of a new argument that. So yeah, shows

1027
01:00:28,360 --> 01:00:34,440
Speaker 1: just yeah, how how abstract a problem racism tries to

1028
01:00:34,520 --> 01:00:36,400
Speaker 1: solve by just being like, I don't know, man, because

1029
01:00:36,440 --> 01:00:38,720
Speaker 1: if there's more equality, it's going to be bad. Look,

1030
01:00:38,760 --> 01:00:41,240
Speaker 1: I'm this is already a bad faith argument I'm trying

1031
01:00:41,240 --> 01:00:43,400
Speaker 1: to make. You don't expect me to have something better

1032
01:00:43,520 --> 01:00:45,800
Speaker 1: than that ship like where it's like I don't know,

1033
01:00:45,840 --> 01:00:48,000
Speaker 1: if people know each other and get along, they're gonna

1034
01:00:48,080 --> 01:00:54,600
Speaker 1: like fight more. Makes sense. It's one step away from

1035
01:00:54,640 --> 01:00:59,600
Speaker 1: I'm the one who's going to be oppressed. No, I

1036
01:00:59,600 --> 01:01:02,080
Speaker 1: don't know, check the books, check the receipts. You're doing

1037
01:01:02,080 --> 01:01:05,120
Speaker 1: all right, But I think this again, I really want

1038
01:01:05,160 --> 01:01:08,200
Speaker 1: to urge listeners to check this show out because it,

1039
01:01:10,280 --> 01:01:13,240
Speaker 1: like I said, I couldn't believe how touched I was

1040
01:01:13,440 --> 01:01:18,080
Speaker 1: by being completely ignorant about the topic but also realizing

1041
01:01:18,120 --> 01:01:23,800
Speaker 1: how any person who's had to move, who who's who's

1042
01:01:23,840 --> 01:01:27,560
Speaker 1: gone from one culture to another, has immigrated whatever, that

1043
01:01:27,680 --> 01:01:31,120
Speaker 1: these that it's so easy to connect to, and also

1044
01:01:31,200 --> 01:01:34,240
Speaker 1: realizing yet to your point of like, man, how it

1045
01:01:34,320 --> 01:01:37,880
Speaker 1: is an active process to be like, Okay, how can

1046
01:01:37,920 --> 01:01:42,480
Speaker 1: I sort of reverse this cycle of colonization? And it

1047
01:01:42,800 --> 01:01:44,920
Speaker 1: doesn't have to be this like monumental act. It can

1048
01:01:44,920 --> 01:01:48,200
Speaker 1: be actually very like very subtle things that you're sort

1049
01:01:48,240 --> 01:01:51,840
Speaker 1: of pinning together and you're you're, you're you're doing something

1050
01:01:51,920 --> 01:01:54,800
Speaker 1: much better. Um. So it's it was a yeah, man,

1051
01:01:54,840 --> 01:01:58,480
Speaker 1: I gotta say congress on the show because it's it's true. Absolutely, man,

1052
01:01:58,520 --> 01:02:02,160
Speaker 1: thank you so much for joining It's yeah, all right,

1053
01:02:02,480 --> 01:02:06,320
Speaker 1: that's gonna do it for this week's weekly Zeite. Guys,

1054
01:02:06,480 --> 01:02:10,280
Speaker 1: please like and review the show. If you like the show,

1055
01:02:10,880 --> 01:02:15,280
Speaker 1: uh means the world of Miles. He needs your validation, folks.

1056
01:02:15,880 --> 01:02:18,920
Speaker 1: I hope you're having a great weekend and I will

1057
01:02:18,960 --> 01:03:05,560
Speaker 1: talk to him Monday. By