WEBVTT - Dream Lover 0:00:01.800 --> 0:00:05.040 Blind Down with Jane Kramer and Michael Coffin and I'm 0:00:05.080 --> 0:00:09.240 her radio podcast. You know what I think is funny 0:00:09.240 --> 0:00:12.800 where there's been a few times where we've woken up 0:00:13.119 --> 0:00:16.720 in the morning and whatever our dream was has really 0:00:17.640 --> 0:00:24.000 dictated how we felt about the other person. Yeah, because 0:00:24.480 --> 0:00:28.560 the other day I woke up and you broke up 0:00:28.600 --> 0:00:33.320 with me and you went back to your ex girlfriend, 0:00:34.400 --> 0:00:37.800 and I was just blindsided, and I just remember it 0:00:37.880 --> 0:00:40.600 feeling so real and just like, how could he just 0:00:40.720 --> 0:00:43.800 blindside me like this? And I told Mike, I was 0:00:43.880 --> 0:00:45.680 like and the worst part of it was, I was 0:00:45.720 --> 0:00:48.400 like I had no prospects. Like I just remember going 0:00:48.400 --> 0:00:50.360 through my phone being like, you didn't even give me 0:00:50.400 --> 0:00:52.280 a heads up. I didn't have heads up to even 0:00:52.360 --> 0:00:54.720 think about who a prospect could be. But I was 0:00:54.760 --> 0:00:56.480 just like nobody. That was the thing that she was 0:00:56.480 --> 0:01:00.040 the most upset about. She was like, Okay, fine, you 0:01:00.320 --> 0:01:02.600 left me for your ext but damn give her sister 0:01:02.760 --> 0:01:04.800 heads up so I could set some things in motion. 0:01:05.440 --> 0:01:08.040 And then you're like, you'd have prospects. I was like no, 0:01:08.120 --> 0:01:09.600 And I was like I started thinking about it. I'm like, 0:01:09.640 --> 0:01:11.640 you know how we've always you know, like when you're 0:01:11.640 --> 0:01:15.760 in relationships. You're like, I could probably Texas person, but like, 0:01:16.200 --> 0:01:18.880 there was nobody in my dream, and there would be 0:01:18.880 --> 0:01:21.240 nobody now, but I'm just saying there was nobody and 0:01:21.280 --> 0:01:23.640 it was just I woke up just being like, oh 0:01:23.760 --> 0:01:25.080 I didn't like that, and then I was just like, 0:01:25.120 --> 0:01:27.080 how could you do that to me? And then this 0:01:27.160 --> 0:01:31.039 morning you woke up, yeah, where you slept with somebody 0:01:31.160 --> 0:01:35.920 that we know, and you're so unapologetic and unempathetic. You're 0:01:35.959 --> 0:01:40.360 just like, yeah, okay, whatever changed. I woke up. I 0:01:40.440 --> 0:01:43.600 was like, what the is your problem? I was like, 0:01:43.760 --> 0:01:46.240 and I was like, what's dick? I was like, what 0:01:46.319 --> 0:01:48.720 do you mean? I was like, good morning to you too. 0:01:49.040 --> 0:01:52.120 I'm like, yeah, good morning, and I was like, what 0:01:52.160 --> 0:01:54.320 did I do wrong to you last night? Bad taste 0:01:54.320 --> 0:01:57.200 in my mouth about you? This morning? Well, but then 0:01:57.200 --> 0:01:59.520 you get ever it. I just think it's funny. No, 0:01:59.600 --> 0:02:03.160 it is fun me because we didn't actually I didn't 0:02:03.160 --> 0:02:06.480 actually cheat on you and you didn't actually leave me 0:02:06.520 --> 0:02:09.840 for your ex. But the first thing you wake up, 0:02:09.880 --> 0:02:12.840 you kind of give that personal look, like vivid dreams 0:02:12.880 --> 0:02:17.000 that you have. Dreams are interesting, dreams are so interesting. 0:02:17.000 --> 0:02:19.240 But I also think dreams, which I'd love to get 0:02:19.240 --> 0:02:22.840 a dream expert on because I'm so fascinated by dreams 0:02:23.360 --> 0:02:28.960 and what it means. And you know why I was 0:02:29.680 --> 0:02:31.680 you know, why did you dream about me having an 0:02:31.680 --> 0:02:34.880 affair with someone? I think we talked to somebody early 0:02:35.000 --> 0:02:39.040 on in the show from us doing this show, someone 0:02:39.120 --> 0:02:43.320 talked about dreams and they were describing it more as 0:02:43.360 --> 0:02:46.280 like metaphork, where it's just like if you dream about 0:02:46.280 --> 0:02:49.360 a polar bearer, that means you're sad or something like that, 0:02:49.400 --> 0:02:53.079 and I just I want more more than that. I 0:02:53.080 --> 0:02:55.760 want more than just like the metaphor around it. Well, 0:02:55.800 --> 0:02:59.800 they say that whatever you're thinking about before you go 0:02:59.880 --> 0:03:03.200 to bed, that could also be what's in your dream. 0:03:03.320 --> 0:03:06.600 So were you thinking that I was having an affair? 0:03:07.960 --> 0:03:12.160 See I completely personally, I completely disagree with that in 0:03:12.200 --> 0:03:16.000 my in my experience, yeah, where it's like things that 0:03:16.040 --> 0:03:19.560 I'll think about it before bed, I very seldom dream about. Well, 0:03:19.600 --> 0:03:22.359 we had this dream book growing up and it was 0:03:22.400 --> 0:03:24.720 a gift I think that my uncle Ray gave to 0:03:24.800 --> 0:03:29.160 my mom and it was all about dreams. And it's 0:03:29.280 --> 0:03:31.360 crazy because you would look in this dream book and 0:03:31.520 --> 0:03:33.200 even to this day, I think my mom still has it, 0:03:33.240 --> 0:03:35.200 but it's like torn to shreds and pieces missing, because 0:03:35.200 --> 0:03:37.880 it's just this book is like this ancient witch book, right, 0:03:38.600 --> 0:03:40.600 and if you were to dream about like a shark, 0:03:41.040 --> 0:03:42.520 you go in there and you look at this dream 0:03:42.520 --> 0:03:45.040 book and it's like, oh, yeah, I am kind of 0:03:45.040 --> 0:03:47.200 stressed out about money right now or whatever, like the 0:03:47.240 --> 0:03:49.840 shark represents you know, or you feel like trapped or 0:03:49.880 --> 0:03:52.880 you feel interesting, I know. And so then you start 0:03:52.920 --> 0:03:55.800 to introspectively look at it and you're like, oh, yeah, 0:03:56.160 --> 0:03:59.320 kind of. But then it's like there's that also shape 0:03:59.360 --> 0:04:02.720 your like steer you in a direction on your thought 0:04:02.720 --> 0:04:06.360 process maybe or maybe it's something good, like something's coming. 0:04:06.680 --> 0:04:09.600 But then Mike has like a you know, one of 0:04:09.640 --> 0:04:13.040 your video game games, or like an alien dream, which 0:04:13.120 --> 0:04:16.040 if I could take my dreams and the next day 0:04:16.120 --> 0:04:20.520 be able to jot down everything in detail as vivid 0:04:20.560 --> 0:04:23.440 as it wasn't my dream, I would be the next 0:04:23.480 --> 0:04:27.400 Michael Bay. Like my dreams would be uh them as 0:04:27.440 --> 0:04:29.400 movies would be amazing. I feel like you and Eastern 0:04:29.440 --> 0:04:34.320 would have like the most like Marvel packed word dreams. Easton, 0:04:34.960 --> 0:04:37.440 do you agree with this if our dreams could become movies, 0:04:37.760 --> 0:04:39.680 I don't know that. Like I almost feel like Eastern's 0:04:39.760 --> 0:04:42.720 like dreams are not what we think they're Eastern. My 0:04:42.800 --> 0:04:46.680 dreams are not exciting at all. They're they're not like 0:04:46.920 --> 0:04:49.240 it's like I have to like build a go cart 0:04:49.279 --> 0:04:53.560 with my ex landlord. Like that's like the dream very disappointing. 0:04:53.680 --> 0:04:55.960 That mean storry to let you down, to Mike, but 0:04:56.600 --> 0:05:00.560 that is disappointing, you know. It's anxiety that nfs in 0:05:00.600 --> 0:05:03.400 really disappointing ways. Like my wife has like crazy dreams 0:05:03.440 --> 0:05:05.680 where she's like being chased by a serial killer or 0:05:05.760 --> 0:05:09.719 like something so insane. And then mine are like always 0:05:09.760 --> 0:05:11.720 like I had a dream that I left my keys 0:05:11.760 --> 0:05:13.159 at home and I had to go get them and 0:05:13.200 --> 0:05:15.640 I was waiting for work, and it's like I had 0:05:15.680 --> 0:05:18.200 come on these dreams. You're like, come on, You're like, 0:05:18.240 --> 0:05:20.640 I'm the coolest, I have the greatest ideas, Like give 0:05:20.680 --> 0:05:25.200 me some Marvel, But no, I have to reoccurring dreams, 0:05:25.240 --> 0:05:30.040 like the one is that I don't I didn't graduate 0:05:30.120 --> 0:05:33.520 high school. That's one reoccurring dream. And I always wake 0:05:33.600 --> 0:05:36.839 up feeling just like a failure. And but it's like 0:05:36.880 --> 0:05:38.680 a constant thing where I'm like, oh my god, I'm 0:05:38.680 --> 0:05:41.040 not going to graduate. I'm not going to graduate like crap. 0:05:41.440 --> 0:05:43.800 So that's one, and then the second one is whenever 0:05:43.839 --> 0:05:46.839 I'm sick. And I've had this since I was like 0:05:46.960 --> 0:05:50.159 Jolie's age. I can remember whenever I'm sick, I have 0:05:50.279 --> 0:05:52.800 I have like a dream of like a trailer or 0:05:52.920 --> 0:05:56.360 like one of those tractors like crushing me terrif. I know, 0:05:57.120 --> 0:06:01.279 oh my god, this is this is a different thing, 0:06:01.360 --> 0:06:04.240 but it's it's along the thought of dreams, but it's 0:06:04.279 --> 0:06:08.960 more of like a day dream where I'll almost like 0:06:09.240 --> 0:06:17.320 relive a situation but the opposite outcome occurred. We're like, man, 0:06:17.400 --> 0:06:20.359 say I had a really good football game, right, and 0:06:20.400 --> 0:06:23.400 I'm like reflecting back on it, I'm like, oh, what 0:06:23.520 --> 0:06:26.480 if I had dropped that pass? What if I had 0:06:26.520 --> 0:06:30.520 done this? And it's like I'll take my back myself 0:06:30.520 --> 0:06:34.480 back through the memory with the opposite outcome, and then 0:06:34.520 --> 0:06:36.920 I'll like start feeling like the guilt or shamer on him. 0:06:36.960 --> 0:06:39.240 I don't have sucked, but like, no, no, it didn't happen. 0:06:39.279 --> 0:06:46.120 Didn't happen. Yeah, do you ever do that? Cool? Just me? 0:06:46.680 --> 0:06:49.200 I do that all the time, Mike, I start, yeah, 0:06:49.920 --> 0:06:52.760 I do, like I had a really bad relationship like 0:06:52.800 --> 0:06:55.600 ten years ago that like really messed me up, and 0:06:55.680 --> 0:06:58.640 I always think about, like I could, like what if 0:06:58.640 --> 0:07:02.440 I had gotten her pregnant or like gotten married to her, 0:07:03.200 --> 0:07:04.880 Like I was thinking about that and how different my 0:07:04.920 --> 0:07:08.120 life would be now, because like I was just making 0:07:08.160 --> 0:07:10.640 some horrible decisions when I was with this person, and like, 0:07:11.760 --> 0:07:13.280 I don't know, I think about that all the time, 0:07:13.320 --> 0:07:15.200 and then then I feel like, oh, I'm glad I 0:07:15.200 --> 0:07:17.920 didn't do all that stuff, Like I'm right because I'm 0:07:17.920 --> 0:07:20.760 happy with the decisions I did make. It's like when 0:07:20.800 --> 0:07:22.720 you press on a tooth that kind of hurts, you know, 0:07:22.920 --> 0:07:26.320 like it's like a controlled kind of pain because I 0:07:26.360 --> 0:07:28.160 don't know if that makes sense, No, that makes sense, 0:07:28.680 --> 0:07:31.520 but that's what it feels like. M Yeah, I don't know. 0:07:31.560 --> 0:07:35.480 I don't know if I could, if I could, if 0:07:35.480 --> 0:07:37.320 I do that, like that would just I feel like 0:07:37.320 --> 0:07:41.040 that cosm anxiety, like the what IF's and that's like, 0:07:41.080 --> 0:07:43.920 all right, I went through that. That sucks or that stunk, 0:07:44.120 --> 0:07:46.640 you know, But if not or if I wouldn't have 0:07:46.640 --> 0:07:49.880 done this, and I would, it's like I I mean, yeah, definitely, 0:07:49.880 --> 0:07:52.480 it definitely opens up a rabbit hole that you can 0:07:52.480 --> 0:07:54.960 start going down. It's but yet it is what if 0:07:55.000 --> 0:08:00.720 trained And for me it's primarily been sport. It's related, 0:08:01.560 --> 0:08:04.600 but there's also been times where, like you Easton, where 0:08:04.600 --> 0:08:07.720 I'm like, well, man, what if what if I never 0:08:07.760 --> 0:08:10.640 met Janna? You know what I mean? Like, I can't 0:08:10.680 --> 0:08:12.840 imagine what my life would be like. It wouldn't be 0:08:12.960 --> 0:08:16.800 nearly what it is. And what if this didn't happen? 0:08:16.800 --> 0:08:19.400 What if that didn't happen. It's just, yeah, it's crazy. 0:08:19.920 --> 0:08:22.600 So that's what those are. It's so interesting that those 0:08:22.600 --> 0:08:24.920 are the because I don't I don't know if. I 0:08:24.960 --> 0:08:26.720 wonder if women, Becky, do you do that? Because I 0:08:26.760 --> 0:08:28.240 don't feel like I do the well what if I 0:08:28.240 --> 0:08:30.120 didn't make Mike? Where would I be? It's almost just 0:08:31.320 --> 0:08:36.120 I don't know, um no, because that would cause me anxiety. 0:08:36.360 --> 0:08:39.280 I would have an actual panic attack. The what if 0:08:39.360 --> 0:08:44.280 mindset would like be paralyzing for me. Yeah, go down 0:08:44.320 --> 0:08:46.959 that path, which is so interesting. I wonder if it's 0:08:46.960 --> 0:08:50.760 like like mostly guys do that, then that is interesting 0:08:51.320 --> 0:08:52.839 I think for me. I think we should have a 0:08:52.920 --> 0:08:57.480 dream expert, I think and they could probably touch on 0:08:57.520 --> 0:09:00.560 this topic because it is kind of a similar relation 0:09:00.640 --> 0:09:03.840 between dreams and like this what if thought process, and 0:09:03.880 --> 0:09:07.120 I think for me at least personally, it's my way 0:09:07.160 --> 0:09:11.640 of reflecting and being able to be, you know, express 0:09:11.679 --> 0:09:14.480 gratitude for the moment to be like Okay, it's like 0:09:14.480 --> 0:09:16.800 I'm gonna take myself down this bad path of where 0:09:16.840 --> 0:09:19.400 things could be, but then it brings me back to 0:09:19.400 --> 0:09:21.520 where I'm am today and be like, man, thank god 0:09:21.559 --> 0:09:23.760 I am where I am today, you know what I mean, 0:09:23.840 --> 0:09:28.880 Like it's yeah, yeah, I mean I'm starting thinking like, well, 0:09:28.920 --> 0:09:31.120 what if I didn't where I go. I'm like, okay, 0:09:31.120 --> 0:09:34.160 what if I didn't meet my crazy X in the 0:09:34.160 --> 0:09:35.719 baby beginning? And then what if I didn't meet you? Well, 0:09:35.720 --> 0:09:37.480 I'm like, oh my god, then I wouldn't have Jolian Jason. 0:09:37.520 --> 0:09:38.760 Then I started to get Then I start to get 0:09:38.800 --> 0:09:41.240 anxiety because I'm like no, no, no no, no, Like I 0:09:41.240 --> 0:09:43.160 can't imagine like how how would there not be a 0:09:43.160 --> 0:09:44.920 world without them? So it's like I just go like 0:09:45.000 --> 0:09:47.400 kind of Becky's saying, like straight to just like anxiety. 0:09:47.440 --> 0:09:49.080 I don't like that what if? Now? That what if 0:09:49.080 --> 0:09:50.680 that I do do is like when I'm on an airplane, 0:09:50.679 --> 0:09:52.360 I'm like, oh my god, what if I die? That's 0:09:52.360 --> 0:09:53.880 the what if game I play all the time, which 0:09:53.880 --> 0:09:57.679 is like so bad. Like, so there we go, that's 0:09:57.679 --> 0:09:59.160 what women do. Then the women are doing like what 0:09:59.200 --> 0:10:01.200 if I die? Like I'm I'm always like, am I 0:10:01.200 --> 0:10:02.719 gonna die? I'm not gonna die? Well what if I 0:10:02.760 --> 0:10:06.800 do die? Like because I'm like, oh God, like my kids, 0:10:06.800 --> 0:10:09.120 like you know, they're young. I hope they remember me. 0:10:09.200 --> 0:10:11.480 Like I'm already writing letters like if I die, you know. 0:10:11.600 --> 0:10:16.920 So it's like it's bad. So that's that's what women do. 0:10:17.040 --> 0:10:18.720 We go a little bit more morbid, and you go like, 0:10:18.840 --> 0:10:20.440 you know, what if I didn't meet this, you know, 0:10:20.840 --> 0:10:25.000 Chick fil a drive through, it wouldn't hit the girl 0:10:25.040 --> 0:10:27.200 in front of me. By the way, Michael is banned 0:10:27.280 --> 0:10:29.480 from drive through is because not only did he scrape 0:10:29.520 --> 0:10:31.800 his car and then McDonald's drive through and he then 0:10:31.880 --> 0:10:33.880 just hit someone at a Chick fil a drive through. 0:10:33.880 --> 0:10:36.760 I was like, you are a banned from eating bad food. 0:10:37.080 --> 0:10:39.920 Even the chick Fila is good. But anyways, I don't 0:10:39.920 --> 0:10:47.040 have a good track record with Blood Sugar. What's going on? Well, 0:10:47.080 --> 0:10:49.200 the most recent one I blame on Jolie, but it's okay. 0:10:49.280 --> 0:10:51.400 How do you blame our daughter. She was asking me 0:10:51.520 --> 0:10:53.920 for something. I turned around the helper and what your 0:10:53.920 --> 0:10:56.000 foot just goes on thing? And my foot like slipped 0:10:56.000 --> 0:10:58.120 because I was like pushing on the break till you 0:10:58.160 --> 0:11:00.360 reached back towards her in my foot slip and went 0:11:00.400 --> 0:11:02.480 forward and loved tap this car in front of me. No, no, 0:11:02.559 --> 0:11:04.640 he didn't love tap. And here's the funny thing. He's like, 0:11:06.200 --> 0:11:09.920 this is this is a very funny story because there's 0:11:10.000 --> 0:11:13.560 actually a comedy skit by Sebastian Maniscalco and he talks 0:11:13.600 --> 0:11:17.280 about basically the love tap the scratch, and you know, 0:11:17.320 --> 0:11:19.720 his wife's like, it's not it's just just a little scrape. 0:11:19.760 --> 0:11:21.760 And he's like, I'm really curious to see what my 0:11:21.800 --> 0:11:24.400 wife thinks is a little scrape. And he goes out 0:11:24.400 --> 0:11:26.520 there and he's like like you know, and he's like 0:11:26.559 --> 0:11:28.640 trying to hold back his Italian anger, and he's like 0:11:28.720 --> 0:11:30.960 the entire he's like the entire like door has to 0:11:30.960 --> 0:11:33.040 be replaced, Like it's not just a little like you 0:11:33.040 --> 0:11:35.720 can't buff it out. So Mike's like saying, it's you know, 0:11:35.720 --> 0:11:37.600 it's gonna be like maybe like a hundred dollars, like 0:11:37.720 --> 0:11:39.640 just a little like a little scrape. You could like 0:11:39.840 --> 0:11:42.720 use a pen to wipe it out. So I look 0:11:42.760 --> 0:11:44.920 at his phone this morning or when he woke up 0:11:44.920 --> 0:11:46.360 and I was like, hey, you got a text message. 0:11:46.360 --> 0:11:48.559 It says maybe Jennifer. I was like, who's maybe Jennifer? 0:11:49.040 --> 0:11:50.839 And he's like, oh, that's the lady that I hit. 0:11:51.200 --> 0:11:52.800 So I was like, oh, I want to see the pictures. 0:11:52.880 --> 0:11:54.480 And so I opened it up. I was like, Babe, 0:11:54.920 --> 0:11:57.640 that's not a scratch. I was like, that's like her 0:11:57.640 --> 0:12:02.640 whole back bumper was a scratch across the whole back bumper. 0:12:06.400 --> 0:12:09.920 Oh God. Okay, anyways, we're let's take a break, but 0:12:10.000 --> 0:12:13.439 then we have a really really really awesome guest um 0:12:13.520 --> 0:12:16.280 two guests coming on, Nate and Kaylee Clemp. So let's 0:12:16.280 --> 0:12:26.400 take a break and then we'll bring them on. We're 0:12:26.400 --> 0:12:28.720 going to be wearing masks for a while. It's important 0:12:28.760 --> 0:12:31.960 to have the right mask protect yourself and others. 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I'm super excited 0:13:03.160 --> 0:13:05.439 to have these next two guests on our show to 0:13:05.559 --> 0:13:09.800 husband and wife Nate and Kaylee clemp Um, and I'm 0:13:09.800 --> 0:13:12.000 just gonna let them kind of give their elevator pitch 0:13:12.040 --> 0:13:16.120 of themselves because they're both extremely accomplished human beings and 0:13:16.120 --> 0:13:18.960 professionals in their world. So let's have them on. And 0:13:18.960 --> 0:13:20.839 I will say they have a book out right now 0:13:20.880 --> 0:13:23.400 called The Eight Marriage, a New Model for a Happier, 0:13:23.679 --> 0:13:27.000 Stronger Relationship on Amazon. So excited to dive in on 0:13:27.040 --> 0:13:33.480 that as well. So here they come. Hello, Hello, Thank 0:13:33.520 --> 0:13:35.120 you guys so much for coming on Wine Down. We 0:13:35.160 --> 0:13:39.199 really appreciate it. Obviously our podcast is very relationship focused. 0:13:39.240 --> 0:13:42.280 So um, when I you know, started to just like 0:13:42.320 --> 0:13:45.080 read the breakdown everything, I was like, oh my goodness, like, hey, 0:13:45.080 --> 0:13:47.400 I'm ordering your book right now, and be like I'm 0:13:47.400 --> 0:13:50.320 just super excited to dive in. So yeah, So we 0:13:50.360 --> 0:13:52.360 gave our our listeners a little bit of intro on 0:13:52.440 --> 0:13:55.119 you guys, but you know, you guys are such accomplished 0:13:55.120 --> 0:13:56.840 people in your own right. So I want you guys 0:13:56.840 --> 0:13:59.480 to kind of give us the elevator pitch of yourselves 0:13:59.520 --> 0:14:01.160 to our list and marriage because you can say it 0:14:01.200 --> 0:14:03.160 better than any of us can. Well, my name is 0:14:03.240 --> 0:14:06.800 Nate Clemp. I'm a founding partner at Mindful, co author 0:14:06.840 --> 0:14:09.640 of the AD eighty marriage with Kaylee. I was a 0:14:09.679 --> 0:14:13.400 former philosophy professor till I decided to get out of 0:14:13.440 --> 0:14:16.319 the activity I could gave me a business and become 0:14:16.360 --> 0:14:20.120 a writer on mindfulness and marriage. And I'm Kayley Clemp. 0:14:20.240 --> 0:14:23.520 So co authored a eight marriage here with Nate. And 0:14:23.640 --> 0:14:27.640 I'm also a leadership executive coach and worked with executive 0:14:27.680 --> 0:14:30.920 teams and individuals looking at personality and all the tools 0:14:30.920 --> 0:14:34.360 of conscious leadership. You know, it's it's so cool. Sorry, honey, 0:14:34.600 --> 0:14:36.880 I was just gonna know. You go ahead, Oh, you 0:14:36.920 --> 0:14:41.880 go ahead. We see we're such We're such a happy marriage. 0:14:43.320 --> 0:14:48.000 Radical generosity is everywhere right now, right Um, I'll go ahead, honey. 0:14:48.160 --> 0:14:49.400 And what I was gonna say when I was reading 0:14:49.440 --> 0:14:52.360 the breakdown, you know, I love the combination of both 0:14:52.360 --> 0:14:54.720 of you because you know, with your background Nate in 0:14:54.760 --> 0:14:57.000 the in the mindfulness is such a big thing nowadays, 0:14:57.080 --> 0:14:59.480 especially with mental health and just meditation, those kind of 0:14:59.480 --> 0:15:03.000 practices really getting some momentum. And then Kayley, with everything 0:15:03.080 --> 0:15:04.920 that you do and kind of helping you know, the 0:15:04.960 --> 0:15:08.000 executive leadership and and the angiogram stuff that you're a 0:15:08.000 --> 0:15:10.400 specialist in that I read about is just so fascinating 0:15:10.400 --> 0:15:12.760 because it's like, you guys are like the perfect blend 0:15:12.800 --> 0:15:15.200 of like what you want someone to like read a 0:15:15.200 --> 0:15:18.400 book from, like literally, so it's exciting to talk to 0:15:18.440 --> 0:15:20.160 you guys about that and that you have a book 0:15:20.560 --> 0:15:24.360 around that. So because of that, are you guys, I mean, 0:15:24.560 --> 0:15:26.600 please tell us that you guys still have arguments and 0:15:26.600 --> 0:15:30.720 you still fight. Yeah, for sure, definitely. And uh, well 0:15:30.840 --> 0:15:34.280 especially because this week actually today is launch day for 0:15:34.360 --> 0:15:38.240 this book. So we have been just like in this 0:15:38.440 --> 0:15:40.600 insane you know, you guys have a look you know 0:15:40.600 --> 0:15:44.240 what it's like that pre launch period. And simultaneously our 0:15:44.320 --> 0:15:48.440 daughter broke her risk. There was like a woodpecker outside 0:15:48.480 --> 0:15:51.240 of our house trilli into our wall the middle night. Yeah, 0:15:51.280 --> 0:15:54.440 so so we've had this like perfect storm which is 0:15:54.960 --> 0:15:58.520 led to just you know, some healthy arguments exactly all 0:15:58.880 --> 0:16:02.840 the same, like, oh that's what happening is that really 0:16:02.880 --> 0:16:04.880 your truth right now, because I see it different way. 0:16:04.920 --> 0:16:06.880 How do you guys handle a conflict when you get 0:16:06.920 --> 0:16:10.160 in those situations. So one of the things that we 0:16:10.400 --> 0:16:13.720 wrote about in the book that we definitely advocate for 0:16:13.840 --> 0:16:18.520 and also practice is called reveal and request, And basically 0:16:18.560 --> 0:16:22.280 the whole idea behind it is reveal your inner experience, 0:16:22.480 --> 0:16:24.120 this is what's going on for me, and then to 0:16:24.160 --> 0:16:27.240 make a request of your partner. And when we're in 0:16:27.280 --> 0:16:30.200 those conflict moments, I think it's really an opportunity just 0:16:30.280 --> 0:16:33.040 to be known because a lot of times I'm actually 0:16:33.040 --> 0:16:34.880 surprised that when I say something where I'm like, hey, 0:16:34.880 --> 0:16:36.800 this is what's going on for me, and I would 0:16:36.800 --> 0:16:38.800 love it if you did this instead, a lot of 0:16:38.800 --> 0:16:40.840 times says surprises like oh my gosh, I have no idea, 0:16:40.880 --> 0:16:48.160 I'm really sorry, and it's it's so fast. Why yeah, 0:16:48.400 --> 0:16:51.040 and so's a great question. Yeah. Well, so I think 0:16:51.080 --> 0:16:53.920 it starts with the precursor to a d which is 0:16:53.960 --> 0:16:58.480 what we think of this fifty marriage fairness. It's this 0:16:58.560 --> 0:17:01.320 idea that we're all really familiar, you're with that you 0:17:01.320 --> 0:17:04.399 know the way to a perfect marriage in this modern 0:17:04.440 --> 0:17:06.399 age where we're both equals and we want to be 0:17:06.480 --> 0:17:10.520 in love is to just make everything perfectly fair. And 0:17:10.600 --> 0:17:13.639 we tried this, man, did we try this for like 0:17:14.440 --> 0:17:18.119 a good decade, just like trying to make everything fair, 0:17:18.240 --> 0:17:21.880 trying to keep score. And it was like a total disaster. 0:17:21.960 --> 0:17:24.240 I mean it almost ended our marriage, you know, it 0:17:24.320 --> 0:17:26.720 was It was actually very painful. We can joke about it, 0:17:26.760 --> 0:17:30.000 but like the fights and the conflict and the feeling 0:17:30.000 --> 0:17:33.840 of resentment, and so, you know, when we interviewed couples 0:17:33.880 --> 0:17:37.119 for this book, we found that this really isn't working 0:17:37.160 --> 0:17:39.480 for anybody, and that there are a couple of reasons 0:17:39.480 --> 0:17:41.720 for that. One. You know, when you're trying to keep 0:17:41.760 --> 0:17:44.880 score all the time, it's the perfect setup for all 0:17:44.880 --> 0:17:48.760 sorts of resentment. Um. But also we ran into all 0:17:48.800 --> 0:17:53.199 this interesting research and psychology while writing this book, showing 0:17:53.240 --> 0:17:58.240 that we consistently overestimate our own contributions to the marriage 0:17:58.600 --> 0:18:02.159 and underestimate those of our partners. So basically, there are 0:18:02.200 --> 0:18:06.040 all these cognitive biases at work, making it almost impossible 0:18:06.440 --> 0:18:09.440 to decide what is or isn't fair. So so I'd 0:18:09.440 --> 0:18:11.879 say that's really the starting point, is that we're working 0:18:11.920 --> 0:18:15.679 against that background. So I mean from there, where we 0:18:15.720 --> 0:18:19.360 go A d eight is basically saying if you're striving 0:18:19.400 --> 0:18:22.480 to contribute more than your fair share. The reason that 0:18:22.480 --> 0:18:25.200 that works better is because it gets contagious. So when 0:18:25.320 --> 0:18:28.920 both people are really trying to do more than just half, 0:18:29.440 --> 0:18:33.879 then you get a spirit of generosity, of contribution, of appreciation. 0:18:34.520 --> 0:18:37.119 But it's interesting we stopped at a D eighty. We 0:18:37.240 --> 0:18:40.080 didn't say, like, go a hundred a hundred because we 0:18:40.200 --> 0:18:43.960 also also think it's really important for each person to 0:18:44.000 --> 0:18:46.600 have their own purpose and some of their own things 0:18:46.640 --> 0:18:49.960 that are specific to them. And so there's a way 0:18:50.000 --> 0:18:52.600 that you go all out a D eight, try to 0:18:52.640 --> 0:18:54.560 overshoe the name with your partner, but you have to 0:18:54.640 --> 0:18:58.159 keep your own purpose. I love that because when you 0:18:58.160 --> 0:19:00.280 guys are talking about it, I think of you know, 0:19:00.320 --> 0:19:04.080 I feel like you know people today or maybe they 0:19:04.119 --> 0:19:05.720 will call it a generational thing if they want to 0:19:05.760 --> 0:19:07.919 say millennials or whatever, where people have a more of 0:19:07.920 --> 0:19:10.000 a tendency to say, well, that's not my job. Why 0:19:10.040 --> 0:19:11.879 am I going to do that? Right? And it's like 0:19:12.400 --> 0:19:14.560 because I asked you to or because it needs to 0:19:14.600 --> 0:19:16.479 get done, you know. And it's one of those things 0:19:16.520 --> 0:19:20.280 where I think Janna and I've fallen into a healthy 0:19:20.400 --> 0:19:22.119 version of that where it's like, yeah, we have the 0:19:22.160 --> 0:19:25.080 things kind of like you're saying, Kayley, that we primarily 0:19:25.119 --> 0:19:28.240 do ourselves, but then there's things that overlap. So we've 0:19:28.240 --> 0:19:30.440 been maybe living some of the eight eighty without even knowing. 0:19:31.800 --> 0:19:34.680 I bet you have. And it's it's interesting actually, because 0:19:34.680 --> 0:19:37.520 I think what you're describing is when you actually get 0:19:37.560 --> 0:19:40.919 clear on some of those roles, it frees up a 0:19:40.920 --> 0:19:43.280 lot of energy. So when you know, hey, these are 0:19:43.280 --> 0:19:44.840 the things that I do and these are the things 0:19:44.840 --> 0:19:47.679 that Jannah does, it actually it relieves a lot of 0:19:47.760 --> 0:19:50.520 tension where you don't have to fight about each and 0:19:50.520 --> 0:19:52.760 every chore or each and everything that you go, oh yeah, 0:19:53.280 --> 0:19:54.800 I take those. You take those, and there are a 0:19:54.800 --> 0:19:57.119 couple where we want to have a conversation. I totally 0:19:57.160 --> 0:20:02.000 agree with you. And for me, that's where resentment goes away, 0:20:02.119 --> 0:20:04.760 because when when when it's just like I'm like, oh, 0:20:04.880 --> 0:20:06.040 I have to do this too, and I have to 0:20:06.080 --> 0:20:07.560 do this too, and I'm like, oh what is he doing? 0:20:07.600 --> 0:20:10.600 And it's like resentment just build so much that then 0:20:11.080 --> 0:20:13.360 I start screaming at him about a lamp shade. There's 0:20:13.400 --> 0:20:15.280 nothing to do about the lamp shade has everything to 0:20:15.280 --> 0:20:18.440 do about this list of resentment that's been building. So yeah, 0:20:18.480 --> 0:20:20.879 once we started doing the roles and be like, okay, 0:20:21.000 --> 0:20:23.800 you know this is what the roles are, this is 0:20:23.840 --> 0:20:25.920 what it looks like. Are we happy? Cool? And it's 0:20:25.920 --> 0:20:29.400 been really good. I feel like we've had less conflict 0:20:29.560 --> 0:20:32.879 because we've we've taken those on and then we're not 0:20:32.920 --> 0:20:36.560