Speaker 1: From the heart of where innovation, money and power Colli
Speaker 1: in Silicon Vallet and beyond. This is Bloomberg Technology with
Speaker 1: Emily Jay i'memerly check in San Francisco, and this is
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Technology. Coming up in the next hour. The plot thickens.
Speaker 1: Twitter adds Elon Musk to its board just a day
Speaker 1: after must disclose he is now Twitter's largest shareholder. Turns
Speaker 1: out former CEO Jack Dorsey and new CEO Paragua Wall
Speaker 1: are in on it. What does it all mean for Twitter,
Speaker 1: free speech, and the world's most public town square. We
Speaker 1: will uncover this story from all angles through the hour,
Speaker 1: plus what's it like to work on a board with
Speaker 1: Elon Musk? Anyway. We'll be joined by former Tesla board
Speaker 1: member Steve Wesley, who will share the good, the that,
Speaker 1: and the unexpected that comes with having one of the
Speaker 1: world's most controversial innovators in the room. And he has
Speaker 1: fashioned himself as a free speech defender. But will must
Speaker 1: be good or bad for free speech? Could this open
Speaker 1: the door to former President Trump being unbanned from the platform?
Speaker 1: Will debate, But first, Twitter share still soaring on all
Speaker 1: of this, up another two percent after spike Monday bloom
Speaker 1: works at Ludlow here to break it all down, and
Speaker 1: we can debate the long term impacts of this, but
Speaker 1: no question, it's been good for investors the last forty
Speaker 1: eight hours. Yeah, exactly so, especially considering was a day
Speaker 1: where equities broadly will lower, especially tex stalks as yields
Speaker 1: to rising. That a lot of hawkish comments out of
Speaker 1: the Fed, which weighed on technology shares, and yet Twitter
Speaker 1: buck the trend right bam up another two percent, its
Speaker 1: biggest two day gain in record above on record above,
Speaker 1: And here's the reality of the situation. If you come
Speaker 1: and me into my Bloomberg terminal, there's just a staggering
Speaker 1: volume of Twitter shares that have exchange hand over the
Speaker 1: last two days. I mean that chart, Emily says it all.
Speaker 1: Look at the right hand side of the screen. Two
Speaker 1: hundred sixteen million shares changing hands on Tuesday. That's after
Speaker 1: more than two hundred fifty million chairs change hands on Monday.
Speaker 1: Investors also taking a real interest on the retail side.
Speaker 1: You look at many of the trading platforms like Fidelity
Speaker 1: for example. We'll touch on this later in the show,
Speaker 1: but a lot of demand for Twitter shares. His investors
Speaker 1: try and work out, well, is this a good thing?
Speaker 1: Elon Musk being on the board of the company. The
Speaker 1: direction travel on the stock certainly suggests so final chart
Speaker 1: is a little bit of irony and all of this.
Speaker 1: This is year to day Twitter and Tesla, and before
Speaker 1: the big surge, we've got a Monday around and other
Speaker 1: two percent. On Tuesday, Twitter was down year Today it's
Speaker 1: now very firmly in positive territory year to day and
Speaker 1: as you can see, we're now outperforming Tesla on a
Speaker 1: year to date basis, which is higher. It's up around
Speaker 1: three percent. And it's interesting the direction of travel, the
Speaker 1: Elon Musk effects that you have about these stocks and
Speaker 1: how he uses Twitter is a met is and to
Speaker 1: communicate with investors, well, I'm sure we're gonna be paying
Speaker 1: a lot close attentions Twitter now and all right, blood law,
Speaker 1: thank you now. And yet another plot twist, Twitter CEO
Speaker 1: Parague Aggerawall announcing Elon Musk has joined Twitter's board and
Speaker 1: Jack Dorsey, who set to leave the board in May,
Speaker 1: says he's happy about it. Musk's Twitter ownership will be
Speaker 1: capped at fourteen point nine percent as a board member
Speaker 1: to avoid him having undue influence, though he's currently at
Speaker 1: nine point two percent, which will give him plenty of influence. Enough,
Speaker 1: let's discuss the moving more with Teconomy founder David Kirkpatrick,
Speaker 1: along with Bloomberg's Max Chafkin. Max. Elon Musk has often
Speaker 1: talked about his Tesla master plan. What do you think
Speaker 1: his master plan is for Twitter and how does it
Speaker 1: fit into Twitter's master plan for Twitter? Well, I think
Speaker 1: that Elon Musk really likes Twitter. He's obviously an enthusiastic user,
Speaker 1: and you can totally see why Twitter would want him
Speaker 1: on the board. I think for Musk, um the master
Speaker 1: plan is as you said about Tesla, and I think
Speaker 1: what's what's happening here? Although I'm sure Ellen has some
Speaker 1: really big ideas for for Twitter, you know, around free speech,
Speaker 1: the I think the really the game behind this is
Speaker 1: protecting Tesla's most important, you know, marketing channel, and you
Speaker 1: know Ed mentioned it's Elon Musk's you know, sort of
Speaker 1: way of communicating with investors, of of just sort of
Speaker 1: raising enormous amounts of almost unlimited capital for Tesla. It's
Speaker 1: also this great way that he's been able to market
Speaker 1: you know, both himself and the cars. And I think,
Speaker 1: you know, having a stake in that literally a seat
Speaker 1: on Twitter's board um is going to help him in
Speaker 1: the long term. You know, yesterday, Twitter's value, you know,
Speaker 1: went up a bunch of eight hundred million dollars or
Speaker 1: so would have been Musks gained. Tesla went up a
Speaker 1: whole lot more, you know, a whole lot less as
Speaker 1: a percentage. But but Musk made a lot more money
Speaker 1: on Tesla. His money is still in Tesla, and I
Speaker 1: think we should still be thinking about it in those
Speaker 1: terms now. Looking at these tweets from Parague, Agawalla and
Speaker 1: Jack Dorrisey today, Parague tweeting, I'm excited to share where
Speaker 1: are pointing el on to our board? It became clear
Speaker 1: to us through conversations in recent weeks that he would
Speaker 1: bring great value to our board. Jack Dorsey then retweeting this,
Speaker 1: and what you can imagine is a coordinated effort saying
Speaker 1: I'm really happy Ellen is joining the board. He cares
Speaker 1: deeply about our rule and Twitter's role in it. Parague
Speaker 1: and Ellen both lead with their hearts and they will
Speaker 1: be an incredible team. David, what do you make of
Speaker 1: their wholehearted embrace of this. Well, first of all, we
Speaker 1: know that Jack Dorsey and Elon Musk are good friends
Speaker 1: and they've sort of think alike in a lot of ways,
Speaker 1: although certainly Elon Musk is a much more impetuous person
Speaker 1: than Jack Dorsey. But um, you know, you have to say,
Speaker 1: having the richest man in the world, one who's every
Speaker 1: move is attended to with such incredible attention, has got
Speaker 1: to be good for any company. Uh, it's certainly been
Speaker 1: good for Tesla. And I think that if he really
Speaker 1: cares about Twitter, which he must, although this is something
Speaker 1: we're really just learning that he cares about organizationally as
Speaker 1: opposed to just being one of its greatest power users. Um,
Speaker 1: he's gonna certainly bring tremendous value to their deliberations about strategy,
Speaker 1: product design, etcetera. Now what kind of freedom do you
Speaker 1: think Elon Musk feels he is lacking on Twitter, given
Speaker 1: that he seems to have roamed there quite freely. Um, yeah, well,
Speaker 1: I think there's some risk though to to Elon's a
Speaker 1: Twitter presents. First of all, he's somebody who's continually pushing
Speaker 1: the boundaries right and Twitter has been you know, aggressive
Speaker 1: or not aggressive, but but has made some moves in
Speaker 1: terms of trying to rein in um you know what
Speaker 1: it terms misinformation or hate speech and and that sort
Speaker 1: of thing. He's also in the middle middle of this
Speaker 1: very messy fight with the SEC over tweets that he sent,
Speaker 1: you know, years ago. Tesla has this Twitter sitter, and
Speaker 1: right around the same time that Um Musk was acquiring
Speaker 1: these Twitter skate stakes, there's a court filing that drops
Speaker 1: where Musk is complaining about about his you know, being
Speaker 1: muzzled as he saw it by the SEC. So I
Speaker 1: could see it both, you know, as as partly as
Speaker 1: a protective action. You know, this is a way for
Speaker 1: him to ensure that this um stays put. Now, it'll
Speaker 1: be interesting, David, how this impacts the rest of the
Speaker 1: social media landscape. There was quite a moment um. Elon Musk,
Speaker 1: in response to his question about an edit button, got
Speaker 1: a lot of feedback, including from Andrew Bosworth, who's now
Speaker 1: the CTO of Facebook, saying that they solved the question
Speaker 1: of editing on Facebook long ago. You just leave a
Speaker 1: log of the edit, Elon Musk responds, Facebook gives me
Speaker 1: the Willie's What do you think? Having Elon in Twitter's corner,
Speaker 1: or at least on Twitter's board means for Facebook, well,
Speaker 1: I would reiterate that having him on your corner is
Speaker 1: going to be bad for your rivals. Um period Um.
Speaker 1: I would say, many of us find things that have
Speaker 1: happened on Facebook give us the willies in recent years.
Speaker 1: So I can understand why he would say that, and
Speaker 1: I do think Twitter, on balance has been a more
Speaker 1: responsible platform than Facebook. Um. The confusing thing is his
Speaker 1: repeated statements are several times saying, you know, he wants
Speaker 1: free speech to be more allowed on Twitter, that he
Speaker 1: thinks it's it's gonna be more that it's maybe too restrictive,
Speaker 1: and it doesn't really make sense to me since he
Speaker 1: has never been restricted by Twitter itself. He's been restricted
Speaker 1: by the SEC, and I think he's had second thoughts
Speaker 1: about some of his own tweets. But um, you know,
Speaker 1: I don't I think it's bad for Facebook. I do
Speaker 1: think maybe an edit function is a good idea for Twitter.
Speaker 1: I personally have trouble using Twitter. I'm a I just
Speaker 1: find it awkward and off putting in many ways. I'm
Speaker 1: an outlier in the tech journalism community in that way.
Speaker 1: But I can understand Twitter needs product improvements. Even Jack
Speaker 1: Dorsey says that all the time and doesn't make any
Speaker 1: bones about it. And yet Katie Stanton, longtime former Twitter veteran,
Speaker 1: was on the show yesterday. She said, this is a
Speaker 1: pretty expensive way to add an edit button if that's
Speaker 1: what you want. Max. You know, as you point out,
Speaker 1: Elon Musk like likes making jokes, but he's rarely doing
Speaker 1: it just to joke. I mean, a steak is now
Speaker 1: worth for billion dollars. You have to be more than
Speaker 1: an edit button desire here, right right, And I think
Speaker 1: that's why, you know, David's pointing out withstanding um, Twitter's
Speaker 1: playing with fire here. I mean, Elon Musk is really
Speaker 1: good at attracting attention. There's obviously we saw on that
Speaker 1: chart there is a large community of investors who will
Speaker 1: basically buy anything that he tells them to. And that's
Speaker 1: really good. But if but if Twitter has a bad
Speaker 1: quarter or you know, if Twitter loses its market value,
Speaker 1: you know, that's disastrous for Twitter's management team. And that's
Speaker 1: just like a blip on Elon Musk's radar. It doesn't
Speaker 1: affect his long term visions or anything like that. So
Speaker 1: the fear, I think would be, this is somebody who
Speaker 1: has in the past had trouble raining himself in is
Speaker 1: very impetuous, and now all of a sudden, Twitter, this
Speaker 1: relatively small company, is attached to the Elon Musk train.
Speaker 1: So so it's gonna it's gonna ride that way for
Speaker 1: better and probably for So here's an open question, what
Speaker 1: does this mean for former President Trump? David who has
Speaker 1: been banned from Twitter. I've asked Twitter executives CFO net
Speaker 1: Segal many times if there's a path for him to
Speaker 1: come back, and he has said no. Could this Could
Speaker 1: this open the door? David? Well, it's a very legitimate question, given, um,
Speaker 1: given the point that Musk has made about free speech,
Speaker 1: because the first thing you think of, if Twitter were
Speaker 1: more lax in enforcing its speech rules, the implication, number
Speaker 1: one implication would be that Trump might be allowed back on.
Speaker 1: I don't think of Musk as a particular defender of Trump.
Speaker 1: I think he's in a libertarian by inclination, although he
Speaker 1: has a very complex mix of views. So I would say,
Speaker 1: if anything is positive for the president x president. But um,
Speaker 1: we can't know. There's so many things about this we
Speaker 1: can't know. The speed with which it all happened is dizzy.
Speaker 1: You know, it's it's I've just been thinking, what a
Speaker 1: weird thing. The richest man in the world is so
Speaker 1: incredibly impetuous. You never know what he's gonna do next.
Speaker 1: It's like he's a professional global entertainer or something. So
Speaker 1: all the implications are going to be found out only
Speaker 1: through time. I'm afraid the plot has thickened indeed. David Kirkpatrick,
Speaker 1: founder of Teconomy, and Bloomberg's own Max Chafkin, thank you both.
Speaker 1: Coming up, we're gonna hear from a Republican Representative darryl
Speaker 1: Isa his thoughts on what musk means. First, free speech
Speaker 1: and what is it like working on a board with
Speaker 1: Elon Must school ask a former TESLA board member that
Speaker 1: is next. This is Bloomberg. Well, lawmakers on both sides
Speaker 1: of the aisle. I've had plenty to say about Twitter's
Speaker 1: handling a free speech on its platform, and for different reasons.
Speaker 1: Here's Republican Representative Darla Isa of California earlier with my
Speaker 1: colleague David Weston. I've known Elon must for a long time,
Speaker 1: and I watched him break a glass ceiling that kept
Speaker 1: him from competing in rockets and missiles. Uh, and he
Speaker 1: did so over a long period of time with his dedication.
Speaker 1: He believes in sort of that free enterprise system, and
Speaker 1: so I think he's going to be a positive for
Speaker 1: a Twitter that has been airing on the side of
Speaker 1: less free speech. Uh. You might remember taking down things
Speaker 1: uh as misinformation that later proved to be true. I
Speaker 1: think he's going to look at it as no, we're
Speaker 1: We're going to be for free speech in a bigger way.
Speaker 1: And I think that's positive for Twitter. It is positive
Speaker 1: for all of us who would like to see um
Speaker 1: social media be less about censoring and more about simply
Speaker 1: being a conduit for people's ideas, whether we disagree with
Speaker 1: them or not. So as I have been listening to
Speaker 1: Congress over the last couple of years, I hear two concerns.
Speaker 1: One is the one you just identified, and that is
Speaker 1: Twitter's role in saying who can talk and who can't talk.
Speaker 1: And I understand you're saying Elon Musk will make it freer,
Speaker 1: he won't just prejuice in favor of his own point
Speaker 1: of view, but also in terms of concentration, there's a
Speaker 1: lot of concern about you have a trust responsibility as well.
Speaker 1: Are you concerned at all about this the wealthiest man
Speaker 1: in the world now having significant influence over Twitter. You know,
Speaker 1: uh ten doesn't run a company, um and you know
Speaker 1: there are two extreme anti oil people on Exog's board,
Speaker 1: so uh you know. I think that it's the power
Speaker 1: of his argument that's going to be more important than
Speaker 1: in his actual vote, because he is going to be
Speaker 1: outnumbered essentially nine to one. But there is something else
Speaker 1: here at work, and that is that, yes, Twitter has
Speaker 1: a monopoly on one section, Facebook has a monopoly on
Speaker 1: another section. These giants we are concerned about, but remember
Speaker 1: if they operate like your public utility, charging everyone the
Speaker 1: same amount to buy electricity and not shutting anyone off
Speaker 1: as long as the bill is paid, then the monopoly
Speaker 1: is pretty benign. And I think that's one of the
Speaker 1: concerns we have in Congress is not whether an entity
Speaker 1: has monopolistic power, but how they use that power, whether
Speaker 1: they have used it or simply have the luxury of
Speaker 1: being the dominant force. That's been true in tech for
Speaker 1: a long time. I remember when Microsoft basically owned your
Speaker 1: ability to get on the Internet. That's not true today,
Speaker 1: but it did take looking at and making sure they
Speaker 1: were an honest broker in their tie ins uh some
Speaker 1: years ago. Republican Darryl is Sa They're of California, who
Speaker 1: himself has worked in tech and business. Well, how will
Speaker 1: having Elon Musk in the board influence Twitter's handling a
Speaker 1: free speech, misinformation and so much more. Let's get to
Speaker 1: that question now with someone who worked on a board
Speaker 1: with Elon Musk for many years. Steve Wesley is the
Speaker 1: founder of the Wesley Group and was an early investor
Speaker 1: in Tesla and a former Tesla board member. Steve, great
Speaker 1: to have you back with us. So what is it
Speaker 1: like serving on a board with Elon Musk? Well, it's
Speaker 1: never boring. Look, I think this is a big win
Speaker 1: for Twitter. He's brilliant, he sees the future. He's a driver.
Speaker 1: Look for sure, he's a bit temperamental and irascible, but
Speaker 1: he pushes people to be their best. He's also, of course,
Speaker 1: twitter It's greatest power user. So I think it's a
Speaker 1: good thing that he likes pushing boundaries. And my advice
Speaker 1: to Twitter executives is put on your track shoes now,
Speaker 1: because Elon is going to push you to pick up
Speaker 1: the pace all at all. I think that's a good
Speaker 1: thing for Twitter users and a good thing for Twitter investors.
Speaker 1: Ellen is his own biggest marketer. I wonder how that
Speaker 1: could work to Twitter's advantage. Well, look, I think a
Speaker 1: case can be made. Did Ellen's reinventing twenty one century marketing?
Speaker 1: Just look what he did at Tesla. He had a
Speaker 1: marketing budget close to zero. He took every penny he could,
Speaker 1: even though we were a much smaller auto company, invested
Speaker 1: in innovation, making greater products. In contrast, the world's major
Speaker 1: auto companies GM for Toyota, spent billions it could have
Speaker 1: been spending on R and D in tired commercial campaign,
Speaker 1: super Bowl ads and so on. And you just have
Speaker 1: to wonder how much further ahead would the major auto
Speaker 1: companies be if they'd done what are elon dated Tesla.
Speaker 1: So I think in a lot of ways he is
Speaker 1: the perfect poster boy for what some might call twenty
Speaker 1: century marketing, forming that direct relationship with your customer customer,
Speaker 1: and he's doing it all on Twitter. What's a better
Speaker 1: advertisement than Twitter for Twitter than that? Well, he's gonna
Speaker 1: have a very direct relationship with Twitter's leadership and other
Speaker 1: board members. What do you imagine his relationship with Parague aggrawall,
Speaker 1: the new CEO will be well, it's not gonna be quiet.
Speaker 1: I think he's gonna push all of them. I mean,
Speaker 1: here we are, day one into this and he's already saying, hey,
Speaker 1: maybe it's time to to get that edit function in there.
Speaker 1: I think he's gonna shake things. Uh. I think that's
Speaker 1: part of the future. In the old days used to
Speaker 1: say if it ain't broke, don't fix it. The new
Speaker 1: mantra of the twenty one century is from Steve Jobs.
Speaker 1: If you're not busy obvious leading your own products, someone
Speaker 1: else he is. And I think Ela is gonna come
Speaker 1: in like he's gonna shake things up, and he's gonna
Speaker 1: simultaneously make a statement two CEOs of the other five
Speaker 1: fortune companies you need to form a direct relationship with
Speaker 1: your customers. Twitter is probably the most cost effective way
Speaker 1: to do it. Look, Elan is not a chrismatic guy,
Speaker 1: slightly awkward. That he's genuine, he's real, he's authentic. I
Speaker 1: think a lot of other CEOs how to be taking note. Now,
Speaker 1: Elon Musk has used Twitter too, basically, as you say,
Speaker 1: replace his own marketing department. And I wonder how an
Speaker 1: investment in Twitter fits into the broader Musk portfolio. Do
Speaker 1: you think there's some broader end game in terms of
Speaker 1: how Twitter relates to Tesla and SpaceX and the boring
Speaker 1: company hyper Loop for example. Well, look, Elon has a
Speaker 1: big picture guy, and I think what he's simply saying
Speaker 1: is I'm an innovator. I have transformed the American auto industry,
Speaker 1: the global auto industry, have transformed prediction in space. This
Speaker 1: old world marketing has got to go. CEOs of the
Speaker 1: future needed direct relationship where they can tell the truth
Speaker 1: in real time to their customers, not waged six months
Speaker 1: for a lot of crazy ads. I think that's a
Speaker 1: step forward, and I think he's going to become a
Speaker 1: role model for a lot of other not just CEOs,
Speaker 1: but politicians. And I think having that direct relationship with
Speaker 1: the customer and the voter instead of the can adds
Speaker 1: that so many of us are used to is probably
Speaker 1: a net positive. But you're still going to have to
Speaker 1: manage it. Well, we'll see how they do. What do
Speaker 1: you think you a musk falls on Twitter's banning of
Speaker 1: President Trump. So look, only Elon knows that, but a
Speaker 1: lot of people said, oh my gosh, he's a free
Speaker 1: market heater. Uh, he's gonna let Trump back on doing
Speaker 1: he wants. I don't think that's the case. Elon has
Speaker 1: higher standards. He holds people to a high standard. And look,
Speaker 1: the reality is that I say this for all of
Speaker 1: tech because someone who spent part of my life as
Speaker 1: an elected official and part of my life as a
Speaker 1: tech executive, Tech overall needs to hold a higher standard
Speaker 1: for people telling the truth. They need to remove people
Speaker 1: who are telling flat outlies, They need to remove people
Speaker 1: who are inciting violence. So I believe and hope Kill
Speaker 1: set a higher standard that firms like Facebook can follow.
Speaker 1: On that note, though, I mean some would argue that
Speaker 1: Elon Musk has peddled his own version of the truth,
Speaker 1: for example the funding secured tweet, which got him in
Speaker 1: trouble with the SEC when funding wasn't secured. Look, Elon
Speaker 1: is always pushing the boundaries. So he will be one
Speaker 1: of nine board members, uh On bar or on on
Speaker 1: the whole. I think he's going to push them to
Speaker 1: innovate in terms of setting government policy, what the standards are.
Speaker 1: I don't know if he'll be taking the lead on that.
Speaker 1: It's more of an innovator, more of a tech guy,
Speaker 1: but we'll see one thing. I can promise you it
Speaker 1: won't be boring. It won't be boring indeed, Steve Wesley,
Speaker 1: founder of the Wesley Group, former Tesla board member Steve
Speaker 1: good to have you back with us. A few other
Speaker 1: stories we continue to watch. Amazon is buying dozens of
Speaker 1: rocket launches to deploy slate lights for its high speed
Speaker 1: internet service. The company will buy as many as eighty
Speaker 1: three launches from Aaron Space, Blue Origin, and United Launch Alliance.
Speaker 1: Amazon's license with the FCC requires it to launch at
Speaker 1: least half its thirty two hundred satellites by July. And
Speaker 1: Mackenzie Scott has transformed American philanthropy in the last three
Speaker 1: years by giving away twelve point four billion dollars, often
Speaker 1: to overlooked causes. She's now stepping up her donations outside
Speaker 1: of the United States. Scott's latest giving spree three point
Speaker 1: nine billion dollars, including about sixty nonprofits based outside the US.
Speaker 1: These serving causes across five continents, from Micronesia to Brazil.
Speaker 1: And I be am Banking on the lingering relevance of
Speaker 1: mainframe computers at a time when many businesses are moving
Speaker 1: to the cloud, the company has unveiled a new model
Speaker 1: designed for corporate data centers. IBM has been marketing itself
Speaker 1: as a key player to support data storage both on
Speaker 1: premise and in the cloud. Coming up, we'll have more
Speaker 1: on what Ela musk plans could be for Twitter and
Speaker 1: especially free speech. That's next, Mrs Bloomberg, Welcome back to
Speaker 1: bloomber Technology and Emily Chang in San Francisco. Well, you've
Speaker 1: heard it from investors, to analysts, to Twitter's onn CEO
Speaker 1: and former CEO. There are a lot of opinions out
Speaker 1: there about what Elon Musk means for Twitter. Bloom Brooks
Speaker 1: and Ludlow has been taking a look at the markets
Speaker 1: view on it and d so far so good. Here
Speaker 1: is there any indication that this could be bad for investors? Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's interesting. I mean the stock is held up for
Speaker 1: two days, right, only a two percent gain on Tuesday,
Speaker 1: but over the two days that's the biggest two day
Speaker 1: jump in Twitter's history as a public company. And what's more,
Speaker 1: you know, the broad range of analyst notes that came
Speaker 1: out in reaction to the news that Elon Musk had
Speaker 1: been first taking a stake in Twitter, but then second
Speaker 1: of all, been appointed as a board member were largely positive.
Speaker 1: You know, they basically range from the opinion that they'll
Speaker 1: help he'll help Twitter by association. Right, he has some
Speaker 1: star power, the Elon Musk effect, but also he has
Speaker 1: good ideas. He has a track record of innovation which
Speaker 1: could help. But there's an interesting thing, M. There's a
Speaker 1: gap between what people see as him doing for the
Speaker 1: platform and what they see him doing for the stock.
Speaker 1: So coming into my Boomberg terminal and take a look
Speaker 1: at this chart, there's been a big pop in the stock. Right.
Speaker 1: You see that on the right hand side, which is
Speaker 1: the white line. The blue line is the average analyst
Speaker 1: twelve month price target for Twitter, which you can see
Speaker 1: is around forty four dollars a share when we're currently
Speaker 1: trading at a share. What's interesting, some analysts even cut
Speaker 1: their price targets after the recent run up in the
Speaker 1: stock because they don't think there's that much upside to run.
Speaker 1: So this is gap in where people think that Elon
Speaker 1: Musk could take Twitter and where they see the stock
Speaker 1: and going. And there's a further breakdown of that real
Speaker 1: quick MD, which is the influence of retail investors. I
Speaker 1: told you earlier in the show that around four sixty
Speaker 1: million shares of Twitter had changed hands over the last
Speaker 1: two days, but there's real insatiable retail investor appetite. These
Speaker 1: are the top names on Fidelities trading platform over the
Speaker 1: last set Tuesday's training session Twitter number one. More than
Speaker 1: ten thousand by orders for Twitter and around eight thousand,
Speaker 1: six hundred for Tesla. The third company is Sunshine Bio,
Speaker 1: a bio company in pharmaceuticals. But clearly it's not just
Speaker 1: Wall Street looking at this and going what's Elon Musk
Speaker 1: going to do? But the retail investor, just as they've
Speaker 1: done with the test, the story, hang on Ela Musks
Speaker 1: every word had brought in over the last two sessions
Speaker 1: as well. All right, my Ludlow, thank you. I want
Speaker 1: to stick with this and bring in our next two guests,
Speaker 1: Tim O'Brien, a senior columnist for Bloomberg Opinion, and Jennifer Greigl,
Speaker 1: Associate professor of Communication at Syracuse University. Tim, I want
Speaker 1: to start with you. Not only has Twitter added Elon
Speaker 1: Musk to their board, but brock Agawall said that they
Speaker 1: have been talking to him for weeks. Why is that significant, Well,
Speaker 1: it's significant because Elon Musk took a stake in this
Speaker 1: company under the guys, essentially being a passive investor, which meant,
Speaker 1: if or if you're following that classic definition, uh, that
Speaker 1: he was merely stopping by and parking his money and
Speaker 1: was going to watch from the sidelines and not seek
Speaker 1: great changes or significant changes at the company, not do
Speaker 1: things like sk a board seat, for example. Um, all
Speaker 1: of which was up in the air yesterday when this
Speaker 1: investment was disclosed. And then lo and behold, we find
Speaker 1: today that he has a board seat, and that Twitter
Speaker 1: CEO has said that they've been talking together for weeks,
Speaker 1: which certainly doesn't bear any hallmarks of a passive investor.
Speaker 1: I don't think anyone thought he would be a passive investor,
Speaker 1: uh in this. I think he's he is an activist
Speaker 1: by nature. Um. But I also think it represents a
Speaker 1: little bit just another tiny chapter in an Elon Musk
Speaker 1: flouting his you know, thumbing his nose at convention and
Speaker 1: at SEC guidelines as he sees fit. He has had
Speaker 1: a long run in with the SEC about tweeting inside
Speaker 1: information or misleading information, and and and I said, I
Speaker 1: suspect this will be a little bit more fodder for
Speaker 1: the SEC to chew on now Musk has been positioning
Speaker 1: himself as a free speech defender. Professor Greigle, what do
Speaker 1: you think that means for President Trump? In particular? Where
Speaker 1: does Musk or will Musk fall on this? This really
Speaker 1: isn't about free speech. If anything, Twitter has just become
Speaker 1: a little bit more about Elon's speech. You just saw
Speaker 1: a large portion of this company and gets to kind
Speaker 1: of steer what happens there now. If anything, he's figured
Speaker 1: out that this is a powerful platform. Maybe he took
Speaker 1: some notes from Mark Zuckerberg and others that you need
Speaker 1: to have some influence over a platform. So I I think,
Speaker 1: if anything, the future for former President Trump is still TBD.
Speaker 1: But you know, I've never seen it as a band.
Speaker 1: It's a band for as long as those who are
Speaker 1: in control of the company wanted to be a band,
Speaker 1: and we just need to be You're realistic about that, Tim,
Speaker 1: what's your response to that? In your column today, you
Speaker 1: refer to Ellen as a quote unquote world class troll
Speaker 1: because that's how he's used Twitter historically and for as
Speaker 1: much you know, he defines himself as a self described
Speaker 1: free speech absolutist, and yet he's routinely over the years
Speaker 1: tried to shut down his critics, uh, silence them. He's
Speaker 1: used Twitter to savage them, to make fun of them.
Speaker 1: He's used Twitter as a troll to to go after people.
Speaker 1: He's used Twitter to talk up his own investments and
Speaker 1: things like cryptocurrencies. Um and so this whole time that
Speaker 1: he's in the recent weeks where he said that Twitter
Speaker 1: is throwing blockades in the way of free speech and
Speaker 1: that maybe he needs to um launch a new platforms
Speaker 1: and the enticing things he put out there prior to
Speaker 1: this investment being is closed really want run counter to
Speaker 1: his entire personal experience on Twitter. He has been unfettered
Speaker 1: on Twitter. Um. But Elon Musk is a libertarian, and
Speaker 1: I think he has a posture uh that is part
Speaker 1: of the far right site guys right now that the
Speaker 1: social media platforms have turned against conservatives, when in fact,
Speaker 1: I think the social media platforms have finally woken up
Speaker 1: to some of the virtues of policing divisive propaganda, which
Speaker 1: is I think a different thing than free speech in
Speaker 1: certain cases. So hang on, Tim, We've actually got some
Speaker 1: breaking news now. Twitter has just announced via a tweet
Speaker 1: from its Twitter Communications account that they are the company
Speaker 1: is working on an edit button. Internally, this is a
Speaker 1: feature that they have been testing um and testing and
Speaker 1: working on since last year. Tim Well, you know, Elon
Speaker 1: Musk tweeted last night after his investment was disclosed that
Speaker 1: he'd really like to see an edit button a Twitter.
Speaker 1: So I suppose this is Twitter making a big bowl
Speaker 1: public statement that they're responsive to what Elon Musk wants
Speaker 1: to see. But of course they've been working on this
Speaker 1: for a long time. If they step up their pace
Speaker 1: on things like better user experiences, better communication tools on Twitter,
Speaker 1: because Elon Musk is there, that's great, and that's good
Speaker 1: for investors, and it's good for its users. That's again,
Speaker 1: that's apart from what he might do to either curtail
Speaker 1: or or pervert actual free speech on the platform itself.
Speaker 1: Professor Griggle Eileen aside, how do you think an edit
Speaker 1: button would change the nature of Twitter? I mean, this
Speaker 1: is the company. This is something that users, some users
Speaker 1: have been asking for for a long time, but Twitter
Speaker 1: has always resisted. I believe in the name of uh
Speaker 1: maintaining and protecting the authenticity of the platform. I don't
Speaker 1: think this is about typos, you know, like I I
Speaker 1: think he's trying to use this as a way to
Speaker 1: look like he's appealing to the public, that he's some
Speaker 1: type of like rebel leader, you know. But Elon Musk
Speaker 1: is about the only thing I'm sure of is that
Speaker 1: he's really good acute relating wealth. Um, and when that
Speaker 1: comes power. So you know, again, there's been some conversation
Speaker 1: about how Facebook lets you edit things too, and Facebook
Speaker 1: and Twitter are not the same thing. Um. Last time
Speaker 1: I checked, journalists around the world have not been impetting
Speaker 1: Facebook posts in news stories. Um, and uh. I think
Speaker 1: it just would fundamentally kind of change what the platform is.
Speaker 1: But like, maybe that's what Ellen wants to do. I
Speaker 1: don't I don't know why he's taking a mistake in this,
Speaker 1: other than he's figured out that this is somehow going
Speaker 1: to help him serve his agenda. So we'll have to
Speaker 1: wait and see. But it will, I think, culturally change
Speaker 1: what Twitter is, and maybe that's for the best. Maybe
Speaker 1: he wants to burn it down, and you know, maybe
Speaker 1: that's a good thing. At this point, it's it's just
Speaker 1: a bunch of CEOs, politicians, state actors and folks like
Speaker 1: exploiting this are competing the press. Maybe it's a maybe
Speaker 1: it's not that great anymore. To that point, Tim, in
Speaker 1: your article just this week where you suggest that Elon
Speaker 1: Musk could be bad for free speech, the venture capitalist
Speaker 1: Mark Andreason reposted it. Uh didn't seem to agree with
Speaker 1: your premise. Elon Musk then commented, saying, uh that such
Speaker 1: an article is always good for a laugh. He confused
Speaker 1: the fact that your article written for Bloomberg was actually
Speaker 1: republished in the Washington Post. But what do you make
Speaker 1: of a quote unquote defender of free speech criticizing your
Speaker 1: free speech. Well, they're entitled to do that because I
Speaker 1: believe in free speech too, so I'm okay with that.
Speaker 1: I think that you know, Mark Andreason and and Elon
Speaker 1: Musk are are cut from the same cloth. They're Silicon
Speaker 1: Valley titans who have a view of the world. I
Speaker 1: think that is pretty mechanistic and individualistic. There can be
Speaker 1: virtues to that, But I think when you're talking in
Speaker 1: the context of why they have an interest about the
Speaker 1: kind of speech that appears on Twitter, it has nothing
Speaker 1: actually to do with free speech, and as everything to
Speaker 1: do I think with their own biases being put to
Speaker 1: the test by the things that appear on Twitter. Tim O'Brien,
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Opinion, Jennifer Gracle, professor at Syracuse University. So much uh,
Speaker 1: so much to continue to debate. Thank you both. Let's
Speaker 1: get to our crypto report now and come back to
Speaker 1: today's main story. Elon Musk joining Twitter's board. How would
Speaker 1: this shape the social platform's future? Will it bring the
Speaker 1: elements of blockchain networks into Twitter? Let's talk about all
Speaker 1: of this and more with Kristin Smith, executive director of
Speaker 1: the Blockchain Association, and Kristen It's no secret that Twitter
Speaker 1: has been um bulking out some of its crypto features.
Speaker 1: They've got this a blue sky project that they've been exploring.
Speaker 1: But what do you make of Elon Musk's influence on
Speaker 1: the crypto community and how that could influence Twitter? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean these are all great questions, Emily. I think
Speaker 1: Elon Musk's um news about him taking such a large
Speaker 1: steak and joining the board of Twitter is very important.
Speaker 1: I think I think one of the reasons is he
Speaker 1: really truly understands the value of cryptocurrency, whether it be uh,
Speaker 1: you know, bitcoin or doge coin. He has and he
Speaker 1: knows the value of open source networks, and he knows
Speaker 1: the value when you have many multiple minds thinking and
Speaker 1: building on how to create a better network. That's very
Speaker 1: different than a centralized company like Twitter. UM. So what
Speaker 1: I think is going to be interesting is is he
Speaker 1: going to bring these elements of the crypto world, these
Speaker 1: anti censorship elements, the open source elements, and allow for
Speaker 1: a way for new people to come in and maybe
Speaker 1: import their own algorithm that could potentially go through and
Speaker 1: sort the news in the way that they want to
Speaker 1: be seen, not in the way that Twitter is dictating
Speaker 1: that it be seen. So I do think there is
Speaker 1: a potential for innovation here, and you know, given that
Speaker 1: you know, we represent the crypto industry at the Blockchain Association,
Speaker 1: and we're hopeful that that by you know, bringing in
Speaker 1: this kind of mindset, that there will be new ways
Speaker 1: to to get this platform UM to a place that
Speaker 1: serves more more of its users, because it certainly is
Speaker 1: an incredibly powerful platform, and I would argue probably the
Speaker 1: most powerful platform for sharing and receiving information and and
Speaker 1: just how important is Twitter do you believe to the
Speaker 1: crypto community. Obviously there's a strong and very passionate uh
Speaker 1: community of cryptocurrency supporters on Twitter. I mean, we call
Speaker 1: it crypto Twitter back in crypto topics are trending on
Speaker 1: Twitter because of the volume of these users there. Yeah, no,
Speaker 1: crypto Twitter is is a real thing. And it's really
Speaker 1: interesting because what you have. Twitter enables developers all across
Speaker 1: the globe to debate whether or not they should make
Speaker 1: technological changes to open source networks. It's a forum for
Speaker 1: this kind of debate. It's it's really a public commons
Speaker 1: for exchanging ideas and a way for people that have
Speaker 1: very targeted and narrow interests to find one another and
Speaker 1: to build a community. And I think the crypto community
Speaker 1: uses Twitter perhaps more so than any other community or
Speaker 1: ecosystem out there. Um. It's also an incredibly powerful tool
Speaker 1: for the crypto community. The if you look back to
Speaker 1: last summer in August, we had over forty phone calls
Speaker 1: generated to the US Senate over the course of five
Speaker 1: days because they shared a link on Twitter and it
Speaker 1: went viral. And you had um crypto Twitter influencers, you
Speaker 1: had members at the House and Senate tweeting these links.
Speaker 1: You had celebrity influencers, you had business leaders. Um. You know,
Speaker 1: this is a tool for political activism, it's a tool
Speaker 1: for sharing and debating ideas. It's an incredibly important platform
Speaker 1: and I think it's one where concepts that we find
Speaker 1: every day in the crypto world will only improve the
Speaker 1: way that the platform can work. So I'm excited to
Speaker 1: be part of it. The SEC has obviously been paying
Speaker 1: attention to Elon Musk, and he's had some run ins
Speaker 1: with them before. How do you imagine the SEC is
Speaker 1: watching this steak in Twitter his influence on Twitter in particular. Well,
Speaker 1: I think the SEC pays very close attention to what
Speaker 1: he does. They also pay very close attention to the
Speaker 1: crypto community. So um, definitely a lot of eyes going
Speaker 1: on out there. But listen, I think is you know,
Speaker 1: as long as he's transparent with what's going on and
Speaker 1: brings perhaps more transparency, I don't think that's necessarily a
Speaker 1: bad thing for for him to be a part of it,
Speaker 1: and um, I don't think it should pos is any
Speaker 1: problems um for the SEC at this time. But but yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm sure that they have to keep a close eye
Speaker 1: on him, just just like they do with many other
Speaker 1: people in the crypto space. They are most definitely watching.
Speaker 1: Kristin Smith, Executive director of the Blockchain Association, Thank you
Speaker 1: for joining us. I think he really believes he can
Speaker 1: do something really good for society with this platform. He's
Speaker 1: certainly making a statement, and it's a statement about censorship.
Speaker 1: He he doesn't agree with censorship. UH for a smooth
Speaker 1: functioning democracy. I interpret this as a sign of just
Speaker 1: how influential Elon Musk is. Uh. There's nothing changed in
Speaker 1: the fundamental outlook for Twitter. I think this really just
Speaker 1: starts what's gonna be. I think a broader strategic initiative
Speaker 1: for Elon at Twitter. I think it's a very expensive
Speaker 1: way to get yourself an edit button. UM. I think
Speaker 1: it's a very interesting move. UM. Elon is obviously a
Speaker 1: power user. He knows a product well. He knows that
Speaker 1: Twitter is the place for the world's conversation. It will
Speaker 1: lead to be our grule, changing the policy of the
Speaker 1: company to you know, really open source, uh the the
Speaker 1: censorship or or call people out on censorship, or it
Speaker 1: will be a management change. I don't know what's going
Speaker 1: to happen. Twitter chairers meantime have skyrocketed since the news
Speaker 1: of elon mistake in the company. But how long can
Speaker 1: the rally last? Brent, They'll have Jefferies joins us now
Speaker 1: he currently has a hold on the company and Brent,
Speaker 1: are you sticking with it? Stating with the whole you
Speaker 1: had a big move, clearly a positive move for the company,
Speaker 1: not taking any way on that side, but when you
Speaker 1: have a thirty plus percent move, it's inbanding a lot
Speaker 1: of the fundamental improvement which we haven't seen yet. Uh
Speaker 1: is my friend mark me and he pointed out in
Speaker 1: the earlier segment. You know we I think many of
Speaker 1: us have been asking advertisers, you know, has any changed
Speaker 1: and the answer is no. Uh. So clearly this is
Speaker 1: a bet on the future that they can take the foundation.
Speaker 1: You know, I've called this a a foundation of a
Speaker 1: great car. But Ellen knows how to put the pet
Speaker 1: u or the dog mode inside the car to let
Speaker 1: your dog in the car, that the whole user interface.
Speaker 1: In terms of what he's done in in the autle world, Uh,
Speaker 1: I think he could bring a lot to to this world. Uh.
Speaker 1: And I think it's he's gonna have no doubt to
Speaker 1: the positive impact. It's gonna take time, and so investor
Speaker 1: by now we're betting not for the next four or two,
Speaker 1: but they're betting a year out that that that's going
Speaker 1: to have an improvement, which I think again is grateful
Speaker 1: long term, sure old their short term I think there's
Speaker 1: gonna be a a lot of all affilia the stock still,
Speaker 1: So here's a question. Will this materially change the game
Speaker 1: for Twitter's business? I mean, there was an argument made
Speaker 1: earlier that Twitter could spend less on marketing because Elon
Speaker 1: Musk will do that for them via Twitter. But but
Speaker 1: but really, though, when you look at the balance sheet,
Speaker 1: how will this change? I don't know if it's a
Speaker 1: game changer. I mean, look, the board is stacked, and
Speaker 1: they have a phenomenal ward Brett Taylor from salesforce dot com.
Speaker 1: He's a broduct guy. Great the thumbs up for Facebook.
Speaker 1: I mean, he knows how to how to effectively create
Speaker 1: amazing products. So they are surrounded by rooting at a
Speaker 1: body of people. And I think right now Twitter doesn't
Speaker 1: have an awareness issue. They have a usability each and
Speaker 1: that is what I think many of the advertisers and
Speaker 1: end users are still looking for better, better solutions from them. Advertisers.
Speaker 1: You know, one advertiser last week said it perfectly. Snap
Speaker 1: has had ten improvements of the platform in the last year.
Speaker 1: Twitter hasn't had that many in the decade. Okay, that
Speaker 1: to me is the opportunity. And I think this is
Speaker 1: why he's betting a huge amount of his zone. Well
Speaker 1: one less than one percent is net worth a huge
Speaker 1: amount for all the rest of us the planet. Uh,
Speaker 1: he's put a big dollar amount in because he seeds
Speaker 1: the future three or five years that if they can
Speaker 1: make these changes and make it more usable and they
Speaker 1: can get you know today, right, there's over two three
Speaker 1: billion on Facebook's platform, you know, over two hund million
Speaker 1: en users today. It's a tiny number relative to those
Speaker 1: are on other platforms. Right, what are the risks of
Speaker 1: bringing Elon Musk into the room? Big ideas can go haywire. Right,
Speaker 1: you can see some of these ideas. I've no doubt
Speaker 1: he's gonna have huge influence on the board and the
Speaker 1: manager team to make big, big bets. And anytime you
Speaker 1: make a big bet, it can flare off. But we
Speaker 1: we know that. Uh, we think he's gonna have a
Speaker 1: very positive impact. I don't I think one person's view
Speaker 1: and opinion on this as a board member. Uh, you know,
Speaker 1: there's gonna be a lot of other voices. And I
Speaker 1: think it's it's run, it's it's gonna be running very
Speaker 1: well over time, I think, uh so, I don't think that.
Speaker 1: I think the risk right now is just stock a
Speaker 1: huge run in and beds near term fundamentals. Attorney. If
Speaker 1: fundentals don't turn the next quarter or two on, the
Speaker 1: investors are gonna gonna be be put on hold in
Speaker 1: the short term. I don't think there's a lot of
Speaker 1: outside given that he's in. I think, you know, as
Speaker 1: we say, debab, don't be against must. You know you've
Speaker 1: got a nice floor probably put in in the short
Speaker 1: term given his arrival. But the risk is that the
Speaker 1: recent running the stock combined with this is gonna take
Speaker 1: selver course, this is not going to be an overnight
Speaker 1: experiment that that turns uh that turns out of you know,
Speaker 1: a perfect solution, but it is certainly going to be
Speaker 1: an entertaining one. Brent Fill of Jeffreyes, we are along
Speaker 1: for that ride. Thank you. That does it. For this
Speaker 1: edition of Bloomberg Technology, make sure to tune in tomorrow
Speaker 1: will continue our coverage of Elon Musk's big steak in Twitter.
Speaker 1: Daphne Keller of Stanford will be joining us along with
Speaker 1: Bitcoin two that kicks off in Miami, will have a
Speaker 1: slew of special guests. I'm Emily Changing in San Francisco.
Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg