WEBVTT - Meet the Real 'Wolf of Wall Street': David Lamar

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome to Criminalia, a production of Shonda Land Audio in

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<v Speaker 1>partnership with I Heart Radio. Hello, and welcome to the

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<v Speaker 1>third season of Criminalia. This season, we're exploring the lives

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<v Speaker 1>and motivations of some of the most notorious impostors throughout history.

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<v Speaker 1>Today we're talking about the original and legendary Wolf of

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<v Speaker 1>Wall Street. I'm Maria Tremarki and I'm Holly Fry. And

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<v Speaker 1>you may think you know who. The Wolf of Wall

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<v Speaker 1>Street was based on Martin Scorsese's movie, which was appropriately

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<v Speaker 1>named The Wolf of wall Street. Right, that is a

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<v Speaker 1>person named Jordan Belford, and that movie was based on

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<v Speaker 1>Jordan's book where he described his debaucherous rise as a

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<v Speaker 1>New York stockbroker right up to his very corrupted, messy fault. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>so Jordan's rise. At his peak, he bought mansions. He

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<v Speaker 1>bought cars for those car people out there, especially from

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<v Speaker 1>the eighties. He had two superstars, the Lamborghini Kuntosh and

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<v Speaker 1>the Ferrari Tester Rosa. He bought a helicopter which he crashed.

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<v Speaker 1>He bought a yacht which he sank. And as a

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<v Speaker 1>side note to that yacht, he bought it from cocosan. Now,

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<v Speaker 1>he took a lot, a lot which explains a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of his behavior. He took a lot of coludes. He

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<v Speaker 1>said that he modeled himself after his on screen hero,

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<v Speaker 1>Gordon Gecko, who was the ruthless corporate raider played by

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<v Speaker 1>Michael Douglas in the eighties movie Wall Street. Ultimately, Jordan

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<v Speaker 1>was arrested that was in and he pled guilty to

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<v Speaker 1>fraud and various crimes associated with defrauding investors out of

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<v Speaker 1>more than two hundred million dollars. And because he was

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<v Speaker 1>willing to cooperate with the FBI and give testimony against

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<v Speaker 1>his partners and subordinates in this whole thing, his sentence

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<v Speaker 1>was lightened. He only spent twenty two months in prison,

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<v Speaker 1>and it was during his prison time when he began

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<v Speaker 1>writing his book, his memoirs, which he called the Wolf

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<v Speaker 1>of Wall Street. That's a road name. We're going to

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<v Speaker 1>talk about that in the second need. He did steal

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<v Speaker 1>something in years after Jordan had served his time, Martin

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<v Speaker 1>Scor says, he's movie was released, it wouldn't be wrong

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<v Speaker 1>to call Jordan's the Wolf of Wall Street because he

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<v Speaker 1>certainly sounds as though he could be the wolf of

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<v Speaker 1>Wall Street. But it turns out though that Jordan's just

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<v Speaker 1>a Wolf of Wall Street. He's not the first, and

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<v Speaker 1>of all things he did, he actually never impersonated anyone.

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<v Speaker 1>Enter the real topic of today's conversation, David Lamar. David

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<v Speaker 1>Lamar is the original Wolf of Wall Street, not Jordan Belfort.

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<v Speaker 1>Although comedically enough, they do have something in common despite

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<v Speaker 1>that it's in their name. Neither of these men actually

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<v Speaker 1>ever really worked on Wall Street. It's just coincidence. Bryan,

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<v Speaker 1>So um, it is a little bit early, But we're

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<v Speaker 1>going to stop now for a break for a word

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<v Speaker 1>from our sponsor, so that when we come back, will

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<v Speaker 1>introduce David Lamar. Welcome back to criminal LYA. Do you

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<v Speaker 1>know how to short stock? This has been in the

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<v Speaker 1>news in recent times. Everyone's trying to figure it out. Well,

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<v Speaker 1>David Lamar, sha knew how to do it. Yes, So

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<v Speaker 1>David David was born in or around seventy seven, we

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<v Speaker 1>don't know the exact date. He went on to become

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<v Speaker 1>a legend for his financial scams as well as his

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<v Speaker 1>impersonation of a member of Congress and various other people.

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<v Speaker 1>Let's just say for right now, he was known for

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<v Speaker 1>walking about New York City with his diamond studied walking

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<v Speaker 1>stick for his horses, and also for being brash and

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<v Speaker 1>cutthroat in his dealings. So he was actually born David Levy.

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<v Speaker 1>We know that because he had a brother, Henry, who

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<v Speaker 1>would sign his last name Levy, and that how people

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<v Speaker 1>put it together. But David later told people that he

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<v Speaker 1>changed his last name to Lamar to match that of

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<v Speaker 1>a noted Mississippi senator in order to help facilitate his

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<v Speaker 1>business dealings. And Holly just said facilitate with quotation marks

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<v Speaker 1>around him. Yeah, that person he's referencing would presumably be

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<v Speaker 1>a man named Lucius Quintus Cincinnatis Lamar. And in the

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<v Speaker 1>eighteen seventies and eighteen eighties that Lamar served as both

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<v Speaker 1>a member of the U. S. House of Representatives and

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<v Speaker 1>then the U. S. Senate, and then he became Secretary

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<v Speaker 1>of the Interior and eventually an Associate Justice of the

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<v Speaker 1>Supreme Court. But here's the thing. L QC. Lamar's legacy

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<v Speaker 1>is one that is deeply rooted in racism. It is

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<v Speaker 1>extraordinarily ugly, and he had a lot of very active

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<v Speaker 1>rhetoric around white supremacy. So really not a great choice

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<v Speaker 1>for someone to associate yourself with via a name change.

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<v Speaker 1>It was not actually the only name that he would use, though,

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<v Speaker 1>David at Lamar also went by David Lewis, particularly during

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<v Speaker 1>a stretch of time he spent in Omaha, Nebraska, and

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<v Speaker 1>at one point JP Morgan smartly had become suspicious of

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<v Speaker 1>Lamar and his financial doings, and he put two and

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<v Speaker 1>you together, and he figured out that these were very

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<v Speaker 1>likely the very same man. So Morrigan actually paid to

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<v Speaker 1>have a judge from Omaha who had had dealings with

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<v Speaker 1>David Lewis fly to New York to identify David Lamar

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<v Speaker 1>as being the same man. And as you probably expected,

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<v Speaker 1>he was. And many sources say that David pretended to

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<v Speaker 1>be the heir of a wealthy Georgia family that allowed

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<v Speaker 1>him not only to live very extravagantly, but also gave

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<v Speaker 1>him better access to politicians and financial heavyweights. Some sources

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<v Speaker 1>also suggest that around people with money, David pretended to

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<v Speaker 1>be a legitimate businessman. He was charged with bribery in

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<v Speaker 1>in Virginia after what he got involved with, which the

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<v Speaker 1>press called quote electric franchise fight. Presumably he was trying

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<v Speaker 1>to help monopolize the delivery of electricity to people. He

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<v Speaker 1>went on to pose as a New York businessman while

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<v Speaker 1>he was in Mobile, Alabama. I mean, the list goes

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<v Speaker 1>on and on and on. It's actually kind of tricky

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<v Speaker 1>if you look back partically at his obituaries that came

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<v Speaker 1>out when he died, all of the newspapers are just

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<v Speaker 1>like lists of weird things that he was involved in,

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<v Speaker 1>and like his rap sheet, and it's actually so thick

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<v Speaker 1>it's you can see that they were even having trouble

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<v Speaker 1>keeping it all straight. It's hard to track the timeline

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<v Speaker 1>with the name and the associated event. Because he was mobile,

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<v Speaker 1>he was in a lot of places, and you can

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<v Speaker 1>see he managed to get into a lot of scrapes.

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<v Speaker 1>But he was very driven and even after any of

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<v Speaker 1>these scrapes, he always continued simply moving on from one

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<v Speaker 1>ruse to the next because he he had big imagination

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<v Speaker 1>um and knew a lot of people. Uh So, David

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<v Speaker 1>was the type of fraudster who would do whatever it

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<v Speaker 1>took to close a deal and make some money. And

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<v Speaker 1>early and really significant score for him was when he

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<v Speaker 1>fleeced the Rockefeller's in by manipulating George Rogers, who was

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<v Speaker 1>the secretary to Standard Oil founder John D. Rockefeller Senior.

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<v Speaker 1>David convinced the junior Rockefeller to buy stock in US Leather.

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<v Speaker 1>Rockefeller did buy that stock, and then David did short it.

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<v Speaker 1>Rockefeller Junior lost about a million dollars of his father's money. Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>so we told you we would talk about shorting. If

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<v Speaker 1>you do not know what shorting is, here is the

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<v Speaker 1>quick and dirty version because this will come up again,

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<v Speaker 1>and also it's just good life information to have. Shorting stock,

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<v Speaker 1>also called short selling, is when an investor borrows shares

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<v Speaker 1>and then immediately sells them with the intention of buying

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<v Speaker 1>them back later at a lower price. This is a

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<v Speaker 1>trading technique for people who are willing to take substantial

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<v Speaker 1>risk of capital laws, at least potentially substantial risk and lass.

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<v Speaker 1>It's also a trading technique that can make someone like

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<v Speaker 1>Jordan who we mentioned earlier, or David Lamar a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of pocket change. Yeah, he's gonna need a lot of

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<v Speaker 1>pockets right now. So much of David's story actually revolves

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<v Speaker 1>around following his arrest record, So we're moving ahead a

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<v Speaker 1>few years to a really great example of how ruthless

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<v Speaker 1>and cutthroat he could be, as well as his air

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<v Speaker 1>of feeling sort of above the laws he was doing things.

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<v Speaker 1>So in July, David's coachman was a man named James McMahon,

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<v Speaker 1>and he was supposed to appear in court to testify

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<v Speaker 1>against David Lamar on an assault charge. But unfortunately McMahon

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<v Speaker 1>was stabbed and beaten before he was able to enter

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<v Speaker 1>the courthouse, and because of this he was unable to testify.

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<v Speaker 1>David's brother in law and two of David's plays were

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<v Speaker 1>arrested and subsequently charged with having been involved in the

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<v Speaker 1>attack on McMahon. So now we're going to move on

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<v Speaker 1>the timeline to and that was an extraordinarily busy year

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<v Speaker 1>for Lamar. And during one scandal, a reporter actually asked

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<v Speaker 1>Lamar about his name change and his involvement in various

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<v Speaker 1>nefarious business dealings, and David replied, quote, I'm sorry, I've

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<v Speaker 1>never given an interview and I can't start now on

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<v Speaker 1>a personal matter. As for the matter of my change

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<v Speaker 1>in name, well, the Senate records show I declined to

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<v Speaker 1>tell the right one because it would make the innocent suffer.

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<v Speaker 1>Perhaps we really have no idea what he was getting

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<v Speaker 1>at with that, none whatsoever. I my personal suspicion is

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<v Speaker 1>that he was just trying to continue to cultivate his

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<v Speaker 1>air of mystery. I agree to, especially the addition of perhaps.

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<v Speaker 1>But it's here in nineteen thirteen when David begins to

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<v Speaker 1>impersonate some real big fish for power and financial gain.

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<v Speaker 1>Say you want an drive down steel prices in an

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<v Speaker 1>effort to short the stock and make huge amounts of

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<v Speaker 1>money for yourself. If you're David, you settle on a

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<v Speaker 1>plan to defraud the US Steel Corporation as well as

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<v Speaker 1>JP Morgan and Company, which pretty much dominated the corporate

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<v Speaker 1>finance world on Wall Street at the time. So to

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<v Speaker 1>do this, he figured he would pretend to be a

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<v Speaker 1>member of Congress. And he really did just do exactly that. Yes,

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<v Speaker 1>Like he woke up one day, I know this will work. Uh.

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<v Speaker 1>His target to impersonate was Pennsylvania Representative Alexander Mitchell Palmer,

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<v Speaker 1>who was a lawyer and a politician, and David faked

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<v Speaker 1>this persona in telephone interviews, and he even attempted but

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<v Speaker 1>failed to deliver a floor speech to persuade Congress to

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<v Speaker 1>his proposal. Sometimes your schemes, though, do not go as planned.

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<v Speaker 1>In this instance, while no one could see him over

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<v Speaker 1>the phone, and that seemed to work. He could not

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<v Speaker 1>mask his face in front of all those gersman who

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<v Speaker 1>actually knew Alexander Mitchell Palmer. That would actually been really

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<v Speaker 1>impressive on his impersonate, like the way that he was

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<v Speaker 1>imperson in people. And now he's like, now I covered

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<v Speaker 1>my face and face job it becomes Harry mission impossible

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<v Speaker 1>with the very much right, so Palmer. Actually, Palmer served

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<v Speaker 1>in Congress from nineteen and nine to nineteen fifteen, although

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<v Speaker 1>you probably actually know him better as the U. S.

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<v Speaker 1>Attorney General under President Wilson Woodrow Wilson. By nineteen twenty,

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<v Speaker 1>Palmer had his eye on the White House, and so

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<v Speaker 1>if you're not really familiar with his name, you may

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<v Speaker 1>be familiar with one of the things he's most famous

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<v Speaker 1>for doing, which were the Palmer Raids, conducted by the U. S.

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<v Speaker 1>Department of Justice between nineteen nineteen and January nine. The

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<v Speaker 1>raids kicked off what became known as the Red Summer,

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<v Speaker 1>and this was all led by Palmer, but it was

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<v Speaker 1>executed by a young j Edgar Hoover. This campaign targeted

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<v Speaker 1>people who were alleged communists anarchists, focused on people of

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<v Speaker 1>certain countries Russians were targeted, but basically any people who

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<v Speaker 1>were suspected of far left extremism were targets, and in

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<v Speaker 1>the end, about four thousand people were arrested and about

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<v Speaker 1>eight hundred were deported. Yeah, that whole thing started because

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<v Speaker 1>there was a bombing attack on Palmer, but then he

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<v Speaker 1>parlayed that into I am going after anyone I don't like,

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<v Speaker 1>particularly anyone for him, Like he just went mad with

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<v Speaker 1>his quest on that. It was kind of a weird

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<v Speaker 1>little story, you know, like somebody tried to bomb his house,

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<v Speaker 1>that messed up and blew themselves up, and the Roosevelts

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<v Speaker 1>looked across the street and they were afraid. So all

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<v Speaker 1>of this kind of played into what became this terrible year. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>they treated people absolutely horribly. David Lamar, not surprisingly, did

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<v Speaker 1>not get away with impersonating the Palmer, even though this

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<v Speaker 1>was several years price or when Palmer really would have

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<v Speaker 1>been in the every single paper in the United States,

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<v Speaker 1>though he was already a prominent politician, and David was

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<v Speaker 1>subsequently arrested at his apartment at the Hotel Laurelton, which

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<v Speaker 1>was in Manhattan's Midtown neighborhood. So to set the wealth scene. Here.

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<v Speaker 1>Let's say, if you're not familiar with New York City,

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<v Speaker 1>this is a neighborhood today where you'll find the Empire,

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<v Speaker 1>State Building, the christ they're building Times Square. I can

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<v Speaker 1>just keep listing them. There are many more attractions. But

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<v Speaker 1>back at the turn of the twentieth century, Midtown was

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<v Speaker 1>kind of a stagnant, almost commercial neighborhood. When David moved

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<v Speaker 1>in there though, it was undergoing a huge transformation and

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<v Speaker 1>moneyed families were turning the neighborhood into this bustling business district.

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<v Speaker 1>And that's when the big towers were created, the Prysler

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<v Speaker 1>Building was built, and it was all on par with

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<v Speaker 1>Wall Street when it came to power. Yeah, if you

0:13:56.160 --> 0:13:57.959
<v Speaker 1>look at the history of New York City, it's very

0:13:58.000 --> 0:14:01.840
<v Speaker 1>fascinating how initially the population was all clustered at the

0:14:01.840 --> 0:14:04.200
<v Speaker 1>south end of the island and it just slowly spread

0:14:04.240 --> 0:14:07.400
<v Speaker 1>up and up and up and up northward. Um, that's

0:14:07.400 --> 0:14:12.240
<v Speaker 1>a whole other story. It's a whole another show. In

0:14:12.360 --> 0:14:15.840
<v Speaker 1>a Senate committee hearing on this whole matter, Lamar, calmly

0:14:15.960 --> 0:14:20.480
<v Speaker 1>and perhaps amazingly, just confessed to impersonating people all the time.

0:14:20.680 --> 0:14:22.920
<v Speaker 1>A big deal. He would be like a picture of

0:14:23.000 --> 0:14:27.080
<v Speaker 1>nonchalance about it, and joked about it, like, oh yeah,

0:14:27.120 --> 0:14:30.760
<v Speaker 1>you got me. I'm impersonated people. It's hilarious, Like you

0:14:30.800 --> 0:14:35.600
<v Speaker 1>don't do that too. One press write up noted quote,

0:14:35.680 --> 0:14:39.800
<v Speaker 1>never before had the national lawmakers listened to such brazen

0:14:39.840 --> 0:14:43.800
<v Speaker 1>effrontery and acknowledgement of chicanery as came from the lips

0:14:43.840 --> 0:14:46.880
<v Speaker 1>of the Wolf of Wall Street on that occasion. His

0:14:46.960 --> 0:14:50.360
<v Speaker 1>own confessions clearly proved that his character was a dash

0:14:50.400 --> 0:14:54.440
<v Speaker 1>of Baron, Munchausen and Anius and a trace of Cagliostro.

0:14:55.080 --> 0:14:58.960
<v Speaker 1>I love that. That's a good description. It's a great

0:14:59.000 --> 0:15:01.640
<v Speaker 1>description that just apeared in the newspaper, like it has

0:15:01.680 --> 0:15:05.240
<v Speaker 1>a great description of him. So David was charged for

0:15:05.400 --> 0:15:07.880
<v Speaker 1>his attempt at impersonating a member of Congress, and on

0:15:07.960 --> 0:15:13.280
<v Speaker 1>December three, he appeared in the Federal District Court before

0:15:13.280 --> 0:15:17.280
<v Speaker 1>he had judged sessions, and after just about forty five minutes,

0:15:17.640 --> 0:15:22.080
<v Speaker 1>the jury found him guilty of impersonating by telephone representative

0:15:22.160 --> 0:15:27.000
<v Speaker 1>Alexander Mitchell Palmer with the intention of defrauding two major

0:15:27.120 --> 0:15:30.240
<v Speaker 1>corporate players. He was convicted on two counts of the

0:15:30.280 --> 0:15:34.480
<v Speaker 1>second of three indictments against him and his council planned

0:15:34.480 --> 0:15:37.440
<v Speaker 1>to appeal, and the court granted his counsel a writ

0:15:37.480 --> 0:15:40.080
<v Speaker 1>of error that meant a stay of execution of the

0:15:40.120 --> 0:15:43.160
<v Speaker 1>sentence pending the result of that appeal. And if that

0:15:43.320 --> 0:15:45.800
<v Speaker 1>just sounds like a lot of legal language in mumbo jumbo,

0:15:45.840 --> 0:15:48.400
<v Speaker 1>because kind of is. What it boils down to, is

0:15:48.440 --> 0:15:52.440
<v Speaker 1>that the court temporarily suspended David's sentence while his lawyers

0:15:52.440 --> 0:15:55.680
<v Speaker 1>prepared to challenge the case's outcome. And we did look

0:15:55.720 --> 0:15:57.960
<v Speaker 1>that up, of course as well. David did go on

0:15:58.080 --> 0:16:01.600
<v Speaker 1>to serve two years in Atlanta pen a tentury in Atlanta, Georgia.

0:16:02.320 --> 0:16:04.400
<v Speaker 1>We're going to take a quick break for a word

0:16:04.440 --> 0:16:07.400
<v Speaker 1>from our sponsor, but when we're back, we'll talk about

0:16:07.400 --> 0:16:21.160
<v Speaker 1>the sunset of david sordid occupation. Welcome back to Criminalia. Okay,

0:16:21.240 --> 0:16:24.680
<v Speaker 1>let's kick things off with David conspiring with a German

0:16:24.760 --> 0:16:31.040
<v Speaker 1>spy surprises no one. So over the years, the type

0:16:31.080 --> 0:16:34.000
<v Speaker 1>of David's engagements kind of changed a bit, although his

0:16:34.240 --> 0:16:37.120
<v Speaker 1>end goal was still, of course, power and money. So

0:16:37.280 --> 0:16:40.880
<v Speaker 1>fresh out of prison in nineteen fifteen, he acted as

0:16:40.920 --> 0:16:44.480
<v Speaker 1>an agent for Captain Franz von Rintelin, who was a

0:16:44.520 --> 0:16:48.800
<v Speaker 1>German naval intelligence officer which you could also call him

0:16:48.800 --> 0:16:51.960
<v Speaker 1>a German spy in the United States during World War One.

0:16:52.640 --> 0:16:55.560
<v Speaker 1>Much later, while giving a speech, the Captain joke amid

0:16:55.600 --> 0:16:59.120
<v Speaker 1>the audience is laughter that a secret service agent is

0:16:59.160 --> 0:17:02.000
<v Speaker 1>a spy. He is on the other side, but an

0:17:02.000 --> 0:17:06.560
<v Speaker 1>intelligence officer if working for you. He also admitted he

0:17:06.600 --> 0:17:09.640
<v Speaker 1>had lived in New York under five aliases, but that

0:17:09.720 --> 0:17:12.760
<v Speaker 1>was just about all he ever divulged of his intelligence

0:17:13.080 --> 0:17:16.280
<v Speaker 1>slash spy work. He was always pretty tight lipped about

0:17:16.280 --> 0:17:18.600
<v Speaker 1>what exactly he did and how exactly he did it.

0:17:19.520 --> 0:17:22.879
<v Speaker 1>Von Brintlin spoke on occasion about how the war would

0:17:22.880 --> 0:17:26.240
<v Speaker 1>not be decided in Europe. He believed rather that it

0:17:26.240 --> 0:17:28.879
<v Speaker 1>would be in the United States. So he struck a

0:17:28.920 --> 0:17:32.840
<v Speaker 1>plan to conduct a campaign of propaganda to improve relations

0:17:32.880 --> 0:17:35.840
<v Speaker 1>between the United States and Germany, and it would also,

0:17:35.960 --> 0:17:39.600
<v Speaker 1>he hoped, create a pro German sentiment in the US.

0:17:40.160 --> 0:17:43.280
<v Speaker 1>There was actually a second piece to this plan as well.

0:17:43.680 --> 0:17:46.160
<v Speaker 1>You know. So this was war and he also wanted

0:17:46.200 --> 0:17:49.320
<v Speaker 1>to curtail the commercial power in other countries and in

0:17:49.400 --> 0:17:52.960
<v Speaker 1>particular Great Britain. To do that, he wanted to prevent

0:17:53.040 --> 0:17:57.440
<v Speaker 1>munition manufacturing and shipments, and that meant strikes in American

0:17:57.560 --> 0:18:02.200
<v Speaker 1>munitions factories. This was important to the war effort, of course,

0:18:02.240 --> 0:18:06.240
<v Speaker 1>because munitions factories were making military weapons and equipment that

0:18:06.320 --> 0:18:10.480
<v Speaker 1>we're in high demands. Working together, Von Rintlin and David

0:18:10.600 --> 0:18:14.280
<v Speaker 1>Lamar as David Lamar this time concocted a plan to

0:18:14.440 --> 0:18:19.240
<v Speaker 1>pressure American munitions factories and shipping agencies to strike. They

0:18:19.240 --> 0:18:21.440
<v Speaker 1>figured out that they could do this by taking aim

0:18:21.440 --> 0:18:25.679
<v Speaker 1>at financial institutions and business organizations. And because of his

0:18:25.800 --> 0:18:29.520
<v Speaker 1>talent for manipulating people, as well as his obvious total

0:18:29.760 --> 0:18:33.760
<v Speaker 1>disregard for ethics and morals, David was considered the brains

0:18:33.800 --> 0:18:37.960
<v Speaker 1>behind this campaign. Von Rinteln gave him somewhere between three

0:18:38.040 --> 0:18:41.280
<v Speaker 1>hundred thousand to five hundred thousand dollars at the reports

0:18:41.280 --> 0:18:44.840
<v Speaker 1>on just how much vary. It's all big numbers, uh.

0:18:44.880 --> 0:18:48.600
<v Speaker 1>And this was given to David to implement the plan. Yeah.

0:18:48.600 --> 0:18:51.240
<v Speaker 1>You know, when you're doing spy work, you don't really

0:18:51.280 --> 0:19:00.359
<v Speaker 1>like broadcast your receipts on people speak your David Lamar

0:19:00.520 --> 0:19:05.159
<v Speaker 1>was not signing a received three dollars with a copy

0:19:06.320 --> 0:19:10.400
<v Speaker 1>right for this little carbon book. This whole thing, though,

0:19:10.440 --> 0:19:13.640
<v Speaker 1>despite all the money involved and promises of what would

0:19:13.800 --> 0:19:16.280
<v Speaker 1>be done with it, did not go as planned, and

0:19:16.320 --> 0:19:19.720
<v Speaker 1>that is because of David. Remember he was not any

0:19:19.800 --> 0:19:23.960
<v Speaker 1>kind of expert in such matters. He was an opportunistic poser.

0:19:25.320 --> 0:19:29.479
<v Speaker 1>David's reports on the campaign's success, when he reported von Riddlen,

0:19:29.960 --> 0:19:33.280
<v Speaker 1>we're all faked and they were always exaggerated, he was

0:19:33.320 --> 0:19:36.080
<v Speaker 1>basically like, yes, boss, everything is according to plan. Where

0:19:39.840 --> 0:19:42.639
<v Speaker 1>it was not until later that von Rentalin realized that

0:19:42.720 --> 0:19:45.119
<v Speaker 1>David had swindled him out of a large amount of

0:19:45.119 --> 0:19:48.040
<v Speaker 1>money and didn't deliver any results. And we should point

0:19:48.040 --> 0:19:52.560
<v Speaker 1>out this really doesn't reflect well on von Rentalin's intelligence

0:19:52.840 --> 0:20:00.960
<v Speaker 1>at all, Like, yeah, surely he should have spotted a collaborator,

0:20:01.520 --> 0:20:03.919
<v Speaker 1>but David somehow convinced him that he would be a

0:20:03.920 --> 0:20:07.200
<v Speaker 1>great partner in such a move. Why not, I's got

0:20:07.200 --> 0:20:11.120
<v Speaker 1>a lot of risk in and here's five thousand dollars um.

0:20:11.440 --> 0:20:15.200
<v Speaker 1>So it actually wasn't after he was swindled. It wasn't

0:20:15.280 --> 0:20:18.360
<v Speaker 1>bon Vinoline or any other man involved in the plan

0:20:18.440 --> 0:20:21.359
<v Speaker 1>as far as we can tell, who actually tipped off

0:20:21.480 --> 0:20:26.720
<v Speaker 1>the authorities. But David was yet again arrested. This time

0:20:26.720 --> 0:20:29.879
<v Speaker 1>he was convicted of conspiring with Germans and interfering with

0:20:30.000 --> 0:20:34.359
<v Speaker 1>munitions shipments, which technically yes, um he testified on his

0:20:34.520 --> 0:20:37.960
<v Speaker 1>own behalf that indeed he had engaged in the anti

0:20:38.040 --> 0:20:42.720
<v Speaker 1>munitions scam. David also gave up the captain and claimed

0:20:42.760 --> 0:20:45.359
<v Speaker 1>that the campaign was done at the request of actually

0:20:45.400 --> 0:20:48.800
<v Speaker 1>another man, someone named the Reverend doctor Thomas C. Hill,

0:20:49.240 --> 0:20:52.399
<v Speaker 1>who had also been a professor of Christian ethics at

0:20:52.520 --> 0:20:56.880
<v Speaker 1>Union Theological Seminary. Hill only comes up in the men's testimony.

0:20:56.920 --> 0:20:59.320
<v Speaker 1>Actually he remains a bit of a mystery to both

0:20:59.320 --> 0:21:03.040
<v Speaker 1>of us. Another man who was implicated in this plan

0:21:03.200 --> 0:21:06.720
<v Speaker 1>was Henry B. Martin, and he, like David, took the stand.

0:21:07.520 --> 0:21:10.000
<v Speaker 1>While he denied he knew that the money came from

0:21:10.000 --> 0:21:13.040
<v Speaker 1>a German source, he did admit that he accepted large

0:21:13.040 --> 0:21:15.840
<v Speaker 1>amounts of money from David, which he spent on the

0:21:15.880 --> 0:21:19.760
<v Speaker 1>behalf of the Labors National Peace Council as well as

0:21:19.800 --> 0:21:24.040
<v Speaker 1>promoting and distributing pro German propaganda to Americans. All of

0:21:24.119 --> 0:21:27.800
<v Speaker 1>the Labors National Peace Council really does sound like a

0:21:28.000 --> 0:21:31.679
<v Speaker 1>very official group. It actually wasn't at all. It was

0:21:31.840 --> 0:21:35.800
<v Speaker 1>a reputable organization, it was just one that David formed

0:21:35.880 --> 0:21:38.960
<v Speaker 1>all as part of this larger plan. So also taking

0:21:38.960 --> 0:21:41.840
<v Speaker 1>the stand that day was George Plockman, who was treasurer

0:21:41.960 --> 0:21:47.200
<v Speaker 1>of the Transatlantic Trust Company. He testified against von Riddlin, David,

0:21:47.480 --> 0:21:51.119
<v Speaker 1>a former congressman, and five associates for the Labors National

0:21:51.160 --> 0:21:56.160
<v Speaker 1>Peace Council. Other prominent businessmen and former politicians all denied

0:21:56.200 --> 0:21:59.360
<v Speaker 1>that they knew about any of this, and they definitely

0:21:59.600 --> 0:22:02.800
<v Speaker 1>or so claimed did not know that the Labor's National

0:22:02.800 --> 0:22:06.720
<v Speaker 1>Peace Council was backed by a German spy. The Sherman

0:22:06.760 --> 0:22:09.800
<v Speaker 1>Act passed in eight nine as a way to prosecute

0:22:09.920 --> 0:22:14.359
<v Speaker 1>violations that would include things like price fixing, market allocation,

0:22:14.480 --> 0:22:18.000
<v Speaker 1>and interfering with trade with the intent of lowering economic

0:22:18.040 --> 0:22:21.960
<v Speaker 1>competition for your personal gain. And if that doesn't sound

0:22:21.960 --> 0:22:25.360
<v Speaker 1>like David Lamar to you, yeah it does to us.

0:22:25.480 --> 0:22:30.280
<v Speaker 1>So the charge was conspiracy to instigate strikes, and the

0:22:30.320 --> 0:22:34.120
<v Speaker 1>men were all found guilty. David, Ron Ridlin, and Martin

0:22:34.280 --> 0:22:38.199
<v Speaker 1>were all sentenced to one year in jail. Yeah, it

0:22:38.240 --> 0:22:40.400
<v Speaker 1>kind of sounds like David Lamar read the Sherman Act

0:22:40.400 --> 0:22:42.640
<v Speaker 1>as like a job description, right, He's like, I could

0:22:42.680 --> 0:22:47.320
<v Speaker 1>do all these things, check in check. It should surprise

0:22:47.400 --> 0:22:50.520
<v Speaker 1>no one that after losing a scheme this big David

0:22:50.560 --> 0:22:54.440
<v Speaker 1>initially tried to run. According to the Evening Star of Washington,

0:22:54.480 --> 0:22:57.200
<v Speaker 1>d C quote, he jumped an appeal bond and fled

0:22:57.240 --> 0:23:01.479
<v Speaker 1>to Mexico by airplane, subsequently sur rendering himself and serving

0:23:01.480 --> 0:23:05.000
<v Speaker 1>out the sentence in Trenton, New Jersey. There's actually a

0:23:05.080 --> 0:23:07.920
<v Speaker 1>pretty steady stream of press coverage about all of this

0:23:08.080 --> 0:23:10.200
<v Speaker 1>while it was going on, and one of the most

0:23:10.320 --> 0:23:13.520
<v Speaker 1>fun to read is uh this story that ran in

0:23:13.560 --> 0:23:18.240
<v Speaker 1>the San Francisco Examiner in April of n under the

0:23:18.320 --> 0:23:23.240
<v Speaker 1>headline the Wolf of Wall Street Trapped, with the subheadline

0:23:23.680 --> 0:23:27.320
<v Speaker 1>A prison cell at Last awaits David Lamar, the most

0:23:27.440 --> 0:23:32.520
<v Speaker 1>daring and resourceful pirate whoever tormented New York's Great Financial District,

0:23:33.520 --> 0:23:36.159
<v Speaker 1>And perhaps the best paragraph from all of this the

0:23:36.480 --> 0:23:40.280
<v Speaker 1>reads quote, David Lamar has been one of those hovering vultures,

0:23:40.359 --> 0:23:43.000
<v Speaker 1>and from time to time he has prayed upon the

0:23:43.040 --> 0:23:46.679
<v Speaker 1>best workers of the financial district for many years until

0:23:46.760 --> 0:23:50.240
<v Speaker 1>he became known as the Wolf of Wall Street. While

0:23:50.280 --> 0:23:55.439
<v Speaker 1>he was surely active in his fraud and impersonations games,

0:23:55.520 --> 0:23:58.760
<v Speaker 1>it actually wasn't until ninety three when we find that

0:23:58.840 --> 0:24:02.399
<v Speaker 1>David again gets arrested, and this time it was a

0:24:02.480 --> 0:24:06.399
<v Speaker 1>charge of grand larceny involving the sale of rubber. History

0:24:06.400 --> 0:24:09.919
<v Speaker 1>actually doesn't have to say about this particular trial and

0:24:10.160 --> 0:24:14.639
<v Speaker 1>arrest and jailing. We don't really know that much about

0:24:14.680 --> 0:24:18.000
<v Speaker 1>the story except that he sold but he never delivered.

0:24:19.119 --> 0:24:21.840
<v Speaker 1>Throughout all of this, we should mention that David he

0:24:21.880 --> 0:24:24.560
<v Speaker 1>wasn't just scheming. He had a social life and a family.

0:24:25.119 --> 0:24:28.000
<v Speaker 1>In Nive he got married to an actress who was

0:24:28.040 --> 0:24:30.159
<v Speaker 1>thirty six years younger than him. She was just twenty

0:24:30.160 --> 0:24:32.040
<v Speaker 1>one at the time, and her name was Edna French.

0:24:32.359 --> 0:24:35.520
<v Speaker 1>But that was actually his second marriage, his first wife,

0:24:35.600 --> 0:24:39.000
<v Speaker 1>Marie Anderson. You'll remember we mentioned his brother in law earlier,

0:24:39.320 --> 0:24:42.119
<v Speaker 1>but Marie divorced him in nineteen four, a year before

0:24:42.119 --> 0:24:44.720
<v Speaker 1>he married French. Yeah, and and she doesn't come up

0:24:44.840 --> 0:24:50.040
<v Speaker 1>very much at all. So, not long after his rubber scandal,

0:24:51.280 --> 0:24:54.879
<v Speaker 1>on January twelve, four, when he was in his mid fifties,

0:24:55.280 --> 0:24:58.000
<v Speaker 1>David was found dead in a hotel room at the

0:24:58.119 --> 0:25:01.560
<v Speaker 1>Hotel Wellington in New York City. His death was determined

0:25:01.600 --> 0:25:04.639
<v Speaker 1>to have been caused by heart disease um and all

0:25:04.680 --> 0:25:07.120
<v Speaker 1>that was left of his fortune, which at one time

0:25:07.160 --> 0:25:11.000
<v Speaker 1>was said to be in the millions, was thirty eight

0:25:11.000 --> 0:25:15.040
<v Speaker 1>dollars in cash, a suit, a hat, a cane, a

0:25:15.119 --> 0:25:18.639
<v Speaker 1>gold watch and chain. And gold cuff links. The front

0:25:18.640 --> 0:25:20.600
<v Speaker 1>page of the New York Times the day after he

0:25:20.680 --> 0:25:24.520
<v Speaker 1>died ran the headline Lamar found dead in midtown hotel

0:25:24.960 --> 0:25:28.320
<v Speaker 1>Wolf of Wall Street dies obscure and alone owing a

0:25:28.359 --> 0:25:32.960
<v Speaker 1>week's room rent. Yeah, all of those stories that broke

0:25:33.040 --> 0:25:34.880
<v Speaker 1>when he was found dead, you could tell they were

0:25:34.920 --> 0:25:37.280
<v Speaker 1>just aching for it to be something more dramatic than

0:25:37.280 --> 0:25:40.240
<v Speaker 1>it was, and they're like listing out, like, well, a

0:25:40.280 --> 0:25:43.400
<v Speaker 1>hotel porter said he did um stick to his room

0:25:43.400 --> 0:25:46.439
<v Speaker 1>by himself and wanted his towels delivered without knocking like

0:25:46.480 --> 0:25:48.920
<v Speaker 1>a druggist down the street. Was like he did buy

0:25:48.960 --> 0:25:52.160
<v Speaker 1>a lot of heartburn medication. And it's like, yeah, because

0:25:52.160 --> 0:25:54.440
<v Speaker 1>he had heart disease, because he was about to die

0:25:54.440 --> 0:25:58.000
<v Speaker 1>of heart disease. Yes, it's not really a very thrilling

0:25:58.119 --> 0:26:02.040
<v Speaker 1>end for someone that led nefarious, but thrilling to the

0:26:02.119 --> 0:26:05.600
<v Speaker 1>spectator life exactly. No spy came and got him in

0:26:05.640 --> 0:26:09.560
<v Speaker 1>his room, right, and the whereabouts of his wife when

0:26:09.600 --> 0:26:12.440
<v Speaker 1>he was initially found were unknown according to those first

0:26:12.480 --> 0:26:16.080
<v Speaker 1>press coverage appearances about his death. But David's body was

0:26:16.200 --> 0:26:19.439
<v Speaker 1>claimed by Edna French Lamar on January sixteenth, that's four

0:26:19.520 --> 0:26:22.879
<v Speaker 1>days after the story broke from the Riverside Memorial Chapel

0:26:22.920 --> 0:26:26.520
<v Speaker 1>in Manhattan. A funeral was arranged for the following day,

0:26:26.520 --> 0:26:31.080
<v Speaker 1>and a burial immediately followed. Friends, and we're using quotes

0:26:31.119 --> 0:26:34.560
<v Speaker 1>around that because that is who Edna named of David.

0:26:34.640 --> 0:26:38.399
<v Speaker 1>We're covering the expenses. And that was all according to

0:26:38.440 --> 0:26:42.120
<v Speaker 1>a story that ran in the Brooklyn Daily Eagle. So

0:26:42.359 --> 0:26:45.360
<v Speaker 1>at one time in his I don't necessarily want to

0:26:45.400 --> 0:26:48.440
<v Speaker 1>call it a career, but like you know, it kind

0:26:48.480 --> 0:26:52.359
<v Speaker 1>of was a long career. He had an estate in

0:26:52.400 --> 0:26:55.520
<v Speaker 1>New Jersey, and he had a mansion on Fifth Avenue.

0:26:55.800 --> 0:26:59.920
<v Speaker 1>He had wealth on and off, but what do you want?

0:27:00.040 --> 0:27:02.800
<v Speaker 1>It really was power and recognition and I mean, yeah,

0:27:02.840 --> 0:27:05.520
<v Speaker 1>and wealth, but like he wanted that to come with it.

0:27:05.960 --> 0:27:09.120
<v Speaker 1>While we mentioned a few of the highlights, and there

0:27:09.160 --> 0:27:12.719
<v Speaker 1>are way more than we even talked about. There are

0:27:12.800 --> 0:27:16.119
<v Speaker 1>much smaller incidents that lended David in court over the years,

0:27:16.200 --> 0:27:21.240
<v Speaker 1>usually under accusations of swindling someone out of money. Often

0:27:21.320 --> 0:27:27.080
<v Speaker 1>and seemingly miraculously, he often went free, uh not totally free, though.

0:27:27.560 --> 0:27:29.480
<v Speaker 1>You know, you play this game long enough and you might,

0:27:29.760 --> 0:27:33.639
<v Speaker 1>like David, find yourself forbidden to have transactions with various

0:27:33.680 --> 0:27:38.080
<v Speaker 1>stock firms due to your various unscrupulous doings, um or

0:27:38.200 --> 0:27:41.760
<v Speaker 1>you know, often you'll just find yourself broke. Oh, David,

0:27:42.000 --> 0:27:47.119
<v Speaker 1>I know he wanted wealth and power so badly. I

0:27:47.160 --> 0:27:50.200
<v Speaker 1>mean he got it sometimes sometimes not and off sometimes

0:27:57.359 --> 0:28:00.880
<v Speaker 1>so h it's an interesting one actually to do a

0:28:00.960 --> 0:28:05.400
<v Speaker 1>mocktail for I think, um, I know, researching David, I

0:28:05.440 --> 0:28:08.639
<v Speaker 1>wanted to take a few shots of whatever. So uh,

0:28:08.840 --> 0:28:12.000
<v Speaker 1>you know, So what do you bring to the table

0:28:12.000 --> 0:28:15.320
<v Speaker 1>this week, my dear. So this is a drink that

0:28:15.359 --> 0:28:20.520
<v Speaker 1>I'm calling a wolf and sweet clothing, and this is

0:28:20.600 --> 0:28:23.880
<v Speaker 1>one that is, um, it's very yummy, but it does

0:28:23.960 --> 0:28:27.359
<v Speaker 1>have a surprise little kick even without any alcohol in it.

0:28:27.480 --> 0:28:30.679
<v Speaker 1>So it starts out with three ounces of orange juice,

0:28:31.520 --> 0:28:34.840
<v Speaker 1>and then you are going to take any kind of

0:28:34.880 --> 0:28:37.560
<v Speaker 1>spicy syrup. I did mind two ways. I have one

0:28:37.600 --> 0:28:40.840
<v Speaker 1>that's a spicy mango syrup and I have another that's

0:28:40.840 --> 0:28:42.920
<v Speaker 1>a hobby nurro lime syrup. And I made it both

0:28:42.960 --> 0:28:46.000
<v Speaker 1>ways and both were very delicious. The aftertaste was the

0:28:46.040 --> 0:28:48.960
<v Speaker 1>primary difference. Interesting. I always love when you bring in

0:28:49.000 --> 0:28:53.080
<v Speaker 1>the mango one good. I'll describe how they taste a

0:28:53.120 --> 0:28:56.040
<v Speaker 1>little bit different afterwards. Um. And then on top of that,

0:28:56.080 --> 0:28:58.880
<v Speaker 1>you're gonna pour three ounces of sprite, and I like

0:28:59.000 --> 0:29:00.640
<v Speaker 1>to not mix this as I go because I like

0:29:00.680 --> 0:29:03.400
<v Speaker 1>a little subtle gradient to it. And then you're going

0:29:03.440 --> 0:29:09.400
<v Speaker 1>to take some black cherry puree just and just drizzle

0:29:09.440 --> 0:29:11.520
<v Speaker 1>it on top, and it's going to sink largely to

0:29:11.520 --> 0:29:14.360
<v Speaker 1>the bottom, but it creates these pretty streaks in the drink,

0:29:14.760 --> 0:29:16.480
<v Speaker 1>and then you kind of top it with three to

0:29:16.520 --> 0:29:20.040
<v Speaker 1>four marrish you no cherries. So it looks very beautiful

0:29:20.080 --> 0:29:23.720
<v Speaker 1>and sweet, and it is very sweet. But what happens

0:29:23.840 --> 0:29:28.040
<v Speaker 1>because of that spiky syrup that's in there afterwards, Like

0:29:28.320 --> 0:29:30.360
<v Speaker 1>it leaves this like film in your mouth where you're

0:29:30.360 --> 0:29:34.920
<v Speaker 1>like hot, spicy hot. It's very subtle, it's not it's

0:29:34.960 --> 0:29:37.680
<v Speaker 1>not bad, but I feel like this is how people

0:29:37.720 --> 0:29:40.520
<v Speaker 1>felt when they met this person who looked very handsome

0:29:40.520 --> 0:29:43.040
<v Speaker 1>and very put together, and then they realized, like, I've

0:29:43.080 --> 0:29:49.200
<v Speaker 1>been duped. Where did um? Oh? This bites a little

0:29:49.240 --> 0:29:51.360
<v Speaker 1>bit at the end. So yeah, So the one that

0:29:51.400 --> 0:29:54.080
<v Speaker 1>I did with spicy mango, it leaves that sense of

0:29:54.120 --> 0:29:56.680
<v Speaker 1>spice in your mouth. And the one that I did

0:29:56.680 --> 0:29:59.520
<v Speaker 1>with the Habbanniro limes syrup, it's not so much a

0:29:59.600 --> 0:30:02.360
<v Speaker 1>taste is just the sensation of heat, so it's a

0:30:02.440 --> 0:30:04.800
<v Speaker 1>little bit different, but both are very yummy. And if

0:30:04.800 --> 0:30:07.479
<v Speaker 1>there's like another syrup that you have that is in

0:30:07.520 --> 0:30:10.760
<v Speaker 1>that sort of family, like sometimes I'll make hallepeen you syrup,

0:30:11.120 --> 0:30:13.240
<v Speaker 1>which is super easy. If anyone's interested, you just do

0:30:13.280 --> 0:30:16.320
<v Speaker 1>your simple syrup recipe, which is one part sugar to

0:30:16.360 --> 0:30:19.200
<v Speaker 1>one part water. Throw a couple of sliced Halloween ews

0:30:19.200 --> 0:30:21.360
<v Speaker 1>in there while you get it to boiling point and

0:30:21.440 --> 0:30:23.479
<v Speaker 1>make sure the sugar is dissolved, and then you let

0:30:23.520 --> 0:30:25.320
<v Speaker 1>it cool and then you strain out or pull out

0:30:25.360 --> 0:30:27.560
<v Speaker 1>the Halloween news if you want, you can leave them

0:30:27.560 --> 0:30:29.080
<v Speaker 1>in there to steep. It will make it hotter and

0:30:29.080 --> 0:30:31.560
<v Speaker 1>hotter depending on the Halloween you. There are lots of fun,

0:30:31.640 --> 0:30:34.720
<v Speaker 1>easy ways to make hot syrup, but that was the

0:30:34.760 --> 0:30:37.480
<v Speaker 1>one I did and it was very yummy. Now for

0:30:37.600 --> 0:30:40.560
<v Speaker 1>my drinkers in the crowd, I will shock you because

0:30:40.560 --> 0:30:42.960
<v Speaker 1>in my experiments, this is another time where I thought

0:30:43.040 --> 0:30:46.280
<v Speaker 1>vodka was going to be the easy clear winner, and

0:30:46.320 --> 0:30:49.320
<v Speaker 1>again it was gin. I don't know how it is changing.

0:30:49.600 --> 0:30:53.120
<v Speaker 1>What's going on. Jim. Jim goes so well with that,

0:30:53.200 --> 0:30:57.400
<v Speaker 1>like hyper sweet and citrus combination. This drink can be,

0:30:57.720 --> 0:31:00.200
<v Speaker 1>if you are not into sweetness, a little bit cloying.

0:31:00.680 --> 0:31:02.920
<v Speaker 1>So when you add gin, it really kind of like

0:31:03.120 --> 0:31:07.120
<v Speaker 1>cuts back on that that soda sweetness. And it was

0:31:07.160 --> 0:31:09.040
<v Speaker 1>really really yummy. But I didn't try it. But I

0:31:09.040 --> 0:31:10.600
<v Speaker 1>think you could also throw rum in here, like a

0:31:10.640 --> 0:31:13.440
<v Speaker 1>white rum, and it would be delightful. It would feel

0:31:13.520 --> 0:31:16.719
<v Speaker 1>very tropical at that point. Yeah, exactly. So I actually

0:31:16.880 --> 0:31:20.920
<v Speaker 1>will admit that I found Marischino chraerries in my refrigerator

0:31:21.360 --> 0:31:23.440
<v Speaker 1>and happened to mention it to Holly, who promised me

0:31:23.480 --> 0:31:25.480
<v Speaker 1>that she would use them for a drink at some point.

0:31:25.560 --> 0:31:29.640
<v Speaker 1>And so I am very excited about this because it's

0:31:29.640 --> 0:31:32.440
<v Speaker 1>either used them in his drink or eat them on

0:31:32.480 --> 0:31:35.480
<v Speaker 1>a fork. Well, you can also make yourself a little

0:31:35.480 --> 0:31:40.040
<v Speaker 1>Shirley Temple course with a lemon lime soda and some

0:31:40.120 --> 0:31:43.680
<v Speaker 1>Maraschino cherries and some pomegranate juice or any kind of

0:31:43.760 --> 0:31:47.000
<v Speaker 1>juice really, if you just do half juice, half lemon

0:31:47.040 --> 0:31:49.160
<v Speaker 1>lime soda, or even club soda, if you want to

0:31:49.200 --> 0:31:51.840
<v Speaker 1>take it back from that sweet place and throw those

0:31:51.920 --> 0:31:55.000
<v Speaker 1>cherries in there, delicious. I have a lot of options,

0:31:55.120 --> 0:31:58.800
<v Speaker 1>but I like yours, got to do it too. Uh yeah,

0:31:58.840 --> 0:32:00.520
<v Speaker 1>throw a little spicy sir up in there and you'll

0:32:00.560 --> 0:32:03.360
<v Speaker 1>get a nice surprise and you won't be cheated out

0:32:03.360 --> 0:32:06.800
<v Speaker 1>of your money and doing so, I hope, we all hope,

0:32:08.240 --> 0:32:11.480
<v Speaker 1>like I paid seven hundred dollars to this bottle of syrup,

0:32:11.560 --> 0:32:14.000
<v Speaker 1>Please don't do that. You can make it for a buck.

0:32:14.480 --> 0:32:17.320
<v Speaker 1>This guy outside the story told me that it would

0:32:17.320 --> 0:32:24.120
<v Speaker 1>be the cheapest that I would find in town ever. Ever. Alrighty,

0:32:24.200 --> 0:32:26.480
<v Speaker 1>thank you so much. We hope if you trying this

0:32:26.640 --> 0:32:29.480
<v Speaker 1>mocktail or cocktail that you dig it. We want to

0:32:29.480 --> 0:32:31.320
<v Speaker 1>thank you again for spending this time with us, and

0:32:31.320 --> 0:32:33.320
<v Speaker 1>we will see you right back here next week with

0:32:33.440 --> 0:32:41.200
<v Speaker 1>more imposters. Criminalia is a production of Shonda land Audio

0:32:41.280 --> 0:32:44.640
<v Speaker 1>in partnership with I Heart Radio. For more podcasts from

0:32:44.640 --> 0:32:47.600
<v Speaker 1>Shonda land Audio, please visit the I Heart Radio app,

0:32:47.760 --> 0:32:51.000
<v Speaker 1>Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows,