WEBVTT - Greek Fire: The Byzantine Secret Weapon 0:00:00.080 --> 0:00:03.120 Emperor Alexios ordered ships to be furnished by all the 0:00:03.120 --> 0:00:06.480 countries under the Roman sway. He had a number built 0:00:06.480 --> 0:00:09.160 in the capital itself, and would at intervals go round 0:00:09.400 --> 0:00:12.840 and instruct the shipwrights how to make them, as he 0:00:12.920 --> 0:00:15.319 knew that the Pieasons were skilled in sea warfare and 0:00:15.400 --> 0:00:17.640 dreaded a battle with them. On the prow of each 0:00:17.640 --> 0:00:19.560 ship he had a head fixed of a lion or 0:00:19.560 --> 0:00:22.400 other land animal, made in brass or iron, with the 0:00:22.440 --> 0:00:25.360 mouth open and then gilded over, so that their mere 0:00:25.440 --> 0:00:29.479 aspect was terrifying, And the fire which was to be 0:00:29.520 --> 0:00:32.000 directed against the enemy through tubes he made to pass 0:00:32.040 --> 0:00:34.560 through the mouths of the beast, so that it seemed 0:00:34.600 --> 0:00:36.839 as if the lions and the other similar monsters were 0:00:36.920 --> 0:00:46.280 vomiting the fire. Then the man called Count Lamon very 0:00:46.320 --> 0:00:49.480 boldly attacked the largest vessel at the stern, but got 0:00:49.600 --> 0:00:52.240 entangled in its rudders, and as he could not free 0:00:52.280 --> 0:00:54.560 himself easily, he would have been taken had he not, 0:00:54.720 --> 0:00:57.720 with great presence of mind, had recourse to his machine 0:00:58.280 --> 0:01:02.560 and poured fire upon the enemy very successfully. Then he 0:01:02.640 --> 0:01:05.240 quickly turned his ship round and set fire on the 0:01:05.319 --> 0:01:09.440 spot to three more of the largest barbarian ships. At 0:01:09.480 --> 0:01:12.160 the same moment, a squall of wind suddenly struck the 0:01:12.200 --> 0:01:15.440 sea and churned it up, and dashed ships together, and 0:01:15.520 --> 0:01:19.880 almost threatened to sink some. For the ways roared at 0:01:19.880 --> 0:01:24.080 the yard, arms creaked, and the sails were split. The 0:01:24.120 --> 0:01:27.840 barbarians now became thoroughly alarmed, firstly because of the fire 0:01:27.920 --> 0:01:30.920 directed upon them, for they were not accustomed to that 0:01:31.000 --> 0:01:34.759 kind of machine, nor to a fire which naturally flames upwards. 0:01:35.360 --> 0:01:38.759 Then this case was directed in whatever direction the sender desired, 0:01:39.360 --> 0:01:43.800 often downwards or laterally. And secondly, they were very much 0:01:43.880 --> 0:01:47.920 upset by the storm, and consequently they fled. That is 0:01:47.960 --> 0:01:57.680 what the barbarians did. Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your 0:01:57.680 --> 0:02:06.400 Mind from how Stop work dot com. Hey you welcome 0:02:06.440 --> 0:02:08.320 to stuff to Blow your Mind. My name is Robert 0:02:08.400 --> 0:02:11.360 Lamb and I'm Joe McCormick. And those were the words 0:02:11.440 --> 0:02:15.960 of eleventh and twelfth century Byzantine Princess Anna Comnena from 0:02:15.960 --> 0:02:19.560 her book The Alexiad. And we we only tweaked it 0:02:19.680 --> 0:02:22.720 slightly for performance purposes here and it was brought to 0:02:22.760 --> 0:02:25.800 life by Annie Reese, one of the hosts of food Stuff. 0:02:26.200 --> 0:02:29.239 Food Stuff is another podcast here in the house, stuff, works, family. 0:02:29.360 --> 0:02:32.919 It is about all things edible and potable, that's right. 0:02:32.960 --> 0:02:34.680 I don't I don't know that they've done anything on 0:02:34.800 --> 0:02:39.120 Greek food or Byzantine food, but just if if you 0:02:39.160 --> 0:02:42.520 can can't tell from that that lovely introduction, we are 0:02:42.520 --> 0:02:45.480 going to be talking about the Byzantine Empire, and we're 0:02:45.480 --> 0:02:48.400 going to be talking about a secret weapon of the 0:02:48.400 --> 0:02:52.720 Byzantine's weapon so secret that we're not even really sure 0:02:52.800 --> 0:02:56.080 what it consisted of in detail. Today we're talking about 0:02:56.200 --> 0:03:00.680 Greek fire, the nuclear bomb of the Middle Ages. I mean, really, 0:03:00.680 --> 0:03:03.160 it was ahead of its time. It was like napalm 0:03:03.360 --> 0:03:05.520 in the Middle Ages. It was like a flamethrower in 0:03:05.520 --> 0:03:08.120 the Middle Ages. Right, So we want to explore all 0:03:08.160 --> 0:03:11.160 the ins and outs of this ancient secret super weapon. 0:03:11.320 --> 0:03:13.079 I don't know does it qualify a super weapon. It's 0:03:13.120 --> 0:03:16.040 kind of small scale, but it's in terms of power 0:03:16.080 --> 0:03:18.679 and awe at the time, you could maybe consider it 0:03:18.720 --> 0:03:20.600 a super I would think, so, I mean it was 0:03:20.639 --> 0:03:24.120 a it was a super weapon that definitely inspired terror 0:03:24.520 --> 0:03:29.360 and was extremely effective in particular situations. As is the 0:03:29.360 --> 0:03:31.760 case with a lot of a shock and awe weaponry, 0:03:32.080 --> 0:03:35.080 you know, it can't win it's not gonna win a 0:03:35.120 --> 0:03:37.600 battle on its own. In the same way that you know, 0:03:37.640 --> 0:03:40.240 a tank is pretty great, but a tank needs infantry 0:03:40.240 --> 0:03:42.800 support if it's going to be effective. That's sort of thing, right. 0:03:42.840 --> 0:03:46.000 So to explore the world of Greek fire, all the science, 0:03:46.040 --> 0:03:49.040 all of the speculation about what it was, how it worked, 0:03:49.040 --> 0:03:51.840 how it came to be, we've got to first give 0:03:51.880 --> 0:03:55.680 you the setting. So what was the Byzantine Empire and 0:03:56.280 --> 0:03:59.640 where was Byzantium? All right, so we're basically talking about 0:03:59.640 --> 0:04:03.440 the read of the southern Balkans and Asia minor modern 0:04:03.520 --> 0:04:06.480 day Turkey. Yeah, rought modern day Turkey and part of Greece. 0:04:07.160 --> 0:04:09.600 But in the middle of the sixth century, this was 0:04:09.640 --> 0:04:12.280 an empire that that stretched out all the way across 0:04:12.520 --> 0:04:15.680 the North African coastal region from the Atlantic to Egypt, 0:04:16.360 --> 0:04:20.360 along with southern parts of Spain and Italy. Uh. Now, 0:04:20.400 --> 0:04:22.200 to give you a sort of a timeline of this 0:04:22.720 --> 0:04:27.760 of this empire, in three twenty four, Constantine, the Emperor 0:04:27.760 --> 0:04:32.200 Constantine moved the capital of the Roman Empire itself to Byzantium. 0:04:32.240 --> 0:04:34.520 And of course we know Constantine was the first Roman 0:04:34.560 --> 0:04:37.560 emperor to claim to have converted to Christianity. Yes, so 0:04:37.600 --> 0:04:41.039 that's key. So it's you know, Roman Christian Christianity here, 0:04:41.240 --> 0:04:45.279 the Holy Roman Empire. Now this went for this was 0:04:45.320 --> 0:04:48.200 a successful empire for quite a spell. Here. It wasn't 0:04:48.279 --> 0:04:53.000 until fourteen fifty three that Constantinople, the capital, fell to 0:04:53.080 --> 0:04:58.400 the Ottoman Empire, and afterwards, of course became Istanbul. Yeah, 0:04:58.440 --> 0:05:01.800 as the of the Animania songh we're illustrate for us. 0:05:02.480 --> 0:05:06.280 So all in all, this is an empire with one 0:05:06.320 --> 0:05:10.800 thousand nine year history. Yeah, though its borders changed a 0:05:10.880 --> 0:05:13.200 lot over the centuries, and during its final years the 0:05:13.200 --> 0:05:16.960 Byzantine Empire was reduced to a relatively minor state around 0:05:16.960 --> 0:05:20.920 the Constantinople area. But it's strange to realize that in 0:05:21.040 --> 0:05:25.640 some form the Roman Empire didn't actually end before the 0:05:25.680 --> 0:05:28.200 Middle Ages. And I usually think of when did the 0:05:28.279 --> 0:05:31.719 Roman Empire end? I think of the western Roman Empire 0:05:31.760 --> 0:05:34.720 around the city of Roman, which of course you know fell, 0:05:34.839 --> 0:05:38.960 and that that's ushers in what historians generally have thought 0:05:39.000 --> 0:05:41.480 of as the Middle Ages in Europe, you know, around 0:05:41.880 --> 0:05:45.359 the middle of the first millennium. But if you consider 0:05:45.560 --> 0:05:47.960 the eastern part of the Roman Empire, the Roman Empire, 0:05:48.000 --> 0:05:51.560 which it certainly did consider itself the Roman Empire. The 0:05:51.680 --> 0:05:56.919 Roman Empire in some form lasted until the Renaissance in Europe, 0:05:57.120 --> 0:05:59.479 which is a just a bizarre thing to consider. It 0:05:59.520 --> 0:06:03.200 just doesn't mesh with my normal view of history. Yeah, yeah, 0:06:03.400 --> 0:06:07.479 I think that's important to note. Uh. Likewise, I often 0:06:07.520 --> 0:06:09.480 fall into the trap of sort of thinking of the 0:06:09.520 --> 0:06:12.920 Byzantine Empire and thinking of it like sort of vaguely 0:06:12.960 --> 0:06:16.599 as a much smaller and briefer affair than it actually 0:06:16.800 --> 0:06:20.560 was now it's worth It's also important to note here 0:06:20.560 --> 0:06:23.719 that nobody actually called it the Byzantine Empire during its time. 0:06:24.440 --> 0:06:27.919 You only called inhabitants of Constantinople or a couple of 0:06:27.960 --> 0:06:31.800 other areas Byzantines. Now the subjects of the emperor themselves 0:06:31.800 --> 0:06:35.200 that they called themselves Romans, uh Constantine. The first, as 0:06:35.200 --> 0:06:37.599 we mentioned, was the Fruit was the first Christian ruler 0:06:37.600 --> 0:06:39.800 of the Roman Empire at least took on that mantle, 0:06:40.200 --> 0:06:42.640 uh he, and he moved the capital to Constantinople, and 0:06:42.680 --> 0:06:45.479 as such they were the Christian Roman Empire, and the 0:06:45.520 --> 0:06:48.640 western remnants of the Roman Empire proper, you know, they 0:06:48.680 --> 0:06:52.360 fell into barbarians successor kingdoms. So we mentioned that the 0:06:52.400 --> 0:06:55.560 Byzantine Empire had, you know, over a thousand year history, 0:06:55.880 --> 0:06:59.800 and during this time it was pretty much constantly at 0:07:00.000 --> 0:07:03.520 war in some form or another. It was constantly challenged 0:07:03.520 --> 0:07:05.560 by its neighbors. In the east, you had first the 0:07:05.600 --> 0:07:09.440 Persian Empire and then various Islamic powers later on. And 0:07:09.480 --> 0:07:13.040 to the north there were the Slavs and the Turkish Avars. 0:07:13.360 --> 0:07:16.680 There were the Bulgars, the Hungarians, the Serbs, and finally 0:07:16.920 --> 0:07:19.600 the Ottoman Turks. Um. I know, it seems kind of 0:07:19.600 --> 0:07:21.560 weird that you would put them with the north, but 0:07:21.640 --> 0:07:24.080 like that was sort of the shape of of of 0:07:24.640 --> 0:07:29.520 geographically of the territory at the time. So and and 0:07:29.520 --> 0:07:32.160 then likewise, in the West, they were constantly engaging in 0:07:32.200 --> 0:07:35.440 these tents struggles with Greek city straight states and other 0:07:35.640 --> 0:07:40.000 Roman remnants, often with complications from papal politics. Yeah, and 0:07:40.080 --> 0:07:43.400 some of those complications get very complicated. Like one of 0:07:43.400 --> 0:07:45.720 the things a lot of people don't realize about some 0:07:45.760 --> 0:07:49.440 of the Crusades is that, yes, the Crusades were waged 0:07:49.560 --> 0:07:54.280 by European Christians, often against Muslims and Jews, but they 0:07:54.360 --> 0:07:58.760 also sometimes fought the Byzantine Christians. Yeah, I mean, there's 0:07:58.800 --> 0:08:02.040 the whole elder in the Crusades of the essentially the 0:08:02.080 --> 0:08:07.200 sacking of Constantinople by the Christian crusaders. Yeah, for usually 0:08:07.240 --> 0:08:11.960 for complicated, petty political reasons. But you know, they survived 0:08:11.960 --> 0:08:14.240 all this time, and one of and one of the 0:08:14.280 --> 0:08:18.160 reasons was that they were essentially still the Roman empire 0:08:18.200 --> 0:08:21.880 and spirit. They were well organized, they boasted strong fiscal 0:08:21.960 --> 0:08:26.640 and military systems, again testaments to their Roman history. And 0:08:26.720 --> 0:08:30.000 of course they had a secret weapon. There's nothing better 0:08:30.160 --> 0:08:33.080 than a secret weapon there. Really, we were talking about 0:08:33.120 --> 0:08:35.880 this earlier there. How many secret weapons can you really 0:08:35.960 --> 0:08:39.760 think of, even in the modern age? Well, I mean 0:08:39.800 --> 0:08:43.280 you can definitely. The modern parallel that comes to mind 0:08:43.360 --> 0:08:46.240 is the race for the atom bomb during the World 0:08:46.280 --> 0:08:48.560 War two era. It's it's a thing where if you 0:08:48.600 --> 0:08:50.840 go back and read it at the time, even if you, 0:08:51.400 --> 0:08:53.560 you know, don't think that the atom bomb was a 0:08:53.600 --> 0:08:56.240 good thing for humanity to have discovered. I mean, we 0:08:56.720 --> 0:08:58.480 probably might a lot of us agree that the world 0:08:58.520 --> 0:09:00.880 would be better if nuclear weapons didn't exist, though some 0:09:00.920 --> 0:09:04.079 people might argue otherwise. Some people might say that it's 0:09:04.080 --> 0:09:07.720 a really useful deterrent against more large scale conventional war. 0:09:08.320 --> 0:09:11.880 But it's a scary time. It's like trying to imagine 0:09:11.880 --> 0:09:14.239 what would the world have been like if the Nazis 0:09:14.280 --> 0:09:18.120 had gotten the atomic bomb first, or other scenarios along 0:09:18.120 --> 0:09:22.559 those lines. Yeah, yeah, I think that the atomic bomb, 0:09:22.559 --> 0:09:25.640 along with the various biological and chemical weapons are are 0:09:25.679 --> 0:09:29.160 probably the best analogy we have. But then to think 0:09:29.200 --> 0:09:32.760 of this in the Middle Ages, to to extrapolate similar 0:09:32.800 --> 0:09:37.719 circumstances regarding state secrets and weapons systems, it's it's kind 0:09:37.720 --> 0:09:41.520 of mind bockling right now. Greek fire is certainly much 0:09:41.559 --> 0:09:44.920 smaller in applied scale than a large scale bomb like 0:09:44.960 --> 0:09:48.199 an atomic weapon in the twentieth century, but it may 0:09:48.240 --> 0:09:51.880 be no less terrifying in the way that it's represented 0:09:51.920 --> 0:09:55.640 in legend. Oh yes, yeah, because we're talking about essentially 0:09:55.800 --> 0:09:57.840 we'll get into the details here, and you already had 0:09:57.840 --> 0:10:01.160 an example from the intro. We're talking about ships spewing 0:10:01.920 --> 0:10:06.840 liquid fire like essentially spewing napalm onto enemy vessels, onto 0:10:06.880 --> 0:10:11.079 the water itself, causing the water to burn and then 0:10:11.080 --> 0:10:14.640 of course to burn ships, which are generally highly flammable 0:10:15.000 --> 0:10:18.160 as well as the individuals aboard. You would, I would think, 0:10:18.160 --> 0:10:22.720 certainly think twice about approaching one of these Byzantine vessels, 0:10:22.840 --> 0:10:25.720 especially if it had a visible uh you know, animal 0:10:25.760 --> 0:10:27.800 head on the front. But you can also think about 0:10:27.800 --> 0:10:31.320 it from the from the individual sailor's perspective, like the 0:10:31.440 --> 0:10:34.040 terror that would be inflicted on them, because if you 0:10:34.080 --> 0:10:38.360 so you imagine a naval battle and you are approaching 0:10:38.360 --> 0:10:42.120 a ship that is spewing fire, it is probably the 0:10:42.160 --> 0:10:44.600 case that because you're a medieval sailor, you don't know 0:10:44.640 --> 0:10:47.439 how to swim, and you might be far from shore, 0:10:47.880 --> 0:10:51.120 and so you were facing two possible fates either burning 0:10:51.120 --> 0:10:54.679 alive or jumping overboard and drowning. And even if you 0:10:54.720 --> 0:10:57.920 could swim, the water is now on fire. Yeah, so 0:10:58.040 --> 0:11:00.280 that's it's not like you have a great option either. 0:11:00.640 --> 0:11:02.640 Now we know there have been all kinds of thermal 0:11:02.679 --> 0:11:05.960 and incendiary weapons used throughout history. Fire plays a big 0:11:06.120 --> 0:11:09.680 role in more fair going back to prehistoric times, uh, 0:11:09.720 --> 0:11:13.240 you know, just like burning and raising villages. Like a 0:11:13.280 --> 0:11:18.080 common way of siege tactics before siege engines were invented 0:11:18.120 --> 0:11:20.760 would be to just set fire to crops and villages 0:11:20.800 --> 0:11:26.719 surrounding a besieged castle or fortification to essentially draw them out, 0:11:26.720 --> 0:11:28.640 to say like we're going to torch everything you have 0:11:28.760 --> 0:11:30.600 if you don't come out to fight us. What kind 0:11:30.600 --> 0:11:33.200 of goes back to our episode on fire. Fire is 0:11:33.200 --> 0:11:36.560 is the basic, you know, the basic aspect of human technology. 0:11:36.880 --> 0:11:38.560 So as long as we've had it, we've used it 0:11:38.600 --> 0:11:42.360 for to kill each other and to keep each other alive, right, 0:11:42.440 --> 0:11:44.800 And so it's it's quite clear and quite easy to 0:11:44.840 --> 0:11:47.160 see why it's a useful tool. And more also, it 0:11:47.200 --> 0:11:49.760 has that kind of scary element because it's not just 0:11:49.800 --> 0:11:52.000 a directed weapon like an arrow or a sword. It 0:11:52.040 --> 0:11:54.840 has a life of its own. You release fire into 0:11:54.880 --> 0:11:56.880 the wild and it can sort of carry on with 0:11:56.960 --> 0:12:00.920 its own business without completely unaided by your continued efforts. 0:12:01.600 --> 0:12:04.560 But I want to know when's the first time we 0:12:04.600 --> 0:12:09.080 saw this specific version of incendiary weaponry use What when 0:12:09.080 --> 0:12:12.200 does Greek Fire itself first come on the scene. Well, 0:12:12.240 --> 0:12:14.400 I'm glad you asked, Joe. It was the year six 0:12:14.520 --> 0:12:17.880 seventy eight, and uh in Constantinople was in a kind 0:12:17.880 --> 0:12:20.160 of a tight spot, right, And so going forward from 0:12:20.160 --> 0:12:22.120 this point, I just want to acknowledge one of our 0:12:22.120 --> 0:12:25.480 main sources. It is a really interesting paper back from 0:12:26.240 --> 0:12:29.800 two in the journal Technology and Culture by Alex Rowland 0:12:29.880 --> 0:12:33.480 called Secrecy, Technology and War, Greek Fire and the defensive 0:12:33.520 --> 0:12:36.600 Byzantium six to twelve O four. So a lot of 0:12:36.600 --> 0:12:38.719 our information going forward is going to be coming from here, 0:12:38.720 --> 0:12:41.560 but we'll mention a few other sources also. So at 0:12:41.600 --> 0:12:46.200 six Constantinople we're under siege. What's happening? Okay? So the 0:12:46.280 --> 0:12:50.840 caliph Mawija has dispatched his fleet for the fifth consecutive time, 0:12:51.400 --> 0:12:54.839 and he's taken the peninsula of sizy Couse and here 0:12:54.960 --> 0:12:59.480 just south of the Byzantine capital, uh, the entire era 0:12:59.760 --> 0:13:02.920 name forces here. They've converged with the army and they're 0:13:02.960 --> 0:13:06.080 going to march on Constantinople and besiege it. Okay, So 0:13:06.160 --> 0:13:10.600 we have the Arab forces moving in and Constantinople, how's 0:13:10.640 --> 0:13:13.680 it going to defend itself? Well, I mean, luckily it 0:13:13.760 --> 0:13:16.320 is a it is a very defensible city at the time, 0:13:16.559 --> 0:13:17.559 and so they have a lot of a lot of 0:13:17.559 --> 0:13:19.200 stuff going for them. But that this is the thing 0:13:19.240 --> 0:13:23.880 about being besieged, is that it is a long term affair. 0:13:24.000 --> 0:13:28.400 Usually it's about a steady strangling of the city of 0:13:28.559 --> 0:13:32.719 the nation. Even but being a coastal city, Constantinople has 0:13:32.760 --> 0:13:36.160 a lot of a lot of its power and resources 0:13:36.200 --> 0:13:38.920 in its ability to travel the seas, right, So if 0:13:38.960 --> 0:13:42.280 you've got a fleet coming in to attack your ability 0:13:42.320 --> 0:13:45.360 to travel the seas, that's no good, that's right. So 0:13:45.400 --> 0:13:49.920 they luckily Constantinople had a strong navy and pretty much 0:13:49.920 --> 0:13:54.599 had a strong Imperial navy at least isolated to Constantinople 0:13:54.679 --> 0:13:58.320 for the you know, the duration of the empire. But 0:13:59.200 --> 0:14:01.760 what they needed the was it was a particular weapon. 0:14:01.800 --> 0:14:04.720 They needed something that would really give them a strong advantage, 0:14:04.840 --> 0:14:07.680 an advantage the likes of which we we we we 0:14:07.800 --> 0:14:10.600 heard in the intro to this episode, and that's where 0:14:10.800 --> 0:14:15.760 a particular individual comes into play. Kalinkas. Yes, the stories 0:14:15.880 --> 0:14:19.960 tell us that Kalinkas was a Syrian architect and engineer 0:14:20.120 --> 0:14:24.000 from the town known at the time as Heliopolis of Syria, 0:14:24.040 --> 0:14:27.080 and he arrived in Constantinople as a refugee after he 0:14:27.120 --> 0:14:30.120 had been driven out of his homeland, so he'd recently 0:14:30.280 --> 0:14:34.280 escaped the Arab conquest of Syria. He brought his military 0:14:34.360 --> 0:14:37.840 ideas and inventions with him to the Byzantines and essentially 0:14:37.960 --> 0:14:41.120 he showed up on their doorsteps and offered them the 0:14:41.160 --> 0:14:44.040 science of napalm. Really, what is with what it breaks 0:14:44.040 --> 0:14:47.040 down to, how do you imagine that scene breaking down, 0:14:47.040 --> 0:14:49.320 like he knocks on the city walls and says, I 0:14:49.400 --> 0:14:52.040 have a flamethrower. Yeah, I mean, I guess you had. 0:14:52.080 --> 0:14:54.080 He had to make a case for it, like, hey, 0:14:54.160 --> 0:14:57.440 I've got some ideas. They're they're really explosive, you're gonna 0:14:57.440 --> 0:15:00.400 love them. Or maybe there was a post saying, hey, 0:15:00.400 --> 0:15:04.280 we have an opening for a you know, a weapons engineer, 0:15:04.320 --> 0:15:07.640 a chemical engineer to help us with our weapons systems 0:15:08.000 --> 0:15:11.560 for this upcoming siege. What does a medieval weapons pitch 0:15:11.640 --> 0:15:14.880 meeting look like. I don't know, but I'm I guess 0:15:14.880 --> 0:15:16.720 it's you know, it's like an audience with the king 0:15:16.840 --> 0:15:20.720 or or dignitaries, and then you know he's probably showing 0:15:20.760 --> 0:15:23.360 them some plans or something. Right, however he ended up 0:15:23.360 --> 0:15:27.360 pitching it, it was accepted. In fact, it was even 0:15:27.440 --> 0:15:31.840 referred to as clinicals fire, as well as Roman fire, 0:15:32.240 --> 0:15:36.160 marine fire, liquid fire, artificial fire, and of course Greek fire. 0:15:36.400 --> 0:15:39.160 Now it probably wasn't referred to as Greek fire at 0:15:39.200 --> 0:15:41.600 the time by the Byzantines because they didn't even think 0:15:41.680 --> 0:15:44.680 of themselves as Greeks. I think that name that Appellachian 0:15:44.720 --> 0:15:48.840 came later from Western Europeans. Right, like Crusaders would encounter 0:15:48.960 --> 0:15:52.680 this or something like it, and because they were going 0:15:52.760 --> 0:15:54.760 east when they saw it, they referred to it as 0:15:54.800 --> 0:15:57.600 Greek fire, right, and then the name that name, in 0:15:57.640 --> 0:16:00.720 particular Greek fire, ends up being applied. I do various 0:16:00.760 --> 0:16:04.000 things that might not have been the same Greek fire 0:16:04.040 --> 0:16:07.440 weapons system, or might have been just something just you know, 0:16:07.760 --> 0:16:11.400 remotely similar, like maybe you just involved flaming oils of 0:16:11.440 --> 0:16:14.120 some sort. Yeah, I've got to comment on that actually. So, 0:16:14.160 --> 0:16:17.120 according to Kelly Dvrees and Robert Douglas Smith in their 0:16:17.160 --> 0:16:21.080 book Medieval Military Technology from University of Toronto Press in 0:16:22.120 --> 0:16:25.600 basically there were many different types of weapons referred to 0:16:25.720 --> 0:16:29.000 as Greek fire and the extant literature throughout the Middle Ages, 0:16:29.720 --> 0:16:32.880 so there were they separated into three main categories. You've 0:16:32.880 --> 0:16:35.880 got liquid fire pumped out through a nozzle, and then 0:16:35.960 --> 0:16:40.240 a liquid incendiary weapon that's hurled in small ceramic grenades. 0:16:40.960 --> 0:16:44.560 And then you've got later solid incendiaries that used explosive 0:16:44.600 --> 0:16:47.480 so that'd be something more like gunpowder. For the purposes 0:16:47.480 --> 0:16:51.320 of today's discussion, we're focusing primarily on that original Byzantine 0:16:51.320 --> 0:16:54.360 marine fire, which is what Anna Komnina was describing it's 0:16:54.400 --> 0:16:57.400 a liquid jet of flame that vomited out of a 0:16:57.440 --> 0:17:00.440 nozzle on the ends of ships. And for for the 0:17:00.440 --> 0:17:04.800 purposes of simplicity, we could also call it Kalina costs fire, 0:17:04.920 --> 0:17:07.520 because that specifies that it's what was used in the 0:17:07.560 --> 0:17:11.520 eighth century by the Byzantines in their ships, these flamethrowers 0:17:11.760 --> 0:17:16.200 coming out the prow of the of the Byzantine warships. Now, 0:17:16.560 --> 0:17:19.840 in the case of this initial rollout of Greek fire, 0:17:20.400 --> 0:17:22.840 uh it turned. It was able to help turn the tide. 0:17:22.880 --> 0:17:26.240 According to the accounts, they are able to drive back 0:17:26.280 --> 0:17:28.440 the invaders and the remnants of the air of fleet 0:17:28.480 --> 0:17:32.040 were then subsequently lost in a mighty storm. And when 0:17:32.080 --> 0:17:36.440 the forces again attempted the investiture of Constantinople and seven seventeen, 0:17:36.800 --> 0:17:39.560 the Byzantines again used the Greek fire, and this time 0:17:39.600 --> 0:17:43.160 they apparently had a an improved formula, and the invaders 0:17:43.160 --> 0:17:46.240 were driven off once again. And and this is a 0:17:46.320 --> 0:17:48.080 kind of a key historic moment, by the way, some 0:17:48.160 --> 0:17:52.960 historians rank it only under Charles Martel's victories over Islamic 0:17:53.000 --> 0:17:55.800 invaders in southern France during the seven thirties is a 0:17:55.880 --> 0:17:59.720 key stop point for Muslim expansion into Europe. So it's 0:17:59.760 --> 0:18:02.360 some one of those moments in time where it's hard 0:18:02.400 --> 0:18:07.040 to imagine a timeline forking off in an alternate direction. Yeah. 0:18:07.119 --> 0:18:09.760 I always love those things in history, like those key 0:18:09.800 --> 0:18:14.600 moments where I've never heard of like an alternate history 0:18:14.640 --> 0:18:16.840 that explores what would have happened if things had gone 0:18:16.880 --> 0:18:19.240 the other way. But I want to read that book. 0:18:19.280 --> 0:18:21.680 Maybe it's out there, yeah, yeah, and maybe maybe HBO 0:18:21.760 --> 0:18:25.240 will adapt it. It It sounds equally problematic to to have 0:18:25.359 --> 0:18:28.919 like a modern series showing what a you know, what 0:18:28.960 --> 0:18:33.359 a predominantly Islamic at least, you know, at least Eastern 0:18:33.400 --> 0:18:36.280 Europe would have looked like you know, it's just it's 0:18:36.320 --> 0:18:38.800 fascinating to try and try and picture how that would 0:18:38.840 --> 0:18:41.800 have come together in an alternate timeline. But we should 0:18:41.800 --> 0:18:44.719 focus on the technology itself, because that's the core of today. 0:18:44.800 --> 0:18:49.680 What was Greek fire? Yeah, I mean, as you might 0:18:49.720 --> 0:18:52.000 imagine with a wonder when weapons such as this, it 0:18:52.600 --> 0:18:55.600 was a matter of state secret, and it's a secret 0:18:55.640 --> 0:18:59.000 that seemingly died with the death of the Byzantine Empire 0:18:59.040 --> 0:19:03.679 in the four or maybe much earlier. We'll get to 0:19:04.359 --> 0:19:08.200 uh and to this day, chemists and historians. They continue 0:19:08.240 --> 0:19:12.080 to devise possible recipes for it, and thoughts not only 0:19:12.119 --> 0:19:15.200 on the the just the the liquid itself, but also 0:19:15.240 --> 0:19:18.960 the weapons system and involved here what what what were 0:19:18.960 --> 0:19:21.440 they cooking up? How are they dishing it out? And 0:19:22.040 --> 0:19:24.639 to what degree was anyone ever able to replicate it? 0:19:25.160 --> 0:19:28.000 Fascinating questions we will explore in depth when we come 0:19:28.040 --> 0:19:35.119 back from this break. Thank thank alright, we're back now, Robert. 0:19:35.160 --> 0:19:38.520 We're onto the Greek fire itself, the chemistry of the 0:19:38.560 --> 0:19:42.800 liquid substance, the liquid flame, and the delivery system for it. 0:19:42.880 --> 0:19:46.560 So what do modern scholars think about Greek fire and 0:19:46.800 --> 0:19:49.040 and what do we know about Greek fire from these 0:19:49.080 --> 0:19:51.800 medieval descriptions that we can use to try to figure 0:19:51.800 --> 0:19:55.560 out how it worked. Yes, let's get into the main 0:19:55.640 --> 0:19:58.359 properties of Greek fire. Though before we do that, I 0:19:58.400 --> 0:20:01.560 do want to point out one point that Rowland makes 0:20:01.600 --> 0:20:06.359 in his his paper, and that's the historian Theophanes wrote 0:20:06.400 --> 0:20:09.520 that the Bysantine, the Bysantine emperor, already had a fire 0:20:09.560 --> 0:20:13.440 ship program in the works two years before the arrival 0:20:13.760 --> 0:20:17.320 of Kalin cost So it remains a mystery exactly what 0:20:17.480 --> 0:20:20.640 the nature of the prior system weapons system was and 0:20:20.680 --> 0:20:24.720 how he improved upon it with presumably with his formula. Yeah, 0:20:24.760 --> 0:20:27.600 that is one interpretation I've read that some modern historians 0:20:27.600 --> 0:20:29.480 look at this and say, okay, Kalina Coss if you 0:20:29.520 --> 0:20:31.640 assume he was a real person and he did show 0:20:31.720 --> 0:20:34.959 up to help with the Greek fire system, that what 0:20:35.040 --> 0:20:38.200 he actually did was not invent Greek fire or bring 0:20:38.280 --> 0:20:41.720 them Greek fire, but that he improved upon their recipe. 0:20:41.760 --> 0:20:45.000 That they already had some kind of chemical incendiary weapon 0:20:45.440 --> 0:20:48.440 that could be lit and and tossed out over enemies, 0:20:48.480 --> 0:20:51.600 but that he made it much more powerful. And what 0:20:51.680 --> 0:20:55.159 are the key characteristics that are often reported about this 0:20:55.240 --> 0:20:58.840 powerful version of Greek fire or Kalina Coast fire. Okay, 0:20:58.880 --> 0:21:02.440 so they're they're basic four of these properties. First of all, 0:21:02.520 --> 0:21:05.399 we've already alluded to this. It burns in water. Some 0:21:05.480 --> 0:21:08.720 say it some say it was ignited by water, but 0:21:08.800 --> 0:21:12.159 this is almost certainly a myth. It's also said that 0:21:12.240 --> 0:21:16.359 only vinegar, sand or urine could extinguish it. Now in 0:21:16.440 --> 0:21:18.960 the next key characteristic, it was a liquid. It was 0:21:19.040 --> 0:21:22.359 something that was vomited forth from one of these animal 0:21:22.400 --> 0:21:25.960 heads or a siphon number three at sea, it was 0:21:26.000 --> 0:21:30.560 shot from tubes, or siphons and very rarely used on land. Okay, 0:21:30.600 --> 0:21:33.680 so it mainly came out of the prow of a ship, right, yeah, 0:21:33.680 --> 0:21:36.280 this and it's something that would be you know, squirted 0:21:36.359 --> 0:21:41.040 or blasted out of um an aperture. And then finally, 0:21:41.160 --> 0:21:42.920 and this is this one is really interesting and will 0:21:42.960 --> 0:21:45.400 come into some of the theories that we're going to discuss. 0:21:45.800 --> 0:21:49.360 There was smoke and a booming sound as it vomited 0:21:49.400 --> 0:21:52.919 forth from the tube. And this is about as detailed 0:21:52.920 --> 0:21:56.199 as our understanding of the properties get Like, most of 0:21:56.200 --> 0:21:58.240 the theories that we're looking at are going to be 0:21:58.680 --> 0:22:02.560 speculating based on these characteristics. Now, all but the use 0:22:02.560 --> 0:22:06.199 of tubes, you can find in prior incendiary weapons used 0:22:06.240 --> 0:22:09.320 by other people, such as various historical accounts of just 0:22:09.560 --> 0:22:13.280 flaming oils being used. Fireworks existed in the region as 0:22:13.320 --> 0:22:15.959 early as the fourth century, and those could have created 0:22:16.000 --> 0:22:19.080 smoke and noise. But still there are a lot of 0:22:19.160 --> 0:22:22.800 questions regarding you know what, what exactly is going on here. Well, 0:22:22.840 --> 0:22:25.960 let's chase those questions, man, all right, let's do it. Okay, So, 0:22:26.080 --> 0:22:30.000 what are some potential ingredients that have been hypothesized by 0:22:30.080 --> 0:22:33.919 modern scholars that would have been constituents of the Greek 0:22:33.960 --> 0:22:36.760 fire recipe. We know that it was probably more than 0:22:36.840 --> 0:22:40.600 just one thing. Right now, one thing that has been 0:22:40.600 --> 0:22:45.480 suggested by modern scholars is the idea of quicklime. Quicklime 0:22:45.640 --> 0:22:48.800 is the common name for calcium oxide or C A O, 0:22:49.480 --> 0:22:52.359 and this is something that can be produced from lime 0:22:52.480 --> 0:22:57.240