WEBVTT - 8. The Red Dot Photos

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<v Speaker 1>Mm hmmmm mm. If you've never been to Arizona, much

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<v Speaker 1>of it is as you might expect, vast stretches of scrubby,

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<v Speaker 1>empty desert. I'm a fan of greenery, so I've never

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<v Speaker 1>thought of the Southwest as a place for me. But

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<v Speaker 1>to watch storm clouds gather on the horizon, or a

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<v Speaker 1>glowing desert sun sink into darkness is sublime. To see

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<v Speaker 1>oranges and purple's light up the sky, mountains backlit twilight,

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<v Speaker 1>to feel a dry breeze, It's an awe inspiring place.

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<v Speaker 1>I had only been to Arizona once before to Tucson

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<v Speaker 1>actually years ago, when I did a semester of grad school,

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<v Speaker 1>I flew into profile a militia leader who hunted down

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<v Speaker 1>undocumented immigrants with thermal cameras and a pack of German shepherds.

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<v Speaker 1>Now back in Tucson, I had a much different mission.

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<v Speaker 1>After a trip to Phoenix, I had only a few

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<v Speaker 1>days left to track down sources as I investigated Jerry

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<v Speaker 1>Paisley's claim that the missing Congressman Nick Beget and Hail

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<v Speaker 1>Bogs were assassinated in nineteen seventy two their plane bombed.

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<v Speaker 1>It was here in Tucson where Paisley wed Peggy Begets

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<v Speaker 1>in nineteen seventy four. It was here in Tucson where

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<v Speaker 1>he worked for two mafia families, the Bananas and the

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<v Speaker 1>Lick of Olie's. And it was here in Tucson where

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<v Speaker 1>I hope to figure out once and for all, did

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<v Speaker 1>Paisley tell the truth? From my heart Media, This is

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<v Speaker 1>Missing in Alaska, the story of two congressmen who vanished

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<v Speaker 1>in nineteen seventy two and my quest to figure out

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<v Speaker 1>what happened to them. I'm your host, John Wallzac. This episode,

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<v Speaker 1>We're going to focus on two photos. It sounds simple, right,

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<v Speaker 1>just two photos. But these photos, the red dot photos,

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<v Speaker 1>are at the center of a web we will explore extensively.

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<v Speaker 1>These are the wedding photos that investigators secretly obtained and

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<v Speaker 1>marked up with stickers red dots with black numbers. Paisley

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<v Speaker 1>is red dot number six, Peggy is red dot number seven.

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<v Speaker 1>Standing next to them are mobsters and X cop, a

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<v Speaker 1>judge and others. I got the photos, the originals from

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<v Speaker 1>Tom Davis, who worked for the Arizona Department of Public Safety.

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<v Speaker 1>While working undercover in Tucson in n Davis secretly observed

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<v Speaker 1>Peggy and Paisley's wedding in Phoenix. Davis and I spoke

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<v Speaker 1>for more than five hours. After I left. We stayed

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<v Speaker 1>in touch. Hey Tom, how are you? I'm doing good

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<v Speaker 1>and sent Davis again. Is also one of the reinvestigators

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<v Speaker 1>who conducted the pivotal Paisley interview at the Pima County

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<v Speaker 1>Jail when Paisley first disclosed the alleged bombing of the

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<v Speaker 1>congressman's plane. So I saw your text. You tell me

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<v Speaker 1>what the text said and just how you found it out. Okay.

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<v Speaker 1>I pulled up Google Match and I went to the

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<v Speaker 1>corner of wilmotin Speedway. If you go there and you

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<v Speaker 1>go in the main building, asked them where the old

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<v Speaker 1>Eldo Lodge used to be. The Eldrado Lodge is where

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<v Speaker 1>the wedding took place. Turns out it no longer exists. Well,

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<v Speaker 1>the buildings are still there, but today they're home to

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<v Speaker 1>the Mountain Oyster Club, a private club. I drove there

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<v Speaker 1>with Paul Decan, our supervising producer. The outside hasn't changed,

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<v Speaker 1>still stone. The inside, however, has been renovated. It's western

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<v Speaker 1>in ornate, a lot of would no more seventies to court.

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<v Speaker 1>We sat down with Pauline loftus, the manager. Could I

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<v Speaker 1>show you two photos and see if any of it

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<v Speaker 1>seems familiar. So these are photos from a wedding, a ceremony,

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<v Speaker 1>and a reception that took place in nineteen four on

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<v Speaker 1>this property when it was the El Dorado. Um m

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<v Speaker 1>hmm not yet. Let me think about it for a

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<v Speaker 1>little bit. I mean, most of the doorways in the clever,

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<v Speaker 1>big archways, and this one's kind of just a small,

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<v Speaker 1>regular doorway. It could almost be in the room that

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<v Speaker 1>we're sitting in. Um or either that or in the

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<v Speaker 1>lobby there's or is that a picture behind them? Is

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<v Speaker 1>that a picture? It looks like a picture, yeah, so

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<v Speaker 1>or is it a mirror? It's hard to tell. Gums

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<v Speaker 1>Tree detectives. Now, the three of us wandered through the club,

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<v Speaker 1>impairing certain features, doorways, etcetera. To what exists today? Where

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<v Speaker 1>were the red dot photos taken? Where was the bar

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<v Speaker 1>where investigator Tom Davis sat undercover? Um, there's a bar?

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<v Speaker 1>Can you sure you were saying you think you know

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<v Speaker 1>where the bar was? Could you take a We're going

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<v Speaker 1>to go around this way. I think it wasn't here

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<v Speaker 1>because if you look at that window. I don't think

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<v Speaker 1>this wall was here. I think that staircase was open

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<v Speaker 1>to upstairs because there were rooms up there, and so

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<v Speaker 1>you would have come down the stairs. There was the

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<v Speaker 1>bar in here and then the doorway there and that window. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>we thought we found some of the spots in the photos,

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<v Speaker 1>but it was hard to tell. So much had changed.

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<v Speaker 1>We don't have original plans of the building. We don't

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<v Speaker 1>know half the time. We don't know what's in the walls.

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<v Speaker 1>So it's like we have a lot of surprises nobody

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<v Speaker 1>so far. No. No. In fact, we had a pretty

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<v Speaker 1>major kitchen remodel last summer, and that kept occurring to me.

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<v Speaker 1>I would think, my god, I hope we don't find

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<v Speaker 1>any bodies when they dig that. In the Peggy Paisley

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<v Speaker 1>wedding photos taken at the Eldorado, red dot number three

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<v Speaker 1>is Pete look of Oli Jr. The son of mob

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<v Speaker 1>boss Pete horse face look of Oli Senior. Pete Jr.

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<v Speaker 1>Was Paisley's friend. He and his wife Cathy, even accompanied

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<v Speaker 1>Paisley and Peggy on their honeymoon in Mexico. For months,

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<v Speaker 1>I tried to reach Pete Jr. Who still lived in

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<v Speaker 1>Tucson to no avail now. As we left the Mountain

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<v Speaker 1>Oyster Club, I pulled up another list of possible numbers

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<v Speaker 1>and dialed away Hi the number. That ranger in recording

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<v Speaker 1>the error can check the number and your call again.

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<v Speaker 1>So apparently the rule of from is if you are

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<v Speaker 1>an old mobster, you do not have a working phone number.

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<v Speaker 1>None of them have working phone numbers. They're all dead.

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<v Speaker 1>They all sound like crazy modem sound. At the end.

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<v Speaker 1>All I want to do is to call some mobsters.

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<v Speaker 1>I kept striking out. I've reached a number that does

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<v Speaker 1>not accept solicitations. If you are a solicitor, please add

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<v Speaker 1>this number to your do not call list and hang

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<v Speaker 1>up now. Otherwise, please press one or stay on the line.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm gonna press one, thank you, lease hold Okay, I'm

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<v Speaker 1>sorry this mailbox has not yet been set up by

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<v Speaker 1>the subscriber. Please try again later. Goodbye. Jee here trying

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<v Speaker 1>to block me As a solicitor, I can't leave a

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<v Speaker 1>voicemail somebody who doesn't want to be found. Yes, we're

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<v Speaker 1>just gonna have to go to house then, So that's

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<v Speaker 1>what we did. We went to Pete Lukavoli Jr's house.

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<v Speaker 1>At first, We circled the block. Then we pulled up.

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<v Speaker 1>I hopped out of the car and rang the bell. Nothing.

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<v Speaker 1>I knocked nothing. We drove to his brother, Mike's house nearby.

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<v Speaker 1>Mike Lacavoli isn't in any of the wedding photos, the

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<v Speaker 1>red dot photos. I think, I say I think because

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<v Speaker 1>there are a few unidentified men. Maybe he is one

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<v Speaker 1>of the red dots. I don't know. Like Pete Jr.

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<v Speaker 1>Mike had been friends with Paisley. When I walked up

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<v Speaker 1>to Mike's door, I heard a muffled TV. I rang

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<v Speaker 1>the bell, A dog barked. Someone told it to shut up.

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<v Speaker 1>I waited. No one came to the door. The TV

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<v Speaker 1>cut off. I knocked nothing. I wondered if the Look

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<v Speaker 1>of OLiS had been tipped off that we were in town.

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<v Speaker 1>I know that sound paranoid, but hear me out. The

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<v Speaker 1>day before, I had spoken by phone with Louis Marconi,

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<v Speaker 1>an X cop who back in the day was friends

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<v Speaker 1>with both Paisley and the Look of Olie kids in

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<v Speaker 1>the wedding photos. Marconi is red dot number five. When

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<v Speaker 1>we spoke, I played dumb, testing Marconi because I already

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<v Speaker 1>knew the answer. I asked whether or not he attended

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<v Speaker 1>Peggy and Paisley's wedding. He said no. I told him

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<v Speaker 1>I had a photo of him at the wedding. He

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<v Speaker 1>said basically, okay, prove it. Send me the photo. So

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<v Speaker 1>I cropped out everyone but him and emailed it to him.

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<v Speaker 1>He was like, yeah, that might be me. I'm not sure.

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<v Speaker 1>I asked if he didn't recognize himself, maybe it was him.

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<v Speaker 1>He said maybe it wasn't. That was a long time ago. Yeah, okay,

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<v Speaker 1>but you don't recognize yourself. I asked him if he

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<v Speaker 1>still spoke with the Look of Olie kids. He said no. Remember,

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<v Speaker 1>this was the day before Paul and I went to

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<v Speaker 1>the Look of Always Holmes. This is why I wondered

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<v Speaker 1>if someone had tipped them off. I wondered if Marconi

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<v Speaker 1>had tipped them off. After we left Mike lick of

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<v Speaker 1>Ali's house, the house where someone was clearly home, but

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<v Speaker 1>nobody came to the door. I called Marconi again. I

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<v Speaker 1>asked again whether or not he was still in touch

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<v Speaker 1>with the Lick of Olie kids. The day before, he

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<v Speaker 1>said no. Today he said yes. I asked if he

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<v Speaker 1>had alerted them that we were in town digging. He

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<v Speaker 1>got flustered and hung up on me. Frustrated, I turned

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<v Speaker 1>my attention to Salth Spinelli Red dot number four. Spinelli,

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<v Speaker 1>a mobster, was Paisley's close friend, his business partner, and

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<v Speaker 1>the best man at his wedding to Peggy Baggage. He

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<v Speaker 1>was so close to Paisley, in fact, that even his

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<v Speaker 1>father attended the wedding. Spinelli Sr. Is red dot number eight.

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<v Speaker 1>At the time, I wasn't sure whether or not Spinelli Jr.

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<v Speaker 1>Was even alive. I'm good at finding people, but he

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<v Speaker 1>was a ghost for months. I called and called, an emailed,

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<v Speaker 1>and emailed and mailed letters to addresses all over the place. Now,

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<v Speaker 1>in a last ditch effort, Paul and I drove around

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<v Speaker 1>knocking on doors. The first was a bust an empty house.

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<v Speaker 1>The second was an apartment on the edge of town.

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<v Speaker 1>So I just went looking for this apartment that we

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<v Speaker 1>thought Salth Spinelli might be in, and I knocked on

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<v Speaker 1>the door. Had to walk through this apartment complex, and

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<v Speaker 1>it's this kind of dingy, dark little corridor, so I

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<v Speaker 1>was hoping I didn't get jumped. Um. But I knocked

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<v Speaker 1>on the door and I could hear a woman, and

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<v Speaker 1>then another woman, and then I could hear them talking

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<v Speaker 1>about me, just like who is this guy? Like, don't

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<v Speaker 1>answer it? Should I answer it? Like he might ask

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<v Speaker 1>about Graham or Grant, and so I don't. I'm like

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<v Speaker 1>the hiding some old lady or I don't know. It

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<v Speaker 1>was weird. And then I started walking away and I

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<v Speaker 1>circled around the bill name because I said I was

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<v Speaker 1>I was looking for Sal. And then they were completely quiet,

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<v Speaker 1>and I stood there for like a minute, and I

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<v Speaker 1>walked around the building started to leave, and this guy

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<v Speaker 1>pulled up in a car and asked me, like, Hey,

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<v Speaker 1>are you banging on the door looking for a Sal?

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<v Speaker 1>And I said yes, and he said, oh, I don't know,

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<v Speaker 1>no fucking Sal. So don't don't do that again. Don't

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<v Speaker 1>bang on the door again. So this is seal possible

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<v Speaker 1>address number two. The first one was for sale and

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<v Speaker 1>nobody was living there. So on with Seal spelunking hunting.

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<v Speaker 1>Please don't use this audio. We checked more addresses, but

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<v Speaker 1>none worked. Turns out Spinelli's dead, so too is Toby

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<v Speaker 1>levettter Red Dot number twelve, the judge who presided over

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<v Speaker 1>Peggy and Paisley's wedding. Interestingly enough, Lovetta also presided over

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<v Speaker 1>sal Spinelli's nine extortion trial. Go figure as afternoon Mel did.

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<v Speaker 1>In the evening, Paul and I decided to make one

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<v Speaker 1>final stop at the home of Alganum, Red Dot number one,

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<v Speaker 1>except that failed to Ganum lived in a gated community

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<v Speaker 1>and we couldn't get in by the way. Poor Paul.

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<v Speaker 1>That day was his birthday and he was stuck driving

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<v Speaker 1>me around Tucson looking for old mobsters. So we went

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<v Speaker 1>back to our hotel and and then we kept working

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<v Speaker 1>into the night. But work is a stretch. Paul is

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<v Speaker 1>something of a foodie, so I told him to just

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<v Speaker 1>pick a place wherever he wanted and we'd go there

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<v Speaker 1>for dinner. Turns out he was cool with a desert

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<v Speaker 1>tiki bar, specifically the Contiki, so dinner doubled as work.

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<v Speaker 1>The Contiki. What a place. It's a tiki bar in Tucson,

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<v Speaker 1>one of the oldest surviving tiki bars in the nation.

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<v Speaker 1>This is the place where a core THNK to Jerry Paisley.

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<v Speaker 1>Peggy Beggett allegedly dined with Joe Banano in the summer

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<v Speaker 1>of nineteen seventy two before Nick Beggett, her husband disappeared.

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<v Speaker 1>The inside can best be described as dark and tropical.

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<v Speaker 1>Paul and I sat down, We ordered a few drinks.

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<v Speaker 1>For hours, the only music that played was the Red

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<v Speaker 1>Hot Chili Peppers. At first, we didn't tell our server,

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<v Speaker 1>Kaylee Anne, who we were or why we were there.

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<v Speaker 1>When we did tell her, she was, to say the

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<v Speaker 1>least surprised. So we are standing outside the CONTI key, uh,

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<v Speaker 1>could you tell me your name? Kyle? And how long

0:14:36.480 --> 0:14:39.320
<v Speaker 1>have you works here? I've warned here I think about

0:14:39.360 --> 0:14:41.960
<v Speaker 1>five months so far? And what do you know about

0:14:42.000 --> 0:14:44.880
<v Speaker 1>this place? How old is it? Well, it was either

0:14:45.080 --> 0:14:48.400
<v Speaker 1>sixty two or sixty three that it first got established.

0:14:48.400 --> 0:14:51.360
<v Speaker 1>It started as a fine dining steak restaurant. From what

0:14:51.680 --> 0:14:55.840
<v Speaker 1>I've heard, people say that the interior has barely changed

0:14:55.920 --> 0:14:58.080
<v Speaker 1>besides the point that they got rid of the red

0:14:58.240 --> 0:15:03.840
<v Speaker 1>carpet finally this last year. And we've had like birds

0:15:04.000 --> 0:15:07.200
<v Speaker 1>and lizards outside on what is our patio now? So

0:15:08.040 --> 0:15:11.800
<v Speaker 1>have you ever seen any mobsters in here? I have

0:15:11.840 --> 0:15:15.080
<v Speaker 1>not seen any mobsters. Do you know who Joe Bano was?

0:15:15.280 --> 0:15:17.800
<v Speaker 1>I have no idea who that is. Okay, so Banana

0:15:17.920 --> 0:15:20.120
<v Speaker 1>was the guy. Have you ever seen the Godfather? Yes?

0:15:20.120 --> 0:15:23.480
<v Speaker 1>Okay Banana was the guy. Who inspired Don Corleone and

0:15:23.520 --> 0:15:27.120
<v Speaker 1>The Godfather, and he was he was in New York

0:15:27.160 --> 0:15:31.200
<v Speaker 1>and he retired, quote retired to Tucson and he actually

0:15:31.280 --> 0:15:33.960
<v Speaker 1>lived here for a very long time and died. And

0:15:34.680 --> 0:15:38.920
<v Speaker 1>there's an allegation from someone who was associated with him

0:15:38.960 --> 0:15:42.440
<v Speaker 1>that in the summer of nineteen seventy two that Joe

0:15:42.440 --> 0:15:47.600
<v Speaker 1>Banano met with the wife of a congressman at the Contiki.

0:15:48.400 --> 0:15:52.840
<v Speaker 1>But hearing this and just standing outside the Conti Ki

0:15:53.160 --> 0:15:57.440
<v Speaker 1>and we've all tell us your neighbor a good Kaylee,

0:15:57.560 --> 0:15:59.200
<v Speaker 1>John Paul. The three of us have all been in

0:15:59.240 --> 0:16:01.480
<v Speaker 1>there for what three hours? You're probably be in the

0:16:01.560 --> 0:16:07.360
<v Speaker 1>locker than us. What is what do you think here that?

0:16:08.120 --> 0:16:10.560
<v Speaker 1>I mean, I just couldn't imagine that happening in the

0:16:10.600 --> 0:16:13.440
<v Speaker 1>place that it is now, and considering that it's like

0:16:13.480 --> 0:16:16.040
<v Speaker 1>a tiki bar. People come here like from all over

0:16:16.080 --> 0:16:19.040
<v Speaker 1>the United States just to kind of collect our mugs

0:16:19.040 --> 0:16:21.800
<v Speaker 1>and do other things like that in our scorpion bowl

0:16:21.920 --> 0:16:23.680
<v Speaker 1>is what we're known for, which just has a lot

0:16:23.720 --> 0:16:28.160
<v Speaker 1>of boozes. So it's kind of crazy to think at

0:16:28.200 --> 0:16:30.560
<v Speaker 1>one point something like that could have happened because it

0:16:30.720 --> 0:16:33.200
<v Speaker 1>just seems like a free loving place. But if I

0:16:33.240 --> 0:16:35.840
<v Speaker 1>mean I could believe it if it really was the

0:16:36.280 --> 0:16:39.240
<v Speaker 1>luxurious steakhouse that everyone made it out to be beforehand,

0:16:39.280 --> 0:16:42.200
<v Speaker 1>because of course, why when mobsters go there? Right from

0:16:42.200 --> 0:16:48.360
<v Speaker 1>what we know from movies, that's just that I cannot

0:16:48.560 --> 0:16:52.040
<v Speaker 1>fully wrap my mind around it. From how the Conti

0:16:52.160 --> 0:16:58.920
<v Speaker 1>key is now, the County keys and FBI documents, I

0:16:58.920 --> 0:17:00.960
<v Speaker 1>couldn't see that. I mean, we just have a lot

0:17:01.000 --> 0:17:04.240
<v Speaker 1>of fun people that come in. It's such a diverse crowd.

0:17:04.640 --> 0:17:07.960
<v Speaker 1>But tell me, could you describe the Contiki to me?

0:17:08.720 --> 0:17:11.320
<v Speaker 1>Oh my goodness, Well, you can definitely tell that it

0:17:11.400 --> 0:17:13.679
<v Speaker 1>has some history to it. I mean just with the

0:17:13.720 --> 0:17:16.440
<v Speaker 1>decorations and everything we've had, like a lot of them

0:17:16.440 --> 0:17:22.200
<v Speaker 1>are original pieces that are in there. I mean, it's

0:17:22.240 --> 0:17:25.359
<v Speaker 1>just a fun place. It's so when you drive up

0:17:25.359 --> 0:17:28.320
<v Speaker 1>to the Contiki, you're thinking, what is this because the

0:17:28.359 --> 0:17:32.040
<v Speaker 1>buildings on the side, some of them aren't feels like

0:17:32.119 --> 0:17:34.520
<v Speaker 1>some of the storefronts and all that. And you just

0:17:34.600 --> 0:17:37.520
<v Speaker 1>walk inside and it's like you're in your own little oasis,

0:17:38.040 --> 0:17:39.920
<v Speaker 1>and you're like, there's no way that in the middle

0:17:39.920 --> 0:17:44.080
<v Speaker 1>of Tucson on Arizona could be this place. And I

0:17:44.119 --> 0:17:46.399
<v Speaker 1>mean people just come here to have fun, have a

0:17:46.440 --> 0:17:51.120
<v Speaker 1>good time escape. It's an island escape. And to hear

0:17:51.160 --> 0:17:55.840
<v Speaker 1>the allegation that allegedly an assassination plot was hatched partially

0:17:55.960 --> 0:18:00.440
<v Speaker 1>at the Contiki and that it's in FBI documents. I mean,

0:18:01.280 --> 0:18:03.359
<v Speaker 1>the Tiki is supposed to be a happy place either.

0:18:03.440 --> 0:18:06.320
<v Speaker 1>My manager, he's like, it's it's a Tiki day, It's

0:18:06.320 --> 0:18:09.800
<v Speaker 1>a day in Tiki paradise. So I couldn't imagine that

0:18:11.080 --> 0:18:21.399
<v Speaker 1>an assassination was planned in the teach. I know, I

0:18:21.480 --> 0:18:25.680
<v Speaker 1>know it sounds absurd, but guess what, The conti Ki

0:18:26.040 --> 0:18:29.239
<v Speaker 1>was controlled by the mob, at least in part. A

0:18:29.240 --> 0:18:32.240
<v Speaker 1>few months after our Arizona trip, I traveled with another

0:18:32.280 --> 0:18:35.600
<v Speaker 1>one of our producers, Chris Brown, No, not that Chris Brown,

0:18:35.920 --> 0:18:38.720
<v Speaker 1>to Columbia, Missouri, where we spent a day digging through

0:18:38.840 --> 0:18:43.880
<v Speaker 1>archived records at the State Historical Society of Missouri. Why Missouri, Well,

0:18:44.040 --> 0:18:46.399
<v Speaker 1>we had been granted special access to a trove of

0:18:46.520 --> 0:18:50.199
<v Speaker 1>valuable records. These records were compiled in the seventies by

0:18:50.280 --> 0:18:53.680
<v Speaker 1>journalists working on the Arizona Project. The project launched in

0:18:53.720 --> 0:18:57.000
<v Speaker 1>the aftermath of the assassination of reporter Don Bowles, who

0:18:57.119 --> 0:19:00.520
<v Speaker 1>was killed in Phoenix by a car Bomb amazingly indies

0:19:00.560 --> 0:19:04.159
<v Speaker 1>records which document widespread crime and corruption. Chris and I

0:19:04.320 --> 0:19:08.440
<v Speaker 1>kept finding names. We recognized the Bananas, the Lick of Olie's,

0:19:08.640 --> 0:19:14.640
<v Speaker 1>Jerry Paisley, Peggy Beggitte, Danny Zivinach sal Spinelli, Louis Marconi,

0:19:14.960 --> 0:19:20.080
<v Speaker 1>Joeya Tarola, and the Contiki. Yes, even our beloved Contiki.

0:19:20.720 --> 0:19:23.480
<v Speaker 1>I found the Conti he described three times as a

0:19:23.520 --> 0:19:27.320
<v Speaker 1>mob owned business, specifically that Pete Likavoli Senior owned it

0:19:27.359 --> 0:19:30.520
<v Speaker 1>at the time, at least in part. Again, the Conti

0:19:30.600 --> 0:19:34.000
<v Speaker 1>key was the place where, according to Paisley, Peggy Beggett

0:19:34.040 --> 0:19:37.280
<v Speaker 1>allegedly met with Joe Banano. In the records, I also

0:19:37.280 --> 0:19:40.960
<v Speaker 1>found a memo dated December sixteenth, nineteen seventy six, written

0:19:41.000 --> 0:19:44.440
<v Speaker 1>by Alex Dressler, the reporter who secretly observed Peggy and

0:19:44.480 --> 0:19:50.800
<v Speaker 1>Paisley's wedding. The subject Bill Bonano, Joe Banano's son, Quote D. S.

0:19:50.880 --> 0:19:54.520
<v Speaker 1>Forty is a confidential law enforcement source in Anchorage, Alaska.

0:19:54.920 --> 0:19:58.040
<v Speaker 1>He told me that one of his confidential informants, a woman,

0:19:58.400 --> 0:20:00.560
<v Speaker 1>was on a huge Air West flight to December four,

0:20:00.760 --> 0:20:04.959
<v Speaker 1>ninety six from Phoenix to San Jose. On board the plane,

0:20:05.080 --> 0:20:07.800
<v Speaker 1>sitting next to her was a man who identified himself

0:20:07.840 --> 0:20:11.040
<v Speaker 1>as Bill Bonano. When she told him she was from Anchorage,

0:20:11.080 --> 0:20:13.959
<v Speaker 1>he stated that he had a bar in Anchorage. Because

0:20:13.960 --> 0:20:16.640
<v Speaker 1>of salth Spinelli and Jerry Paisley's involvement with a bar

0:20:16.720 --> 0:20:18.920
<v Speaker 1>in Anchorage and the fact that they have been close

0:20:18.960 --> 0:20:21.760
<v Speaker 1>to Bill Bonano in the past, it is conceivable that

0:20:21.760 --> 0:20:25.480
<v Speaker 1>Banano meant that this was his bar end quote. If

0:20:25.520 --> 0:20:28.600
<v Speaker 1>this source was accurate, and if Bill Bonano was referring

0:20:28.640 --> 0:20:31.639
<v Speaker 1>to Paisley's bar, then he was in fact referring to

0:20:31.680 --> 0:20:34.960
<v Speaker 1>the Alaska Mining Company the bar co owned by Paisley,

0:20:35.040 --> 0:20:38.760
<v Speaker 1>Peggy Baggett, and Danny Zevanich as his bar, a Banano bar.

0:20:39.480 --> 0:20:43.760
<v Speaker 1>Another Dressler memo, citing a different law enforcement source, said quote,

0:20:44.080 --> 0:20:47.760
<v Speaker 1>the word is that Peter Locavoli Jr. Year old son

0:20:47.800 --> 0:20:51.800
<v Speaker 1>of Detroit mafia boss Peter Locavoli Sr. With Jerome, Max

0:20:51.840 --> 0:20:55.320
<v Speaker 1>Paisley and Salvator Spinelli, are in the process of setting

0:20:55.359 --> 0:20:58.400
<v Speaker 1>up their own group. This alliance would consist of younger

0:20:58.440 --> 0:21:01.520
<v Speaker 1>members of the Likavoli and Banana families and would attempt

0:21:01.520 --> 0:21:05.840
<v Speaker 1>to control gambling, narcotics, trade, and prostitution organized in Western

0:21:05.920 --> 0:21:10.200
<v Speaker 1>United States and Alaska. Information has it that Licavoli would

0:21:10.200 --> 0:21:13.240
<v Speaker 1>head up this new organization with Paisley and Spinelli, who

0:21:13.280 --> 0:21:16.240
<v Speaker 1>both hold allegiances to Joseph Bonano, who would control the

0:21:16.280 --> 0:21:19.800
<v Speaker 1>lucrative Alaska market. It appears that younger members of different

0:21:19.920 --> 0:21:24.159
<v Speaker 1>organized crime families, namely the Likavolian Banano families, are forming

0:21:24.240 --> 0:21:27.639
<v Speaker 1>to control the operations in the Western States, including Alaska.

0:21:28.119 --> 0:21:30.600
<v Speaker 1>This new venture apparently has the sanction of the old

0:21:30.680 --> 0:21:35.119
<v Speaker 1>downs Joseph Bonano Senior and Peter Likavoli Senior end quote,

0:21:35.760 --> 0:21:40.119
<v Speaker 1>and there was much much more. In December nineteen seventy two,

0:21:40.160 --> 0:21:43.439
<v Speaker 1>according to one document, mob boss Joe Banano met at

0:21:43.440 --> 0:21:47.439
<v Speaker 1>a Tucson hotel with two men, including Joeya Tarola or

0:21:47.520 --> 0:21:51.120
<v Speaker 1>Joey the i Ayah Tarola again was the man Paisley

0:21:51.119 --> 0:21:54.400
<v Speaker 1>claimed dined with him, Peggy Baggett and Joe Banano at

0:21:54.400 --> 0:21:57.119
<v Speaker 1>the Conti Ki in the summer of nineteen seventy two,

0:21:57.480 --> 0:22:00.200
<v Speaker 1>the man who allegedly gave Paisley the lock suit case

0:22:00.280 --> 0:22:02.919
<v Speaker 1>with a bomb that he flew to Alaska, the bomb

0:22:03.040 --> 0:22:06.720
<v Speaker 1>that allegedly killed the missing congressmen. Another memo states that

0:22:06.760 --> 0:22:10.600
<v Speaker 1>in nineteen seventy five, Jerry Paisley sal Spinelli and Nick

0:22:10.640 --> 0:22:14.320
<v Speaker 1>Begett Jr. Attended a Banano wedding in Tucson, though it

0:22:14.320 --> 0:22:18.440
<v Speaker 1>doesn't specify which wedding. Quote. We are interested in these

0:22:18.480 --> 0:22:22.840
<v Speaker 1>people because of information that they are involved in running prostitutes, narcotics,

0:22:22.880 --> 0:22:26.840
<v Speaker 1>and stolen goods from Arizona to Alaska, with Peter Licavoli

0:22:26.920 --> 0:22:30.440
<v Speaker 1>Junior in charge of the criminal group end quote. Back

0:22:30.480 --> 0:22:34.359
<v Speaker 1>in the seventies, Pete Lacavoli Junior denied these allegations. I

0:22:34.400 --> 0:22:36.720
<v Speaker 1>tried several times to reach him for comment, but he

0:22:36.760 --> 0:22:41.560
<v Speaker 1>didn't respond. Nick Begetts Junior declined an interview request in

0:22:41.640 --> 0:22:44.840
<v Speaker 1>March nineteen seventy five, and this was deering Paisley's marriage

0:22:44.840 --> 0:22:48.160
<v Speaker 1>to Peggy Baggage. An informants saw Paisley with Bill Bonano

0:22:48.320 --> 0:22:52.240
<v Speaker 1>and Sal Spinelli. Quote Paisley and Spinelli are involved in

0:22:52.280 --> 0:22:57.879
<v Speaker 1>the following activities and Anchorage cocaine, speed, prostitution, gambling, and

0:22:57.960 --> 0:23:02.800
<v Speaker 1>stolen turquoise jewelry end quote quote Stolen turquoise jewelry is

0:23:02.840 --> 0:23:05.880
<v Speaker 1>being run from Arizona through the Nick Vegats jewelry store

0:23:05.880 --> 0:23:09.720
<v Speaker 1>and Anchorage end quote. Also in the archives. And yes,

0:23:09.760 --> 0:23:11.960
<v Speaker 1>I know you're probably sick of me. Using that phrase.

0:23:12.320 --> 0:23:14.879
<v Speaker 1>I found a copy of Jerry Paisley and Peggy Beggat's

0:23:14.920 --> 0:23:18.920
<v Speaker 1>divorce settlement. Paisley and Peggy filed for divorce on March eighth,

0:23:19.040 --> 0:23:23.600
<v Speaker 1>nineteen seventy six, reconciled, filed again for divorce on September thirtieth,

0:23:23.680 --> 0:23:27.359
<v Speaker 1>nineteen seventy six, and finally were granted to divorce on

0:23:27.400 --> 0:23:31.400
<v Speaker 1>November sixteenth, nineteen seventy six. As part of the divorce settlement,

0:23:31.440 --> 0:23:34.840
<v Speaker 1>Peggy kept several pieces of land in both Arizona and Alaska.

0:23:35.280 --> 0:23:38.680
<v Speaker 1>Paisley renounced his interest in the Nick Begets Junior jewelry store.

0:23:39.080 --> 0:23:42.399
<v Speaker 1>Peggy kept a nineteen seventy six Buick Wagon, a seventy

0:23:42.480 --> 0:23:46.080
<v Speaker 1>six Oldsmobile, a seventy four Jaguar, and as seventy three

0:23:46.119 --> 0:23:50.639
<v Speaker 1>Dotson quote. Jerry gets the seventy five Caddy end quote.

0:23:51.080 --> 0:23:54.520
<v Speaker 1>The settlement also details how Peggy, Paisley, and Danny Zevanich

0:23:54.640 --> 0:23:57.760
<v Speaker 1>split up ownership of Max Inc. Their business, the one

0:23:57.840 --> 0:24:00.840
<v Speaker 1>behind the Alaska Mining Company. I could go on and

0:24:00.920 --> 0:24:03.720
<v Speaker 1>on and on, but I have to get to explosives.

0:24:04.280 --> 0:24:07.320
<v Speaker 1>In the red Dot photos, the Paisley Peggy wedding photos,

0:24:07.480 --> 0:24:11.439
<v Speaker 1>there are three unnamed men Now, via these records, I

0:24:11.480 --> 0:24:14.199
<v Speaker 1>was finally able to identify one of them as Robert

0:24:14.240 --> 0:24:18.800
<v Speaker 1>Thomas Smith or Bobby Smith. Paisley and Smith were business partners.

0:24:18.960 --> 0:24:22.399
<v Speaker 1>They started a company called the Paisley Smith Construction Company,

0:24:22.480 --> 0:24:26.680
<v Speaker 1>and guess what. In nineteen Smith was indicted on extortion

0:24:26.760 --> 0:24:31.240
<v Speaker 1>charges after allegedly bombing a Tucson nightclub. Another man, Victor

0:24:31.359 --> 0:24:35.720
<v Speaker 1>Vincent Livingston, was indicted alongside Smith. According to a memo

0:24:35.800 --> 0:24:39.760
<v Speaker 1>I found, Livingston was quote an explosives expert who once

0:24:39.800 --> 0:24:43.119
<v Speaker 1>worked for the Apache Powder Company. Smith reportedly is a

0:24:43.240 --> 0:24:46.439
<v Speaker 1>driver for Livingston when they're on a job end. Quote.

0:24:46.920 --> 0:24:49.120
<v Speaker 1>So here we have a man in Peggy and Paisley's

0:24:49.119 --> 0:24:51.480
<v Speaker 1>wedding photo, one of the red dots, who was a

0:24:51.560 --> 0:24:55.879
<v Speaker 1>driver for and indicted alongside an explosives expert who allegedly

0:24:55.920 --> 0:24:59.400
<v Speaker 1>bombed a Tucson nightclub in nineteen sixty eight. But wait,

0:24:59.720 --> 0:25:04.720
<v Speaker 1>there's more. A memo dated January nineteen seventy seven states

0:25:04.760 --> 0:25:07.800
<v Speaker 1>that salth Spinelli, Paisley's close friend and the best man

0:25:07.840 --> 0:25:11.119
<v Speaker 1>at his wedding to Peggy Baggage, had quote ties to

0:25:11.160 --> 0:25:14.439
<v Speaker 1>a Robert Lloyd Lusk, who was present when Charles O

0:25:14.720 --> 0:25:18.320
<v Speaker 1>Louderback was arrested in Alaska for possession of one pound

0:25:18.320 --> 0:25:22.000
<v Speaker 1>of heroin, a half pound of coke, twenty one firearms,

0:25:22.400 --> 0:25:26.919
<v Speaker 1>live moorder rounds, and thousands of rounds of ammunition. End quote.

0:25:27.359 --> 0:25:30.240
<v Speaker 1>So Spinelli was one degree of separation from a guy

0:25:30.359 --> 0:25:34.320
<v Speaker 1>arrested in Alaska for possession of drugs, guns, thousands of

0:25:34.400 --> 0:25:39.040
<v Speaker 1>rounds of ammunition, and live moorder rounds. There's still more though,

0:25:39.440 --> 0:25:45.040
<v Speaker 1>there's still Suitcase Charlie. Yes, Suitcase Charlie. Journalists working on

0:25:45.080 --> 0:25:49.320
<v Speaker 1>the Arizona project received multiple reports that Suitcase Charlie, whose

0:25:49.400 --> 0:25:52.560
<v Speaker 1>real name was Charles Cochrane, was the man who allegedly

0:25:52.640 --> 0:25:56.159
<v Speaker 1>rigged the bomb that killed investigative reporter Don Bowles. A

0:25:56.280 --> 0:26:00.040
<v Speaker 1>source said, quote, Charles Suitcase Cochrane should be question and

0:26:00.200 --> 0:26:03.879
<v Speaker 1>about his electronics knowledge in relation to the bowls case. So,

0:26:03.960 --> 0:26:07.680
<v Speaker 1>in nineteen seventy six, only four years after Jerry Paisley

0:26:07.720 --> 0:26:11.520
<v Speaker 1>allegedly transported a mafia bomb from Arizona to Alaska, a

0:26:11.600 --> 0:26:14.479
<v Speaker 1>bomb he claimed was put on the missing Congressman's plane,

0:26:14.800 --> 0:26:18.200
<v Speaker 1>we have a guy named Suitcase Charlie, who also allegedly

0:26:18.200 --> 0:26:21.120
<v Speaker 1>worked for the mob, had electronic knowledge and was good

0:26:21.119 --> 0:26:24.800
<v Speaker 1>at rigging bombs. Pinpointed it as the person who allegedly

0:26:24.800 --> 0:26:28.160
<v Speaker 1>built the remote controlled bomb that blew up reporter Don Bowls.

0:26:28.720 --> 0:26:32.119
<v Speaker 1>None of this proves anything, it's just odd. It shows

0:26:32.160 --> 0:26:35.280
<v Speaker 1>that there was at least one mob connected explosives expert

0:26:35.320 --> 0:26:38.120
<v Speaker 1>in Arizona in the seventies able to build a high

0:26:38.119 --> 0:26:42.760
<v Speaker 1>tech bomb. And another twist. Remember, and it's okay if

0:26:42.760 --> 0:26:45.280
<v Speaker 1>you don't, I get it. This is a lot of information.

0:26:45.560 --> 0:26:49.639
<v Speaker 1>A man named Victor Livingston. Livingstone was the explosives expert

0:26:49.640 --> 0:26:53.439
<v Speaker 1>tied to Bobby Smith. Smith attended Paisley and Peggy's wedding.

0:26:53.840 --> 0:26:57.080
<v Speaker 1>Livingston was indicted in nineteen sixty eight for allegedly bombing

0:26:57.080 --> 0:27:00.640
<v Speaker 1>at Tucson nightclub, and Livingston once worked for the Apache

0:27:00.640 --> 0:27:05.439
<v Speaker 1>Powder Company. Well, here's the twist. In nineteen eighty four,

0:27:05.480 --> 0:27:09.040
<v Speaker 1>the Arizona Republic ran a series of articles detailing how

0:27:09.160 --> 0:27:12.359
<v Speaker 1>terrorists responsible for more than thirty bombings in the Philippines

0:27:12.400 --> 0:27:15.400
<v Speaker 1>around nineteen eighty were trained in the desert near Tucson.

0:27:15.880 --> 0:27:19.919
<v Speaker 1>And wait for it, the terrorists used explosives purchased from

0:27:19.920 --> 0:27:23.840
<v Speaker 1>the Apache Powder Company. Yes, these terrorists in the Philippines

0:27:23.840 --> 0:27:26.240
<v Speaker 1>were trained in the desert near Tucson by a man

0:27:26.280 --> 0:27:29.520
<v Speaker 1>who bought explosives in nineteen seventy nine and nineteen eighty

0:27:29.560 --> 0:27:33.080
<v Speaker 1>from the Apache Powder Company, the same Apache Powder Company

0:27:33.119 --> 0:27:36.320
<v Speaker 1>for which Victor Livingston, the explosives expert with ties to

0:27:36.359 --> 0:27:40.080
<v Speaker 1>Bobby Smith, worked. The same Bobby Smith who attended Paisley

0:27:40.119 --> 0:27:43.720
<v Speaker 1>and Peggy's wedding and started a construction business with Paisley.

0:27:43.760 --> 0:27:46.840
<v Speaker 1>According to the Republic, a smuggler involved in a terrorist

0:27:46.920 --> 0:27:50.120
<v Speaker 1>ring was arrested at the Manila Airport after quote one

0:27:50.160 --> 0:27:53.800
<v Speaker 1>of his suitcases was found to contain bomb components, including

0:27:53.840 --> 0:27:57.440
<v Speaker 1>fifteen sticks of dynamite wrapped in brown wax paper marked

0:27:57.480 --> 0:28:02.920
<v Speaker 1>amagel number one Apache Powder comp Penny Benson, Arizona, October nineteenth,

0:28:03.000 --> 0:28:07.159
<v Speaker 1>nineteen seventy three. So around nineteen eighty terrorists in the

0:28:07.200 --> 0:28:10.480
<v Speaker 1>Philippines used dynamite with a stamped on date only one

0:28:10.600 --> 0:28:14.760
<v Speaker 1>year after Nick Baggage disappeared, dynamite procured from a company,

0:28:14.800 --> 0:28:18.239
<v Speaker 1>the Apache Powder Company, for which Victor Livingston worked as

0:28:18.240 --> 0:28:21.920
<v Speaker 1>an explosives expert, the same Victor Livingston whose driver was

0:28:21.960 --> 0:28:25.359
<v Speaker 1>Bobby Smith, the same Bobby Smith who attended the wedding

0:28:25.359 --> 0:28:28.520
<v Speaker 1>of Peggy Baggage and Jerry Paisley and started a construction

0:28:28.520 --> 0:28:32.320
<v Speaker 1>company with Paisley. This is a lot of information I know,

0:28:33.000 --> 0:28:37.000
<v Speaker 1>so to recab. The Arizona Project records document close ties

0:28:37.040 --> 0:28:40.440
<v Speaker 1>between Jerry Paisley and the Banana and Likavoli families. They

0:28:40.440 --> 0:28:43.360
<v Speaker 1>showed that joe Bonano and Joey A. Tarola or Joey

0:28:43.400 --> 0:28:47.240
<v Speaker 1>the I were spotted together two months after the congressman disappeared,

0:28:47.560 --> 0:28:50.840
<v Speaker 1>only a few months after Banano and Iya Tarrola allegedly

0:28:50.920 --> 0:28:53.840
<v Speaker 1>met with Peggy Baggage. They showed that Paisley was one

0:28:53.880 --> 0:28:57.160
<v Speaker 1>degree of separation away from an explosives expert who procured

0:28:57.240 --> 0:29:00.080
<v Speaker 1>dynamite from a company whose dynamite was later used has

0:29:00.080 --> 0:29:03.000
<v Speaker 1>been more than thirty terrorist attacks in the Philippines. They

0:29:03.000 --> 0:29:06.160
<v Speaker 1>showed that Sal Spinelli, Paisley's close friend and best man,

0:29:06.440 --> 0:29:09.000
<v Speaker 1>was one degree of separation from a man arrested in

0:29:09.000 --> 0:29:12.840
<v Speaker 1>Alaska with live mortar rounds. They showed the possibility that

0:29:12.880 --> 0:29:15.840
<v Speaker 1>the Bananas had some steak in the Alaska mining company

0:29:16.080 --> 0:29:19.880
<v Speaker 1>the Bar run by Peggy Beggett, Jerry Paisley, and Danny Zevenage.

0:29:20.480 --> 0:29:24.040
<v Speaker 1>These records show so many things. Now do they prove

0:29:24.200 --> 0:29:28.360
<v Speaker 1>that the missing Congressman's plane was bombed. Absolutely not. But

0:29:28.600 --> 0:29:31.360
<v Speaker 1>in my opinion, it becomes harder and harder to write

0:29:31.360 --> 0:29:34.520
<v Speaker 1>off Jerry Paisley's allegations when you're looking at an avalanche

0:29:34.560 --> 0:29:37.480
<v Speaker 1>of documents prepared not by me, but by a team

0:29:37.480 --> 0:29:41.120
<v Speaker 1>of forty investigative reporters back in the seventies, documents that

0:29:41.160 --> 0:30:09.800
<v Speaker 1>back up parts of Paisley's story. The Golden Interview, the

0:30:09.840 --> 0:30:12.520
<v Speaker 1>interview I wanted more than any other, was one with

0:30:12.640 --> 0:30:16.840
<v Speaker 1>Jerry Paisley himself. Unfortunately, Paisley died in prison of liver

0:30:16.920 --> 0:30:21.440
<v Speaker 1>cancer in September, a year before I started researching this,

0:30:21.840 --> 0:30:24.400
<v Speaker 1>so I never had a chance to speak with him. However,

0:30:25.760 --> 0:30:29.160
<v Speaker 1>I found something interesting an old blog written by an

0:30:29.160 --> 0:30:32.960
<v Speaker 1>anonymous Arizona prisoner who used a pseudonym and mailed out

0:30:33.000 --> 0:30:36.320
<v Speaker 1>dispatches that someone else posted online. The name of the

0:30:36.320 --> 0:30:40.680
<v Speaker 1>blog John's Jail Journal. On it, the author wrote frequently

0:30:40.720 --> 0:30:44.000
<v Speaker 1>about his friend to Tony's, a fellow prisoner he described

0:30:44.040 --> 0:30:46.920
<v Speaker 1>as a mafia mass murderer who left the corpses of

0:30:47.040 --> 0:30:51.520
<v Speaker 1>rival gangsters from Tucson to Alaska. Two. Tony's was quote

0:30:51.680 --> 0:30:55.840
<v Speaker 1>a Detroit Irish Italian whose wit could upstage Rodney danger Fields.

0:30:56.240 --> 0:30:59.440
<v Speaker 1>I was highly suspicious by this point that two Tony's

0:30:59.600 --> 0:31:03.440
<v Speaker 1>was in fact. Jerry Paisley, the blogger, quoted two Tony's

0:31:03.480 --> 0:31:06.400
<v Speaker 1>as saying, quote, I sent a few motherfucker's to the

0:31:06.400 --> 0:31:09.320
<v Speaker 1>other side, but if they were alive today, they'd probably

0:31:09.360 --> 0:31:12.800
<v Speaker 1>be trailer park trash eating out a chef Boyard Cans,

0:31:12.840 --> 0:31:15.640
<v Speaker 1>so I did him a favor. He described Two Tony's

0:31:15.680 --> 0:31:17.880
<v Speaker 1>as a fan of the author Tom Wolfe and as

0:31:17.920 --> 0:31:22.040
<v Speaker 1>someone critical of mass market fiction. Stephen King, for one,

0:31:22.160 --> 0:31:26.720
<v Speaker 1>according to two Tony's, was quote running a fucking McDonald's franchise.

0:31:26.920 --> 0:31:30.040
<v Speaker 1>He's pumping out books like he's making quarter pounders. Two

0:31:30.080 --> 0:31:33.840
<v Speaker 1>Tony's was also critical of pop music. His words not

0:31:33.920 --> 0:31:37.160
<v Speaker 1>mine quote, Don't give me no country in Western with

0:31:37.200 --> 0:31:40.000
<v Speaker 1>some hillbilly winding about how some granny got drunk and

0:31:40.080 --> 0:31:42.360
<v Speaker 1>rain over him in a pickup truck. Don't give me

0:31:42.400 --> 0:31:45.560
<v Speaker 1>no rap with egotistical ghetto stars singing about their bitches,

0:31:45.600 --> 0:31:48.720
<v Speaker 1>big booties, how much jewelry and money and dope they've got,

0:31:48.880 --> 0:31:51.160
<v Speaker 1>and how they're driving around in benzes with bottles of

0:31:51.240 --> 0:31:53.480
<v Speaker 1>crystal in one hand and a crack pipe and the

0:31:53.520 --> 0:31:58.320
<v Speaker 1>other gimme handles. Messiah gimme Strauss's thunder and lightning. Anyone

0:31:58.320 --> 0:32:01.920
<v Speaker 1>who doesn't like that as a fucking anim sacrilegious Nietzsch

0:32:02.080 --> 0:32:05.760
<v Speaker 1>was right. Life needs music. To Tony said that when

0:32:05.800 --> 0:32:09.840
<v Speaker 1>he committed murder, he felt a satiating rush. Quote. It's

0:32:09.840 --> 0:32:12.400
<v Speaker 1>not easy going into a heavily armed hotel room at

0:32:12.400 --> 0:32:14.680
<v Speaker 1>two in the morning and blowing a guy's face off,

0:32:15.000 --> 0:32:17.440
<v Speaker 1>but it gives you a feeling of living on the edge.

0:32:17.960 --> 0:32:21.320
<v Speaker 1>So two Tony's seemed to be Jerry Paisley, but I

0:32:21.360 --> 0:32:25.640
<v Speaker 1>wasn't a hundred percent sure. Thankfully, the anonymous blogger eventually

0:32:25.640 --> 0:32:29.320
<v Speaker 1>revealed his real name, Sean Atwood, a young British man

0:32:29.400 --> 0:32:33.800
<v Speaker 1>imprisoned in Arizona for trafficking ecstasy. Atwood, who was deported

0:32:33.800 --> 0:32:35.800
<v Speaker 1>to the UK after he got out of prison in

0:32:35.800 --> 0:32:39.280
<v Speaker 1>two thousand seven, is now a prolific author and public speaker.

0:32:39.680 --> 0:32:43.880
<v Speaker 1>We spoke by Skype, and how long after you arrived

0:32:43.920 --> 0:32:50.840
<v Speaker 1>in prison did you meet Jerry Paisley. I met him

0:32:51.040 --> 0:32:58.320
<v Speaker 1>and late two thousand and four, I think. So when

0:32:58.360 --> 0:33:02.640
<v Speaker 1>you write about Jerry, you use the pseudonym to Tony's.

0:33:02.760 --> 0:33:05.120
<v Speaker 1>Did he ask you to use a pseudonym and not

0:33:05.200 --> 0:33:09.440
<v Speaker 1>to use his real name. Yes, Um, is it uncomfortable

0:33:09.520 --> 0:33:13.000
<v Speaker 1>for you that I know who to Tony's is What

0:33:13.440 --> 0:33:18.440
<v Speaker 1>is slightly uncomfortable is that he asked me not to

0:33:18.480 --> 0:33:24.520
<v Speaker 1>bring any heat on his ex and the family. So

0:33:25.040 --> 0:33:30.280
<v Speaker 1>he asked that everything regarding the descriptions be substantially changed.

0:33:31.080 --> 0:33:35.560
<v Speaker 1>When you say his ex, you mean one of his wives. Yes,

0:33:36.280 --> 0:33:42.000
<v Speaker 1>his first wife or second Paisley's second wife was Peggy Baggage.

0:33:42.280 --> 0:33:44.640
<v Speaker 1>What did he tell you about Peggy? I mean did what?

0:33:44.920 --> 0:33:47.880
<v Speaker 1>Did he his marriage to her? How did he describe that?

0:33:48.440 --> 0:33:50.160
<v Speaker 1>He said it was one of the happiest periods of

0:33:50.240 --> 0:33:53.200
<v Speaker 1>his life, but he sucked it up. Did he say

0:33:53.240 --> 0:33:56.520
<v Speaker 1>why he funked it up or what what led to it? Yeah?

0:33:56.560 --> 0:34:01.440
<v Speaker 1>Because of that addiction to the lifestyle and because he

0:34:01.440 --> 0:34:06.880
<v Speaker 1>had got um cocaine which exacerbated his dark side. But

0:34:07.040 --> 0:34:09.919
<v Speaker 1>did you did you sense any animosity on his part

0:34:10.000 --> 0:34:15.320
<v Speaker 1>towards Peggy? No? I felt felt more the other way around.

0:34:16.040 --> 0:34:18.880
<v Speaker 1>That he felt that that he had been in a

0:34:18.880 --> 0:34:22.680
<v Speaker 1>good situation and that he had brought There are a

0:34:22.719 --> 0:34:27.280
<v Speaker 1>lot of problem, problems and trouble and risk Atward stood

0:34:27.320 --> 0:34:30.600
<v Speaker 1>out in prison. His nickname was England. He was an

0:34:30.680 --> 0:34:33.359
<v Speaker 1>intellectual who read more than a thousand books in less

0:34:33.400 --> 0:34:37.200
<v Speaker 1>than six years. Peasley took a liking to him. Can

0:34:37.239 --> 0:34:39.640
<v Speaker 1>you describe Jerry to me? What was he like as

0:34:39.640 --> 0:34:42.000
<v Speaker 1>a person, What was his personality like? What did he

0:34:42.040 --> 0:34:44.239
<v Speaker 1>look like like when you first met him? Can you

0:34:44.280 --> 0:34:50.480
<v Speaker 1>describe that? Very confident, very charismatic. He had already served

0:34:50.480 --> 0:34:53.920
<v Speaker 1>a considered amount of time in prison, so he was

0:34:54.800 --> 0:34:58.680
<v Speaker 1>an older guy. But like Uncle Junior character of the Sopranos.

0:34:59.360 --> 0:35:01.840
<v Speaker 1>And if you ever watched a movie like Good Fellows

0:35:02.480 --> 0:35:06.040
<v Speaker 1>our casino, it was like he just walked off that

0:35:06.400 --> 0:35:10.560
<v Speaker 1>movie set. The way he spoke, his mannerisms just like

0:35:10.600 --> 0:35:15.080
<v Speaker 1>a character of Good Fellows a casino. Eventually, Paisley asked

0:35:15.080 --> 0:35:18.239
<v Speaker 1>Atwood to write his biography on the condition that he

0:35:18.320 --> 0:35:22.880
<v Speaker 1>continued to mask Paisley's identity even after Paisley died. Paisley

0:35:22.920 --> 0:35:25.960
<v Speaker 1>told Atwood that he wanted to protect his family. And

0:35:26.040 --> 0:35:29.320
<v Speaker 1>I think this is very important because if Paisley was

0:35:29.360 --> 0:35:33.040
<v Speaker 1>a full blown sociopath who just craved media and attention

0:35:33.160 --> 0:35:37.000
<v Speaker 1>and notoriety and fame, why would he care whether or

0:35:37.040 --> 0:35:39.880
<v Speaker 1>not he was named in his own biography. After he

0:35:40.000 --> 0:35:45.040
<v Speaker 1>died in eighteen, Atwood published Paisley's biography, The Life Story

0:35:45.120 --> 0:35:48.480
<v Speaker 1>of Two Tony's, in a book called The Mafia Philosopher.

0:35:48.960 --> 0:35:52.480
<v Speaker 1>In parts of the book, Atwood used composite characters and situations,

0:35:52.760 --> 0:35:56.399
<v Speaker 1>so I'm not going to quote from it directly. Interestingly enough,

0:35:56.640 --> 0:35:59.480
<v Speaker 1>there is no mention of Paisley's claim that the Missing

0:35:59.480 --> 0:36:02.799
<v Speaker 1>Congress were assassinated. Were you aware that he made these

0:36:02.800 --> 0:36:06.839
<v Speaker 1>claims in ninety, that he told investigators that he transported

0:36:06.840 --> 0:36:11.719
<v Speaker 1>explosives to Alaska and that he played a part in

0:36:12.520 --> 0:36:15.560
<v Speaker 1>at least in terms of transporting a bomb in the

0:36:15.600 --> 0:36:21.920
<v Speaker 1>plane going down. No, I was not. He never discussed

0:36:21.920 --> 0:36:28.160
<v Speaker 1>that with you. Now. Now, Paisley could have discussed these

0:36:28.160 --> 0:36:30.720
<v Speaker 1>claims with Atwood and asked him to keep them quiet.

0:36:31.080 --> 0:36:34.479
<v Speaker 1>But Paisley is dead, so we only have Atwood's word here,

0:36:34.680 --> 0:36:37.560
<v Speaker 1>and I believe him. Atwood and I discussed the issue

0:36:37.560 --> 0:36:41.040
<v Speaker 1>of truth again. Who do we as a society choose

0:36:41.120 --> 0:36:44.839
<v Speaker 1>to believe? Who do we instantly right off? This might

0:36:44.920 --> 0:36:49.560
<v Speaker 1>sound purely philosophical, but it's not. It's very practical because

0:36:49.640 --> 0:36:54.720
<v Speaker 1>if the FBI wrote off Jerry Paisley's claims in solely

0:36:54.760 --> 0:36:57.680
<v Speaker 1>because of his past, because he was a criminal, that

0:36:57.800 --> 0:37:00.960
<v Speaker 1>matters it means that he could have told almost anything

0:37:01.239 --> 0:37:04.160
<v Speaker 1>and the Bureau would have said, this guy's a criminal,

0:37:04.360 --> 0:37:08.160
<v Speaker 1>can't believe any of his claims onward, Maybe the FBI

0:37:08.280 --> 0:37:11.400
<v Speaker 1>sincerely thought Paisley was lying, Maybe they just didn't want

0:37:11.440 --> 0:37:14.600
<v Speaker 1>to get involved. Maybe someone told them to drop the case.

0:37:14.880 --> 0:37:18.360
<v Speaker 1>I don't know, but in my opinion, if someone like

0:37:18.520 --> 0:37:23.160
<v Speaker 1>Jerry Paisley makes serious, substantial claims, those claims deserved to

0:37:23.160 --> 0:37:27.040
<v Speaker 1>be investigated, and other claims Paisley made were in fact

0:37:27.120 --> 0:37:30.600
<v Speaker 1>investigated just by members of local and state law enforcement,

0:37:30.800 --> 0:37:34.320
<v Speaker 1>not the FBI. Remember, Paisley was convicted of a second

0:37:34.400 --> 0:37:37.800
<v Speaker 1>murder because he told Arizona investigator Tom Davis that he

0:37:37.880 --> 0:37:40.640
<v Speaker 1>shot someone at death in a motel, and Davis actually

0:37:40.680 --> 0:37:44.080
<v Speaker 1>followed up and did his job, unlike the FBI. And

0:37:44.120 --> 0:37:47.520
<v Speaker 1>if you still say, well bullshit, John, let me ask

0:37:47.560 --> 0:37:51.440
<v Speaker 1>you this. If your spouse or mine disappeared, and shortly

0:37:51.520 --> 0:37:55.520
<v Speaker 1>thereafter you married a violent, mob connected person who later

0:37:55.560 --> 0:37:57.759
<v Speaker 1>claimed they played a part in the disappearance of your

0:37:57.800 --> 0:38:00.799
<v Speaker 1>first spouse, do you think invest the gators would take

0:38:00.840 --> 0:38:04.560
<v Speaker 1>those claims seriously? Because I do. None of this is

0:38:04.600 --> 0:38:07.640
<v Speaker 1>to say that I fully believe Jerry Paisley is to

0:38:07.719 --> 0:38:11.440
<v Speaker 1>say again that his claims should have been investigated properly

0:38:11.640 --> 0:38:14.640
<v Speaker 1>by the FBI. How else do you answer the question

0:38:14.640 --> 0:38:17.040
<v Speaker 1>of whether or not he was telling the truth. I

0:38:17.080 --> 0:38:21.920
<v Speaker 1>think that people on the outside looked at Jerry and

0:38:22.040 --> 0:38:25.600
<v Speaker 1>what he said, and even today people look at him

0:38:25.640 --> 0:38:28.239
<v Speaker 1>and say, well, that was a violent guy. I don't

0:38:28.280 --> 0:38:32.360
<v Speaker 1>believe anything he said. Um, you know, at the same time,

0:38:32.360 --> 0:38:35.600
<v Speaker 1>like I sit there looking at politicians every day who lie,

0:38:35.800 --> 0:38:41.160
<v Speaker 1>and it really seems in part to be a kind

0:38:41.160 --> 0:38:44.400
<v Speaker 1>of just a judgment call, like partially a class issue,

0:38:44.920 --> 0:38:47.320
<v Speaker 1>you know, I mean, everybody lies, and I guess the

0:38:47.440 --> 0:38:52.440
<v Speaker 1>question is should should we believe anything that Jerry said?

0:38:53.040 --> 0:38:56.480
<v Speaker 1>Should we believe anything that anyone says. I'm believe in

0:38:56.520 --> 0:39:03.759
<v Speaker 1>critical thinking, and I'm just a reporter, So I was

0:39:03.880 --> 0:39:06.760
<v Speaker 1>just the means by which Jerry could tell his story,

0:39:08.200 --> 0:39:11.719
<v Speaker 1>and it's up to the reader to make that decision

0:39:12.400 --> 0:39:15.600
<v Speaker 1>what they believe in, what they don't believe. I can't

0:39:15.680 --> 0:39:17.640
<v Speaker 1>judge him. I mean, he saved my life in prison

0:39:18.040 --> 0:39:22.799
<v Speaker 1>over a situation. He definitely had a heart, and I

0:39:22.880 --> 0:39:26.480
<v Speaker 1>saw the human side of him when we said goodbye,

0:39:26.520 --> 0:39:28.560
<v Speaker 1>you know, he was there was tears in his eyes

0:39:28.719 --> 0:39:32.000
<v Speaker 1>when we said goodbye at the fence. He told me

0:39:32.080 --> 0:39:33.879
<v Speaker 1>that I was like the sun that he'd never had.

0:39:35.320 --> 0:39:40.000
<v Speaker 1>So people commit extremely violent acts, but they're still human beings.

0:39:40.800 --> 0:39:44.240
<v Speaker 1>You can't write him off just because and say everything

0:39:44.280 --> 0:39:46.840
<v Speaker 1>that he said his lives because he was a violent person.

0:39:47.960 --> 0:39:50.640
<v Speaker 1>Everybody's got that in them. That's one thing he taught me.

0:39:51.280 --> 0:39:54.040
<v Speaker 1>I asked Atwood what else Paisley shared with him about

0:39:54.040 --> 0:39:58.080
<v Speaker 1>Peggy Baggage? Were you aware that her former husband was

0:39:58.120 --> 0:40:05.480
<v Speaker 1>a congressman? Yeah, he told you that. Yeah, what did

0:40:05.480 --> 0:40:09.960
<v Speaker 1>he say about that? He was very excitable about it,

0:40:10.000 --> 0:40:13.759
<v Speaker 1>but he never like revealed a bigger picture that you're

0:40:13.800 --> 0:40:16.399
<v Speaker 1>telling me. When you say excitable, what do you mean

0:40:16.400 --> 0:40:19.319
<v Speaker 1>by excitable? There was a look in his eyes if

0:40:19.320 --> 0:40:23.400
<v Speaker 1>there was more and it was a big deal, but

0:40:23.640 --> 0:40:26.920
<v Speaker 1>he never expanded on it. If let's say that Jerry

0:40:27.080 --> 0:40:29.400
<v Speaker 1>was telling the truth that there was some kind of

0:40:29.440 --> 0:40:32.080
<v Speaker 1>foul play involved, why do you think he would have

0:40:32.120 --> 0:40:37.440
<v Speaker 1>not told you? Okay, I can't um. I don't know

0:40:37.480 --> 0:40:40.920
<v Speaker 1>whether he was involved or not. But my best guess

0:40:40.920 --> 0:40:44.000
<v Speaker 1>on why he wouldn't have told me it was because

0:40:44.040 --> 0:40:47.040
<v Speaker 1>he was trying to steer away anything that could hurt Peggy.

0:40:47.160 --> 0:40:50.000
<v Speaker 1>Did he express regret about how he treated Peggy and

0:40:50.040 --> 0:40:54.400
<v Speaker 1>treated the kids. Yes, what did he say. He said

0:40:54.400 --> 0:40:59.719
<v Speaker 1>that cocaine had scrambled his decision making processes and he

0:41:00.000 --> 0:41:03.560
<v Speaker 1>at this. You know, he was living in this huge house,

0:41:04.760 --> 0:41:07.680
<v Speaker 1>he was loving being a dad to the kids, and

0:41:07.800 --> 0:41:11.799
<v Speaker 1>his own kid would come out from Arizona and it

0:41:11.880 --> 0:41:16.320
<v Speaker 1>was all hunky dory, and then he just started slipping

0:41:17.600 --> 0:41:21.760
<v Speaker 1>into his owld ways. But even worse because he started

0:41:21.840 --> 0:41:25.359
<v Speaker 1>murdering people and he just let the family down and

0:41:25.400 --> 0:41:29.440
<v Speaker 1>brought a lot of risk and danger into the lives.

0:41:30.120 --> 0:41:34.000
<v Speaker 1>Did he ever discuss taking part in any bombings for

0:41:34.160 --> 0:41:39.560
<v Speaker 1>the bananas, like my understand he did. Yeah, he bombed

0:41:41.160 --> 0:41:46.479
<v Speaker 1>the wigs Salon, he bombed um. It's in the book.

0:41:46.520 --> 0:41:48.560
<v Speaker 1>I can't I can't specifically remember off the top of

0:41:48.560 --> 0:41:51.680
<v Speaker 1>my head right now. But he dynamited a few places

0:41:51.680 --> 0:41:55.320
<v Speaker 1>for the bananas. Was one of a judge's house, a

0:41:55.400 --> 0:42:04.120
<v Speaker 1>judge named Ebode. Yes, that's it. Yeah, believe he did that. Why,

0:42:05.040 --> 0:42:10.160
<v Speaker 1>he just was really proud of it. And that didn't

0:42:10.200 --> 0:42:12.600
<v Speaker 1>seem to be any ambiguity when he was telling me that.

0:42:13.040 --> 0:42:16.160
<v Speaker 1>So when I didn't want things any details changed, it

0:42:16.320 --> 0:42:20.399
<v Speaker 1>just told it me straight. So do you understand why

0:42:20.440 --> 0:42:22.680
<v Speaker 1>all of this is so fascinating to me? You have

0:42:22.800 --> 0:42:26.480
<v Speaker 1>a guy, you know, I'm not I'm not judging you know, Jerry,

0:42:26.480 --> 0:42:28.680
<v Speaker 1>I never met him, But you have a guy who

0:42:29.800 --> 0:42:33.520
<v Speaker 1>was a multiple murderer, a bomber, ties to the bananas

0:42:33.520 --> 0:42:36.759
<v Speaker 1>and the look of Olies. Marries the widow of a

0:42:36.760 --> 0:42:40.839
<v Speaker 1>missing congressman sixteen and a half months after her husband disappears.

0:42:41.560 --> 0:42:46.960
<v Speaker 1>Later tells investigators that he transported explosives to Alaska. Uh

0:42:47.000 --> 0:42:51.040
<v Speaker 1>and that somebody else, another man who they later went

0:42:51.080 --> 0:42:54.080
<v Speaker 1>into business with, UM told him that he put a

0:42:54.120 --> 0:42:56.320
<v Speaker 1>bomb on the plane and that he was given equity

0:42:56.320 --> 0:43:02.360
<v Speaker 1>in the business because of his role in the alleged assassination.

0:43:03.560 --> 0:43:08.840
<v Speaker 1>You understand why this is so absolutely like fascinating to me? Yeah?

0:43:08.880 --> 0:43:11.400
<v Speaker 1>I do, I really do. You know. I write books

0:43:12.120 --> 0:43:17.880
<v Speaker 1>with conspiracies, um. I wrote book about Barry Sealed. They said,

0:43:19.600 --> 0:43:24.239
<v Speaker 1>cocaine flying pilot and all this stuff. It's fascinating to

0:43:24.280 --> 0:43:28.080
<v Speaker 1>me as well. And it's just a shame that, you know,

0:43:28.200 --> 0:43:33.120
<v Speaker 1>he didn't reveal any of that to me. It's it's

0:43:33.160 --> 0:43:36.120
<v Speaker 1>interesting because I would have thought that if he would

0:43:36.200 --> 0:43:39.600
<v Speaker 1>tell anybody, he would tell you. And as far as

0:43:39.600 --> 0:43:43.560
<v Speaker 1>I can tell other than discussing it, he never shared

0:43:43.600 --> 0:43:46.680
<v Speaker 1>the story with anybody ever again, So he didn't even

0:43:46.719 --> 0:43:51.080
<v Speaker 1>tell me that he discussed it with the investigations, which

0:43:51.640 --> 0:43:57.480
<v Speaker 1>indicates to me that there was a lot more to

0:43:57.560 --> 0:44:00.000
<v Speaker 1>that story that he didn't tell me. If he wouldn't

0:44:00.120 --> 0:44:03.319
<v Speaker 1>tell me even that, and what else did he know.

0:44:28.080 --> 0:44:30.520
<v Speaker 1>Back in Tucson, Paul and I worked hard as the

0:44:30.560 --> 0:44:33.279
<v Speaker 1>hours ticked down toward our flight out of town. In

0:44:33.360 --> 0:44:36.640
<v Speaker 1>terms of interviews, Arizona was mostly a wash. We got

0:44:36.640 --> 0:44:39.719
<v Speaker 1>Tom Davis and Steve Fowler and that's about it. Most

0:44:39.719 --> 0:44:42.040
<v Speaker 1>of the red Dots were dead. The rest we either

0:44:42.080 --> 0:44:44.799
<v Speaker 1>couldn't reach or they wouldn't talk to us. So we

0:44:44.880 --> 0:44:47.719
<v Speaker 1>decided to use our remaining time to visit places tied

0:44:47.719 --> 0:44:51.160
<v Speaker 1>to the story. We visited the Sahara Motel where Paisley

0:44:51.239 --> 0:44:55.120
<v Speaker 1>murdered a man. Now it's an apartment complex. We visited

0:44:55.120 --> 0:44:57.880
<v Speaker 1>a plane graveyard, but that was just for fun, and

0:44:57.920 --> 0:45:00.760
<v Speaker 1>at the very end, we visited the Spanish Trail Motel.

0:45:01.560 --> 0:45:03.920
<v Speaker 1>It's been a long trip in Arizona. Paul and I

0:45:04.000 --> 0:45:07.719
<v Speaker 1>have been here a few days and we have had

0:45:07.760 --> 0:45:10.919
<v Speaker 1>people back out of interviews. We've been calling numbers left

0:45:10.960 --> 0:45:16.640
<v Speaker 1>and right. Old mobsters apparently don't like phones or email.

0:45:17.440 --> 0:45:21.359
<v Speaker 1>They don't really like to be contacted. So, yeah, Paul

0:45:21.400 --> 0:45:24.440
<v Speaker 1>and I are standing at the Spanish Trail Motel and Tucson.

0:45:24.920 --> 0:45:27.879
<v Speaker 1>The sun is almost completely behind the mountains. It's getting dark,

0:45:27.880 --> 0:45:32.080
<v Speaker 1>it's breezy. The sky is pink and purple and blue,

0:45:32.160 --> 0:45:34.800
<v Speaker 1>and you can see palm trees and wound the periphery

0:45:34.800 --> 0:45:39.040
<v Speaker 1>of this beautiful old motel that's now completely decayed. There's

0:45:39.360 --> 0:45:42.080
<v Speaker 1>rust and broken glass and needles and an old shopping

0:45:42.120 --> 0:45:45.040
<v Speaker 1>card and it's very much the epitome of what you

0:45:45.040 --> 0:45:50.040
<v Speaker 1>want to photograph and explorer and exploration. Uh. And one

0:45:50.080 --> 0:45:52.839
<v Speaker 1>of these buildings here with the smashed out windows could

0:45:52.880 --> 0:45:56.239
<v Speaker 1>have been the place that Jerry Paisley lived, or the

0:45:56.320 --> 0:45:59.919
<v Speaker 1>room that he said he brought Margaret, who he later

0:46:00.000 --> 0:46:03.040
<v Speaker 1>said was Peggy Baggetts, who after she met allegedly with

0:46:03.120 --> 0:46:07.719
<v Speaker 1>Joe Banano. And there's only a slight glimmer of light

0:46:07.840 --> 0:46:11.600
<v Speaker 1>left here at the Spanish Trail Motel. Paul, you want

0:46:11.600 --> 0:46:16.560
<v Speaker 1>to hop the fence? Sure, Okay, so we're gonna I'm

0:46:16.560 --> 0:46:18.640
<v Speaker 1>gonna let Paul hop the fence first, because he's six

0:46:18.680 --> 0:46:21.920
<v Speaker 1>to I'll just use Paul as a ladder. I'm not

0:46:21.920 --> 0:46:25.279
<v Speaker 1>gonna hop defense. We didn't hop the fence. So at

0:46:25.280 --> 0:46:27.360
<v Speaker 1>the end of this trip in Arizona, we're standing on

0:46:27.400 --> 0:46:30.799
<v Speaker 1>the side of a rusted out motel And honestly, there

0:46:30.800 --> 0:46:34.000
<v Speaker 1>have been some surprises, but mostly it's been a frustrating trip.

0:46:34.360 --> 0:46:36.280
<v Speaker 1>We haven't been able to interview many of the people

0:46:36.280 --> 0:46:39.400
<v Speaker 1>that we wanted to. Nobody's answering the damn phone. We've

0:46:39.480 --> 0:46:43.440
<v Speaker 1>showed up at uh Peter Likavoli's house twice today alone,

0:46:43.480 --> 0:46:46.000
<v Speaker 1>so all we're doing is circling Tucson trying to find

0:46:46.640 --> 0:46:52.440
<v Speaker 1>octogenarian mobsters and no answers and no answers, so the

0:46:52.440 --> 0:46:55.360
<v Speaker 1>soun's almost gone and hopefully somebody doesn't jump out of

0:46:55.520 --> 0:46:59.279
<v Speaker 1>bush on this creepy alley and and you know she

0:46:59.400 --> 0:47:03.399
<v Speaker 1>have a shivn my rib. Thankfully, though our Arizona trip

0:47:03.520 --> 0:47:07.080
<v Speaker 1>wasn't a total bust. We got two good interviews. And

0:47:07.160 --> 0:47:10.000
<v Speaker 1>remember Bob Martinson, the man who broke the news to

0:47:10.040 --> 0:47:13.720
<v Speaker 1>me via text that Cokey Roberts Hail Boggs's daughter died.

0:47:14.120 --> 0:47:17.040
<v Speaker 1>The Bob Martinson I told you was important and asked

0:47:17.080 --> 0:47:22.960
<v Speaker 1>you to remember well on September in that very same text,

0:47:23.280 --> 0:47:25.960
<v Speaker 1>the one in which Bob told me Cokey died. He

0:47:26.120 --> 0:47:28.760
<v Speaker 1>also sent me something I had been waiting on for weeks,

0:47:29.200 --> 0:47:32.279
<v Speaker 1>the exact coordinates of where he found part of Assessma,

0:47:32.800 --> 0:47:35.919
<v Speaker 1>part of what could be the missing plane. So armed

0:47:35.960 --> 0:47:38.960
<v Speaker 1>with this a latitude and longitude, we were off to

0:47:39.040 --> 0:47:48.839
<v Speaker 1>Alaska next time on missing in Alaska. If you were

0:47:49.080 --> 0:47:51.399
<v Speaker 1>a Republican in the head of the Young Republicans Club,

0:47:51.440 --> 0:47:55.360
<v Speaker 1>why were you arranging a flight for two Democratic congressman

0:47:56.040 --> 0:48:00.239
<v Speaker 1>That's my own business. I don't care who are before

0:48:00.280 --> 0:48:02.919
<v Speaker 1>as long as they paid the bill was like, that's

0:48:02.960 --> 0:48:06.080
<v Speaker 1>where they did, but the flight was unpaid. It was

0:48:06.120 --> 0:48:17.400
<v Speaker 1>a free flight. Before we go an epilogue In December nineteen,

0:48:17.600 --> 0:48:22.160
<v Speaker 1>I got a voicemail from someone surprising Rosalie Banano. Rosalie,

0:48:22.320 --> 0:48:25.200
<v Speaker 1>now three, is the daughter in law of Joe Banano,

0:48:25.400 --> 0:48:28.840
<v Speaker 1>who she calls Mr b. In nineteen fifty six, she

0:48:28.960 --> 0:48:32.280
<v Speaker 1>married his son Bill at a lavish mafia wedding. Joe,

0:48:32.440 --> 0:48:35.680
<v Speaker 1>her father in law, and Bill, her husband, have both died.

0:48:36.120 --> 0:48:38.719
<v Speaker 1>I called Rosalie back and left her a voicemail on

0:48:38.760 --> 0:48:42.799
<v Speaker 1>her jitterbug phone, and then for a while nothing. When

0:48:42.800 --> 0:48:45.440
<v Speaker 1>I called again in April. However, she picked up. She

0:48:45.600 --> 0:48:47.960
<v Speaker 1>was friendly. She even asked how I was holding up

0:48:47.960 --> 0:48:51.560
<v Speaker 1>in New Orleans during the pandemic. She kindly answered my questions,

0:48:51.640 --> 0:48:54.759
<v Speaker 1>but didn't want to do a recorded interview. Rosalie said

0:48:54.800 --> 0:48:57.399
<v Speaker 1>that she and the other Banana wives were mostly kept

0:48:57.400 --> 0:48:59.640
<v Speaker 1>out of the loop. They spent their time in the kitchen.

0:49:00.080 --> 0:49:02.120
<v Speaker 1>I asked if I could run some names by her

0:49:02.200 --> 0:49:05.800
<v Speaker 1>to see if she recognized them, and she agreed. Unfortunately,

0:49:05.960 --> 0:49:09.680
<v Speaker 1>she didn't recognize most of them, including Jerry Paisley, though

0:49:09.719 --> 0:49:11.520
<v Speaker 1>she said she was going to check with someone who

0:49:11.600 --> 0:49:15.280
<v Speaker 1>might know more and get back to me. Rosalie did, however,

0:49:15.480 --> 0:49:19.200
<v Speaker 1>remember joe Aya Tarola, the Banano lieutenant Paisley Claine gave

0:49:19.280 --> 0:49:22.200
<v Speaker 1>him a lock suitcase that contained a bomb, the bomb

0:49:22.239 --> 0:49:25.680
<v Speaker 1>allegedly put on the missing Congressman's plane. Aya tar Rolla

0:49:25.800 --> 0:49:29.240
<v Speaker 1>is also the man who allegedly dined with Paisley, Peggy Baggett,

0:49:29.320 --> 0:49:31.960
<v Speaker 1>and Joe Banano at the Contigui in the summer of

0:49:32.040 --> 0:49:36.160
<v Speaker 1>nineteen seventy two. Rosalie told me that Joeya Tarola and

0:49:36.239 --> 0:49:39.839
<v Speaker 1>Joe Banano were close. She remembers seeing Ayah to rolla

0:49:39.920 --> 0:49:43.200
<v Speaker 1>around Banano's house She said the two men respected each

0:49:43.200 --> 0:49:46.000
<v Speaker 1>other a lot. Before the call ended, I had two

0:49:46.040 --> 0:49:49.800
<v Speaker 1>final questions. First, did she know of any Bonano business

0:49:49.800 --> 0:49:53.880
<v Speaker 1>ceilings in Alaska? She said no, but again reiterated that

0:49:53.920 --> 0:49:56.320
<v Speaker 1>she was kept out of the loop. And I asked

0:49:56.400 --> 0:49:59.400
<v Speaker 1>whether or not any documentation from the seventies still exist,

0:49:59.560 --> 0:50:03.680
<v Speaker 1>received checks, diaries, stuff like that. She said that after

0:50:03.760 --> 0:50:06.239
<v Speaker 1>Joe Banano died, she sold a trove of his old

0:50:06.280 --> 0:50:09.560
<v Speaker 1>checks on eBay and made a small fortune. However, she

0:50:09.680 --> 0:50:12.000
<v Speaker 1>told me that since Bill Bonano, her husband died in

0:50:12.000 --> 0:50:15.360
<v Speaker 1>two thousand eight, she still hasn't gone through his filing cabinet.

0:50:15.719 --> 0:50:18.480
<v Speaker 1>She said doing so might be a good project, and

0:50:18.560 --> 0:50:21.440
<v Speaker 1>she said she would contact me if she found anything interesting.

0:50:22.680 --> 0:50:25.799
<v Speaker 1>This week, I have two tasks for you, one specific

0:50:25.880 --> 0:50:28.759
<v Speaker 1>and one vague. First, we're going to post the red

0:50:28.800 --> 0:50:32.319
<v Speaker 1>dot photos online. If you recognize any of the unidentified

0:50:32.320 --> 0:50:36.160
<v Speaker 1>wedding guests, let us know. Second, this episode is packed

0:50:36.200 --> 0:50:40.200
<v Speaker 1>with information, so maybe listen again, take notes, and see

0:50:40.239 --> 0:50:42.719
<v Speaker 1>if you can find anything we missed. If you do,

0:50:43.040 --> 0:50:45.799
<v Speaker 1>let us know. You can reach us by phone at

0:50:45.840 --> 0:50:49.640
<v Speaker 1>one eight three three m I A tips. That's one

0:50:49.760 --> 0:50:54.120
<v Speaker 1>eight three three six four two eight four seven seven

0:50:54.480 --> 0:50:59.080
<v Speaker 1>again one eight three three six four two eight four

0:50:59.480 --> 0:51:03.040
<v Speaker 1>seven Evan, or you can reach us via email at

0:51:03.160 --> 0:51:07.080
<v Speaker 1>tips at i heeart media dot com. That's tips t

0:51:07.400 --> 0:51:11.600
<v Speaker 1>I P s at i heeart media dot com. An

0:51:11.640 --> 0:51:15.160
<v Speaker 1>important note, none of the people Jerry Paisley claimed took

0:51:15.200 --> 0:51:18.840
<v Speaker 1>part in or had knowledge of the alleged bombing, Joe Bonano,

0:51:19.200 --> 0:51:23.840
<v Speaker 1>Joey A. Tarola, Danny Zavanich, Gene Fowler, Larry Fowler, or

0:51:23.840 --> 0:51:27.960
<v Speaker 1>Peggy Baggage were ever charged with or convicted of crimes

0:51:28.000 --> 0:51:31.640
<v Speaker 1>tied to any of Paisley's allegations. Peggy Beggatt and Danny

0:51:31.719 --> 0:51:34.600
<v Speaker 1>Zavanache declined multiple requests for an on the record interview.

0:51:34.920 --> 0:51:38.920
<v Speaker 1>Gene Fowler was unavailable for an interview. Joe Bonano, Joeya Tarola,

0:51:39.000 --> 0:51:42.560
<v Speaker 1>and Larry Fowler are dead. Louis Marconi, the X cop

0:51:42.600 --> 0:51:45.279
<v Speaker 1>who was friends with Paisley, also was never charged with

0:51:45.480 --> 0:51:49.040
<v Speaker 1>or convicted of any crimes tied to any of Paisley's allegations.

0:51:49.520 --> 0:51:53.680
<v Speaker 1>Marconi declined multiple requests to do a recorded interview. Finally,

0:51:54.000 --> 0:51:57.680
<v Speaker 1>in his seventies, Pete Lookavoli Jr. And Mike Lackavoli vehemently

0:51:57.719 --> 0:52:00.640
<v Speaker 1>denied reports that they were involved in organized crime rings.

0:52:01.080 --> 0:52:04.120
<v Speaker 1>The Lick of OLiS didn't respond to multiple interview requests.

0:52:05.560 --> 0:52:08.400
<v Speaker 1>Ben Boland is our executive producer. Paul Decan is our

0:52:08.400 --> 0:52:12.680
<v Speaker 1>supervising producer, Chris Brown is our assistant producer, Seth Nicholas

0:52:12.719 --> 0:52:16.280
<v Speaker 1>Johnson is our producer. Sam T. Garden is our research assistant,

0:52:16.520 --> 0:52:19.640
<v Speaker 1>and I'm your host and executive producer, John Wallzac. You

0:52:19.680 --> 0:52:22.080
<v Speaker 1>can find me on Twitter at at John Waalzac j

0:52:22.280 --> 0:52:26.880
<v Speaker 1>O n w A l c z a K special

0:52:26.920 --> 0:52:30.919
<v Speaker 1>Thanks to investigative reporters and editors or ire and specifically

0:52:31.320 --> 0:52:35.040
<v Speaker 1>executive director Doug Haddocks. Thanks also to everyone at the

0:52:35.040 --> 0:52:39.360
<v Speaker 1>State Historical Society of Missouri, including John Console, Kevin George,

0:52:39.440 --> 0:52:42.000
<v Speaker 1>and Beth Pike. And a big thank you to Pauline

0:52:42.000 --> 0:52:45.520
<v Speaker 1>Loftus for showing us around the Mountain Oyster Club. Missing

0:52:45.560 --> 0:52:47.840
<v Speaker 1>in Alaska is a co production of I Heart Media

0:52:47.960 --> 0:52:48.920
<v Speaker 1>and Greenfork Media.