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Speaker 1: Happy Saturday. Maria Sibilia Marianne was born on April twod seven,

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Speaker 1: so we are bringing out our episode on her as

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Speaker 1: today Saturday Classic. Maria Sibilia Marianne was a naturalist and

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Speaker 1: an illustrator who made significant contributions to the field of entomology,

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Speaker 1: and whose artwork was also an achievement in its own right.

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Speaker 1: So enjoy Welcome to Stuff you missed in History Class

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Speaker 1: a production of I Heart Radio. Hello, and welcome to

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Speaker 1: the podcast. I'm Holly Frying and I'm Tracy B. Wilson. Tracy,

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Speaker 1: you know this, but it's worth mentioning that there was

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Speaker 1: a time and people believed the insects were somehow spawn

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Speaker 1: from mud. In fact, I had a book as a

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Speaker 1: child that was about animals that discussed this fact, and

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Speaker 1: I was perplexed that anyone ever would have thought that

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Speaker 1: was a thing. It seems very far fetched now, but

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Speaker 1: that's because science and there were plenty of other misconceptions

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Speaker 1: where bugs came from. But the woman that we're talking

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Speaker 1: about today helped dispel a lot of those myths and

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Speaker 1: really improved the scientific study of insects and plants, and

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Speaker 1: she did it beautifully. This is sort of a wonderful

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Speaker 1: marriage of art and science. Although she was not a

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Speaker 1: scholar in the sense of having attended college for education,

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Speaker 1: her work would go on to be studied by naturalists

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Speaker 1: and was even used by the father of modern taxonomy,

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Speaker 1: Carl Linnaeus, as he identified and named plant an animal species.

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Speaker 1: So today we are talking about naturalists and scientific illustrator

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Speaker 1: Maria Zibuya Marianne. In an interesting thing, her star is

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Speaker 1: apparently on their eyes, because I have noticed all of

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Speaker 1: a sudden as I was researching this, articles were cropping

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Speaker 1: up on other sites about her. So she is kind

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Speaker 1: of a buzzword at the moment, apparently, but she's really

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Speaker 1: amazing and worthy of all this attention. So that's who

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Speaker 1: we're talking about today. Maria Zibuya Mayan was born on

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Speaker 1: April second, sixteen forty seven, in Frankfurt, Germany. Her father

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Speaker 1: was Matteius Marion, one of seventeenth century Germany's best illustrators,

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Speaker 1: and her mother was Johanna Sabaya Hain. Johanna was Matteius's

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Speaker 1: second wife, and he had inherited a print shop from

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Speaker 1: his father in law from his first marriage, and Maria

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Speaker 1: was born into a family of much older siblings that

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Speaker 1: were from her father's first marriage. Before his first wife died,

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Speaker 1: that couple had had five children together, so when she

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Speaker 1: was born, Maria had two half sisters who were in

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Speaker 1: their twenties, another half sister who was a teenager, and

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Speaker 1: a brother who was twelve. So she was the baby

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Speaker 1: by a significant margin. But though her father was a

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Speaker 1: renowned illustrator and she undoubtedly inherited talent from him, she

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Speaker 1: wasn't able to benefit from his influence because he died

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Speaker 1: when she was only three. But her mother remarried and

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Speaker 1: Maria's stepfather, Jacob Merril, was a pay in tor. He

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Speaker 1: was well known for his still life work, which focused

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Speaker 1: on just meticulously rendered florals. Yeah, this is a moment

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Speaker 1: during research when I reached out to Tracy and said,

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Speaker 1: this is one of those weird times when a thing

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Speaker 1: I love meets up with a thing i'm researching because

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Speaker 1: I really like, in particular YAKA Meryl's paintings. Uh. He

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Speaker 1: has this one sort of signature color scheme on a

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Speaker 1: lot of flowers that look almost like a peppermint stripe,

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Speaker 1: and it's very beautiful and you'll see it appear first

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Speaker 1: in like individual images of tulips that he would paint

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Speaker 1: and then they kind of get worked into bigger Dutch

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Speaker 1: Golden Age florals that you've seen, undoubtedly, So it was

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Speaker 1: kind of a lovely discovery that he tied into our

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Speaker 1: show today. H And Maria was interested in art from

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Speaker 1: the time she was very tiny. I don't know how

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Speaker 1: you couldn't be in that family. So her stepfather took

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Speaker 1: the role of teacher and gave her a foundation that

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Speaker 1: was going to serve her for the rest of her life.

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Speaker 1: And it was assisting Merril in his work that she

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Speaker 1: found her own personal passion. While still very very young,

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Speaker 1: Maria would collect the plants and insects that served as

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Speaker 1: models for Meryl's still life paintings, and gathering those specimens

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Speaker 1: sparked her curiosity and she became more and more fascinated

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Speaker 1: with insects and plants. Caterpillars were of special interest to Maria,

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Speaker 1: and she began keeping her own collection of them so

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Speaker 1: that she could follow their life cycles as they transformed

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Speaker 1: through the puba stage and into butterflies. As she observed

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Speaker 1: these processes, she started documenting them through illustrations and Maria's

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Speaker 1: practice of keeping insects and other living things, and watching

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Speaker 1: the metamorphos and or grow through their life was really

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Speaker 1: quite significant. Other artists that made illustrations of plants and

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Speaker 1: animals almost always were working from dead, preserved specimens, but

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Speaker 1: Maria preferred to see all of her subjects alive to

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Speaker 1: truly understand what they looked like and how they functioned.

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Speaker 1: And it was undoubtedly this practice that she began as

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Speaker 1: a child that earned her a reputation for work that

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Speaker 1: surpassed all the scientific illustrators that came before her. At

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Speaker 1: the age of eighteen, in sixteen sixty five, Maria was

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Speaker 1: married to one of Meryl's apprentices, an artist named Johann

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Speaker 1: Andreas Graff. In addition to working as a painter, he

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Speaker 1: was also a draftsman and a publisher, as well as

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Speaker 1: a copper engraver. In sixteen sixty eight, Maria and Johan

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Speaker 1: had their first child, a daughter named Johanna Elena, and

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Speaker 1: after Johanna was born, the family moved to Johann's hometown

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Speaker 1: of Nuremberg. In the early years of Johanna's life, Maria

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Speaker 1: began producing more serious illustration studies of flowers and insects.

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Speaker 1: She once again began raising her own specimens, and has

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Speaker 1: said to have even spent nights where she got no

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Speaker 1: sleep because she was watching over pupa's that were expected

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Speaker 1: to produce metamorphosed moss or butterflies. She didn't want to

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Speaker 1: miss any of their transformations. Yes, she was dedicated to

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Speaker 1: watching them. She really like if she saw any movement

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Speaker 1: in a pupa that suggested it might be about to

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Speaker 1: release the um the metamorphosed creature, she was like, Nope,

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Speaker 1: I'm just gonna sit here and watch this no matter what. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And in Nuremberg, Maria also began a series of floral engravings,

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Speaker 1: which were published in three volumes over the course of

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Speaker 1: five years from sixteen seventy five to sixteen eighty. This publication,

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Speaker 1: titled bloom In Book or Book of Flowers, was so

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Speaker 1: popular that it was later republished as Neius Bloomin Book

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Speaker 1: New Book of Flowers, with additional plates and a new preface.

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Speaker 1: Thirteen years into their marriage, Maria and Johan had a

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Speaker 1: second daughter, Dorothya Maria I, was in sixteen seventy eight.

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Speaker 1: The year after Dorothy's birth, Maria produced the first of

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Speaker 1: two volumes titled Caterpillars Their Wondrous Transformation and peculiar nourishment

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Speaker 1: from flowers. That was in sixteen seventy nine. Volume two

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Speaker 1: didn't publish until almost four years later, in sixteen eighty three.

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Speaker 1: Marian's volumes on insects were greeted with acclaim immediately. She

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Speaker 1: had chosen to show moss and butterfly throughout their life cycles,

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Speaker 1: and in each image she showed them in each of

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Speaker 1: their life stages alongside and interacting with the plants that

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Speaker 1: served as the insects, food sources and habitats. Both the

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Speaker 1: insects and the flowers were illustrated in incredible and accurate detail,

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Speaker 1: with annotation for each and Maria's work had achieved an

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Speaker 1: entirely new level in scientific illustration, as no one had

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Speaker 1: ever documented the entire life cycle in this particular way.

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Speaker 1: That astonishes me that it was the seventeenth century before

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Speaker 1: anyone did this, because it's such a ubiquitous feature in

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Speaker 1: like science books for children. Now, yeah, you always show

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Speaker 1: the habitat plants along with the insects, but they were

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Speaker 1: always just drawn separately prior to this. Just after Maria's

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Speaker 1: Floral Book finished publication, and in the years between the

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Speaker 1: publications of volume one and two of her book on insects.

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Speaker 1: Her family pulled up stakes from Nurnberg, which had been

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Speaker 1: their home for fourteen years, and they moved back to Frankfurt.

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Speaker 1: Jaka Merrill had died in one leaving Maria's mother a widow,

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Speaker 1: and so she and her husband Graf had moved to

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Speaker 1: take care of her. Four years later, Graf moved back

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Speaker 1: to Nuremberg. Maria and their two daughters did not move

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Speaker 1: with him. In six six, Maria, her mother Johanna, and

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Speaker 1: her daughter's Johanna and Dorothea, all moved to a village

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Speaker 1: and what was West Frisland but would now be part

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Speaker 1: of the Netherlands. They joined Maria's half brother, Casper, and

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Speaker 1: a colony of Labidists, which was a Protestant communist sect

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Speaker 1: that could be its own whole story in and of itself.

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Speaker 1: Perhaps one day it will be. But we're about to

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Speaker 1: talk about the official end of Marian's marriage and her

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Speaker 1: ongoing studies of the natural world. But first we will

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Speaker 1: pause and have a sponsor break. Maria's mother, Johanna, had

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Speaker 1: died in the village where her her brother Casper lived

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Speaker 1: in six and the following year Marianne took her daughters

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Speaker 1: to a new home in Amsterdam, and throughout their stay

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Speaker 1: with the lobbyists, Maria and Johann Graff were still legally married,

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Speaker 1: but they divorced the same year that Maria took the

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Speaker 1: children and left the colony. She would later confide in

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Speaker 1: a friend that the marriage had been poor and joyless,

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Speaker 1: and she also sometimes lied about the end of their

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Speaker 1: relationship later in her life, telling people not that she

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Speaker 1: and Graff had divorced, but that he had died and

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Speaker 1: left her a widow. Just kind of the the cruelest

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Speaker 1: thing you can possibly do to an x So they

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Speaker 1: died in Amsterdam. The family had a studio where they

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Speaker 1: all worked on their painting. Both of Maria's daughters with

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Speaker 1: Graff would go on to become skilled painters themselves. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: this was definitely a family line of artists from before

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Speaker 1: Maria and after. And at the age of fifty two,

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Speaker 1: Maria and Dorotea, who was when he one at the time,

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Speaker 1: traveled to Surinam. That was in six and at this

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Speaker 1: time Surinam was a Dutch colony almost five thousand miles

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Speaker 1: away from their home in Europe. For two women to

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Speaker 1: be traveling there for an extended period of time, without

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Speaker 1: a man to accompany them. This was considered a very,

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Speaker 1: very dangerous move. Add to that the fact that the

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Speaker 1: trip was beyond expensive, and it becomes clear just how

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Speaker 1: much of a risk it was. Maria had sold as

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Speaker 1: many drawings as she could and had gone into debt

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Speaker 1: to finance the journey. Her hope was that she would

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Speaker 1: be able to make her money back after she published

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Speaker 1: a new book about Surinam's native wildlife, so this was

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Speaker 1: really a huge gamble. But Maria, who up to that

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Speaker 1: point had only been able to see dead, de hydrated,

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Speaker 1: preserved specimens of the plants and animals that lived in Surinam,

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Speaker 1: really craved the opportunity to see those species alive so

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Speaker 1: that she could draw them as accurately as possible. They

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Speaker 1: had planned to visit South America for a five year expedition,

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Speaker 1: but it was cut short after two years because Maria

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Speaker 1: became ill. Initially, she thought her weakness was the result

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Speaker 1: of too much sun and heat, but things really progressed

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Speaker 1: to the point that she thought she might die if

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Speaker 1: she stayed there, so she made the decision to return home.

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Speaker 1: She and Dorotea returns to Amsterdam in September seventeen O

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Speaker 1: one and exactly what she had contracted is unknown, although

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Speaker 1: the two most likely candidates are malaria and yellow fever. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of speculation, and since she did work

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Speaker 1: with insects and was routinely going into the jungles to

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Speaker 1: study them, those were probably the two most likely things.

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Speaker 1: But in those two years that they did stay there,

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Speaker 1: both mother and daughter dedicated themselves to learning everything they

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Speaker 1: could about the new species of plants and animals that

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Speaker 1: they were exposed to. Of the many illustrations produced during

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Speaker 1: this time, there have been some issues actually identifying which

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Speaker 1: were done by Maria and which were done by Dorotea,

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Speaker 1: because their styles were very similar. This is a debate

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Speaker 1: that sometimes still goes on. She published a new book

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Speaker 1: in seventeen oh five, Metamorphosis Insectorum surinam Insium, which was

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Speaker 1: metamorphos of the Insects of Suriname. There were more than

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Speaker 1: five dozen engravings in the book, carefully detailing the life

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Speaker 1: cycles of surinames insect world. The work followed the same

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Speaker 1: format as her work on caterpillars, featuring each creature alongside

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Speaker 1: its host plant life with detailed descriptive text. While her

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Speaker 1: books on flowers and caterpillars were lauded as extraordinary achievements

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Speaker 1: for botany and zoology. It was the Insects of Surinam

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Speaker 1: book that would be considered her most significant work. For one,

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Speaker 1: it was one of the first such studies of flora

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Speaker 1: and fauna of that area, and second, it offered a

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Speaker 1: wealth of new information about the food chains and developmental

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Speaker 1: cycles of insects. This was really groundbreaking because it abandoned

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Speaker 1: the idea of spontaneous geration, that maggots came not from

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Speaker 1: eggs but from meat, and that insects were the products

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Speaker 1: of mud, among other incorrect ideas about how insects come

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Speaker 1: to be. Yeah, for a long time, people thought rotting

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Speaker 1: meat was where maggots came from. And while that may

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Speaker 1: be where their eggs, the eggs get laid that produced them,

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Speaker 1: they didn't realize that there was a whole egg aspect,

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Speaker 1: but they just thought the meat started some process. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And while those myths were addressed, Maria's work was not

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Speaker 1: above criticism, although most of that criticism came after her life.

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Speaker 1: And we've got some bun proboscis talk. Right after we

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Speaker 1: first paused for a word from one of our sponsors,

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Speaker 1: because of her dedication to carefully watching every moment of

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Speaker 1: the insects lives unfold. Included in her surinam book was

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Speaker 1: a detail that she observed in sphinx moths, which went

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Speaker 1: contested for quite some time. In her illustration of a

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Speaker 1: newly metamorphosed moth that appears in the book, she shows

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Speaker 1: it with what looks like a split tongue if you're

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Speaker 1: just looking at the picture, and in her accompanying notes

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Speaker 1: she described the two pieces combining to form a tube

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Speaker 1: that allowed this moth to drink nectar. This is a

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Speaker 1: time where prior, unrelated research for my job allowed me

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Speaker 1: to get to read this whole part and just feel

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Speaker 1: already vindicated. This was the text that accompanied the plate

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Speaker 1: of the space moth, which notes the split proboscus and

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Speaker 1: also gives you a sense of the types of notes

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Speaker 1: that generally accompanied her illustrations. Here's the quote. The large

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Speaker 1: green caterpillar ate the leaves both of this plant and

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Speaker 1: of the sweet stop described in plate fourteen. It ate

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Speaker 1: vigorously and greedily, yet had as little discharge an excrement

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Speaker 1: as the smallest caterpillar. When touched, it thrashed around wildly.

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Speaker 1: On twenty June, it remained still and shed its skin.

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Speaker 1: The skin it discarded is on the leaf. After the molting,

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Speaker 1: it was no longer so green, but became more reddish

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Speaker 1: in color. The next day it changed into a liver

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Speaker 1: colored chrysalis with an external protuberance like the one which

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Speaker 1: can be seen on the stock below. The chrysalis was

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Speaker 1: very restless, throwing itself to and fro continuously for about

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Speaker 1: a quarter of an hour. On twenty August there emerged

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Speaker 1: a large moth with six orange and yellow spots on

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Speaker 1: its body, whose four wings and six legs were strangely

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Speaker 1: covered with black thoughts. It's long proboscus consists of two

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Speaker 1: long tubules, which in this species of moth are joined together,

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Speaker 1: thus making a small tube through which they can suck

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Speaker 1: honey from the flowers. When they have finished sucking, they

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Speaker 1: roll the proboscus up tightly and place it under their

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Speaker 1: head between the eyes, so that it is scarcely visible.

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Speaker 1: And there were critics of this particular drawing who claimed

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Speaker 1: that it was proof that her work was not as

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Speaker 1: accurate as had been Lane, hinting that she had added

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Speaker 1: flourishes to her observations. And again this happened after she

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Speaker 1: had passed, and we'll talk about that timing in a

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Speaker 1: little bit. But eventually it was confirmed that some moths,

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Speaker 1: the sphinx moth among them, have to half tubules that

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Speaker 1: do join together to form one proboscis. They are one

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Speaker 1: of the most fascinating features of moths, yes, along with

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Speaker 1: like little rows of hooks that connect their wings together.

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Speaker 1: Sometimes to return to the subject at hand. Similarly, Marian's

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Speaker 1: illustration of a tarantula making a meal out of a

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Speaker 1: humming bird was decades out of her death called out

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Speaker 1: as an impossibility. Early nineteenth century naturalist Landsdown Gilding called

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Speaker 1: the plate a quote entomological caricature. British entomologist William McClay

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Speaker 1: tested the idea and the eighteen hundreds by offering a

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Speaker 1: large spider in his lab of birds eat and when

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Speaker 1: the bird or when the fighter fled. He resolved that

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Speaker 1: Marian had quote told a willful falsehood. But of course

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Speaker 1: we know now that such things do indeed happen in nature.

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Speaker 1: When Henry Walter Bates observed this same behavior and published

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Speaker 1: his findings in eighteen sixty three, Marian's depiction was validated.

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Speaker 1: I literally did multiple she was right dances in my

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Speaker 1: chair while reading that one. When Polly wrote it, there

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Speaker 1: were to be clear some errors in metamorphosis of the

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Speaker 1: insects of Surinam. Some of these have been attributed to

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Speaker 1: the abrupt end of her studies in South America and

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Speaker 1: her need to create some of her illustrations from memory

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Speaker 1: and preserved samples. For example, army and leaf cutter ants

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Speaker 1: are grouped together as though they lived in the same colonies,

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Speaker 1: and some of the caterpillars are pictured with different butterflies

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Speaker 1: than the ones they actually metamorphosed into. Yeah, I mean

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Speaker 1: to be fair, any scientists has some errors along the way,

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Speaker 1: and she did. That trip did not go as planned,

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Speaker 1: so you could kind of see why. There's a really

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Speaker 1: long and wonderful paper that I will link to in

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Speaker 1: our show notes. It was one of my sources that

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Speaker 1: kind of outlines why we should not discount her work

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Speaker 1: just because there are some errors. Well, we make errors sometimes, everybody,

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Speaker 1: everybody to anyone that deals with lots of information does.

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Speaker 1: You can't help it unless you're a robot, and even

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Speaker 1: then sometimes robots make mistakes. But in that same book,

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Speaker 1: slipped in along with the various notes on an illustration

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Speaker 1: of a peacock flower with a caterpillar climbing its stem,

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Speaker 1: and a pupa resting on a leafy segment, and a

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Speaker 1: moss sipping nectar from the flowers is an annotation that

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Speaker 1: is not about botany or insects, but about slavery. In

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Speaker 1: the notes, Marian wrote that enslaved women of Surinam would

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Speaker 1: use the seeds of the peacock flower as an apportive

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Speaker 1: face it, choosing not to have a child rather than

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Speaker 1: to allow one to be born into the cruelties of slavery.

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Speaker 1: She continued, quote, indeed, they even kill themselves on account

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Speaker 1: of the of the usual harsh treatment needed out for them.

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Speaker 1: So they consider that they will be born again with

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Speaker 1: their friends in a free state in their own country,

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Speaker 1: so they told me themselves. This was, of course a

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Speaker 1: unique outtake in Marian's notations, a rare deviation from the

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Speaker 1: science of her work on flora and insects to comment

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Speaker 1: on the dark side of colonialism and the slavery that

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Speaker 1: came with it. She continued that the slaves quote must

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Speaker 1: be treated benignly. Biographer Kim Todd wondered in her book

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Speaker 1: about Marian if this notation wasn't intended to provide food

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Speaker 1: for thought for the people of Europe who might own

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Speaker 1: slave plantations, many of whom would be the likely audience

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Speaker 1: for this book. But as Maria made no further known

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Speaker 1: remarks on the subject, we don't really know what she

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Speaker 1: hoped to achieve with these particular passages. Yeah, it does

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Speaker 1: stand out though, it's sort of like, here we are

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Speaker 1: leaf cut her ants and look at the what the

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Speaker 1: spiders are doing. Hey, slavery is horrible, and also let's

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Speaker 1: look at this plant. It's really like it jumps out

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Speaker 1: as as out of context with the rest of the book. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And we should note that while the peacock flower that

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Speaker 1: she described in that passage was brought back to Europe

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Speaker 1: by other explorers in the seventeen hundreds because of the

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Speaker 1: appeal of its showy blossoms, that information of its use

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Speaker 1: as an abortifation it was not widely shared, even though

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Speaker 1: it had been known because of this work that Maria

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Speaker 1: had done. And though the Surinam book brought praise and admiration,

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Speaker 1: it did not bring the wealth she had hoped for.

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Speaker 1: It did not stave off difficult times. At the end

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Speaker 1: of Maria's life, she really struggled to bring in enough

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Speaker 1: money to sustain herself. To drum up cash, she painted

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Speaker 1: flowers and sold her work for likely far less than

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Speaker 1: it was worth in most cases, and she also began

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Speaker 1: selling the many and varied specimens that she had acquired

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Speaker 1: it over her life, and even used her connections to

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Speaker 1: collectors to purchase more of them and then flip them

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Speaker 1: to make a little more money. She continued to work,

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Speaker 1: and she began collecting new insects as soon as the

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Speaker 1: last illustrations for her Surinam book were completed. She also

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Speaker 1: published revisions of her previous books and cases. Where new

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Speaker 1: information about the insects became known, she would update the

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Speaker 1: illustrations and annotations to include the most current information. Maria's daughter, Johanna,

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Speaker 1: who was also an artist and was not the one

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Speaker 1: she took on that trip, followed that trail blazed by

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Speaker 1: her mother and her sister Dorotea, and she actually moved

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Speaker 1: to Surinam permanently in seventeen eleven, taking her husband with her.

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Speaker 1: And the following year, Maria, who had liquidated most of

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Speaker 1: her collections at that point, really had a big sort

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Speaker 1: of shift where she stopped corresponding regularly with friends and

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Speaker 1: business associates, and seventeen fifteen, Marian had a stroke, possibly

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Speaker 1: related to the fever that she had contracted, and Sir

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Speaker 1: and Um she had been working on another caterpillar book,

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Speaker 1: but the project sat largely dormant after that due to

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Speaker 1: a partial paralysis. Her son in law and Dorotea's second husband,

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Speaker 1: Swiss Baroque painter George Zell, painted Maria's portrait in these years,

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Speaker 1: near the end of her life, and in it she

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Speaker 1: is surrounded by curiosities and specimens from her collection. Maria

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Speaker 1: Zebulla Marion died on January seventeen seventeen. She was sixty nine.

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Speaker 1: A few days later, all of her remaining watercolors were

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Speaker 1: bought for the Tsar of Russia, Peter the First. As

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Speaker 1: a result of the Tsar's interest in her illustrations, Maria's

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Speaker 1: daughter Dorotea was offered a job at St. Petersburg as

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Speaker 1: the official scientific illustrator for the Tsar, and nearly one

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Speaker 1: hundred years after her death, Maria's work was still influencing

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Speaker 1: scientific illustrators. In eighteen o one, English botanist and zoologist

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Speaker 1: George Shaw included an illustration of a frog in his

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Speaker 1: book General Zoology amphibia, and that frog was named the

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Speaker 1: Marian frog or Rana marianna. It would later come to

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Speaker 1: be known by the scientific name Trachycephalis venulosis or by

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Speaker 1: the more common identifiers of vained tree frog or common

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Speaker 1: milk frog. The decades of observing insects and plants and

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Speaker 1: taking copious notes on their life cycles that Maria did

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Speaker 1: significantly advanced the scientific community's knowledge of entomology and botany. Unfortunately,

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Speaker 1: some poor reproductions of her work that were published in

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Speaker 1: the eighteenth and nineteenth centuries really damaged her reputations. Would

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Speaker 1: examine these sloppily executed prince and that led them to

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Speaker 1: believe that she had not been as skilled as she

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Speaker 1: really was. And that time gap before the criticism of

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Speaker 1: her work began is a really interesting aspect of her

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Speaker 1: career and how her work was viewed at different points

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Speaker 1: in history. At the dawn of the eighteenth century, when

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Speaker 1: Marian published her book on surinam, it was really well

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Speaker 1: received and it actually wasn't until nineteenth century that people

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00:24:01,560 --> 00:24:04,240
Speaker 1: started to question things like the split proboscis on the

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Speaker 1: sphinx moth and the bird eating tarantula. As we mentioned

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Speaker 1: some of the problem was due to bad reproductions that

401
00:24:11,119 --> 00:24:14,439
Speaker 1: just didn't capture the fine and careful details that she

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00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:17,919
Speaker 1: had poured into every illustration, but some of the problem

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00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:21,600
Speaker 1: can also be traced to the shifting role of women

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00:24:21,800 --> 00:24:26,400
Speaker 1: in European society. When disbelievers of the nineteenth century saw

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00:24:26,520 --> 00:24:30,520
Speaker 1: elements and Mary and Marian's work that they thought were incorrect,

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00:24:30,920 --> 00:24:33,320
Speaker 1: they wrote her off as a silly woman who must

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00:24:33,320 --> 00:24:36,639
Speaker 1: not have understood what she was looking at, never mind

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Speaker 1: that she had actually already advanced entomology significantly while she

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Speaker 1: was alive. Yeah, she got written off because she was

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Speaker 1: a woman a lot, which really kind of stunk. But thankfully,

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Speaker 1: despite those criticisms, uh one, she was proved correct on

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Speaker 1: most of them, and to her work has once again

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00:24:55,760 --> 00:24:59,200
Speaker 1: become recognized as a really important contribution both to science

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Speaker 1: and to art, so much so that her book on

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00:25:01,680 --> 00:25:04,720
Speaker 1: surinams insects was actually republished at the end of last year,

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Speaker 1: and just a few days from when this episode will air,

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Speaker 1: there will actually be a symposium on her work in Amsterdam,

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Speaker 1: So she kind of is becoming really really popular again,

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Speaker 1: which I love because again, her illustrations are so beautiful. Um,

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Speaker 1: I could just gaze at them all day, and it

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00:25:21,200 --> 00:25:23,919
Speaker 1: makes sense that she was trained by a Dutch Golden

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Speaker 1: Age painter when you look at her for illustrations. And

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Speaker 1: I don't know why my brain never made that connection before. Yeah. Well,

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Speaker 1: and I had seen her illustrations before, but I knew

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Speaker 1: virtually nothing about her life or even how long ago.

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Speaker 1: It was like in my head, illustrations with the level

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00:25:42,000 --> 00:25:45,359
Speaker 1: of skill and detail that she had would would have

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Speaker 1: been a little later recent, right, And that's because they

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Speaker 1: were so good in many cases, and she had so

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Speaker 1: perfectly captured things that there they were used for. I

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Speaker 1: mean still they get referred to so uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: that's why they seem like they must be more recent,

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Speaker 1: because we still see them in textbooks on occasion. And

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Speaker 1: of course I do know that there was plenty of

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Speaker 1: scientific work going on before this point, but a lot

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Speaker 1: of a lot of their aspects do seem to come

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00:26:13,560 --> 00:26:16,160
Speaker 1: off as a little more recent than they really were. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and again, her work was so amazingly good that that's

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Speaker 1: why it feels more modern than it was. Bay so

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Speaker 1: much for joining us on this Saturday. Since this episode

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