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Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome back to the Psychology of Your Twenties,

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Speaker 1: the podcast where we talk through some of the big

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Speaker 1: changes and transitions of our twenties and what they mean

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Speaker 1: for our psychology. This week, we're discussing the psychology of failure.

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Speaker 1: This was inspired by a Sex and the City episode.

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Speaker 1: I've been obsessed with that show recently. I don't know why.

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Speaker 1: Maybe it's like moving to a new city, a big

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Speaker 1: city that's really got me into it. But Carrie did

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Speaker 1: a didn't what is it called an article I guess

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Speaker 1: on failure, and I was like, this is a great

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Speaker 1: inspiration from the podcast or for the podcast. So from

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Speaker 1: now on, all podcast episodes we'll make direct references to

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Speaker 1: Sex and the City episodes. But that aside, I think

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Speaker 1: the reason why it kind of stuck with me is

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Speaker 1: because we're all in nevertably going to fail in our twenties,

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Speaker 1: probably multiple times, whether at work or UNI, in relationships,

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Speaker 1: dealing with finances, or leaps of faith where we fall short,

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Speaker 1: even just like perceiving failure and things that aren't really failures,

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Speaker 1: they're just mistakes or things we wish we'd done differently.

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Speaker 1: So I think it's important to kind of get our

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Speaker 1: head around it, and for me at the moment, I

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Speaker 1: think there's just been a few things in the past

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Speaker 1: six months where I've felt like a sense of failure

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Speaker 1: for some reason. Perhaps it's unjustified, but yeah, most of

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Speaker 1: these episodes I kind of just do because it's something

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Speaker 1: I'm thinking about a lot at the moment. So if

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Speaker 1: you're in the same boat, hopefully you get something out

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Speaker 1: of this episode. But before we dive in, I just

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Speaker 1: want to say thank you for all the support and

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Speaker 1: love my two recent episodes have gotten. The one I

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Speaker 1: did the two that I did with Cloudier, I have

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Speaker 1: been getting heaps of messages from people who have been

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Speaker 1: tuning in, and honestly, it makes me so happy. It

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Speaker 1: makes my day. I heard this quote the other day

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Speaker 1: and it says, when you put something out there in

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Speaker 1: the world, ten percent of people are going to hate it,

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Speaker 1: eighty percent of people are going to be indifferent, and

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Speaker 1: ten percent of people are going to love it. So

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Speaker 1: for all of those who do love it, thank you

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Speaker 1: so much for reading, for reaching out to me and

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Speaker 1: making that known. And if you do feel called to

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Speaker 1: do so, please consider leaving a review on either Spotify

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Speaker 1: and Apple Podcasts. It would be obviously massively appreciated, it

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Speaker 1: helps the podcast grow, helps my ego a little bit,

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Speaker 1: and then, as always, thanks for tuning in to this episode.

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Speaker 1: Failure is such a messy, messy concept in our younger years,

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Speaker 1: when small mistakes can feel so life altering and permanent.

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Speaker 1: But the more mistakes we make, the more I guess

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Speaker 1: we learn that they aren't the end of the world,

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Speaker 1: the consequences don't last forever, and the more we kind

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Speaker 1: of learn in general. So this episode, we're going to

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Speaker 1: talk about why failure is important in this decade of

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Speaker 1: our lives, how it affects our behavior and our self concept,

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Speaker 1: and how to overcome negative feelings or perhaps a fear

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Speaker 1: of failure, how to move on. So let's go. I

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Speaker 1: think failure is not just confined to our professional or

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Speaker 1: academic lives as we so often think they are. You

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Speaker 1: can fail at so many things in your twenties, and

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Speaker 1: chances are it's going to be the first of many

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Speaker 1: more times we experience that feeling. Like I said, I

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Speaker 1: do think we often think about failure in terms of constructed,

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Speaker 1: almost artificial settings where you either pass or you fail.

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Speaker 1: There's no great area, and that decision has kind of

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Speaker 1: made for you, you know, failing an exam, failing a

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Speaker 1: driving assessment, failing to get a job that you really wanted.

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Speaker 1: But in this episode, I want to kind of push

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Speaker 1: out a little bit further and talk about a sense

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Speaker 1: of failing at something more intangible and the sense that

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Speaker 1: you can fail in any area of your life, not

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Speaker 1: just academic, professional or an examination sense. So an example,

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Speaker 1: I was talking to a dear friend the other day

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Speaker 1: about her long term relationship that had ended just recently,

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Speaker 1: and they had been together for two years. And as

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Speaker 1: we were kind of debriefing and going through the timeline

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Speaker 1: of events, I asked her if she had told her

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Speaker 1: parents yet, and she said no, that she hadn't, And

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Speaker 1: when I asked her why, she said she was embarrassed.

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Speaker 1: She didn't want them to think that she had failed

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Speaker 1: at her relationship. And I remember having a similar feeling

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Speaker 1: after someone I was dating. After I ended things, I

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Speaker 1: felt like such a failure, a failure for having invested

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Speaker 1: time in this person, a failure for not having seen

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Speaker 1: the red flag seen this side lines, for having told

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Speaker 1: my friends and my family that I really like this guy,

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Speaker 1: only for you things to come to an end in

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Speaker 1: a way that was like not amazingly satisfactory, And in

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Speaker 1: the aftermath, I've feel like I felt like I couldn't

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Speaker 1: trust myself or my judgment anymore. And that's such a

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Speaker 1: critical feature of the sense of failing, the self loathing

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Speaker 1: that comes afterwards. So we are going to metaphorically kind

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Speaker 1: of fail at so many things in our twenties. We're

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Speaker 1: going to fail at keeping friendships, fail at feeling successful enough.

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Speaker 1: Sometimes the stakes are really high, But for most people,

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Speaker 1: I would say this decade of our twenties is a

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Speaker 1: time when failures won't mean the end of the world

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Speaker 1: or life as you know it. I'm guessing you don't

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Speaker 1: have kids, so you don't have big financial responsibilities, meaning

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Speaker 1: you have a bit more of a safety net. You

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Speaker 1: can always pick up your life and move. You know,

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Speaker 1: nothing's really holding you, holding you down to the environment

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Speaker 1: that you those failures in. So it's the perfect time

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Speaker 1: to kind of teach yourself, to pick yourself up and

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Speaker 1: learn the lessons at that moment, and that experience was

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Speaker 1: intended to teach you. And the chances are you'll fail

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Speaker 1: again and again and again in different ways, until one

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Speaker 1: day you'll just start failing at something different. So what

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Speaker 1: does psychology have to say about the impact of failure

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Speaker 1: on our minds, our behavior, our self concept. How can

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Speaker 1: we adopt, I guess, a more positive relationship with making

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Speaker 1: mistakes and failing in this formative decade of our lives.

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Speaker 1: So failure it hits us where it hurts for a

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Speaker 1: number of reasons, and it starts really early on in childhood,

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Speaker 1: as so many reactions and patterns often do. Failure and

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Speaker 1: fault are virtually inseparable in so many households, in so

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Speaker 1: many organizations and cultures, every child learns at some point

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Speaker 1: that admitting failure also means taking lane. Perhaps you're scolded,

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Speaker 1: or you're told to go to bed, you know, you

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Speaker 1: let the dog outside by accident, or you fail a

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Speaker 1: test and you receive some form of punishment for your

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Speaker 1: behavior and your failure, which leads to a negative internal

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Speaker 1: reaction and a bad feeling that you inherently want to avoid.

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Speaker 1: So after repeated positive or negative punishment, so either the

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Speaker 1: removal of a good thing or the introduction of a

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Speaker 1: bad thing to influence our behavior by an outside force,

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Speaker 1: maybe a parent or a teacher. Soon we don't even

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Speaker 1: need those figures in our lives to make us feel

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Speaker 1: bad and to get us to avoid mistakes. We have

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Speaker 1: internalized that feeling, and now we have a fear of failing.

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Speaker 1: We stop ourselves from failing because we've had enough experiences

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Speaker 1: to anticipate what will happen if we do. We've been

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Speaker 1: conditioned to know the outcome of our failures and to

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Speaker 1: know that those are not great outcomes the things we

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Speaker 1: want to avoid. So we begin to self monitor and

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Speaker 1: inflict that negative feeling or punishment that we normally receive

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Speaker 1: from an external figure on ourselves. So these early learning experiences,

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Speaker 1: I think, are why so few cultures and people have

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Speaker 1: shifted to an attitude of almost psychological safety in which

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Speaker 1: the rewards of learning from failure can be fully realized.

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Speaker 1: And there's another key reason we avoid failure, and it

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Speaker 1: has to do with the perception of interpersonal or group shame.

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Speaker 1: At the root of failure and a fear of failure

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Speaker 1: is shame, which is a very unpleasant emotion associated with

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Speaker 1: feeling like you're a bad person or are a flawed

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Speaker 1: or defective individual. If I make a mistake, if I fail,

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Speaker 1: how does that affect who I am and how I

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Speaker 1: see myself? As well as how others see me. How

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Speaker 1: will others see me? Is such a huge element of

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Speaker 1: this anti failure conundrum. And there's a very traditional and

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Speaker 1: well traded idea in psychology that humans naturally seek the favor, acceptance,

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Speaker 1: and admiration of the groups that they belong to. Maybe

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Speaker 1: it's your friendship group, your family group, your religious group,

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Speaker 1: your academic group. We want to be in the in group, basically,

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Speaker 1: and one way that we stay liked by the group

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Speaker 1: we're in is by sticking to the rules or blueprint

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Speaker 1: on what behavior is accepted, what actions and outcomes are accepted,

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Speaker 1: and which ones aren't. And if we stray, we may

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Speaker 1: be outcast. And when we were primitive beings, that meant

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Speaker 1: you know, pretty much certain death if you weren't part

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Speaker 1: of a tribe or a group. And that sense of fear,

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Speaker 1: that fear reaction, it survives today in our olympic system,

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Speaker 1: and that's a crucial part of the old brain that

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Speaker 1: controls our behavior to ensure survival, often unconsciously, and that's

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Speaker 1: a big part of this. It's unconscious. So let's give

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Speaker 1: an example. Say you make a really big mistake at work.

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Speaker 1: Been there, done that, got the T shirt? You fail

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Speaker 1: to kind of meet your boss's expectations for I don't know,

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Speaker 1: presentation or whatever whatever you do for work, and the

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Speaker 1: consequences of this will likely be criticism or some kind

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Speaker 1: of critique that feels like rejection, and for a while

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Speaker 1: you might not feel like you are as respected or

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Speaker 1: liked at work. You may not feel as accepted by

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Speaker 1: the group. And that's where a big failure of failure

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Speaker 1: comes from, the notion that you could be cast out

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Speaker 1: from a group whose respect and favor you unconsciously need,

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Speaker 1: you want, you crave, And the impact of failure is

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Speaker 1: pretty magnificent on our self concept and our confidence, self esteem,

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Speaker 1: or our self concept self evaluation construct that corresponds to

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Speaker 1: an overaw view of what we kind of contemplate and

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Speaker 1: evaluate about ourselves, both internally, how we see ourselves and

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Speaker 1: how we think others see us. Successes and failures they're

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Speaker 1: just inextripically linked to that, and they influence your mood,

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Speaker 1: They influence your emotional states, all to varyingly varying degrees,

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Speaker 1: as well as self esteem levels, in so far that

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Speaker 1: these events are perceived as personal successes or failures, which

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Speaker 1: either contribute to the image you have or detract from it,

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Speaker 1: emotions and self esteem. They're linked in everyday experience, such

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Speaker 1: that people with high self esteem report more positive states

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Speaker 1: of emotion, and people who lack self worth are generally

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Speaker 1: in more of a negative mood. So when we fail,

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Speaker 1: when a relationship breaks apart, when we lose a job,

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Speaker 1: or we miss out on an opportunity, this influences the

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Speaker 1: characteristics and thoughts we assign to ourselves and can be

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Speaker 1: really damaging for our self esteem and it can take

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Speaker 1: a while to recover and receive the necessary reinforcement to

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Speaker 1: rebuild those aspects of our identity that have been threatened

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Speaker 1: by a failure. And I think importantly for kind of

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Speaker 1: like the modern twenty something person. Social media also threatens

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Speaker 1: to make every slip up an extinction level event socially

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Speaker 1: and professionally, which contributes to this shame avoidance framework for

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Speaker 1: our fear of failure that we kind of discussed before.

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Speaker 1: Good news. When we get older, our failures don't seem

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Speaker 1: to hurt our self concept and the opinion or image

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Speaker 1: we hold of ourselves as much. So. In one study,

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Speaker 1: researchers found that the impact that perceived failure has on

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Speaker 1: our positive emotional states it declines the older we are.

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Speaker 1: I think older adults are assumed to change their affects, states,

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Speaker 1: and reaction to positive and negative stimuli across the lifespan,

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Speaker 1: but to less severe degrees. They also have more experiences

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Speaker 1: and learning opportunities to now be able to appraise a

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Speaker 1: potential failure for what it actually represents, which is something

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Speaker 1: that isn't a really big deal. According to a lot

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Speaker 1: of theoretical frameworks, older adults are just better equipped to

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Speaker 1: regulate their emotional states and to use this regulatory ability

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Speaker 1: to manage positive and negative emotions that may affect how

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Speaker 1: they see themselves, to kind of see them as something

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Speaker 1: that yes is related, and yes, influences how they see themselves,

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Speaker 1: but isn't the be all and end all. So I

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Speaker 1: guess that is something to look forward to. But in

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Speaker 1: our twenties, there are certain people who can handle earlier

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Speaker 1: better than others. And I'm sure you've seen this amongst

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Speaker 1: your friends. You know, the person who experience as a

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Speaker 1: huge step back and it doesn't seem to bother them,

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Speaker 1: versus I guess people like myself who it really does

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Speaker 1: kind of get to. So this psychologist Hire Cohen from

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Speaker 1: Carnegie mellon. I think, yeah, that's it, Carnegie. Mellen makes

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Speaker 1: the distinction between guilt prone people and shame prone people.

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Speaker 1: To bear with me here. When some people make mistakes,

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Speaker 1: they tend to focus more narrowly on their behavior. You know,

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Speaker 1: now I'm going to think of ways to correct for this.

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Speaker 1: I'm going to improve. And that's an example of a

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Speaker 1: guilt prone person. They feel guilty for the mistake, but

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Speaker 1: recognize it and use it as kind of motivation to

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Speaker 1: that they can avoid the problem in the future. And

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Speaker 1: this psychologist Cohen says, this type of person is different

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Speaker 1: than the other group of shame prone people. So the

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Speaker 1: shame prone person is kind of like this. If you

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Speaker 1: do something wrong, you might think I'm a bad person

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Speaker 1: rather than just I did a bad thing and I

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Speaker 1: made a mistake. And if you think you're a bad person,

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Speaker 1: that's much harder to counteract, and that might lead you

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Speaker 1: to withdraw from people. So a healthier response to failure

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Speaker 1: is focusing on specific behaviors rather than looking at the

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Speaker 1: experience as a reflection of yourself, Because you could easily

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Speaker 1: change your behavior, but it's much harder to change who

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Speaker 1: you are or who you think you are. Researchers have

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Speaker 1: also found that people who strongly fear failure have a

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Speaker 1: composite of two personality characteristics low achievement orientation, that is,

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Speaker 1: they don't take much pleasure from accomplishment and meeting goals

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Speaker 1: and high test anxiety, a fear of not performing well

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Speaker 1: at a critical moment. So, in other words, they're motivated

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Speaker 1: less by the possibility of winning and gaining something of value,

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Speaker 1: and they're more motivated by their anxiety about the possibility

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Speaker 1: of messing up. And those are some of the same

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Speaker 1: personality traits that drive perfectionism, and it can show up

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Speaker 1: in people who are high achievers and people who are

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Speaker 1: less motivated to achieve. Doesn't matter. In fact, perfectionism, I think,

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Speaker 1: and fear of failure go hand in hand. From a

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Speaker 1: clinical perspective, there's one type of individual for whom failure

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Speaker 1: is particularly hard to deal with and overcome. And if

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Speaker 1: this is you, I'm so sorry, but maybe you'll listen

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Speaker 1: to this kind of profile of this person and be

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Speaker 1: able to be like artstart me. It's this condition, so

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Speaker 1: adolaphobia is a phobia or deep fear of failure, which

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Speaker 1: may lead people to avoid any situation where failure could

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Speaker 1: take place, hence isolating themselves from new and novel experiences

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Speaker 1: and opportunities. So adolophobia is often referred to as perfectionism,

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Speaker 1: and whilst it is considered extreme perfectionism. This associate professor

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Speaker 1: of psychiatry at the Wheel Corner Medical College, his name

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Speaker 1: is doctors Gael Salt, He says that it's more than that.

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Speaker 1: It is a true irrational and that's the key word

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Speaker 1: when we think about phobia's irrational fear of making any

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Speaker 1: form of mistakes. As with any phobia, people with adolaphobia

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Speaker 1: think about the fear of making a mistake in a

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Speaker 1: way that means they have to avoid situations where there's

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Speaker 1: a risk of that happening. And that's the other key

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Speaker 1: feature of a phobia, avoidance, So irrational and avoidance. And

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Speaker 1: they also obsess a lot about mistakes that they've made

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Speaker 1: in the past or imagine mistakes they could make in

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Speaker 1: the future, and these thoughts kind of cause them to

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Speaker 1: have overwhelming anxiety, another aspect of a phobia. So it

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Speaker 1: might make even feel panicky or nauseous dizzy or experience

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Speaker 1: a rapid heartbeat, that kind of panic that sets in

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Speaker 1: for a fear of failure, which is irrational, and it

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Speaker 1: often leads to constant judgment and a negative evaluation that

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Speaker 1: you can never believe you're doing things the right way.

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Speaker 1: And it's a kind of perfectionism that's more than just

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Speaker 1: striving for excellence or ambition. You know, we all innately

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Speaker 1: wish to be successful. However, on some level, the average

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Speaker 1: person can anticipate, except and tolerate shortcomings. We can tolerate

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Speaker 1: mistakes and failed attempts. But people with autolophobia, they just

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Speaker 1: feel crushed by even the idea of a failed attempt,

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Speaker 1: and it often makes them miserable and depressed and perhaps,

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Speaker 1: like I don't know if this is part of the

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Speaker 1: clinical definition, but definitely probably worse off because they aren't

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Speaker 1: actually ever able to try new things and learn lessons

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Speaker 1: from situations in which you're inevitably going to fail. I

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Speaker 1: think an intense fear of failure is not a place

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Speaker 1: we want to be in. And there's a saying fail hard,

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Speaker 1: fail soon, and fail often. And I really love this saying,

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Speaker 1: even if I struggle to fully realize it. Most of

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Speaker 1: the time. We talked about this shift in mind frame earlier,

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Speaker 1: But how is it the week and have a healthy

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Speaker 1: relationship with failure such that it creates growth rather than shame.

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Speaker 1: How can we be okay with failing often and not

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Speaker 1: only be okay with it, but make it part of

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Speaker 1: our life philosophy. Okay, I'm not going to give you

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Speaker 1: a simple equation here because I'm not a licensed psychologist.

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Speaker 1: I'm I don't know a life coach. Nor am I

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Speaker 1: going to say, you know, our failure is avoidable if

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Speaker 1: you just try a little harder, like we can get

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Speaker 1: away with never failing. That's silly talk. That is so silly.

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Speaker 1: Obviously you're going to fail, Isn't that just it's a

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Speaker 1: part of life. You know, every parent has said that

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Speaker 1: to you, I'm sure, But I think it's important to

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Speaker 1: talk about how our relationship with failure can change for

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Speaker 1: the better. So there's a common clinical tool in psychology.

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Speaker 1: It's called cognitive behavior therapy. For those who haven't heard

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Speaker 1: about it, which I'm sure if you've ever been to

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Speaker 1: a therapist you have. But the gist is this, if

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Speaker 1: you can change your perception of an event or an

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Speaker 1: experience so that you would praise it as being positive

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Speaker 1: or at the very least not life ruining. You allow

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Speaker 1: yourself to behave in a manner that reflects that new

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Speaker 1: mind frame. So it's kind of like, I don't know,

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Speaker 1: like a train, Like if you get the first part

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Speaker 1: of the train moving, the second part follows, and we

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Speaker 1: can apply this to failure. Choose a reasoning that works

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Speaker 1: best for you. So maybe it's failure is nothing but

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Speaker 1: an opportunity to grow, or everyone fails, no one's paying

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Speaker 1: attention to me in particular. Maybe it's you know, with

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Speaker 1: every failure, I'm one step closer to doing this right.

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Speaker 1: Whatever justification you need, you get to choose it. Find

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Speaker 1: the thing that you can accept more than you can

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Speaker 1: you know, not accept failure, and repeat that until you

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Speaker 1: no longer feel threatened by the idea of screwing up

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Speaker 1: or hurt by previous mistakes and failures that you've made.

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Speaker 1: It's almost like an affirmation or it's like a soothing tool.

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Speaker 1: Your cognition of a situation is linked to how you behave,

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Speaker 1: or react to that situation, as CBT says. Therefore, if

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Speaker 1: you change your perception around failure, your acceptance of it

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Speaker 1: as a part of life and something important will follow suit.

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Speaker 1: I think also importantly, you need to attach the outcomes

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Speaker 1: of your actions to your self concept, and that's something

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Speaker 1: we talked about when we were referring to older people

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Speaker 1: and how they're kind of more chill with it. Failure

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Speaker 1: it's linked to feelings and motions like sadness, anxiety, stress,

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Speaker 1: maybe even rage, and those feelings are incredibly uncomfortable for

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Speaker 1: any person, and we will do anything to get rid

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Speaker 1: of them, but they don't need to become deeply embedded

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Speaker 1: truths about yourself. Those feelings and emotions will help you

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Speaker 1: work harder to find different and better solutions in order

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Speaker 1: for you to improve the next time if you recognize

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Speaker 1: that the consequences of your actions are just that they

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Speaker 1: are an outcome of a series of events and decisions,

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Speaker 1: not just your self concept. Sometimes there are things you

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Speaker 1: can't control. You're not defective because you've failed. There's always

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Speaker 1: going to be new opportunities, there's going to be new

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Speaker 1: things to strive for. So I think with much of psychology,

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Speaker 1: embracing that negative state while it's there, learning from it,

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Speaker 1: not trying to avoid it, that can lead to healthy

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Speaker 1: coping mechanisms rather than isolate, projection or suppression. It's not

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Speaker 1: very growth mindset of you. If you just suppress those

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Speaker 1: negative feelings and worst case scenario, it might lead to

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Speaker 1: like a phobic pattern of behavior in which you don't

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Speaker 1: even allow yourself to be in situations where you could

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Speaker 1: make a mistake, And then are you really fulfilling your potential?

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Speaker 1: I don't know. Those are just some of my more

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Speaker 1: nuanced musings. I hope that despite the weird ramblings of

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Speaker 1: this episode, you've managed to take something in learn something

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Speaker 1: about the psychology. It's a bit of a shorter episode

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Speaker 1: this week. I know, I'm sorry. I guess it's interesting

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Speaker 1: like failure. I've kind of been feeling that a lot recently,

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Speaker 1: just with like making a big life decision, friendships ending,

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Speaker 1: relationships ending, yeah, and just feeling pretty down on myself

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Speaker 1: about how can I couldn't have anticipated the outcomes of

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Speaker 1: some of my actions a little bit better. But at

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Speaker 1: the end of the day, I think this is just

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Speaker 1: such a learning period in everyone's life. If you're around

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Speaker 1: the same age as me, which I'm guessing you are

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Speaker 1: if you're listening to this podcast, yeah, I just think

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Speaker 1: changing your mind frame is so important away from you know,

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Speaker 1: I failed, I failed, I failed to like what did

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Speaker 1: I learn here? And to some of those recent experiences,

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Speaker 1: Like there's just been so many lessons that have come

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Speaker 1: through despite like you know, the like not so much pain,

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Speaker 1: but like the hurt of the experiences. So yeah, just

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Speaker 1: very excited to like for the next chapter. I guess, well,

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Speaker 1: I think that's also silly. There's never chapters. It's just

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Speaker 1: one big life, one big story. No chapters needed anyhow. Sorry,

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Speaker 1: just using this as my personal journal. I guess sometimes

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Speaker 1: I find it that way because I know that probably

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Speaker 1: the one probably listening back to this in ten years,

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Speaker 1: and it's good to kind of know where I was at.

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Speaker 1: But I hope you did enjoy this episode. I hope

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Speaker 1: you learned something. I hope if you have at alophobia

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Speaker 1: you get some help because that sh it sounds brutal.

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Speaker 1: And thanks again for listening. Follow us on Instagram, Follow

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Speaker 1: us on Facebook. I never use the Facebook page, but

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Speaker 1: it's there. If that's your cup of tea. Leave a review.

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Speaker 1: I love when people leave me reviews. I'll be sending

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Speaker 1: you air kisses from Afar if you do that, And

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Speaker 1: I hope you have a magnificent week. I know UNI

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Speaker 1: started again, I know works back on, people are starting

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Speaker 1: new jobs. It's all very exciting. So throughout all that,

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Speaker 1: don't be scared to fail, and don't be scared to

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Speaker 1: reach out and listen to the podcast. Wow, that was

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Speaker 1: really smooth. Anyhow, I will see you guys soon