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Speaker 2: at the volume. Happy Friday, everybody. We're actually releasing this
Speaker 2: on Saturday, but we're recording it on Friday, which is
Speaker 2: very important for the standings that we're going to be
Speaker 2: discussing today. We're having the guys from NERD Sesshona, so
Speaker 2: I'm very very excited about. We're going to do a
Speaker 2: deep dive into the play in tournament in both conference.
Speaker 2: I'm gonna give you guys some numbers just based on
Speaker 2: the strength of schedule and where teams are in the standings,
Speaker 2: and then we'll have a little bit of a discussion
Speaker 2: on where we expect things to land and where we
Speaker 2: hope things to land. After that, we're gonna do a
Speaker 2: little bit of a touch on the contenders at the
Speaker 2: top of the league, and then after that, I have
Speaker 2: a fun game for the nerds at the end of
Speaker 2: the show where we're gonna go over some of my
Speaker 2: favorite bad takes from this season. So this a little
Speaker 2: bit of an early start for you guys this morning.
Speaker 2: You gen z Ors, I could tell you're a little sleepy.
Speaker 2: I can see it in your eyes. Carson, I could
Speaker 2: see it in the energy.
Speaker 3: Zoom call sickness.
Speaker 2: Anyway, We're gonna start out in the Western Conference. So
Speaker 2: as as a quick synopsis, we have kind of three
Speaker 2: tiers in the West Plain Tournament. The Pelicans are currently
Speaker 2: at the five seed. They are at twenty seven losses
Speaker 2: after a loss last night to the Orlando Magic. Also,
Speaker 2: Brandon ingram hypercented his knee is going to be out
Speaker 2: at least two weeks heading into a pretty tough stretch
Speaker 2: of their Skins schedule as well. They are at twenty
Speaker 2: seven losses, ninth toughest remaining schedule, fifty two percent opponent
Speaker 2: winning percentage. Then we have the Mavericks, the Sons, and
Speaker 2: the Kings. They're all tied with twenty nine losses, so
Speaker 2: two more than the Pels. The MAVs have a forty
Speaker 2: eight percent opponent winning percentage in their remaining schedule, which
Speaker 2: is the ninth easiest, The Suns fifty seven point four
Speaker 2: percent toughest remaining in the entire league, and then the
Speaker 2: Kings at fifty six percent opponent win percentage is the
Speaker 2: third toughest remaining schedule in the league. So the Sons
Speaker 2: and Kings both really tough schedules. Probably worth mentioning though
Speaker 2: that this time of year, the toughness in the schedule,
Speaker 2: a lot of it has to do with where it's loaded,
Speaker 2: because once you get into that last week or so,
Speaker 2: even some of the top teams in the league start
Speaker 2: sitting guys. Then we go to the Warriors and the
Speaker 2: Lakers at thirty two losses, so three behind the Mavericks,
Speaker 2: Sons and Kings, both of them at thirty two, seventeenth
Speaker 2: and eighteenth toughest remaining schedules, respectively, with the forty eight
Speaker 2: percent opponent win percentage. So let's get started here are
Speaker 2: with you, Carson, What is your best guess for how
Speaker 2: the standings land from here in the play?
Speaker 4: So I think that we're probably gonna end up with
Speaker 4: the four teams who are currently in the play and
Speaker 4: still in the play and a little bit boring.
Speaker 3: Maybe.
Speaker 4: I think that the Pelicans are in some risk of
Speaker 4: falling now that they don't have BI, But they've honestly
Speaker 4: played pretty well without him this year, and he's got
Speaker 4: a really good season, so I don't want to diminish
Speaker 4: what he brings scoring, playmaking, improved defense. But they're four
Speaker 4: and two without him. I still think they maintain that
Speaker 4: really elite defensive identity no matter what, and they've gotten
Speaker 4: a really good version of Zion lately. So I think
Speaker 4: just for this very short stretch, with the advantage they
Speaker 4: have in the standings, they can probably hold on.
Speaker 3: But then with the Kings and the Suns.
Speaker 4: I just think they do have really tough schedules, as
Speaker 4: you laid out specifically Phoenix. I mean, it's ridiculous they
Speaker 4: have games remaining versus the Nuggets. They have two left
Speaker 4: versus New Orleans, which is maybe a little bit easier
Speaker 4: without Bi, but that's still a tough, physical, defensive, minded,
Speaker 4: talented basketball team. Cleveland, the Tea Wolves twice, the Clippers twice,
Speaker 4: and then the Kings. I just don't think they've consistently
Speaker 4: shown a high enough level defensively, a high enough level
Speaker 4: in terms of effort for where I'm like, yeah, they're
Speaker 4: gonna overcome being a couple games back from New Orleans
Speaker 4: and climb up with that sort of schedule in.
Speaker 3: Front of them. And then I do still think the
Speaker 3: Lakers Warriors end up.
Speaker 4: In nine to ten. They may have a bit of
Speaker 4: an advantage in terms of schedule, and I may think
Speaker 4: that both these teams are better than their record, There's
Speaker 4: no question about that. And with the Lakers specifically, we've
Speaker 4: seen the ceiling that they're capable of reaching when they
Speaker 4: just reach the requisite effort level. But I just think
Speaker 4: they've kind of dug themselves too deep a hole at
Speaker 4: this point. And I think that we've seen with the
Speaker 4: Warriors again, they've obviously risen to a higher level, but
Speaker 4: if they were able to just magically flip a switch
Speaker 4: and then start reeling off a whole bunch of regular
Speaker 4: season wins, I think that they probably would have done
Speaker 4: so before getting to this point where now they are
Speaker 4: just a few games above five hundred, and they have
Speaker 4: been in that nine to ten range for so much
Speaker 4: of this season. So I think that we're still headed
Speaker 4: for Lakers Warriors in the nine ten.
Speaker 3: I agree for the most part.
Speaker 1: I think if we're gonna see a team fluctuate between
Speaker 1: where they are right now, I think it would probably
Speaker 1: be Dallas either climbing to five or four over the
Speaker 1: Pelicans or Clippers. But yeah, I think the bottom four
Speaker 1: teams are gonna stay the same. And the thing about
Speaker 1: the schedule too, The Suns have one hell of a
Speaker 1: road stretch here. Their next five games are all on
Speaker 1: the road. That's really tough to endure in like two
Speaker 1: games against San Antonio. Any game against Wenby, I feel like,
Speaker 1: isn't just a wash, you know what I mean, It's
Speaker 1: always a tough out. So I would probably take Sacramento
Speaker 1: to lock up seven to eight. And then I agree
Speaker 1: with you, man, I just think the Lakers and Warriors
Speaker 1: are in too big of a hole. And if any
Speaker 1: of those teams, I'm not predicting this by any means,
Speaker 1: if either of those teams slip up. I mean, Houston
Speaker 1: has been surging, dude, seven straight wins, Like, I wouldn't
Speaker 1: pick them to leapfrog or get in there. But the
Speaker 1: Warriors of Lakers fall asleep at the wheel for a
Speaker 1: couple of games and the last week of the season
Speaker 1: could get really grimy for both of those teams.
Speaker 2: Yeah, again, like that last when you get into the
Speaker 2: end stretch, it's when you run into the issue with
Speaker 2: teams starting to rest guys. So, like I even looking
Speaker 2: at the Warriors Lakers, Warriors are heading into a little
Speaker 2: bit of a tough stretch of their schedule as well.
Speaker 2: They play the Timberwolves and the in the Orlando Magic
Speaker 2: in the next couple of games. Tonight, they play the Pacers. Specifically,
Speaker 2: they have you know, Aaron E. Smith and Andrew Nemhart
Speaker 2: in Indiana. Now Steph shot him out of the building
Speaker 2: when they played in Indiana about a month ago, But
Speaker 2: that's a tough perimeter matchup. Then you go to Orlando,
Speaker 2: they have one of the best guard defenders in the league,
Speaker 2: and Jalen Suggs. You go to obviously Minnesota professional, you know,
Speaker 2: perimeter defense team. Those types of teams have typically given
Speaker 2: the Warriors some issues, and the Lakers, while they're about
Speaker 2: to head into a tougher schedule in a little bit,
Speaker 2: they're in a little bit of an easier stretch right here.
Speaker 2: So like, I actually think that it's more likely than
Speaker 2: not that the Lakers end up at nine and the
Speaker 2: Warriors end up at ten. I agree with you guys
Speaker 2: as it pertains to the plan. I think we're gonna
Speaker 2: get MAVs and Pelicans out of the plan. It's a
Speaker 2: risk with the Pels because they're in a little bit
Speaker 2: of a tougher stretch and obviously Bi being out and
Speaker 2: he's been so so good for them on both ends
Speaker 2: of the floor as of late, sliding really nicely into
Speaker 2: that secondary role behind Zion as they've kind of shifted,
Speaker 2: and then also just everything he's been doing defensively, which
Speaker 2: has been one of the better defensive seasons of his career,
Speaker 2: and so like, obviously there's some risk there. But the
Speaker 2: same reason why I don't think the the Pelicans will
Speaker 2: drop is the same reason why I don't think the
Speaker 2: Lakers and Warriors will pass the Suns or the Kings.
Speaker 2: It's the same reason why I don't think the Houston
Speaker 2: Rockets will pass the Warriors or the Lakers. It's just
Speaker 2: that three losses is just way too much to make
Speaker 2: up in this short piece period of time. Like again,
Speaker 2: like to put it simply, imagine like a fifteen game
Speaker 2: sample and you went and you happen to go, you know,
Speaker 2: twelve in three, they would only have to go what's
Speaker 2: that nine and six to hold their ground, right, So like,
Speaker 2: it's just not that it's not that difficult to hold
Speaker 2: that ground over that period of time. And again you're
Speaker 2: gonna get into that final week and it's gonna be
Speaker 2: a lot of automatic wins. Who do you, guys think
Speaker 2: has the best chance to survive the play in tournament
Speaker 2: between the Lakers and the Warriors. We'll start with you, Logan.
Speaker 1: Man, I've flip flopped between this all season long, and
Speaker 1: I've wanted to sell my stock since the start of
Speaker 1: this season, and I picked the Lakers to win the title.
Speaker 1: I really want to take Golden State, guys, I really
Speaker 1: want to take Golden State. And I think they have
Speaker 1: improved immenseally over the back half of the season, with
Speaker 1: Raymond Green returning, with Chris Paul being such a steadying
Speaker 1: force off the bench, with the emergence of rookies like
Speaker 1: Brandon Pitzimski and tray Jackson Davis. I can't sing tj
Speaker 1: D's praise is enough, man, that kid is awesome. I
Speaker 1: just can't bring myself to take Golden State. Jason. You
Speaker 1: did a breakdown a couple of days ago about Steph
Speaker 1: and their reliance on him offensively, and that's really what
Speaker 1: it comes down to me. I just think the Lakers
Speaker 1: have more secondary shot creation, more guys they can pull
Speaker 1: their weight on any given night. You know, I think
Speaker 1: the Lakers are really well equipped to withstand an off
Speaker 1: night from a Lebron James and off night from an
Speaker 1: Anthony Davis because they have Dangelo Russell, because they have
Speaker 1: Austin Reeves, because they have these other guys that can
Speaker 1: pull their own weight and create their own shots offensively.
Speaker 1: And then you get into the fact that we always
Speaker 1: harp on the Lakers physical one athletic advantages. It's just
Speaker 1: something I can bank in on more. I really want
Speaker 1: to say Golden State. I think Golden State is the
Speaker 1: more esthetically pleasing team. They're more fun to watch in
Speaker 1: my opinion, But that's not what it comes down to.
Speaker 1: I think the Lakers still have those physical one athletic advantages,
Speaker 1: and there's just more shot creation up and down the roster. Also,
Speaker 1: you add in the fact that I don't know, man,
Speaker 1: I think this team has a legit chip on his shoulder.
Speaker 1: They still got Lebron James. I still think that when
Speaker 1: this team it was ironic because last year, right guys,
Speaker 1: it was like the Lakers at any given night in
Speaker 1: the playoffs would just boot a game and they'd say, Ah,
Speaker 1: you know what, we'll just win tomorrow night. We'll punt
Speaker 1: on this game. We'll win tomorrow night. I still have
Speaker 1: that feel with this Lakers team where I think that
Speaker 1: if they really want to crank the dial up in
Speaker 1: intense environments, in big game scenarios, I think the Lakers
Speaker 1: will show up. So it pains me to say it
Speaker 1: because I've been trying to offload my Lakers stock for
Speaker 1: so long, but I will side with LA and I
Speaker 1: want to take Golden State. Man. I want to see
Speaker 1: Golden State get it done. I'm rooting for that, But
Speaker 1: my gut says LA is going to get through.
Speaker 3: Well.
Speaker 4: I think that when we're answering this question, we have
Speaker 4: to start with the fact that this is likely going
Speaker 4: to be the nine to ten matchup, So first somebody
Speaker 4: has to survive this specific game, and that's where I
Speaker 4: think the answer becomes relatively clear. I just think the
Speaker 4: Lakers are a brutal matchup for Golden State. I think
Speaker 4: that we saw that in the playoff series last year.
Speaker 4: Of course, this is a different Warrior team. It's a
Speaker 4: younger Warriors team, it's a more athletic Warriors team. But
Speaker 4: the ultimate insurmountable advantages that the Lakers had last year,
Speaker 4: to me, were the fact that they had the two
Speaker 4: superstar talents on the floor, the two guys who could
Speaker 4: be top ten players throughout a series, and the Warriors
Speaker 4: only had the one, that being Steph Curry, and they
Speaker 4: are very overwhelmingly reliant on him as that lone star
Speaker 4: shot creator. Shout out to Kaminga and what he has
Speaker 4: done as a mismatch attacker, weaponizing his athleticism out of
Speaker 4: the post in transition, he's been so good, but there's
Speaker 4: still obviously a gap, and I think in that playoff
Speaker 4: environment he needs to prove that he can sustain this level.
Speaker 4: And so that's a real advantage that the Lakers are
Speaker 4: just gonna have two guys on the floor who are
Speaker 4: head and shoulders above everybody else except for Steph Curry
Speaker 4: at all times. I do prefer their secondary shot creation,
Speaker 4: as Logan laid out. I mean, especially with the level
Speaker 4: that we've been getting from D'Angelo Russell. I don't want
Speaker 4: to be the guy who banks on d Low because
Speaker 4: obviously he melted down against the Nuggets last year, and
Speaker 4: he is just kind of inherently erratic because of his
Speaker 4: shot selection, because he relies on those tough pull ups
Speaker 4: and he can take the offense out of rhythm when
Speaker 4: it's not falling. But he is playing at a level
Speaker 4: that we haven't seen from him in quite some time.
Speaker 4: I mean, has just been so impressive for this last
Speaker 4: month plus now, and so I'm at least optimistic about
Speaker 4: what he can bring in stretches, what Austin Reeves brings
Speaker 4: in stretches, and so I think it comes down to
Speaker 4: a combination of two of the three best players by
Speaker 4: far on the floor in this series, overall athletic and
Speaker 4: really massive size advantages. Like Anthony Davis is just a
Speaker 4: brutal matchup for the Warriors. We saw that last year
Speaker 4: in terms of how he was able to dictate the
Speaker 4: series defensively. Kevon Looney did a really good job of
Speaker 4: battling him on the glass, but he's still eight up
Speaker 4: boards in that series was over fourteen a game, I believe,
Speaker 4: And I love TJD. And he is bawling out, but
Speaker 4: the Lakers just don't have a physical answer for Anthony Davis.
Speaker 4: They didn't have a center who was athletic enough last year.
Speaker 4: Now they do have an athletic center in TJD. But
Speaker 4: he's still undersize for that matchup, and if you get
Speaker 4: dialed in AD, he's just a problem, and he's really
Speaker 4: a problem against a small team like Golden State.
Speaker 3: So even though I love.
Speaker 4: How the Warriors have turned the corner overall in the
Speaker 4: second half of the season, and I think that they
Speaker 4: have been rejuvenated by this young core and they're doing
Speaker 4: a lot of good things, LA specifically, is just a
Speaker 4: really tough matchup if Lebron and AD are going to
Speaker 4: hit that top gear.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I look at it like this when Vanderbilt out,
Speaker 2: I think they're pretty much on similar footing as teams,
Speaker 2: and honestly, like I really do feel like even if
Speaker 2: they're healthy, which by the way, Jovon Boujac came on
Speaker 2: the show yesterday and reported that Jared Vanderbilt is going
Speaker 2: to return the season, or not that he's going to,
Speaker 2: but that it's far more likely that he's going to
Speaker 2: return this season. So even with that allowed, I think
Speaker 2: I'd picked the home team between those two regardless, like
Speaker 2: I would have a hard time picking against Steph at
Speaker 2: home in a single elimination game. That said, I think
Speaker 2: when Jared Vanderbilt's healthy on the Lakers, I think the
Speaker 2: Lakers are just better than the Warriors. I think he's
Speaker 2: that when he's out of the lineup, that specific position
Speaker 2: group is such a devastating weakness for the Lakers that
Speaker 2: Steph can get comfortable all game long, and that's a
Speaker 2: real problem. Like literally Austin Reeves draws the staph assignment
Speaker 2: when when Jared Vanderbilt is out of the lineup, and
Speaker 2: we've seen how that's been a problem. But with Vanderbilt healthy,
Speaker 2: they're just more built for that sort of thing. That said,
Speaker 2: I still think just with the way the schedules are
Speaker 2: set up, even though they have similar remaining strength of schedule,
Speaker 2: the Lakers tougher parts of their schedule are later on,
Speaker 2: whereas the Warriors toughest parts of the schedule are earlier on,
Speaker 2: and I think that that benefits LA. They also have
Speaker 2: a head to head matchup on April ninth, where the
Speaker 2: Lakers will be at home, which I think is an
Speaker 2: advantage towards the Lakers. So, even though again I think
Speaker 2: you'd be foolish to count steph Out, I think if
Speaker 2: Golden State did get the nine seed, I would be
Speaker 2: I would lean towards picking them to win that nine
Speaker 2: to ten game. I just think it's more likely than
Speaker 2: not that the Lakers win the nine seed, and if
Speaker 2: Jared Vanderbilt is healthy, I think the Lakers have a
Speaker 2: better chance of winning a road game in Oracle than
Speaker 2: the Warriors have a chance of beating the Lakers in
Speaker 2: Crypto dot Com Arena in the event that there are
Speaker 2: the ten seeds, So I think I leaned towards the
Speaker 2: Lakers there. As far as the seven to eight matchup goes,
Speaker 2: I really like the Kings are definitely a tougher matchup
Speaker 2: for the Lakers than either the Suns or the Kings.
Speaker 3: Are for the Warriors.
Speaker 2: So in a weird way, I actually give the Warriors
Speaker 2: a slightly better chance should they beat the Lakers to
Speaker 2: get out of that seven to eight matchup. But the
Speaker 2: one excuse me, the one thing that I keep pointing
Speaker 2: to with the Lakers as a you know, kind of
Speaker 2: like an optimistic sign for them as a play in team,
Speaker 2: is that they do not rely on variants nearly as
Speaker 2: much as the other teams around the league. The Warriors
Speaker 2: are a high volume jump shooting team, the Lakers are not.
Speaker 2: The Lakers take are one of the lowest volume three
Speaker 2: point shooting teams in the league. There one of the
Speaker 2: most frequent paint scoring teams in the league. They have
Speaker 2: an ability ability to scale up in terms of their
Speaker 2: physical in position when they get into those matchups. A
Speaker 2: big example for me would be like Game six last year,
Speaker 2: Lakers Warriors, Lakers at home. They get their butt kicked
Speaker 2: in Game five. Now, as Logan pointed out earlier, that's
Speaker 2: kind of was their theme last year's they would just
Speaker 2: punt specific games. But in that Game six, what happened.
Speaker 2: Lebron came out in the first quarter and was like,
Speaker 2: I'm bigger and stronger than all these dudes, and for
Speaker 2: one night, I can bury them all in the rim.
Speaker 2: And he went out and he did that. And so again,
Speaker 2: like I think, I think, when when we really zoom
Speaker 2: in on it, the both teams have a decent chance.
Speaker 2: But I'd say I give the Warriors a little bit
Speaker 2: less than a fifty percent chance of escaping the plane
Speaker 2: and the Lakers a little bit more than a fifty
Speaker 2: percent chance, and so I'd leaned towards the Lakers. So
Speaker 2: one last note on that before we head out to
Speaker 2: the Eastern Conference playing. If you're the Lakers, and we're
Speaker 2: gonna do both of these rapid fires, so we'll go
Speaker 2: through both of you and then we'll go to the Warriors.
Speaker 2: If you're the Lakers, who's the one team you want
Speaker 2: to avoid in a road playing game. Let's start with you, Carson.
Speaker 4: I think you would have to be Dallas if they're
Speaker 4: in this conversation. I mean, they're on the fringes of
Speaker 4: the play, and I just think the Lakers still have
Speaker 4: a physical advantage in the front court there, but it
Speaker 4: has diminished from what would have been overwhelming earlier in
Speaker 4: the year. We've seen Dallas improve so much as a
Speaker 4: rebounding team, just improve their overall big situation, and then
Speaker 4: I just think the offensive ceiling that they have with
Speaker 4: Luca and Kyrie when they're going can be really overwhelming.
Speaker 4: And so I just think they're the scariest team. The
Speaker 4: Kings have been a tough matchup, specifically for the Lakers,
Speaker 4: with the quickness of their guards and the whole Sabonis
Speaker 4: ad battle, but I still like the Lakers in that matchup.
Speaker 3: So it's definitely Dallas to me.
Speaker 1: If Dallas is in the conversation, I'd say Dallas, Sacramento
Speaker 1: doesn't scare me. If I'm LA, Phoenix doesn't scare me.
Speaker 1: If I'm LA, I don't really consider I have enough
Speaker 1: confidence in Dallas getting out of the Final four. So
Speaker 1: I would take Golden State honestly, Like, and that's what
Speaker 1: I want to emphasize. I don't want to count out
Speaker 1: Golden State by any means. Like if Steph does go
Speaker 1: crazy in a one game scenario and Clay is still
Speaker 1: a swing factor in a one game scenario where if
Speaker 1: he's hitting big shots and his shot is on, he
Speaker 1: is the kind of guy that can swing a single game,
Speaker 1: right if Anthony Davis has an off night shooting, like,
Speaker 1: there's a recipe for Golden State to win a game.
Speaker 1: Because I consider Dallas kind of out of this conversation,
Speaker 1: I would definitely say that I lean LA, but Golden
Speaker 1: State still scares scares the hell out of me. If
Speaker 1: I'm LA, Man, they can They've got all the recipe,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, And we've seen it before,
Speaker 1: so Golden State still terrifies me if I'm Los Angeles.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree with you in the sense that I
Speaker 2: think a road game in Dallas or Golden State would
Speaker 2: both be issues for the Lakers. Really, a road game
Speaker 2: against any of those teams, I think for the Lakers
Speaker 2: would be tough. They've got a lot of young players
Speaker 2: and they really depend on their role players playing well,
Speaker 2: which is scary in those types of environments. I still
Speaker 2: lean the Kings as the scariest Lakers matchup, and it
Speaker 2: really is this simple to me, Like I think Lebron
Speaker 2: and AD would be able to scale up physically against Dallas.
Speaker 2: I think they'd be able to scale up physically against
Speaker 2: Golden State. Mean what I mean by that is like,
Speaker 2: I don't think I don't think PJ. Washington and Daniel
Speaker 2: Gafford or Prej Washington and Derek Lively are going to
Speaker 2: be able to hold up well under a Lebron James
Speaker 2: Anthony Davis onslaught in a single elimination game that the
Speaker 2: Kings really they're The Kings are a bad defense, but
Speaker 2: they have defensive strengths, and they've had moments this year
Speaker 2: where they've been a really good defense. And the King's
Speaker 2: two defensive strengths both play specifically into Laker offensive weaknesses,
Speaker 2: which is, the Lakers guards struggle against ball pressure, good
Speaker 2: physical ball pressure, and the Kings have a ton of
Speaker 2: quickness at the guard position to cause those sorts of problems.
Speaker 2: And secondly, Anthony Davis is an inconsistent over the top
Speaker 2: shot maker, and so Bonus is quicker and stronger than him,
Speaker 2: so you can beat him to spots and force him
Speaker 2: to make shots over the top. Some Knights, Anthony Davis
Speaker 2: makes all his hooks and jumpers, and some Knights he
Speaker 2: just can't make him to save his life, and that
Speaker 2: can be a problem. And then on the other end
Speaker 2: of the floor, it's just a simple matter of like
Speaker 2: I actually like the Lakers against over the top shot makers,
Speaker 2: which is your Luca, You're Kyrie obviously looking at even
Speaker 2: the Suns guys, even looking at the Clippers guys, even
Speaker 2: looking at the thunder guys. Like, the Lakers have done
Speaker 2: really well this year defensively against teams that rely on
Speaker 2: over the top shot making, because they have good positional
Speaker 2: defenders that can get contests on shots, and because the
Speaker 2: Lakers do so much damage in the paint on the
Speaker 2: other end of the floor, it brings a physical wear
Speaker 2: and tear element that can sometimes lead to jump shots missing.
Speaker 2: I've seen a lot of complaints from people who don't
Speaker 2: like the Lakers this year, being like, oh, they got lucky,
Speaker 2: this team misshots. Oh they got lucky, this team misshots,
Speaker 2: and they don't realize it keeps happening because the Lakers
Speaker 2: play bully ball and that can have a wear and
Speaker 2: tear effect on the game, whereas like with the with
Speaker 2: the Kings in particular, obviously Darreon Fox is having a
Speaker 2: great pull up shooting year. Obviously we know Milik Monk
Speaker 2: can hit pull up jump shots. Obviously we know Harrison
Speaker 2: Barnes and Keigan Murray and Kevin Herder and these guys
Speaker 2: can shoot. But they're the primary driving force behind their
Speaker 2: offense is actually a downhill force element. It's it's Darren
Speaker 2: Fox and Malik Monk. It's it's Demonisa Bonus in his
Speaker 2: power game. So like they're they're a team that I
Speaker 2: think plays more directly into the Lakers weaknesses on both
Speaker 2: ends of the floor. All right, quickly, Warriors, starting with you, logan,
Speaker 2: who's the one team you want to avoid? If you're
Speaker 2: the Warriors.
Speaker 1: Ironically, it's la. I think that matchups's gonna be a battle.
Speaker 1: I think that they just match up really well against
Speaker 1: each other. Like said earlier, I don't think Golden State
Speaker 1: has an answer for ad. It's like, you know, I
Speaker 1: think at the top of the draft we were doing
Speaker 1: prospect breakdowns the other day. It's like they don't have
Speaker 1: a big Zoo, they don't have a Hartenstein, they don't
Speaker 1: have a Robinson, and like just having a big kind
Speaker 1: of a big body like I think if Golden State
Speaker 1: could somehow swing it like a Donovan Klingen or somebody
Speaker 1: like that, like an immediate impact, big body center would
Speaker 1: be really effective. I think for a team like Golden State,
Speaker 1: where you could run different types of defensive coverages, you
Speaker 1: just have a you know, you just have a physical answer.
Speaker 1: A guy that just matches up well against any big
Speaker 1: body in Golden State has not had that. With Looney
Speaker 1: slightly tailing off this year, you know what I mean,
Speaker 1: he's not the same guy that he once was. I
Speaker 1: think they could get physically overwhelmed. Again. I'm not counting
Speaker 1: them out, and this isn't a shot it Sacramento is
Speaker 1: a Kings fan. I just kind of have a sinking
Speaker 1: feeling that Sacramento is not going to get it done.
Speaker 1: And then Phoenix. I don't know about you, guys, Phoenix
Speaker 1: doesn't really scare me at all. I just think they
Speaker 1: can't play defense. So ironically, I think the kryptonite for
Speaker 1: both of these teams is a matchup against each other,
Speaker 1: and it kind of seems like that's the collision course
Speaker 1: that we're headed on. So for both teams, i'd say
Speaker 1: it's LA Golden State.
Speaker 4: I think it's LA for Golden State because of a
Speaker 4: lot of the reasons that I laid out earlier, and
Speaker 4: just to mention Phoenix, because I do think they're obviously
Speaker 4: a very talented basketball team. I just don't necessarily identify
Speaker 4: them as a tough matchup.
Speaker 3: For a lot of people because it feels to.
Speaker 4: Me like they are just very dependent on what level
Speaker 4: of shot making are we going to get from our stars?
Speaker 4: And generally, when I think about matchup, it's like, Okay,
Speaker 4: what do you have that is going to make X
Speaker 4: team uncomfortable? And because of their lack of defensive grip,
Speaker 4: because of their lack of physicality, overall, I don't think
Speaker 4: Phoenix is really going to shine there, it's going to
Speaker 4: be like, what level are our stars playing at and
Speaker 4: how is their difficult shot making? But I think it's
Speaker 4: La Again. I think it's the star advantage. I think
Speaker 4: it's the physical advantage. I do think Vandal coming back
Speaker 4: is a real problem at the point of attack, just
Speaker 4: able to hassle Steph off ball. I think we saw
Speaker 4: how effective they're pick and roll coverages were with both
Speaker 4: him and a d against Steph last year in the playoffs,
Speaker 4: and so I think it's pretty clearly the Lakers who
Speaker 4: the Warriors want to la Void.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it's the Lakers too. I think if
Speaker 2: in the event that they won a game against the Lakers,
Speaker 2: let's say that they get the nine seed and they
Speaker 2: go to Oracle and they win, or they happen to
Speaker 2: upset them at a crypto, the team that I'd be
Speaker 2: most worried about if I was Golden State at that
Speaker 2: point is Dallas. They have the interior size and length
Speaker 2: with Derek Lively. I actually I go back and forth
Speaker 2: with Gafford and Lively, but I think in that specific matchup,
Speaker 2: I'd really like doing some of the stuff that a
Speaker 2: lot of teams have done against the Warriors where you
Speaker 2: top lock in funnel and basically just count on Derek
Speaker 2: g Lively to be kind of a deterrent at the rim,
Speaker 2: you know, playing off of the non shooters. So yeah,
Speaker 2: I'd probably lean towards Dallas in the event that they
Speaker 2: escape the Lakers. But I agree with you that the Lakers.
Speaker 2: To me, the Lakers are when healthy win Jared Vanderbilt
Speaker 2: the best team out of that play in group overall,
Speaker 2: even including the Pelicans, just when they're actually healthy. But
Speaker 2: that again, like I think, I think Jared Vanderbilt being
Speaker 2: out has made the Lakers look so physically overwhelmed at
Speaker 2: the on the perimeter, but like little things like when
Speaker 2: Vando's in there, it just slots everything so much better.
Speaker 2: Now Austin Reeves is guarding the second best perimeter player,
Speaker 2: which is something he actually can handle as opposed to
Speaker 2: being in a struggle position. Jared Vanderbilt is one of
Speaker 2: their best defensive rebounders at the forward position. He's so
Speaker 2: much better offensively this year than he was last year,
Speaker 2: mainly because of the system that they're using. Like I think,
Speaker 2: I think the Lakers are very much just in the
Speaker 2: pack right now, But when Vanderbilt is healthy like they're
Speaker 2: they're legitimately and I look at him more in that
Speaker 2: tier with the teams below Denver at the top when
Speaker 2: they're actually healthy. Moving on to the East Plan, and
Speaker 2: we won't say as long on this one just because
Speaker 2: it's not as interesting and some of the stuff is
Speaker 2: more set. The nine and ten seeds are set, Chicago's
Speaker 2: at the Atlanta's at the ten. That's most likely not
Speaker 2: going to change. We do have three teams tied at
Speaker 2: thirty one losses, though, the Pacers with a thirteenth toughest
Speaker 2: remaining schedule fifty one percent opponent win percentage, the seventy
Speaker 2: six ers twentieth toughest remaining schedule forty eight percent opponent
Speaker 2: winning percentage, the Heat fourth easiest remaining schedule forty seven
Speaker 2: percent in opponent winning percentage. So on this one, what
Speaker 2: I'd like to see is just for fun, and we'll
Speaker 2: start with you, Carson. What with number one being Boston
Speaker 2: to Milwaukee, three being Cleveland, what's your ideal set of
Speaker 2: matchups for the first round? Just as a basketball fan,
Speaker 2: what would you prefer to see in the Eastern Conference
Speaker 2: first round as the survivors from the plane?
Speaker 4: So I think there's potential for some pretty fun matchups here,
Speaker 4: just because of the Heat doing their normal regular season
Speaker 4: routine where they have these brutal stretches, and obviously that's
Speaker 4: some injuries early in the year, but just being way
Speaker 4: down there in the standings, and then obviously Philly dropping
Speaker 4: far because of the emb'd in. So I think there's
Speaker 4: a couple of dangerous first round draws for the top seeds.
Speaker 4: I would like to see Celtics heat in the first round,
Speaker 4: just because I think that would be a fantastic test
Speaker 4: for this Boston team, see how different they really are
Speaker 4: than previous iterations. And I think that they are for
Speaker 4: what it's worth, I think they're significantly better than last year.
Speaker 4: But if anybody's gonna make them uncomfortable, it's Miami, and
Speaker 4: I would just love to see that rematch. There's just
Speaker 4: a pretty fun history in recent years between those teams
Speaker 4: and these high stakes playoff matchups. Then I would like
Speaker 4: to see buck sixers, and these are both very plausible.
Speaker 4: I mean, Miami and Philly are both in that play
Speaker 4: and range right now. I just think that seeing mbiid
Speaker 4: Giannis would be a super fun first round matchup. I
Speaker 4: think seeing what Tyrese Maxi could do against a Bucks
Speaker 4: point of attack defense that obviously still has its issues
Speaker 4: would be fun. I think seeing the Dame Maxi matchup
Speaker 4: overall would be really exciting. And I think getting two
Speaker 4: of the top five players on the planet, two huge
Speaker 4: physical guys like Embiidiannis matched up, that would just be
Speaker 4: really exciting. And those are two really good teams. I
Speaker 4: think Philly's obviously much better than their seed this year.
Speaker 3: Then I have calvs.
Speaker 4: Pacers just as a sort of leftovers matchup. I think
Speaker 4: that Cleveland is pretty clearly better there. The Pacers have
Speaker 4: just been bumming me out ever since Hallie came back
Speaker 4: from the hamstring, just because he's not even close to
Speaker 4: the same player. So I loved watching him. I loved
Speaker 4: watching their offense early in this year. I think that
Speaker 4: he is still very much the future, but right now
Speaker 4: he's just limping through this season. And I'd like to
Speaker 4: see Akham fit. But when he is nothing close to himself,
Speaker 4: when he can't get a step, when he's settling for
Speaker 4: all these brutally tough pull up threes, like, the Pacers
Speaker 4: aren't that fun and they just aren't that good because
Speaker 4: they need that offense to be great. And then I
Speaker 4: have Orlando against New York because I think that would
Speaker 4: be a really fun, defensive minded matchup that would be
Speaker 4: a kind of throwback series just in terms of the grittiness,
Speaker 4: the physicality.
Speaker 3: You have some big forwards.
Speaker 4: In this matchup, if it's Fronds, if it's Paalo, if
Speaker 4: it's Julius Randall. Obviously Ojananobi as a defensive counter, and
Speaker 4: I would kind of enjoy the defensive chess match between
Speaker 4: these two teams. And Orlando is a fun young team,
Speaker 4: I personally don't think they really have the offensive ceiling
Speaker 4: to make noise in this playoff run. I would definitely
Speaker 4: take New York. I think healthy New York is a
Speaker 4: really scary playoff team, But I think that would be
Speaker 4: an interesting matchup for both these teams, and I think
Speaker 4: it would just present some discomfort inherently by their play styles.
Speaker 1: I think as long as Atlanta and Chicago get bounced,
Speaker 1: I think the first round is gonna be awesome. As
Speaker 1: long as we can remove both of those teams, it's
Speaker 1: gonna be a good time. I flopped on some of these.
Speaker 1: I think a rematch of Cavs Knicks would honestly be
Speaker 1: really fun saying if Cleveland can make adjustments, and just
Speaker 1: the fact that New York that battle of the interior
Speaker 1: guys man Allen and Mobley versus Robinson and Randall Hartenstein.
Speaker 1: That was awesome last year watching those guys bat Like
Speaker 1: you talk about a throwback series, we kind of got
Speaker 1: it last year, and I'm I'm honestly down to the
Speaker 1: double down and get that again this year and see
Speaker 1: if Cleveland can make adjustments, if the Knicks can just
Speaker 1: go in there and handle business. I like, I really
Speaker 1: like Philly versus Milwaukee. I think that. I mean, what
Speaker 1: Tyrese Maxie has done in the absence of Joel Embiid
Speaker 1: this season has been like astounding. You know, I knew
Speaker 1: Maxi was great, but seeing him this year without having
Speaker 1: a guy to rely on like Embiid, Maxie's pull up shooting,
Speaker 1: his command of the offense, the way he's controlled the game,
Speaker 1: I've been super impressed with him. So I think I
Speaker 1: think it would be an offensive showdown between them and Milwaukee. Obviously,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna take Milwaukee if Embid's not healthy. And then
Speaker 1: on the Miami point, I want to ask you, guys,
Speaker 1: I think Miami matches up because they just got the
Speaker 1: heat culture. I think they're better than last year with
Speaker 1: the improvement of guys like Triple j Yovich they had
Speaker 1: in Terry Rozier. Is it wrong to me to question
Speaker 1: if Jimmy Butler is gonna be good to go for
Speaker 1: this playoff rund? Like it's it's rubbed me the wrong way.
Speaker 1: We haven't and I know Jimmy and Miami doesn't do
Speaker 1: this every year, but Jimmy's just been so consistently out,
Speaker 1: like you know, missing games. If it's I don't know,
Speaker 1: is it wrong of me to be concerned if Jimmy
Speaker 1: Butler is gonna be good to go come playoff time?
Speaker 4: Be my guest man?
Speaker 2: Are our our friend? Ryan Brumley has always said that
Speaker 2: he hates Miami and Jimmy because because because they always
Speaker 2: take the regular season off and it just makes them
Speaker 2: really difficult to evaluate in that regard, to which point
Speaker 2: I agree, Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 4: Jimmy's been banged up a year after year, he generally
Speaker 4: shows up in the playoffs and balls. I wouldn't be
Speaker 4: the guy to be throwing around a bunch of anti
Speaker 4: Miami takes right now, and listen I've been that guy.
Speaker 4: I've been that guy, and I still am sitting here
Speaker 4: saying that they're probably gonna lose first round. I mean,
Speaker 4: that'll depend on the matchup, but I think Jimmy's gonna
Speaker 4: be fine.
Speaker 2: Uh So, I obviously Boston my m he is the
Speaker 2: easy one. You just want to see that. That's a
Speaker 2: fun rematch Milwaukee Philly. I I understand the appeal there,
Speaker 2: and I'd be lying if I if I said I
Speaker 2: wouldn't enjoy that as a basketball fan. But part of me, really,
Speaker 2: like just for Embiid's sake, just hopes that Philly misses
Speaker 2: the playoffs this here, because, like I just I don't
Speaker 2: want him to rush back and then look like a
Speaker 2: shell of himself and lose in the first round again
Speaker 2: and then just further exacerbate the narrative surrounding him. Like
Speaker 2: I think Embiid is eventually going to break through in
Speaker 2: a big way in the postseason, and I'd almost rather
Speaker 2: have him just sit out the rest of the season
Speaker 2: than manage his knee more diligently next year, stop worrying
Speaker 2: about regular season awards and just get to to April
Speaker 2: healthy and then and then and then have him try
Speaker 2: to make a run at that point. But that said,
Speaker 2: obviously i'd have fun seeing Milwaukee Philly in the event
Speaker 2: that Philly misses the playoffs. The team that I think
Speaker 2: would be really fun to see against Milwaukee is a
Speaker 2: fun first round opponent is Chicago. They have a elethora
Speaker 2: of perimeter defenders to throw Damian Lillard to make to
Speaker 2: make work extremely hard. They have a lot of perimeter
Speaker 2: speed in general, which is a weakness for Milwaukee. Their
Speaker 2: set of perimeter shot creators, between guys like Kobe White
Speaker 2: and Demarta Rosen, they would be comfortable most of the
Speaker 2: series going against Milwaukee's perimeter options. And then, like Chicago
Speaker 2: with Andre Drummond Nicola Vucevich, they actually have a decent
Speaker 2: amount of interior size, which I think would help in
Speaker 2: terms of the building of the wall type of stuff
Speaker 2: going on when you're trying to defend Giannis in a
Speaker 2: playoff series. So obviously i'd pick Milwaukee to win that series.
Speaker 2: But talking about a fun first round matchup, obviously that'd
Speaker 2: be a good one.
Speaker 3: Calvs.
Speaker 2: Pacers one hundred percent with you on that front, although calvs.
Speaker 2: Nicks would also be a fun kind of like rematch
Speaker 2: type of situation, Haliburton, do you, like, I think, I
Speaker 2: don't know about you guys. Have either of you ever
Speaker 2: had a hamstring strain? I have not, so I had
Speaker 2: one before I played in college. This was when I
Speaker 2: was very young. I was like eighteen nineteen years old,
Speaker 2: and I ended up re injuring it a few times
Speaker 2: before it finally got healthy. And I like, literally there
Speaker 2: was a lengthy stage where I just didn't trust it
Speaker 2: at all to like really take aggressive steps. And with
Speaker 2: Tyrese Haliburton specifically when it comes to beating switches, he
Speaker 2: needs to take those like really aggressive long steps to
Speaker 2: get to his spots. And I just don't think he's
Speaker 2: in a good place physically right now. And I think
Speaker 2: it's starting to hurt his confidence, which is starting to
Speaker 2: hurt even his wide open jump shooting. And I like,
Speaker 2: I'm with you, Carson. I'm a big believer in Haliburton
Speaker 2: in the big picture, but he's just not close to
Speaker 2: form right now, which is which is which is unfortunate.
Speaker 2: And then Orlando New York, like, you could not script
Speaker 2: a better just old fashioned nineteen nineties ass kicking of
Speaker 2: a series that would just be that would just be
Speaker 2: a ton of fun. All right, Moving on to the
Speaker 2: top of the conference, though, I'm interested in kind of
Speaker 2: talking about Boston and Milwaukee as it pertains to the future,
Speaker 2: because both of these teams, with exception of a player
Speaker 2: option for Drew Holliday which he may or may not
Speaker 2: pick up, we'll see, but both of these teams, their
Speaker 2: starting fives are more or less locked up or for
Speaker 2: the next season, and more for some of the other guys. So,
Speaker 2: with that being the circumstance, who has more urgency to
Speaker 2: win a title this year? Boston or Milwaukee? We'll start
Speaker 2: with you.
Speaker 1: Logan urgency is an interesting word because if you think
Speaker 1: that Damian Lillard is going to fall off next season,
Speaker 1: or if he's not going to turn this around, I'd
Speaker 1: probably say Milwaukee. That being said, I think it's interesting.
Speaker 1: I was talking with one of my friends about how
Speaker 1: long it takes like stars to jail with teams, and
Speaker 1: so I wonder if it's just a year of growing pains. Right,
Speaker 1: even Lebron, Dwayne Wade, and Chris Bosh didn't get it
Speaker 1: done in their first year in Miami, and so I
Speaker 1: wonder if it's just a time thing. I think it's
Speaker 1: a personnel thing with Milwaukee, the fact that they don't
Speaker 1: have point of attack defense that they don't have have
Speaker 1: you know, they got a lot of aging guys on
Speaker 1: their roster that they're getting older. I also do think
Speaker 1: it's a chemistry thing and something that may improve with time.
Speaker 1: I think Boston has more pressure, but I think the
Speaker 1: team that needs to get it done more is probably
Speaker 1: Milwaukee with their aging superstars. That being said, I don't
Speaker 1: really see a path from Milwaukee. I've kind of been
Speaker 1: off Milwaukee for a while. I think it would take
Speaker 1: a serious injury to another team. I honestly think the
Speaker 1: Knicks are probably my second favorite team in the Eastern Conference,
Speaker 1: including Milwaukee. I would say urgency wise, I think there's
Speaker 1: probably more pressure on Milwaukee just because they have so
Speaker 1: many older guys on their team that you know, I
Speaker 1: could see Brook Lopez taking even a further step back.
Speaker 1: I could see Damian Lillard maybe taking another step back
Speaker 1: next season. I'd say urgency wise, you know, Boston's younger.
Speaker 1: There's a ton of pressure on Boston, man because they
Speaker 1: keep hitting their freaking head on the ceiling, man, and
Speaker 1: it's you just you keep wondering, like, when are they
Speaker 1: finally gonna breakthrough. You know, twenty eighteen, you go seven
Speaker 1: games in the Eastern Conference Finals against Lebron, twenty twenty,
Speaker 1: you losing six to the Heat in the Eastern Conference Finals.
Speaker 1: You collapse in the NBA Finals against the Warriors in
Speaker 1: twenty two and then Miami slams the door in your
Speaker 1: face again, and so you know, it's frustrating, and I
Speaker 1: think there's a lot of pressure mounting for Boston, but
Speaker 1: they're not going anywhere. They've got a culture, they've got
Speaker 1: the players locked up, They've got a ton of talent.
Speaker 1: They're gonna be back here probably the next couple seasons.
Speaker 1: So I think Boston has more pressure, but I think
Speaker 1: there's gotta be a lot more urgency for Milwaukee. Man,
Speaker 1: they're just older, and I mean, I can see this
Speaker 1: and I didn't even mention Middleton. You know, Middleton's another
Speaker 1: guy with health concerns with aging, with him potentially losing
Speaker 1: a step. It's just I can see Milwaukee definitely knows diving.
Speaker 1: After this season, Boston's probably a perennial contender. Despite how
Speaker 1: frustrating they are there, They're gonna be back.
Speaker 4: There's definitely more urgency for Milwaukee. They're just in a
Speaker 4: much morecarious position. They've gone all in on this core
Speaker 4: comprised mostly of dudes who are in their early in
Speaker 4: mid thirties, outside of Yannis, who himself is still twenty nine.
Speaker 4: I mean, he's not as young obviously as Jason Tatum
Speaker 4: as the cornerstone, and there are legitimate basketball flaws here
Speaker 4: that they have not been able to reconcile up to
Speaker 4: this point. With the point of attack defense, the Dame
Speaker 4: thing logan you talk about if it's fit, I absolutely
Speaker 4: think that that is a factor. I think that we
Speaker 4: still have not seen Dame and Yannis unlock the potential
Speaker 4: that they have with their two man game. I think
Speaker 4: that there's still a really high ceiling there. But there's
Speaker 4: just a bit of synergy and feel between the two
Speaker 4: of them that they haven't totally tapped into. And just
Speaker 4: the volume at which they run Jannis Dame pick and
Speaker 4: roll has not been high enough, in my opinion, and
Speaker 4: so then you have Dame running a bunch of pick
Speaker 4: and roll with Brook Lopez and it's very stagnant, and
Speaker 4: you know that he's popping every single time, and so
Speaker 4: Dame shot quality has gone down. I think if he
Speaker 4: we're running more pick and roll with a legitimate rim,
Speaker 4: threatening athletic big that would just be better for everybody involved.
Speaker 4: I also think Dame has lost a bit of a
Speaker 4: step this year, though, I think in terms of quickness,
Speaker 4: and he's getting to the rim at a career low rate,
Speaker 4: like he's been on a really good stretch these last
Speaker 4: three games, and I think he's capable of exploding. But
Speaker 4: this is not the Damian Lillard that was advertised. This
Speaker 4: is not the Damian Lillard that we saw last year,
Speaker 4: who had maybe the offensive season of his career. And
Speaker 4: so that's just frightening when you consider that's what you've
Speaker 4: gone all in on, and that was supposed to be
Speaker 4: like the miracle drug, that was supposed to be the
Speaker 4: thing that would solve everything, fix your half court offense,
Speaker 4: and from that point, your backline defense is good enough,
Speaker 4: you're gonna contend. You have Damon Giannis, you have the
Speaker 4: best duo on the planet. If that formula isn't great enough,
Speaker 4: then Milwaukee's in a really tough spot because the rest
Speaker 4: of this roster just isn't even close to up to
Speaker 4: par with what Boston has. Boston has this team of
Speaker 4: super soldiers man, this starting five.
Speaker 3: That is just unfair.
Speaker 4: And they are younger and they are healthy at this point,
Speaker 4: Like I'm more worried about Chris Middleton being healthy for
Speaker 4: a playoff run than Chris stops Porzingis and he's older
Speaker 4: and Milwaukee's just slow because of their age. So yeah,
Speaker 4: there is definitely more pressure on Boston in the sense that, hey,
Speaker 4: you guys are overwhelmingly talented. You are the team that
Speaker 4: hasn't done it yet. Milwaukee, albeit with Drew Holiday instead
Speaker 4: of Damian Lillard, like most of these core guys have
Speaker 4: gotten a ring. But if you are talking about actual,
Speaker 4: circumstantial urgency, like if you guys don't do it this year,
Speaker 4: you're gonna have to start asking some big questions like
Speaker 4: maybe Boston would be so disappointed that the city eats
Speaker 4: itself alive and they burn down Boston, then that's a problem.
Speaker 4: But we know that they could come back next year
Speaker 4: and still be the most talented team in the league
Speaker 4: and Milwaukee doesn't have that luxury.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the way you both put it is perfect. I
Speaker 2: would say Boston is more pressure and Milwaukee has more urgency.
Speaker 2: The pressure basically just meaning Boston is expected to win
Speaker 2: and so if they don't. There's aviously a certain level
Speaker 2: of like backlash that will come from every basket. Like
Speaker 2: Boston's in a position where like, if they don't win
Speaker 2: it this year, no one will ever leave in them
Speaker 2: until they actually hoist it. They could be up three
Speaker 2: to two in the NBA Finals and no one would
Speaker 2: would believe it until they actually hoisted the trophy. The
Speaker 2: breakdown of the age that you the ages of the
Speaker 2: starters that Carson kind of went over, is something that
Speaker 2: I think a lot of people don't realize. Like, as
Speaker 2: of next year, all five of Milwaukee's starters will be
Speaker 2: in their thirties, and this is a team that already
Speaker 2: has a certain amount of a lack of foot speed,
Speaker 2: and like even Giannis is starting to succumb to some injuries,
Speaker 2: which has become a little bit more prevalent over the
Speaker 2: last few years. This hamstring thing he's dealing with, there's
Speaker 2: been a little tricky as he's been not as vertically
Speaker 2: athletic as we're accustomed to seeing with Giannis. So yeah,
Speaker 2: like in terms of the urgency, it really is that
Speaker 2: simply you look at Boston, both of the Jays and
Speaker 2: chrisops Porzingis are still firmly in the heart of their
Speaker 2: prime in their late twenties. Of next year, both Derek
Speaker 2: White and Drew Holliday will be in their thirties. But
Speaker 2: they both look really good physically right now and are
Speaker 2: more or less, you know, reliable in that regard. And
Speaker 2: so just with Milwaukee, to put it simply, there's just
Speaker 2: a shorter window. Even as you look at Boston, they're
Speaker 2: still improving. Jalen Brown is playing the best basketball of
Speaker 2: his career right now. Jason Tatum is since January first,
Speaker 2: in a thirty five game sample size, is taking six
Speaker 2: pull up threes per game and shooting over forty percent
Speaker 2: on them. So all those conversations, just by the way,
Speaker 2: we're legitimate. This is new information. We always have people
Speaker 2: that are like, oh, take back everything you said about Tatum.
Speaker 2: It's like, actually, he used to miss them. Now he
Speaker 2: makes them. It's a difference. But like literally, for three years,
Speaker 2: Tatum was a high volume pull up three point shooter
Speaker 2: and couldn't make them at a high enough clip. He
Speaker 2: was in the low thirties. And now he's hitting them
Speaker 2: at forty percent. And so Tatum's getting better. Jalen Brown's
Speaker 2: getting better. Christops Perzingis in the last two three years
Speaker 2: has made significant leaps as a player. Derek White has
Speaker 2: gone from being like an interesting young guard prospect to
Speaker 2: like a useful role player to like a borderline fringe
Speaker 2: star in terms of his overall impact on both ends
Speaker 2: of the floor, and then Drew Holliday as a fifth starter.
Speaker 2: You really can't do much better than that, and so
Speaker 2: Boston just has more groom to grow. That's what's so
Speaker 2: funny is even if Boston loses this year, everyone will
Speaker 2: roast them, everyone will have fun at their expense, and
Speaker 2: then they're going to be right back next year kicking
Speaker 2: everybody's ass again. On the Milwaukee front, though, I want
Speaker 2: to be clear, even though they're under more urgency and
Speaker 2: even though they're not as good as Boston, there's a
Speaker 2: lot of encouraging stuff there as well. Like some of
Speaker 2: the issues with the two man game you had mentioned,
Speaker 2: some of that has to do with the fact that
Speaker 2: as Dame is starting to kind of figure it out,
Speaker 2: Giannis has been dealing with some injury issues. Chris Middleton
Speaker 2: has been out of the lineup for a good chunk
Speaker 2: of this year, and now he's finally back. Damian Lillard
Speaker 2: you mentioned it. Carson back to back to back thirty
Speaker 2: point games for just the second time this season, but
Speaker 2: zooming in on.
Speaker 3: It a little bit further.
Speaker 2: In his last thirteen games, on nine to three point
Speaker 2: attempts per game, he's shooting forty four percent from three.
Speaker 2: So Dame has been in a good offensive rhythm. I've
Speaker 2: been seeing throughout the year enough to make me believe
Speaker 2: that this was less about decline and more about learning
Speaker 2: how to play with this particular group in terms of
Speaker 2: the geometry of the floor and just where his touches
Speaker 2: come from. And I think we're starting to see some
Speaker 2: of that come together. And so I think Milwaukee is
Speaker 2: still every bit as potent and capable as we thought
Speaker 2: they were to begin the season. It's just been a
Speaker 2: disappointing season because Dame was so bad for so much
Speaker 2: of it, and because honestly, the Adrian Griffin issue as
Speaker 2: well has to be factored in there. So I definitely
Speaker 2: think Boston has more pressure, but Milwaukee definitely has more
Speaker 2: urgency moving out west. So Nikole Jokic polishing up the jumper,
Speaker 2: getting ready for the postseason. Jamal Murray obviously has been
Speaker 2: playing in an all star level the Nuggets have lost
Speaker 2: just twice since the All Star break, and both of
Speaker 2: those losses involved a last second shot that either sent
Speaker 2: it to ot or ended the game. They have had multiple,
Speaker 2: probably about a half dozen, just ridiculous half court ass
Speaker 2: kicking sessions that they've put on at the end of
Speaker 2: games to put things away. I Denver just seems like
Speaker 2: a freight train to me. And so I'm gonna present
Speaker 2: this question to you guys like this, and I'll start
Speaker 2: with you, Carson. Would you take Denver or the field
Speaker 2: at this point to win the NBA title.
Speaker 3: It's a really good question.
Speaker 4: I would probably take Denver, but I don't think there's
Speaker 4: a big gap between them and Boston. I'm very confident
Speaker 4: that one of those two teams is gonna win the title.
Speaker 4: I think that Boston is the most overwhelmingly talented, and
Speaker 4: I think that as a basketball team, they have the
Speaker 4: highest ceiling. With the level that Jalen Brown has been
Speaker 4: playing at.
Speaker 3: As of late.
Speaker 4: Got if you get christophs ferzingis consistently knocking down his
Speaker 4: shots from the perimeter, which he didn't really do when
Speaker 4: they played Denver, and he was getting good looks there.
Speaker 4: Just the overall athleticism that they have the combination of
Speaker 4: perimeter defense and interior defense. In fact, they're a good
Speaker 4: rebounding team. They have two star shot creators. Jalen's been balling,
Speaker 4: Jason's having a career season. They can go on these
Speaker 4: flame throwing runs from deep. They lead the league in
Speaker 4: three point volume in their second in terms of their
Speaker 4: percentage there. So the ceiling that they have is incredibly high.
Speaker 4: I do still think that Denver is a bit more
Speaker 4: reliable though, because their offensive brilliance is truly inevitable. They
Speaker 4: are never going to break down in terms of process.
Speaker 4: They are never going to experience the swings in terms
Speaker 4: of perimeter shot making. That although Boston's ceiling is very high,
Speaker 4: we saw the difference maker in their matchup, and Boston
Speaker 4: fans may say, oh, well, we had a just miserable
Speaker 4: shooting game from deep, but so did Denver. Denver made
Speaker 4: four threes in that game. They could not knock down
Speaker 4: a shot from the perimeter. And they have one advantage
Speaker 4: that nobody else in the league does, which is that
Speaker 4: that offensive machine just keeps churning because of Niko Ajokic's
Speaker 4: in dominance offensively, because of his ability to create quality
Speaker 4: shots in and around the paint for cutters, for Aaron
Speaker 4: Gordon in the dunker spot. Jamal Murray's mid range shot making,
Speaker 4: like Denver, is less susceptible to shot variants than anybody
Speaker 4: else in the NBA. They won two games in the
Speaker 4: finals last year where they made five to three pointers
Speaker 4: or fewer. Nobody else did that in the entirety of
Speaker 4: the postseason. Nobody else can survive off shooting nights like Denver.
Speaker 4: And by the way, they're a really good shooting team,
Speaker 4: but they don't need to be to win every single game,
Speaker 4: and I think that that's a huge advantage. I think
Speaker 4: there are top three offense of this century. I mean,
Speaker 4: particularly in the clutch, the shot quality they can create
Speaker 4: with either Aniko Jokic's post up. Obviously, I think he's
Speaker 4: the best post score on the planet, in the best
Speaker 4: scorer period, and he can get to any of those
Speaker 4: touch shots and make sixty five percent of them no
Speaker 4: matter who's on him. But if you dig, he's going
Speaker 4: to create a good shot for a shooter, if you
Speaker 4: double from the paint. He and Aaron Gordon have maybe
Speaker 4: the best two man chemistry that I've ever seen, and
Speaker 4: so there is an inevitability there, whereas Jason Tatum, yes,
Speaker 4: has been on a really good pull up shooting run.
Speaker 4: But you can see these stretches from Boston where the
Speaker 4: decision making from Tatum and Brown isn't great and they
Speaker 4: are susceptible to just downstretches in terms of perimeter shot making.
Speaker 4: And Denver's a really good defensive team too. I think
Speaker 4: that obviously, particularly on the perimeter. They have some good athletes,
Speaker 4: They're not a team that is at all easy to
Speaker 4: pinpoint mismatches with. I think about that a lot, where
Speaker 4: you see it in the MAVs game recently, for example,
Speaker 4: where Luca is like trying to hunt switches and go
Speaker 4: at Jamal Murray late in that game, and it's still
Speaker 4: not super easy, like Jamal's still a six to four compact,
Speaker 4: pretty athletic guard. So I think they're underrated defensively, and
Speaker 4: they're the best offense in the league, the offense that
Speaker 4: I trust the most by a good bit. But I
Speaker 4: just can't act like they are head and shoulders above
Speaker 4: Boston because I know what Boston is capable of. Boston
Speaker 4: has the most talented starting five that we've seen, certainly
Speaker 4: since the peak Golden State Warriors. I think this is
Speaker 4: a team that, in most post Warriors years, like would
Speaker 4: be better than the champion. I'm interested in your guys'
Speaker 4: thoughts on that because I think Denver is the strongest
Speaker 4: champion we've seen since those Warriors. I think if you
Speaker 4: dropped this Celtics team against the twenty nineteen field well Toronto,
Speaker 4: just because Golden State was hurt that year, the twenty
Speaker 4: twenty Lakers are tough, but the twenty twenty one Bucks
Speaker 4: twenty twenty two Warriors. I think this Boston team is
Speaker 4: so overwhelmingly talented that I would take them against most
Speaker 4: of those teams, and I think that that's a testament
Speaker 4: to how strong both these teams are.
Speaker 3: I think that we.
Speaker 4: Are headed on kind of a collision course for one
Speaker 4: of the best finals of this century. I view both
Speaker 4: these teams very, very highly.
Speaker 1: I'm taking Denver, and I agree with you. I think
Speaker 1: it's gonna be a battle of the Titans. If the
Speaker 1: Celtics are the Avengers, Jokic is Thanos and Nice. To me,
Speaker 1: it comes down to one thing. Jason made a I
Speaker 1: can't remember what take you made it about. Jason, you
Speaker 1: were talking about how star players. Their teams assume the
Speaker 1: identity of their star player, and I really think that
Speaker 1: that's what it comes down to with both of these teams.
Speaker 1: The Celtics leader is Jason Tatum, and Tatum is susceptible
Speaker 1: to bad pull up shooting runs, settling for a lot
Speaker 1: of threes, and so that's what his team does a lot.
Speaker 1: I'm not putting that on on Jason Tatums shoulders, but
Speaker 1: by and large, they have assumed the identity of Jason Tatum.
Speaker 1: And there's no team more in the NBA that I
Speaker 1: think has assumed the identity of their leaders than the
Speaker 1: Denver Nuggets. Jokic's impact, his unselfishness not only creates open
Speaker 1: looks and open opportunities for his teammates, but it makes
Speaker 1: his teammates more unselfish. Like watch a Nuggets game and
Speaker 1: it will blow you away when you're watching Aaron Gordon
Speaker 1: kick it to MPJ and MPJ will swing it, and
Speaker 1: it's just it's beautiful basketball. Carson, you talk about them
Speaker 1: being one of the greatest offenses of this century. It's
Speaker 1: the most beautiful basketball. It's like the twenty twentyds and
Speaker 1: twenty ten Spurs. It's like the twenty tens Warriors. The
Speaker 1: ball movement is unreal, and that's what it comes down
Speaker 1: to me, Like the entirety of the Nuggets team has
Speaker 1: assumed part of Jokic's identity is We're gonna play unselfish,
Speaker 1: beautiful basketball. We're gonna make that extra pass and it's
Speaker 1: gonna kill you. It's part and why the Nuggets are
Speaker 1: so infallible when it comes to clutch offense, because they
Speaker 1: are looking for that extra pass, because they are looking
Speaker 1: to play make for their Their team is just so
Speaker 1: unselfish because their leader is. And that's the beautiful thing
Speaker 1: about the Nuggets, and that's why I can't pick against them.
Speaker 1: I do think the Celtics are probably the most talented
Speaker 1: team we've seen since the Warriors, even with like and
Speaker 1: the twenty twenty Lakers are probably the closest. But there's
Speaker 1: a depth advantage that the Celtics have that the Lakers
Speaker 1: don't have when you're comparing those teams apples to apples.
Speaker 1: So I don't want to undersell Boston. But what it
Speaker 1: comes down to me is the fact that both of
Speaker 1: these teams, you know, buy into their identity, their culture,
Speaker 1: their leader. I trust Denvers culture and their leader more,
Speaker 1: and I think it is permeated to the rest of
Speaker 1: the roster in a way that you seldom see with teams.
Speaker 1: Man Like their unselfishness is unreal, and that's that's ultimately
Speaker 1: why I buy in and can't bet against Denver. Also
Speaker 1: the fact, like you mentioned, Carson, you got MPJ just
Speaker 1: banging nails on contested threes. Every one of their players
Speaker 1: has something that they can kill you with. Man if
Speaker 1: it's an Aaron Gordon dunkor spot lob, if it's it's coming.
Speaker 1: I do think the Nuggets are inevitable and I would
Speaker 1: really be surprised if they didn't win the title.
Speaker 2: To be clear, I have Denver as my championship favorite,
Speaker 2: and I'm more confident in them now than I was
Speaker 2: even to start the season they have. I think they're
Speaker 2: just better than they were last year. I think they
Speaker 2: have more well defined roles and more well defined processes
Speaker 2: on both ends of the floor even than Boston does,
Speaker 2: which I think allows them to kind of reach their
Speaker 2: ceiling more frequently than Boston does, even though I agree
Speaker 2: boston ceiling is higher. Carson, I thought the bit you
Speaker 2: did on their lack of a life on variants was
Speaker 2: super super interesting. That stat about the five May threes
Speaker 2: in the finals. That's absolutely crazy, and I mean that
Speaker 2: I think that reflected in the Celtics games. They got
Speaker 2: outshot by Boston in both games on jump shots in
Speaker 2: terms of jump shot efficiency, and both of those teams
Speaker 2: are good jump shooting teams. They're both top ten jump
Speaker 2: shooting teams in the league by a point per shot efficiency,
Speaker 2: and so like their ability to weather that kind of storm.
Speaker 2: And again then I think like one of the big
Speaker 2: ones too, is just Denver knows exactly like their hierarchy
Speaker 2: in big situations. Boston can get a little bit finicky
Speaker 2: on that end, and they they don't really know what
Speaker 2: they want to run, which I think is part of
Speaker 2: the reason why they get inconsistent. That said, winning four
Speaker 2: championship rounds is really really hard. And even though I
Speaker 2: would put I would pick Denver over the field in
Speaker 2: the Western Conference, I think once you throw in that
Speaker 2: Boston variable, I think, like I think that it's just
Speaker 2: a it's a lot to say Denver winning over anybody
Speaker 2: else as an option. And so even though more confident
Speaker 2: Denver or in Denver than I have been at all
Speaker 2: this season, I still think like there's a less than
Speaker 2: fifty percent chance that they win, just because of all
Speaker 2: of the variables that go into it. I would pick them.
Speaker 2: I will pick them in every series. I will pick
Speaker 2: them against Boston if they get to the finals. I
Speaker 2: agree with you, Carson, I think it's going to be
Speaker 2: an all time great series. That said, I think there's
Speaker 2: there's obviously, like just a ton of variants in the NBA.
Speaker 2: I mean, even just looking back to the simple fact
Speaker 2: that we haven't had a repeat conference finalist in the
Speaker 2: last five years just goes to show you the stuff
Speaker 2: that you can run into in a postseason series. Not
Speaker 2: to mention the injury risk along the way too, Like
Speaker 2: it's just there's just always a chance that maybe Jowell
Speaker 2: Murray will go down or Michael Porter Junior will go
Speaker 2: down before you get there. And obviously, as we know,
Speaker 2: Denver synergy depends so much on all five of those
Speaker 2: guys being healthy. And so yeah, I think I think
Speaker 2: Denver fans should feel very confident. But if I was
Speaker 2: forced to pick Denver the field, I'd pick the field
Speaker 2: just because I think the field is all unless you're
Speaker 2: picking like Tiger Woods in his prime, UH to win
Speaker 2: a major like it's hard to it's hard to go
Speaker 2: against the field in these sorts of situations. All right,
Speaker 2: before we get out of here today, we're gonna have
Speaker 2: a fun game. We're gonna go rapid fire style. We're
Speaker 2: gonna start with Logan. I'm gonna give you I have.
Speaker 3: Six of uh.
Speaker 2: I don't want to call it bad takes, because sometimes
Speaker 2: I think hot takes are good takes just for entertainment's sake.
Speaker 2: Let's just call these, let's call these takes that I
Speaker 2: vehemently disagree with. Okay, I've got I've got six of them.
Speaker 2: What I want to do is we're gonna go back
Speaker 2: and forth. We'll go rapid fire style. I just want you,
Speaker 2: guys to give your initial reaction, like what your what
Speaker 2: your basketball mind screams when you see something like this
Speaker 2: when you're scrolling through your phone in the morning over
Speaker 2: some coffee, like the spit take, and then and then
Speaker 2: what comes next? All right, So Logan, you're up first.
Speaker 2: This is from the famous Hooper Twitter account ball Don't stop.
Speaker 2: The three highest scoring players ever, meaning Kareem Abdul Jabbar
Speaker 2: and uh A, Karl Malone and Lebron James wouldn't really
Speaker 2: be considered pure scorers, but their durability was insane, and
Speaker 2: they're scoring arsenal just worked so well and efficiently. They
Speaker 2: really outlasted everyone from their era and the era after
Speaker 2: their era. Logan, how do you feel about Karl Malone,
Speaker 2: Lebron James, and Kareem Abduljabbar not being considered pure scorers
Speaker 2: by the Hooper community?
Speaker 1: Really know what that means? I mean, what, how do
Speaker 1: you score nearly forty thousand points or forty thousand plus points?
Speaker 1: The only guy I'd say is probably Karl Malone because
Speaker 1: he was a John Stockton merchant, but that's another conversation
Speaker 1: for another day. I mean, yeah, dude, like Kareem and
Speaker 1: Lebron just have two of the most unstoppable scoring skill
Speaker 1: sets of all time. Lebron with the fact that he's
Speaker 1: one of the greatest rim pressures and most unstoppable athletes ever,
Speaker 1: and then Kareem would just one of the most immaculate
Speaker 1: postgames and shots of all times. So I don't really understand.
Speaker 1: I wouldn't consider them like pure scorers because they do
Speaker 1: everything else else, but to not call them scorers is ridiculous.
Speaker 1: They're two of the greatest of all time. That's kind
Speaker 1: of ridiculous to me.
Speaker 4: Yeah, totally unsurprising though coming from ball Don't Stop especially, And.
Speaker 3: I think that there is a large group of.
Speaker 4: The basketball community who has a serious infatuation with basically
Speaker 4: the aesthetics of one on one boy nice in very
Speaker 4: little interest in the effectiveness. Logan said it well, like
Speaker 4: if you can't stop something, you can't stop it. What
Speaker 4: baldon't Stop said in that tweet about the effectiveness of it,
Speaker 4: that's what matters, what should define if somebody is a
Speaker 4: great scorer. I mean, pure scorer is such a nebulous term.
Speaker 4: Like what does pure mean that you also don't excel
Speaker 4: in the other aspects of the game, Like is that
Speaker 4: something that we want to be lauding? Do we love
Speaker 4: Cam Thomas because all he does is take tough shots?
Speaker 4: And like, yeah, I like Cam Thomas when he's on, Like,
Speaker 4: you know, he's got a really shifty movement style, and
Speaker 4: he's got a deep bag and he's a tough shot creator.
Speaker 4: But there's a reason that there's not a lot of
Speaker 4: teams banging on the door to get Pam Thomas. There's
Speaker 4: a reason that Jamal Crawford wasn't as good as he
Speaker 4: was fun to watch a highlight tape of, Like these
Speaker 4: dudes who may have these awesome dribble combinations and may
Speaker 4: be great, difficult shot makers. Like, if you aren't getting
Speaker 4: to your spots, if you aren't making life easy on
Speaker 4: yourself offensively, and especially if you aren't doing the other
Speaker 4: things that matter in a basketball game, playmaking, defending, rebounding,
Speaker 4: et cetera, then you're just not gonna be that effective
Speaker 4: in an NBA game. So I see this sort of
Speaker 4: thinking all the time. To me, it just doesn't make sense,
Speaker 4: Like there is value in having a tough shot making
Speaker 4: skill set, right, Like if you are going to try
Speaker 4: to run clutch offense through Giannison Tantakoupa, who may be
Speaker 4: a super effective scorer, you're gonna have issues because if
Speaker 4: teams just fully commit to hey, we're walling off the rim.
Speaker 4: In this specific situation, he doesn't have the requisite counters.
Speaker 4: But for most of the game, I mean, he's just
Speaker 4: going to be able to get thirty efficiently because he
Speaker 4: has these unstoppable traits. And I think many people overvalue
Speaker 4: just how does it look when you score?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think I think it gets a little complicated
Speaker 2: when you're differentiating between the Yannis types and like the
Speaker 2: Lebron's and the Kraam Abdul jabars and the Yokices, Cause
Speaker 2: it's like there is some truth to the fact that,
Speaker 2: you know, Jannis's lack of skill polish can become an
Speaker 2: issue when he gets into the half court, which is
Speaker 2: more complicated than just reading his point progec he's a
Speaker 2: better score than ja Yeah, like it really, you know,
Speaker 2: but for sure, yeah, no, you're you're.
Speaker 3: I agree the.
Speaker 2: But yeah, Like the hilarious part to me about this
Speaker 2: tweet is the part that says they're scoring. Arsenal just
Speaker 2: works so well and efficiently, and it's like, oh, so
Speaker 2: that's what a pure scorer is, isn't it, Like like
Speaker 2: that's the literal definition the And then also like again,
Speaker 2: so much of the aesthetic appeal like some of these guys,
Speaker 2: like Lebron, for instance, I think honestly Lebron's bag, so
Speaker 2: to speak, has been highly underrated over the course of
Speaker 2: his career. But also like bully ball is the most
Speaker 2: effective and reliable form of scoring when you get to
Speaker 2: the later form of later rounds of the playoffs. That's
Speaker 2: just a fact and lastly, before we move on, Like,
Speaker 2: the funniest thing to me is like the sixteen dribble
Speaker 2: combination pull up jump shot is also like one of
Speaker 2: the hardest things to play alongside as a teammate. Like
Speaker 2: it's a rhythm disruptor. And what's so funny is like
Speaker 2: all these guys, the karl Malons, the krim Abduljabbars and Lebron's,
Speaker 2: their scoring came in a way that allowed other people
Speaker 2: to score well around them. And like, then you get
Speaker 2: these guys like Kyrie or not, Kyrie's more lumped in
Speaker 2: with just the way that Dallas plays. But let's talk
Speaker 2: about Luca for instance. Like Luca, like you have to
Speaker 2: put play finishers around him because if you put other
Speaker 2: guys who can dribble, shoot and pass around him, they
Speaker 2: would never be in rhythm because they'd be watching Luca
Speaker 2: take seventeen dribbles on every single possession. And so like,
Speaker 2: what's so funny is the specific type of style of
Speaker 2: scoring that he is referencing here is probably the kind
Speaker 2: that is like least it has a value, but it's
Speaker 2: less valuable than the other forms of scoring that exist
Speaker 2: out there. Okay, next one, this is not a quote,
Speaker 2: but it's come from several Miami Heat players, so I'm
Speaker 2: just gonna kind of reference it vaguely or start with
Speaker 2: du Carson. A few Miami Heat players have said that
Speaker 2: Chris bosh was the most important player on the heatles
Speaker 2: because he was a stretched big, even though he was
Speaker 2: on the same team with Lebron James, what's your reaction, Yeah.
Speaker 3: That's pretty hilarious.
Speaker 4: That's a classic case of people galaxy brain and things
Speaker 4: and making things more complicated than they are. I don't
Speaker 4: really have a bunch to say. I mean, Lebron was
Speaker 4: clearly the best player on the planet in both Miami
Speaker 4: title years and just an absolute full crumb both offensively
Speaker 4: and defensively. His versatility in Miami was the best of
Speaker 4: his career. His ability to play multiple styles like I
Speaker 4: think the super heliocentric ball dominant Lebron that we got
Speaker 4: in the second Cleveland stint, Like his mastery of the
Speaker 4: game intellectually was incredibly impressive, but his ability to play
Speaker 4: off ball as well in Miami with just that sort
Speaker 4: of freak athleticism. I mean, the best combination of his
Speaker 4: explosiveness from those first Cleveland years and his strength and
Speaker 4: then he was at his defensive peak. I mean, Lebron
Speaker 4: was at one of the highest peaks we've ever seen
Speaker 4: from a basketball player ever, And so I'm very happy
Speaker 4: that Chris Bosh was able to stretch the floor. And
Speaker 4: obviously he was a very good basketball player. But you
Speaker 4: take Lebron off those teams, you see what happens like
Speaker 4: in the subsequent years. And obviously d Wade had diminished
Speaker 4: at that point, and Chris Bosh obviously had all of
Speaker 4: his health issues. But like they were an okay playoff
Speaker 4: team after Lebron left, and I think it's very obvious
Speaker 4: that they would not have been tending. And it's like
Speaker 4: giving Iggy the Finals MVP in twenty fifteen. Sometimes we
Speaker 4: look at people maybe exceeding their value or doing one
Speaker 4: specific thing that is super valuable. Oh my god, he
Speaker 4: guarded Lebron and he shot the ball really well, and
Speaker 4: we want.
Speaker 3: To reward that.
Speaker 4: But it's like, who would you not be with in
Speaker 4: the who would you not be there in the first
Speaker 4: place if you didn't have Well, maybe it's Steph Curry,
Speaker 4: the guy who completely changed modern NBA offense and drove
Speaker 4: all the Warrior success on that side of the ball,
Speaker 4: So I think that's a very silly take.
Speaker 1: I mean, credit to Chris Bosh for grabbing one of
Speaker 1: the most important rebounds in NBA history, But yeah, I
Speaker 1: just completely disagree with this one. I'll give Chris Bosh
Speaker 1: a credit for doing another thing too. I think it's
Speaker 1: important too. When you have that accumulation of talent, when
Speaker 1: you have two bona fide guys who are maybe the
Speaker 1: best players on the planet, it takes sacrifice, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean. Chris Bosh had to sacrifice his role,
Speaker 1: his numbers, his view of you know, his stance as
Speaker 1: a player in the league, legacy wise, to go win championships.
Speaker 1: That's what championships take sacrifice from guys, you know, taking
Speaker 1: a lesser role and doing that role to perfection. And
Speaker 1: I'll give Chris Bosh a ton of credit for doing
Speaker 1: that and being a really underrated player. I think he's
Speaker 1: probably underrated now, especially you know, combined with the fact
Speaker 1: that he took a lesser role and the fact that
Speaker 1: you know his career was shortened because of blood clot issues.
Speaker 1: That's got to be one of the most hyperbolic takes
Speaker 1: or ridiculous, Like, what are we doing here?
Speaker 3: Man?
Speaker 1: I mean that version of Lebron's one of the greatest
Speaker 1: players ever. The volume